Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
August 13, 2020

Open Thread 2020-64

News & views ...

Posted by b on August 13, 2020 at 14:26 UTC | Permalink

next page »

"Revenge for Gen. Soleimani’s blood a matter of time: IRGC chief"

Iran has described the missile attack on the Ain al-Assad air base as a “first slap.”

Posted by: arby | Aug 13 2020 14:35 utc | 1

This is a bit Off Topic, sorry about that.

I comment from some time here and i think that it is a good place with good people.

I hope you guys and gals can do that for me.

My mother will be undergoing a serious medical operation tomorrow (she already had one operation before one week too), so if you can say a prayer for her too, i will be thankful.

Thank you all.

Posted by: Passer by | Aug 13 2020 14:36 utc | 2

passer by.... i hope all goes well with your mom and i will say a prayer for you and her...

Posted by: james | Aug 13 2020 14:37 utc | 3

Jimmy Lai publicly admits goal was always to exterminate the socialists/communists, marks the official beginning of the Second Cold War:

‘No world peace without changing China’: Hong Kong’s Apple Daily founder Jimmy Lai calls for American support


How to build a candidate from nothing:

Keir Starmer says 'something has gone horribly wrong' as nearly 40% of results downgraded with biggest reductions among disadvantaged students

Sure, sir Keir said that. The problem is he's late for the party: it was the British teachers who had first denounced the downgrades, not sir Keir Starmer (as the first news from The Guardian demonstrate).

Sir Keir doesn't care about the downgrade, and only entered the arena after he saw an opportunity to capitalize on it. He's not from the education area, he doesn't care about the education of the British children, he never will be.

The Independent should stop attributing genuine popular struggles to the person of sir Keir Starmer in their front page.


More on the (second) fall of the UK:

Daily Mail publisher to cut up to 100 jobs as revenues fall: DMGT says quarterly print advertising down 69% and digital income down 17%

The Daily Mail is the soul of the UK. If it is doing badly, the nation is doing badly.


Brazilian healthcare system collapses with tons of useless HCQ rotting in its stocks:

UTIs estão sem remédios para intubação de pacientes em 22 Estados; cloroquina está sobrando

That's what happens when you spend all your resources on a useless drug.


Fab-ulous: Huawei Will Build 45nm Chipsets At New Fab Facilities To Secure Supply Lines In Trade War

The West still has time to avoid the humiliation. Call off the Second Cold War, admit defeat and unconditionally surrender to China. Open your markets to Chinese capital while the CCP is still in a good mood. It will be better for all humanity.


COVID-19 Live Updates: Germany Confirms New Daily Spike of 1,445 Infected

The same is going on in New Zealand.

When the chief epidemiologist from Italy was asked in CGTN what would he do differently if he could travel back in time, he answered: we should've done exactly what was done in Wuhan.

A true lockdown was only enforced in China (and, maybe, the other socialist nations). The rest of the world did a half-baked monstrosity they called a lockdown, but that is not the real deal.


The UK economy's GDP fell 20.4% in the three months to June; 21.7% annualized.

The reason the UK's GDP fell more annualized than quarterly is simple: its economy already was degenerating long before the pandemic.

The same is true for all the Western economies (including the American one, which fell by almost one third annualized against "only" 9% quarterly).

The UK is also a devastating blow to the anti-lockdown ilk. See, it's not a trade between a lockdown and the economy: for your economy to recover as fast as it can, it must enforce a total lockdown first. The only country that did it so far is China.

Sweden - the other herd immunity poster-boy - will also register a recession as big as its lockdown poster-boy brother Norway.

Posted by: vk | Aug 13 2020 14:49 utc | 4

Posted by: Passer by | Aug 13 2020 14:36 utc | 2

I wish you all the best for your mom..I can't pray cause I am atheist but I truly hope all will go well.

Posted by: LuBa | Aug 13 2020 14:52 utc | 5

Such fine folks---

"Dion Nissenbaum
Exclusive: As Beirut tries to rebuild after deadly blast, the Trump administration is preparing to impose anticorruption sanctions on Lebanese figures in an effort to shape next government and dilute Hezbollah's power.

Posted by: arby | Aug 13 2020 14:53 utc | 6

Passer by - I have enjoyed reading your cogent comments. My thoughts are with you. Best wishes for a good out come.

Posted by: Miss Lacy | Aug 13 2020 15:04 utc | 7

@vk | Aug 13 2020 14:49 utc | 4

Sweden - the other herd immunity poster-boy - will also register a recession as big as its lockdown poster-boy brother Norway.

Well, apart from the fact that there is no 'lockdown' in Norway. That is a lie.

Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 13 2020 15:12 utc | 8

Wishing you and your mom the best possible outcome, Passer by.

Posted by: urblintz | Aug 13 2020 15:18 utc | 9

After Turkey's claim that Greece fired on a private vessel yesterday, France has sent fighter jets to Greece to 'ward against' any Turkish action in the East Med to which Erdogan responded by saying that no one should see themselves as a 'giant in the mirror' (Would the Tall Man have the balls to make the same comment to Putin? And he should also consider the less literal meaning which would of course be far more applicable to Turkey than France!)

Additionally, Erdogan claims that it is Greece who is provoking tensions in the region not Turkey, which is pure projection, of course. Turkey wants both a place at the table and a piece of the pie. Not sure that Erdogan has any serious cards left to play, however.

Posted by: AtaBrit | Aug 13 2020 15:26 utc | 10

Posted by: arby | Aug 13 2020 14:53 utc | 7

For those who think yet that it's been an accident.

Posted by: LuBa | Aug 13 2020 15:32 utc | 11

The DNC is burdened with Joe Biden's brain. A new brain was required
to augment the old one.

The new brain for Biden is truly abby normal.

Posted by: librul | Aug 13 2020 15:32 utc | 12

Re: Beirut explosions

Hiding seismic data … what do you know. Trump did say “it was an attack.”

Normally, the sensors’ data are available to the public via the Incorporated Research Institutions for Seismology (IRIS) website, which aggregates information from global seismographic research institutions. [Location: Washington DC]

However, shortly after 6 PM on August 5 – that is, less than 24 hours after the Beirut disaster – access to all the data collected prior to the event was blocked, and visitors to the site are notified that no information is available.

Of course, nothing can really be taken away once it was posted online, and so some geophysicists managed to obtain the deleted data and found that this seismograph data matched other regional sensitive sensor data regarding the Beirut event. It appears that no one else has noticed the facts revealed by the investigation of the retrieved seismographic data:

[Source: Jewish Press]

Posted by: Oui | Aug 13 2020 15:56 utc | 13

"Auxilio Emergencial"

I don't know the details but I read an interesting news report talking about an "Auxilio Emergencial" by Bolsonaro in Brazil which is claimed by IBRE and others to have reduced UN-defined extreme poverty levels in Brazil from 6.5% to 3.3% during the recent months or last half year.

- - - - - - - - - - - - -

GPS spoofing news

Something that might interest many here.

· Initial report "Ghost ships, crop circles, and soft gold: A GPS mystery in Shanghai", MIT Technology Review, 20191115.

· Ball starts rolling "Systematic GPS Manipulation Occuring at Chinese Oil Terminals and Government Installations", SkyTruth, 20191212.

· And rolls all over "AIS Ship Tracking Data Shows False Vessel Tracks Circling Above Point Reyes, Near San Francisco", SkyTruth, 20200526.

After which it slowly filters through various media and biases before it hits an obscure layer where I randomly picked it up and worked my way back to the sources (the chain linked chronologically above).

I only discovered this news a few hours ago and have not had time to do much more than that. There are various news reports that might also be decent but I do not yet know how much they add or remove/corrupt. The SkyTruth in the news page has several links to media coverage on it (and other entirely different topics), look for any entries that mention Bjorn Bergman and GPS.

I decided to post this "fresh" instead since I have no idea if I'll get around to anything more :)

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Aug 13 2020 16:08 utc | 14

FYI Greyzone highlights Kamala Harris' support for Israel, including: Nov. 2017 meeting with Netanyahu and reciting "the pledge" in public.

Are there any senior Democrat or Republican leader that has not done these things?

If USA really wanted to look for foreign "meddling" in US elections, Israel+AIPAC is the prime candidate.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 13 2020 16:13 utc | 15

Oui @13

The strange conclusion the "Jewish Press" draws from the missing seismic data is that the explosion was initiated by the detonation of a Hezbollah weapons cache.

How would Hezbollah have the reach to silently purge the seismic data? It isn't as if the Incorporated Research Institutions for Seismology would take down their data just because Hezbollah asked. Consider at whose request that seismic studies organization might hide the data and you start getting closer to your culprit.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 13 2020 16:19 utc | 16

Best wishes to your mother and you "Passer by" :)

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Aug 13 2020 16:22 utc | 17

Good luck to your mom, Passer by. And to you.

Posted by: b | Aug 13 2020 16:30 utc | 18

Passer by @ 2.

...... all my wishes and good thoughts hoping, hope your mom will be fine - and hang in there buddy or budette life can throw bad stuff. in the spirit at your side, yes, yes.

Posted by: Noirette | Aug 13 2020 16:30 utc | 19

@William Gruff | Aug 13 2020 16:19 utc | 16

How would Hezbollah have the reach to silently purge the seismic data?

True. But more importantly, why would anyone want to purge the seismic data, unless it would indicate a different scenario than is currently being pushed?

Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 13 2020 16:54 utc | 20

Taiwan Straits situation is escalating, "PLA drills a warning to ‘Taiwan secession’ forces," with Global Times being very direct:

"The Chinese People's Liberation Army (PLA) Eastern Theater Command on Thursday announced that it held consecutive live-fire drills in the Taiwan Straits and its northern and southern ends. It said that 'a certain major country' has been continuously making negative moves on the Taiwan question, which has sent the wrong signal to 'Taiwan independence' forces. Therefore, the drills are aimed at the current security situation in the region and to safeguard national sovereignty, according to the spokesperson of the PLA Eastern Theater Command.

"The PLA often carries out exercises in the East China Sea. But it is rare for the Eastern Theater Command to talk about the regional situation directly, and single out a particular major country. It is also the first time that we see in media reports that the drills cover the Taiwan Straits and its northern and southern ends....

"The drills of the PLA Eastern Theater Command send a clear warning to Taiwan and the US, which declare the Chinese mainland's firm will that it will not sit still in the face of US and Taiwan provocation, and erosion of the 'one China' principle. Taiwan and the US should abandon their illusion that they can smoothly upgrade their official ties, as this process is bound to be accompanied by the risks they could hardly bear.

"Military actions are the ultimate card the mainland plays to deter 'Taiwan independence' forces. The Anti-Secession Law has put the Democratic Progressive Party in awe. The recent drills by the Eastern Theater Command sends a clear message that the mainland's military pressure on Taiwan will increase together with the increasing collusion between the US and Taiwan, and that as long as the US and Taiwan can bear the worsening situation in the region, the Chinese mainland fears no 'shake.'"

The Neocons have awoken Smaug by toying with the dragon's tail, but it isn't Tolkien's creation. And China doesn't bluff. The next two paragraphs display China's resolve in the matter and to go to war if required:

"The US must not overestimate the deterrence it could pose by military intervention in the Taiwan Straits. The Chinese people generally no longer believe that US military could dominate the battlefield once a war breaks out there. The Chinese people have enough courage to safeguard their national sovereignty by engaging in the military showdown with the US across the Straits, when all the other options fail. And we are confident we will win. We don't want to go that far, but no country should think about separating Taiwan from China using salami-slicing tactics or intimidating the mainland.

"Taiwan authorities can choose between a peaceful developing island and a place filled with severe military confrontation, where a hot war could be detonated by a tiny spark. In the past, the PLA's military drills took place in the Taiwan Straits. Currently, they are occurring in the Straits and its northern and southern ends. If Taiwan authorities go further in the future, the PLA's military exercise will emerge in the Straits, in its northern and southern ends and in eastern water of Taiwan, as part of around-the-island drills. Then, PLA fighter jets will carry out exercises above Taiwan."

In another article, High ranking KMT member and "Former leader of Taiwan region Ma Ying-jeou Ma Ying-jeou said on Monday at a speech that if the Chinese mainland decides to reunify the island by force, 'the first battle is the last battle,' and the US military will not come to the island's rescue, and that there won't be time for the US to come either, Taiwan media reported." [My Emphasis]

IMO, KMT people have a more realistic appraisal of the situation in the short and long term, which is why they never attempted to try and secede as they knew such an action would be hopeless and very destructive:

"A Beijing-based Taiwan affairs expert who requested anonymity told the Global Times that many secessionists on the island are trying to downplay the mainland's determination to reunify the island, as they believe the military deterrence from the mainland has existed for decades. They said the mainland dares not take real action, and 'with worsening China-US ties, many of them doubt that the mainland would attack, and even believe the US will let American soldiers fight and die for Taiwan separatism.'"

So as with the Zionists, the Taiwanese will resist to the last American soldier. The Outlaw US Empire thinks it can just grab Belarus without repercussions. Taiwan is Chinese territory, so it has no claim to defending its sovereignty if China flies its jets over the island. And if Taiwan shoots at one with its air defense forces, that will be the end of Taiwan and there's zero Trump can do to stop China from reclaiming its land.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 16:56 utc | 21

Passer by @2--

I took care of my Alzheimer's afflicted mother over many years until her final demise and greatly empathize with your situation. Do what you can to make certain she knows your love for her so she can use it as strength to get through her ordeal. Yes, it's a very difficult trial, but at least you're facing up to it instead of abandoning her as so many do nowadays. My Best Wishes for you both!!!!!

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 17:03 utc | 22

More indications that T-cells are what matters: Fauci notes study on why many people don't even show coronavirus symptoms

Another affirmation of what Volchkov said well over a month ago.

“One of the things that I don’t think has been emphasized very much at all during the attempt to address, scientifically, the COVID-19 outbreak, and vaccine development and testing, is that we’ve been focusing very exclusively on the antibody test,” Fauci told McClatchy in a recent interview. “There’s another equally important component of the immune system.”

The study, funded by the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases which Fauci heads, is one of the first to identify T cell “cross reactivity” in individuals who have previously been exposed to one of the four endemic coronavirus strains, SARS or MERS.

Cells known as “T cells,” which originate in the thymus, serve as a secondary line of defense in the immune system once antibodies have failed or faded away.

“If you look at it metaphorically as an army with different levels of defense, the antibodies prevent the virus from getting in. So that’s kind of like the first line of defense,” Fauci explained. “For those viruses that do escape and infect some cells, the T cells come in and kill the cells that are infected or block them.”

The T cells of individuals who took part in the study recognized the novel coronavirus when it was introduced to their immune systems for the first time.

Posted by: c1ue | Aug 13 2020 17:13 utc | 23

"UPRISING: Immunity for Police Under Attack by Federal Judge":

Outstanding article dealing with the unconstitutional judicially contrived "doctrine" known as qualified immunity which is at the root of the BLM protests. I urge those barflies residing within the Outlaw US Empire to read the article and the judge's opinion upon which it's based--Yes, it's that important--and do spread it around to all you know, particularly Trump supporters as this "doctrine" ruins their Bill of Rights just as much as everyone else's. Just as with the sneak attack allowing corporations to be allowed the same rights as people, this "doctrine" destroys natural law, which is its primary purpose.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 17:32 utc | 24

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 16:56 utc | 21

China taking the island by force would solve the semiconductor issue plaguing the mainland. It might even be cheaper than dropping billions into the tech industry. The United States would be at a severe disadvantage since TMSC is the world's semiconductor manufacturer, there's really no replacement.

Posted by: One Too Many | Aug 13 2020 17:35 utc | 25

An Air Force helicopter was forced to make an emergency landing at a Virginia airport Monday after someone shot at it, injuring a member of the crew, local and military officials told McClatchy.

The UH-1N Huey helicopter is assigned to the 1st Helicopter Squadron at Joint Base Andrews. It was flying about 1,000 feet off the ground, about 10 miles northwest of Manassas Regional Airport when the incident occurred, the Air Force said in a statement.

The injured crew member, who was not identified, was treated at a hospital and released.

“Initial findings are that the helicopter was struck by a bullet resulting in a minor injury to an aircrew member and damage to the aircraft,” the Air Force said.

The Federal Bureau of Investigation is looking into the incident.

Posted by: Mao | Aug 13 2020 17:46 utc | 26

Head of the Snake - Wexner, Maxwell’s, Mossad & Mega Group Exposed

Posted by: Mao | Aug 13 2020 17:49 utc | 27

Posted by: Oui | Aug 13 2020 15:56 utc | 13
((IRIS) website, which aggregates information from global seismographic research institutions. [Location: Washington DC] )

Is Seismography an exclusively Western (NeoLiberal Capitalist) science? If it is then IRIS can conceal facts. If it's not then every seismic monitoring station on Earth will have a record coinciding with the time of the Beirut blast. Since such records are not Top Secret Stuff, it should be possible, theoretically, to request a seismic record from ANY country. Imo.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 13 2020 17:50 utc | 28

The Russian Interference Report, Without Laughing

Now the madding crowd has moved on, I take a mature look at the report by the Intelligence and Security Committee on Russia. It is so flawed it is tempting simply to mock it. But in fact, it is extremely dangerous.

Posted by: Mao | Aug 13 2020 18:02 utc | 29

re: taiwan

yes, while current Taiwan govt tiptoeing toward what state dept probably hopes will be a US presence.
Calls to increase defense etc [SCMP].

Although Taiwan is actually doing quite well from both sides, record chip exports this year, other industry to benefit from US "decoupling" efforts. Not sure what's in it for them to escalate any further, since Chinese retaliation would have to be economic as far as Taiwan is concerned.

Posted by: ptb | Aug 13 2020 18:04 utc | 30


Can the mainland take Taiwan without killing any Americans? Or has the USM embedded itself in such a way that this would be impossible? Such a move by the mainland, should it be successful, would be directly crossing over into a world where US projection of military would have been shown to be completely impotent. I cannot conceive of a military response by the US that could be both proportional and effective in changing the outcome, so what would the rabid dog do? Loss of face would be catastrophic to the current 'world order'. They could threaten to nuke a Chinese city and say that any retaliatory move would be considered an act of war... "Withdraw or we will..." Nuclear chicken.

Posted by: the pessimist | Aug 13 2020 18:08 utc | 31

Continuing on from the alleged Greek "attacks" on a civilian vessel' which the Greek coastguard claims were only warning shots and no damage was done nor wounded incurred, Erdogan has now "warned of a "heavy price" if a Turkish vessel searching for oil and gas in disputed Mediterranean waters was attacked and hinted that one incident had already occurred."

Given Turkey's recent history of false flags and 'managed' events, I was sceptical when I read about 'Greece's attack' yesterday. Now it makes sense as Turkey preparing ground for a possible false flag situation. Let's not forget that Turkey's actions at sea have long been extremely provocative and seem often designed to force a 'situation'. The Greeks - and now the French too - need to be exceptionally patient and surefooted in any action they take as a trap is being set it seems.

Posted by: AtaBrit | Aug 13 2020 18:20 utc | 32

the pessimist @31--

When Nixon agreed to the One China Policy, that spelled the end of any hopes for Taiwanese independence from a mainland its been part of, aside from Colonization, for almost all of its history. That policy entails recognizing China has 100% sovereignty over Taiwan. End of game really. The mainland's policy of slow, peaceful unification hasn't really been challenged until now. As the editorial stated, China's people aren't afraid of war and are confident they'll win, and presumably they've considered the possibility of an attempt at nuclear blackmail by the Outlaw US Empire and factored that into their calculations. No General Officer within the Outlaw US Empire would risk nuclear war over Taiwan, no matter the bluster of a Pompeo or Trump, as China will retaliate with its own nukes, and perhaps Russia as well since they're Strategic Partners. Thus, the Chinese Military's confidence.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 18:27 utc | 33

Is France preparing for strikes against Hezbollah?

France Deploys Jets, Warship To East Mediterranean Amid Turkey Gas Tensions

Anyone recall how France said nothing about Turkey's support for ISIS even after France was the subject of terrorist attacks?

Supposed Greek-Turk tensions make a good cover for assembling a strike force.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 13 2020 18:32 utc | 34

Posted by: One Too Many | Aug 13 2020 17:35 utc | 25
Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 16:56 utc | 21

You're pretty smart, aren't you, piece of cake right? "taking the island by force". It's a continuation China unfinished civil war when KMT crossed into Taiwan and pockets of KMT's forces in the western China crosses into Burma or Myanmar, just as Trump wanted. No need for USA face off the immense Chinese or commie forces. Let the Freedom fighters and democracy forces in Taiwan do it. USA, 5eyes will support Taiwanese included Japan and the coalition of the willing SEA nations, NATO and India. They will supports Taiwan and Sell all or any weapons needed to win the civil war. I guess another Marshall plan.

Another, if you are unaware even if USA invades China, USA can never, never win! China had repeatedly said China will not fire the first shot it was repeated yesterday in Global Time, CGTN or XinHua News.

I hope I read Reuters correctly: "MOSCOW (Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin said on Thursday that Moscow would regard a nuclear attack on its allies as a nuclear attack on Russia itself and would immediately respond.". WORLD NEWS, MARCH 1, 2018 / 3:15 AM / 2 YEARS AGO

Posted by: JC | Aug 13 2020 18:36 utc | 35

Kamala Harris was the obvious choice for Biden since the Democratic party is still under the thumb of the Clintonistas who had put their support behind Harris. The Center for a New American Security is a Clintonista foreign policy neocon think tank which had put their people into Kamala's campaign. Ever wonder why Hillary went after Tulsi during the campaign? It was probably over Kamala being ousted from the campaign by Tulsi. So it was a no-brainer that she would be chosen as VP since the original plan was a Kamala/Hillary ticket. It still might be. Joe is not well and the corona virus may be used as an excuse for him to retire and then give the ticket to Kamala, which is what the Dem oligarchs wanted in the first place. They like Joe but they fear he cannot beat Trump.

Of course the media will say nothing about any of this because they like to have jobs. Don't be surprised if supposedly Joe gets the coronavirus and drops out with Kamala being coronated.

Posted by: Kali | Aug 13 2020 18:38 utc | 36

Oui @13.. congratulations! you found the open thread where you can continue to hammer on the same nail!!!

Posted by: james | Aug 13 2020 18:40 utc | 37


"No General Officer within the Outlaw US Empire would risk nuclear war over Taiwan,..."

We can hope this is the case. A wise leader would not push the mainland into a confrontation in which the possible consequences of escalation are so dire and in which the consequences of defeat would be so severe for the US if it failed to respond in some way - over someone else's territory. Yet the high level diplomatic visit and announced arms sale seem to suggest otherwise. Plus the attempt to steal TikTok, the sanctions against Huahei, the attempt to extradite the daughter of the founder, and on and on.

They tried this with Russia and it didn't work, but they seem to have learned nothing - well, they have slowed Russia's development of trade with Europe, and cost it something economically, but these short term roadblocks have only spurred Russia to develop more independence.

This kind of poker is extremely risky.

Posted by: the pessimist | Aug 13 2020 18:53 utc | 38

Hoarsewhisperer @28

Presumably it was only a series of seismometers on the floor of the eastern Mediterranean that were close enough to pick up the disturbances. The disturbances were not detected by more distant seismometers.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 13 2020 18:58 utc | 39

Posted by: the pessimist @31, ptb@30

"Calls to increase defense etc [SCMP]."

When reading SCMP articles it's mostly Taiwan bias... SCMP speaks well of Taiwan and US of A. Both SCMP Exec. vice Chairman and CEO Gary Liu are Taiwanese with reporters (spies) planted in various Chinese cities and the world. It's another Walls Street Journal. Washington Post etc... Please check the reporter where posted, Gweilo, Chinese or ethnicity.

"Can the mainland takes Taiwan without killing any Americans?" Rubbish questions! Maybe if you pray hard enough, with god everything is possible! The only way to destroy China killing the least Americans - another Civil war let the Chinese kills each other while the Americans sell more weapons and sit on the sideline cheering for the Taiwanese. BTW not all Taiwanese are anti China there are many pro mainlanders or “We are all Chinese” in Taiwan and in US of A and worldwide too

"I cannot conceive of a military response....... Loss of face would be catastrophic to the current 'world order'. They could threaten to nuke a Chinese city and ....... "Withdraw or we will..." Nuclear chicken."

Anything is possible with the current regime in the WH. Let me assure you China will never fire the first shot she has less than 400 nuclear warheads and the USA produced more than 70,000 nuclear warheads.

Posted by: JC | Aug 13 2020 19:29 utc | 40

@Jackrabbit | 34
Interesting take.
I just thought France was protecting Total's interests when standing by Egypt and Greece/ Cyprus. ))

Given that Cavusoglu was in Lebanon at the same time as Macron and their 'role' as you contend in the Greece-Turkey spat, the implication is that Turkey is also collusive in any action against Hezbollah and therefore against Sunni Diab. Guess you are thinking Partition?

Posted by: AtaBrit | Aug 13 2020 19:36 utc | 41

For those not locked into TDS or multi-culti cultism:
A long article concerning Trumpism vs. Republican Party vs. Democrat Party
The Case for Trump by Michael Anton

We see immediately, however, that no party representing the interests of the rural, small-town and small-city manufacturing-agricultural population currently exists. The Democrats long ago abandoned “the common man” in favor of their high-low coalition. The Republicans would seem to be the country party—certainly, they get a lot of their votes from such people—but in practice GOP office-holders and donors are just as, if not more, likely to side with the interests of the ruling class and “global capital” over those of their own ostensible base.

What’s needed, then, is a Trumpist political party focused squarely on “old economy”—rural, manufacturing, and blue-collar interests. Which means, in most if not all cases, a party actively opposed to the program of the ruling class. If the Republican Party can become that, all to the good. If it can’t, it should go out of business.


Let’s also be clear that saving the Republican Party will require, in no small measure, moving it to the left economically. Note well: moving it leftward, not making it a leftwing party. A Trumpist party—whether Republican or something else—will still be the party of property rights and of basic economic freedom, and will be the party opposed to “reparations” and other forms of unjust redistribution and expropriation. But it will be a party much friendlier to the interests of workers: the party of tight labor markets and rising wages, of reasonable worker safety and environmental regulations, of far-sighted government spending on infrastructure, and, above all, of industrial and trade policies that favor and encourage domestic manufacturing. Republican free-trade, low-tax, no-regulation dogma stopped serving the interests of at least half of the Republican voting base decades ago. The wing of the party that still sings from that hymnal today is nothing but a controlled-opposition adjunct of the ruling class. Its dogma will have to be smashed.

Posted by: c1ue | Aug 13 2020 19:40 utc | 42

JC | Aug 13 2020 18:36 utc | 35: "They will supports Taiwan and Sell all or any weapons needed to win the civil war."

I am not so sure a resumption of the civil war would last long enough for the capitalist forces to get more than a couple phone calls in, much less any major arms shipments. Taiwan has no real strategic depth against the mainland anymore. Figure that the mainland likely has every piece of military hardware on the entire island targeted already and can take out everything right down to the ROC Army's portable toilets in the first half hour of any renewed combat. Within a couple hours of the first sign of the conflict the mainlanders would have Taiwan's airports and seaports secured, so where would any arms shipments go? The eastern side of Taiwan is mostly just little fishing villages and rough terrain... not good beachhead territory if the US wants to stage a landing. The US would have to send warships into the Strait to do anything at all, and they would be annihilated there. All the US could do is provide a little air support, and it would be a very little air support because China's anti-ship missiles have a longer range than America's attack aircraft. It's bad tactics to send your stealth aircraft in when they won't have a carrier to land on when they've finished their mission. Basically, America's air support would be suicide missions, even if they avoid being shot down.

Realistically, if it comes down to a fight, it will be a short one.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 13 2020 19:43 utc | 43

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 13 2020 19:43 utc | 43

Excellent comments but humbly disagrees, will reply in full after finished my comments karlof1 @33.. be patience please. :-)

Posted by: JC | Aug 13 2020 19:59 utc | 44

Passer-by. Both you and your mother have our sympathy as she prepares for her operation. I look forward to learning that all went well. Solidarity.

An interesting idea: the Republicans returning to their American System, isolationist roots. Leaving the Democrats to their globalist fantasies. It would certainly make sense both as an alternative to warmongering, a graceful way of greeting the inevitable multi-polarity, and in terms of domestic economic policy.
The problem is that both parties are wedded to the arms economy and the need for constant international tension and the vast budgets for Defense. And a tax system which continually transfers wealth from the bottom to the top.

Posted by: bevin | Aug 13 2020 20:13 utc | 45

Passer-by @ 2:

Wishing you and your mother well during her operation. Hope all goes safely then and afterwards.

Posted by: Jen | Aug 13 2020 20:26 utc | 46

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 13 2020 18:27 utc | 33

Wish we can have a cop of coffee or tea together and share our stories and my wishes... I'm too old to travel, Not here. My dad left behind an oral archived, he loved America and wished to study in the USA like many Chinese past and present. The last KMT president met Xi Jinping in Singapore starts the "buried the hatches." It was indeed an extremely cruel and brutal civil war before it ended stalemate and the Japanese occupied a vast track of lands and cities in Asia. Yes almost every day, weeks, months since 2017 never ending bashing and sanctions. How can anyone or nations stand it? I guess Syria, Russia, Cuba, N Korea, Iran, Venezuela and few other’s nation faces the same cruelty from US of A.

But China is not like other nations or even Russia. China had the mean, population and resources to face head-on US of A. She kept repeatedly said no one wins in "any" (trade) war. “Work with China to manage differences on the basis of equality and mutual respect

Posted by: JC | Aug 13 2020 20:27 utc | 47

@Passer-by | 2
Best of luck to you and your mum.

Posted by: AtaBrit | Aug 13 2020 20:34 utc | 48

@Posted by: Passer by | Aug 13 2020 14:36 utc | 2

I do not know how old your mother is, but, will to live is ( although kind of unscientific...) a must in medicine..
Even in centenaries, it has been observed that strenght of nature...

Since people posting here are usually elders, I discard your deep love for her... as the wish to keep her alive beside you is obvious, which is an added plus, as she for sure feels it...Also, as I have witnessed, mothers who are much needed by theri families strongly resist to leave...even when old enough...

All will go well.

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Aug 13 2020 20:36 utc | 49

A prayer for your Mum, passerby:

Heavenly King, Comforter, Spirit of Truth
Who art everywhere present and fillest all things;
Treasury of blessings and Giver of life,
Come and abide in us,
Cleanse us from every impurity,
And save our souls, O Good One.

Blessings on your family.

Posted by: juliania | Aug 13 2020 20:45 utc | 50

@bevin #45
I would suggest that you read the full article.
Among other things - it distinguishes Trumpism from both the Republican and Democrat parties.
I'd like to think even the most TDS would recognize that the executive core and primary sponsors of the Republican party hate Trump worse, if anything, than the Democrats do.
Nor can I disagree with the Democrat "high and low" strategy which Anton describes.
The point being: the "American" system isn't so much about mercantilism as it is about returning focus to the "small city, small mercantile/agricultural" enterprises.

Posted by: c1ue | Aug 13 2020 20:53 utc | 51

vk@4 mentions the New Zealand recurrence of covid 19. This from the New Zealand Herald today:

"...Three of the new cases were employees at coolstore Americold, where one of Tuesday's cases also worked. Seven were family members of these employees...

This reminded me of the Beijing outbreak, which had a connection to the shipment of frozen fish, so I am wondering if that could have been the source again. So far it seems the traced infections come from this source.

Posted by: juliania | Aug 13 2020 21:16 utc | 52

Posted by: Passer by | Aug 13 2020 14:36 utc | 2

I'd like to wish your mum all the very best for the op'.
Hope the recovery goes well too.
I'll say a prayer for her.
Kind regards,

Posted by: Jon_in_AU | Aug 13 2020 21:35 utc | 53

Meanwhile, the Trump regime commits itself to piracy on the high seas, grabbing the oil.

WSJ: U.S. Seizes Iranian Fuel Cargoes for First Time

Posted by: Lurk | Aug 13 2020 23:01 utc | 54

@ juliania... i have good or bad news for you depending on how you take it!! here is an apparent sequel to tinker, tailor, soldier, spy!!

smiley's people -

Posted by: james | Aug 13 2020 23:08 utc | 55

@ Lurk | Aug 13 2020 23:01 utc | 54.. that is an interesting development... i can't see it working out.. thanks for pointing it out...

no mention on the iran news outlets yet...

Posted by: james | Aug 13 2020 23:20 utc | 56

@ juliania.. apparently the link i gave @55 has been edited some... i got this from reading the comments...

here is the unedited bbc version...

Posted by: james | Aug 13 2020 23:51 utc | 57

@ passer by 2,

best wishes for your mom from NZ.

Posted by: Paul | Aug 13 2020 23:58 utc | 58

Looks like we're in for another repeat of the Stena Impera/Grace-I fandango:

"The Trump administration has reportedly confiscated four Iranian cargo ships believed to be carrying fuel in violation of US sanctions. The US seized the four ships without using military force in recent days as tensions have risen between the White House and Tehran, the Wall Street Journal reported. The vessels — named the Bering, Bella, Luna and Pandi — are currently rerouted, heading to Houston, where White House officials will await their arrival, sources told the paper."


Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 14 2020 0:17 utc | 59

It appears that the resurgence of the Covid 19 virus in New Zealand is linked to importing frozen food as now there are many cases linked to the logistics company Americold :

Beware of frozen food, unless you do it yourself.

Posted by: Paul | Aug 14 2020 0:26 utc | 60

@ arch... lurk shared a link to wsj with same @54... we'll see where it goes and if it is legit...

i am curious... does anyone think biden and trump could compete based on mandated masks, verses not?? it seems to be one area where they clearly differ... how would that pan out in terms of votes? anyone have any ideas??

Posted by: james | Aug 14 2020 0:27 utc | 61

There is a name for hijacking vessels exercising the right of innocent passage on the high seas: piracy.

@ karlof1 is right, it is indeed the "outlaw American empire."

Who would want to be an ally of this grotesque gang?

Posted by: Paul | Aug 14 2020 0:48 utc | 62

"A top U.S. diplomat said on Thursday the FBI would join a probe of the massive Beirut explosion that killed at least 172 people, urging change in Lebanon to “make sure something like this never happens again”."
“The FBI will soon join Lebanese and international investigators at the invitation of the Lebanese to help answer questions about the circumstances that led up to this explosion,” Hale said on Thursday."

A lot of politicians and bureaucrats in Lebanon will be out to save their butts. US will have a lot of malleable material to work with there.

"At this stage of the investigation, no hypothesis can be ruled out as to the intentional or accidental nature of the explosion, but criminal negligence seems to be proven in all cases.
An impartial investigation must identify and severely punish all the culprits, and break with the traditional sectarianism of the judicial system which judges people according to their political and religious affiliation; without a fair & transparent trial and full accountability, Lebanon will always be a failed State"

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 0:51 utc | 63

AtaBrit @Aug13 19:36 #41

Guess you are thinking Partition?

I don't think Israel and it's Western allies would be satisfied with Partition. Partition means the Hezbollah threat to Israel remains.

I think they want to expel Hezbollah from Lebanon. The war against Hezbollah may have already begun with the Beirut explosion.

It would mean civil war. Which would quickly become a new front in the proxy war against Syria.

<> <> <> <> <> <>

Hezbollah has prepared a great deterrence against an Israeli attack. But what good is that deterrence if it is not Israel that attacks but a Lebanese government that is allied with Western countries (France mostly but possibly also US/UK)? Naturally, this would be justified as being for the good of the people of Lebanon(tm) because it will satisfy Western blackmailers: Western governments will not provide aid to Lebanon or (more importantly) commercial opportunities to Lebanese oligarchs unless they expel Hezbollah.

So I take a cynical view of France re-positioning warplanes. Especially since French leaders have proven so many times how willing they are to do the bidding of Washtington and Israel. My prime example is that France wouldn't take action against Turkey when France was attacked despite knowing that NATO ally Turkey was the transit point for foreign fighters joining ISIS.

To think that Macron might take action over Turkey's exploratory drilling is naive. Re-positioning for action against Hezbollah seems much more likely.

Just my thoughts. I don't have a crystal ball.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 1:31 utc | 64

There is a posting at ZH titled

Trump Admin Designates Confucius Institute As Communist China Foreign Mission

All those pissed TikTok users just found an outlet for their curiosity about China....well played Trump.....speed the socialist centered social organization assimilation process

Posted by: psychohistorian | Aug 14 2020 1:34 utc | 65

This comment is from a retired USAF colonel on Afghanistan exit on Linkedin:

Jonathan Arnold
Retired Colonel, US Air Force, Cyber Defense and National Security policy specialist.

Retreat is always an option. Just declare victory and leave, just like Alexander the Great did in 329 BCE.

By the way, the Crusaders were “true” Catholics, go read Prof Riley’s many books about the Crusades.

We’ve wasted enough blood and treasure on those worthless people. Just think, if we had “nuked ‘em ‘til they glow” look how many problems we would have solved and have new problems to deal with for a change.

Posted by: hittheground | Aug 14 2020 2:11 utc | 66

Jackrabbit | Aug 13 2020 16:13 utc | 15:

It's too bad no one is doing anything about it.

james | Aug 13 2020 23:20 utc | 56:

It's now posted on PressTV. US seizes Iranian fuel cargoes for first time: WSJ The problem I have is why give the WSJ the time of day.

BUT, teleSUR, AMN, and MEMO have yet to report this.

Posted by: Ian2 | Aug 14 2020 2:18 utc | 67

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 1:31 utc | 64

I don't think Israel and it's Western allies would be satisfied with Partition. Partition means the Hezbollah threat to Israel remains.

For a paranoid state even the ghost of Hezbollah will continue to terrify if they ever manage to remove them.

I think they want to expel Hezbollah from Lebanon. The war against Hezbollah may have already begun with the Beirut explosion.

A quibble: "The war against Hezbollah may have already begun with the Beirut explosion." ... I think the war against Hezbollah began decades ago, at least prior to 2006. I think you mean "the latest campaign"

Any military intervention in order to remove Hezbollah will result in a replay of the Lebanese civil war ... exactly the kind of environment organisations like Hezbollah and Amal emerged from. The west needs to remember that a large section of the Lebanese population is Shiite.

My predictions:

- If indeed the US and allies do intervene militarily in Lebanon we will see an exact replay of the 70s-80s, with organisations even more extreme than Hizbullah emerging from the result.
- Therefore there will be no intervention.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 14 2020 2:21 utc | 68

Posted by: hittheground | Aug 14 2020 2:11 utc | 66

Retired USAF Colonel

He certainly doesn't get that high up without being a risk adverse yes-man while in service, and he also certainly offers differing opinions only when he gets his guaranteed fat pensions without a consultancy position in the MIC.

Just another day in the American culture of cowardice.

Posted by: J W | Aug 14 2020 2:36 utc | 69

Ian2 67

This is perhaps the main information in the Press TV piece.

"Meanwhile, Iranian ambassador to Venezuela Hojat Soltani has dismissed the report as another "lie" and “psychological warfare” by the United States.

He tweeted that “neither the vessels are Iranian, nor their owners or flags are related to Iran.”"

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 3:07 utc | 70

The verdict on the 2005 murder of former Lebanese premier Rafic Hariri was delayed until August 18.

I suspect that Hezbollah will be implicated. And the latest campaign against Hezbollah will intensify.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 3:09 utc | 71

Peter AU1 @Aug14 3:07 #70

He tweeted that “neither the vessels are Iranian, nor their owners or flags are related to Iran.”"

That only means that Iran has no cause to retaliate.

But the ships were seized because they carried Iranian oil. And that's likely to make it nearly impossible for Iran to entice ships to carry their oil in the future.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 3:15 utc | 72

So now Reuters has a posting about the ships titled

Ship owners sailing four Iranian fuel cargoes to U.S. for seizure
The take away quote
U.S. prosecutors filed a lawsuit in July to seize the gasoline aboard the four tankers, and a judge subsequently issued a warrant for seizure. The fuel cannot be seized until the tankers enter U.S. territorial waters.

The owners of the four vessels agreed to have them sail to the United States after talks with the U.S. government, the sources said. The warrant only covers the cargoes aboard the Liberia-flagged Bella, Bering, Pandi and Luna, not the vessels.
Might-makes-right continues to work until it doesn't. I hope that point comes soon.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Aug 14 2020 3:19 utc | 73

Yale University discriminated against Asian-American and white applicants, according to the Justice Department, which issued its findings nearly two years after opening an investigation into the school’s admissions practices

Posted by: Mao | Aug 14 2020 3:22 utc | 74

Who would have thought that Prince Peter Kropotkin was a stooge for Perfidious Albion after all these years.

That City of London crowd sure are a global menace. Just like those Venetians used to be in the 1500's

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Aug 14 2020 3:40 utc | 75

@ Ian2 | Aug 14 2020 2:18 utc | 67.. it was first posted by lurk @54 via the wsj... not sure why we give wsj any heed, other then some of it looks legit.. press tv will be better for this kind of thing...

@ 72 jackrabbit quote - "But the ships were seized because they carried Iranian oil. And that's likely to make it nearly impossible for Iran to entice ships to carry their oil in the future." i am not so sure about that... china?? does china own any ships?? this bully tactic of the usa only goes so far and of course makes it out to be a tyrant on the world stage, which probably is fine with pompass.... just remember.. i hate the usa for all its freedom.. it couldn't be anything else!!

Posted by: james | Aug 14 2020 3:49 utc | 76

bears repeating - usa law is not applicable to the rest of the world... not sure when the usa figures that one out...

Posted by: james | Aug 14 2020 3:50 utc | 77


Iran has a tanker company but I think they only have oil tankers.

The shipments to Venezuela are gas because AFAIK, Venezuela doesn't have the ability to refine oil in quantity. I don't think gas can be transported by oil. I suppose that's why they're using 3rd parties to transport it.

Maybe Iran's tanker company will build some gas tankers now (or have been doing so?). But Venezuela probably needs gas asap.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 4:35 utc | 78

Sounds like the ships captains were bribed to take the oil to US rather than Venezuela.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 4:37 utc | 79

Taiwan is already separate from China. Its totally independent. More so since its not caught up in the UN/WHO umbrella. This is why we have escaped the COVID madness seen elsewhere.

I personally am alarmed at US attempts to create friction with China using Taiwan. Azars visit was an ominous sign that Taiwan might become the next Poland

Nobody here is under any illusion China could conquer the island quickly. But what to do once thats done. Occupation is far challenging . You can be sure that TSMC will not be left to fall into Chinas hands should they invade.

The US will not intervene militarily to save Taiwan, but they can make sure there will be no valuables left for China to take. Its not like Taiwan is rich in natural resources. Taiwan is far more valuable to China as an independent nation while giving them the illusion its not. When reality breaks in on the illusion China panics a bit and barks, but barking dogs don’t bite.

Taiwan must take care not to trust the US too much. Many former friends of the US have learned the hard way that they will turn on you quickly if it suits them. They already learned that lesson when the US withheld arms after WWII allowing the communist victory over KMT, and in the 70’s when they turned their back on Taiwan.
Other than Israel and London, and the Globalists, the US is loyal to none

Its a tight rope Taiwan must walk, dealing with the beast across the straight and the American Imperialists. They have done it quite well for over 40 years. One of the last few remaining Democracies left standing.
The trick is in keeping it. Anti-Democratic tendencies are like a virus in the Fake Democracies of the West. Most don't even realize they are infected.

Posted by: Kay Fabe | Aug 14 2020 4:49 utc | 80


Gas and gas? Here the stuff that comes in pressure vessels is called gas and the stuff we pump into our car is called petrol.

I'm not sure that there is a difference for carrying crude or refined petrol or as its called gasoline in the US. Both can be quite volatile, from something I have read in the past, crude may have a lower flash point.
Some of the volatiles are removed from crude before shipping but I'm not sure that includes petrol.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 4:51 utc | 81

Peter AU1

Yeah, sorry. Here in the States" we call petrol "gas".


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 4:56 utc | 82

Kay Fabe

I suspect US would like to see China take Taiwan. US would then use this to turn Europe and Asia pacific against China.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 4:58 utc | 83

Peter AU 1 @83--

ASEAN nations are key in this scenario. Their views on the issue are really unknown to me, but they are tight with China and expect to go places with BRI. The world's workshop is now mostly within Asia and it won't be leaving for Africa anytime soon. The USA and its Empire are dying--centrifugal forces are at work. But then, history works that way!

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 14 2020 5:17 utc | 84


I liked this one from Caitlin: Don’t. Side. With. The. Powerful.

Learn to see clearly where the power is, and refuse to side with it. Expunge the “What did you expect?” mind virus from your system and you’ll be doing all of humanity a big favor.

I find that many westerners (esp. Whites) suffer from Stockholm Syndrome. They give the powerful the benefit of the doubt and feel concern for the welfare of their leaders who are not actually working for the people but for the oligarchs.

Example: Someone told me how concerned they were for Trump and his family when a secret service agent interrupted a news conference. WTF!?!?

I explained that if they had any brains their first thought would be for their own family instead of Trump and HIS family. Trump's belligerence has led to Russia's recent warning that any missile fired at Russia would be considered a nuclear attack. And Trump's disregard for US citizens is clear by his allowing coronavirus to spread in USA to further neoliberal and foreign policy agendas.

Sadly, I find that logic often doesn't matter to these dunderheads that WANT to identify with the power-elite asshats. They are simply drawn there like flies to shit.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 14 2020 5:24 utc | 85


Perhaps much depends on who ASEAN sees as coming out top dog? At the moment, none are burning bridges.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 14 2020 5:37 utc | 86

Kay Fabe #80

Taiwan is China, no doubt about it. It has been hoarding stolen Chinese antiquities and national treasures since the renegade royalist KMT retreated there after their defeat by the patriotic Chinese people. There are war criminals and traitors and their stolen Chinese gold there still. All should be repatriated so that the residents of that island can get on with a decent life unmolested by UKUSAI.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Aug 14 2020 6:56 utc | 87

Meanwhile, the Trump regime commits itself to piracy on the high seas, grabbing the oil.

WSJ: U.S. Seizes Iranian Fuel Cargoes for First Time

Posted by: Lurk | Aug 13 2020 23:01 utc | 54

As 5 eyes and friends continue to bitch and moan about South China Sea and FONOPs, the only state actor that has proven to be the pirate and stripping the world of FON is USA.

If this is not a great reason for China to continue to do what it is doing to secure its trade routes, I don't know what is.

Well done USA for vindicating China! Bravo!

Posted by: A.L. | Aug 14 2020 7:01 utc | 88

Paul #62

There is a name for hijacking vessels exercising the right of innocent passage on the high seas: piracy.

@ karlof1 is right, it is indeed the "outlaw American empire."

Who would want to be an ally of this grotesque gang?

Thank you Paul and I see the USA is still exporting Fort Detrick virus. First to the Military Games as athletes in Wuhan and now to New Zealand as frozen meat.

Who would buy any product from this country. BDS USA

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Aug 14 2020 7:04 utc | 89

I disagree with your assessment. As you say, Israel and the UAE had been having close contacts already for years. If Israel wanted to it probably could have formalised the relationship already a while ago. However, Israelis don`t believe in international law. Israel would never try to attain something officially, in a legally binding manner which Israel already got in a shady back door agreement.

No, the original plan had been to annex the West Bank and to push for it`s international recognition, like with the Golan Heights and Jerusalem before. The rest of the world made then clear that transforming Israel officially into an apartheid state is unacceptable and would this time not be answered with just some empty diplomatic protests. In particular Jordan and the European countries were ready to severe ties. When Netanyahu realised this he phoned his friend the Prince of Dhubai and asked him for a favour. Now "the magician" can drop the annexion plans in a face-saving manner and at the same time present his buddy Trump to the American public as a peace maker.

Posted by: m | Aug 14 2020 8:43 utc | 90

Hello uncle tungsten,

I understand your point and the historical context, we both have long memories , sort of.

Don't buy frozen food from the supermarket, especially in Victoria. I'm guessing you are from OZ.

NZ has it all together. Vote yes and yes at the coming referendum.

Posted by: Paul | Aug 14 2020 8:47 utc | 91

juliania | Aug 13 2020 21:16 utc | 52

It is almost certain that the virus crept into Aotearoa on the surface of some box or carcass transported and warehoused by Americold who claim to be the largest cold storage logistics corporation on the planet.
Not only was the original case employed at Americold, 4 other employees have been discovered to have covid.
Since that first case the dept of health has been aggressively testing everyone with connections to the original whanau but have thus far been unable to discover anyone further up the chain of infection, despite over the last few days the genome of the coronavirus has been analysed and yet has not uncovered any similar variant of the virus among all of the thousands of returnees, tested for covid on arrival in Aotearoa, then twice more during their compulsory quarantine, or the original cases in the first wave.

The government has been reluctant to accept ,much less publicise the fact that this could have been the mode of transmission because they are concerned not to provoke a kneejerk reaction from other nations blacklisting Aotearoa primary produce, the biggest export earner, especially since tourism (second largest) is now non-existent.

Silly really, because if the first person infected is indeed the index infectee, tracking and tracing all carrying covid will happen a lot quicker once the government can point at the source of the infection, a pallet of frozen pork ribs imported from the US.

If that is indeed the source of the infection a notion which was further buttressed today by the news that a General Practioner whose surgery is close by Americold :

" Government officials are reportedly stepping in ahead of an Auckland-Rarotonga flight tomorrow morning, after an Auckland-based Cook Island doctor tested positive for Covid-19.

It is understood the man's Auckland surgery is close to Americold - the cold storage business caught up in the latest Covid-19 cluster, 1 News reported.

The father of the family at the centre of the new Auckland Covid-19 cluster works at Americold."

If cold store transmission is a fact, the very foundations of globalism must be queried.

There could have been many transmissions of the coronavirus via 'cold store logistics' previously but the source wasn't uncovered because that city or nation already had community transmission of the virus. Aotearoa had been free of all virus transmission for more than 3 months until these cases which as I wrote, have no commonality with any previous cases in Aotearoa were uncovered.

IOW if refrigerated products are an acknowledged vector of covid 19 transmission those out of season fruits, imported cuts of meat, and latin american floral bouquets will be much less attractive to the consumerists.

Unless of course the world gets a good old fashioned cover up.
One only has to consider the rate which covid galloped through abbatoirs to deduce that the virus' ability to survive & transmit is greatly increased in a cold indoors environment.

Posted by: John Lee | Aug 14 2020 9:36 utc | 92

UAE did not announce "normalization" but "A roadmap to normalization". If the UAE is serious about the roadmap part, link palestians issues - ie jerusalem capital - then nothing will happen out of this and you guys all jumped on your complotists horses way too early.
The Saoudis have made such an offer back in 2000 and nothing got out of it.

Posted by: murgen23 | Aug 14 2020 9:50 utc | 93

Leave me breathless

Trump should this as his campaign song

Posted by: Noel Grannell | Aug 14 2020 10:11 utc | 94

This is what impartial news reporting looks like b.
I recommend your commentators look at the comments on this link ! And realise just how complacent and irelevent looks in comparison.
Germ warfare, Black Lives Matter, Lebanon —— must try harder.

Just compare the ‘Its A Wrap’ post to the above link. Compare the journalism and lack of opinionated bias.
Sorry b but the truth is the truth.
Thanks to those of you, who tried—— willy, citizens, Jack Rabbit and others.
Oh and b your it’s a wrap post is fake news with a fake welder photo ! Why is it still there ?

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 14 2020 12:41 utc | 95

Final humiliation for the anti-lockdown ideologues:

Total deaths from Covid / Q2 GDP contraction:

Sweden: 5,776 / -8.6%
Denmark: 621 / -7.4%
Finland: 333 / -3.2%

All the data are the official numbers, i.e. come directly from each country's government.

"Game over"

Posted by: vk | Aug 14 2020 14:02 utc | 96

If true, this can only escalate, those idiots in the US for sure didn't seize those ships just so they could release them to avoid angering Iran, and Iran can't afford to do nothing about it. This seems quite crazy and irresponsible, which is not surprising, but totally illegal too, which means little. How many US ships will be sailing past Hormuz before they get taken? It worked with the UK... i doubt it will work the same with Trump.

How will Iran respond Mr B.?

Posted by: Et Tu | Aug 14 2020 14:25 utc | 97

Brother Marandi says> "Seyed Mohammad Marandi
@s_m_marandi 6h Iranian tankers/fuel haven't been stolen by the US regime.
Just as western/Saudi reports about Hezbollah storing weapons in Beirut Port were fake, this was also a lie.
They lied about the port to hide the corruption of their allies & lied about tankers to compensate weakness."


The previous remarks in re the CV19 cold storage vector make sense...

Posted by: Walter | Aug 14 2020 14:28 utc | 98

"Meanwhile, Iranian ambassador to Venezuela Hojat Soltani has dismissed the report as another "lie" and “psychological warfare” by the United States.

He tweeted that “neither the vessels are Iranian, nor their owners or flags are related to Iran.”

The ships and the owners are not Iranian but perhaps the cargo comes from Iran.

Posted by: arby | Aug 14 2020 14:36 utc | 99

@ # 92 a thought

About vector CV19, maybe...

In 1952 when Chinese and Korean trains were bombed with germ agents and so forth the fellas twigged right away, and rigged up steam sterilization stations (steam locos and all) and moved the trains very slowly through the hot live steam...

Similarly, a germ agent needs a vector. A global distribution company...

Maybe that is a coincidence.

I shall treat everything from the store like one treats wild game...The first edition of "The Joy of Cooking" had good advice.

Posted by: Walter | Aug 14 2020 14:58 utc | 100

next page »

The comments to this entry are closed.