Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 27, 2020

Iran's Top Nuclear Scientist Assassinated As Israel Tries To Provoke War

Today the top Iranian nuclear scientist Mohsen Fahrizade was assassinated in a complex terror attack while driving on a highway in Absard, a small city just east of Tehran. An explosion stopped his car. Then shots were fired at him from two directions.


Between 2010 and 2012 four other nuclear scientist in Iran were assassinated in similar ways.

There is little doubt about who is responsible for this attack:

Fakhrizadeh was named by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in 2018 as the director of Iran’s nuclear weapons project.

When Netanyahu revealed then that Israel had removed from a warehouse in Tehran a vast archive of Iran’s own material detailing with its nuclear weapons program, he said: “Remember that name, Fakhrizadeh.”


According to the IAEA Iran did not and does not have a nuclear weapons program. More than 20 years back some Iranian scientists did an organizational study about what they would have to do to create a nuclear weapons program. But politics intervened and the program was never launched.

The Islamic Republic of Iran has since its establishment rejected all weapons of mass destruction out of religious reasons. Its leader Ayatollah Khamenei has issued a fatwa the prohibits any attempts to develop, produce or otherwise introduce such weapons.

While a terror attack against its top nuclear scientist can be seen as an act of war Iran is unlikely to openly take revenge for it. Doing such would only play into Netanyahoo's hands as he attempts to goad the U.S. into an attack on Iran.

The assassination of Mohsen Fahrizade does not aim at Iran's nuclear program. Its purpose is to assassinate the nuclear deal with Iran before president elect Joe Biden comes into office.

There are expectations, which I don't have, that Biden will rejoin the nuclear deal with Iran. The Trump administration had left the deal and had re-introduced severe sanctions against the country. President Trump retweeted news of today's assassination. If Biden really wants to revive the deal he should immediately condemn today's assassination. Obama did similar when the other scientist were killed.

There are still 55 days until Trump leaves the office. Netanyahoo will use that time to launch more provocation.

Posted by b on November 27, 2020 at 17:16 UTC | Permalink

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As much as I admire the staunch Iranian expression of independence and as much as I respect
her proverbial wisdom, it seems that my advocating for a strong response from the Iranian authorities
has been construed as lacking in patience and wisdom.

For one thing, in as much as I understand that this is a bait to elicit such a response, this provocation must not remain unchallenged.

Too much patience and appetite for martyrdom encourage the bullies to commit more wanton crimes.

Somebody in a previous post attributed the Lockerbie bombing to Iran as a retaliation for the shooting down of air flight 644 (an Iranian Liner) with 290 victims by a USS destroyer Vincennes. I believe Iranians are too noble to have committed such a horrible crime.

Posted by: CarlD | Nov 28 2020 23:53 utc | 202

Since when did the US need a legitimate reason to attack a country?

Also I think Iran sees these provocations as desperation.

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 0:00 utc | 203

Missed in all this.............

Iran just completed the platforms, wells, and pipelines necessary to exploit it's half of the Pars Oil/Gas field.

Took them years........... due to the sanctions........... but they succeeded !!!!!!!!!!

Quatar no longer has monopoly on extraction from this shared field...........

Could it be.......... that the martyr in question was instrumental in this achievement????


The Nuclear issue is a red herring?????????


Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Nov 29 2020 0:18 utc | 204

Grieved @98 & Hassan @89--

Yes, systems are deterministic as long as people allow them for they can be changed as we have witnessed. Probably the best definition for Freedom is how much ability people have in changing their system when it fails them. As such, those of us within the Outlaw US Empire and the Neoliberal nations are fettered--unfree--to a system that is not only corrupt but is a complete failure when it comes to advancing the people's interests. The Iranian people changed their system in 1979, and the Outlaw US Empire has tried to force them into changing it ever since. Same as with the Cubans in 1958. And of course there are many others. Some changes are top->down, others bottom->up. Although they aren't portrayed as such, the USA's changes have all been top->down, and all for the worse, IMO.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 29 2020 0:23 utc | 205

William Gruff #124

We can easily see that the poster is spinning a narrative that the poster itself doesn't believe and is just a formula provided by a marketing team. Who here doesn't know that the plans to attack Iran were formalized in Project for the New American Century during Clinton's reign and had been informally part of the empire's objectives since the Iranian Revolution during the Carter regime? Why try to sanitize history to make it look like the coming war is only Trump and not long-standing imperial policy? Furthermore, what's with accusing Debsisdead of being a Trump supporter? How could being that wrong possibly be a mistake? Hint: It isn't a mistake. Tarring as witch/demon/Trumpist (same thing) anyone who challenges the narrative being forced is right in the troll farm instruction manual distributed by the neoliberals. The authors of that manual themselves all suffer from "Trump Derangement Syndrome" and so to them the surest way to silence and discredit opposition is to link it to Trump.

What is most frustrating here is that if this gambit works then the empire will get its war of aggression while simultaneously reclaiming the image of a champion of peace and decency. This will succeed in getting the populations of the Five Eyes and Europe on board with the war effort. Their relief at the removal of the Orange Ogre will be so great that they will give Harris/Dead Guy the Nobel Peace Prize even as they escalate the war.

Thank you William Gruff, mighty well said.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Nov 29 2020 0:28 utc | 206

Framarz #200

you say:

@196 uncle tungsten @198 Jackrabbit

You are both denying the fact that since 40+ years Iran has been facing a nuclear weaponized alliance, for the most part, outside and above any global regulation, on it’s own.
Question yourself, if Iran had the privilege of an alliance with such powerful countries like Russia or China why Iranian military doctrine is based on own deterrence and self defence without any outside support? ... Then offer your wisdom ...

I have never denied that fact - it is bleeding bloody obvious what Israel is and its nuclear capacity. Triggering a nuclear exchange is a dilemma of immense moral challenge AND there is no doubt that Israel lacks the moral capacity to resist launching said weapons. Iran has used extraordinary diplomacy and self defence at all times and has utilised its global network of friends of the faith, allies etc to assist.

On your second point: I observe that Iran's allies, Russia and China exercise similar reserve as Iran. They have not been dashing about our beautiful planet destroying other nations with their military might. To that extent they share a sophisticated, reserved diplomacy and avoid warfare.

The man who is content to march in rank and file to the strains of music is beneath contempt.
He received his magnificent brain by mistake.
A mere spinal column would suffice.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Nov 29 2020 0:42 utc | 207

Why are these guys continually whacked in cars? Maybe time to get vehicles that don't have satellite tracking!

Posted by: Alee | Nov 29 2020 0:55 utc | 208

Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 28 2020 17:11 utc | 146

I'm not sure Obama was much better, only better PR. Not to long ago, the hairpiece looking for a brain John Kerry had packaged a peace deal with Russia in Syria only to have it destroyed when Syrian troops defending Deir Ezzor were attacked by the USAF and its Satraps, risking the citizens being over run by ISIS. Then there were all those bankers that never saw justice. Then there were the premiums on health insurance Obamacare that many couldn't afford, let alone the deductibles, enriching the Insurance companies.

Then there is Israel, which is quite is capable of a major false flag involving the US navy (remember the Main, sorry, wrong false flag,) the Liberty. Obama spent the last days of his reign making life difficult for the incoming President, so nothing new. I doubt this started with the Clintons destroying the "W" on Whitehouse keyboards.

Posted by: Tom | Nov 29 2020 1:00 utc | 209

you notice that the US Empire representatives (John Brennan for example) and its shills in the propaganda system I mean the mainstream media are urging IRAN to act in a 'civilized' and 'restrained' manner..... BUT that this so-called restraint is not to be applied in this case to.... Israel (no surprise there really)

or else the media shills call on 'all parties' to exercise 'restraint'

luckily for the world, patience is indeed a virtue and a value often practiced by, among others, Russia, Iran, China, and Syria, just to name a few, which haven't resorted (in general and in kind) with lethal force to revenge (mass) killings perpetuated by the war-criminal prone and sociopathic Americans, Brits and Israelis, and of course deceitful rats like Erdogan in Turkey

Posted by: michaelj72 | Nov 29 2020 1:04 utc | 210

bevin @153--

Yes, you understand at least some of it all. THE biggest fear of those who fathered Neoliberalism is losing their free lunch money, and the perfection of Capitalism becoming Socialism was too much for them on top of the ongoing movement to finally end Feudalism. Note that Neoliberalism is essentially the continuation of Feudalism under a different flag. But also note that Feudalism was the method used by Rome's latifundia masters to continue those privileges as they colluded with the Roman Church. Yes, it's paramount to realize that what we have is the continuation of the Creditor/Land owner dominance that ruled the Roman Empire, which was the Fascism of its day. I'd hoped to present my hypothesis in a completed version with the loose ends tied up neatly, but it's nearly impossible to deal with the current situation and its roots without having to divulge some of it in piecemeal fashion. 2,500 years of almost continuous success at staying on top leads to a mindset that says you never give up, never give in, and that's just what we see in the constant doubling-down that looks like hubris--it's the track record that fuels that behavior. Iran is just as old and has seen this behavior before. The Civilization Nations Know, that's why they play the Long Game.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 29 2020 1:08 utc | 211

@kooshy | Nov 28 2020 17:06 utc | 143 & 136

FYI, you know that shahadat (martyred) of Imams (especially ahal byet) are not congratulated, they are actualy very serious mourning days in Shia calendar. And I think, congratulating the family of martyrs of religion in shia goes way back than Shariati, it has a mystic non materialist Iranian dervish/ Sufi thought behind it. 


That is true.  There are plenty evidence that this  type congratulation comes from Iranian  cultural heritage,  per-Islamic and post-Islamic embedded in in Sufi tradition as well as in Pahlavani tradition and finaly  preserved and revived in Shea tradition.

As a short evidence I would like to cite here, it is from  Rumi's Masnavi, Volume-6, Verses from 777 to 805

A poet traveling, arrives  at Aleppo, Antioc gate, by chance it was the Ashura day, that is annual day of Shea mourning for Imam Husein. The poet was a stranger, he was not familiar with Shea tradition. ( FYI Rumi, being the great pillar of Persian Sufi tradition, was not a Shea).

He saw there was a great distress in the city, men and women in a great multitude wailing, beating themselves.  He set out to investigate those shrill cries, in search on waht is this sorrow for, it must be a great person  who has died. He ask them, wht was the name of the person who hase died that you are mouring deeply for?  What was his title, profession, rank? I am a poet, I may compose an elegy, so I may get somthing,  a morcel of food, too.

"Oh! you do not know?" siad one, "are you mad"? "Your are nto a Shea. "  "Don’t you know that the Day of Ashura is mourning for a single soul
that is more excellent than a generation? " " He was the grand son of the Prophet, son of Fatimah, our 3rd Imam" "

"Aha", said the poet. I understand now. But Imam Husein was murdered in Karbala, some 600 hundred years ago. Many many generations passed. How come the news come to you so late? Have you been asleep so many centuries?

Then Rum conclude his story with heavy blews:

"Have you been asleep till now,
that now you have rent your garments in mourning?"

"Then, O sleepers mourn for yourselves,
for this heavy slumber is an evil death."

"A royal spirit escaped from a prison: why should we rend our garments
and how should we gnaw our hands?"

"Since they were monarchs of the religion,
it was the hour of joy when they broke their bonds."

"They sped towards the pavilion of empire;
they cast off their fetters and chains."

"It is the day of kingship and pride and sovereignty,
if you have an atom of knowledge of them."

"And if you have not knowledge, go, weep for yourself, for you are
disbelieving in the removal and in the assembly at the Last Judgement."

"Mourn for your corrupt heart and religion,
for it sees nothing but this old earth."



Posted by: arata | Nov 29 2020 1:14 utc | 212

Mr. arata

Rumi, a Sunni, is here denigrating the Shia and pushes forward his - presently obsolete
- neo-Platonic philosophy.

He does not understand the nexus of ideas behind the mourning for Imam Hussein, its cathartic effect on human minds and the identification of common everyday injustices.

Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 1:25 utc | 213

Paco @ 160:"Do you observe all the orthodox fasting festivities...?"

Thank you for asking, Paco. The little church I used to attend was on the Old Calendar for all feasts, and I regularly observe those feasts throughout the year, which are the same as the Russian Orthodox calendar, 13 days after the Gregorian calendar. It fits very well with the changes of season in my desert mountain home. (I say 'used to attend' because that little church is no more.though ofshoots from it can be found in Santa Fe.

As far as strict observance of the preparatory fasts, no, these days I do not follow the instructions to the letter that are found in such calendars. When I lived near our little church I did follow them with respect to the important feasts, and my youngest daughter was born on the first day of Lent. That being the case I observed the 40 days absence from church up until Palm Sunday that had been the custom for the mother of Christ in her own natal period. Our priest told me it was optional; I didn't have to do it. I chose to.

The fasting rules are observed rigorously by monastics; I am not such. However at important times of preparation for the services yes, and particularly during Holy Week it is important to follow them as one is able in order to prepare for the festal occasions. The breaking of the fast on Easter night is the greaatest esample of such a preparatory fast. But even so, Saint John Chrisostom's Paschal sermon, read during the service, makes it known that all are invited to the feast, even the one who only comes at the very last hour. All are welcome. This is a stunning moment; it cannot be described, only experienced. There is nothing like it.

I cannot hope to emulate the fasting that is done in the Islamic faith, nor their prayer ritual. For Orthodox, Saint Paul's injunction that fasting be not done ostentatiously but with a cheerful visage that disguises the internal state of being is something I believe in,

I do think fasting is a cleansing experience, healthwise as well as in spiritual preparations.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 29 2020 1:40 utc | 214

Thanks james @ 192, and to the discussion that preceded my post. It caused me to research the Orthodox hymn, in the course of which I found the excerpt I posted. A link to the entire essay, which has in depth analysis that I didn't give except for the final part is:

I've bookmarked it, very glad to have found it.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 29 2020 1:58 utc | 215

I always assumed that they DID find WMDs in Iraq and that they all said "Made in America" on them.

Posted by: Shadow | Nov 28 2020 20:57 utc | 185

All the chemical WMD were supplied by the west to Saddam's Iraq to poison and kill thousands of Iranians during the Iraq Iran war in the 1980's. So yea, there might have been some still kicking around. While that lying Obama has the gall to write in his latest effort at fiction that the USSR supplied Iran with chemical weapons. Hard to find a war that hasn't had a big lie to get the show started.

Posted by: Tom | Nov 29 2020 2:32 utc | 216

thanks juliania... i really have to read Dostoevsky and the brothers karamazov.... i started reading another of his books - notes from the underground - which happened to be at the 2nd hand book shop, but i think maybe it is better to try for brothers karamazov... i have read tolstoi's anna kaarina, but not war and peace... i am presently finishing up reading 'i am brian wilson' which is about the life of the guy who wrote many beautiful songs -"god only knows" being one of them! so many ways to find inspiration! but as a musician, i tend to get absorbed in the musical dimension! i have written a few songs in the past week after not doing much in this way... a friend asked if i could write a song with the theme ' keeping calm and singing on'.. i am not a lyricist, but i engaged my friend and they came up with some words for it which is great!

it is interesting the importance of song to the orthodox faith you practice.. another friend whose husband is suffering from dementia informs me that music is one of the last things that engage a person suffering from dementia.. apparently the music therapist does well with her husband where nothing else seems to be able to reach him.. anyway - enough about me! thanks for sharing..

Posted by: james | Nov 29 2020 2:34 utc | 217

I am on the non-retaliation camp, USA is losing all by itself. Iran needs not bother to attack, but prepare for defense, it needs to purge western spies tho.

Posted by: Smith | Nov 29 2020 2:48 utc | 218

Posted by: arata | Nov 29 2020 1:14 utc | 212

Posted by: arata | Nov 29 2020 1:14 utc | 212

I agree, although his eminence Molana (Rumi) was a Sunni Muslim, beside his Persian tongue, his behavior, his love for living, color, humanity, soul, scents, senses is obviously and completely is Iranian, a mystic Iranian with a wealth of non-martial humanity positions, to be shared with whoever comes to his presence. Once Dr. Shafiei told me, to understand this people’s (Iranians) mentality and behavior, their line of thought, one would need to understand Persian literature specially the poetry. For Iranians their poetry and poets are more important than their history. Or one may say, is one of the same. The Real Iran is inside the wealth of her poems. This a the reason majority of our second generation Iranians who grew up in west are totally incapable of understanding Iranian mentality, outside of enjoying a lunch of Gormeh Sabzi.

Posted by: kooshy | Nov 29 2020 2:51 utc | 219

Mr. CarlD

I tend to agree with you.

Mr. Khamenei has publicly authorized retribution against the perpetrators of this crime; it is his perogative as the Commander-in-Chief of Iranian Armed Forces.

Mr. Zarif was beghing European governments for a strong condemnation. None has been proffered. Nor any public statement has been issued by any one from the government-in-waiting of Mr. Biden. China and Russian governments have been silent as well. Thus, there is no diplomatic succor is extended to Iran.

Retaliation is coming, in my opinion.

Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 2:55 utc | 220

@199 lysias

You know, I used to think you were smart, even though I didn't always agree with you.

Sad statement on YOU, not George Floyd or Mark2.

Posted by: Circe | Nov 29 2020 3:01 utc | 221

@ Fyi | Nov 29 2020 2:55 utc | 220 who ended with
Retaliation is coming, in my opinion.

The retaliation that is coming will not be eye for eye type but will be more concrete steps toward ending empire in the ME. I would also write that while many agree that retaliation is coming, the what and more crucial, the when is unknown. IMO the when will be after January 20, 2021 unless some line is crossed before then.

Just like China and Russia have been measured in their response to the latest US (s)election, this event like the ongoing killings in Gaza reflect flailings of a desperate and morally bankrupt social structure with global private finance at the core.

I agree that it would be hard to see this behavior continue un-recognized for the perfidy it represents and continue to wonder if we are months or years away from a point of inflection in the civilization war humanity is in.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 29 2020 4:37 utc | 222

karlof1 | Nov 29 2020 0:23 utc | 205

Indeed we can, and do, all learn from this vague thing that we have given the name "history". After all, much of history was composed by history purveyors at a time when very few humans could read or write and, more to the point, there was utterly no corresponding accounting or procedure to evaluate credibility of the composed history compositions. Not to bore MOA readers, but there was not even the tiniest awareness of missing/omitted vital data to what was being composed and spread...who could doubt what was written in stone.

So I only add here that Iran experienced a brief moment of united good government 1n 1954 when the shah fled out of the country when his criminality was exposed and proven by Mohammed Mosaddegh, who was elected Prime Minister. Immediately, within days, the MI6 and CIA [et al are not mentioned]forcefully smashed that victory for truth...

But for those who did not notice, there is still missing/omitted data in all historical accounts that I am aware of...

Namely, the GREAT President DDEisenhower arranges the Korean War Armistice and that war-fighting stopped July 1953. Amazing! that DDE could end those very distracting hostilities so magically...and to huge relief,joy and applause of the US public. What a hero!...but then, in August 1953, there happens that Anglo-Amer [et al] coup in Iran to smash the PM Mosaddegh and reinstall the criminal Shah...and save Anglo-Amer control of energy and even banking, and repercussions in the Global Oil Trade/banking/geopolitics are still making waves these last 67 years.

The GREAT DDE pulled a fast one; the Korean War was was a crazed sham in US history and the proof was how fast it stopped to enable suppression of the real, overwhelming crisis should Iran [read oil and gas and Mid-East presence] have its own elected government.

Military-schooled DDE was just a subtle precurser to our present-day, military-schooled Pompeo...astute and very bright but with a headfull of carefully placed, deliberately limited viewpoints.

Posted by: chu teh | Nov 29 2020 4:43 utc | 223

Below is an interesting posting at Xinhuanet that confirms the assertion that this killing is being downplayed....look who responds from the UN

UNITED NATIONS, Nov. 28 (Xinhua) -- A United Nations spokesman on Friday called for exercising restraint and avoiding escalation in the Middle East region following the assassination of top Iranian nuclear scientist Mohsen Fakhrizadeh.

"We have noted the reports that an Iranian nuclear scientist has been assassinated near Tehran today. We urge restraint and the need to avoid any actions that could lead to an escalation of tensions in the region," Farhan Haq, deputy spokesman for UN Secretary-General Antonio Guterres, said when responding to a question related to the assassination.

In a letter to Guterres and Inga Rhonda King, president of the Security Council for the month of November, Iran's permanent representative to the United Nations Majid Takht Ravanchi expressed strong condemnation against the "criminal assassination" of its nuclear scientist.

He added Iran "expects the secretary-general of the United Nations and the Security Council to strongly condemn this inhumane terrorist act and take necessary measures against its perpetrators."

Takht Ravanchi noted in the letter that "one of the latest services of Martyr Fakhrizadeh was his outstanding role in the development of the first indigenous COVID-19 Test Kit, which is a great contribution to our national efforts in curbing the COVID-19 pandemic at a time when Iran is under inhumane sanctions of the United States, strictly preventing our access to humanitarian goods including medicines and medical equipment."

"He was also supervising the development of a COVID-19 vaccine," the Iranian ambassador added.

Takht Ravanchi elaborated that over the current decade, "several top Iranian scientists have been targeted and assassinated in terrorist attacks and our firm evidence clearly indicates that certain foreign quarters have been behind such assassinations."

"The cowardly assassination of Martyr Fakhrizadeh -- with serious indications of Israeli responsibility in it -- is another desperate attempt to wreak havoc on our region as well as to disrupt Iran's scientific and technological development," he said.

"Warning against any adventuristic measures by the United States and Israel against my country, particularly during the remaining period of the current administration of the United States in office, the Islamic Republic of Iran reserves its rights to take all necessary measures to defend its people and secure its interests," he said.

Iranian high-ranking nuclear physicist Fakhrizadeh, dubbed the "father of the Iranian bomb," was assassinated near capital Tehran on Friday by "armed terrorists," Iran's Ministry of Defense announced.

The Iranian government suspects that the assassination was performed by Israel's Mossad intelligence agency, though Tel Aviv has neither confirmed nor denied the allegation, according to media reports.

Iranian Foreign Minister Javad Zarif has condemned the killing and alleged "serious indications" of Israeli involvement.

So Fakhrizadeh had developed a test for Covid and was supervising development of a Covid vaccine How sad to lose such an energy doing good for his country.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 29 2020 5:18 utc | 224

re William Gruff #124

I understand why you would see that poster and the one whose acolyte he is as being crude neolib plants, however I've sorta discounted that as I just find it hard to believe the arseholes are so desperate that the only astro turfers they can find are a total nutter who is supported by a moron.

Maybe you're right maybe the once famed dim machine has fallen that far.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Nov 29 2020 5:48 utc | 225

@Posted by: arata | Nov 29 2020 1:14 utc | 212

For those interested, here's more to understand Rumi's ( ~1250 BP ) cognitive position:

Only Breath (1)

Ah, true believers, what can I say?
I no longer know who I am.

Not Christian or Jew or Muslim.
Not Hindu, Buddhists, Sufi, or Zen.
I am not from the East or the West,
not out of ocean or up from the ground.
Not natural or ethereal, nor composed
of elements at all. I do not exist.

I am not from China or India, not
from the town of Bulghar on the Volga
nor remote Arabian Saqsin. Not
from either Iraq, between the rivers,
or in western Persia. Not an entity
in this world or the next. I did not
descend from Adam and Eve or any origin
story. My place is the placeness,
a trace of the traceless, neither
body or soul, I belong to the beloved,
have seen the two worlds as one
and that one call to and know,
first last, outer, inner, only
that breath breathing human being.

Only Breath (2)

Friends, when I taste love’s wine,
the two worlds combine,

and I have no purpose
but this play of presences.

If I spend one moment outside you,
I repent, and when I have

a moment of closer rapport,
I dance to rubble the the ruins

of both, Shams Tabriz,
this friendship is all I say.

Posted by: suzan | Nov 29 2020 5:51 utc | 226

@Fyi | Nov 29 2020 1:25 utc | 213

Rumi, a Sunni, is here denigrating the Shia and pushes forward his - presently obsolete
- Neo-Platonic philosophy.

Thanks for your comment.

 Rumi has highly respected Imam Husein, he has mentioned him several time as the greatest martyrdom.

  It is not fair  to  label him with a Neo-Platonic sticker.

Watch a short video clip from Sardar Qasem Soleimani -Declamation verses from Rumi , here.

Then tell me who is Sunni, who is Shae. Please think about it.

Sunni, Shea, Muslims, Christians, Jews, Hindus, did not bother Rumi. Human, human, all the human, was his concern. He says: discover thyself. THYSELF.

Those philosophical schools, including Neo-Platonic, including many Sufi orders, view the world as a combination of macrocosms vs microcosms. In their view,  human is in the micro side.

But Rumi as his Persian predecessors, says, realize and discover thyself,  you are greater than both of macro and micro world. You do not know the power within thyself. You should try and try and try to discover thyself.

Posted by: arata | Nov 29 2020 7:08 utc | 227

Posted by: juliania | Nov 29 2020 1:40 utc | 214

Thanks for your detailed answer. Maybe I should re-read Dostoevsky but it does not come easy, important books are perceived differently depending on when in your lifespan you read them. For sure The Karamazovs left a deep impression on me, but that was a long time ago.

When it comes to Russian literature I feel closer to Lev Tolstoy, just a couple of days ago I was reading about a Mexican translator who has published in Spanish the last book written by Tolstoy, Path of Life, last night I was searching for it in English but curiously the prologue to the book I could not find, so I machine translated this paragraph from the Russian prologue to the book:

The Kingdom of God will come to us only when church faith in miracles, sacraments and rituals is replaced by faith in reason, without miracles, sacraments and rituals. The time is drawing near. This faith is still in its infancy. But the embryo cannot but grow. Let's wait and work so that the time comes sooner.

Since there is talk of religions in this post I thought it was appropriate to post this, maybe VK or another of the qualified forum historians can confirm my suspicion that from Tolstoy came Lenin.

In any case I want to let you know that I have deep respect for all religions, and I have very deep respect for Orthodoxy since I had the privilege and great pleasure of spending some time as a guest of a rural Orthodox Priest in northern Russia, great conversations we had, specially about football, he was all for Xavi a Spanish player, I was all for Maradona for his sinner side as the human part of a demigod, he could not openly agree with me, there was a group of people in the discussion, but his sly smile did.

One more thing about Tolstoy that really impressed me, his burial place in Yasnaya Polyana, nothing to mark a mound on the ground, nothing, I was there in winter time and the impression will be with me for a long time, so many generals, presidents, kings and pharaohs with their monumental places of rest, and this great man, a force of nature, buried in the ground without any ornament or display, what a lesson.

Posted by: Paco | Nov 29 2020 8:14 utc | 228

Jackrabbit @ 106 =>But it's not a Hitler-like dictator that drives this or an amorphous, faceless "system", it's a team effort by Deep State managers of the Empire. That's why pro-Empire policies never change from President to President.

<==Yes Jackrabbit you have said it well.
its not the state Israel, that assassinated Iran's organizational talent, the assassination was a joint venture of private oil and gas thieves and capital market purveyors (its the old days in terms of Industry killing off union organisers). Iranian nuclear scientist Mohsen Fahrizade was a talented organizational genius, his talents were producing highly successful competitive science; science discoveries and engineering feats [which the privately owned nation state rule of law system, could not use against Iranian businesses to direct profits from Iran into the pockets of the private western empire dependant oligarchs. These Oligarchs are angry, they cannot own or control Iranian science or profit from Iranian Engineering feats and worse the Oligarchs have no system capable to contain these feats. The Iranians don't hand over to patented and copyrighted controlled science and engineering what Iran develops. The oligarchs are not happy the Iran can compete.

Iran's scientific progress has,= since Sanction=> been beyond belief.. these Oligarch guys cannot stand that Iran is not only a successful competitor in Global markets but also that Iran is a prominent beneficiary to Zi's success in organization the 26 state trade-agreement with Russia, China, and Iran, making trade a border transparent system that incorporates 1/3 of the worlds GNP.

Fyi @ 147 & 190 =>no one will invest in Iran for the foreseeable future, so integration w/e world economy and foreign investments has no value for the Iranian leaders. <= snake the object of the murder <=prevent foreign investment in rising-star Iran was the job description for Trump Foreign policy desk. but as you say Better weapons c\n\b neutralized by the West

bevin @ 153 => inversion effect: diminishing top-level credibility is, propelling the detached governed, to engage revolutionary transformation.

AR @ 150 says neither China or Russia condemned the assassination <=yes that because they are part of the global [use the nation state rule making power] to control the deplorable and to own the world bunch.

H. Schmatz @ 151 says Criminalization of any expression against globalization, NATO, the EU, the IMF or WB, at least in Spain. Some alternative websites have been already targeted. One would say that it is an intend to shut up any opposition for the future wars in the Middle East and around the world, including the developing against the working class. <===Snake says yes, you often see western capitalist trying to stem the in-progress rate increasing flows of capital from west=>east.. soon that flow will break the backs of the western nation state coordinated private venture empire.

William Gruff @ 173 The myth of the invulnerability of the empire needs to be maintained. Each of the empire's mistakes and failures must be recast as part of a deeper plan. <=snake: empire must defend against W to E flow of capital.

H Schmatz @ 162..narrative space filler. attack [on Iran] fills narrative space sufficient for media to avoid US #dollar crash narratives. <= but I see nothing in the media about killing a nuclear scientist in Iran. No where in the USA governed America.

Dr. George W. Oprisko @ 274 said what Snake said in early to this thread post that B would not allow to the list;;
"Missed in all this.............Iran just completed the platforms, wells, and pipelines necessary to exploit it's half of the Pars Oil/Gas field. Took them years........... due to the sanctions........... but they succeeded !!!!!!!!!! Quatar no longer has monopoly on extraction from this shared field...........Could it be.......... that the martyr in question was instrumental in this achievement????" <==BOY OF BOY OH BOY DOES SNAKE AGREE WITH YOU ON YOUR LAST STATEMENT "The Nuclear issue is a red herring?????????" Everyone please the empire is experiencing a negative flow of capital an increasing rise in un- collateralized nation state debt which is pumping the inflation genie fueled by the mothballed private upstart entrepreneur. Copyrights, patents and monopoly powers, that have mothballed inventive enterprising, oligarch-independent, open source share with all everything <=Americans <=the efforts of none oligarch entrepreneurs have been criminalized. so true competitive entrepreneurship can no no longer contribute to the Domestic American economy..

Posted by: snake | Nov 29 2020 9:24 utc | 229

Bidens choice for Ambassador to the United Nations, looks a really good pick.
Sends a signal that the president elect is ready to rengage with the rest of the world. “Agreement capable “

Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 29 2020 11:09 utc | 230

@229 snake

This assassination is not about blocking an economical project or blocking scientific development and competitiveness of Iran. Of course such issues are very important for ZioImperialists but to achieve such second level goals, they follow one of their main agenda since 1979 revolution. It’s the agenda of eliminating key forces that could offer a political platform in accordance to the main objectives of the revolution: Freedom, Independence, Social Justice.

ZioImperialist acts of terror did not start a decade ago and with nuclear scientist. It started right after the revolution. Beheshti and Motaheri, members of high-positioned progressive clergy, Rajaee and Bahonar, government administrators with action plans toward a social just development, even part of the political opposition, the leadership of Iran’s Tudeh Party (eliminated by part of IRI intelligence apparatus based on MI6 prepared and initiated plan), who offered an alternative national-democratic (in sense of scientific socialist theory) political program to the liberal policy of technocrats, were all victims of ZioImperialist terror war against the revolution.

They are not assassinating individuals, it’s about derailing a revolution, about preventing main objectives of an anti-imperialist revolution.

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 29 2020 11:11 utc | 231

So Fakhrizadeh had developed a test for Covid and was supervising development of a Covid vaccine How sad to lose such an energy doing good for his country.

@Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 29 2020 5:18 utc | 224

Doing good for his country...and who know whether also for the whole world.
I for one can not imagine a faithful commited Shia developing a vaccine which makes me any harm, as his religion impels him to do exactly the opposite.
Then, I have not heard any Iranian Shia official took part in Event201 pandemic simulacra ( like Avril Haynes next head of security council in Biden´s adminsitration ), nor works or has anytime worked for big pharma, nor takes part as member or is part of heading team in the WEF´s Great Reset Operation..

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 11:34 utc | 232

Mr. Zarif was beghing European governments for a strong condemnation. None has been proffered. Nor any public statement has been issued by any one from the government-in-waiting of Mr. Biden. China and Russian governments have been silent as well. Thus, there is no diplomatic succor is extended to Iran.

Retaliation is coming, in my opinion.

@Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 2:55 utc | 220

And that is very telling, lacking evidence can not be wielded as alibi as the EU as a whole had no problems in condming Russia on alleged Navalny´s poisoning with alleged "Novichok", without any evidence so far beign showed.

Our governments benefit from the fact that most of population only hear or read MSM news and broadcasts, otherwise they would be all in the verge of being overthrown by their lack of consistence, basic decency, and honesty. It is is this sense that new laws are being prepared to shut up the aware.

They could think that by keeping silent in face of this outrage, they will be free of being victims of "Strategy of Tension", but recent and past history shows that is not the case when international organized bullies involved.

I do not know how long TV channels plan their programation, but in the very same day Mr. Fahkrizahde was murdered in Teheran, a film about a pretendedly handsome Mossad agent working in Syria against "criminal Assad and his equally criminal intelligence services", who has a love story with a US young journalist female of Jewish mother...

That was at a public TV channel Spanish autonomous region in the North...I, for one will be investigating who is the person in charge of the programation of this cahnnel and what his/her background is, as I am a taxpayer...

One wonders whether that is done to make us this assassination more palatable....
What this is done for, for sure, is to brainwash people and justify criminal procedures of criminal governments around the world who are part of the real "Axis of Evil".

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 12:01 utc | 233

Taken from a Twitter thread. Sounds plausible. Very: Emphasis mine to underline external origins. (Not specified in thread)

“1- Iranian priority estimates say that all the members of the team that carried out the assassinations of Fakhrizadeh entered special training courses, as well as security and intelligence services abroad.

2- According to the leaked Iranian info, a squad of 62 members participated in the assassination of Fakhrizadeh, 12 of them participated in the field to carry out the operations, 50 other elements provided the field team with logistical support to carry out the assassination”

“3- According to leaked Iranian data from the Fakhrizadeh assassinations, the assassination team that carried out the field operations used a Hyundai Santa Fe, a Nissan and 4 motorcycles to carry out the Fakhrizadeh assassinations.”

“4- The team knew exactly the date & course of the movement of the Fakhrizadeh protection convoy in the smallest details, & had documented information that Fakhri Zadeh would go on this day & at this specific hour to his private villa in the city of Absard”

“5- The assassination team, half an hour before the arrival of the Fakhri Zadeh convoy to the specific location, cut off the electricity completely from this area. A Hyundai Santa Fe with 4 passengers, 4 motorcycles, 2 snipers, and a Nissan car booby-trapped were waiting”

“6- Fakhrizadeh's convoy consisted of 3 bulletproof cars, the assassination team waited for the first car to pass from the entrance roundabout of the city of Absard until the second car (Fakhrizadeh's car), opened fire, then the Nissan car was detonated on the third vehicle

7- After the car bomb was detonated, 12 operatives opened fire towards Fakhri Zadeh's car & first protection vehicle. According to Iranian leaks, the leader of the assassination team took Fakhri Zadeh out of his car and shot him and made sure he was killed”

8- When some of the wounded, members of Fakhrizadeh protection, were transported to the emergency services near the site of operations, they were surprised by the power outages in these emergency services, and then they were transferred to hospitals in the capital, Tehran.”

“9- According to the Iranian leaks, none of the twelve elements who participated in the field operations of the Fakhri Zadeh assassinations were wounded or arrested.”

PS. My principal computer has been stopped from accessing internet friday night. Probably coincidence - but then a bit of paranoia keeps one awake.

Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 12:02 utc | 234

One more thing about Tolstoy that really impressed me, his burial place in Yasnaya Polyana, nothing to mark a mound on the ground, nothing, I was there in winter time and the impression will be with me for a long time, so many generals, presidents, kings and pharaohs with their monumental places of rest, and this great man, a force of nature, buried in the ground without any ornament or display, what a lesson.

Posted by: Paco | Nov 29 2020 8:14 utc | 228

Yes, thank you for expressing that so well. We are not here just to pile up stuff and stroke ourselves off. It's not about you.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 29 2020 12:13 utc | 235

@ Juliana.

I was baptized by Bishop, later Metropolitan Anthony Bloom who was my spiritual father into my twenties. Although born in London into a British family, all my early learning experiences were formed by Russian ferfugees from the Lenin and Stalin eras.

I was enrolled in Protestant schools and never could ‘ fit in ‘. I do comprehend very well the Ethos of the Orthodox Church but life has taught me to stand apart and question everything I perceive to be ‘ out of wack ‘.

Commenters on this thread have given me a new perspective to Islam. However in the certain knowlege that the following comment will enrage many Muslims, I cannot embrace a religion that places a man above God.

Posted by: beibdnn | Nov 29 2020 12:14 utc | 236

Comment on my 234

The size and organization of the operation hints at why Brennan spoke up. "62 people" implies that all this group would now go into hiding, as the Iranians will now deploy a major search to find them - thus making any other terrorist action difficult. So, what had Brennan organized for later, (after Biden is in place), that this action might compromise?

Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 12:15 utc | 237

@Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 12:15 utc | 237

But, why do you blame Brennan, whom so far, is the only officila around the world, along UN one, a woman I think on charge of terrorism fight, who has lableled the attack as it is and condemned it along with asking for Iranian restraint.

This attack happened during Trump´s tenure and has all the marks of that on Soleimani.

The organization with cut off of power outage included by electric especialists to asure the target will die even when only seriously wounded by having to go next hospital, points all the way to Mossad.
The twelve highly especialized in target assassinations ground operatives points at two Seals´teams from that oultlawed US joint command.
The kamikzes of the bomb car highly likely MEK braniwashed people continuously prepared to that end in Albania.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 12:55 utc | 238

Btw, wondering whether the people talking about religions could transport their conversation to the Open Thread, so that not elongate unnecesarly the thread.

I am not aware who started the derailing, since I am just catching up with this thread, but I recall having observed this same tendence at other threads where Israeli autorship on any terrorist attack is discussed.

Also, it would be great if the usual suspects could stop repeating the same points ong TDS and exculpating Trump from everything, even in face of obvious flagrant evidence, and repeatedly insulting others with different points of view from theirs who have the same right to comment here, one guess....


Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 13:06 utc | 239

Well, condemnations from world officials have been, after all, only they have not been reported so far in this thread, crowded by US people/operatives, included those from Iranian desks at US intelligence services dedicated to find whatever could demonize the Shia even from very personal translations into English of Persian poetry...I, for one, knowing partially the message of Imam Hussein and Imam Reza out of interest from my travels, can not believe any mystic could find anything wrong with people mourning such spiritual leaders who only promoted, peace, love, compassion, and even observing restraint in revenge and retaliation...hence that the US/Israel play with advantage here, as they very well know this from their Iranian desk´s operatives´s research....

Reaction from Russian senator, President of Russian Foreign Affairs Commmitee ( which could be deemed the Russian one, when Kremlin officials do not want ot express still theirs...)

Russia: Assassination of Iranian scientist will destabilize region

Reaction in the US, from Bernie Sanders...

Sanders calls Iranian scientist's murder illegal and provocative

Global repudiation, inlcuding the West, EU and so on...

Global condemnation of the assassination of Iranian nuclear scientist

Several countries in the world condemn the murder of the eminent Iranian nuclear scientist, Mohsen Fajrizade, in the terrorist attack on Friday in Tehran.

More countries condemn Friday's act of terrorism, which Iran says has been perpetrated by the Israeli regime, and for which it has promised to take revenge in due course. In Syria, both the government and various opposition parties condemned the terrorist attack against the scientist.

For his part, the President of the Turkish Parliament, Mustafa Sentop, called the attack a terrorist act.

From Brussels, the office of the Head of Diplomacy of the European Union (EU), Josep Borrell, described the attack as a criminal act.

Venezuela was one of the first countries to repudiate the terrorist attack, while others such as South Africa and Qatar later joined the condemantion.

Iran submitted a letter to the United Nations Security Council (UNSC) on Friday denouncing state terrorism and affirming that it will take the necessary measures against the aggressors.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 14:00 utc | 240

What those continuously exculpating Trump here and now insinuating another twisted comspiracy of the Democratic Party to blame Trump for this obviate, is that Trump Twitted immediately after the attack, as he iddi after Soleimani assassination, which he recognized full authorship, retwitting a former Mossad who was justifying the assassination on whatever invented charges against Fahkrizhde, whihc acted as a confession for the Iraniansv from both, US Trump´s and Israeli administration.

Who others would be interested in commiting this provocative crime, right now, if not those who are on the verge of losing the grip on power and managed to waste the hardly worked for years JCPOA?

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 14:13 utc | 241

BTW,the members of Iran's Intelligence Services are commonly called "SARBAZAN GOMNAM EMAM ZAMAN" , which translates to: "The Unknown soldiers of the hidden 12th Imam , therefore they have double power, Devine strength and that of the hidden Imam, wait and see....

Posted by: Sammy | Nov 29 2020 14:40 utc | 242

Thanks H. Schmatz @ 241
Brilliant contribution to the truth.
The very reason I come here. We need more of it. If we value our reputation.

Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 29 2020 15:03 utc | 243

H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 12:55 utc | 238

I agree with most of your post. The reason that I mention Brennan is that I get the impression he was upset that the group had not "followed (his) orders" and by doing so lost their cover. The assassination certainly could have been carried out by those you mention. No problem - actually an interesting "division of responsibility".

Doesn't this point up the divisions in command chains (CIA or Pentagon Military, Pentagoons (Almost non-military but heavily invested in the Military-Industrial industry, Zio-inserts. etc)?

It was a"professional" job. The the groups involved, 62 people, would have to have been in position over a longish period of time OR they were flown in "just" for that operation?. Knowledge that they exist and in such a number is going to push the Iranians to find them urgently.

Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 15:27 utc | 244

@Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 15:27 utc | 244

What if the "team" smuggled into Iran through the "chaos and mayhem" of the past conflict in Nagorno Karabakh? Fortunatley the Iranians were packing troops along their whole border, but who knows, and we can not obviate insiders collaborationists of always...

Recall that first villages in being took over were those placed in Iran´s there is a current intent on replicating the "idlib" scenario with trnasporting and settlement of around 4000 Trukmen "moderate rebels" from Syria in newly occupied parts of Artsakh, which points all the way at preparations for an Iranian war/invasion, as i pointed out at the very beginning of the Artsakh conflict, which place Pashinyan as either willing or unwilling neccessary collaborator...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 16:27 utc | 245

Ms. suzan

The problematic in the long lines of verse that you have quoted is what plagues all Monist views and philosophies, i.e. how to account for and interact with the quite evident empirical diversity of the world.

Here, late Mr. Rumi, by fiat, denies the Reality of Diversity and replaces it with abstract Unity. But that is not how life is lived or were lived in his own time.

Would he have agreed to a marriage proposal from a Christian family for the hand of his daughter? Almost certainly not, and "Unity be damned." he would have said.

Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 16:30 utc | 246

Well, it seems by the wording of coming Biden official that the Us stablishment is playing the bad cop/good cop with the Iranians, as this official states that to return to the JCPOA the Biden administration needs Irans complying with JCPOA requirements plus other preconditions not related to it...

You can bet that the not related preconditions will be related to acquisition of modern non nuclear defense systems and weapons, pnce UN embargo expired, which piints all the way at that the Trump administration dinamitation of any agreement was a behavior well planned and intended by the US "deep state" to achieve more advatageous conditions for them on detrimtent of their partners in the agreement.

Thus, highly likely Brennan is not, but gaining time...for what?

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 16:39 utc | 247

Mr. arata

Thank you for your comments and the link to the declamation of the late Brigadier General Hadj Qasem Soleymani.

That the late Mr. Rumi respected Imam Ali or Imam Hussein has never been in doubt; he has a poem on Imam Ali in which describes him as "the Lion of Truth".

But he was not a Shia, he denigrated the Shia of Aleppo's participation in Ashoura ceremonies, failing to comprehend it as a spiritual exercise.

Those who taught me his poetry, interpreted it for me from neo-Platonic point of view. I later came to discard that philosophy.

Poetry is like food, it is a matter of taste. However, there could be good rational reasons to prefer one food to the other, regardless of taste.

Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 16:45 utc | 248

@ arata and suzan... thanks for the rumi quotes.. very enlightening!

@ 228 paco... my wife was telling me just the other day that tolstoy helped fund a number of doukabours their trip to canada... we have some friends that recently found out their ancestry is doukabour.. there parents resided in a place called 'rama' saskatchewan... it is funny the name 'rama' as this is the important hindu god in indian culture! at any rate, there parents either were embarrassed by this background info, or were unaware of it... here in b.c. there were a number of doukabour settlers and the offshoot 'sons of freedom' were certainly a colourful offshoot of this interesting religion- ideology... every time i pass thru grand forks, b.c. i make sure to stop for some borscht!!

Posted by: james | Nov 29 2020 17:12 utc | 249

After the assassination does not start a war, a false flag incident will be next. Maybe the bombing of a US base in Iraq which will be then attributed to Iran.

Posted by: DRDHESQ | Nov 29 2020 17:44 utc | 250

"John Bolton
· 22h
Iran's terrorist regime is seeking nuclear weapons for terrorist purposes. Faced with such a threat, a pre-emptive strike is fully justified."

Posted by: arby | Nov 29 2020 17:59 utc | 251

Fakhrizahde already drawn along Soleimani and Al Muhandis as resistant at the front line...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 18:03 utc | 252

"There are a few things that any functional state should try to do, or at least have a damn good excuse for not doing. Protecting the life of it's citizens is the first by far, followed closely by feeding it's citizens and allowing them to start a family."
Posted by: Tod | Nov 27 2020 21:51 utc | 42

America does not protect the life of its own, it also murders other citizens globally in pretending to do so.

America feeds it own citizens toxic food. Over half the population is OBESE, being fed toxic foods due to economic suffocation of its own citizens- corn syrups, hydrogenated oils, growth hormones, antibiotics, pesticides etc. Obese Americans are easy pickings for Covid, obese americans are not combat effective, obese americans are profit margins for a health "care" system that profits from poor health- the more unhealthy the obese population, the more profit for the health care system and all the bottom feeders- its own Health Industrial Complex.

Dozen military vets a day suicides, homeless sick Vets everywhere. Is that taking care of its own citizens?

Maybe you need to watch more US war propaganda Revenge films to get your blood lust up? Persia invented Chess, have you played lately?

Posted by: CitizenX | Nov 29 2020 20:03 utc | 253

Informative piece by Elijah:

Israel, unlike President Trump when he assassinated Brigadier general Qassem Soleimani, did not officially announce its responsibility for the assassination of Fakhri Zadeh, even if Netanyahu hinted to this effect in his own style. However, US B-52s were ordered back to the Middle East a few days before the attack and the Pentagon ordered USS Nimitz back to the Persian Gulf and the US administration vowed to hit hard if any US soldier was attacked in Iraq. All these indications are taken by Iran as clear signals of the US-Israel complicity and responsibility for this unlawful assassination.

Posted by: Yul | Nov 29 2020 20:28 utc | 254

Everything told to Magnier by his source sounds logical. The source mentioned possible Saudi participation in this operation, I think he had considerations, not talking about Turkey, and am sure that Iran is going to have a careful look at that direction too. The amount of logistical resources invested in the assassination almost guarantee that this is an still ongoing operation and this action was just a single task on a multiple tasks agenda. If by assassination case of general Soleimani, there were rumours and theories about an internal leak, after assassination of Dr. Fakhrizadeh, everyone know that there is a leak inside.
Interestingly someone with high security background in one of northern provinces of Iran were arrested yesterday, formally because of economic-criminal records of his son.
I don’t think US military manpower or facilities need to be a payback target, one could pick rather any part of Zionist networks operating in hyperactive mode in southern shores of Persian Gulf. This way, one don’t need to wait until after 20th January 2021.

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 29 2020 22:34 utc | 255

@Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 29 2020 15:27 utc | 244

Where did you take that it was a team of 62 people and there were 12 shooters on the ground, plus the electric outage issue?

I say it because just read at South Front quoting Fars News Iranian agency by saying that there were no human operatives involved, but was a machine gun remotely controled mounted at the Nissan car ( which then self-destroyed ) which shot at Fakhrizadeh when he got out of his car to test what was happening.
They do mention Fakhrizadeh died of his injuries before arriving at hsopital but do not mention anything about any power outage.

How do you explain it?
How did you know how many operatives were involved and how they operated if ot through the Iranians?
Someone is lying here.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 23:43 utc | 256

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 23:43 utc | 256

How do you explain it?
How did you know how many operatives were involved and how they operated if ot through the Iranians?
Someone is lying here.

I've seen this story spread around other sites exclusively by the usual team of hasbara operatives. My feeling is that it's simply another mossad narrative meant to capitalise on the event.


Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 30 2020 0:12 utc | 257

It looks like one of Fakhrizadeh's bodyguards *may* survive:

If that is indeed the case, expect a more detailed picture to emerge countering any hasbara narratives that are bound to form in the next few days.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 30 2020 0:16 utc | 258

And as I predicted, Iran will now retaliate by increasing the rate of nuclear fuel production and withdrawing even further from the limits of the JCPOA, using Fakhrizadeh's killing as justification:

Sunday, the Iranian parliament voted by an overwhelming majority on the draft law about “strategic measures to abolish sanctions,” which includes raising uranium enrichment to 20%.
The Iranian Parliament Speaker, Muhammad Baqer Qalibaf, also affirmed that “the draft law on strategic measures to lift the sanctions will limit the terrorist acts waged by the enemy against Iran.”

So Iran intends to leverage the tragedy with respect to the JCPOA.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 30 2020 0:24 utc | 259

The Saker has a great analysis here.

Of particular note is his assertion that Iran in no way has to respond immediately or symmetrically. Look how one speech from Nasrallah, promising retribution following an assassination attempt in Damascus, had the Zionist occupiers "standing on one leg (ready to flee)."
Agreed that Iranian intelligence should have been more thorough in ensuring the victim/martyr's safety (in light of persistent threats from the Zionist entity), but time (and world public opinion)is on Iran's side here; time for Uncle Scam to get used to "standing on one foot," too.

Posted by: robjira | Nov 30 2020 0:26 utc | 260

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 23:43 utc | 256

"How do you explain it?"

Whenever you see one of these fully-formed romantic narratives about some violent international event of this sort, you may be sure it is bullshit. The Izzies are particularly fond of it, but so is Uncle Sugar.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 30 2020 0:30 utc | 261

@ Circe | Nov 27 2020 22:07 utc | 46

The link in Zanon's comment #41 looks just fine on my screen -- just the way it should look.

Posted by: AntiSpin | Nov 30 2020 1:28 utc | 262

@ Posted by: Fyi | Nov 29 2020 16:30 utc | 246

(asking patience from H.Schamatz and perhaps others for replying here instead of on an old open thread)

My friend, i do not understand, like you, that “Rumi denies the Reality of Diversity and replaces it with abstract Unity” (your words).

Rumi was born of Persian descent in what is today Afghanistan. The buddhadharma was widespread teaching there at his time of birth. It taught about relative reality which our ordinary sense perceptions recognize, and which are somewhat illusional or delusional, dependent on many psychic factors, personal history etc.; and also ultimate (non)reality which is intimately interrelated with relative reality.

One coin, two sides.

Cause and results are primary. This, then that, but all within a whole.

Posted by: suzan | Nov 30 2020 2:05 utc | 263

@257 Arch Bungle

While the alleged tweet (non-linked) redistributed by H. Schmatz have the characteristic of being part of a PsyOp, fully adopting official report by Fars News (and SF), doesn’t fit the real circumstances of the event.
You can study already existing photos of the car and review eyewitness reports published early after assassination. You can see from the photo of Dr. Fakhrizadeh’s car that snipers equipped with sophisticated guns were part of the assault team.
It’s not a simple task to bypass a security team consisting of 3 units directly engaged in the protection in addition to general security network, and hit the target. Without a doubt many resources were pulled together to get this done.
Those who accuse Iran of supporting international terrorism proved once again to be the real actors sponsoring terror acts against civilian targets around the world.

@260 robjira

Robjira, It doesn’t make sense that Iran should use the same policy of deterrence as Hezbollah. While Hezbollah are champions of resistance and successfully exercise pressure on Zionist Apartheid regime, they are not representing a state and can’t utilize all tools available to an official government. Iranian government need to demonstrate a series of reaction to this provocation. That’s what we are observing, first diplomatic reactions, then parliamentary reactions and the time will come for physical reactions. A pay back was decided and already under implementation.

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 30 2020 7:27 utc | 264

More than likely a defection. His family removed to safety. Carried out by the Saudis. See Thomas Wictor's damage assessment on yt.

Posted by: Kula | Nov 30 2020 8:07 utc | 265

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 30 2020 7:27 utc | 264

I agree that the Fars report should not be trusted either. In my opinion no media should be trusted from either side.

As is usually the case, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle of all the narratives ...

My bet:

This was carried out by the MEK. Little or no Mossad coordination was involved other than perhaps a contract to find and kill Fakhrizadeh.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 30 2020 8:52 utc | 266

So...I'm not a regular poster here, but my point here is to point out a bit of cognitive dissonance of those who think Iran will be oh-so patient and calculating for a response, and we just have to wait for Iran's response.

This "patient, calculating" response goes 100% AGAINST the reality of Iran's INCOMPETENCE at protecting its top General and its top Scientist.

Was allowing them to be martyred a patient and calculated endeavor?

If not, then Iran is proven incompetent.

And anyone afterwards claiming that Iran is "Patient, calculating..." is assigning WAY MORE competence to Iran than Iran actually deserves. Cognitive dissonance. Magical thinking.

A dozen years of murdered scientists, and a couple years of murdered top General and top Scientists..."response/retaliation" is kind of an afterthought. The first thought is why Iranian scientists and generals keep being murdered.

"Sure, the Iranians allowed the Ayatollah and every other citizen to be murdered in a huge nuclear strike, but I claim Iran is calculating, patient. Even if none of them are still alive"

Child-like heroes. Undeserving.

Posted by: Wind Hippo | Nov 30 2020 9:31 utc | 267

@265 Kula

Well, I must admit the Lee Marvin photo with the M3 gun could leave some impressive effect on a premature teenager mind, but the rest of the story presented by this dude doesn’t even qualify to be called horse manure. Have you any reliable information about what kind of stuff he use to smoke?

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 30 2020 9:39 utc | 268

@267 Wind Hippo

General Soleimani didn’t made a name only by formulating functioning military strategies, the fear and respect toward him by the enemy top commanders was mostly caused by the fact that military operations under his command had a level of quality never seen before, indeed one must go watch “mission impossible” series made by Hollywood to find something similar. Iranians doesn’t talk loud about this. There are many Soleimanis in Iran.

Not being able to dodge an act of terror is nothing extra ordinary, no one on this planet is able to provide 100% security. It’s your PsyOp efforts that sound childish, if you ask me.
As I mentioned in another comment, terror war against Iran started 40 years ago. When you look at current geopolitics, it didn’t achieved much.

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 30 2020 10:24 utc | 269

Posted by: Framarz | Nov 30 2020 10:24 utc | 269

"no one on this planet is able to provide 100% security"

I think that is true, but the important point is that no soldier can do his job if he is solely focussed of saving himself. These men are soldiers in a war, and they know they may die and choose to keep doing their job. That's called discipline, good morale, and a being a soldiers general. One of the striking things about Iran's military effort in Syria in the early part of the war was the number of command officers that were killed in combat. They have skin in the game.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 30 2020 11:49 utc | 270

Framarz @Nov27 22:34 #53

Nimitz going inside Persian Gulf, means no chance of war. When these type of units are far away, in free waters, then it's dangerous.

Not. Really. True.

Nimitz is the oldest carrier in the fleet. It's replacement John F Kennedy has already been built and was launched last year. The Nimitz will be retired in little more than a years time.

If any carrier is to be sacrificed, this would be the one.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 14:54 utc | 271

Iran is playing into the narrative of potential false-flag (as I imagine was hoped for):

  • declaring their intention to seek revenge for yet another martyr;
  • essentially terminating the JCPOA by increasing enrichment levels.

If Iran doesn't need nukes for deterrence (a some at moa insist) then why provoke their enemies with nuke tech?

<> <> <> <> <>

One more major assassination or other attack on Iran, followed by more hateful rhetoric from Iran, will probably be enough to complete the false-flag narrative for a gullible Western public.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 15:04 utc | 272

"If Iran doesn't need nukes for deterrence (a some at moa insist) then why provoke their enemies with nuke tech?"

That is silly.
They are just slowly breaking their agreements on the JCPOA and if the paranoid constant accusers are bothered by that then that is a good thing.

Posted by: arby | Nov 30 2020 16:50 utc | 273

Jackrabbit (#272), 20% enriched uranium treats cancer, while I personally think that business competition is a good thing for consumers there may some folks that disagree.

Posted by: Joe | Nov 30 2020 16:55 utc | 274

The same way that the US forced Russia and China together is the same way they are forcing countries to get nukes. Making the world a complete pile of fear and absurd danger. Unforgivable.

Posted by: arby | Nov 30 2020 17:36 utc | 275

H.Schmatz | Nov 29 2020 23:43 utc | 256

Re alternative scenario; As mentioned in the (copied) Twitter thread, this was a leak which sounds plausible. No, I am not going to link as quite often these days the source disappears.

As pointed out by Framarz | Nov 30 2020 7:27 utc | 264, there are only three-four small signs of impact on the cars windscreen, not a series, as one could expect from a "remote controlled machine gun". Then to say that "he got out of his (bullet proof) car to see what was going on" belies belief. You don't need to be a nuclear scientist to know when to keep your head down.

However, WHY is the official version trying to play down the quantity of assailants? Not just to "excuse" their not being able to find the real killers. It is also possible they are deliberately spreading disinformation, as a future reprisal means that they would have to specify someone exactly. (ie US-Israel is a big target !) Better to have an asymmetric response by increasing nuclear research or the enrichment of Uranium. Meanwhile localize the killers by giving them enough rope to reveal themselves? We shall see, what we will see.

Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 30 2020 17:42 utc | 276

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 15:04 utc | 272

Iran is playing into the narrative of potential false-flag (as I imagine was hoped for):

It's got nothing to do with plausible false flags or plausible cassus beli or anything like that.

It's about capability: If the Anglo-Zionist Empire could attack with impunity they would magically pull all the false flags they needed out of a hat!

Do you think a system that can put a man on the moon can't manufacture a plausible false flag? Do you really think they care what their publics think?

No.It's about opportunity.

Iran is too hard a nut to crack right now. Which means they could well get away with anything they chose to below a certain threshold, including withdrawing completely from the JCPOA or even the NPT ...

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 30 2020 18:04 utc | 277

Posted by: robjira | Nov 30 2020 0:26 utc | 260

Saker analysis IMO is correct and on point, he knows and works with many Iranians inside, as is visible on his site. I am sure he had consulted with them before writing his opinion. A retaliatory payback for sure will take place how, when,where is up to iranian planers, I suspect,an attack both on US and her regional allies in western Asia, but Iranians will not be fooled or pushed to take a foolish hasty revenge as some here speculate or demand. This is not arcade or a video game, as I wrote yesterday, this is not the same as assassination of General Solimani, that was a declared state sponsored assassination on a military person, it was retaliated declared and on military bases and persons. Showing Iran is not afraid of starting a war, as matter of fact US was humiliated claiming to be a superpower but afraid of war with smaller regional power when a smaller power bombard her bases. One wonders if you didn’t have the balls for the war then why assassinating the military officer?
This retaliation will be fully denied with ambiguity. In Shia revenge is as much of a religious duty as is being a martyr .

Posted by: kooshy | Nov 30 2020 18:13 utc | 278

@Posted by: Joe | Nov 30 2020 16:55 utc | 274

Nuclear enenrgy is also a source of electric power in a country which has wide dry regions.

I am finding the Jackrabbit a bit hashbara here, in the usual twisting of relaity on blaming the cukprit for the attack of the AngloZionist operatives on it, spreading that way squid ink.
Also he is way too informed about US carriers... to be your average citizen commenting here.
When the Beirut port bombing I also found his "theories" and sugesstions directed to me strange and confussing..

Another meme distributed by the hashbara trolls here is that of "negligence" on the part of the Iranians in protecting their officials/engineers, this meme started by The Saker, btw, in his last "analysis", which is another way to deviate talk about authorship and blame the victim for the damage inflcited on it. At this point, I would put my hand on fire that The Saker works for the US military in any way.

First it was Rumi, a Persian,...talking the hell about the Shia...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 19:14 utc | 279

"And anyone afterwards claiming that Iran is "Patient, calculating..." is assigning WAY MORE competence to Iran than Iran actually deserves. Cognitive dissonance. Magical thinking.

A dozen years of murdered scientists, and a couple years of murdered top General and top Scientists..."response/retaliation" is kind of an afterthought. The first thought is why Iranian scientists and generals keep being murdered.

Child-like heroes. Undeserving."
Posted by: Wind Hippo | Nov 30 2020 9:31 utc | 267

Ok Rambo- reality check-
If one person with decent intelligence and skills wants to break into your car or your home- they will find a way to do it. If that same person is hell bent on attacking/killing you, they can and they likely will succeed.
There isn't shit you can do about it. You can try and protect yourself in every conceivable way- to no avail.

Now if multiple Rogue Nations (US/Israel) throw every possible resource into taking you out- they can and will succeed. Grow the fuck up... a determined proficient enemy will take you down. This isn't hollywood.

For fucks sake- USA has sold the story that 2 dozen terrorists from caves managed the official 911 story.

Posted by: CitizenX | Nov 30 2020 20:11 utc | 280

Seems I was wrong: The Iranians have said that it was a remote controlled machine gun on a Nissan pickup which then exploded. Sorry.

BUT, note that this allows them to say that the gun was made in Israel and thus point to them as the direct originator, not the US.

It would still have meant a big deployment of forces, and the idea that the victim got out to see what was happening (he "thought there had been "stones" hitting the car") still does not make much sense.

At least we now know who will be the target of any (if any direct) retaliation.
Add to that the killing of an IRGC commander at the Iraqi-Syrian border and lots of Israeli air activity around Lebanon and Damascus...

Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 30 2020 21:05 utc | 281

@Posted by: Stonebird | Nov 30 2020 21:05 utc | 281

Well, last I read from Iranian Security Council´s mouth that after 20 years of going after him, may be guard by Fakhrizadeh and his security team was can not keep the tension 24/7 for 20 years, that is the time Israel kept trying to assassinate this man....

They are not denying that evnethough it was a remote controled operative, it did not imply it had not high sophistication....

Al Mayadeen is reporting that the Israelis benefitted from their friendship with Azerbaijan for achieving their goal, as i suspected all the way at first moment of Nagorno-Karabakh war..

It is said that, yes, Israelis living in Qatar and UAE are unable to glue an eye at night...Javanka are also travellling there to make peace amongst KSA and Qatar...

Btw, that with all this issue, plus the Orwellian current wave to criminalize as antisemitism any expression of support for the Palestinian people, headed by Troy Horse into British Labour Party, Keir Starmer, got buried that yesterday, it was celebrated the International Day of Solidarity with Palestinian People

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 21:42 utc | 282

Weapon used in nuclear scientist's assassination made in Israel: Source tells Press TV

The remains of the weapon used in the Friday assassination of senior nuclear scientist Mohsen Fakhrizadeh show that it was made in Israel, an informed source has told Press TV.

The source made the revelation on Monday, saying the weapon collected from the site of the terrorist act bears the logo and specifications of the Israeli military industry.

Iran's Ministry of Intelligence also said it had obtained "new leads" on the identity of the perpetrators and that the information "will be publicized very soon".

Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif tweeted on Sunday that the assassination bears all the hallmarks of the Israeli regime.

The history of Tel Aviv’s sabotage targeting Iran’s nuclear energy program is as old as the program itself.

Many observers believe Israel is not able to carry out such dangerous operations without the prior information and support of the United States which left a landmark nuclear deal with Iran in 2015.

Israel possesses the Middle East’s sole nuclear arsenal estimated to contain at least 200 warheads. The occupying regime maintains a policy of ambiguity concerning its nuclear weapons, neither confirming nor denying publicly that it has the capability.

Unlike Iran, it also refuses to join the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) and does not allow any international inspection of its nuclear weapons program.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 21:58 utc | 283

Martyr Fakhrizadeh was buried today, they wouldn’t take any action until his body was buried.

Posted by: Kooshy | Nov 30 2020 22:02 utc | 284

In his latest post, IMO Iran Will Wait For Biden, pat lang implicitly dismisses the possibility of a false-flag involving the USS Nimitz aircraft carrier when he writes:

Are the Iranians dumb enough to take the bait?

A rather strange question from an ex-Mil guy. A shrewd ex-Mil guy who is against "the Borg" (as pl claims to be) might be expected to ask a different question: Are the Israeli's dumb enough to miss this opportunity?

But perhaps stranger still is that pl ignores the possibility that of a Trump win. Absent the hoped-for thaw in relations from a Biden Presidency, should we expect Iran to "lash out" in frustration? Would the USS Nimitz be at risk in such a scenario?

Strangely, pl has had a sudden, though subtle, change of heart wrt the election. Until TWO DAYS AGO (!) ago, pl whole-heartedly supported Trump's effort to win a second term against a "vast left-wing conspiracy" but then he changed his tune, calling a Biden Presidency all but inevitable:

IMO the courts will not have guts enough to face up to the fraud upon the country that has been committed by a vast left wing conspiracy.

Only three days before that (Nov 25) in Trump Recommendations Redux, pl repeated his call for Trump to resist:

To repeat - He should not concede until, at the very earliest, ALL issues in re the election are legally resolved.....

And he did so in the face of Threats which he had described just the day before (Nov 24):

I am now receiving draft comments that are threats to take action against me if I do not desist from resisting treasonous election fraud. To all of these I say, go f**k yourselves.

Furthermore, on Nov 23rd pl had urged his readers to read PCR's post: Classified US Embassy Cable Proves Smartmatic's Connection to Venezuela, and pl has published/approved Larry C. Johnson's posts describing the attempt by Democrats to steal the election and calling on "Patriots" to rise up:


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 22:05 utc | 285

Arch Bungle @Nov30 18:04 #277

It's got nothing to do with plausible false flags or plausible cassus beli or anything like that.

You need a plausible false flag when you want a major war.

It's about capability: If the Anglo-Zionist Empire could attack with impunity they would magically pull all the false flags they needed out of a hat!

They can't attack with impunity. A war with Iran will mean lots of casualties and could expand into WWIII.

To prosecute such a war, they need to convince the Western masses that the war is a just war.

Do you really think they care what their publics think?

Yes, they do. US Military still believe that Vietnam was lost on the home front. For them, the "the lesson" of Vietnam is to ensure popular support for a major war.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 22:15 utc | 286

Continuing from @Nov30 22:15 #286

pl changed his tune on a Biden Presidency (we must fight the "vast left-wing conspiracy"! => Biden will be President) the same day that we got the news that Nimitz was moving into the Persian Gulf: Nov 28.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 22:28 utc | 287

Western or Eastern for that matter, masses are not para bollos to start any war on behalf of their elites...

In France the people just achieved reverting recent "Law On Global Security" which forbade filming law enforcement forces doing "their job". The whole France took to the streets after a balck man was beated the shit out in his own home by a bucnh of cops...Marine Le Pen was calling for "Law and Order", portraying herslef as she really is and throwing once for all her "alr-right" mask of these past four years...

Yesterday, around 50.000 people demonstrated only in Paris... with that ammount, in the first demos leaded by Tikhanovkaya after past elections in Belarus, the US/EU were asking for a "peaceful transition of power"...You have to be a bit consequent with literate people so loving of their freedoms as they are the French.
France continues in vanguard at organization of street contestation of neofascist tendencies in Europe.

But, then, in India, past Thursday there was a general strike against a new law deregulating labour which leaves workers totally unprotected and at employers will with respect their wages, labour security and conditions, and labour rights, everybody striked, long lines of ricksaws, taxis, peasants, and a lot of banners of the Communist Party of India were seen...Of course, as India is a US ally in its anti-communist, anti-socilist, anti-labour, anti-progressive crusade and so also against China, you have not read anything in the media nor have seen anything on TV, one guess Modi is making extra sessions of pranayanas

In contrast, I read today in a twitt by a person who have lived in China, that he got surprised to know that in China working women can retire at 50 years old, working women in public office at 55y, and working men from 60y on...No wonder there is such an effort in demonizing China...

Workers of the world unite!

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 22:40 utc | 288

Btw, that today, the Houthis ( flip-flop army on Pat Lang´s jargon..) have hit the command centre of the Saudi coalition in Marib with missils...

Marib, town acting as door of the Ramlat Al Sabatayn desert, which acts as border with Saudia...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 23:01 utc | 289

Full state funeral on behalf of Dr.Fakhrizadeh with full speeches and reactions.
First conductor is stating he was a symbol of Iranian scientific progress, innovation and development, the father of Iranian R&I in all fields, including nuclear research for peaceful purposes..

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 23:26 utc | 290

Arch Bungle @Nov30 8:52 #266

My bet:

This was carried out by the MEK.

Yeah. And the "Israeli remote machine gun" is just a red-herring.

I think it's almost certainly CIA that has the MEK connection - not Mossad.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 23:31 utc | 291

@Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 23:31 utc | 291

Are you a double national by any casuality?

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 23:38 utc | 292

Double national?

What nationalities are you thinking of?


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 23:47 utc | 293


Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 30 2020 23:55 utc | 294

H.Schmatz @Nov30 23:55 #294



I'm of the Scot-Irish diaspora, not the Jewish one.

<> <> <> <> <>

My comment about CIA's connection to MEK was not meant as misdirection. It's factual. And we know that CIA and Mossad work together so it hardly matters whose primary.

At moa I've been critical of Israel and supported the right to Boycott, Divest, Sanction (BDS) Israel. It is outrageous that governments (including something like 23 US States) are making it illegal to choose who one does business with. The only way to proove that one is not anti-Israeli is to trade with Israel.

<> <> <> <> <>

Here's some questions for you:


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Dec 1 2020 0:27 utc | 295

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 23:31 utc | 291

I think it's almost certainly CIA that has the MEK connection - not Mossad.

I'd agree on this based on the timing of US carrier and bomber movements as well as the general complexion of the current US political scene.

Besides, the MEK - CIA link is a long established one.

Which means anything we're about to hear out of israel on this is bound to be mere hot air.

In passing: I find it somewhat symmetrical that Soleimani was killed in the beginning of the year while another great Iranian figure is bumped off near the end ... probably nothing to it ...

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 1 2020 0:38 utc | 296

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 30 2020 22:15 utc | 286

*You need a plausible false flag when you want a major war.*

"need" is a rather strong word to use here. History tells us there has never been a *need* for a plausible false flag ... when all else fails even something like "God told me to ..." works. Remember: Iraq, Syria, Libya etc. none needed false flags.

But again, even if a plausible ff was desired, these could be manufactured at will. This is why I believe the US is not held back by lack of one ...

*They can't attack with impunity. A war with Iran will mean lots of casualties and could expand into WWIII.*

That is what I'm saying. My argument is that it's *this* that is the true deterrent power, not other factors like public support.

*To prosecute such a war, they need to convince the Western masses that the war is a just war.*

This is the function of patriotism. The West is filled with patriots. No false flags needed.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 1 2020 0:55 utc | 297

We should also be aware that it may be the Iranians that are employing a red-herring.

The switch from 62 people involved in the assassination to a remote-controlled Israeli weapon requiring much fewer people might could be Iran's attempt to play down the extent of MEK infiltration and public dissatisfaction. Better that the attack be thought to have come from the hated Israelis than from internal opposition.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Dec 1 2020 1:08 utc | 298

beibdunn @ 236, by all means, keep questioning! And don't be put off that there are many streams of thought in Orthodoxy, some very distant to my own. I'm happy that my church was a small one; big isn't always better. Our priest used to call our little community a 'catacomb church' of the early Christian style. It was warm, friendly to all. That is a great baptism you had, wonderful. I have a book that has some of Metropolitan Bloom's writing, and what I remember offhand is his example of the man who sat long hours in charch saying nothing. When asked why he was doing that he simply replied "I look at Him, and He looks at me." I love that.

Paco, thank you for your reply. Dostoievski and Tolstoi never met, and though both have great character development in their novels, they are very different writers. I am currently reading Solzhenitayn's "The First Circle" and find it compelling - there is one lovely chapter on the historically ancient little Saint John the Baptist Church, reflecting on a romantic memory before that church had been reduced to ruins. It's a good account of the hopefulness of early Russian communists, how that came to grief in personal ways. They really didn't realize what was happening to their country. I enjoy your posts. They are full of life!

Posted by: juliania | Dec 1 2020 2:31 utc | 299

Sorry, should be 'Solzhenitsyn'.

Posted by: juliania | Dec 1 2020 2:36 utc | 300

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