Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
September 25, 2021

The Release Of Meng Wanzhou's Is A Small But Decisive Victory For China

The U.S. has given in to the Chinese demand to end its hostage holding of Huawei CFO Meng Wanzhou:

A plane believed to be carrying Chinese tech executive Meng Wanzhou took off from the Vancouver airport on Friday, marking a new stage in a legal saga that ensnared Canada — and two of its citizens — in a dispute between the U.S. and Chinese governments.

A B.C. court decided on Friday that the extradition case against Meng would be dropped after the Huawei chief financial officer reached a deferred prosecution agreement with the U.S. government.

Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig, the two Canadian citizens who were detained in China just days after Meng's arrest in Vancouver, are now on their way back Canada, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau confirmed on Friday evening.

The U.S. had accused Meng Wanzhou of misleading the opium dealer bank HSBC about Huawei's relation with a local entity in Iran. This, the U.S. claimed, had led to breach by HSBC of its unilateral sanctions against Iran.

This was a constructed crime with the only evidence being some wording on one page of a longer power point slideshow which Meng Wanzhou surely had not edited herself.

The deferred prosecution agreement seems to admit that:

As part of her arrangement with U.S. prosecutors, Meng pleaded not guilty in a court Friday to multiple fraud charges.

The Huawei chief financial officer entered the plea during a virtual appearance in a New York courtroom. She was charged with bank fraud, wire fraud and conspiracies to commit bank and wire fraud more than two and a half years ago.
...
The agreed statement of facts from Friday's U.S. court appearance said that Meng told a global financial institution that a company operating in Iran in violation of U.S. sanctions was a "local partner" of Huawei when in fact it was a subsidiary of Huawei.

The deferred prosecution agreement does not included any admission of wrongdoing, just an agreement on the facts.

The whole case was constructed and the arrest arranged by John Bolton when he was National Security Advisor under then President Donald Trump:

The Trudeau adviser said Mr. Bolton and other like-minded officials in the U.S. government were well aware of the significance of the arrest they were asking Canada to make. The adviser and a senior national-security official say they are convinced the U.S. picked Canada to arrest Ms. Meng – and did so in a last-minute rush – because they believed the Justice Department and the RCMP would honour the extradition request.

Trump then used Meng Wanzhou as bargaining chip in his trade fight with China:

Trump has linked resolution of the U.S. government’s dealings with Huawei to a potential trade agreement with China. He has said he would consider Huawei’s role in a trade deal at the final stage of negotiations, the court application says.
...
“Prejudice to the fairness of these proceedings is made out by the president’s repeated assertions that (Meng’s) liberty is effectively a bargaining chip in what he sees as the biggest trade deal ever.”

The case gave Canada a lot of headache as China had arrested two of its spies just days after Canada had followed the U.S. request to arrest Meng Wanzhou. Canada has denied that Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig were spying for its services. However, Canada's main spy agency, the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, welcomed the release of its boys:


bigger

During a July visit to China U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Wendy Sherman had been given two lists of issues that China demanded to be solved before it was willing to cooperate further with the U.S.:

In the List of U.S. Wrongdoings that Must Stop, China urged the United States to unconditionally revoke the visa restrictions over Communist Party of China (CPC) members and their families, revoke sanctions on Chinese leaders, officials and government agencies, and remove visa restrictions on Chinese students.

China also urged the United States to stop suppressing Chinese enterprises, stop harassing Chinese students, stop suppressing the Confucius Institutes, revoke the registration of Chinese media outlets as "foreign agents" or "foreign missions", and revoke the extradition request for Meng Wanzhou.

China sees the end of the Meng Wanzhou issue as a victory:

The high-profile case of Meng, which has become a political dilemma significantly affecting the global geopolitical landscape, has been settled through both legal channels and political wrestling, experts said, noting that China, the US and Canada have seen the best scenario with much compromise made by the Biden administration in resolving the matter. It also helped pave the way for the positive interaction between the world's largest economies in the near future amid strained China-US relations.

It was also one mistake of the US administration that has been corrected in line with the request of China, as China put forward two lists to the US during the bilateral talks in Tianjin in July, including the List of US Wrongdoings that Must Stop which urged the US to release Meng, showing that Beijing's US policies began taking effect and remaining mistakes of the US have to be corrected.

Commentator Pepe Escobar however, does not believe that the release of Meng Wanzhou will change much if anything:

Pepe Escobar @RealPepeEscobar - 11:49 UTC · Sep 25, 2021

MENG WANZHOU
- political kidnapping masked as criminal prosecution
- part of the demonization of Huawei
- near 3-year illegal detention
- fake charges
- “Justice” Dept. had to drop extradition request
- Hybrid War continues

While I agree that U.S. aggression against China will continue I do see this as a Chinese victory. China has disabled one of the weapons that U.S. had used against it. From now on no country will risk to follow a U.S. requests to arrest a Chinese citizen:

The swiftness of the apparent deal also stands as a warning to leaders in other countries that the Chinese government can be boldly transactional with foreign nationals, said Donald C. Clarke, a law professor specializing in China at George Washington University’s Law School.

“They’re not even making a pretense of a pretense that this was anything but a straight hostage situation,” he said of the two Canadians, who stood trial on spying charges. Mr. Spavor was sentenced last month to 11 years in prison, and Mr. Kovrig was waiting for a verdict in his case after trial in March.

“In a sense, China has strengthened its bargaining position in future negotiations like this,” Professor Clarke said. “They’re saying, if you give them what they want, they will deliver as agreed.”

The U.S. had, via Canada, taken Meng Wanzhou as a hostage. China replicated that by taking two Canadian citizens as hostages, thereby putting the pressure on the weaker power involved. It also stopped imports of Canadian canola and pork. No government will want to repeat the experience of the Canadian one.

It worked and the people of Chinese are happy with the result:

The sentiment of patriotism prevailed at the scene. After the short speech, Meng waved to the crowds holding Chinese flags to welcome her at the airport, with a big smile, while singing a song for the motherland together with people at the scene.

People were still singing after Meng rode the bus to undergo epidemic prevention inspection at the request of Chinese Customs.

Groups of people, who wore protective suits, held flowers and welcome banners as they waited on the parking apron at the airport, as Chinese port cities have adopted strict epidemic prevention measures against COVID-19. Local media reports said earlier that Meng was expected to follow the 14 plus 7 days of quarantine following her arrival.

So this is indeed a victory but in a minor battle and in a war that is likely to see much bigger ones.

Posted by b on September 25, 2021 at 17:04 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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Just listened to Lavrov's speech during the UN General Assembly, to conclude it he proposed the following hashtag:

#НашиПравилаУставООН
#UNCharterIsOurRules
#CharteONUEstNosLois
#CartaONUesNstrReglas
#ميثاق_الأمم_المتحدة_هو_قواعدنا
#联合国宪章是我们的主张

I'll be checking out the press conference after the speech, and after my lunch ;)

Posted by: Paco | Sep 26 2021 11:16 utc | 101

I'd like to see Meng Wanzhou sue HSBC for their misconduct in this case. If you look at the specifics of the case, at no time did Meng ask HSBC to route money through the US (thus violating sanctions), yet that is exactly what HSBC did, and they HSBC threw Meng under the bus for it.

To put it another way, this could happen to anyone. I hope Meng sues and wins.

Given the relationship between Huawei and the CPC, it would seem to me that seizure of HSBC, emplacement of a management team loyal to China, and execution of the previous management team by firing squad is more appropriate, and would be a deterrent to others thinking of similar actions.

Given US CIA/FBI activities in HK as part of this case, It also would seem the CPC did the right thing by tightening the screws there and forcing the rats to leave..

INDY

Posted by: George W Oprisko | Sep 26 2021 11:18 utc | 102

m 80

When the Chinese princess had been taken hostage on behalf of Washington I couldn't beliefe it. That's the kind of behaviour I would have expected from North Korea but not by the USA.

LOL
They dont call FUS world's no 1 rogue state for nuthin.
Such thuggish tactics is what I'd expect from the FUS Commander In Chief Ciminal In Chief .

Exhibit A
Read the murikkan trap by ex Alstom
exe.

Posted by: denk | Sep 26 2021 13:14 utc | 103

Well I guess Amurka's long century of humiliation has begun. Could have strung it out longer, but nooooo, Trump had to play the big swinging dick and piss everybody off, force confrontation. No civilized behavior from him. Remember the chocolate cake at the first meeting with Xi, and the Tomahawks? Such hospitality. Crude as can be. Trump was way over his head. Then he lost the election (badly) to Joe Biden, anyway.

Now it is way too late. Meng returns to a heros welcome. Xi is going to be emperor as long as he wants. I hope Pompeo chokes on his next hotdog. Seeing the decadent descendants of slavers and racists humiliated, I can live with that.

Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 26 2021 13:32 utc | 104

Some people seem to forget how FUKUS [UK, US] started out as high sea pirates three centuries ago...and carry on that fine tradition into the 21C

Exhibit B
The case of Yinhe
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2016/12/china-seized-an-unmanned-us-navy-sub-that-was-possibly-legal.html?cid=6a00d8341c640e53ef01b7c8bedc44970b#comment-6a00d8341c640e53ef01b7c8bedc44970b

Posted by: denk | Sep 26 2021 13:52 utc | 105

@ Posted by: john | Sep 26 2021 10:47 utc | 98

Oh, did China invent corporate adoration? Are you really serious on this?

And isn't Julian Assange Australian? Why would the Chinese government fight for his release? Weren't you cool Westerners fed up with internationalism? Communism is an utopia and all that? I thought the fashionable ideology nowadays in the West was nationalism.

Posted by: vk | Sep 26 2021 14:06 utc | 106

@ denk

It is AUKUS now, F(rance) just got fucked.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 26 2021 14:06 utc | 107

dh, I totally agree with you that Canada’s British ties have prevented full annexation by the US. It may be disappointing, but Canada cannot exist as an independent, sovereign, totally free and solitary country. Those who want to live in that country should move to China, Or Russia. Or maybe the UK? Here, we have to exist within multilateral arrangements. One strategy I’ve noticed to protect the territory of Canada from conquest is to make it as difficult as possible to govern from one central location abroad. The First Nations achieving official self-governing status through UNDRIP, and Quebec’s special status (with our official two languages) definitely helps with that. I think this makes it an attractive country to live in, this multiple centres of power arrangement.

Posted by: Bruised Northerner | Sep 26 2021 14:33 utc | 108

This is obviously another black eye for the empire as our host very clearly illustrates. I realize it is a common theme of mine that others may tire of hearing, but do take note of the posters who are trying to blunt the damage and spin this as a win for the empire, or at least frame the issue in a positive way for the US. Most posters seem to be seeing this issue relatively clearly. Take psychohistorian @19: "It looks like that is not working out as planned.....how many back steps does it take to turn into a retreat?" and kiwiklown @95:

The reality is that each time they [the empire] step back from a nose to nose, their credibility as bully boy erodes, and with that, their power to enforce their will.

The opposite applies to those who pick the right fights, stand up to the bully, and force an US backdown, upon which their credibility rises. The latest examples being Iranian oil to Lebanon. And now the Meng Affair.

I quote this whole part because it is important in that it puts the empire fan bois' posts into the proper context.

We have the resident bunny trying to salvage some benefit for the empire by using this incident to create the illusion that there is some distance between "the Left", for which Biden is his example, and the establishment/deep state. Furthermore, that establishment/deep state is supposedly running some sort of psyop against the poor Bidens and Pelosis of the Swamp. The reader is then left to make the connection on their own that to oppose the establishment/deep state they should support the Democrats! Standard tactic that you will find in any New York Langley Times article with any potential political relevance whatsoever. Though this conclusion is built into the post, it is left unstated so that the less attentive reader will imagine it to be their own original thought. That's one way modern brainwashing is done: Make the implanted perspective one that the brainwashee imagines they thought up themselves.

The resident bunny then tries to slide false equivalency in through the back door by calling the obvious spooks that the Chinese arrested "hostages". Captured spooks are never "hostages". They are trade goods at best, and more typically vermin to be exterminated.

More defense of the faux left is then offered with "...perceived failures of the Biden..."

Biden's failure are thus not real, but only "perceived"! Clearly the resident bunny wants to implant the notion of that "perception" of failure by Biden (and thus the faux "Left" Democrats) is due to attacks on the Democrats by the establishment/deep state.

The resident bunny then concludes that everything is going according to the establishment/deep state plans. Included in that assertion is the suggestion that to counter the establishment/deep state plans one should root for the Democrats in America's political show.

Most importantly, though, is the resident bunny's effort to contain the bleeding of the empire's image of omnipotence and infallibility. It is an effort to counter what kiwiklown @95 observed and cast FUD on our host's analysis and what most other posters see as the significance of this event.

Our resident bunny. (ewetoob, 13s)

Just a slightly more clever version of Circe.

Posted by: William Gruff | Sep 26 2021 14:39 utc | 109

smith 107

FUKUS [UK, UK] are the ring leaders.
The F = fuck is mandatory.

IN Africa where UK, US, France are partners in crime screwing the Africans, FUKUS still applies, where F serve a dual role [fuck and France]

tHis latest armed gang in the pacific should read FUKUSA, a perfect caricature.
They'r trying to obfuscate with that awful AUKUS.

This FUS/France spat is prolly for show.
After BIden's sweet talk with Macron, French ambassador is back to FUS ,WHILE FRENCH MP ARE HEADING TO......
TW !!!
Did sleeping sly joe
green light the French to sell those subs to TW as compensation?
iF SO, we might see an EURO/SINO blow up instead of A NATO breakup !
U cant be too cynical when it comes to this FUKUS gang,

Posted by: denk | Sep 26 2021 14:44 utc | 110

@ denk

France will come back to the Anglo fold anyway, France has never been the same since the loss of Waterloo.

So we will have FAUKUS.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 26 2021 14:47 utc | 111

@ dan of steele (#75), I know. However, it is a start. One should expect very little independence from Canada and Australia, as they’re vassals.

@ Peter AU1 (#49), Canadians are at least speaking in public about their private monetary system and challenging the oath to Elizabeth. Haven’t come across Australians doing things in public about their enslavement? However, do know Australians being corrupted and moving to Britain, or doing the dirty work in Myanmar. Even Caitlin Johnstone doesn’t mention Australia’s real status of being a colony of the British Empire. She just blames the U$A Empire. When brought to her attention, she gets upset.

Posted by: Max | Sep 26 2021 16:27 utc | 112

vk @ 3

Luckily, the Chinese are communists, so they don't delve into bullshit. They saw her prison for what it really was - a political stunt - and counter-attacked accordingly, by arresting two of Canada's ruling elite (i.e. the Canadian capitalist class) members

Well, that would be the superficial version.

Regarding her imprisonment...

The Supreme Court of British Columbia approved Meng Wanzhou’s petition Wednesday to modify her bail terms, which included a request to move from her $5 million, six-bedroom residence near a park, to an estate more than triple the size in one of Vancouver’s toniest neighbourhoods. She’ll be just two doors down from the U.S. consul general’s residence, where the star-spangled banner flaps on the front lawn (Link)

They call it, 'house arrest.'

Posted by: john | Sep 26 2021 17:28 utc | 113

Reading the latest on TASS brought me back here to add a couple thoughts. For those who wish for a stronger, independent Canada, that move will need the consent of the Kremlin for starters. What’s happened when Erdogan has shown up seeking to make Turkey stronger, more independent? I see there was a collision in the Bosphorus Straits between a Russian and Turkish cargo ship. And if you think Canada is run by idiots, and even more so the US governed by nutcases, wait and see who we’ll have to choose from to govern this country if we stop cooperating with the British. It might not be fair or just, but…

Posted by: Bruised Northerner | Sep 26 2021 17:47 utc | 114

@ Posted by: Smith | Sep 26 2021 10:52 utc | 99

“Assange really is a sad actor, the only one his leaks benefitted was Trump and Trump dumped him immediately as he gets the throne.”

A perfect example of the sophisticated trolls that lurk below the line.

Starts with what is known as projection.

Yup YOU are SAD (Loser).
So so dad as Trump would say.

“The only one..”
No. Plenty of wikileaks has skewered many a lying murdering bunch of the establishments and is still doing so.

It was A) not Assange but an insider in the DNC that blew the whistle. B) Hillary’s shit campaign she couldn’t get a ride out of a paper bag never mind the voters with her blow hard efforts - she has zero charisma.

Trump was as much in charge of Assange’s fate as any other potus.

Assange now occupies the same political prisoner category as Mandela or Gandhi!

As do many a independent journalist. Such as Craig Murray in the U.K. and others.

Posted by: D.G. | Sep 26 2021 18:51 utc | 115

Michael Kovrig and Spavor are spies, despite obfuscations of Canada's mainstream media


https://www.thecanadafiles.com/articles/michael-kovrig-and-spavor-are-spies-despite-obfuscations-of-canadas-mainstream-media

Posted by: nwwoods | Sep 26 2021 18:52 utc | 116

Thank you for that, Oriental Voice @23, and to other posters giving further comments to fill in the history of this relationship, May it return to such friendship in future days.

Posted by: juliania | Sep 26 2021 21:11 utc | 117

The Canadian justice system failed at almost every step here. RCMP and Boarder services decided to make the arrest with out calling any one in Ottawa. The PM stepped in a big pile of ____ when he didn't have her released immediately upon being informed. A Canadian judge set the precedent that a US law that has no parallel crime in Canada takes president over Canadian law. The same judge also ruled that you don't have to go through the normal steps of informing some one they are being arrested if you are kidnapping them for the US.

Mean while Canada lost hundreds of millions of dollars in sales to China and destroyed our good relations with China. The next time the US asks Canada to commit kidnapping for it, the correct answer is to tell them to FO.

Posted by: BraveNewWorld | Sep 26 2021 21:48 utc | 118

@118 It's interesting to contemplate what Trump would have done if Trudeau had told him to FO. Ideally he would have had a heart attack but it's more likely he would have slammed Canada with massive trade sanctions or sent a Special Forces team to Vancouver airport.

Posted by: dh | Sep 26 2021 22:47 utc | 119

The young Chinese artist 乌合麒麟 has his latest artwork depicted the daring rescue of Meng:

https://n.sinaimg.cn/news/transform/95/w550h345/20210925/afb6-bffba4f86e4156a7decd1ea0c714f023.png

Posted by: d dan | Sep 26 2021 23:04 utc | 120

Pierre might have told them to fuddle duddle but not his son.

Posted by: arby | Sep 27 2021 0:29 utc | 121

@ D.G.

I don't see how speaking the truth was trolling, Assange was backed by no-one, and his benefactor (i.e. Trump) dumped him, in ​contrast to Meng Wangzhou who got supported by the chinese state.

Trump has the power to pardon, as he pardoned many, just not Julian Assange.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 27 2021 1:08 utc | 122

@ d dan

Man, that guy art never manages to NOT be cringe. He should learn less from Hollywood, but more traditional eastern art style.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 27 2021 1:18 utc | 123

Posted by: William Gruff | Sep 26 2021 14:39 utc | 109 -- ".... do take note of the posters who are trying to blunt the damage and spin this as a win for the empire, or at least frame the issue in a positive way for the US.... Just a slightly more clever version of Circe."

Thanks, WG, for confirming my suspicions. I have always thought the bunny's overly-long postings a bit wierd, swinging from one posture to another, from one stance to another, many words about nothing.

Posted by: kiwiklown | Sep 27 2021 2:56 utc | 124

Posted by: D.G. | Sep 26 2021 18:51 utc | 115 -- "(Smith) A perfect example of the sophisticated trolls that lurk below the line."

Thanks, DG, for fingering yet another troll.

A smith is one who crafts, eg. blacksmiths, wordsmiths.

A troll is one who crafts at dissimulation, obfuscation, confusion.

Here is another example from Smith @ 123 --
"Man, that guy art never manages to
NOT be cringe. He should learn less
from Hollywood, but more traditional
eastern art style."

Here, Smithy dismisses the devastating political commentary against the Evil Empire, and pretends to show concern for the cartoonist's artistic skill.

Posted by: kiwiklown | Sep 27 2021 2:59 utc | 125

@ kiwiklown

Art deserves criticism, no?
Anyway, nice to see you again.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 27 2021 3:30 utc | 126

Interesting post on Zero Hedge this morning (Turkish time). The original PDF is also provided by zero hedge.

https://www.zerohedge.com/covid-19/damn-you-hell-you-will-not-destroy-america-here-spartacus-covid-letter-thats-gone-viral

Apologize to those who think COVID posts are dull and boring. One short section about Randomized Control Trials below, but a lot of information of interest throughout.

"Because of the way they are constructed, Randomized Control Trials will never show any benefit for any antiviral against COVID-19. Not Remdesivir, not Kaletra, not HCQ, and not Ivermectin. The reason for this is simple; for the patients that they have recruited for these studies, such as Oxford’s ludicrous RECOVERY study, the intervention is too late to have any positive effect.

The clinical course of COVID-19 is such that by the time most people seek medical attention for hypoxia, their viral load has already tapered off to almost nothing. If someone is about 10 days post-exposure and has already been symptomatic for five days, there is hardly any virus left in their bodies, only cellular damage and derangement that has initiated a hyperinflammatory response. It is from this group that the clinical trials for antivirals have recruited, pretty much exclusively.

In these trials, they give antivirals to severely ill patients who have no virus in their bodies, only a delayed hyperinflammatory response, and then absurdly claim that antivirals have no utility in treating or preventing COVID-19. These clinical trials do not recruit people who are pre-symptomatic. They do not test pre-exposure or post-exposure prophylaxis.

This is like using a defibrillator to shock only flatline, and then absurdly claiming that defibrillators have no medical utility whatsoever when the patients refuse to rise from the dead. The intervention is too late. These trials for antivirals show systematic, egregious selection bias. They are providing a treatment that is futile to the specific cohort they are enrolling.

India went against the instructions of the WHO and mandated the prophylactic usage of Ivermectin. They have almost completely eradicated COVID-19. The Indian Bar Association of Mumbai has brought criminal charges against WHO Chief Scientist Dr. Soumya Swaminathan for recommending against the use of Ivermectin.

Ivermectin is not “horse dewormer”. Yes, it is sold in veterinary paste form as a dewormer for animals. It has also been available in pill form for humans for decades, as an antiparasitic drug.

The media have disingenuously claimed that because Ivermectin is an antiparasitic drug, it has no utility as an antivirus. This is incorrect. Ivermectin has utility as an antiviral. It blocks importin, preventing nuclear import, effectively inhibiting viral access to cell nuclei. Many drugs currently on the market have multiple modes of action. Ivermectin is one such drug. It is both antiparasitic and antiviral.

In Bangladesh, Ivermectin costs $1.80 for an entire 5-day course. Remdesivir, which is toxic to the liver, costs $3,120 for a 5-day course of the drug. Billions of dollars of utterly useless Remdesivir were sold to our governments on the taxpayer’s dime, and it ended up being totally useless for treating hyperinflammatory COVID-19. The media has hardly even covered this at all.

The opposition to the use of generic Ivermectin is not based in science. It is purely financially and politically-motivated. An effective non-vaccine intervention would jeopardize the rushed FDA approval of patented vaccines and medicines for which the pharmaceutical industry stands to rake in billions upon billions of dollars in sales on an ongoing basis."

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Sep 27 2021 5:11 utc | 127

Posted by: Smith | Sep 27 2021 3:30 utc | 126 -- "Art deserves criticism, no?"

D Dan and I are talking about the cartoonist's devastating political attack on the Evil Empire's dastardly games against its victims, in this case, a mother denied her freedom for 3 years by a desperate regime shouting every single day about "respect for freedom."

And you twist the discussion to be about criticising art?

Slippery !!!

Posted by: kiwiklown | Sep 27 2021 6:37 utc | 128

@ kiwiklown

Uh, I was saying that dude should learn less from Hollywood art though for his works tho. I don't remember saying anything about "devastating political attack blah blah".

I didn't know criticism of his art style could lead to you being so...uh...klown-ish.

Posted by: Smith | Sep 27 2021 6:50 utc | 129

I reckon this is just one more expos-ay (sorry, can't be bothered with the french acce-nt, in either case) of how "vk" is not really a native Indian, but rather a Western Marxist-phile pretending to not be where he's actually from.

[Repost from the Open Thread]

On journey home, Meng says "without strong motherland, no freedom today"

Now, imagine if the Chinese had behave like a bunch of demure center-leftists.

What do you think would happen?

Well, what I would think would happen is something rather much like what Meng Wanzhou expressed: a faith in her country's power to free her from an unjust imprisonment.

Most likely, they would be uselessly fighting on the American and Canadian courts as we speak, and Meng would probably rot for at least some 15 years in prison.

This is not the assertion of someone who takes the Chinese side. Anyone who understands China, and its position of power over the American oligarchy, understands that China was not afraid of losing this battle. The only thing China was afraid of was losing Meng Wanzhou.

The logic of vk'S post was the logic of a right-wing American, masquerading as an apologist for China: Centre-leftists are "weak", because...they would...what, exactly? Centre-leftists are weak because they would...negotiate? Engage in diplomacy?

In the end, VK's assertion is that "centre-leftists" (a group I actually despise rather more than he does) would fail because...they did precisely what they did.

VK wants us all to condemn the "centre-leftists" because the center-leftists did what they had to do. China knew that was what would inevitably be the conclusion, and anyone who thought any other outcome would result is essentially a Trump supporter.

So VK wants us to condemn the Biden administration because it didn't act like Trump; because it acted as a "centre-leftist"--which, let us be clear, is an ambiguous term that has little meaning in any genuine discussion of ideology--government that let Meng Wanzhou free because it recognized that she was unjustly imprisoned, and--let's not let realpolitik not have its day--Canada was rightfully pissed that two of its spies had been rightfully swept up and confined.

VK seems rather much like an NSA plant, to me.


Posted by: Pacifica Advocate | Sep 27 2021 15:36 utc | 130

@Pacifica Advocate

Centre-leftists are *apparently* weak because their ostensible public/electorate and their actual allegiances/positions are in contradiction.

Therefore they routinely take self-defeating courses of action, when not outright treacherous, in order to give an appearance of attempting to do what their electorate wants, but through ineffective methods, so as not to actually hurt the interests of their patrons or fail to uphold their hidden positions.

Posted by: Misotheist | Sep 28 2021 8:05 utc | 131

Posted by: Pacifica Advocate | Sep 27 2021 15:36 utc | 130

VK never pretend to be Indian. If anything, his posting history is hinted him as from Brazil. Moreover he make a lot of English structure and grammar error that could only made by non-native speaker. No you cannot fake this thing.

Posted by: Hangar | Sep 28 2021 11:40 utc | 132

Posted by: Hangar | Sep 28 2021 11:40 utc | 132

Yes, definitely not a native USA-ian English speaker, but not a bad English speaker. Always good to see the Stalinists and Trots get into it with each other again. Like all family feuds, entertaining as long as you are not part of it.

Posted by: Misotheist | Sep 28 2021 8:05 utc | 131

Yes, basically, the two major parties here are both cons, rackets. Neither does what they claim to want to do, and both blame the other (or anybody really) for their inability. Both resort to duplicity and outright criminal acts routinely to stay in power. Meanwhile, they all make out like bandits. Unfortunately they are too stupid to make good use of their advantages.

The question is how long will the public here continue to buy into the con?

Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 28 2021 12:50 utc | 133

William Gruff @Sep26 14:39 #109: resident bunny

Sadly, Wm Gruff misconstrues my comment Sep26 6:42 #85, falsely labeling it as an attempting "to blunt the damage and spin this as a win for the empire".

Anyone reading my comment can see that the intent was to warn of a rightward move in USA. And any close reader of moa knows that such a warning is something that Wm Gruff might not be pleased with (because he leans right).

Gruff has previously run interference for my assertion that Trump was SELECTED by the Deep State Empire Managers as a faux populist for the right (a Republican Obama to lead the remnants of the Tea Party). Gruff insists that the Deep State wanted Hillary to win despite quite a bit of evidence to the contrary. And, I might add, we now we have further evidence of the Deep State's manipulations with the election of Biden and Biden's continuing of most of Trump's foreign policy.

Readers can decide for themselves just how far the illusion of democracy rabbit hole goes by contemplating the "service"/sarc of recent Presidents.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Sep 29 2021 18:59 utc | 134

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