Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 26, 2021

U.S. - China Talks Point To A Longer Conflict

The U.S. wants to slice and dice its approach to China. It will use all means to take advantage of China where it can, while restricting China in those fields were it can no longer compete with it. The Chinese reject that approach. The U.S., they say, should not see China as an enemy. It should stop lecturing China, accept it as an equal and cooperate with it in all fields.

The U.S. is unwilling to do that. Its media-military-industrial complex is already primed for a cold war with China. Trillions of dollars are to be made from it. China on the other side is ready to play hardball if it must.

Today U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Wendy Sherman held talks with the Chinese Deputy Foreign Minister Xie Feng, She also meet with Foreign Minister Wang Yi. The later meeting, demanded to be the main event by the U.S., had already led to some squabble. Wang Yi is beyond Sherman's rank and her main discussion, the Chinese insisted, should be with a person on her own level:

The State Department emphasized Sherman will have “senior-level” communications but a statement from China’s Foreign Affairs Ministry emphasized that Sherman “will hold talks” with Xie and after that Foreign Minister Wang will “meet her.”

On Saturday two 'senior U.S. administration officials' gave a preview of the talks:

As Secretary Blinken has said, the U.S. relationship with China will be collaborative where it can be, competitive where it should be, and adversarial where it must be. And we expect all dimensions of the relationship will be on the table for discussion during Wendy’s meetings.
...
In Tianjin, [Sherman is] going to make clear while we welcome stiff and sustained competition with the PRC, everyone needs to play by the same rules and on the level – on a level playing field.

She’s going to underscore that we do not want that stiff and sustained competition to veer into conflict. This is why the U.S. wants to ensure that there are guard rails and parameters in place to responsibly manage the relationship.

The second official added:

So let me also put this meeting into the context of the administration’s broader China policy effort. Since President Biden took office, we’ve put a lot of focus on strengthening our own competitive hand vis-a-vis China through many actions that we’ve taken domestically, investing in ourselves at home. We’ve also rallied our allies and partners, including to advance an affirmative vision of the rules-based international order. And we’ve confronted China when they’ve acted against our interests and values while working to cooperate with China on areas like climate change and nonproliferation.

We know we’re stronger when we work with our allies. We know this makes us more effective when dealing with Beijing. We aren’t seeking an anti-China coalition in our work with allies and partners, but rather trying to work together in a multilateral fashion to uphold the international rules-based order.
...
With all of those actions underway, we’re entering this engagement from a position of strength and of solidarity.
...
Even as we meet with our Chinese counterparts, we will also continue to hold China accountable. These things are not mutually exclusive, and it should be clear that we are not afraid to impose costs for China’s behavior that undermines international norms.

As Peter Lee commented with his usual snark:

chinahand @chinahand - 16:43 UTC · Jul 24, 2021
"We're going to keep kicking your ass. Don't kick back, 'kay?" Our fate now that dime store Machiavellis, excuse me, generational talents, run the FP show.

The emphasized words were not welcome in China. On Sunday Foreign Minister Wang Yi responded in an interview with an attack on U.S. exceptionalism:

“The United States always wants to exert pressure on other countries by virtue of its own strength, thinking that it is superior to others,” Foreign Minister Wang Yi said on Saturday.

“However, I would like to tell the US side clearly that there has never been a country in this world that is superior to others, nor should there be, and China will not accept any country claiming to be superior to others.

“If the United States has not learned how to get along with other countries on an equal footing by now, then it is our responsibility, together with the international community, to give the US a good tutorial in this regard.

Today, after the talk between Sherman and Xie, the Foreign Ministry published a series of strong response snippets by Deputy Foreign Minister Xie Feng:

I especially like the one about the 'rules based international order':

On 26 July, during his talks with U.S. Deputy Secretary of State Wendy Sherman, Vice Foreign Minister Xie Feng made the comment that the U.S. side's so-called “rules-based international order” is an effort by the United States and a few other Western countries to frame their own rules as international rules and impose them on other countries. The United States has abandoned the universally-recognized international law and order and damaged the international system it has helped to build. And it is trying to replace it with a so-called “rules-based international order”. The purpose is to resort to the tactic of changing the rules to make life easy for itself and hard for others, and to introduce “the law of the jungle" where might is right and the big bully the small.

The SCMP summerizes:

China has for the first time given the US a list of red lines and remedial action it must take to repair relations, including lifting sanctions and dropping its extradition request for Huawei financial chief Meng Wanzhou.

Chinese foreign vice-minister Xie Feng told US deputy secretary of state Wendy Sherman on Monday morning that US-China relations had reached a “stalemate” and faced “serious consequences”, according to a Chinese foreign ministry statement.

“The foundational reason is that some people in the US are treating China as an ‘imagined enemy’,” it quoted Xie as saying.

After the meeting, Xie said China gave two lists to the US – one with one remedial action for Washington to take towards China, and the other a series of Beijing’s key concerns.
...
Xie said the Chinese side also “expressed its strong dissatisfaction towards the wrong remarks and actions of the US” in relation to investigations into the origins of Covid-19, Taiwan, Xinjiang, Hong Kong and the South China Sea.

“We urge the United States not to underestimate the strong determination, firm will and strong ability of the 1.4 billion Chinese people to safeguard national sovereignty, security and development interests,” state news agency Xinhua quoted him as saying.

In its summary of the talks the Associated Press points to the basic difference in the approaches:

High-level face-to-face talks between U.S. and Chinese diplomats on Monday highlighted sharp differences between the sides, although the tone appeared somewhat less contentious than at their last meeting.
...
Xie said China wants to seek common ground while shelving differences, highlighting a divide in the basic approach to their relationship. The Biden administration has said it will cooperate in areas such as climate but confront China in others such as human rights, describing the relationship as collaborative, competitive and adversarial.

As the U.S. is for now rejecting the Chinese offer for burying the hatchet China will have to play hardball. It will not be cooperative in the fields where the U.S. wants it to be cooperative (Iran, North Korea, etc.). It will also be adversarial in fields where the U.S. has little ability to push back (rare earth exports, Boeing 737MAX re-certification).

The U.S. hopes that it can find and press 'allies' into confronting China. But Europe already rejected that. To others, especially in Asia, the U.S. looks like a declining power because it is a declining power and the economic interests of most nations now favor China. Under these circumstances I for one fail to see how the U.S. could win in a longer cold conflict.

How long then will it take until the U.S. recognizes that and steps down from its illusion of supremacy?

Posted by b on July 26, 2021 at 16:20 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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The communist party is the main opposition party in Russia. They receive about 15-20% support. Putin's party usually received 30-35% support but Putin himself 65-70%.

The Russian Communist Party has been very supportive of President Putin, one can make of that what one will, but ultimately I think they realize he is Pro-Russia first and foremost, and is the best option to keep the oligarchs and neo-liberals in check.

The drop in the polls Putin experienced last year was attributed to Navalny, but in reality was a portion of the Communist Party expressing dissatisfaction with his pension reform.

The pickle the west finds itself in is they'd love to help the neo-liberals/fascist wing to power, but oppositionally speaking they are a distant 3rd to 4th and have no real prospects.

The Communist Party would be the better bet of supplanting United Russia, but the last thing the west wants is to help bring a socialist party back to power in Russia

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 20:47 utc | 201

Over the past 5 years, I've supplied numerous examples the fact that Russian strategic industries and their related governmental agencies have taken to following the Chinese method. In fact, I just did so a few days ago with Russia's Civilian Shipbuilding Sector. And today we have yet another example, this time related to transport infrastructure and long term planning. The following three paragraphs provide numerous examples:

"According to the Governor, St Petersburg aims to develop only environmentally friendly transport systems, including electric and gas engine transport. Under an agreement with Gazprom, 2,800 new Russian-made gas engine buses will start operating on local routes as early as next year. All commercial passenger buses will be converted to gas motor fuel under the first large-scale experiment in Russia.

"Mr Beglov also discussed efforts to make Kronstadt more accessible. A historical cultural centre is being established there in collaboration with the Defence Ministry, and work is underway to create the Island of Forts Museum Historical Park as part of a large-scale project. Three historical forts, Kronschlot, Peter I and Alexander I, are being overhauled for the first time.

"New public-private partnership projects, including the construction of 18 flyovers spanning railway tracks, are being contemplated. The old-time disproportion between housing construction projects and social facilities is being eliminated. The city has to build 346 social facilities worth an estimated 300 billion rubles by 2026. It is necessary to invest the same sum (300 billion rubles) in order to provide these facilities with utility mains."

Through an impressive network of quasi-governmental organizations that were built by Putin and other government members, Russian private businesses are instilled with the patriotic need to improve Russia and better the lives of its people, and the sanctions provide plenty of motivation. I know this because I've very closely observed Russia for 30+ years now during the horrors of Yeltsin and the rise of Putin's Phoenix. Putin's tireless and very hands on when he must, and he demands the same from his governmental team. Perhaps the most important and under-noticed aspect of the Putin recovery years is the close involvement of banks with industry and the Central Bank being closely controlled from the Kremlin, which is contrary to the disinformation often posted here and elsewhere. From the above link, we have yet another example:

"A number of significant projects have already been implemented, as I have said, and – I can see that the head of VTB has joined us – VTB Bank has helped significantly to improve the situation at Pulkovo airport, which is now preparing for a second stage of modernisation. As a result, the airport's capacity will exceed 30 million people a year."

Unlike within the Outlaw US Empire and the vast majority of nations captured by Neoliberals, Russia's banks loan money directly into the economy for much needed development and improvements. Then there's Russia's National Wealth Fund and this agency, Council for Strategic Development and National Projects. And last but certainly not least, Putin gets more direct feedback from his citizens through his numerous media interactions designed to do just that than any other world leader. And what's even more incredible, no problem is too small for him to hear about--the tangible proof exists for anyone to discover.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 20:51 utc | 202

ArthurDent 201

Those percentages - are they percentages of number of votes cast or number of voters? From what I can gather actual number of voters that cast a vote is often low.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 27 2021 20:53 utc | 203

karlof1 202

A lot of new names here now that still have not realized as Armstrong puts it - "Everything we have been told is a lie"

A lot of drilled in propaganda and projection happening, most of it unintentionally.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 27 2021 21:05 utc | 204

@105
Russia wouldn't need to intervene if USA used one little nuclear weapon on China...the proportional response would be China uses one little nuclear weapon on USA.

USA maybe chooses the Yunin nuclear subbase on Hainan Island as a target and China chooses the nuclear subbase at Bangor outside of Seattle. Civilian casualties are kept below 100,000 due to the relative remoteness of each base...everyone is happy!

In reality VK is right, once one nuclear detonation happens, all nuclear detonations happen as it will be impossible to tell the difference between a nuclear tipped vs. conventionally tipped missile....amongst other reasons.

Try reversing the query...if China just used one piddly nuke on USA, what would they do? Would Blinken with his sad little fear-biter face announce some new sanctions and call it good?

All in all it is a silly question.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 21:07 utc | 205

Arthur Dent @201--

From Wikipedia:

"United Russia is the largest party in Russia, and as of 2021 it holds 336 of the 450 seats in the State Duma, having constituted the majority in the chamber since 2007."

For some insight into Putin's relationship with his political party, here's his address at the Party Congress delivered on June 19. A hint: The demands Putin makes of party members differ little from the demands made on members of the Communist Party of China:

"But, of course, it is the United Russia as the majority party that plays a key role here. To take responsibility, to lead, to be in the forefront means to work harder and better than others, to act much more energetically and persistently, and to do that, both in the legislative sphere and in everyday work you need to quickly and clearly resolve issues of concern to our citizens, to achieve substantive results, value people's trust, preserve and constantly strengthen it."

Serve the public and thereby strengthen the nation. Sounds simple, yes?

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 21:08 utc | 206

@ Bemildred | Jul 27 2021 19:55 utc | 194:

I find it interesting that Ms Sherman, and not Mr. Blinken, is front and center in all this negotiating with our enemies now

Thanks for pointing this out; this is indeed striking. Does it mean that the US realizes that Blinken has poisoned relations to such an extent that they dare no longer send him, or that the US is doubling down on its "indispensible" act by regarding other states, China in particular and perhaps Russia as well, as unworthy of Blinken's time?

I hope the former and suspect the latter. It's as if Richard Grenell were our entire State Department now, if without his ironically refreshing bluntness.

Posted by: corvo | Jul 27 2021 21:10 utc | 207

@ Baron (#195), you’re completely missing the Financial Empire’s global construct. The Financial Empire wants each nation to be a VASSAL and dependent on its global economic system, to achieve its dream of a global empire. The Empire did come up with a realistic global control structure, an evil plan.

It sent its global operative Kissinger to integrate China as a MANUFACTURING center of the world. Chinese saw an opportunity to strengthen their economy and opened themselves to investment opportunities. However, they had a plan to learn and build their sectors, and invest their resources in developing nation’s infrastructure, capabilities and capacities.

Russia wasn’t fortunate, as it didn’t have a good leadership team and neither a plan. It was bamboozled in early 1990s. The Empire wanted to own Russia’s RESOURCES and integrate it in its empire as an energy center. It was able to capture local traitors and ended up owning Yeltsin gang. If Putin would have been happy to be a puppet of the Empire, China would have been in a worse position today. Vladimir Putin was a game changer. He has denied the Empire control of Russia, the Middle East and dominance over energy resources. In summary, Putin/Russia have disrupted Empire’s plans.

Now it is not about just the labor cost in China, which is rising, but the ECOSYSTEM of infrastructure, capabilities and capacities. China has built an excellent manufacturing supply chain and achieved significant comparative advantage in scale and scope. This is the key reason behind high end Western companies not moving out of China. Just talk to an Apple manufacturing specialist.

China and Russia, together want to end the US$ as the reserve currency and be SOVEREIGN now. An interesting gameplay

Posted by: Max | Jul 27 2021 21:14 utc | 208

Those numbers are an average taken from four years of polling numbers combined with a percentage of votes cast in three previous elections.

You are correct, turnout is higher then turnout in American elections, but the "real" opposition would be "no opinion/did not vote" which polls between United Russia and the Communist Party...I have no idea what the "no opinion" folks think politically.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 21:14 utc | 209

Bemildred @194--

Blinken and Austin are out making the rounds trying to drum-up a new coalition of the stupid to attack China and Russia, that's why Sherman was in China, Blinken's mission is deemed more important.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 21:16 utc | 210

Look jinn, I'm not much one for word games.

I posed a question about a discrepancy in these opaque and unregulated financial shenaninigans. That is not 'impugning' my own source.

Everybody understands, and understood, well before you started splitting hairs here, that there is not nearly the amount of money existing in total, that is anywhere near the total face value of outstanding derivatives bets.

That was not the point of the discussion, which is about the fundamental Ponzi underpinnings of this so-called economy. On which the wheels have fallen off many times in the past, and appear to have fallen off again. Perhaps for good this time.

There is nothing to be gained by moving bits of paper around. But there is a very large net cost on the real, productive economy that makes actual things for actual people.

This entire financial 'industry' is free, I suppose? And sustains itself without any input of money that is actually earned by real people?

Heck, maybe it even contributes to us all, like manna falling from the heavens?

Do you believe that taxes exist? Then how much does this entire Wall Street and FIRE sector skim off of the real economy?

We have very good info on the vast amounts of wealth held by these parasites. It is in fact, MOST of the accumulated wealth that exists.

Did that just grow on trees? Or was it more like wool being fleeced off of a sheep?

This entire bullshit with this entire 'industry' is like a giant lead ball tied around our feet. It has no reason to exist, other than for parasites to extract the sweat and labor of the people.

Money is simply a symbolic token of exchange that has no intrinsic value of its own. At least, that's what it's supposed to be---but the propagandists have managed to convince the people otherwise: that money can actually CREATE more money!

That is fundamentally FALSE, and has been known to be false since the time of Aristotle, who wrote about money 'giving birth' to money, being the most 'unnatural' means of acquring wealth.

And in the words of The Great Thinker, also the most 'despised'!

This dust you have kicked up here with your contrarian fussilades, to the rightful concerns raised here about the extremely dangerous gaming going on with these despised parasites, does nothing to provide much needed clarity.

Nobody needs derivatives, nor 90 percent [at least] of this financial 'industry.' In fact we would all have more money in our pockets if the whole shebang just dried up and blew away.

The Great Thinker often turned to the physical world for analogy to explain puzzling things. We know that neither energy, nor mass can be either created or destroyed.

Yet we are supposed to believe that pushing pieces of paper and betting slips, from one sweaty palm to the next, is supposed to create some material and tangible good? [And which can even be counted as a net gain in our year-end tally of the GDP?]

How stupid and irrational is that?

And now these monkeys are taking us off the cliff with them. Because of course they are much dumber than they imagine themselves to be, otherwise they would be doing something PRODUCTIVE with their god-given time.

Like Wile E. Coyote, the end is always the same: BLOW UP IN FACE!

Posted by: Gordog | Jul 27 2021 21:23 utc | 211

@corvo
@karlof1

RE Ms Sherman

I don't know what to think. Blinken, when I have noticed him lately, is in places like Gambia or meeting with Ms Toootsenskaia from Belarus. I can think of lots of rationales for it, but no real clues.

There was a prior dispute with the Chinese over Ms Sherman wanting to meet above her station.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 27 2021 21:27 utc | 212

@Karlof206
Yes, United Russia dominated the 2016 legislative election, receiving around 53% of the votes. They poll lower but when push comes to shove they receive lots of support from the Communist Party and the Social Democratic Party as well as undecideds.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 21:28 utc | 213

ArthurDent 209

A short tie ago, I think there were elections and constitutional referendum combined. Putin was behind a major push for voter turn out. The turnout was larger than normal and from what I could make of it, that turnout backed the changes. I suspect amongst the non voters in normal years, opinions would be similar amongst the non voters percentage wise as what shows in the votes cast, perhaps leaning more toward United Russia than the communists as many that are mostly content with the way the government is going don t bother to vote.
Early on I believe many smaller and independent groups would side with United Russia and Putin rather than risk the communists coming back to power.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 27 2021 21:31 utc | 214

Glenn Diesen offers this superb analysis of the NS2 "agreement" and how it pans out geopolitically in the emerging Multipolar World. Here's a taste:

"In the absence of common interests, Washington is becoming more reliant on threats of economic coercion against its allies, although these threats failed to sway Germany from pursuing its national interests with Nord Stream 2. The dispute has now been resolved with a formal agreement. However, in the past, cooperation was based on shared interests expressed as ideological unity or common values. This time, in the absence of common interests, a formal agreement was necessary to outline the conditions for the US to end its sabotage of a Berlin-backed gas pipeline. The agreement does not signal trust, and neither should it, as Germany is well aware that Ukraine’s gas transit days are coming to an end.

"As the frontlines of the new Cold War move to Asia, the supposed frontier states against Russia lose their significance and become an obstacle for rational policy. The US must prioritize Asia, while Germany must look after its interests in its own backyard. The German-American agreement was reached in spite of fierce opposition from Poland and the Baltic States, while Ukraine reasonably considers itself betrayed as it is no longer a top strategic priority."

I've referred to this excellent work by Diesen, Russia's Geoeconomic Strategy for a Greater Eurasia, on many occasions and often without mention. It can now be freely downloaded here. First published in 2018, it's a tad dated data-wise, but the geoeconomic and geopolitical concepts introduced and discussed haven't, and for those alone is worth reading as it plainly details the why behind the shifting balance of power.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 21:34 utc | 215

ArthurDent@205

Interesting response. Am I correct in reading you to say that if any missiles start flying, all out nuclear war is the inevitable result (a claim you attribute to VK)? I'm not sure what reasoning supports such a conclusion, other than the assumption that it's not possible to distinguish nuclear from non-nuclear missiles from each other. This seems questionable to me, as this seems to imply that there will then be no use of missiles at all in the future by any of nuclear powers, because such a usage would lead directly to all out nuclear war.

Because of this, I'm not convinced that asking how Russia would respond to American aggression is a silly question - or, relatedly, that the Americans would treat it as such.

Posted by: out_there | Jul 27 2021 21:35 utc | 216

karlof1 @185

That China now has to build up its military and nukilar arsenal is really a sub-optimal situation. That means its economic development will suffer, as will its capacity to develop BRI. The optimal situation would be China being able to trust Russia 100%, leaving the military side to Russia and continuing on the economic front in China and the BRI countries. Surely China will be overstretched trying to do everything, which may be the aim of the Empire. But what does 100% trust entail? Surely it can only happen if China and Russia merge and become one country.

Posted by: Robert Macaire | Jul 27 2021 21:47 utc | 217

@216
The silly part is how you frame the question...what would Russia do if USA used one nuke, not two or three, just one because any more would be mean!

The obvious answer to that impossible situation is that Russia wouldn't need to be involved...China could just use one nuke, not two or three, just one on an American target. Then where are we? Do the math.

And yes, the use of any missiles on the mainland of Russia or China does risk all out nuclear war...but if one...just one of those missiles produces a nuclear blast, then total nuclear war is almost, but not quite inevitable.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 21:55 utc | 218

This news is related to Diesen's essay:

"Russian-state owned energy firm Gazprom has reportedly decided not to purchase the rights to move additional gas supplies through Ukraine, on top of its normal exports, for August as a debate rages over Kiev's transit revenues."

August deliveries via Ukraine will be under 64 million cubic meters per day and no additional capacity is being negotiated. Gazprom still utilizes the 5-year plan and plans to massively increase investment:

"The planned amount of Gazprom’s investments is RUB 22.8 billion, which is 5.9 times more than in 2016–2020."

Here again is the 6 years of construction in 6 minutes" video of the Amal gas processing plant for those who missed it before.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 21:56 utc | 219

@PeterAU1
Right, I am not saying the Communist Party is anywhere near the reigns of power, just that the Communist Party is very loyal to Putin and the Communist Party is the largest opposition (loyal opposition) block.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 21:59 utc | 220

out_there @216--

In 2018, if I recall correctly, in response to the Outlaw US Empire's positioning dual purpose missiles close to Russia's borders, both Putin and Lavrov stated that given the impossibility of determining what sort of warhead is on the missile that it would be assumed/treated as a nuclear-tipped missile and acted upon accordingly. As expected, that news was swept under the rug very fast in the West. As far as I'm aware, that policy decision hasn't been reversed and remains valid. Upon further thinking, I believe it was on or close to the occasion of Putin's 2018 roll-out of Russia's new hypersonic weapons when that policy was stated. I don't know how much of the discussion on Russia's military abilities over the past 2-3 months you've followed here, but at this moment Russia is almost capable of a first strike knockout while completely defeating any counterstrike with its massive series of anti-missile systems, the S-500 being the latest to successfully undergo combat testing. (It may very well be possible that what's being said are Buk systems knocking all Occupied Palestine missiles from the air during its last three attacks on Syria were actually S-500s being tested.) Furthermore, Russia remains very serious about Civil Defense whereas the West has essentially given up. From most every top Russian source: Russia plans to win the next war and not have it fought on any of its territory--the fight will be taken to the enemy's lands and they'll be devastated. Yes, the Russians and Chinese are very serious whereas the West treats such seriousness as a joke--which is extremely dangerous.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 22:17 utc | 221

Everybody understands, and understood, well before you started splitting hairs here, that there is not nearly the amount of money existing in total, that is anywhere near the total face value of outstanding derivatives bets.
__________________________________________________
Maybe that is because the face value of outstanding derivatives bets is not anywhere near as large as what you are trying to claim it is. And sure the BIS is obfuscating and you are helping spread their disinformation about how large derivatives really are.

As for the wheels falling off the economy that has been happening periodically for centuries
And the financiers have been skimming off the backs of real workers for a lot longer than that.
And helping to spread Wall Street's disinformation isn't going to change anything.

Posted by: jinn | Jul 27 2021 22:36 utc | 222

ArthurDent @220--

Yes, Russia's Communist Party is very patriotic as are most of the minor parties. It's very plain to see that Putin and the entire government are doing their utmost to improve Russia and better the lives of its citizenry. The contrast with the lack of same here within the Outlaw US Empire is appalling. You may recall Neil Young's Rockin' in the Free World, which was released one year into GHW Bush's term in 1989, and its depiction of the USA. Ironically, both Trump and Sanders used it as their campaign theme song in 2016.

Here's some of Shadowstats commentary from today:

"Reflecting the Surge in Money [June 2021 Money Supply 'Basic' M1 Surged to a Record 87.8% Gain Versus Its Pre-Pandemic Trough, Up from 81.1% in May; All Money Supply and Monetary Base Dollar Levels Are at Historic Highs and at Record- or Cycle-High Growth Rates], June CPI and PPI Inflation Have Exploded, Well in Excess of Consensus Expectations, While Faltering Business Activity Has Begun to Intensify.

• "At His June Press Conference, Fed Chairman Powell Acknowledged Some 'Temporary' Near-Term Inflation Issues, as Headline Inflation Continued to Surge Amidst Surging Money Growth and Renewed Softening in Economic Activity. Significant Details of Tomorrow’s (July 28th) July Press Conference Will Be Covered Here Late-Day in the SYSTEMIC RISK Section."

I expect Real Unemployment to remain over 25% when the new data's released. The lies made to cover up the genuine economic situation are no longer working, thus the rise in domestic turmoil coinciding with R-Party refusal to do anything to solve the problem as they smell blood and what to regain seats in 2022. Of course, media isn't covering much of what's real, so we get extended fire and Olympics coverage. Bah!!


Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 22:39 utc | 223

ArthurDent@218

Thanks for clarifying. I might note I'm not sure from where you drew the framing that you criticize; so far as I'm aware, I've not spoken in those terms. Rather, I said originally (and reiterated repeatedly) "The crucial issue for the future, I suspect, is whether Russia will act as a military ally of China. Will Russia commit to attack if the USA attacks China? Particularly, if they attack with nuclear weapons? The answer to this is not obvious to me."

Nor was I talking primarily about the scenario you focus upon, namely, a nuclear strike by the USA on China. What I was questioning was whether Russia will act as a military ally of China in general. I asked because (among other things) it seemed important to determining the attitude and responses of both China and the USA in the future.

And finally, I see you are presuming escalation to total destruction from any use of nuclear weapons is "almost, but not quite inevitable", a conclusion I find questionable primarily because the neither the reasoning nor the evidence supporting it is obvious to me. Given the unprecedented nature of this threat, it's not clear to me from where you draw your certainty that this result will ensure.

Posted by: out_there | Jul 27 2021 22:48 utc | 224

@ 211 gordog... thanks.. you hit it out of the park again....

@ re sherman bemildred quote - "There was a prior dispute with the Chinese over Ms Sherman wanting to meet above her station." that is what i heard too, and a deciding factor in the chinese not accepting this game the usa are playing...

@ arthur dent.. thanks for your posts... ditto karlof1....

Posted by: james | Jul 27 2021 22:49 utc | 225

karlof1@221

Thanks for your excellent points. And I agree with you both about the seriousness of the Russian attitude and the odd attitude of the NATO/West towards this. The latter is very worrying and in need of rectification, for sure.

I am also familiar with the Russian policy regarding missiles pointed at Russia. My line of inquiry was regarding Russia's attitude toward China - in particular, whether they viewed China as a military ally (rather than as some other type of ally), and, if so, what this entailed in terms of response by Russia for aggressive acts towards China by the USA. The gist of my extended query is this: do you believe the Russian policy you noted would extend to missiles pointed at (or fired at) China?

Posted by: out_there | Jul 27 2021 22:59 utc | 226

ArthurDent@218

typo correction: I meant "ensue", not "ensure".

Posted by: out_there | Jul 27 2021 23:02 utc | 227

suzan | Jul 27 2021 16:28 utc | 166 et al

the asuccinct Bill Black: The best way to rob a bank is to own one.

Posted by: chu teh | Jul 27 2021 23:12 utc | 228

@224

"I'd have thought it would depend on the nature of strike itself - if it struck a military installation, for instance, with a tactical (non-ICBM) nuclear weapon, and there were a small number of inhabitants, is that going to be sufficient reason to unleash the entirety of Russia's capability?"

There you go, you answered the question for yourself, it would depend on the nature of the strike itself...a strike on a chinese military installation with a tactical nuke would not require a Russian response, the Chinese would just respond in kind. Then what? Do the math.

Follow that to it's logical conclusion. Limited nuclear strike on China = limited nuclear strike by China on USA....minimally.


As far as why any single nuclear strike on China or Russia would almost inevitably lead to total nuclear warfare would take me many pages to explain and it is probably best for you to do the necessary research on the respective nuclear postures of each involved nation, the flight time of nuclear missiles, the positioning of nuclear weapons and the risk of not responding to a potential decapitation strike.


Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 23:32 utc | 229

out_there @227--

The key point is the inability to discern where an ICBM is targeted when launched. Russia has said it assumes it's the target and will react accordingly. And therein lies your answer. Another indicator is China's purchase of Russia's outstanding anti-missile defense systems--it hasn't--and that should tell us something since China can certainly afford several divisions of such systems. As for China's defense budget, it's said to be just over $200 billion or about 1.5% of GDP. At such a level, China could easily double that to 3% and not hinder any of its development projects. Do recall that China's GDP figures are close to being genuine whereas the Outlaw US Empire's are grossly falsified, meaning its defense spending is closer to 6% of real GDP of which about 5% is "overhead" that goes directly to the pockets of the 1%. Then look at the quality and military readiness ratings, which over the last several years have barely made a C grade. The recent Woke-related purge within the military has certainly hurt its ability hard.

To sum-up, China's behavior says it's covered by Russia as does Russia's expectations upon any ICBM/SLBM launch. Russia has also described in easy to understand language what it will do in that event. What we haven't discussed are the laser weapons Russia's unveiled, albeit very briefly, which can be powered by the small, portable, nuclear generators ROSATOM produces. Ironically, the Terrorist Foreign Legion employed by the Outlaw US Empire has aided Russia's military in training for and planning against swarm attacks designed to overwhelm defenses; that the weapons employed against Russia were mere drones matters little in this case.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 27 2021 23:35 utc | 230

@Karlof1 230
That is all true, but it would be a mistake to underestimate China's military capabilities and their ability to defend themselves without Russian help.

China only trails Russia in a few areas, namely Jet Engines, Metallurgy and portable nuclear power. Their efficiency in mass producing any technology they master is unparalleled.

The navy they have built in record time is impressive, the ships are top-notch, and come with air defense/missile defense systems that are only a step below what Russia has to offer, which is another reason they don't need to buy the systems, they can make them just fine.

Five to Seven years max before China passes both Russia and the USA.

Should the USA start a war in the South China Sea, China would absolutely wax their sorry asses.

Posted by: ArthurDent | Jul 27 2021 23:59 utc | 231

ArthurDent@229

Thanks for your reply and clarification. I am clear now how you came to focus on that framing. I can also see how you believe my central concern - the Russian attitude and response towards China - is irrelevant to such a scenario.

My interest remains, however, in Russia's attitude toward hostilities directed at China by the USA, and whether (as I asked karlof1) Russia would extend their policy of treating all missile aimed at Russia as potentially nuclear to missiles aimed at China, and would respond in similar fashion.

As to the details of escalation in theory and in practice, I have (as you suggest I should) been researching in this area for some time, particularly in strategic game theory, but am not aware of anything in the specialist literature that comes to the conclusion you do with such unequivocal certainty; most of the literature I've read has been more equivocal, particularly given the degree of speculation involved regarding evidence, and the unprecedented nature of the issue. I'd certainly be interested in any such references so I could study them and their reasoning and evidence.

Posted by: out_there | Jul 28 2021 0:01 utc | 232

Stonebird | Jul 27 2021 8:04 utc | 117

it's the collateral, stoopid:
Jeff Snider (Reverse Repo Deep Dive, Mind Blowing Intel On Shadow Banking Risks, Why Zoltan's Wrong)


start @ 50 min

Worth a listen. "The collateral system is the central point of failure."

Here's the WSJ article referred to.

Posted by: pogohere | Jul 28 2021 0:03 utc | 233

Ummm, I'm curious...has everyone figured out "the box" as in "Ability to think outside the box"?

It's your own implanted... ummm... pre-packaged container of ready-made concepts complete with movies, "thoughts", sensations, etc-etc-etc [big on etc] guaranteed to subvert any attempt to "think" outside its bounds .

Who are the authors? Well, just for openers, it is what schooling is all about!

And yes, it's certainly loopy [as techies might appreciate]. Any escape invites big centripital effects, often a gainful and wild ride.

MOA ... is stimulating!

Posted by: chu teh | Jul 28 2021 0:06 utc | 234

karlof1@230

Thanks for your comments. Very informative and clear.

I should add that my original query was specifically about non-ICBM missiles and non-ICBM firings. Do you believe that the same considerations apply to those? If not, what response would you foresee forthcoming from Russia in a non-ICBM scenario?

Posted by: out_there | Jul 28 2021 0:10 utc | 235

corvo | Jul 27 2021 15:40 utc | 157

I advocate precisely the opposite approach. Know in advance where the bombs are most likely to fall; then, when the strike is imminent, get as close to Ground Zero as possible. Better to be vaporized instantly than to suffer horribly for hours, days, or weeks. There will be no safe places--none.

When I was a grade school kid growing up in the New Jersey suburbs in the 1950s across the Hudson River from NYC I adopted that very strategy. The adults "running" the show had clearly lost their minds--had us squatting in the school hallways in exercises to prepare for falling nukes.

I decided to step into the street outside my house and return to dust. That gave me peace of mind.

Posted by: pogohere | Jul 28 2021 0:26 utc | 236

From the blog of Andrei Martyanov, we get this new bit of info and his analysis of it:

"When I write about US crisis I constantly stress that it is systemic and it is institutional. Very few American institutes are as tragicomical and popular as being butts of the jokes around the world than the so called America's 'Intelligence Community'. It's failures to assess or to predict anything are so spectacular, that one must question a validity of their 'analytical' methodology. To illustrate this, it is enough to take a look at a comment to a release in 2012 by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence Global Trends Projections 2030."

And wait till he digs into the 2040 assessment! Always a good read!

/////

out_there @235--

Thanks for posing your question more specifically. I'm quitting for today, but I'll provide an answer when I come back in the morning. Glad to see your commentary and interest.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 28 2021 0:27 utc | 237

#232 out_there

It's doubtful whether the US would ever allow either Russia or China to just "sit out" even a limited nuclear war between itself and another country. From the US perspective, if it is going to be severely damaged, then it is imperative that neither of its two primary rivals be sufficiently undamaged to be able to dominate the post war world. So while no one knows exactly how a nuclear war might develop, both Russia and China have reason to suspect that once it begins, they will both be US targets.

Posted by: Fnord13 | Jul 28 2021 0:29 utc | 238

Fnord13@238

Good point. And I agree with you: that consideration will in all likelihood be informing tactics and strategy in both Russia and China, and probably exerting pressure towards an escalation of hostilities and damage by all parties. My additional fear is that if the USA is in decline, there might well be time pressure as well, a "do it while you are still able" idea playing out, pushing the USA towards a confrontation sooner rather than later. I hope not, but that's my fear.

Posted by: out_there | Jul 28 2021 0:57 utc | 239

Regarding what would trigger Russia into a war if it were not directly attacked. Both Russia and China are doping their utmost to prevent US launching major war to save its failing position as hegemon. There are a number of smaller target countries US can no longer attack conventionally. Iran, Venezuela, North Korea ect. That is why under the Trump regime,m US went back to tactical nukes. Usable nukes they called them.
The trigger comes when US resorts to using nuclear weapons for the purpose of maintaining its hegemony, no matter what country it targets. Once the US uses them once, if it gets away with it will use them on other targets.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 1:00 utc | 240

nothing like a dr. strangelove conversation.. is this is driven primarily by americans???

Posted by: james | Jul 28 2021 1:06 utc | 241

i guess when the financial sanctions no longer work, people have to resort to thinking about nuclear attacks... nothing seems to work, short of an exorcism, or removal of the brain center of the usa - wherever that might be located, lol...

Posted by: james | Jul 28 2021 1:08 utc | 242

@ james @1:06 UTC:

Well, duh! :-)

@ james @1:08 UTC:

One can argue whether the USA has a brain center. There's at least one penile center, however.

Posted by: corvo | Jul 28 2021 1:25 utc | 243

@ pogohere:

Wish I'd known someone like you in grade school!

Posted by: corvo | Jul 28 2021 1:25 utc | 244

Peter AU1@240

I agree with you that the potential use of tactical nuclear weapons by the USA is problematical and undesirable.

What can be done about it is, unfortunately, a difficult matter. Moreover, the distinct question of what will in fact be done about it, if and when such a use takes place, is perhaps an even more difficult question - as is the question of who (which nation-state actor) will perform such acts, given the risk to that actor of so doing.

Posted by: out_there | Jul 28 2021 1:27 utc | 245

@233 pogohere

Wow, that is a kinghell conversation you linked - and I'm only 5 minutes into it from the 50-min mark. I downloaded for more leisurely study.

Many thanks.

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 28 2021 1:54 utc | 246

I guess this is the right place for an update on Britain's Carrier Strike Force now in the South China Sea....

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/british-aircraft-carrier-under-chinas-221504794.html

"Meanwhile the US defence secretary said on Tuesday that Britain might be more helpful as an ally if it did not focus on Asia.

Lloyd Austin told a press conference in Singapore: “We have interests around the globe and we want to make sure that we work together to address all those interests.” "

Posted by: dh | Jul 28 2021 2:09 utc | 247

The USA has devolved into a cesspool of corruption. This is clearly shown by such events as 9/11, Biden gaining the most votes of any president ever, the farce that the Capital hill protest prosecutions have become, the covert funding of Uighur terrorists, Al Quaeda, ISIS etc., the FBI promoting Russiagate and coaching low intellect suckers to commit false flags. I could go on and on but it has got so outrageous more and more Americans are becoming aware of the own nation's duplicity. Would these people support a war with China. I don't think so. If the military decides to get aggressive a few ship killing missiles will quickly reduce their enthusiasm and they know it or at least the ones with more than one brain cell do. Therefore the chances of a major conflict are small but expect lots of asymetrical action to irritate china and lots of pro USA propaganda. Just like the recent Five Eyes allegations of Chinese Cyber attacks. No proof as usual.

Posted by: Ike | Jul 28 2021 2:27 utc | 248

Fnord13 @238

We know for a fact that the US had a policy to destroy an innocent, harmless and non-nuclear China simultaneously with thoroughly nuking the USSR ca. 1960. Both military and population centers, regardless of whether China was fighting or not.

Declassified Targets map


Is there any reason to think that calculation has changed? Since Tbilisi, Warsaw and so on no longer need to be nuked, there are more bombs available for points further east.

Posted by: Billb | Jul 28 2021 2:41 utc | 249

I was just talking to someone in the Philippines. A man with a visa to Canada has been refused entry because he was vaccinated with the Chinese Sinovac. The trouble is that was the only vaccine available to him.

A previous barfly commented that governments are 'cold hearted.' I believe Canada's decision is clearly politically motivated, the intent is to thwart China's every move as a means to improve, mistakenly, their own feeble standing.

Posted by: Paul | Jul 28 2021 3:52 utc | 250

J-Dogg #119

The peasants in the USA wouldn't so much rebel as it would be dog eat dog in a heavily armed nation. Even if China only landed 200 or 300 warheads, most the country would be without electricity and water for a year or two. All services and society would collapse, the army would splinter, it would be chaos and carnage unlike anything ever seen.

YES, 'The Road' by Cormac McCarthy would indicate the descent into hell.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 28 2021 4:12 utc | 251

What Blinken is doing:

Blinken starts India meetings with address to civil society group

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 28 2021 4:49 utc | 252

james 241 242

Looking at the US Russia interactions and also Martyanov's pieces on military power, I think the worst has passed. A dangerous time when Russia moved into Syria, but Putin's speech in 2018 has by now sunk in. Trump had to ask Russia's permission which was not granted, now the powers that be with Biden as the facade also realize they have to make piece with Russia if they want to take down China.
Most of whats happening now is show and bluff though the rest of five-eyes and to a lesser extent Europe are committed to going down socially and economically with the USS titanic.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 5:25 utc | 253

Rozhin at Cassad translated into Russian this entry, under the title "The so called rules based order".

https://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/6939222.html

Commenter Neznam Neznamov says:

A German that writes in English, good source, I recommend it.

Posted by: Paco | Jul 28 2021 5:40 utc | 254

B asks "How long then will it take until the U.S. recognizes that and steps down from its illusion of supremacy?" The USA will never go away from outside pressure..financial empires and global corporate mafias come and go.. but Americans persist.


Max @ 19
"Without the USD as the reserve currency the U$A financial sector is toast and the Financial Empire nears death." Destruction of the USA protected privatized financial sector would return 1) America to Americans, and 2) the USA to the service of Americans. Many look forward to that day..

"Why is China funding the Financial Empire, its adversary?"
<= the flow of funds (the churn) keeps the financial sector in charge of the nation state system, that churn produces and replenishes the wealth of the Oligarchs on both sides of the divide. Derivatives are a factor.

Jyc @ 29 The USA is not supremacy-downgrade capable. <= the supremacy downgrade relates to foreign activities being conducted by privately owned oligarch interest operating through the USA portal located in, or near, the white house. Closing that portal will not end activity by the oligarch seeking bounty foreign foreign places; the oligarch will just hire private contractors? You folks view it will be the USA that takes the fall, but the USA is fall proof. Instead the privatized rich oligarch who use the USA that will suffer the coming losses. America will likely regain its consciousness and direct the USA to retract back into government those elements that have been privatized.


Max @ 31 says it well "if we Americans can focus on building our nation through industrial capitalism and avoiding distractions of Empire’s misadventures. This is our challenge. The U$A has been corrupted and captured by the Financial Sector of the Global Financial SYNDICATE through the reserve currency.' Max also says

"The Financial Empire is not confident of its hold over the U$A."
<= I agree. and he asks where is Britain in all of this.. <= I answer the British were the original designers of financial empires. They adopted the feudal system so the resources of governments could be privatized into corporately owned private enterprises and assigned to Oligarchs. Britain was an inventive leader in enslaving the power and resources of a nation state (earlier it was done by colonization) to forge and extract for the pockets of its oligarchs, from foreign nations, massive profits.

stonebird @ 44 .. " the US has no way of changing direction as they have deliberately devalued their own leadership by putting Biden in place, to allow hidden groups to get what they want." <== consider this

Sushi @ 46 Can anyone supply a more coherent explanation?.. American retail stores are refusing to deal in cash, every time Biden gets a chance he gives money to increase the national debt (which burdens the USA taxed American). When the oligarchs pull out of USA governed America and move to China, Americans will be left holding the debt bag, basically America will be in the position Greece was, a few years back. Its oligarch, not the government. victim Americans will will be forced to pay the oligarch induce national debts.

Posted by: Max @ 52 "What fractal emerges from Empire’s boom-bust cycles?" <= the answer depends on which nation state supplies the reserve capital at the point in time of the analysis.

by: Gordog @ 58 explains that Oligarchs should use their nation states to take advantage of window of time opportunities to strength their war industries <= If there were no nation state to make laws of monopoly, then all expressions of the human mind would belong collectively, universally, and rightfully to mankind. This explains why I say war, mass poverty, and wealth of a few will continue until the nation state system is destroyed from within.

Jinn @ 65 says it all "The Ultra Oligarchs have a $700 trillion derivatives bet going on that there will NOT be a rise in interest rates due to industry starting to be active again." <=God will balance the gains against the losses..


max @ 67 and 69 If nations start adopting China’s mixed economic model built on sovereign money then it will reduce its PRIVATIZATION opportunities and bring a halt to its global empire dream. Now the Financial Empire is frustrated, failing and falling apart. Russia: Stability –> Security –> Sovereignty? <= excellent. but this is not a problem for most Americans only for those involved in the empire. Americans want what they had, which was something similar to the Chinese model. you picture. excellent thanks.

uncle tungsten @88 Jiri @ 94 <= nuclear concerns = disruption.

max @ 95 What purpose has the Financial Empire served, enabling it to survive this long? that's easy, it has ruined America.

Reggie @ 143 The economic model of the US is incompatible with war with China, consumerism is incompatible with war with China.<=The USA does not have an economic model.. financial elite have many.. compatible happens as soon as the financial elite in America move to China. which i predict will happen just as soon as the Yuan becomes the reserve currency of the world.

Gordog @ 145 China is showing exactly how it's done, and there is no reason that system can't be copied by any country. <= you are right

thank you Karlof1 @ 181..

lysias @ 189 WWI happened because Britain saw that time was not on its side. <= maybe? WWI happened because the oil and gas interest wanted to destroy technology and diplomatic competition and to position to take the oil from the Ottoman Empire. Both goals were achieved.. Wilson invited the British to use American Resources to help with those goals Bernays

Max @ 208
China and Russia, together want to end the US$ as the reserve currency and be SOVEREIGN now. <= single nation reserve currency is disappearing worldwide . .. it seems to me. ?

Gordog @ 211 "This entire 'industry' is like a giant lead ball tied around our feet. It has no reason to exist, other than for parasites to extract the sweat and labor of the people." <=large numbers of Americans have come to understand that..

Posted by: snake | Jul 28 2021 6:16 utc | 255

uncle tungsten 251

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 6:32 utc | 256

uncle tungsten 251

Try again. Haven't read the book, but a quick look and I thought about "Grapes of Wrath". US will at some point have through go through 'Grapes of Wrath' 2.0.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 6:36 utc | 257

@snake | Jul 28 2021 6:16 utc | 255

the flow of funds (the churn) keeps the financial sector in charge of the nation state system, that churn produces and replenishes the wealth of the Oligarchs on both sides of the divide. Derivatives are a factor.

I don't think it's as insidious as that. It's just that there's still money to be made and the benefit of the foreign income in helping china's domestic development is still greater than the pain of geopolitics.

If there were no nation state to make laws of monopoly, then all expressions of the human mind would belong collectively, universally, and rightfully to mankind. This explains why I say war, mass poverty, and wealth of a few will continue until the nation state system is destroyed from within.

I believe China sees it differently. Monopoly should always be in the hands of the state ultimately, to then be (re) distributed for the benefit of the people. Case in point is the private education clampdown. The exploding private sector is luring away all the teachers which will ultimately result in pay to play and the poorer will be shut out of quality education. The analogy given was everyone's view is blocked somewhat by the person sitting in front in a theatre. If one person stands up to get a better view and is not taken down immediately then soon everyone will stand up resulting in a poorer experience for all. There are plenty of private innovation and capitalism in China and the govt only shows its hand when it is clear that its further development is contrary to the common good. Which is exactly what a government should do, regulate. And yes some investors will be burnt. They claim they invested in 'good faith' but their faith was misplaced in a concern that is contrary to the long term good of the state. After this heavy handed triage there will be tuning to allow bona-fide private tuition, you watch.

This contrast with the west that the unaccountable private sector has political and therefore "regulatory capture" to maintain and further their monopolistic "market capture" at the detriment of the people. Look at the education and health sector in the US for example.

Because the private sector will always be steps ahead than the state a heavy handed initial approach is the only way to manage a hybrid economy (Chinese characteristic). Softly softly will only provide wiggle room for the private sector to again out manoeuvre the state.

On QE, once the defacto reserve currency starts printing the others must start too lest their currency appreciate so much their exports become uncompetitive. The difference here is that while QE was just a heroine hit for the west its free money to supercharge development in China (yes there were excesses). But at the end China has the future industrial capability to back up the printing (borrowing). The west?

Posted by: A.L. | Jul 28 2021 7:04 utc | 258

@ Max | Jul 27 2021 21:14 utc | 208

Good points, Max, but Baron sticks to his interpretation of the switchover between the old model of the economy to the new in both Russia and China. Not for him to turn to conspiratorial flavour in explaining things.

It wasn't Kissinger that set up China as a manufacturing centre of the world, to was the decision of the Chinese to open up for foreign investment that did the job after Mao expired, they were lucky because at the same time the West decided to shift resources from manufacturing to services, mostly the Anglo-Saxon West made the move. The other ingredient that kicks in, again roughy at the same time as China invited Western capital to form joint ventures in China was containerisation, a new way of shipping stuff long distance appeared around the mid 70s, the Chinese takeover of manufacture made use of it, in fact depended on it, without low transportation costs the attractiveness of China would not be as great as it is with containers.

And as for current labour costs, the minimum wage in China is roughly $120-$180 per month (depending on the region), someone in the UK on a minimum wage would make it roughly in 2-3 days, in the US in less than 2 days. To compare on the basis on the min wage is the best, one can get data easily, the rates are published. Add to it the low cost of energy in China, we in the UK pay about twice as much for each kW and you cannot but accept that making stuff in China is a win, will be a win until we find an answer to the labour cost differential.

Posted by: Baron | Jul 28 2021 7:58 utc | 259

Thanks, b, the caption says it all, and thanks to the barflies for their insightful comments.

Posted by: Paul | Jul 28 2021 8:20 utc | 260

Littlereddot #141

Kishore Mabubhani - A highly accomplished former Singaporean diplomat of Indian descent who has some very interesting things to say about the China US relationship

Thank you for the reference to Kishore Mabubhani and I went looking and found this masterpiece of his 2015 presentation "What Happens When China Becomes Number One?" to the Harvard - John F Kennedy jr. forum.

Note Harvard only uploaded this to utoob on March 2021 !

Kishore has some explosive things to say and the camera work is fascinating. He is lucky none of the audience were packing weapons in their handbags. If looks could kill he would be ash. And this was 2015.

It runs for 1 hour 15mins but it is prescient and loaded with understanding of the Chinese position and consequently explodes the idiocy of USA mismanagement of the day.

Salut brother - a diamond in the dust.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 28 2021 9:18 utc | 261

Hello again everyone - got nothing of value to contribute - just wanted to chime in before b posts something new and this thread dies to thank the few people who bothered with replying to my post at #21 with info about China (and of course: thanks to the other commentators too; this thread happened to contain a lot of China info).

Have a nice day y'all and don't let youself get too bogged down by the things going on right now.

Posted by: pachinko | Jul 28 2021 10:15 utc | 262

out_there | Jul 27 2021 22:59 utc | 226

China-Russian Military togetherness. from yesterday.

"Russian Eastern Military District motorized rifle units will take part in a joint exercise with China in August in the Ningxia Hui Autonomous Region."

and on the Western end of Russia......

"More than 8k servicemen will take part in a Western Military District large engineering exercise as preparation for Zapad 2021."
***
There is a big Russian exercise coming up so we have a series of US contra-vids: showing US machines hitting ships from Estonia.

"Spike NLOS live-fire demonstration from a JLTV vehicle at targets in the Baltic Sea from Estonia."

*******

pogohere | Jul 28 2021 0:03 utc | 233
Yup. Haven't yet had time to watch the vid, but it is always the bottom that holds the top up.

Posted by: Stonebird | Jul 28 2021 10:34 utc | 263

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 28 2021 9:18 utc | 261

Thanks for your comment, in particular the video link to the venerable Kishore Mauhabhani, iit is well worth watching:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RO3izbn201s

What happens when China becomes No # 1

Some ipeople n Australia would applaud a YKY figure to advance australia fair. . Of course a YKY figure would be a fascist dictator BUT he would get the trains RUNNING ON TIME!

Posted by: Paul | Jul 28 2021 10:36 utc | 264

Pachinko @ 262:

Sorry I'm coming late to your thread but have you considered reading Jeff J Brown's "BIG Red Book on China" as an introduction to current Chinese politics and society? You might also try reading Godfree Roberts' articles over at Ron Unz's website. Good luck!

Posted by: Jen | Jul 28 2021 10:45 utc | 265

pachinko 262

Go to China and take a look. Not some paid for guided tour. Simply fly over there and wander around. Hard to do know with this covid thing which is a shame. Great for five eyes though cos nobody can check up on their bullshit in person.
When I went there I knew we were being fed a lot of bullshit but still expected to see something of a police state. I came back realizing it was me that lived in a police state.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 10:56 utc | 266

snake | Jul 28 2021 6:16 utc | 255

" the US has no way of changing direction as they have deliberately devalued their own leadership by putting Biden in place, to allow hidden groups to get what they want."

Election shenanigans? who would have thought ......

I've been watching this for some time, its like a TV reality show that doen't want a finalé, as all the actors would lose their jobs when the show ends.

.

Posted by: Stonebird | Jul 28 2021 10:57 utc | 267

Posted by: Paul | Jul 28 2021 3:52 utc | 250

Of course it is political. Canada is a vassal state of the US.

I wonder if a person vaccinated by Sputnik V or Sinovac could take the government to court for discrimination or a violation of one's human rights given that the efficacy of those vaccines are no less regarded internationally and are safer than many of those Canada advocates.

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Jul 28 2021 11:12 utc | 268

I doubt if the US State Dept will understand the gravity of the Chinese warning. There is a very basic misunderstanding of the Chinese psyche.

Firstly, the Chinese are non confrontational. Whenever faced with an in-your-face situation, the Chinese will always take a step back. They expect the the other side will recognise this gesture and lessen the intensity of their tone. However with many cultures especially Indian and US, this is taken as either stupidity or docility, and they keep pushing, assuming that they are making advances in their negotiation. The Chinese side however sees the continued pushing of the other side as a lack of humanity or civility.

This will repeat several times until the Chinese reaches his red line. After this, the Chinese the retaliation is no holds barred. The other side will be shocked by the Chinese sudden explosive response and thinks that the Chinese are irrational or just plain aggressive.

You see the problem?

The present issue is, all countries' State Depts/Foreign Ministries are traditionally staffed with people who know the intricacies of the culture they are dealing with and adjust the application of their national objectives accordingly. They have spent years staffing the embassies learning about the host culture. Unfortunately ever since the fall of the USSR and the US had their unipolar moment, they have discarded the notion that they to deal with other countries as equals (or at least pretend to).

It appears that so few senior state dept officials are even inclined learn about the Chinese culture and psyche. Instead they only know how to push and bully. Cant get your way? Sanction the country. If that doesn't work? Send in an invasion force for a regime change operation.

This sorry state is also compounded by the fact US State Dept top positions are now filled by political appointees with little knowledge of foreign cultures, rather than veteran diplomats who have spent the time gaining experience in the relevant countries.

IMHO the US could have dealt with China very easily during the Trump era had he gotten himself people who knew the Chinese psyche and culture. The Chinese do not respond to threats. They may take steps back in order to keep the peace, but they are always expecting some recognition and reciprocation, an indication of civility. Trump made the fatal mistake of both threatening/punishing China and at the same time breaking the solemn treaties of the US. This both slighted the Chinese sense of pride as well as indicated to them that the US was not an honourable party. The latter virtue features very big in the Chinese estimation of a partner.

As an aside, if given a choice, a Chinese businessman would much rather pay more to vendor he knows is honourable, rather than a dubious new guy who offers a better price. This is the basic idea of Guanxi, a "honourable person network" or "reliable person network", and not the "shady dealings I scratch your back and you scratch mine" kind of network Westerners misunderstand it to be.

Back to the topic of Trump. If he had instead, after his visit to Beijing, complimented the Chinese and played up to their egos, he would have gotten 1000X better results. This is the Chinese soft spot, and it is easy use. Too bad no one in the US State Dept/White House has the humility to ask a real Chinese person who really knows Chinese culture. Instead what you see in the US are the likes of Gordon Chang.... WTF.

Biden and his regime has shown he has not learned the lessons either with the continued Blinken and now Sherman bullying actions.

I have no confidence this will end well, and am bracing for impact.

Posted by: Littlereddot | Jul 28 2021 11:13 utc | 269

Littlereddot

Through the Trump era, there was very little response or pushback from China. That Changed completely after the Alaska meeting.
I think the Chinese were willing to sit Trump out and see what a new admin would bring. The Biden admin is in most aspects following in Trumps footsteps so now the Chinese know for sure Trump was not simply an aberration but policy the US intends to continue with.
It was within a day or two that the foreign ministers of China and Russia had a meeting, after which they jointly announced the would take action against US colour revolutions in other countries among other things.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 11:40 utc | 270

vk @92: "...it [Taiwan] also serves as some kind of escape valve that helps China, as the USA has a card it knows it can always play if it wants a conventional hot war against China on favorable conditions (in the sea; far from the American mainland; therefore relatively few American casualties). This indirectly lowers the risk of an outright escalation to a nuclear war, as the American elite will always be able to delude themselves with the possibility of a glorious triumph in traditional warfare for as long as Taiwan exists."

This is very true, but Taiwanese are still Chinese and casualties there count as Chinese casualties. While America is perfectly fine with this, mass casualties on the island is something the mainland hopes to avoid. Of course, China is trying to arrange for the inevitable conflict (Thucydides Trap) with the US to not produce any civilian casualties, either in the US or China. A conventional war with little to no civilian deaths, very little destruction of infrastructure, and fought "far from the American mainland" is the ideal for China as it has least chances of "triggering" Americans into squealing for end-of-the-world nuke attacks. On top of this, Americans are massively overconfident in the invincibility of the US Navy, so committing the navy to action is politically easy for America. Towards this end the Chinese have been setting up the South China Sea as the battleground for this war; a "monkey trap" that America cannot resist, while at the same time being isolated enough from any "juicy" civilian targets for America to not be able to practice its trademark "Shock & Awe™" war crimes on. The war in the South China Sea will be a classic military-to-military slugfest with no opportunities for the US to do as it normally prefers and defeat its target by causing civilians to suffer (America is always eager to jump straight to "total war" and break their victims' will to fight by killing their children).

Escalation to nuclear war could possibly be avoided if the US is dealt a strategic defeat in the South China Seas and the Chinese can prevent the fighting from spreading beyond there. Even if the Chinese lose two ships for every one that the US loses, that counts as a defeat for the US because for all intents and purposes America's ships are irreplaceable. This is doubly true for aircraft carriers.

Such a conflict might be enough to get past the Thucydides Trap without nukes being used, though as you can see from the discussion in this thread the Americans are desperate to "Shock & Awe™" the Chinese into submission with a "small" nuclear strike.

In any case, this is China's intention. Whether it works or not remains to be seen. Keep this in mind when you are wondering why China doesn't directly confront the US in Syria, Afghanistan, or in Africa. Those are not places where a China-US conflict can be kept contained and civilian suffering minimized. They are places rich in civilians that the US can use as hostages "Oh, look what you made me do! I had to bomb another wedding party!" It's all your fault! Be careful or you'll make me bomb a school or a hospital!"

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 28 2021 12:21 utc | 271

Biden trash talks about Russia:

Biden: the Russian economy has only nuclear weapons and oil

Biden noted that Putin "has a real problem" as he runs "an economy that has nuclear weapons and oil wells and nothing else."

"He (Putin) knows that he is really in an unpleasant position, and this, in my opinion, makes him even more dangerous," Biden said.

Not satisfied, Biden then said that "[Russia] is already interfering" [in the upcoming US congressional elections], "spreading misinformation."

This resonates with my second comment in this thread: the USA is adopting a "ripe fruit" strategy on Russia, i.e. wait for its economy to degenerate and finally collapse so that it can take over and use it as a springboard against China. That's why the Russian media immediately realized that Russia is next on the list after Cuba.

Posted by: vk | Jul 28 2021 12:36 utc | 272

pogohere | Jul 28 2021 0:03 utc | 233

It is always the bottom that holds the top up.

Vid.
So Tuesdays are the days to panic?. Re; The scramble for collateral, (T.bills) was to cover a lack of "liquidity" (mobile collateral), but even then the basic reason for the panic was to cover their as"""s, for failed positions.

Could those that were in survival mode, be outliers and not the major groups of speculators? ie. They were covering positions for their own individual safety. The "mass" of holders in the derivatives market were on the "pay-to" side, and didn't move.
(Not clear there, as it is not known exactly who was threatened with shut-out).

This could possibly be enough to spark a riot as others became unstable at the same time.
*

Repros pay interest for overnight lending. That Tuesday was the selling of repros at a loss to cover other positions. The original reason is unknown. Collateral became the "safety" net, not the cause of the panic. (Which must have been the Bankers who had uncovered loans calling in.)
Although I can agree that the situation is screwed and that getting collateral will be the determining feature of who gets "to the other side", it is knowing the key that will start the final collapse, which I find interesting.
*

So I come back to the "inflation and continued supply of funny money", (funny collateral), to avoid any changes at all in the present financial MMT (Magical Money Tree), by avoiding interest like the plague. Returning to more "sound" money management. It would make monetary handouts painful if they had to pay interest, and couldn't make a profit from the Fed through repro lending/buyback.

Would that interrupt the Derivatives market, if they could no longer access free money to play?
******

PS. I Dunno, i'll ask the ten year old who knows more about computers than I do, if he has any ideas on the subject. ?:)

Posted by: Stonebird | Jul 28 2021 12:36 utc | 273

Link to @ 272: Biden: the Russian economy has only nuclear weapons and oil

Posted by: vk | Jul 28 2021 12:37 utc | 274

@Peter AU1

Yes. So many things happened those few days. Including China announcing that it would be reinforcing its nuclear arsenal. I expect that in less than six months it will announce several more thousand warheads.

Seems to me that they have both given up hope that the US could overcome its collective craziness. Who was it who said that "those whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad"? He was really onto something.

Posted by: Littlereddot | Jul 28 2021 12:45 utc | 275

@Blue Dotterel 268

A more charitable interpretation is that Canada is pushing for reciprocal recognition of WHO approved vaccines. As of now, China gives preferential treatment only to their own Sinovac vaccinations- others need to quarantine for 2-3 weeks.

Canada is in a bit of a bind in that regard because they used mixed vaccines and played fast and loose with inter-shot timing (mostly because vaccines were being hoarded by you-know-who). They also used Indian-made AstraZeneca which is not universally accepted.

Posted by: Billb | Jul 28 2021 13:04 utc | 276

Sending Anthony Blinken to Tianjin for talks really wasn’t ever going to be the best idea.
He had already played his ace card on the table at Anchorage. He was outclassed.
Neither would being conciliatory with his hosts go down well with the home audience or his owners in that Swamp on the Pond.
Rather, Wendy Sherman was despatched on a 24-hour stop with a simple brief – test the Chinese bottom line, which Beijing was ready to oblige.
Ms Sherman demanded to meet above her pay grade, but that was just for dramatic effect. As was the weather balloon about setting up Xi-Biden summitry. ( Not happening soon, maybe never).
What she got was a checklist of Chinese grievances, and to-do tasks, ` to put relations back on track’.
Mission accomplished. Washington has received, loud and clearly, that the Deng Xiaoping era of stoically `hiding your light under a bushel’ is over for Beijing.
Another Deng-ism may now be more fitting: `` When dealing with imperialists, one cannot show the slightest courtesy’’.
This originally came about during the negotiations for the return of Hong Kong to the mainland, when Margaret Thatcher tried to handbag the Chinese side into letting Britain keep its colonial treasure.
Deng tripped her up ( just saying) and the poor Iron Lady fell on the steps of the Great Hall.
Both sides are now very clear where the other is coming from.
Washington has sparked the trade war (failed). Tech war (sputtering). All-of-society response: pushing out researchers and students, inciting anti-Asian hate via media with conspiracy theories and smear campaigns about Hong Kong, Xinjiang, etc.
Whatever curve ball it plans to throw next, China is ready to bat it back.
As pointed out months back on this blog, whatever direction the Biden regime takes, Beijing will just roll with it.

Posted by: LittleWhiteCabbage | Jul 28 2021 13:19 utc | 277

Billb
No vaccine is 100$ effective. Any country that has kept covid well under control would still quarantine international travelers that have been vaccinated.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 13:22 utc | 278

Foreign Minister Xie Feng has us pegged, "The United States has abandoned the universally-recognized international law and order ... to replace it with a so-called “rules-based international order” ... [for its own benefit] where might is right"

China caught onto our game much more quickly than Russia and even Iran who had the misguided notion that they could purchase goodwill from us by doing us a favor without demanding something in return, like helping us in Afghanistan. Instead, we took that as a sign of weakness and abused them even more.
-----------------------------------------

I am now impressed by Dr. Fauci. I thought he was bit of a weasel because of the shifty way he handled the mask guidance but I am impressed at how he is standing up against the Lab origin theory. Multiple friendly cable hosts are giving him ways to walk away from the CDC's past collaboration with Wuhan and he won't do it. He says, 'the Chinese scientists are well regarded, they produced peer reviewed papers and we funded surveys of SAR's virus' not gain of function and are process of allocating money was thorough. We funded this research because SARs is located in China, not Secaucus'

He is refusing to agree with the hack, Josh Rogin that China is withholding information and has terrible safety conditions. The hosts, I saw two interviews, begged him multiple times to bad mouth the Wuhan Institute and China.

--- You might think he is wrong but he is not a weasel.

Posted by: Christian J. Chuba | Jul 28 2021 13:22 utc | 279

Excellent question from the video of the discussion by Kishore Mahbubani: "... if you want that world [where the US is #2 and China is #1] to be a peaceful and orderly one the time has therefore come for the United States to ask a very simple question: 'would the United States feel comfortable living in a world where China behaves just as America did when it was sole superpower?'"

The obvious answer is a despairing "Nooo!!!", and this is a big part of why Americans feel they must somehow, with bioweapons or nukes if necessary, knock China down.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 28 2021 13:24 utc | 280

What Blinken is doing now:

Blinken meets representative of Dalai Lama in India

Gee. Blinken seems to have connections to the NSO/Pegasus scandal:

Biden Advisers Ride on Pegasus Spyware

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 28 2021 13:56 utc | 281

pogohere @ 233, great interview.

Collateral scarcity leading to deflation.’
————

This hasn’t been allowed to happen but needs to happen. Ie real estate and stock prices need to deflate.

T bills supporting this Ponzi scheme does not bode well for t bills or the usd

We need fire sales and liquidations in these markets and need to concentrate on the real economy. This would also help correct wealth inequality.

Posted by: financial matters | Jul 28 2021 14:14 utc | 282

Littlereddot @Jul28 11:13 #269

Thanks for that informative comment.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 28 2021 14:41 utc | 283

A.L. @Jul28 7:04 #258: I believe China sees it differently.

I believe any thoughtful person sees the flaws of the neoliberal/neofascist framework.

But can China keep the jackals at bay - especially when the jackals are goaded by the Empire?

Social responsibility is a cultural value that the West has undermined for decades. Psychohistorian would say its part of the "civilization war".

Note: Putin has taken steps to strengthen cultural values, recognizing that a government that serves the people must, in turn, have the support of a people with strong values. Those that claim that Putin is neoliberal need to explain this and his resistance against the neoliberal West.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 28 2021 15:00 utc | 284

@ 253 peter au... i think you are correct...

@ 276 billb and @ 278 peter au.. i think this is a more accurate view on that from my pov as well... thanks..

Posted by: james | Jul 28 2021 15:11 utc | 285

@Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 13:22 utc | 278

No vaccine is 100$ effective.

They are probably 1000$ effective. Multiply that with a few billion people and you have a business case for a failing economy.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 28 2021 15:18 utc | 286

Posted by: Littlereddot | Jul 28 2021 11:13 utc | 269

Good comment.

Several days ago someone posted a link to a short video presentation which captured an essential difference between the two cultural perspectives. Below are a few quotes from that presentation.

It may be, as in Buddhist philosophy, one takes a firm stand in the end after attempts to create mutual benefit fail, not only protect oneself but, to protect the other from an almost assured dismal future due to the infallibility of causality, the other having been pursuing violent trajectories which disrupt harmonious development.

Also, I wonder if Ms Wendy Sherman whose earlier specialty training as social worker is tasked to step in as diplomat social worker — for whom?


“Harmony shall bring life to earth, while the attempt to create sameness will not last. Harmony is the allowance of diverse elements to be counterbalanced by one another, which produces growth while generating life and vitality.”
From additional scrolls of the Spring and Autumn Annals

American journalist John flynn: “ [The enemy aggressor is always pursuing a course of larceny, murder, rapine, and barbarism.] We are always moving forward with high mission, a destiny imposed by the Deity to regenerate our victims, while incidentally capturing their markets; to civilize senile and savage and paranoid peoples, while blundering accidentally into their oil wells.”

from As We Go Marching. (The bracketed part was not included in the video presentation.)

Posted by: suzan | Jul 28 2021 15:33 utc | 287

out_there @235--

I should add that my original query was specifically about non-ICBM missiles and non-ICBM firings. Do you believe that the same considerations apply to those? If not, what response would you foresee forthcoming from Russia in a non-ICBM scenario?

As already mentioned, NATO's dual-purpose missiles will be treated as nuclear armed by Russia, and those emplaced in Japan will be treated the same. Indeed, the main impediment to Russia and Japan signing a peace settlement to formally end WW2 is Japan's vassal status to the Outlaw US Empire as Japan isn't a sovereign nation whatsoever.

As for Russia's defense doctrine dealing with an op-force missile launch, the first priority is to eliminate the missile followed by its launch site and followed up by a strike against the ultimate source of the Command and Control apparat--Washington DC and Brussels--"We know where they all live" is what Russia has said meaning the warmongers will be directly targeted. In that statement, it was made clear that as much of the elite as possible will be targeted since they not the citizenry are the ones ordering the war. And this doctrine is for any type of missile attack. Russia's hypersonic missiles can level the Pentagon will before an ICBM releases its warheads for example. And I believe the Russians have something special for NORAD's Cheyenne Mountain complex, so there's no safety there either. The bottom line is you're pulling the trigger on yourself if you launch against Russia.

One other technological point needs to be raised and that's Quantum Computing, where the Chinese are way ahead of everybody, and its uses for defense--an area where discussions of its use are extremely difficult to find.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 28 2021 15:47 utc | 288

@ Christian J. Chuba | Jul 28 2021 13:22 utc | 279:

Fauci is now coming out against the lab leak theory -- in response to growing demands that his own GOF research be investigated.

He's not only a weasel; he might just be a criminal of epic proportions.

Posted by: corvo | Jul 28 2021 16:05 utc | 289

fm @ 282

My only problem with this interview is that it seems to be oriented towards capital markets and as an investment advisor I think he tends to see this as the real economy.

Those t bills need to be supporting health care, education, infrastructure etc.

Also it’s interesting that money markets are at the heart of the shadow banking system fiasco. Most people who park money there probably don’t realize that. In fact they probably don’t even consider it investing.

Posted by: financial matters | Jul 28 2021 16:08 utc | 290

@ Littlereddot | Jul 28 2021 11:13 utc | 269... thanks... that is an insightful comment and i agree with you in your viewpoint on this...

Posted by: james | Jul 28 2021 16:12 utc | 291

But can China keep the jackals at bay - especially when the jackals are goaded by the Empire?

Jackrabbit | Jul 28 2021 15:00 utc | 284

Via nominal regulations? No they cannot. The hits are coming too fast hence they will always be reactionary.

This leaves them with little choice except the heavy handed no warning cut-your-balls-off tactics on the private education explosion, ant financial, didi etc.

Effective, but certainly not to the palette of global neolibs and financial elites.

Posted by: A.L. | Jul 28 2021 16:14 utc | 292

Foreign Minister Xie Feng tells Wendy Sherman that the Empire has no clothes.

Posted by: Turk 152 | Jul 28 2021 16:33 utc | 293

Wang Yi and Taliban hold talks:

"China could play the role as a better mediator between the Afghan government and the Taliban for its smooth and high-level communication with both sides whose peace talks may be stuck in stalemate for a long time, analysts said in response to an Afghan Taliban delegation's trip in Tianjin on Wednesday and its reiteration of a previous promise of never allowing any force to use the Afghan territory to endanger China.

"China reiterated that the East Turkistan Islamic Movement (ETIM) is a UN-designated terrorist group and hopes that the Afghan Taliban will make a clear break with all terrorist organizations including ETIM, Chinese State Councilor and Foreign Minister Wang Yi said while meeting with a Taliban delegation from Afghanistan in Tianjin on Wednesday."

The article is very sparse with specifics, but after the Moscow visit it seems clear the Taliban want to promote themselves as reasonable and convince their two biggest potential partners that their ideas on governance have greatly evolved from its more ISIS-like past.

IMO, the Taliban had 20 years to open their eyes and look around at the West's deliberate targeting of Islam and use of extremist terrorists versus the East's attempts to consolidate Islam into its broader culture, particularly Russia's policy post-Chechnya and its promotion of Kazan.

Shoigu's comments on Afghanistan though few were important:

"Speaking to journalists on Wednesday, the military chief said US intentions to monitor the advance of insurgents from afar indicated that Washington still has plans for the Central Asian nation long after all its troops leave the country later this summer."

Escobar today at VK wrote that NATO's Terrorist Foreign Legion's being moved from Idlib to Kabul and says his source was Shoigu:

"It's a pleasure to see Defense Minister Shoigu now saying in public what I have been publishing in my columns for weeks now:

"Jihadis from Syria and Libya are commuting to Afghanistan - in droves.

"'Facilitated' by guess who."

Shoigu addressed the SCO Defense Ministers Conference in Dushanbe, and this short PR formed the basis for the RT article above. I couldn't find anything at the MoD website to confirm Pepe's report. Apparently, when it comes to providing press conference or speech transcripts, the MoD isn't as transparent as the Kremlin or MFA.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 28 2021 16:46 utc | 294

@ Baron (#259), “Anyone who does not understand contemporary history as a chain of decisions and events and instead always takes only the end link of a long chain into account – will not understand anything at all.” You’re completely missing the Empire’s trajectory and forces.

What were the global driving forces of 1950s and 1960s? Please answer this question to see what you’re missing. Let me share a partial answer. The U$A was the only manufacturing powerhouse after the WWII. This advantage started to decline in 1960s as the European manufacturing based on newer machines was back. This is the reason for the Financial Empire trying to capture Vietnam and find low cost manufacturing centers in Asia and LATAM to remain competitive and capture new territories. The City and Wall Street were supposed to be the FINANCIAL CENTERS and NATO the military arm of the Global Empire. The EU addressing the high end of the global markets. How to build and capture the mid and low-end categories?

It is incorrect to state the following as the primary rationale:

“the decision of the Chinese to open up for foreign investment that did the job after Mao expired, they were lucky because at the same time the West decided to shift resources from manufacturing to services, mostly the Anglo-Saxon West made the move. The other ingredient that kicks in, again roughy at the same time as China invited Western capital to form joint ventures in China was containerisation,”

The global trade through the sea route has been happening before containerization, which is just an innovation in the transportation trajectory, like the AI engines in the data trajectory. Before the manufacturing moving to China in 1990s, they moved to Asia (Malaysia, Thailand, Taiwan, South Korea,...) & LATAM (Mexico,...) in 1980s. The Financial Empire’s lackey Kissinger offered China an opportunity to absorb it in the Empire as a VASSAL.

China is intelligent and hardworking, it outsmarted and outperformed the Financial Empire. The Empire’s plan was for China to float its currency and then be captured like Japan and Germany. However, China knows Empire’s shenanigans! Who were Empire’s key players for the Plaza Accord? China outsmarted them in the trade deal! Learners are outsmarting the Empire’s lackeys, who are full of hubris and out of LUCK! Where will the UK (Usury Kingdom) go? What are its LIABILITIES?

The core (UK-U$A) of the Financial Empire has been ENCIRCLED and its pillars of power being DISMANTLED!

Posted by: Max | Jul 28 2021 16:48 utc | 295

Turk 152 @Jul28 16:33 #293

Excellent quip!

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 28 2021 16:58 utc | 296

Norwegian 286

Not a good typo that one. Yep 100$ effective but not 100% effective.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 28 2021 19:00 utc | 297

LittleWhiteCabbage @ 277

Margaret Thatcher tried to handbag the Chinese side into letting Britain keep its colonial treasure.
Deng tripped her up ( just saying) and the poor Iron Lady fell on the steps of the Great Hall.
Both sides are now very clear where the other is coming from.

LOL, love your imagery.

whatever direction the Biden regime takes, Beijing will just roll with it.

Well, the better part of me certainly hopes you are right. But with the incessant madness coming out of DC, I going to get me a another 5kg bag of rice to stock up my larder today.

Posted by: Littlereddot | Jul 29 2021 2:41 utc | 298

out_there: After reviewing the various posts by you, it is easy to see that you are a troll and absolutely insincere. The questions you are asking make no sense. There will not be a "drôle de guerre" [funny war]. The major powers will either be at war or persist in the current stalemate [cyber attacks, bioweapon attacks, etc.]. I suggest you read some history like The War of the Three Gods by Peter Crawford, which discusses the fifty-year war between the Byzantine and the Persian Empires that resulted in the destruction of both empires and the conquest of Persia and the loss of most of the Byzantine Empire's territory in North Africa and the Middle East by the invading Muslim armies. The bottom line is that if two of the powers are in a war that doesn't involve the third or a fourth if you want to include the EU, then the powers not involved automatically win. Obviously, that will not happen.

Posted by: Albertde | Jul 29 2021 3:12 utc | 299

Posted by: Littlereddot | Jul 28 2021 11:13 utc | 269 -- "I doubt if the US State Dept will understand the gravity of the Chinese warning.... Too bad no one in the US State Dept/White House has the humility to ask a real Chinese person who really knows Chinese culture....

At Anchorage, China made a supreme effort at peace, sending not only Wang Yi, the foreign minister, the opposite number to Blinkin' Blinken, but, in a surprising departure from protocol, also Yang Jiechi, the No. 3 in the CPC's top leadership, ranking up there with President Xi, and above Wang Yi, and therefore, also above Bluuudy Blinkener.

Blinken's tone-deaf 'power opening move' drew the deserved roasting heard across the world.

Now, those familiar with Chinese culture will note that, accompanying his angriest words, Yang Jiechi raised two fingers in a rocking-pointing motion at Blinkin' Blinken's forehead.

You see this when an angry grandfather scolds his grandchild for a major infraction. Or when a wronged man upbraids another for the injustice, in the moments shortly before a street fight.

Yang Jiechi would not have done that if he was not confident that the entire CPC leadership is behind him: you can fall from power for such an uncontrolled display of anger on the world stage if your CPC enemies want to do you in.

That is why the US regime does not understand the gravity of Chinese warnings.

That is why Wang Yi has lately stated that China, with other nations, will have to give the US a tutorial in manners next.

Posted by: kiwiklown | Jul 29 2021 4:34 utc | 300

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