Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
December 17, 2020

Open Thread 2020-99

News & views ...

Posted by b on December 17, 2020 at 14:04 UTC | Permalink

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William Gruff @97--

What occurred beginning in the late 1970s was Capitalists ignoring the cost labor had to bear in order to survive as Dr. Hudson continually points out. Healthcare, housing, transportation, schooling, childcare and other costs NOT calculated into the rate of inflation made US labor less competitive as it needed ever increasing wages to pay for the rise in real living costs. Look at the median cost of housing which was just shy of $325,000 at the end of 2020's Q3, while when Ford became POTUS it was @$40,000--800% rise in 45 years. "In the United States, the average selling price for a new light vehicle came to around 36,800 U.S. dollars in 2019," while the BLS estimated "the average vehicle costs $9,576 per year to own and operate," clearly more if you're paying for that new 36K car. By deliberately setting policy to inflate asset prices, the Fed has priced US labor out of a job, while as you report employers sought labor costs that allowed them to remain competitive. And since the policy is to inflate asset prices, not to lower the living costs for labor, banks looking for the best return are going to buy those artificially inflating assets--yet another massive Fraud Bubble a la Greenspan. And what does this do to Aggregate Demand? It's being lowered by the crowding out caused by the gross inflation in real living costs. Hudson rants about this constantly because it's been ongoing for 40+ years, yet it only seems to be a secret to the mass of uninformed deplorables who don't understand why they have ever less to spend after paying their monthly bills. Shadowstats shows annual GDP shrinkage to be @2.5% since 2000, which likely mirrors the drop in annual Aggregate Demand thanks to purchasing power lost to inflating asset prices. The additional affect was the continual shrinking of the labor market as many vacated the work force which enabled the government to not count them as unemployed. Shadowstats shows current real unemployment to be 26.3% out of what ought to be a labor force of 250,000,000 for about 66,000,000 unemployed, or about 20% of the entire population. Oh, and do note that all of that was happening prior to the pandemic's start.

The overall problem is three-fold: Asset Bubble, Debt Bubble, and resulting unsustainable living costs. Then sitting atop those three is the huge Political Problem related to solving them. This entire problem was discussed in depth by Steve Keen and Hudson in their recent podcast.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 17:46 utc | 101

@Posted by: H.Schmatz | Dec 18 2020 17:45 utc | 101

Consider that all that money that will be spent on highly likely non working vaccines, will be taken from public treasury, the taxes of those who still work....

While we are still in the second wave, with strict measures including curfew and impossiblity to meet peers to demonstrate/organize, conversations on impossing a new carbon tax on vehicles ( the same which will provoke the Yellow Vests revolt in France ) is being taken in Spain, plus another on pension reform to include in the final pesion ammount calculation the period of last 35 years, instead of 25 years which are calculated now.

One guess this is what Agenda 2030 is all about, saving financial neolibealism at our backs´ cost.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Dec 18 2020 17:54 utc | 102

China just finished a three-day long meeting:

"The meeting often provides a rare window for domestic and global markets into the Chinese leadership's reading of the world's second-largest economy as well as policy priorities for the coming year. This year's meeting has greater significance, as 2021 will mark a critical inflection point for the Chinese economy, when China seeks to further consolidate its steady recovery from the COVID-19 pandemic, start the 14th Five-Year Plan (2021-25) and embark on its next centennial goal of building a modern socialist power."

Improving the internal dynamics of its economy is China's primary goal during this newest 5-Year Plan, which relies on several subsidiary goals. Clearly, intense focus will be given to increasing China's overall Aggregate Demand as it continues its work in raising rural standards to become closer to urban realities. Read between the lines and you'll see an effort to avoid the mistakes made by Neoliberal nations.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 18:27 utc | 103

Mr. Vk

It is true that an unregulated (by the state) market economy, in which producers are producing for The Marker primarily, will self-destruct and with it destroy also the substance of the society in which it operates.

Western Governments in which the Production for the Market is the dominant form of production have always intervened in the operations of the Market. They also have used public funds to address glitches of the Market; I think sometime in middle 1930s the United States Federal Government became the largest de jur owner of publicly-traded companies.

I personally do not see any alternatives to the Market economy due to the efficiencies that it brings and the cocomitant innovations that it fosters.

Posted by: Fyi | Dec 18 2020 18:50 utc | 104

Mr. H.Schmatz

This mathematician does not have to worry about his next paycheck in case of a year-long shutdown.

A day-laborere and his family will gradually starve to death in case of a year-long shutdown.

Posted by: Fyi | Dec 18 2020 18:53 utc | 105

Lavrov welcomed to Moscow Syria's new Minister of Foreign Affairs and Expatriates of the Syrian Arab Republic Faisal Mekdad, who took over after Walid Muallem’s passing, and his delegation. The introduction was followed later by a presser that provided some reminders and updates:

"We confirmed Russia’s unchanged stance in favour of unconditional respect for Syria’s sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence as well as the right of the Syrian nation to determine its own fate and future. All these principles are clearly and unambiguously stated in UN Security Council Resolution 2254. All countries without exception must follow these principles." [My Emphasis]

The bolded sentence is yet another direct demand for the Outlaw US Empire to change its ways and cease its illegal behaviors. That was quickly followed thusly:

"The attainment of socioeconomic development goals in Syria is being hindered by the illegal (and even criminal in light of the COVID pandemic) unilateral sanctions adopted against Syria by the United States and some of its allies.

"We reaffirm our condemnation of the continued illegal presence of foreign troops in Syria."

This has made the continuance of the "Astana three" a requirement since "[i]t is the only international assistance mechanism for the Syrian settlement that has actually proved its efficiency and relevance." On Syria's economy, 2021 looks like it will be a huge improvement over 2020:

"As for economic rehabilitation, in the past few weeks we have adopted a number of very serious decisions, which will greatly enhance Syria’s opportunities to organise systemic work in this sphere. We continue providing humanitarian aid. We have delivered 100,000 tonnes of Russian grain. These deliveries will continue. We are discussing practical steps now. A comprehensive strategic programme for economic cooperation is being prepared.

"A new Syrian co-chair of the intergovernmental commission in trade and economic cooperation has been appointed this month. The commission is preparing for a full-scale meeting early next year, during which all these topics and joint practical actions will be discussed."

Lastly, Lavrov was asked to comment on Pompeo's most recent series of lies regarding Russia in Libya and the Mediterranean region. His 5 paragraph reply was as close to a tirade as Lavrov gets. Here's the first to give readers a taste:

"During the past four years of working with the current US administration, we have become used to the United States showing no desire, ability or skill when it comes to discussing their concerns openly and on the basis of facts during direct negotiations. The Americans and their Western allies have developed a trend of publicly accusing others without any facts, making these accusations part of the international agenda and, finally, presenting them as a proved matter. This is what they did and what they are doing regarding the US elections and the recent complaints about hackers. This is what they did in the case of the Skripals, and this is what they are doing in the Navalny case. They have no facts, not a single one, to prove their point."

Do please read the rest! It should be very clear by now after decades of lies, distortions, and the gamut of other prevarications that nothing uttered by anyone representing the Outlaw US Empire should be believed while also assuming the opposite is most likely true until refuted by genuine facts coming from an unbiased source.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 19:09 utc | 106

Pelosi Postpones Weekly Press Conference Today After Taking Covid-19 Vaccine

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2020/12/pelosi-postpones-weekly-press-conference-second-time-today-taking-covid-19-vaccine/

Must have hurt...

Posted by: gm | Dec 18 2020 19:11 utc | 107

Is this huge, huge, huge
or a nothing-burger?

Headline: Pentagon Abruptly Halts Biden Transition Briefings, Leaving Officials "Stunned"

Small: taking a break for the holidays

Medium: pressure for the Democrats to stop leaking anti-Trump stuff they gather during the transition

Huge: they have got the goods on Biden and now can prove he is a security risk

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/abrupt-halt-bidens-pentagon-transition-briefings-leaves-officials-stunned

Posted by: librul | Dec 18 2020 19:32 utc | 108

Whoa!!! Stop the presses!! Republican Senator demands bill for $1200 direct payments be passed but is blocked by another Republican Senator.

"In a speech on the Senate floor Friday, Hawley said the $1,200 payments to adults and $500 to children—modeled after the checks provided under the CARES Act—are 'the least that we can do.'

"'It should be the first thing that we can do,' said Hawley. 'And as these negotiations drag on and on, fixated and focused and hung up on who knows what issues, let's start with this. Let's send a message to working families that they're first, not last. That they are the most important consideration, not some afterthought.'

"After Johnson blocked his request for unanimous consent, Hawley said Sanders will be on the floor later Friday to demand passage of the direct payments.

"'This is not the end of this fight,' said Hawley. 'I'm here right now on this floor. Senator Sanders will be back in a matter of hours to ask again for the same measure... I've been proud to partner with him on this effort.'"

I can't recall the last time I read anything like that said by a Republican. Hawley is from Missouri, and it's extremely rare to hear such rhetoric from a Blue Blood, although his Wiki page shows him to be a series of contradictions.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 19:43 utc | 109

Slightly tipsy with victory, the prosecution in the Nuremberg trials pronounced that crimes against peace are the progenitor of war crimes.
By this standard, the US is the preeminent war criminal. The insistence that someone has to equate the US, who started wars against---wait, let's just list the ones that resulted in mass deaths in the hundreds of thousands, if not millions---Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and I think Afghanistan. The list of short invasions include Lebanon, the Dominican Republic, Panama, Grenada. The list of subversions putting into power properly bloodthirsty allies include Guatemala, Bolivia, Chile, Colombia, Honduras, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Libya, Syria, Somalia, Ethiopia I think, Congo, Rwanda, Niger, Mali, Burkina Faso...I think it would take a book to list them all. Simple random raids to kill people also are almost too numerous to count, but bombing a pharmaceuticals plant in Sudan is still notably disgusting. Subverting the will of the people in favor of the rich was a pastime even, if not especially the rich, as in Italy post-WWII, and Yeltsin's Russia.

As against this, the demand to equate the war-crimes of Russia is an astonishing example of false equivalence even for the internet. Proyect is a one-man band devoted to proving that, "Yes, Virginia, there really is a social-fascism!" It is amazing to think that even an old Trotskyite can't find a better hobby. (I generally use Trotskyist but Proyect, like WSWS, has been putting the -ite in Trotskyite for years now.)

The notion that debt cancelation, antitrust, soft money and, well, it's not clear what, are enough to reform capitalism by taming the cycle is not quite insane when formulated into a real program, as in the wishes of the Hudsons. But one, there are not very many Hudsons and two, they have no influence. Even more important, there is no reason to think long-term trends can be affected by even radical reforms: The growth of the productive forces has left a stock of physical capital that is too extensive to "earn" a high profit and the pursuit of profit by immiseration of the workers has both physical and financial limits. And, this titanic mass of productive forces in a capitalist system where raw materials, aka the environment, must act as constant capital, expended value to be used in production, instead of a utility, is now undermining the world ecosystem as a whole. I can't see any point to abusing Dr. Hudson but his program is not the answer. Worse, insofar as antitrust etc. is the program of the capitalist roaders in China, it's not the way forward for any of us. The greatest environmental threat is of course war in a nuclear world. The notion that a "multipolar world" is an improvement forgets (purposefully?) that this is a plea to make the world safe for war again! If the contemptible Proyect had the least sincerity in humanitarian pretensions, this would be an issue.

Posted by: steven t johnson | Dec 18 2020 20:17 utc | 110

Dec 18 2020 3:37 utc | 57

There is a REMEDY fur our political nightmare:

Every 2 years, elections are held. Use P2P and internet to agree that ...

Vote only for a candidate who demands a vote on Medicare For All.

Then, 2 years later, make it another 99% issue.

Posted by: chu teh | Dec 18 2020 20:19 utc | 111

William Gruff # 97

If you look at all of the decisions between the late 1960s and the present that impacted outsourcing you will find that they are all quite understandable and very pro-capitalist. Particularly far-sighted people might have noted that the day of reckoning was just being delayed and the can kicked down the road, but kicking that can almost half a century down the road made a lot of sense back then. After all, that gave America decades to come up with a Plan B. It only became a problem after we had gotten down the road to where the can ended up only to discover that someone else had taken the can.

Thank you brother Gruff, that is a perfect analogy. It always pays to have a Plan B that is immediately able to be implemented. My guess is that the USA Plan B was - invade some poor nation and plunder both the homeside taxpayers and the victims resources. In the case of the Saudis and Sunni occupied Gulf States all they had to do was bribe them with dazzling wealth and power (both economic and religious) and profit from the refined oil barrels.

The past two presidents have been looking for the can, the next one might have to create a better plan B fast or repeat the past Plan B just to be seen to be doing something. They sure don't look subtle/inventive enough yet to come up with a sophisticated, peaceful plan. Hint look at FDR / Henry Wallace as a start toward a socialist alternative.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 18 2020 21:36 utc | 112

India analysis and Modi's neo liberalism backgrounder. 25 minute Video from redfish.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 18 2020 22:03 utc | 113

William Gruff # 97
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 18 2020 21:36 utc | 113

The 70s was when they started selling the good redwood saw logs to Japan instead of cutting them up here because they could get more profit that way. At the time I do not think it was considered that the Japanese would be able to compete with us as well as they did, and I think the same applies to the other sellouts of our working class to foreign cheap manufacturing centers. You have to remember these people really do think they are better. They do think in class terms even if they avoid that rhetoric in public. The problem is they thought they could control China like they did Japan. That was dumb then and it looks even dumber now. You can see similar dumbness in their lack of grip on any realisitic view of Russia. Provincials really. Rich peasants.

Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 18 2020 22:22 utc | 114

Canadian Cents | Dec 17 2020 21:00 utc | 38

Just WOW.Thanks referral to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgzB4_Zw3RE

I worked electrical/nuclear with early Programmable controllers/and at maintenance at Nuc Pwr Generators and alongside Westinghouse and Alstom personnel, etc. and could not make sense of , for example,

1. Big rush job to "upgrade" nuc electrical control and s/ware at a pwr plant
2.Suddenly GE buys Alstom
3. Siemens intimately involved in sabotage of Iran centrifuges ;[BTW was at U. when Jesse Beams was spinning at 1 million rps., so I paid attention]

Well, reference link just explained a whole lot!

Posted by: chu teh | Dec 18 2020 22:49 utc | 115

add to my # 116, above, a point "4."...

4. Mitsubishi Heavy Ind. sells 4 unique steam generators to US nuc plant, , they all fail, and 2 operating nuc pwr plants are suddenly shut down...forever [SONGS]. The entire reasons for failure are true, but absurd in how the failures were "allowed" to happen. E.g., the certification process was grossly inept and failure was invited, if not assured.

Posted by: chu teh | Dec 18 2020 23:09 utc | 116

Bemildred @115--

I wrote this for the next thread; but after reading your comment, it belongs here since the Trump thread didn't want to have it. "Provincials" as you said who in reality are gutter-scum.

This may appear to be about getting Trump, but it's more likely about keeping relations with Russia in the tank. For example, I remarked this morning that the only media report about Putin's annual, impressive presser was the highly convoluted answer Putin gave to some recent fake news reports about his family and how they connect to the Navalny crap. It appears the writing has similar qualities meaning it was produced by similar sources. There's only one way to properly illustrate this and that's to provide what Putin related.

The Question:

"Alexander Yunashev: Good afternoon, Mr President.

I will take the advice from the young reporter [from the previous question which is also of some importance]. A number of interesting investigative reports have been released lately, for example, about your daughter, your former son-in-law Shamalov and other people who are allegedly close to you. This week the Alexei Navalny investigation also came out. Could you tell us why a criminal investigation into his poisoning and who did it has not been launched until now?

Putin: "I see.

"It is no surprise that these fake news stories emerge. It has always been this way and always will. There is a battle unfolding in the media space. Nothing new here. Do you remember the terrible developments in the Caucasus and efforts to fight international terrorism? How was yours truly portrayed by the international media and, unfortunately, in Russia as well? Remember how they portrayed me with fangs? I remember all this very well. Still, I have invariably proceeded from the premise that I need to be doing what I believe to be right for our country. When I do something, I do it not for the sake of pleasing someone abroad. This is the first part of my answer.

"The second part has to do with my close ones. This report is impossible to read. I flipped through it, since it talks about me, it seems, but it is such a cut-and-paste job, with so many things piling up, that I was unable to finish reading it. What did I want to point out in this regard? The report keeps repeating 'the president’s son-in-law' over and over again. At the end, however, he is referred to as the former son-in-law. This is the first thing I wanted to say. Still, in the text they keep driving home the message that he is my son-in-law. So this goes for point one.

"The second point is about 'President Putin forbidding the elite to hold overseas assets.' There is no ban preventing the elite from holding assets abroad. Public servants cannot have financial assets abroad. This was the right thing to do. They cannot hold accounts or other financial assets abroad. The company in question is 100-percent private. The state does not own a single share in it.

"The next question: who received shares in this company and how? It turns out that the company released a statement on this matter and what it thinks about these allegations. The company had a compensation scheme for its senior executives, and Mr Shamalov received stock just like all other senior executives. There are also other programmes for executives at a different level, and they received stock following a different scheme. Nothing special here.

"But ultimately, in my opinion, the most important thing is this: just now, aspiring journalist Shnurov asked about our hackers. What is written in the beginning? Note that it says that an unknown, anonymous person is pursuing goals we do not understand and then, apparently, this anonymous person is tracked down. What do I mean? It is said that what happened is similar to the events in 2016 when outlawed Russian hackers associated with Russian military intelligence hacked US Democratic Party members’ emails. Here is your anonymous person. I think we know who that is. Who called these hackers outlaws associated with Russian military intelligence? It was the US Department of State and US intelligence agencies, which are in fact the authors. At any rate, it is completely obvious that it was done upon their instructions. This is the first thing.

"The second is that the reference to the insinuation that our hackers, as they believe, interfered with US domestic policy in 2016 means that the purpose of this is clear. The purpose is to take revenge and try to influence public opinion in our country in order to interfere, of course, with our domestic politics. This is absolutely obvious. It is absolutely obvious to me and, I think, it will also become clear to the majority of readers if they pay attention to the things I have just mentioned.

"But to this end, I would like to emphasise the following:

"One should be driven by… now I want to address those who ordered these publications, not those who actually wrote them. I know that if they get an assignment from intelligence services they have to write it. But those who order these kinds of articles, should not be driven by revenge or act on the assumption of alleged exceptionalism; instead, they should develop relations with their international partners based on mutual respect and the fundamental standards of international law. Then we will be able to achieve shared success in the areas that are essential to all of us.

"Now, with regard to the patient of a Berlin clinic. I have already mentioned it many times, and can repeat only certain things. Mr Peskov told me just yesterday about the latest speculations in this regard concerning our special service officers’ data and so on. Listen, we are perfectly aware of what this is all about. It is about legalisation the first time around and now. This is not about an investigation. This is about legalising the materials from the US special services.

"Do you really think we are unaware of the fact that they are tracking locations? Our special services understand this well and are aware of it. Officers of the FSB and other special services are aware of it and use telephones whenever they believe they should not be hiding their location, etc. But if this is so – and rest assured that this is so – it means that this patient of a Berlin clinic has the support of the special services, those of the United States in this particular case. And if this is the case, then it gets interesting and the special services should, of course, be looking after him. However, this does not mean at all that he must be poisoned. Who cares about him? If they really wanted to, they would have, most likely, carried it through. His wife addressed me, and I gave the green light to have him treated in Germany that very second.

"There is one important thing that the general public is not paying attention to. It is a trick to attack the people at the top. Those who perform it thus propel themselves up to a certain level where they can say: see who I am talking to? I am a person of the same calibre, so treat me as a person of nationwide importance. It is a well-known trick that is used in political dealings around the world.

"I think, though, that something else, not these tricks, should be used to gain people’s respect and recognition. You need to prove your worth either by doing something important or by putting together a realistic programme with specific goals that can be implemented in a particular country, Russia, in this particular case.

"I urge the opponents to the current government and all political forces in our country to be led not by personal ambitions, but by the interests of the people of the Russian Federation, and to come up with a positive agenda in order to overcome the challenges facing the country. And we have many of them." [My Emphasis]

The rational flow is probably better in Russian with some key emphasis lost in translation. But Putin delivered the main point on the ordering and authorship, and IMO it's the same for much of the crap thrown our way since 1990. The only reason we aren't being treated to similar material about Biden is he's not one of the current targets, while legitimate anti-Biden stories are completely suppressed until they disappear under the rug. IMO, BigLie Media has become close to what State Media was in the USSR.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 23:39 utc | 117

@librul | Dec 18 2020 19:32 utc | 109

If you take that account that chief of staff Gen Mark Milley was meeting defence of UAE, Saudi and Israel since yesterda + one unannonced visit to Afghanestan than maybe there is something happening.

https://www.jcs.mil/

Elijah J. Magnier reporting..
My sources in #Iran tell me the possibility of @realDonaldTrump hitting specific locations in Iran is very high. There is a war preparation still in the air.

https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1339971985250660356

Posted by: _AR_ | Dec 18 2020 23:46 utc | 118

Re-upping The Jimmy Dore Show videos—for those who haven’t seen them—on Dore’s demand to the “progressives” to withhold their vote for Nancy Pelosi unless she brings vote for Medicare For All to the House floor:

I think it’s safe to say “The Squad” is finished. No one with half a brain will trust them after this episode. Best thing Jimmy has done this year.

Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 0:41 utc | 119

The petition is up at https://forcethevote.org, but it’s better to also call the Reps:

  Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez  NY-14  (202) 225-3965
  Ayanna Pressley           MA-07  (202) 225-5111
  Barbara Lee               CA-13  (202) 225-2661
  Chuy Garcia               IL-04  (202) 225-8203
  Cori Bush                 MO-01  (314) 492-8386
  Ilhan Omar                MN-05  (202) 225-4755
  Jamie Raskin              MD-08  (240) 847-4937
  Katie Porter              CA-45  (202) 225-5611
  Marie Newman              IL-03  (708) 625-6972
  Mark Pocan                WI-02  (202) 225-2906
  Pramila Jayapal           WA-07  (202) 225-3106
  Rashida Tlaib             MI-13  (202) 225-5126
  Raúl Grijalva             AZ-03  (202) 225-2435
  Ro Khanna                 CA-17  (202) 225-2631

Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 1:16 utc | 120

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 23:39 utc | 118

Thanks for that, very interesting. I don't think it's a problem with translation, I think he thinks very fast, you just get the high points, enough to follow along if you pay attention.

"Gutter scum" works, I stopped paying much attention, their work is very recognizable by the memes they select to attack whomever, it's very much a bunch of cliches by now. Mostly projection from what I can tell.

Interesting message too, my kind of guy, but I doubt it will be heard.


Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 19 2020 1:44 utc | 121

@ Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 0:41 utc | 120

Jimmy Dore is proposing a dumb move. If Medicare for All goes to the floor right now, it will lose the vote, greatly demoralizing the cause.

Posted by: vk | Dec 19 2020 1:49 utc | 122

This is awesome, he nails the dilemma which our owners are confronted with;

I'll put it this way: It is not as though the American ruling class is intelligent, competent, and patriotic on most important matters and happens to have a glaring blind spot when it comes to appreciating the threat of China. If this were the case, it would make sense to emphasize the threat of China above all else.

But this is not the case. The American ruling class has failed on pretty much every issue of significance for the past several decades. If China were to disappear, they would simply be selling out the country to India, Saudi Arabia, Vietnam, or some other country (in fact they are doing this just to a lesser extent). Our ruling class has failed us on China because they have failed us on everything. For this reason I believe that there will be no serious, sound policy on China that benefits Americans until there is a legitimate ruling class in the United States. For this reason pointing fingers at the wickedness and danger of China is less useful than emphasizing the failure of the American ruling class. The bottom line is the true enemies of the American people are no foreign nation or adversary---the true enemy of the American people are the people who control America.

This way of thinking points to a dilemma for the American ruling class. Contrary to a lot of the rhetoric you hear, much of the American ruling class, including the "deep state" is actually quite anti-China. To fully account for this would take longer than I have here. But the nutshell intuitive explanation is that the ruling class, particularly Wall Street, was happy for the past several decades to enrich both themselves and China by destroying the American working class with policies such as "free-trade" and outsourcing. But in many ways the milk from that teat is no more, and now you have an American ruling class much more concerned about protecting their loot from a serious geopolitical competitor (China) than squeezing out the last few drops of milk from the "free trade."

The Zürich Interviews - Darren J. Beattie: If Only You Knew How Bad Things Really Are

Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 19 2020 2:00 utc | 123

@vk

“Demoralizing the cause?” We’re not talking about gay marriage or pot legalization here. Do you seriously think that people will go “Screw universal healthcare!” if it doesn’t pass the vote? People want it because they need it. You don’t have to win the hearts and minds on this. All Democrat voters support it, and most Republican voters support it. The point of Jimmy’s idea is to show people that the “progressives” are not progressives at all and won’t use even the tiniest leverage they have to try to help the people, that Pelosi is not their friend, that the Democratic Party is not the answer, etc., etc.—opening people’s eyes to what’s going on and who’s who. It’s strange that a self-avowed Marxist like you doesn’t understand this. Your dislike of Dore must be clouding your judgement.

Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 2:14 utc | 124

@125 S & @123 vk

S is correct. The rationale for doing nothing is procedural based on the assumption of a long process to win - i.e. perhaps decades. This is what AOC is now saying - although she wasn't on campaign. On campaign, she was saying that we can do this now, and the voters knew that was true.

What Dore and many others are saying to AOC and others is that this long process used to be the case, but the situation has changed. We are now in an extreme moment. We're in a killer pandemic, and the issue is simply universal healthcare, which every nation has, except the US. It's crystal clear.

We are at a point in history where there is leverage to bring this to the floor and shine the light of truth on every poser, every hypocrite, every false politician pretending to support this cause yet failing at the test.

And then in 2022 they can be swept away, and replaced with more authentic people - and the job will be done.

That's the strategy at stake here. The job can be done. In two years, the lost vote of 2021 becomes the victory of 2022.

And since every politician can calculate this as well as we can, then, understanding the consequences of failing to support this, they might actually get the job done in 2021. That's how potent this moment is - and no procedural timidity can overturn the revolutionary potency that inheres in this political moment.

S, I applaud your support for this moment, and vk, I urge you to reconsider in this light.

Posted by: Grieved | Dec 19 2020 2:37 utc | 125

@98 suzan

Thank you very much - Texas v. White, as you say and I'm sure it is.

I shall read it again this weekend. it'll be like meeting an old lover at a reunion decades later. The heart is apprehensive ;)

But glancing at it now, I see that in the very beginning it narrates the secession of Texas from the Union and ends its preliminary narrative with the declaration:

"Thus was established the rebel government of Texas."

This case is evidently filled with juice of the ripest variety. Maybe I'll fall in love again.

I may have more to say on this - thank you again.

Posted by: Grieved | Dec 19 2020 2:53 utc | 126

@ karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 23:39 utc | 118... thanks.. would you mind sharing a link to the quoted sections in your post? you usually do! thanks..

Posted by: james | Dec 19 2020 3:08 utc | 127

@102 karlof1 - "By deliberately setting policy to inflate asset prices, the Fed has priced US labor out of a job, while as you report employers sought labor costs that allowed them to remain competitive."

I never heard it said so succinctly and truly as this before. That is what happened isn't it? The worker can't afford life anymore, in this country.

And if the worker can't afford the cost of living - who bears the cause of this, how follows the remedy of this, and what then comes next?

I really appreciate your point of view, which is the only point of view, which is that the designers of the economy, the governors of the economy, have placed the workers of the economy in a position that is simply just not tenable.

No wonder they strive to divide in order to rule - because they have over-reached through greed and killed the worker, who holds up the society.

How long can the worker flounder around blaming others before the spotlight must turn on the employer?

Posted by: Grieved | Dec 19 2020 3:12 utc | 128

Bemildred #115

You have to remember these people really do think they are better. They do think in class terms even if they avoid that rhetoric in public. The problem is they thought they could control China like they did Japan. That was dumb then and it looks even dumber now. You can see similar dumbness in their lack of grip on any realisitic view of Russia. Provincials really. Rich peasants.

Thank you, they certainly DO think in class terms ALWAYS. + Rich peasants is perfect :))

Thankfully they are blinded by hubris at the same time. The USA destroyed the Allende government in Chile in 1973. After the Nixon Kissinger visit to China in 1979 they assumed they could just pull a color revolution stunt when they deemed it to be the right time. Perhaps in their hubris they thought every Chinese worker would be infatuated with capitalism and growth.

They tested that out in the People Power colour (yellow) revolt in the Filipines in 1986 following a rigged election by Marcos. In 1989 only 16 years after China had been buoyed up with growth and development following the opening to USA capitalism, they tried out the same trick in Tienanmen square in China but those students were up against the ruling party of the entire nation - not the ruling class. BIG MISTAKE. The ruling party of China was solidly backed by the peasant and working class that was finally enjoying some meager prosperity and reward a mere 40 years after the Chinese Communist Party and their parents and grandparents had liberated China from 100 years of occupation, plunder, human and cultural rapine and colonial insult. Then in 2020 it was tried on again in Hong Kong. FAIL.

The hubris of the ruling class and its running dogs is pathetic.

We see the same with Pelosi and the ruling class in the Dimoratss today. They push Biden Harris to the fore, piss on the left and refuse to even hold a vote on Medicare for All in the middle of a pandemic. Meanwhile the USAi ruling class has its running dogs and hangers on bleating that "its wrong tactic, its premature, its whatever craven excuse to avoid exposing the ruling class for what they are - thieves, bereft of compassion, absent any sense of social justice, fakes lurking behind their class supposition.

They come here to the bar with their arrogant hubris, brimming with pointless information some even with emoji glitter stuck on their noses. Not a marxist or even a leftie among them. Still its class that matters and its the ruling class that we must break.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 3:12 utc | 129

@102 karlof1 and Grieved | Dec 19 2020 3:12 utc | 129

I did not understand inflate-assets/suppress-workers and forgot to return to it to clear it up. Grieved sent me back to Karlof1. I just got it.

That viewpoint indeed explains method of operation to accomplish the results I observed. When Nixon was forced to default on Bretton Woods use of Gold Exchange Standard* [the USD is as good as gold], then printing fiat solved the problem [threat to US inventory of gold]....but printing fiat [no longer redeemable as a promise convert to gold] became the new problem [no way to extinguish the promises to redeem/pay].

So how to proceed? Aha! Steal from the workers; squeeze 'em, entertain and dazzle 'em!.. Such an elegant solution...slow, certain and hardly noticeable...like slow-boiling frogs...an on-going project as we blog.

Now I'll read Karlof1's link.

Posted by: chu teh | Dec 19 2020 4:00 utc | 130

S, VK, Grieved

Can I add that the Pelosi gang will not hesitate to put legislation forward that will be diametrically in opposition to the wishes, ideology of the Squad. YOU CAN BET ON THAT. This will expose and be used to oppress the Squad as being socialists opposed to USA USA USA etc etc. And the Pelosi gang will never hesitate, they will attack and attack and have their press minions attack and attack. The Dimoratss will demand that the Squad vote WITH them on some mighty dodgy if not downright loony legislation, they will whip and whip the squad to vote with them - no matter what.

Exposing the feckless contradiction, the theft, the greed of the ruling class is the right stuff even though the time is never right. The time for Sanders was never 'right' but the time was the moment he chose to do what was right - win or lose - up against the lion or the mouse = he chose the right time and the right dialog and it galvanised action and an avalanche of power shift. Regardless of Sanders demise and broken promise, it is up to the current crop of success from the Sanders campaign momentum to reinvigorate the promise in the minds and hearts of the millions that reached out for change with th campaign.

Now is always the right time to set up legislation for a desirable future, yesterday was always the right day to plan better but today is the day to act.

Millions donated small dollars as a promise of their commitment to change and it is now time for ten or twelve people to donate their political power to demand change, demonstrate solidarity and rebuild faith with the millions today.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 4:02 utc | 131

Katie Halper and Briahna Joy Gray set out the case and Jimmy Dore demonstrates how the numbers can work to get M4A for Americans. Ten minute video and clearly spelt out.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 4:20 utc | 132

Here is a Katie Halper / Briahna Joy Gray peek into the Biden clown cart reality. Just as we could tell from the Trumpsters idiotic anecdotes and asides in the campaign and before inauguration, so we can tell from this leaked video about what life in the Biden White House will be like.

This 50 minute video is well worth the look or take a slice or two and savor. A strong drink could assist or the periodic break out for a prayer.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 4:53 utc | 133

re Medicare for All

The Democratic party has always specialized in co-opting the groundswell movements that arise from the street level up, and neutering those movements through a tongue-twisting and mind-bending variety of rationales for doing nothing.

And so the Democratic party sees its imperative currently as co-opting this call for Medicare for All. It has attempted this, and is still attempting this, but its efforts are failing. It cannot turn the impulse from the street into longer-view delays on getting this done - especially because both the tactical moment and the strategic realities are NOW, and the people know this.

~~

A clever Democratic party, deep in its back room, would realize that the only way to maintain its mystique as a "progressive" force now would be to concede the loss of its obstructionist position, and to allow the vote for Medicare for All, in order to save itself as a party for the future decades.

It so far doesn't seem to have understood this.

The Democratic party is enabling its own destruction and it will never understand why. And as we have seen before with multiple examples, this lack of understanding is alone the reason that any representative entity should die.

Posted by: Grieved | Dec 19 2020 6:01 utc | 134

@ Grieved | Dec 19 2020 6:01 utc | 135 with the rant about the Dems and Medicare for All

The US government has been financialized like the majority of the Fortune 500. Since the 1970's the trajectory in the US has been to reduce government spending on social safety net programs and privatize the Social Security Insurance program. While SSI was raped by Reagan/Greenspan/Congress and taken from the independence of actuaries and made a political budget football including false claims of being and "entitlement" program the safety net social programs fared worse. In the early 1970's, when I was familiar with the planning for and provision of social services like for developmental disabilities, alcoholism, mental health, job search help, infancy care (WIC) and drug abuse, the concept of continuum of care helped the different agencies collaborate and really help folks. Then the Fed stared changing the rules of the way money was to be spent that developed columns of services that don't interact/coordinate with each other as well as reducing overall low income support.

I also want to add to what you wrote earlier that humanity use to make other than the throw-away-to-churn-the-money-mill products that were both designed and built better/to last. It fits with our throw away food system with all that packaging and none of it refillable, seemingly by design.....
....
....
because as I continue to write here, its all about the God of Mammon instead of the support of the masses social structure with the underpinning of the God of Mammon way of life is controlled by the global private financed owned elite and the support of the masses way of life is exampled biggly currently by China.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 19 2020 7:11 utc | 135

Grieved #135

Exactly that. In one move to allow the vote, the D's could ensure their win in the Senate runoffs, maybe majority BOTH houses and cement solidarity with the unleashed aspiration from Bernie Sanders and thereby co-opt the lot.

But no, they seem to think that they individually are to pay for everyone's M4A. They are trained in parsimony to delay, deny, defer, negate to their own injury/extinction. These are losers. Politics as if people mattered is the art of the possible, the trade of give a little and get a good to share. In M4A the D's could put the nations taxes to the highest purpose use - ever and to everyone's benefit.

They could even have a health system better than Cuba and with more doctors and services per 100,000 people.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 7:22 utc | 136

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 23:39 utc | 118

IMO, BigLie Media has become close to what State Media was in the USSR.

With one big difference, the scope is global and the tools are… well, like comparing a pencil with the most sophisticated printing press. Overall the translation sounds like what I heard, and the main point should be that Putin is able to talk at length and just about any subject since it is very hard to think of a pre arranged setup à la 2016 debate when the questions to be posed had been previously provided to the Clinton team.

Posted by: Paco | Dec 19 2020 7:44 utc | 137

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 18 2020 23:39 utc | 118

For next year conference, if all the players and myself are still around I'll try to take advantage of the open offer to pose a question on line, I found out too late but there was a very accesible setup to do it.

One of the questions was chosen by VVP or his team, and it was from a northern village resident, complaining about the local health services, claiming that there was a single 86 year old nurse in charge, and that she was unable to tell apart a tonsillitis from a hemorrhoid. I guess this part could have been prepared, to relax a bit a tense atmosphere. But it had consequences, the mentioned nurse has sued the daring patient, maybe he'll get his suppository orally, so as to heal his throat.

Posted by: Paco | Dec 19 2020 8:15 utc | 138

Paco #139

Thank you that is a mighty good idea and a great offer.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 9:03 utc | 139

Medicare for All brings Dr Cornel West to the Jimmy Dore Show for 35 minutes of lucid discussion.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 9:05 utc | 140

@114 uncle tungsten

Thanks for the redfish video suggestion. Worth watching not only to get insight about the current developments in India but also understanding the global Zeitgeist.

I couldn’t avoid to identify the exact same type of developments and problems that working class and increasingly also middle class facing in other parts of the world.

The globalization of capitalism since the fall of USSR and Warsaw pact, has caused accelerated monopolization of political and economic power everywhere in the world, this was achieved by enforcing the same neoliberal agenda globally. No matter if you look at the USA, Germany, Iran or India, you discover the same type of “reforms”. Reforms that result in increased poverty, more and more middle class families are losing their socioeconomic position and becoming part of working class.

One come to the understanding that the “Great Reset” we are talking about recently, is not something new in the beginning and making, it’s only the continuation of an agenda which has been in implementation since 30 years ago.

Posted by: Framarz | Dec 19 2020 9:14 utc | 141

@114 uncle tungsten

have you noticed that terms like “Imperialism” and “Capitalist government” which were natural parts of the political discourse in 20th century have been increasingly replaced by “Nepotism” and “Oligarchy” in 21st century?

Posted by: Framarz | Dec 19 2020 9:42 utc | 142

Framarz #142 and #143

Thank you and I have noticed the shift in terminology. I try to avoid it as I believe in the need to be extremely clear about socialism and capitalism. I prefer to avid CCP and prefer Chinese Communist Party. I take care to compare western issues with how Cuba is actually doing. Keep making it clear there is a range of alternatives to private finance capitalism and IMF usury.

The weavers of deceit and theft that are private finance capitalists are indeed oligarchs and they attempt to crush any discussion of repossessing their wealth and redistributing it so that more people can do more work with it and generate stronger societies. The private finance vultures live in dread of a Tobin tax so I say bring it on. Wherever cash is locked away and idle - take it and give it to the people as it is they who know how to put it back to work and generate security and peace within communities.

Wherever power is monopolised in industry then force a devolution of shares to workers and unions and pay shares as taxes to the state so that dividends go to all including the state. As it is now in many countries mega corporations extort tax holidays to set up production units in the counties and dump the entire cost of infrastructure expansion onto those counties as part of their extortion. Information monopolies are the most critical to dismantle. Look at the west where critical journalism has been reduced to mediocre stenography and those with integrity are entirely reliant on other monopolies to squeeze their digital content between the pillars of censorious monopolies like twitter and facebook etc. These monopolies are managing public content and creativity and should be in public ownership - NOT just shareholder public but the entire public.

There is this ruse of oligarchs today just as in Venice in the 16th and 17th century where the Doges in their magnificence spy on the citizens and reward citizens for spying on each other, where social cohesion and solidarity is corroded and rots within. That is what the neo liberal and private finance agenda is - to monopolise $$$ and power and decision making within the hands of decrepit gerontocrats like Pelosi, Lord Rothschild, Rupert Murdoch, Queen Elisabeth etc, etc.

Enough of this rant... thank you Framarz. Long live those countries that have for decades repelled the evil that would crush their freedom and socialism. May Russia find its way to reintegrate socialism within its future.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 10:30 utc | 143

vk @123

I'm very disappointed in your flawed analysis this time. You are just regurgitating the capitalist mass media's defense of their establishment stooges in Congress. Jimmy Dore knows that the vote for Medicare for All will probably lose. The point is to get on record who votes against it so they can be removed in the 2022 midterms.

If the vote for Medicare for All is defeated then nothing is lost except for the House seats for those who vote against. Then it can be brought up for a vote again.

You, vk, have quite obviously not even listened to the arguments being made on this issue except those from the capitalists' mass media, and your analysis of the matter lacks Marxist rigor. Please do not discredit Marxism further with this shabby and lazy approach to what is being attempted against Congress.

Posted by: William Gruff | Dec 19 2020 11:04 utc | 144

@ Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 2:14 utc | 125; also Grieved, William Gruff et al;

There are three problems with your argument. I'll put them in reverse order of importance (the most important for last):

1) Who told you the American people needs Medicare for All? For what I'm observing, the American people is doing fine with 300,000 dead in ten months, and are protesting to extinguish all the restrictions to small and medium businesses, that the deaths would be worth it. Also, in this very blog it was published an article praising the USA's capacity to take a lot of deaths without incurring the danger of a revolution, praising the resilience of the American system; in other words, it is a myth Americans don't like death - as long as it is not theirs and their families, death is fine and even desirable;

2) Installing a Medicare for All would imply a very radical, very traumatic, reform of the American system as it is. Over the decades, America's privatized healthcare system built up an entire middle class that exists on being the middle man between the consumer and the hospital - those are the insurance industry workers. They also include petit-bourgeois (small insurance and lawyers who specialized on the area). In other words, the USA has a large class of kulaks whose sole existence is to suck off the private healthcare industry. Building a Medicare for All system would, therefore, imply in a very traumatic process of dekulakization in the USA, where an entire middle class would have to be destroyed or virtually destroyed (reduced to insignificance in numbers);

3) It is doubtful the USA even has the resources to build a Medicare for All system at this point. You can print the dollars, but you would still have to import most of the medicine from India and China and most of the medical equipment from China. Many highly specialized medicines for rare diseases also have to be imported from Western Europe (mainly from France, Germany and the Netherlands). This would further accelerate the USA's deindustrialization process, and weaken the USD even more. Over time, printing dollars to buy stuff from abroad will not be effective anymore, and the system would collapse. Long story short: the USA simply doesn't have the resources to build a universal healthcare system anymore.

Posted by: vk | Dec 19 2020 13:17 utc | 145

Three tales about the USA:

Meanwhile, almost 8 million Americans have fallen into poverty since the start of the pandemic

The poverty myth that there is little or no poverty is all too common. In fact, the United States has one of the highest poverty rates in the developed world. One study ranked the United States 29 of 31 OECD countries in 2012. When it comes to child poverty, things are even worse. A UNICEF report found that the United States ranked 34 of 35 developed countries – only Romania had a higher child poverty rate.

Do you think a nation like this has the means to build Medicare for All? I don't think so.

Combined wealth of America's 651 billionaires has jumped by more than $1 trillion since pandemic started

This is what Marx called "centralization of capital".

Numbers don't lie:

"Trickle down" comprehensively refuted. It was "trickle up".

Posted by: vk | Dec 19 2020 13:51 utc | 146

-uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 4:20 utc | 133

On Briahna Joy Gray

I think Jimmy Dore's M4A plan is exactly the right one, and has the best chance of succeeding/advancing the US toward a universal health-care system.

I also hazard to bet that the big corporations vested in the current private health system remaining the status quo think so too, and are sufficiently worried by Dore's plan.

Worried enough to bring in a polished media-genic, 'youth/identity-genic' corporate litigator lawyer like Briahna Joy Gray ( who worked at 2 corporate law firms) , and with carefully/visibly burnished 'liberal/socialist' creds (Stein 2016/Bernie 2020 Press Secretary; hired by Intercept 2018; writes for various mockingbird print media outlets), too co-opt and lead the Jimmy Dore plan.

And then make sure the Dore plan gets strangled in the cradle before the momentum gets too strong.

I think Dore sees through this too, and is wary and well on guard to keep it from happening.

See Dore's 1-on-1 YT with Joy-Gray yesterday:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4CyduP4RxM

Posted by: gm | Dec 19 2020 14:57 utc | 147

Radio New Zealand is reporting a new more deadly and contagious English variant of Covid virus. At this pivotal time in history, we all need some joy, not conflict. I hope the following gives barflies some strength and inspiration:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a23945btJYw

Merry Christmas to all.

Posted by: Paul | Dec 19 2020 15:34 utc | 148

vk @146

I pleaded with you to not to further discredit Marxist analysis. When you make posts such as this can you at least lead with a disclaimer that the post is not the result of Marxist analysis and is instead just nonsense that you pulled out of your ass?

Posted by: William Gruff | Dec 19 2020 15:54 utc | 149

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Dec 19 2020 15:54 utc | 150

I did not explain why a universal healthcare couldn't possibly happen in the USA @ 146; I explained why it can never happen by the stroke of a pen in the Congress and the Senate.

If there's outside pressure and a pre-revolutionary situation in the USA, then it's a completely different story. But there isn't; in this context, putting the whole thing on the floor will just legitimate both parties' position that the American people doesn't want M4A. It will set back the agenda by some 12-20 years minimum.

Posted by: vk | Dec 19 2020 16:12 utc | 150

Operation SNOWGLOBE:

[apologies if I missed this shocking story being posted here already]

SNOWGLOBE was the forward-looking 2015 FBI DOJ/FBI HRC $18M bribe-taking sting/blackmail plan to keep Obama/Deepstate in the catbird seat, and Hilary in line and under DOJ's thumb after she won the 2016 election.

This is according to the video statement below from former FBI confidential asset Patrick Byrne (Overstock founder used as FBI honey-pot to set up Maria Butina).

https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/293156

More background by the Duran's Alex Christoforou here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exN487f7q7o

Posted by: gm | Dec 19 2020 16:47 utc | 151

Here is another information rich link from what looks like an Australian based blog, which I admit I found for the first time today while researching the SNOWGLOBE story:

https://joannenova.com.au/2020/12/patrick-byrne-i-bribed-hillary-clinton-18m-on-behalf-of-the-fbi/

Posted by: gm | Dec 19 2020 17:12 utc | 152

james @128--

Putin's presser transcript is finally complete.

As Putin and others noted, this was a most difficult year. I hadn't read his concluding remarks until just now. I'm going to copy/paste them along with the question that sparked them. And it most unequivocally answers a longstanding question Billy Joel asked at a time that seems like it was only yesterday:

"Viktor Sineok: Izvestia, Viktor Sineok.

"Mr President, we have heard many questions about many different problems but mine is a little different. Over the past year we have understood, we really felt what it meant to have a very hard time, including emotionally. You said at the press conference a few years ago that you put your emotions into your work. Here is my question: what sort of emotions have you felt in recent years, including this difficult year of 2020? And which emotions would you like to wish us in the coming year? Maybe you already know how you will toast the New Year?

"Vladimir Putin: Please, be seated.

"As to which prevailed – the good or the bad… You know, each year brings issues we have to overcome, and each year brings us great joy – both family, and state, national achievements. Against all odds, we have great achievements that we can and should be proud of, and we are.

"Yes, the year was complicated, but what would I like to draw your attention to? You know, this is what I thought about when you were asking me this question. Haven’t we faced difficulties in our recent history? Just now, in this meeting I remembered how hard life was in the 1990s and the early 2000s. It seemed at that time that there was no light at the end of the tunnel, that there was nothing. No army, no economy, a ruined social sphere and skyrocketing unemployment. One out of three lived below the poverty line, but look at what it is like now.

"Yes, there are problems. Yes, people are still living a very hard life, and there are very many such people. That said, the foundations of Russian statehood, the pillars of the Russian economy, and the potential of the state are incomparable with what they were in the 1990s and the early 2000s. This gives us tools we have never had before. This gives us an opportunity to focus on resolving the most important, most urgent problems without forgetting about the strategic development goals of the Russian Federation.

"As for toasts, like every person, every citizen, I always have toasts for the New Year. It is only important that the amount of champagne and other drinks you consume is limited. As for toasts, the number does not matter.

"Of course, we will all raise toasts to the people in our lives, our family, friends and colleagues. But I, my family and friends always have one main toast – 'To Russia.'

"Not to finish my remarks on this pathetic note but on something heart-felt, I would like to say the following: during this meeting, some of my colleagues asked me what we were planning to do to support families with children and whether we have plans for this. This is what I would like to say. Some volunteers told me recently that they have various ideas and initiatives on supporting children before the New Year. Unfortunately, this year large events like children’s New Year parties have been cancelled due to the restrictions. Large events in theatres, children’s studios and so on have been cancelled as well.

"But still, this is an unusual holiday. It comes with expectations and hopes for the future and, at the same time, with difficulties. Therefore, before coming here I consulted the Government and the Presidential Executive Office. We agreed that our country, our state will also give a gift to our children. It is a small, modest gift, but nevertheless, we will pay 5,000 rubles to all families with children under 7 years old; 5,000 will be paid for every child in this age group.

"I would like to thank all of you for our common work. I would also like to wish you all the best. I hope we have not worn each other out. I would like to hope that the people who listened to us for more than four hours, for four and a half hours, have found this useful and interesting.

"For my part, I would like to say that the meeting was very useful for me. We will do all we can to give the best possible response to all your questions, concerns and problems that are faced by the country and each Russian family.

"All the best to you!

"Thank you very much." [My Emphasis]

We now most certainly know that the Russians Love Their Children Too. However given the behavior of the Outlaw US Empire, I very much doubt the same can be said, which makes for a very dangerous situation. Putin has a truthful sincerity to him that is utterly vacant from every US President I've known in my life except for JFK--he made a very positive impression on my very young mind, something that was clearly missing from LBJ and Nixon prior to my rather abrupt awakening in 1970. Perhaps that's because none ever promised to do anything for Commonfolk as anything aimed at promoting the people's wellbeing was always opposed. I don't know how the average Russian feels about Putin's words, but I would be very proud to have such a leader as focused on the wellbeing of what makes his Nation great--its people.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 19:28 utc | 153

Oh, how nice of Typepad to finally post my comment! When it refused, I filled it out some more and made it into an article at my VK space, entitled "Russian's Love Their Children; Americans get ready to evict millions at first of January." It's my hope that other barflies will make an effort to make this vast chasm in morality noticed by the wider world. If I had Twitter, I'd try to make such a chasm go viral, but I don't. And I hope people will understand why I pasted that entire entry.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 20:17 utc | 154

More research on SNOWGLOBE and Patrick Byrne; apparently taken from some blog, journal or interviews done by Byrne himself:

https://uncoverdc.com/2020/10/21/patrick-byrne-the-story-behind-the-clinton-bribe/ (Oct 21, 2020)

This goes all the way back to 2005, and comes forward to the present. Reads kind of krazytown in places right from the start:

For example, secret meetings in 2005-2006 with then-Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Arlen Specter [~ the time Spector had just been diagnosed with Hodgkin's lymphoma--Spector died in 2011] together with other senators, and a letter of immunity for Byrne which Senator(s) placed on file in secure-storage at DoJ in excchange for some service Byrne says he agreed to do at their request).

Its a several thousand word long post, sounding in places pretty unbelievable, and ending with the quote:

“You told me to find you the Deep State, I found you the Deep State.”

Crazy? maybe...but then again an awful lot of crazy, unbelievable things have been happening and coming to light as being true, especially in recent time off these last two years.

Posted by: gm | Dec 19 2020 20:33 utc | 155

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 20:17 utc | 155

Thank you for the transcript, must have been a pain to get done, much appreciated.

Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 19 2020 20:49 utc | 156

On the M4A initiative, I'd like to note that Medicare isn't free; you must pay a premium and it doesn't cover a raft of things, some that are very expensive like in-home care or LTC for Alzheimer's. In other words, it's not a panacea, although it is better than nothing, which is the point. However, Universal Single Payer that covers everything IMO is the best course of action and will put Big Med and Big Pharma where they out to be--Out of Business.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 21:07 utc | 157

Important movement on Assange front given the huge pushback related to Heritage Foundation press release. Trump did say a string of pardons are in the works.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 21:25 utc | 158

gm #148

Thank you gm. I see the Dore move has quickly built a coalition across the spectrum to give M4A a fighting chance and to separate it from the cult of the individual. The Squad is the sticking/opportunity point and those are the trigger voters that will likely avalanche Pelosi out of the chair and finally out of office. There is a chance that a rogue outside the Squad could also declare a pro M4A vote and demand Pelosi DO IT.

I get it that Briahna Joy Gray is likely a conservative product of the USAi education/grooming machine. Bernie Sanders campaign appears to have had many. Yet (I guess) they had vaguely leftish tendencies whatever that means in the USA spectrum. Thanks for the video link. I am mindful that Katie Halper is a big promoter of Briahna and she has never seen (expressed) the deception and sellout of Sanders AFAIK. At least Halper has never called out Sanders betrayal. She too is a product of the USA monopoly/deception politics indoctrination. They do their best from their view through the Overton window.

Its a broad coalition of D and R and many who could never bring themselves to vote for this tragic system that calls itself democracy.

You say

"I also hazard to bet that the big corporations vested in the current private health system remaining the status quo think so too, and are sufficiently worried by Dore's plan.

Worried enough to bring in a polished media-genic, 'youth/identity-genic' corporate litigator lawyer like Briahna Joy Gray ( who worked at 2 corporate law firms) , and with carefully/visibly burnished 'liberal/socialist' creds (Stein 2016/Bernie 2020 Press Secretary; hired by Intercept 2018; writes for various mockingbird print media outlets), too co-opt and lead the Jimmy Dore plan.

And then make sure the Dore plan gets strangled in the cradle before the momentum gets too strong.

I think Dore sees through this too, and is wary and well on guard to keep it from happening."

That is a clear analysis of the players IMO. You can bet the industry heavyweights have by now already gamed out their sabotage of the move and are mobilising voices to confuse it and diminish it - that seems clear to me from the videos at both Dore and Halper. Plus the industry will have gamed the amendment strategies for when the Bill hits the Congress floor. There will be mayhem when that happens and they will both make it and drive it. These stakes are mighty high. They will already have gamed the replacement for Pelosi when/if she quits in the next few weeks. (That might even be their first big ploy).

The Insurance ghouls own an industry that filches the public and private purse, they own the candidates (well most) in their primaries and they own them once elected. Then they own both political parties. I assume they own many Hospitals and clinics too. Transforming this to M4A will be like separating two mighty strong magnets and then finding some way of keeping them apart. Without a tightly price capped medical service regime the system will be gamed mercilessly.

Time will tell.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 21:35 utc | 159

karlof1 #159

Thank you for that link to the Assange story. His role over past decades and his current gross mistreatment by the thugees in the UKi cross the boundaries of many. I trust here are enough people of good will to set him free. The cowards within the Australian Government have neither the brains nor the strength of character to stand up to the UKi or the USAi. Deplorables!

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 21:46 utc | 160

@ karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 19:28 utc | 154 / 155 .. thanks karlof1! yes - the difference between russia giving the children some money and the thought of the usa on the edge of evicting many people is a sad overview that you've captured...

i see the comments on navalny in the transcript.. thank you!

Posted by: james | Dec 19 2020 21:50 utc | 161

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 19:28 utc | 154
"It is a small, modest gift, but nevertheless, we will pay 5,000 rubles to all families with children under 7 years old; 5,000 will be paid for every child in this age group."

That's more than I'm giving any of my family!

Posted by: tucenz | Dec 19 2020 22:14 utc | 162

@vk #151:

. . .in this context, putting the whole thing on the floor will just legitimate both parties' position that the American people doesn't want M4A.

More nonsense. How can a vote by representatives serve as evidence of what the U.S. people want?


1. The absolute majority of U.S. citizens want Medicare For All. That’s a basic fact that has been established by multiple public opinion polls.

2. If the “progressives” refuse to implement Dore’s idea, that will show them to be liars—a useful outcome.

3. If the “progressives” follow Dore’s idea, but Pelosi refuses to bring the vote to the floor, a process for selecting a new speaker will commence during which the “progressives” will be able to demand the same thing from any prospective candidate—a useful outcome.

4. If Pelosi brings the vote to the floor, but it doesn’t pass, that will show the Democratic Party to be working against its voters on a major issue—a useful outcome.

5. Those who force the vote on Medicare For All and vote for it will be re-elected, those who don’t will not.

Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 22:35 utc | 163

@ Posted by: S | Dec 19 2020 22:35 utc | 164

More nonsense. How can a vote by representatives serve as evidence of what the U.S. people want?

Don't they do political campaigning in the USA? How were they elected?

Posted by: vk | Dec 19 2020 22:38 utc | 164

Yesterday, China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi had a video-conference with the Outlaw US Empire's Asia Society that was covered in a series of Global Times articles. In this one, the tone is conciliatory and a few more direct quotes from Wang are provided, like these two:

"China-U.S. relations are never a zero-sum game, and the success of either party is not at the expense of the failure of the other party."

"We hope the United States can work with China to rebuild a strategic framework for the stable and sound development of bilateral ties, with mutual respect as the premise, enhanced dialogue and consultation as the approach, deepened integration of interests as the driving force, and solid foundation of public opinion as the support."

The second is far more confrontational:

"Despite China's earnest efforts to build China-US relations on the basis of coordination, cooperation and stability, some US politicians continue to make strategic miscalculations, Chinese State Councilor and Foreign Minister Wang Yi said on Friday.

“What we see and hear every day from almost all senior officials of the US government are attacks and accusations toward China without real evidence. [Sounds like Lavrov & Putin] Some attacks contain the presumption of guilt or are used as some sort of emotional catharsis...”

"Wang said some US politicians have made a series of strategic misjudgments on China-related issues.

"They have neglected the broad common interests and room for cooperation by listing China as a 'major competitor,' even a 'threat.'

[Wang stated] “This is an error. China is not a threat to the US. It has not been in the past and will not be in the future.”

IMO, only the Outlaw US Empire's policy toward China can render China into an enemy, and Wang's remarks are clearly aimed at Biden's team.

The Outlaw US Empire's attempts to undermine the rapidly growing multilateralism of the planet's nations led to Wang's best reported line:

"This is the era of globalization, and the interests of all countries are interrelated."

That point is one the biased Asia Society can hardly ignore, unlike the Outlaw US Empire's Pompeo and Trump.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 22:49 utc | 165

Every D-Party candidate that said they'd vote yea on M4A was re-/elected; all those that didn't lost. I posted an article about that outcome two days after the election--the point was made by AOC.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 22:53 utc | 166

re: "Time will tell."

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 21:35 utc | 160

Agreed. It is going to be a [another] YUGE fight if the PTB can't stop it from getting out into the open...

And Dore is striking at the opportune moment now, while the iron is hot, while the domestic deep state (the de facto servants/protectors to the interests of our Overlords) is busy/tied up fighting, and to finish off and complete the election steal coup against Trump.

If the US can ever get to a health care system like that of Japan or Canada, I think many (including Dore (?) would consider it a YUGE victory.

It would also drive reduction of the US budget available to fund MIC and 3-letter agency abuses/atrocities/war crimes and and treason.

Posted by: gm | Dec 19 2020 22:56 utc | 167

vk #151

You said:

"If there's outside pressure and a pre-revolutionary situation in the USA, then it's a completely different story. But there isn't;"

You fail to see the situation in the USA. I assumed that for a poster that pontificates on multiple issues, that you are capable of some analysis and insight. Clearly that assumption is nonsense.

I now figure that you are a distraction and you cannot see the bleeding bloody obvious. Or that you willfully post BS.


There is a huge aspiration in the USA to change the system that has trapped them.
There is huge and growing poverty
There is current and imminent homelessness
There is a grotesquely inflated private finance pricing system that enslaves people for life
There is a pandemic in full swing and totally uncontrolled and people see that others have saved their nations
There are massive job layoffs and imminent evictions for entire families
There are kilometer long queues to get food aid
There Pelosi showing their fridges full of ice cream to weather the pandemic
There is monopoly control of media and internet and social networks
There are billionaires parading their gross lifestyles across the media
There are mass demonstrations against inequality
There are militarised police
There are after dark suburbs aflame that can't be stopped


and you suggest there is no evidence of pre-revolutionary conditions


There are clear voices calling for a more humane service economy
There are clear voices explaining how the USA has become an open air prison where poverty is enforced
There are clear voices celebrating billionairs and their financial cleverness
There are USA soldiers in every continent on earth and many island nations too
There is a Congress and Senate that serves every need of the Military Industrial Complex
There is a Congress and Senate that pours $$$ Trillions into the wall street banks and billionairs

Barely a penny is dropped in front of the poor, the ill, the children, the students, the families, the workers


and you suggest there is no evidence of pre-revolutionary conditions.


Some have managed to escape their delusion, their indoctrination. their gullibility
Some are able to seize the hour and strive to change the paradigm
Others are lost in their illusion and at the same time are supporting th status quo

I am with the change makers, you clearly are not.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 23:05 utc | 168

Kyle Kulinsky calls out hopeless Joe as being another first term time waster as he gets immediately conned by scumbag Dem senators. A good takedown in a three minute video.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 19 2020 23:37 utc | 169

[Focus Group Time]

New pro-Trump short propaganda video ad (1:39 min)

"FIGHT FOR TRUMP!" SAVE AMERICA - SAVE THE WORLD

Stylistically, does it work on you?

Posted by: gm | Dec 20 2020 1:25 utc | 170

Below is a combination of two Reuters postings that describes the posturing between China and the West in regards to finance

"
SHANGHAI (Reuters) - China has drawn up new rules that will allow authorities to review foreign investment on national security grounds, the country’s state planning agency said on Saturday.

The new review system will cover foreign investments in military sectors as well as “important” investment in energy, natural resources, agriculture, internet technology and financial services, the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC) said.

The NDRC said the review system was in line with international practice and would help balance the economic benefits of further opening with the need to ensure national security.
"
"
Publishing the investment rules is “not protectionism or backtracking from opening-up policies,” the NDRC said, asserting that “opening up without protection is not sustainable.”
"

IMO, this is the core of the civilization war being fought between the private finance based West and the public finance based China.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 20 2020 2:17 utc | 171

It has come to this.

Many in the world look at US behaviour and miss these subtleties as to how it has come to this. Perhaps it was destined to end this way and now the elitist scientism and professionalism is being visited on the children. Plus the fear of unionism, collectivism, social services made possible by taxes etc, etc has brought emus home to roost.

For those who comprehend a long and disturbing read and have a desire to peek inside the US elite suburban beast. THIS is dysfunction at its best and it is entirely within the elite and no doubt everywhere else right now.

This a FUBAR planted in the future of every child. And not just in the US.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 2:25 utc | 172

gm #171

Good find gm. I am certain I saw Leni Riefenstahl at 0:24 - on the motorbike.

Stylistically it made my arm twitch ;)

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 2:32 utc | 173

AOC loses her committee position to another rightist democrat after the rightist democrat threatened to not vote for Pelosi unless she got the committee position.

This Jimmy Dore video of thirteen minutes will peel the scales from your eyes.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 2:55 utc | 174

@ uncle tungsten # 173 with the Slate link about American "education"...thanks

I had to bring over one quote from the article that uses my latest descriptive term for the period we are going through
"
The whole thing could only be diagnosed, in that community’s collective clinical opinion, as a shitshow.
"

A shitshow here, a shitshow there, pretty soon the whole place starts to stink.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 20 2020 3:11 utc | 175

@ uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 2:32 utc | 174

Exactly. I sensed a Leni Riefenstahl riff or two there also. I had vague reminders of old nazi prop. films like "triumph of the will" (TOW) we were shown in my [US] Catholic grade school a long time ago.

Tried to refresh memories of Leni R. cinematographic techniques and compare for similarities with the Trump ad in question, by trying to scroll back thru an old copy of TOW on youtube.

But guess what? -- YouTube has *censored/deleted* ToW.

YOU can no longer access historical clips the nuns showed us in 5th grade any more because it is now considered "offensive content"?

Please pinch me. Is this still the "Home of the Brave and the Land of the Free"?

Anyway...back to my main point, I personally felt strongest impacts [unexplainably] from the segments with the speeded up vehicles moving around the bend with people lined up along the curb, the trucks moving down center lane of highway quickly while both side lanes of traffic were stopped, and the final scene in the [West Point(?)] stadium with the cadets waving vigorously in the stands.

I don't know why these three specific scenes were most visually impactful to me.

Posted by: gm | Dec 20 2020 4:04 utc | 176

Posted by: gm | Dec 20 2020 1:25 utc | 171

The video: suitable for torturing prisoners at Gitmo. Brain fry in no time. They say he likes Adderal.

Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 20 2020 4:18 utc | 177

Impactful scenes indeed.

Well here is a mighty M4A interview with Jimmy Dore, Aaron Mate Ben Norton, later Katy Halper from a long Grayzone piece. These four on line at once is a good look and the fuse is lit I'd say.

This dissects many elements from Jimmy Dore's manners ;) to deceit and sellout politics.

Sellout D's and apologists for do nothing strategies should hang their heads in shame.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 5:37 utc | 178

@175 uncle tungsten

Yep. Brilliant. 14 minutes of pure gold. Politics 101, explained by a comedian who has riled the establishment and made the bootlickers squirm and distort themselves to appear genuine and not be revealed as empty phonies.

And AOC gets the bootlicker's reward. She gets the boot in the face, courtesy Nancy. And as Jimmy articulates so well, AOC is still going to vote for Pelosi no matter how much Pelosi kicks her.

What a pathetic loss of position for AOC with the people who voted for her. What a betrayal. And all the progressives have now been removed from committee power by Pelosi in favor of corporate shills, who will set the legislative agenda for the next two years.

I know all this because a comedian just explained it to me, in detail. Alexandria, you should have listened to Jimmy. Not too late to force the vote for M4A - having thrown away all your integrity, what do you have left to lose?

Posted by: Grieved | Dec 20 2020 5:46 utc | 179

@ Grieved | Dec 20 2020 5:46 utc | 180 with the M4A and AOC detail...thanks

I can't pay as close attention to the shit show as you and others. The capitulation by AOC isn't surprising to me....here is the short version of the backroom conversation...

Pelosi... AOC, you have been raising all sorts of good questions about changes that should be made in our country but, I ask you because this M4A meme represents a serious bottom-up push, do you really believe that your support represents the will of the people or you not doing your job?

AOC...Well I thought that we are suppose to represent the will of the people?

Pelosi...Remember AOC, it was Mitt Romney that normalized the concept that corporations are people. Are you forgetting that? But more than that, think of the implications of those behind M4A setting some precedent of influencing our machinations. We had to shut down Occupy because it was raising too much awareness and letting this M4A meme gain any sort of credibility is off the table....Understand?????

AOC....I understand.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 20 2020 7:22 utc | 180

thanks uncle t for the dore vid.... i wonder how the cheerleader is going to spin this?

Posted by: james | Dec 20 2020 7:55 utc | 181

psychohistorian #172

IMO, this is the core of the civilization war being fought between the private finance based West and the public finance based China.

Thank you for that reminder. The Israeli attack on Iranian centrifuges followed by the destructive USAi attack on the Venezuelan energy generators and grid network is enough to tell any nation that you would never let a western company invest or construct anything in a security sensitive industry. The assault on Huawei including executive kidnapping has added insult to injury and there is every reason for every nation in the world to be taking every precaution from this time on.

Breaking the singular USAi technology monopoly is a beneficial thing for the world as the innovation unleashed could assist in providing secure infrastructure and liberation from global private vulture finance schemes.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 8:08 utc | 182

james #182

A cheerleader is trained to cheer anything and everything the team does except when in a forest of bears who's porridge has been kept from them. That's not a calm space to be in right now.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 8:56 utc | 183

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 19 2020 19:28 utc | 154

Please forgive the pedant in me, but wasn't that lyric from a Sting song?

Thanks again for all that you post here. So much vital information to be ruminated upon.

Wishing you and all of the barflies a calm X'mas, and a much better, more co-operative, caring, and understanding year ahead for all.

Kind regards,

Jonathan


Posted by: Jon_in_AU | Dec 20 2020 9:21 utc | 184

China's economy of peace: the end of dollar hegemony. A short read from globalresearch by Peter Koenig:

Peter Koenig is a geopolitical analyst and a former Senior Economist at the World Bank and the World Health Organization (WHO), where he has worked for over 30 years on water and environment around the world. He lectures at universities in the US, Europe and South America. He writes regularly for online journals and is the author of Implosion – An Economic Thriller about War, Environmental Destruction and Corporate Greed; and co-author of Cynthia McKinney’s book “When China Sneezes: From the Coronavirus Lockdown to the Global Politico-Economic Crisis” (Clarity Press – November 1, 2020). He is a Research Associate of the Centre for Research on Globalization.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 20 2020 9:29 utc | 185


Also I thank you uncle tungsten for that video. Lots of informative stuff and humour eg 13:58
"How fucking Canadian can you be!". Since I first saw/listened to him several years ago, I have appreciated and enjoyed "pothead comedian" Jimmy Dore's contributions. He would be exactly the sort of person who would call out the following linked bullshit and really tell these governments: Algeria, Angola, Bahrain, Belarus, Burkina Faso, China, Cuba, Egypt, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kyrgyz Republic, Libya, Namibia, Nigeria, Pakistan, Palestine, Philippines, Russian Federation, Singapore, Sri Lanka, Sudan, Syria, Tajikistan, Turkey, Turkmenistan, the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela how fucking stupid they are about this -
https://www.unodc.org/documents/commissions/CND/CND_Sessions/CND_63Reconvened/statements/03Dec/Russia_Joint_Statement.pdf

It's a weird feeling - for once to feel solidarity with policy and practice of my "kith and kin kuntries".

Thank you for your reply Paco.
Posted by: Paco | Dec 17 2020 20:14 utc | 36

A very friendly way of addressing any Vladimir is Vova, not Vovo, it goes from Vladímir to Volodya to Vova, and each step indicates closer relationship. ...

So what does calling a Vladmir, Vlad, mean?

Posted by: tucenz | Dec 20 2020 9:50 utc | 186

Posted by: Jon_in_AU | Dec 20 2020 9:21 utc | 185

The real pedant in this case was Sting back in the 80's at the hight of the cold war, assuming that we love our children and probably the dammned reds do not. Sometimes I have the feeling that anglos love a lot more there pets that everybody else's children.

Posted by: Paco | Dec 20 2020 10:10 utc | 187

Posted by: Paco | Dec 20 2020 10:10 utc | 188

There and their, many typos. Unforgivable.

He -that is Sting- is not a bad musician, he has a nice live album issued right after leaving The Police, but somehow he embodies a lot of the brits arrogance. The world is changing, and real fast.

Posted by: Paco | Dec 20 2020 10:14 utc | 188

@uncle tungsten (many posts)

Thanks for the Jimmy Dore links, that was very revealing stuff.

Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 20 2020 12:26 utc | 189

A new 70% faster-spreading strain or mutation of Covid has been detected in U.K.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-55382212

🤬🙁

Posted by: Circe | Dec 20 2020 13:02 utc | 190

@ 185 Jon_in_AU ... thanks jon! right back at ya!

@ uncle t - lol!

@ 189 paco - i think you are right in all that..

Posted by: james | Dec 20 2020 17:37 utc | 191

Jon_in_AU @185--

Yes, It's from The Dream of the Blue Turtles, which has several other excellent songs on it. And thanks for your well wishes, the same served back to you!

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 20 2020 18:28 utc | 192

Leo Panitch has passed.

“ Some five weeks ago he was hospitalized and diagnosed with multiple myeloma. While in the hospital he contracted Covid-19 and this developed into viral pneumonia. This is a collection of interviews with Leo, who gave great encouragement to creating theAnalysis.news”

https://theanalysis.news/interviews/our-leo-has-passed-away/

Posted by: suzan | Dec 20 2020 21:03 utc | 193

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