Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict …
The open thread for other issues is here.
|
|
|
|
Back to Main
|
||
|
May 19, 2022
Ukraine Open Thread 2022-69
Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict … The open thread for other issues is here.
Comments
You’re conflating my observations of employed military strategy and political will with immorality of purpose and sadistic execution. I was pretty young, but I remember the evolution of our war in Vietnam quite differently. Posted by: K | May 20 2022 5:31 utc | 201 PavewayIV | May 20 2022 4:24 utc | 193 Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 20 2022 5:36 utc | 202 #151 jared | May 20 2022 0:45 utc Posted by: IronForge | May 20 2022 5:44 utc | 203 IronForge | May 20 2022 5:44 utc | 201 Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 20 2022 5:57 utc | 204 bobzibub | May 20 2022 2:19 utc | 169
No, it is an attack on countries like Germany and Hungary.
Ok, you are calling people stupid, but you can’t get your geography or even politics right. You must be US American. Norway is a founding member of NATO since 1948. Get into your head we are talking about Sweden and Finland. Look at a map for god’s sake.
Someone touched his shoulder and he sent a message to his audience by the ridiculous 180 degree turn. It was made so obvious that “anyone with IQ over room temperature” would see through it. Posted by: Norwegian | May 20 2022 6:05 utc | 205 bobzibub | May 20 2022 4:33 utc | 196 Posted by: Flying Dutchman | May 20 2022 6:08 utc | 206 @Peter AU1 | May 20 2022 5:36 utc | 200
All wars are “hybrid”. “Hybrid war” is just another Orwell-like language-obfuscation. All wars consist of propaganda, political moves, false flags and outright military fighting. Posted by: Norwegian | May 20 2022 6:14 utc | 207 Posted by: IronForge | May 20 2022 5:44 utc | 201 Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | May 20 2022 6:44 utc | 208 @IronForge | May 19 2022 23:46 utc Posted by: Leuk | May 20 2022 7:07 utc | 209 Posted by: Scorpion | May 20 2022 3:07 utc | 175 Posted by: Arganthonios | May 20 2022 7:22 utc | 210 and Gruff Posted by: ld | May 20 2022 7:28 utc | 212 We need a laugh: Posted by: Paul | May 20 2022 7:28 utc | 213 Scott Ritter’s is an experienced analyst that offers a view of the war from his perspective as do others. Would the esteemed cabal here prefer him to lie so that his view is nicely tailored to theirs? What makes them right and him wrong? Posted by: Organic | May 20 2022 8:31 utc | 214 I think that those posters, bemused by the West’s apparent self-harm by applying economic and financial sanctions on Russia, expecting the West’s population to rise up are working from false assumptions. The premise would ld require a revolutionary consciousness in the population not there. Posted by: Vragtes | May 20 2022 8:49 utc | 215 Posted by: the pessimist | May 19 2022 15:59 utc | 44 Posted by: njet | May 20 2022 9:25 utc | 216 Organic | May 20 2022 8:31 utc | 212 Posted by: John | May 20 2022 9:31 utc | 217
No it’s not! Intel Slava Z is mostly ‘official’ video footage mixed in with stuff from a range of sources inc. Ukrainian Posted by: Barofsky | May 20 2022 9:42 utc | 218 Posted by: njet | May 20 2022 9:25 utc | 214 Posted by: Bloke from block 8 | May 20 2022 9:44 utc | 219 Not sure why the hubbub over Ritter. How did his view even change? It looks to me like he was wrong on his initial analysis and now is blaming Russia for not waging war in the manner he thought optimal. He still says Russia is winning, inflicting serious losses in the East. I am of the opinion that the East and parts of the south is all Russia has ever been interested in and their strategy has reflected that. Posted by: Haassaan | May 20 2022 9:49 utc | 220 Dave_K’s post at 102 seems pretty solid. Posted by: Haassaan | May 20 2022 9:57 utc | 221 The US Senate approves the whopping $40 billion dollars to Ukraine by a big margin. Posted by: Republicofscotland | May 20 2022 9:58 utc | 222 Gonzalo Lira on Scott Ritter’s “Open Corridor” Posted by: Norwegian | May 20 2022 10:04 utc | 223 “Finland’s Prime Minister Sanna Marin has dismissed the possibility of deploying nuclear weapons or establishment of NATO military bases on her country’s soil, saying the alliance itself has not expressed any interest in placing nuclear weapons or permanent bases in Finland.” Posted by: Republicofscotland | May 20 2022 10:05 utc | 224 Situation Azov today (pun intended) is that Russia grinds on Ukraine Donbass troops after seizing Azovstal in Mariupol. Posted by: Greg Galloway | May 20 2022 10:13 utc | 225 @ #221 Posted by: rk | May 20 2022 10:18 utc | 226 Oh I just forgot: EU economies stepping proudly over the abyss. US Vegas casino sending 40 billions they dont have to line up MIC pockets… Posted by: Greg Galloway | May 20 2022 10:21 utc | 227 The message this sends is that the United States is committed, that we are going to stand with any country that is a democracy when there is an autocracy that attempts to overrun it,” Idaho Republican Jim Risch alleged. Posted by: Arganthonios | May 20 2022 10:23 utc | 228 Greg Galloway | May 20 2022 10:21 utc | 224 Posted by: Stonebird | May 20 2022 10:31 utc | 229 Thanks B. I would be keen to get your take on the applicability of the just war tradition with respect to the Russian ‘special military operation .’ This would entail a critical look at jus ad bellum, jus in bello and jus post bellum. Posted by: Imani | May 20 2022 10:40 utc | 231 Stonebird | May 20 2022 10:31 utc | 226 Posted by: Flying Dutchman | May 20 2022 10:41 utc | 232 Posted by: John | May 20 2022 9:31 utc | 215 Posted by: Paul | May 20 2022 10:45 utc | 233 Credits to William Gruff in this thread Posted by: Norwegian | May 20 2022 10:46 utc | 234 Scott Ritter posts a quickie on how US was never going to defeat Russia in Donbass and gives Lloyd Austin a kick in the shins on the way past. Posted by: uncle tungsten | May 20 2022 10:48 utc | 235 Haassaan #217
I believe Russia is interested in much more that just its struggle with resurgent nazism in Ukraine. It is primarily interested in putting an agreement together around its treaty proposal of December. They proposed a treaty with NATO and the USA. Neither of them took it seriously and so, as promised, Russia is now demonstrating the military and technical reasons why such a treaty will benefit all. IMO that includes the entirety of Ukraine as Russian tolerance of persistent belligerence is now zero. Posted by: uncle tungsten | May 20 2022 10:56 utc | 236 I imagine that if you make a scenario in your head such as training troops in Poland with new sophisticated weapons it will take time. Then it will take a quantity of troops, and a plan to move and position those troops. It would worry me more if the pace of the battle was not changing daily with huge casualties and surrenders, one wonders if the best UKA troops are not already dead or the process of being snared in a cauldron. @Norwegian | May 20 2022 10:04 utc | 220 Posted by: aquadraht | May 20 2022 11:03 utc | 238 @ #233 Posted by: rk | May 20 2022 11:07 utc | 240 anyway, Ukraine will be out of diesel before summer, so there’s not much suspense how war’ll turn out, won’t it ? Posted by: motorik | May 20 2022 11:08 utc | 241 Latest on E. Ukraine Posted by: Barofsky | May 20 2022 11:09 utc | 242 There was video posted yesterday by RMoD of US artillery being attacked. It’s not enough material to change the course of the conflict, at most it prolongs it and manages to kill some Russian troops. The US took all the electronics off so the range is reduced and the ability to use smart munitions with extended range is eliminated. Posted by: Lex | May 20 2022 11:28 utc | 243 Interview with pro-Russian Ukrainian video blogger Yuri Podolyaka (In Russian) – answering questions from a youthful audience Posted by: Aslangeo | May 20 2022 11:34 utc | 244 regarding the allegations against Scott Ritter I’ve heard plenty of cases of “Law enforcement” falsifying evidence, lying under oath and creating crimes out of whole cloth (remember the whole Michigan governor kidnapping case that imploded when it was discovered that the KGB, I’m sorry I mean the FBI, organized, directed and financed the entire “plot”; there were more FBI informants than charged individuals). The fact that Ritter was let go with a slap on the wrist further convinces me that this was just an intimidation case brought by the government to threaten Ritter. Now that Scott is staking out a claim that is contrary to the political orthodoxy it wouldn’t surprise me if we see more criminal charges against him in the near future Posted by: Kadath | May 20 2022 11:39 utc | 245 Posted by: Lex | May 20 2022 0:38 utc | 149 Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | May 20 2022 11:45 utc | 246 Ritter has been twice prosecuted for sex crimes. The only thing this proves is he very much has the attention of legal authority. They are on his case. If they had real crimes to charge him with they would. Instead he has been entrapped twice. Entrapment once is suspicious, twice is a farce. Posted by: Oldhippie | May 20 2022 11:46 utc | 247 @ njet 214 Posted by: Daniel | May 20 2022 11:46 utc | 248 USD falls further relative to Ruble Posted by: Norwegian | May 20 2022 11:53 utc | 249 Too many Khazar-Ashkenazi Tribals causing problems here in Murica and against RUS and Russian-Speaking Ukrainans…100 Posted by: GodBlessAmerica | May 20 2022 12:05 utc | 250 Ritter looks like a nerd to me. People need to get off of Ritter. Posted by: Bemildred | May 20 2022 12:06 utc | 251 Greg Galloway | May 20 2022 10:21 utc | 224 Posted by: Bemildred | May 20 2022 12:14 utc | 252 Just as worrying is the dispersion of cases in small numbers without (yet) any known links or reasonable causes. Pre-seeding a pandemic? Posted by: Stonebird | May 20 2022 12:40 utc | 253 Only 2 senators voted against the Tonkin Gulf Resolution. This time 11 senators voted against the $40 billion boondoggle. Posted by: Lysias | May 20 2022 12:40 utc | 254 This whole operation feels like a very clever Nato plan to rid the world of Nazis – antagonise Russia until they start killing Ukrainian Nazis and then just send every Nazi from around the world there for Russia to kill. Posted by: D J G | May 20 2022 12:49 utc | 255 Just as worrying is the dispersion of cases in small numbers without (yet) any known links or reasonable causes. Pre-seeding a pandemic? Posted by: Bemildred | May 20 2022 12:53 utc | 256 Hepatitis was linked to pfeeezer vaxxers. Apparently pfeeezer makes boo-boo on liver Posted by: rk | May 20 2022 12:55 utc | 257 Hepatitis was linked to pfeeezer vaxxers. Apparently pfeeezer makes boo-boo on liver Posted by: Bemildred | May 20 2022 12:57 utc | 258 The so-called Ukraine Crisis is horrendously tragic, But is merely the focal point of something much bigger, although I don’t know what that will be. That the Western Ukraine Nazis believe they can somehow ‘hold out’ is sheer stupidity. That the U.S. government is apparently ready to spend $40,000,000,000 to send out-of-date weapons plus soldiers into the Ukraine is also sheer stupidity. Posted by: blues | May 20 2022 13:04 utc | 259 I have to thank PeterAU1 for his reply at 202. I had no coffee in my mouth so there was no chance of spewing on the screen. His remark about oriental blacksmithing was interesting. I used to know some knife makers in Inverness, Kalifornia who used A2. They would wait for a moonless night to heat the metal to the right temperature of 1725 degrees, shown by a cherry glow, before cooling in order to harden it. Posted by: Quid me vexari? | May 20 2022 13:09 utc | 260 Not if it’s linked to something happening a lot in those areas. Like obesity. Or like a very long living population, Italy and France style. Monkeypox has very high frequency in homosexual men, that’s what WHO says, you can gugl that statement Posted by: rk | May 20 2022 13:09 utc | 261 Gonzalo, it’s not so easy. Posted by: njet | May 20 2022 13:09 utc | 262 I think Russia is major supplier of titanium – as used in m777 howitzers. Posted by: jared | May 20 2022 13:14 utc | 263 Stonebird | May 20 2022 10:31 utc | 226 Posted by: Doug Hillman | May 20 2022 13:21 utc | 264
Well, some Pentagram types (Curtis LeMay, anyone?) were strongly advocating nuking North Vietnam into glass. Posted by: malenkov | May 20 2022 13:22 utc | 265 First time posting, been lurking since the start of the SMO! Love this place and it’s become my new go-to. Posted by: Minkz | May 20 2022 13:24 utc | 266 Stonebird [226] Posted by: Paul Greenwood | May 20 2022 13:36 utc | 267 “…we have the picture of both sides trying to out-Verdun the other, a mutual forced attrition with each side expecting to outlast the other unto the other’s collapse. This is supposed to be the alternative to nuclear war.” There is very likely to be the worst depression the U.S. has ever seen come this autumn. None of this makes one bit of sense. Something very strange seems to be in the offing. Posted by: Doug Hillman | May 20 2022 13:46 utc | 269 Until now I haven’t seen one of these 777 destroyed. This to Martyanow, who claims that Russia sees everything in real-time. Posted by: Scorpion | May 20 2022 13:50 utc | 270 “Russia is now demonstrating the military and technical reasons why such a treaty will benefit all. IMO that includes the entirety of Ukraine as Russian tolerance of persistent belligerence is now zero.” from OilPrice dot com Posted by: Don Bacon | May 20 2022 14:21 utc | 272 Scott, on the other hand, seems oblivious to the big picture and therefore worth little more than an announcer at a football game. I know he could do better if he just opens his eyes. Posted by: Henry Moon Pie | May 20 2022 14:22 utc | 273 @Don Bacon #269 Posted by: rk | May 20 2022 14:28 utc | 274 A most interesting development. Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | May 20 2022 14:34 utc | 275 Things are going all Rambo-like over at Task & Purpose. Seems Bush the Lesser’s comment about Iraq, I mean Ukraine, must have hit a nerve. These military types are all so much alike. They have absolutely no problem with “the mission.” No, their issue is with leadership, failure in command and so on. They still do not grasp that everything they were ordered to do in Iraq, and did do in Iraq, all of it was based on a lie, a complete and utter falsehood. They take pride in and defend their effort regardless of how entirely wrong, mistaken and nightmarish that effort was found to be. I guess indoctrination creates permanent conditioning. Posted by: thecelticwithinme | May 20 2022 14:44 utc | 276 a must-read from Pepe here . .”Hybrid War is being fought predominantly in the economic/financial battleground – and the pain dial for the collective West will only go up.” Posted by: Don Bacon | May 20 2022 14:45 utc | 277 “This all could have been avoided, easily, if the EU masters had any consideration for their citizens. They don’t. And they are not stupid, nobody can be that stupid. The only realistic conclusion is that they are creating hardship and famine on purpose. They are.
True, but easily propagandized Canadians (new Canadians more so than old) believe every story of alleged oppression they are fed. There is a Holodomor Bus that tours and propagandizes the population, mostly students. Posted by: Opport Knocks | May 20 2022 14:49 utc | 279 Re Ritter’s criticisms, this from Martynov:
Posted by: Barofsky | May 20 2022 14:52 utc | 280 …from Ukrinform–“signs of aggravation”
Posted by: Don Bacon | May 20 2022 14:59 utc | 281 The Ukraine Foreign Minister Kuleba recently returned from a whirlwind visit to other European countries, including high-level contacts with many, but apparently some Europeans are practicing “strategic ambiguity” toward Ukraine and the Ukie FM doesn’t like it. . .here Posted by: Don Bacon | May 20 2022 15:09 utc | 282 @278 I don’t think Kuleba is doing himself any favors with that kind of whining. He comes across as ungrateful and people will take note. Posted by: dh | May 20 2022 15:19 utc | 283 The other night my wife and I were getting busy in bed…. Posted by: jared | May 20 2022 15:20 utc | 284 @Cyril #159 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:22 utc | 285 @jared #43 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:28 utc | 286 @PavewayIV #64 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:32 utc | 287 @circumspect #195 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:34 utc | 288
There’s little about the present conflict that can be considered enjoyable, but one such phenomenon is the volleys of abuse that Ukronazi ingrates hurl at Western states and the Eurotoadies in particular. The toadies certainly deserve it, and they keep coming back for more! Posted by: malenkov | May 20 2022 15:37 utc | 289 @njet #259 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:41 utc | 290 @blues #256 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:45 utc | 291 … the Russian people, understandably, will no longer accept rapprochement. Posted by: anon2020 | May 20 2022 15:51 utc | 292 Biolabs in Ukraine.. Posted by: Et Tu | May 20 2022 15:54 utc | 293 @ Et Tu: Posted by: malenkov | May 20 2022 15:59 utc | 294
Scott Ritter is supposedly a former Intelligence Analyst. Failing to recognize any form of entrapment is the opposite of intelligence. Unless he was trying to expose the government perpetrators, but there is no evidence of that. Posted by: Opport Knocks | May 20 2022 16:02 utc | 295 @ blues | May 20 2022 13:04 utc | 256 – i agree blues.. thanks for your overview here… Posted by: james | May 20 2022 16:03 utc | 296 The United West wants to destroy Russia, because they are the masters of the world and any desobidience has to be punished. Posted by: njet | May 20 2022 16:17 utc | 297 Posted by: c1ue | May 20 2022 15:45 utc | 287 Posted by: Arganthonios | May 20 2022 16:17 utc | 298 “Disentanglement / disconnection of RF from the EU is geo-strategic win for the US.” @ 291 Posted by: oldhippie | May 20 2022 16:28 utc | 300 |
||