Kyle Rittenhouse Is Not Guilty

November 19, 2021

The jury in the contentious Rittenhouse trial has made its judgment.

On the five counts Kyle Rittenhouse was accused of it found: Not guilty, not guilty, not guilty, not guilty, not guilty. The decision was unanimous.

Some here have repeated the 'woke' media claims which falsely accused Rittenhouse of being a racist murder.

For starters the three people he shot were all white just as he is. In each case he defended himself from people who directly attacked him. They were obviously seeking to severely harm him.

All the available video evidence, aptly combined in this 13 minute clip, proves that the verdict is fully justified.

It also confirms the judgment I had made on August 27 2020 after reviewing the evidence:

Yesterday a white teen with a semi-automatic weapon had the stupid idea to join others in 'protecting the businesses' in Kenosha from further looting. He ended up killing two people and wounding more after he was attacked by some of the rioters. The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense.

The case the prosecutors had was very thin. I doubt that they will try to appeal the case.

I am for one satisfied and happy with this outcome.

Posted by b on November 19, 2021 at 18:32 UTC | Permalink

Comments

i posted a revolver article about the prosecutor “binger” in the newsfeed over at The Saker`s site.
Imo it is a must read.

Posted by: Per/Norway | Nov 19 2021 21:12 utc | 101

Did you think I’m here to appreciate your intellect?
Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:04 utc | 91
Perish the thought!
You’re clearly here to attempt to demonstrate how clever you think you are.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:13 utc | 102

Found not guilty means he cannot be tried again. Appeal as a legal mechanism to a not guilty verdict is not permitted.

Posted by: Walter | Nov 19 2021 21:13 utc | 103

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 19 2021 20:58 utc | 85
For sure the media has been highly irresponsible. Both corporate “left” and right. What else should anyone expect?
Whether the “Proud Boys” are “white supremacist” is certainly up for debate (they claim “Western chauvinist” leanings and numerous members are non-white (although VERY few Black)). But it’s naïve at best to deny that there are real white supremacists who have supported KR and likely donated money to his defense and that he associated with the “Proud Boys” and flashed what is widely recognized as a sign denoting support for “white supremacy.”
As far as the “white supremacists” backing and donating, I suppose that’s merely guilt by association and in no way a barometer on KR’s own feelings in that regard. One hopes if he was able to know, he’d reject such donations (they were probably tiny in comparison to others).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OK_gesture#White_power_symbol
But aside from the “white supremacy” crap that flooded the media, and for the record since it’s widely thrown out there that his first shooting victim by the name of Rosenbaum was a convicted child molester, bipolar and out on bond (from a mental institution), nobody seems to mention that KR had previously openly wished to shoot shoplifters/looters and that he was caught on video beating up a young girl, which if ever charged and prosecuted means he would’ve had a criminal record too.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:14 utc | 104

Even on Fox News, they’re still referring to the guys who Kyle shot as “victims”. Kyle was found not guilty of murder, relying on the defence of self defense. Therefore, the guys who got shot more accurately could be described as “attackers”.

Posted by: Absurdio | Nov 19 2021 21:15 utc | 105

I fully agree with @ 85 William Gruff. I think the kid was dumb to go there, but whatever. It is all so pointless. I am planning for an evening of riots out here in Los Angeles. So stupid. As William Gruff said, the media is playing us. Mostly peaceful protests resulting in small business owners having their livelihood torched by white BLM activists in Kenosha WI over something they heard about on CNN. What a sad show. Boring and predictable. Thank you, b, for all that you do.
Also. W. Gruff mentioned “the Proud Boys.” That organization was founded by Gavin McInnes, one of the guys that created Vice magazine. Subtlety obviously isn’t the forte of the puppet masters.
Here is a good sound track for tonight’s show. I have to figure out my bike route home…
Dead Kennedys – Riot

Posted by: lex talionis | Nov 19 2021 21:19 utc | 106

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:10 utc | 97
You’re extrapolating a simple tautology to a trial.
Look up non sequitur.

Posted by: Erelis | Nov 19 2021 21:19 utc | 107

Posted by: lex talionis | Nov 19 2021 21:19 utc | 105
I highly doubt that there will be many “riots” or even protests nor that any that do take place will be very sustained.
Americans don’t generally take to the street to protest the deaths of white people, which I’m sure Gruff will agree with.
However, if the vigilante murderers of Ahmaud Arbery are acquitted in Georgia, you might board up your windows…

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:23 utc | 108

nobody seems to mention that KR had previously openly wished to shoot shoplifters/looters and that he was caught on video beating up a young girl, which if ever charged and prosecuted means he would’ve had a criminal record too.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:14 utc | 103
” openly wished to shoot shoplifters/looters” is NOT a crime.
“he was caught on video beating up a young girl, which if ever charged and prosecuted means he would’ve had a criminal record too.”
In the video I saw he was pretty clearly attempting to defend his sister from verbal or physical attack.
And furthermore, unless tried as an adult, any criminal record of a minor is expunged upon reaching adulthood. Any crime he may have committed on that occasion was frankly trivial compared to those Mr Rosenbaum, Mr Huber and Mr Grosskreutz committed as adults.
Rosenbaum’s crimes were certainly far more serious, involving the forcible rape of 5 male children all under the age of 12 yrs old, and all committed when he was legally an adult.
Comparing Rosenbaums crimes to fictional or theoretic crimes (if he would have etc) allegedly committed by KR is frankly ridiculous

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:27 utc | 109

I am for one satisfied and happy with this outcome.”
I’m sorry to hear it. This will now allow the White police, who shot a Black man seven times in the back, to more easily recruit racist Volunteers to kill more non-Whites and dissidents trying to protect them.
The lynching and killing can now be done by White Nazis with the racist police supporting them, increasing the strength of a Nazi movement in the USA.
The verdict occurred because the judge, prosecution and defense were all on the side of Rittenhouse, as was much of the media and dissident opinion. B was on the side of Rittenhouse before the evidence was presented of the various charges as is common in the USA which has a tradition of racial homicide. The tradition is largely defended by the Rule of Law, White judges, prosecution, police, and juries. That b is satisfied with the exoneration of Whittinhouse suggests a violent future ahead for America.

Posted by: Mathew | Nov 19 2021 21:28 utc | 110

@tom a Collins 103
Lots of “if” in your comment.
I appreciate your opinion, but it’s 99.9% conjecture.
As with many comments on this topic, your opinion isn’t fact.
For example: If my mom had testes, she’d be my dad.
See? It’s nonsense when facts matter.
Cheer

Posted by: Cadence Calls | Nov 19 2021 21:29 utc | 111

@ Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:13 utc | 101
Maybe. That’s a hypothesis that would require further investigation.
Doesn’t mean I’m not having fun.
–//–
@ Posted by: Erelis | Nov 19 2021 21:19 utc | 106
I will put a longer answer here because you clearly didn’t understand what I said.
There are thousands of people walking around the USA right now with AR-15. They’re all somewhere right now.
Not all of them are being trialed for murder in the city of Kenosha. Hence your quantum mechanics style argument is absurd.

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:31 utc | 112

Maybe. That’s a hypothesis that would require further investigation.
Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:31 utc | 111
—
nah, we have all we need to know what you are.
Most people are smart enough to recognize a narcissistic personality when they see it.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:33 utc | 113

@ Posted by: Absurdio | Nov 19 2021 21:15 utc | 104
That’s the thing I have been trying to warn you here. The judge’s biased conduction of the trial, plus the jury decision, basically legalized “fifth quarter justice” in the USA.
Fifth quarter justice cuts both ways. The people who want to keep calling Rittenhouse a murderer will keep doing so (even though this is illegal by the cold letter of law).
The mob rule is the mob rule. The judge and the jury have no power about what will happen outside the courthouse.

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:34 utc | 114

@ b
It’s a bit beneath you to pander to this non-event, but I guess you’re the media too.
@ #1 who cares?
ditto
@vk 24
agree completely: Americans love their certainties (“not guilty means not guilty!” no it doesn’t——read Oedipus Tyrannos) and they love them more and more as the whole place slips into a miasma of decline, irrelevance and civil collapse. Hurry up and get on with it rednecks, those AR-15s don’t shoot themselves!

Posted by: Patroklos | Nov 19 2021 21:34 utc | 115

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:27 utc | 108
I never said that the audio recording of Rittenhouse wishing he had his AR to shoot (unarmed) alleged shoplifters/looters was a crime. What it speaks to is his mindset and intent, which would be very relevant to deconstructing the self-defense argument by a competent prosecutor. Also, he was pointing his weapon at people on the night of the shootings prior to being pursued based on the testimony and video I saw.
Nice job minimizing the brutal assault he carried out on a FEMALE. His sister was the aggressor in that video and that the other girl MAY have been coming out on top is just too bad. He had no business laying a hand on a girl and throwing punches wouldn’t be necessary to defuse a fight between FEMALES. Give me a break.
As to whether it would have been expunged or handled in juvie court, it was recent enough that it would still have been on his record (or he’d be technically out on bond if only charged recently) at the time of the Kenosha shootings.
But you seem to be missing my larger point in thinking I’m trying to minimize Rosenbaum’s criminal history (and again you fail to neglect his documented mental illness, why?), and frankly it’s your attempt to minimize KR’s previous criminal behavior (and relevant contextual statements) that’s ridiculous.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:35 utc | 116

B was on the side of Rittenhouse before the evidence was presented of the various charges
Posted by: Mathew | Nov 19 2021 21:28 utc | 109
….
Yeah, because the majority of the evidence presented in court was video evidence.
Almost all the video evidence was widely available for anyone to peruse within hours of the events.
All anyone had to do was use their eyes and then admit the truth of what they saw.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:36 utc | 117

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:27 utc | 108
And let me expound on my previous post by saying that the fact that a young man found it necessary (or just thought it was a good opportunity to get away with) to literally land multiple punches on a female whom it appeared his sister was bullying is further evidence that he has mental issues of his own, or at the very least it is documented fact that he’s previously engaged in toxic masculinity and violence against females. That’s not the kind of person or personality who’s going to do any good whatsoever in a situation like the streets of Kenosha after dark. He’s obviously unstable and prone to violence.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:40 utc | 118

@ 107 Tom Q – The jury is still out on that. Tonight I will just chill and listen to some DJ Screw out of Houston. RIP DJ Screw. I don’t have any purple juice, but I’ll have a few beers. Hopefully they don’t destroy the businesses down the street from me like they did in 2020.
George Floyd DJ Screw track

Posted by: lex talionis | Nov 19 2021 21:40 utc | 119

frankly it’s your attempt to minimize KR’s previous criminal behavior (and relevant contextual statements) that’s ridiculous.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:35 utc | 115
There was no “previous criminal behavior”
For that to be true he’d have to have been adjudicated guilty of a crime in a court of law.
That never happened, no matter how much you might wish it to have been so.
It is in fact yet another imaginary construct from inside your head.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:41 utc | 120

Cadence Calls @110
Hey, some people have moms with testes these days but you’d better not call her “Dad!” or you’ll be accused of being a “white supremacist”… or something like that. You’d be accused of being a really bad person in any event.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 19 2021 21:43 utc | 121

That’s not the kind of person or personality who’s going to do any good whatsoever in a situation like the streets of Kenosha after dark. He’s obviously unstable and prone to violence.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:40 utc | 117
Evidence in court showed him doing lots of good in Kenosha that day
For example: Cleaning grafitti, offering medical aid and protecting local business from the rampages of a looting arsonist mob of criminal degenerates like Rosenbaum, Huber & Grosskreutz.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:44 utc | 122

The pro-vigilante commenters are insisting they aren’t racist, and even use Black petit-bourgeois business owners as a rhetorical shield and cudgel to try and show how the left are the real racists, and I guess I’ll just take them at their word that they aren’t racist because they bring enough to the table to show others what they really are without any accusations being necessary.
What they really reveal in their comments is the willingness to defend private property through the use of lethal force, even if this is done by out-of-towners who show up brandishing weapons and looking for a fight, rather than the actual property owners. Importantly, this desire to defend private property is at the root of petit-bourgeois conformity to its white supremacist vanguard (even if the PB aren’t personally racist themselves – racism has always been better understood as structural rather than personal) and historically it has been the rhetorical basis for attacks on Civil Rights Movement leaders and the movement itself. Indeed, civil rights meant the curtailing of private property absolutism in American society, with business owners now having to face public restrictions on who they can discriminate against. This gives the petit-bourgeoisie, now politically restricted, more love for the white supremacists who are historically, at least in America, private property absolutists, from the issue of chattel slavery to the issue of racial discrimination by business owners.
Well, that’s a clear enough political delineation for me. The sadism and hatred of one’s class enemies on display speaks for itself. That might rally your side, but it disgusts everyone else, especially those not loyal to the institution of bourgeois private property. Taking a sanctimonious posture about the use of violence against counter-demonstrators or against private property while praising the extrajudicial killing of leftist demonstrators is obnoxious, to say the least, but again, it induces the right kind of feelings among the partisans of the institutions at the core of America’s social rot.
You are indeed giving the vk types what they want. Foreign Marxists see this and have their ideas of American decline into civil unrest confirmed. They’re even explicitly rooting for it in this thread.
The petit-bourgeoisie’s biggest class enemy is always itself.

Posted by: fnord | Nov 19 2021 21:47 utc | 123

A gunman is always a threat to those without guns. There is no way for those without guns to counter the threat, because, as this case shows, if they try to disarm the gunman they will be shot and the gunman will claim self defense. So the only way to counter a gun threat is to have a gun. This is why the US is turning into a giant gun fight at ok corral. Kyle is an immature twit who has helped to make sure that all sides will be armed in future demonstrations. Nice going Kyle.

Posted by: DG | Nov 19 2021 21:48 utc | 124

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:44 utc | 121
Once again you’re all too caught up in the narrow legalistic interpretation of this case.
I’m looking at it from a balanced sociological and psychological perspective. That KR was seen cleaning graffiti is irrelevant to the case I’m making, not the case as it was argued in court.
KR is on video throwing and landing multiple punches against a female who his sister was bullying or at least attempting to intimidate or beat up. His sister came out on the wrong side, it would appear, and KR intervened not by simply breaking up the fight, as any normal male would do being much stronger (and bigger) than the girls in the video. No. Instead he took the opportunity to throw vicious blows at a female which he, and his brainwashed or narrow minded supporters, are trying to present as “protecting his sister” (from a fight she started).
I DGAF if that assault ever led to an arrest, prosecution or conviction, nor do I care whether it would have happened in the juvie courts or that his record might have eventually been expunged or relegated to sealed status as the result of his having been a minor.
What I do GAF about is that clearly Rittenhouse had demonstrated anti-social, violent thoughts and behavior with clear “sides” taken in the lead up to the Kenosha shootings. That anyone would even try to dispute this by hiding behind the narrow proscriptions of the trial itself is, to me, evidence of either closed mindedness or disingenuousness.
The situation involved parties with clear mental health issues, and a history of violence, on both sides.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:53 utc | 125

One of the things that bothered me about this case is how the media portrayed the “militias” as defending corporate chains like TJ Maxx, which they had no connection too, and therefore weren’t really there to defend businesses, but to do something more nefarious.
I grew up in near Kenosha and am familiar with the area the riots took place. It isn’t a strip mall full of corporate chains, but a mixed residential area full of old wooden houses and an old style downtown with small ma and pa style businesses, often with apartments and other living areas above the businesses.
In Wisconsin, a person’s work is an important part of who they are. The businesses burnt to the ground were the product of a life time of hard work and commitment, and in many cases a labor of love, and often, a home, too. That is what the “militia” came to protect. An important component of those militias is the real left, not the phony-bologna Antifa fascists who do the bidding of corporate America…whether they are aware of it or not.

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 21:54 utc | 126

Evidence in court showed him doing lots of good in Kenosha that day
For example: Cleaning grafitti, offering medical aid and protecting local business from the rampages of a looting arsonist mob of criminal degenerates like Rosenbaum, Huber & Grosskreutz.
Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 21:44 utc | 121
He was not mature enough, lacked sufficient training in most regards and in no fit mental state to be doing any of that is what I’m saying. Others doing what he was allegedly doing most likely were, but based on everything I’ve seen about the kid, he wasn’t.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:57 utc | 127

I owe you all another point of clarification.
Most of you here are not bilingual, but being bilingual is actually pretty tough. You can get rusty pretty easy and pretty fast if you don’t practice it every day. Just yesterday I made some embarrassing mistakes I deeply regret. I tend to make more mistakes the more hurried I am, therefore practicing speed and urgency is also valuable.
That’s why I comment here often – more frequently than I would like.
It is also nice to be updated with the most recent terminologies and using them myself. A language is only alive in the place it is natively spoken, after all, therefore I can only keep my English “alive” artificially, by consciously feeding from native English sources.

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:57 utc | 128

Did this happen?
Did Trump and Biden debate and then did the Biden campaign issue this inflammatory Twitter post the following day?
https://cms.zerohedge.com/s3/files/inline-images/kenosh_0.png?itok=n7yPhC-u
Need to research it. If anyone can assist let me know.

Posted by: librul | Nov 19 2021 22:00 utc | 129

Also, he was pointing his weapon at people on the night of the shootings prior to being pursued based on the testimony and video I saw.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:35 utc | 115
..
Stretching the truth to breaking point there TQ, as usual….
As far as I know he was accused of that by the prosecution but no reliable evidence was every presented, except for the last minute miraculous appearance of the very dubious magic pixel video which was in all likelihood little more than the result of blatant prosecutor/crimelab malfeasance.
The Jury obviously rejected, as not reliable, that video when they declared him innocent of the provocation charge.
The judge allowed it into evidence but clearly indicated that having watched it he could see little of value in it which might help the prosecution. He described it as “a high risk strategy” and the jury obviously agreed and rejected it.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:01 utc | 130

Posted by: fnord | Nov 19 2021 21:47 utc | 122
I wonder how many of KR’s staunch defenders would take any interest whatsoever in seeing this horrific, previously covered up for many decades, violent and wanton destruction of property and murders incident be investigated and tried.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre
Nobody was ever even charged except victims. Where was/is the outrage over the poor business owners who lost all they had up to and including, literally, some of their lives?
There’s no statute of limitations on murder, several of the perpetrators surely were still alive until very recently, yet nobody had any appetite for holding them accountable for the long-term, often irreversible damage done out of pure hatred by white people. Whoops, I guess knowing about this in the first place makes me “woke”….lol.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:03 utc | 131

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:01 utc | 129
What are you talking about? Like I said, I’m no longer discussing the trial. Therefore I’m not even remotely referring to the videos of the incident that were or weren’t seen by the jurors, prosecutors or defense.
I’m talking about KR’s documented propensity to use unnecessary violent force against people, including females and statements he made about shooting unarmed alleged looters/shoplifters.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:06 utc | 132

He was not mature enough, lacked sufficient training in most regards and in no fit mental state to be doing any of that is what I’m saying.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:57 utc | 126
lol, what a ridiculous statement
not mature enough to clean grafitti? what “fit mental state” does one need to be in to clean grafitti.
Some rather desperate clutching at straws, there TQ
And anyway you know nothing about his metal state.
It’s just something you have invented in your own head. You might want to examine your own mental state TQ
.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:06 utc | 133

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:01 utc | 129
Ah, OK you were referring to a different comment I made before I stopped talking about the trial. Regardless, everything I’ve seen backs up the assertions that he was seen at least pointed his weapon *in the direction of* people, including surely unarmed people, prior to the confrontation with Rosenbaum.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:08 utc | 134

What I do GAF about is that …..
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 21:53 utc | 124
you appear to be becoming very upset about this TQ
Perhaps you might want to consider whether or not you are actually in a fit mental state to discuss this like a rational adult at this point in time.
Perhaps take a break from the internet for a while. Overindulgence is clearly clouding your judgment.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:11 utc | 135

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:06 utc | 132
LOL, here you go again cherry picking elements of the events to suit your preconceived biases.
Nobody needs training to fucking clean graffiti, duh. Only an immoderate assclown would purport to try debunking my case based only on that.
Please take note of my qualifier “after dark” – which explicitly means that he didn’t have the necessary mental state or training to serve as an armed guard nor is there any evidence he had more than basic CPR training. Simply “offering” to lend medical support is meaningless in the big picture.
I’m going to stop responding to you now because you’re not willing to admit that only a violent, anti-social person would take advantage of an opportunity to beat up a young girl and that there’s audio of him stating he wished he had his AR with him at a previous incident so that he could shoot people who were most likely completely unarmed.
Hell, it’s also on the record that his family life was garbage. His dad was an alleged abusive alcoholic and illegal drug user and his single mom was struggling to make ends meet.
All you’ve proven here today is that you’re looking at this from a purely ideological perspective that blinds you to important contextual details about why what happened, happened. Good day, sir.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:14 utc | 136

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:11 utc | 134
As I predicted you couldn’t resist from the ad hominem. Big surprise.
Hey let’s both take a mental health quiz on the Internets and compare scores, lol.
Let’s see who’s fit to be having this “debate” and who isn’t. Otherwise I’m done with you because you’re projecting your own anger and embitterment onto me.
Here, I chose the pediatric version for you: https://screening.mhanational.org/screening-tools/youth/?ref

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:17 utc | 137

Post 109 is sheer lunacy.

Posted by: Figleaf23 | Nov 19 2021 22:17 utc | 138

agree completely: Americans love their certainties (“not guilty means not guilty!” no it doesn’t——read Oedipus Tyrannos) and they love them more and more as the whole place slips into a miasma of decline, irrelevance and civil collapse. Hurry up and get on with it rednecks, those AR-15s don’t shoot themselves!
Posted by: Patroklos | Nov 19 2021 21:34 utc | 114
This characterizes exactly the mindset of “LOL” with whom I’ve been having what might be loosely described as a debate. He/she/it is certain on literally every aspect of this case despite countervailing evidence, and when he/she/it cannot refute said evidence, or refuses to accept it falls back on “certainty” in the form of only the evidence allowed at the trial and the trial’s verdict and projection of anger.
KR is on video brutally beating a young woman and this person shamefully attempts to minimize and deflect from that salient fact.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:22 utc | 139

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:03 utc | 130
TQ, you appear to now be reduced to throwing everything, including the kitchen sink into this truth-stretching-beyond-breaking-point argument you have conjured up in your head.
It’s almost impossible to take you seriously at this point…
I’m really beginning to have some very worrying doubts about the fitness of your mental state for this conversation right now.
This plainly righteous legal verdict seems to have caused you to go off the rails a little.
perhaps take a break?

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:23 utc | 140

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 22:23 utc | 139
LOL (not your “handle” but literally me LingOL) @ this pathetic attempt to deflect and defame.
My response was to fnord, not you. Speaking of “taking a break” maybe you should consider taking a break from butting into conversations you’re not a part of….Oh, and when you get the results of your mental health quiz, feel free to share them and I’ll share mine, lol.
Until then, good day. I’ll be “taking a break” from engaging an obvious troll.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:26 utc | 141

Tom Collins
Rittenhouse started to raise his weapon when one of the guys in Rosenbaum’s party reached for his pistol. That same person was the first to fire a shot, and firing that shot led directly to Rosenbaum getting killed. The defense wanted the initial shooter to be part of Rittenhouse’s defense, but he opted out on 5th Amendment grounds, as his testimony would have incriminated himself.
The FBI purposely released low resolution edited video, because the high resolution unedited video shows the real story.

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 22:29 utc | 142

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 22:29 utc | 141
Correct. And if LOL would calm down and take a few deep breaths, he/she/it would realize that I’m not disputing that part of the case.
What I am saying is that – whether deemed admissible or not by the court – there were eyewitness statements that KR had been seen with his gun pointed toward people and not just slung on his back. I will attempt to track this information down, but it’s not easy given that the search results today are HEAVILY centered on the verdict.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:34 utc | 143

The butt-hurt fake progressives/ antifa partisans here demonstrate a consistent pattern of intellectual dishonesty, as they chant the same fallacies irrespective how often amd thoroughly their points are disposed of. For them, this is a propaganda exercise, with the law and the clear facts treated as inconveniences.

Posted by: Figleaf23 | Nov 19 2021 22:34 utc | 144

@ Posted by: Figleaf23 | Nov 19 2021 22:34 utc | 143
So, the conservatives/alt-rightists/far-rightists/Trumpists believe in the American system now?
Where did the Deep State go? Disappeared?

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 22:40 utc | 145

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 22:29 utc | 141
Can’t believe I found it. This was what I was referring to.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/08/31/witnesses-kenosha-shooting-see-kyle-rittenhouse-shoot-protest-jacob-blake/5675987002/

Jeremiah had received a text from a friend saying a bunch of protesters had their tires slashed. He wanted to get to his car before vandals did. He decided the quickest path was to cut through a parking lot.
As he made his way toward it, Jeremiah saw more armed white men. Two crouched on the roof of a building, sniper style. Two or three others stood guard over the lot. One of them, a babyface with a backward ball cap, raised an assault rifle and pointed it at him.
Jeremiah, 24 and Black, was more annoyed than afraid. He’d been out protesting all summer, more than 90 days so far. He knew about these guys and their scare tactics, and he refused to be intimidated.
When the kid started yelling, Jeremiah shouted back: “I’m trying to get out of here. If you’re gonna shoot me, just shoot!”
A few minutes later, Jeremiah saw the same guy pointing his weapon at someone else.
This time, Kyle Rittenhouse fired.

I have no idea whether this was introduced as evidence at the trial, but there you go. There is at least one eyewitness account of KR having been seen pointing his weapon at someone prior to the Rosenbaum encounter.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:42 utc | 146

@Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 20:47 utc | 78
My error, they were all minority owned serving the minority (including Black) community. That doesn’t change my point about the propaganda framing by the MSM, I was showing that a completely opposite framing may be closer to the truth of the situation. Let’s remember that there had been two nights of looting and arson prior to the night that Rittenhouse decided to act (again not condoning his action to go out with an AR-15, but that does not stop me understanding his actions).

Posted by: Roger | Nov 19 2021 22:42 utc | 147

Only in the USA can a juvenile vigilante armed with an automatic rifle show up at a protest to “protect” private property and get into a shootout ‘defending’ himself against other gun-toting thugs. This could never happen in Europe or in Canada where civilians walking around in public armed to the teeth just isn’t a thing.
So non-Americans chiming in with innocent or guilty as if this happened in their own country is absurd. They’d have to be familiar with American laws and pretend to understand the sensibilities of a legal system that is alien to the judicial values of their own country.
But I guess with American media dominating the internet we are all Americans now. It’s a charade folks.

Posted by: Antibody | Nov 19 2021 22:42 utc | 148

Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 22:40 utc | 144
It’s a psychosis and it ties back to my initial comment in this thread on the “rule of law” vs. “rules based order.”
Americans seem very prone to switching back and forth between the two as it suits their particular agendas. The “rule of law” has been contorted or corrupted too many times to count within the American justice system, but one side or the other will always glom onto it when an outcome matches their pre-conceived biases.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:45 utc | 149

So, basically, an instance of Lumpen idiots killing other Lumpen idiots? I suppose Marxists would consider this a win-win.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Nov 19 2021 22:47 utc | 150

@Posted by: Antibody | Nov 19 2021 22:42 utc | 147
Absolutely, not in China, Russia or Asia either. It was a riot, the actual protests were happening somewhere else. Looting and arson are not protesting, especially when done by violent criminals such as the skateboard guy, the guy who head kicked Rittenhouse, and the pedophile who pointed his hand gun directly at Rittenhouse and got shot in the arm (he admitted this on the stand). The first guy was bi-polar and depressed, so could’ve been very much a sad tragedy on both sides.
The US is a shit-show, and the elites are so divorced from the reality of everyday life that they don’t understand that they cannot separate themselves from the collapse caused by their extractive rentier capitalism and divide and conquer methods to stay in power.

Posted by: Roger | Nov 19 2021 22:52 utc | 151

@Posted by: Clueless Joe | Nov 19 2021 22:47 utc | 149
You are certainly clueless about Marx. Marxists like to destroy the capitalist elite, not the lumpen proletariat. Perhaps you mean Western “progressives”, economically neoliberal and culturally post-modern, and most definitely not leftists.

Posted by: Roger | Nov 19 2021 22:56 utc | 152

You are spot on ‘b’.
The young man was trying to protect private property from a looting mob, the local and state law enforcements were cowardly absent, failed to deal with the rioters, it was in self-defence he killed, the verdict cannot be faulted, the left leaning fruitcakes should learn from it, but it’s unlikely they will..

Posted by: Baron | Nov 19 2021 22:58 utc | 153

Can’t believe I found it. This was what I was referring to.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 22:42 utc | 145
If “Jeremiah’s” story were at all credible the prosecution who, remember, were reduced, klke TQ earlier, to throwing in even the kitchen sink into their case (when they were waving around the miraculous last minute magic pixel hocus pocus out of focus video ” evidence”,) would surely have introduced it in evidence and surely produced “Jerimiah” as a witness
but they never did.
obviously there was something about J or his story which didn’t add up or which the prosecution did not want revealed in court.
probably thought he was lying and would be easily revealed as a liar by the defence and if would look bad for their case

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:02 utc | 154

TQ, your dubious claim of KR pointing weapons all night long at people turns out to br based solely on a dubious news story with a dubious source and not on any video “evidence” or actual real testimony, as you earlier claimed.
that was exactly what I ment by “stretching triuth beyond breaking point”
in other words it could be said you are “pulling a Binger” right now, with that dubious claim of yours

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:07 utc | 155

Tom Q Collins @145
I don’t recall “Jeremiah” being called to the stand by prosecution?
In any event Jeremiah’s story doesn’t sync with the grainy FBI video.
Who knows, maybe USA Today is telling the truth, but since the media fabricates so much misinformation in this case, I think it safe to assume this is more fabrication.

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:09 utc | 156

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:02 utc | 153
Since you were somewhat coherent and on topic this time I’ll reply.
You’re just speculating. Have you read the entirety of what was and wasn’t entered into evidence and why?
As I’ve mentioned a couple of times, 1) the prosecution was clearly incompetent and 2) the judge was biased based on refusing to allow other information into evidence – who’s to say that this testimony wasn’t another example, or that it wasn’t possible to track down this “Jeremiah” either because of lack of leads or incompetent prosecution?
Neither of us have any idea. But here you have documented eyewitness statements that KR (and the other “snipers” on the roof) was training his weapon on someone before Rosenbaum came after him.
Why would “J” have lied to a USA Today reporter? In fact I’m pretty sure I found *other* instances of KR pointing his gun prior to the Rosenbaum shooting as well as that same USA Today article talking about how others in Rittenhouse’s group were seen doing the same.
Hey since you’re such an expert on this case and on the rioting and looting and arson, maybe you could shed some light on why the counter protestors (or self-professed armed guards) were slashing the tires of alleged arsonists and looters thereby forcing them to stay within the area rather than leaving – or by having one’s tires slashed, maybe pissing someone off enough to start engaging in rioting/looting/arson where previously they hadn’t. Also what are your thoughts on the recordings in which the armed vigilantes were told by police that – rather than the common incorrect allegation around here that they merely stood by without acting – aggressively pushing the alleged rioters/looters/arsonists toward the area where the armed self-professed protectors were camped out and who most likely were the “vandals” slashing tires of protestors. I’m genuinely curious as to whether you have a take on that.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:10 utc | 157

Posted by: Prof | Nov 19 2021 18:55 utc | 6
B misses the forest for the trees. <=so B, raised the truth from the ground? Posted by: Razer Ray | Nov 19 2021 19:27 utc | 17 He had zero business being there BRANDISHING a weapon to allegedly 'defend' property that wasn't his. It DOESN'T MATTER if the victims were pink or purple. White Supremacists are referring to this piece of human scum as "Saint Kyle". I hope he never feels safe in public ever again and dies young from his fears along with those Proud Boys he was partying with a few months ago. <= I believe Rittenhouse had more right to be in that place than those he was forced to defend himself against. Rittenhouse was defending the town.. his employer's property, his culture, his sense of morality, the American way, and he risked his life to do it. By the way that's what a Jury of your peers are for.. to override those who think the law someone in Washington wrote, is to be applied against local reason and local context.. Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 19 2021 19:30 utc | 20 Re: Prof @6 You are delusional. I mean that in the true sense of the word which is that your perception of the real world is perversely inaccurate. Our host didn't render the verdict in this case. That verdict was handed in by a jury of Americans who deliberated the issue in detail. The shot people were violent attackers and Rittenhouse was their intended victim. This is the real world and you are not in touch with it. You should try to fix that flaw in your head. <= agree B has been right on ..The verdict shows the great difference between American culture of justice and USA Globalized system which does not often deliver justice. 527 elected hired hands run the USA and make its laws, but the anti federalist forced into the constitution the Bill of Rights in 1788 to protect people for the accusations of the state. The 6th amendment says: "In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him,; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense." Posted by: vetinLA | Nov 19 2021 19:31 utc | 21 Should be interesting to see how many nutbags show up at future social protests "locked and loaded"... Seems " sheer stupidity" runs deep on both sides of this issue.. <=yes it was unreasonable to indite this kid..ie first place.. the prosecution needed to have looked more closely at the videos. I wonder if the Prosecutor grew up in this town? Posted by: fnord | Nov 19 2021 19:42 utc | 30 This is a victory for those who want to defend a sick society and the bourgeois institution of property on which it is based. I think you just saw the difference between the USA (and its laws ) and home town America and its right for its citizens to defend what they do only to a jury of their peers. I think the outcome in Rittenhouse is is a victory for home town America; it says its citizens can defend their cities, their properties and their lives against unwanted outsiders. .. and those who want to use the law and force of the USA to enforce outcomes, or to impose social programs, that serve unAmerican purposes. I wonder what a jury would say about the USA vaccine mandate.. ?? Posted by: vk | Nov 19 2021 21:06 utc | 94 re: Post of Lawrence Miller | Nov 19 2021 20:56 utc | 84 But the trial, while it was happening, was for murder. You can't have a trial for innocence in modern Law, as it is presumed. Unless you think the jury transcends space-time, there's no way around that. <=Yes, the 6th amendment in the USA constitution does exactly that, I think, IAMAL, It denies USA authorities application of their law to cases which in the opinion of the jury present in a context which the Jury believes is justified. See Jury Nullification by Conrad..

Posted by: snake | Nov 19 2021 23:14 utc | 158

I love the barfight! Here is a great Three Dog Night song about Jeremiah the Bullfrog. Joy to Tom Q @ 156!
Joy to the World

Posted by: lex talionis | Nov 19 2021 23:18 utc | 159

You’re just speculating. Have you read the entirety of what was and wasn’t entered into evidence and why
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:10 utc | 156
I’m not speculating that he was never called to court TQ
a genuinely objective person, not you obviously, would ask why
and unlike you I watched the whole trial, so in fact am sure there was no evidence from J in court written or oral
perhaps you should speak less about something you clearly know little about

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:20 utc | 160

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:09 utc | 155
Same answer as to LOL, but adding that I can’t think of a motive of the USA Today reporter or this Jeremiah to simply make that up.
This person attempted to debunk Jeremiah’s account but at the end concluded that it wasn’t possible based on the (voluminous) evidence that he compiled.
It’s a relatively long read:
https://orcanut1.medium.com/refuting-jeremiahs-witness-story-of-kyle-rittenhouse-8bf82a9f0327

Conclusion
Jeremiah claims that Rittenhouse threatened him at the mechanic shop — though details of the story don’t match what actually happened, we can’t conclusively prove whether or not Rittenhouse pointed his gun at Jeremiah. Jeremiah also claims that he was “near the back of the pack chasing Rittenhouse”, but does not appear in any of the videos surrounding the shootings. Ultimately, we still need more evidence.

I’m definitely interested in getting to the truth here, so I’ll do some research on the evidentiary hearings of the trial if I can find them. It is curious to me as well why Jeremiah and others didn’t appear to testify.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:20 utc | 161

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:20 utc | 159
Could you please try a little harder to maintain focus on the train of thought?
Since you’re the expert on who and what was and wasn’t introduced as evidence, the question has become WHY Jeremiah’s eyewitness statements or testimony weren’t introduced. THAT is where you – as someone who should know better given your claimed expert knowledge of the trial – are speculating.
Again, unless there’s something you haven’t yet disclosed, you have only assumptions as to why Jeremiah wasn’t part of the evidence.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:23 utc | 162

Biden differs little from the idiots that wanted Rittenhouse railroaded. Biden tweeted:
“While the verdict in Kenosha will leave many Americans feeling angry and concerned, myself included, we must acknowledge that the jury has spoken.”
I guess he didn’t watch the decisive video. The story would be very different if the video displayed an act similar to the one exposed by Chelsea Manning. There’s absolutely no grounds for anyone to be “concerned” as justice was properly done for a change.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 19 2021 23:23 utc | 163

“Same answer as to LOL, but adding that I can’t think of a motive of the USA Today reporter or this Jeremiah to simply make that up”
Any motive? The media is full of misrepresentations and outright lies concerning this case. I’d say the same motive applies to the USA Today fabrication as it does to all the other media fabrications that came before it.

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:26 utc | 164

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:26 utc | 163
of course it does, but for some reason TQ Binger just couldn’t think of that at the time….. cos we have seen the msm has been so honest about this case and not made up so much as one little statement about any if it
lol
all Mr TQ Binger has is “Jeremiah” and his dubious story and by golly, just like Binger himself, he’s gonna flog it to death and beyond

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:31 utc | 165

162 Cont’d–
Should’ve added that my prediction @2 was most certainly correct.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 19 2021 23:31 utc | 166

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:26 utc | 163
Nah, not at that level or at that time. Keep in mind that interview was right after the events, not later when the lies and misrepresentations and ‘political’ elements started to emerge. At that point in time everyone was still processing it and trying to piece together the chronology. That’s not how the corporate MSM tells lies.
Here’s my current theory as to why this Jeremiah (or others) didn’t testify nor have their statements entered into evidence. The state/prosecution wasn’t trying to prove that Rittenhouse had previously pointed his gun at anyone else. It was a very specific case based on the shootings that actually happened (which again I think is (intentional?) prosecutorial mediocrity). They never bothered to look for this guy or have him (or others) testify because in their minds it was immaterial to the case they were building.
As to the “intentional?” aside, the hyper-cynical take on this whole trial could be that the state/prosecution didn’t really want to convict him on anything so they did a terrible or neglectful job of making their case and digging for evidence that might help them do so. It wouldn’t be the first time it’s happened in the USA. Not by a long shot.
Because I’m a genuine actor not swayed by any ideology on this matter (other than my belief that the police are way too militarized and that there are way too many guns in the USA) I’m open to any explanation that LOL can come up with for why Jeremiah or other testimony that KR had pointed his gun at people prior to Rosenbaum was never introduced at trial.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:34 utc | 167

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:31 utc | 164
LOL (again not in reference to your handle)….OK, if you say so. But as the self-professed expert on this trial and someone who claims to have followed it from the very beginning and seen every day of testimony, at this point you don’t have anything productive to add to the discussion on Jeremiah until you can produce information as to why his (or that type of corroborating) testimony wasn’t used in the trial at all.
P.S. what is “Binger” – someone who binges on booze or something? You must not be American.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:37 utc | 168

Nah, not at that level or at that time.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:34 utc | 166
you’re speculating again Mr Binger, presenting speculation as fact as usual

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:38 utc | 169

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:38 utc | 168
Sorry that’s not how the burden of proof works. I cited an interview conducted almost immediately after the shooting before the politicians and media could sink their hooks into it. I also provided a pretty detailed attempt to debunk Jeremiah’s claims or his presence there at the time, which couldn’t conclusively do so. In fact that person was able to determine Jeremiah’s full identity. You should read it.
In the mean time, until you can explain – based on your self-proclaimed expertise on the case – why the prosecution didn’t introduce Jeremiah or other testimony about KR pointing his gun (I took a stab at it just above), this conversation is effectively over again. There’s literally nothing left to do in the absence of a logical and truthful explanation other than throw around childish insults like “Binger” (why always capitalized?) or fuckmuppet, which I have so far proceeded to do.
Can this conversation carry on in a civil fashion with actual information or not? That part is a YES or NO answer.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:42 utc | 170

what is “Binger” – someone who binges on booze or something? You must not be American.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:37 utc | 167
lol its impossible to take you seriously. If you knew anything about this case you’d know exactly who Binger is
but anyway, here’s an alt definition which I found amusing. Its not the reason I called you Binger but its hilariously apt, given your ignorance of something about which you have written so many pointless words.
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php%3fterm=Binger&amp=true

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:43 utc | 171

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:42 utc | 169
So far have NOT proceeded to do….carry on….

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:44 utc | 172

Posted by: LOL | Nov 19 2021 23:43 utc | 170
You said TQ Binger, only someone with as much time on their hands to follow every detail of the trial (and read every MSM spin story) would have immediately thought that was a reference to the DA.
But touche…my bad, silly me. Nice Urban Dictionary find too.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:46 utc | 173

@Tom Collins 167
“Because I’m a genuine actor not swayed by any ideology on this matter (other than my belief that the police are way too militarized and that there are way too many guns in the USA) I’m open to any explanation that LOL can come up with for why Jeremiah or other testimony that KR had pointed his gun at people prior to Rosenbaum was never introduced at trial.”
Because it never happened.
If we are just going to wildly speculate…maybe the rioters, looters and arsonists are unwitting tools for the Neocons, funded and organized by corporate interests to cause chaos so the oligarchs can finish looting what little of value is left in the USA.
I followed this event from the beginning. The media obfuscation started immediately and never relented.

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:50 utc | 174

I don’t have horse in this race, but I am very very happy young lad walked away free.
And it is not because I like his character, am impressed with his nerve in battle and trigger discipline and the fact he got rid of some pedophile rapist scum.
It is because, the real point of this spectacle is, that common folk got out on the streets armed to fix the mess usurper government created for its own people. It is the biggest fear of the government. It is why the gov and its controlled media HAD TO crucify young lad.

Posted by: Abe | Nov 19 2021 23:52 utc | 175

Its not the reason I called you Binger but its hilariously apt, given your ignorance of something about which you have written so many pointless words.
So many pointless words that you’ve been completely unable to address and a few simple questions that your expertise bizarrely can’t seem to answer.
Why wasn’t testimony about KR pointing his gun at people prior to Rosenbaum presented at the trial?
Come on, you’re the expert, that should be an easy one for you. I want informational evidence, not more speculation. I’ve at least demonstrated that witnesses to that effect did exist.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:52 utc | 176

Posted by: Haassaan | Nov 19 2021 23:50 utc | 173
But it DID happen without a doubt. A guy named Jeremiah DID provide an interview to a news reporter immediately thereafter and someone DID succeed in identifying Jeremiah’s full identity. That is not in doubt. It’s in the article I posted above and again here: https://orcanut1.medium.com/refuting-jeremiahs-witness-story-of-kyle-rittenhouse-8bf82a9f0327
Once I know WHY this wasn’t part of the trial, I’ll have nothing more to say on it. So far nobody has provided anything except speculation, including those who claim to have followed every part of the trial.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:55 utc | 177

@nook #15
Communist agitators? ROTFL
Did you check IDs?

Posted by: fnord | Nov 20 2021 0:00 utc | 178

It appears that the third attacker on Kyle, the drop kick to head guy was black. Kyle’s bullet or bullets went through his vest (nice souvenir regarding black-crime-pays-no). But just imagine for a moment that this black attacker ended up hit. Would this slight of hand of turning white-on-white into white supremacist/racist be any easier?
In the general scheme of things this outcome is mostly symbolic. Also, it is not a win for justice by any stretch. As long as the “liberal left” that is DNC, Soros (who paid the rioters) and assorted globalists retain their escalation dominance, any perceived loss of theirs will lead to much worse atrocities and eventually, possibly to civil war.
This was just a skirmish.

Posted by: Kiza | Nov 20 2021 0:02 utc | 179

C1ue and gruff,
Enjoy your shit hole country as it descends into civil war. You deserve it. A country of violent assholes deserves to die.
Your analytical problem is that you can’t root any of this in historical and political economic trajectory.
American capitalism entered structural crisis after the 1973 recession, itself a product of the secular decline in the rate of profit, precisely as Marx wrote.
Neoliberalism and neoconservativism tried to exit the crisis through class warfare, financialization, globalization and militarization via the war on terror, and look where it’s got your shitty country: fascism, social decay, racism, guns, opioids, forest fires and a million covid deaths. You all suck and are a stain on humanity. Go to bed in your brown Carhartts and please don’t wake up.

Posted by: Prof | Nov 20 2021 0:03 utc | 180

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 19 2021 23:10 utc | 156
having read that 156 again I really doubt TQ is genuinely in a fit mental state, as a result of this very predictable, to anyone that took the time to inform themselves beforehand, righteous jury determination.
His inability to accept the jury’s predictale determination of fact and predictable adjudication of KRs innocence speaks volumes.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 0:10 utc | 181

DG @123: “A gunman is always a threat … because… if they try to disarm the gunman they will be shot and the gunman will claim self defense.”
Here’s a novel concept for you woke-tards: Why not just leave the “gunman” alone? Isn’t that an option for you morons? What do you imagine would have happened to the psycho pedo dwarf if he had gone home and watched an episode of “Game of Thrones” instead of challenging a kid to “Shoot me, nigga!”?
You idiots always start with the assumption that participants in the events like the psycho pedo dwarf or his FBI handler Joshua Ziminski had no options to behave other than they did and that the only one who could control the outcome was their victim, Rittenhouse. That is stupid. That is profoundly stupid.
Here is the reality that you woke-tards insist upon overlooking: Nobody was shot until they attacked the Rittenhouse kid. Where was the option for them to just not attack Rittenhouse? Why do you woke-tards excuse those attacks?
There is no excuse for those attacks by the criminals upon Rittenhouse, and you idiot woke-tards know it. You woke-tards are the ones with violence and hate in your souls, but your psyche is too scrambled for you to confront your own psychosis.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:17 utc | 182

@fnord #30
Why do you use a moniker that is already in use? We already have a fnord here, but apparently you can’t see the fnord.

Posted by: fnord | Nov 20 2021 0:18 utc | 183

vk @127: “Derp! My stupidity is just due to bad translation!”
You’re lying vk, and you know it. What’s worse is that everyone else in this thread knows it too. Please just stop.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:23 utc | 184

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:17 utc | 181

Here’s a novel concept for you woke-tards: Why not just leave the “gunman” alone?

Because humans cannot read minds. You have to assume the shooter wants to kill you, for all intents and purposes.

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 0:24 utc | 185

@fnord #37
Can you see the fnords? There’s too many here, literally and figuratively.

Posted by: fnord | Nov 20 2021 0:24 utc | 186

Another thing that will be interesting to follow from now on is Rittenhouse’s attitude in social media and public relations.
I wouldn’t be surprised if, by now, his lawyer and everybody in that court (behind the scenes) has already warned him to disappear from the internet and any public event that even resembles a right-wing activist movement. For his own good, I think even the judge himself has already suggested for him to live the rest of his life in a low profile.
That would be a significant blow to the ones who want him to “receive a medal” or become a far-right-wing sex icon.

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 0:29 utc | 187

@Jen #51
“All criminal trials in the US and other English-speaking countries involve the use of juries…”
Are you sure about that? Perhaps you should reevaluate your audacious claim.

Posted by: fnord | Nov 20 2021 0:36 utc | 188

@ Prof 179
You sound angry and bitter.
America is still the number one power globally.
Yes, it’s lost its luster.
Yes, it’s going downhill.
Nobody here in the bar will dispute that.
However, this trial was an example of the vestigial justice system in the US
Breaching the water for another breath.
If you hate the way America is now, bravo.
You’ll find lots of agreement here.
But this trial was an acid test of the modern US justice system
And shit tons of people are totally stoked that Kyle is exonerated.
Most people, I would say.
The people upset about this verdict are in the minority, IMO

Posted by: Cadence calls | Nov 20 2021 0:51 utc | 189

vk @184
Again, your understanding of the facts is wrong. You, vk, are ignorant of the facts, or you are deliberately misrepresenting them, troll-style.
But yeah, I get it. You’re just trolling for fun because your anus hurts.
“You have to assume the shooter wants to kill you…”
Unless you are talking about the psycho pedo dwarf’s FBI handler Ziminski, there was no shooter before the pshyco pedo dwarf committed suicide by juvenile.
Which “shooter” are you talking about, butt hurt vk? Other then the rioters themselves there were no shooters before Rittenhouse was forced to defend himself.
Here is why your understanding of the situation is so warped, vk: You think that Rittenhouse simply having a weapon on his person was in and of itself an attack on the psycho pedo dwarf. That is very “woke” of you, and by woke I mean brainwashed.
Why don’t you clarify for us which kinds of weapons, in your warped imagination, justify an attack on the person holding the weapon? Clearly you think a rifle counts, but how about a rocket launcher? How about an S400 missile system? How about a big scary sword? Fists can be deadly weapons too so how about a guy with big huge biceps? Are people justified in attacking some guy walking down the street because he has huge muscles and can kill someone with a single punch?
Either you are genuinely stupid or… well, I don’t think you are just pretending to be stupid. None of these weapons justify anyone attacking the person possessing the weapon.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:59 utc | 190

far-right-wing sex icon.
Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 0:29 utc | 186
lol
ahh, poor vk’s now jealous that KR will be getting laid a lot more than vk ever did.

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:07 utc | 191

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:59 utc | 189
By its intended design.
And handgun can be a weapon of self defense. It is portable, can be carried without problems on your belt and can be quickly drawn against the enemy.
An assault gun is a cumbersome piece of metal that is hanged around your neck and requires both of your hands to effectively operate. A person with an AR-15 cannot use his hands for self defense, the only escalation possible is to aim and press the trigger in order to shoot.
That’s the problem with the AR-15: it puts you in a position where no degrees of escalation is possible – either nothing happens, or everything happens, there’s no in-between. It eliminates that essential, middle ground level of violence, the proverbial “football hooligans fight”/”bar fight”, that is so essential to male socialization (and survival).

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 1:13 utc | 192

A surprisingly poor take and reaction to the outcome. 2 dead and 1 wounded by an adolescent vigilante. Perhaps the verdict was proper given the judges very tight and limited perimeters of presentation. But the law that allows self defense, in this case, is wrong.

Posted by: yancey | Nov 20 2021 1:16 utc | 193

vk @191
Which “shooter” were you talking about, vk? I asked a question and you dodged it with nonsense. Answer the question.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 1:19 utc | 194

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 1:13 utc | 191
as Gruff already pointed out quite clearly, no degree of escalation would ever have been required that night had the criminal degenerates not attacked him.
Responsibility for that escalation rest solely with the attacking criminal degenerates, as the jury indicated quite definitively when they accepted his actions as selfdefence, by adjudicating the defendant “not guilty”..

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:20 utc | 195

One question to the people who were wasting their lives following the trial: were the jury members all Kenosha residents or were they from all regions of Wisconsin?
Because, if they were all from Kenosha (or region of Kenosha) then undoubtedly peer pressure played a part: they would go back to their lives and have to look to the eye of their middle class/petty bourgeois friends and neighbors and tell them they condemned the kid. Collateral effect of living in a small town.
It’s like I said: fifth quarter justice. It happens a lot in small towns.
–//–
@ Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:20 utc | 194, @ Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 1:19 utc | 193
Neither of you are talking anything that makes sense. I literally didn’t understand your points.

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 1:29 utc | 196

I literally didn’t understand your points.
Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 1:29 utc | 195
I doubt that surprises anyone here who has read any of your comments tonight. Comprehension clearly ain’t your strong point

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:35 utc | 197

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 20 2021 0:17 utc | 181
“Here’s a novel concept for you woke-tards: Why not just leave the “gunman” alone?”
Because humans cannot read minds. You have to assume the shooter wants to kill you, for all intents and purposes.
Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 0:24 utc | 184
that would be a very stupid assumption particularly considering that in this case their decision to act on that same assumption is actually what caused the weapon holder to shoot them….

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:39 utc | 198

Fnord @ 187:
I hope I am speaking to the original Fnord and not to any pretenders. I have checked some websites and yes you are right, I did overreach in saying that all legal jurisdictions in the Anglosphere require juries in criminal trials, although for a criminal trial to be heard without a jury, the case that is to be tried has to meet certain criteria and the legal teams have to make an application for such a trial to go ahead.
I also overreached in assuming that all criminal trials had to involve a unanimous jury verdict (thx Bevin for picking that up) but again some jurisdictions do not allow more than a maximum number of dissenting jurors (two in England and Wales accdg to Wikipedia) and other conditions on jury decisions may be set as well to allow non-unanimous decisions. Where I live (NSW in Australia), the rule is still unanimous jury decisions but other states permit non-unanimous jury decisions.
I understand that the US Supreme Court made a ruling last year that jury decisions in US Federal criminal trials must be unanimous. I wonder how this will affect Julian Assange if the worst comes to the worst and he is extradited to the US and put on trial in a closed court.

Posted by: Jen | Nov 20 2021 1:44 utc | 199

Posted by: vk | Nov 20 2021 0:24 utc | 184
it turned out to be a particulalry stupid assumption considering the weapon carrier had not shot anyone all night long while legally openly displaying the weapon.
That the idiot criminals decided to think like you and make an ass of themselevs by assuming, is what got them shot in the first place

Posted by: LOL | Nov 20 2021 1:44 utc | 200

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