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September 23, 2020
Open Thread 2020-76
Comments
jinn @199
Your prevarications are boring. If you have no idea what Mark2 was talking about then just say so.
Posted by: William Gruff | Sep 25 2020 20:57 utc | 201
Gruff @ 201
A small apology to Julianina would have been appropriate and saved your embarrassment.
My comments stand, they need no explanation.
Ps get rid of those tyres in your yard. It’s rough out there.
Posted by: Mark2 | Sep 25 2020 21:32 utc | 202
American Exceptionalism™ doesn’t appeal to everyone.
Sep 25, 2020 — Foreign Affairs
The United States Is Not Entitled to Lead the World
Washington Should Take A Seat at the Table—But Not Always at Its Head .
That the United States should lead the world is often taken for granted, at least in Washington, D.C. The country played that role for more than seven decades after World War II, and most Americans don’t want China to assume it. So it would be easy to think that if the American people vote Donald Trump out of office and bring in committed internationalist Joe Biden, the United States can just go back to “the head of the table,” as Biden’s recent Foreign Affairs article claimed. But global leadership is not an American entitlement.
Trump has broken with traditions of U.S. global leadership in a long and familiar list of ways. But while most of Washington’s allies (with a few notable exceptions, such as Israel and Saudi Arabia) are of the “Anybody but Trump” inclination, restoring a constructive U.S. role in the world will require much more than proclaiming that the United States is back and reverting to a pre-Trump playbook. The country must come to terms with fundamental shifts in its global position. Seen in historical perspective, the country has gone from being apart to atop and, now, to amid the world, and the transition requires some adjustments. .here
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 25 2020 21:37 utc | 203
@vk
Always this excuse. I guess the HK protests and all the other color revolutions were also peaceful with some “infiltrated” bad apples.
If the protesters cannot keep themselves in check, they are to be judged as a collective as rioters.
Posted by: Smith | Sep 25 2020 21:38 utc | 204
Just chill Smith @ 204
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqYAI7JoswU
Posted by: Mark2 | Sep 25 2020 22:05 utc | 205
Don @203–
Thanks for that. Foreign Affairs is completely blind and deluded by its own 70+ years of propaganda and falsification of history.
Mark2–Thanks for the compliment you made to us! We’re both very appreciative!
Karlofi @ 206
Thanks for that, I to am blessed with the best soulmate in the world ! That love and respect shines through, reflected in our deeds and comments here. Love not hate. Good night.
Posted by: Mark2 | Sep 25 2020 22:49 utc | 207
H.Schmatz #140
What are you referring by this? I do know nothing about his previous life as investigative journalist…I did not know he was a US citizen either until now he has died..
I was referring to Andre Vltcheks tough life when he was imprisoned and brutally tortured in East Timor by the Indonesian Army. It took a year before his left arm could recover. He travelled throughout the world getting into the grit and essence of the people in those lands. No one does that sort of extensive travel and close quarters encounters free from a multitude of ailments and the occasional wounds.
He worked hard and tirelessly so his metabolism responded normally and had various agues from that life work.
He was a citizen of the world and great communist thinker and reporter as he freely admitted.
I don’t care if he was a US citizen or whatever he was among us all regardless of nation.
There was this link posted by CitizenX at the beginning of this thread: I recommend the video embedded in the report.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 25 2020 23:27 utc | 208
@Schmoe #151 re: China and chip fabs
I was slightly mistaken. I found the following quote in this AnandTech article: SIMC Details Its N+1 Process Technology: 7nm Performance in China
A SMIC’s spokesperson said the following:
“Our target for N+1 is low-cost applications, which can reduce costs by about 10 percent relative to 7nm. So this is a very special application.”
Notably, SMIC’s N+1 does not use extreme ultraviolet lithography (EUVL), so the fab company does not need to procure further expensive equipment from ASML. Which isn’t to say that the company hasn’t considered EUV – the company did acquire an EUV step-and-scan system – but it has not been installed, reportedly because of restrictions imposed by the US. As a result, it will be SMIC’s N+2 that will use EUV.
The foundry from China plans to start risk production using its N+1 technology in Q4 2020, so expect the process to enter high volume manufacturing (HVM) sometimes in 2021 or 2022.
So, not make their own EUV machines, but an end-run around the de facto western monopoly on high performance chip fabs. It’s highly likely a (very effective) stop-gap while they either develop their own EUV or some new tech.
Posted by: Dr Wellington Yueh | Sep 25 2020 23:55 utc | 209
Thankyou Karlof1.
I very much appreciated your response to my comment. You have personalised your thinking and this has led me to a better understanding of your position.
Posted by: Australian lady | Sep 26 2020 0:50 utc | 210
Scotch Bingeington #111
So apparently, Navalny did suffer from poison of some kind, but he took it himself. At least that’s what Putin has come to think.
Navalny has publicly thanked the German surgeon Dr Kai-Uwe Eckardt who saved his life – John Helmer [Dances With Bears] has tweeted it here.
Kai-Uwe Eckardt is the Berlin doctor thanked yesterday by Alexei Navalny for his “incredible job”. Navalny will not explain what Eckhardt, an expert on diabetes and kidney transplant, did to treat ”Novichok poisoning”.
If you scroll down a post or two it is revealed that there is a schism in the hoax surrounding the BS.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 2:36 utc | 211
willie #193
[responding to juliania 186#]
I don’t want to mingle with your spatty conversation with Gruff and Mark2 and bemildred,all commentators that I regularly appreciate ,but your reference to Socrates is what makes me jump on my chair a bit.I think everything we know about Socrates comes from Plato.If you affiche Socrates as a superior mind,I tend to agree,but do you know he would be stamped conspiration -theory spreader if he were living today.Why?Because in his last speech just before his last gasp he makes clear,like he is telling some secret, that the earth is hollow and that we actually live inside.Thank you for clearing that up.
Plato is a shoddy character and (IMO) a bitter and twisted egotist or wanker. The greatest scientist of the times was Democritus, a contemporary of Socrates (died 399bce). This was the generation immediately preceding Plato. Plato ignored this brilliant scientist and appears to have had a passionate hatred of him. Plato is an early cancel culture advocate I guess.
Aristotle, a student of Plato, was not afflicted with Plato’s faults and went out of his way to praise Democritus saying that not one of our predecessors “with the single exception of Democritus … penetrated below the surface or made a thorough examination of a single one of the problems” {Professor Robert Temple, The Crystal Sun, pp244-5}.
So if one is citing Plato in reference to Socrates then it is mighty thin ice.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 3:05 utc | 212
willie #154
Which year was it that Donovan sang?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1tFxaJviXA
Thank you. I still sing that song to myself as solace. It has been with me all my days. Donovan was a beautiful spirit in those time s and today. You made my day.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 3:29 utc | 213
For Donovan fans, he played the title role in the 1972 film The Pied Piper. It’s a beautiful film, wry humor and lots of intrigue.
Posted by: Dr Wellington Yueh | Sep 26 2020 3:36 utc | 214
Dr Wellington Yueh @209
Yes I had seen those articles but am fairly certain that the required processes will depend on US technology, so this will likely be stopped dead in its tracks if Trump imposes sanctions on SMIC (Hint: he will).
Posted by: Schmoe | Sep 26 2020 3:43 utc | 215
@Schmoe #215, sanctions will be attempted, but is anyone going to follow them? There isn’t really a big market for this kind of hardware (Israel, Taiwan, a few others?) so sales are becoming more critical. Also, it won’t necessarily be US tech, but tech they ‘control’ at the moment. ASML is Dutch, a colony to be sure, but for how long?
Now I’m curious…I’m gonna go dig. My reading has usually focused on various chip architectures, less about how they’re made, more about what they do and how they do it.
Anyway, yours is a good point, if a depressing one.
Posted by: Dr Wellington Yueh | Sep 26 2020 4:22 utc | 216
205#
Thanks again Mark2!I did not know that one.It’s real good skanking.Would that be Horsemouth on drums?
Posted by: willie | Sep 26 2020 6:38 utc | 217
Hello uncle,glad I’m not the only one who likes the oldies!Indeed Donovan is one of those who keep standing out from that epoch.It shows what a human can do with an acoustic guitar ,a voice,and a cheap harmonica.
When I was in grammar school,after three years of ancient Greek,we read Plato in class,progressing just one or two alinea’s per greek hour.We read Symposion,Gorgias and Phaedo.As you know in this last one Socrates has to drink the poison being the death sentence for offending the State of Athens.And then towards the end when paralysis mounts from his feet to his head Socrates starts telling this strange view on our earth that he said was based upon his personal observation.No dialogue,no logic development just his tale,and that is what makes it significant to me now.At the time we did not understand the translation,and found it very awkward,the teacher did not explain neither.
As for to what degree Plato is trustworthy in reporting about Socrates,we are not able to know more about him,if there are no other sources.This is the whole problem about historic research and reading original sources,that we can’t even be sure to be original.Like juliania’s bible,the result of how many translations,copiist’s errors and deliberate falsehoods decided in the Vatican?Like deciphering hieroglyphes,ancient languages with little scriptures etc.How can we ever be sure about what really happened in the past? The whole world has seen Kennedy butchered,but still we do not know for sure what happened,so how can we be sure what happened in the murder of Julius Caesar 21 centuries ago? By the way,there are voices claiming that a lot of “Roman” books were actually written at the beginning of the Renaissance.We should never forget the destructions and burnings of ancient knowledge and books,a few times in Alexandria,Rome ,Constantinopel,and,fuck,why are there no ancient jewish buildings and hebrew inscriptions in occupied Palestine?
I’m sorry,I am not superiorly thinking,but just superficially,it’s my nature,still I admire people who coordinate the writing of their thoughts thoroughly as many do over here at this blog.
Posted by: willie | Sep 26 2020 7:21 utc | 218
Uncle Tungsten,
I forgot.Demokritos is one of those scientist/philosophers that vaguely are called the pre-socrates philosophers,putting all of them in one basket,and few people are interested in them.I’m glad to read about him following your reference of professor Temple,I’ll look that up;well not today,but I will,thanks.
Posted by: willie | Sep 26 2020 7:29 utc | 219
Willie @ 217
Glad you liked that one ! Hope others did to. You clearly know your stuff with good music, I can’t answer your q about drummer. The more we learn the more we realise how little we know. But music is a great humaniser, in these times of turmoil a good reminder, a unifying force for good. Why i put it on this particular thread. With respect to b.
Posted by: Mark2 | Sep 26 2020 8:56 utc | 220
willie #219
Thanks for your response. When you catch up with Prof. Temple be prepared be astounded at both the revealed knowledge and the rigour of Temple’s approach. Lenses have been part of humanity for many thousands of years. Crystal Sun is a truly important book written by a magnificent mind. There is one youtube of him presenting his findings but that only skims the surface and you have to read the book to appreciate the fine grain of some of our ancient history. Temple lives in your fair land.
Here is some further good Roots Reggae.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 9:00 utc | 221
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 2:36 utc | 211
Thx for Helmer update, agree about Plato == first bitter academic wanker, pre-Socratics == first observation-not-revelation scientific attitude, Aristotle lays out analytic method, but not much interest in observation, to authoritarian about it, basis for centuries of neo-platonism, tsk.
Recommend Pirsig (Zen & The Art of Motorcycle Maintenance) & Camus (short essays, Rebel, Sisyphus) on Greeks, for different points of view.
It seems safe to assume that what has been passed down to us from the past is mostly sanitized according to the wishes of whomever ruled at the time. What would US history look like a couple hundred years hence is all we had is a few beat up high school history books from 1965 Texas?
Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 26 2020 11:04 utc | 222
I liked Pirsig’s book and his defense of the sophists.
I recommend a similar point of view on PlatoParallel Thinking . Should be ‘strongly recommend’ I guess.
Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Sep 26 2020 11:37 utc | 223
Maybe this should be on the lying thread—
Galloway: Lying industry may be the only sector of Western economies still in full production & TAXPAYERS pay for it
With a link to anonymous
LINK
Posted by: arby | Sep 26 2020 13:23 utc | 224
Re Greek (History, Philosophers, Cosmology, etc.)
Stephen Fry has written a splendid new narrative on Greek Cosmology (Gods), told as a tale of gaining command of chaos and establishing order over several generations of Gods. Well written, putting a living face on all the carryon Gods are capable of, humorous, had Stephen Fry told this earlier, Olympus would still be inhabited by the usual suspects. The book: “Mythos, The Greek Myths Retold”, ISBN 978-1-405-93413-8 Penguin Books. Not for snowflakes or other triggering sensitive idiots.
Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Sep 26 2020 13:57 utc | 225
@214 Ah yes Donovan…..supposed to be England’s answer to Dylan. He did some nice stuff but very gentle. He didn’t have Dylan’s edge.
Posted by: dh | Sep 26 2020 16:01 utc | 226
Occasionally, BigLie Media publishes something that’s not a BigLie. And that’s the case with this, “The Top 1% of Americans Have Taken $50 Trillion From the Bottom 90%—And That’s Made the U.S. Less Secure”, which is based upon this RAND paper, “Trends in Income From 1975 to 2018”. Two good questions: Will this issue and the facts related to it enter into the election verbiage or used to help analyze the nationwide protests?
I have yet to read either, although they jibe with earlier data I’ve seen.
The effects of income trends will probably be diminished by more serious covid lockdown effects. Some effects of less (or no) income and the resulting home evictions will be increased crime, like the current spike in burglaries in San Francisco.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 26 2020 17:53 utc | 228
from Carnegie Endowment…
Making U.S. Foreign Policy Work Better for the Middle Class
Five broad recommendations
1. First, broaden the debate beyond trade. . .
2. Making globalization work for the American middle class requires substantial investment in communities across the United States and a comprehensive plan that helps industries and regions adjust to economic disruptions. . .
3. Third, break the domestic/foreign policy silos . .demand a wider prism. . .
4. Banish stale organizing principles for U.S. foreign policy. . .there is no evidence America’s middle class will rally behind efforts aimed at restoring U.S. primacy in a unipolar world, escalating a new Cold War with China, or waging a cosmic struggle between the world’s democracies and authoritarian governments. . .
5. Fifth, build a new political consensus around a foreign policy that works better for America’s middle class. None of the current major foreign policy approaches hold the key to American middle-class renewal—be it post–Cold War liberal internationalism, President Donald Trump’s America First, or progressives’ elevation of economic and social justice and climate change and the potential downsizing of U.S. defense spending. . .here
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 26 2020 18:23 utc | 229
A “hilarious” (if it were not so sad) take by John Quincy Adams on The Atlantic pundit JEFFREY TAYLER’s 2001 piece “Russia is Finished – The unstoppable descent of a once great power into social catastrophe and strategic irrelevance”. Taylor’s credits include being “a former contributing editor at The Atlantic and the author of seven books”!!! Wow, that tells me more than I need to know about his expertise.
https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2020/09/25/america-is-finished/
Quincy Adams takes the indicators Jeffrey Taylor had used in 2001 to predict Russia’s demise 19 years ago and compares them for Russia vs. USA now.
– Oligarchs are losing power in Russia but gaining it in America.
–Confidence in government is rising in Russia but falling in America.
– Russia’s military achievement are rising while America’s are falling.
– Russia’s military expenditure is falling but America’s keeps rising.
– Russian population is stabilizing while America’s is starting to fall.
And then he adds several additional factors like the likelihood of a civil war in the US. As I said, it is hilarious (as far as our corporate media pundits are concerned), if it were not so sad.
Posted by: Nathan Mulcahy | Sep 26 2020 18:58 utc | 230
Benjamin Studebaker says RBG was not that great and everybody should calm down:
The Fear Surrounding the Death of Ruth Bader Ginsburg is Unhealthy
Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 26 2020 19:08 utc | 231
uncle tungsten | 211
uncle tungsten, thank you very much for that bit of information! I would never have found it, I try to stay away from Twatter… So, diabetes and kidney issues it is… It’s very telling indeed. Helmer’s latest piece is about Russian cheese (funny subject), I just wish he would write another one about the “schism in the hoax surrounding the BS”. You put that very nicely. Sounds like a line from some bad-ass rap song! 😉
Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Sep 26 2020 19:51 utc | 232
Scotch Bingeington # 232
Helmer emailed me the twitter link because I periodically comment at his site and thank him for his good work. The link he sent did not work for twitter so I entered via his twitter link in the masthead at his site. I go to twitter when pushed and bookmark a few goodies. Barflies could keep an eye on that one.
Thanks to Willie and Bemildred, dh, Tuyzentfloot on music and Plato.
On good 60’s music – Rodriguez – superb.
Dylan got the push because …. Rodriguez was submerged (maybe because Latino). There is a good movie on Rodriguez and his unexpected impact on the end of apartheid in South Africa – strongly recommended.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 20:09 utc | 233
From my link @ 224
Anonymous has obtained all kinds of stuff on The Integrity Initiative , etc.
“First in a series of upcoming publications that will expose interference of Her Majesty’s Government in internal affairs of various countries around the world.”
HMG Trojan Horse: From Integrity Initiative To Covert Ops Around The Globe. Part 1: Taming Syria I
Posted by: arby | Sep 26 2020 20:26 utc | 234
From my link @ 224
Anonymous has obtained all kinds of stuff on The Integrity Initiative , etc.
“First in a series of upcoming publications that will expose interference of Her Majesty’s Government in internal affairs of various countries around the world.”
HMG Trojan Horse: From Integrity Initiative To Covert Ops Around The Globe. Part 1: Taming Syria I
Posted by: arby | Sep 26 2020 20:26 utc | 235
Zero Hedge on Pres. Trump’s “Platinum Plan” for Black Americans, Designates Antifa, KKK As “Terrorist Organizations”:
here
Meanwhile Biden compares Trump to Goebbels and Castro:
RT
Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 26 2020 21:02 utc | 236
Thank you Uncle Tungsten for the hour of rocksteady you linked to.I downloaded it.Many names that I did not know,though I possess some 200 reggae or rocksteady albums.What was very typical and admirable in that time,was the fact that real poor guys from Trenchtown and other ghetto-like dwellingplaces,could have their songs recorded and broadcasted all over the third world,as developing countries were called then.Toasters like Dr.Alimentado,Prince Far I and I-Roy ,they all lived in extreme poverty.A wonderful voice as that of Prince Alla came out of a kitchen with metal roof and his goat scratching for food.But they were known and heard in Nairobi,Soweto,Kinshasa ,the Congos.Priceless.
Posted by: willie | Sep 26 2020 21:10 utc | 237
Posted by: arby | Sep 26 2020 20:26 utc | 235
You’re late to party on this one:
New Documents Reveal Secret British Efforts To Arm, Assist And Propagandize ‘Moderate Rebels’ In Syria
Posted by: One Too Many | Sep 26 2020 21:26 utc | 238
@uncle tungsten re: Rodriguez… Do you have a name for the film, or better still a link? Interested, thanks!
Posted by: Dr Wellington Yueh | Sep 26 2020 21:31 utc | 239
Dr Wellington Yueh #238
Searching for sugarman
If you enjoy the trailer then you will likely find the movie on a subscription download. When I get a spare minute I will look for the movie and pour a nip of Arak to sip while revelling.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 26 2020 21:44 utc | 240
Dr Wellington Yueh
“will be attempted, but is anyone going to follow them? There isn’t really a big market for this kind of hardware (Israel, Taiwan, a few others?) so sales are becoming more critical.”
Everyone is obeying US Sanctions against Huawei, so it is a virtual certainty they will be followed. No individual corporate entity in the world of any substance can afford to violate US sanctions. China screwed up massively by not devoting more resources to semiconductor manufacturing and they are likely going to pay a steep price for that.
Posted by: Schmoe | Sep 26 2020 21:54 utc | 241
It has crossed my mind that the west/US will ban or badmouth the Russian Covid vaccine and get the populations to take the American or European ones.
Most likely the rushed west ones won’t work and the Russian one will. Result will be increasing Covid problems in the Exceptional country and a disappearance in the Evil countries. That should make for some gyrations.
Posted by: arby | Sep 26 2020 22:44 utc | 242
@uncle tungsten: got it, thanks! Not a drinker, but I got some whole bean from Mexico that will do. Salud.
@Schmoe: I’m hoping they can ‘erode the bottom’ by pumping out good-enough chips for domestic to build revenue. Phones will be a problem because everyone is used to Samsung/Apple/Huawei performance. I’ll cling to my hope…I’m an optimist.
Posted by: Dr Wellington Yueh | Sep 26 2020 23:13 utc | 243
@Smith | Sep 24 2020 13:25 utc | 85
Yeah, I see cops who are beating people until they cry, and not even cuffing them but continue the beating.
Videos like those are never honest enough to highlight what the “peaceful protestors” in Hong Kong were doing BEFORE the cops weighed in — like dousing people with gasoline and setting them on fire. The rioters don’t always make human torches, but they do plenty of other violent things to justify an intervention by the Hong Kong cops.
Posted by: Cyril | Sep 27 2020 1:44 utc | 244
Rodriguez 2018 big gig Live at best kept secret
Just found this and loving it. I hope you barflies dig it too.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Sep 27 2020 9:22 utc | 245