Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 29, 2020

U.S. Officials Disseminate Disinformation About 'Virus Disinformation'

In another round of their anti-Russian disinformation campaign 'U.S. government officials' claim that some websites loosely connected to Russia are spreading 'virus disinformation'.

However, no 'virus disinformation' can be found on those sites.

The Associated Press as well as the New York Times were briefed by the 'officials' and provided write ups.

AP: US officials: Russia behind spread of virus disinformation

Two Russians who have held senior roles in Moscow’s military intelligence service known as the GRU have been identified as responsible for a disinformation effort meant to reach American and Western audiences, U.S. government officials said. They spoke to The Associated Press on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly.

The information had previously been classified, but officials said it had been downgraded so they could more freely discuss it. Officials said they were doing so now to sound the alarm about the particular websites and to expose what they say is a clear link between the sites and Russian intelligence.

Between late May and early July, one of the officials said, the websites singled out Tuesday published about 150 articles about the pandemic response, including coverage aimed either at propping up Russia or denigrating the U.S.

Among the headlines that caught the attention of U.S. officials were “Russia’s Counter COVID-19 Aid to America Advances Case for Détente,” which suggested that Russia had given urgent and substantial aid to the U.S. to fight the pandemic, and “Beijing Believes COVID-19 is a Biological Weapon,” which amplified statements by the Chinese.

The first mentioned piece, Russia's Counter-COVID Aid To America Advances The Case For A New Detente, is by the well known author Andrew Korybko,  a U.S. political analyst living in Moscow. It was published at OneWorld.press. The essay discussed the Russian Coronavirus aid flown in early April from Russia to the U.S. The analyst concludes that such aid can be seen as the beginning of a new détente between the U.S. and Russia.

There is zero 'virus disinformation' in the Korybko piece. The aid flight did happen and was widely reported. In a response to the allegations the proprietors of OneWorld point out that Secretary of State Mike Pompeo in a recent Q&A also alluded to a new détente with Russia. Was that also 'virus disinformation'?

The second piece the 'officials' pointed out, Beijing believes COVID-19 is a biological weapon, was written In March by Lucas Leiroz, a "research fellow in international law at the Federal University of Rio de Janeiro". It is an exaggerating analysis of the comments and questions a spokesperson of the Chinese Foreign Ministry had made about the possible sources of the Coronavirus.

The original spokesperson quote is in the piece. Referring to additional sources the author's interpretation may go a bit beyond the quote's meaning. But it is certainly not 'virus disinformation' to raise the same speculative question about the potential sources of the virus which at that time many others were also asking.

The piece was published by InfoBRICS.org, a "BRICS information portal" which publishes in the languages of the BRICS countries (Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa). It is presumably financed by some or all of those countries.

Another website the 'U.S. officials' have pointed out is InfoRos.ru which publishes in Russian and English. The AP notes of it:

A headline Tuesday on InfoRos.ru about the unrest roiling American cities read “Chaos in the Blue Cities,” accompanying a story that lamented how New Yorkers who grew up under the tough-on-crime approach of former Mayors Rudy Giuliani and Michael Bloomberg “and have zero street smarts” must now “adapt to life in high-crime urban areas.”

Another story carried the headline of “Ukrainian Trap for Biden,” and claimed that “Ukrainegate” — a reference to stories surrounding Biden’s son Hunter’s former ties to a Ukraine gas company — “keeps unfolding with renewed vigor.”

U.S. officials have identified two of the people believed to be behind the sites’ operations. The men, Denis Valeryevich Tyurin and Aleksandr Gennadyevich Starunskiy, have previously held leadership roles at InfoRos but have also served in a GRU unit specializing in military psychological intelligence and maintain deep contacts there, the officials said.

InfoRos calls itself a 'news agency' and has some rather boring general interest stuff on its site. But how is its writing in FOX News style about unrest in U.S. cities and about Biden's escapades in the Ukraine 'virus disinformation'? I fail to find any on that site.

In 2018 some "western intelligence agency" told the Washington Post, without providing any evidence, that InfoRos is related to the Russian military intelligence service GU (formerly GRU):

Unit 54777 has several front organizations that are financed through government grants as public diplomacy organizations but are covertly run by the GRU and aimed at Russian expatriates, the intelligence officer said. Two of the most significant are InfoRos and the Institute of the Russian Diaspora.

So InfoRos is getting some public grants and was allegedly previously run by two people who before that worked for the GU. What does that say about the current state and the content it provides? Nothing.

The NYT adds that hardly anyone is reading the websites the 'U.S. officials' pointed out but that their content is at times copied by more prominent aggregator sites:

“What we have seen from G.R.U. operations is oftentimes the social media component is a flop, but the narrative content that they write is shared more broadly through the niche media ecosystem,” said Renee DiResta, a research manager at the Stanford Internet Observatory, who has studied the G.R.U. and InfoRos ties and propaganda work.

There are plenty of sites who copy content from various outlets and reproduce it under their name. But that does not turn whatever they publish into disinformation.

All the pieces mentioned by AP and NYT and attributed to the 'Russian' sites are basically factual and carry no 'virus disinformation'. That makes the 'U.S.officials' claims that they do such the real disinformation campaign.

And the AP and NYT are willingly falling for it.

 

Posted by b on July 29, 2020 at 16:56 UTC | Permalink

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People being prepared for Russia having the worlds first covid19 vaccine, the US will of course say it was stolen from them. Infantile politicians create infantile press to feed infantile articles to adult children. Critical thinking skills do not exist in the US population.

Posted by: Getald | Jul 29 2020 17:44 utc | 1

There's a corporativist aspect to all of this.

The development of propagation of information/disinformation through the internet eroded the power of the old newspapers/news agencies. It's not that this or that particular website is getting more views, but that the web of communications - the the imperialistic blunders + decline of capitalism post-2008 -, as a whole, weakened what seemed to be an unshakeable trust on the MSM (the very fact that this term exists already is historical evidence of their loss of power).

And this process manifests itself not only in loss of power, but also loss of money: this is particularly evident in the social media, where Facebook (Whatsapp + Facebook proper) and Google are beginning to siphon advertisement money from both TV and the traditional newspapers (printed press). When those traditional printed newspapers went digital, they behaved badly, by using paywalls - this marketing blunder only accelerated their decline in readership and thus further advertisement money, generating a vicious cycle for them.

The loss of influence of public opinion for the MSM also inaugurated another very important societal shift: the middle class' loss of monopoly over opinion and formation of opinion. Historically, it was the role of the middle class to be highly educated, to go to academia (college) and, most importantly, to daily read the newspapers while eating the breakfast. The middle class was the class of the intellectuals by definition, thus served as the clerical class of the capitalist class, the priests of capitalism. With the popularization of the internet, the smartphone and social media, this sanctity was broken or, at least, begun to deteriorate. We can attest this class conflict phenomenon by studying the rise of the term "expert" as a pejorative one. In the West's case, this shift begun through the far-right side of the political spectrum, but the shift is there.

The popularization of what was once a privilege is nothing new in capitalism. The problem here is that capitalism depends on infinite growth to merely exist (i.e. it can't survive on zero growth, it is mathematically impossible), so it has to "monetize" what still isn't monetize in order to find/create more vital space (Lebensraum - a term coined by the hyper-capitalist Nazis) for its expansion and thus survival. Hence the popularization of college education in the USA (then in Europe). Hence the popularization of daily news through the internet/social media. This process, of course, has its positives and negatives (as is the case with every dialectical process) - the fall of the MSM is one of the positives.

So, in fact, when the likes of AP, Reuters, NYT, WaPo, Guardian, Fox, CNN spread disinformation against "alt-media", they are really just protecting their market share - the fact that it implies in suppression of freedom of speech and to mass disinformation and, ultimately, to war and destruction, is merely collateral damage of the business they operate in. They are, after all, capitalist enterprises above all.

Posted by: vk | Jul 29 2020 17:44 utc | 2

Excellent analysis, as always, by b. And vk's points are very pertinent too. One tiny quibble: I doubt that the Nazis coined, though they certainly popularised, the term lebensraum.
There is an air of desperation about these campaigns against "Russian" "disinformation" massive changes are occurring, and, because they are so vast, they are moving relatively slowly.
The old media model, now totally outdated, was the first thing to fall. Now capitalism itself is collapsing as a result of the primary contradiction that, left to itself, the marketplace will solve all problems.
As Washington, where magical thinking is sovereign, is demonstrating, left to itself the hidden hand will bring only misery, famine, death and the Apocalypse. This was once very well understood, as a brief look at the history of the founding of the UN will show, now it is the subject of frantic denial by capitalism's priesthood who have grown to enjoy the glitter and sensuality of life in a brothel. It is a sign of their mental decay that they can do no better than to blame Russians.

Posted by: bevin | Jul 29 2020 18:16 utc | 3

One should presume the anonymous officials responsible for this ground-breaking report (sarc) are close to the various "combatting Russian disinformation" NGOs. They are merely living up to the mission statements of their benefactors. AP and NYTimes are being unprofessional and spreading fake news by failing to reveal their sources. It's mind-numbing - the BS one must wade through.

Posted by: jayc | Jul 29 2020 18:23 utc | 4

@ b who ended his posting with
"
And the AP and NYT are willingly falling for it.
"

Sorry b, but AP and NYT are active participants in the disinformation campaign of failing empire and are not falling for anything

The folks that are falling for it are the American public that has lost its ability to discriminate with the fire hose volume of lies told to them on a daily basis.

Empire is in the process of defeating itself which is the only safe way of ending the tyranny of global private finance. I commend China and Russia for having the patience and fortitude to hold the safe space for the dysfunctional social contract having private control of the lifeblood of human commerce to self destruct.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jul 29 2020 19:19 utc | 5

This is SO hilarious! The propagandists are worried about Russian virus dis-information when most dis-information has come from the US government in the person of Trump and from the CDC, which spent months discrediting the effectiveness of face masks!!!

Theses propagandists need to get real jobs dealing with real world problems.

Posted by: JohnH | Jul 29 2020 19:21 utc | 6

This is SO hilarious! The propagandists are worried about Russian virus dis-information when most dis-information has come from the US government in the person of Trump and from the CDC, which spent months discrediting the effectiveness of face masks!!!

Theses propagandists need to get real jobs dealing with real world problems.

Posted by: JohnH | Jul 29 2020 19:21 utc | 7

there has been no national response to coronavirus but there must be a national acceptance that this national non-response is China's fault. and any sources reporting truthfully about the US or disseminating statements easily found elsewhere, as long as they are Russian, Chinese, Venezuelan, Cuban, Iranian, etc., is pure disinformation. How brittle and weak the US is. Where's the Pericles to say to the Spartans, "enter our city and inspect our defenses"? The US is a nation of heavily-armed mice and sheep.

btw, the China love on display around here is pretty funny. in that the Chinese government has mounted a national response to a very serious threat, China is a nation in a way that the US is not. There is no US or we would not have 50 states doing different things in response to the corona outbreak. the US is already dead. But China is a thoroughly authoritarian capitalist state. they are who they are in a dialectic competition with the US and other capitalist powers, not because of some Maoist-Confucian amalgam that inspires such wisdom in their brilliant leaders, who are just as quick to destroy their environment for capitalist gain as anyone on this planet is. The decline of the US will not make China or Russia or any "emerging" power less authoritarian or violent. au quite the contraire. They are Shylocks who will try to better instruction.

However, none of this is of concern to people in the US, whose only concern is the Nazi spawn who've been running "the West" for much longer than the last 75 years. but it's time to kill the bitch, not let it keep screwing us and breeding.

Posted by: jason | Jul 29 2020 19:25 utc | 8

Russia’s rush to have the first COVID vaccine will be viewed by the propagandists as just another evil attempt by Putin to embarrass the US. Should it prove safe and effective, you can bet that it will be banned in USA, because anything Russian is by definition bad.
https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/russia-hopes-register-worlds-first-covid-19-vaccine-aug-12

Posted by: JohnH | Jul 29 2020 19:30 utc | 9

As others already said, this is a bit rich, considering that virus disinformation comes from Trump himself, both live and on Twitter, quoting genuine hacks and megalomaniac doctors, depending on the week.
Reality check: Russians will be able to travel across the world way before Americans, for obvious healthcare reasons.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Jul 29 2020 19:46 utc | 10

@2 I would think adblocking has a lot to do with it too. I'm always surprised that it has been allowed to continue.

Posted by: dh | Jul 29 2020 19:50 utc | 11

Out of the supposed 15 million confirmed cases worldwide, only 4.1 percent of those resulted in death. In other words if you catch it you have generally a 96 percent chance of surviving it. 80 percent of persons with covid have mild to no symptoms at all.

Better efficacy than most vaccines already out there.

The hysteria and huge governmental overreaction and overreach is nowhere near warranted.

Who stands to gain the most? Big Pharma.

Anyone who can't see this scamdemic for what it truly is has been breathing too much of their own CO2.
Biggest and most powerful lobby in Washington DC and the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit margins in the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit centers for Big Pharma? vaccinations.


If a mask is all one needs to protect themselves from a supposedly contagious and deadly virus why would you need to have a BSL 4 suit in a BSL 4 lab to work with said viruses?

Posted by: O | Jul 29 2020 20:00 utc | 12

Posted by: bevin | Jul 29 2020 18:16 utc | 3

Bevin, I agree, I once had a short exchange on Mondoweiss about the term Lebensraum, it had been used in some type of marketing by my favorite Swizz supermarket. Which then, apparently caused an uproar. The term Lebensraum on its own is rather innocent. Leben (life) Raum (space), a noun compound. Context matters. And I am sure I checked it, and Micros definitively did not use it in any type of world conquering settler context. I haven't stumbled yet across a Micros supermarket anywhere outside Switzerland, ;)

Here is link to the German Wiki entry via Google translate:
https://tinyurl.com/Wikipedia-Lebensraum

Posted by: moon | Jul 29 2020 20:13 utc | 13

@ Posted by: donkeytale | Jul 29 2020 18:42 utc | 5; Posted by: jason | Jul 29 2020 19:25 utc | 9

Err... this post is not about China.

I think you are the rabid ideologues seeing ghosts, not me.

Posted by: vk | Jul 29 2020 20:24 utc | 14

AGREE with psychohistorian @ 6

The NTT no longer qualifies as "the paper of record". More like toilet paper if nothing better can be found.

Posted by: Perimetr | Jul 29 2020 20:34 utc | 15

apologies, meant NYT, i.e. New York Times

Posted by: Perimetr | Jul 29 2020 20:35 utc | 16

I'm under the impression that Info Ros is a Russian government-funded, supported, backed, site, it certainly looks like it and its reportage is decidedly 'neutral'.

Posted by: barovsky | Jul 29 2020 20:38 utc | 17

This is SO hilarious! The propagandists are worried about Russian virus dis-information when most dis-information has come from the US government in the person of Trump and from the CDC, which spent months discrediting ...
Posted by: JohnH | Jul 29 2020 19:21 utc | 8

This is close to my overall take on matters. But I wouldn't put so much emphasis on face masks but on something along the lines of Covid is notthing but a flu. Face masks were initially discussed quite controversially everywhere.

For Georgio Agamben too, strictly a favorite of mine, it was simply another State of Exception too. Suppressive biopolitics:
https://www.journal-psychoanalysis.eu/coronavirus-and-philosophers/

************

Were it gets interesting is here:
A report published last month by a second, nongovernmental organization, Brussels-based EU DisinfoLab, examined links between InfoRos and One World to Russian military intelligence. The researchers identified technical clues tying their websites to Russia and identified some financial connections between InfoRos and the government.

Gotta add that institution to my link list collection on matters.
EU disinfo Lab
https://www.disinfo.eu/publications/how-two-information-portals-hide-their-ties-to-the-russian-news-agency-inforos

They have a competitor which seems Bruxelles based too, Patrick Armstrong alerted me to a while ago:
https://euvsdisinfo.eu/
EUvsDisinfo is the flagship project of the European External Action Service’s East StratCom Task Force

************

But yes, on first sight InfoRos seems to be neatly aligned with US alt-Right-Media in basic outlook. More than with the US MSM.

And now I first have to read what has been on Andrew Korybko's mind lately. ;)

Posted by: blum | Jul 29 2020 20:41 utc | 18


sorry didn't close html tag.

Posted by: blum | Jul 29 2020 20:42 utc | 19

Integrity Initiative strikes again. AP and NYT rush faithfully to print. Journalist gets an extra dime.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 29 2020 21:20 utc | 20

Many Americans of all walks of life do not trust their own government, yet most people here seem to have faith that their media outlets are telling the truth. How do you break through to the public that has utter faith in whatever newspaper or television channel they prefer and highlight the lies in a way which gains real traction?

I believe it takes leadership, which, for Americans, mean celebrities have to endorse the idea or it likely won't be taken seriously. This cult of celebrity is mirrored on social media platforms, where millions flock to be a part of some beautiful person's beautiful photograph or some known personalities acceptable opinion du jour.

There is a great bond gripping the minds of American media consumers. They have trained their entire lives to worship at the cult of celebrity and this is the key to breaking the entire media landscape down for them.

This also is the key to unlocking the voices of those who know better with regards to media lies, but keep silent out of fear.

Will a Joe Rogan or Tucker Carlson be able to break the spell? I think it will never happen based on how Hollywood gatekeeps celebrity and based on how hopelessly apathetic most are to Julian Assange.

Posted by: Rutherford82 | Jul 29 2020 22:13 utc | 21

Lol I write for One World. I'm an American who has never had a piece edited or been told what to write. I was allowed to write a piece about Russia where I was critical of their policy of backing the STC in Yemen (I thought it was bad to divide Yemen). No one makes anybody tow any specific line. I decided not to publish my piece on Russia and the STC in Yemen because I didn't find the topic interesting enough, but I was 100% allowed to be critical of Russia.

If it's a GRU outfit then it's a bad one.

Posted by: Ben Barbour | Jul 29 2020 22:36 utc | 22

Lol I write for One World. I'm an American who has never had a piece edited or been told what to write.
...
Posted by: Ben Barbour | Jul 29 2020 22:36 utc | 23

Is it possible that you're just the in-house joke at OW?
If they don't care that you'd write "tow" instead of "toe" or that you're too lazy/thoughtless to reproduce the full name of the entity for which STC is an acronym, before using the acronym, then it suggests that One World's Editorial Standards are as lax as your own :-)

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 29 2020 23:14 utc | 23

"... Two Russians who have held senior roles in Moscow’s military intelligence service known as the GRU have been identified as responsible for a disinformation effort meant to reach American and Western audiences, U.S. government officials said. They spoke to The Associated Press on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly ..."

Of course GRU agents always work in pairs, guided only by the mysterious telepathic powers of the Russian President and no-one or nothing else, as Alexander Petrov and Ruslan Boshirov did in Salisbury in March 2018 when they supposedly tried to assassinate or send a warning to Sergei Skripal, and as Dmitri Kovtun and Andrei Lugovoy did in London in November 2006 when they apparently put polonium in a pot of tea served to Alexander Litvinenko in full view of patrons and staff at a hotel restaurant. It's as if each agent carries only half a brain and each half is connected to its complement by the corpus callosum that is Lord Vlademort Putin's thoughts beaming oing-yoing-yoing-like through the atmosphere until they find their targets.

And of course US government officials always speak on condition of anonymity.

As Agence Presse News puts it:

"... The information had previously been classified, but officials said it had been downgraded so they could more freely discuss it. Officials said they were doing so now to sound the alarm about the particular websites and to expose what they say is a clear link between the sites and Russian intelligence ..."

So if US government officials can now freely discuss declassified news, why do they insist on being anonymous? This would be the sort of news announced at a US national press club meeting with Matt Lee in the front row asking awkward and discomfiting questions.

Posted by: Jen | Jul 29 2020 23:29 utc | 24

The malicious cultivation (including Gain of Function research) and implantation of this biowarfare agent (and other ones such as Swine Fever) by the U.S. Intelligence services in various places around the world (especially in China and Iran), the intentional faulty responses and deceptive statistics administered by the monopoly-controlled medical establishment, the feigned inability to provide adequate testing, care, and treatment, along with planned economic destruction as a means of restoring investor losses and control of populations through stifling of dissent, are at the heart of the deflection and projection of blame. That broadly-based subject is barely discussed in alternative media and is totally obfuscated in MSM, because the "denier-debunkers" dispute the possibility of such extreme malice existing in our institutions, in spite of previous experience with events such as 9/11 and the '08 financial crisis.

Posted by: norecovery | Jul 29 2020 23:35 utc | 25

...
So if US government officials can now freely discuss declassified news, why do they insist on being anonymous?
...
Posted by: Jen | Jul 29 2020 23:29 utc | 25

Precisely.
My guess is that they don't know when to quit.
and/or
They embrace the Mythbusters motto...
"If a thing's worth doing, it's worth overdoing."

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 29 2020 23:48 utc | 26

"Is it possible that you're just the in-house joke at OW?
If they don't care that you'd write "tow" instead of "toe" or that you're too lazy/thoughtless to reproduce the full name of the entity for which STC is an acronym, before using the acronym, then it suggests that One World's Editorial Standards are as lax as your own :-)"

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 29 2020 23:14 utc | 24

Fair point on tow vs toe. That's why editing exists when writing articles. As for the STC part, that is common knowledge if you follow basic geopolitics. When making a post in a comment thread, should I write out "Islamic State of Iraq and Syria" before using the acronym ISIS? If I am posting in a comment thread about Iran, do I need to write out "Mujahedin-e Khalq" instead of just using MEK?

It just displays a massive level of ignorance on your part. Nice try though.

Posted by: Benson Barbour | Jul 29 2020 23:54 utc | 27

...
It just displays a massive level of ignorance on your part. Nice try though.
Posted by: Benson Barbour | Jul 29 2020 23:54 utc | 28

Thanks. Do you realise that you've just wasted 50+ words explaining why BB didn't bother writing the 3 words that STC stands for?

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 30 2020 0:29 utc | 28

Global media moguls are blaming the 1,000 American deaths per day from the Wuhan coronavirus on Donald Trump to finally get him out of the way. But they are silent on their and the Democrats complicity in the death toll due to the lack of a national public health system or the funding to pay for it.

The USA is going to hell. A scapegoat is needed. For the media and Democrats, Russia is to blame. Anybody else rather than themselves, the true culprits. Donald Trump blames China for the pandemic if he acknowledges it at all but that is where all of Tim Cook’s iPhones are made. Blaming China is globalist heresy.

Posted by: VietnamVet | Jul 30 2020 0:59 utc | 29

norecovery @Jul29 23:35 #26

I think there's a reasonable case to be made that this is what has occurred.

And, if true, it is covered up by sly suggestions that nCov-19 was man-made with hints or a smug attitude that convey the message that China created the virus. As well as a virtual black-out in Western media of Chinese suggestions that the virus may have started in USA or been planted in Wuhan.

But then, I already stand accused of attributing magical powers of self-interested foresight and boldness to US Deep-State due to my belief that Trump was their choice to lead USA in 2016. And so I expect you're theory will receive the same derision. Yet Empires have not been shy about killing millions when it was in their interest to do so.

In any case, I've written many times that USA/West's unwillingness to fight the virus has been dressed up as innocent mistakes. Even if the West wasn't the source of the virus they have much to answer for. Yet very few have taken note of the way that USA/West have played the pandemic to advance their interests - from lining the pockets of Big Pharma to blaming China for their own "incompetence" (a misnomer: the power-elite are very competent at advancing their interests!).

Inconvenient Truths:


!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 30 2020 1:03 utc | 30

It seems disinformation has been redefined to mean information that counters someone else's (yours) belief. We pretend to be in an Age of Reason but really, we have just replaced religious beliefs with secular beliefs. Science has been taken over by pseudoscientists that have replaced priests. The conflict of interest by the science/priests who profit from their deceptions is beyond criminal.

To know what is the truth you just have to look at whats being censored. Nobody being censored for supporting mask mandates, claiming vaccines are safe, and not questioning the blatant data manipulation of COVID cases that anyone with an open mind and IQ of 100 , and who reads the data, definitions and studies can see through.

It seems people on both sides of the fence have replaced their brains with their chosen ideology. Its like watching a Christian, Jew and Muslim arguing which is the best or true religion. No point in it.

Posted by: Kay Fabe | Jul 30 2020 1:29 utc | 31

thanks b!

so, lets say GRU agents are feeding russian propaganda sites... how does that compare to all the CIA-FBI agents and has been hacks working for the western msm?? seems a bit rich for the pot to be calling a kettle black, even if they are lying thru their teeth! i am sure if someone did a story on how many CIA - m16 people are presently working with the western msm, they would have a story with some legs... this shite from anonymous usa gov't officials is just that - shite..

@ Ben, or Benson Barbour .. thanks for your comments!

Posted by: james | Jul 30 2020 1:33 utc | 32

Anyone notice that the Democrats still haven't presented any plan whatsoever to flatten the curve in the US? They are just as bad as Trump.

Posted by: Prof K | Jul 30 2020 1:50 utc | 33

Ben Barbou @ 23

Lol I write for One World. I'm an American who has never had a piece edited or been told what to write. I was allowed to write a piece about Russia where I was critical of their policy of backing the STC in Yemen (I thought it was bad to divide Yemen). No one makes anybody tow any specific line. I decided not to publish my piece on Russia and the STC in Yemen because I didn't find the topic interesting enough, but I was 100% allowed to be critical of Russia.

There's such a thing as self-censorship. Mainstream US news has effectively brought up folks to be this way: stay in line or become unemployed- doesn't need to be stated. Not aimed at you, but it needs to be said (und understood).

Posted by: Seer | Jul 30 2020 1:55 utc | 34

"So InfoRos is getting some public grants and was allegedly previously run by two people who before that worked for the GU. What does that say about the current state and the content it provides? Nothing."

More importantly, what does it say about CNN, MSNBC and all the other "news organizations" who have former Pentagon and CIA people acting as "consultants" and act as stenographers for the US Deep State?

In other words, pot, meet kettle.

The real problem: Ninety-five percent (if not higher) of the dumb US electorate will buy this story. Even people in the infosec community who should know better. Even people in right-wing militias who *don't* trust the US government will believe it.

This is how deep the brainwashing as a result of an entire generation or more of biased "news" goes in this country.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 30 2020 2:20 utc | 35

@35 That's a very good point. I completely agree. Self-censorship and group think are two of the biggest problems in modern journalism/analysis. One World consistently publishes pro-Pakistan and pro-China articles. When I was first sending them submissions, I did a piece on US vs China in Sudan and South Sudan. I considered omitting China's culpability in escalating the conflicts, and instead focus on laying the blame squarely at the feet of the US. In the end I told the truth about both countries' imperialist escalations (to the best of my ability).

There is a lot of incentive to self-censor at just about any outlet. It's more comfortable to fit in with a site's brand.

In the case of the Russia-STC article, I really just found the subject matter to be thin. Russia's support of the STC is mostly just diplomatic. Not a lot to write about.

Posted by: Ben Barbour | Jul 30 2020 3:14 utc | 36

Posted by: Kay Fabe | Jul 30 2020 1:29 utc | 32 To know what is the truth you just have to look at whats being censored.

Almost nothing is being "censored" except by the big social media platforms - and even that is haphazard, because, as TechDirt continually reaffirms "content moderation at scale is impossible."

Your problem is that what you think is being "censored" is what *you* believe in, namely all your anti-mask, anti-vaccine, "it's just the flu" bullshit. In reality, all that is spreading all over the place and what you call "censorship" is just the experts debunking it on a daily basis.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 30 2020 3:36 utc | 37

Think you can't possibly be more outraged than you already are?

Try this --
The Government's Weapon Against Reality Winner: COVID-19
By John Kiriakou, Reader Supported News
27 July 20
https://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/64239-the-governments-weapon-against-reality-winner-covid-19

Posted by: AntiSpin | Jul 30 2020 3:55 utc | 38

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 30 2020 0:29 utc | 29

Google or duckduckgo "STC in Yemen". First hit, it's not that hard.

Posted by: One Too Many | Jul 30 2020 4:09 utc | 39

Trump just lost the only consistent polling advantage he had over Biden: analyst

Trump is toast. The majority don't believe he's "better on the economy" - which has been his "saving grace" (only among morons) all through his term. I wouldn't call an election that still three months away, but unless something radically changes for him, this doesn't look good. Well, it's good for *us*. LOL Even Biden can't be worse than Trump, in my view - although I'm sure Biden will try to be.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 30 2020 5:36 utc | 40

Posted by: james | Jul 30 2020 1:33 utc | 33

Small wonder that food from Anglozionists is so bad, they love being in the kitchen but they can't stand the heat.

Posted by: J W | Jul 30 2020 5:39 utc | 41

The Americans are increasingly unhinged in their spittle-flecked accusations against not only Russia, but also China, Iran, Venezuela, etc.

It's so pathetic as to be humorous.

Underlying the USA's Two Minutes of Hate campaigns, however, is a deeper disease that defines Americans as a nation and as a people.

Namely, Americans have an inbred fundamentalist belief in their own Moral Superiority as the Beacon of Liberty, Land of the Free, blah, blah, blah--no matter how many nations they have bombed back to the Stone Age, invaded, colonized, regime changed, sanctioned, or economically raped in the name of Freedom and Democracy™.

Donald Trump is half correct.

The United States of America is truly a great nation alright--but great only in terms of its deceit, great in terms of its delusions, and great in terms of the horrors that it has inflicted on much of the world.

Comparing America to the Nazis would be a high insult ... to Nazi Germany, as the Third Reich only lasted about 12 years, while the American Reich has unfortunately lasted well over 200 years and gotten away with its crimes against humanity by possessing what are likely the greatest propaganda machine and political deception in human history: the American Free Press and the world historic lie called "American Freedom."

Harold Pinter in his 2005 Nobel Literature Prize speech briefly but powerfully exposes this heart of American darkness:

"The crimes of the United States have been systematic, constant, vicious, remorseless, but very few people have actually talked about them. You have to hand it to America. It has exercised a quite clinical manipulation of power worldwide while masquerading as a force for universal good. It’s a brilliant, even witty, highly successful act of hypnosis.

I put to you that the United States is without doubt the greatest show on the road. Brutal, indifferent, scornful and ruthless it may be but it is also very clever. As a salesman it is out on its own and its most saleable commodity is self love. It’s a winner."

https://www.nobelprize.org/prizes/literature/2005/pinter/25621-harold-pinter-nobel-lecture-2005/

Posted by: ak74 | Jul 30 2020 5:40 utc | 42

And the disinformation in the USA continues.
https://www.rt.com/usa/496578-fauci-coronavirus-eye-protection/

"Top US immunologist Dr Anthony Fauci is now saying citizens are not “complete” in protecting themselves from the Covid-19 pandemic unless they go beyond wearing a mask and add in eye protection like goggles, too."

More provocation from the oligarchy. Now, that masks are becoming less controversial, time to step up the provocation, division and control.

Fauci is also behind the anti-hydroxychloroquine propaganda, as well, that even b has swallowed. This, despite it being used effectively in other countries. All of this simply because Trump supports it (ergo, it must be bad) and Big Pharma (who control Fauci,
CDC abd WHO) can't profit significantly from its use.

Of course vacines are still an issue:
https://www.globalresearch.ca/kennedy-jr-warns-parents-about-danger-using-largely-untested-covid-vaccines-kids/5719566

"During the course of the debate, Kennedy also talked about the regular vaccines most people take, from Hepatitis B to the flu shot, emphasizing that no proper testing had ever been done, which is mandatory for any other medication. Vaccines “are the only medical product that does not have to be safety-tested against a placebo,” he explained."

Kennedy said

“it’s not hypothetical that vaccines cause injury, and that injuries are not rare. The vaccine courts have paid out four billion dollars” over the past three decades, “and the threshold for getting back into a vaccine court and getting a judgment – [the Department of Health and Human Services] admits that fewer than one percent of people who are injured ever even get to court.”

So, how well has the Russian vaccine been tested? Does anyone know?


Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Jul 30 2020 6:23 utc | 43

It is interesting how USAians are being played by the oligarchy.

On foreign policy, the dems and reps are in basic agreement and the propaganda is to bring the masses together to hate Russia, Chaina and anyone else who the Western (US) oligarchy has targeted.

Domestically, unity is the enemy of the oligarchy. The masses must be controlled through division and diversion, so the dems and reps play good cop, bad cop (bad and good being relative to the supporter) to ensure the masses are diverted from important oligarch issues to issues of irrelevance to the oligarchs, but easily manipulated emotionnally by the oligarchs for the beast.

It seems so obvious, and yet, works so well.

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Jul 30 2020 6:40 utc | 44

Posted by: VietnamVet | Jul 30 2020 0:59 utc | 30

"[...]Donald Trump blames China for the pandemic if he acknowledges it at all but that is where all of Tim Cook’s iPhones are made. Blaming China is globalist heresy."


Then why do you phrase it the "Wuhan coronavius" yourself?

Posted by: vato | Jul 30 2020 7:31 utc | 45

Posted by: ak74 | Jul 30 2020 5:40 utc | 40

Thanks for that link.

Posted by: Jams O'Donnell | Jul 30 2020 7:59 utc | 46

"Top US immunologist Dr Anthony Fauci is now saying citizens are not “complete” in protecting themselves from the Covid-19 pandemic unless they go beyond wearing a mask and add in eye protection like goggles, too."

He's correct. Actually if you want "perfect" protection, you need a full-head sealed respirator. Or maybe a full-body hazmat suit.

So of course RT gets it wrong. The odds of getting a viral load via your eyes is probably *much* less than getting it through your normal respiratory organs - mouth and nose.

I recall an interview with a Singapore expert who, when asked about eye protection, pointed out to the interviewer that the interviewer was wearing glasses - which would probably be sufficient, just like a face shield serves to block the bulk of projected contagious air - even if it doesn't block all of it. The stuff that gets around the shield is bad, too, but it's a lot less bad than getting a face-full.

As I've been saying all along, it's entirely a matter of probabilities. Anything that gets in the way of the virus particles getting to your nose or mouth - and eyes - is helpful. Back that up with washed hands and staying away from other people and it's pretty hard for the virus to get to you.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 30 2020 8:50 utc | 47

For those interested in corona virus truth,
I am interested in the question —- was it spread by negligence or deliberately?
That question must be relivant to this debate on MOA.
I ask this now becouse——
Tonight on bbc ‘panorama’ there investigating the spread of the virus from Hospital to care homes !! I’m told there is some pretty shocking information exposed.
Some may wish to catch that prog. Heads up.

I just add an obversation. — western psychopathic disinformation and projection has led to a confused public. A public deciding to disengage with politics. To the gain of the psychopaths.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 9:32 utc | 48

A new candidate to the demonization and disinfo operations has been added...Germany...which has been labeled "delinquent" by the POTUS...in a clear exercise of projection...

https://www.rt.com/news/496584-germany-withdrawl-troops-gas/

Of course, to not be insulted or labeled delinquent, you must act as these other countries enumerated by Southcom commander, to work for the US ( not your country...) and moreover pay for it....Typical mafia extortion, isn´t it?

https://twitter.com/kopamaros/status/1285292016885215237

Posted by: H.Schmatz | Jul 30 2020 10:41 utc | 49

norecovery #26

That broadly-based subject is barely discussed in alternative media and is totally obfuscated in MSM, because the "denier-debunkers" dispute the possibility of such extreme malice existing in our institutions, in spite of previous experience with events such as 9/11 and the '08 financial crisis.

YES to that and thank you for that post. That the institutions of state and private sectors are the incubators and propagators of extreme malice is axiomatic in the UKUSAI and its five eyed running dogs is beyond doubt. They attack and scorn any critic or unbeliever. They assault and pillory truth speakers and those who might question 'their narrative'.

Then if all that fails the hunt them down and make preposterous claims about them being anti semitic of anti religion or anti their nation.

Mendacity is the currency of the permanent state and its minions and they need to be outed and shamed and challenged at every opportunity.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 30 2020 10:49 utc | 50

VietnamVet #30

Wuhan coronavirus you say?

Fort Detrick coronavirus would be on the mark and as you most likely know, you cannot trust the USA lying eyes once you have served them in their killing fields.

Even that right wing ex special forces advocate Steve Pieczenic testifies to the fact of a deadly virus in USA in November/December plus his beloved bloggers say way earlier than that around Maryland etc. Then there is the small problem of the 'vaping' illness that generated lots of pneumonia like fatalities in June/July. And then the instant closure of Fort Detrick due to its leaking all over the place through a totally inadequate waste water treatment plant that couldn't scrub a turd let alone a virus.

Fort Detrick Virus is closer to the reality imo.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 30 2020 11:00 utc | 51

The problem with presstitutes, possibly including Ben Barbour, (disclaimer: I've never read any media products that particular individual generated) goes beyond the point made by Seer @35. To be sure, there is no chance that a presstitute would bite the hand that feeds it, but there is more depth to the problem of why they all suck so badly, at least the ones in the US. While journalism degrees are the university equivalent of Special Education (nowadays referred to as "Exceptional Student Education", which is very fitting for students from such an "exceptional" nation), they still prepare the future presstitute to understand that their capitalist employers have interests beyond their immediately apparent ones. That is, more important to a capitalist employer than tomorrow's sales and profits is the preservation of capitalism itself.

But the problem is deeper still. The presstitute that is successfully employed by a capitalist enterprise will invariably be one that knows not to criticize the employer's business, the capitalist system it depends upon, and the empire that improves that employer's profitability. More importantly, that successful hireling will additionally have been brainwashed from infancy that all of these things are good and necessary aspects of the modern world that need to be ideologically defended. The prospective presstitute will be one that not only voluntarily, but eagerly serves its capitalist masters varied interests. After all, when there are plenty of whores to choose from, would you hire one that requires explicit instructions on every last thing you expect from them and just follows those instructions mechanically or the the one that puts effort into figuring out what would please you and delivers that with enthusiasm? Keeping this dynamic in mind will allow one to better understand the capitalist mass media's products.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 30 2020 11:00 utc | 52

The contempt at which the American ruling class hold their citizens is galling. The US corporate media operates as if their targeted audience are all morons.

Posted by: Steve | Jul 30 2020 11:24 utc | 53

you cannot trust the USA lying eyes once you have served them in their killing fields. ...
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 30 2020 11:00 utc | 48

that's not a good argument, uncle t. But yes I wondered to to what extent VV or good old VietnamVet has been won over to the Trump diction.

Posted by: moon | Jul 30 2020 11:37 utc | 54

I wondered to to
I wondered too to what extent VV seemingly has been ...

Posted by: blum | Jul 30 2020 11:39 utc | 55

Mark2 @45: "...was it [novel coronavirus] spread by negligence or deliberately?"

Most likely both.

There is evidence to suggest that the virus was circulating in the US prior to it being discovered in China. While it is possible this could have been the results of testing the transmissibility of the virus, it seems more probable that it was an accidental release from Fort Detrick. This would explain the facility being shut down last year. Military facilities are never shut down simply for breaking a few rules but because those rule violations led to something unpleasant.

An accidental release, coupled with the fact that the synthetic origin of the virus would become apparent to scientists worldwide, resulted in a need to quickly establish an alternate explanation for the virus. Since the US was losing its trade war with China, and use of a bioweapon to turn the tide was already gamed out and on the table anyway, the virus (or possibly a very similar strain that had been pre-selected for the attack) was deliberately sprayed around a market in Wuhan.

The CDC and CIA probably thought that the virus was contained in the West and that since it was a surprise to the Chinese it would run rampant there and result in their economy shutting down and their borders being closed, decoupling China from the world. With the Chinese treating the virus as a bio attack and defeating its spread, followed by the virus rampaging through the West, the dynamic changed. Now in order for the virus to decouple China it must become endemic in the West. The Chinese must be made to close their borders in fear of becoming infected from the rest of the world. To make this backup plan a reality, and to get the economies moving again as fast as possible, some western leaders have decided to accelerate the spread in the hopes of quickly developing "herd immunity". Taking out some retirees whom the capitalists view as a burden on the economy is just some nice icing on the cake.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 30 2020 12:00 utc | 56

@ 51 & @ 52
I’d say not ! I’m confided Vietnam Vet is doing ‘balenced’ Reporting ! The subject of this post. Take another look at both this post and his comment. A lesson in how to be unbiased but truthfull.
Soooo any one got a definition of fake news.
Mine would be Truth before personal agenda.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:04 utc | 57

Self censorship works well.

Straight cash payoffs work well too.

CIA has had total control of media for 70 years now. It was a priority when they set up shop.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jul 30 2020 12:18 utc | 58

William Gruff @ 53
I think yours is just about the most clear and concise summary of this whole virus catastrophe that I have seen so far. And that’s a hell of a statement !
Unrelated I wonder what would have happened if the Chinese whistle blower had not blown the whistle ? Now that’s one to ponder ? As bad as this all is world wide, where would be right now ? Dose not bare thinking about.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:19 utc | 59

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:04 utc | 54

What are you trying to tell me? Anyone that does not acknowledge the virus originated in China and that China didn't respond as fast as it could have? And more polemically: there is some kind of African Marxist heading WHO who obfuscated China's late information to the WHO?

There is a dot of truth in everything. There is also a dot of truth in the fact that Trump or his relevant admin was informed early enough.

Posted by: vig | Jul 30 2020 12:21 utc | 60

Big @ 57
What ?

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:27 utc | 61

We've been acquainted with this virus about 7 months or so and it is difficult to separate reliable information from disinformation. We know very little about it, eg, we don't know whether those who recover can be reinfected. Is it like the common cold, against which there is no immunity? We just have to assume that the Trump virus has infected every level of the administration so that there is ignorance and unadulterated stupidity from the lowest level in the ministry of propaganda to the secretary of state and, of course, the president himself currently celebrating the wisdom of an animist/Christian hybrid doctor from Africa spewing the foulest disinformation one can imagine.

Posted by: jadan | Jul 30 2020 12:35 utc | 62

Big @ 57
What ?
Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:27 utc | 58

babbling: look if this is the good old VV from SST, I wouldn't want to nail him on the usage of Wuhan virus. But on the larger content of his comment, I am wondering.

Full discovery: I entered the US conspiracy universe shortly after 9/11. I'll probably never forget there was this one commenter that completely out of then current preoccupations within the diverse theories, you recall?, suggested that the Chinese were approaching via the Southern borders.

There surely should be a way how the US and Russia

Posted by: vig | Jul 30 2020 12:46 utc | 63

There surely should be a way how the US and Russia

There surely should be a way how the US and Russia repartition their claims. After all historically the Russian had some type of partly real Yellow threat too ... :)

Posted by: vig | Jul 30 2020 12:48 utc | 64

Vig @ 60
Thanks for clearing that up. Cheers

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:54 utc | 65

Can probably trace this back to the “integrity initiative” and/ or the Atlantic Council. That’s a web worth untangling with transparency.

Spot on James @ 33

Posted by: Hannibal | Jul 30 2020 12:56 utc | 66

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:19 utc | 56

Except the "whistle blower" was not a whistle blower since local, provincial, and nations institutions were already advised or in the process of being advised. Dr Wenliang posted his information in a private chatroom with other medical professionals on December 30th. Timeline of events:

Dec 27 -- Dr. Zhang Jixian, director of the respiratory and critical care medicine department of Hubei Provincial Hospital, files a report to the hospital stating that an unknown pneumonia has developed in three patients and they are not responding to influenza treatment.

Dec 29 -- Hubei Provincial Hospital convened a panel of 10 experts to discuss the now seven cases. Their conclusion that the situation was extraordinary, plus information of two similar cases in other hospitals, prompted the hospital to report directly to the municipal and provincial health authorities.

Dec 30 -- The Wuhan Municipal Health Commission issued an urgent notification to medical institutions under its jurisdiction, ordering efforts to appropriately treat patients with pneumonia of unknown cause.

Dec 31 -- The National Health Commission (NHC) made arrangements in the wee hours, sending a working group and an expert team to Wuhan to guide epidemic response and conduct on-site investigations. The Wuhan Municipal Health Commission released a briefing on its website about the pneumonia outbreak in the city, confirming 27 cases and telling the public not to go to enclosed public places or gather. It suggested wearing face masks when going out. The Wuhan Municipal Health Commission released briefings on the pneumonia outbreak in accordance with the law. WHO’s Country Office in the PRC relayed the information to the WHO Western Pacific Regional Office, then to the international level headquarters.

Jan 1 -- The NHC set up a leading group to determine the emergency response to the epidemic. The group convened meetings on a daily basis since then.

Jan 2 -- The Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention (China CDC) and the Chinese Academy of Medical Sciences (CAMS) received the first batch of samples of four patients from Hubei Province and began pathogen identification. The NHC came up with a set of guidelines on early discovery, early diagnosis and early quarantine for the prevention and control of the viral pneumonia of unknown cause.

Jan 3 -- Dr. Wenliang signs a statement not to post unsubstantiated rumors.

There's no "whistle blowing" as the information of the cases were already going up the chain of command. These are facts that can be sourced by multiple media outlets. I can't believe this fallacy keeps floating and doesn't flush.

Posted by: One Too Many | Jul 30 2020 13:05 utc | 67

In retrospective analyses, SARS-COV-2 was found in routinely collected samples of European sewage water dating back to at least december 2019. A french doctor reviewed archived medical samples and imagery from patients who had fallen mysteriously ill in the latter half of 2019 and also found that some had been early cases of COVID-19.

The real coronavirus whistle-blower is a doctor in Washington state USA who tested for the virus in Januari 2020 and was silenced by USA medical and federal authorities.

I am afraid that there will never be a sincere investigation into the real cause of the "vaping disease" that caused many deaths from sudden respiratory failure in the USA in the summer of 2019. Tell me again when Ft. Detrick labs was shut down exactly?

Posted by: Lurk | Jul 30 2020 13:52 utc | 68

@ Hannibal | Jul 30 2020 12:56 utc | 63

Don't forget to mention Mark2's employer, the 77th brigade. We're in an information war, after all.

Posted by: Lurk | Jul 30 2020 13:59 utc | 69

What are you trying to tell me? Anyone that does not acknowledge the virus originated in China and that China didn't respond as fast as it could have? And more polemically: there is some kind of African Marxist heading WHO who obfuscated China's late information to the WHO?

There is a dot of truth in everything. There is also a dot of truth in the fact that Trump or his relevant admin was informed early enough.

Posted by: vig | Jul 30 2020 12:21 utc | 57

vig repeats widely spread arguments, basically, the "official propaganda" from offices related to an orange-American (excessive time spend on golf courses changes skin color, perhaps in combination with sunscreen, without sunscreen you would get a "redneck look").

1. Origin: somewhat debatable, but any virus has to originate somewhere. Every country was on receiving end of pathogens from other countries.

2. China did not respond as fast as it could have. Now, how fast and effective was USA? One has to note that clusters of fatal lung infections happen regularly, but this is because of mutations that increase impact on health, while separate mutations increase (or decrease) the transmission. Draconian measures are necessary if you get both, but you do not lock cities, provinces, introduce massive quarantine programs until you know that they are necessary. For the same reasons, the response in Western Europe and USA was not as fast as it could have.

3. "African Marxist heading WHO mislead poor naive Americans". What is the budget of American intelligence, and American disease control? Do they collect information, do they have experts? In particular, American authorities knew pretty much what Chinese authorities knew, and they had benefit of several weeks of extra time to devise wise strategy. Giving this benefit to people with limited mental capacities has a limited value. Perhaps China is at fault here too, Pompeo reported about pernicious impact of Chinese Communist Party on PPT meeting in USA, that could have deleterious impact on education and thus on mental capacities.

Pompeo himself may be a victim. He excelled as a West Point student, but if the content of education was crappy, diligence impacted his brain deeper and not for the better. But nobody attempts to blame CCP for that.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jul 30 2020 14:00 utc | 70

@ Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 12:19 utc | 56

It would've changed nothing.

For starters, the "whistleblower" wasn't a whistleblower at all: he thought he had found a resurgence of SARS, not a new pandemic. Secondly, the head of respiratory diseases at the region already was investigating some cases of a "mysterious pneumonia" since end of November or mid-December - so the investigation already was well under way.

Discovering a new disease is not magic: a doctor cannot simply go the market, see a random person, and claim he/she discovered a new virus. Doctors are not gods: they can only diagnose the patients under their care.

The point of discord that the Western MSM capitalized upon was the fact that some random officer from the local police intercepted his private social media and made him sign a letter of reprimand. No Law is ever perfect, and these episodes of false triggers do happen even in Western Democracies.

Little known fact (one which the Western MSM censored) is that the so-called "whistleblower" was a member of the CCP. After knowing the details of the situation (including that the disease was already being investigated), he quickly realized the state-of-the-art and went to the frontlines to fight the pandemic - as any member of the CCP would've done. Revolutionary communist parties have this tradition that comes since the Bolshevik Party, where the leadership always leads by example. The Bolsheviks themselves lost the vast majority of their elite in the Civil War, as they always led in the front (vanguard). Fidel Castro himself led his army in the front when the invasion of the Bay of Pigs begun. So, it is not surprising this doctor, once having the facts on the field, quickly shut up and went to the frontline as a vanguard soldier.

After the whole truth came to the forefront, the Western MSM quickly begun to meltdown over the fake story they fantasized, and the Taiwanese MSM invented a story of some another whistleblower who had discovered the virus "at the end of November". That one never truly gained traction, and silently died out.

But all of this is moot point for the West, because Trump and the other European liberal powers refused to believe either that the virus was real or that it could reach them until February the next year.

But all of this

Posted by: vk | Jul 30 2020 14:17 utc | 71

I think it is OK that b nails the US makes yet another display of stupidity.... on the other hand I presume that b also has other things to care about, I mean exposing the US as a "fake" nation is a full time job!
Americans have at least the last 50 years been known for fails, even Churchill commented something like "the Americans will fail numerous times, but eventually they will get it right" well that was back then! Today it is fail upon fail. I know that there must be bright people over there, but it is my sincere impression, that they are a very small minority. Maybe their schooling system has all gone bonkers ?
"3% of all Americans believe the Earth is flat! WTF!!!
America is on a steep slope downward.

Posted by: Den lille abe | Jul 30 2020 14:17 utc | 72

I am personally not worried much about Covid 19, although I am 63 and live in Sweden, the "black Sheep" in Europe because of our rather lax restrictions, the Swedes themselves are rather good at keeping distance and using common sense.
I am much more worried that the American culture of ignorance, brain farts, stupidity and low IQ media will infest my country further and maybe completely ruin it.
Especially by the junk that comes out of Hollywood, pure Sh*t served nice and hot!
I am happy I know, I have not got to endure further 30 years of this.

Posted by: Den lille abe | Jul 30 2020 14:31 utc | 73

A few months ago, b posted a link to a Canadian vlogger who lives in Nanning, China. The vlogger took us on a tour of a so called Wet Market. Here, the vlogger takes us to another Wet Market tour. He does a good job dispelling racist stereotypes and showing real life in China.

https://youtu.be/ppIbzX8JfEw

Posted by: Prof K | Jul 30 2020 14:52 utc | 74

One to many @ 64
Thanks ! So there was a group of whistle blowers then. It’s down to definitions again. Perhaps mine is a little more loose. But it’s of no concern.
For the sake of this excellent thread, perhaps we could all be a little less pedantic. VK ?

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 14:56 utc | 75

@uncle tungsten, 11:00 Jul 30

Also relevant - Crimson Contagion - the pandemic simulation run by the US government from January to August 2019 and was based on an infectious coronavirus coming from a food market in China

Posted by: cirsium | Jul 30 2020 15:19 utc | 76

@Dla 69,70

Everywhere u go in this world you'll find some version or an "murican" in every country. Even a country like modern first world Switzerland has its "mountain folk".
In my personal experience with Americans I'm most often pleasantly surprised at their levels of sophistication and introspection over their American experiences. An enjoyable and as pleasant a people as anywhere. This may be clouded by mostly meeting these people outside of the US where unless tourists are well educated and travelled and by default more aware of a negative view of their homeland that exists outside of the US. For some reason most of these Americans I've met abroad are decidedly non republican in nature and are mostly
from California and North and North Eastern States. Fellow future Canadians I would call them.
The other side of the coin is when I've travelled to the states. Texas, Florida, Arizona. Whew! What a difference. I've learned that talking politics is impossible and the natives are almost entirely ignorant of anything outside their bubble. Outside of talking points there is no information behind their arguments. Their knowledge of the outside world is incredibly lacking and the view of the US in it is overwhelmingly positive.
It isn't Americans its America and its leadership, its influences, systems and all the other shit that make the US the salad it is. The people r redeemable.

Posted by: PleaseBeleafMe | Jul 30 2020 15:23 utc | 77

Calling the professionals doing their jobs in China "whistleblowers" is inaccurate. "Whistleblower" implies revealing information that others are trying to hide. In this case the suggestion is that the Chinese government was trying to hide the outbreak. This is nonsense as the Chinese government was unaware of an outbreak until after the relevant professionals had determined that there was an outbreak. There is no way the Chinese government could have known about an outbreak before the outbreak was identified by the professionals tasked with identifying outbreaks. The only ones who knew about the outbreak before the outbreak occurred were the US "intelligence community".

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 30 2020 15:34 utc | 78

@ Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 14:56 utc | 72

For the sake of this excellent site, perhaps we could all at least pretend to take our meds?

Posted by: Lurk | Jul 30 2020 15:43 utc | 79

@ 67 piotr ... i like the idea blaming the CCP for pompeos ignorance....pompeo had one too many chinese noodle that was loaded down with fat too or was that kellogog corn flakes from kansas?... it would be in keeping with all the rest of the blame going around...

interesting comments from M. K. BHADRAKUMAR of the meeting between pompeo and australians foreign minister.... here is pompeo trying to sound like churchill... he sounds more like some hayseed from the praries who has never left kansas or travelled the world.. i guess all his teachers were former 'war on communism' mcchartyism types...

“If we bend the knee now, our children’s children may be at the mercy of the Chinese Communist Party, whose actions are the primary challenge today in the free world. General Secretary Xi is not destined to tyrannise inside and outside of China forever, unless we allow it. Now, this isn’t about containment. Don’t buy that. It’s about a complex new challenge that we’ve never faced before. The USSR was closed off from the free world. Communist China is already within our borders.”

Posted by: james | Jul 30 2020 15:58 utc | 80

It's going to be damn well near impossible to unravel the truth since we're in a Cold War.

Also, Herman Cain just passed away and MSM is claiming the virus was responsible. However, the guy have been fighting stage 4 liver cancer for some time. Hmmm...

Posted by: Ian2 | Jul 30 2020 15:58 utc | 81

This follows the typical pattern of Russian ‘bashing’ - base a story on ‘allegations’ by intelligence agencies that are uncritically presented as ‘fact’ and vomited up by the paper of record (NYT), Wall St J and other MSM outlets. Many vaccines are targeting the ‘spike’ glycoprotein on the viral surface (see: proteolytiwww.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7151553); scientists in the US, China, Russia and EU are well aware of this. Further, Russia and China have ongoing research with potential vaccine candidates already in clinical trials. Covid19 is not just a US or Chinese problem, it is a global problem and thus, there should be a cooperative, international effort to develop an effective vaccine, as pointed out by Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at NIH. The Trump administration has steadfastly refused to do this. This is being done by the paper of record and other corporate media outlets (who primarily serve as the ‘ministry of propaganda’) to divert public attention from the totally inept/incompetent response to the Coronavirus pandemic by the Trump Administration, nothing short of a complete debacle, and the immense economic and social problems confronting the country, which are largely self-imposed. This is an effective way of minimizing any kind of coherent public discussion of the looting of the Treasury by the FED to bailout Wall St, exploding deficits, healthcare and lack thereof, jobs, housing, tax cuts for the wealthy, spending on the Pentagon and war, etc. All factions of the US ruling elite are in agreement with these policies, despite tactical differences.

Posted by: Paul | Jul 30 2020 17:02 utc | 82

Posted by: vk | Jul 30 2020 14:17 utc | 68

Dr Wenliang specifically told his colleagues not to disseminate the information in the private chat room. It was someone else that took a screenshot and posted the contents to WeChat. For the MSM the term "whistle blower" sounds a lot better better than someone who just violated professional ethics.

Posted by: One Too Many | Jul 30 2020 17:07 utc | 83

Dear B and all barflies. I am writing once again concerning the correct and effective use of hydroxychloroquine with zinc and an antibiotic. For months I tried to offer up info to y'all on this subject, but for some reason b took it all down. I am both sad and angry. I will quote Dr. Harvey Risch, epidemiologist from Yale "the drug could save 100,000 lives if widely deployed." This in a zerohedge article. I don't do links, but you're all ground ups.

So - thinking of all the agony - needless agony - I am, as I said - angry and sad. And disgusted by the mad scramble for dollars on the part of the big pharma "vacine" hustlers and their .gov minions.

For 1/10th - or maybe 1/100th of all the so called CARE money which went to Boing, Musk, Lockheed Martin, Blackrock etc etc etc every "murkan" could have had a prophylactic dose of Hydroxychloroquine + zinc + antib's.

I wonder who will be the first to shout ...

Posted by: Miss Lacy | Jul 30 2020 17:51 utc | 84

@81 Miss Lacy

No shouting from this quarter. The situation with this drug is nuanced, which is why black and white responses to it are by their very character inadequate.

Who can we trust on this question of hydroxychloroquine? How about Cuba?

Cuba has one of the highest proportions of doctors to population of any country in the world, and this fulfills the revolutionary dream of Che Guevara (who I, in my ignorance, only very recently learned was trained as a doctor).

Cuba uses hydroxychloroquine as one part of its treatment protocol for COVID-19 - only one part of the cocktail, and only for cases in the early stage:

"We do use hydroxychloroquine in the framework of the protocol for management of coronavirus patients," Dr. Augustin Lage Davila, advisor to the president of BioCubaFarma and former director of the Centre for Molecular Immunology in Havana, told Anadolu Agency on Thursday. [...] "We are aware of the polemics around this product. Physicians here mostly have a good opinion of the results it has achieved, provided that it is used at an early stage in low doses and only with patients without comorbidities, which could be complicated by hydroxychloroquine," Dr. Davila added.

He said Cuba will continue to use hydroxychloroquine on the "few active patients" left in the country, although it is "not the main" component of the Cuban protocol.

Praising BioCubaFarma's role in battling the disease, Dr. Davila emphasized that hydroxychloroquine is only one of several drugs used in the protocol to treat coronavirus patients, and five other key drugs they use are unique to Cuba.

Cuba: Early hydroxychloroquine potent against COVID-19

Go Cuba! And thanks for the nuance :)

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 30 2020 18:10 utc | 85

Posted by: Miss Lacy | Jul 30 2020 17:51 utc | 81

Well it's an odd situation for sure, you would think such a question could have & would have been put to rest by now, yet it just trundles along in a cloud of noise and dust. I don't have an opinion about it, not my expertise, but I can see that there is no agreement globally and it reeks of meddling and manipulation. But then what doesn't these days?

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 30 2020 18:22 utc | 86

Miss Lacy @Jul30 17:51 @81

Yes.

Many of us have noticed the growing evidence that HCQ+Zinc is an effective treatment. And we were always disturbed by the media campaign against HCQ. IMO Trump's early support for HCQ was meant to be a 'kiss of death' for the drug. Some will decry that as a 'conspiracy theory' but it is consistent with his actions and his pro-Big Pharma / anti-China agenda.

AFAIK b has not yet revised his thinking about HCQ. Nor has he altered his believe that Trump/Trump Administration simply made innocent mistakes even as other countries fought the virus much more effectively.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 30 2020 18:37 utc | 87

Quinine + zinc as an anti-viral prophylactic would have to be taken on a daily basis during periods when exposure to the virus might occur. It is not like a vaccination where one treatment gives you immunity. Though we are doubtless talking much lighter doses for prophylactic use than those scary doses that were discussed for treatment of the disease itself, we are still talking hundreds of millions of doses per day in the US alone. If there were more than a ridiculous joke of an attempt at testing and contact tracing in the US so that we could safely narrow down who was at risk of being exposed, and then if there were some national healthcare body that could coordinate with the testers and contact tracers, then distributing the prophylactic treatment to at-risk communities might work. We in the US don't have anywhere near the healthcare infrastructure to pull something like that off. I'll bet Britain with their NHS could do it.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 30 2020 18:52 utc | 88

@psychohistorian (6) "Sorry b, but AP and NYT are active participants in the disinformation campaign of failing empire and are not falling for anything."

This is 100% correct. Major corporate news outlets remain "major" by having access to high level sources and leakers who feed them stories which are subsequently vomited back up to the public without having been fact-checked (as b. has done for them). They are in on the game, because that's the only way they can stay in the game. And not coincidentally, they share the interests of the political and economic ruling elites.

Posted by: Rob | Jul 30 2020 19:22 utc | 89

Sadly the US style rot has set into th U.K. national Health Service.
Don’t forget to watch Panarama at 9pm tonight (U.K. time) exposing the virus being transferred from hospital to care homes.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 30 2020 19:28 utc | 90

Posted by: Prof K | Jul 30 2020 14:52 utc | 76

Thanks Prof, Watched many Gweilo vids posted... didn't know he's a Canadian.Gweilo is Cantonese for "Old White". Wet markets are still found in many SEA nations. In Australia it's wholesale market like Flemington market Sydney. The last time I was there in the early 80's.

In the States it's Farmers market on weekend.

Posted by: JC | Jul 30 2020 19:41 utc | 91

William Gruff 90

With the Quinine type medicines used as prophylactic, I believe it is a matter of keeping blood concentration levels above a certain point. From what I have read, they stay in the body for sometime and once blood concentration levels are reached, only need a top up once a week. I read up on dosage rates awhile back and as a prophylactic against malaria, it was a couple of larger doses at the start then low weekly dose to maintain blood concentration levels.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 30 2020 20:00 utc | 92

Posted by: vk | Jul 30 2020 14:17 utc | 73

"But all of this is moot point for the West, because Trump and the other European liberal powers refused to believe either that the virus was real or that it could reach them until February the next year. "

Excellent comments I couldn't write so eloquently even if I tried. And now "The Senate Judiciary Committee advanced a bill (S 4212) that would allow U.S. citizens to sue China for physical or economic damages related to COVID-19. " While the Americans killing one another in Portland and Seattle.

Today received "California Voter Survey" email my voting preference

1st question - How interested, between 1-10. I tick 10.
2nd question - Race I tick, Asian, Pacific Islanders.
3rd question. pick Trump$$ or Biden1. I pick none and no other options. I exist and restarted... the same shit again. I refused to tick either of two idiots. So no survey for me.

https://research-opinions.com/index.php/survey/index/sid/486717/newtest/Y/lang/en/token/CA687807

Posted by: JC | Jul 30 2020 20:03 utc | 93

Posted by: JC | Jul 30 2020 20:03 utc | 95

Regarding your survey, I took most of it, it seems to be some sort of push-poll about an uncoming proposition in the November election. Not a real survey. I didn't finish the survey, any response just encourages them.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 30 2020 21:05 utc | 94

William Gruff | Jul 30 2020 18:52 utc | 90

... much lighter doses for prophylactic use than those scary doses that were discussed for treatment of the disease itself, we are still talking hundreds of millions of doses per day in the US alone.

From the dosing recommendations that Peter AU calculated, it appears that you can maintain prophylactic protections simply by drinking tonic water. I started with a liter a day and scaled back to half a liter a couple of months later.

IMO it's better to dring tonic water with hydroxchloroquine added. I avoid tonic water that uses natural quinine.

I eat a small handful of sunflower seeds everyday for zinc. I also take vitamin-D.

WARNING: I'm not a doctor. This is merely informational not medical advice.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 30 2020 22:55 utc | 95

JC @ 93:

Sydney Markets still operates the huge wholesale markets in Flemington and Haymarket (near the old Chinatown district in the Sydney CBD) though of course with restricted hours due to the COVID-19 pandemic. A separate company operates Sydney Fish Market in Pyrmont (not far from Haymarket, roughly a 30-minute walk from there).

Asian-style wet markets exist on a small scale in parts of Sydney where there has been immigration from China, Vietnam, South Korea and other parts of east and southeast Asia. In Chatswood and Eastwood (in northern Sydney), you can find many Asian-style supermarkets with "wet market" sections. These are separate from Asian-style BBQ shops / restaurants that have window displays of roast duck, chickens and pork.

Cabramatta (centre of Vietnamese community since late 1970s) has large Asian-style supermarkets and malls with "wet market" sections though I admit I haven't been to Cabramatta for nearly 20 years. Other parts of Sydney with east and southeast Asian communities include Campsie and Strathfield (Koreans), Burwood and Ashfield (mix of Chinese and others), Blacktown (Filipino) and Randwick (Indonesian), and they have some Asian-style supermarkets with "wet market" sections, though the scale will vary from tiny to big.

On top of those, there are the weekly or monthly farmers' markets, community markets and fairs organised by local councils to celebrate Lunar New Year and other special annual events (like the August Moon festival usually celebrated in ... September or October).

Posted by: Jen | Jul 30 2020 23:50 utc | 96

Jackrabbit 97

I made up some tonic water from bark early on when we were discussing it here. Turned out when we looked up drug interactions, my wife couldn't drink it because she has a few heart issues so I tried a bit. Took a liking to the stuff and downed the bottle in a week. Mixing it a desert spoon to a glass of lemonade. I have a number of immune issues - pelvis and lower back fused, constant gut ache due to inflammation ect. Gut problems and aches and pains that are immune related simply disappeared. The quinine medicines are used to treat a number of immune related problems and to me, it seemed the variouse alkaloids in quinine bark had a very strong anti inflammatory action that has lasted well over a month. Aches and pains starting to return now so time to pull anther bottle of tonic out of the fridge.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 31 2020 0:09 utc | 97

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 30 2020 21:05 utc | 96

Thanks it's not the same survey after read your comment I went back again. It's different. Something fishy here. The survey I took stopped unless I pick either Trump$$ or Biden0. on question 3.

Note, Trump end with two $$ at the end and Biden with 0. At the end this note:

"Please do not forward the survey link to others or share it to social media as it is personalized for each recipient of this invitation to ensure that the survey link will only work once."

https://research-opinions.com/index.php/survey/index/sid/486717/newtest/Y/lang/en/token/CA687807

Posted by: JC | Jul 31 2020 1:17 utc | 98

Posted by: JC | Jul 31 2020 1:17 utc | 100

It looked fishy to me too. I picked "Other" for President. Then it spend a looong time asking me questions about this proposition coming up on the November ballot. I probably screwed it up for you using your token. Oh well.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jul 31 2020 2:08 utc | 99

Posted by: Jen

In the 80s I worked for a company and traveled yearly to Mount Kuring-gai. I've forgotten Haymarket, thanks for bring it up. I had not traveled to Ozzie for more than 30years.

Am very sorrie your pm Morrison too stoopid to understand what will happen if he and the 4eyes succeed starting China's civil war? Taiwan is no match for the Mainlanders. Therefore Ozzie and other 4eyes, Japan maybe India will join in as another coalition of the willing. The last civil war in Asia was Vietnam war. This time China will not budge it going for broke! The refugees will be worsts than "boat people." Most likely the SEA nations involved. Understands I dun hate the white, Ozzie or Kiwis. But deeply dislike the Brit or Limey.

Posted by: JC | Jul 31 2020 2:21 utc | 100

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