Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 29, 2020

The MoA Week In Review - Open Thread 2020-94

Last week's posts at Moon of Alabama:

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Other issues:

Syria:

Civil War:

Covid-19 Transmission:

Opioid crimes:

> What's hilarious is that it looks like McKinsey gave Purdue advice between 2008-2010 on how to boost up opioid sales, when apparently both the client and firm knew that such a strategy would lead to overdoses, then came back in 2017 to essentially give Purdue a PR strategy on how to apologize for all the people they killed. This was when everyone and their mother knew that Purdue was facing an existential legal crisis. So you paid McKinsey to dig you a hole, then paid them to help you climb back out. <

Use as open thread ...

Posted by b on November 29, 2020 at 13:59 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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Jonathan Cook-this guy just gets better, and better.
https://dissidentvoice.org/2020/11/the-planet-cannot-begin-to-heal-until-we-rip-the-mask-off-the-wests-war-machine/

Posted by: bevin | Nov 29 2020 14:24 utc | 2

Here is part of my wrap up of the week:

The Pfizer guinea pigs have been found.

Not good.

Individual Israelis should hop on a plane and get their vaccines elsewhere (once those are available).
(Having a population scatter around the world is not good either. Catch-22?)

Headline:

Israel to receive Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine as early as December – report

https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-to-receive-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-as-early-as-december-report/


Israel is expected to receive up to half a million doses of the Pfizer Inc. vaccine against the coronavirus as early as December, one month earlier than originally hoped for, Channel 12 reported Monday.

According to the unsourced report, the country would receive anywhere between 200,000 and 500,000 doses of the vaccine and will devote them primarily to those working in the medical field, while the general population would not be vaccinated this winter.

The report also quoted a senior Health Ministry official as saying that the early arrival of the vaccine would have a “positive” effect on Israel’s battle against COVID-19 this winter.

Earlier this month, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu announced that Israel had signed a deal with Pfizer to purchase coronavirus vaccine shots, days after the US pharmaceutical firm said data suggested its vaccine was 90 percent effective at preventing COVID-19.

As part of the agreement with Pfizer, Netanyahu said Israel would receive 8 million doses of the vaccine, enough to inoculate 4 million Israelis. Netanyahu expressed hope that Pfizer would begin supplying the vaccine in January, pending authorization from health officials in the United States and Israel.

Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 14:31 utc | 4

From Scott Ritter,

"From Syria to Libya to Nagorno-Karabakh, this new method of military offense has been brutally effective. We are witnessing a revolution in the history of warfare, one that is causing panic, particularly in Europe."

https://www.rt.com/op-ed/508000-turkey-drone-swarms-war/

"The face of modern warfare has been forever altered, and those nations that are not prepared or equipped to fight in a battlefield where drone technology is fully incorporated in every aspect of the fight can expect outcomes similar to that of Armenia: severe losses of men and equipment, defeat, humiliation and the likely loss of their territory. This is the reality of modern warfare which, as Gustav Gressel notes, should make any nation not fully vested in drone technology “think – and worry.”"

Posted by: Bluedotterel | Nov 29 2020 14:35 utc | 5

Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 14:31 utc | 4

The Brits are also claiming they are going to be giving the Pfizer vaccine in December. It's supposedly a race to rescue the people from this lethal virus.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 14:41 utc | 6

Posted by: Bluedotterel | Nov 29 2020 14:35 utc | 5

You have to be careful over the facts when talking about the Karabakh war. Nearly 100% of the propaganda has been pro-Armenian, including on this blog. In this case "we fought bravely, but we couldn't overcome the massed weaponry of the evil Azerbaijanis, who had devilish weapons we couldn't fight", all the while of course forgetting that the war only happened because of Armenian aggression 25 years ago.

Scott Ritter is good, but it may be that some of his sources of information were less than accurately precise.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 14:52 utc | 7

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 14:52 utc | 7

Mostly I was supporting Bevin's post at Posted by: bevin | Nov 29 2020 14:24 utc | 2, the Cook article.

This new type of drone warfare is simply another example of the way we are being used to continue supporting the MIC.

Posted by: Bluedotterel | Nov 29 2020 14:56 utc | 8

@ bevin 2
Jonathan Cook-this guy just gets better, and better.
YES! Cook gets it all right about warmongering, going on at length about it to slam the warmongers; especially good on Mr. Hope & Change.
Another slant on what he correctly says would be the misuse of the English language to excuse these crimes:
>citizens of countries the US attacks after regime change are "insurgents" and "terrorists."
>bombing the shit out of foreign cities are "airstrikes."
>making the bomb-builders rich is "defending US vital interests" etc.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 29 2020 15:10 utc | 9

RE: Drone wars

Well, I think Ritter overstates the case. To be sure we will soon have competing swarms of drones going at each other, and then war will be reduced to a video game.

These type of systems must have either some sort of autonomous control (AI) or a communications link to an (human/AI) operator. I am skeptical that there are AIs up to the job yet, but given the tolerance for "error" one can expect in war we may see such things soon.

But there will be countermeasures soon too. And Turkey has not yet found it wise to take on those similarly equipped.

It will, it has already, changed the face of war. But I have doubts that the result is as dramatic as suggested.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 15:16 utc | 10

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 15:16 utc | 10

Of course, what I think is that there weren't waves of drones impossible to defend against, rather there were some drones, and the Armenian sources exaggerated the numbers to justify their defeat. Ritter's article is not very precise about numbers.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 15:35 utc | 11

People who join the US to kill their own people should beware.
. . .from Stars & Stripes:
Afghan pilot says he's been told to rejoin air force or leave US protection

KABUL, Afghanistan – An Afghan major under U.S. protection at a U.S. base after the Pentagon reversed its decision to approve his move to the United States, said he has been told he will be forced to leave the base Monday if he does not rejoin the Afghan air force.
Maj. Mohammed Naiem Asadi, one of the Afghan military’s few elite attack helicopter pilots, his wife, and his 4-year-old daughter had been approved to seek refuge in America in early October due to being in “imminent danger of being killed by the Taliban,” approval documents and emails shared with Stars and Stripes showed.
The Pentagon, which had endorsed Asadi’s bid to come to America, changed its decision and withdrew its endorsement in early November, leaving the major fearing both violence by the Taliban and retribution from the Afghan air Force for applying for asylum.
The Afghan government has threatened to jail pilots in the past for attempting to gain asylum in other countries, said Kimberly Motley, Asadi’s lawyer. Motley represented another Afghan pilot, Niloofar Rahmani, who received asylum in America in 2016 after receiving death threats from the Taliban.
Asadi said he doubts the Afghan government’s ability and willingness to protect him, as the country suffers a wave of assassinations by the Taliban. Families of several of the country’s elite pilots told Stars and Stripes in 2018 that their loved ones did not receive adequate protection by the government before being killed.
The major is said to have killed more Taliban than any other pilot in the Afghan air force during thousands of flight hours, Afghan and U.S. military officers told Stars and Stripes. . . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 29 2020 15:44 utc | 12

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 14:52 utc | 7
Since you are so anti propaganda and fund of remembering, pray tell what happened to Armenians on azeri ground before that?😉

Your grasp of history is non existing or you are pushing a turk narrative, think trough your words again and see why you just made a fool of yourself🤷‍♂️

Posted by: Per/Norway | Nov 29 2020 15:45 utc | 13

Why develop a nuclear bomb if you can buy one? North Korea comes to mind.

Posted by: passerby | Nov 29 2020 15:56 utc | 14

spreading the virus
from China's Global Times:
Will cold-chain imports trigger new wave of COVID-19 in China?

After employees from international delivery firms UPS and FedEx tested positive for COVID-19 at Shanghai Pudong International Airport, one of the busiest airports in the world, cargo operations are continuing as normal, but freight operators and staff members have stepped up preventive measures, especially as two confirmed patients were both exposed to a contaminated container from North America. The latest outbreak in Shanghai flashed a warning sign for the country that has successfully reined in the epidemic over the past year, but which remains vigilant over new risks of the virus resurging from overseas via cold-chain and other cargos. But in stark contrast to the massive mobilization and response when cases emerged almost a year ago, the country has been clearly steadfast and calm in face of the new risks - a show of confidence from the hard-fought victory so far.. . . the latest sporadic outbreak at the airport occurred when China's top health authority found that the number of cases involving COVID-19-positive imported cold-chain foods has increased significantly, affecting more areas and products, such as seafood, meat and poultry. The infections have also extended from cold-chain food to containers. . . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 29 2020 15:58 utc | 15

Posted by: Per/Norway | Nov 29 2020 15:45 utc | 13

Like I say, all you get on this blog is pro-Armenian propaganda, from you and some others. After all, they're nice Christians aren't they? And Azeris are nasty Muslims. Well, surprisingly Wiki is quite neutral on this topic. The origins of the war in the 1990s were an attempt by Armenia to grab a large slice of territory some of it inhabited by Armenians, who then proceeded to ethnically cleanse the Azeris. But that's fine, because they're nice Christians, isn't it? The Azeris getting back the territory they lost is however evil, according to you. You'll believe any Armenian propaganda, it seems.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 16:03 utc | 16

Passerby--

What makes you think that North Korea would sell the bomb?

What makes you think that Iran wants the bomb?

There is a lot of conjecture in your question.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 16:10 utc | 17

I’d like to use the following analogy to describe the use of a vaccine, based on insufficiently tested technology, in order to protect us from a danger that is being disproportionately inflated.

It is like replacing the tires, made with a technology that has an incomplete record of safety, of a car in order to make a road trip safer, when the problem lies with the braking system.

I had posted more on this in the other thread (The Vaccine Competition Will Be Ruthless - dated Nov 27). See post #53.

Posted by: Nathan Mulcahy | Nov 29 2020 16:12 utc | 18

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 15:35 utc | 11

Indeed, everybody involved in the war, the Turks, the Azeris, and the Armenians, is eager to applaud the Azeris' achievements. Considering the amount of bad blood in evidence, it seems unlikely to me this is the end of it. I imagine the Armenians are feverishly looking into drone swarms now, and no doubt various outside parties will be eager to help them out.

I wonder where next Erdogan will try out his new toys?

I would suppose that since the Armenians have offered themselves to keep Erdogan distracted, Putin will probably allow it to fester like in Georgia & Ukraine.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 16:21 utc | 19

What was in the 'Iranian' archive that the Mossad stole archive that Netanyahu ranted about so much?
(link chosen at random) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/israel-benjamin-netanyahu-iran-secret-nuclear-files-deal-deadline-trump-project-amad-latest-a8329961.html

I keep following links and they all follow the same pattern ...
1. Lots of details about the genius operation itself. When someone spends all of their time telling me how smart they are rather than the actual content, that raises red flags to me.

2. liar-liar-liar : not even going to elaborate, you know what I mean.

Authentic or not, how far did Iran get in their nuclear weapons program that they suspended in 2003?
Does Israel even try to assert that any of the documents are post 2003?
I just cannot find info on the actual content of the 110,000 pages.

Posted by: Christian J. Chuba | Nov 29 2020 16:52 utc | 21

Posted by: Christian J. Chuba | Nov 29 2020 16:52 utc | 21

RE: Irainian document trove

I've been watching that since they went in and rescued the documents. The story has always stunk in the way that the Skripal, Navalny, Argentine social center bombing, or Russian election meddling stories, for example, stunk. It's a much longer list really. I have never seen anything either to debunk the documents or to show they actually exist and are what is claimed. Iran has showed little interest from the beginning. The Israelis trot it out once in a while, hit the propaganda points, and blather on for a while and that's it.

So if it happened at all, it did not produce anything useful to the Israelis or they would have used it.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 17:08 utc | 22

Headline: The 'Smartest Man In The Room' Just Joined Sidney Powell's Team

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/11/the_smartest_man_in_the_room_has_joined_sidney_powells_team.html

Concluding line: "Things are getting fun."

Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 17:28 utc | 23

Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 17:28 utc | 23


From the link:

8. Dominion used Chinese parts, and there's reason to believe that China, Venezuela, Cuba interfered in the election.


Take your trash back.

Posted by: v | Nov 29 2020 17:33 utc | 24

thanks b... i would like to point out the prescient nature of b's post on nov 25th ( israel is again pushing for war) which quickly manifested in the death of one of irans top nuclear scientists........ it seems to me b has his finger on the pulse more often then not.. thank you.. thanks also to the many find posters who contribute here at moa..

Posted by: james | Nov 29 2020 17:37 utc | 25

Ouch

Posted by: circumspect | Nov 29 2020 17:51 utc | 26

@23

If the Dr is so good and is connected to all the alphabet soup agencies, one wonders why he didn't come to the rescue of Comey and the FBI to guess the passcode of an iPhone 5C used by the San Bernardino killer back in 2016 !

Posted by: Yul | Nov 29 2020 17:55 utc | 27

re: covid, EU

EU mortality data, in the active countries.

https://ibb.co/R0pHYL9

From EuroMOMO. 2020-week 48 data. Vertical axis are "Z-scores" (standard deviations, after baseline correction and simple sinusoidal seasonal adjustment). Yellow band (last 3 weeks) are incompletely reported and likely will increase in future reports.

Note that under normal circumstances, a score of Z=10, i.e. 10 stdev's, is not unusual. For example the graphs show it happened in winter 2017 in FR, IT, ES. On the other hand, the Z=10 in 2017 were without the social distancing and mask wearing! Now we are seeing equal or greater despite the protections and extensive testing.

Posted by: ptb | Nov 29 2020 17:55 utc | 28

re: covid, EU

EU mortality data, in the active countries.

https://ibb.co/R0pHYL9

From EuroMOMO. 2020-week 48 data. Vertical axis are "Z-scores" (standard deviations, after baseline correction and simple sinusoidal seasonal adjustment). Yellow band (last 3 weeks) are incompletely reported and likely will increase in future reports.

Note that under normal circumstances, a score of Z=10, i.e. 10 stdev's, is not unusual. For example the graphs show it happened in winter 2017 in FR, IT, ES. On the other hand, the Z=10 in 2017 were without the social distancing and mask wearing! Now we are seeing equal or greater despite the protections and extensive testing.

Posted by: ptb | Nov 29 2020 17:55 utc | 29

Doubleheader from Ria Novosti:

Russia won the war against Ukraine for the most valuable resource

The author mentions Ukraine lost some 7-8 million inhabitants since the Maidan Counter-revolution, 3 million of which immigrating to Russia. Those extra 3 million immigrants alleviated Russia's chronic (and irreversible) population decline.

He also mentions this new Ukraine commemorating the anniversary of the "Holodomor". The argument of the Ukrainians is that there was a nationalist-independentist movement going on in Ukraine, and that Stalin purposely engineered a famine in 1932-33 to squash it.

Both claims are false. The nationalist-independentist argument is not even supported by the heavily biased Western historians.

Alas, Western historians insist the famine was a communist genocide. This claim is false, too.

For starters, Western historians on the subject use very weak and few documental evidence for this claim. There is one quote, one line in length, where Stalin really admits the initial phase of collectivization really saw a momentary drop in output, and was its most difficult phase. This is normal for every new system being built over the old ones, capitalism in England included.

Russia had 500 years of famine in its 1000 year history. That's roughly one famine every 2-3 years.

We also know that the famine of 1932-33 in Ukraine was due to a new variety of lice (or rust, if memory doesn't fail me), not due to forced collectivization (or Lysenko allegedly killing genetics in the USSR). In the post-war, the USSR never had any year of famine: the legendary "long lines" propagandized in the West at the end of the 1980s were for durable goods (which indeed was a weak point of the Soviet system), not food. Hunger only returned to the USSR after it was dissolved, during the Russian Federation era.

Collectivization solved the famine problem in the USSR. Indeed, their collective farms remembered a lot the USA's "belts" system. They were very modern and very sound for the epoch, and it's hard to imagine the USSR ever urbanizing without it.

But yes, the initial years of forced collectivization shocked the center-left in the West. Even the pro-Soviet historian Edward Carr erroneously condemned it, under the false argument that "it would take decades for Soviet agriculture to recover" (as in opposition that this period was unnecessary if they didn't do so). But that's not what the documentation and circumstantial evidence shows us after the opening of the files in 1991.

--//--


Shoigu compared the head of the German Defense Ministry with a schoolgirl in elementary grades

There's no greater symbol of a liberal government telling the world it doesn't care about its armed forces than nominating a woman to the Defense.

The problem here is not that having a woman in the Defense is inherently bad, but that Western Democracies do not have the habit of enlisting women to the armed forces, let alone to the officialdom.

A post-war German woman will spend her entire 85-90 years of life without ever getting 10 miles from a battalion or a base (unless it is an American NATO base). German women do not know the art of modern warfare, are not expected to know and do not want to know. They can spend their entire lives simply ignoring the military exists.

Modern warfare is an extremely sensitive and complex affair. Anything below a veteran general already is a sign you're not really serious on defense. Nominating a woman is just putting a huge neon sign to that plate, essentially a "please don't attack me, I surrender".

The only exception to this rule is the USA, where recent Defense Secretaries usually come from the executive branch of the big corporations of the MIC (e.g. Mark Esper, CEO from Boeing). But even the USA has a "revolving door" system, where generals transit between consulting for these corporation and the Pentagon.

Posted by: vk | Nov 29 2020 18:04 utc | 30

@17 I think it is likely that NK would threaten to sell/give Iran a bomb (together with delivery system) as part of their ongoing 'negotiations' with the US. Israel would be the first to know if and when it happens.

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 18:06 utc | 31

@ Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 17:28 utc | 23

Dominion was also used in Utah and Florida - states where Trump won comfortably.

If the software is the problem, then it was a problem for those two states, too.

Posted by: vk | Nov 29 2020 18:10 utc | 32

I love your posts VK.

Posted by: Peter Schmidt | Nov 29 2020 18:27 utc | 33

Posted by: vk | Nov 29 2020 18:10 utc | 32

Not necessarily. Neither were "battleground" states. If you were to fix the election, you would select the states with close racs, not those that were polled to be obvious Trump wins

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Nov 29 2020 18:31 utc | 34

Some authors are reference points in navigating stormy sea at night.
I just recognized Greenwald as one of these.
Tremendous resources, skill, focus, openness.
And willingness to give fair hearing to otherview points.
We are blessed to have them.

Posted by: jared | Nov 29 2020 18:31 utc | 35

dh @ 31
"I think it is likely that NK would threaten to sell/give Iran a bomb (together with delivery system) as part of their ongoing 'negotiations' with the US."

First of all I know of no negotiations going on between NK and the USA.

IMO, North Korea has in no way threatened anything except a response to any US aggression on it.

No idea how anyone could think that as there is not the slightest evidence that NK would do something like that.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 18:44 utc | 37

fwiw?! no responsible scientist would ever say a new drug is safe within a year (the vague industry standard of 3-5 years is an incredible stretch in itself)

Posted by: Rae | Nov 29 2020 19:02 utc | 38

@37 You missed Trump's meeting with Jong Il. It was well publicized. Seems possible the question of nuclear tech transfer to Iran was discussed.

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 19:11 utc | 39

#39 Jong il should be Kim Jong-Un. There are ongoing negotiations but on the back burner. We have to wait and see if they are continued under Biden.

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 19:22 utc | 40

#39

Iran has stated dozens of times that it does not want nukes. I have no doubt that if they did want nukes they would have developed them by now.
Instead they have built a formidable defence system which seems to be keeping the aggresors at bay.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 19:33 utc | 41

@41 Great. But it has nothing to do with my suggestion that NK might use nuclear transfer as a bargaining chip.

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 19:37 utc | 42

I do not think I have missed a Trump meeting with Kim.

"Seems possible the question of nuclear tech transfer to Iran was discussed."

In somebody's imagination. We need some kind of evidence for statements like that otherwise it pure fabrication based on zero.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 19:40 utc | 43

"Bargaining chip"

This is not a game of poker and I doubt that NK threatening a chip like that would get the aggressor to go "Oh My", He's got us.
NK is much smarter than that.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 19:45 utc | 44

@43 & 44 Of course I was using my imagination. But I still think it was discussed. And the US would have got the message. And Iran would probably turn any such offer down. But if NK was pushed to the brink nobody knows what they would do.

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 19:50 utc | 45

In response to the reported murder of Iranian nuclear physicist Mohsen Fakhrizadeh, and working under 'double urgency', the Iraniam Parliament passed a law called 'The strategic measure for the removal of sanctions' which:

1. creates conditions for enriching uranium to, and beyond, the 20% concentration,suggesting the possibilities of approaching weapons grade levels.

2. "restoration" of the Arak nuclear reactor. It was closed and disabled due to concerns it might be able to make material involved in constructing a nuclear weapons.

3. Construction of a further reactor (no details in the article)

4. End Iran's voluntary compliance with the Additional Protocol to the safeguards agreement with the International Atomic Energy Agency

https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/202011291081309980-irans-lawmakers-pass-bill-to-boost-nuclear-activity-in-wake-of-top-scientists-murder-reports-say/

Clearly, this is a set of conditions designed to be bargained away.

In other words, a new Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA)agreement.

It would have to include full reparations for the cost to Iranian society for the illegal US and Western trade restrictions (so-called "sanctions").

It would have to EFFECTIVELY end all trade restrictions place on Iran.

Western signatories (not USA) were supposed to facilitate trade with Iran, in accordance with International law. They didn't.

Therefore those signatories will have to pay for their 'surprising' apparent impotence and utter helplessness in creating a channel for trade and payment with Iran, and for breaching the relevant Security Council resolution in favor of obeying USA commands to break International Law as embodied in the relevant Security Council resolution.

Call it the Fakhrizadeh JCPOA, JCPOA II, son of JCPOA, or whatever you like, pre-conditions are being set in place by Iran for a 'new JCPOA.

On the face of it, this appears to be rather a clever move.

Posted by: powerandpeople | Nov 29 2020 19:52 utc | 46

The guy in Hamburg, Germany, who knows everything but is unfortunately never consulted by the PTB about world problems is nevertheless easily pissed if anybody of his readers critizes his wisdom. Then deletion is the way, make these thoughts disappear from the earth. But, here they are again, this time the ones from Swami Donkeynanda he deleted 2 days ago in the Iran thread:

Of course what this event proves is Trump's scorched earth policy completely contradicts the fantasies of Trump Tools, which not so surprisingly include many of the eminent regular commenters on MoA.

Israel and Trump not to mention their dull-edged Tools don't want the US under Biden to re-commit to JCPOA. Biden has already signalled his willingness. Rouhani has also signalled his own willingness to re-engage with Biden which appears to be the motivation for the assassination of the unfortunate scientist.

How can this honestly be viewed any other way?

Posted by: Swami Donkeynanda | Nov 27 2020 21:12 utc | 36

Thanks but as you know for yourself this blog is a closed round table of do nothing bloviators governed by ill logical thought processes derived from a narrow propaganda-infected list of dubious reading sources.

No actual truth or honesty or whole perspective is wanted here. The pervasive attitude is one of spinning all events into the same false perception of reality. Swallowed whole by the nihilism of defeatist geriatric leftists who now own houses and pensions and so haven't an activist bone left in their withering bodies.

If it's change we seek we surely will find no allies at MoA.

Posted by: Swami Donkeynanda | Nov 27 2020 21:43 utc | 42

Yes I agree that BLM is an organized movement of the left. Antifa I'm not sure exists as anything other than loosely confederated sets of groups meant to oppose right wing militias as they manifest on the streets. As such, reading commenters here who term both BLM and antifa as fascist thugs is a dead give away that MoA has been almost completely taken over by fascist sympathizers, whether by design or because so many posters here are merely useful idiots driven more by their ideological loneliness and wanting to belong.

As for the peace loving American public it is very true that the majority prefer leftist solutions even while far too many allow themselves to be identified with Republicans, again simply by a desire to get along and combat their alienation inside the violent police state.

Similar in some respects to the psychological ass whipping seen here where people allow themselves to be herded by rightwing nonsense because this is home do to speak.

My advice is join up with the activism on the streets and its online affiliations and not worry too much about the commenters here who are simply idling away their cynical alienation unto death.

Posted by: Swami Donkeynanda | Nov 27 2020 22:55 utc | 63

Arthur Dent

May I suggest an "MoA Love it or Leave it" bumper sticker for the back of your truck?

It will look great next to your "Honk if you love Trump" and comes in a variety of colors to match your shotgun rack.

Yee-haw!

Posted by: Swami Donkeynanda | Nov 27 2020 23:07 utc | 67

Posted by: thomas | Nov 29 2020 20:05 utc | 47

@45 Since it's still legal to use our imaginations how do you think Iran would react to a major attack by US or Israel? Would they depend on Hizbullah for a response or do they have some bigger surprises for Israel?

Posted by: dh | Nov 29 2020 20:07 utc | 48

Interesting and well written article from Craig Murray on the [shitty little] "state" that can't be criticised:

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2020/11/the-state-you-may-not-criticise/

I can't fault Murray's logic.

Posted by: Paul | Nov 29 2020 20:43 utc | 49

Something most commentators on this forum are willingly or unwillingly confused of is the difference between assassinations of martyred Sulumani and Mohandis and past and recent killing of Iranian scientists. It was a declared state sponsored assassination and iran had the right to respond militarily and in same way and she did, within few days without any ambiguity.
Killing of Iran’s scientists are undeclared state sponsored terrorism against civilians, a retaliation will require a different and more ambiguity, therefore will need more carful thought planing in a manner that time, theater and intensity could only point to Iran in a plausible ambiguity. If I understand shia mentality correctly there is no way a retaliation against Israel, US and some Arab states would not take place, but not necessarily will come as an assassination. I guess some people thought since Iranians and shia believe in martyrdom, they would ease off on revenge of their martyrs . May be is my fault, I should have mentioned for shia who ever brings justice (revenge ) for martyrs is facilitating the return of Mahdi. My guess is, there already are a lot of volunteers who want to bring the “ master of era” and end of times and rid the world of evil.

Posted by: Kooshy | Nov 29 2020 20:57 utc | 50

nyt - official israeli mouthpiece...

Posted by: james | Nov 29 2020 21:09 utc | 52

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 16:21 utc | 19

"Indeed, everybody involved in the war, the Turks, the Azeris, and the Armenians, is eager to applaud the Azeris' achievements."

Oh really? There was so much Armenian propaganda that until Russia declared the peace agreement, I thought the Armenians were winning. In fact the Armenians were comprehensively defeated. Difficult to get back from in the near future.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 29 2020 21:20 utc | 53

brilliant, all of it


Biden, the Emcee at the Billionaires’ Ball
https://www.blackagendareport.com/biden-emcee-billionaires-ball

.....The Lords of Capital know, better than most of the rest of us, that the Race to the Bottom that immiserates the working class and disperses Black communities, is also responsible for the exponential, fantastical growth of oligarchic wealth. The Race to the Bottom is a global phenomenon of late stage imperial capitalism, which funnels ever-increasing proportions of wealth upward by forcing all the world’s workers to compete against each other. War must be endless, to enforce the terms of the Race on as much of the planet as possible. Government social, health and income supports that allow workers to refuse “gig” and less-than-living wage work, spoil the Race.

Biden is the oligarchs’ pick to keep the Race to the Bottom accelerating and the profits skyrocketing....

Posted by: michaelj72 | Nov 29 2020 21:41 utc | 54

"Supreme Court's Scientifically Illiterate Decision Will Cost Lives": Jeffry Sachs examines the very wrong USSC ruling about the need to restrict "religious services" during the pandemic as there's no need to gather in groups to worship your chosen deity, nor can such gatherings be deemed an equivalent of a visit to a store.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 29 2020 21:42 utc | 55

Sorry for the off-topic ..... i keep getting redirected to this url when visiting SF ...’adexc.me/zmchot gallly’. I can’t comment on SF , since im not on discus, fb ..or any of the rest ...hopefully SF can chect for a bug. Tnx ..james joseph

Posted by: James joseph | Nov 29 2020 22:42 utc | 56

@ Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 29 2020 21:42 utc | 55

The problem is not that the SCOTUS is scientifically illiterate - nobody is super human, you can only be an expert in one area at the most -, but that it is too powerful.

One of the greatest reforms of Hugo Chávez (and one that enrages the Venezuelan elite exiled in Florida to this day) was the democratization of the Judiciary: all the judges in Venezuela now have a limited mandate and all must be democratically elected. It is the only country in the world that does that, if I'm not mistaken.

Posted by: vk | Nov 29 2020 23:14 utc | 57

The Kraken on Crack (referring to Powell and content of librul's link, not librul personally)

"Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 17:28 utc | 23, from the link
Although he had no access to the machines, Dr. Kershavarz has looked at available data about the election and the vote results. Based on that information, he concluded

1. The counts in the disputed states (Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, Michigan, Arizona, Nevada, and Georgia) show electronic manipulation."


This is appalling. There is no relationship between the internal NW traffic and the reporting of the vote tallies. This is a self-disqualifying statement.

I read Powell's 104 pg complaint and focused on the GA recount and claims about Dominion because 1. electronic manipulation is the only way to get the amount of fraud necessary to change the results and 2. the recount tested all of the theories swirling around Dominion.

The Dominion voting system in general and in GA produces a paper ballot in the voting booth which the voter sees and puts into a secure box. Later a poll worker scans it where it is electronically tabulated. Had Dominion altered logs prior to sending the tallies (one of Powell's allegations) or had they manipulated the results in flight then the comparison to the paper ballots in the reount would have caught the discrepancy. There was no discrepancy.
Falsification would require the simultaneous destruction and recreation of paper ballots in sync with the electronic alterations. This would require a conspiracy of a large number of people and is next to impossible to pull off but Mr. genius math guy (is he a paid consultant?) might say otherwise but he never addresses this.

Posted by: Christian Chuba | Nov 30 2020 0:07 utc | 58

@: karlof1 55
The court's five conservative justices, a new majority with Barrett now on the bench, argued that the state's limits on religious gatherings violated "the minimum requirement of neutrality" to religion under the First Amendment.

This comes from the mistaken, but often stated, view that the Constitution provides human rights, under the tag "constitutional rights." That's BS because it promotes government rights over human rights.

In fact the document which constituted the US government is not a provider of rights! It merely has protections against any laws that might be written limiting certain rights, which shouldn't prejudice other rights. Ninth Amendment: "The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."
Our human rights are not conferred by any government. They are intrinsic. We were born with them, as the Declaration of Independence states: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

In this case, the NY Governor determined that churches don't have the right to harm people's human rights of life through their group gatherings. Those rights matter. The Governor was correct in not getting tied down by the Constitution, the document that established government but not our rights.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 0:08 utc | 59

USA High Politics: everything is connected:

Biden Reportedly Mulls Promoting 'Taliban Bounties Story' Congresswoman to be CIA Director

--//--

@ Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 0:08 utc | 59

Human Rights are not intrinsic. They are a post-war invention (1948) by the UN, something created so everybody could sleep better at night (or be invaded, if you're a fan of post-Cold War History).

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 0:20 utc | 60

vk @57--

I again consulted The Many-Headed Hydra: Sailors, Slaves, Commoners, and the Hidden History of the Revolutionary Atlantic by Linebaugh and Redicker for some of their excellent citations of Elite opinions about the masses--the Hydra and their communitarian ways they feared. I was reminded of the intertwining of the Church of England's Canon Law with that of the Realm's so that God's Law couldn't be used as a defense against being sentenced to death amongst other things. Of course, all magistrates were upper class and quite often inherited their seats & robes, and little has changed, although the Church's Canon now differs. If a judge doesn't comprehend the area being adjudicated, recusal ought to be s/he's choice of action instead of displaying their ignorance. The problem with electing judges IMO rests in there often being a lack of an opponent; and where there are two or more choices, the availability of enough information to make an informed choice, which is the case here in Oregon. One judge in particular has no place on the bench but she wasn't opposed and thus remains--unfortunately. But yes, Class as always presents a big problem in obtaining Justice, and Bastiat's refrain about corrupt societies rules once again.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 0:26 utc | 61

The genocidal nature of the middle class:

NYC mayor reopens elementary schools under pressure from parents, but hints no return to norm without vaccine

Your kids are never going to enter Ivy League. Deal with it.

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 0:27 utc | 62

"The 'smartest man in the room' has joined Sidney Powell's team
10. The systems failed to produce any auditable results."

This is an outright lie or display of ignorance. Georgia upgraded its system to Dominion specifically to create paper ballots. That was another one of Powell's manic complaints in her 104-page filing, that 'GA failed to do due diligence and rushed the approval of Dominion in 2019 just prior to the election'. GA did so because they were under court order to produce paper ballots.

I can't stand Powell, the American Thinker, or this math genius. They are making so many sensationalistic assertions, wreaks of propaganda, using phrases designed to stir up emotions.

Posted by: Christian Chuba | Nov 30 2020 0:28 utc | 63

Drones are the future, it seems. The japanese were right.

Now if we only see how drones are employed in naval battles.

Posted by: Smith | Nov 30 2020 0:35 utc | 64

Don Bacon @59 & vk @60--

The concept of Human Rights is an extension of the concept of Natural Rights upon which the Declaration and Constitution are founded upon. Human Rights was used extensively by Abolitionists to end Slavery, and is also the basis for the sort of Libertarianism credited to Thoreau. I agree with Don in this case and the verdict must be challenged.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 0:37 utc | 65

https://www.rt.com/news/508170-iran-assassination-remote-gun/

So not western spies, but a remote controlled gun, which is kind of a drone.

War has become very mechanized.

Posted by: Smith | Nov 30 2020 0:46 utc | 66

@ Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 0:37 utc | 65

Well, technically, you're correct. It all depends on the flexibility you give to the term "extension".

Because this "extension" you speak of nothing more nothing less resulted in a very violent schism of Liberalism.

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 0:47 utc | 67

I see this curious, humorous exchange between ex-DCI Brennan and reactionary Texas Senator Cruz has yet to be linked but is now. Too bad the Age of Dueling is passe as it would be excellent to have them square off ten paces apart and open fire with their Uzis thus resolving two problems.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 0:58 utc | 68

vk @67--

Something for you to ponder: What good has come from Liberalism and how many have died because of it?

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 1:00 utc | 69

Natural rights are just as much the figment of some people's imagination as human rights.
None of these have any existence or any objective, scientific, physical basis, they are just intellectual notions, like money, gods and other fancy ideas. The majority of people might agree on them from time to time, but they surely aren't eternal, and any system based on these has a limited lifespan.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Nov 30 2020 1:02 utc | 70

@ karlof1 68... your link doesn't work... thanks for your posts..

Posted by: james | Nov 30 2020 1:05 utc | 71

@30 va you wrote..
"Collectivization solved the famine problem in the USSR. Indeed, their collective farms remembered a lot the USA's "belts" system. They were very modern and very sound for the epoch, and it's hard to imagine the USSR ever urbanizing without it."

Usually I learn a lot from your posts vk, but this is just crazy. I remember canada shipping 80 % of its wheat export crop to Russia in the cold of the early 70's. It generated huge discussion in the country: morality of feeding the starving vs politics of communism. The US would not help. Canada did.

First thing Gorbachov did on his first ever visit to Canada was visit a modern farm. Collectivism died when he returned and he was acclaimed in Russia for the transformation.

Father Trudeau was a genius, the son an asshole

Posted by: les7 | Nov 30 2020 1:14 utc | 72

@30 vk

That first visit by Gorbachov was in the early 80's, long before his role as leader of the Soviet Union. The export deal was for 6 million tons of wheat,first year, and peaked at 9 million tons if memory serves, plus other grains. Farming in canada boomed. Russia kept a special sense of friendship with canada until the idiot son lectured Putin on Ukraine.

Posted by: les7 | Nov 30 2020 1:22 utc | 73

@Christian Chuba | Nov 30 2020 0:07 utc | 58


The Dominion voting system in general and in GA produces a paper ballot in the voting booth which the voter sees and puts into a secure box. Later a poll worker scans it where it is electronically tabulated. Had Dominion altered logs prior to sending the tallies (one of Powell's allegations) or had they manipulated the results in flight then the comparison to the paper ballots in the recount would have caught the discrepancy. There was no discrepancy.

Falsification would require the simultaneous destruction and recreation of paper ballots in sync with the electronic alterations. This would require a conspiracy of a large number of people and is next to impossible to pull off but Mr. genius math guy (is he a paid consultant?) might say otherwise but he never addresses this.


You have rather weak understanding about how Dominion system works. In reality paper ballot in Dominion voting machines means nothing because it is not ballot itself but the QR code printed on it which is scanned. In essence, what is printed on paper is a redundant artifact and comes into play only during hand recounting, which provides enough time to match any fraudulent counts with paper stacks.

Similarly, for mail-in ballots the tabulators can be manipulated by altering sensitivity of the scanner to put "unclear" ballots in a special holding area. From this area the administrator can change ballots for any candidate, or discard them. So he is working as a hidden, completely unaccountable votes counter of this stack of ballots. I think there was at least one case, when this stack was not processed at all (which means all ballots in it were discarded) in Georgia.

In each location 2-6 people have admin access to Dominion machines, server and network and they are kings of the hill. Voters are redundant at this point. With some level of knowledge and criminal intent they can change a lot of ballots without any audit trace and/or suppress audit trace. There are vast possibilities for fraud, if you are an administrator. Add to this that in some cases Dominions tech staff was present on the floor and has access to the network. There are rumors (and some twits) that the network also have remote internet access enabled, supposedly to help to troubleshoot problems with voting stations remotely. See, for example,

http://www.softpanorama.org/Skeptics/Political_skeptic/Two_party_system_as_poliarchy/US_election_fraud/dominion.shtml

https://www.michigan.gov/documents/sos/071B7700117_Dominion_555356_7.pdf

I actually do not know what actually happened, but your defense of Dominion is pure technical nonsense and/or incompetence. This is a small office class system with consumer hardware, consumer OS and consumer hardware (on top of which there is some proprietary software) which is a dream for any intelligence agency to work with.

Posted by: likbez | Nov 30 2020 1:35 utc | 74

@ Posted by: les7 | Nov 30 2020 1:14 utc | 72

Just because a country imports food doesn't mean there's a famine in said country. The problem with the USSR was that it was a socialist country, therefore it had no money: it had to export gold for food from the capitalist countries, in a barter operation.

The USSR really did have an ungrateful climate for agriculture: only 10% of its land was arable, and there were big droughts every 10 years or so. The USA, for example, has 35% of marvelous land in excellent climate for agriculture.

Very few capitalist nations are self-sufficient in food. It doesn't mean collectivization was a failure. Indeed, the major evidence of its success is in the fact that it survived the "Destalinization" period throughout the whole Soviet era and even the beginning of the Russian Federation era. Collectivization was the last Soviet element Yeltsin dismantled - and even so with great difficulty (because it was very unpopular).

Gorbachev was all about technological innovation, not change of societal organizations.

--//--

@ Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 30 2020 1:00 utc | 69

The "extension" you talk about came with the French Revolution of 1789. The Jacobins - the "radical" liberals - abolished slavery in France. Truth be told, France had just lost the Seven Years War, so it was moot point if they had abolished it or not (they lost all their colonies).

But this gave birth to "radicalism", which some claim is the predecessor of socialism (the French one). I don't know about that; seems forced to me.

Liberalism committed a lot of genocides - the Irish, the Native Americans, the Bengali, Africans, Algerians, Jews, Slavs, etc. etc. - it is, by far, the most genocidal ideology in Human History, both in territorial extension and in absolute number of people killed, without a doubt.

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 1:41 utc | 75

"Headline: The 'Smartest Man In The Room' Just Joined Sidney Powell's Team
Posted by: librul | Nov 29 2020 17:28 utc | 23"

As Krebs discussed, on 60 Minutes: 92% of ballots were paper or backed by paper. All the machine and hand recounts of paper ballots validated previous results. The machines were accurate (enough) before, during and after the election and produced that same results.

But, but, but - the Powell Movement claims "the machines had Chinese components"! So does everything electronic in my house.

Posted by: daffyDuct | Nov 30 2020 2:02 utc | 76

Lots of talk but no plans offered to fix things.. the last thread was excellent it sorted out the lie in the narrative
but pointing to this event or discovering the caricature in this or that narrative or forecasting the future.. with the wisdom of a random number generator. is not productive to inverting the power structure from top down to bottom up.

8 billion in number, humanity is trapped.. between one of 256 different borders.. mad men are at the helm of each of the nation states the different borders enclose and the same powerful few are in control of all of the humanity, all of the borders and all of the mad men. ..

What is the plan.? What is the plan? what is the plan? ..How can humanity redeem its rights.. ?

Posted by: snake | Nov 30 2020 2:02 utc | 77

@Christian Chuba | Nov 30 2020 0:28 utc | 63


I can't stand Powell, the American Thinker, or this math genius. They are making so many sensationalistic assertions, wreaks of propaganda, using phrases designed to stir up emotions.

I think they are trying to invoke foreign election interference act by claiming that Venezuela is connected to Dominion and was a part of voter fraud. See https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/executive-order-imposing-certain-sanctions-event-foreign-interference-united-states-election/

But with all her warts and penchant for self-promotion, Powell collected a very interesting stack of evidence. Her filing are historically important documents for any study of 2020 US Presidential Elections. Looks like in large cities Dems overplayed their hand with mail-in ballots. And this is provable.

That probably will not change the result of election as courts are reluctant to interfere in such cases, but it does make Biden victory a Pyrric victory. He will come to power as semi-illegitimate President, possibly with hostile to him Senate controlled by Republicans. Who probably will derail any of his initiative anyway, even if we assume that he has the courage to put any( I actually do not think so; he is a neoliberal,neocon and warmonger ). So forget about ending wars securing more jobs by infrastructure upgrades, addressing mass unemployment, strengthening Social security, upgrading Medicare, fixing Obamacare. That will be Obama II or "Health of American global neoliberal empire is all the matter"

Looks like God has a very dark sense of humor, but DNC plutocrats might later regret about derailing Tulsi, Warren, and Sanders. By fixing Primaries (probably the same methods were used ;-) and propping semi-senile Biden they created unpredictable and dangerous situation, while simultaneously discrediting the US election system.

How it will develop is completely unclear, but the crisis of neoliberalism and stagnation of the US economy will stay as two critical factors. So this reminds me zugzwang situation in chess.

Moreover, even in a narrow context of elections, there are no good moves by Biden and all Obama honchos, as they were involved with Russiagate and Trump has a moral upper hand and he has the initiative.

Also the quote "Whom the gods would destroy they first make mad." is probably applicable here too. Biden behaves like nothing changed since 2016 and "Full Spectrum Dominance" policies (aka restoring American leadership) will work, which is a very dangerous delusion.

BTW there are discussions of Powell's filings and what it means for neoliberal Dems on YouTube by several pretty upscale lawyers, that I would recommend to listen to, if you have no time to read both documents.

Posted by: likbez | Nov 30 2020 2:21 utc | 78

@59 bacon

Yes, indeed.

If government is an intrinsic phenomenon of human will in a collective sense, then the constitution and declaration were the framing documents of this country which infers the natural, intrinsic (read: God-given) rights of humans to not be trampled by an overreaching government.

In other words, the founders set out immediately to make it known that we must be vigilant when it comes to government overstepping their bounds.

This does not mean that government should not be able to establish laws but that the primary purpose of these documents were limiting aspects.

Contrast that to the many marxists in here cheering people not being able to leave their homes, worship and commune with the logos, and spread cheer.

We are too dumb to take care of ourselves, I spose.

Posted by: NemesisCalling | Nov 30 2020 3:07 utc | 79

@ CJ 70
Natural rights are just as much the figment of some people's imagination as human rights.

No. We all have the right to Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.
Those rights are codified by the UN in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights .
...included...

Article I - All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Article 2 - Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.
Article 3 - Everyone has the right to life, liberty and the security of person...here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 3:54 utc | 80

This wrongful Supreme Court decision, that religious people have the right to threaten our health because religion is protected by the Constitution, may lead some to project threats to a woman's right of choice regarding abortion. The Supreme Court is supremely dangerous in this regard.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 3:59 utc | 81

NemesisCalling@80 seems to be confused about Don Bacon favoring special privileges for churches. The confusions about the Constitution as some sort of protection from overreaching government is not really confusion. It's just moldy old ideology. The Constitution is quite ambiguous on the people's rights, because it also tries to ensure states' rights. States having "rights" that people don't is actually pretty backwards thinking. As for the idea that it prevents government overreach, that's proven nonsense. See the 18th amendment! The Constitution is all about giving a minority veto over the government, which is why an organized persistent minority, like the rich, can rule over the people and their rights, wherever said rights come from. Reactionaries always favor strong government, especially when it is trying a mere citizen in court. If you want hundreds of thousands of people in prisons, you are for Big Government. If you want bases chaining the world, you want Big Government. If you want a government too weak to actually provide the services the people actually need as opposed to supporting the stock market and the banks, you want Big Government that services the rich. Pretending that "No taxation with representation!" is the American ideal is a lie. If you want the government out of the boardrooms but into the bedrooms, you're not against government overreach and you do not favor the Constitution as protection against Big Government, you're just another liar repeating moldy lies.

Posted by: steven t johnson | Nov 30 2020 4:21 utc | 82

@83 steven t johnson

Of course, the framers knew a system such as ours can be exploited by sociopaths seeking power.

That's why Ben Franklin retorted to the lady: "A republic, if you can keep it."

What we have today within our judicial system are activists intent on legislating. Example: executives impose some draconian measure wrt pandemics and seeks the court approval, circumventing the checks and balances, including the threat of elections, of the legislative branch.

Yes, there are insane people who are making attempts on the livelihoods of the polis, but, as we see with a populist president in 2016, the supreme court can thusly be restored to strict constitutionalists who will not arbitrarily be at the whim of technocratic tyrants in the executive.

And yes, unborn life is deserved of all the liberties of any other perfectly unique human being. And I can't wait for an actual supreme court which understands the constitution to weigh this again with clarity sans activism.

Posted by: NemesisCalling | Nov 30 2020 4:41 utc | 83

As Krebs discussed, on 60 Minutes: 92% of ballots were paper or backed by paper. All the machine and hand recounts of paper ballots validated previous results. The machines were accurate (enough) before, during and after the election and produced that same results.

I think we are all being spun by both sides so the truth is a little difficult. One has to follow the actual court filings.

Actually a full recount has not yet happened in Georgia. They went through a canvass and a post-election audit which all the news organizations are calling a full recount. A canvass is looking for missing ballots, memory sticks, and the like. A post election audit takes a small sample is not a full recount.

Monday, they will be wiping voting machines to actually scan all the ballots hence more lawsuits to stop them from wiping the machines data so it can be preserved for analysis.

Since the actual action is not being reported in the main we have to look for it and I am not 100% sure I am following it correctly myself. I am 100% sure not to believe much of anything the MSM puts out.

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/18694655/7/1/pearson-v-kemp/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1ik3wu0xnzn1dkh/SECOND%20ORDER%20-%20PEARSON%20v.%20KEMP%2011.29.2020.pdf?dl=0

So the second order nullifies the first order to preserve data. The machines will be wiped 30 November 2020 and the ballots will be fed to perform a full recount. Naturally no human being wants to plow through his crap but as a former voter who gave up long ago I am collecting evidence and understanding for my county election board.

It is quite a stretch for Trump but it is interesting to see these allegations which have stretch back to at least 2006 in Congress.

What I remember happening is that at the end of the machine voting Trump had huge leads in the 5 swing states prior to the counting of the mail in ballots. Counting was allegedly stopped at around 11PM eastern time in the 5 swing states in question and then at 4am EST his lead evaporated. The MSM was telling us for weeks Trump would win the machine voting but lose the mail in. The pump was primed.

I think the fight is over were these votes injected from overseas through the Scytle server, were 100% of the mail in ballots legitimate, and was it fair to keep the observers from actually observing? They are also arguing the equal protection clause as used in 2001.

Granted Giuliani is a joke but Powell is no lightweight. Neither was Giuliani back in his pre-depends days. Hopefully we will obtain some sanity in our voting systems next go around. Somehow I doubt it.

Posted by: circumspect | Nov 30 2020 4:55 utc | 84

An excellent book:
The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Constitution

The Constitution of the United States created a representative republic marked by federalism and the separation of powers. Yet numerous federal judges--led by the Supreme Court--have used the Constitution as a blank check to substitute their own views on hot-button issues such as abortion, capital punishment, and samesex marriage for perfectly constitutional laws enacted by We the People through our elected representatives.
Now, The Politically Incorrect Guide to the Constitution shows that there is very little relationship between the Constitution as ratified by the thirteen original states more than two centuries ago and the "constitutional law" imposed upon us since then. Instead of the system of state-level decision makers and elected officials the Constitution was intended to create, judges have given us a highly centralized system in which bureaucrats and appointed--not elected--officials make most of the important policies.

Chapter 5 -- The Imperial Judiciary: It started with Marshall

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 5:12 utc | 85

@ 86
. . .Of course the Congress doesn't have the right to legislate against human rights either.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 5:15 utc | 86

It seems to me a plan that teaches the masses that their liberty depends on enforcing the four corner reading of the constitution
would be in order? Maybe require a test as a condition of eligibility to vote and a series of free classes attended by
poll watchers and students to educate voters.

It seems to me a plan should include amending Article V, so that citizens of the USA can impose on government
amendments. since government is suppose to serve the governed the governed should make the rules that government
must follow and government should make the rules that governed must follow.

If Article V were amended to allow citizens to circulate proposals to petition the government to amend the Constitution what
would that amendment look like? Several states have well tested methods for amending constitutions of the states.
Courts would approve the form and attest to the clarity of the language in any amendment proposal, and would be required
to write a brief to accompany the proposal which brief should explain the possible meanings of the proposed amendment, and
to explain the possible implications or results that might arise because of the proposed amendment, and then the amendment
would be circulated to the citizens for sufficient signatures(maybe 20,000 signatures from each house district=that would be
9,000,000 signature minimum). If the threshold number of signatures on the proposed amendment were obtained, it would
obligate the government to place the proposed amendment for a yes, no vote on the next ballot. A majority would result
would determine the fate of the proposal. if the majority is yes, then the amendment becomes effective at the start of the
next calendar year.
qualification to vote on amendment proposals would be the same as qualification to vote in the general elections except that
no one who is in the employee of the government or any of its agencies or a member of the military on active duty at the
time of the amendment or who is a contractor, or an employee of that contractor, who has a contract with the government
at the time of the vote.

In other words, just a little amending and a lot enforcement of the constitution, might save it.

I would amend the 1st Amendment to define a few things.
1. Media to be the object of any means used to present or distribute content to an audience.
2. Public Media to be any media that receives, accepts or uses funds from a third party or any media
that is owned produced or aired by any government or any agency of government, and any media
that enjoys an audience greater than 1000 persons at any time.
3. Content Tort, to be any violation, by content owner or an agent of content owner, of the implied or expressed duty to tell the truth to the public
4. Truth to be expression supported by a preponderance of the evidence that the expression is true at the time of its publication on any media.
5. Content to be any expression in any form or format or size which is distributed or made available to an audience of any kind or size.
6. Time Limit for damage action in tort to be limited to 5 years from last date the same or similar content appears on, over, or is distributed by, any media.
7. Content provider to be the party that created any expression that has been published to or distributed on any media.

Please note; Nothing in this proforma amendment would subject any media to any liability for publication of a content, unless such liability arises because the media or its owner is also the creator of the content.

Posted by: snake | Nov 30 2020 10:16 utc | 87

Don Bacon @81: "We all have the right to Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

I hate to sound so flip on such an emotive issue, but I suggest that nobody try to test these "Natural Rights" with a shark, or the coronavirus. Finding out the hard way that those "rights" are far from natural can be extremely unpleasant.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 30 2020 11:11 utc | 88

@ Posted by: NemesisCalling | Nov 30 2020 3:07 utc | 80

If government is an intrinsic phenomenon of human will in a collective sense [...]

It is not.

The rest of your comment is therefore false.

--//--

@ Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 30 2020 3:54 utc | 81

If it is codified and has a birth date, it is not "natural".

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 11:16 utc | 89

Yes. Messing with the black diaspora will be become increasingly unpleasant as well.

Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 30 2020 11:37 utc | 90

Hi b, would be interested to hear what you (and others) think about the provocative Chinese tweet that has ruffled feathers here in Australia.

Posted by: Patroklos | Nov 30 2020 11:40 utc | 91

US should turn away from ideology in its China policy: Global Times editorial

I agree. The Western peoples should stop with their nonsensical utopia of a free market capitalism and accept the reality on the field.

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 11:46 utc | 93

@ Posted by: Patroklos | Nov 30 2020 11:45 utc | 93

Yep. I think those vaunted "Human Rights" are not so guaranteed or natural after all...

Posted by: vk | Nov 30 2020 11:47 utc | 94

Oz pm is sounding increasingly desperate about the mess he has made of Oz/China relations. Now that Orangetan is on his way out & creepy joe has promised to ease up on the nonsense (costing his owners too much no doubt) China has decided to teach the now unprotected by big brother Oz government a lesson in diplomacy.

Yesterday Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Lijian Zhao retweeted this apt little take on Australian war crimes.

I learned of this today on an Aotearoa news site which included a discussion from al jazeera on the hole the Morrison government has dug for itself.

For whatever reason, the kiwi article has been butchered with the AJ news vid taken out. I have found an original AJ news version of the article, which is fairly standard msm except it includes the AJ vid that had been on the stuff.co.nz site.

The vid was set up as a 'debate' between a beijing academic and a hongkong academic, but there is really only agreement about the fact that Australia needs to grow up and quit harrassing China businesses in Australia if it wants to stop China harassing Australian businesses in China.

For example Morrison et al keep rabbiting on about press freedom yet they raided the homes of Chinese journos working in Oz and stole their phones & laptops. No warrant because it was 'national security'.
Whitefella hypocrisy knows no bounds.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Nov 30 2020 11:59 utc | 95

This is sure getting interesting:

Lt Gen McInerney reported that US Special Forces 305 battalion attacked CIA server farm in Germany in server seizure operation. 5 soldiers and 1 CIA service member were allegedly killed during the operation.

Allegedly, the specialized software like Hammer and Scorecard was used on this facility. Hammer and Scorecard were created by the U.S. intelligence contractors and could be used to interfere in the U.S. presidential election in 2020.

“But the important thing is they identify China, Iran and Russia as being involved in this and manipulating the votes. In addition, the U.S. special forces command seized a server in Frankfurt, Germany, because they were sending this data from those five states or six states through the internet to Spain, and into Frankfurt, Germany. Special operations forces seized those facilities. So they have those servers. They know all the data they were providing.”

Lt. General Michael Flynn claimed in his first interview since President Trump’s pardon:

“Everything that we are experiencing right now actually is more that just an assault on President Trump. This is an assault on the American Republic.”

LT. GENERAL MCINERNEY DISCLOSED THE KRAKEN’S IDENTITY

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 30 2020 12:04 utc | 96

War brings out inherent KKKulture in occupying thugs, be it Ausssies in Afghanistan, U.S. everywhere there's brown people, and U.K. same.

HELLO, WHO F**KED UP THE THREAD? Culprits: bevin, circumspect, likbez, that idiot librul, idem Josh and poweandpeople.


Nitwits who can't be bothered with HTML tags messing up type
And margins for everyone else and then they think they're so smart.

Posted by: Circe | Nov 30 2020 12:05 utc | 97

Don't post your links without html tags on upcoming 2nd page! At this stage you should know better!

Posted by: Circe | Nov 30 2020 12:09 utc | 98

@97 Bemildred

Judge Sullivan should have given that rabid Iran hater, Flynn,
some prison time while he had a chance.

Now Flynn is back to his Ziofascist ways.

Posted by: Circe | Nov 30 2020 12:18 utc | 99

Posted by: Circe | Nov 30 2020 12:18 utc | 100

I'm not taking sides yet. What's interesting is that people (Powell, Flynn to name two) who are supposed to be connected and well-informed, are going way the heck out on a limb here and making wild, dramatic claims, which would seem to be easy to refute. This suggests to me that we are getting close to the point where somebody cracks, and/or the shit hits the fan. And it's not even December yet.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 30 2020 12:31 utc | 100

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