Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict …
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April 2, 2022
Ukraine Open Thread 2022-39
Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict …
Comments
librul@96 “That is, Martin Niemöller was saying that if you don’t Posted by: David F | Apr 2 2022 22:12 utc | 101 @99 Petri Krohn – I am worried about this also Posted by: ptb | Apr 2 2022 22:22 utc | 102 When I was a young child after me Da had passed due to wounds suffered during the Normandy campaign me Ma would tell me a bit here and there about her personal memories of the war. I remember most of what she shared, like how she left her suburb to go to work in London one morning and everything was normal in her neighborhood. But on her return her street was strewn with debris and her neighbors house was gone, as were her neighbors. As best as I can remember, it was a V-1 aka a Buzz bomb that did the damage. Posted by: bubbles | Apr 2 2022 22:23 utc | 103 Nick | Apr 2 2022 22:03 utc | 97 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 2 2022 22:24 utc | 104 “cauldron” Posted by: librul | Apr 2 2022 22:30 utc | 105 @Posted by: David F | Apr 2 2022 22:12 utc | 101 Posted by: librul | Apr 2 2022 22:34 utc | 106 @ bubbles 80 Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 2 2022 22:40 utc | 107 Idealy, not necessarily possible the ruskies would present the ukraian army with clearly insurmountable situation. Posted by: jared | Apr 2 2022 22:43 utc | 108 The independent journalist who has been tracking the biowar labs, Dilyana Gaytandzhieva, has also been tracking Bulgarian shipments of weapons to Ukraine. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 2 2022 22:45 utc | 109 uncle tungsten | Apr 2 2022 22:12 utc | 100 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 2 2022 22:45 utc | 110 . . .latest MSM headlines (1 day): Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 2 2022 22:45 utc | 111 This expected casualty is now official. From an item at RT:
I wanted to build a scale model of the ISS but now I’m glad I didn’t. China has its own, and Russia will soon follow. Then it’s on to the moon. The bankrupt West will never again be human spacefarers. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 2 2022 21:52 utc | 94 Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 2 2022 22:47 utc | 113 Librul – No particular reason. When I read your explanation of “selfish unselfishness”, I was reminded of the Brahma-viharas Posted by: David F | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 114 … a dream that the spear of this nation’s possibility be cast beyond the miserable, self-loathing, colonial past which has caused our limping, fawning and abject gait in relation to the world. It is time we forged out of Australia something beyond our past, beyond that stinking freezing derelict theme-park known as the United Kingdom and beyond that other fake unity, the United States with its identitarian totalitarianism causing all other destinies to circle the drain of its banal infantile non-culture. Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 115 Reading Nightvision’s sitrep over at The Saker. He suggests that the 200-250,000 Russian troops initially reported to be on Ukraine’s border before the war, totaling 150 BTGs, didn’t actually exist. In which case, the 50 BTGs he and the UAWarData guy counts would be all that Russia has inside Ukraine. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 116 @Posted by: David F | Apr 2 2022 22:12 utc | 101 Posted by: librul | Apr 2 2022 22:56 utc | 117 Posted by: Kadath | Apr 2 2022 16:57 utc | 19 Posted by: watcher | Apr 2 2022 23:00 utc | 118 Posted by: Nick | Apr 2 2022 22:03 utc | 97 Posted by: watcher | Apr 2 2022 23:04 utc | 119 @bevin | Apr 2 2022 21:58 utc | 95 Posted by: Vintage Red | Apr 2 2022 23:04 utc | 120 @Posted by: David F | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 114 Posted by: librul | Apr 2 2022 23:08 utc | 121 Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 2 2022 22:47 utc | 113 Posted by: watcher | Apr 2 2022 23:10 utc | 122 On grains, many are sowed in fall, rye in particular; so, it’s possible that survived the combat. Beets are another staple and they grow fast: 60-70 days from germination to harvest, and the entire plant is eaten. They’re one of our favs. IMO, the problem isn’t planting; it’s yields given the shortage of artificial fertilizers. Poor people who could never afford them will do fine; rather, farmers having become dependent and their nations will suffer smaller harvests. However, the #1 problem has always been equitable distribution and wastage due to improper storage. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 116 Posted by: watcher | Apr 2 2022 23:19 utc | 124 @Petri Krohn | Apr 2 2022 22:07 utc | 99 Posted by: Sundial | Apr 2 2022 23:20 utc | 125 Another interesting RT item, “Japan says it won’t scrap Russia projects: Tokyo intends to continue working with Russian oil and gas enterprises.” Yes, Japan’s an unfriendly because it illegally sanctioned Russia, but:
Looks like Japan doesn’t want to be lumped in with the West even though it’s occupied. Richard Steven Hack | Apr 2 2022 22:53 utc | 116 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 2 2022 23:27 utc | 127 Another interesting item from RT: “Anti-Russian sanctions don’t work – Poland.” Yes, that statement makes Poles appear intelligent until you read more:
And just what does the brilliant Polish PM think will be more powerful sanctions when “sanctions from hell” have backfired onto the sanctioning nations? So far, none of the various rounds of sanctions have worked, so this guy proposes to try again! Gee, maybe I was wrong in saying he’s intelligent. But then he does have an excuse–he’s Polish. Bevin @ 95, Vintage Red @ 120: Posted by: Jen | Apr 2 2022 23:33 utc | 129 # 111 Posted by: ka | Apr 2 2022 23:36 utc | 130 Sundial | Apr 2 2022 23:20 utc | 125 Posted by: rjb1.5 | Apr 2 2022 23:36 utc | 131 Could this operation end shortly? Posted by: Ghost Ship | Apr 2 2022 23:40 utc | 132 Posted by: Ghost Ship | Apr 2 2022 23:40 utc | 132 Posted by: Ghost Ship | Apr 2 2022 23:48 utc | 133 “Remember also a lot of children grew up being brainwashed. 8 Years of full control of a nation…” Sundial@125 Posted by: bevin | Apr 2 2022 23:50 utc | 134 And the EU idiots will try something new to see if what sticks via another RT item: “EU reveals aim of new Russia sanctions: The bloc will focus on pursuing Russian oligarchs and weakening the ruble.” Pardon me while I fall out of my chair and howl with laughter.
Seriously!! The oligarchs Russia hates who looted the nation during Yeltsin and fled when Putin cracked down on them!! And the ruble that’s now tied to gold and the price of hydrocarbons that’s already 100x stronger that the fiat euro and dollar although exchanges don’t yet reveal that reality?!? The ruble the EU will make stronger because it needs Russia’s hydrocarbons?!? can anyone confirm this story: Posted by: Manage without me | Apr 2 2022 23:52 utc | 136 can anyone confirm this story: Posted by: Manage without me | Apr 2 2022 23:52 utc | 137 The quote is a little long but seems to give a decent overview of Ukraine’s main crops.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 2 2022 23:53 utc | 138 Posted by: watcher | Apr 2 2022 23:10 utc | 122 Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 2 2022 23:58 utc | 139 Nightvision’s response to me on the numbers…
I’ve asked Martyanov what he thinks about the disposition of forces inside and outside Ukraine. We’ll see if he has anything to say. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 0:10 utc | 140 Manage without me | Apr 2 2022 23:52 utc | 137 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 0:14 utc | 141 Patroklos #113
It is a bit bleak I’ll admit but there are stirrings. The UKUSA grip is stifling but unusual events can bring forth astounding change. There is a strong core of independent mind in Oz and I trust it will gain traction in time to save us from becoming an actual state of the USA. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 3 2022 0:19 utc | 142 @Jen | Apr 2 2022 23:33 utc | 129 Posted by: Vintage Red | Apr 3 2022 0:20 utc | 143 Thanks to two posts on my favorite subject, I hope b will forgive us for ‘swerving the atom’ away from war in Ukraine — Aleph_Null does post links to Orthodoxy, and these extracts do relate to life and death as we are painfully witnessing on these threads, so perhaps my added thoughts can help on that subject:
Aleph, you quoted also from Dostoievski’s diary – I’d just comment that I don’t find the novel to be the same sort of literature as the diary, though of course by the same man. For me, the novel presents Orthodoxy; the diary presents Russia. I will note that on the same page as the Scriptural epigraph, above it, the dedication is inscribed, to Dostoievski’s wife.
I would say the critique of the Catholic Inquisition, an essay read by older brother Ivan to youngest brother Alyosha in the novel (not by Father Zossima) is not Dostoievski’s own ‘take’ on the matter, since it is Alyosha who is called the hero, not Ivan, and his reaction on hearing it read is depicted as Christ-like towards his brother – he kisses him, as Christ kisses the Grand Inquisitor in the tale. It is admittedly a powerful indictment of the Inquisition, but I wouldn’t say of Catholicism as a whole. Posted by: juliania | Apr 3 2022 0:24 utc | 144 Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 0:10 utc | 140 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 0:25 utc | 145 @ Petri Krohn | Apr 2 2022 22:07 utc | 99 Posted by: suzan | Apr 3 2022 0:28 utc | 146 uncle tungsten | Apr 3 2022 0:19 utc | 142 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 0:35 utc | 147 This Ehret essay is explosive thanks to the work of those he helps spread: “New Revelations Shed Light on Nazi Roots of House of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha”:
And there’s more all barflies will enjoy learning, John Cleary in particular. karlof1 #135
Yes to the first sentence. The second is perhaps better defined as the nazi traitors disease as it is more encompassing of many other EU states and their behaviour. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 3 2022 0:45 utc | 149 Peter AU1 @138– Denazification of Ukraine implies denazification of Europe and North America where the enablers of nazi-Ukraine are. It will take time. Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Apr 3 2022 0:54 utc | 151 Those barflies commenting about religious views of today need to know that Pope Francis is now wading in against Russia. Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 3 2022 0:54 utc | 152 A dominant holding position I should have said, one in which time is on their side. Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Apr 3 2022 0:55 utc | 153 To add to 152 Posted by: Chaka Khagan | Apr 3 2022 0:59 utc | 154 https://www.rt.com/business/553197-iran-oil-output-sanctions/ Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 3 2022 1:01 utc | 155 “Ukraine potential in terms of numbers. All men between ages 18 and 60 getting called up/press ganged for military service…” Peter AU1@145 Posted by: bevin | Apr 3 2022 1:02 utc | 156 @ juliania | Apr 3 2022 0:24 utc | 144 Posted by: Aleph_Null | Apr 3 2022 1:06 utc | 157 karlof1 | Apr 3 2022 0:48 utc | 150 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 1:15 utc | 158 Librul – “So, perhaps there needs to be a state Posted by: David F | Apr 3 2022 1:17 utc | 159 bevin | Apr 3 2022 1:02 utc | 155 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 1:24 utc | 160 Peter AU1 @157– @148 karlof1 Posted by: ptb | Apr 3 2022 1:26 utc | 162 @9 Posted by: theresamarquesa | Apr 3 2022 1:30 utc | 163 fyi Posted by: michaelj72 | Apr 3 2022 1:30 utc | 164 @152 psycho Posted by: NemesisCalling | Apr 3 2022 1:37 utc | 165 theresamarquesa | Apr 3 2022 1:30 utc | 162 Posted by: Doesitreallymatter | Apr 3 2022 1:46 utc | 166 Here’s some tripe from TTG at turcopolier (Lang is in hospital).
Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 1:46 utc | 167 @ NemesisCalling | Apr 3 2022 1:37 utc | 164 who wrote Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 3 2022 1:49 utc | 168 Even when I was teenager the whole “first they came for…” poem struck me as ignorantly pretentious, a hallow slogan to sooth the ego of the masses who repeat it, much like the fascism it claims to reject. As I’ve gotten older I’ve only seen more and more evidence that those in the West who clamor so loudly about about “human rights”, are those that inflict the most death, destruction and suffering on humanity and they spout gibberish like “first they came” like a prayer for absolution of sins so they can go about their murderous deeds with a clear conscience and bloody hands. Of course, the organizations and poets who prostitute themselves in praise of the elites are richly rewarded for their service, after all, if they didn’t get paid, they might complain about Julian Assange, the people in our concentration camps or those pesky kill lists. Posted by: Kadath | Apr 3 2022 1:56 utc | 169 Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 1:46 utc | 166 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 1:56 utc | 170 Not a war historian or journalist or strategist but this whole bit about MSM sources very publicly announcing Russia’s utter defeat after just a month of war – uh, is war only supposed to last a month nowadays now, such that even amateur armchair observers can now pass judgment on what counts as a victory or defeat? Posted by: HandsomeMan | Apr 3 2022 1:57 utc | 171 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 0:25 utc | 145 Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:03 utc | 172 @ HandsomeMan | Apr 3 2022 1:57 utc | 170 with the observed desperation of the MSM Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 3 2022 2:07 utc | 173 @ librul and @ David F | Apr 3 2022 1:17 utc | 158 Posted by: suzan | Apr 3 2022 2:11 utc | 174 Bevin @ 95, Vintage Red @ 120, Jen @ 129: Posted by: John Kennard | Apr 3 2022 2:12 utc | 175 I see some of my last posts are missing the letter N in places. Not my fault, I have tried to wean my key board off booze and coffee – like prohibition it does not seem to be working. Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 2:12 utc | 176 @ HandsomeMan | 170
Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 2:19 utc | 177 Posted by: michaelj72 | Apr 3 2022 1:30 utc | 163
But where’s the evidence? This is what ticks me off about all these armchair analysts (including me): They make assertions but have no reference to back it up. He may well be right, but where are the numbers? Assuming that the mainland Russian forces are now in Donbass because the front is advancing is purely an assumption. It was advancing fine all through the war just on the basis of what Russian troops were there and the LDR forces. So why assume that just because the Donbass front is heating up that Russia has committed reserve forces from Crimea or elsewhere? Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:22 utc | 178 Is there a difference between the trump policies, and the FJB policies on Ukraine? Posted by: Cadence Calls | Apr 3 2022 2:23 utc | 179 Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:03 utc | 171 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 2:26 utc | 180 @John Kennard | Apr 3 2022 2:12 utc | 174 Posted by: Vintage Red | Apr 3 2022 2:28 utc | 181 @ Richard Steven Hack 171 Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 2:28 utc | 182 The great propaganda game is in full swing here in the U$A. Not to worry, eventually, reality will Posted by: vetinLA | Apr 3 2022 2:31 utc | 183 Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:22 utc | 177 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 2:32 utc | 184 Doesitreallymatter | Apr 3 2022 1:46 utc | 165 Posted by: theresamarquesa | Apr 3 2022 2:38 utc | 185 Dreizin also repeats the conscript callup stuff, although he thinks it’s to increase the number of humanitarian workers in Ukraine. I posted a comment pointing out the the conscript callup is done twice a year, that they can’t be sent outside Russian territory, and if Russia wanted more humanitarian workers, they could just ask for some, they don’t need to draft them. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:38 utc | 186 One thing about Putin, he goes about creating circumstances, situations. 22 years in the making now, since US pulled out of the ABM treaty. Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 2:42 utc | 187 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 2:26 utc | 179 Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Apr 3 2022 2:42 utc | 188 theresamarquesa | Apr 3 2022 2:38 utc | 184 Posted by: Doesitreallymatter | Apr 3 2022 2:43 utc | 189 Regarding conscripts, Russia can’t and shouldn’t use infantry to get at the Ukraine infantry in trenches. The best way would be to cut off their logistics so they’ll surrender when they get real hungry. Plus the artillery has been hitting at them and drones are keeping tabs on them. It’ll take some time, but time is on Russia’s side. Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 2:47 utc | 190 From the Kherson People’s Republic Telegram account:
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 3 2022 2:50 utc | 191 Remember, the US had Poroshenko put NATO and EU in the Ukraine constitution after the US-led coup. That has to come out, with an understanding that any action to go there would be met kinetically, as they say. Also there would be some autonomy (if not recognition of independence) for Donbass, like many other regions in Europe that have some autonomy, so it isn’t unusual. Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 3 2022 2:55 utc | 192 Five weeks is a serious amount of combat time. Posted by: John Kennard | Apr 3 2022 3:01 utc | 193 Hi, Posted by: Kim | Apr 3 2022 3:04 utc | 194 suzan | Apr 3 2022 2:11 utc | 173 & librul (indirectly) Posted by: David F | Apr 3 2022 3:05 utc | 195 @ psychohistorian | Apr 3 2022 0:54 utc | 152 Posted by: Cabe | Apr 3 2022 3:19 utc | 197 I don’t know about Niemoller’s original words (he doesn’t seem to have later either), but most of the versions I’ve seen do an admirable job of “cancelling” who went to the torture-centers and concentration-camps first, the Social Democrats, who were left the sole remaining support of the Weimar Republic after the Catholic Center Party, by order of the Vatican, withdrew from the Weimar Coalition, the great “stab in the back’ of the interwar-years that set the stage for rule by decree, the appointment of Hitler, and, after Hindenburg’s death, Hitler’s appointment of himself as ruler. Posted by: John Kennard | Apr 3 2022 3:25 utc | 198 Karlof1 122
Posted by: Dadda | Apr 3 2022 3:38 utc | 199 Robert Lindsay | Apr 3 2022 2:42 utc | 187 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 3 2022 3:45 utc | 200 |
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