Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
January 7, 2022
Remarks on Exceptionalism

Some comments to the previous thread on Kazakhstan mentioned U.S. exceptionalism.

It started with Bemildred:

It is amusing how these "thinkers" ideas about how to undermine Russia or China tend to look a lot getting them to do what Bush-Cheney did, i.e. over-reach and over-spend and engage in little stupid wars for profit, revenge, and to stroke their little egos.

and:

"We'll give them their own Vietnam, Afghanistan, whatever the latest one was." Always fighting the last war, and always losing it again, at great cost, again.

To which Ghost Ship responded:

It's American Exceptionalism and American Projectionism working against Washington.

Washington believes in American Exceptionalism so thinks that the way it does things is the only right way to do those things, then American Projectionism kicks in and guides Washington to project the way it does thing on to others. Washington can't cope when its opponents do something a way it has not even considered and it runs around in circles all flustered while the opponent is so far within John Boyd's famous OODA loop that Washington with all its advantages loses.

BTW, what has become of John Boyd's OODA loop in Washington. At one time, you couldn't move for the paper generated by articles mentioning it. Now there is nothing. But it's still a useful tool to be used against Washington to unbalance a top-heavy regime like Washington. Has Washington given up on it because it's too slow to apply it successfully?

Meanwhile Washington seems to continue with the "My enemy's enemy is my friend" BS which has been brought back from the dead as a zombie idea.

Two days before those comments an essay which Professor Michael Brenner had sent to his mailing list had formulated a similar idea. In it he lamented the loss of a realistic view of the world in U.S. foreign policies:

When Pompey the Great made his triumphant return to Rome in 61 BCE from his stunning conquests in the East, a spectacular ceremony was planned. Pageantry on a grandiose scale was designed both to satisfy his outsized ego and to display superior status in his rivalry with Julius Caesar. The centerpiece was to be a towering throne where a regally costumed Pompey would pass through a Victory arch installed for the occasion. A small problem arose, though, when a rehearsal showed that the throne was 4 feet taller than the height of the arch.

That is a neat metaphor for the uneasy position in which Uncle Sam finds himself these days. We proudly pronounce our enduring greatness from every lectern and altar in the land, pledge to hold our standing as global Number One forever and ever; yet, we constantly bump our head against an unaccommodating reality. Instead of downsizing the monumental juggernaut or applying ourselves to a delicate raising of the arch, we make repeated attempts to fit through in a vain effort to bend the world to our mythology. Evocation of the Concussion Protocol is in order – but nobody wants to admit that sobering truth.

Our engagements in the world over the past 20 years reveal a grim record of failed ventures. Most have been caused by unrealistic goals, blinkered views of the field of action, overweening pride, an ignorance of foreign places and their history, and an unseemly readiness to take complacent comfort in fantasy worlds that exist only in our own imagination. In short, American foreign policy has been misguided – badly and consistently misguided.

This is caused by a mismatch between the view America has of its role in the world and how the world really is:

Americans are struggling to draw into focus their exalted image of themselves and reality. They are not doing a very good job of it. The gap is wide and growing. That is due in good measure to what has been happening beyond the country’s shores as well as at home, and over which it lacks the skills and the means to exercise decisive influence. Our response has been one of avoidance and reaffirmation of thought and deed. We seem to fear that if we stare at reality squarely, we will find reality staring back at us in a discomforting way.

There is a psychological background to this:

Americanism provides a Unified Field Theory of self-identity, collective enterprise, and the Republic’s enduring meaning. When one element is felt to be jeopardy, the integrity of the whole edifice becomes vulnerable. In the past, American mythology energized the country in ways that helped it to thrive. Today, it is a dangerous hallucinogen that traps Americans in a time warp more and more distant from reality.

There is a muted reflection of this strained condition in the evident truth that Americans have become an insecure people. They grow increasingly anxious about who they are, what they are worth and what life will be like down the road. This is an individual and collective phenomenon. They are related insofar as much of our self-identity and self-esteem is bound up with the civic religion of Americanism. To a considerable degree, it’s been like this since the very beginning. A country that was “born against history” had no past to define and shape the present.

We are close to a condition that approximates what the psychologists call “dissociation.” It is marked by an inability to see and to accept actualities as they are for deep seated emotional reasons. Those you are dissociating are not aware that they are sublimating on a systematic basis. "Dissociation is commonly displayed on a continuum. In mild cases, dissociation can be regarded as a coping mechanism or defense mechanism in seeking to master, minimize or tolerate stress – including conflict." Conflicts of purpose, conflict of aims, conflict of ideas, conflict between idealized reality and actual truth. Dissociative disorders are sometimes triggered by trauma (9/11?).

The ever growing gap between wanting to be exceptional and not being it leads to attempts to act even more exceptional (which will then create even bigger failures):

What do these developments foretell for the United States’ relations with the rest of the world? The most obvious and important implication is that Americans will be ever more dependent on maintaining that sense of exceptionalism and superiority that is the foundation of their national personality. A fragile psyche weak in self-esteem and prowess is sensitive to signs of its decline or ordinariness. Hence, the obsession with curbing China. Hence, the country will continue to exert itself energetically on the global stage rather than become progressively more selective in its engagements and choice of methods for fulfilling them.

Continuity is a lot easier than reorientation. It doesn’t demand fresh thinking and different skills. …

To change that path would require more qualified people in Washington DC and less of the groupthink (also in the media) which creates failure after failure by its attempts to keep up its illusions about itself.

There is no end of it in sight.

Comments

George W Oprisko #30
Perfectly well said > the nub of it.
Thank you.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 8 2022 2:22 utc | 101

Karlofi @ 75
What I was asking you specifically was whether you have ever experienced the dread of decline and intimations of extinction (fading prowess) which Brennan hypothesized as common to the U.S. collectively (as a nation)and on an individual psychological level as well.
The strength, competence and love towards you mom, wife and daughter is, of course, quite commendable.

Posted by: Gulag | Jan 8 2022 2:22 utc | 102

too scents #8
“Well at least the USA doesn’t have a monarch.”
Yes, but the Jan 6th folks almost installed one.

Posted by: vetinLA | Jan 8 2022 2:27 utc | 103

anubis64 #99
The George Webb is a magnificent achievement of the entire Western gang. An exclusive venture and if it attains its projected functionality will deliver a fantasmagoria of images to dazzle the plebs as they huddle under their shelters contemplating food in the near future.
It too will be eclipsed as the year progresses.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 8 2022 2:31 utc | 104

anubis64 #99
The George Webb is a magnificent achievement of the entire Western gang. An exclusive venture and if it attains its projected functionality will deliver a fantasmagoria of images to dazzle the plebs as they huddle under their shelters contemplating food in the near future.
It too will be eclipsed as the year progresses.

Posted by: unc | Jan 8 2022 3:01 utc | 105

good conversation! thanks everyone..
i agree with what peter au said @ 76 .. here’s his post again..
” – Exceptionalism covers most of the anglosphere. The majority of the anglosphere believe what has been in their lifetimes and recent history can never change and cannot envisage any other culture leading the world or even sharing in this. History says this will change.
US and the anglosphere have crossed Russia’s red line and are very close to crossing China’s red line in our attempts to pull them down.
Any agreement with US has to be ratified into law in the US rather than simply signed by a president as seen with the Iran nuke deal and that simply wont happen until Russia has nuke tipped hypersonic missiles pointed at the US so call lawmakers and decision makers from just outside their borders.”

Posted by: james | Jan 8 2022 3:17 utc | 106

Charles Hugh Smith looks at at American exceptionalism a bit differently in his posting linked to below
Why Don’t We Cut Out the Middleman and Just Elect Pfizer and Merck?
The take away quote

If we no longer have the capacity to distinguish between moral legitimacy and self-serving corruption, then we might as well eliminate the Middleman and vote directly for Pfizer or Merck. At least the corruption, neofeudalism and autocracy would finally be transparent.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 8 2022 3:19 utc | 107

Posted by: vetinLA | Jan 8 2022 2:27 utc | 103
“Well at least the USA doesn’t have a monarch.”
“Yes, but the Jan 6th folks almost installed one.”
vetinLA, are you referring to the self appointed Jan 6th, Imperial College of Heralds?

Posted by: Paul | Jan 8 2022 3:23 utc | 108

American exceptionalism is suffering from poor judgement. American exceptionalism is caught in a catch 22. Good judgement comes from experience. And experience, well that comes from poor judgement. Life (for an exceptionalist) without pain has no meaning. There is no punishment for when they are wrong. Often they get a promotion. Putin is about to give the exceptionalists life meaning. That is why they are shitting bricks right now.

Posted by: Tom | Jan 8 2022 3:56 utc | 109

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 8 2022 3:19 utc | 107
@Psycho it’s the capitalist and financial elites that rides the exceptionalists not the other way around.
Imagine if it’s a bull that like run down things and destroy them while the capitalist keep steering it into flimsier or weak constructs that it could actually run down. Now those flimsy stuff run out and the bull would actually start to hit harder things that could actually end up mortally wound it.

Posted by: Lucci | Jan 8 2022 4:13 utc | 110

Great comments here! Some of you have it right–b not so much. American Exceptionalism has two angles one of which is true and one that is right. We Americans are exceptional in that we are the first fully multi-cultural society by definition and intention. We welcome everyone even though we do have prejudices and, like all humans, distrust outsiders; we seek to overcome the narrow-minded attitudes of most non-Americans. On the other hand, we think we ought to run the world precisely because we are uniquely positioned in terms of power, wealth, and intention because the future of the world, we believe and I believe lies in cooperation with disparate people and cultures. Unfortunately that vision became overwhelmed by the corruption of power, money, sex and so on.
We can regain some aspect of that vision but it demands a sort of spirituality that, while it has always been present in some form among a minority, has yet to assert itself. I think it will do so eventually but do we have time to wait? We will wait and see. I and others are doing what we can.

Posted by: Chris Cosmos | Jan 8 2022 4:16 utc | 111

American exceptionalism.thats funny.
kazakhstan supplies israel with 20% of its crude oil.the riots are in the oil producing region
https://thediplomat.com/2016/07/the-israel-kazakhstan-partnership/

Posted by: mcohen | Jan 8 2022 4:23 utc | 112

As I was trained, I often TRY to put myself in the other persons shoes. In this way, I have rarely been surprised by Putin’s counter measures after being endlessly goaded by the doofuses of DC. So, when I read this* I thought, yes, this is a logical response…if done early enough. Outside of sanctions, what could the US do in response that would not endanger Taiwan’s independence? As I have said in many ways, many times before, DC’s pampered elite seem quite happy to trade a queen for a useless pawn.
*”I believe it will be strikes..against NATO installations being built on the Ukrainian coast.” – How far can diplomacy go? Gilbert Doctorow 07 Jan 2022
https://gilbertdoctorow.com/2022/01/07/how-far-can-diplomacy-go-awaiting-the-us-russian-talks-in-geneva-on-10-january/

Posted by: S Brennan | Jan 8 2022 4:40 utc | 113

Posted by: Ian2 | Jan 8 2022 0:07 utc | 87

…., China should use its military might in the South China Sea, Taiwan, Japan, Korea, and Guam to divert the American….

I believe that analyst may be a bit overconfident on China’s naval strength. Yes it’s certainly on it’s way to become the next biggest Navy but they haven’t reached that point. IMHO, at best they can enforce their hold onto the SCS and maybe achieve air superiority over Taiwan. A ground assault on Taiwan is a bit dicey. But there’s no way China today can do anything useful against South Korea, Japan and Guam at the same time.
Posted by: Ian2 | Jan 8 2022 0:07 utc | 87

The analyst mentioned “diverting’ US attention. Any conflict in Ukraine or Kazakhstan will be necessarily be supported by the USN. In this case only a portion of the USN could be brought to bear against the Russians.
Chinese diversions would increase the probability of Russian success. And should the Russians manage to destroy the US fleet arrayed against them. There would certainly be a high chance that China would seize the opportunity to retake Taiwan.

Posted by: littlereddot | Jan 8 2022 5:11 utc | 114

Paul @ 108 asked;
“vetinLA, are you referring to the self appointed Jan 6th, Imperial College of Heralds?”
Nope, I’m referring to the attempt to stop the electoral count in DC, by a bunch of Trump supporters, and throw the election into the house, where DJT would be declared the POTU$..
This happened once before in 1875.

Posted by: vetinLA | Jan 8 2022 5:45 utc | 115

My post @ 115 should read 1876.. Here’s a link. Same strategy was in the works in 2021.
https://www.history.com/news/reconstruction-1876-election-rutherford-hayes

Posted by: vetinLA | Jan 8 2022 5:50 utc | 116

“Most have been caused by unrealistic goals, blinkered views of the field of action, overweening pride, an ignorance of foreign places and their history, and an unseemly readiness to take complacent comfort in fantasy worlds that exist only in our own imagination. In short, American foreign policy has been misguided – badly and consistently misguided.”
This is projectionism. They did none of what they did because they were “unrealistic” or “prideful”. Lies! They did it to steal. TO STEAL.

Posted by: Marija | Jan 8 2022 6:06 utc | 117

Posted by vetinLA @ 115
I was making fun of them, “arise, King Donald the 1st and arise Sir Jared, Knight Errant, your heraldic credentials pass our test.”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_of_Arms

Posted by: Paul | Jan 8 2022 6:13 utc | 118

I think that wrt the subject of American Exceptionalism, people attribute a sort of creationism: “America is guided by a divine being with a mysterious plan.”
But the Saker had it right: Their policy is a vector which is merely a summation of the wants of various interest groups. They just don’t have the ability to transform that resultant vector into a coherent policy. It is merely a summation.
Now exceptionalism is actually just the inability to follow laws, right? In society, generally the poor and uneducated cannot follow laws, because they don’t have the ability to make a sucessful life around them. Following laws means you give up present gains for future ones. But if your actions reflect an irrational summation of wants you will be a habitual law breaker. There is no underlying philosophy.

Posted by: bobzibub | Jan 8 2022 6:14 utc | 119

S Brennan #113
Re the Doctorow hypothesis. I cannot see Biden winning Pelosi or Schumer to a peaceful retreat from the ugly confrontational stance. And yet I cannot see any of the Dems urging give peace a chance. They are trapped in a USA election cycle that ensures yesterdays idiot policy is maintained by today’s idiot lawmaker majority who live in fear of today’s opposition minority becoming tomorrows triumphant ‘ignorant’ majority.
And so they perpetuate a deplorable rabble diving to the bottom of their cesspit.
The people of this world look on in horror or bemused indifference.
I am sure the people of Laos will not miss the rogue criminal empire as they are daily reminded of the evil they have spread.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 8 2022 6:32 utc | 120

vetinLA | 115

This happened once before in 1875.

2016 doesn’t count? I mean they spent three-odd years, thirty million dollars, thousands of hours of media telling us “the walls are closing in”, and non-stop Russophobia trying to install Bonnie Princess Hilary (the girl who was born to be President) in the Oval Office.
The hypocrisy and lack of self-awareness is flabbergasting.

Posted by: Kukulkan | Jan 8 2022 6:38 utc | 121

“ American exceptionalism is suffering from poor judgement. American exceptionalism is caught in a catch 22. Good judgement comes from experience. And experience, well that comes from poor judgement. Life (for an exceptionalist) without pain has no meaning. There is no punishment for when they are wrong. Often they get a promotion. Putin is about to give the exceptionalists life meaning. That is why they are shitting bricks right now.”
Tom! That is just beautiful. Every.single sentence. You sir, are one who gets IT. Well said. And no this is not snark

Posted by: Skuppers | Jan 8 2022 8:03 utc | 122

@cirsium | Jan 7 2022 20:02 utc | 52

The petition is run by change.org, a data harvesting operation. No account will be taken of it. If the signatures had been gathered on the UK parliament petition site, it would have occasioned a debate which would probably have been voted down by the MPs

One is that it will not lead to any action, but do you mean to question the number of signatures?

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:02 utc | 123

@Don Bacon | Jan 7 2022 23:59 utc | 85

Regarding an increasing (it seems to me) practice that is an enigma to me. . .
Why do Americans like to display their flag so much?

Yes, indeed. Please explain this strange phenomenon.
(I am not being cynical)

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:10 utc | 124

Posted by: Kukulkan @ 121
There is now doubt vettinLA is right.
I know Hilary, her sexual orientation, and her ambitions, was outed many yers ago by Yoko Ono.
A Friend of mine has known Yoko for a number of years and enjoyed her hospitality, told me this was common knowledge.

Posted by: Paul | Jan 8 2022 9:34 utc | 125

@Anubis64 | Jan 8 2022 2:02 utc | 99

I don’t know if the USA went to the Moon (I am pretty sure they didn’t) but there is a third outcome that is rarely considered. Imagine spending vast sums of money, labour, effort and political capital on a project that was supposed to dwarf all human achievement. It was the greatest scientific and engineering accomplishment in history on the par with the pyramids and other Wonders of the World.
What would you say if 50 years later, most people (except us old or middle-aged witnesses) do not really care to the extent that they are completely blase about it and large percentages simply do not believe NASA’s story. No primary records remain, the wondrous technology has been lost and the supernova that was Apollo programme is rapidly fading into deep oblivion. In another 50 years, hardly anybody will have known about it. How’s that for a fate worse than death?

The most astonishing success of modern psychological warfare is the ability to make a large part of the US population believe the Mercury, Gemini and Apollo programs didn’t happen. At great cost, it was an enormous achievement to go to the Moon, and they did.
Primary evidence exists in abundance on Earth, and of course at the landing sites on the Moon. As for the technology, see this lecture The 1969 Apollo Guidance Computer
In a way, the Giza pyramids are a valid comparison, because it is a legacy of a fallen civilization (ie. not the current one), and it isn’t just the pyramids but also the technological wonders of Saqqara in Egypt, Sacsayhuaman in Peru, Barabar caves in India and many other places.
The exceptionals of today are not quite as exceptional as they think. Not in relation powers in the past, and not in relation to other powers in the present.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:42 utc | 126

@Chris Cosmos | Jan 8 2022 4:16 utc | 111

We Americans are exceptional in that we are the first fully multi-cultural society by definition and intention.

A truly ignorant statement that serves as evidence of why this MOA post is relevant.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:53 utc | 127

Aaron Mate @ The Grayzone interview on Ukraine/Russia
Interestingly, Ret. Col. Douglas McGregor is convinced Russia will invade Ukraine in the next month or two:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkYgXQo2aQs

Posted by: Et Tu | Jan 8 2022 10:03 utc | 128

@ Don Bacon | Jan 7 2022 23:59 utc | 85, Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:10 utc | 124
The US has been doing a slow-motion strip-tease since Truman replaced Henry Wallace as FDR’s veep in ’44.
The ‘Outlaw US Empire’ as World Emperor has had no clothes for some time now, which gives rise to a Mark Twain quote
“Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no influence on society.”
For a time after WWII they looked lean and mean but their influence is dissipating day by day and
their nakedness now is butt-ugly. Hence they wrap themselves in their flag. It is the only fabric they have left.

Posted by: waynorinorway | Jan 8 2022 10:05 utc | 129

@waynorinorway | Jan 8 2022 10:05 utc | 129

For a time after WWII they looked lean and mean but their influence is dissipating day by day and
their nakedness now is butt-ugly. Hence they wrap themselves in their flag. It is the only fabric they have left.

LOL, as funny as that was, it sounds like a most plausible explanation! Thanks!

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 10:14 utc | 130

A truly ignorant statement that serves as evidence of why this MOA post is relevant.
Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:53 utc | 127
Yeah, it’s like every word is wrong. This all starts with the lying about JFK, and the corruption that PsychoHistorian points to all the time. And it never stopped after that.
And it is easy to see that justifying the current dispensation here depends heavily on denying the reality of what we still had here back then, academically and culturally that has all been thrown away, for a mess of slop called “entertainment”. The plutocrats do not want to talk about that.
I can only regret that Poppy Bush is not still around to see his work, but I note Dick Cheney is still with us. We could still give him a nice show trial.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2022 10:22 utc | 131

The lackeys of the USA do everything they can to carry on the idea of an Anglo-Saxon exceptionalism. It has now extended to the EU as a whole, no doubt under the influence of this kind of spooks (see ‘The Ghostwriter’ on him, I would be curious to know if people here know more about that).
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2007/may/10/labourleadership.labour2
“This country is a blessed nation.
The British are special.
The world knows it.
In our innermost thoughts, we know it.
This is the greatest nation on earth.”

Posted by: Tom2 | Jan 8 2022 10:26 utc | 132

“…but I note Dick Cheney is still with us. We could still give him a nice show trial.”
Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2022 10:22 utc | 131
When heartless Dick Cheney’s heart finally gives out the Americans should not
lower their flag to half-mast in mourning but raise it to mast-and-a-half in celebration!

Posted by: waynorinorway | Jan 8 2022 10:55 utc | 133

When heartless Dick Cheney’s heart finally gives out the Americans should not
lower their flag to half-mast in mourning but raise it to mast-and-a-half in celebration!
Posted by: waynorinorway | Jan 8 2022 10:55 utc | 133
I like the way the Irish put it: “I’ll dance on your grave.” The best revenge is living well, moving on, living your own life. But first, you have to “correct the record”, as they say.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2022 11:11 utc | 134

William Gruff 59
“The rise of Identity Politics among a portion of the population is nothing more than individuals who are already damaged and distanced from material reality clinging to what remains of their fragmented identity when their societal bonds are lost.”
Excellent post!
How much of the above would you attribute to the education system being taken over by Marxist progressives in the liberal art’s which everywhere in the western world is demented crazy to some degree with no counter argument just indulgence for fear of cancelling?
And the destruction of the industrial economy and it’s replacement by the “post industrial services economy”?
More to do with extraction of profit than anything else, and it’s denial of a decent wage to many.
Both to my mind add to your observations.

Posted by: JPC | Jan 8 2022 11:11 utc | 135

What would you say if 50 years later, most people (except us old or middle-aged witnesses) do not really care to the extent that they are completely blase about it and large percentages simply do not believe NASA’s story. No primary records remain, the wondrous technology has been lost and the supernova that was Apollo programme is rapidly fading into deep oblivion. In another 50 years, hardly anybody will have known about it. How’s that for a fate worse than death?

Anubis64 | Jan 8 2022 2:02 utc | 99:
I wouldn’t be surprised” is what I would say.   Although a great achievement, it’s old news to the general public.   It’s no different than the Egyptian Pyramids.   People in general may not remember the details but the event would not be forgotten.   However, I wouldn’t go as far to say a “large percentage simply do not believe NASA’s story.”   In all likelihood, the reality is the other way around.
IF China is really serious with their Space programme (which I hope they are), I can guarantee you that the Apollo missions would still be in everyone’s mind for some time.   It would inspire younger generations to look into it.

Posted by: Ian2 | Jan 8 2022 11:42 utc | 136

Oriental Voice | Jan 8 2022 1:33 utc | 96:
We all have our delusions. The Global Times writer is proclaiming that “water is wet.” No shit Sherlock. Any newly built military installations would also be considered valid military targets. The writer is likely thinking about missile strikes similar to what Iran did in Iraq back in Jan 2020. However, the writer over at Oriental Daily News is definitely delusional.

littlereddot | Jan 8 2022 5:11 utc | 114:
First off, the Montreux Convention and the Russian Black Sea fleet would prevent the USN to be effective should the Ukrainian situation turns hot. The Turks wouldn’t want that. I suppose the USN could force their way into the Black Sea but no telling how far the Turks would go to enforce the convention. IIRC, a subtle message was given to Kiev that they’d be alone if they decided to make the situation even worse. Second, Kazakhstan is too far deep into Central Asia. It’s virtually untouchable by the US military (excluding ICBM).
I agree China wouldn’t miss the opportunity to retake Taiwan and maybe even convince the Koreans to join them in giving the Japanese some payback, IF we’re talking about WW3. However, as of now, the Chinese Navy isn’t capable of taking on South Korea, Japan and the US at the same time as suggested by the writer over at the Oriental Daily News (@77).

Posted by: Ian2 | Jan 8 2022 12:13 utc | 137

Sorry to burst your bubble but the US did go to the Moon. IIRC, the Soviets had launched a spy satellite that followed Apollo 11 just to confirm that the US really made it to the Moon. The Apollo 11 astronauts caught a glimpse of it, reporting it as an UFO because none of them knew what it was. After confirmation, the Soviets forced the spy satellite to crash on the surface of the Moon. IF the Moon landings were faked, the Soviets would have wasted no time in debunking it.
The Soviets knew the whole thing was faked. They cut a deal with the US in exchange for their silence. There were no landing sites to look for, because they did not exist. Neither the Indians nor anyone else, bothered to look for such.
All this talk of manned lunar missions is bunkus. The Van Allen Belts are real, and the radiation within them is real, and the levels of radiation beyond them, including in the region surrounding the moon is real. The radiation levels are high enough to cause radiation sickness among the crew within days to weeks. Dosages have been calculated, and the risk is known.
To survive this, the space craft would need be modified to contain a radiation shield protecting the crew within. It has been calculated that a meter of water would work. Only problems… obtaining the water, and accelerating that mass to achieve escape velocity.
INDY

Posted by: George W Oprisko | Jan 8 2022 13:12 utc | 138

Apollo11 did go to the moon. If it was staged in a film studio Australia’s CSIRO Parkes Radio Telescope would have needed to be a part of the charade.
Considering recent political events, particularly AUKUS and the sacking of the last independent PM by the Governor General, no less, who’s to say they weren’t??
Particularly since your “witness” went off tilting at windmills in Area 51…
INDY

Posted by: George W Oprisko | Jan 8 2022 13:17 utc | 139

The usual suspects talking the usual nonsense with the usual zero outcome.
Nice to see that I have missed literally nothing despite 2 weeks of COVID + moving fun.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 8 2022 13:28 utc | 140

Democrat historic 2022 rout watch:
Biden disapproval continues to increase

The economy was the top priority for men and women, every age cohort, Latino and white voters, and those with and without college educations. Black respondents, who named racism their chief priority, said the economy takes second place.
Sixty percent of the survey’s 1,895 respondents said they disapprove of Biden’s handling of the economy, marking a six-point decline in approval from September.
On personal economic issues, voters are even more likely to criticize the president. Some 72% disapprove of his handling of the price of everyday goods, while 66% disapprove of his efforts to help their wallets.

Asked to give the Biden administration a letter grade on both how it’s handled health-care costs and raising wages, Democrats gave the president two Cs, but a B on the economy overall.
Independents gave Biden a D on every issue, while Republicans gave the president a failing grade across the board minus the stock market, where they gave him a D.
What’s more, a 55% majority of survey respondents said they disapprove of the president’s handling of the coronavirus pandemic, a sign Biden is struggling in an area where he previously excelled.

Some 84% of those surveyed said the prices they see for everyday goods are higher than they were a year ago, while just 19% report earning more income over the same period. And only 23% say they believe inflation is starting to come down or will begin to decline soon.

Independents disapproving = Democrat rout in 2022, especially since it is 100% clear that we will have historic new numbers of COVID cases (and sadly, likely deaths) come the end of January.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 8 2022 13:37 utc | 141

still obstruction of early treatment continues
likely to continue thru end of January

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 13:54 utc | 142

Trusted News Initiative (TNI)
All the major news outlets
(and others, eg, Microsoft)
conspiring (they don’t even try to hide it any more)
to collectively “stay on message”.
The CEO of Reuters is on the board of Pfizer.
A Global Director of Reuters is top of the hierarchy at the CIA.
Search it out yourself.

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 14:03 utc | 143

For 4 months in Missoula, Montana, there were a bunch of regular Americans who decided to tell the mayor and city council members what they thought of public finance abuses. If you wonder what happens to regular folks in the states who have the temerity to tell the emperor he’s a naked narcissist, the documentary I’ve been working on is now available to view. It’s long, but worth the watch, IMHO: https://www.engensmissoula.com

Posted by: lizard | Jan 8 2022 14:24 utc | 144

I never realised that there are so many foreign NGO’s in Kazakhstan.
“The International Center for Not-for-Profit Law (ICNL) estimates there are 38,000 active NGOs in Kazakhstan while the majority of them is funded by the United States and European countries by way of grants and donations.”
https://sputniknews.com/20220107/coincidence-us-foreign-ngos-may-have-played-key-role-in-social-unrest-in-kazakhstan-expert-says-1092101738.html
Nor had I realised that the government was starting to crackdown on them.
“The fines and suspension of the NGO activities contradict the priorities of the development of civil society announced by the state and damage international reputation of Kazakhstan. Echo and International Legal Initiative organizations have been fined 400 MCI (1,166,800 KZT) each and their activities have been suspended for 3 months. Kazakhstan International Bureau for Human Rights and Rule of Law was fined 800 MCI (2,333,600 KZT) with a suspension of activities for 3 months. Another organization Erkindik Qanaty was fined 100 MCI (277 800 KZT). Thus, the total amount of fines for only 4 non-governmental organizations amounted to almost 5 million tenge. In the near future, this amount for all organizations can reach tens of millions tenge.”
https://www.icnl.org/resources/civic-freedom-monitor/kazakhstan
Might this be the real catalyst to the violent uprisings?

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 8 2022 14:25 utc | 145

@87 Ian2
Sorry to burst your bubble but they did not go to the moon.
Russians knew that the Apollo launcher would dump in the Atlantic if there was any problems. Spy ships galore.
There is the evidence of an American coast guard ship going to Russia to collect a training lander as it was described during the cold war. There’s also the wheat and money deal paid by America to Russia. Did the US Coast Guard cutter Southwind go to Murmansk specifically to collect this Apollo module on the weekend of 5-6 September 1970? Yes they did.
Sure the Russians could have made the Yanks look silly, but by playing along they extracted a far better deal for themselves.
And besides, how on earth did America forget how to go to the moon? It’s not like the Landers or the rockets have disappeared. They are museum pieces.
As for the spy satellite that tailed Apollo?! The Yanks would have detected the launch, and the cold war climate would have ensured a loud public reaction in a manner only the US can do.
Finally, note that the Soviets did not think the United States even had the technical capacity to reach LEO with a manned spacecraft, and for this reason the Soviets knew that NASA had to fake their part of the Apollo-Soyuz project as well. It supplies a valid reason for making an Apollo CM available to the Soviets without being seen to do so.
Everything about America is just a pile of lies smeared in baloney.
Source: Aulis dot com

Posted by: Some Random Passerby | Jan 8 2022 14:34 utc | 146

combine 52 cognitive bias with cognitive dissonance is a heady mix for these pathological and sociological exceptionalusts”.
Interesting prog on tv yesterday…an FBI crime profiler explaining the manipulative methods and personalities of narcissistic murderers…….a close match.
Syrian uprising so I understood c 2011 in north east was started and promoted before and afterwards by “interested parties” due to drought issues for local economies. Similar kind of raison d’etre for K?Seems to be about 2600 CSTO flown into Kazakhstan ….is that enough for this large country, are there more waiting to come in just in case? I thought that trouble was happening in many of the towns and cities so are local law and order operatives sufficient for those as we only seem to be recieving info from the two chief cities? No info or stats about
numbers of police and military that K has nor their make up nor organisation .
?

Posted by: Jo | Jan 8 2022 14:37 utc | 147

@ Norwegian 124
@Don Bacon | Jan 7 2022 23:59 utc | 85
Regarding an increasing (it seems to me) practice that is an enigma to me. . .
Why do Americans like to display their flag so much?
Yes, indeed. Please explain this strange phenomenon.
(I am not being cynical)
Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 8 2022 9:10 utc | 124
I tried to answer that question in my 89
@ Jen 86
. . .lack of stability and restlessness, and the consequences of those characteristics and tendencies: self-aggrandisement, extreme individualism and the inability to work with others or to work through problems
Perhaps that’s why so many flags are being displayed, to honor the “freedom” of being a selfish jerk?
Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2022 0:22 utc | 89

Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2022 14:42 utc | 148

I await the arrival of flat earthers with trepidation.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 8 2022 14:43 utc | 149

Some significant arrests have been make in Kazakhstan.
“Karim Masimov, the former chief of Kazakhstan’s National Security Committee (KNB) was arrested earlier this week along with other unidentified suspects as part of a probe into “high treason,” the security agency said on Saturday.
The KNB had launched a pre-trial investigation on January 6, it said in a statement, adding that its former chairman, Masimov, and others had been arrested and placed in pre-trial detention on the same day. The agency provided no further details on the case, citing the ongoing investigation.”
https://www.rt.com/russia/545442-kazakhstan-security-chief-arrested-treason/

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 8 2022 15:02 utc | 150

Posted by: George W Oprisko | Jan 8 2022 13:12 utc | 138
To add to your explanation there’s also the fact that US moon lander doesn’t have blast craters typical from landing rocket.
If the Soviet decides to play along i believe it’s because they wouldn’t want to make people to believe all the scientific publication of space explorations to be painted with the same skepticism.
So until there’s a second and a third other credible entities that can confirm US indeed landed and disembark man on the moon it’s not wrong to cast doubt on US claims regardless they’re really true or not.

Posted by: Lucci | Jan 8 2022 15:06 utc | 151

@ Ian2 87
I believe that analyst may be a bit overconfident on China’s naval strength. Yes it’s certainly on it’s way to become the next biggest Navy but they haven’t reached that point.
. .actually they have. . .
China Has World’s Largest Navy With 355 Ships and Counting, Says Pentagon . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2022 15:10 utc | 152

@126 Norwegian
I’m not an American.
I do believe Apollo went to the moon.
I do not believe man accompanied them on the voyage.
First two Apollo’s were on remote control, and both space race countries had the ability to leave items via unmmaned probes.
We’ll know for sure one day. I’d actually like to be proven wrong, but considering how the Yanks love to tell lies and baloney, I don’t have much faith.
A11 work and no play makes Jack a dull boy.

Posted by: Some Random Passerby | Jan 8 2022 15:14 utc | 153

#121
Thanks. Seems to me Americans forget too easily that trying to undo election results by dodgy means has been a decades long American tradition.
(besides the 2016 attempt by the Clinton gang, let’s not forget that Obama birth certificate conspiracy theory, the alleged thousands of votes disappeared in Florida that would have put Gore instead of GWB in the white house, the impeachment proceedings against Clinton (Bill) via the Lewinsky affair… Pinning all the blame on Trump like he’s invented political corruption, in the most corrupt country on Earth, is spectacularly misguided.)

Posted by: Sumguy | Jan 8 2022 15:35 utc | 154

Apparently many Americans are exceptionally not wanting to work any more.
…from The Hill. . .

There are 1.7 million fewer people in the labor force than would be expected given the state of the economy.
Employers have struggled for months to hire and retain workers, who have enjoyed new leverage in pandemic-restrained economy.
There were more than 10 million open jobs posted in November, according to Labor Department data released Tuesday, and more workers voluntarily left their jobs — likely to take new ones at higher pay — than ever before. Jobless claims have also lingered below pre-pandemic levels since mid-November. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2022 15:47 utc | 155

part of the space race theatrics is to not only convince Americans that NASA is on the moon and Mars but to convince them that other countries are also doing the same thing, landing on comets, shit like that. all fake. gps is fake. sputnik? fake. like Satan putting signs of evolution in the earth’s historical record in order to trick the true believers, the global cabal is very, very clever and almost omnipotent. which omnipotence they use, to make movies like “gravity”.
“People will believe anything,” the hero in ‘Capricorn One,’ commenting on the film technology used to make the movie magic we in the US call, The Western. horses and gunfire don’t actually work that way? well, now i believe in nothing.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 16:01 utc | 156

The Ukie armies are just part of the picture. The US has been building more BioWeapons around Russia than Nato has armies. And Kazakhstan should open Russian eyes up or else. Say what ? Ukraine – 12+ BioWeapons Labs – Georgia – 1 huge one and probably some Satellites – Kazakhstan – 6 maybe 7 BioWeapons Labs.
Ya, that ” Old Man” that ran/runs Kazakh and his family are billionaires many times over and he let in the NWO, US military and the big Pharma BioWeapons labs, using the gaz, oil and uranium to his own advantage also.
Notice that that X Ukie Prez YanukoBitch also let in the NWO Globalists and their BioLabs, being disguised as Agriculture and Animal labs.. Since then Poroshankster and the other comedian prez also lets the NWO and US , do whatever they want – also.
Which brings up the Big Question Why is Russia allowing this shit to happen , but plays with Nato on its Borders ? My sources ? Vladimir Platov’s many articles @ NEO, Dilyana Gaytandzhieva from Bulgaria and Anti Empire +Edward Slav…. with his correlations of big pharma and Russia.And like the rest of you – I connect the Dots.

Posted by: GMC | Jan 8 2022 16:07 utc | 157

@Don Bacon #155
The “disappearance” of so many American workers has been yakked about forever.
Yet we really don’t need to look very far:
suspension of student loan repayments.
Why student loan repayments vs. say, rent or mortgage interest or other areas?
The student loans cannot be avoided in any way – unless rent, mortgage interest or credit card debt. They can’t be discharged in bankruptcy, they can’t be forgiven, etc etc.
It doesn’t seem impossible to me, at all, that millions of lower paid retail workers did what they did in order to make their student loan payments. We have clearly seen that the expiration of Federal pandemic unemployment benefits had virtually no impact on work force participation – so clearly FPUB isn’t it. Similarly, ongoing rolling closures of rent/mortgage evictions isn’t doing it either.
As the student loan repayment moratorium is set to end May 1 – we’ll see. There are roughly 43M such borrowers owing an average of around $40K apiece.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 8 2022 16:13 utc | 158

@rjb1.5
GPS is not fake.
Satellites are not fake – you can see them in the sky.
I would be continually amused by the antics of the ignorant such as yourself, if I weren’t much more continually saddened.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 8 2022 16:16 utc | 159

Exceptionally Corrupt
From the Roosevelt Institute
https://rooseveltinstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/RI_Pharma_Cost-of-Capture_brief_201905.pdf
This was timely, May 2019. Warning given, near history provided clear illustration.
The Cost of Capture:
How the Pharmaceutical Industry has Corrupted
Policymakers and Harmed Patients

The Revolving Door

The revolving door between government service and pharmaceutical industry positions
presents another opportunity for influence. The revolving door generally refers to “an
institutionalized system or culture of integration between government officials and regulated
economic interests” (Chopra & Margetta Morgan 2018). When individuals “revolve” back and
forth between regulatory agencies and the firms they regulate, it can create both actual and
perceived perverse incentive structures and conflicts of interest. Corporate executives leaving
their companies for public service, for instance, are often given million-dollar payouts—known
as “golden parachutes”—that are available if the executive leaves the firm for a high-level
government position.
For sitting government officials, the prospect of a lucrative industry position may provide an
incentive to avoid conflict with regulated entities. Further, the expertise and contacts that
government officials accrue during public service can be highly valuable to regulated companies;
by offering lucrative post-government positions, big companies are able to buy up influence and
knowledge about the inner workings of government agencies. This provides both an advantage
to these companies as well as a disadvantage to smaller competitors and non-profit or policy
organizations that cannot compete in attracting talent from the government.
An active and sizeable revolving door exists between the pharmaceutical industry and
government, creating opportunities to influence the policymaking of FDA regulators,
Congressional staffers, and agency heads. One analysis of the employment paths of all FDA drug
reviewers in hematology-oncology over a ten-year period found that over half of the reviewers
who left the agency went on to work in some capacity for biopharmaceutical firms (Bien &
Prasad 2016). The study’s author states, “…If you know a major post-employment opportunity is
on the other side of the table, you give them the benefit of the doubt, maybe, make things a little
easier on the companies” (Kaplan 2016

Exceptional !
(if you cash in)

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 16:20 utc | 160

This is news: United States and NATO on Friday roundly rejected Russian demands.
It is such a laugh if things we’re so serious. I mean, why say anything at all? Amateur-hour.
The Golden Silence is suddenly shattered by an earth-shaking what exactly? I cannot predict but one thing:
if this is the attitude the U.S. is looking to bring to “the table” things will not go their way.
Plain and simple.
I said it before – Silence is great when you carry a big stick. First round is a one-on-one with no back-up. What is to be had? For Russia, they must find it difficult to engage with such company.
But try they must.

Posted by: thecelticwithinme | Jan 8 2022 16:20 utc | 161

i hurt my eyeballs w/this moon landing thing. rolling, like the stars.
it’s not impossible that what my parents saw on the TV in ’69 was a performance on a sound stage AND that the Apollo astronauts also landed on the moon. no contradiction. bring in Hollywood cuz space is boring, movies and NASA have always been part of the MIC, and space in itself doesn’t exactly inspire one to want to march on or nuke Moscow, quite the opposite, so something must be done.
Americans believe in UFO’s and angels and Mountain Dew. you gotta make that moon landing relevant and exciting, otherwise it’s fake.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 16:30 utc | 162

c1ue | Jan 8 2022 16:16 utc | 159
i’m not buying you a sarcasm or irony meter.
i’m typing to you on the supertubes, mr “gps isn’t fake.”

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 16:34 utc | 163

After reading the new comments here this morning the following is the one I want to respond to

I await the arrival of flat earthers with trepidation.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 8 2022 14:43 utc | 149

You know, don’t you, that the earth is only flat on one side…../s

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 8 2022 16:42 utc | 164

O/T.
This doesn’t bode well.
“The United States and NATO on Friday roundly rejected Russian demands that the alliance not admit new members amid growing concerns that Russia may invade Ukraine, which aspires to join the alliance.”
“Secretary of State Antony Blinken and NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said Russia would have no say over who should be allowed to join the bloc. And, they warned Russia of a “forceful” response to any further military intervention in Ukraine.”
I don’t think Blinken does irony, hypocrisy yes, or he wouldn’t have said this on Russia aiding Kazakhstan.
“I think one lesson in recent history is that once Russians are in your house, it’s sometimes very difficult to get them to leave,”
https://www.rt.com/russia/545422-russia-blinken-kazakhstan-lesson/
https://news.antiwar.com/2022/01/07/us-nato-reject-russias-call-for-halt-of-eastward-expansion/

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 8 2022 16:53 utc | 165

People walked on the Moon? Are you stupid? It’s too small. Look, about the same size as a quarter!
[Gruff holds a US twenty-five cent piece at arm’s length next to the Moon in the sky]
What idiots you are! Next thing we know you will be saying that the Earth is a ball!

Posted by: William Gruff | Jan 8 2022 17:00 utc | 166

Get used to it. The Dark Ages MkII are already here, but they get “better” from this point on.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jan 8 2022 17:02 utc | 167

librul | Jan 8 2022 16:20 utc | 160
med school ain’t cheap. or free of torture. you’d think doctors would be against the junk food culture (etc., etc.) of our society. you’d be dead wrong. you’d think doctors know war kills. nope. medicine is a business and doctors are there to grow the business. they aren’t there to cure cancer or stop people from smoking. they are there to use “scientific, medical” authority to enforce the diktats of capital, which is profit-taking. and doctors want a slice of that pie.
but do their MRI’s work? does a d-dimer test work? what about an EEG or EKG? do you not let EMT’s put their hands on you during a heart attack or car crash b/c they are, definitively, in the hands of Big Money? no blood for you b/c hobos make money from selling it (capitalism = vampirism)?
some of the stuff capitalists produce does work. i know it’s hard, but try to wrap your brain around that fact. scientists in a lab are interacting with physical reality. quite unlike people posting shit on the innertubes.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 17:05 utc | 168

Just noticed a notch down in exceptionalism.
Alan Shepard was the first American to travel into space.
Yuri Gagarin was always a non-person in the US press
for most of my life. (I just now had to look up the correct spelling of
Yuri Gagarin.)
Here is the notch down:
(from Wikipedia)

Alan Bartlett Shepard Jr. (November 18, 1923 – July 21, 1998) was an American astronaut, naval aviator, test pilot, and businessman. In 1961, he became the second person and the first American to travel into space, and in 1971, he walked on the Moon.

The attribute “second” would not have appeared in news items for many years.
Note that it says second *person*. No mention of Soviets or USSR.
I had done a quick search of Alan Shepard just now
as I thought I’d mention I bumped into him some decades ago.
I walked into one of those cafeteria-style breakfast areas, where you
select what you want, take it to the cashier and then exit into
the larger dining area.
There was no one in the cafeteria area except for the cashier and
one other person. Initially I only saw him very peripherally.
But my subconscious identified him immediately using only the corner
of my eye. My subconscious turned my head on a swivel — whiplash!
I have always felt compassion for those tossed into the limelight
and how they loose their privacy forever. Alan Shepard probably
couldn’t run to the convenience store for milk without drawing a crowd.
But here he was in a city a long, long way from his home.
I’ll bet he was reveling in his relative anonymity.
He saw my swivel and our eyes made contact. His body language told
me he would rather just go about his business. Perhaps that was me
projecting, who knows. I respected his privacy.
A couple minutes later we were at the cashier and he was
behind me in line two feet from me.
The cashier dropped a nickel of my change and I display amazing
reflexes and caught it midair before it touched the ground.
I said to the cashier, “from the ground up”.
Alan Shepard smiled knowingly.
That last paragraph I made up. That is what I wished had happened.
“From the ground up”, is what JFK quipped when he reached to pin a
medal on Shepard but it fell from JFK’s fingers and landed on the pavement.
An aide picked it up for Kennedy as it would have been unseemly for Kennedy to do it.
“From the ground up”
-JFK, 1961

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 17:12 utc | 169

People who non-contextually bring up the US moon landing are disinformation specialists; their mission is to discredit and disrupt unapproved information sources. All the meaningful writing on this thread has been discredited by the sock-puppet-side-show. It works, they’re spreading rhetorical chafe to obscure any counter-narrative to those offered up by DC’s “Ministry of Truth”. Yes, it’s low quality material, lacking any semblance of originality but, as bad as it is, it still earns them mileage on their 3LA membership card.
Any democratic forum can be disrupted in this manner…and that has been true since the term “oligarch” was coined. In modern language, it’s state sponsored trolling.

Posted by: S Brennan | Jan 8 2022 17:16 utc | 170

William Gruff | Jan 8 2022 17:00 utc | 166
amateurs need to reconsider their naive realism before their skull gets crushed.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 17:17 utc | 171

@Posted by: S Brennan | Jan 8 2022 17:16 utc | 170
“barflies”, remember?
You forgot the forum context.
Barflies

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 17:18 utc | 172

Considering the word “exceptionalism”, my thoughts are that it goes very well with how the new world order which is being proclaimed in significant ways, not by the west or by Davos participants, but by the eastern nations, Kazakhstan being the most recent herald. Every nation, in a multipolar format, can and should have citizens proclaiming their own unique exceptionalism, for the world to be a vital and interesting and creative planet, with no citizen needing to migrate beyond the borders of their ancestral home. And look, Syrians are going back home. Afghans are still finding their feet; but they will. Crimea is a stage ahead, and developing fast. China? Well, no need to say — It’s citizens are as proud as punch! We’ve seen recently all these examples, and we ought to, as Saint Paul says, “hold fast to the good.”
Too often our thoughts are couched in negativity. What profit then? We have a New Year. Talks are about to begin from a new strength of purpose. Let’s not be left behind. There is no reason to doubt the exceptionality of the moment.
Now is the time for hope.

Posted by: juliania | Jan 8 2022 17:35 utc | 173

back on topic…
Ian2 | Jan 8 2022 12:13 utc | 137
thank you. can other NATO members consider Turkey a ‘reliable partner’ re Ukraine? how many fake moon landings ago was it that NATO tried a coup against Erdogan?

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 17:36 utc | 174

Exceptional ism
Different nations, people, are moved by different energies, values, themes.
For example, I would say the energy of Germany is *intelligent action*.
Clearly, for the USofA the energy is idealism. Clearly.
What is the energy of Russia?
I will venture a guess that it is also idealism
and thus that is why our two countries clash.
We are both trying to fill the same role on this planet – The Ideal.

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 17:46 utc | 175

The behaviour of the American Governing elite is perfectly rational, the Empire is flailing, falling apart, losing the grip on things, the last thing such a collapsing entity needs is the world and its perceived or real rivals to be successful, enriching themselves, living in peace trading, exchanging ideas beneficial to the parties involved.
The response the Governing Elite cannot but pursue is obvious – as many conflicts as possible to weaken what in the eyes of the Governing Elite are the challengers for its hegemony. That’s exactly what the Rand report outlined, what the Governing Elite is trying to accomplish, the Kazakhs adventure is a part of it, more is to come.

Posted by: Baron | Jan 8 2022 17:51 utc | 176

Posted by: librul | Jan 8 2022 17:12 utc | 169
“From the Ground Up”
Thank you, librul, I enjoyed your post! (I would however point out that President Kennedy had a bad back; his inability to stoop, there was nothing unseemly in that.)
Certainly from the ground up (or even lower) is, I hope, where the US is right now, and the Heraclitus quote that Eliot used and Dante exemplified in The Divine Comedy is apt:
“The way up is the way down.”
Midway along the journey of our life
I woke to find myself in a dark wood,
for I had wandered off from the straight path.

Posted by: juliania | Jan 8 2022 17:54 utc | 177

but i thought those ubersonic and hyperphonic and hydroponic missiles and jets and ships were gonna fix all this, that NATO would pack up its NGO’s and jihadi recruits and fold its nuclear-tipped and -ringed hand? wow. Russia’s faster missiles only made the West more belligerent? who would have guessed? maybe if Russia and China spread more of that technology around the world, that will help? call their making money off war “self defense” like the US does?
i’ll get myself anathematized for saying stuff like this.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 18:08 utc | 178

@Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 8 2022 16:30 utc | 162
Go away and disrupt another forum with your nonsense.

Posted by: Roger | Jan 8 2022 18:21 utc | 179

Funny discussion between Emma Ashford and Matthew Kroenig on
https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/01/06/kazakhstan-russia-putin-csto-protests-ukraine/
It shows the complete inability of US elites (here Kroenig) to understand Russia, and it also gives the reason for this: the conviction of absolute US superiority in any terms. No need to think further than to the Pentagon. The rest is left to psychology. What else.
MK: I am glad FP published the piece, but it’s a bunch of nonsense. No one, not even Putin in his deepest bouts of paranoia, really believes that NATO poses a military threat to Russia.
EA: I’m not sure why it’s so hard to believe that Russia might feel militarily threatened by NATO. The United States recently had a half-century cold war with them, and Russia was invaded by Germany within (almost) living memory. It might be an overblown fear, but it’s hardly irrational. But go on.
MK: The real threat the Kremlin perceives is political and economic. If Ukraine succeeds as a vibrant, open-market democracy, its neighbors in Russia will want the same thing, and Putin and his fellow kleptocrats will be in trouble. Therefore, he wants to dominate Ukraine, and keep it down, to make Eastern Europe safe for autocracy.
Putin is also on a lifelong mission to restore the Russian empire for reasons of psychology and prestige, and having the former core of the Russian empire in a rival alliance system blocks his imperial ambitions.
EA: I think if he were on a mission to restore the Russian empire, he wouldn’t have stopped at Crimea and the Donbass. He wouldn’t have stopped at Abkhazia and South Ossetia in Georgia.
MK: A major reason he stopped, I believe, is a five-sided building in Arlington, Virginia.
EA: Hmm. Given that the George W. Bush administration declined to intervene in Georgia in 2008, and the Obama administration declined to intervene in Ukraine in 2014, I’m not sure the Pentagon deserves so much credit.

Posted by: Jan | Jan 8 2022 18:23 utc | 180

Concerning exceptionalism, I have the same problem as the US. I talk too much, and to too many people, about my prowess in bed. So, sometimes, once in bed…

Posted by: Leuk | Jan 8 2022 19:13 utc | 181

my take
Here is your new leader
we chose him just for you
the other guy is gonna die
and we’ve arranged a coup
our good and faithful minions
share all of our opinions
so if you want to live
here’s what yer gonna do
Arrest our competition
and buy our submarines
and force your population
to submit to our vaccines
just do as you are told
don’t make us use the stick
for we can be quite ruthless
when we want to be a prick.
Psycho Suzerain will kill
any obstacle at will
with a sniper or a drone
in a crowd or all alone
Uncle Sam gets his man
From Haiti to Iran
Venezuela Vietnam
just look what happened to Japan

Posted by: ld | Jan 8 2022 19:49 utc | 182

psychohistorian @164–
Indeed! It’s flat where ever one stands. And despite it’s rotation it remains continually flat.
As for exceptionalism, last night we watched The Last Waltz–what a time machine trip! Watching the well integrated orchestra and choir along with The Band play “The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down” was rather emotional as was Muddy Waters performing “I’m a M*A*N*–Man.” I remember trying to get tickets to it, but it sold out in less than one day, and none were to be had on the black market. There’s much to recall about 1976 and its promise, but that promise turned out to be no better than a candle in the wind.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 8 2022 20:16 utc | 183

@Norwegian
The Van Allen belts prove that there have been NO moon landing, go check NeverAStraightAnswer`s own site and find THE reason “we” dont go to the moon NOW…
Sorry, but Logos and Occams razor is 100% on “our” side in this, no one survives those radioactive belts surrounding our earth. No one.

Posted by: Per/Norway | Jan 8 2022 20:22 utc | 184

Posted by: S Brennan | Jan 7 2022 17:46 utc | 31
Worked in IT for a while, back in the day.
Insiders would talk about how all systems relied on TLAs (RAM, ROM, CPU, VDU). Then there was the innovation of introducing ETLAs (extended three letter acronyms) such as PROM, RTFM, and, of corse, ETLA…

Posted by: Vandemonian | Jan 8 2022 20:31 utc | 185

Related to the ideology of exceptionalism is that of humanitarian imperialism, the support for foreign intervention and regime change which is shared by so many progressives, making them effectively an extension of the US imperialist agenda.

Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Jan 8 2022 20:48 utc | 186

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 8 2022 20:16 utc | 183
Ah! The Last Waltz, thank you for jerking that memory molecule. I have it on VHS, CD and vinyl triple album. What a concept. Its on the record deck now. ‘Such a night’ was the track that got me.
I’d bet you enjoy Ry Cooder too. Saw him live in Oslo.
Best wishes from a back row barfly.

Posted by: JohninMK | Jan 8 2022 20:59 utc | 187

i am a relatively new participant, would not presume to name myself a barfly, and i realise my posts contribute approximately nothing…
even i am getting okay at spotting what really does seem like “state sponsored trolling” – why the fuck are their posts not deleted or marked or something? surely there are veterans here, b included?!, that can spot that shit instantly??

Posted by: Rae | Jan 8 2022 21:04 utc | 188

US Sec/State Blinken spoke to the press yesterday and told at least three whopping lies relevant to the scheduled meetings next week. What confidence can anyone assume in light of this?
“In 2014, the Ukrainian people chose a democratic and European future for themselves.  Russia responded by manufacturing a crisis and invading…”
“It’s Russia that has failed to implement any of its Minsk commitments, indeed is actively violating many of them, and refuses to acknowledge it’s a party to the conflict…”
“It’s also worth noting that Moscow is simultaneously driving the false narrative that NATO is threatening Russia – that NATO plans to station military infrastructure in Ukraine to stir conflict with Russia, that NATO swore after the Cold War not to admit countries in Eastern Europe, and that NATO has broken those promises. Each of those claims is false… NATO never promised not to admit new members. It could not and would not – the “open door policy” was a core provision of the 1949 North Atlantic Treaty that founded NATO. The Russian president at the end of the Cold War, Mikhail Gorbachev, was asked directly about this in an interview in 2014, and said very clearly that the topic of NATO expansion was not discussed at all in negotiations about German reunification that led to the end of the Cold War. There was no promise that NATO wouldn’t expand.”
https://www.state.gov/secretary-antony-j-blinken-at-a-press-availability-11/

Posted by: jayc | Jan 8 2022 21:09 utc | 189

wish i had not said “deleted”. did they get me?!
let’s say “moved” instead of “deleted”

Posted by: Rae | Jan 8 2022 21:10 utc | 190

RT must have saved this article for just the right moment: “‘After 900 nuclear tests on our land, US wants to ethnically cleanse us’: meet the most [nuclear] bombed nation in the world.”
It’s the above crime and the many thousands of others that have never seen any form of justice even attempted that makes the Outlaw US Empire exceptional–Exceptionally hideous and evil. Perhaps if those at the peak of the pyramid had their lives treated as cheaply as they treat all others they’d get the hint and stop.
jayc @189–
Thanks for posting that crap!!

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 8 2022 21:24 utc | 191

librul@169: good you point out the “exceptional” A.Shepard, he was *not* second in space, at best *third* as Titov was second, and likely several Soviet cosmonauts died before that.
As for the moon landing, i am no longer a believer. There is a fantastic British documentary series, by ITV i believe that demolishs the myth. What made me disbelieve was the famous photographs. Astonishly crafted they were. This from chest mounted Hasselblads with basically no focus, f-stop, or shutterspeed controls, yet the framing and crispness and lighting is *stunning* from non-professional astronauts wearing thick gloves. Where are the out-takes? The other instant gieveaway are photos with NO STARS, yet here on earth amateurs crank these out by the millions. So NASA didn’t think enough of Astronomers, their biggest fans, to provide just *one* serious image of a star field? Why? If you’ve ever sailed at night you know that the starfield will *precisely* show where you are. A faked moon picture would not get the relative positions of the stars & planets right. Hence under no circumstances could the fakers show a starfield as the fakery becomes glaring…

Posted by: Simpliciuss | Jan 8 2022 23:05 utc | 192

And of course, speaking of photograph Stanley Kubrick started out as a professional photographer and was one of the best: he prefected the Mise en Scene and his set pieces are visually stunning in his movies

Posted by: Simpliciuss | Jan 8 2022 23:09 utc | 193

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 7 2022 22:47 utc | 75
Well said that man!

Posted by: John Cleary | Jan 8 2022 23:11 utc | 194

Roger | Jan 8 2022 18:21 utc | 179
no one died and left you blog boss, so piss off.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 9 2022 0:00 utc | 195

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 8 2022 16:53 utc | 165
“I think one lesson in recent history is that once Russians are in your house, it’s sometimes very difficult to get them to leave,”
Any other time in history the peals of hysterical laughter at this clowns comment would be deafening!
What does it say about western media?
Someone should ask the vietnamese Iraqis, Afghans , Syrians just off the top of my head their thoughts on the veracity of Blinkens script!

Posted by: JPC | Jan 9 2022 16:33 utc | 196

JPC @196
And how about Guantanamo Bay?

Posted by: spudski | Jan 9 2022 18:04 utc | 197

Blinkin’ Blink’n’s Baby Babble: “…. once Russians are in your house, it’s sometimes very difficult to get them to leave,”
Once the Americans are in your house, it is always — not sometimes — but always difficult to get them to leave.
Worse still is that they go right on killing on their way out. Remember those 7 dead children in Afghanistan?
Other times, they come into your house uninvited, stay, kill, steal, keep the oil. Remember Syria?

Posted by: kiwiklown | Jan 10 2022 3:42 utc | 198

Posted by: Tom2 | Jan 8 2022 10:26 utc | 132 — “The British are special….. This is the greatest nation on earth.”
Yes, so special that they have a special warehouse staffed by specially-qualified warehouse experts to curate all their loot stolen from around the world.
They call that warehouse the British Museum.

Posted by: kiwiklown | Jan 10 2022 3:45 utc | 199

“Mismatch in world view”
current( and past) US MoO is “projection”.
There is no truth, no reality of value around.
Everything gyrates around projection power and pushed narratives.
You win when you can stamp your projection into the global mind.
In that domain Russia has less to stand on.
They will have to make a disruptive move that shreds the projection.

Posted by: w.iederling | Jan 16 2022 11:43 utc | 200