Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
August 27, 2020

'Mostly Peaceful' Rioting And Looting Is Helping Trump's Campaign

The Civil War of 2020 continues apace.



After three months of continuous clashes in Portland between Antifa rioters, who hide behind peaceful protests, and the police, the mayor is finally concerned about the damage:

Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler said Wednesday he hasn’t done enough to focus on damages caused by some city protests over the last three months and the fallout from coronavirus. He called on the community to help him come up with better solutions to city issues.

During the last months the Magnificent Mile in Chicago was looted - twice. Yesterday new riots and looting occurred in Minneapolis after a rumor of another police killing incited some people:

Police Chief Medaria Arradondo tried to dispel rumors that spread on social media about the death of the unidentified Black man, who was suspected in a Wednesday afternoon homicide and fatally shot himself on the Nicollet Mall as officers approached several hours later. His death, which was captured on city surveillance video and released by police within 90 minutes, nonetheless sparked protests and unrest in the heart of downtown.

The video confirmed the police account of what happened and showed the man glancing over his shoulder before pulling out the gun and firing, then collapsing to the ground as a half-dozen witnesses ran away with their hands in the air. The officers, one of whom had his gun drawn, shooed a remaining witness away and kicked the suspect’s gun away before performing chest compressions.

Last Sunday police in Kenosha, Wisconsin proved to be too incompetent to arrest a man they had already had under control. They shot him 7 times into the back when he was trying to get into his car. Nights of rioting followed. Buildings were burned down and businesses were looted.

Yesterday a white teen with a semi-automatic weapon had the stupid idea to join others in 'protecting the businesses' in Kenosha from further looting. He ended up killing two people and wounding more after he was attacked by some of the rioters. The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense.

The cycle of violence will likely continue. There are too many racist in the police and the level of U.S. police training seems to be abysmal. There is also too much tolerance for violence within the general community.

Politically this plays into Trump's law and order campaign. The Democrats have lauded Black Live Matters and the protests but have hardly spoken out against the rioting and looting that comes with them.

This CNN chyron from yesterday evening is an expression of their position:


'Mostly peaceful protests' are like the 'moderate rebels' in Syria - propaganda constructs that do not exist in the real world. The people who owned the burning cars and whose businesses were destroyed will not be relieved by such phrasing.

Joe Biden's attempt to swing Republican voters to his side has failed. At the same time he has rejected many of the issues progressives favored. This will hurt the election turn out the Democrats will need. Add to that the unrest which plays into Trump's hands. The Democrats who fear that are right:

“There’s no doubt it’s playing into Trump’s hands,” said Paul Soglin, who served as mayor of Madison, on and off, for more than two decades. “There’s a significant number of undecided voters who are not ideological, and they can move very easily from Republican to the Democratic column and back again. They are, in effect, the people who decide elections. And they are very distraught about both the horrendous carnage created by police officers in murdering African Americans, and ... for the safety of their communities.”

Trump, of course, is positioning himself as the antidote to urban unrest. "So let me be clear: The violence must stop, whether in Minneapolis, Portland or Kenosha," Vice President Mike Pence declared in his Republican convention speech Wednesday night, with Trump looking on. "We will have law and order on the streets of this country for every American of every race and creed and color."

Republicans had chided Joe Biden and other Democrats for not calling out the violence in the aftermath of the Blake shooting. Biden immediately addressed the shooting, but didn’t condemn the ensuing violence until Wednesday in a video posted on social media.

Despite Trump's failure to bring the pandemic under control his job approval rating continues to be high while Biden's lead in the polls is shrinking. The United States seem to have a higher tolerance for avoidable death by guns or viruses than other societies have. It is not the only point that makes it exceptional.

Posted by b on August 27, 2020 at 17:39 UTC | Permalink

next page »

thanks b... it really looks like an empire in fast decline.... i don't believe the usa constitution took into consideration the idea of corporations... also as you note - the tolerance for violence or death as with covid is indeed much greater... i guess more people have to have guns as it is in their constitution, and so much for public medicare... it is like a dream about public finance and somewhere way off in the distant future... i don't believe it is going to matter who wins this coming election, as the divisiveness is so pronounced, it will be hard to build bridges.. it seems like no one is interested in building bridges between the opposing sides either... all the politicians are mostly looking after corporations and special interest lobbies - israel and etc. etc... sad kettle of fish...

Posted by: james | Aug 27 2020 17:46 utc | 1

so is this:

Joe must be pretty far along with his dementia.

Posted by: Alaric | Aug 27 2020 17:55 utc | 2

In the elections of 1980 Ronald Reagan made good use of - how can I say - behavior out of the ¨middle amerika¨ mainstream (rowdy demonstrations, drug use, sexual freedom, and of course racial tolerance) to win over this contested segment of the voting public. It is happening again. The anger and frustration cannot be contained. As in 1980, the Republican apparatchiks are egging it on with more dirty tricks.

Posted by: c | Aug 27 2020 18:00 utc | 3

We’re gonna need a bigger basket of kente.

Posted by: oglalla | Aug 27 2020 18:03 utc | 4

Very fair analysis, I enjoyed this piece. You are absolutely right, the terrible training and general ineptitude of the police is at the core of the problem. The protesters recognize this and there are many salient examples to fuel the outrage. However, the solutions they call for don't address this root problem and alienate many moderate voters. Defund the police? This will make the police more responsible? The whole thing is a mess with no real solutions in sight.

In my opinion, the problem is the hiring and personnel practices in US police departments. Police officer is a critical job, you must often make snap judgments in tense situations, and you have the power to do violence to others. But police officers are paid similarly to car mechanics, not even as much as many private security guards! The most responsible and wise Americans do not become police officers, they pursue other careers where their talents are better rewarded. Then, if a great person makes it into the police force, there is no way to distinguish themselves by excellent performance and rise quickly through the ranks. The red tape in the personnel system is suffocating. The best officers leave for private opportunities, leaving the police force to make do with the rest.

Given the US political system, where decisions are made based on which simple slogan can rally the crowd, I don't see any hope of this improving. It would take a redesign of the org structure and personnel management of the entire system. Far more likely that leaders make some symbolic, token changes so they can claim to have "done something." The dysfunction of the US government is starting to be noticeable in almost every area...

Posted by: sabre | Aug 27 2020 18:09 utc | 5

"too many racists in the Police".
You are looking away from the issue.
5% of the black male pop is in prison - load more have been. (It may be 2.5% of blacks but they are almost all men - young black men).
The reason is crack. Punished 18X as much as cocaine. 3 strikes of crack and you are looking at 25 years.

White guy in a car approached by the police and he is thinking of where he stashed his coke. Black guy is thinking where he stashed his gun - because 1 nosey cop could mean years in prison.
~And of course the Policeman knows what the black man might be thinking.

No one talks about crack laws but that is easily the biggest thing out there. (and of course entirely due to inherent racism amongst lawmakers - Dems included).

Posted by: Michael Droy | Aug 27 2020 18:12 utc | 6

'Mostly Peaceful' Rioting And Looting Is Helping Trump's Campaign

I think the blogger ("b") isn't seeing the forest for the trees.

At this point, the elections results look like the lesser of the problems with the USA. The problem here is not who's right and who's wrong, but the inner economic contradictions arising from secular decline. At least I don't think the people rioting and protesting (and dying in the process) care about who's going to win in November.

That is, unless someone demonstrates all of these riots are astroturf. In this case, the elections will end the riots (or increase them). Only in this scenario the election results matter structurally to the USA.


It's time for me to declare "my vote" in these 2020 elections of the USA. Last time (2016), I declared for Trump.

My vote is... for anyone (Biden or Trump), as long as it is a very disputed and contested election. If it is decided by blatant fraud, even better.

This is because, if the election is fraudulent and contested, the USA will probably plunge deeper into civil war. And, the more the Americans waste their time and resources killing themselves, the less they keep killing us, from the rest of the world.

Posted by: vk | Aug 27 2020 18:12 utc | 7

The Illinois punk went "hunting" as was said by someone on Facebook, an assessment both myself and the Missus agree with, and he's been appropriately charged with First Degree Murder. NBA players involved in their playoffs broke their contract to hold a sit-down strike-like protest. I went to their Union's FB page to exhort them to use their media platform to raise awareness of the unconstitutional judicial doctrine of Qualified Immunity that's behind the inability to get justice for all the victims over the years. I wrote it's up to them since the major media won't do their job. If you reside within the USA and have FB, I ask you to please go to the NBPA FB page scroll down to Gigi Taylor's comment, like it, and add your own seconding recommendation. IMO, neither political party will touch the doctrine and we already know the major media won't, so what remains are distinctly unorthodox tactics to put pressure on the USSC to rescind its doctrine. IMO, the protests ought to move there and camp until that occurs, but protesters need to know why that's the move to make.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 18:13 utc | 8

What does it matter who the riot help? Same thing, both sides.

Posted by: Steve | Aug 27 2020 18:14 utc | 9

I very much agree with your overall points b, except the vigilante teenager. Every info up to now about the fellow presents him exhibiting extreme right-wing tendencies, further shown his decision to play gunslinger. The fact that he, along with others of his ilk received support and cover by this very same f***d up police force is quite revealing.

Posted by: Constantine | Aug 27 2020 18:17 utc | 10

"Yesterday a white teen with a semi-automatic weapon had the stupid idea to join others in 'protecting the businesses' in Kenosha from further looting. He ended up killing two people and wounding more after he was attacked by some of the rioters. The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense."

Sometimes the best thing an ignorant person can do is shut their mouth. Stick to Europe, Asia, and the Middle East please.

Posted by: Crazy | Aug 27 2020 18:22 utc | 11

Because of the Qualified Immunity judicial doctrine, the police aren't held accountable for their actions and know they can get away with heinous crimes. No amount of police reform will work until that doctrine sees its demise and murderers are no longer capable of hiding behind a badge. Only then in police training will the words "You'll be held accountable for your actions, and that means prison when you shoot anyone without cause" have the force they must have.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 18:24 utc | 12

"We will have law and order on the streets of this country for every American of every race and creed and color." says the current administration. What is stopping them from doing this right now, as opposed to after getting REELECTED? What am I missing?

Posted by: Nathan Mulcahy | Aug 27 2020 18:26 utc | 13

The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense.

Unfortunately b fails to note that the 17-year old:

  • was from out-of-state;

  • a member of pro-police group "blue lives matter";
  • in Kenosha that night with group of white militia;

Also that:

  • Kenosha PD has stonewalled questions of their relationship with white militia;
  • facebook allowed white militia to organize.

As I wrote about in the Open Thread (with links).


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 18:29 utc | 14

One Party, two flavors.

Trump is the Deep State pick, just as he was in 2016.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 18:31 utc | 15

james @Aug27 17:46 #1

Does the unrest really reflect an "Empire in decline" or a Deep State gambit to introduce control measures in anticipation of a war?

Instead of addressing BLM complaints rationally, I see a deliberate effort to exacerbate the unrest by the political establishment.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 18:36 utc | 16

I suggest reading this report. I wish b had read it prior to writing his. The police behavior is 100% wrong to the nth degree and only serves to further escalate the situation nationwide. Indeed, every cop on that street ought to be dismissed immediately. And I hope they have PTSD from it forever.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 18:40 utc | 17

Thanks for this insightful essay and thanks for the last link to the chilling must read essay by Larry Romanoff on the Unz Review. I simply don't know the answer to the multiple problems faced by the US but isn't that the job of the professional politicians? It seems none would even begin to address any of the mind blowing issues raised by Romanoff. In a previous era many of those crucial issues would be career ending third rail, touch and die. Times have been forever changed by events. I have the feeling the general populace won't put up with the present archaic and parasitical structures for long. Hang on for a bumpy ride.

Posted by: Paul | Aug 27 2020 18:40 utc | 18

Misleading picture- picture of California fires in Santa Cruz have nothing to do with the article, that picture is burned out big basin state park from the California lightning complex fires oldest state park in California, nothing to do with social unrest

Posted by: Garrett adams | Aug 27 2020 18:43 utc | 19

The conclusion is unfortunately correct, but the sole focus on Antifa as the problem Imo just shows the power of the media and politicians to shape the narrative. Who do you believe is more dangerous, Antifa or White Supremacist militias? The Feds are well aware that WS groups are using the protests to destroy property and trying to set off a race war, but the media and politicians are remarkably silent about the role of White Supremacists in the violence, unless something happens that is too hard to ignore, like 'Umbrella Man.'

Posted by: Roy G | Aug 27 2020 18:56 utc | 20

I can’t help but surmise that much of the violence in the streets reveals a boiling-over of exasperation, not only as a reaction to racist and callous police actions, but due to protracted impoverishment and disenfranchisement of mostly young men and particularly blacks. It has reached a dangerous phase when unemployment and lack of prospects for people’s livelihood continue unabated and unaddressed by the derelict ‘leadership’ in Washington, DC. All sorts of solutions have been proposed, but very few programs have been brought to bear on a situation that is being allowed to fester, while Fed largesse has been lavished on the investor class. “Law and Order” proponents disregard the fundamental need of people to survive.

I suspect this heightened economic oppression in the West was pre-planned, coordinated, and has been implemented through the Coronavirus scare-mongering in the MSM (such as prevalent ‘asymptomatic transmission’) and inadequate responses, including what appears to be the U.S. medical establishment’s initial rejection of treatments and methodologies that had been deemed effective by medical professionals in China, Cuba, and elsewhere. The expectation of a 'miracle vaccine' is being promoted as the only desirable long-term solution, whereas the holistic health of the society and all the built-in factors that denigrate it have been ignored, because corporate profits are unassailable in the institutions and structures of capitalism.

Posted by: norecovery | Aug 27 2020 19:01 utc | 21

@ Garrett adams with the call out on the inciting posting picture....thanks/interesting

@ b who wrote
"Yesterday a white teen with a semi-automatic weapon had the stupid idea to join others in 'protecting the businesses' in Kenosha from further looting. He ended up killing two people and wounding more after he was attacked by some of the rioters. The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense."

I find it interesting that none of "rioters" as you call them had weapons that would support your self defense claim. I read your words in this posting as tacit support for the White Supremacist movement which you know is being manipulated by the elite to their ends. Where is the insight and moral position you infuse into the ME postings in this one?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Aug 27 2020 19:07 utc | 22

"a beautiful sight" - Nancy Pelosi, 2019. Referring to the Hong Kong color revolution.

Mostly peaceful protests? A beautiful sight indeed!

Karma is a bitch.

Posted by: A.L. | Aug 27 2020 19:10 utc | 23

psychohistorian @22

They had weapons. The self-defense legal defense will probably stand.

36 year old felon shot by teen

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 19:20 utc | 24

I followed the link in the first sentence to The Seattle Times.

This may or may not be a trivial distinction but the original loose affiliation Antifa is not The Pacific Northwest Youth Liberation Front, the organization discussed in the article. b is painting with a pretty broad brush on that. the PNYLF only states antifascism as one of their efforts (from the article,) and Antifa seems to have a limited scope of activities it will respond to. Hyperbole at this juncture is neither necessary nor informative. The distinction probably matters to the principals of Antifa, but I'm only guessing.

Posted by: vinnieoh | Aug 27 2020 19:22 utc | 25

Mostly agree, it's a race to the bottom

Trump the alpha male, 'I'm going to protect you', basic function of govt, sad that this sets him apart from a major party candidate. Versus Trump the narcissist, 'I take no responsibility for anything bad that happened during my Presidency' (a real turn off for normal people who see the Covid bodies piling up).

I actually do not care at this point because both candidates are basically the same and pulling us to the bottom of the ocean. I don't know who will win, Trump might lose if he starts a war w/Iran which is possible because he is a narcissist and he is surrounded by Israel firsters.

Posted by: Christian J. Chuba | Aug 27 2020 19:22 utc | 26

Thanks for the commondreams post, karlof1 @ 17. I think b, whom otherwise I greatly respect for what he does here, has read this wrong. The police brutality issue is a far more serious one for both the merchant class in the US and for poor people, plus the majority of citizens. Trump can't win on a 'law and order' issue, it seems to me, as all this is happening on his watch. It is, as it is for the covid situation a clear case of wrong or even absence of, governance, and if it helps anyone it will help the milder seeming Biden, whom many of us here have observed to be on the wrong side of international politics.

If it gets completely out of hand as it seems to be doing, I think many who would have sat the election out because they don't approve of either candidate, will decide for the sake of the nation's better governance to vote for Biden. Whether or not that will be a good thing remains to be seen.

Posted by: juliania | Aug 27 2020 19:26 utc | 27

Previous MoA and Unz Review articles as a ref.. hmm.

Can't disagree w the underlying argument, but some broader source material might help to avoid preaching to the already converted sometimes...

Posted by: Et Tu | Aug 27 2020 19:27 utc | 28

Leaving aside the comments I think are just wrong. It is clear that the solutions provided - do away with qualified immunity for police - have better training and hiring better people - do away with the drug war - and I would add - have social issue trained people rather than armed police deal with situations caused by people with mental issues. b. is correct that the United States political system is dysfunctional in that we all know these solutions will never be implemented or the real problems solved in any way. Instead we will continue on the almost there police state and militarization of the police. That there are real issues i the US that should be protested as a start to fix them is not a question. There is a question of who exactly is turning these protests into property and injurious riots. What are their motives? These present riots are unlike the 60s where the violent protests were the last resort of the powerless to get change.

Posted by: gepay | Aug 27 2020 19:27 utc | 29

While I have gotten much insight from this site for the past 6 years, b has betrayed an acute ignorance about the real state of race relations, economic prospects and the manner in which “law and order” are dispensed in the US. However his observation of the incredibly low level of professionalism, training and self-control on the side of law enforcement was a small redemption. The heavy hand of the police on poor Americans and people of color here has been a repeated grievance here for several decades.
Furthermore the behavior or a youthful mass shooter who believed he was assisting the police was particularly egregious and grossly unacceptable to civilized people here in the states.

Posted by: DougDiggler | Aug 27 2020 19:27 utc | 30

FYI, the article image of the Covid sign surrounded by flames is from the wildfires in California, not the Kenosha riots. Its ironic value still holds though.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 27 2020 19:36 utc | 31

"The teen was arrested and he is facing charges but I doubt that he is guilty of more than sheer stupidity and manslaughter in self defense."
I must sharply disagree. B, you're defending a murderer here. The fact that he is a stupid young murderer doesn't change a thing. The pictures show very clearly that there is no acting in self-defense. Whoever holds a potent weapon in his hand should know what he is doing. This moronic teenager obviously did not know and killed two people, ruining his own life in the process.

When everyone pours oil on the fire, things will take their course. Tens of thousands of heavily armed men in all over the country are deliriating about a civil war. Tronald does not stop them, but supports them. Whether this will help him in the final balance is questionable. Such events develop a momentum of their own and cannot be controlled by anyone.

Posted by: pnyx | Aug 27 2020 19:37 utc | 32

@Daniel 31

Just saw that Garrett (19) already mentioned this.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 27 2020 19:39 utc | 33

I like the pic. Wall Steet booming, attacking other nations. Business as usual while the country burns.
For those that think all cops should fired - you live in a violent country. around 16000 murders per year. Cops shoot about a thousand per year, 40-50 cops are killed per year.
A cop kills someone thats not threatening - should be charged ect - but then rioters create a path of destruction - not targeted but random destruction. People who have nothing to do with the shooting lose their businesses cars whatever, so they start protecting themselves... the cycle continues.

Just a violent shithole that thinks itself exceptional.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 27 2020 19:40 utc | 34

Re: Psychohistorian @22,

More video evidence is coming out and making the story more complex (there's now accusations that the first shooting victim chased the shooter into a car lot and threw a Molotov cocktail at him before being shot). No idea what if that is true or exaggerated, but I've learned to distrust selectively edited videos being pushed by the media (remember the Sandmann video CNN was squawking about). RT already has articles about the alleged 1st shooting victim claiming that he was a convicted sex offender seen daring people to shoot him before he was shot. We have the Democrats promoting chaos in their cities in the hope it might somehow damage Trump and the Media supporting the rioters. I never thought I'd see the day when politicians would actively supporting the torching of own their cities in the hopes it could be used for political points on the national stage. The best position for now is to reserve judgement until more evidence comes to light and not trust anything.

Posted by: Kadath | Aug 27 2020 19:41 utc | 35

pnyx @32

I linked an image showing one of the victims armed and attacking the kid up above.

Your turn. Link to pictures showing the kid attacking protesters.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 19:43 utc | 36

@15 The DNC does not care if Trump wins. The DNC wins as long as either Biden or Trump win. No difference between them.
The only thing the DNC did not want was Sanders or a progressive slate of policies.
Until the US provides basics rights for it's citizens (healthcare, education, clean air/water, jobs, housing) things will continue to degrade. Have no problem seeing the US burn until it provides for it's citizens. That kid shooter was not arrested until the next day by Illinois police even with protesters pointing him out to the Wisconsin police at the shooting. Believe majority of police have brain injuries from either football or military service.

Posted by: Joe | Aug 27 2020 19:59 utc | 37

The Republicans who insist that Donald Trump is the only person who can restore law and order need to be reminded constantly that the current disorder erupted on Trump's own watch. How exactly is he supposed to make it better, when it's obvious to anyone with eyes and a functioning brain that Trump makes it worse?

Posted by: Rob | Aug 27 2020 20:05 utc | 38

William Gruff @Aug27 19:43 #36

The crowd was chasing him for a reason. At some point, I think that reason will become known.

The kid also wears gloves so his fingerprints are not on the gun. Why is a 17-year old kid so concerned about his fingerprints on a gun unless he is considering using it in an unlawful manner?

Why is disobeying the police a death sentence for blacks but a white kid with an AR-15 is ignored during a riot in which there are shots fired?

Why is Kenosha PD stonewalling about their relationship to white militas?

Who are the kids parents? Are they police officers? Why would they let their gun-toting 17-year old travel to Kenosha at this time? A 17-year old doesn't have the maturity to be in a situation like that.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 20:07 utc | 39

The self defense claim is ludicrous. Kid crossed state lines, armed, to pick a side in what he probably thinks is the start of the race war.

Anyone claiming the Democrats are supporting riots should consider that most protests are taking place in Democratic cities and are being violently repressed by Democratic mayors. Instead, look at hysterical conservative pop media that has claimed for decades that immigration and the anti racist movement represent white genocide. That is the american intellectual current causing mass shootings across the country and abroad.

Posted by: Keats | Aug 27 2020 20:11 utc | 40

Jackrabbit @40: "At some point, I think that reason will become known."

Yes, more facts will come out, yet working on limited facts you, bunny, have already convicted him. You should watch out for that.

There will be no first degree murder conviction.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:11 utc | 41

Joe @Aug27 19:59 #38

The only thing the DNC did not want was Sanders or a progressive slate of policies.

For the umpteenth time: Sanders was a sheepdog working with the Democratic establishment against progressives. He was never a serious candidate. You were fooled.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 20:12 utc | 42

the riots generally follow the murders and assaults by cops. this happens in other areas too, for example when israel wants a reason to murder palestinians. the kid was defending himself? seriously? the cops were encouraging and giving these armed right wingers refreshments. this is not a symmetrical situation. riots and looting do not inevitably accompany protests. the riots are much more likely to occur after decades of police brutality.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 27 2020 20:16 utc | 43

Keats @41

Enough with the hyperventilating about "crossing state lines" already. Check a
map of Antioch, IL where the kid is from to see why that is not a relevant argument.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:16 utc | 44

Your eurocentrism is showing in this article, b. Understanding the principal contradiction of amerikkka would help you develop an accurate analysis of the imperial core. All I see from this post is Tucker Carlson-lite. What's darkly amusing to me is how the Liberal media is shoring up the Tucker Carlson 'self-defense' narrative in Kenosha which only further deepens the right wing turn in this country. The conclusion wrt Amerikkkan MSM: both are inherently white supremacist and profit off the assassination of the oppressed. They are the entertainment outlets of the most vile tendencies. Hunger Games-esque.

Posted by: dimitrov | Aug 27 2020 20:19 utc | 45

uh the people were chasing him because he shot somebody, from what i read. people don't like being shot. they don't like cops murdering them. kinda like countries don't like the u.s. toppling their governments and invading them, they often respond with violence. notice the similarity in narratives justifying police violence at home and empire violence abroad--they were just responding to threats! they were protecting the innocent south vietnamese/iraqs/salvadorans/etc etc ad infinitum.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 27 2020 20:19 utc | 46

@Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 18:29 utc | 14

Re: "Unfortunately b fails to note that the 17-year old:

was from out-of-state;
a member of pro-police group "blue lives matter";
in Kenosha that night with group of white militia;"

JR: Kenosha borders IL: Kyle Rittenhouse the 17 yr old, lives ~20 miles away in Aurora IL. He was there with others guarding a gas station in the riot zone.

All three of the men he shot in self-defense apparently, were white, and were convicted felons or under bail for pending felony charges (the wounded one who was aiming an [illegal] pistol at Rittenhouse).

Details according to Ryan Dawson YT:

Posted by: gm | Aug 27 2020 20:20 utc | 47

William Gruff @Aug27 20:11 #42

you, bunny, have already convicted him

I haven't convicted anyone. And this isn't a court.

The 17-year-old's actions are very suspicious: crossing state lines to go to a protest/riot with a gun, associating with white militias, wearing gloves so his fingerprints on not on the gun.

Kenosha PD actions are also suspicious. They knew the militia was there. But they didn't try to disperse THEM after curfew even as they dispersed the crowd of protestors.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 20:20 utc | 48

Gotta cover up the war crimes, human rights violations, pedophilia, fraud, and extortion somehow now don't you ?
The new cold war has to be slid in through the back door and get well established before actual press "coverage" can begin.

How did Orwell call this so perfectly ?

Get ready to wake up in a corporate industrial zone you used to call your country and make sure you work on your credit score because debt peonage is just around the corner.

Be safe and don't let the bastards drive you into doing anything stupid.

Posted by: dave | Aug 27 2020 20:21 utc | 49

as for antifa, what exactly have they done? who are they? is there an organization? as far as i can tell, it's a hyped up joke, remember when al quaida was supposed to be some nefarious worldwide organization directed by bin ladin.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 27 2020 20:26 utc | 50

gm @27 20:20 #48

He was there with others guarding a gas station in the riot zone.

Really? He didn't shoot those people at a gas station. They were chasing him down a wide street.

And those "others guarding a gas station" were not with him.

He went off on his own without adult supervision? Why? And why was he being chased?


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 20:27 utc | 51

jackrabbit, the cops were giving them water and telling them how much they appreciated them being there. the professional right wing militia supporting the amateur right wing militia. just like criminal gangs often have youthful appendages, kind of feeder gangs.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 27 2020 20:28 utc | 52

Dementia Biden will regret for not picking Amy Klobuchar. A right wing Democrat white soccer mom from mid western

Posted by: Nick | Aug 27 2020 20:31 utc | 53

RE: Posted by: gm | Aug 27 2020 20:20 utc | 48

Correction: Kyle Rittenhouse lives in Antioch IL, not Aurora.

Posted by: gm | Aug 27 2020 20:33 utc | 54

@43 Would have voted for Sanders. Would never vote for Trump or Biden.
Regardless of what you think, Sanders is far better man and would have done country good if permitted.
Surprised you think progressives are so easily manipulated. If anyone is being manipulated it is those supporting the status quo.

Posted by: Joe | Aug 27 2020 20:33 utc | 55

Most of us barflies living within the nightmare that's the "exceptional shithole" Outlaw US Empire are old enough to remember the 1950-60s Freedom Marches within the Southern states that were often televised on live TV or we watched tape broadcast on the evening news. The Kenosha cops differ in no way from those racist cops lining the roads with their clubs, shotguns and attack dogs, occasionally sicing a dog on an innocent or dragging others out and wantonly beating them--the police chief in his press conference reminds me of precisely such people with the same "moral compass." As was portrayed then, the same deep dysfunction is very much alive and ought to horrify the world as it did then. Putin's remark at the end of his interview I posted on the Belarus thread reflects that POV. The world looks at the behavior of the Outlaw US Empire's government on the international stage then looks at what it does and allows to be done within its borders and the only entity agreeing with its actions is the Zionist entity whose behavior is essentially the same.

IMO, the situation now is worse than that of the 1960s primarily because a much higher percentage of the populous is oppressed, the structural dysfunctions much deeper, and the populous more ignorant/less informed/lied to more often/ignored by politicos than then. Note the Establishment's desperate attempt to revive the Cold War in an attempt to divert attention from the problems here to the problems they're making elsewhere and blaming on the Other. Too be sure, the Class War manipulators are smiling as they sip their cognac and accept another tranche of free billions from the Fed. And you can be certain Trump will only say and do things that escalate the situation and then deny he did so, while Biden hides from the issue entirely.

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 20:33 utc | 56

pretzelattack @Aug27 20:26 #51

... as for antifa, what exactly have they done? who are they? is there an organization?

My pet theory is that they are an off-shoot of JDL. Ready to turn any legitimate protest into a riot for the evening news. Because Zionists need to protect the Zionist asshats that run USA/Empire.

That's why they're (still) so mysterious. That's why the US government can never seem to understand who they are. Antifa are the domestic "White Helmets" ready to support YOUR protest. Except not.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 20:37 utc | 57

Its the Nixon 68' playbook. I wonder what will to happen after the day after?
1 . Trump mostly like will win by electoral college
2 . Will there to happen riots?
3 . Civil war, arrest, etc..??

Posted by: Nick | Aug 27 2020 20:39 utc | 58

As for the 17 year old... lots of statements being made with very little facts.

He was videotaping people looting when attacked. It’s on at least two videos.
He was assaulted and also had a Molotov cocktail thrown at him.
I have heard other “stories” up to this point, but nothing that has been proven yet.

After he shot one man attacking him, he stopped and called police from the scene while the man was being tended to. At the point the rioters can be heard yelling things like “there he is. Get him!”. The kid pro proceeded to run away from the crowd (to police).
Again, this is all on video.

While running from the crowd he tripped and fell. At that point he was assaulted by a man with a skateboard. Two others closed in, one grabbed the rifle. The kid shot the guy sleep assaulted him, they guy who grabbed the gun and a guy with a handgun closing in on him on the ground..
Again, this is all on video.

Killed were a registered sex offender and a felon who beat women.
Shot was a felon in possession of a gun.
It’s of now no conclusive link has been made to the kid and any white supremacy group.

These are just facts. Quite a few people here are reporting fantasy.

I have heard additional details from people who were participating in the protest and Law Enforcement as well. As of this point, none of what i have heard has been substantiated so i will not share it to stoke the flames of either side.

Posted by: Kevin | Aug 27 2020 20:42 utc | 59

Sorry about the grammar. Autocorrect got the best of me on my phone.

Should additional details become confirmed, they will be shared regardless of what party they make look good or bad.

Posted by: Kevin | Aug 27 2020 20:45 utc | 60

Cops probably recognized the kid involved in the shooting because he was a member of a "Public Safety Cadet" program.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:48 utc | 61

I suppose that "Public Safety Cadet" programs count as "White Supremacist militias" these days.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:49 utc | 62

@60 and the coward in this case was the kid with the automatic weapon.
Easy to be charged with felon these days. Can get one for protesting or smoking pot.
When one has limited options they may consider trying to disarm someone with an automatic weapon.
The failed justice system is just another facet of what is wrong in the US.

Posted by: Joe | Aug 27 2020 20:51 utc | 63

Joe @64

The felon was apparently a child rapist, and was on the sex offender list. Thirty-six years old.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:54 utc | 64

When a teenager is assaulted by a thirty-six year old child rapist, he's a coward for shooting that assailant. I wonder what the court will say about that?

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 20:56 utc | 65

@66 You are a sad dude. We know your view is skewed to your beliefs as is true for many.
Regardless of what someone's history may be, it does not justify someone infiltrating protesters with automatic weapons and killing them.

Posted by: Joe | Aug 27 2020 21:00 utc | 66

I have to agree with Kevin @60 and William Gruff on the kid.

Doesn't look to be a white supremacist or anything like that. Get used to it Americans. More and more people will start doing what this kid done. A cop shoots someone. Rabble then use that as an excuse for rioting and looting. Those hurt by the rioting and looting start to fight back. The problem is not just who did what in a particular incident but as karlof1 says the deeper structural dysfunctions.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Aug 27 2020 21:00 utc | 67

This kid went out and lived out the fantasy of gun nuts all over America, he went out and shot down some rioters in the name of "dispensing justice". Expect more people to emulate him soon, this is only likely to escalate.

Posted by: Malchik Ralf | Aug 27 2020 21:04 utc | 68

Joe @67

Actually, it is your view that is skewed here. The kid was not "infiltrating protesters". He'd been in the neighborhood all day, earlier cleaning up damage to local businesses from the previous night's riots, and staying to try to guard some of the businesses.

You project like an American.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 21:05 utc | 69

Another fake news story from b just like the recent ‘It’s a wrap ‘ post, complete with yet another fake photo = MOA — misinformation.
Have regard for your credabilty.
The battle moves on, MOA a casualty, sadly.

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 27 2020 21:08 utc | 70

Malchik Ralf @69

Absolutely, it will escalate. When the sides cannot see where each other is coming from, then there is no compromise position to be had. Escalation is the only option.

Interesting that the kid literally "disarmed" that adult who was brandishing a gun at the kid. That was some nice shooting. I wouldn't want to be on the opposite side of the fight from guys like that.

Posted by: William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 21:14 utc | 71

@ Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 20:33 utc | 57

These are completely different from the Freedom Marches. During the 1950-1960s, the USA was an exuberant economy, a flourishing empire, at the apex of its strength and beauty. The FMs happened in a context of the highest of hopes, of certainty of ultimate victory, and of a better life if not for themselves, for their children and grandchildren.

Today's riots are happening in a context of pure desperation, hatred and hopelessness. They are destruction for destruction, a battle not for a better country, but where each side is fighting for a worse country for the other side.

Comparing the FMs to the riots of 2020 is like comparing the Stoic Opposition to the Crisis of the Third Century.


@ Posted by: Kevin | Aug 27 2020 20:42 utc | 60

The problem is the kid is from the neighboring town (Antioch). He's not a local petite-bourgeois defending his small business or property. Best case scenario, he has family in Kenosha and traveled there to defend his parents' or uncles' small business.

Posted by: vk | Aug 27 2020 21:17 utc | 72

Before we start with accusations of murder lets look at the actual laws in the State of Wisconsin with regards to self-defense:

939.48  Self-defense and defense of others.

(1)  A person is privileged to threaten or intentionally use force against another for the purpose of preventing or terminating what the person reasonably believes to be an unlawful interference with his or her person by such other person. The actor may intentionally use only such force or threat thereof as the actor reasonably believes is necessary to prevent or terminate the interference. The actor may not intentionally use force which is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm unless the actor reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself.

(ar) If an actor intentionally used force that was intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm, the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies:

1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring.

2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.

(2) Provocation affects the privilege of self-defense as follows:

(a) A person who engages in unlawful conduct of a type likely to provoke others to attack him or her and thereby does provoke an attack is not entitled to claim the privilege of self-defense against such attack, except when the attack which ensues is of a type causing the person engaging in the unlawful conduct to reasonably believe that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm. In such a case, the person engaging in the unlawful conduct is privileged to act in self-defense, but the person is not privileged to resort to the use of force intended or likely to cause death to the person's assailant unless the person reasonably believes he or she has exhausted every other reasonable means to escape from or otherwise avoid death or great bodily harm at the hands of his or her assailant.

(b) The privilege lost by provocation may be regained if the actor in good faith withdraws from the fight and gives adequate notice thereof to his or her assailant.

(c) A person who provokes an attack, whether by lawful or unlawful conduct, with intent to use such an attack as an excuse to cause death or great bodily harm to his or her assailant is not entitled to claim the privilege of self-defense.

So the relevant questions are does the defendant have a duty to retreat since the attack did not occur in the defendant's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, did the defendant engage in unlawful conduct to provoke such attacks, and was the force used to repel such attacks reasonable? These questions must be answered first before dismissing an affirmative defense and going straight into a prosecution.

Posted by: One Too Many | Aug 27 2020 21:23 utc | 73

I like it how people who claim "Well, they have a criminal record, but it's because they're poor and lived in crappy neighborhood" don't realise how mightily insulting this is to the vast majority of people who lived through the same shitty upbringing yet did NOT turn to crime and violence and tried to play by the rules and the law.

As for the US, the country is indeed doomed to civil war. The election will obviously be contested, and this will only accelerate the process.

As for that teenager shooting people, this is also inevitable - in the long run, if chaos increases and the State can't maintain order, people will growingly try to keep some order and security on their own. Basically, if you're too ridiculously soft on crime for too long, you ensure that militias will arise to replace the failed State. It's like people never heard of what happened in the past, for instance some European countries in the early 20th century, or some Latin American countries in the later 20th.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Aug 27 2020 21:23 utc | 74

@ Posted by: One Too Many | Aug 27 2020 21:23 utc | 74

I don't think the law matters at this point. It's "gloves off", as they say.

Posted by: vk | Aug 27 2020 21:26 utc | 75

actually, there is NO such thing as "Antifa". Antifa is as made up as ISIS/Ali Queda is. Antifa is a vague term loosely applied toward a group of people who are fed up with all the fake "Capitalism" and are willing to fight against it.
Some may even not be "Antifa" but fake "Antifa" created for propaganda purposes. Exactly how the notorious "red brigade" in Italy who kidnapped Aldo Moro and killed him. And the Red Brigade was supposed to be Communist also; finny that, since Aldo Moro was about to create a coalition with the Communists and he is prevented from accomplishing that by "Communists".

But b is essentially correct, the average American moron™ is now fed up with all the riots and looting and is siding with trump. But that's only because the Average American moron™ (I have trademarked it, so dont try to steal it) is so stupid, they cannot even think about anything, they live in a very simple good vs bad world.

Posted by: Hoyeru | Aug 27 2020 21:27 utc | 76

@72 Gruff
That was some nice shooting, an old west style gunfight and the guy with the faster weapon lost. If the prosecution pushes for homicide, they are likely to lose, as the kid was attacked first in both shootings, the first time with a molotov cocktail, the second time with a skateboard and a .45. Don't bring a skateboard to a gunfight I guess.

I am trying to find the specific laws regarding the kids right to open-carry in Wisconsin as a citizen of Illinois. Depending on how the law is written will determine if manslaughter charges will stick. I am originally from the North Chicago area and Kenosha is in practical terms a suburb of Chicago, although in legal terms that probably doesn't matter.

Regardless of the intentions of the rioters, the civil disorder plays into Trump's hands as far as the politics of the Midwest goes and could likely lead to a repeat of the 2016 election.

Posted by: Jason | Aug 27 2020 21:29 utc | 77

"The kid was not "infiltrating protesters"."

Then why wasn't he at home if he wasn't infiltrating protestors? He went out of his way to cross state lines with a rifle. He has no official sanctioning and isn't even an adult yet.

He's ruined his life already and his parents should be prosecuted for allowing him to do something this stupid.

Anyone who can't see how badly vigilante law can turn around on you was not raised or educated properly. Due process is slow and not always just but it's better than having a 17 year old kid getting suckered into someone elses fight and ruining his life.

The American public hasn't caught on to the fact that their own foreign policy is now domestic policy. Watch as the elite get us all to kill one another via propaganda and psyops while they continue to hoard all the resources.

Stay safe and sane folks, don't let the state or the media tell you who your enemies are.

Posted by: dave | Aug 27 2020 21:31 utc | 78

Carzy @ 11

Perhaps you should be following your own advice.

Posted by: Digital Spartacus | Aug 27 2020 21:39 utc | 79

While we discuss the individual players, i can not help but think about the politicians who have created this environment.
Both parties get what they want no matter who is in charge. The party not in charge just has to work a little harder.
It sure seems like they are more than willing to sacrifice our lives to get money and power in an ever more slightly easy fashion.
When do the people turn on the politicians?
When does the system get burned down?
Hopefully one day the citizens will work together to take down their true oppressors, not each other.

Posted by: Kevin | Aug 27 2020 21:40 utc | 80

Once again the confident command of idiomatic English sounds more MSM than b's occasional but endearing (and identifying) slips. It also sounds more right wing than him too. But I guess we'll never know.

Posted by: Patroklos | Aug 27 2020 21:41 utc | 81

the problem is
a. the hiring and personnel practices in US police departments by sabre <= @ 5.
b. the inner economic contradictions arising from secular decline. <= vk @ 7
c. media focus on Antifa <= according to B.
d. events and failures orchestrated to heightened economic oppression <= norecovery @ 21
e. Business as usual while the country burns AU1 @ 34
f. repressive authoritarian state militancy and Trump @ 37..
g. All three shooting victims <= self-defense<= white, <= felons. gm 48
h. A JDL offshoot.. Jackrabbit @ 58

I say the problem of "unsatisfied rising discontent" is to be expected When anyone in a democratic society fails to be heard, by all concerned, little recourse remains to those with a grievance but to ....XXXXX

A very strong constitutional issue exists in these riots=>. The First Amendment <=was not in the Federalist construct of Aristocrats and the corporate empires they owned. The effort to control America is hidden deep inside the words and court interpretations since the Constitution of the United States of America was imposed on Americans.

The Aristocrats in America wanted a British Colonial government without British Aristocrats; they wanted a government with a strong army so it could protect them from Angry Americans! The Aristocrats and their corporations still in America after Britain was defeated wanted to control the profits that could be made in America, much in the same fashion as the British Colonial Government had helped its corporations, investors, and bankers before the war to control who got the profits that were made in America.

The Federalist wanted a government the Aristocracy could use to exploit America; the federalist wanted to govern the behaviors and direct the toils of those in America in such a way that only one federal government could do. In fact the so called Framers wanted a royal government, tried to make George Washington, King.

Remember the Declaration of Independence was in 1776, the America states defeated the British Government in 1778, the Constitution of the USA did not come into being until 1788. During that 10 years John Hanson was the first President of the United States of America.. Samuel Huntington, Thomas McKeeny, and others were President of the United States of America. The British were gone, George Washington was appointed general to remove the British corporations, Investors, and bankers from America, that was accomplished in 1778. The American Aristocrats wanted to own America. George Washington was selected to be the general of the Army because his wealth made him famous enough to attract mercenaries to fight the British at Valley Forge. At the time the Constitution in Philadelphia was developed, George was in Mt. Vernon.

The Aristocratic Convention in Philadelphia, was a meeting, designed to terminate involvement by the newly emancipated American in American politics. The result of the Convention in Philadelphia was a document which outlined how control of America could be returned to the American Aristocrats, a document which would make the Aristrocrat powerful again, the same Aristocrats who had previously used the British Government, to control Americans. Check it out what were George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin, and the like doing in America while America was a British Colony (before 1776)? The Aristocrats wanted a government that would allow America Aristocrats to direct and a government they could use to control Americans.

The anti-federalist tried to refuse ratification of the denial to be against the peoples involvement in their own government but the best the anti-federalist could do against, the strong powers behind the Constitution, was to force the Federalist to add to their regime change Constitution ten basic promises, <=these promises were in the form of amendments and are known as the Bill Of Rights [BOR]: Anyway the first amendment of the BOR reads.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.. But, but but it does not say Congress will make every law necessary to enforce the protection of the first Amendment.

So why can't those who are protesting be allowed to live so they can be heard? Why can't their grievances be listed and placed on the national ballot? Let everyone be heard.. explore every aspect of their concerns and accommodate those with a Grievance to rejoin our democratic society, ask the nation to settle the issues dissenters have ? When the Aristocrats use the government to impose their will on risings, they do so by eliminating bystander awareness and deny everyone but a few to be involved; worse, they allow media to promote, one side of the issue (no must carry rule).. this narrowing of participants happens until nothing remains but conflict between bottom up grievance . . and top down power.. and believe me that is the goal.. to divide and conquer.

Posted by: snake | Aug 27 2020 21:41 utc | 82

What many are doing here, in the heat of battle, is forgetting that this is not a "civil war," it is class war. The ruling class is pursuing its classic tactic of "divide and conquer." Those divided are under the influence of the propaganda of the ruling class, and continue to damage each other, rather than their true enemy the ruling class. This must be made clear, in order to unite the working class, that they may exercise there true power and crush the ruling class. There is no other way.

Posted by: donten | Aug 27 2020 21:46 utc | 83

I'm sure a good living could be gleaned by offering legitimate, unbiased fact-checking in this day-and-age. Here's one of many incidents, and I'm 100% certain more will follow.

As to square one in Kenosha, a curfew was declared. The kid was likely aware of the curfew and set out to violate it anyway--law breaking incident #1. Having a firearm in possession while under 18--a fact being so close to WI the kid ought to have known--is law breaking incident #2. That he's not arrested or turned back by Kenosha PD is a failure to enforce the law, which is the first violation by the PD. And the kid has yet to do anything other than arrive on the scene. IMO, there's no moral or legal defense for either the kid or the PD--they both violated laws they ought to have known about, PD especially.

Unfortunately, it seems too few barflies want to deal with the logic of my comments and would rather argue with Gruff, himself sitting on a fence with very pointy pickets. My point being we're wasting energy yelling at each other when we ought to be yelling at those responsible for the state of dysfunction--a behavior the Class War manipulators are all laughing at while slapping each others backs and lighting another cigar with the latest billion given them by the Fed.

I see I got a few likes in response to my plea regarding the NBPA's FB comment I made. If they came from some barflies, I thank them very much and hope others will still emulate them. On the issue of Qualified Immunity, there're three articles I know of: Zuesse's, Pauly's, Cohn's, and the judge's opinion they all stem from. There ought to be 300, not 3, and there lies a major part of the overall problem; therefore, my plea to the NBPA and ongoing push for this issue to gain the relevance it demands. Not one god damned thing's change within the Outlaw US Empire until this doctrine gets rubbished for all time. Zuesse makes this ultra important point in his essay which is why only The People are going to get this doctrine destroyed:

"Congress and the President can’t fix this, even if they wanted to; they can’t fix a problem that they didn’t themselves create; but Congress and the President can condemn and shame the Court — which they never do. Better yet, they can impeach and remove all of the sitting ‘Justices’ and replace them with decent people — such as Carleton Reeves. But each of this Court’s members was placed there by the Congresses, and by the Presidents. It’s an extremely vicious circle, and no part of it can fix other parts of it."

Lets stop shouting and pointing fingers at each other and start doing the same where it might do some good!

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 21:52 utc | 84

Kevin @Aug27 21:40 #81

Both parties get what they want no matter who is in charge.

Because they both represent the same people: the wealthy and the Deep State.

Bart Simpson shoots protestors/rioters and Mr. Burns is rubbing his hands and thinking: "Exxxcellent!"


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 27 2020 21:54 utc | 85

That kid is going to be a hero, a star. Not saying I agree mind you, although as someone said he does seem to be well-trained and "familiar with his weapon". But I already see people going all googly-eyed over him, the White Right is going to go nuts.

Posted by: Bemildred | Aug 27 2020 21:55 utc | 86

Perhaps I should have more patience but as of reading half way through these comments nobody has mentioned that one need be at least 18 years old to carry a weapon in Illinois.

Further, b’s euro culturalization or whatever is a bit of a give away that he’s not up on the language of discourse in the first slave republic where there is distinction made between “riots” (the first race riots were by euroamericans], rebellion, and, not on the program, revolution, against unjust rule.

Most of us trying to survive and if possible thrive under adverse circumstances made worse by a predatory system all about “profit” with little concern or consideration for everyday people.

Posted by: Suzan | Aug 27 2020 22:03 utc | 87

snake @83--

Good review. Franklin's contemptuous answer--"A Republic IF you can keep it"--was very honest, knowing he didn't have much longer to live--he died in 1790.

donten @84 reminds us it's a Class War as I often try. It seems Sneeches never learn.

It would likely reassure those outside the Outlaw US Empire if there were a corresponding waning of its international illegalities as its domestic situation deteriorates, but that's very unlikely; indeed, the opposite becomes even more likelier--Sorry!

Posted by: karlof1 | Aug 27 2020 22:12 utc | 88

The supposed 'Molotov Cocktail' was a plastic bag with a bottle in it. Multiple pictures and videos of it on Twitter.

The real story here is that guns don't make you safe. Rittenhouse wouldn't be in jail and the victims would still be alive if he hadn't shown up armed and anxious to live out his fantasies. He was more excited to brandish his weapon than anything. Just like his idols in the Thin Blue Line.

Posted by: Roy G | Aug 27 2020 22:23 utc | 89

Here is something to chew on. I live in portland and the first time I saw Antifa spring up was back in 2009. Rose City Antifa organized a boycott of a local cooperatively owned bike shop. They plastered the town and all the bike racks in the city saying to boycott the worker owned business. What was it’s crime you ask?, to get such treatment. The bike shop hosted a meeting and speakers forum held by Portlanders for 911 truth. Draw your own conclusions here.

Posted by: Seneca’s Cliff | Aug 27 2020 22:24 utc | 90

William Gruff | Aug 27 2020 19:43 utc | 36
You see 'the kid' shooting at others, indiscriminately, claiming these people threatened his life is absolutely ridiculous, whatever the picture you uploaded - how about a link? - shows. The attacks on him, which you can also see, were about trying to snatch his gun away from him. Unfortunately, this did not succeed. It is clearly murder.

Posted by: pnyx | Aug 27 2020 22:31 utc | 91

Two of my cousins and their young families live in Minneapolis in neighborhoods in which rioting took place. Both are Sanders supporters who vote Democrat no matter what. These neighborhoods are full of old, wood, and closely packed houses. During the heat of summer, with a little wind, a fire could easily get out of control and do lots of damage. During the demonstrations one of my cousins had his car stolen from his driveway, it was found burnt a few blocks away causing damage to a nearby garage. Fortunately the blaze was brought under control by neighbors with fire extinguishers.

My cousins are BLM supporters, but they are also scared. Both have Master's Degrees, but neither are wealthy enough to relocated their families to the suburbs. Over the weeks I have seen their attitudes change towards BLM and the democrats in general. Neither would vote Trump, but their anti-Trump enthusiasm is waning.

The polls from Minnesota are limited, but revealing. Double digit lead for Biden down to a dead heat in less than a month. Minnesota is a "Liberal" state with a healthy dose of Sanders/Gabbard lefties. No matter how liberal a midwestern state is, an underlying respect for "law and order" could be said to be a defining characteristic of midwestern lefties. If Biden and Trump are truly tied in Minnesota, things don't look good for Biden. I can see no other reason for a 10-13% polling swing than how the Democrats have responded to the rioting.

I am not here to debate whether or not these protests are a good way to create social change, but I will say the rioting/looting/burning that is being linked to the protests are giving Trump a way to win in 2020. Looks to me like a repeat of 2016 where the DNC will do everything in its power to make sure it loses.

Posted by: Jason | Aug 27 2020 22:43 utc | 92

this is the kind of crypto white chauvinist nonsense that turned zerohedge into the trash bin it is today. what a disappointing article

Posted by: blm | Aug 27 2020 22:56 utc | 93

@ Posted by: Jason | Aug 27 2020 22:43 utc | 93

But that was the whole point of Biden entering the race: to stop Bernie Sanders from winning the nomination. It was never intended to be a pro-blue collar move to win back the Rust Belt.

Just to give you an idea of how the liberals are shitting in their pants of fear of a communist revolution in the USA: some days ago, the MSM published some articles about how Trump betrayed the blue collar workers. It lasted one day. They never touched the subject again, so far.

Posted by: vk | Aug 27 2020 23:09 utc | 94

@93 Jason

I agree with your concluding paragraph. In January I would have said the election was Trump's to lose. Then, dammit if he didn't throw the entire thing into doubt by botching the virus worse than anyone could even have dreamed that he would.

I said somewhere along the line that the DNC would have to work mightily to give the election to Trump, and so they chose Biden, at the uttermost extreme of absurd on the political spectrum. Imagine: it took a walking corpse to be worse than Trump showed himself to be during 2020.

Anyway, I agree that the Dems don't want to be in the leading position. They make way too much money in their #2 slot, and they don't have to make excuses for why they no longer represent their historic platform, which they have in fact sold out completely. Winning the election is a terrifying prospect to them. They would have to face the people.

Thanks for the story by the way, and your view of the rigged game.

Posted by: Grieved | Aug 27 2020 23:14 utc | 95

These issues were initiated by the police shooting a man seven times in the back at point blank range with his children nearby almost in the range of fire. This after responding to a call over a minor physical dispute which the shot man had apparently already had resolved, while the cops had failed to determine the true circumstances. IMO, the social dysfunction on display in the aftermath is a direct result of the endemically poor practices of the country’s law enforcement -a situation which the PTB not only tolerate but insist upon.

Posted by: jayc | Aug 27 2020 23:14 utc | 96

You are right. The ridiculous theory that Sanders was a "sheepdog" only there to lead people away from a reform programme simply does not stand up to scrutiny. The effort to prevent Sanders, with his threateningly reformist language and his burgeoning movement was not as feint but a serious campaign. Significantly enough it involved the very people being exposed by the current protests- the Black Misleadership class. Just as Biden, the Crime Bill author, and Harris, the racist prosecutor, exemplify the culture on exhibition in Wisconsin.
As someone upthread noted this is the Nixon '68 playbook being dusted off by the idiotic Republicans. But this aint'68.

Posted by: bevin | Aug 27 2020 23:21 utc | 97

Et Tu @ 28

Here is some broader source material:

Remember the interviewer, Adams, is a long time PEP i.e. progressive except for Palestine.

Posted by: Paul | Aug 27 2020 23:21 utc | 98

"...the terrible training and general ineptitude of the police is at the core of the problem."
You are missing the point: the Police are very well trained, and indoctrinated. There is nothing accidental in their behaviour. And the police culture is pretty well internationalised. It is very similar in Canada and the UK for example. And, as we have seen during the past year in France too.
It is a fascistic culture in which racism is an inherited and central but by no means essential part. The Police are an crucial part of the neo-liberal system. And part of the reward they get for doing as they are told, busting strikes, kettling demonstrators, terrorising poor neighbourhoods and protecting private property, is a loose rein: they can do more or less anything that they want. No Judge will do more than slap their wrists, the Juries will thank them for their service. For certain personalities, in which US culture is richly endowed, the right to run wild as part of the biggest biker gang in the world, is a marvellous reward.
They are not only heavily armed but recruited, in large measure from the imperial armed forces; there is nothing like a tour of duty in Afghanistan or Iraq to demonstrate impunity in action.
The cops are the iron fist in the class system, defended by the judiciary, the legislatures and the broad ideological apparatus, from the media to the educational system. And backed up by armed and civilian militias, in most of which off duty cops and 'veterans' of imperial adventures play leading roles. The police stations are gang headquarters in which violence and contempt for democracy and legality are celebrated. And bullying is the secret to success and advancement.
To put the matter in perspective- cops shoot about 1000 US civilians a year, about 25 a week. And most of them are poor people, a constituency in which Black people are over represented after centuries of discrimination and exploitation regimes enforced by violence.
The neo-liberal ideology, like many of its predecessor bodies of ideas and alibis for theft, teaches people that poverty is a mark of personal failure and moral turpitude. It also teaches that crime pays and that it is a constant temptation for the poor who, left unregulated, would help themselves to the wealth that members of the ruling class worked so hard for, from the very earliest age, by choosing the right fallopian tubes to crawl into.
It may be that b is right in his analysis. But it is also possible that-given the stark nature of the facts surrounding these cases- public opinion will recognise that the one constant in all these problems is the police system and the Gulags for private profit which not only dwarf anything the Soviet Union ever developed, in terms of numbers, but in terms of licence, unregulated violence and disregard for natural law hark back to the worst days of the plantation culture.
If such a reaction takes place it will lead to the formation of self defence militias where they are needed on the communities of the poor. And the failure of Biden /Harris would be a positive development in the discrediting of the corrupt "misleadership" class exemplified in the campaign to defeat Sanders and nominate Biden, which was based on the sense, in the Black community, that the Democrats- headed by the author of incarceration laws and one of the most evil prosecutors California has seen in the modern era-are their only protection.
The obvious alternative is that put forward by the Black Panthers-self defence, self policing, community cooperation and expelling the state's terrorists from the places where they are doing most harm. As the case of the 17 year old vigilante demonstrates, unless communities do police themselves not only will the state invade them, it will also facilitate the invasions of fascist militias.
Does anyone really believe that the silly 17 year old was the only vigilante shooting that night? Or that he was doing so on his own initiative? There is something very sick about the way in which the excuses for him- he shot a sex offender (so that's OK then!), one of the protestors (no chance it was a provocateur then) allegedly had a Molotov Cocktail (that one is straight out of the Gestapo playbook).
b is right about one thing: the kid is too young to understand what he is doing. But kids of his age are being incarcerated every day- which is how the likes of Shamela Harris made their livings and founded their careers.

Posted by: bevin | Aug 27 2020 23:21 utc | 99

@Posted by: Suzan | Aug 27 2020 22:03 utc | 88

"Perhaps I should have more patience but as of reading half way through these comments nobody has mentioned that one need be at least 18 years old to carry a weapon in Illinois."

Just speculating here--no direct knowledge, but the the deer hunting culture is strong in the N.IL->WI area (ironically the hot spot for cervid Chronic Wasting Disease in the US ), and there are likely legal exemptions and loopholes (ie. under parental/guardian OK/supervision, HS-ROTC(?)/youth police cadet firearms training certifications programs, etc) for people under the age of 18(?) or 21(? ), to use a long gun in either state.

On the other hand...

Posted by: gm | Aug 27 2020 23:34 utc | 100

next page »

The comments to this entry are closed.