Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
March 05, 2022

Zelensky And The Fascists: "He will hang on some tree on Khreshchatyk"

Yves Smith of Naked Capitalism states:

Lambert and I both find this is the worst informational environment either of us have faced, orders of magnitude worse than the war in Iraq, ...

and:

Dear patient readers,

Lambert and I, and many readers, agree that Ukraine has prompted the worst informational environment ever. We hope readers will collaborate in mitigating the fog of war – both real fog and stage fog – in comments. None of us need more cheerleading and link-free repetition of memes; there are platforms for that.

I ask readers and commentators here to live by the same standard. There are too many comments now for me to read and police. Please notify me via email if there are certain trolls or offenders who deserve to be excluded from this site.

Now back to Ukraine and the big question: Why is Russia doing this?

At the Grayzone Alexander Rubinstein and Max Blumenthal have published a piece about Zelensky's turn from the peacemaker he had promised to be before his election to an active supporter of the fascist 'ultranational' militia. They pin that turn to a frontline meeting between Zelensky and militia fighters in the fall of 2019:

In a face-to-face confrontation with militants from the neo-Nazi Azov Battalion who had launched a campaign to sabotage the peace initiative called “No to Capitulation,” Zelensky encountered a wall of obstinacy. 

With appeals for disengagement from the frontlines firmly rejected, Zelensky melted downon camera. “I’m the president of this country. I’m 41 years old. I’m not a loser. I came to you and told you: remove the weapons,” Zelensky implored the fighters.
...

Once video of the stormy confrontation spread across Ukrainian social media channels, Zelensky became the target of an angry backlash.

Andriy Biletsky, the proudly fascist Azov Battalion leader who once pledged to “lead the white races of the world in a final crusade…against Semite-led Untermenschen”, vowed to bring thousands of fighters to Zolote if Zelensky pressed any further. Meanwhile, a parliamentarian from the party of former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko openly fantasized about Zelensky being blown to bits by a militant’s grenade.

Though Zelensky achieved a minor disengagement, the neo-Nazi paramilitaries escalated their “No Capitulation” campaign. And within months, fighting began to heat up again in Zolote, sparking a new cycle of violations of the Minsk Agreement.

By this point, Azov had been formally incorporated into the Ukrainian military and its street vigilante wing, known as the National Corps, was deployed across the country under the watch of the Ukrainian Interior Ministry, and alongside the National Police. In December 2021, Zelensky would be seen delivering a “Hero of Ukraine” award to a leader of the fascistic Right Sector in a ceremony in Ukraine’s parliament.

That is all correct. But let me point out that death threats from the fascists to Zelensky were already made much earlier.

On May 27 2019, a week after Zelensky's inauguration as president, the Ukrainian internet news site Obozrevatel published a long interview with Dmytro Anatoliyovych Yarosh, a co-founder of the Right Sector who was then the commander of the Ukrainian Volunteer Army. Yarosh and others like him have had little support when they tried to get elected to parliament but they, as demonstrated during Maidan, have the guns and the will to use them.

I now get an 'access denied' when I try to fetch the original interview but found a copy at archive.org.

The headline of the interview carries his main message (machine translations):

Yarosh: if Zelensky betrays Ukraine, he will lose not his position, but his life

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As the interview is quite long I will concentrate on two parts. Zelensky had promised peace and to implement the Minsk agreement. Here is Yarosh's thought about Minsk:

Interviewer: What do you mean?

Yarosh: The Minsk format - and I talk about this all the time - is an opportunity to play for time, arm the Armed Forces, switch to the best world standards in the system of national security and defense. This is an opportunity for maneuver. But no more. The implementation of the Minsk agreements is the death of our state. They are not worth a drop of blood of the guys and girls, men and women who died in this war. Not a drop.

We were better prepared during this diplomatic game for a possible large-scale Russian invasion.

I: Do you think it's time to abandon "Minsk"?

Y: Undoubtedly.

I: But Zelensky was told immediately after the elections that he had no alternatives.

Y: "They told Zelensky" ... Did Zelensky say anything at all?

I: Not.

Y: And it's scary. The Supreme Commander, who says nothing at all. It's kind of empty. And it's very strange.

I: Waiting for what the newly elected president will say?

Y: Not only. Let's fight and get ready. We are waiting for what he will say and, most importantly, how he will act. "By their fruits you will know them," says Scripture. "Fruits" we will see somewhere in the fall. Zelensky is an inexperienced politician. And the retinue makes the king. And we already see who is there, "in the retinue", is beginning to appear. It does not add optimism. Because Zelensky promised his voters (I was not Zelensky's voter) that he would break the oligarchic system. But already from the first appointments, we see that the oligarchic system continues to live and flourish. And, obviously, it will continue to be so. Just the streams will be transferred.

To the 'ultranationalists' in the Ukraine the Minsk agreement was always just a fig-leaf to have time for rearming. In 2019, five years after Minsk, they already felt capable and ready to again attack and overwhelm the Donbas rebels.

Yarosh's remark about Zelensky and the oligarchs is not wrong. The streams of money sucked from Ukrainians and foreign donors were redirected under Zelensky to benefit those oligarchs, most prominently Igor Kolomoyskyy, who had supported him.

The interviewer then asks Yarosh about his relation to Kolomoyskyy who had called the conflict with Donbas a civil war. Yarosh does not mind Kolomoyskyy but rejects the 'civil war' claim:

Yarosh: [P]erhaps, something is pushing him to make such statements. Apparently, some kind of business interest.

This is the main danger of the oligarchy, as for me. They, the oligarchs, are talented people, because without talent it is impossible to build such businesses and earn billions. But the danger of the oligarchs is that they are compradors. They don't give a damn about the Motherland. They need money. Profit turns a blind eye to everything. And then you can negotiate with Russia on any terms.

And that is why Zelensky is very dangerous for us Ukrainians. I feel it.

Interviewer: What is the danger?

Y: His statements about peace at any cost are dangerous for us. Vladimir simply does not know the price of this world. He may have been with concerts close to the front. But when my boys were torn apart by Russian shells into small pieces and then these pieces had to be collected and sent to their mothers, the price somehow looks completely different.
...
I: Are you trying to meet him now?

Y: Yes. I have already made a couple of messages, but he is silent. Perhaps they didn't reach him. He is a busy man...

But even if this meeting does not happen, it's okay. He just needs to understand one truth: Ukrainians cannot be humiliated. Ukrainians, after seven hundred years of colonial slavery, may not yet have fully learned how to build a state. But we learned how to make an uprising very well and remove all those "eagles" who are trying to parasitize on the sweat and blood of Ukrainians. Zelensky said in his inaugural speech that he was ready to lose ratings, popularity, position... No, he would lose his life. He will hang on some tree on Khreshchatyk - if he betrays Ukraine and those people who died in the Revolution and the War.


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Khreshchatyk is the main street of Kiev. The above and other threats to Zelensky certainly helped to convert him from peacemaker to warmonger and friend of the various 'ultranational' militia formations.

In spring 2021 Zelensky announced that the Ukraine would retake Crimea by force. Russia then held large military maneuvers and Zelensky backed down. By November 2021 the Ukraine again made noise and said it would be retaking Donbas by force. Russia again held military maneuvers as a show of force but this time the situation deteriorated further.

Starting in mid February the OSCE observers around Donbas noted in their daily reports a strong increase in ceasefire violation and explosions.


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Most of the violations came from the Ukrainian site and the explosions of the fired shells and missile happened on Donbas held grounds. On February 19, at the hight of the fire, Zelensky gave a speech at the Munich Security Conference. He prominently mentioned the Budapest Memorandum under which the Ukraine had given up the nuclear weapons it had inherited from the USSR*:

Since 2014, Ukraine has tried three times to convene consultations with the guarantor states of the Budapest Memorandum. Three times without success. Today Ukraine will do it for the fourth time. I, as President, will do this for the first time. But both Ukraine and I are doing this for the last time. I am initiating consultations in the framework of the Budapest Memorandum. The Minister of Foreign Affairs was commissioned to convene them. If they do not happen again or their results do not guarantee security for our country, Ukraine will have every right to believe that the Budapest Memorandum is not working and all the package decisions of 1994 are in doubt.

One of the package decision Ukraine took in 1994 was the entering of Ukraine into the Treaty on Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons.

Russia understood Zelensky's remark in Munich as a threat by Ukraine to acquire nuclear weapons. It already has the expertise, materials and means to do that.

A fascist controlled government with nukes on Russia's border? This is not about Putin at all. No Russian government of any kind could ever condone that.

I believe that this credible threat, together with the artillery preparations for a new war on Donbas, was what convinced Russia's government to intervene by force.

On February 22 Russia recognized the Donbas republics as independent states. On February 24 Russian troops crossed the borders into the Ukraine.

The aim set for the Russian military is to de-militarize the Ukraine and to de-nazify it.

The first is easy to understand. The Russian military will simple destroy or disable all heavy weapons the Ukraine has.

The second aim requires more explanation than the above interview with Dmytro Yarosh.

As the Grayzone notes:

In November 2021, one of Ukraine’s most prominent ultra-nationalist militiamen, Dmytro Yarosh, announced that he had been appointed as an advisor to the Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Yarosh is an avowed follower of the Nazi collaborator Bandera who led Right Sector from 2013 to 2015, vowing to lead the “de-Russification” of Ukraine.

The threats from the fascists make it impossible for any Ukrainian politician to implement a sane policy that would lead to peace in the country.

The fascists in Ukraine are relatively few. But they have the guns and they will kill anyone who opposes them and their aims. They have been put into important state positions. (Besides that oligarchs like Kolomoyskyy pay and use them for their own purposes.)

The problem is that such ideological groups, once firmly established, tend to grow. The Right Sector is holding 'patriotic' summer camps for young Ukrainians and the Ukrainian state is financing those. They are successful and Ukrainian youths is looking up to them.

These developments are what Russia is afraid off. As Patrick Armstrong wrote at the start of the current intervention:

What [Putin] is talking about is what the Soviet Union tried to do from 1933 onwards: namely to stop Hitler before he got started. This time Russia is able to do it by itself. In other words, Putin feels that he is making a pre-emptive attack to stop June 1941. This is very serious indeed and indicates that the Russians are going to keep going until they feel that they can safely stop.

The Russian military will destroy the militia formations like the Right Sector and the Azov battalion which is currently holding the people of Mariupol as hostages. It will try to get all their leaders - dead or alive.

When the task is done the Russian military will leave the Ukraine.

Being freed from powerful fascists will enable Ukrainian politicians to re-institute sane policies.

That's the plan.

But will it work?

That is probably the wrong question. One should ask to what degree and for how long will it work.

After Ukraine's independence it took the 'ultranationalists' 22 years, and the help of the CIA, to come to power. Once eliminated they may claw back, but it will take them some time. The Ukraine will be busy with reviving its economy. It will have little money to spend on arms.  

Thirty years later Russia may see a repeat of the confrontation. But 30 years are quite a long time.

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* Ukraine could not break the permissive action link security codes of those nuclear weapons so it actually gave up nothing.

Posted by b on March 5, 2022 at 16:57 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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The Russian invasion is succeeding, just as the US knew and planned it would. The US plan to 1)fracture Western Europe from Russia and to 2) demonize, weaken and isolate Russia is also succeeding. The objective of the Russians is a neutral and demilitarized Ukraine. The remaining objective of the US (the two above are virtually fait accompli) is to stoke an insurgency in Western Ukraine that bleeds Russia. It remains to be seen who succeeds.

Posted by: Rodrigo | Mar 5 2022 17:10 utc | 1

Thanks for the tremendous amount of work you put in, b. I know this has to be highly stressful; it's stressful just being bombarded by the incessant propaganda, much less trying to winnow out good, valid information in this shitstorm of noise.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 17:13 utc | 2

Хулкарой, [05/03/2022 16:52]
Confirmed, Ukrainian security forces have killed one of their own. (Not sure how exactly this was carried out) but Kireev was one of the members of the Ukrainian delegation negotiating with the Russians.

https://lenta.ru/news/2022/03/05/sbu_kireev/

Хулкарой, [05/03/2022 17:00]
“Allegedly, he was killed while being detained by the Security Service of Ukraine. Previously, Kireev was suspected of treason.”

We all know what “treason” really means to the ultra nationalists, any hesitation on the narrative being told and forced by the extremists in Ukraine

Posted by: Barofsky | Mar 5 2022 17:13 utc | 3

Ukrainians will become the Palestinians of Europe. Mowing the grass once in a while to keep the weeds in check.

Posted by: Symen Danziger | Mar 5 2022 17:14 utc | 4

thanks b... i am not hopeful of the denazifying of ukraine... especially since the west is okay with it all if it can take down russia... there is some sick thinking in all this, but it appears our leaders - whoever the fuck they are - don't give a shit about any of this.. and they don't care how many innocent people need to die for this either...

quote from your post which is why i hold the position that it is going to be hard to denazify ukraine.. how does this get altered???

"The threats from the fascists make it impossible for any Ukrainian politician to implement a sane policy that would lead to peace in the country.

The fascists in Ukraine are relatively few. But they have the guns and they will kill anyone who opposes them and their aims. They have been put into important state positions. (Oligarchs like Kolomoyskyy pay and use them for their own purposes.)

The problem is that such ideological groups, once firmly established, tend to grow. The Right Sector is holding 'patriotic' summer camps for young Ukrainians and the Ukrainian state is financing those. They are successful and Ukrainian youths is looking up to them."

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 17:19 utc | 5

@ Rodrigo | Mar 5 2022 17:10 utc | 2... agreed.... unless the west changes course or russia succeeds here, we're fucked...

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 17:21 utc | 6

“Worst informational environment ever”

It kicked into gear in summer of 2014 - MH17. This A.M., western press is uniform: Russians shelled civilian evacuation. No space for argument or alternate perspective, one is immediately suspect. Predictable, this was happening in Syria I.e. the last stage of clearing Aleppo was met by hysterical headlines in western press, grandstanding western pols warning of massive civilian casualties, UNSC emergency meetings etc.
The pitch today is even more hysterical, more unhinged, triggering inchoate despair in the populace.
Factual documented primary source information means nothing in face of this in short term. Tremendous damage to the psychic membrane of the western publics is being done, in concert with the “hostage” attitude to Ukraine’s civilian population.

Posted by: jayc | Mar 5 2022 17:21 utc | 7

Tutta l'Europa, almeno i loro governi, sono contro la Russia e applicano sanzioni su sanzioni,
Ma nonostante ciò la Russia continua a rifornirli di gas petrolio e minerali,
Io che sono un grandissimo ignorante non mi capacito di questa decisione di fare sopravvivere un Europa russofoba e come detto nella mia totale ignoranza avrei chiuso tutti i rubinetti e li avrei lasciati riscaldare con dei fiammiferi.

Posted by: Alessandro Cagliostr | Mar 5 2022 17:21 utc | 8

Didn't the Russians issue an arrest warrant on Dmytro Anatoliyovych Yarosh back in 2015 in relation to terrorsit activities?

Posted by: Andrew S MacGregor | Mar 5 2022 17:22 utc | 9

@james, it gets altered if the Russians successfully kill a lot of the leading fascists. ugly, but what alternative is there? they are relatively few, as you say, which indicates their point of view is not widely shared--i wonder how many Ukrainians in western Ukraine would applaud this because they fear and hate the Nazis more than the Russians. I wonder if Zelensky fears and hates the Nazis more than the Russians.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 17:32 utc | 10

Accomplishing the goal of denazification will take a long time and a great deal of effort. If that is the case this will pass as the main media story in time. The longer it takes the greater the chance for this to spiral out of control due to some errant behavior alleged or real by any party.

The murder of one of the Ukrainian negotiators is a grim outlier. I cannot remember the member of a negotiating team being murdered by the state it represents in my life. It sounds like the West wants this to last as long as possible. It would not surprise me if they took the Russian negotiators hostage at some point.

Posted by: circumspect | Mar 5 2022 17:33 utc | 11

Ideologically, Ukrainian extreme nationalists are fascists, organizationally, they resemble pre-Nazi Freikorps. They recruit a lot of gangsters and homicidal maniacs, away from larger organized units they dabble in extortion, intimidation job etc. In a country of that size, finding several tens of thousands of such people is not a problem, especially with a dearth of decent jobs.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Mar 5 2022 17:34 utc | 12

@ pretzelattack... good questions.. i think zelensky is caught somewhere between the cia and the uke nazis.... i don't envy his position and frankly he reminds me of a typical politician who is willing to say whatever to the highest bidder... as for russia taking out the leading fascists - the problem is they are building them into the infrastructure as i see it... it is going to take a lot of work.. as @ circumspect notes - it will take a long time too..

so the possibility of someone like zelensky being murdered had one of the uke negotiators murdered instead.. the astro timing was as i mentioned the past few weeks - early march.... the key area of concern now astrologically is april 4th area.. not sure what happens then, but it doesn't look pretty...

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 17:37 utc | 13

What bums me out more than anything is that US/NATO were fully aware of this (via observations by army helping train these Ukrainian ultra-nationalist groups and parties during and after 2014 war, plus of course the quite frank on-the-record statements by the ultra nationalists of their appalling world views), but US/NATO encouraged it cynically for the usual geopolitical purposes. Not nearly for the first time.

Posted by: ptb | Mar 5 2022 17:40 utc | 14

Zionist fascists.

Ich verstehe

Posted by: Mr Green Jeans | Mar 5 2022 17:08 utc | 1

Thinking it impossible for Nazis and Jews to get along is tantamount to buying into bullshit racial nazi theories.

Jews were a target of opportunity, there is no hierarchy of races, and religions aren't races.

Fascist systems need scapegoats; in the german case it was jews (and many others), in the ukronazi case it's russians and russophones (and several others too, I guess).

Let's also not forget that Zionists are, in practice, supremacists; and have become extremely fond of ethnic cleansing.

Which particular group is scapegoated the hardest at any particular time is largely irrelevant, the ultimate goal of nazists is exterminating or enslaving everybody who isn't them, in which particular order they do so is only a matter of pragmatic calculus regarding how much effort it would take vs. how much power they have at the moment.

Fortunately, given their distorted perspective of their own strengths, compounded by their routine abuse of stimulants; nazi pigdogs are very prone to errors of overconfidence, such as targeting Russians.

Posted by: Misotheist | Mar 5 2022 17:42 utc | 15

the west fully supported isis.... of course that was buried, but it was obvious... the west supports nazis and that is buried by the msm for obvious reasons as well..

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 17:42 utc | 16

One small language quib against our excellent German leader of free drinks "unter den Tisch!" here at the pub benieth "dem Mond in Alabama":
.
The state in question bears a name that should be translated as "The Ukaine" or "Das Ukraina" in west Germanic and other Atlantisistic languages, i.e. with a definite particle.
.
This is because there are many other borderlands in this World of ours, I know German sub-stetes are called "die Länder" (the lands), but that is here just as irrelevant as that USA "Länder" are called "states" when they are amongst "den Unter-Ländern" of the Anglo-Zionist financial Kàballa. (Kaballah means "shop receit" in present modern Hebrew at the supermarkets there!)
.
Please allow me to thank You and Y'all anyhow for great postings -- the article and comments included, but maybe not my own small Besserwisserai and Weltscmertz!

Posted by: Tollef Ås/秋涛乐/טלפ וש | Mar 5 2022 17:42 utc | 17

b. Thank you for the platform.


Being freed from powerful fascists will enable Ukrainian politicians to re-institute sane policies.

That's the plan.

But will it work?


Will it Work? Only if fascist purge must be much wider than just Ukraine. Practically all of Europe has lined up behind the Nazis.

Posted by: too scents | Mar 5 2022 17:42 utc | 18

Thirty years later Russia may see a repeat of the confrontation. But 30 years are quite a long time.

Between them, in 30 years, Covid-19 and Climate change will reshape the world.

Posted by: C_A | Mar 5 2022 17:43 utc | 19

Does anybody really know what time it is? I've appreciated the side-conversation about the nature of time in recent threads. My own idea of time is that 'the later it gets, the faster it gets late.' And I think it is getting pretty late, meaning that the future is less and less random and more and more fixed.

I've been talking to people whose level of despair over the world is giving them suicidal thoughts. This despair been building for years, as eyes open, and has now reached a critical mass. Remember the 'new normal'? Well what is it now? Do we move from hospital masks to gas masks?

We're on Mr. Toad's wild ride and where it stops is not back at the beginning.

Posted by: gottlieb | Mar 5 2022 17:47 utc | 20

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C6NnUlhpxR4

Posted by c1ue late on previous thread and excellent. Interview of Scott Ritter. Thank you c1ue.

At end he says what I was starting to consider, that Putin is going to Lvov and is denazifying completely. The over 800,000 Ukrainians who have already crossed to Poland are not just those with the wherewithal to escape the fight. Many will be those who know for sure that they will die if they remain.

Ritter’s soy boy Azov comments echo what I have been saying here. Look at photos, they post selfies all the time. The uniformed and in the field photos disguise it a little, it still looks like high school. Rich kids with purchased dumb thugs. And it is always a photo of a short platoon, there are not that many of these dopes. Contrast with any photos of Russian military. Contrast with Chechens. Bullies can make enormous trouble in civil society, they are always losers.

Posted by: oldhippie | Mar 5 2022 17:48 utc | 21

I noticed in February that reports about attacks on Donbass suddenly mentioned distribution points of gas, electricity and water. Was there a deliberate attempt to disturb the infrastructure?

Posted by: Wim | Mar 5 2022 17:53 utc | 22

Please witness and attest.

b referenced a Grayzone article.
It has this title:
How Ukraine’s Jewish president Zelensky made peace with neo-Nazi paramilitaries on front lines of war with Russia

I compared a search using the corporatist Google with DuckDuckGo for the above title (I did not use quotes around the title).

DuckDuckGo gave as a result a list of numerous websites that have reprinted the Grayzone article by Alexander Rubinstein and Max Blumenthal.

Google gave as it's first result the Grayzone website.
Result #2 was www.vox.com Title: "Putin's “Nazi” rhetoric reveals his terrifying war aims in Ukraine"
Result #3 was www.nytimes.com Title: "Ukrainian Fighters Battle to Hold Kyiv - The New York Times"
Result #4 was www.washingtonpost.com Title: "Putin says he will 'denazify' Ukraine. Here's the history behind ..."

Again, I did not use quotes around the search terms.

Posted by: librul | Mar 5 2022 17:55 utc | 23

Please witness and attest.

b referenced a Grayzone article.
It has this title:
How Ukraine’s Jewish president Zelensky made peace with neo-Nazi paramilitaries on front lines of war with Russia

I compared a search using the corporatist Google with DuckDuckGo for the above title (I did not use quotes around the title).

DuckDuckGo gave as a result a list of numerous websites that have reprinted the Grayzone article by Alexander Rubinstein and Max Blumenthal.

Google gave as it's first result the Grayzone website.
Result #2 was www vox com Title: "Putin's “Nazi” rhetoric reveals his terrifying war aims in Ukraine"
Result #3 was www nytimes com Title: "Ukrainian Fighters Battle to Hold Kyiv - The New York Times"
Result #4 was www washingtonpost com Title: "Putin says he will 'denazify' Ukraine. Here's the history behind ..."

Again, I did not use quotes around the search terms.

Posted by: librul | Mar 5 2022 17:58 utc | 24

#3 Хулкарой,
https://archive.ph/P8JnL

The Rada announced the murder of a member of the Ukrainian delegation

Deputy of the Rada Dubinsky said that the SBU killed the representative of Kyiv in negotiations with Russia

The Security Service of Ukraine (SBU) killed Denis Kireev, a member of the Ukrainian delegation at the talks with Russia. This was stated by the deputy of the Verkhovna Rada Alexander Dubinsky, RIA Novosti reports.

Presumably, Kireev was suspected of high treason, tried to resist arrest and was killed. Officially, the Ukrainian authorities have not yet confirmed this information.

Until 2014, Kireev worked in the banking sector, was a member of the governing bodies of Oschadbank and Ukreximbank. Later he worked in the management of private funds. Why the office of the President of Ukraine decided to include him in the delegation at the talks is still unknown.

Earlier, President of Ukraine Volodymyr Zelensky said that the country is making every effort to comply with agreements with Russia on the creation of humanitarian corridors and the evacuation of citizens. He stressed that after the removal of the residents, he would decide on further continuation of the dialogue.

Posted by: C_A | Mar 5 2022 18:01 utc | 25

Thanks again b for all you do. The only bright spot I see is if the ucranians begin to realize they have been played. I have no such hopes for the Europeans unfortunately.

Posted by: c | Mar 5 2022 18:03 utc | 26

How would the refugee flow to EU impact on this current conflict?

Russia recently announced a ceasefire to let civilians out of the conflict zone. Many of these civilians would possibly head to EU.

A few months back, Belarus allowed refugee flow from Iraq to EU as an instrument of pressure on EU. Will the Russians pressure Europe with Ukrainian refugees?

What’ about a possible backlash in Europe? Will the ultranationalist groups in Europe attempt to gain from this possible backlash?

Posted by: Anony | Mar 5 2022 18:04 utc | 27

@rubble "fledging democracy" (sic) good joke. The jew you refer to was about to get assassinated by those fledgling democrats you so revere if he didn't cave in to their murderous Nazi agenda.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 18:04 utc | 28

#13 James
https://unz.com/mwhitney/the-man-who-sold-ukraine/

Posted by: C_A | Mar 5 2022 18:05 utc | 29

Posted by: Alessandro Cagliostr | Mar 5 2022 17:21 utc | 8

Gracias señor Caliostro, got that post completely without computer help, which brings me to the point that Russians and Ukrainians should understand each other easily, if they want to, let us hope so, and as you say the taps are open, in spite of the hate wave in Europe the energy keeps on flowing, until it doesn't. We in Europe do not deserve our politicians, career is their only aim, and we know what it takes to be successful, sucking up to the master.

Posted by: Paco | Mar 5 2022 18:07 utc | 30

Rumor: It is again claimed that Zelensky has moved to Poland

Ukrainian MP Ilya Kiva said that Volodymyr Zelensky left Kyiv and is on the territory of the American embassy in Poland. https://t.me/intelslava/21590

Posted by: Norwegian | Mar 5 2022 18:07 utc | 31

The other day (yesterday?) I said to WJ that a Russian nuclear escalation, if it were to be in the script, would begin as a very public violation of the test ban treaty.

Any nuclear escalation scripting beyond that would be more direct. Reason tells me it would come in the form of mostly or perhaps all tactical nuclear deployments against as many of the relevant intelligence services headquarters and heads of state as necessary. As with Willie Brown on 9/11, non-public notices will be sent out to favored souls to avoid the areas.

Then 'World Peace' will be brokered.

Killing two birds with one stone: destroying some serious fucking demand and making a clean break with the old order that no longer serves its purpose.

Yeah I know call me crazy.

Posted by: reante | Mar 5 2022 18:11 utc | 32

@C_A : I bet in 30 years NOONE will be talking about COVID anymore, except as a historical scam. And the concern over « climate change » will have morphed into some other version of the scam. Too much Nitrogen maybe. That is, unless we’ve moved onto a different paradigm (world).

@gottlied : For years, many years before getting a better view on geopolitics, I had a strong feeling something was deeply wrong with the world, in an overarching way. Psychologically, I carried the weight of the World on my shoulders. Then, as a result of overwork and other personal difficulties, I had a depression and a burnout. Since taking anti-depressants, I don’t get depressed anymore. Sometimes a-holes make me anxious and very uptight, and I have to be alone in quiet. That’s my nemesis. But I’m not depressed about the world anymore. I don’t know exactly why, but here are my suspected reasons :

1. I don’t carry the world on my shoulders anymore.

2. The anti-depressants.

3. I’ve already lost a lot in my life.

4. I’m not afraid of death.

5. Since starting geopolitics, there appear to be « good guys », ie.: the Axis of Resistance, who appear to be reversing the tide.

So people despairing should cheer up, and grab some popcorn. Cause whatever happens, there’s nothing we can do about it. Now I suppose I might feel different if i had kids.

Posted by: Featherless | Mar 5 2022 18:13 utc | 33

b says correctly: "The fascists in Ukraine are relatively few." But I say the word ''fascist'' is disrespectful and is actually inaccurate. Better and plainer language is ''ultranationalists'' on the far-right of the political spectrum. They are entitled to their political opinions. They have done poorly in all democratic elections in Ukraine before and after 2014.

The political spectrum in every country has some people who stances are on the far right side of the spectrum. This is no excuse to invade the country. The de-nazification rhetoric of Putin and his supporters concerning Ukraine is very lame and limp rhetoric, because the ultranationalists in Ukraine are absolutely few and because they are entitled to their political opinions in Ukraine.

Posted by: Oleg Lobotosad | Mar 5 2022 18:17 utc | 34

A photo of the fascists that Joe Biden supports along with the Azov Battalion Democrats:
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse3.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.leLuWB07kiTuEWyjvBsMXAHaEM%26pid%3DApi&f=1

Posted by: Rabbit | Mar 5 2022 18:20 utc | 35

@Oleg - are those ultra-nationalists also entitles to murdering and ethnic cleansing their fellow citizens ?

Posted by: Featherless | Mar 5 2022 18:24 utc | 36

b says correctly: "The fascists in Ukraine are relatively few."
Posted by: Oleg Lobotosad | Mar 5 2022 18:17 utc | 34

---

They showed up like mushrooms after the rain here is Switzerland.

Posted by: too scents | Mar 5 2022 18:25 utc | 37

physics isn't a scam. climate change isn't going away.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 18:26 utc | 38

I wonder if the leaders of European nations are considering the possibility (likelihood?) that fascist/Nazi movements in their own countries will grow and gain in strength as a result of events in Ukraine. It's not hard to imagine that fascists and nazis throughout Europe are encouraged by the actions of their own governments to support ultra-right forces in Ukraine.

Naah, on further consideration, I can't give European leaders credit for having any foresight. They will be surprised when it happens. Blowback's a bitch, baby.

Posted by: Rob | Mar 5 2022 18:27 utc | 39

Biology is not a scam either. Covid is mutating too fast for it to be stopped.

Posted by: C_A | Mar 5 2022 18:30 utc | 40

Postado por: Rick Rubles | 5 de março de 2022 17:55 utc | 23

I'm new here and I notice that guys like you always appear thinking that there are people rooting for someone other than innocent civilians in the middle of the mess. No one here for the short time I've been here has been deluded with anyone but for the sake of survival if you're dominated by enemy forces I'd rather wait for the Russians to resolve than face the NATO bomb carpet. You crybaby here, it's not about who's better, it's about who's least bad.

Posted by: Oisin | Mar 5 2022 18:31 utc | 41

Oleg Lobotosad @ 34

Given the means and the support it is not impossible for a small number of people to terrorize and control a country to a degree. That is what we see here. The West is supporting these thugs just like they have done in Afghanistan to defeat the Russians, in Libya to break up the government, in Syria, in Nicaragua after the Sandinista's where overthrown. In Korea in the 50's we supported right wing death squads of youths to dismember any thought of communism among the population. That is just a small sample. There are more.

Clearly they have been integrated into the Ukrainian military. Clearly the history is deep and the Agency has been doing these things since its inception. If we cannot control a country we use thugs. Standard operating procedure

Posted by: circumspect | Mar 5 2022 18:38 utc | 42

@pretzelattack - strawman. The Earth’s wobble and sunspots, and weather in general aren’t going away either. « climate change » is a conveniently unassailable label for a phenomenon that has always existed. It’s funny that since « climate change » and its precursor name « global warming » have been fashionable, we don’t talk much about pollution anymore. I wonder why that is...

In any case, it was my mistake to answer @Oleg’s OT statement.

Posted by: Featherless | Mar 5 2022 18:40 utc | 43

I still stand by my statement from over ten years ago:

Ukraine is not a nation. It is a racist theory about the inferiority of the Russian people.

The need to de-Russify Ukraine stems from the belief in the racial and cultural superiority of Anglo-Saxon and Germanic Europeans. And from the self-hatred this inflicts in westernized Russians.

P.S. - Here is something interesting from The Guardian:

They are ‘civilised’ and ‘look like us’: the racist coverage of Ukraine

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Mar 5 2022 18:42 utc | 44

@ Rob | Mar 5 2022 18:27 utc | 39:

Fascism -- the merging of state and corporate interests under a nationalist agenda -- is a natural result of unchecked capitalism. It might even be the inevitable result of unchecked capitalism. European states have been busily dismantling their social-democratic enterprises (sales of state-owned railways, postal banks, airlines; in UK even talk of privatizing the national health service), often by the parties that promoted state ownership of such enterprises in the first place, which in essence means green-lighting unchecked capitalism.

I'm not sure how "nationalist" the upcoming Eurofascism will be, given all the idle prattle about EUropean unity, but I'm not seeing any indication that Europe will not welcome fascism with open arms.

Posted by: malenkov | Mar 5 2022 18:43 utc | 45

If you're looking for a little humor in these dark days - please enjoy this.

https://www.theburningplatform.com/2022/03/01/open-letter-from-president-zelenskyy-to-my-american-comrades/

I listened to Nationalist Propaganda Radio this morning, and I am sad to say I am not overly optimistic about the U.S. ability to help diplomatically resolve this conflict. All they could talk about was Russian aggression and U.S. sanctions. More importantly, they offer only escalation if sanctions fail to dissuade Putin. Troubling for sure.

Posted by: thecelticwithinme | Mar 5 2022 18:45 utc | 46

Birthing a new multi-polar won't be pretty, but necessary.

As always b, thanks for the platform, and the necessary therapy...

Posted by: vetinLA | Mar 5 2022 18:46 utc | 47

There is the little matter of a mansion in Miami. According to the Pandora papers, Zelensky was given a mansion and piles of money by Kolomysky. So he was not entirely "forced" to change sides. He is a greedy little clown but very little else..

He could well have been threatened, and probably was, but there was/is a promised reward at the end of the rainbow. He eats from any table, any dish.

*****

PS. Miami is renown for retirement homes. He will be welcomed by his two new neighbours, Guaido and Navalny, who already have personalized deckchairs along the front.

Posted by: Stonebird | Mar 5 2022 18:46 utc | 48

When the fascists don't like that you want to make peace:

SBU shot dead member of Ukrainian negotiating delegation Kireev who was suspected of treason during his arrest – MP Honcharenko

During the arrest, the Security Service of Ukraine (SBU) shot dead a member of the Ukrainian negotiating group Denys Kireev, who was suspected of high treason, MP Oleksiy Honcharenko has said.

"During the arrest, the Security Service of Ukraine shot dead a member of the Ukrainian negotiating delegation Denys Kireev. He was suspected of high treason," Honcharenko wrote on his Telegram channel.

He claims that, according to interlocutors in political circles, the Security Service had clear evidence of Kireev's treason, including telephone conversations.

Interfax-Ukraine has not yet confirmed this information.

That was a warning to Zelensky himself.

Posted by: b | Mar 5 2022 18:46 utc | 49

Guiado 2.0


#BREAKING
🇺🇸🇪🇺🆘🇺🇦 — U.S. and allies are quietly preparing a Ukrainian government-in-exile led by Zelensky as Washington and European officials anticipate that the Russian military will reverse its early losses, setting the stage to support Ukraine for a long, bloody insurgency against Russia - 🇺🇸 Washington Post

https://archive.is/yEkMh

Posted by: WJ | Mar 5 2022 18:49 utc | 50

I listened to Nationalist Propaganda Radio this morning, and I am sad to say I am not overly optimistic about the U.S. ability to help diplomatically resolve this conflict.

Posted by: thecelticwithinme | Mar 5 2022 18:45 utc | 46


Rest assured that the USA has no interest, none whatsoever, in a diplomatic resolution to the conflict. The USA desires further escalation. The only real question is whether the USA will be satisfied with the destruction of the Ukraine and Europe as a viable economic entity, or whether the USA intends to provoke Russia into hot war.

Posted by: malenkov | Mar 5 2022 18:50 utc | 51

as Washington and European officials anticipate that the Russian military will reverse its early losses [snip] 🇺🇸 Washington Post

Posted by: WJ | Mar 5 2022 18:49 utc | 50


"Early losses." Ha! That's astonishingly desperate spin!

Posted by: malenkov | Mar 5 2022 18:52 utc | 52

Thank you b for all that you are doing here. Even though it is clearly a labour of love it must be difficult and highly stressful.

To be able to come up with insightful reporting day after day under these conditions is nothing short of amazing.

I salute you!

Posted by: John Cleary | Mar 5 2022 18:54 utc | 53

I have a question regarding foreign voluntaries coming to Ukraine to fight against the Russian Army. Are these people covered by the Geneve Convention?

I'm not talking about neonazis or white supremacists. I'm talking about people brainwashed by mass media about the conflict. For instance in Canada, some people expressed their intention to fight. A retired snipper from the Canadian Army, who is also a retired pharmacist (perhaps full of money and bored to the bones) announced that he is departing to that "adventure".

What happens to a guy like him if captured? Could people like him be executed ipso facto?

Posted by: Andres | Mar 5 2022 18:55 utc | 54

nope Featherless, not a "wobble". the oil companies are some of the giant corporations driving this warmongering, and US foreign policy in general, which means they also drive NATO policy since NATO is mainly a US puppet. there is no need to catapult their propaganda.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 18:56 utc | 55

@50 I wonder how enthusiastic the Poles will be having a second government.

Posted by: dh | Mar 5 2022 18:57 utc | 56

So I wrote that sometimes I hold my nose and watch CNN, just to blow back their bullshit. So this armchair retired general is discussing that Putin stated earlier that if NATO aircraft enter Ukraine airspace, he would consider that entering into war with Russia. Then the General went on to say that although No Fly is still off the table, if it were possible, Russians would be petrified to encounter NATO aircraft.

CNN is taking on the role of provocateur trying to blur the lines of how to wiggle in U.S. presence in Ukraine, and especially using Western Ukraine where the U.S. is smuggling in hundreds of Stingers and Javelins and more weapons. Then they stated that Russia does not have air superiority and showed a video of a stinger taking down a low flying helicopter near Kiev.

This is the kind of garbage they're serving up on CNN.

Now, regarding Zelensky, I wrote on the previous thread that he cannot be trusted, is unfit to lead and has demonstrated extreme hostility towards Russia and Putin, first by evoking the Budapest Memorandum of 1994 an then with subsequent cries to have Putin sanctioned and Russia removed from SWIFT and now pressuring the U.S. to implement a no fly zone over Ukraine.

I actually agree with the fascist thug on the fact that Zelensky is weak and inexperienced, and I'll add enthralled with U.S. power and co-opted by fascists who are doing the dirty work that he maybe couldn't stomach at first, but that he finds palatable now and necessary to hold on to power.

Damn him. If the fascists string him up; he will have authored his end. If you lay down with Nazi fascists you may end up in the town square upside-down.

Posted by: Circe | Mar 5 2022 18:57 utc | 57

@Rob | Mar 5 2022 18:27 utc | 39

I wonder if the leaders of European nations are considering the possibility (likelihood?) that fascist/Nazi movements in their own countries will grow and gain in strength as a result of events in Ukraine.

I wonder if you consider they may be all installed as the leaders and that they may be following orders of their masters and not the best interests of their countries.

Posted by: Vajezatha | Mar 5 2022 19:00 utc | 58

There seem to be parallel arguments being made. In one, Zelensky and Ukraine have since 2014 been run by Nazis, who overthrew the duly elected president (because he was leaning toward Russia) and who have been intent on getting Ukraine into NATO and create a Nazi friendly state. In another - now the only one being heard on MSM btw - the Nazi element has been wiped clean, forgotten, cancelled, and this is about noble Ukrainian democrats and a courageous leader standing up to the nasty expansionist Russian bear.

Context and history matter. When the Germans invaded Russia many Russians, or Ukrainians, who hated the Soviets, joined the German side. Many Eastern Europeans became staff in the German killing machine. In all the years since, there has and continues to be an element, a small percentage, of descendants from those Nazis and their supporters, who have endured, beneath shadows, in Europe, the Americas, and elsewhere. Lately this view has become more out there, public, empowered. It is called right wing nationalism, white supremacy, whatever. But it is of a kind with a view that matches the Nazi view.

Yet....WW2 was 80 years ago, and all those Nazis from then somehow either went into hiding or changed their views after the War ended, Germany became a solid democratic country, and it seemed for decades this type of thinking was dying out. Maybe those with such views became careful, and hid, or forgot, or maybe they generally rethought things and decided they had been wrong. Whatever they did, to some degree this right wing tendency toward choice of autocratic exclusive governments seems much wider than Ukraine. It seems prevalent throughout the Western world. Is it Nazi? Lots of people think so. I think lots of Russians think so, with their history.

I'd take Putin at his word - he feels existentially threatened, backed into a corner, with no way out. Not a good idea, to trap and corner a powerful bear. The Western response has been itself a declaration of economic war against the Russian Federation. We hope and think these sanctions will drive the good Russian people to overthrow Putin. But I think we will drive the good Russian people to feel attacked and their nationalism will rise and they will come together to survive this, because, in their view, the original basis for all this - the failure to implement Minsk and the expansion of NATO - was never even considered by the West, and never would have been.

What happened when FDR curt off oil to Japan in World War 2? Remember? We should.

Posted by: Boomheist | Mar 5 2022 19:02 utc | 59

Ukrainian nationalists are going to kill 9 citizens of Iraq held in Sumy, blaming the Russian military for this, sources in the Russian law enforcement agencies told RIA Novosti.

SBU (Security Service of Ukraine) employees discussed in Syria the possibility of involving militants in the events in Ukraine, a military-diplomatic source told RIA Novosti. SBU employees agreed in Syria on a series of secret meetings with "interested parties".

Posted by: alaff | Mar 5 2022 19:03 utc | 60

@Rick Rubles

Fledging democracy, huh? Ukraine has been for years the poorest country with the lowest per capita GDP(even lower than Georgia, Moldova). It's a mafia state with changing plutocrats on top who enrich themself and their buddies.

Posted by: Vato | Mar 5 2022 19:06 utc | 61

Posted by: Andres | Mar 5 2022 18:55 utc | 54

No they aren't

Posted by: jo6pac | Mar 5 2022 19:07 utc | 62

malenkov 45

"Fascism -- the merging of state and corporate interests under a nationalist agenda -- is a natural result of unchecked capitalism."

That is the definition of Nationalist Fascism.

Substitute 'internationalist' for "nationalist" and you get Imperial Fascism.

Substitute 'global' for "nationalist" and you get Global Fascism, which is both the logical conclusion of industrial capitalism and what we currently have.

Get it together, now.

Posted by: reante | Mar 5 2022 19:07 utc | 63

Circumspect (11)

Walther Rathenau 1922

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Mar 5 2022 19:14 utc | 64

b: "Yarosh: if Zelensky betrays Ukraine, he will lose not his position, but his life"

It is what happened to Kyreyev.

"“During an attempt to detain Denys Kyreyev, a member of the Ukrainian negotiating delegation, the Ukrainian Security Service shot and killed him. He was suspected of high treason,” Honcharenko wrote on Telegram. Kyreyev was among the members of the Ukrainian delegation at the first round of the talks with Russia in Belarus."

Jews supporting nazis. Who could believe this? Cf. Kolomoïsky and others. Killing all people in one town, it is written in the bible (Jericho, Aï, etc.).

Posted by: Olivier | Mar 5 2022 19:17 utc | 65

I hope to be alive when Russia and Greater Greece refurbish the Hagia Sophia. It will be amazing

Posted by: Jezabeel | Mar 5 2022 19:19 utc | 66

A slight diversion from fascists to highlight the West's premier oligarchs and the limits to growth.

From the Telegraph:

Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos eye Russia's place in space

Warnings about the International Space Station crashing to earth show era of international harmony is over

...

All the while, the station’s altitude has regularly been topped up by a Russian cargo spacecraft that delivers fuel and supplies. Without it, the ISS would slowly descend into the earth’s atmosphere, partially burn up, and crash into the earth.

It was not a possibility many had countenanced until last week, when Dmitry Rogozin, the head of the Russian space agency, threatened just that.

“Do you want to destroy our cooperation on the ISS?,” Rogozin wrote on Twitter. “The correction of the station's orbit, its avoidance of dangerous rendezvous with space garbage, is produced exclusively by the engines of the Russian Progress cargo ships. If you block cooperation with us, who will save the ISS from an uncontrolled deorbit and fall into the United States or Europe?”

...

Workers at the Roscosmos space agency were preparing to launch a payload of 36 satellites owned by OneWeb, the satellite operator partly owned by the British government following a $500m bailout in 2020.

But on Wednesday, less than three days before the launch, Rogozin issued an ultimatum: either the Government sells off its stake in OneWeb, or the satellites stay firmly on the ground. British, American and Japanese flags on the rocket were covered up.

... continues


Archived link ==> https://archive.ph/jt1y1

Stick a fork in non-rentabe space junk. OneWeb is done.


Posted by: too scents | Mar 5 2022 19:19 utc | 67

the ones that flap and scream in hysteria do so because that is all they can do. They are losing.

I know it is difficult to look at the global lockstep lies
'they are winning the information war' ... who cares? The hearts and minds of the uninformed will change drastically when these authoritarian measures are applied at home and they will be.... they already are.

China and Russia will not fall because of zionist newspapers or opinions of a dying empire.
There are a few sane heads left at the helm. I hope they prevail.

It is lonely and disheartening that so many friends family and countrymen who have paid zero attention to the world up until now spout absolute nonsense narratives.

Thank the dieties that this site still exists

The infultrators who have shown up are at least the bottom of the barrel.
Report Don't Feed

Posted by: ld | Mar 5 2022 19:20 utc | 68

Sorry did not read comment #49 by b.

Posted by: Olivier | Mar 5 2022 19:21 utc | 69

If the fascists in fact come mostly from those catholic parts of Ukraine in the west that used to be part of Poland, Romania and maybe Hungary then Ukraine must be Balkanized to remove these parts from Ukraine.

That is the only way to stop them from impacting Ukraine again because we all know CIA/MI6 money will flow to them again….if it ever stops

Posted by: Alaric | Mar 5 2022 19:22 utc | 70

@ C_A | Mar 5 2022 18:05 utc | 29... thanks


@ Oleg Lobotosad | Mar 5 2022 18:17 utc | 34 - ultra nationalists is no excuse to hold the rest of the country hostage or murder one of the peace negotiators either... but the shit continues on until it doesn't.. zelensky rubber stamps all of the usa-nato warmongering and you are okay with it.. fine... others see it differently here..

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 19:23 utc | 71

Rick Rubles | 23
But, whatabout those poor 13 guards who were blown away on Snake Island or the car that was crushed by a Russian tank?

Posted by: Keith McClary | Mar 5 2022 19:24 utc | 72

https://9gag.com/gag/a21M1b9

Posted by: Qwerty | Mar 5 2022 19:26 utc | 73

If this is correct, carving up Ukraine is not out of the question.

https://twitter.com/ASBMilitary/status/1500119105722105858
Putin - "Today's leadership in Kiev must understand - if they continue in the same spirit, they call into question the future of Ukrainian statehood, and if this happens, it will be entirely on their conscience."

I cannot access the Kremlin site to check.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 5 2022 19:26 utc | 74

I think its entirely feasible that Russia will occupy deep into Ukraine permanently, simply because it will keep US/Nato nukes further from the Russian border than if they withdraw right back. Also occupying or incorporating a large chunk of Ukraine East of Kiev, will also be a buffer zone to the inevitable rise again of the Ukrainian Nazis.

It will be almost impossible to de-natzify Ukraine, Nazis can just throw off their uniforms and melt into the civilian population, the ones that can't do this are the ones known to Russian authorities they will need to flee West to near the border with Poland, or another Ukrainian Nazi friendly country. It would appear that the lauding of Nazism in Ukraine is endemic, I say that because many streets are named after Nazi sympathisers and there are also many monuments to them as well, the deeper question must be are the streets and monument named after Nazi sympathisers there because the general population want them to be, or are they there because the Nazi element in the country has cowered the general population into keeping quiet.

Another important factor on incorporating or occupying Ukraine East of Kiev, to protect Russia's borders, is that the West won't stop funneling weapons and supplies along with fighters into Western Ukraine, that will go on for years to come, occupying or incorporating East Ukraine give Russia a battleground to deal with those mad dogs in any fashion they want to it also protects Donbas, of course Ukraine East of Kiev will not be safe for civilians for years to come, evacuation is the only option as the Wests mad dog fighters and the Ukrainian Nazis would use the population to melt into, as human shields or kill them and use their deaths as propaganda against Russia.


In my opinion its really the best option for Putin, in what is going to be along drawn out affair Nato/EU will send in all their proxy fighters armed to the teeth for years to come.

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 5 2022 19:29 utc | 75

@Rodrigo, #1:

2) demonize, weaken and isolate Russia is also succeeding.

Succeeding only in the western world. The rest of the world, I'm not so sure. The ones I'm in contact with, China/Hong Kong/Taiwan/Singapore/KualaLumpur, would not fall into that category at the citizenry level.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Mar 5 2022 19:31 utc | 76

This fight is ultimately about the control of the world. Ukraine is but a battlefield, just like Syria. The West has zero intention of giving up on the petrodollar and will not hesitate to start a nuclear war if that's what it takes for them to preserve their exorbitant privilege. Contrary to popular belief, a nuclear war is absolutely possible and would not mean the extinction of the human race. Case in point: people in Hiroshima live normally.

Posted by: HB | Mar 5 2022 19:37 utc | 77

@ HB | Mar 5 2022 19:37 utc | 77

Today's nukes are several orders of magnitude more powerful than the ones Truman d*ck-wagged Stalin with in 1945. And there are thousands of them.

Posted by: malenkov | Mar 5 2022 19:40 utc | 78

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 5 2022 19:26 utc | 74

This comes as we receive word that the US plans to set up an exiled Ukrainian government (prob in Poland) with Zelensky at the head.

How does Russia’a threat to Balkanize the Ukraine an effective response to the US play to stage insurgent warfare in the country via a proxy exiled government?

I’m sure these two things are related but would like help understanding how it is supposed to work. If Russia had likely some other response ready to counter the US move—I believe they would have anticipated the US trying this—what would that be?

Posted by: WJ | Mar 5 2022 19:41 utc | 79

at least we are all safe from Russian cats entering catshows, and Russian chessplayers at FIDE tournaments.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 19:42 utc | 80

Could a jew become a head of state in russia? No, because no one other than your authoritarian hero will allow anyone to oppose him.

Posted by: Rick Rubles | Mar 5 2022 17:55 utc | 23

At the same time, many publications write that President Vladimir Putin is Jew by nationality of his mother. There is a document - an application for issuing a new passport of Russian citizen Putin Vladimir Vladimirovich of December 30, 2000, which indicates the citizenship of the parents. According to official data, Father - Putin Vladimir Spiridonovich - Russian, and mother - Shelomova Maria Ivanovna - Jewish.

Was Vladimir Putin's mother Jewish?

Posted by: Down South | Mar 5 2022 19:43 utc | 81

I echo John Cleary @53 - and very many others here I'm sure - in thanking b for his reporting, analysis, and provision and maintenance of this forum.

Posted by: spudski | Mar 5 2022 19:45 utc | 82

Vladimir Putin declares war on the Straussians
by Thierry Meyssan
Russia is not waging war on the Ukrainian people, but on a small group of people within US power who have transformed Ukraine without knowing it, the Straussians. It was formed half a century ago and has already committed an incredible amount of crimes in Latin America and the Middle East unbeknownst to the United States. Here is their story.

https://www.voltairenet.org/article215852.html

Posted by: Roy | Mar 5 2022 19:45 utc | 83

It's time for the good Ukrainians, those who oppose the nazis, to stand up and take responsibility for their country. It's not fair to let the Russians do all the dirty work. Good Ukrainians can be the most effective helping the Russians de-nazifying. If there aren't enough of them willing to fight, what hope is there for Ukraine as a nation?

Posted by: Robert Macaire | Mar 5 2022 19:46 utc | 84

New site to me by way of commenter at NC that still won't allow MofA to be cross posted.

https://newcoldwar.org/

I'm using Yandex to translate

Posted by: jo6pac | Mar 5 2022 19:48 utc | 85

The moment Russian forces leave Ukraine, is the moment CIA will start reorganizing Nazis. It must not happen. Or, a Belarus-style setup must be effected.

Posted by: Supercommenter | Mar 5 2022 19:49 utc | 86

None of the things that happened in Ukraine from 2014 to this day would have happened without outside meddling. Meddling by the US (mainly under Democrat supervision), that's the interested party that actually knows what it's doing. And meddling by the EU, by NATO, and by individual member states of the two (Germany, Poland, the Baltlets come to mind). That's the interested party that doesn't know what it's doing, or to what end the other interested party is doing what it is doing.

Maybe the nationalists and ultra-nationalists had some organic roots in Ukraine. They got as much as 10% in one election, alright. But you don't get from there to a group of some 20.000 people completely hijacking the military, security apparatus and politics of a whole nation by way of natural growth or purely internal development. These people have this kind of influence only because of outside help. Well, help, in this case, doesn't even begin to cover it.

Before Ukraine got hijacked by the US (Democrats), it actually got along not too bad with Russia. Ukraine and Russia parted ways in the dissolution of the USSR without a single shot being fired. That in itself is remarkable. What's more, there weren't even border disputes, imagine that. And neither were there any disputes between Ukraine and Belarus. It was the complete opposite of what happened in a somewhat comparable situation, namely when the Russian Empire broke down (everybody fought everybody else, repeatedly).

There's a very interesting book on this, aptly titled "Explaining the Low Intensity of Ethnopolitical Conflict in Ukraine" by one Susan Stewart. Of course, it was written many years before the Maidan, and the author has by now sold her soul to the US' anti-Russian project. She wouldn't write such a book today, it was merely an honest mistake, a "Jugendsünde".

Anyway, getting rid of the Nazis in Ukraine won't be difficult. They're not the SS with a million members and so many "Dienststellen". They're deluded, alien to their own country, and about to die or be captured and tried. Crush them, crush the CIA and NATO networks, and Ukraine will be able to find a new life and its rightful place again.

Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Mar 5 2022 19:50 utc | 87

b:

Troll cleanup on Aisle 85, please.

Posted by: malenkov | Mar 5 2022 19:52 utc | 88

I think b wants us to email him about trolls.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 19:55 utc | 89

@ Alaric | Mar 5 2022 19:22 utc | 70

@ Peter AU1 | Mar 5 2022 19:26 utc | 74

what are the odds on the balkanization of yugoslavia being repeated here with ukraine? what are the odds of that happening? at least 25 to 1 i'd say..

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 19:57 utc | 90

@ pretzelattack | Mar 5 2022 19:55 utc | 90 yes - , and he already has received more then a few e mails too i suspect..

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 19:58 utc | 91

Patrick Armstrong
At the moment they are readying for the next phase. The long column that so obsessed the “experts” on CNN is the preparation for the next phase. And that is this: “You didn’t get the hint, so now we have to hit you”. The fact that the column has been sitting there indicates that the Russians know they have complete air superiority. Secondly it is a message to the Ukrainian armed forces that it’s over, give up. (And one should never forget that the Russians/Soviets have always been the best at strategic deception, so who knows what’s actually there versus what the images show?)

As far as I can see they’ve created three cauldrons (encirclements). Probably the most important one is the one around Mariupol where the main concentration of Azov, the principal nazi force, is. Another is being established around the main concentration of the Ukrainian Armed Forces facing LDPR. And there appears to be another developing to the east of Kiev. A super cauldron of all three is visible. The nazis will be exterminated; the ordinary Ukrainian soldier will be allowed to go home. The nightmare question is how many ordinary Ukrainians will be free to choose.

https://www.unz.com/article/russia-ukraine-2-the-world-order-has-changed/

Posted by: ld | Mar 5 2022 19:59 utc | 92

getting rid of the Nazis in Ukraine won't be difficult. They're not the SS with a million members
Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Mar 5 2022 19:50 utc | 88

---

There are probably many millions of Nazi diaspora salted internationally.

Posted by: too scents | Mar 5 2022 20:00 utc | 93

"The problem is that such ideological groups, once firmly established, tend to grow. The Right Sector is holding 'patriotic' summer camps for young Ukrainians and the Ukrainian state is financing those. They are successful and Ukrainian youths is looking up to them."
Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 17:19 utc | 5

The de-Nazification must be extended to Canada. The radicalization of Ukrainian Nazis - and the pollution of Ukrainian youth - has been the result of steady financing and training provided by the Canadian progeny of SS 1st Galicia and other Nazi collaborators. These activities have been supported by the US ziocons.

Posted by: Cerena | Mar 5 2022 20:00 utc | 94

cbc news top post - Mariupol">https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/mariupol-ukraine-russia-invasion-1.6374303/">Mariupol diary: Scenes from Ukrainian port city battered by Russia's invasion no mention of azov battalion in the area either... funny that...

this is a rehash of the war on syria.. the only thing missing is the white helmets.. maybe they are going to arrive shortly... blitz the west with propaganda...

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 20:02 utc | 95

WJ | 50

U.S. and allies are quietly preparing a Ukrainian government-in-exile led by Zelensky

Strange that WaPo would publish this - I expect it will trigger a panicky collapse of the Kiev regime.

Posted by: Keith McClary | Mar 5 2022 20:03 utc | 96

i am not going to fix the link... anyone stupid enough to want to read it can go to cbc news website..

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 20:03 utc | 97

@b, #49:

It appears the Empire is running its operations in complete Mafia style. How in the world did we sink so low in our part of the world???

p.s. I live in the western world.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Mar 5 2022 20:04 utc | 98

@ Cerena | Mar 5 2022 20:00 utc | 96... we're working on it... some of us have been raising alarm bells for at least the past 8 years since maiden protests... we have our own little neo-nazi with crystia freeland at the levers of canuck parliamentary power...

Posted by: james | Mar 5 2022 20:05 utc | 99

" What happened when FDR curt off oil to Japan in World War 2? Remember? We should.

Posted by: Boomheist | Mar 5 2022 19:02 utc | 59 "

Very true. Its also widely know that the US intentionally did that to force Japan into war, while also giving casus belli for war against Germany. The only reason they did this was because they were extremely sure of winning at the end. Is this the case in our current situation ? Why is the US seemingly hell bent on starting a war if they didnt think they could win ?

Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Mar 5 2022 20:07 utc | 100

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