Only news & views related to the Ukraine conflict …
Back to Main
March 24, 2022
Ukraine Open Thread 2022-34
Comments
@Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 16:59 utc | 79
The US seems to have been very diligent in turning most European rulers into compradors, just as it has with Canada. Incredible how they have been able to remove the possibility of independence so effectively. In the recent Bulgarian election the 41-year old Canadian (Petkov) and his Harvard-affiliated buddy decided to form a new “anti-corruption” party and won the election, where have we seen this story before? Petkov is definitely a good technocrat vassal, with an MBA from Harvard. His LinkedIn says he worked as a Corporate Development Manager for McCain Foods, owned by the ultra-wealthy Canadian McCain family, then got his Harvard MBA, then founded his company ProViotic.
https://bulgaria.pglf.org/team/kiril-petkov-2/
I do feel that a major proportion of the US elite, the paymasters of the Congress, have truly drunk their own koolaid and have no idea about the awfulness and risks of the actions they are supporting – helped by the ignoramuses such as Blinken and Sullivan and the non-entity of Harris. It may very well be the cooler heads of the US military and perhaps some of the financiers (that were not consulted on the decision to cut off Russian banks from SWIFT and steal its foreign exchange reserves) that my hold off the more catastrophic decisions. Yes, Europe has been cowed and split from the East, but the damage to the US will also be extensive.
With a big chunk of the world now looking at a recession, the oil price may have overreacted a bit in the short-term. It may need a rest around $100 before it moves up further. The lack of exploration for the past decade, the limitations on US shale, together with continuing Eastern demand increases, will keep the price high in the longer term. But anything at $120 and above tends to create a recession in the West.
Don Bacon @94–
The simple solution is for the EU to tell the Empire to fuck off and eat your illegal sanctions. Hydrocarbons priced a tad higher are much better than getting no hydrocarbons at all. Hudson is 100% correct in saying that this fight will show if Europe has any independence at all or has completely succumbed. Macron hopes for reelection against openly Pro-Russian, Pro-Farnce, Anti-Empire, Anti-NATO candidates from both left and right, and the voting will certainly go into the second round.
@Steve Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9
The fact that our host here is ex Western military, as are Scott Ritter and the Saker, I believe, should persuade some, I would hope, but I haven’t really tried. It’s always best to find a source close to the views of the person you want to persuade. Ben Pile @clim8resistance is a climate sceptic linked to the Marxist spiked-online.com, .theblogmire.com is christian conservative, (both English) Steve McIntyre @ClimateAudit is Canadian radical statistician – all highly recommended
Posted by: geoff chambers | Mar 24 2022 17:52 utc | 103
Not to worry, no matter the back and forth, reality will prevail. The one reality that is apparent to me is; This latest war was, and is, wholly acceptable to the U$A/NATO contingent. IMO, the corporations, who run the world, love war. It’s much more profitable than peace.
Posted by: vetinLA | Mar 24 2022 17:52 utc | 104
@Steve | Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9
Based on my 40 year career in the global oil industry, here’s my very cynical take. The vast majority of people I’ve met all over the world are predisposed to believe what they want to believe regardless of facts. This is because they subconsciously filter out data that conflicts with their culturally-derived value systems and biases.
In Western culture, Russians have unjustly been considered to be inferior uncivilized barbarians for centuries, perhaps at least as far back as the Schism of 1054 or even earlier to the 4th century separation of the Roman Empire into West and East (i.e. Byzantium). I would argue that this long-standing cultural bigotry / racism towards Russia and Russians is deeply embedded into most contemporary Westerner’s subconscious. The current Tsunami of anti-Russian propaganda only reinforces this.
As a result of the above, IMHO you’re wasting your precious energy and creating unnecessary stress for yourself trying to convince most Westerners you know that their viewpoints about Russia and the current conflict are wrong. Unfortunately the few who are capable of critical thinking outside of the box are few and far between.
Sorry for being so cynical about human nature.
Posted by: Old Cynical Guy | Mar 24 2022 17:53 utc | 105
@Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 17:42 utc | 97
I truly wonder whether many of the European leaders have been lost in the post-modern dreams that are the basis for the liberal arts and humanities educations, and activist and political careers, that so many of them seem to have. So few of them have backgrounds in science, technical, or hands-on industrial business fields (and starting a trendy probiotics company, or playing with borderless money does not qualify) that would properly connect them to reality. A reality that may very soon be punching them in the face. If they want to create the conditions for social unrest and thus the possibility of political change they are going in the right direction. Then the fascists may truly remove their masks in the face of public revolt.
The hypocrisy and irony of an increasingly authoritarian Europe savings its “freedoms” from the Russians through greater acts of authoritarianism seems to be the probable future. Sad that any true “left”leadership has departed the field or become thoroughly co-opted.
ADL covers for Nazis
By Andrew Srulevitch, ADL Director of European Affairs
“There are neo-Nazis in Ukraine, just as there are in the U.S., and in Russia for that matter. they are a very marginal group with no political influence“
Posted by: librul | Mar 24 2022 17:57 utc | 107
malenkov @99–
Thanks for the reply. I spaced the Pole’s affinity for Catholicism and the ultimate reason why the USSR imploded–its own internal corruption and ignorance of the “inside” as Lukashenko called it at the CSTO Summit after the failed Kazakh coup.
Roger @100–
Thanks for your reply. I’ll bet Petkov becomes more corrupt that his predecessors as that’s the Neoliberal’s biggest weak spot.
re: Arne Hartmann | Mar 24 2022 17:27 utc | 89
Thank you for your posts, I find all of them quite important and useful.
You write If Habeck doesn’t accept paying in rubles, he has to somehow organize LNG replacements (they are not available in the needed quantity).”
Germany has NO LNG facilities and it takes 3 to 4 years to construct them. Two (expensive) LNG projects are currently in the development stage; when completed, they will allow the import of a total of 20 billion cubic meters of LNG per year. Currently, Germany gets 55 billion cubic meters per year from Russia. Nordstream 2 has (had) the capacity to deliver 27.5 billion cubic meters per year.
As of Feb 25, German natural gas storage sites were just 29.7% full
Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 24 2022 17:58 utc | 109
@Steve9
My advice is to show them articles and videos with authorities that somehow refute the mainstream narrative. People in general will, as you probably know, only trust someone higher up in the hierarchy. A starter would be Noam Chomsky on the Ukraine-crisis.
Posted by: Mikael | Mar 24 2022 17:58 utc | 110
..from DW–
Germany
German Vice Chancellor Robert Habeck reflects on tricky Arab energy mission
For three days, German Economy Minister Robert Habeck traveled around the Arab world while a war raged in Europe. The Green Party politician described this as hardly bearable.
In Qatar and the United Arab Emirates (UAE), the aim was to make new gas deals as quickly as possible and to cooperate on the production of green hydrogen.
. .was he successful?
quotes
…There is a longer energy partnership with the United Arab Emirates
. .We have now signed a total of five cooperation agreements
. . .I now have a bit of a feel for where they stand.
. . .Our companies will now enter into talks.
…But, while we say that more needs to be done for workers’ rights in Qatar and we criticize the Emirates for welcoming the Syrian strongman Assad, which I also did on this trip, these countries’ view of Germany and the West is: “You leave us hanging when armies that we see as terrorists fire on us. Your attitude toward Iran is ambivalent, and we have to pay the price. And you only ever come when you want us to help you.” I was told that very bluntly. . .here
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 17:59 utc | 111
From a USA Today article headlined in Yahoo! News:
US, allies consider providing anti-ship missiles to Ukraine
The U.S. is consulting with allies on providing anti-ship missiles to Ukraine, a senior administration official told reporters Thursday. The official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, said there could be technical challenges but that it is something that allies are “starting to work on.” The Russians have several warships off the coast of Ukraine in the Black Sea and Sea of Azov, according to the official. They include surface combatants that have shelled the city of Mariupol. They also have amphibious landing craft, supply ships and patrol boats.
Ukraine’s navy reported Thursday that it had sunk the Russian ship Orsk in the Azov near the port city of Berdyansk. It released photos and video of fire and thick smoke coming from the port area. Russia did not immediately comment on the claim.
– Maureen Groppe and Tom Vanden Brook
Posted by: The Space Wanderer | Mar 24 2022 17:59 utc | 112
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 17:59 utc | 110
Oh my God, I was literally laughing out loud by the end of your post. The last sentence, apparently quoting a somewhat meditative Habeck, “I was told that very bluntly”, really helped put it into a higher gear.
The chickens are truly coming home to roost.
Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 18:04 utc | 113
This war could have been prevented weeks ago, had the U$A/NATO crowd responded to Putin’s legitimate security concerns, which they choose to ignore..
Posted by: vetinLA | Mar 24 2022 18:04 utc | 114
This war could have been prevented weeks ago, had the U$A/NATO crowd responded to Putin’s legitimate security concerns, which they choose to ignore..
Posted by: vetinLA | Mar 24 2022 18:04 utc | 115
This war could have been prevented weeks ago, had the U$A/NATO crowd responded to Putin’s legitimate security concerns, which they choose to ignore..
Posted by: vetinLA | Mar 24 2022 18:04 utc | 116
A Russian ship docked at the Port of Berdyansk off the Sea of Azov, 45 km. from Mariupol was seriously damaged by explosions and so was one another landing craft.
I hope the crew are alright and most of the cargo could be salvaged.
The Ukies are taking credit for this incident all over the mainstream, but it could have been caused by detonation of ammunition on board or wreckage from a missile that was intercepted by Russian air defense.
large Russian landing ship explodes
When shit happens you deal with it, learn and keep moving. Z will prevail over the Naziscum, and hand them their ass in multiple ways. Not if–when.
Posted by: Circe | Mar 24 2022 18:04 utc | 117
boy, I’m laughing today thinking about all the push back some of us got when we suggested, YOU CAN’T SANCTION RUSSIA’S ESSENTIAL EXPORTS. But, boy, we have all this argument from people who, I think quickly realized that they were full of it, but they kept arguing. Anyway, I hope that too is another discussion that has been resolved. On that, I’m still liking my argument that we see a basic unilateral walk-down by NATO, as I said, reality is dawning on them; they’ll keep up the bluster, but also signal that the gig is up. Time will be allowed for Russia to tidy up; but we’re not going to WW3; NATO isn’t ready. All that’s left is the optics. Ultimately, the problem with foreign policy is that all politics is local; and local pressures, economic and electoral are dawning on them. It’s all they care about.
Posted by: ScottinDallas | Mar 24 2022 18:06 utc | 118
The “1812 Overture” will be banned from playing at 4th of July celebrations this year.
In case you aren’t from the states,
the “1812 Overture” has become as much a fixture
as are fireworks on the day the US of A
celebrates it’s birthday.
I was shocked when I saw something about banning Russian composers in my local rag,
so I did an internet search with the terms:
ban russian composers
and, sure enough, there is no limit to crazy.
Posted by: librul | Mar 24 2022 18:12 utc | 119
Gotta hand it to the deep state. They turned the business loving Germans stupid and ideological. I never would have thought I’d live to see a German work against his own profit margin.
Oh well.
Posted by: Jezabeel | Mar 24 2022 18:15 utc | 120
Posted by: Steve | Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9
I wish you luck. The propaganda machine is in turbo mode since December, but really really bad in the past few weeks.
Google searches systematically exclude any narratives that countervail the USUKNATO stuff and the only return results are all exactly the same, but from “different” sources (i.e., Reuters, AP, NYT, NBC, etc. – I’m sure BBC etc. in the UK). I’m positive that they have gamed their own SEO algorithms to prevent truths from the “other side” from reaching the Western masses. No different than what we’re constantly told about China, really.
To that end, can anyone recommend a search engine other than Google or Yahoo and/or a way to override the search engine optimization / censorship-by-omission there?
I suppose it’s *possible* that what they’re really doing is flooding the Internet with pro-NATO anti-Russia content and that it’s pushing the information in question down so far in the results list that nobody will ever click through to all of it, but even if so, this is unprecedented in my lifetime.
Sorry for going off topic there a little bit. Steve, your best bet is digging up some articles from FAIR.org or the links here at MoA both in b’s posts and comments for your friends/relatives to read prior to having any further discussions with them about it. My experience with one particular friend has been exhausting. I’ll prove some NATO narrative wrong one day and he’ll acknowledge it, then the next day he’s saying the same exact thing again as though his memory was erased overnight. The propaganda is that powerful and omnipresent. By intent…
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 18:16 utc | 122
re: The Space Wanderer | Mar 24 2022 17:59 utc | 111
thanks for the link to the Yahoo article, which also notes that Biden is considering supplying “air-defense systems” to Ukraine.
Perhaps others here can expand on the likely meaning of that, but I would think that any such “system” would require US military to accompany and operate such systems, probably getting targeting information from the US (AWACs ?).
Likewise, the anti-ship missiles would have the same requirements and would include US military to operate the missiles, with targeting information coming from the US/NATO). Russia obviously would target such weapon systems . . . would they also target the AWACs or NATO bases providing targeting information?
Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 24 2022 18:16 utc | 123
All these other countries are dealing or will deal in rubles but Germany (largest buyer) is reeling . . .
Germany reeling as Putin tells Europe to pay for gas in rubles . .German Economy Minister Robert Habeck said Putin’s demand was a breach of contract and that Berlin will discuss with European partners “how we would react to that”..
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 16:53 utc | 77
As Pepe Escobar noted yesterday on Twitter,
“The US dollar and the euro – and everything denominated in dollars and euros – are HIGH RISK ASSETS.”
Eh, a breach of contract vs. Theft of Sovereign funds !! ? The breach of contract complaining takes the prize of the 21st century.
Commercial contracts are written to allow for price and currency adjustments. Sellers’ rules.
Russia is not Cuba, Venezuela, Syria or Iran
These dumbshit leaders do not think of consequences. And their sanctions on Russia will be paid by their citizens’ energy bills expected to increase …Oh and did we mention food ?
UK Families to Face Annual Energy Bills of Up to £2,800 as Wholesale Costs Buffet Up Price Cap
https://sputniknews.com/20220324/uk-families-to-face-annual-energy-bills-of-up-to-2800-as-wholesale-costs-buffet-up-price-cap-1094140732.html
British households have been warned by forecasters of the possibility that their average annual energy bill might soar to around £2,800 ($3,691) by autumn.
Record surges in global gas prices have already driven a 54 percent energy price cap rise. After it is raised on 1 April by regulator Ofgem, bills will increase by around £693 ($913), from £1,277 to £1,971 for those on default tariffs paying by direct debit, affecting 22 million customers.
= = = = = =
John Helmer’s latest:
Simple Simon Met a Biden…Going to the War
http://johnhelmer.org/simpletons-primer-on-the-long-war-the-us-aims-to-wage-against-russia/#more-57931
No incumbent US president has been re-elected in conditions of long war and double-digit inflation.
In the history of the world wars, or the last century of wars in Europe, or the wars the US has waged since 1945, it has never happened that what the President of the US says, and what the head of the front-line country which the US is fighting to defend says, have mattered less than what Joseph Biden and Vladimir Zelensky say now.
The reason is that no US president running a war has ever been as incapacitated in command and control as Biden, nor as impotent among his own officials as Zelensky. Rule by crock and rule by stooge aren’t rule at all.[.]
Zelensky has declared he is in favour of negotiations to end the war; he has declared he is opposed to the terms which President Vladimir Putin and the Russian leadership have made clear, long before the war began and ever since, were the casus belli, the objectives for which they are fighting.
The reason Zelensky regularly contradicts himself is that his power – his survival in office – depends on the Galician faction headquartered around Lvov, whose only occupation is permanent warfighting, and whose only income flows from the US and the NATO alliance. They are as committed as Blinken to operating the Ukraine as a gun platform targeted at Russia; the Galicians will destroy all of eastern Ukraine as they withdraw, in order to keep firing. The Germans thought and did as much on the same battlefields eighty years ago.
Biden, Blinken, Zelensky, and the Galicians also hate Russians with more racial virulence than has ever been shown by Americans towards a European enemy in the history of American wars.
Race hatred towards Russians now far exceeds American public opinion measured towards Germans during World War I or World War II. [.]
More
Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 24 2022 18:17 utc | 124
I suggest this brief blurb by Godfree Roberts published at The Saker, “Sitrep: How Russia slew the US Dollar”:
“On April 1, China and the Eurasian Economic Union – Russia, Armenia, Belarus, Kazakhstan, and Kyrgyzstan – will reveal an independent international monetary and financial system. It will be based on a new international currency, calculated from an index of national currencies of the participating countries and international commodity prices….
“SDRs pose an attractive alternative to the toxic US dollar for the EAEU, 143 BRI member states, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO), ASEAN, and the RCEP, none of which counts the United States as a member and all of which count Russia as a full or correspondent member.
“Adding amusement to this development is the fact that the EAEU, BRI, SCO, ASEAN, and RCEP were already discussing a merger before the Ukraine operation.”
Here comes the Eurasian Bloc out of the starting gate at full speed!!
For all those who were scoffing at the role of gold:
RUSSIA WILL ALLOW “UNFRIENDLY COUNTRIES” TO PAY FOR NATURAL GAS IN GOLD
https://nitter.net/FirstSquawk/status/1507028263654215682
Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 18:19 utc | 126
Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 18:19 utc | 125
On that note, let me restate something I said yesterday: The EU countries had better start looking for the keys to their 10,000 tons in monetary gold reserves, and also, start calling London and New York for all the bullion they entrusted to the “custody” of the Masonic-Satanic thieves and pirates there. Watching the continentals and the Anglos – whose habit is to just sell off whatever gold any gullible party leaves in their hands – sort this out between themselves will be most gratifiyng.
Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 18:26 utc | 127
Posted by: Steve | Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9
“How I do communicate with propagandized ppl?”
My experience: don’t fight for claims that you cannot prove because they are too wide. For example the question whether Putin is a good or a bad guy or whether Russia was justified to attack.
Instead grab the points where you can raise doubts. For example by claiming that maybe the NATO expansion was a bit too enthusiastic and that it is understandable that Putin is worried. Quite likely you will hear that all those countries were eager to join NATO. That applies for the Baltics and Poland. But in the other countries the population was lukewarm at best. But NATO had its methods to build “support”. The military was given trainings and arms and its brass was invited to international conferences. And the politicians was told that NATO membership would help in the process of becoming EU member. When NATO declared that Ukraine could become a member in 2008 opinion polls in Ukraine showed just 20% support for NATO membership. Of course it is now more …
Posted by: Wim | Mar 24 2022 18:27 utc | 128
news report
NATO steps up defenses over concerns Russia may use chemical attacks
NATO is activating nuclear, biological and chemical defenses in response to concerns that Russia may be preparing a chemical attack on Ukraine, a potential action that the alliance’s top official said Thursday could put neighboring nations at risk.
. . .if they can’t spray some fluid around, photo some kids on the ground, and do the white helmet thing, I’ll go over there and do it myself so help me Hannah
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 18:32 utc | 129
Nato’s puppet mouthpiece will stay on in his Western propaganda role for another year.
“NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg will stay on another year due to the conflict in Ukraine, he confirmed on Thursday. Rather than leaving when his term expires in October and becoming governor of Norway’s central bank, Stoltenberg will be kept posted in Brussels.
Stoltenberg said he was “honoured by the decision” of the NATO heads of state to extend his term as Europe faces the “biggest security crisis in a generation” over the conflict in Ukraine.
The Norwegian native has led NATO since 2014, and previously served as Norway’s prime minister between 2000 and 2001 – and later between 2005 and 2013. Earlier, he worked as the country’s finance minister and energy minister.”
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 24 2022 18:35 utc | 130
Posted by: Steve | Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9 and replies
Another tactic I’ve used with some success, at least in getting people to realize they’ve been propagandized, is to ask them what they think of the genocide going on in Yemen or Nigeria and why they’re so much more concerned about what is happening in Ukraine than those places. At the very least, if they’re honest, you may discover that some of your friends and family are subconsciously relegating the peoples of the ‘global south’ to the sub-human category. Sad, but not worth our time or worries. Another question would be “can you please explain your understanding of what has been happening in Ukraine since 2014?” At that point you can provide proof that Russia tried multiple times to solve this situation diplomatically and peacefully and that the Ukraine government was in frequent violation of the Minsk accords rather than the other way around.
I’m always anti-war, and I do retain a sliver of an opinion that Russia and Putin could’ve gone about this differently, but that’s also sort of ignoring the very history I just alluded to above. I, too, am a victim (or “survivor” in Western criminal justice terminology) of the propaganda machine and it takes a lot of time and effort to peel back all the layers that ‘they’ just keep adding.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 18:36 utc | 131
Escobar’s keyboard’s on fire as he erupts with a passion I haven’t seen from him in awhile. NO excerpts as it must be read as a whole piece, IMO.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 18:32 utc | 128
I can’t believe how stupid and/or propagandized and/or lacking in critical thinking skills some people, including my own friends and family are. Why the fuck would Putin or the Russian generals take the massive PR risk of using chemical/biological weapons? They aren’t needed for them to win, but the specter of them is needed to keep the Western populations convinced that Putin is truly evil and deflect attention from the USA’s own long history of using exactly those types of weapons.
Seriously I can’t even wrap my mind around the alleged viewpoints of people who think chemical weapons are even an option. Do they kill and maim any less painfully than molten flying shrapnel, depleted uranium, or white phosphorous? Or regular munitions for that matter…SMH.
The same friend to whom I’ve referred above said “look at the theater in Moscow” as proof that Russia has a history of using chemical weapons in war. When I explain to him that it was an internal police action which was badly bungled by the Russian police/military and inform him that the police in the US have done similar (see Philadelphia bombing of black people), he nods his head and then comes back with the same exact argument the following day.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 18:42 utc | 133
Zelensky can play hard to get on the Donbass and Crimea, but Putin will play hardball and soon, the comedian turned president, won’t have a pot left to pee in under all the rubble.
Crimea, Donbass, Mariupol, Odessa, Kiev…and everything in between until Zelensky cries Stop.
Posted by: Circe | Mar 24 2022 18:42 utc | 134
I apologize if this link to the Indian Punchline article has already been posted, but its covers the impacts of the sheer self-defeating arrogance of the West seems to know no bounds.
“No matter the hype about it, India realised that it has no real partnership with the US or EU, that it was a mere transactional relationship — and that in the final analysis, India lived in its region.”
Then of course Biden referred to India as “somewhat shaky”, as if they are a minion who dares to not fully support their “master”.
“Succinctly put, the big-power struggle in faraway Europe, precipitated by the Biden administration for geopolitical purposes to isolate and weaken Russia, erupted at a most critical juncture when India has been increasingly sceptical about American policies and statesmanship. The picture that the US is presenting itself is far from convincing either: a battleground of tribalism and culture wars, an ageing superpower in decline with dwindling influence globally. In the Indian economy’s tryst with destiny, the US is of no help. On the other hand, the waning multilateralism and the new constraints imposed on growth by the US’ growing propensity to weaponise the dollar, threaten to blight the shoots of post-pandemic growth in the Indian economy. ”
“If the Chinese news website Guancha is correct, which it mostly is, “China-India diplomatic relations will significantly ease and enter a recovery period. China and India will realise the exchange of visits of diplomatic officials in a relatively short time. Chinese officials will go to India first, and Indian Foreign Minister Jaishankar will come to China.” This is good news. Modi’s unique stature in Indian politics enables him to take difficult decisions. The renewed mandate he secured from the heartland puts him in a position to break fresh ground in foreign policy.”
Seems like the Quad is dead, and the West is providing a new ally for China, to add to Russia and Iran. Amazing how utterly arrogant and incompetent these elites are, helping build and unite the Eurasia that will see the end of their dominance. Lets also remember that the US would not give India the nuclear technology that they are now providing to Australia.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 18:42 utc | 132
Philly: https://www.bbc.com/news/av/stories-57322706
Or Waco or Ruby Ridge or……but it’s probably a waste of time arguing with most of these people.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 18:45 utc | 136
regarding the Scott Ritter/Mate/Blumenthal discussion; I was thinking about Biden and the way all the Democrat challengers disappeared; it seems the fix was in; and now we know why. I don’t even know if Joe was in on it; but he’s easy enough to manipulate. They point out Biden wants nothing to do with Ukraine, discussions of Hunter or any of it. But, the forces that be forced the matter and here we are.
Posted by: ScottinDallas | Mar 24 2022 18:48 utc | 137
.from oilprice dot com
Diesel Crisis In Europe Worsens
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 18:49 utc | 138
opinion polls show that the percentage of Ukrainians that believe that they are winning has risen from 88% to 93%. With such figures it is unthinkable that Zelensky will do any meaningful concessions. It would be seen as treason.
I expect that several hard facts need to happen before this will considerably change. Think of the fall of Mariupol, the closure of the Donbass cauldron and Russian troops reaching Transnistria.
We might also see a Russian television station covering the areas of Ukraine that it controls (and some territory nearby).
Posted by: Wim | Mar 24 2022 18:49 utc | 139
Y’know the more I read of Nato threats on Russia and in this case China, and the likes of US social media sites calling for the murder of Russians and the demonising of all Russians and the seizing of their goods, the more it becomes crystal clear that Nato just has to win this war, they’ve no option but to continually increase their threats and sanctions on Russia and on other countries that aid or does business with Russia because Russia and its allies are changing the economic order that’s been dominated by the USA for decades.
Nato cannot afford to lose already the Western economy is in a bit of a state, and its about to get a whole lot worse, Europe which is now the USA’s playbook, the Monroe Doctrine should be rewritten to include Europe such is their obedience to the USA, will suffer greatly with the change, unless they shrug-off the US and that can only happen if the people rise up and make it happen.
The Dollar won’t be the major currency of business in the East anymore, and Russia wants Rubles from hostile countries not dollars in exchange for its goods, if thing escalate over the next few months, Europe could and probably will have a very cold Winter, with a minimal industry and mass unemployment. Putin’s know where to hurt Europe and the USA simply by looking at what they haven’t sanctioned coming out of Russia, these are pressure points that if squeezed will lead to chaos in the West, more so in Europe than the USA as it will protect its own interests over Europe’s a price the Europeans look as though they are willing to pay.
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 24 2022 18:50 utc | 140
https://youtu.be/BzSlNjkQkDA
Video-prank with the UK défense minister..
What the UK is ready to do again
Posted by: Virgile | Mar 24 2022 18:51 utc | 141
Then why do Germans seem so happy to be subjugated and occupied by the Outlaw US Empire since 1945?
karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 17:28 utc | 90
I think part of it is that the American Empire is really good at brainwashing the masses, unlike the Soviets. Germans swoon over anything and everything American, at least they did until a couple of decades ago. Another factor is that all political parties in Germany are subservient to the U.S. elites, except one party, but that party is right-wing and nothing scares Germans more than being seen as a Nazi supporter.
Besides, most Germans don’t believe they live in an occupied country. They have lots of freedoms, after all. Their government has lots of freedoms, too: they can lower or raise taxes, decide whether a new road should be built, etc. Everybody is friends as long as nobody gets crazy ideas like demanding all foreign troops leave the country. And those troops are much needed in times like these because they’re the only thing that protects Europe from Putin!
Posted by: WhyCantWeJusGetAlong | Mar 24 2022 18:56 utc | 142
MOSCOW, 24 Mar – RIA Novosti. Security forces from Chechnya have liberated the Mariupol administration building, Ramzan Kadyrov said.
“The guys report by radio that they have liberated the Mariupol administration building and hoisted our flag over it. The surviving bandits did not take risks, abandoned their positions, as has already become traditional for them, and ran away,” Kadyrov wrote in his Telegram channel.
Posted by: Passerby | Mar 24 2022 18:56 utc | 143
As Nato must win this war, (I doubt they will) an emergency summit today has led to this, if Russia wins, Nato will look weak and countries who once kowtowed to Nato might look East instead, the Empire of Lies has already been exposed for what it is.
“The United States and its Western allies have stepped up pressure on Russia over its military operation in Ukraine, agreeing to strengthen their forces in Eastern Europe, increase military aid to Kiev and tighten their sanctions on Moscow.
Western leaders made the decisions at an unprecedented triple summit of NATO, the G7 and the European Union in Brussels on Thursday, as Russia’s offensive against its neighbor enters its second month.
“We agreed to strengthen our deterrence and defense for the longer-term. We also agreed to give further support to Ukraine and to continue to impose costs on Russia,” NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said.
He went on to say that NATO has already rushed tens of thousands of extra troops to its eastern flank, adding that four new combat units will be set up in Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary and Slovakia.”
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 24 2022 18:57 utc | 144
@Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 18:38 utc | 131
Thankyou for this, Escobar surely is on fire! I haven’t heard such truths said about the reasons for WW2 said in such a direct fashion for quite a while, and about the desperation thrashings of the side that is on the wrong side of history.
topic – poland
i am not able to keep up with the posts… however –
@ cabe, @ roger and @ tom_12 posted on the previous thread some comments on poland… i sent a friend of mine who is polish- lives in canada, but her 92 year old mom and brother still live in poland… here is her response to the post from @ cabe in the previous thread…. any thoughts or feedback on this anyone??
“It is very brief, and not neutral, it contains speculations. Devil is in details, as you know. I can’t type long now, we can meet and talk, it’s easier.
But making it simpler: Germans learned their lesson, they are more civilized and changed visibly after WWII. So, Poles can see it, and can cooperate.
Russians, on the other hand, didn’t change, they still represent asian cruelty, where Life of single person does not count. As we see now! Polish people suffered more cruelty from russian/soviet army/administration than from more civilized, westerners Germans.
And THAT makes the whole difference.
All time after WWII until 1989 Poland, just as other Eastern European countries of socialism, we were under occupation and propaganda of soviets. Soviets means Russian. And Poles can distinguish propaganda even when it is so subtle as it is in USA/Canada.
Read biography of Stalin and Hitler, and compare who was more cruel. Soviets and Stalin were pure savages, or better: beasts.
My family lived in above mentioned Wilno-Vilnius and Lwów-Lviv, that was majority polish citizens, it was Poland for centuries. The cruelty of soviets they observed and had does not compare to what Germans did. Did you hear about Katyń? Where soviets killed all polish officers/intelligencia? And than blamed it on Germans? It was in late 1980-ties we all learned that soviets did it.
History is written by VICTORS. Propaganda changes everything.
If Putin’s war was so good for Ukraine as Putin says, why would over 2 million (in one months!) of Ukrainian mothers with children flew to Poland and West???? What we have in our news IS TRUTH!! Soviets are bombing civilians, I know it from my Family, who hosts several Ukrainian mothers/children, not from news.
And both WWI and WWII were financed by Americans…. Now, Americans are manipulating STUPID polish government to start war with Putin, which will start WWIII. I know it from alternative news from USA.”
Posted by: james | Mar 24 2022 18:59 utc | 146
@ Wim 138
re: 93% Ukraine is winning
..Ukraine poll audience/sample. . .
Audience: the population of Ukraine aged 18 and older in all oblasts, except for the temporarily occupied territories of the Crimea and Donbas. The sample is representative by age, sex and type of settlement. Sample population: 1000 respondents. Survey method: CATI (Computer Assisted Telephone Interviews) [to people with phones]
They must be reading the Kyiv Post
. . leading stories today
>Speech by the President of Ukraine at the Riksdag in Sweden, 24 March 2022
> Russia’s war against Ukraine: March 24
– – Russia slams Polish ‘escalation’
— – Zelensky plea for planes, tanks
– – NATO boosts defences
– – Ukraine taking back ground: Britain
>US and British military intelligence agree: Ukraine is counterattacking in Kyiv …
>UNESCO Condemns Killing of a Russian Journalist by Russian Invaders
>Support the Ukrainian Army!
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 19:01 utc | 147
@134 Roger
“Modi’s unique stature in Indian politics enables him to take difficult decisions.” … ie he is a shameless nationalist whose government is built on anti-muslim sentiment and has hurt people on a scale that makes Ukraine look like 2 guys arguing on a streetcorner, but he is lucky there is a world crisis to save him from blame for Covid, he is pragmatic by necessity and has no illusions about the self-serving BS coming out of US/EU (as would be the case for any even halfway coherent Indian leader, regardless of politics)
Regardless, I also very highly recommend following Bhadrakumar, via his blog and twitter (or nitter).
Posted by: ptb | Mar 24 2022 19:02 utc | 148
@138 Wim
Wow, wouldn’t have expected that. That seems like a very important observation.
Posted by: ptb | Mar 24 2022 19:07 utc | 149
Alexander Mercouris reports that Jens Stoltenberg (the infamous Norwegian quisling) is to stay in the job as General Secretary of NATO for another year. This is really good news for Norway as he doesn’t get to go home and rob the bank.
The rest of the world can take it as proof of his puppet status, TPTB were unable to find someone below his level to replace him. I would also take it as a sign that NATO is on its last legs.
Posted by: Norwegian | Mar 24 2022 19:07 utc | 150
Audio of British Def. Sec. Wallace entertaining Ukrainian nuclear ambitions on phone call w/ a prankster he believed to be the Ukrainian PM was just released.
INSANE: Phony Ukraine PM asks for help with nuclear weapons & actual British Defence Secretary replies UK “will support Ukraine” if they “want to explore new weapons.”
https://nitter.net/wyattreed13/status/1507005846701568006 (reload if the page comes up blank)
Posted by: WhyCantWeJusGetAlong | Mar 24 2022 19:13 utc | 151
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 18:38 utc | 131
Did you check out the video with Vovan and Leksus doing in ignorant Wallace? At the end they say good bye by telling him Slava Vovan and Leksus. And a curious detail about the “special relation”, Utube has not blocked the video even though the brits have asked to do it, a hated poodle more than a partner, in spite of sharing so much evil. So telling, comfortably seating in a luxury car and promising all kinds of hardware and help but as long as we don’t have to fight, we put the hardware you guys put your lives on the line.
There is word that the Russian flag is being raised in Maryupol’s township which means they made it to the city centre. There is something in the air that signals a sudden collapse of the nazi project, I’m just disgusted with the European politicians, they’re about to bring ruin upon us which is not something to be glad about. I liked the moniker Von Der Lugen, even though I call her Von Der Mierden, which in my nonexistent german would be Von der Schaissen.
Posted by: Paco | Mar 24 2022 19:18 utc | 152
@ ptb 147
[Modi] is a shameless nationalist whose government is built on anti-muslim sentiment and has hurt people on a scale that makes Ukraine look like 2 guys arguing on a streetcorner
Yes, “democracy” can’t be wasted on a man like that in a country like India.
Millions of people, about 25% of India’s population of 1.3 billion people, are grouped under the scheduled castes (Dalits) and scheduled tribes (Adivasis) in India’s constitution. Adivasis are indigenous Indians who have been socially and economically marginalized for centuries.
And then there are the 195 million second-class Muslims, as many as in Pakistan, another 15% of India’s population. For decades, Muslim communities have faced discrimination in employment and education and encountered barriers to achieving wealth and political power. They are disproportionately the victims of communal violence and it’s worse under Modi.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 19:23 utc | 153
new meme idea; “You’re Wrapped up in Propaganda” and of course you know the video to attach.
I just got banned on FB for 30 days for making a joke about the swimmer and old college trips across the border and visiting transvestite bars and waiting to see who was so drunk they’d get a blow-job; a couple of mates thought they’d fallen in love. lol I wasn’t hating on anyone; whatever gets you through the night…
Posted by: ScottinDallas | Mar 24 2022 19:24 utc | 154
@Posted by: ptb | Mar 24 2022 19:02 utc | 147
Agreed, that take on Modi was a little hagiographic to put it mildly.
somebody wake up Sleepy Joe . .got some news . .h/t Paco
. .from NDTV
Chechen Leader Says Hoisted Russia Flag At City Hall In Ukraine’s Mariupol
Moscow: Chechen leader Ramzan Kadyrov said Thursday that forces from his Russian region had taken control of the city hall in Ukraine’s besieged southeastern port of Mariupol and hoisted the Russian flag.
Kadyrov posted on Telegram a video of a phone recording in Chechen, which he said was Russian parliamentary lawmaker Adam Delimkhanov speaking to “our valiant men”. . .here
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 19:29 utc | 156
Did you check out the video with Vovan and Leksus doing in ignorant Wallace? At the end they say good bye by telling him Slava Vovan and Leksus.
Posted by: Paco | Mar 24 2022 19:18 utc | 151
That was the best part of the video. Prior to that he’d done a fairly decent job of sounding supportive but noncommittal on such matters as nukes, but the look on his face when Vovan and Leksus tried to get him to say “Slava Vovan and Leksus” was priceless: “Vovan and Leksus? Something about those names is giving me a really bad feeling, but I can’t put my finger on it . . .”
Posted by: malenkov | Mar 24 2022 19:30 utc | 157
In response to
”
@Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 18:38 utc | 131
Thankyou for this, Escobar surely is on fire! I haven’t heard such truths said about the reasons for WW2 said in such a direct fashion for quite a while, and about the desperation thrashings of the side that is on the wrong side of history.
Posted by: Roger | Mar 24 2022 18:58 utc | 144
”
AGREED! Thanks Karl
Posted by: psychohistorian | Mar 24 2022 19:35 utc | 158
@Posted by: Wim | Mar 24 2022 18:49 utc | 138
“We might also see a Russian television station covering the areas of Ukraine that it controls (and some territory nearby).”
They really need to do this, and replace those propaganda channels in the rest of the Ukraine. Eventually, the clash with reality will destroy the legitimacy of the messengers, opening up some space for Russia to undo the programming. Seeing Russian soldiers acting as human beings and providing humanitarian aid, and seeing their lives get better will quickly undo the propaganda in Ukraine.
I am waiting for the mental gymnastics that the Western media will carry out to reconcile the victory of Russia and the impotence of the West in the face of Russia’s actions. The European populations better enjoy the coming summer, its going to be a cold hard winter for them.
@Don Bacon #94:
Reuters
Russia’s demand, which still needs to be backed by a concrete mechanism, presents European customers with a dilemma: don’t pay in roubles and risk getting no gas or comply and risk higher prices as contracts get renegotiated and more favourable long-term deals are jettisoned.
Reuters is lying, as usual. Putin has explicitly stated that, with the exception of the payment currency, all other parameters of the existing contracts will be preserved.
Posted by: S | Mar 24 2022 19:38 utc | 160
would love to see that video, but can’t access it..
video with Vovan and Leksus doing in ignorant Wallace
Posted by: james | Mar 24 2022 19:39 utc | 161
works here
https://piped.kavin.rocks/watch?v=5IJ4hKqweKQ
Posted by: james | Mar 24 2022 19:40 utc | 162
but there is no translation on the link i just shared..
Posted by: james | Mar 24 2022 19:41 utc | 163
. . .from CNN
Biden says Western leaders discussed food shortages, which he says will be “real”
US President Joe Biden said leaders discussed the possibilities of food shortages triggered by the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Biden said food shortages will be “real,” and he called Ukraine and Russia the “breadbasket” for Europe. . .here
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 19:42 utc | 164
Wobblie | Mar 24 2022 17:27 utc | 88
karlof1 nailed you earlier, wobbly.
and you spelled your name wrong, wobbly.
it’s sleight of hand of fascist apologists today to turn the war against Nazism into a “lesser evilism” pissing contest about who was worse, Hitler or Stalin. You do this about *everything*. “Poland is right to be” blah blah blah, totally irrelevant today cuz there is ZERO CHANCE of Russia doing anything to Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Finland or any of that utter bullshit you fascists bring up, unless Poland and co start it first.
which is what you, wobbly, want.
Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 24 2022 19:46 utc | 165
people believe what makes the least ethical demand of them. we stampede ourselves into doing nothing or as little as possible and then justify it after the fact.
thus the covid idiocy still being spread around by people like librul. take the laziest intellectual path to believing what you are already doing, i.e., nothing.
americans are such sheep they can’t even be bothered to be fleeced for being ground up into lamb chops (now w/more pork) for likes of Musk and Blinken.
Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 24 2022 19:49 utc | 166
Intel Slava Z, [24/03/2022 15:50]
🇷🇺🇺🇦⚡️ Kadyrov said that our troops completely liberated the Left Bank district of Mariupol. The enemy retreated to the west
https://t.me/intelslava/23431
Posted by: Greg Galloway | Mar 24 2022 19:52 utc | 167
For those cynical Russian trolls and PutinBots here who still believe that America and the collective West do not have the best interests of Ukraine at heart, here is the most damning proof of the USA’s and West’s intentions towards this plucky democracy.
This proof below inconvertibly demonstrates America’s and Europe’s sincerity to #SupportUkraine and the welfare of the Ukrainian people for the past 30 years and counting.
Slava Ukraini!!!!!!
Impoverishing Ukraine: What the US and the EU have been doing to the country for the past 30 years, Part 1
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/03/23/921f-m23.html
Impoverishing Ukraine: What the US and the EU have been doing to the country for the past 30 years, Part 2
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/03/23/bc65-m23.html
Posted by: ak74 | Mar 24 2022 19:54 utc | 168
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 17:40 utc | 95
My take is that the moment SK feels free from the US, they immediately merge with DPRK so forming an industrial dragon with nuclear power – this might not please Japan, USA, Russia, China, though.
Posted by: Greg Galloway | Mar 24 2022 19:57 utc | 169
@james #145:
any thoughts or feedback on this anyone??
Well, my feedback is that your Polish friend has been brainwashed with extreme anti-Soviet propaganda.
Posted by: S | Mar 24 2022 20:06 utc | 170
To Convince skeptics, I just focus on proving to them that there’s a huge far right, neonazi problem in the Ukraine.
They themselves will recognize that this is a big story that’s not carried in MSM.
The sources I use are the kinds of sources that they themselves would have trouble ignore I’ll be ignoring – sources like Amnnesty International, the Atlantic council, the BBC, et cetera.
Posted by: Old Cynical Guy | Mar 24 2022 17:53 utc | 104:
“As a result of the above, IMHO you’re wasting your precious energy and creating unnecessary stress for yourself trying to convince most Westerners you know that their viewpoints about Russia and the current conflict are wrong.”
Agreed. This is important to understand. 95% of my closest friends are breaking away by refusing even to read non-aligned-information. People read, believe and support what they want or need to believe.
“Discourse” is an illusion, it always was, but now it becomes obvious. Our thinking is adaption to power, camouflaged by arguments or rationality. May be it has something to do with your genes, that enable you to think controversial. It’s not your brains.
Democracy is a fascinating technique that brings people to identify 100% with politics that rejects all their interests.
Posted by: njet | Mar 24 2022 20:16 utc | 172
@ S | Mar 24 2022 20:06 utc | 169
thanks.. yes, i already knew that, lol… she grew up in poland… her brother is a drummer and he relates to putin as opposed to the west.. i told her i related more to her brother on this topic!
Posted by: james | Mar 24 2022 20:17 utc | 173
Sorry All,
I didn’t attach the links to my previous post.
In order to convince skeptics about what’s really going on in the Ukraine, I just focus on proving the existence of the far right/ neo nazis in large numbers, something which they themselves would recognize as casting doubt on the MSM narrative.
The sources I use to prove the existence of the neo nazis are sources that they themselves would have trouble ignoring:
Amnesty International
https://www.amnesty.org/en/documents/EUR50/040/2014/en/
Atlantic Council
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/ukraine-s-got-a-real-problem-with-far-right-violence-and-no-rt-didn-t-write-this-headline
Stanford University
Mapping Militant Organizations. “Azov Battalion.” Stanford University. Last modified March2022.
https://cisac.fsi.stanford.edu/mappingmilitants/profiles/azov-battalion.
https://m.box.com/shared_item/https%3A%2F%2Fstanford.app.box.com%2Fs%2F7ocm1tlvp2uydbki04qiuph4oa5j8tg9
Two BBC spots/docs on far right
https://youtu.be/hE6b4ao8gAQ
https://youtu.be/5SBo0akeDMY
Oliver Stone film free
https://www.writebrainstudios.tv/project/ukraine-on-fire/?fbclid=IwAR3daQvnLbcgmbWo9GK9mrV4HIdgpfT7sbVJZ-4ItIoAXmnEonLgtFNVU3U
I dated a woman who grew up in Poland, moved to America at around 30 yrs old.
A very sweet woman who didn’t have a bad word to say about literally everything, except the Russians.
It was shocking to realize the level of hatred she harbored for all things Russian.
Posted by: David F | Mar 24 2022 20:30 utc | 175
ak74 | Mar 24 2022 19:54 utc | 167
Thanks for the two parts of a 30 year financial “war”.
Alhtough that does pose the question why the Ukrainians en masse are not more willing to listen to Putin. (Western Propaganda?) It might explain why so many have fled!
Posted by: Stonebird | Mar 24 2022 20:32 utc | 176
. .from PressUnited India
Biden refuses to rule out Ukrainian territorial concessions
If Ukraine wishes to give up any territory in order to negotiate an end to its conflict with Russia, Washington will respect Kiev’s choice, US President Joe Biden told reporters, in Brussels, on Thursday.
Asked if President Volodymyr Zelensky needs to cede any land to secure a ceasefire, or if such a move is off the table, Biden said that’s “a total judgment based on Ukraine.” [sure]
“I don’t believe they’re going to have to do that,” he said, but he noted that “discussions have taken place that I have not been a part of.” He was presumably referring to talks between Ukrainian and Russian negotiators. . .here
>>Of course Sleepy Joe has not been part of any negotiations. No time for that.<<
Posted by: Don Bacon | Mar 24 2022 20:33 utc | 177
@ Don Bacon 155
I read at a post of an unreliable source that the Mayor of Mauripol fled the city yesterday.
Discussion of nukes are in the news again. From the Pranksters, Bless them:
Moscow: UK Defence Secretary’s Interview With Pranksters Confirms NATO’s Plans for Ukraine to Acquire Nuclear Weapons
https://sputniknews.com/20220324/live-updates-62-civilians-killed-466-injured-in-donetsk-peoples-republic-in-past-35-days—jccc–1094141488.html
The conversation between UK Defence Secretary Ben Wallace and Russian pranksters confirms NATO had plans for Ukraine to get nuclear weapons, Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova said.
The pranksters claim that they managed to hold a video call with Wallace on 17 March and have published eight videos from the conversation, which include the discussion of the status of Ukraine in NATO, arms supplies and involvement of foreign mercenaries in the conflict, as well as a possibility of Kiev acquiring nuclear weapons.
“I was shocked by something else: the ease with which British officials talk about the possession of nuclear weapons by Ukraine and, in principle, the possibility of supporting such a development of events from Britain,” Zakharova told a briefing.[.]
So Zelensky was not just wishing?
And the markets went schzoid this morning. At ZH there is this:
Futures Jump With Treasury Yields As NATO Says It’s Preparing For “Risk Of Nuclear Incidents”
ZH LINK at your own risk.
The rally stumbled a bit moments ago when headlines hit that NATO was preparing for a potential incident…
*U.S., NATO PREPARING FOR RISK OF RUSSIAN NUCLEAR INCIDENTS
*U.S., NATO PREPARATIONS INCLUDE DETERRENCE POSTURES: OFFICIALS
… but promptly resumed the grind higher as algos decided that WW3 is bullish.
Algos, the new market makers decided that WW3 (going nuclear) is bullish.
We are in deep quicksand.
Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 24 2022 20:40 utc | 178
Posted by: Steve | Mar 24 2022 13:26 utc | 9
Revenge (or at least Schadenfreude) is a dish best served cold.
Posted by: kral | Mar 24 2022 20:42 utc | 179
James @ 145
“Asian cruelty…savages….beasts”
This is racism pure and simple.
The Poles are good at detecting propaganda? According to one who spouts it.
Some years back I had a GF who was from Carlsbad, Czechia. She carried around a lot of this BS and there was no cure for it.
One day her employer flew her out to San Fran to cook for Gorbachev. This when Gorby was Pelosi’s tenant at the Presidio. While she served dinner Gorby spoke a few words with her in Russian, praised her borscht. That was all it took, Russians restored to status as humans. It is not about facts or logic.
Posted by: oldhippie | Mar 24 2022 20:52 utc | 180
The animosity between the Polish and Russians goes all the way back to the Deluge, not without reason.
Despite being repeatedly invaded by the Swedes and Germans as well, the Polish have been indoctrinated into believing that the Westerners are their betters, so reserve their hate for Russians. (Similar to how the Japanese reserve their hate for the Chinese even though the U.S. dropped two nuclear bombs on them)
Posted by: Sid Victor Cattoni | Mar 24 2022 21:01 utc | 181
james (quoting a Polish friend) | Mar 24 2022 18:59 utc | 145
“Russians, on the other hand, didn’t change, they still represent asian cruelty, where Life of single person does not count. As we see now! Polish people suffered more cruelty from russian/soviet army/administration than from more civilized, westerners Germans.”
And how many extermination camps did the Soviets set up and run on Polish territory?
Posted by: Kukulkan | Mar 24 2022 21:07 utc | 182
RT links are being blocked. It reports that Goldman Sachs thinks the Outlaw US Empire isn’t currently in a recession:
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 17:18 utc | 84
If inflation (currency devaluation) is 7.5% (low end) and GDP growth is 3% then real GDP is at least -4%.
Goldman Sachs are not stupid, but they think that the muppets are.
Posted by: Opport Knocks | Mar 24 2022 21:12 utc | 183
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 17:35 utc | 93
It is imo too harsh a judgment, Karl. Many Poles are scarred by the history and the constant propaganda, so they do not know the whole truth. Give them some slack! they are not Hitler fans, or neo-nazis in their hearts, but badly disinformed.
Posted by: bystander 04 | Mar 24 2022 21:13 utc | 184
Posted by: Useless meat beater | Mar 24 2022 13:43 utc | 15
Yes great nations are in a fight but only one side has historically proved itself to be Imperialistic.
I come here for informed opinion and links to same. I’m quite capable of discerning what sources are credible or propagandistic. I see some people here worshipping all things Russian as well, so what? I don’t know you or where you live but where i come from we have been worshipping TV and consumer goods for as long as I remember.
I speculate that people are interested in Russia and China because their cultures are representing an alternative to the American Dream that has infected the entire West.
I certainly don’t see posters here as an homogenous bloc, there are disagreements often and anyway its anonymous and people are all over the world. I also feel tnat people come here for a kind of refuge, that is a human need.
Being snide is not helpful. Why don’t you contribute positively to the conversation here?
For example the conversation about the myth of “sustainable growth” is to me extremely important and positive and a few posters are talking about this, not much traction as yet because life nad death is of course more important than theory.
Last night I caught myself thinking that the Ukrainians are lucky to be invaded by Russia as I think they will come out of this far better off. In Australia businesses are already belt tightening and things have not even begun to get difficult. My livlihood is already threatened and I I see the human cost unfolding before my eyes. All I can do is pray for a quick collapse of the Empire because that seems to be the only possibility for release of the vassal states from our death spiral of feilty to Empire.
Be kind and criticise the comments or the ideas here rather than the people.
Posted by: K | Mar 24 2022 21:17 utc | 185
@Unnamed (97)
on ordinary Germans (who, it should be remember however, by a wide margin support the West’s war on Russia, including even stronger measures than already taken)
What makes you come to that conclusion? Got any links to polls?
Posted by: joey_n | Mar 24 2022 21:20 utc | 186
Posted by: David F | Mar 24 2022 20:30 utc | 174
Catholic clergy are the most responsible for spreading this animosity. This is true for Poles and Russians as well as Croats and Serbs.
Posted by: Milos | Mar 24 2022 21:24 utc | 187
karlof1 @131
Pepe sure has some interesting ideas about WW2. Hitler as a pawn of the Anglos against the Soviets makes a lot of sense. But something remains unexplained. Why did Hitler, after invading Poland, turn West and bite the hand that fed him? I seem to remember that France and Britain did declare war on him, but in action, nothing was done. Poland was abandoned, it was like a tacit approval. Why did Hitler turn West after Poland instead of continuing East to Russia. Surely he would have received the same tacit approval. History is full of mercenaries, pawns turning against their masters. But, in this case, wasn’t the timing wrong? Didn’t he have a better chance concentrating East first, and turning West only after defeating the Soviets?
Posted by: Robert Macaire | Mar 24 2022 21:35 utc | 188
@ james | Mar 24 2022 18:59 utc | 145
Very nice of you to put up the reply of the Polish lady; thank you, James! And what she says sounds reasonable in part, but it is very representative of Polish nationalism, and how do you argue with a nationalist? So Vilnius and Lviv were Polish-majority cities, but they were surrounded, mostly, by non-Polish-speaking countryside, and therein lay the problem. The Polish language for centuries was the official language of the ruling elite, whatever their supposed “ethnic” origin, so those two cities contained Polish majorities in that sense, and when nationalism came along with a vengeance from 1800 on, they indeed identified themselves as Polish. After all, Lithuanian and Ukrainian weren’t even written languages yet. But when modern mass education and mass literacy were gradually introduced to drag all the peasants into the modern world, it suddenly mattered a great deal what language one spoke and especially what language was used for instruction in the schools, so Lithuanian and Ukrainian nationalism were born, the latter in response to Polish nationalism in Galicia under the Austro-Hungarian Empire. After nationalism, the Poles of Vilnius and Lviv were just out of luck, surrounded by a sea of hostile nationalism.
There are a couple of other faults in the lady’s rendition of things which I would attribute to the atavistic ideas and ideals of nationalism. Most egregiously, she actually states, “Russians, on the other hand, didn’t change, they still represent asian cruelty, where Life of single person does not count.” This is just a racist generalization about tens of millions of people she does not know, and also represents the typical nationalist justification of the self and blame of the other. The idea of “asian cruelty,” presumably set against European kindness, is rather rich, considering all of the depredations of Europeans historically, which are not quite over yet, thanks to NATO interventions. European nationalists ought to self examine to see the flaws in their own history.
Of course, the Poles will especially play the victimology card effectively, because who can doubt that Poland was repeatedly abused, especially in the Second World War. However, that does not entirely exculpate them, as there were plenty of tensions inside of interwar Poland, so that one might inquire what the Ukrainians, Belarusians, and Lithuanians thought of Polish nationalist logic then, let alone the Jews, who today do not entirely exculpate the Poles for their own suffering.
It is only a judgement call to describe Stalin as crueler than Hitler. It is true that Hitler showed more kindness to his close companions, but it is still quite possible to blame Hitler more than Stalin for the Second World War, and in particular Hitler’s genocidal intention toward the whole Polish people, who were marked for servitude and eventual extermination, is not something at all found in Stalin, despite his liquidation of part of the Polish ruling class in the Katyn Forest Massacre, of which I am well aware. I also note that the correspondent had nothing to say about Stalin creating Poland in its present borders as an ethnically-cleansed ethno-state, following the very nationalist logic of the Poles themselves. That fact stands forever, whatever one may make of Stalin in general. Also, why hate on Russia because of Stalin? If Stalin was the worst human being who ever has existed, weren’t the Russians equally his victims? Stalin was a Georgian, and while he used Russian as the lingua franca in the Soviet Union, a language he spoke with a Georgian accent, he forcefully discouraged “Great Russian chauvinism” among the Soviet citizens and was no promoter of Russian nationalism at all.
Russia was not an independent entity in the Soviet period, and the current generation of Russian citizens are not people who participated in any oppression of Poland whatever. But just try to tell that to a nationalist!
Posted by: Cabe | Mar 24 2022 21:42 utc | 189
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 24 2022 17:35 utc | 93
This does not seem entirely correct. The Baltics were already included in the Soviet sphere of influence in the planned division of Central Europe according to the Ribbentrop-Molotov pact. Finland was also included, and it was its attempted invasion by the Soviet Union that drove it in the arms of Germany.
Posted by: Alberto | Mar 24 2022 22:02 utc | 190
Green Party in the State of Schleswig Holstein voted against building an LNG terminal that was planned at Brunsbüttel, rebuking their minister in Berlin, Robert Habeck. Habeck is from Schleswig Holstein and was a minister there as well before going to Berlin. So it his local party branch that was voting against him.
Piece is from Feb 22, 2022 an in German. I dont know if the vote still stands. But its the current view of the Green party there.
https://www.zfk.de/politik/deutschland/nord-gruene-bekraeftigen-nein-zum-lng-terminal
Posted by: Arne Hartmann | Mar 24 2022 22:04 utc | 191
a reminder to the maniacs and neo-con interventionists in the West, especially perhaps the psychopaths in Poland, the UK and the usa
https://t.me/asbmil/894
Head of Roskosmos: “I want to confirm, knowing the technical side of the matter, that the Russian Federation is capable of physically destroying any aggressor or any group of aggressors at any distance, globally, in a matter of minutes,” he said on Channel One television.
The head of Roskosmos also expressed hope that Russia wouldn’t have to use the missiles that the state corporation builds because they are “the last resort.”
“Our machines are for the last resort,” he said. “I think that’s what President [of the Russian Federation Vladimir Putin] was talking about when he warned the countries that would try to intervene in this special military operation, including NATO countries, that no one should forget that Russia has a very reliable nuclear strategic potential and means of its delivery.”
“The means of delivery are intercontinental ballistic missiles, as well as operational-tactical missile systems, and so on,” Rogozin said.
Posted by: michaelj72 | Mar 24 2022 22:04 utc | 192
GoogleTranslate:
MOSKVA. March 24. /TASS/. Russia intends to completely restore the city of Mariupol after the end of the special operation in Ukraine. This was announced by Secretary of the General Council of United Russia, First Vice Speaker of the Federation Council Andrei Turchak during a visit to a temporary accommodation center in the village of Volodarskoye in the Donetsk People’s Republic.
“Russia will restore everything [in Mariupol]. Now we need to finish the operation. And immediately the builders, and we will all pile on, and we will do everything. We will restore everything,” the press service of United Russia quoted Turchak as saying on Thursday. Thus, he answered one of the residents of Mariupol on the question of who will restore the city destroyed during the hostilities.
Posted by: JB | Mar 24 2022 22:07 utc | 193
Indeed, to blame Russia for Stalin is a great problem. Since Stalin was a Georgian, by nationalist logic, why not blame Georgia? And that thought truly reveals the utter stupidity of such nationalist logic, because how can you blame a whole people who were not involved at the power level, for the doings of one unquestionably autocratic ruler? This idea of guilt by association is typical of nationalist logic and has to be fought against and resisted at every turn. The same goes for the Ukrainian nationalists citing the Holodomor famine of 1930-1933. Even though it is questionable whether or not it was intentionally genocidal, how can it possibly be blamed on Russia and the Russian nationality specifically? The RSFSR did not engineer or order it; indeed, it had no independence to order anything. Rather, it came from central planning in the early Soviet system, not to mention bad weather. Even if it were accepted that it was engineered and genocidal, Russia of today bears no responsibility for it whatever. Of course, there were Russians in the Soviet government of the time, but there were also Ukrainians, and the head of it all was a Georgian, and none of these people were nationalists, unless, maybe, Soviet nation-statists. So the whole argument that Russia is to blame for Stalin is completely specious, rejected, and stupid.
Indeed, rather, something like the way Tito in Yugoslavia, a Croat, cut down Serbia to size so it wouldn’t dominate the other nationalities as had been the case under the monarchy (1918-1941), the Soviet communists led by Lenin and then Stalin cut down Russia to size as well, leaving a lot of Russian population outside of the RSFSR, including the contested areas of Eastern Ukraine. If the nationalists are so bent on berating Stalin, or Russia because of Stalin, then maybe they should also denounce the eastern borders of Ukraine drawn by the communist leadership deliberately to include many Russians and Russian-populated areas in Ukraine. But its next to impossible to reason with a nationalist.
Posted by: Cabe | Mar 24 2022 22:08 utc | 194
Polish “animosity” towards Russia and Russians has nothing to do with “history” or perceptions of injustice but it has everything to do with the fact that “Poland” is not a sovereign nation,it’s a US satrapy,what passes as “education” there is penned by the Pentagon and US embassy temp admins.This applies to all Eastern Euro states under NATO umbrella.
Posted by: Lolgege | Mar 24 2022 22:09 utc | 195
karlof @131 –
I tried posting the Pepe Escobar to Twitter in multiple ways (as a reply to a tweet, as a standalone tweet) and it is being pre-emptively censored/banned. That isn’t the case with the 2015 Consortium News article by Robert Parry on the HoR findings of Nazism rampant in Ukraine. Clearly this isn’t just an algorithm thing as both articles feature the word “Nazi” in the headline.
In every case, I get an “invalid content” message that I’ve never seen before and the site seems to momentarily ‘break’…Just more proof of the information warfare and psyops-by-omission being waged on Western populations by our own governments, media and tech giants (both of which are fully functional organs of the deep state of course).
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 22:11 utc | 196
“For all those who were scoffing at the role of gold:
RUSSIA WILL ALLOW “UNFRIENDLY COUNTRIES” TO PAY FOR NATURAL GAS IN GOLD”
Posted by: Unnamed | Mar 24 2022 18:19 utc | 125 and 126
It’s the Gold when all else fails.,,, We understand why US has been pressuring China, and now gold payments for goods.
China has the escape route..PetroYuan and the Shanghai Gold Exchange.
US Treasury’s New Guidance: Any Transaction Involving Russian Central Bank’s Gold Covered by Existing Sanctions
https://sputniknews.com/20220324/live-updates-62-civilians-killed-466-injured-in-donetsk-peoples-republic-in-past-35-days—jccc–1094141488.html
The US Treasury issued a new guidance on Thursday to make clear that any transactions involving the Russian central bank’s gold are prohibited by the existing sanctions. ”Treasury is also issuing a new [guidance on gold transactions] to blunt the Central Bank’s ability to deploy international reserves, including gold, to prop up the Russian economy and fund Putin’s brutal war. This guidance makes clear that any transaction involving gold related to the Central Bank of the Russian Federation is covered by existing sanctions,” the Treasury said in a press release.[.]
+ + + + + +
Hello Janet,
Good luck. Please be informed. Flashback to 2017. The PetroYuan.
Treasury was unable to stop Iran trading with gold. And what will you do once Russia and China declare their currencies are now gold backed?
PetroYuan. September 2017
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroyuan
China sees new world order with oil benchmark backed by gold
Yuan-denominated contract will let exporters circumvent US dollar.
Yes, The Petro-Yuan Is A Threat To The U.S. Dollar
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4148232-yes-petro-yuan-is-threat-to-u-s-dollar
Feb 20, 2018 …
On the contrary, the petroyuan allows gold to appreciate in yuan terms. The yuan is backed by the gold reserves that keep rising in price in …
= = = =
And, it Is offered China has up to 30,000 tons of gold.
https://www.investing.com/analysis/china-the-petrodollar-and-gold-200602545
Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 24 2022 22:16 utc | 197
bystander 04 @182–
Yeah, a bit over the edge to be sure. I usually leave the trolls alone, but occasionally my knee jerks proving I’m human.
Robert Macaire @186–
France’s fascists made taking France too hard to refuse, and the East was settled for the moment and Germany could use France’s industry and its ports. Plus Hitler didn’t have enough mechanization of all sorts and needed the time to build them up, and he still lacked trucks bigtime forcing artillery to be drawn forward using horses slowing the Blitzkrieg. My big question has always been why no landing craft were built to deal with the UK AND the failure to build a reliable heavy bomber. Then there’s one more–Hitler never unleashed the U-Boat wolfpacks in the manner Doenitz emphatically suggested again and again, which would have made the lack of landing craft a moot point. As many have said, Hitler was the best general the Allies had, a point IMO we should be thankful for. Sorta like now with Biden as CinC with Blinken and Sullivan as top aides.
Posted by: Cabe | Mar 24 2022 22:08 utc | 192
True. And the Holodomor certainly wasn’t “engineered” in the same way that the Irish Potato Famine was, by the Slimey ruling class. Intentional class- and race-based genocide plain and simple. Rather Malthusian…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4nL_RsAjxhg
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 24 2022 22:17 utc | 199
“…The astounding thing is that it was widely understood and openly said only a few weeks ago that Germany could not divorce itself from Russian oil and gas. The question is whether its decision makers just forgot about this in the meantime, or are desperately betting that Russia will crack any day now and return to providing energy at whatever terms the EU sets…”
It seems quite obvious that NATO strategy is entirely based upon the expectation that Putin will fall and be replaced by “liberals’ very quickly. In fact they probably expected that it would already have happened.
This nonsensical misinformation bears the hallmark of the CIA- which was taken completely by surprise when Gorbachev and glasnost arrived. The CIA has so many spies in Russia that they only listen to the ones telling them what they want to hear.
Robert Macaire@186
Remember that France collapsed quickly into prepared fascist positions when the Germans attacked through the Ardennes. And then Petain, fascism in the land of Action Francaise, the original fascist movement.
In the UK the saviours were the Labour Party and Trade Unions which publicly backed a Churchill coalition. The most influential Tories were ready to make an Empire saving deal with Hitler, that was almost certainly Halifax’s position. Even Churchill had wanted to join in on the side of Finland, and against Russia, in the Winter War.
And then there was the flight of Rudolf Hess which was obviously planned at the highest levels in Berlin and only carried out because there were real expectations, centred on the Royal Family that he would meet a sympathetic reception.
Look up The Lobster for Hess and surrounding details. The bottom line is that the UK was very close to alliance with Hitler. That is why, incidentally I chose the name bevin who for all his faults was the rock in the Union/Labour refusal to do what the ruling class wanted.
Posted by: bevin | Mar 24 2022 22:20 utc | 200