Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 08, 2020

The MoA Election Week In Review

Last week's posts at Moon of Alabama:

> Public PBS and NPR provided extensive coverage to presidential candidates in their newscasts with President Trump receiving 48 per cent of all politics-related news coverage on both channels, largely critical. Former Vice President Biden and his campaign received 18 per cent of such coverage on PBS and 20 per cent on NPR, most of which was neutral. On the three national TV networks (ABC, CBS, and NBC) President Trump received 63, 56 and 60 per cent of prime time politics-related news coverage, respectively, most of which was critical, while former Vice President Biden received 20, 25 and 22 per cent, respectively, mainly in a neutral tone. The cable networks were mostly relying on reporting opinions at the expense of balanced coverage. MSNBC, and, albeit to a lesser degree, CNN, portrayed the incumbent President very negatively, and Fox News showed open bias with demeaning vocabulary against former Vice President Biden in some of its evening shows. <

> Though the maths and maps suggests Biden will likely reach 270 Electoral votes, the old saying ‘It ain’t over ’till it’s over’, holds true. The electoral vote scenarios in the key ‘swing states’ would only apply if there is no litigation, fraud or theft.  However all three are in play – If you are stuffing the ballot box, you first wait to see what the regular vote is, so that you know how many votes you ‘need’ (mathematical anomalies aside) to push your candidate over the top.  Trump, somewhat rashly, gave out the GOP vote calculations at 02.30 on Wednesday, and hey-presto, loads of absentee ballots suddenly arrived at certain polling stations at around 04.00.  That seems to have happened in Wisconsin, where over 100,000 Biden votes appeared seemingly out of nowhere on a flash drive delivered by hand from a Democratic district. That put Biden ahead in Wisconsin – but litigation is in process. Likewise, it appears that a huge “absentee ballot” dump appeared in Michigan that heavily favored Biden.

This is just the beginning of a new and more uncertain phase that could go on for weeks. <

> In sum, if the results we have hold, Joe Biden will win the election and preside over a divided Congress. A chastened and anxious Democratic caucus will continue to hold the House. A triumphant Senate Republican caucus will obviously destroy his major legislative agenda. Biden will assuredly turn to policy by executive action, just as Barack Obama did late in his legislatively stymied administration. When he does, Republicans will do all they can to send those actions to a 6–3 conservative Supreme Court Biden will be unable to pack or meaningfully reform. In defeating Trump, Democrats will have avoided their worst-case scenario. Instead, they will have won the worst possible Biden victory, a political situation that will be a nightmare all its own. <
> There is nothing done by the Trump administration that can be rationally characterized as a radical aberration, some dramatic break, from U.S. tradition. Quite the contrary: none of Trump’s actions and policies are in some new universe of savagery, lawlessness, or radicalism when compared to those who preceded him in power. <

bigger
Joseph Dana @ibnezra - 10:06 UTC · Nov 8, 2020
Biden’s acceptance speech in front of a Chase logo pretty much says everything you need to know about the next four years. #USElectionResults2020

Please use the Open Thread 2020-88 for non-election issues.

Posted by b on November 8, 2020 at 13:06 UTC | Permalink

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All is quiet on the Western Front

Posted by: librul | Nov 8 2020 13:33 utc | 1

Viewing Biden as a cannula to insert Harris and all that would imply, I ask how such a weak person as Harris might seek to increase consent for her rule. Mrs Thatcher sought this, as did Bush 43, Truman with Korea, and as many others have classically done, by making a war and a victory. It does seem sure that the "election" has failed materially to achieve the basic goal of creating consent. In the example of Thatcher, Robert Green tells us that in the Belgrano affair the war went very nearly to atomic explosives. One is inclined, in the matter of atomics, to speculate on how many times luck will prevent nukewar. Of course Korea also came quite close to nukewar too, and remains there.

The glorious (if hypothetical so far) Harris War may not go well, as Martyanov tells us, the US has in fact lost military supremacy, and the weak unconsented Harris is not liable, I judge, to have the strength or understanding to avoid defeat.

Defeat, at this stage of empire, may be akin to the wizard of oz being seen to be a fake. Indeed, Harris herself seems to be a fake "black" and also a fake champion.

When empires lose wars and are seen to be insane, the several satrapies begin to depart. Only today, they say, Germany decided not to buy F35's... Therefore, considered as a whole from this moment in History, it seems to me that we shall have a glorious atomic defeat, will all that follows.

That would seem to satisfy the Deagle prediction of a mere 54 million persons in USA circa 2025.

Posted by: Walter | Nov 8 2020 13:36 utc | 2

So many good things travel around on thumb drives, much better than the old floppy disk.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 8 2020 14:06 utc | 4

So many good things travel around on thumb drives, much better than the old floppy disk.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 8 2020 14:06 utc | 5

"Please use the Open Thread 2020-88 for non-election issues."

That's what it says in the header---

Posted by: arby | Nov 8 2020 14:08 utc | 6

Have the Democrats ended the United States of America ?

Posted by: librul | Nov 8 2020 14:17 utc | 7

The corpse of American democracy is not even cold yet, and the NYT has already poured a cup of water on the socialists' beer:

Biden Can’t Be F.D.R. He Could Still Be L.B.J.

Yep. No economic reforms, people.

--//--

China not amused:

Drop illusions over China-US relations, but don’t give up efforts: Global Times editorial

--//--

'President-Elect' Joe Biden Pledges to 'Make America Respected Around the World Again'

This confirms my hypothesis that stated the liberals didn't like Trump merely because he's vulgar - not because of his policies.

This is the "confidence thesis", which states that the sole factor for the success of any given liberal system (not socialism - socialism is failed by design...) is merely the people in it to make it work and trust blindly it will work. Guess where this thesis is dominant? The financial sector.

The logic of finance is impregnating in every facet of American life and politics. The USA is consolidating itself more and more as an exclusively financial superpower.

Posted by: vk | Nov 8 2020 14:31 utc | 8

Once again, the media (including social media and search engine monopolist) rules the mind set in private party owned and controlled, USA governed America. No one can talk to America unless those beast of prey grant access.

The media establishes the information environment, it removes from view all that does not fit the instructive narrative, and it promotes with both lie and truth those events and views which turn believing minds into constant consistency soup..

Unless and until, the political process makes by law false and misleading content on any media or by any means, into a tort for which all offended can sue and recover nothing is likely to change.

to make matters worse, 5g is coming soon.. corporate control with government backup and support is what started the American Revolution against the British in 1776.. ..


Trump understood this going in, but Twitter is not for everyone. To stay sane, it seems quite necessary to avoid Twitter, trash the TV, block facecrock, deny Google assess and remove chrome before using any application and refuse to visit websites that use crookies.

Posted by: snake | Nov 8 2020 14:34 utc | 9

Cut-paste from Consortium News:

Late last month Jake Sullivan, Hillary Clinton’s deputy chief of staff during her time as Kerry’s predecessor at State and now a heavyweight in Biden’s foreign policy team, had this to say about Central America, where U.S. policy has had its bloodiest consequences over the postwar decades: “The vice-president fundamentally believes that the United States should be operating in mutual respect and a sense of shared responsibility.”

I have residual difficulties parsing English, but the way I understand it is that United States, of which they are many, should exhibit fairness and civility dealing with each other according to then former vice-president and current president-elect-apparent. Concerning the entities "south of the border", it is hard to tell what his fundamental beliefs are, if any -- at least, going by the words emanating from his team. From the past events, there seems remarkable continuity between various Administrations, I am lazy to write a paragraph each about Honduras, Nicaragua, Ecuador, Haiti, Venezuela and Bolivia*. From current events, "mutual respect" between representatives of "several states" (of which there are 50) is an aspirational statement, but Democrats tend to be more polite, with notable exception for Donald Trump.

It is too often overlooked that there was some basis for that exception. The route from selling overpriced tacky condos and catering to rich golf players to political arena was traversed by Donald Trump with political activism, most notably spending years paying for ads doubting the birth place of Barak Obama, and downhill from there.

* An incident exhibiting the degree of USian "respect" and Austrian neutrality: the plane of Bolivian president en route from Moscow was forced to land and searched, giving happy (felix) Austrians a chance to drag Edward Snowden from that plane (the latter did not cooperate). France and Portugal contributed to the farce, and so did "interagency consensus".

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 8 2020 14:39 utc | 10

Cut-paste from Consortium News:

Late last month Jake Sullivan, Hillary Clinton’s deputy chief of staff during her time as Kerry’s predecessor at State and now a heavyweight in Biden’s foreign policy team, had this to say about Central America, where U.S. policy has had its bloodiest consequences over the postwar decades: “The vice-president fundamentally believes that the United States should be operating in mutual respect and a sense of shared responsibility.”

I have residual difficulties parsing English, but the way I understand it is that United States, of which they are many, should exhibit fairness and civility dealing with each other according to then former vice-president and current president-elect-apparent. Concerning the entities "south of the border", it is hard to tell what his fundamental beliefs are, if any -- at least, going by the words emanating from his team. From the past events, there seems remarkable continuity between various Administrations, I am lazy to write a paragraph each about Honduras, Nicaragua, Ecuador, Haiti, Venezuela and Bolivia*. From current events, "mutual respect" between representatives of "several states" (of which there are 50) is an aspirational statement, but Democrats tend to be more polite, with notable exception for Donald Trump.

It is too often overlooked that there was some basis for that exception. The route from selling overpriced tacky condos and catering to rich golf players to political arena was traversed by Donald Trump with political activism, most notably spending years paying for ads doubting the birth place of Barak Obama, and downhill from there.

* An incident exhibiting the degree of USian "respect" and Austrian neutrality: the plane of Bolivian president en route from Moscow was forced to land and searched, giving happy (felix) Austrians a chance to drag Edward Snowden from that plane (the latter did not cooperate). France and Portugal contributed to the farce, and so did "interagency consensus".

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 8 2020 14:39 utc | 11

Your reporting that 100,000 votes arrived on a single flash drive, with all votes for Biden, is perhaps an effort at hyperbole. It appears to also to be quite incorrect. I refer you to this reporting by Jeramey Jannene, a Milwaukee journalist reporter, https://urbanmilwaukee.com/2020/11/04/absentee-ballots-give-biden-lead-in-wisconsin/ Mr. Jannene reports the story quite differently. Nothing sinister seems to have occurred. Just the counting of mailed-in ballots, which could not by law begin until after the walk-in polls were all closed.

Posted by: Michael Cohen | Nov 8 2020 14:45 utc | 12

@2 Walter

"The glorious (if hypothetical so far) Harris War may not go well, as Martyanov tells us, the US has in fact lost military supremacy,"

Andrei Martyanov is a self important, abusive windbag who thinks anything he says is divine writ. Martyanov babbles about hypersonic missiles ending "war as we know it" and misses how war is actually fought in the 21st century - by information control, economic strangulation, colour revolution, and armed rebellion by proxy. The Amerikastani Empire, no matter who controls it, may have lost the hypersonic missile war. So what? They're very effectively using the second method to wage war against Russia, which is losing as steadily because of the neoliberal capitalist Putinist regime's famous "restraint". Russia is increasingly surrounded by enemies and the more it exercises "restraint" the worse the situation gets for it. I do not see a "Harris" (it would actually be a Killary Clinton) regime make any difference to that at all.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 14:48 utc | 13

valery Plame?

Posted by: snake | Nov 8 2020 14:57 utc | 14

Decent recap imo.

"To be sure, it was Russia’s intervention in Syria in 2015 that sealed the deal, proving that the US did not have the omniscient capability to launch attacks anywhere, anytime without impunity – '

Trump was a symptom of American decline that Biden is unlikely to reverse

Posted by: arby | Nov 8 2020 14:58 utc | 15

Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 14:48 utc | 12

Ad homenims against Martyanov fail to persuade me that Martyanov's views are in error. I am disappointed to see such tactics, as they imply that his logic and assessments are valid.

However I believe you have not addressed my central point. That is that a politically weak unconsented naif "leader" is classically prone to make war for domestic "authority". Wars can be lost.

Collapse of Empire often is attended by military defeat. Harris would be terribly tempted to try to prevent defeat by any means.

So, obviously, would the mooted opponents some of which my colleague has named for us as Russia.

President Putin has explained what happens if Russia is attacked by the US. "No one would survive".

To repeat. The essential feature of Harris is weakness, that tends to a pattern of war, which, at every step, is liable to catastrophic failure.

Posted by: Walter | Nov 8 2020 15:06 utc | 16

Fat Lady Hasn't Sung

- Legal challenges in PA (and elsewhere)

- Recount in GA

If Trump manages to win PA & GA then Biden would have only 270 Electoral Votes and a single faithless elector could hand the win to Trump (by forcing a vote in the House of Representatives where Trump would win).

<> <> <> <>

If Trump manages to be victorious his supporters will be even more devoted because of his tenacity.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 15:06 utc | 17

Walter @Nov8 13:36 #2

I ask how such a weak person as Harris might seek to increase consent for her rule.

I think you are failing to see the continuity of EMPIRE policy. Biden, Harris, Trump, Hillary, Obama, GWBush, Clinton all did or will do what the Deep State EMPIRE managers want them to. Harris is no any more prone to war-making than any of her predecessors and will not take risks that the Deep State have not thoroughly examined.

=

Walter @Nov8 15:06 #15

Biswapriya Purkayast may not have addressed your main point but you haven't addressed his either:

Martyanov babbles about hypersonic missiles ending "war as we know it" and misses how war is actually fought in the 21st century - by information control, economic strangulation, colour revolution, and armed rebellion by proxy. The Amerikastani Empire, no matter who controls it, may have lost the hypersonic missile war. So what? They're very effectively using the second method to wage war against Russia ...

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 15:19 utc | 18

@ Walter 15

"Ad homenims against Martyanov fail to persuade me that Martyanov's views are in error."

That's rich since Martyanov is the king of ad hominems - have you ever checked his blog? - as well as a craven moral poltroon who blocks people who pose dissenting viewpoints he can't summon the facts to counter. As commenters go, he is a buffoon.

<>"That is that a politically weak unconsented naif "leader" is classically prone to make war for domestic "authority". Wars can be lost."<>

Your central point is moot. The war is already being waged, has been aggressively waged since at least the Maidan coup in Ukraine in 2014, and the Putinist restraint has ensured that Russia has been consistently losing it.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 15:25 utc | 19

I wonder how true this is...
did-president-trump-just-launch-the-largest-sting-operations-in-us-history-against-the-corrupt-swamp-of-the-democratic-party

A game changer if true and would explane Trumps behaviour.

Posted by: Helen | Nov 8 2020 15:27 utc | 20

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 14:48 utc | 12

You are mixing issues.

1. Hypersonic weapons. Here the issue is the American pursuit of "first strike capability". In the absence of that capability, NATO is forced to some restraint that wizards in charge of American MIC find distasteful and thus demanding huge funding to overcome. For example, supposed that NATO wants to annihilate Russian military presence in Syria, it is not too complicated, send a big barrage of missiles at the main Russian bases to overwhelm air defenses and obliterate them. The needed hardware exists, but the caper on that scale could provoke a nuclear response (my favorite "measured response" would obliterate Diego Garcia, a spot dear to Atlanticist hearts and bereft of civilians, and the aftermath could go any which way). But if inter-continental missiles are "rendered obsolete" by air defenses, that "measured response" would not work, even more, Russia and China could be blackmailed by so-called first strike destroying the bulk of their nuclear forces, with air defenses taking care of the remnants.

Note that an ICBM is not an easy target. In the "boost phase" in can be launched somewhere near place where the borders of Russia, China and Kazakhstan meet, thousands of kilometers from any NATO (or allied) installation. Up there in vacuum, ICBM may be decoyed with aluminum foil balls or something like that. But when landing their course can be accurately calculated and intercepted (at least, plausibly so). Note that an ICBM is damn fast, so you need to send a fast missile.

Here LITERALLY comes a twist. Construct a warhead with ability to zigzag while landing. Turns at that speed (7km/s?) are a technological challenge, but you do not need to turn a lot to make the future precision sufficiently unpredictable. So Chinese and Russians work on that. As a counter, Americans are working on hypersonic weapons that would be better in destroying opponent missiles on the ground before launch, that is a more difficult goal and thus they "are behind".

The bottom line is that Americans spend many billions (annually) on futile programs forcing Russia and China to spend resources on counter measures. Would Americans, at long last, develop stealthy accurate hypersonics for the first strike, a conceptually simple counter measure is to build thousands of launching sites, each with a decoy of a strategic nuclear weapon (but some with the real things). They would need to reduce the cost per a decoy site, more precisely, the ratio between the cost of "launching site destroyer" and "launching site decoy". Notably, current treaties do not allow for that, so Americans rely on limitations of the current treaties while breaking them one after another.

2. Actual developments like Syria, Ukraine etc. Biswapriya is notably reticent in description what a better Russian conduct would be, so the criticism of "neoliberal capitalist Putinist regime" is not convincing. What a better regime could do?

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 8 2020 15:31 utc | 21

I still want to ask this question.

If and I say IF Pashinyan does the unthinkable and ask for US intervention to protect Armenia and Biden obliges, and you have US troops in Armnenia.

What would Russia's response be? And what would be Turkey's response be?

Posted by: Smith | Nov 8 2020 15:32 utc | 22

When two opponents play a game, and one opponent is allowed to cheat to win, then the game is finished.

If Trump is not allowed to expose the fraud endemic in this election, or if the election is allowed to stand in spite of this fraud, then any pretense of democracy in the U.S. is finished.

The U.S. will transition from an 'effective oligarchic dictatorship' to an 'official fascist dictatorship'.

Posted by: dh-mtl | Nov 8 2020 15:42 utc | 23

@ 20. Piotr Berman

1. Hypersonic missiles will only ever be used in an all out war, de facto WW III. Which is overwhelmingly the least likely kind of war. Short of that no use of them is going to happen except perhaps China-Taiwan. They will certainly not be employed by Russia. Can anyone imagine Putin using hypersonic missiles in response to a trade blockade by Amerikastan on a par with the Amerikastani trade blockade of Iran?

2. I have already said exactly what Russia should have done, repeatedly and in great detail, but if you missed it you can see some of it here:

https://bill-purkayastha.blogspot.com/2020/10/the-sultan-and-grandmaster-nagorno.html

Except:

A few years ago I wrote an article in which I had compared Putin’s “restraint” against Amerikastani provocations not just failures in and of themselves, but direct encouragement to more provocations. Back in 2014, I had said, Putin was so single issue focussed on the Sochi Olympics that what even the Amerikastani imperialists STRATFOR called the “most blatant coup in history” played out in full public view in Kiev, without Russia lifting a finger. I had written that Putin could have sent in two battalions of Spetsnaz, overthrown Obama’s Ukranazi coup regime, reinstated Viktor Yanukovych, and withdrawn, with the clear statement that if there were any more coups Russia would return and this time to stay. I remember that when the militias of the Donbass were desperately raiding museums to secure WWII weapons to take on Ukranazi armoured columns, when Russian military blogs were demanding “Putin, dai prikaz!” (Putin, give the order!), Putin kept silent. When the defenders of Donbass had to withdraw from Slovyansk and were nearly cut into two, when the Ukranazis were at Donetsk airport, when defeat was only a matter of hours, it was then that Putin allegedly did something. What that something was I’m not clear about. It was certainly not the dispatch of Russian forces, or else Russian tanks would have been rolling down the Kiev streets in two days. It may have been finally sending weapons, allowing volunteers to go to the front to fight (including more than a few brave and laudable Americans; not all of them are brain-dead imperialists), and possibly limited artillery support. At any rate, when the defenders of the republics crushed the Ukranazis at Debaltsevo and were well on the way to liberating Mariupol on the Black Sea, Putin again withdrew support to them, leaving them without a port and stuck in a frozen war interrupted by sniping and shelling.

...

But let’s ignore the people of the two Donbass republics for the moment and look at the result of this “restraint”. Today, Amerikastani B52 bombers and RC135 reconnaissance planes fly freely through Ukranazi airspace right up to the Russian border, compelling Russian air defence systems to turn on their electronic defences, exposing their signatures for analysis and jamming by said Amerikastanis. Ukranazistan, not being a NATO member officially, is even more valuable to Amerikastan than it would have been as a NATO member, since it can be used for staging actions that could not involve NATO without risk of a world war. How’s that for “restraint”, Putinoids?

In fact, with the one shining exception of the war against Georgia in defence of South Ossetia in 2008, when Medvedev – not Putin – was president, Russian foreign policy has always been criminally defensive and reactive, never proactive. In 2011 Russia permitted Libya to be destroyed, turning an ally into a jihadi hellhole where a slave trading human trafficking regime and a CIA asset fight for control. In 2015 Syria was on the verge of collapse when Putin belatedly and reluctantly sent just enough planes and troops to save Damascus and help the legitimate government of Dr Assad liberate Aleppo, but failed to do a thing to stop the north and east turn into, respectively, an Ottoman colony and a Kurd Quisling puppet state under Amerikastani protection. In 2020 in Belarus it was only the personal courage and genuine popularity of President Aleksandr Lukashenko that prevented a colour revolution that would have turned the country into another NATO stooge. The same 2020 saw the Putin regime allow the racist right wing “liberal” Alexei Navalny to be sent to Germany, and predictably a fake “Novichok poisoning” was immediately manufactured to wreck EU-Russian relations, which were just about beginning to mend, beyond repair.

To quote Shakespeare, "art thou answer'd yet"?

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 16:01 utc | 24

The caped crusader of QAnon has gone down to narrow, but certain defeat. Wasn't it obvious after Trump ordered the release of all Russiagate documents and no one released them? When Barr/Durham lost the election for Trump refusing to release the Durham probe results and indict Obama, Biden & Clinton? When he got and was cured of Covid in a day and no one cared? When Hunter's crack-pipe made front page news, but no one could find sleepy joe's crack pipe, or sleazy bank deposits from Chinese spies?

Just as no one cared Trump was impeached, or is a tax cheat, grifter and money launderer.

What mattered most to most voters in this election was turning off one man's venal vainglory in exchange for a modicum of competence after a human clusterfuck called Donald Trump.

Posted by: gottlieb | Nov 8 2020 16:10 utc | 25

@Smith 21

1. Armenia, poor, landlocked, strategically not particularly significant, lacking natural resources, isn't a prize the Biden regime would be eager to grab at the expense of angering the Ottomans. But even if they did, Biden takes office in two months and the utter collapse of the Armenian side means that the war is unlikely to last two more weeks.

2. Going by the trend of the endless neoliberal capitalist Putinist regime restraint, Russia would meekly withdraw its forces and Putin's online worshippers would settle down to coming up with explanations of how this was yet another victory by the Greatest Geopolitical Grandmaster Genius The Galaxy Has Ever Known.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 16:10 utc | 26

Biswapriya Purkayast @18

"...how war is actually fought in the 21st century - by information control, economic strangulation, colour revolution, and armed rebellion by proxy..."

Wars were fought like that in the 20th, 19th century, etc. probably all the way back in history. The purpose of such tactics is to avoid direct conflict, to weaken your oponent, to draw them into expending resources on debilitating conflicts.

Quotes from "The Art of War" (Sen Zhui, 5h Century BC):

“The greatest victory is that which requires no battle”

“Victorious warriors win first and then go to war, while defeated warriors go to war first and then seek to win”

The western war against Russia goes back 100s of years.

The point Walter is making is that the US indirect war against Russia is failing and that the defeated US may seek to "win" by going to a direct conflict with Russia and that a week person, Harris, may lack the wisdom to prevent, moderate such desires.

Harris is a weak character and it is believed that she is overly fond (reliant) on alcohol. It seems obvious that she was originally intended to be the democratic nominee but despite preplanned set pieces (the evisceration of the "racist" Biden) she messed it up and disappeared in the polls only to resurrected as Biden's running mate. For some reason it seems very important to have Harris as the VP.

Walter's point isn't moot.

Posted by: ADKC | Nov 8 2020 16:13 utc | 27

Piotr Berman @Nov8 15:31 #20

... so the criticism of "neoliberal capitalist Putinist regime" is not convincing. What a better regime could do?

I think this is correct.

But it doesn't detract from Biswapriya Purkayast's argument that Russia's advantage in conventional arms is not indicative of Russia's ability to prevail in conflict with the Empire which engages in 4th-generational warfare.

My own view is that IMO Russia's "answer" to the Empire's 4-gen warfare has been demonstrated in Ukraine and Syria and their ability to counter 4th-gen warfare will only improve via Russia's alliance with economic powerhouse China and the SCO military alliance.

This is consistent with the consensus view at moa that the Empire has a limited time to smack-down China and/or break up the Russia-China lovefest.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 16:13 utc | 28

Helen | Nov 8 2020 15:27 utc | 19 wrote

I wonder how true this is...
___________________________________________

Well it is not true but it could be cover story for what may be true.

Typically the way a sting operations works is that the govt finds some useful idiots who are disposed to committing a crime and encourages and lures these morons to commit the crime and then swoops in and makes an arrest. So in this case the govt would be getting some gullible people to commit the crime of election fraud for the purpose of arresting them and then using those arrests to to question the legitimacy of the election.
That sort of sting operation is plausible. Yjis is how the FBI operate more often than not.

What is disturbing about this story is that this business of a blockchain watermark on each ballot that makes it possible to trace each ballot back to the voter it came from is a huge attack on the concept of a secret ballot. It is really astounding that Alex Jones is the one promoting this 1984 scenario. That part of the story is almost certainly bullshit.


Posted by: jinn | Nov 8 2020 16:22 utc | 29

"Biswapriya Purkayast"

I believe I read some time ago that Putin said that Russia was not there to save all the countries in the world.

If Putin did what you suggest then building Russia would become secondary to saving everyone. This would appeal to the west as it would straetch and weaken Russia.

Posted by: arby | Nov 8 2020 16:34 utc | 30

Biswapriya Purkayast @Nov8 16:01 #23

Back in 2014, I had said, Putin was so single issue focussed on the Sochi Olympics that what even the Amerikastani imperialists STRATFOR called the “most blatant coup in history” played out in full public view in Kiev, without Russia lifting a finger. I had written that Putin could have sent in two battalions of Spetsnaz

I think moa consensus is that Russia was smart to take the best parts of Ukraine and leave the West with the corrupt bankrupt part.

=
I remember that when the militias of the Donbass were desperately raiding museums to secure WWII weapons to take on Ukranazi armoured columns, when Russian military blogs were demanding “Putin, dai prikaz!” (Putin, give the order!), Putin kept silent.... when the defenders of the republics crushed the Ukranazis at Debaltsevo and were well on the way to liberating Mariupol on the Black Sea, Putin again withdrew support to them, leaving them without a port and stuck in a frozen war ...

A lot of consternation at Russia's seeming lack of support for Donbas. But I think Russia/Putin was walking a fine line between support for "rebellious provinces" and a full-blown war. Russia had already essentially seized Crimea prior to a referendum there.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 16:41 utc | 31

ADKC @ 26

For some reason it seems very important to have Harris as the VP

I’ve been wondering the same thing. It never made any sense.
Then I read this comment on one of The Saker’s election threads:

Raggmunk on November 07, 2020 · at 2:30 pm EST/EDT
My prediction is that it will be Kamala, and not Biden, who will be running all the show. Being a woman and a so-called “person of color”, any criticism against her will be dismissed as racism or misogyny. She will be the holiest of all holy cows, an Obama on steroids.

Now it makes sense. If you criticise her you will be branded a racist/misogynist/white supremist.

For example after the Harris-Pence debate when Harris showed herself to be completely out of her depth you had tweets like this:

Mark Ruffalo
@MarkRuffalo
Just going over it all in my head. The way Mike Pence constantly interrupted and spoke over @KamalaHarris was the prime example of white male supremacy and its common dismissal and disrespect for black woman.
4:59 AM · Oct 8, 2020

Posted by: Down South | Nov 8 2020 16:49 utc | 32

When discussing weak people in the White House, don't forget the Bush Baby. Weak presidents serve a purpose, which is to allow their handlers in the CIA/deep state to work unimpeded. What this means is that Harris has no bearing on whether the US will go kinetic again. That decision will be up to committees in the CIA/deep state. Unfortunately, the CIA is a distillation of the very most violently psychotic and delusional freaks from American society, which is itself a society that produces more than its share of violently psychotic and delusional freaks.

That's not good.

Posted by: William Gruff | Nov 8 2020 16:56 utc | 33

We must defeat China because they don't have our precious democracy. ()

Posted by: blues | Nov 8 2020 17:02 utc | 34

follow up @Jackrabbit @Nov8 15:06 #16: Fat Lady Hasn't Sung

Real Clear Politics (RCP) hasn't called the race.

They show Pennsylvania, Georgia, Arizona, North Carolina, and Alaska as undecided and the current delegate count as 259 - 214.

Biden can't be said to be the "President Elect" until the Electors vote on December 14 or Trump has conceded.

<> <> <> <>

I'm an independent. Not a Trump supporter. The push to present Biden as "President Elect" is suspicious. And not just in the obvious way that it could be an attempt to unjustly unseat Trump but in also in the adoration of Trump supporters if Trump prevails (something that approaches Trump as 'Glorious Leader' which I have warned of).

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 17:02 utc | 35

"That seems to have happened in Wisconsin, where over 100,000 Biden votes appeared seemingly out of nowhere on a flash drive delivered by hand from a Democratic district. "

Bullshit. So b appears to have been suckered in by general cynicism (which he's welcome to since it's usually right) to believe an already debunked conspiracy theory.

Fact-checking the avalanche of Wisconsin election misinformation


CLAIM: "Wisconsin took a break, and when they returned, Biden coincidentally came back ahead by 100k."

This is one of several viral claims that key states took a break from counting in some form on election night.

And it’s simply not true.

Election officials worked through the night in Wisconsin to tally the unprecedented numbers of mail-in ballots, which under state law they were not allowed to start counting until Election Day.

"Our municipal and county clerks have worked tirelessly throughout the night to make sure that every valid ballot is counted and reported accurately," Meagan Wolfe, the director of the state Elections Commission, said in a news conference the morning after the election.

The jump in Biden’s tally came when the central count facility in Milwaukee completed its tally of the mail-in votes around 3:30 a.m., reporting those all at once. That led to a long-predicted spike in Biden’s favor since Democrats are more likely to use vote absentee and Milwaukee is a heavily Democratic area.
CLAIM: Wisconsin "found" or "dumped" 100K ballots around 4 a.m. the morning after the election.

A chart from FiveThirtyEight.com showing how the Wisconsin race changed as results were reported sparked an array of unfounded conspiracy theories. It showed a sharp uptick in Democratic votes at around 4 a.m. on the morning after the election.

A conservative website trumpeted this as "Voter Fraud in Wisconsin." One widely shared Facebook post called it a "ballot dump," while another referred to the votes as being "found." President Donald Trump followed the same narrative when he tweeted about 9 a.m. that his lead in key states "started to magically disappear as surprise ballot dumps were counted."

These claims are ridiculous. This jump was expected and explainable.

"We are not finding ballots," Julietta Henry, director of elections for Milwaukee County, told PolitiFact National. "Ballots are being counted."

The increase in the chart simply shows when the City of Milwaukee reported its absentee ballot results. We knew well before the election that Democrats were much more likely than Republicans to vote absentee, that it takes longer to count such ballots, and that Milwaukee is a Democratic stronghold.

So, predictably, the mail-in results from that area led to a spike in the number of Democratic votes when the Associated Press added that count -- reported all at once -- to its vote tally about 3:30 a.m.

From 3:26 to 3:44 a.m. in the Associated Press election reporting stream, the vote for former Vice President Joe Biden jumped by 149,520 (9.2% of Biden's total votes) and Trump's vote jumped by 31,803 votes (2% of his total votes). Milwaukee County accounted for most but not all of that jump.

These votes were all reported together because Milwaukee and 38 other communities used a central count location. Other communities counted absentee ballots at the polling places, and reported them along with their in-person vote totals.

The city of Green Bay reported its results in bulk shortly after. It also had a central count facility for absentee ballots.

In other words, it’s not fraud, that’s just the time officials finished counting those legitimate votes.

Milwaukee County absentee ballots help flip Wisconsin red to blue Wednesday morning


At around 4 a.m., county election officials were able to confirm that 100% of the county's votes had been accounted for and recorded for this election.
That was also the moment Wisconsin flipped from red to blue.

After counting absentee ballots for nearly 20 hours, the data from the City of Milwaukee's Central Count Location was loaded onto flash drives and escorted, by police, to the Milwaukee County Courthouse. Executive Director of the City of Milwaukee Election Commission, Claire Woodall Vogg, walked in the front doors and handed the data over to the county clerks office. On those flash drives, 169,519 absentee ballots that were counted in the City of Milwaukee. Those votes were added to the rest of the votes in Milwaukee County, which brought the total number of ballots cast to 460,300.

The county reports an 83.67% voter turnout, which election officials said was "very good for a presidential election."

When all of the votes were counted, just over 69% of Milwaukee County's vote went to Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. Just over 29% of the vote was for President Trump and Vice President Pence.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 8 2020 17:17 utc | 36

I think there's a trend toward consensus here.

I agree generally that the course of empire is toward conquering Russia, indeed toward conquering every space and people. I point out that ad homenim is actually an endorsement of the argument while rejecting the man - eg Martyanov's views seem to be unwelcome, but may be correct.

My hunch is that the war will be curated by zee ion and aimed at Iran. Rus and Wu may be seen as a bit too difficult, though the PLA may take Taiwan while the Iranians demonstrate to the good lady what a catastrophic military defeat looks like. I imagine that the deepstate machine will see the "little war with Iran" as salable to Harris. Just my hunch.

Of course the election process has nothing to do with media companies. The States, not the people decide. It's not over, but the doubts further weaken the anointed lady - make more urgent her need to grab consent..

Best to all.

Back to lurk

Posted by: Walter | Nov 8 2020 17:19 utc | 37

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 15:06 utc | 16 - Legal challenges in PA (and elsewhere) - Recount in GA

Not going to happen. Reversing Georgia was always in the cards since the race was so close. But a recount there won't change the outcome of the election.

And Pennsylvania is not going to be flipped for Trump either. And every report on his legal options I've read indicate they go nowhere. That's why he's reportedly bitching about how his lawyers have failed him, as I reported in an earlier thread.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 8 2020 17:23 utc | 38

The election farce may not be about electing Trump or Biden but about electoral failure. Whitney Webb wrote a series of articles about this earlier in the year:

Cybereason Series

At present Biden looks like he has clearly "won" but Webb's series perhaps indicate that election meddling may be "proven" and the "result" may swing back and forth.

Whitney talks about "chaos" before or on election day but it seems to me that the reasoning also holds for the period after the election (or for the never-ending period of the election count and dispute). From "How Government and Media Are Prepping America for a Failed 2020 Election":

"What has been left unsaid, however, is that a government’s solution to “chaos” is always the imposition of “order.” This means that — whatever “chaos” ultimately ensues prior to or on election day — will result in a government response that will do much more to crush freedom and undermine democracy than any act of foreign meddling has, be it real or imagined."

Posted by: ADKC | Nov 8 2020 17:28 utc | 39

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 17:02 utc | 34

Oh, here we go. The bunny is still trying to get Trump elected after he lost his ridiculous landslide prediction.

Pennsylvania is solid. It's not going anywhere for Trump regardless of legal efforts.

"or Trump has conceded." It is not necessary for Trump to concede for Biden to be the President-Elect.

I'm not going to bother to get into this any further with you. You lost your prediction. Move on.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 8 2020 17:32 utc | 40

‘Exit polls’ are not trustworthy, viable, etc. is a meme running about. In fact exit polls are good; of course all polls are subject to some margin of error.

Newsweek published the results of the Edison exit poll*:

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-increases-share-black-hispanic-vote-1544698

The fact that Trump made gains amongst Black, Hisp. etc can be read all over the MSM, twitter, blogs, with Dems sometimes saying ‘that can’t be right!’ - minorities are expected to vote Dem - a white racist can’t ‘make gains.’ (One can increase votes in one category and still lose the / an election.)

Imho particularly many Hispanics are attached to law and order (see “Defund the Police”) and many established immigrants are against uncontrolled immigration. I also suspect that quite a few Blacks, probably specially women strongly disaprove of Antifa - etc. Much more could be said, at least some Blacks see through the Dem. condescension and Obama fakery. Important factor: the economy, which was the no. 1 concern of Trump voters (see Pew polls, 80% about, posted previous), which pre-covid did put a little more money into many poorer pockets. Chart at link, the visible uptick is small but steady.

Using the exit poll to ‘extrapolate’ the overall result:

Ethnicity || voted for DT according to poll || % of electorate || equals * out of 100 voters

White 57%…. 67%…. 39.18
Black 12%…. 13%…. 1.56
Asian 31% …. 4% …. 1.24
Hisp 32% …. 13% …. 4.16
Other 40% … 3% … 1.2

Total = 46.35

This makes sense: a ‘good, fair’ majority of whites voted for DT. A small minory of blacks did so. Just under a third of Asians and Hispanics voted for DT, and ‘other’ did so somewhat under half.

If we award all the other votes to Biden, that makes 53.75 for JB.

Tricky. How many votes were for for 3rd party candidates ? Vox estimates 2% 3rd cand. 2020. Jill Stein got 1% plus, Gary Johnson 3.28% in the past. Maybe 3% is a good guess. Of course on the intertubes ppl saying they voted 3rd cand. proliferate - you’d think it was 15%! Certainly there were many other candidates.

Then, the non conforming ballots, mistakes, spoiled / blank ones, etc. About 2% is standard in the EU…so let’s say (conservatively) 5% NOT for DT or JB. With 5%, Total:

46.35 For DT
5.00 for 3rd party, write-ins, invalid
51.35 accounted for

48.65 for JB is the remainder, he is the winner.

If 10% of ballots were for 3rd party / other fanciful / rejected, DT got 46% and JB 44%, DT win.

Tight race, with many imponderables. Extrapolating from that one exit poll.

third parties 2020 wiki

https://bit.ly/357oOyX

household income

https://bit.ly/2GF9eB8

ethnic compo of electorate

https://pewrsr.ch/3n5wOqa

*15,590 voters outside polling stations, early voting sites, and over the phone. The number is large enough. *poll distinguishes Latino/Hispanic but that is the same category in census.


Posted by: Noirette | Nov 8 2020 17:35 utc | 41

So what if Trump has only a modicum of competence? Surely that's a lot more than what Biden has.

Posted by: lysias | Nov 8 2020 18:01 utc | 42

@ Jackrabbit

In retrospect, a trump landslide prediction seems less “crazy” to me than when you first made it. The turnout for trump turned out to be huge. Who really predicted an equally huge turnout for biden/harris given their inability to pack an auditorium on the campaign trail? Without that turnout, yes, it would be a trump landslide.

Posted by: oglalla | Nov 8 2020 18:02 utc | 43

Poor Trump gave Netanyahu so much blow job .. and what got .. haha

Posted by: Nick | Nov 8 2020 18:11 utc | 44

Posted by: Walter | Nov 8 2020 13:36 utc | 2

You nailed it.

Posted by: Per/Norway | Nov 8 2020 18:47 utc | 45

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 17:02 utc | 34

Your hypothesis cannot be totally discarded… yet.
A come back from Hades would make the subject divine substance. An absolute rapture... of sorts.

Posted by: Paco | Nov 8 2020 18:49 utc | 46

I'm looking forward to Trump pardoning Assange before he leaves office, if he leaves office. That'll set President BYE-DON, The Swamp and its Eurotrash Atlanacist NATO frauds hair on fire...

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Nov 8 2020 18:56 utc | 47


"The statute is very, very clear," said retired Wisconsin Supreme Court Justice Michael Gableman - who served as a Milwaukee poll watcher on Election Day. "If an absentee ballot does not have a witness address on it, it's not valid. That ballot is not valid."

"In defiance of and direct contradiction to the statute, the Wisconsin Elections Commission gave guidance--that is, cover--to all 72 county clerks and turned the statute on his head," Gableman added. "They said, 'Gee, we know the law says an absentee ballot without the witness address is not valid, but county clerk, you have a duty to go ahead and look up on your own the witness' address if there's no address on the absentee ballot."

According to the report, the WEC informed voters that "your witness must sign and provide their full address (street number, street name, city) in the Certification of Witness section," adding "if any of the required information above is missing, your ballot will not be counted."

On October 19, the WEC instructed clerks to 'simply fill in the witness address themselves so that the ballot would not be invalidated.'


Wisconsin Poll Workers Allegedly Altered Thousands Of Invalid Ballots: Report

Posted by: Down South | Nov 8 2020 18:58 utc | 48

Neoliberal fascists continue the purge of the real Left and give us a small taste of what will happen under a Biden presidency

Posted by: killwallstreet | Nov 8 2020 13:37 utc | 3
------------------------------------------------------

Neoliberals and Neocons are both supporters of the Empire! The only difference is Neocon don't hide their Empire agenda behind some nice words/slogans like the Neoliberals.

Mao once said he'd prefer to deal with the right party.

Posted by: lulu | Nov 8 2020 19:26 utc | 49

interesting conversation with walter, Biswapriya Purkayast and a few others... i mostly see it like walter... the usa is playing a losing game with a losing hand.. it ain't working long term and having harris as leader is more of the same... it ain't gonna work... that is how i see it.

Posted by: james | Nov 8 2020 19:34 utc | 50

Yes, I too would like to see Assange pardoned. Even more, I would like to see documents released about such matters as the JFK assassination and 9/11.

Posted by: lysias | Nov 8 2020 20:23 utc | 51

Is it a done deal yet?

All I see is media blitz. Almost as though they need to control the narrative before the beats start dropping Monday.
If there is no evidence of fraud come Monday, I'll be disappointed in Giuliani etc for the rhetoric. But methinks this shotgun wedding is hiding an illegitimate baby

Posted by: Jezabeel | Nov 8 2020 20:50 utc | 52

Trump lost the popular vote by over 5 million popular votes.
The Dims have won that contest, no matter what the Repugs do now.

Fascism lost in the Executive, but retained its hold of part of the Judiciary.

Incompetence prevented it from achieving the likes of past Germany, Italy, Hungary or Spain.
But another 4 years would of mattered?

We will now be dealing with another capitalist.
Probably a slower death.

Posted by: Duncan Idaho | Nov 8 2020 20:53 utc | 53

Legislative, not judicial.

Posted by: Duncan Idaho | Nov 8 2020 21:01 utc | 54

Forgive me for waxing nostalgic in this dark hour, but I for one will miss Trump's cheery Nuremberg rallies, especially the bit at the end where he wallows like a hapless mammoth in a peat bog to the homoerotic strains of "YMCA" while his homophobic supporters blithely cheer him on. We have Trump to thank for raising the standard of American political conversation to its current lofty level. Let us keep it there.

Posted by: drj | Nov 8 2020 21:11 utc | 55

Gruff @ 32

No. CIA is a distillation, no, a perfectly straightforward committee of old WASP families. Are WASP families all those other adjectives? Yes.

Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 8 2020 21:16 utc | 57

Biden has vowed to regain the world's respect for the Outlaw US Empire, which begs this question: When did the world actually respect it? "Leaders" who uttered the word respect were paid to do so as it was painfully clear for those at the top levels of governments that after WW2 what was the USA was now the Outlaw US Empire since it had no compunction violating International Law and thus its own fundamental Law--a nuclear armed outlaw is something you fear, not respect. And even before WW2, FDR had to make clear his foreign policy toward those in the Western Hemisphere was to be that of a Good Neighbor, not Loan Shark. Again, the Loan Shark is feared, not respected. So, what respect is it that Biden seeks to regain since none has existed for over a century? We'll need to wait and see what he does immediately after he's sworn in on 20 January for he must first show respect for the Constitution he'll swear to defend and uphold, and that means obeying the edicts of International Law as directed by the UN Charter which is part of said Constitution. IMO, that would need to be a mandatory first step if he wants to gain respect. Otherwise, he'll signal the USA will remain the Outlaw US Empire.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 8 2020 21:29 utc | 58

The Trumpists are not having any of this unity crap:

Forget Biden’s unity, Trump supporters won’t ‘hug those who’ve viciously attacked them,’ says Megyn Kelly

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 8 2020 21:29 utc | 59

Posted by: drj | Nov 8 2020 21:11 utc | 54

Re: video

Thank you for that, takes me back to the 60s. I see not much has really changed.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 8 2020 21:34 utc | 60

@54 Yes thanks for that. It captures the spirit of the times.

Posted by: dh | Nov 8 2020 21:52 utc | 61

Richard Steven Hack @Nov8 17:32 #39

The bunny is still trying to get Trump elected ...

This totally misrepresents my position on Trump and the purpose of my prediction.

I've said that Deep State is planning war and may try to make Trump into a sort of 'Glorious Leader' as part of that planning.

Anyone that follows moa knows that I'm a pro-democracy, anti-war guy. I'm independent of any Party or candidate. I've advocated for voting third-party or not at all.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 21:59 utc | 62

For 4 years, journalists have told us that a US presidential election is highly susceptible to manipulation. For 4 days they have been telling us that a US presidential election is 100% secure and not vulnerable to manipulation at all. (
tweet

Posted by: passerby | Nov 8 2020 21:59 utc | 63

Biden is our Guido now.

When does Branson arrange a freedom concert at the southern border?

Posted by: Young | Nov 8 2020 22:10 utc | 64

You're very welcome bemildred @59 and dh @60. There are uplifting moments in American history. That was one of them.

Posted by: drj | Nov 8 2020 22:12 utc | 65

As this thread has turned into the election thread I found this of interest, even if not unexpected:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-markets/investors-celebrate-biden-winning-u-s-presidency-idUSKBN27N0L9?il=0

Posted by: JB | Nov 8 2020 22:23 utc | 66

So what if Trump has only a modicum of competence? Surely that's a lot more than what Biden has.

Posted by: lysias | Nov 8 2020 18:01 utc | 41

That reminds me a reported conversation between a logic professor and a lady in Warsaw, ca. 50 years ago.
Place: a streetcar

Scene 1: lady asks "how many stops from here to the Central Station", professor "two".

Scene 2, after the streetcar stopped once: lady "so now there is only one stop the the Central Station?" professor "no, now there are three stops".

In this case, the question is if Trump has non-negative competence, or negative, i.e. making stuff worse when he pays attention to it. That would require a study: when and how did Trump pay attention to what is happening.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 8 2020 22:24 utc | 67

The new synthesis of Communism: Marxism-Leninism-Maoism-Trumpism

To understand Trump’s GOP, we need to look to Lenin and Mao: The GOP is behaving like a Maoist party, by Melissa Macauley

Posted by: vk | Nov 8 2020 23:25 utc | 68

Posted by: Down South | Nov 8 2020 18:58 utc | 47 Wisconsin Poll Workers Allegedly Altered Thousands Of Invalid Ballots: Report

O’Donnell Missing the Point in Fraud Claim


Fortunately, O’Donnell and the GOP are wrong. RightWisconsin consulted our own election law expert, Michael Maistelman, who recently had the nomination papers thrown out for two contenders for Milwaukee County Executive. While Maistelman is a Democratic election expert, he has represented Republicans in the past.

It is correct that absentee ballots without an address for the witness cannot be counted. However, there is nothing that prevents municipal clerks from correcting the witness addresses, whether they’re illegible or missing.

“If a ballot is returned without the witness’ address, the poll worker can attempt to obtain the address from a variety of documented sources,” Maistelman said.

In fact, nothing that O’Donnell cites indicates that the clerks cannot fix the addresses of witnesses, only that the addresses are required.

Most of the time, the clerks will attempt to contact the voters to try to verify the correct information. However, if the clerk knows the voter, or can document the source for the address correction, then the clerk can fix the ballot envelope, too. Making the task easier for most clerks, most of the time the witness is someone who lives at the same address as the voter. Once the problem has been fixed, voilà, you have a legal ballot.

This happens every election, and it’s similar to how nomination papers are treated.

“{The clerks} do similar things all of the time when people turn in nomination papers,” Maistelman said. “They do a quick review to insure they are legal addresses and within the voting district. They also review to make sure that an address is legible.”

If the Republican Party, O’Donnell and Gableman really want to attempt to throw out thousands of legitimate ballots at random, Trump ballots and Biden ballots alike, in the hopes of winning the lottery and finding the right combination to help Trump overcome a 20,000 vote deficit, good luck with that.

“If Gabelman wants to object to certain ballots because the clerk filled in the address, have at it,” Maistelman said. “The clerk will simply have to explain how they got the address.”

What O’Donnell and Gabelman are discussing is not “vote fraud.” It is a voter clerical error that’s fixable. ...

What we tend to think of vote fraud is usually casting a vote when you do not qualify to do so. For example, you’re under 18, you’re a felon still “on paper,” you have already voted, or you are not a U.S. citizen. Voter fraud is not forgetting to have a witness fill in their address and then someone else filling it in that knows it.

This does not mean that there are no instances of vote fraud. However, they are usually individual efforts, certainly not on the level to give a candidate a 20,000 vote victory in a statewide race.

The last large-scale vote fraud effort, ironically, was conducted by Republicans in North Carolina. In this election, there has been one documented case of one of the major presidential campaigns allegedly attempting to commit vote fraud, but it was the Trump campaign.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2020 0:23 utc | 69

@Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 8 2020 16:10 utc | 25

Hi, had never picked on your strange name ( Indian? ) before today, but I must say that found your cartoons of the long winded series "IS Tragicomedy" hilarious, especially those elaborated incriptions in "Amerikastani" soldiers´ helmets, like that "My name is Tom, Uncle Tom for you, and I´m very proud of that too"...Questions by Jihadi Rose to this Americastani soldier are quite logic...

One question, what nationality Jihadi Rose and Jihadi Colin do have, Britons?

You should publish that compilation, only it may be will be difficult to find a publisher, either in the US, Europe or Russia, but may be it could be possible publishing it as samizdat...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 9 2020 0:36 utc | 70

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 8 2020 21:59 utc | 61 This totally misrepresents my position on Trump and the purpose of my prediction.

No, it doesn't. I didn't mean that you were pro-Trump. I mean that you're hoping to regain your Trump win prediction by hoping Trump turns it around using legal maneuvers or finding vote fraud. Wishful thinking, in other words. Not going to happen.

From FairVote:


FairVote's September 2016 report by Rob Richie and Haley Smith is an update to past recount reports examining statewide election recount outcomes and practices in the United States. Using data from the decade and a half of elections taking place between 2000 and 2015, we determine how often recounts occur, how often they change outcomes, how much vote totals change and how these figures vary with the size of the electorate. We conclude that:

Statewide recounts are rare: Out of the 4,687 statewide general elections in the 2000 to 2015 decade, there were 27 statewide recounts, 15 of which were deemed "consequential" (with an original victory margin no more than 0.15 percent). In other words, there was one recount for every 173 statewide elections and one consequential recount for every 312 statewide elections. This pattern was true of most subcategories of statewide elections as well, including only three consequential recounts out of the 808 elections in this period for the offices of governor, lieutenant governor, secretary of state, attorney general and treasurer.

Outcome reversals are even rarer: Over the 2000-2015 period, recounts resulted in three reversals out of 15 consequential recounts, or one out of every 1562 statewide elections. These reversals took place in the races for U.S. Senate in 2008 in Minnesota, auditor in 2006 in Vermont and governor in 2004 in Washington.

Margin shifts in recounts are small: Statewide recounts resulted in an average margin swing of 282 votes between the frontrunners, representing 0.0191% of the statewide vote in those elections. The median average shift was 219 votes, with 22 of the 27 recounts changing the victory margin by fewer than 500 votes.

Trump is ahead in Wisconsin by 20,000. A recount is not going to change anything in any state except perhaps Georgia, where the race was close enough to trigger an automatic recount. Even if Georgia is flipped, that won't alter the outcome of the election. Wisconsin and Pennsylvania went for Trump and there is zero evidence of vote fraud produced so far.

Yes, I know, you didn't say anything about that. I'm addressing that fact to everyone who thinks Trump can recover from his loss.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2020 0:36 utc | 71

It appears Hernando Cortez's relative is under tremendous pressure to get out of Congress. She would not be saying this stuff if harsh words and reactions from colleagues were not coming across. They did expect a huge victory.

The machine wants life back to normal...

AOC said she might quit politics, as some centrist Democrats blame progressives for House losses, NYT says

Posted by: circumspect | Nov 9 2020 0:44 utc | 72

@Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 9 2020 0:36 utc | 69

"The Great Big ISIS Movie Extravaganza", not "IS Tragicomedy", sorry, subconscient betrayed me, may be, or simply, my memory...

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Nov 9 2020 0:48 utc | 73

Trying to talk Trump down off the ledge:

US election: 'Lamestream media' doesn't pick the US President, says Trump, as allies abandon him

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 9 2020 0:50 utc | 74

Gawd! Without even reading the article, I can tell by its title that it's complete junk!! Mao and his massive Communist Party of China is a Meritocratic Party, not a party of political cronies who don't give a damn about Governing. And the same can be said of the D-Party. The Duopoly's corruption is mind bending given its size, depth and ability to avoid prosecution. What takes place within the Outlaw US Empire cannot take place within Mao's China since those of the Duopoly's sort is what Mao and his peasant army kicked out of China, the Kuomintang was that corrupt entity. Is Mao's Party perfect? No. But it's far cleaner than most Western parties and their Neoliberalism, while it excels in its efficiency.

To make a proper comparison, the Outlaw US Empire's Duopoly must be paired with its complement in Feudal Aristocracies, which IMO come closest in their corruption and inability to govern. They don't give a shit about the hoi polloi--Let them eat cake! Let them try and exist without basic healthcare in the midst of a pandemic! Do Nothing to aid their plight! But make sure the .00001% is funneled Trillions$$$$$$.

One of the main trends we've witnessed for 3+ decades is continuity in policy--No matter which part of the Duopoly's in power, the fundamental policy goals remain the same, as they did under Trump. As was said by one analyst/book writer whose interview I linked said, "The government is waging war on the nation", meaning us hoi polloi and the institutions and infrastructure that supports our wellbeing. And I doubt that trend will change with Biden.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 9 2020 0:59 utc | 75

Down South @ 47

I think you are correct. The statue says the ballot must be rejected.

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/6/iv/87/6d

Helen @ 19

I have been following that theory and I do have my mail in ballot in hand and I can report the only watermark it contains is the California poppy which is on all ballots. It is heavily barcoded inside and out.

If Homeland Security reviewed printing of all ballots and maintained a database of all ballots printed I suspect it would have been widely reported. It is possible but I would consider that unlikely.

In my lifetime I have never seen so may allegations of voter fraud pouring in and so many smack downs in the media but the Empire must maintain legitimacy at all costs. I would post many more but it is pointless as everyone's views are hardened at this point.

Posted by: circumspect | Nov 9 2020 1:16 utc | 76

From FactCheck.org. November 6:

Trump’s Wild, Baseless Claims of Illegal Voting


Trump then proceeded to mischaracterize litigation pertaining to observers watching the vote counting process, saying that Democrats “have gone to the state Supreme Court to try and ban our election observers and very strongly.”

The dispute has been over how close observers can get to the canvassing proceedings, not whether observers are allowed to be present. Initially, a trial court denied the Trump campaign’s request for closer observation in Philadelphia, finding on Nov. 3 that by the campaign’s own admission, it had been given the opportunity to observe “the opening and sorting of ballots.”

The next day, a state court reversed that ruling, allowing observers within 6 feet, “while adhering to all COVID-19 protocols, including, wearing masks and maintaining social distancing.” Philadelphia’s election board then appealed the ruling to the state Supreme Court, saying that it had complied with the law and that closer inspection “jeopardizes both the safety of the City Defendants’ canvass, plus the privacy of voters.”

Separately, but on the same issue, the Trump campaign filed suit in federal court on Nov. 5 to stop the vote count in Philadelphia. That request was dismissed by a judge — who was appointed by President George W. Bush — after both sides agreed that each would be allowed 60 observers. The Trump lawyer admitted during the hearing that the campaign did have some canvassing observers present, stating, “There’s a non-zero number of people in the room.”

Philadelphia, notably, has been livestreaming its vote canvassing, which is available online for anyone to watch.

There's much more in that piece - worth reading to see how Trump lies about *everything*.

Elections expert Q&A: No evidence of fraud and fail-safes everywhere in US voting system


Q. What kind of specific safeguards are in place to make sure elections aren't rigged?

A. There are multiple safeguards. With mail balloting, ballots have individual identifiable codes on them that match the voters that request them or that they’re sent to. They're checked when they come back. There’s a signature check, or a scan check. If there’s a question because the ballot in some way got messed up or can’t be read, they’re opened and they’re looked at carefully.

If there’s a question at all, there’s a Republican and a Democratic or opposing candidate’s representatives who are part of the counting system. These are not the observers that stand aside and look around. These are the people that actually decide, ... if there’s a questionable ballot, what did the voter intend. And if they agree, then it goes forward.

The other is when people vote in person, they’re on a voter roll because they’ve registered and they’ve supplied evidence of their residence. In some states, first time voters have to supply additional ID... When you’re there, your signature is there and there’s just no evidence that anybody has tried to impersonate somebody else at any level that makes a difference.

The handful of times when people try to do something, they're caught and they’re indicted. ... It’s only a handful of individuals and that’s not going to change an election.

The Next 2020 Election Fight? Convincing Trump's Supporters That He Lost


And now Trump has seized on those doubts. He and his campaign have shared conspiracy theory after conspiracy theory about why votes were still being counted after Election Day, even though the tallying process was going roughly according to plan.

"I am disturbed that this is being intentionally mischaracterized to undermine the election process," Tina Barton, the Republican city clerk of Rochester Hills, Mich., said Friday in a video debunking one of the Trump campaign's many claims.

While these sorts of assertions largely have not found a receptive home in the courts, they have found one online. Social media groups have quickly sprung up in the days since voting stopped to spread disinformation about supposed cheating on the part of election officials, and in some cases organize in-person protests.

"This is the most intense online disinformation event in U.S. history and the pace of what we have found has only accelerated since [Election Day]," said Alex Stamos, director of the Stanford Internet Observatory and Facebook's former chief security officer.

The social media groups are reusing channels that have previously been aimed at sharing other conspiracy theories that cater mostly to Republicans, says Melissa Ryan, who runs the firm Card Strategies, which researches disinformation.

"These 'Stop The Steal' protests are clearly building off the infrastructure from the reopen protests that we saw earlier in the year during the pandemic," Ryan said. "And frankly, they're using the same strategy and infrastructure as the Tea Party back in 2009, 2010."

Morons gotta moron...

Why These New Election Lawsuits Will Fail
The president’s lawyers may try to tie up the election in courts, but the courts aren’t cooperating.


One group of lawsuits takes aim at the deadlines for receiving mail ballots. Many states have specifically provided that ballots will be accepted as long as they are mailed or postmarked on or before Election Day (as required by state law) and received within a certain number of days thereafter.

In Pennsylvania and North Carolina, a state court order and the state elections board respectively clarified that ballots arriving by a specific date after November 3 would be accepted as long as they were mailed in time (such clarifications are appropriate under state and federal law). Lawyers for the Trump campaign and other GOP operatives have tried to roll back the deadline in these states, and their efforts have been rejected thus far by courts up to and including the U.S. Supreme Court.

Other states require that ballots be received before polls close on Election Day. In a now dismissed challenge in Georgia, lawyers for the Trump campaign alleged that all of 53 possibly late arriving ballots were placed on the same table with timely arriving ballots by the Chatham County Board of Elections. The judge concluded that there was “no evidence” of fraud or commingling of late and on-time arriving ballots.

Another set of lawsuits from the Trump campaign alleges that their poll watchers were not given proper access to view the ballots. These lawsuits want counting to stop. There’s no basis to ask that ballots be thrown out, because there is no suggestion that any voter did anything wrong. On Wednesday, the campaign filed one such lawsuit in Michigan on behalf of an observer who claims to have not had appropriate access, but the lawsuit was so short on details that the judge said she planned to deny the request to stop the counting.

And then there are the lawsuits in Pennsylvania. As of Thursday evening, the Trump campaign’s lawyers had filed no fewer than four and were trying to intervene in a Pennsylvania case already before the U.S. Supreme Court.

All four of these new Pennsylvania suits challenge various ballot counting procedures. Two concern poll watcher access, and a third challenges guidance issued by the Pennsylvania secretary of state allowing voters to provide required identification information for an additional three days beyond what is required by statute. The fourth alleges that ballots with incomplete outer envelopes are being counted. None of these lawsuits allege that the voters who cast these ballots are ineligible people who are are voting. Two of the four Pennsylvania suits specifically target Philadelphia.

More lawsuits are threatened. After two lawsuits in Nevada petered out, a third complaint was filed on Thursday night.

Our judiciary is supposed to protect the right to vote, but we’re not seeing a lot respect for the role of the judiciary. Federal and state courts are getting tied up in disputes that other courts have spoken on or that grown-ups should be able to work out (or both). In an example in Pennsylvania, a request was filed one day in federal court, then effectively withdrawn when it did not look like the plaintiffs were going to get what they wanted, and the same issue was already being litigated in a state court case. This is not about process or fraud prevention — it is a distraction and a waste of judicial resources.

And finally, a short read on how hard it is to do mass mail-in voting fraud:

How Security Features Prevent Vote-by-Mail Misconduct
Voter fraud related to mail ballots is virtually nonexistent thanks to numerous safeguards.

Of course, none of this will stop morons from posting assertions that this or that "suspicious event" - or even outright clear local fraud - means mass voting fraud across all the swing states which proves the 4.4 million votes Biden received over Trump are all "fraudulent."

Bullshit.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2020 1:27 utc | 77

Is slow vote counting normal?

I large bunch of NGOs supported by Western governments trains Ukrainians how to improve democracy, decrease corruption etc. Last month there were elections to regional and municipal authorities according to the best rules and practices.

In Kiev, the capital, it took mere 15 days to count the votes for mayor of the city, and the current mayor (mer in Ukrainian) won 50.25% of the vote, exceeding exit polls by 5%. According to the sources unfriendly to the current central government and Klichko (the mayor) himself, the count was slow because it involve horse trading with a complicated package deal. The party of the country President gave 5% votes out of their take to Klichko in exchange for this and that. Similar trades happened in several other places too.

However, those shenanigan pale in comparison with what is happening in respect to so called "anti-corruption structures" and Constitutional Tribunal. But this is a bit complicated, and I will post something in few days.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 9 2020 1:38 utc | 78

from april 2016 and in one of caitlin johnstones e mails the past day

America is no model state: U.S. elections rank worst among Western democracies

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2020 1:57 utc | 79

i liked what yeah, right said on a previous thread... here is yeah, rights comment...

"What I will note is the swift manner in which the main stream media and the tech giants dismiss Trump's claims that there has been voting irregularities. They dismiss it out-of-hand as being blatant lies being presented without any evidence.

Hmmmm. I've heard that song before. Back when Trump insisted that he and his campaign was being spied upon by the FBI.

An obvious lie. An outrageous claim that was presented without any evidence.
Only, it turned out that this was absolutely, completely, and utterly true.

If there is massive voter fraud going on in this election then *of* *course* Trump is not going to have the evidence at his disposal to back up that allegation. After all, he is not a co-conspirator. He was not in the room when those frauds were planned, or executed.

Doesn't mean he is wrong. Doesn't mean his allegations can be dismissed out of hand, if only because the last time that happened it turned out that Trump was correct and his detractors were wrong.

Yet there is - once again - 100% unanimity across the board that what he is alleging is false, and can be immediately shoved down the memory hole.

That for me raises a very big red flag.
Posted by: Yeah, Right | Nov 8 2020 4:18 utc | 296"

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2020 2:03 utc | 80

love waving red flags in front of bulls, lol...

here is a pretty song to keep you calm
Lara · Joey Calderazzo

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2020 2:05 utc | 81

Here is a good point raised by Kevin McCarthy R House Minority leader pointing to systematic jiggling of votes cast on in-person (electronic) voting and electronic machine vote tabulating systems:

PROOF OF FRAUD? Republicans Won 28 of 29 Most Competitive House Seats, Added 3 State Legislatures, Did Not Lose a Single House Race — But Joe Biden Won!!?!

Most working stiffs who vote in the Prez election, whether Dem or Repug, just pull the "Straight Party ticket" lever. They work too hard/long to have time to learn or absorb much beyond the top of the ticket anyway. So, wtf, people who want Trump pull the full party GOP ticket and--lo and behold, many of the poll-trailing down-party Repugs get re-elected, but the top of the ticket slowly "loses" over the ensuing next several nights in key states? wtf?

Then there is this:

Developing: Nancy Pelosi’s Chief of Staff Is Chief Executive and Feinstein’s Husband a Major Shareholder at Dominion

Dominion is Canadian registered company that bought out *both* Diebold and Sequoia voting e-box companies.

Posted by: gm | Nov 9 2020 2:19 utc | 82

james @Nov9 2:03 #79

Thanks for re-posting Yeah, Right's comment.

I thought of doing the same earlier today but other matters took precedence.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 9 2020 2:19 utc | 83

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2020 2:03 utc | 79

Well I would not say the board is unified.

But I do agree there is a "rush to judgement" on the anti-Trump side.

But not too long ago Trump was all "Stop the voting!" when he was ahead.

So while I see the problem, I don't want to take sides.

I don't have an answer, the problem is systemic here. "Winning isn't the only thing, it's everything." and such is considered deep wisdom here in a lot of places. Politics is more like a team sport than a serious policy-oriented enterprise, and the money boys like it that way.

So people want their team to win. Didn't the Byzantines have vast riots over chariot races, green and blue? So we haven't come that far.

I am, to be fair, glad to have Trump out, but I'm for counting all the votes all the time regardless. If people show up to vote, they deserve to have that vote recorded. I think if we did that, made it so eligible citizens could easily vote, and always counted all the votes, then things might start to change here.

Posted by: Bemildred | Nov 9 2020 2:30 utc | 84

James @ 79

The board isn't unified...yet. What we have is the usual divide. One side being the Orange man evil/lockdowns & masks forever crowd. The other side seeing that there are positives and negatives to President Trump and that he's far less threatening to civil liberties than all the West's career politicians.

Did I mention "yet"? If readers are like me, they're beginning to tune out the comment section. Really it's been pretty pathetic compared to the comment section at the Saker's blog. Which is unfortunate because MofA deserves better. But why bother coming here when everything one side writes you can get at CNN, NYT, CBC, BBC and any number of other propaganda sources?

B does great writing, yet half his readers default to the intellectually lazy position in which they want government to tell them what to do and MSM to do their thinking for them.

Posted by: EoinW | Nov 9 2020 2:48 utc | 85

James and bemildred I agree both of your comments point to something that needs time and investigating. I would like to get Whitney Webb's viewpoint on the election. The U.S. is such a basket case and the power elite are so united against Trump I think Biden is "in".
Time will tell, I imagine the honeymoon period will be short for lefties who held their noses and voted for Biden. They will bail within the first 6 months, some will speak out about the cabinet etc. appointments before inauguration day. Next, look for some kind of Republican effort to appeal to Blacks and Browns, mostly fake but the Democrat "party" will be left with a few suburbans and some wannabe smart people.
Meanwhile, Bolivia is roaring back. Want to learn how to organize? Watch them, but be prepared to sacrifice....

Posted by: migueljose | Nov 9 2020 2:52 utc | 86

Here you have it how they did it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ficae6x1Q5A&feature=emb_logo

Posted by: Xpilgrim | Nov 9 2020 3:02 utc | 87

I'm perfectly happy with every single Trump lawsuit alleging improper counting of votes going forward.

Let the courts decide. That requires *EVIDENCE* - not assertions.

But in the end, if Trump doesn't either find 4.4 million more votes for him or invalidates 4.4 million Biden votes - he loses. Not 500 here, or ten thousand there, or even 100,000 in Wisconsin. 4.4 MILLION.

Period. End of story. Until then, shut the fuck up about a "stolen election" because you're talking out of your ass.

I am now done with the 2020 election. Trump lost. Biden won. What's important now is how much SHTF over that fact will occur. I'm ready for it, for the most part. Are you?

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2020 3:11 utc | 88

HRC could, maybe.
Dream team after uncle Joe is gone mentally or physically: Kamala Harris Pres. with Tulsi Gabbard VP.
They clashed in primary debates but so did Biden and Harris....

Posted by: Antonym | Nov 9 2020 3:17 utc | 89

That's not how it works Hack. (3:11)
It's a few thousand votes in Pennsylvania, Georgia, Wisconsin, Nevada, Arizona, and Michigan.
You're having a w*nk about the total popular vote. Hillary won that vote. Didn't see her much in the White House.
But I'm with you: Let the courts decide.

Posted by: Jezabeel | Nov 9 2020 3:55 utc | 90

Meh, I'm already over Trump.

RSH is right, let's focus on the next chess move from the US system.

Still, I guess there are some goods in encouraging more dissidents voices to delegitimize the US elections, this will force Biden to be tangled with domestic issues and not foreign ones.

Posted by: Smith | Nov 9 2020 4:00 utc | 91

Anyone with an independent POV can see that both Parties, their candidates, and their partisan hacks have stretched the truth and acted in strange/unexpected ways. Each side points fingers at the other for the crazy-ass stuff they pull.

There is a deliberate effort to:

  1. support the neoliberal establishment and the 'Deep State' managers that run US politics and the Empire;
  2. drown the truth in a sea of partisan nonsense.

But what stands out, in the eyes of cynics like myself, is that:
  • faux populist Trump has done everything that the establishment might've wanted - just as faux populst Obama did before him;
  • the Democrats have mounted one failed attempt at 'resistance' to Trump after another while mostly agreeing with his aggressive moves overseas and supporting his military build-up;
  • war is brewing - USA is in conflict with multiple countries: Syria, Iran, Yemen, Venezuela, Russia, China, North Korea.

Everyone is free to draw their own conclusions but IMO a Trump win is still not out of the question. If nothing else, we have the example of the 2000 election: Gore had actually won but conceded to GWBush.

Wouldn't Gore have done what the Deep State wanted? Yeah, but Bush-Cheny was more trusted. And they went on to engage in a war of choice against Iraq - something that was evidently planned in advance.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Nov 9 2020 4:02 utc | 92

thanks everyone for the feedback.... i am not attached to any particular outcome... i see how much angst and turbulence there is in the usa at present and i don't wish more of it.. it would be nice if there was a way for their to be less of it... i only feel that it is important to acknowledge 2 sides to pretty well any story that comes out in the news.. it makes it hard for people to know, and maybe we will never really know.. it will be like any number of other events that are the subject of conspiracy theories and etc. etc... i do believe though that the media seems to be playing a role in all of this that is mostly unhelpful.. this is why i appreciate the alternative views that are shared here.. lets see how it unfolds... i thought i didn't have the stomach for talking more usa election stuff, but i kind of blew it by posting those 3 posts earlier.. maybe the poster 'yeah, right' will come back and comment again, but maybe there is nothing more to say...

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2020 4:17 utc | 93

Jackrabbit:

Anyone with an independent POV can see that both Parties, their candidates, and their partisan hacks have stretched the truth and acted in strange/unexpected ways. Each side points fingers at the other for the crazy-ass stuff they pull.

Me: what was strange/unexpected? Obviously, not stretching the truth (if you did not expect that, hm, it does not give credit to your observation skills).

Jackrabbit:

There is a deliberate effort to:

support the neoliberal establishment and the 'Deep State' managers that run US politics and the Empire;
drown the truth in a sea of partisan nonsense.

Me: by the time of elections, what I think as Deep State managed to train Trump in obedience, and it goes without saying that Biden learned his lessons long time ago (even 100% opportunists need to learn what they are supposed to do, and Biden never being too bright, it did not happen instantly). The folks visibly try to fix "narratives", and do much more what we do not see. I doubt that they would do any vote tampering, this is not their expertise.

But the "sea of partisan nonsense" is something that "serious politicians" do all the time. You may remain an idealist if your political carrier is based in some remote mountain or islands, otherwise you provide voters with voters want to see.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Nov 9 2020 4:48 utc | 94

It would be a fine thing for all involved in the current procedures, and mostly the press, to show respect for the office of the presidency at this time of current turmoil. This was something I notice in the very first debate - that Biden seemed to think Trump's presidency had ended once the vote was cast. That is most certainly not the case. I am not an advocate for Trump; I did not vote for him. I am an advocate for respect of the office. Trump was correct during that debate when he said that his term is not over until the new term officially begins. Biden should have agreed on that point.

The press is not the maker of decisions in this respect. There is time to sort out the various claims through the courts and through recounts. And to let the rumors subside and just facts determine what has been a close election. Let each of the states do their best to make it legitimate for whichever candidate proves to have had the requisite votes in the electoral college as the Constitution requires. And if Trump feels there are discrepancies, let him make that claim. He is entitled to do so.

Otherwise, we do have chaos, and that is not in anyone's interest.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 9 2020 5:20 utc | 95

So what? . . . As b said five days ago: Every four years the United States has "the most important election ever" though none of those I remember have really changed anything fundamental." . . .So button up for same-old, same-old.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 9 2020 5:24 utc | 96

@Bemildred | Nov 9 2020 0:50 utc | 73

Trying to talk Trump down off the ledge:
US election: 'Lamestream media' doesn't pick the US President, says Trump, as allies abandon him

Yes, but it isn't just Trump they are trying to talk down and abandon. Listen to what Apple's 'Siri' answered when asked how old the president is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY9BeRIaqmw

There was talk here earlier about what would be a suitable casus belli for a 'democrat' US government to go to war. The usual modus operandi in such cases is to get rid of someone not needed anymore.

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 9 2020 6:20 utc | 97

to All

the troll “biswapriya” are known as hasbara troll who always denigrate “putin” as weak , just like the same trolls during ukraine war 2014 who said putin weak for not invading ukraine and liberating donbass..

and jackrabbit the resident hasbara troll support this “biswapriya” a sure sign they are working in the same astroturfer division on tel aviv or atlit.

Posted by: milomilo | Nov 9 2020 6:23 utc | 98

Otherwise, we do have chaos, and that is not in anyone's interest.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 9 2020 5:20 utc | 94

——

Come on Juliana , the world need US to be embroiled in chaos , and it is on the road there , as fate would see it destroyed due to its own actions past decades where it ruin the world for its own gain.

the time is ripe for US to step down from debt fueled hegemony and start the world into a better and peaceful world under non anglo rulers.. Let US citizens life within its means and not spending fake money for everything..

Posted by: milomilo | Nov 9 2020 6:27 utc | 99

@Xpilgrim | Nov 9 2020 3:02 utc | 86

Here you have it how they did it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ficae6x1Q5A&feature=emb_logo

Can't see it, it says you have to sign in to see it. I am not signing in to Google/Youtube.

Can you explain what it says?

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 9 2020 6:28 utc | 100

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