Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
February 4, 2022
The Great Russian Chinese Fireworks Of Beijing

While the fireworks of the Winter Olympics Opening Ceremony light up the sky over Beijing another firework comes in the form of a

Joint Statement of the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China on the International Relations Entering a New Era and the Global Sustainable Development

by President Vladimir Putin of Russia and the President of the People's Republic of China Xi Jinping.

It is a long political statement touching many issues and can be seen as a common program Russia and China want to pursue.

The joint statement's introduction is followed by four parts covering democratic principals, global development cooperation between Russia and China, concerns about global governance issues and a reaffirmation of support for multipolar organizations.

It is altogether a well aimed shot against the United States which makes multiple appearances in the text without being named. The quotes below focus on those parts.

The intro:

The Russian Federation and the People's Republic of China, hereinafter referred to as the sides, state as follows.

Today, the world is going through momentous changes, and humanity is entering a new era of rapid development and profound transformation. It sees the development of such processes and phenomena as multipolarity, economic globalization, the advent of information society, cultural diversity, transformation of the global governance architecture and world order; there is increasing interrelation and interdependence between the States; a trend has emerged towards redistribution of power in the world; and the international community is showing a growing demand for the leadership aiming at peaceful and gradual development. At the same time, as the pandemic of the new coronavirus infection continues, the international and regional security situation is complicating and the number of global challenges and threats is growing from day to day. Some actors representing but the minority on the international scale continue to advocate unilateral approaches to addressing international issues and resort to force; they interfere in the internal affairs of other states, infringing their legitimate rights and interests, and incite contradictions, differences and confrontation, thus hampering the development and progress of mankind, against the opposition from the international community.

The sides call on all States to pursue well-being for all and, with these ends, to build dialogue and mutual trust, strengthen mutual understanding, champion such universal human values as peace, development, equality, justice, democracy and freedom, respect the rights of peoples to independently determine the development paths of their countries and the sovereignty and the security and development interests of States, to protect the United Nations-driven international architecture and the international law-based world order, seek genuine multipolarity with the United Nations and its Security Council playing a central and coordinating role, promote more democratic international relations, and ensure peace, stability and sustainable development across the world.

Part 1 declares that democracy is a universal human value but notes necessary differences in its implementation:

There is no one-size-fits-all template to guide countries in establishing democracy. A nation can choose such forms and methods of implementing democracy that would best suit its particular state, based on its social and political system, its historical background, traditions and unique cultural characteristics. It is only up to the people of the country to decide whether their State is a democratic one.

This followed by another appearance of the United States:

Certain States' attempts to impose their own ”democratic standards“ on other countries, to monopolize the right to assess the level of compliance with democratic criteria, to draw dividing lines based on the grounds of ideology, including by establishing exclusive blocs and alliances of convenience, prove to be nothing but flouting of democracy and go against the spirit and true values of democracy. Such attempts at hegemony pose serious threats to global and regional peace and stability and undermine the stability of the world order.

Part 2 is about common support for global development as well as bilateral measures supporting it.

In part 3 both sides express a common world view of the current geopolitical climate. Russia is supporting China's viewpoint on Taiwan and AUKUS while China is supporting the current Russian demands towards the U.S. and NATO. They see each other as allies in the confrontation with the U.S.:

The sides are gravely concerned about serious international security challenges and believe that the fates of all nations are interconnected. No State can or should ensure its own security separately from the security of the rest of the world and at the expense of the security of other States. The international community should actively engage in global governance to ensure universal, comprehensive, indivisible and lasting security.

The sides reaffirm their strong mutual support for the protection of their core interests, state sovereignty and territorial integrity, and oppose interference by external forces in their internal affairs.

Both oppose the cold war block strategy the U.S. is pursuing against them:

The sides believe that certain States, military and political alliances and coalitions seek to obtain, directly or indirectly, unilateral military advantages to the detriment of the security of others, including by employing unfair competition practices, intensify geopolitical rivalry, fuel antagonism and confrontation, and seriously undermine the international security order and global strategic stability. The sides oppose further enlargement of NATO and call on the North Atlantic Alliance to abandon its ideologized cold war approaches, to respect the sovereignty, security and interests of other countries, the diversity of their civilizational, cultural and historical backgrounds, and to exercise a fair and objective attitude towards the peaceful development of other States. The sides stand against the formation of closed bloc structures and opposing camps in the Asia-Pacific region and remain highly vigilant about the negative impact of the United States' Indo-Pacific strategy on peace and stability in the region. Russia and China have made consistent efforts to build an equitable, open and inclusive security system in the Asia-Pacific Region (APR) that is not directed against third countries and that promotes peace, stability and prosperity.

Both sides express support for the various global arms reduction treaties and security conventions.

This is followed in part 4 by support for support for international organizations both have interests in like the United Nations, WTO, G20, BRICS, SCO, APEC and Asean.

The sides underline that Russia and China, as world powers and permanent members of the United Nations Security Council, intend to firmly adhere to moral principles and accept their responsibility, strongly advocate the international system with the central coordinating role of the United Nations in international affairs, defend the world order based on international law, including the purposes and principles of the Charter of the United Nations, advance multipolarity and promote the democratization of international relations, together create an even more prospering, stable, and just world, jointly build international relations of a new type.

A reaffirmation of their strong alliance:

The sides call for the establishment of a new kind of relationships between world powers on the basis of mutual respect, peaceful coexistence and mutually beneficial cooperation. They reaffirm that the new inter-State relations between Russia and China are superior to political and military alliances of the Cold War era. Friendship between the two States has no limits, there are no ”forbidden“ areas of cooperation, strengthening of bilateral strategic cooperation is neither aimed against third countries nor affected by the changing international environment and circumstantial changes in third countries.

This is followed by another shot against the United States, its phantom 'rules based order' and damaging sanction policies:

The sides reiterate the need for consolidation, not division of the international community, the need for cooperation, not confrontation. The sides oppose the return of international relations to the state of confrontation between major powers, when the weak fall prey to the strong. The sides intend to resist attempts to substitute universally recognized formats and mechanisms that are consistent with international law for rules elaborated in private by certain nations or blocs of nations, and are against addressing international problems indirectly and without consensus, oppose power politics, bullying, unilateral sanctions, and extraterritorial application of jurisdiction, as well as the abuse of export control policies, and support trade facilitation in line with the rules of the World Trade Organization (WTO).

The U.S. will say that the above is just some grand declaration with no meaning. But it is much more. It is a political program that China and Russia as well as their allies will be working on for the next decades.

Asian as well as European countries should consider if they want to support or oppose it. They should recognize that siding with the U.S. against China and Russia guarantees that they will find themselves on the losing side.

Comments

And now not only are AP and CNN reporters publicly demanding evidence of the government’s charges against Russia, but, as predicted, Germany, France and Italy are all showing signs of incipient mutiny.

Posted by: bevin | Feb 4 2022 23:46 utc | 101

Posted by: Ghan-buri-Ghan | Feb 4 2022 19:56 utc | 66
For no other reason than the plan to read all the books (at least the novels) in my house and cull the ones of no value I have been reading books collected by one of my boys. Not sure how- probably some trash and treasure sale i expect. One series I found were some Everyman thrillers, which i have generally found good, i a quaint old English sort of way – very polite 1920s-60s, and several with some fascinating social messages. However my most recent on it the unbelievable Fu-Manchu. I had head the name of course but had no idea what the story was about. Never in all my life have i read such explicitly racist anti-Chinese stuff. OK written in 1913, (republished in the 1950s) but I am not sure this excuses it. It is frankly appalling. So very English colonial white race stuff. Makes Kipling seem very progressive.
However I think that these notions die very, very hard and it takes very little to inflame them. Racism is deep seated and in times of stress will always re-emerge as people in crisis seek a scapegoat. Two extremes will be targeted. Those seen as too rich and controlling and those seen as poor and dirty, undercutting jobs.

Posted by: watcher | Feb 5 2022 0:01 utc | 102

Long game
The Chinese own it.
And the Russians are playing it too.
The US…….shrug. We have drones for that.
I’m just glad I’ll be dead before before the local 7 -11 accepts only yuan.

Posted by: Cadence calls | Feb 5 2022 0:02 utc | 103

@ Simplicius | Feb 4 2022 20:34 utc | 75
I completely agree. Russia and China are seeking to promote a more cooperativist world, and that is the purpose of their statements, as well as Putin’s earlier requests over Ukraine and indeed Putin’s policy in general. That does not mean that they do not want influence, but they want parity for themselves, not subordination.
The big problem is that, unlike Russia and China and most other countries, the US has never been demoted, hence the seemingly arrogant incomprehension of its ruling class, its politicians, and its populace. Russia has been demoted many times, by the Russo-Japanese War, the First World War, Stalin, and the Second World War, despite the eventual victory of the USSR in the latter. Indeed, Russia itself was also demoted by the Soviet Union, which discouraged “Great Russian chauvinism” for much of its history. So it is quite incorrect to talk of Russia seeking its own “grandeur,” as @ m | Feb 4 2022 16:58 utc | 22. Russia has been there, done that, and is quite aware of its own actual station in the world.
The idea of Russia as a threat is absurd, and ditto for Putin. While Russia has recovered nicely from its disastrous 1990s under Yeltsin, it still has a shrinking population with a lot of empty territory in an overpopulated world, a population only half that of the US, and an economy vastly smaller than the main leading world economies. It only has equality in one area: it possesses the Great Equalizer, nuclear weapons, and so cannot be attacked militarily, period. This fact simply enrages the US rulers, who try to transmit their rage to the American citizen body, as they successfully did after the Second World War. But back in the day, communism was at least possibly a credible threat, as it called for the workers in every capitalist country to rebel against their ruling elites, but Russia, halved in population by the breakup of the USSR, itself adopted capitalism and Russian nationalism, which constitutes no threat to the US or the so-called “West” at all. So the MSM is having a harder time persuading the rank and file to hate on Russia now.
The smart move would have been for the US to ally itself with Russia, but American exceptionalism and manifest destiny did not allow it to have any allies on a basis of equality. So the US rulers continue their quixotic, useless pursuit of world dominance, alienating everyone else, including most of their allies, whether those dare to speak up or not (usually not), and making Putin and Xi look like immaculate angels of reasonableness, moderation, and good will, whether they really exemplify those qualities or not.
Apparently, for things to improve and the world to become more cooperativist to face the twin dangers of technology and environmental catastrophe, not to mention extreme class differentiation, the US must get demoted. But how to achieve that without them blowing the world up in revenge for not being able to rule and rip off everyone? Things look bleak, and may be headed for civil war right here in the US because of the rapacity of the ruling class, who seem determined to strip the 99% of all their assets and reduce them to slavery.

Posted by: Cabe | Feb 5 2022 0:16 utc | 104

The definition of democracy is that the power to make decisions lies with the people. Chanting “Power to the People!” and chanting “Democracy!” are saying the same thing.
Two Ivy league political scientists last decade published a study. They looked at almost 2000 issues, that arose in the USA over two decades. They looked at polls to see what the public thought. They looked at industry groups, etc to see what the lobbyists and contributors wanted.
Their conclusion …. America is not a democracy. More of an oligarchy. It is rare or impossible for the people to get what they want. The lobbyists and the class that makes large political donations is who makes the decisions and get what they want.
If America is a democracy, then we should have a national referendum before we go to war. A democracy would let the people vote on an important decision like the starting of World War III. A democracy would put the question of war up to a vote by the people.

Posted by: Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:16 utc | 105

sarz #97

Apply these grand principles line-by-line to Tibet.

Fortunately for the people of Tibet they have been freed from their slavery under the ancient regime and priesthood. The poverty inflicted on almost all Tibetans is almost entirely eradicated, children enjoy a much greater chance of attaining adulthood and a life within a society of vastly improved hygiene, education and health standards.
That is what can be achieved through breaking free from feudalism with the help of socialist colleagues. The grand principles are being developed as we speak in todays Tibet. They would be ignored under the monarchy of old and any person discovered propagating the ideas would have been summarily executed by some crappy little monarch’s sheriff.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Feb 5 2022 0:21 utc | 106

re: SWIFT
>China has a joint venture with SWIFT called China SWIFT. Its terms & conditions are here. China is looking to global digital currency use, to internationalize yuan.
This would be a natural move because China leads the world in the use of digital currency. In January, the central bank announced that more than 261 million individual users nationwide had registered a digital yuan wallet, an app for using e-CNY. The number of users has nearly doubled since October.
In 2020, a record 432 trillion yuan ($67.9 trillion) in transactions were carried out via mobile payments, mostly on Alibaba’s Alipay and Tencent’s WeChat Pay. . .here.
It will be an up-hill effort. The euro and U.S. dollar together made up more than seven out of 10 SWIFT payments worldwide in December 2021. Noticeable is the Chinese yuan: Despite that China ranks as the world’s second-largest economy, the yuan ranked as only the sixth-used currency for international SWIFT payments. Meanwhile, US/EU have a stranglehold ability to curtail financial transactions with sanctions.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 5 2022 0:23 utc | 107

O voice @ 69 said; “This document is a strong indictment of everything the Empire is being guilty of: imposing its contorted values upon others; invading, plundering, and destroying other nations and cultures; unilateral violations of treaties and agreements; lies and propagandizes; everything we MOA barflies have been discussing and accusing the Empire of late. It is a powerful document against a clear target.”
Absolutely true..
juliania @ 99; DITTO j, great post…
One hopes this declaration from Russia & China, will signal a change of course in the empire’s quest for global hegemony.
Then I woke up!!!

Posted by: vetinLA | Feb 5 2022 0:34 utc | 108

Sean @94
At the core of the Russian/China alignment is a functional non-aggression pact, which enables each country to pursue its own respective interests.
For example, the large number of forces Russia has shifted from its Eastern military district (approximately 12 BTGs) to Belarus is illustrative of the degree of vulnerability Russia is comfortable with now regarding China.

Posted by: Gulag | Feb 5 2022 0:36 utc | 109

I miss the old idea of an Olympic Truce.
I got to see an Olympics, the one in Atlanta, where a right-wing Christian fanatic terrorist set off a bomb and the FBI missed in advance and then accused the wrong person.
There was something very special about being at an Olympics. It is the atmosphere that was created by people from around the world coming to a place in a spirit of peace, with nothing more on the agenda than the enjoyment of sport and the cheering on of one’s favorites. There really is an Olympic Spirit, and it comes from the people.
The USA and the capitalists have taken the idea of an Olympic Truce and converted into the Olympic Crisis. They use Olympics as a time to create a crisis. Which only goes to show that these people are sick, twisted and quite evil.

Posted by: Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:36 utc | 110

O voice @ 69 said; “This document is a strong indictment of everything the Empire is being guilty of: imposing its contorted values upon others; invading, plundering, and destroying other nations and cultures; unilateral violations of treaties and agreements; lies and propagandizes; everything we MOA barflies have been discussing and accusing the Empire of late. It is a powerful document against a clear target.”
Yep!!
juliania @ 99; Great post, I absolutely concur…

Posted by: vetinLA | Feb 5 2022 0:39 utc | 111

2 DaveGood | Feb 4 2022 22:25 utc | 92
“Russia and China must somehow manage the decline of the US from Sole Global Superpower to Regional Player without triggering a final, hysterical spasm from it involving Nuclear weapons that would doom us all.
That’s an extremely difficult feat to pull off, involving caution, patience and skill.
They’ve done it well so far.”
Excellent post. This is exactly what is going on and explains Putin’s and Xi’s taking a moderate position. Of course they don’t want to announce a military alliance and worsen the US’s addiction to its own exceptionalism.

Posted by: Cabe | Feb 5 2022 0:43 utc | 112

Yahoo headline: Senators close in on “mother of all sanctions” bill”
Wonderful, what a braindead response to legitimate concerns….

Posted by: vetinLA | Feb 5 2022 0:45 utc | 113

Most of the American talk about ‘sanctions’ is quite funny. For example, the bombastic threats to ‘sanction Putin’. When of course, V. Putin would have long ago moved his assets to places the Americans can not touch. Yeah, I’m sure the threat to sanction him personally had him shaking in his boots. — sarcasm.
Likewise, the trade between Russia and China. First, it can be well hidden when the banks and governments are both friendly. Maybe the NSA has ways of tracking things, but it sure looks like money can come in on one account and then quietly out in another account and if anyone tries to ask about these companies they have to go ask the government for information. If the government controls the info about who’s involved in a company, and the banks don’t share info about the finances, then everything gets harder for the Godfather.
The main key of setting up a system to laugh at the Americans would be to have some companies that are set up such that they never do any foreign trade, except for the trade with Russia or Iran or Venezuela or whoever. So, perhaps the NSA can find out there is a company doing this. Then what? They don’t have western bank accounts. They don’t do business with the west. They are entirely internal or deal with trade with the Resistence. At that point, there is nothing to sanction. They can issue paper, but it gets them exactly nowhere.

Posted by: Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:52 utc | 114

The obvious key to the strategic situation is that both Putin and Xi know they win by sitting back and doing nothing. They know China will be the world’s number one economy someday. They don’t have to do anything to make it happen from here. By doing nothing, they get stronger and stronger. Meanwhile, the financial rapacity of the US explodes and its mass inequality has its predictable effects. But even if nothing happens to the USA, Putin and Xi still win by not fighting and generally doing nothing. I’m not saying no responses to situation, but they don’t need a brilliant plan to get them to world power. They just have to sit back and wait for it to come to them. They know it. And the Godfather knows it, which is why the crime boss is looking very desperate.

Posted by: Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:56 utc | 115

Great post, b.
People in the Western Hemisphere recognize the truths in the joint statement.
They just don’t want to do anything about it, or live it.
The energy is still affordable.
The food is still available.
The people are not being blown apart.
Contrast that with the rest of the world, and it’s easy to see the disconnect.

Posted by: Cadence Calls | Feb 5 2022 0:56 utc | 116

Cadence Calls 115
I have read some of your past comments …. But that one hits the nail on the head

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 1:02 utc | 117

Many said nothing significant was signed during this meeting.
However, consider what is published after say a NATO meeting with POTUS, declaration but no details.
The details are left secret, or will be done later.
Concrete deals are for pikers, and remember, meeting between head of state are being worked on long in advance, so Russia would know what the outcome sometime before the Ukraine crisis.
Future will tell.

Posted by: Choderlos de Laclos | Feb 5 2022 1:04 utc | 118

re #115 Cadence.
“People in the Western Hemisphere recognize the truths in the joint statement.”
But, do they ever actually see it?
I just went to go check Mickey Mouse News (Disney-ABC). There is no copy of the text that I can find. I can’t find a ‘written’ story on it at all. Down the page there is a video people can watch, but any video will always be more misleading that simply reading the text of the statement for yourself.
These days, the American news is such propaganda, that to even do things like read the text of a statement, one has to use the internet to go look overseas. Unless people take that effort, they will never ‘recognize the truths in the joint statement’ because they will never actually see the joint statement. They will instead only see the Pro Wrestling style coverage where the headline on the video reads provocatively “Ukraine Crisis: China throws support behind Putin.”

Posted by: Apollo | Feb 5 2022 1:06 utc | 119

@118 Apollo
I feel you, man.
The borg is strong, and has limitless tentacles.
100 years of mass media technology has come to this.
The people I talk to, know better.
We just don’t do anything.

Posted by: Cadence calls | Feb 5 2022 1:20 utc | 120

“Moscow notes the positive significance of the Chinese concept of a “community of one destiny for humanity”, from China Russia Joint Statement 2/4/22.
‘Community of one destiny for humanity’…hmmm…how does that work? Who runs it? Who gets the best vodka and the best sausages? Oh, to be an administrator!

Posted by: Fred | Feb 5 2022 1:21 utc | 121

Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:36 utc | 109 “It is the atmosphere that was created by people from around the world coming to a place in a spirit of peace,”
It is not just Olympics apollo but all the time. To be able to just travel freely in the world if you want to with none of this cold war bullshit. That is the world I would like for my children and grandchildren. People of different cultures getting to respect and like each other.
My government locking us solidly into the anglosphere, yankisphere has fucked that.
So many are brainwashed into thinking we live in a democracy and thinking voting will actually change things – very very few realize the shit they read is straight out Goering propaganda..
I have stopped worrying which is different from stopped caring. My friends, children, think it is all too difficult so ignore it. The shit hits the fan and they become collateral damage, well that was their choice. Either by “military technical means” or its own contradictions anglostan is going down. That can be seen in history. No shamans or scientists required.
Apollo I guess more putting up my thoughts rather than just a reply.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 1:27 utc | 122

@ Fred | Feb 5 2022 1:21 utc | 120 who wrote

‘Community of one destiny for humanity’…hmmm…how does that work? Who runs it? Who gets the best vodka and the best sausages? Oh, to be an administrator!

To be an administrator in the West you have to inherit the power or execute power for those that have it…which are you, Fred?…and yes, Fred, you get the best sausages…don’t choke on them….
To be an administrator in China you rise through a merit driven process to then be voted into the position of administrator by the public is my general understanding….and be totally secular.
I can’t vouch for how the administrators get to be in Russia, can you Fred?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 5 2022 2:03 utc | 123

@Fred | Feb 5 2022 1:21 utc | 120,
1. The quote you cited is not directly from the joint statement from China and Russia on 2022/02/04. One CANNOT find the wording from the joint statement at the link that b provided in his post from Kremlin.
2. While googling, the only occurrence of the exact wording comes from a comment at the Saker that cited TASS.
Maybe it’s not your intent but the way you put it seems misleading and may make it look like the statement comes from the actual joint statement.
As for my take for “community of one destiny for humanity” in Chinese is 人類命運共同體. You asked who runs it?! I believe it is definitely NOT by just ONE nation to run it like the amerikkan hegemony. It will be run by the community. I think the meaning of 共同 is foreign to anglos since they have no concept for common or sharing. The only thing they know is preying.

Posted by: LuRenJia | Feb 5 2022 2:27 utc | 124

@william haught
you were trolling on saker’s site and even after multiple warning you continue trolling , is it a surprise you got banned there ? try it here and see how fast you get banned too
@sean
this guy been all over the intenet blogs spreading FUD and trying to undermine the historic China Russia deal. An obvious troll to me (and to some of MoA resident barfiles)
@All
it is obvious the empire lost their sanity and now spouting threats and releasing their cyber troll army to undermine the china russia deal. Their whole media narrative is crumbling and they are desperate to keep up the narrative..

Posted by: DVA | Feb 5 2022 2:30 utc | 125

Fred | Feb 5 2022 1:21 utc | 120
Fred, are you the fred from the yank colon site? The good Colonel. Your time of imported caviar and vodka may be coming to an end.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 2:35 utc | 126

The khazaktan color revolution debacle was eye opener to the western empire. The carefully prepared and placed jihadist got steamrolled so fast it boggles the mind of the west. we can expect china russian joint help to smash western color revolution currently ongoing in myanmar and thailand..
remembering MH17 false flag , i wonder if the brutal western empire will plan another civilian aircraft downed false flag and this time blaming russia directly ?

Posted by: DVA | Feb 5 2022 2:36 utc | 127

I am watching the Olympic opening ceremonies on NBC and it is nonstop hate propaganda against China and Russia by the commentators. It certainly makes for unpleasant viewing.

Posted by: Michael Weddington | Feb 5 2022 2:37 utc | 128

anyone read the vitrol and hatred toward eileen gu as she represent china in the winter olympic ? it is hilarious these americans spouting insane hatred toward mr Gu and exposing themselves as pure racist..

Posted by: DVA | Feb 5 2022 2:40 utc | 129

Some background material by naked hedgie to assist understanding the current Russian push back and the naked NATO intimidation/aggression.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xhf1KSgURtw&t=115s
30 minutes

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Feb 5 2022 2:44 utc | 130

@ Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 2:35 utc | 124… good catch, lolol… i say bingo, even if we don’t have confirmation@

Posted by: james | Feb 5 2022 2:56 utc | 131

The long term trade deals are a severe check, if not check mate. The winners know how to act. Do the losers?

Posted by: Garrett Wyse | Feb 5 2022 2:59 utc | 132

RE: DVA | Feb 5 2022 2:30 utc | 123
Good lord, did you even read what was posted? Another one fitting the description “poor guy is overwrought and emotional” as watcher puts it. I am starting to get the same impression of you I and uncle tungsten have of The Vineyard of the Hater (see comment #88).

Posted by: William Haught | Feb 5 2022 3:05 utc | 133

OT, but, interesting. A 42min podcast concerning cracks in GOP support for Trump;
https://dl.thomhartmann.com/private/podcasts/2022_0204_thp-020422-hour2.mp3

Posted by: vetinLA | Feb 5 2022 3:15 utc | 134

Apollo 109
>>~ “There really is an Olympic Spirit, and it comes from the people.”
Yes. I wasn’t particularly interested in olympics as I was only a high school level athlete/swimmer.
But when they brought the olympics to my then backyard and in 2000 Sydney olympic park was less than 10km from where I was then living.
So I bought an opening ceremony and package ticket and we had 2 weeks and it was MAGNIFICENT.
I would never have “gone to the olympics”. But when they brought the olympics to me, I went “ go you good thing”.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Feb 5 2022 3:19 utc | 135

@ 43. “Calling this a major game changer is the understatement of the century”.
Absolutely.
Bernhard’s view that this communique is a political program to be further elaborated on over the next 10-20 years is a good way to frame the situation.
@22. “I think the Empire will be relieved that Xi and Putin did not sign any new contracts on de-dollarization, armaments or other crucial domains”.
This is simple ignorance for as b. writes in 39: “There are 16 intergovernmental, interdepartmental and commercial documents”.
The most important part of the economic agreements, but this is never mentioned in Western even not in alternative media, is the construction of a new International payment system to replace SWIFT (repeatedly mentioned in Chinese national News since the 4th in the evening). The talk is no longer about R&D… it is about setting up a new system. The only thing that Chinese news does not say is what is the technology. The digital Yuan is the most advanced technology today with the US 10 years behind according to fintech specialists.
To sum up; the reality of the 4th of February is simply world-changing and you must be Geopolitically blind not to understand that this day will be remembered in history :
1. Announcement of the political program of Multilateralism that will be further expanded as new signatories announce their adherence…
2. Announcement of a new Int’l payment system. The Chinese News would not repeatedly announce this if it what not coming…
3. A new pipeline through Mongolia with a capacity of 10 bln cubic meters of natural gas + an agreement on the deliveries of 100 mln tonnes of oil via Kazakhstan over the coming decade
4. Statement about the mutual complementarity of the GLONASS and Beidou global satellite navigation systems… which implies that both sides will benefit from this complementarity…
5. Global Sustainable Development… + deepening investment cooperation in sustainable (green) development areas + a memorandum of understanding to cooperate in the low-carbon development sphere… This means cooperation in the field of new energies.

Posted by: laodan | Feb 5 2022 3:22 utc | 136

DVA
Thereis no differentiation between commenting and trolling on that clowns website. Fuch me he put up that shit about the morman who had found scientific evidence jesus had been in merica and then this clown finds nano thermite in dust. I guess he likes to think of himself as a bird of prey, but his shortcoming is having the intelligence of a cage hen. He puts up videos of Russian officials speaking which at times are hard to find elsewhere. Like a chook he is good for something.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 3:23 utc | 137

NATO won’t be here in ten years. The question of what it’s for is finally being forced out into the open.
After all, Germany wants to buy Russian Gas and sell it Cars, Russia wants to sell Germany Gas and buy it’s cars.
So what exactly is NATO protecting Germany from?

Posted by: DaveGood | Feb 5 2022 3:36 utc | 138

watcher 100
I ran onto the site after MH17. He seemed quite good on the ukraine Russia stuff. Uncle tungsten said something about a cellar and beer keg but beer doesn’t do that. something more mind altering like taking hard drugs or working for nato. Though he may well have been a nutter from birth.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 3:40 utc | 139

William Haught | 131
I probably should slide on by…but I was lurking Saker at the time…..
Lol. Billy boy, scrolling that thread…, was like being overtaken by some hoon on the freeway… you know the cops have a fav hideaway a few kms up the road, so when hoon hoons by, a slow, anticipatory schadenfreude begins to swell…
Hoon hoons by….oblivious to flashing headlights of oncoming drivers, ….eventually you drive by, to see hoon sidelined and getting a RBT and full vehicle inspection for his (or now increasingly) her efforts.
Why you kept posting….bemused me ….
Now you’re bitchen here.
Saker. B. Martyanov… they run their own show.
Their blog, their rules.
I once put a bit of effort into the prelim of starting a blog myself. Realised it was a hellova lotta work.
So now I try to not shit up threads at places I like to lurk.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Feb 5 2022 3:43 utc | 140

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 3:40 utc | 137
Peter I am not quite sure how long I have been following Saker. I was very impressed at first and I still am often.
For me not being in the least religious, I find the Christian stuff a bit too much and it seems to be my observation that is increasing as a share of his time.
I am also finding the tone of the site a tad too Trumpist. I agree with some of it but not all.
Perhaps all that is happening is that like all of us he is ageing, and as he moves further from his past career as a military analyst, he finds it harder to keep up to date and directs his attention to other topics eg Christian vignettes.
Anyway as I say i will continue to go to the site, because there is some great stuff.

Posted by: watcher | Feb 5 2022 3:53 utc | 141

William Haught @ 131
I find the Saker pretty good at doing geo-political and military analysis, but he has a big problem with being a “Russian” chauvanist…especially since or possibly because he wasn’t born there (his words are generally a hagiography of Russia and Russians) and he is a chauvinist when it comes to his brand of religion. It’s normally pointless to comment there because even if you agree with 99% of what he wrote, he (or his moderators) get into a real snit about the 1% that you may disagree with. Aside from some of the crackpots which he for some reason allows to comment, the comment section is an echo chamber.

Posted by: Victor | Feb 5 2022 3:59 utc | 142

RE: jared | Feb 4 2022 20:42 utc | 77
Russia is not trying to get a serious response. It may be unexpected and great if it actually happens. The goals is to get The Great Hegemon and NATO to state their policy in writing, put nonsense in writing, or show that they refuse even to respond. This is about untying the hands of Russia for whatever is to come and to justify the “not or elses.”

Posted by: William Haught | Feb 5 2022 4:10 utc | 143

RE: Melaleuca | Feb 5 2022 3:43 utc | 138

..Their blog, their rules.
I once put a bit of effort into the prelim of starting a blog myself. Realised it was a hellova lotta work…

Yep, I said or implied that. They can also ban people for misinterpretations. As people who respect their opinion and/or their ability to find hard to find information are driven partially or completely away, they can live with whatever the consequences are too.
At worst, I was perhaps going 61 mph in a 55 mph zone.

Posted by: William Haught | Feb 5 2022 4:23 utc | 144

Posted by: Michael Weddington | Feb 5 2022 2:37 utc | 126
I agree. Bad form!
The final snowflake chorale with children was lovely though, as was keeping the actual flame carried by the last young athletes instead of touching off a huge cauldron. Beautiful effect. I switched the commentators off – they were still droning on about ‘human rights’…

Posted by: juliania | Feb 5 2022 4:24 utc | 145

Posted by: William Haught | Feb 5 2022 4:23 utc | 142
Fact is William, you were so busy posting that you did not have time to read his warnings. I did not think you deserved banning, nor did I. He must have had a bad weekend.

Posted by: watcher | Feb 5 2022 4:43 utc | 146

watcher 144
Nope. Give it some time and think about it again. He comes across as a decent bloke… at first..
Explosives. They go bang. For demolitions they have to be shaped into cutting charges. To penetrate a tank they have to be shaped into cutting charges. To cut a blot head off they have to be shaped into cutting charges. Cut a bolt head off, if it is holding something in shear, then the bolt will or is quite likely to hold for some time. The flying chook doesn’t understand any of that.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 5 2022 4:57 utc | 147

Dawm, all you poor guys are truly desperate, grasping at straws. Creating a whole “article” about a silly nothing “statement” that contained nothing Putin an Xi issued and you all are discussing it and taking it apart word by word as if it the Holy Scriptures. Really pathetic indeed.
I AM getting impressed though by how cunning/crafty/devious/deceitful/Machvelian/scheming/tricky/ the Chinks are however; I have began to call them “Asian’s joos”. They won’t help Russia, they will wait until Russia is strung and destroyed by the West’s sanctions that the Chinks KNOW are coming once US’s false flag event is put in motion in Ukraine at the end of the Olympic games(does anybody waste their time with this crap anymore?), then will will jump in and gobble Russia, the EXACT SAME WAY THEY DID IT WITH IRAN.
{Poor Putin, you thought you’re so smart, knowing that Ukraine will NEVER implement the ridiculous MINSK II agreements, but the US knew that too and they knew that you wanted a frozen conflict but USA can’t wait no longer, they need to neuter Russia RIGHT NOW so they can focus on China.
SO thats the plan, losers, at the end of the Olympic games, the US special forces that US had the audacity to show to the world are in eastern Ukraine will create the false flag event, and Putin the Pussy MUST react or he will be shows as he pussy he really is, then its sanctions from hell for Russia baby!
Snort.

Posted by: Hoyeru | Feb 5 2022 5:30 utc | 148

Now is a good time for Putin to form a NATO-like alliance with China and Iran… And who knows what other countries feel compelled to join the new alliance under that umbrella… Venezuela? And totally the joke of the century… Cuba? An attack on a member state is an attack on the Alliance is the only solution to get rid of those aggressive USA, Israel and NATO countries.
This will also put them on the throne of the world stage.
It is not only Russia but also China that we as Westerners deal with too superficially or that we judge from a misplaced superiority.
Our world view is limited to one square meter of weeping tube and the critical understanding to the length of our nose.
As a result of this social ignorance there are many hundreds of thousands of deaths and millions of refugees due to the disgusting practices of Western interventions in stable dictatorships, not the other way around.
Let’s just mind our own business, work enough I think and that Guantanamo index finger of human rights, what a bunch of hypocrites we are.

Posted by: Faraday | Feb 5 2022 5:32 utc | 149

laodan #134
Thank you.

To sum up; the reality of the 4th of February is simply world-changing and you must be Geopolitically blind not to understand that this day will be remembered in history

Agreed, a mighty good document to give to us all to consider. Auspicious timing.

The most important part of the economic agreements, but this is never mentioned in Western even not in alternative media, is the construction of a new International payment system to replace SWIFT (repeatedly mentioned in Chinese national News since the 4th in the evening). The talk is no longer about R&D… it is about setting up a new system. The only thing that Chinese news does not say is what is the technology. The digital Yuan is the most advanced technology today with the US 10 years behind according to fintech specialists.

Absolutely right time to walk a new path for payment settlements. No more threats, no more pandering, just walk on into a new future.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Feb 5 2022 5:38 utc | 150

psychohistorian | Feb 4 2022 16:13 utc | 3: Given the state of NYC, it wouldn’t surprise me if the UN HQ relocates elsewhere.

Charles D | Feb 4 2022 19:35 utc | 61:
Both the Chinese and Russians have their own alternatives to SWIFT but, neither would completely abandon it as both nations still wants trade with nations outside of their borders. This would change if the rest of the World decides to establish their own SWIFT alternatives for internal reasons; or, completely abandon SWIFT and adopt China’s system.

Ghan-buri-Ghan | Feb 4 2022 19:56 utc | 66:
Yes. I remember the panic during the 80s over Japan. IMO, it’s disguised racism. We’re seeing it again today with China now.

DaveGood | Feb 4 2022 22:25 utc | 92: It’s not over yet.

Apollo | Feb 5 2022 0:36 utc | 109: Olympic truce?   LOL   It’s been a long time; maybe pre-1936.

Posted by: Ian2 | Feb 5 2022 5:40 utc | 151

Natural gas transmission along the new pipeline will reach 10 billion cubic metres by 2026. Settlement in euros. Why did you choose Euros? ‘Since its birth the Euro has competed with the US dollar but due to various US interventions it is at a disadvantage.’ The agreement is designed to strengthen the role of the Euro and please Europe in a situation in which it is expected that the US will pressure Europe to fall into line, but Euro settlement puts Europe in a dilemma, deepening the gap between the EU and US and reinforcing divisions in NATO. Clever move.

Posted by: md | Feb 5 2022 6:00 utc | 152

The false flag of the Russia invasion of Ukraine punctures the space time continuum if only for a blink: https://www.rt.com/russia/548394-bloomberg-russia-invades-ukraine/

Posted by: Idiocrates | Feb 5 2022 6:07 utc | 153

It seems pretty clear to me that the Biden op is heading for an invasion. Note the WW2 invasion stripes on the fuselage and wing panels on one of the C-130’s flying into Poland……….
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/poland-receives-us-army-equipment-effort-bolster-eastern-flank-against-russia-2022-02-04/
Nice touch…. no?

Posted by: whozhear | Feb 5 2022 6:12 utc | 154

Don Bacon #107
The link to China SWIFT takes me to your C drive.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Feb 5 2022 6:20 utc | 155

@ Hoyeru | Feb 5 2022 5:30 utc | 146… come back and talk tough a month from now… i want to see what kind of a pussy you really are…

Posted by: james | Feb 5 2022 6:21 utc | 156

It looks like America’s neo-colonial Monroe Doctrine will not go unchallenged.
Russia’s “military-technical” measures have begun in America’s very own “backyard.”
Russia unveils military plans in Cuba & Latin America
https://www.rt.com/russia/547417-putin-military-plans-cuba/

Posted by: ak74 | Feb 5 2022 6:31 utc | 157

Hoyeru #146

“the US special forces that US had the audacity to show to the world are in eastern Ukraine will create the false flag event, and Putin the Pussy MUST react or he will be shows as he pussy he really is,”

I recall that the reaction promised is to remove the head of the snake. That is unlikely to be in Ukraine and I am sure comrade Putin knows exactly where it is. I for one will be celebrating if that comes to pass.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Feb 5 2022 6:35 utc | 158

TQC @91:
” RT has faced difficulties with its English-language channel too. It was fined £200,000 by UK regulator Ofcom for failing to “preserve due impartiality”.”
Due impartiality! Thanks for giving me the laughs of the week!

Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Feb 5 2022 6:55 utc | 159

@ 156 uncle t… lol… that’s funny… you are going way over our pussy hoyerus head with that one…

Posted by: james | Feb 5 2022 7:01 utc | 160

@DaveGood | Feb 4 2022 22:25 utc | 92
Yes, I agree. I think this is a key point to realize.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 7:21 utc | 161

@Don Bacon | Feb 5 2022 0:23 utc | 107

It will be an up-hill effort. The euro and U.S. dollar together made up more than seven out of 10 SWIFT payments worldwide in December 2021. Noticeable is the Chinese yuan: Despite that China ranks as the world’s second-largest economy, the yuan ranked as only the sixth-used currency for international SWIFT payments. Meanwhile, US/EU have a stranglehold ability to curtail financial transactions with sanctions.

If you think about it, this is no longer as true as it once was. Sanctions have been applied since 2014 or before that, and their effect is diminishing rapidly. If the US prevents Russia from using the USD, it only hastens the demise of the Petrodollar. If the EU should prevent Russia from using the Euro, how should Germany and other European countries pay for Russian gas for which there are no real alternatives? Should they pay in Rubles or Yuan? No, the reality is that European countries will definitely trade with the Russians using Euro. Also, it turns out that the latest gas contracts between Russia and China are now denominated in Euros (previously USD). My guess is that this is a deliberate strategy of Russia and China to implement de-dollarization, and at the same time invite Europe to join them.
The reality of supposed severe economic sanctions on Russia should be revisited by its proponents, it increasingly hurts only the west and in particular Europe. Some might think it is even a US sanctions war on Europe, camouflaged as US sanctions on Russia. Also add the fact that Martyanov mentioned in his latest video, that the majority of Russians do not worry about the USD/Ruble exchange rate at all, because it isn’t really important now that Russia has substituted much of what it used to import with home made products.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 7:55 utc | 162

I am amazed. Robert Scheer has posted the whole Xi/Putin declaration on his site (with an editors note):
https://scheerpost.com/2022/02/04/joint-russia-china-statement-articulates-united-opposition-to-western-alliance/
I think it’s big because, in the US, even among the left, it’s rare to find a blog that’s not anti-Chinese. A good example is Naked Capitalism, which I think, in many respects, is the best alternative blog on the left. It’s pro-Russia, pro-Iran, but anti-China. It’s actually through NC that I discovered MoA (so I’m grateful to them for that). They used to link to MoA a lot, mostly on Middle Eastern issues. But then, b. started getting more and more interested in China. Finally MoA became verboten at NC when b. insisted that the Hong-Kong protests were instigated by the Empire.
I don’t know Robert Scheer well. I don’t know his position on China. But at least, his posting the full declaration shows he’s keeping an open mind. He’ll take a lot of flak for that.

Posted by: Robert Macaire | Feb 5 2022 8:09 utc | 163

@DaveGood | Feb 5 2022 3:36 utc | 136
Exactly. I am liking your posts.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:11 utc | 164

Posted by: Robert Macaire | Feb 5 2022 8:09 utc | 161
Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:11 utc | 162
I suppose it is the anti-communism angle that puts them against China. Perhaps, they are not aware of the socialist nature of Iran’s government.

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Feb 5 2022 8:18 utc | 165

@Faraday | Feb 5 2022 5:32 utc | 147

Now is a good time for Putin to form a NATO-like alliance with China and Iran…

That is not what they are doing. NATO is a US tool for controlling Europe, it has no other purpose. NATO exists to manage the crises created by its existence. It is a bureaucracy in search for a reason to exist. What China and Russia is creating is nothing like that.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:22 utc | 166

@md | Feb 5 2022 6:00 utc | 150
I didn’t see your post before my post @160, I see we came to the same conclusion. I obviously agree with your post.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:27 utc | 167

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:22 utc | 164
Yes, China and Russia, with the win-win BRI are looking at a new approach to the 500 years of the beggar thy neighbor (aka, zero-sum)approach of European derived imperialism. Thus strait out alliances based solely on war, war, war and the threat of war, are a non-starter.
They seem to prefer organizations based primarily on economic or social cultural criteria with a built in military defence mechanism (SCO) to be used when/if necessary. However, unlike NATO, their reasons for existence are not purely military.

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Feb 5 2022 8:35 utc | 168

Idiocrates @151
Yesterday Aftonbladet, the biggest news site in Sweden, posted a comment by an “expert” saying there are signs the invasion has already begun.
If it had, don’t you think we would have like… noticed? 😉

Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Feb 5 2022 8:44 utc | 169

Posted by: DaveGood | Feb 5 2022 3:36 utc | 136
Like the EU, NATO is struggling.It is hard to see what common interest there is between say Poland and Spain or Belgium and Greece.

Posted by: watcher | Feb 5 2022 8:47 utc | 170

Watcher @168
The EU was created as the political wing of NATO. When NATO is officially declared defunct, it will have to find a new role. Going back to being the EC might work.
Macron seems out to be trying to create a global power with its own military al la the US. That project is doomed.

Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Feb 5 2022 8:53 utc | 171

@watcher | Feb 5 2022 8:47 utc | 168
Yes, EU and NATO are causing problems, they are not providing any solutions. Both of them must go, and I think it will happen. When we talk about Europe, we must be clear we talk about a continent (it is actually a peninsula or two on Eurasian landmass…) of countries, not let the semi-fascist “EU” equate Europe with itself.

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 9:00 utc | 172

Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Feb 5 2022 8:53 utc | 169
NATO is largely a political/military organization. Without the military aspect, it does not have a purpose. Thus, it must continuously provoke conflict with others to justify its existence.
https://www.nato.int/nato-welcome/index.html
“Security in our daily lives is key to our well-being. NATO’s purpose is to guarantee the freedom and security of its members through political and military means.
POLITICAL – NATO promotes democratic values and enables members to consult and cooperate on defence and security-related issues to solve problems, build trust and, in the long run, prevent conflict.
MILITARY – NATO is committed to the peaceful resolution of disputes. If diplomatic efforts fail, it has the military power to undertake crisis-management operations. These are carried out under the collective defence clause of NATO’s founding treaty – Article 5 of the Washington Treaty or under a United Nations mandate, alone or in cooperation with other countries and international organisations.”
The closest organization at the moment to NATO, that includes China, Russia and Iran, is the Shanghai Cooperation Organization
http://eng.sectsco.org/about_sco/
“The SCO’s main goals are as follows: strengthening mutual trust and neighbourliness among the member states; promoting their effective cooperation in politics, trade, the economy, research, technology and culture, as well as in education, energy, transport, tourism, environmental protection, and other areas; making joint efforts to maintain and ensure peace, security and stability in the region; and moving towards the establishment of a democratic, fair and rational new international political and economic order.”
If there was not a threat of war or international terrorist, violence, NATO would have no reason to exist, so it would have to create it; whereas, the SCO would have no issue that way, as it does not depend on its existence for engaging in political/military threats or coersion.

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Feb 5 2022 9:17 utc | 173

For me this statement looks like a big nothingburger. i am a bit sad, thought both would state what they intend to do against this rabies raging neocons from langley and foggy bottom.

Posted by: Kerwas | Feb 5 2022 9:26 utc | 174

Posted by: Chas | Feb 4 2022 21:02 utc | 80
Thanks for posting this link to an obvious classic Chinese movie with English subtitles, the Battle of Lake Changjin:
https://youtu.be/j7AXdh3OpZA which is free on YouTube.
You are right, there are plenty of fireworks. I decided to watch it on the big screen after half an hour on the computer.
I am reminded of Akira Kurosava. I notice ‘Runaway Train’ does not make a mention in this 10 best list:
https://theculturetrip.com/asia/japan/articles/the-top-10-films-by-akira-kurosawa/
Veteran screenwriter William Goldman comes to mind. He had the magic formula:
https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/adventures-in-the-screen-trade-a-personal-view-of-hollywood-and-screenwriting_william-goldman/256487/#edition=2393292&idiq=174689
A review: The Battle of Lake Changjin suffers from the over long introductory characterisation scenes common of many classic Australian movies. The cinematic realism and special effects are simply frightening.
The screenwriting is first class, it all comes together from the beginning introductory scenes to the predictable formula ending.
There are a couple of brief real comedy scenes.
I liked the takeaway from the main character wishing for, ‘no more war for the next generations’.
The editing is good, particularly the linking expositional scenes. Even if the movie is way too long. It was obviously made as a patriotic movie for a Chinese cinema audience with three hours to spare.
War movies that combine photo realism and convey the horrors of war work with me.
Germany has produced a number of these movies, I suggest the classic B&W German movie, ‘The Bridge’ for example. Look for the English subtitles versions.
It’s always rewarding to look at ‘the other side of the hill ,’ like the Duke of Wellington was want to do from horseback during his Napoleonic Spanish War campaigns.
I await “Nakba” the movie, but I’m not holding my breath for hollywood to produce it.

Posted by: Paul | Feb 5 2022 10:07 utc | 175

@104 Cabe
In regards of grandeur the USA is certainly a league of it`s own. It does, however, not have a monopoly.
And there is another difference: The USA still -is- the global No. 1 (slightly ahead of China). In this respect it is compareble to the 1970´s Soviet Union. For everybody who chose to see it the decline was visible. To everyone who chose to beliefe it was not. Withoute substantial economic and political reform the situation was heading towards a dead end. But that`s the point: The collaps had not taken place, yet.

Posted by: m | Feb 5 2022 10:59 utc | 176

Robert Macaire @ 161
Robert Scheer was a founding editor of Ramparts. It has been freely admitted that Ramparts was purely a CIA operation. The “Left” never gets anywhere because they never turn their backs on these creeps.
Except recently the “”Left “” has decided that CIA and FBI are now heroes because Orange Man Bad.

Posted by: oldhippie | Feb 5 2022 11:07 utc | 177

One week ago, I wrote this…

This week at the Olympics, Putin and Xi Peng will hold a joint statement. It will be optimistic and promising. It will be hopeful. But within that statement, whatever how nice and hopeful it will sound, will be a message that will put a bone-chilling terror down the spines of the Collective West. I don’t know what it is, but I am sure that we will find out soon enough.
Just realize that the positive news will have a component that will “blow off” the knee-caps of the United States military empire, and it’s EU enablers.
I can’t wait to hear what it is.

And here we are.
All calm, flowery, diplomatic words, but hidden under all that are some very key warnings in diplomat-speak.
What they did is announce a NEW kind of relationship, one that is tighter and stronger than any treaties. What they did was say that Russia and China are leading in that relationship and that they will enjoin with others so inclined. That this relationship is “sky’s are the limit” regarding actions that they can take together, and the world is put on notice on who will enter the new world order of things, and who will not.

Posted by: Rufus Arrr | Feb 5 2022 11:22 utc | 178

@Chas
Yes. OMG, what a great war movie. The thing is that it’s all historically true. Though, the characters and dialog is Hollywood. It’s well-made, a great action flick, and really explains what the Korean War was all about and why China was involved. I found the examples of how the Chinese supported each other and the patriotism to be absolutely accurate as this is what I have experienced inside of China, and the stories of the attacks valid as it matches what my father told me when he fought during the Korean War. It’s a long movie at nearly three hours, but well worth the watch. It’s just amazing.
@sarz
Never been to Tibet, It’s pretty obvious from your comment. Never been called out on it, eh? That’s ok. I understand most people haven’t. I have. Man, the high altitude gave me a splitting headache. I’ll tell you what. Lhasa is very nice, but I found Lyingchi to be “what it’s all about”. People are happy when they have purpose, belonging and respect, and that is what is going on. Local culture is embraced, supported and funded. It’s kept alive. Unlike what the United States did when stamping out the Native American populations.
@DaveGood
You understand. Most on the forum do not. But you do. Kudos.
@Sean
I set you to “ignore”.

Posted by: Rufus Arrr | Feb 5 2022 11:42 utc | 179

Rufus Arr,
I read widely, most of what I write and say was said first by better minds then mine.

Posted by: DaveGood | Feb 5 2022 12:10 utc | 180

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Feb 5 2022 9:17 utc | 171
Eh? What do mean, exactly?

Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Feb 5 2022 13:11 utc | 181

Posted by: Rufus Arrr | Feb 5 2022 11:42 utc | 177
Rufus Arrr, would you kindly put the date/time and post # info when you reference other posts. Thanks.
(Except for Sean, that is. I don’t need to go back and read anything by that one.)
And thanks for your site. I’ve been lost there a number of times lately. Marvelous place to wander about!

Posted by: waynorinorway | Feb 5 2022 13:24 utc | 182

@Posted by: Michael Weddington | Feb 5 2022 2:37 utc | 126
Ditto
NBC clearly does not understand the Olympic Spirit.
NBC’s commentators are disgusting. They are selected because they are reliable.
NBC can rely on them to stay on message.
Reliable stooges spouting warmonger propaganda during the Opening Ceremony of the Olympics.
Disgusting.
NBC clearly does not understand the Olympic Spirit.

Posted by: librul | Feb 5 2022 13:49 utc | 183

Caitlin Johnson links to a Simpsons video
that illustrates
“The Specious Reasoning Behind Claims That The US Thwarted An Invasion Of Ukraine”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSVqLHghLpw

Posted by: librul | Feb 5 2022 14:01 utc | 184

Posted by: Idiocrates | Feb 5 2022 6:07 utc | 151

The false flag of the Russia invasion of Ukraine punctures the space time continuum if only for a blink: https://www.rt.com/russia/548394-bloomberg-russia-invades-ukraine/

Wait for the headline “Russian Invasion Force Exits Ukraine”

Posted by: Sushi | Feb 5 2022 14:10 utc | 185

https://www.greanvillepost.com/2022/02/04/joint-statement-of-the-russian-federation-and-the-peoples-republic-of-china-on-the-international-relations-entering-a-new-era-and-the-global-sustainable-development/
Important section to note,

“The sides reaffirm their belief that the Convention on the Prohibition of the Development, Production and Stockpiling of Bacteriological (Biological) and Toxin Weapons and on their Destruction (BWC) is an essential pillar of international peace and security. Russia and China underscore their determination to preserve the credibility and effectiveness of the Convention.
The sides affirm the need to fully respect and further strengthen the BWC, including by institutionalizing it, strengthening its mechanisms, and adopting a legally binding Protocol to the Convention with an effective verification mechanism, as well as through regular consultation and cooperation in addressing any issues related to the implementation of the Convention.
The sides emphasize that domestic and foreign bioweapons activities by the United States and its allies raise serious concerns and questions for the international community regarding their compliance with the BWC. The sides share the view that such activities pose a serious threat to the national security of the Russian Federation and China and are detrimental to the security of the respective regions. The sides call on the U.S. and its allies to act in an open, transparent, and responsible manner by properly reporting on their military biological activities conducted overseas and on their national territory, and by supporting the resumption of negotiations on a legally binding BWC Protocol with an effective verification mechanism.
The sides, reaffirming their commitment to the goal of a world free of chemical weapons, call upon all parties to the Chemical Weapons Convention to work together to uphold its credibility and effectiveness. Russia and China are deeply concerned about the politicization of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons and call on all of its members to strengthen solidarity and cooperation and protect the tradition of consensual decision-making. Russia and China insist that the United States, as the sole State Party to the Convention that has not yet completed the process of eliminating chemical weapons, accelerate the elimination of its stockpiles of chemical weapons. The sides emphasize the importance of balancing the non-proliferation obligations of states with the interests of legitimate international cooperation in the use of advanced technology and related materials and equipment for peaceful purposes. The sides note the resolution entitled ”Promoting international Cooperation on Peaceful Uses in the Context of International Security“ adopted at the 76th session of the UN General Assembly on the initiative of China and co‑sponsored by Russia, and look forward to its consistent implementation in accordance with the goals set forth therein.”

They called the United States out. This is nothing trivial.

Posted by: Rufus Arrr | Feb 5 2022 14:11 utc | 186

many interesting and salient points here in the discussion, and of course all of it initiated by a nice roundup by b
I particularly like this summary of the vices of the real Evil Empire, by Oriental Voice at #69:
“…This document is a strong indictment of everything the Empire is being guilty of: imposing its contorted values upon others; invading, plundering, and destroying other nations and cultures; unilateral violations of treaties and agreements; lies and propagandizes…..”
I personally am most outraged by the invading and plundering part partaken of by all the Western powers, especially the main drivers the USA and the UK, in their wicked alliances with their Coalitions of the Bludgeoned and the Unwilling, and the chauvinists and warmongers at NATO.
I was radicalized when I was quite young by the outrages and mass murdering of the Vietnam war, and have luckily never been the same since….

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 5 2022 14:16 utc | 187

The “Certain States” of America.
I link the ring of that…

Posted by: Malchik Ralf | Feb 5 2022 14:53 utc | 188

Well Nato must be fed up waiting on Russia to invade Ukraine, so Bloomberg published news that Russia HAD invaded Ukraine.
https://nypost.com/2022/02/04/bloomberg-accidentally-reports-that-russia-invaded-ukraine/
Luckily it didn’t lead to a change reaction in hostilities

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Feb 5 2022 15:09 utc | 189

@ Republicofscotland | Feb 5 2022 15:09 utc | 187
As you can see it is just business as usual (it was published in the business section).

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 15:53 utc | 190

@Chas | Feb 4 2022 21:02 utc | 80
Many thanks for posting the link to the great Chinese war film “The Battle at Lake Changjin”. I wish I could have seen this film on the big screen for the full effect.
A trailer for the sequel is being circulated. I hope that you will post links to “Winterbridge” once it is released!

Posted by: cirsium | Feb 5 2022 16:12 utc | 191

@ Rufus Arrr | Feb 5 2022 14:11 utc | 184 with the detail about chemical weapons
I agree that there is meat in the document that will challenge empire down to its roots. I believe Covid is chemical warfare and its good to see focus on this potential exterminator of humanity.
IMO, Americans are still 99% oblivious to the existence of this document and the China/Russia relationship against empire……a feature of the current MSM
As I wrote in my initial comment to this thread, what will be quite curious is how empire “portrays” this document to the masses in the West. I expect it to be quite sad but highly entertaining from a certain point of view.
Some sort of false flag will be used to color the context within which the “details” are provided sounds like one possibility….what will the spooks of empire do now?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 5 2022 16:19 utc | 192

And about those false flag attempts there is the posting headline below from ZH

Bloomberg Had Fake Headline “Russia Invades Ukraine” On Homepage For 30 Minutes

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 5 2022 16:25 utc | 193

dear m:
There s a difference between western ‘legally binding’ things, no matter how written , how many times signed … and the non binding Chinese partners support – regardless of writings.
This difference will be felt in international matters.

Posted by: augusto | Feb 5 2022 17:32 utc | 194

From Russia’s POV, I see some substance in the spirit of this declaration; glass half-full. There will be no begging to switch on Nord Stream II pretty please. NS2 was at least as much a European project as a Russian one; if they want to kill their own baby, fine. Gazprom will make out like bandits with the increased energy prices, and Russia has plenty of paying customers lining up for their gas in Asia (not only China), plus the means to deliver to them. Everybody happy, except the Eurotrash who can stew in their own juices.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Feb 5 2022 17:43 utc | 195

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Feb 5 2022 17:43 utc | 193
The west is talking about switching supplier to Qatar… why are they talking about it, and not doing it? If they could’ve “switched the supplier” they would’ve done so over the past 15 years.
Talking and blustering is a synonym to impotency. There is no self-sufficiency or ability to plan and execute long term projects within the wannabe EU-Gosplan system. There is absolutely no vision into the future, the truth is with Russia out of the supply loop, they would be completely screwed.

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 5 2022 18:10 utc | 196

pretzelattack @ 58
Kissinger very much wanted US + China vs Russia, that’s why his guy Nixon went to China. Brzezinski was a Kissinger disciple.
As well as the Korean war where Stalin masterfully manipulated North Korea to invade the South in order to foment war between the US and China and dash any thought of an alliance which was being kicked around Western circles at the time.
China and Russia released a very flowery statement of which I have never heard from the Western establishment in a long time if ever. Those IRBM’s may be encircling them in the future and they may and probably will respond in kind making the unthinkable thinkable

Posted by: circumspect | Feb 5 2022 18:24 utc | 197

Posted by: Robert Macaire | Feb 5 2022 8:09 utc | 161
Thank you for the link. I haven’t checked the entire post, but it is not a complete copy of the original introductory remarks – Saker has that. What is left out is a description of the relationship between China and Russia that comes before the term ‘sides’ is introduced. I think that is an important part of the statement as a whole that ought not be omitted. I did not cross-check to see if other parts were not posted.
Also, I was following the open thread at the Saker site, and there were several violations of his request to stick to what was being reported rather than speculate or attempt to interpret. His site; his rules.
Same for me at Naked Capitalism site. I would agree the tone has been anti-China there, and also for the most part clearly posters have a more financially oriented viewpoint, stock market etc., than here. Plus reading the TINA slant against Greece was hard. One aspect that is a positive for me is that currently their observations on GM food and conglomerate agriculture are right on.

Posted by: juliania | Feb 5 2022 18:35 utc | 198

Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 5 2022 8:22 utc | 164
That is a good distinction to make – it is why I think the preamble in the joint statement is important. The relationship between China and Russia is spelled out there – it is not simply an alignment for military reasons. I’d call it a respectful meeting of the minds, with many other aspects of friendship to it as well. The world hasn’t seen such, in my view, not in recent times at least.

Posted by: juliania | Feb 5 2022 18:52 utc | 199

Posted by: m | Feb 5 2022 10:59 utc | 176:
But that`s the point: The collaps had not taken place, yet.
Disagree! I guess I need to qualify what I consider as collapse. To me, when the information media has lost its credibility, the society is collapsed. When the society’s leadership is held in general contempt by its citizenry, the society has collapsed. When the work efficiency of its institutions has lost its effectiveness, I mean its utility infrastructures, its healthcare entities, its educational entities, its mercantile and commercial entities, its religious entities, etc. etc., that society has collapsed. Now you tell me which ones of the entities I named above are still functioning as usefully as, say even as late as 15 years ago, I would gladly eat my crow and apologize. The western societies are busted!!! There is time lag between establishment of a status quo to that status being recognized, but recognized it will be.
Let’s meet here 5 years from now and see who, between you and me, would humbly submit to being wrong.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Feb 5 2022 19:02 utc | 200