Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
September 28, 2022
Whodunnit? – Facts Related to The Sabotage Attack On The Nord Stream Pipelines

For decades the U.S. opposed European projects to receive energy from Russia. It wants Europe to buy more expensive U.S. oil and gas.

the Lemniscat @theLemniscat – 15:56 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

US plan was always to stop EU buying Russia's gas
2014
Rice:"You want to change the structure of energy dependence. You want to depend more on the North America energy platform … to have pipelines that don't go through Ukraine & Russia"
https://youtube.com/watch?v=aF0uYIjaTNE

Europe's, and especially Germany's industry, depends on cheap energy from Russia. Without it Europe will be de-industrialized and go broke.

The U.S. had threatened to disable the pipelines connecting Europe to Russia.

ABC News @ABC – 9:59pm · 7 Feb 2022

Pres. Biden: "If Russia invades…then there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2. We will bring an end to it."
Reporter: "But how will you do that, exactly, since…the project is in Germany's control?"
Biden: "I promise you, we will be able to do that."
abcn.ws/3B5SScx

Currently the U.S. is winning its war on Europe's, mainly Germany's, industries and people. Yesterday's sabotage attack on the Nord Stream I and II pipelines, which are supposed to bring Russian natural gas to Germany, mean that the the war on Germany has entered its hot phase.

A question remains: Whodunnit?

Russia has no motive to destroy the pipelines it owns. These are valuable, long term assets and the gas that escaped from them yesterday was on its own worth some $600 to $800 million.

A pipeline that could be turned off and on again was a leverage point for Russia that gave it some negotiation power. A destroyed pipeline gives Russia no leverage. This is truly elementary. One can not spin that away.

During the war in Ukraine Russia has not stopped to deliver gas to Europe as contractually agreed. Instead European countries, Poland, Ukraine and Germany have blocked overland and sub sea pipelines that brought gas to Germany.

German people have protested against the U.S. ordered shut down of the Nord Stream II pipeline. (Nord Stream I was recently offline because Siemens was prevented by sanctions from maintaining its compressor turbines.)

RadioGenova @RadioGenova – 18:02 UTC · Sep 26, 2022

Thousands of people in Gera in Germany against Olaf Scholz's policy and the explosion of energy and gas prices. They demand an end to sanctions on Russia and the reopening of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline. Demonstrations also in other German cities but EU media censors them.
Embedded video

A day after the protests the pipelines were sabotaged:

AZ @AZmilitary1 – 12:51 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

HERE IT IS
Footage from the site of a gas leak on the underwater section of the Nord Stream.
The video was published by the Danish military.
Earlier, the Kremlin said that it was most likely about sabotage.
The same opinion was expressed in the German government.
Embedded video

Yesterday's attack on the Nord Stream system is not unprecedented:

professional hog groomer @bidetmarxman – 15:51 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

In 2015, the annual routine underwater survey of the Nord Stream 1 pipelines came across a remote operated vehicle rigged with explosives right next to one of the lines in Swedish waters.
The umbilical cable had been cut. The drone’s national origin was never disclosed. 🧵

In 2015 Pipeline Journal reported:

[T]he Swedish military has successfully cleared a remote operated vehicle (drone) rigged with explosives found near Line 2 of the Nord Stream Natural Gas offshore pipeline system.

The vehicle was discovered during a routine survey operation as part of the annual integrity assessment of the Nord Stream pipeline. Since it was within the Swedish Exclusive Economic Zone (EEZ) approximately 120 km away from the island of Gotland, the Swedes called on their armed forces to remove and ultimately disarm the object.

The national identity of the drone has not been verified so far, as many countries use Unmanned Underwater Vehicles (UUVs) of a similar construction, [Jesper Stolpe, Swedish Armed Forces spokesman,] said.

To destroy a sub sea pipeline requires more than a ROV/drone delivered shaped charge.

Javier Blas @JavierBlas – 15:18 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

How strong is a Nord Stream pipe? Quite!
The steel pipe itself has a wall of 4.1 centimeters (1.6 inches), and it's coated with another 6-11 cm of steel-reinforced concrete. Each section of the pipe weighs 11 tonnes, which goes to 24-25 tonnes after the concrete is applied.

It wasn't earthquakes that destroyed the pipelines. These were several well targeted and massive explosions:

A Swedish seismologist said on Tuesday he was certain the seismic activity detected at the site of the Nord Stream pipeline gas leaks in the Baltic Sea was caused by explosions and not earthquakes nor landslides.

Bjorn Lund, seismologist at the Swedish National Seismic Network at Uppsala University, said seismic data gathered by him and Nordic colleagues showed that the explosions took place in the water and not in the rock under the seabed.

The targeted explosions were not small:

Dagny Taggart @DagnyTaggart963 – 15:56 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

Swedish seismologists from Lund University noted that "at least 100 kg of TNT (perhaps more) were used to destroy the pipelines."

Here is where the pipelines were hit:


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The Baltic Sea is controlled by NATO. This from June 2022:

"BALTOPS, with the high degree of complexity, tested our collective readiness and adaptability, while also highlighting the strength of our Alliance and resolve in providing a maritime domain with freedom of navigation for all," said Vice Adm. Gene Black, commander, U.S. Sixth Fleet and Naval Striking and Support Forces NATO (STRIKFORNATO).

Led by U.S. Sixth Fleet, BALTOPS 22 was command and controlled by STRIKFORNATO. From the staff’s headquarters in Oeiras, Portugal, Rear Adm. James Morley, STRIKFORNATO deputy commander, was responsible for ensuring participants met all training objectives.

[Rear Adm. John Menoni, commander, Expeditionary Strike Group Two,] also noted several instances in which forces stepped beyond know warfare methods to push limits with new technologies at sea and ashore. “Whether it was mine-hunting UUVs, persistent Intelligence, Surveillance, and Reconnaissance from an observable UAV, or demonstrating the value of the emerging Marine Corps concept of Expeditionary Advance Base Operations (EABO), our men and women continue to develop the tactics, techniques, and procedures that ultimately make meaningful contributions to Maritime Domain Awareness and increase the lethality of our forces.”

At sea, ships fine-tuned tactical maneuvering, anti-submarine warfare, live-fire training, mine countermeasures operations, and replenishments at sea. The Swedish submarine participating in the exercise, the U.K.’s Daring-class air-defense destroyer HMS Defender (D 36), and aircraft from other participating nations trained in anti-submarine warfare. Meanwhile, mine operations served as an ideal area of focus for testing new technology.

Scientists from five nations brought the latest advancements in Unmanned Underwater Vehicle (UUV) mine hunting technology to the Baltic Sea to demonstrate the vehicle’s effectiveness in operational scenarios. The BALTOPS Mine Counter Measure Task Group ventured throughout the Baltic region practicing ordnance location, exploitation, and disarming in critical maritime chokepoints.

While the Baltops 22 maneuver already took place in June and July of this year the U.S. Sixth Fleet left the Baltic Sea only a few days ago (in German, my translation):

Big Fleet Group From U.S. Navy Passes [German island passage] Fehmanbelt

On Wednesday morning the amphibious assault ship USS Kearsarge, escorted by the Landing Ships USS Arlington and USS Gunston Hall, was en route towards west. Previously, the ships were part of US units that took part in NATO maneuvers and called at numerous ports in Germany, Scandinavia and the Baltic States.

The "USS Kearsarge", flagship of the association and largest warship of the US Navy, which was in action in the Baltic Sea in the last 30 years, has 40 helicopters and fighter planes as well as more than 2000 soldiers on board, the escort ships about 1000. For the around 4,000 soldiers are heading back home on the east coast of the US after their six-month deployment.

Parts of the Kearsange operations in the Baltic Sea were dedicated to test special sub sea mine destruction technologies:

A significant focus of BALTOPS every year is the demonstration of NATO mine hunting capabilities, and this year the U.S. Navy continues to use the exercise as an opportunity to test emerging technology, U.S. Naval Forces Europe-Africa Public Affairs said June 14.

In support of BALTOPS, U.S. Navy 6th Fleet partnered with U.S. Navy research and warfare centers to bring the latest advancements in unmanned underwater vehicle mine hunting technology to the Baltic Sea to demonstrate the vehicle’s effectiveness in operational scenarios.

Experimentation was conducted off the coast of Bornholm, Denmark, with participants from Naval Information Warfare Center Pacific, Naval Undersea Warfare Center Newport, and Mine Warfare Readiness and Effectiveness Measuring all under the direction of U.S. 6th Fleet Task Force 68.

Off the coast of Bornholm, Denmark, is where the pipelines were hit. Just days ago the USS Kearsarge was in that area:

AZ @AZmilitary1 – 13:52 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

An expeditionary detachment of US Navy ships led by the universal amphibious assault ship USS Kearsarge days ago was in the Baltic Sea
It was 30 km from the site of the alleged sabotage on the Nord Stream-1 gas pipeline and 50 km from the threads of Nord Stream-2 gas pipeline


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AZ @AZmilitary1 – 14:12 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

On September 2, interesting maneuvers performed by an American helicopter with the call sign FFAB123. Then it was assumed that this board was from the USS Kearsarge air wing, and today more details were looked.

According to the website ads-b.nl , this call sign was used by 6 boards that day, of which we managed to establish the side numbers of three. All of them are Sikorsky MH-60S.

By superimposing the FFAB123 route on the scheme of yesterday's accident, we get a rather interesting result — the helicopter either flew along the Nord Stream-2 highway, or even between the points where the accident occurred.

On Twitter, meanwhile, there were screenshots of other flights of American aviation — the following screenshot was taken on September 13.


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The MH-60S carries big electromagnetic sensors which allows it to detect submarines, mines and – in the shallow waters of the Baltic Sea -  sub sea pipelines.


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This overlay picture of two others posted above is especially of interest:


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The U.S. military is not the only force that was near the area of the pipeline damage. Just a 100 kilometer south is the Polish naval base Kolobrzeg (the former German Kolberg) which harbors mine laying ships and the 8th Kołobrzeg Naval Combat Engineer Battalion. Naval combat engineers are experts in blowing up anything that is under water, be it mines or pipelines.


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In 2021, while Nord Stream 2 was still being build, the Polish navy had interfered and endangered the pipe laying vessels in the very same place.

Artifaktus @bzyqer – 7:49 UTC · Sep 28, 2022

Gdy Wy mycie zęby, przebieracie się w piżamy i szykujecie do snu, jeden niestrudzony Polak wyrusza w swoją łodzią w kierunku Bornholmu mając na sercu dobro Polski a może i Niemiec …

Translated from Polish by Google
When you brush your teeth, put on your pajamas and get ready to go to sleep, one tireless Pole sets off in his boat towards Bornholm with the good of Poland and maybe Germany at heart …
Image

During the recent Ukraine crisis Poland has rejected to receive Russian gas. It closed the Yamal pipeline that transports natural gas from Russia to Germany. Poland continued to consume Russia gas. It received it from Germany which had received it through the Nord Stream I pipeline from Russia.

Poland and Denmark have build a new sub sea pipeline which connects it to the pipeline that brings Norwegian gas to the Netherlands and Europe.


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The pipeline was opened yesterday, the very same day the Nord Stream system was sabotaged.

Chancellery of the Prime Minister of Poland @PremierRP_en – 11:25 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

🇵🇱🤝🇩🇰 The #BalticPipe is a joint Polish-Danish investment in the energy security of the region.
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Chancellery of the Prime Minister of Poland @PremierRP_en – 13:43 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

🎥The launching ceremony of the #BalticPipe gas pipeline with participation of PM @MorawieckiM , PM of Denmark Mette Frederiksen & @prezydentpl @AndrzejDuda.
The Baltic Pipe is a strategic infrastructure project aimed at creating a new gas supply corridor on the European market.
Video

The Baltic Pipe has a capacity of only 10 billion cubic meters per year. The Nord Stream system could carry up to 110 cubic meter per year. All of which is needed to keep Europe's industries running.

For more on Poland's involvement, likely in cooperation with the U.S., read these informed speculations by John Helmer:

The explosions at Bornholm are the new Polish strike for war in Europe against Chancellor Olaf Scholz. So far the Chancellery in Berlin is silent, tellingly.

The Poles should be reminded that other countries also have the capabilities to sabotage sub sea pipelines.

Radosław Sikorski is a former Minister of Defense and Foreign Minister of Poland. He is now a Member of the European Parliament. Yesterday he posted a picture of the gas escaping the damaged Nord Stream pipelines and thanked the U.S. for blowing them up.


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Sikorski is married to the neoconservative writer Anne Appelbaum who is notorious for her anti-Russian and anti-German screeds widely published in U.S. media.

In 2014 during the Maidan coup in Ukraine another notorious neoconservative, Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, told the U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey Pyatt, who should become the new prime minister of the Ukraine. She famously expressed her opinion about European concerns: "Fuck the EU" Nuland said. She is currently the U.S. Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs.

Over the last decades Germany has financed the Euro zone with up to 1.24 trillion Euros. (See also this thread). This was possible because Germany was exporting lots of industrial products and had a yearly surplus from its trade. With Germany's industry going down because a lack of cheap energy that surplus will vanish. Europe, all of it, will become a poor continent.

Philip Pilkington @philippilk – 21:23 UTC · Sep 27, 2022

9/ The European energy war will likely go down in history, together with the Treaty of Versailles and the trade wars of the 1930s, as one of the biggest economic policy errors in history.

10/ Another thing: when Trump was elected on a platform of milder protectionism, many people rightly pointed to the 1920s and 1930s and warned against these policies. These same people appear to have supported these much more 1920s/30s-like policies this past year. Ironic.

This does not happen by chance or fate. It is part of a long term neoconservative plan for continued U.S. supremacy over the world. The Anglo-American axis is the only party to benefit from the recent events.

The U.S. allegedly warned Germany of sabotage of the Nord Stream system (in German).

This reminds of President Joe Biden's warning of a Russian invasion in Ukraine early this year.

It is easy to predict such events when you are the one who intends to cause them.

The U.S. knew that the Ukraine was going to launch an attack on the Donbas republics. The U.S. knew that Russia would intervene to help its brethren. Russia had said so. The Ukrainian attack started with artillery preparations on February 17. Russia intervened on February 24.

The above is a collection of the currently available facts. You can draw your own conclusions from them.

Comments

Anyone who thinks Russia sabotaged Nordstream 1 and 2 is a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Posted by: TimmyB | Sep 28 2022 14:05 utc | 101

These are valuable, long term assets and the gas that escaped from them yesterday was on its own worth some $600 to $800 million.

So is this saying that the pipeline was carrying $600 to $800 million of Russian gas a day? Anyone have stats or data around the daily dollar amount that was going though?

Posted by: Glossolalia | Sep 28 2022 14:05 utc | 102

First Iranian protests, then the pipelines blow up. Is Taiwan next? I’m hoping it will be Hong-Kong or Xianjing, or Kashmir, because that seems less likely to end very badly.

Posted by: th… | Sep 28 2022 14:10 utc | 103

@Glossolalia
no
the pipes were under full pressure of gas, it is a very long pipe so the total volume adds up to be worth hundreds of millions of usd.
a clarification: it seems it is still possible to start NS2 as one of the lines is still undamaged

Posted by: ct | Sep 28 2022 14:14 utc | 104

@pretzelattack
> it sabotages their economies, why not their….
Germany chooses to sanction Russia, USA hasn’t forced them to walk down this path. Pressure
@Norwegian
The video of Biden is not obviously a threat to destroy a pipeline. A politician can make a vow to end a pipeline thinking he can achieve that end through diplomatic means. And Biden says a lot of inexplicable, borderline incoherent things, so any one brief clip of him talking is very weak evidence of anything.
In general: people claiming USA is most likely culprit should strive to show that USA is the more likely culprit than Ukraine – who has the motive, means, and MO. For USA, it could be the kind of thing that destroys our relationship with Germany. There’s a recklessness there thats inconsistent with Biden’s multilateralism. Please don’t just tell me I’m wrong about Biden, tell me why Ukraine wouldn’t or couldn’t do it.

Posted by: GoFast | Sep 28 2022 14:20 utc | 105

Posted by: c1ue | Sep 28 2022 13:52 utc | 94
I’m unimpressed by the theory that it was the French. Entirely against the major axes of French foreign policy, and all the francophobes here are claiming anyway, that French nuclear power is in a mess, with half or more aging power stations shut down this summer. But then it is very common here to look for sth nasty to say about Macron.

Posted by: laguerre | Sep 28 2022 14:22 utc | 106

I was appalled that CNN let’s Brennan declare that Russia has the most reason to sabotage pipeline without challenge from the hosts.
1. The U.S. has a motive and a history of attacking infrastructure, Stuxnet, mining Managua bay, and gasp, a Soviet era Siberian pipeline.
2. It makes no sense for Russia to cut off their own fingers. Brennan actually said that it was to ‘intimidate Europe because it shows that Russia can next attack the Norwegian pipeline’. This begs the question, if it was Russia then they didn’t they go after the Norwegian pipeline first?

Posted by: Christian Chuba | Sep 28 2022 14:24 utc | 107

The video of Biden is not obviously a threat to destroy a pipeline.
Posted by: GoFast | Sep 28 2022 14:20 utc | 108
Included in the options, so yes it is a threat.

Posted by: laguerre | Sep 28 2022 14:31 utc | 108

That line is now full of sea water. It will never restart due to the corrosion.

Posted by: JackG | Sep 28 2022 14:33 utc | 109

ct | Sep 28 2022 14:14 utc | 107
it seems it is still possible to start NS2 as one of the lines is still undamaged
Or maybe; one of lines is still undamaged because of a failed detonation;
Maybe the device is there, undetonated ? In which watch to see who wants to take control of the survey operation to recapture and hide the device.
Also think; who would want to descend on the pipe to see if a device is still in place ? Only someone who knows it is safe to do so.

Posted by: Lapin | Sep 28 2022 14:34 utc | 110

This begs the question, if it was Russia then they didn’t they go after the Norwegian pipeline first?
Posted by: Christian Chuba | Sep 28 2022 14:24 utc | 110
A better question is why would Russia not target the pipelines going through the active warzone in the Ukraine instead blowing up their own stuff in the middle of NATO waters?

Posted by: meh | Sep 28 2022 14:34 utc | 111

http://johnhelmer.net/the-bornholm-blow-up-repeats-the-bornholm-bash-poland-attacks-germany-and-blames-russia/
This time the attack is targeting the Germans…
Posted by: John Gilberts | Sep 28 2022 14:01 utc | 101

Yes, that was one of Helmer’s better pieces, written on short notice as well. If proven correct, it points to even more serious fractures in the EU and NATO.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 14:41 utc | 112

Although there’s no evidence, yet, it’s obvious whose economic interests are served. There is abundant evidence, however, that the US government is a mafia outfit and totally out of control. There’s only one plausible outcome for such a regime. They know their time is up, soon, but the only question is will they destroy the planet before the US working class wakes up and becomes politically conscious?

Posted by: zeke | Sep 28 2022 14:41 utc | 113

Is this the testing ground for a nuke false flag blamed on Russia?
Empire is desperate. It sounds like they didn’t even hide well that they are the pipeline attackers.
ZH had a posting up about the latest US Treasury market that showed big increase and now the article is not there but lots of noise about bond markets failing. I want the financial markets to crash without a hot war to blame it on and then maybe empire will lose its ability to project might-makes-right aggression.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 14:41 utc | 114

If the US is responsible you would think they would be beefing up security at Cushing and LNG terminals big time, so this might be somewhat of a tell.
A lot of US infrastructure is quite old and I would think extremely vulnerable if someone was inclined to retaliate. The southern border also couldn’t be more wide open thanks to Bidens policies so would not be that hard to sneak in operatives.
Of course then you think with the policies Biden is pursuing if the above happened Biden would use it to further push the mad ‘Green’ agenda. Politicians, deep state agencies and blatant financial interests are out to destroy the world and for what, Ukraine or because some Russian speaking areas would rather return to Russia after 30yrs of Ukrainian failure that has resulted in a ‘country’ half as poor as Russia.

Posted by: MrV | Sep 28 2022 14:42 utc | 115

@laguerre #109
I agree it is against the major axes of France under Macron, but it is disingenuous to say that it is against historical French policy.
Remind me again: who occupied the Ruhr in the 1920s?
Who was invaded and taken over by the Germans in the 1940s?
Who has been eclipsed by the German economy in the last 30 years?

Posted by: c1ue | Sep 28 2022 14:44 utc | 116

GoFast | Sep 28 2022 14:20 utc | 108
“…Ukraine – who has the motive, means, and MO.
Ukraine hasn’t been able to scratch its own arse without assistance from USUK NATO.
Ukraine is a pet attack dog. It follows orders, begs for its bowl to be filled… and will be put down when no longer useful.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 28 2022 14:51 utc | 117

The southern border also couldn’t be more wide open thanks to Bidens policies so would not be that hard to sneak in operatives.
Posted by: MrV | Sep 28 2022 14:42 utc | 118

The northern border is even more porous and sparsely populated.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 14:51 utc | 118

Todos os fãs da Rússia desejaram que a federação parasse o abastecimento de energia para seus inimigos declarados. Bem, como a Rússia fez por orgulho, agora faz pela dor!

Posted by: Rodrigues | Sep 28 2022 14:52 utc | 119

Below is a Reuters story quote that points to the cognitive dissonance that must be bottled up around the sabotage.

BERLIN/COPENHAGEN, Sept 28 (Reuters) – Any intentional disruption to EU energy networks would meet a “robust and united response”, its top diplomat said, after several states said two Russian pipelines to Europe had been attacked, causing gas to spew into the Baltic Sea.
It remained far from clear who might be behind the leaks or any foul play, if proven, on the Nord Stream pipelines that Russia and European partners spent billions of dollars building.

The “far from clear” word salads we will get from the EU puppets as they deny their countries are being raped should be interesting.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 14:55 utc | 120

@GoFast | Sep 28 2022 14:20 utc | 108

Please don’t just tell me I’m wrong about Biden, tell me why Ukraine wouldn’t or couldn’t do it.

You might think you are clever asking us to prove a negative. If you have a theory, YOU provide the evidence for it.
The evidence presented is shows an overwhelming probability that the USA did it. They had the military on the spot, they have the means and the motives, and they are INSANE.
Now show your evidence or go away.

Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 28 2022 14:55 utc | 121

OpportKnocks@121……24/7/365 drone coverage, no need for boots on the ground ….coming from Mexico one can hide and sleep out side of need be….touching on -4 the past few nights up here, the northern border is inhospitable…..and to get to it one requires proof of vaccination just to get into Canada before one reaches the ‘northern border’ where if caught without the vaccination one will be quarantined…..maybe after one gets out, they could go all jihadi like down south……

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Sep 28 2022 15:01 utc | 122

That line is now full of sea water. It will never restart due to the corrosion.
Posted by: JackG | Sep 28 2022 14:33 utc | 112

Depending on the inclination and composition of the seabed, a very large quantity of sand & other debris could have been pulled into the pipeline and carried either upstream or downstream if water has flooded the pipeline.

Posted by: anon2020 | Sep 28 2022 15:08 utc | 123

Maria Zakharova on the Nord Stream attack:
https://t.me/MFARussia/13714

#Opinion by Maria #Zakharova:
💬 On February 7, 2022, Joe Biden said that Nord Stream would be done for if Russia invades Ukraine: “If Russia invades, that means tanks or troops crossing the … border of Ukraine again, then there will be … no longer a Nord Stream 2. We, we will bring an end to it. <…> I promise you, we’ll be able to do it.”
US President Joe Biden must answer whether the United States acted on its threat on September 25 and 26, 2022, when an incident occurred on three branches of Nord Stream 1 and Nord Stream 2, preliminarily qualified as pipeline ruptures, possibly as a result of explosions.
The statement of intent was backed with a pledge. One must take responsibility for one’s words. Failing to understand the meaning of what one is saying does not release one from liability. Europe must know the truth.

Russia will bring it up in the UN Security Council
https://t.me/MFARussia/13715

⚡️ Russian MFA Spokeswoman Maria #Zakharova:
Russia intends to convene an official UN Security Council Meeting regarding the incidents with the #NordStream & #NordStream2 gas pipelines.

Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 28 2022 15:12 utc | 124

Remind me again: who occupied the Ruhr in the 1920s?
Who was invaded and taken over by the Germans in the 1940s?
Who has been eclipsed by the German economy in the last 30 years?
Posted by: c1ue | Sep 28 2022 14:44 utc | 119
Oh come, the Ruhr was a century ago, not much relevance to today. French policy switched after the 2WW to profit from sticking close to Germany, and things have been like that ever since. They’ve done very well out of it, even if sometimes there’s not a lot of personal enthusiasm. Perhaps you didn’t know that much history

Posted by: laguerre | Sep 28 2022 15:18 utc | 125

This tweet notes France does benefit from NS sabotage, and has the capability.
again h/t NakedCapitalism
source
It is true that gas shortages in Europe hurt France too – but it is also true that they hurt France the least (thank you, nuclear power). Destroying Germany as a rival in continental Europe has been a French primary objective since the formation of Germany in 1865 (and prevention of German unity was a goal for centuries before that).
Hmmm.
Posted by: c1ue | Sep 28 2022 13:52 utc | 94

The humble opinion of a French citizen : French involvement is a joke. Our politicians spend too much time communicating in the media to make us believe they still have a role in the decision making.

Posted by: Fabrice Etanchaud | Sep 28 2022 15:21 utc | 126

Please, move on. Nothing to see here …
Everybody knew, that this could/would happen.
– The German government knew, – or at least could have imagined.
So they should have kept a close guard on the pipeline. But might that have prevented it? Better look away.
Moreover, this is certainly an allevation for the German government (no more pressure from the street to open NS2).
– The Russian were very well expecting this. But they left it to the West’s own choice.
– For the German industry it is a clear signal to leave the country. Disassemble the production lines and move to somewhere else.
After all, just a standard move on the chessboard, clearly forseeable.
Regarding the ‘date of entry into application’:
It is interesting, that it only happened only after elections in Italy.
This might tell us something about Giorgia Meloni.

Posted by: Linus | Sep 28 2022 15:25 utc | 127

Breaking News from Afghanistan
RF signs agreement to provide oil gas grain : would anyone like to speculate as top the currency which will be used to pay ?
This is the way to build a coalition to win the war in the Ukraine
« Taliban officials have signed a provisional deal with Russia to import gasoline, diesel, gas, and wheat to Afghanistan, according to Acting Commerce and Industry Minister Haji Nooruddin Azizi.
Speaking with Reuters, Azizi explained that Moscow offered the Taliban “a discount to average global commodity prices.”
The deal calls for the Kremlin to supply war-torn Afghanistan with around one million tons of gasoline, one million tons of diesel, 500,000 tons of liquefied petroleum gas (LPG), and two million tons of wheat annually.
After a trial period of an unspecified amount of time – and if the two sides are satisfied with the arrangement – a final deal will be signed.
No details have been provided on pricing or payment methods. Last month, Kabul offered to barter local products like minerals, dried fruits, and medicinal herbs with Moscow in exchange for fuel and grain. »
https://thecradle.co/Article/News/16230

Posted by: Gerrard White | Sep 28 2022 15:30 utc | 128

@ JackG # 112.
Are you one of the design engineers of the NS2 pipeline?
Were you directly involved in assesing the specifications of the steel used in the actual pipelines?
If not, how can you say catergorically that the pipelines will/are coroded?
How about showing us the actual specification parameters of the alloys in the steel and test results appertaining to the suitability of the materials used before making comment?

Posted by: Beibdnn. | Sep 28 2022 15:32 utc | 129

BLOCKQUOTE>- For the German industry it is a clear signal to leave the country. Disassemble the production lines and move to somewhere else.
Posted by: Linus | Sep 28 2022 15:25 utc | 130
That is key to me. IMO the German govt gambled on getting back to using at least NS1 after the Ukraine war would be over, because they knew the German industry needed cheap natural gas. This option is now toast. Is there any way to get enough cheap natural gas through the remaining NS2 pipeline to Germany? If not, it would take years and years to build another pipeline. The German economy cant wait that long. So, if we physically cant get enough cheap natural gas to power our economy, it is over anyway, no matter how and when the Ukraine ends.

Posted by: Arne Hartmann | Sep 28 2022 15:32 utc | 130

Remember they compared the magnitudes of the Nord Stream detonations with the magnitude of the Government house detonation in Oslo 22. July 2011 to illustrate?
What else could be the common denominator?
Jens Stoltenberg was Prime Minister of Norway in 2011
Jens Stoltenberg is General Secretary of NATO in 2022

Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 28 2022 15:39 utc | 131

Posted by: ct | Sep 28 2022 14:14 utc | 107

… it seems it is still possible to start NS2 as one of the lines is still undamaged

If this is true, then we can expect a final attempt to destroy it completely, soon.
Almost isn’t good enough in cases like these.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 15:40 utc | 132

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 14:41 utc | 117
“Is this the testing ground for a nuke false flag blamed on Russia?”
Every other post in Ukrainian telegram channels that I follow is about something nuclear, whether it be UA creating dirty bomb itself, or standing firm in the case of nuclear blackmail or even real attack.
Recent post from Legitimniy
The West really needs a nuclear strike on Ukraine

Yesterday, Zelensky continued to provoke Putin by saying that Russia should be stripped of its nuclear weapons.
Before that, the terms of the peace settlement agreed with Blinken also implied humiliating Russia by allowing NATO specialists into all Russian military and scientific facilities.
Zelensky behaved in the same way before 24.02. He wanted to join NATO, then a nuclear bomb. In short, he provoked and got his way.
Why we need such things in the world politics when everything is on a thread as it is, you ask?
The Americans have been well acquainted with Putin’s psychological profile. In his 20 years in power, Putin has grown accustomed to being treated with respect. Moreover, he has repeatedly spoken about the need to respect Russia as a great power.
We think that according to CIA analysts, such public humiliation should provoke a response from the Kremlin. Preferably in the form of nuclear strikes. Very preferably on the territory of Ukraine.
Then the U.S. has the maximum set of response options. From nuclear strikes in response to a peace agreement for de-escalation.
In our view, the most likely scenario is that Russia will be declared a sponsor of terrorism, impose all secondary sanctions, and be expelled from the UN Security Council (out of control). This would finally bring down the iron curtain on Russia.
Economically, this is a super option for the U.S.: there will be a ceiling on oil prices for Russia in the package. There would be an energy shortage in the world, prices would explode, but Russia would not make super profits as it does now.
On the front, Russia will be vulnerable for another 3 weeks (this is the most dangerous period), then the mobilized will arrive and the “window” will close. True, there will be new options, but more about them later.

Posted by: js | Sep 28 2022 15:41 utc | 133

GoFast | Sep 28 2022 14:20 utc | 108
Here’s an example of Ukraine being under the control of the UKUS:
Britain helped plot Ukraine counter-offensive to take back Kharkiv
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/britain-helped-plot-ukraine-counter-offensive-to-take-back-kharkiv/ar-AA11OeCr

Ukraine launched its major counter-offensive in Kharkiv after war games with the UK and US showed Kyiv could win.
President Volodymyr Zelensky strategically planned the recent attack in eastern Ukraine with British and American officials, in an unprecedented intelligence sharing operation.
Reporting by the New York Times revealed that Washington and London have been deeply involved in assessing and advising on Ukrainian military manoeuvres. 
Last month the US was said to have stepped up its offering of information, which indicated that Moscow would struggle to quickly reinforce its troops in northeast Ukraine or move troops from the south.
This gave Mr Zelensky the confidence in the strategy to attack in Kharkiv, which has remained a static frontline in recent months.
“We did do some modelling and some tabletop exercises,” Colin Kahl, the Pentagon’s policy chief, told the NYT.
“That set of exercises suggested that certain avenues for a counter-offensive were likely to be more successful than others.
We provided that advice, and then the Ukrainians internalised that and made their own decision.”
It is the first time Western officials have spoken so publicly about their involvement in Ukraine.
Ukrainian forces launched their counter-offensive in early September, seemingly catching Russia’s military off guard.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 28 2022 15:44 utc | 134

@laguerre #128
What I know of history is that France has been a distinct second fiddle to Germany for decades.
Who controls the ECB? German policy ever since the Bundesbank was used as its base.
Yes, France has influence in the EU but it has always been an inferior to German aims.
As to whether the French don’t remember their multiple humiliations to Germany in the 2 World Wars, I leave it to the French to opine.
Maybe young French are as ignorant of history as Americans.
Be that as it may, the reality remains that a failed Germany upends all the supposed policy benefits and goals you have stated are to France’s benefit – and a failed Germany is going to happen regardless of the state of Nord Stream 2.
A Germany with insufficient power imports more
Electricity: that directly benefits France. A Germany without the economic and accompanying political clout to allows more influence to French goals in EU policies.
Note I am not saying France did it, but there is no question whatsoever that France has the motive, means and opportunity.

Posted by: c1ue | Sep 28 2022 15:45 utc | 135

Whether it’s a case of arming, funding, training, transporting and orchestrating puppet jihadi head choppers like ISIS in the Middle East, or similar Nazi puppets in Ukraine, or starving to death hundreds of thousands of children in Iraq, Syria and Venezuela, there are no depths to which Americans would not stoop. They are utterly disgusting, vile, degenerate sickos, the acme of evil on this planet. For the past 80 years they have rampaged across the world, slaughtering, butchering, starving and immiserating hundreds of millions, like Nazi Germany on steroids. Indeed, given their record Adolf Hitler appears quite sane and moderate by comparison. But what goes around comes around. Our US buddies have piled up some very bad karma over the years, and there is a very weighty account to be settled. Americans (and their EU poodles and jackals) may soon have to watch THEIR children starving in front of them or dying for lack of basic medicine. Perhaps then they will finally begin to understand what they have so casually inflicted on so many for so long. Nothing in human history could be so richly deserved.

Posted by: Paul | Sep 28 2022 15:50 utc | 136

touching on -4 the past few nights up here, the northern border is inhospitable…..and to get to it one requires proof of vaccination just to get into Canada before one reaches the ‘northern border’
Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Sep 28 2022 15:01 utc | 125

Come on Sean. I have friends who are camping in Alberta and BC now. You will recall the naive immigrants from India last year who froze to death walking across from Alberta in February.
But for 60% of the year it is easy-peasy. Though a small inflatable on Lake Erie would be my choice.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 15:51 utc | 137

… how could [anyone] have conducted such an operation without being spotted in the process?

I suggest that the operation could have been as unsophisticated as a fishing boat lowering cans of TNT equipped with timers over the side. An 80’ /25 meter long PT boat out of the second world war deployed Mark 6 depth charges that were cans about 20 inches / 50 cm in diameter and 24 inches / 60 cm long, containing 300 pounds / 136 kg of TNT. These charges were capable of sinking submarines, and a pipeline is an easier target as it has a known location and doesn’t move around. Bernard seems to think the charges would need to be 200kg, but even so, the cans would only need to be somewhat larger.

Posted by: nazcalito | Sep 28 2022 15:54 utc | 138

nazcalito | Sep 28 2022 15:54 utc | 141
Try reading previous threads.
_______
https://twitter.com/JavierBlas/status/1574849652016422914?cxt=HHwWhICxscTa_torAAAA
“The Nord Stream 1 and 2 pipeline leaks are ~75 kilometers apart (so, two very distinctive incidents). The Danish military has dropped 3 beacons over the leaks to signal the danger. You can see @MarineTraffic data (red circle).
“> The two areas of the leaks is so far apart (~75 km) that natural events (like subsea mudslides or earthquakes) can be almost certainly ruled out. The same goes about ships dragging anchor or fishing nets from trawlers, or a submarine colliding by chance. This is deliberate.
“> Here the Danish geological service: 2 explosions detected. One at 2.03am on Monday, Sep 26, and another at 7.03pm on the same day (~17 hours apart). The first event registered 2.3 on the Richter scale, the second measured 2.1 (No way this wasn’t man-made)
“> https://eng.geus.dk/about/news/news-archive/2022/september/baltic

GEUS has recorded shaking in the Baltic Sea Published 27-09-2022
The first event registered 2.3 on the Richter scale, the second 2.1 on the Richter scale.
The signals do not resemble signals from earthquakes. They do resemble the signals typically recorded from blasts.
The signals are recorded on GEUS’ two seismographic stations on Bornholm, the station on Stevns as well as on Swedish and German stations.
The Geological Survey of Denmark and Greenland (GEUS) is responsible for monitoring and locating earthquakes and other seismological events in Denmark, Greenland and the Faroe islands.
…..maps of the locations and the seismographic stations. Maps: GEUS and Google Maps 

Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 28 2022 16:02 utc | 139

I believe technically the pipelines can be repaired and gas flow can be stored.
So the logic of sabotage is clear from here: energy supply line from Russia is not safe for Europe.
Whose benefit lays to this sabotage?
It can not be Russian benefit, neither German’s nor Europe.
He said “I promise you, we will be able to do that.” again, and again.

Posted by: arata | Sep 28 2022 16:19 utc | 140

One Adm. Robert P. Burke, an entirely nondescript person, was relieved of his post of Commander CNE-CNA. He retired as scheduled. In came one Adm. Stuart B. Munsch as Burke’s successor. That guy is anything but nondescript. He was a Rhodes Scholar (I learned from the MoA forum how significant that is). He’s also an individual member of the Council on Foreign Relations, which is somewhat odd. They don’t have many military people as members. Burke certainly isn’t a member, in contrast to Munsch. I find that all very peculiar.
So, any information on the dates? Or any thoughts about the command aspect in general?
Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Sep 28 2022 13:54 utc | 97

The change in command from Adm. Burke to Adm. Munsch occurred on June 27 of this year. And according to the original post, BALTOPS 22 took place in June and July.
So, it does seem possible that the change of command might have been timed to install someone who wouldn’t have reservations about blowing up a couple of pipelines.

Posted by: David Levin | Sep 28 2022 16:20 utc | 141

I suspect the following –
Possible Scenario 1:
USNavy/UKNavy did this by themselves – Amphib-Gator Ships usually Haul+Deploy SEAL/UDT SpecOps. With the Underwater Drone Testing, they probably deployed those Explosives with SEAL/UDT Participation.
Subs can deploy them; but from what I gather, it’s shallow, heavily trafficked, near Bomb Dumps, tough to cut+run and deadly in case RUS were onto them. More Gear/Personnel can be deployed and recovered with Amphibs; and if they FUBAR’d it, People can be readily recovered, gear located for destruction,etc.
(Yes, folks – I trained on Nuke Subs as a Midshipman, had orders to an Ohio/Trident SSBN (turned it down for a MIC Mgmnt Tour), and once was Stationed at a SpecOps Trng Facility as well – I even Interviewed for NAVY SEAL CounterTerror Team as an USNavy Ensign)
Scenario 2: USNavy/UKNavy probably did the Training and Weapons Provisions; and the Hosting/Monitoring, with
Trained UKRoNazi/AFU/POL actually doing the Manual Labor.
Scenario 2 may give Biden “Plausible Deniability” to some degree; but we All know that Murican Whitehouse tend to be staffed with Pathological Liars for the better part of the Past 100Years.

Posted by: IronForge | Sep 28 2022 16:22 utc | 142

Meanwhile, in other news….
Here’s another pipeline the US is busting to burst, or is the Polish ?
https://sputniknews.com/20220921/is-washington-against-africa–eu-benefitting-from-long-term-gas-projects-1101021119.html

Posted by: Gerrard White | Sep 28 2022 16:23 utc | 143

i always wondered why people told “polish jokes” when i was growing up. i’m starting to get it now. also funny that applebaum has a husband at all and that she had to go to eastern europe to find him. i always just assumed her and louise mensch would end up together as lezbo spinsters.
this is an occam’s razor/cui bono no brainer. the west lost its capacity for subtlety decades ago so this kind of “throw bombs at shit you don’t like” stupidity is exactly what you’d expect from “shock and awe” types. plus biden’s “nice pipeline…shame if it had a accident!” tough guy alzheimer’s outburst kinda takes away the suspense.
just for a larf i’d like to set up voting booths in germany and see if anyone wants to have a referendum to join russia.

Posted by: the pair | Sep 28 2022 16:25 utc | 144

@c1ue #138
Interesting point. The French DGSE certainly have form in that regard of committing terrorist acts on friendly soils. They bombed a ship in New Zealand in the 1980s.
Unfortunately in this case NS1 and NS2 pipelines weren’t under the protection of a Neighborhood Watch group.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Rainbow_Warrior

Posted by: MrV | Sep 28 2022 16:29 utc | 145

Some excellent comments on page one. Key is destruction of Germany’s and thus the entire EU’s economy–including Poland’s. Such an outcome IMO rules out any EU participant leaving the Outlaw US Empire as the only “winning” actor–it had means, motive and opportunity, plus it signaled it would do exactly what’s been done. The fact that one string of NS2 survived means the possibility of evidence discovery. Somehow, Russia needs to secure the crime scene–for that’s what it ultimately is, a crime.
Many commentators are 100% correct about the economic hurricane that was just unleashed on the EU with the demise of its central economic engine. RT is reporting on Zakharova’s answer to related questions at her weekly briefing, which has yet to be posted by MFA. What she has to say is very interesting. I’m waiting for the transcript as the reporting is fragmented. There will also be a UNSC meeting about this crime, possibly tomorrow or Friday.
That’s all I have for the moment.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 16:35 utc | 146

“First Iranian protests, then the pipelines blow up. Is Taiwan next? I’m hoping it will be Hong-Kong or Xianjing, or Kashmir, because that seems less likely to end very badly.
Posted by: th… | Sep 28 2022 14:10 utc | 106”
Here’s hoping that the next blow up is in the belly of the American beast itself.
A few strategic accidents in USA-controlled energy pipelines or oil refineries, leading to skyrocketing energy costs.
A collapse of the US stock market and explosion of (hyper)inflation.
The acceleration of the undeclared Second Civil War brewing in the DisUnited States.
The growth of Texas and California independence movements from the USA.
These would all be an excellent start.
The only thing that will deter America, its wars of aggression, destabilization campaigns, or its state-sponsored terrorist attacks (like the Nord Stream pipeline attacks) is to bring the United States of America to an end.

Posted by: ak74 | Sep 28 2022 16:41 utc | 147

How long will it take for the German people to realize that they have been stabbed in the back by their supposed NATO and EU Allies? And will they then ask questions about their own leaders possible involvement in the stabbing? I’m not suggesting that German leaders were involved, but their stated willingness to have the citizenry suffer should raise obvious concerns.

Posted by: Rob | Sep 28 2022 16:48 utc | 148

In response to the ‘what is next’ post.
Do we know if Israel and the US still prepping to bomb Iran’s nuclear sites. You know, practicing with refuelling and stuff.
I’m guessing they will be ready in March.

Posted by: Keith | Sep 28 2022 16:53 utc | 149

@2 arch bungle
Nailed it.
Just like the Ukes, the Poles are deluded-nationalists in the service of globalism. Never liked them and the stereotypical dumb-as-a-rock Pole seems to keep ringing true.
They antagonized the NSDAP at the behest of western powers and now they are doing it AGAIN by antagonizing Russia.

Posted by: NemesisCalling | Sep 28 2022 17:02 utc | 150

Actually, has anyone even considered the Baltic states as culprits?
Lithuania, Lativa, Estonia have been unhinged for awhile. The Lithuanians blockaded Kalingrad, which is an act of war. Estonia is supposed to be harboring Darya Dugin’s assassin and won’t support Russians fleeing conscription. I can’t think of anything in particular that Latvia has done lately, but I assume they’re similar to the other two baltic states.
It’s like a game of “Clue” – there are so many plausible suspects!

Posted by: GoFast | Sep 28 2022 17:03 utc | 151

Tagesspiegel seems to imply the pipelines are likely gone FOREVER due to salt corrosion.
(Any engineers keen to comment?)
https://www.tagesspiegel.de/wirtschaft/eu-halt-pipeline-sabotage-fur-wahrscheinlich-und-droht-mit-sanktionen-8687140.html
If so, 2 things immediately come to mind:
-RUSSIA’s REACTION won’t be pretty> UN Sec meeting coming up…
-Germany is now Poland’s bitch
If Germans either don’t realise that or don’t react with vengeance and strength, then i guess they really deserve to be.
The article also indirectly accuses Russia. Unbelievable.
I guess we are talking about the people who were in denial about Merkel’s phone being tapped by Obama, that there are no Nazis in Ukraine, and still convinced the 35,000 US troops are there to protect them…

Posted by: Et Tu | Sep 28 2022 17:03 utc | 152

nazcalito | Sep 28 2022 15:54 utc | 141
Try reading previous threads.

Try reading my post. I didn’t say anything about “ships dragging anchor or fishing nets from trawlers.” I said “lowering cans of TNT equipped with timers over the side.”

Posted by: nazcalito | Sep 28 2022 17:03 utc | 153

Posted by: IronForge | Sep 28 2022 16:22 utc | 142
There are “underwater scooters” (my name, look like that) that are good to visit coral reefs in scuba suits or for some underwater sabotage, these would be most handy, but the range is short — no problem if the base ship can just park 5-10 miles away (more with military specs, I guess). They are small enough and light enough to be brought and taken away by a helicopter. In short, it was easiest for Americans. Poles could do it with American gear, not as easy, and far more difficult for Russia, the story of doing it while “passing by” hard to accept.
In a larger depth, I guess a submarine could come unnoticed, but this is a story for North Sea and different time.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Sep 28 2022 17:05 utc | 154

I doubt anything similar to the Nord Stream sabotage will happen to the new Polish pipeline, but if it did, I am interested in watching what would happen next. Russia is eerily silent. Will they continue with this attitude?

Posted by: joesph | Sep 28 2022 17:10 utc | 155

thanks b… thanks for the posters with insight too – old microbiologist and etc. etc…
@ Melaleuca – thanks for your posts..
@ cadence calls… my apologies again for saying that right after you posted… bad form on my part… it was meant to be general and it applies to me as well!
indian punchline article from today –
Attack on Nord Stream kills prospects for dialogue in Ukraine

Posted by: james | Sep 28 2022 17:10 utc | 156

IMO, the Global Times editorial writer wrote this item before examining evidence or asking PLA sources for comment. I’ll be curious to see how his position changes. I’ll add that China is affected by this terrorist act too because its main EU trading partner was Germany; and with Germany’s economy now effectively doomed, China will lose a significant portion of its EU commerce and income. Further as I’ve written, the entire EU economy will be trashed, which means Chian’s overall commerce with EU will significantly drop. And the only beneficiary from all that damage is the Outlaw US Empire.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 17:14 utc | 157

DAX index finishes up for the day. Euro up. Everything’s coming up roses.
It is all a simulacrum. Reality has been cancelled.

Posted by: oldhippie | Sep 28 2022 17:29 utc | 158

German intelligence services mentioned that it will be next to impossible to repair the 3 destroyed threads. From what I understood in the past, the German intelligence agencies are overcrawling with US assets. Russia claimed it’s possible to fix the 3 threads but without providing any timeframe yet. They’re not even allowed to approach the sight where it happened let alone inspect their damaged assets.
Either way, Scholz should get his act together, open the remaining Nord Stream 2 thread as a justified alternative to Nord Stream 1 and kick Baerbock and Habeck out of the coalition if they so much dare to squeak in protest. At least then in 3 months, when anarchy has set in, Germans will know he tried to do something.

Posted by: xor | Sep 28 2022 17:38 utc | 159

“The Prosecutor General’s Office of the Russian Federation initiated the initiation of a case on an act of international terrorism after damage to the Nord Stream.”
~ IntelSlava
For retaliation, Russia must form a blockade preventing delivery of cream cheese, bagels and lox to the Kagan/Nuland and Blinken households.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 17:39 utc | 160

I agree with the idea that this was a test run for viability of a nuclear false flag. Case in point: I discuss the situation and the mountain of circumstantial evidence already commonly available with my own family members, one of which dismisses the possibility that the US did this because “its too obvious” and “Russia could have done it.” These self-owning mental controls are common in the post-bombing dialogue. I’m convinced the Neocons looked at eliminating the possibility of Germany changing its mind about sanctions and decided this had to happen. But of course, it would be obvious because who else had the means, motivation and equipment on location to do it? And only complete idiots think the Russians are punching themselves in the face at Zaporizhzhia, bombing POWs and now this. Basically this event on the pipeline killed two birds at once: Germany is finally conquered and the effectiveness of the media/dissent controls during an event this bold and obvious can be determined. Clearly they already have a great deal of control, but cracks sometimes form and they need to be air tight for what is coming.

Posted by: Prompt Critical | Sep 28 2022 18:00 utc | 161

As far as I know there is now NO operating gas pipes to EU-rope with the exception of Turk Stream. Which probably doesn’t left over much, if any gas to central/western Europe after the Balkans, Greece, Turkey, Serbia and Hungary. Russia has shut the pipe going through Ukraine and they will probably shut the Yamal pipe too.
Scholz was in Saudi Arabia and got a grand total of one promised LNG tanker shipment delivery sometime… maybe next year?

Posted by: unimperator | Sep 28 2022 18:02 utc | 162

Russia claimed it’s possible to fix the 3 threads but without providing any timeframe yet. They’re not even allowed to approach the sight where it happened let alone inspect their damaged assets.
Posted by: xor | Sep 28 2022 17:38 utc | 159

My understanding is that the Swiss registered Gazprom subsidiary owned NS2 and they have filed for bankruptcy. Gazprom must have included some “force majeure” in the partnership agreements allowing them to inspect/protect/repair the asset in the case of these sorts of situations.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 18:04 utc | 163

I see the Ukraine thread is being polluted by commentary belonging here, which is rather sad, but altogether predictable. RT is now reporting what Peskov said:

Peskov also noted that neither Russia nor Europe had anything to gain from the destruction of the pipelines, especially Germany, for which this incident poses a threat to the future development of its industry, as well as its profitability and competitiveness.
American LNG suppliers, on the other hand, have been making incredible profits after having multiplied their deliveries to the European continent, Peskov pointed out, adding that these companies are “very interested in maintaining these super-duper profits in the future.”
While no suspects behind the incident have officially been named, the Kremlin spokesperson advised against making any official announcements before a proper investigation into the incident is carried out.
Peskov did, however, draw attention to US President Joe Biden’s statements from early February, when the American leader threatened to “bring an end” to Nord Stream 2. “What the US president meant by that, we don’t know,” admitted the Kremlin official, but highlighted the “borderline insane hysterical-euphoric reaction” of Polish officials who have already thanked Washington for sabotaging the pipeline.
The Kremlin’s response comes after some European and Kiev officials, including President Vladimir Zelensky’s adviser Mikhail Podolyak, suggested that the attack on the pipeline was a “false flag” operation carried out by Russia in order to make Ukraine look bad and to further drive energy prices up in the EU.

I still await Zakharova’s briefing to be posted at MFA.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 18:04 utc | 164

Posted by: Prompt Critical | Sep 28 2022 18:00 utc | 161
Agreed with the so-called “test run”. There will be a nuke false flag before the end of the year after which US may attempt to strike at Kaliningrad or Crimea. Better get the iodine tablets ready.

Posted by: unimperator | Sep 28 2022 18:05 utc | 165

Nord Stream Extension Project Information Document (PID) – 2013 [pdf]
For all ye engineers .. 🙂

Posted by: Oui | Sep 28 2022 18:13 utc | 166

NS2 – 2 pipes, steel with concrete cover, likely in a 2m trench: https://www.offshore-technology.com/projects/nord-stream-2-pipeline/
The Norway to UK pipeline was completed around 2006. A look at the tech involved:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-LbbNP58nk
Consider that was 16 years ago and ROVs and underwater tech in general has improved in the interim. As it is 1,200km in length it seems reasonable to conclude that there was some contingency planning for leaks and how to isolate them.

Posted by: the pessimist | Sep 28 2022 18:14 utc | 167

RT reports the statements of some very brain-dead German politicos who are blaming Russia for the terrorist attack.
Earlier it was commented that Russia has ceased gas flows through Ukraine, but I can’t find any verification in media. Bloomberg says EU has enough gas for winter, but that’s bogus as there’s not enough NOW for Germany’s economy to properly operate, nor will there be for many years.
All those wishing for a nuke to be used will now be satisfied that an equivalent has happened, for killing Germany’s economy provides destruction similar to widespread nuclear attack, only the killing will be slow and excruciatingly painful.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 18:15 utc | 168

The Prosecutor General’s Office of the Russian Federation initiated the initiation of a case on an act of international terrorism after the damage to the Nord Stream.
The terrorist state supported the Ukrainian terrorist regime, openly killed Iranian high-ranking military personnel, and is now blowing up gas pipelines in front of the whole world. It is in the interests of the world to neutralize this terrorist state.

Posted by: alaff | Sep 28 2022 18:31 utc | 169

All circumstantial evidence points to the USA. Any other theories require a degree of mental gymnastics.Some more than others.
Posted by: Bob | Sep 28 2022 9:59 utc | 1
No problem. Yenwoda’s got this. See yesterday’s thread in which he performs his impression of a pretzel.

Posted by: nwwoods | Sep 28 2022 18:32 utc | 170

Germany is not involved in the investigation.
German media insinuate that it was the Russians, these are the only ones explicitly mentioned as a possibility.
German “experts” are easily found which are willing to blame the Russians.
There seems to be something rotten in Germany.

Posted by: bottle | Sep 28 2022 18:43 utc | 171

osted by: nwwoods | Sep 28 2022 18:32 utc | 170
bad impression of a pretzel. everybody with any integrity or any sense knows it is a US/NATO operation.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Sep 28 2022 18:50 utc | 172

The problem with the German government: They did let it happen.

Posted by: Linus | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 173

The analysis below is directed at the “you can’t rule anything out” crowd on this forum.
If we’re going to “not rule anyone out” you might as well go ahead and rule everyone in.
Objective of the analysis:
1. Provide a framework for consistent evaluation of all potential actors. This allows all potential suspects to be evaluated based on the same logical system of reasoning, without bias and provides a starting point for improving the iterative consistency of analysis.
2. Explore a second category off potential perpetrators outside of the immediately obvious ones of the USA, Russia, Germany, Poland: China 2. India 3. israel/Mossad 4. Iran 5. Ukraine 6. The UK (MIx)
3. Inquiry into the nature of “evidence” and how/if truth can be derived from it in order to understand how far any amount of evidence can go in “revealing truth”
Scope of the analysis:
• Causes and effects of the pipeline sabotage at the geopolitical level, excluding the technical nature and execution of the pipeline sabotage itself
• We do not examine the technical execution of the pipeline destruction, but the tactical execution
• Exclude the most obvious state actors (Russia, the USA, Germany, Poland, the EU leadership) and focus on the less obvious, but viable actors
• We exclude Non-State-Actors (The New IRA, Chabad Lubovitch, Freemasons, Japanese Yakuza, Italian Mafia, Illuminati, Black Supremacist Movement, Branch Covidian Sect, Falun Gong etc …)
• Particularly, this analysis operates without access to direct forensic evidence of the act (e.g captured saboteurs, filmed evidence, sabotage instruments with genetic material or traceable serial numbers etc …). The reason for this is that direct forensic is unlikely to ever be found in this scenario. This is in effect an analysis of Circumstantial evidence.
Assumptions:
• NS1, NS2 were sabotaged using destructive, local, explosive force in 3 locations along the pipelines
• The destructive force was not remotely triggered by integrated telemetry systems built into NS1/NS2 (i.e not a self-destruct mechanism installed by the Russians as part of the pipeline infrastructure)
• NS1, NS2 are completely not in use. They are not generating any revenue for Russia or supplying gas to the EU.
Motive Space
Independent of why any party may have enacted the sabotage, what are the complete space of reasons (within sane boundaries) why it may be sabotaged in general?
Why blow up a pipeline?
a) To benefit a competing economic project (e.g the Norway-Poland gas)
b) As an economic attack on a State and it’s people
c) To drive shifts to new economic policy (e.g, force independence from Russian gas supplies)
d) As a false flag by a third party to trigger war between competing states (e.g, the Lusitania, the Maine, the Gulf of Tonkin etc …)
Parameters of analysis:
What are the dimensions or axes along which we analysis each potential perpetrator?
a) Motive (weight = 20%) :
• “Motive” refers to a single reason which provides a compelling justification for carrying out an act. It is unique in that no other set of potential reasons could provide the same compelling reason for the act.
• Motive may not specifically translate to “benefit” in the economic or military sense but may include things like “retaliation” against states, or obtaining radical leverage over a a power bloc
(NOTE: “motive” is not to confused with mere benefits of doing a thing, which are neither unique, nor generally significantly compelling).
b) Means weight 10%:
• Does the actor have the technological, tactical, strategic and political means to execute the act?
c) Benefit (weight 10%):
• Cui Bono? What is the specific benefit(s) to be gained
• “Benefit” is not “Motive”. Benefit is more general, less unique as a driving force for carrying out the act and would primarily include significant economic and strategic leverage gains.
d) Deterrents (Risks/consequences) weight = 20%:
• Every act comes with risks, some serious enough to. deter the act completely.
e) Past Patterns of Behaviour (“Consistency with Past Actions”) weight = 5%:
• Does the prospective perpetrator have a history of executing similar acts?
• Patterns of historical behaviour on the part of States suggest long term policy which make such acts a standard part of it’s operating philosophy.
f) Implications (weight = 5% max if plausible):
• Whatever the verdict we accept on whether the suspected perpetrator was guilty of the act, implications will arise, and we must be prepared to accept those implications if we’re willing to pass a verdict of “guilty”.
• These implications may be significantly unrealistic to force us to revisit our verdict and assumptions and perhaps even change them …
g) Impunity / Immunity (weight = 20%)
• The “get out of jail free” card
• If a potential perpetrator holds the “impunity” card, i.e it’s highly likely to be able to get away with the act even it it should be found to be the perpetrator, it increases the likelihood that, given the benefits, utility, motive and past patterns of behaviour, the act would have been committed in the knowledge that the consequences would be insignificant.
h) Verdict:
• A determination of “Guilty or not Guilty?” can never be made in the absence of unambiguous forensic evidence. Even strong circumstantial evidence does not provide mathematical truth.
• All that can be done is pass a verdict of “Most likely to be guilty” by adding up the parameters a) to h) and ordering the perpetrators in sequence of likelyhood.
Now, on to our suspects:
1. China
– Motive : 0
• None. There is no single, strongly motivating political, military, strategic leverage that can be gained over Europe, by China in destroying Russian supply lines
– Means : 5
• While China has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations it lacks the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea.
– Benefit: 5
• Same as India: Long Term gas supply contracts for supplying the EU with gas (of course, resold from Russia …).
– Deterrents: 0
• Loss of revenue due to enhanced EU sanctions as a consequence
• Loss of a geopolitical counter-balance to the USA and India (due to degraded economic trade links)
• Loss of diplomatic trust globally
• China is a culturally and politically conservative society with an aversion to risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour (“Purity Test”) 0
• Modern China has no record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity 0
• Neutral: China doesn’t appear to have impunity in the event it is identified as the perpetrator. The EU can retaliate against China to a moderate degree economically but not militarily.
– Implications: 0
• If this act was executed by China it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• China is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU or Russia, have demonstrated an inclination to act against both interests
• Countries might have to consider potential Chinese subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purely Chinese economic gain
• The USA would have been justified in it’s singling out of China as a threat to the West, potentially increasing military tensions
– Verdict:
• Extremely unlikely: China has minimal motivation moderate means, no past history of sabotage and faces significant deterrent factors with no impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are implausible.
• score: 10%
2. India
– Motive : 0
• None. There is no single, strongly motivating political, military, strategic leverage that can be gained over Europe, by India in destroying Russian supply lines
– Means : 2
• While India has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations it lacks the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea.
– Benefit: 5
• Long Term gas supply contracts for supplying the EU with gas (of course, resold from Russia …).
– Deterrents: 0
• Loss of revenue due to enhanced EU sanctions as a consequence
• Loss of a geopolitical counter-balance to the USA and India (due to degraded economic trade links)
• Loss of diplomatic trust globally
• India is a culturally and politically conservative society with an aversion to risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour: 0
• Modern India has no record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity: 0
• Neutral: India doesn’t appear to have impunity in the event it is identified as the perpetrator. However, it’s unclear the EU has the means to retaliate against the India due to it’s political support by the USA and need for it’s counterbalance to China.
– Implications: 0
• If this act was executed by India it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• China is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU or Russia, have demonstrated an inclination to act against both interests
• Countries might have to consider potential Indian subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purely Indian economic gain
– Verdict:
• Extremely unlikely: India has minimal motivation moderate means, no past history of sabotage and faces significant deterrent factors with no impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are implausible.
score: 7%
3. israel/Mossad
– Motive : 10
• A historical animus against Germany, German interests stemming from the events of WW2 would provide israel with latent motivation for subverting German interests.
• A weakened EU will leave israel with more political power over the EU, thereby increasing the leverage it has over it’s institutions which israel may then use to support it’s objectives in the middle east
– Means : 10
• Israel has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations and it posesses the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea due to the fact that it holds significant political influence over european governments via it’s intelligence agencies and embedded “influence operators” which have infiltrated european and american institutions.
• While not possessing the tactical and strategic means on its own, it is able to co-opt European and American institutions to act in its favour.
– Benefit: 10
• Economic: Long Term gas supply contracts for supplying the EU with gas (of course, resold from Russia …).
• Geopolitical: EU support in capturing the gas fields of Lebanon and Palestine
– Deterrents: 15
• Temporary degraded diplomatic relations with Germany and Russia
– Past Patterns of Behaviour: 5
• Negative: israel has a long established and well documented record of using sabotage to achieve geopolitical ends on a global scale.
– Impunity / Immunity: 5
• israel is essentially immune to any EU retaliation in consequence
– Implications: 5
• If this act was executed by israel it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• israel is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU or Russia, have demonstrated an inclination to act against both interests
• Countries might have to consider potential israeli subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purely israeli economic gain
– Verdict:
• Highly likely: Israel has significant motivation, significant means, a documented past history of sabotage and faces only minor deterrent factors with significant impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are highly plausible.
score: 60%
4. Iran
– Motive : 10
• Iran has a motive to weaken the European economy, weaken Europe geo-politically and may possess an animus against the EU due to decades of European sanctions and support for anti Iranian activities.
• Iran is in direct geopolitical conflict with Europe
– Means : 0
• While Iran has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations it lacks the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea.
• Effectively, Iran has no means to carry out such an act of sabotage unless we attribute absurdly sophisticated technical capabilities to it.
– Benefit: 2
• Minor possibility of obtaining gas supply contracts to the EU.
• Offset by the presence of many competing suppliers.
• Minor reduction of EU geopolitical power, therefore ability to pressure Iran on the JCPOA and other areas.
– Deterrents: 0
• Risk of immediate military retaliation by the EU and USA
• Immediate nullification of all diplomatic relations with the EU
• Reduction of diplomatic trust globally
• Loss of diplomatic relations with an ally, Russia
• Iran is a culturally and politically conservative society with an aversion to risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour: 0
• Modern Iran has no record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity: 0
• No impunity/immunity whatsoever from EU or US retaliation. Retaliation would be likely military in nature.
– Implications: 0
• If this act was executed by iran it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• Iran is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU or Russia, have demonstrated an inclination to act against both interests
• Countries might have to consider potential israeli subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purely israeli economic gain
– Verdict:
• Extremely unlikely: Iran has substantial motivation, no means, no past history of sabotage and faces drastic deterrent factors with no impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are implausible.
score: 12%
5. Ukraine
– Motive : 20
• Strong motivation to destroy NS1, NS2 in favour of it’s own pipelines to obtain political, strategic, economic leverage over the EU
• Strong motivation to retaliate against Russian infrastructure as part of military counter srikes
– Means : 7
• Ukraine has neither the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations and it lacks the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea.
• However it has been able to suborn the military and political institutions of the EU and NATO to serve it’s objectives and may have influenced NATO/EU countries to act
• We deem it to have the technical, tactical and strategic means to perpetrate the act.
– Benefit: 10
• Economic: Substantial Long Term gas supply contracts for supplying the EU with gas (of course, resold from Russia …).
• Weakening the EU, perhaps leaving Ukraine as the strongest state in Europe … ?
– Deterrents: 2
• Minor: Temporary degraded diplomatic relations with Germany and Russia
• Ukrainian leadership has a high appetite for risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour: 5
• Negative: Ukraine has a recently established and well documented record of using sabotage to achieve geopolitical ends on a global scale.
– Impunity / Immunity: 5
• Ukraine is essentially immune to any EU retaliation in consequence
– Implications: 5
• If this act was executed by Ukraine it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions (Plausible)
• Ukraine is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU or Russia, have demonstrated an inclination to act against both interests
• Countries might have to consider potential israeli subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purely israeli economic gain
– Verdict:
• Highly Likely: Ukraine has significant motivation, significant means, a documented past history of sabotage and faces only minor deterrent factors with significant impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are highly plausible.
score: 54%
6. The UK (MIx)
– Motive : 20
• The UK has a stated motive, largely emotional and cultural, to perpetrate acts of destruction against Russian infrastructure.
• The UK has an opportunity to degrade and weaken a historical enemy (Germany) , leaving it as the most powerful state in Europe (we count the UK as essentially “in europe”)
– Means : 10
• Significant: The UK has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations and it posesses the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea due to the fact that it holds significant political influence over european governments via it’s intelligence agencies and embedded “influence operators” which have infiltrated european and american institutions.
– Benefit: 10
• Significant Economic: Substantial Long Term gas supply contracts for supplying the EU with gas (of course, resold from Russia …).
• Significant: Weakening the EU, perhaps leaving the UK as the strongest state in Europe … ?
– Deterrents: 10
• Minor: Temporary degraded diplomatic relations with Germany
• The UK is a somewhat culturally and politically conservative society with a medium appetite for risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour: 0
• Neutral: The British use of sabotage in false flags is unclear. (FYI – google is censoring results for research on this …)
– Impunity / Immunity: 2
• The UK doesn’t appear to have impunity in the event it is identified as the perpetrator.
• However, it’s unclear the EU has the means to retaliate against the UK due to it’s political support by the USA.
– Implications: 2
• If this act was executed by the UK it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• UK is no longer a trustworthy economic and political partner for the EU having demonstrated an inclination to act it’s interests
• Countries might have to consider potential UK subversion and sabotage against their infrastructure in future for purelyUK economic gain
– Verdict:
• Highly likely: Israel has significant motivation, significant means, an unclear past history of sabotage but faces only moderate deterrent factors with some impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are highly plausible.
score: 54%
Ranking perpetrators in order of likely-hood:
1. israel (60%)
2. Ukraine (54%)
3. UK (54%)
4. Iran (12%)
5. China (10%)
6. India (7%)
Conclusions
• As we can see israel scores the highest based on this systematic framework of analysis, followed by the UK, India and China scores the least. This corresponds to an intuitive sense of the likelihood these actors perpetrated the act.
• If we were to proceed mechanically according to this framework, israel could very reasonably be presented as a likely perpetrator of the NS1, N2 pipeline sabotage …
• This analysis shows that the space of potential perpetrators can be *reasonably* expanded far beyond the initial, apparent list of likely candidates. The truth is rarely cut and dried …
Finally, even if none of the identified actors are the actual perpetrator, this analysis indicates Germany is surrounded by parties which while ostensibly appear to be allies, have substantial benefits to gain in acting against it’s interests …
Potential next steps in this analysis:
• Perhaps apply this methodology to the USA, Russia, Poland and Germany ?
• Examine the combinations of actors working in concert to execute the act, on the premise that benefits, motivations, utility arises in commonality when more than one actor is involved …

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 174

@ Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 174 with the analysis
Interesting but long and obfuscatory IMO
Your analysis does not include the US which is a prime suspect nor is their any mention of the fact that all of this is being done, not by any sovereign nation (because they are not), but under the control of the God Of Mammon global finance cult

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 19:06 utc | 175

Victoria Nuland: f#ck the EU.
Germany: no kisses?

Posted by: El Cid | Sep 28 2022 19:08 utc | 176

Comes to something when even Forbes thinks it was America.

Posted by: Bob | Sep 28 2022 19:11 utc | 177

“How does Russia benefit from orchestrating such a false flag operation?”
Does the name “Tonkin Gulf” ring a bell? Of course it serves as a false flag mission for the Russians, they are already blaming Norwegian deep sea divers from Tromsø in the interwebs. Its the marines out of Petersburg trying to be clever. Well, bring it on.

Posted by: Fnord73 | Sep 28 2022 19:13 utc | 178

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 19:06 utc | 175

Interesting but long and obfuscatory IMO

Thanks for the feedback. It is obfuscatory because it is long. Hard to avoid it.

Your analysis does not include the US which is a prime suspect nor is their any mention of the fact that all of this is being done, not by any sovereign nation … God of Mammon

I stated that in the scope exclusions, anticipating you would say that (see the list of wacky Non-State Actors) …
I’m leaving out the prime suspect because it’s been done to death already.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:13 utc | 179

@ Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:13 utc | 179 with the response to my concerns about their analysis…
I know I am a broken record and I am not trying to defend my fellow Americans but the real enemy is supra-national and they are playing nations off against each other. This keeps the focus off them and they continue their global control shit…I want it to stop and only know to try to get people focused on the folks behind the curtain.
I consider all other efforts to be obfuscatory and a waste of energy better spent on the real enemy.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 19:21 utc | 180

@ Et Tu | Sep 28 2022 17:03 utc | 152 “Tagesspiegel seems to imply the pipelines are likely gone FOREVER due to salt corrosion.”
I’m not an engineer, but I would take the salt corrosion panic mongering of MSM with a pinch of salt. 1) The Baltic sea is rather brackish than salty 2) There is little oxygen at the Baltic Sea bottom (caused by the brackish environment), so even when the pipes of NS1 & NS2 wouldn’t have a protective coating, the problem of corrosion is IMO manageable. 3) NS1 & NS2 do have an anti-corrosive coating.

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Sep 28 2022 19:21 utc | 181

Escobar’s article on the terrorist attack is out, published by Iran’s PressTV, “Germany and EU have been handed over a declaration of war”:
“The sabotage of the Nord Stream (NS) and Nord Stream 2 (NS2) pipelines in the Baltic Sea has ominously propelled ‘Disaster Capitalism’ to a whole new, toxic level.
“This episode of Hybrid Industrial/Commercial War, in the form of a terror attack against energy infrastructure in international waters signals the absolute collapse of international law, drowned by a ‘our way or the highway’, ‘rules-based’, order.”
Pepe relates this info that was unknown to me:
“This was far from an isolated attack. On September 22 there was an attempt against Turkish Stream by Kiev saboteurs. The day before, naval drones with English language IDs were found in Crimea, suspected of being part of the plot. Add to it US helicopters overflying the future sabotage nodes weeks ago; a UK “research” vessel loitering in Danish waters since mid-September; and NATO tweeting about the testing of “new unmanned systems at sea” on the same day of the sabotage.” [My Emphasis]
Pepe brings up numerous related topics:
“Meanwhile, EU energy giants are bound to lose big time with the sabotage.
“The roll call includes the German Wintershall Dea AG and PEG/ E.ON; the Dutch N.V. Nederlandse Gasunie; and the French ENGIE. Then there are those which financed NS2: Wintershall Dea again as well as Uniper; Austrian OMV; ENGIE again; and British-Dutch Shell. Wintershall Dea and ENGIE are both co-owners and creditors. Their fuming shareholders will want serious answers from a serious investigation.
“It gets worse: there are no holds barred anymore on the Pipeline Terror front. Russia will be on red alert not only for Turk Stream but also Power of Siberia. Same for the Chinese and their maze of pipelines arriving in Xinjiang.
“Whatever the methodology and the actors who were in the loop, this is payback – in advance – for the inevitable collective West defeat in Ukraine. And a crude warning to the Global South that they will do it again. Yet action always breeds reaction: from now on, ‘funny things’ could also happen to US/UK pipelines in international waters.”
Pepe goes on to illustrate this very important collateral damage:
“The EU oligarchy is reaching an advanced process of disintegration at lightning speed. Their window of opportunity to at least attempt a role as a strategically autonomous geopolitical actor is now closed.
“These EUROcrats now face a serious predicament. Once it’s clear who are the perpetrators of the sabotage in the Baltic, and once they understand all the life-changing socio-economic consequences for pan-EU citizens, the kabuki will have to stop. Including the already running, uber-ridiculous subplot that Russia blew up its own pipeline when Gazprom could simply have turned off the valves for good.
“And once again, it gets worse: Gazprom is threatening to sue the Ukrainian energy company Naftofgaz for unpaid bills. That would lead to the end of Russian gas transiting Ukraine towards the EU.
As if all of that was not serious enough, Germany is contractually obligated to purchase at least 40 billion cubic meters of Russian gas a year until 2030.
“Just say no? They can’t: Gazprom is legally entitled to get paid even without shipping gas. That’s the spirit of a long-term contract. And it’s already happening: because of sanctions, Berlin does not get all the gas it needs but still needs to pay.” [My Emphasis]
Yes, you’ll read some of my analyses mixed with Pepe’s. Pepe was also on RT’s Crosstalk yesterday.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 19:25 utc | 182

(((Applebaum, Nuland, Pyatt)))
The truth is hate speech for those who hate the truth.
https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/09/27/americas-jews-driving-u-s-wars-philip-giraldi/

Posted by: J. Cosgrove | Sep 28 2022 19:27 utc | 183

b writes, “The Poles should be reminded that other countries also have the capabilities to sabotage sub sea pipelines.”
bingo!
Poland and the US-centralized Empire are terrorist states. Do terror, receive terror.
They are also vulnerable along many underwater cables and pipelines which lie in international waters. Where this escalation goes I don’t know….. but, well, history as a guide would lead me to believe that it heads towards more war.
https://twitter.com/LeeFerguson111/status/1574812794062618624
This is the new Norway-Poland Baltic Pipeline that just coincidentally opened today. It kinda reminds me of people in glass houses.

Posted by: michaelj72 | Sep 28 2022 19:28 utc | 184

Arch Bungle @174–
Sorry, but you bungled your analysis by omitting the economic damage China will suffer as a result of destroying the EU’s economy. I stopped reading at that point. Your effort ought to be commended, however.

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 19:31 utc | 185

Don’t know if it represents the majority of Poles but based on some who I’ve interacted with, they seem to be aware that either they or US did it, yet they are trying to force Natostan public opinion to “accept” that Russians did it. And now they want the article 5 and want US to attack Kaliningrad. I can see US expecting a Russian retaliation and they are probably expecting it in North Sea platforms or either Poland-Norway pipe. Natostan then presents this retaliation saying that the NS pipes were a “warning of more serious things to come” and then they present the retaliation on this Nato attack as an unprovoked attack.
Their government also started handing the Poles iodine tablets just a week ago. They must be aware of a certain US plan.

Posted by: unimperator | Sep 28 2022 19:32 utc | 186

If someone in Germany or in the EU was thinking of making peace with Russia fueled by gas, this is now gone.
Who will stop the madness, against US strong will, if it can’t bring economic dividends ?
Integration of Ukrainian oblasts into Russia will likely lead Russia to escalate the conflict into official war : since Ukraine will keep, and if possible increase, pounding of the now Russian land and people.
Official state of war will make western military support cobelligerance.
Europe is now almost locked in inescapable war path against Russia.

Posted by: Saracen’s Head | Sep 28 2022 19:34 utc | 187

The CCP benefits more than anyone; they are not a suspect, so their hands are clean; it hurts all their Western rivals; and they are the likely new buyers of the gas that Russia can no longer ship to Europe.
Since the current US government is essentially a CCP occupation regime, a very straightforward explanation is that the US puppet government did indeed follow through with its threats in the manner that most benefits its CCP patrons.
Another alternative to consider is the WEF/Soros crew acting independently of any government. They are in the business of causing catastrophic outcomes in order to profit from the fallout. Checking to see who recently took large financial positions that would benefit from this event might be a fruitful line of investigation. They would probably have the resources to pull off a Bond villain stunt like this, and if they could hurt Russia badly while reaping billions off the fallout, it would be very much in their interests to do so.

Posted by: ARB | Sep 28 2022 19:34 utc | 188

NS1 & NS2 have been created in order to circumvent the rogue state Ukraine. Soon Russia will make short work of this rogue state. Then the old gas pipelines will be refurbished by Gazprom, and voilá: Gas will flow into Europe again, (perhaps redirected towards the friendly country Hungary in order to circumvent Poland).

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Sep 28 2022 19:34 utc | 189

> Why is Ukraine not being mentioned as a possible culprit?
because Ukraine is not an independent self-directing entity; all its decisions are made by the other players under discussion
no decision of this magnitude could originate in Kiev

Posted by: ARB | Sep 28 2022 19:40 utc | 190

Letting Russia of the hook from the get go sounds to me like a highly ideological and naive type of reasoning. This is not a “clean” war as it’s about existential being of world powers. And that war has started long time ago. And what kind of actions would be out of bounds with such a conflict?
Posted by: John Dowser | Sep 28 2022 10:26 utc | 11
Did you read anything that B wrote in is summary? You know above the comments. Let me give you a hint: “Whodunnit? – Facts Related to The Sabotage Attack On The Nord Stream Pipelines.” You are supposed to read it first before you make stupid statements like, “Letting Russia of the hook from the get-go sounds to me like a highly ideological and naive type of reasoning.” Really, is that what it sounds like? If you are not a Ukie Troll, you sure sound like one.

Posted by: Guernica | Sep 28 2022 19:41 utc | 191

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 174
You win the thread. LOL

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Sep 28 2022 19:56 utc | 192

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 174

A new MoA record for the waste of screen space.
China… no motive??? The less gas sent to Europe in the long term means more for them at lower prices 😉
In any case, we know it is not China. Bad for business.
Your analysis does not include the downside risk of getting caught. We all know who scores top prize there.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 19:58 utc | 193

Continuing on with the framework of analysis in 174, based on psycho’s advice:
We evaluate USA, Russia and Poland. Basically, the framework, even when mechanically applied, agrees with the broad consensus expressed on this forum.
1. Russia
– Motive : 0
• There is no additional military motive for hitting NS2, NS1 that could not be achieved to much greater effect by hitting the Ukrainian pipelines instead
• No strong geopolitical leverage , by means of economic leverage to be gained by destroying NS1/NS2. The pipelines were no longer active, effectively
– Means : 5
• While Russia has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations it lacks the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea in stealth.
– Benefit: 0
• Russia makes 0 economic gains and in fact makes an economic loss on NS1, NS2
– Deterrents: 0
• Loss of potential future revenue due to enhanced EU sanctions as a consequence and potential future contracts
• Loss of a geopolitical counter-balance to the USA in the form of Europe (due to degraded economic trade links)
• Loss of diplomatic trust globally
• Russia is a culturally and politically conservative society with an moderate appetite for risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour (“Purity Test”): 0
• Modern Russia has no record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity 0
• Neutral: Russia doesn’t appear to have impunity in the event it is identified as the perpetrator and stands to suffer consequences in terms of loss of global trust
– Implications: 5
• If this act was executed by Russia it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• The Russian state would have displayed a substantial appetite for self destructive behaviour
• The Russians would be indicating an intention to shut off diplomatic links with the EU for years to come (short, medium term)
– Verdict:
• Extremely unlikely: Russia has no motivation. moderate means, no past history of sabotage and faces significant deterrent factors with no impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are implausible.
• score: 5%
2. Poland
– Motive : 20
• Poland has publicly expressed an animus towards Russia and a desire to see it destroyed.
• Poland has a competing pipeline to NS1/NS2 which would provide it geopolitical leverage in the EU
– Means : 10
• Poland has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations as well as the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea in stealth.
– Benefit: 10
• Poland makes significant economic gains on it’s own current Norway-Poland pipeline without the competing NS1/NS2
– Deterrents: 5
• Moderate: Loss of diplomatic trust globally
• Moderate: Retaliation from Russia
• Poland is a culturally and politically conservative society with a low appetite for risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour (“Purity Test”): 5
• Modern Poland has no record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity: 20
• Moderate: Poland has moderate immunity from consequences.
– Implications: 5
• If this act was executed by Poland it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU and the USA – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European and American institutions
• Poland would indicate it is willing to destroy the potential future economic interests of Germany for its own economic gain
• Poland would effectively be indicating willingness to commit acts of war on Russian infrastructure
– Verdict:
• Highly likely: Poland has substantial motivation, significant means, faces moderate deterrent factors with some impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are plausible.
• score: 75%
3. USA
– Motive : 20
• The USA has publicly expressed an animus towards Russia and a desire to see it destroyed.
• USA has competing LNG to NS1/NS2 which would provide it geopolitical leverage in the EU
• Russia is the USA’s primary geopolitical opponent
– Means : 10
• USA has the technical means for sophisticated sabotage operations as well as the tactical and strategic means to operate *effectively* in the Baltic Sea in stealth.
– Benefit: 10
• USA makes significant economic gains on it’s own current LNG supplies without the competing NS1/NS2
– Deterrents: 20
• Inisignificant: Loss of diplomatic trust globally (couldn’t sink any lower)
• Insignificant: Retaliation from Russia
• The USA is a culturally and politically liberal society with a high appetite for risk
– Past Patterns of Behaviour (“Purity Test”): 5
• The USA has a significant record of systematic use of sabotage for geopolitical ends.
– Impunity / Immunity: 20
• The USA has egregious impunity from the consequences of it’s actions
– Implications: 15
• If this act was executed by USA it would indicate a level of technological, tactical and strategic sophistication far beyond the capabilities of NATO, the EU – OR –
• An egregious level of infiltration and co-option of European institutions
• USA would indicate it is willing to destroy the potential future economic interests of Germany for its own economic gain
• USA would effectively be indicating willingness to commit acts of war on Russian infrastructure
– Verdict:
• Extremely Likely: USA has substantial motivation, substantial means, faces no deterrent factors with total impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are plausible.
• score: 100%
Ranking in order of likelyhood:
USA: 100%
Poland: 75%
Russia: 5%
Conclusion:
• The USA appears to be almost certain to be the the perpetrator
• It would appear that even China and India have a higher likelihood than Russia of destroying NS1 and NS2, by this framework of analysis.
• It would appear the Poland has a higher likelihood than Ukraine, UK, israel of being the perpetrator and is next in line after the USA

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:58 utc | 194

Posted by: karlof1 | Sep 28 2022 19:31 utc | 185

Sorry, but you bungled your analysis by omitting the economic damage China will suffer as a result of destroying the EU’s economy

Karlof, dear I indicated it clearly. I just didn’t bang on ad nauseam about it as you’d normally do:

– Deterrents: 0
Loss of revenue due to enhanced EU sanctions as a consequence
• Loss of a geopolitical counter-balance to the USA and India (due to degraded economic trade links)
– Verdict:
• Extremely unlikely: China has minimal motivation moderate means, no past history of sabotage and faces significant deterrent factors with no impunity from consequences. The implications of it being the actor are implausible.
• score: 10%

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 20:04 utc | 195

@ Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Sep 28 2022 19:34 utc | 189
thank you. i like the way you think.
my anxiety levels just went from 95% to 85%. I will take what i can get…

Posted by: Et Tu | Sep 28 2022 20:04 utc | 196

@ Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Sep 28 2022 19:21 utc | 181
Your corrosion comment with a pinch of salt pun, intended or not, just brought it down another 5% :))

Posted by: Et Tu | Sep 28 2022 20:07 utc | 197

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Sep 28 2022 19:58 utc | 193

China… no motive??? The less gas sent to Europe in the long term means more for them at lower prices 😉

China can get all it wants from Iran if it so wishes. However, the bigger the European market, the more it can resell Russian gas to Europe (LNG?).
(You and karlof seem to diametrically opposed on this point, perhaps you two should nuke each other out of the picture …)

Your analysis does not include the downside risk of getting caught. We all know who scores top prize there.

I specifically included a “Deterrents” section. I suspect b’s crusty blog software ruins the presentation.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 20:10 utc | 198

@ Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 19:00 utc | 174
I think you need to elaborate on a few points mate.. for example… did you realise this is an internet blog’s comment section, and not the the London Review of Books submissions portal?

Posted by: Et Tu | Sep 28 2022 20:15 utc | 199

Posted by: psychohistorian | Sep 28 2022 19:21 utc | 180

I know I am a broken record and I am not trying to defend my fellow Americans but the real enemy is supra-national and they are playing nations off against each other.

It’s clear nations are the “means” and supra-national players are the masters of the means.
However I think it’s important to begin with observing the “means” first, then drill deeper.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 28 2022 20:15 utc | 200