Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict …
The open thread for other issues is here.
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June 12, 2022
Ukraine Open Thread 2022-85
Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict … The open thread for other issues is here.
Comments
Ho hum, in other news about country 404 self destructive internal corruption and theft . Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Jun 13 2022 5:35 utc | 301 @ Peter AU1 | Jun 13 2022 5:23 utc | 299 with the MoA tweet of the EU bull going over the cliff. Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 13 2022 5:36 utc | 302 Bevin @268
Conrad’s family were Polish nobility. I’m sure he’s turning in his grave at being referred to as Ukraine’s finest novelist! Posted by: Herr Ringbone | Jun 13 2022 5:49 utc | 303 Hurry! Buy now to support the American Red Cross in the 404! Posted by: Old Coot | Jun 13 2022 6:48 utc | 304 Ruble strengthening again, at this rate the Russian Central Bank will have to make another sizeable cut in Russian interest rates, to significantly below the level just before the special operation. All good for Russia, and internal retail prices actually falling now. So pls spare us the uninformed blabber. (Being charitable here and not saying you’re lying!) Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 13 2022 7:00 utc | 306 @ Roger | Jun 13 2022 6:58 utc | 305 watching the markets….me too but headed for sleep time. Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 13 2022 7:05 utc | 307 PeterAU @288 is right. There is a lot more to the titanium supply issue than first meets the eye. Including security of supply for military aircraft – and rockets (let alone howitzers). Posted by: powerandpeople | Jun 13 2022 7:22 utc | 308 If you are interested on the language problem of two (or more parts) Ukraine and why this SMO is more of a civil war in the former Ukraine, have look, https://youtu.be/NgaRafZA7Bk the girl is an Ukrainian. Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 7:29 utc | 309 @Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 13 2022 7:05 utc | 307 Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 13 2022 7:05 utc | 307 Posted by: Scorpion | Jun 13 2022 7:45 utc | 311 It explains a lot of his kowtowing to the west over the years.
Also, in 1857 , when he was born, there was no “Failed State” called Ukraine. Posted by: Tom_12 | Jun 13 2022 7:45 utc | 312 @Bevin, 218. You explained why immigrants flee US scorched earth meddling, but you didn’t answer Bobokinski’s valid question of why immigrants prefer shithole US to Mexico. “Americans don’t seem to realise that, being generally protected by two oceans, most of the people they impoverish and drive from their homes never make it to America- instead, ask the Turks or the EU, they drift into Europe.” Posted by: Willow | Jun 13 2022 7:50 utc | 313 Russia to ‘completely cut off’ key city – CNN headline Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 7:53 utc | 314 Sorry to sound classist but: Happy Monday (13.06.2022) in Kherson, https://youtu.be/8zIWAxPI5IE Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 8:02 utc | 316 Odessa in the morning today, https://youtu.be/O6QJOx-GMOQ Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 8:11 utc | 317 „ for almost half a century, France stayed outside of NATO (approximately from 1960 to 2010). Posted by: njet | Jun 13 2022 8:20 utc | 318 Fuel prices in Melitopol 2 days ago, https://youtu.be/FHYr08KMzIY Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 8:25 utc | 319 the mysterious f-35 . lets not forget syria claimed a ancient s300 lock and hit. israel claimed a bird strike on the same day shogui was in syria. 2017 i think. f35 natural habitat is a hanger awaiting parts and design upgrades. my guess is russia just needs to train geese to fly various altitudes for air defence then. Posted by: hankster | Jun 13 2022 8:26 utc | 320 Posted by: Roger | Jun 13 2022 7:33 utc | 310 Posted by: AbjectSaver | Jun 13 2022 8:47 utc | 321 Every war of the US was supported by France. Posted by: laguerre | Jun 13 2022 8:58 utc | 322 Karl luck #294
That sounds desirable. As I understand it, Russia has declared a debt jubilee for the people in the east that have aligned their independent states with Russia. A good thing. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jun 13 2022 9:23 utc | 323 Old Coot #304
The American Red Cross did you say? Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jun 13 2022 9:31 utc | 324 Then again if the entire Ukraine just vanishes in a Great People’s Victory there will be no debt owed by a nonexistent nation. That also sounds good to me. Posted by: Bemildred | Jun 13 2022 10:05 utc | 325 Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 13 2022 7:00 utc | 306 Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 10:18 utc | 326 Apologies for the all italics post. There should have been a closing after the first paragraph. Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 10:19 utc | 327 @ostro 314 Posted by: LeMoyne | Jun 13 2022 10:50 utc | 328 From Intelslava: https://t.me/intelslava/31094 Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 10:59 utc | 329 Azovstal bunkers, exclusive 13.06.2022 https://youtu.be/gW9a16An9qc Posted by: ostro | Jun 13 2022 11:07 utc | 330
Serbia is (thanks God) not YET a member of EU. Posted by: LongCovid | Jun 13 2022 11:22 utc | 331 Scorpion that comment of yours regarding Churchill was perhaps the best, in a literary sense, that I have had the pleasure of reading here. Posted by: anon2020 | Jun 13 2022 11:25 utc | 332 “people can’t complain about gas prices….. if there’s no gas.” joe tzu Posted by: Immaculate deception | Jun 13 2022 11:25 utc | 333 @Posted by: Kingsmeg | Jun 12 2022 22:11 utc | 225 Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Jun 13 2022 11:31 utc | 334 Video by Russophone Ukrainian logger Yuri Podolyaka on Ukrainian Casualties in Russian – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2exHGAMITE Posted by: Aslangeo | Jun 13 2022 11:32 utc | 335 Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 10:18 utc | 326 Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 13 2022 11:47 utc | 336 Scorpion @ 281 Posted by: oldhippie | Jun 13 2022 11:53 utc | 337 Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jun 13 2022 9:23 utc | 323
It’s been said over the course of many US military operations that the US would have been better off just dropping money to the civilians. I think that there’s something to be said of such. And when you think of it it’s pretty much how things operate on a regular basis: bribes, though to the “connected.” Speaking of… Posted by: Seer | Jun 13 2022 12:03 utc | 338 Posted by: c1ue | Jun 12 2022 21:15 utc | 203
Ah! But it’s a matter of perspective. For the MIC it’s a HUGE success! That’s how the US wars have gone: “victory” is assessed based on how much looting of the US citizens has taken place (and to a large degree it’s about making sure that such monies aren’t applied to actual social programs). Posted by: Seer | Jun 13 2022 12:09 utc | 339 Posted by: Roger | Jun 13 2022 7:33 utc | 310 Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jun 13 2022 12:12 utc | 340 You just projected on France your American obsession about Soviet Union. Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jun 13 2022 12:22 utc | 341 Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 13 2022 11:47 utc | 336 Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 12:30 utc | 342
I never inconvenience myself with backing up any of my arguments with facts. We live in a post-fact world, doncha know. I could have posted a video clip from the movie Up, of the dogs yelling “Squirrel!”, I suppose. Posted by: Kingsmeg | Jun 13 2022 12:37 utc | 343 If you are just in love with ancien regime go stand in line to see the Queen. We have absolutely no idea who wrote Churchills books. To call Churchill a working man in any way shape or form is lunacy. Those who bought his books were the idiots who line up for royal pageants. What are you doing here as a monarchist? We have absolutely no idea who wrote Churchills books. Herr Ringbone@303 Posted by: bevin | Jun 13 2022 13:28 utc | 346 To a large degree it’s about making sure that such monies aren’t applied to actual social programs. Posted by: John Kennard | Jun 13 2022 13:46 utc | 347 …. nevertheless the tradition is that once you are at war you hang together until the war is won and you’ve drawn your last breath – no matter the cause – and in that there is honor. Posted by: Tom_12 | Jun 13 2022 14:01 utc | 348 Posted by: Scorpion | Jun 13 2022 12:38 utc | 344 Posted by: Arganthonios | Jun 13 2022 14:20 utc | 349 Would you be willing to stand by your words if you met the Ukies sitting in the Eastern trenches ? Could you keep a straight face doing that ? I for one could see no way to do that. Seriously, this is some high octane medievalist wanking. Scorpion 2281 Posted by: bevin | Jun 13 2022 14:38 utc | 352 Posted by: KyleKoffler | Jun 13 2022 12:30 utc | 342 Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 13 2022 14:42 utc | 353 No easy answers. Posted by: Tom_12 | Jun 13 2022 14:44 utc | 354 @Posted by: Scorpion | Jun 13 2022 7:45 utc | 311 You were easy to deceive, because you prefer your parallel universe. Posted by: John Kennard | Jun 13 2022 15:47 utc | 356 @ Scorpion | Jun 13 2022 12:38 utc | 344 Posted by: james | Jun 13 2022 16:00 utc | 357 Bevin@346 Posted by: Herr Ringbone | Jun 13 2022 16:40 utc | 358 If you fail to plan, double down on failure. joe tzu. Posted by: Immaculate deception | Jun 13 2022 16:56 utc | 359 Sponge is meaningless. Its turning the sponge into titanium plate, sheet, forgings, then there is the machining.
*I had surmised, despite disparate sources, that CHINA holds #1 upstream and down positions. And the funny thing is, no sooner had I begun googling titanium fabricators (metal: mill, machining) than GOOG started serving me ads from Xometry (CN).
That CHINA does not practice vertical monopolies, but stimulates intermediate manufacture (eg. plastics, textiles, semi) through RCEP, ASEAN, BRI supply chain which its exporters ship to westworld is not news.
Sanctions also impose a “big financial blow” on suppliers’ production capacity, material utilization, and CapEx to capitalize new orders to BOEING spec. So. Posted by: sln2002 | Jun 13 2022 17:09 utc | 360 Posted by: james | Jun 13 2022 16:00 utc | 357 Posted by: james | Jun 13 2022 16:00 utc | 357 A king has to walk out in public among his subjects and be answerable to them as well as to the nation’s elites. Posted by: Arganthonios | Jun 13 2022 21:34 utc | 363 The Churchill cult has done England unending harm- it nourished racism and russophobia at a time when, the decks being cleared of empire, a future emphasising the positive aspects of English history, the tradition of popular resistance, the Miltonic respect for freedom, the pioneering communal traditions-the cooperatives and the Trade Unions- from the homeland of Marx and Engels, which it was in reality, the hatred of Empire, the support for Irish and Italian freedom among the people. All the counterbalances to the disgraceful tradition of piracy and violent oppression- buried in the combination of forces that Churchill rallied after an armed electorate had thrown him out. Posted by: K | Jun 13 2022 21:36 utc | 364 @ Scorpion | Jun 13 2022 18:18 utc | 361 / 362 Posted by: james | Jun 13 2022 21:48 utc | 365 I have to wonder if the Nazis loved the aristocracy too Posted by: Arganthonios | Jun 13 2022 22:28 utc | 366 @ K | Jun 13 2022 21:36 utc | 364 Posted by: james | Jun 13 2022 22:30 utc | 367 The Soviet Union did not dissolve voluntarily. A referendum done earlier in 1991 showed that the vast majority of the citizens of the Soviet Union wanted it to remain intact. It was three men who signed the paper dissolving the USSR against the wishes of its people, that is the heads of Russia, Ukraine and Belarus. Posted by: wagelaborer | Jun 13 2022 22:44 utc | 368 I have to wonder if the Nazis loved the aristocracy too Posted by: dh | Jun 13 2022 23:19 utc | 369 Herr Ringbone@358 Posted by: bevin | Jun 14 2022 0:17 utc | 370 I m afraid that due to the exceptionalistan s old, historical custom, the F35s could be wrapped up in shiny, glowing paper laced with red ribbons and delivered to the Ukies. Living under a monarchy is nowhere near as magical and infused with mutual bonding as you make it out to be, Scorpion. I’ve lived under an absolute monarchy from the Persian Gulf and, granted while my childhood in an ‘ex-pat community’ was quite spoiled and comforted in the ever-present knowledge that we could one day leave (if nothing went wrong), one of the first things you learn even as a child is life is cheap and dependent upon the whims of greater, very arbitrary, powers. The religious police, the public right arm of nobility (who were immune for their own games), also brought looming tension to this magical mutual bonding you fantasize. Posted by: JR whenDallasdreamt | Jun 14 2022 1:59 utc | 372 Posted by: John Kennard | Jun 13 2022 15:47 utc | 356 Posted by: Parisian Guy | Jun 14 2022 3:30 utc | 373 Hey, everyone: Posted by: Pacifica Advocate | Jun 14 2022 4:25 utc | 374 A few day ago I was goaded into responding to some friends who believed that Putin had compared himself to Peter the Great – I’d have believed Catherine (lol) -but I agreed I would be surprised if he was claiming kingship and imperial destiny. The proof I was supplied was a Groaniad column written by some literature degreed hoodlum writing copy for the presstitutes who grovel around looking to deliver whatever oral and anal pleasures to these worthies daily. The point of his speech and where it was give at Spif was completely ignored with the ‘look a squirrel’ diversion of he ‘Appeared’ to say…😆 Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 14 2022 7:48 utc | 375 @ Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 14 2022 7:57 utc | 376 The US governments involvement in Ukraine was meant for two reasons IMO: Posted by: Samco | Jun 14 2022 10:00 utc | 377 @376 For sure the Nazis had a lot of supporters in high places in Britain. Mainly because they were anti-communist. The Duke of Windsor (Edward V111) was one. But his brother George was not a fan. Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2022 13:08 utc | 378 I thought this thread was over yesterday after a long pause so closed the tab. But in just reading through I was going to mention what the following, and last comment does: @ Scorpion | Jun 14 2022 18:17 utc | 379 Posted by: james | Jun 14 2022 18:50 utc | 380 |
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