Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 08, 2020

The U.S. Has Surrendered To The Pandemic. Protect Yourself.

Yesterday the United States registered more than 60,000 new Covid-19 cases. As the number of new cases continues to increase unabated about two weeks from now it is likely to reach hundred thousand new cases per day.

Source: 91-divoc - bigger

The increase of testing is not the cause of higher new case numbers. The rate of people among those who were tested and were found positive has also increased. In Florida, which yesterday had nearly 10,000 new cases, the positive test rate has reached nearly 20%. That means that the epidemic is still accelerating.

This did not need to happen. Yesterday Germany, at a quarter the size of the U.S., had 279 new cases. It does 1 million tests per week and the positive rate is decreasing. China has defeated a new local outbreak in Beijing by testing more than 10 million people. The last two days it reported zero new cases.

Many of those who test positive, especially the younger ones, will not fall ill with severe symptoms. But some 10-15% are estimated to need medical support. How many of them will die depends on the quality of care that can be given to them. Some thirty hospitals in Florida have already run out of space in their intensive care units. That is the point where the real emergency begins.

Six months after the disease was discovered more is known of how to care for Covid-19 cases. The death rate per cases has therefore decreased. But this only holds when there are sufficient beds, doctors and staff available. At the current U.S. rate that will soon no longer be the case.

We do know that the hospitalization curve follows the testing/symptoms curve by some 10-14 days while ICU admittance follows the above curve with some 15 to 20 days delay. The eventual recovery in an ICU bed takes up to four weeks. A bed once occupied will not be available for quite some time.

Trump's new policy is to ignore the epidemic. He hopes that the people will get used to the carnage it causes:

Trump’s advisers [..] are seeking ways to reframe his response to the coronavirus — even as the president himself largely seeks to avoid the topic because he views it as a political loser. They are sending health officials to swing states, putting doctors on TV in regional markets where the virus is surging, crafting messages on an economic recovery and writing talking points for allies to deliver to potential voters.

The goal is to convince Americans that they can live with the virus — that schools should reopen, professional sports should return, a vaccine is likely to arrive by the end of the year and the economy will continue to improve.

White House officials also hope Americans will grow numb to the escalating death toll and learn to accept tens of thousands of new cases a day, according to three people familiar with the White House’s thinking, who requested anonymity to reveal internal deliberations. Americans will “live with the virus being a threat,” in the words of one of those people, a senior administration official.

“They’re of the belief that people will get over it or if we stop highlighting it, the base will move on and the public will learn to accept 50,000 to 100,000 new cases a day,” said a former administration official in touch with the campaign.

That may, to some extent, be possible. But 100,000 new cases per day also means that there will soon be 1,000 or so new deaths per day. The hospitals will fill up and the death rate will increase. More and more people will know someone who died of Covid-19. The economy will continue to only limp along as long as people fear getting infected.

My take is that Trump's calculation is simply wrong. The epidemic will continue to get wide media coverage. The hot spots will change but without local lockdown measures each of them will lead to the overflow of local hospitals. This will increase the death rate.

It is now too late to stop the epidemic in the United States. That makes it even more important for its citizens to take personal safety measures.

All spreading events that affected multiple people took place in enclosed spaces. The virus prefers it cool and dry. Places with unfiltered air conditioning should therefore be avoided. Open a window to create airflow if possible. Stay at a distance from other persons. Wear a mask.

Masks significantly reduce the chance of catching Covid-19. Your mask also protects the people around you should you unknowingly have caught the disease. This week high quality N95 masks (FFP-2 in Europe) were again available in my local pharmacy. The price (€6.80) was ridiculous but I bought two to use them in turn. I put one on whenever I leave the house. (It is not required to wear one outside but I am simply too lazy to put it on and off whenever I enter or leave some place.)

These masks (see pic below) are quite comfortable, tight enough to not fog my glasses and there is no problem breathing through them. The masks are officially one time use only but there are safe and simple ways to steam sterilize them for reuse.

My FFP-2 masks are similar to the one below but white and without a brand name printed on them.


Get used to wearing a mask. It is the new normal that is likely to stay with us for at least another year.

Posted by b on July 8, 2020 at 17:55 UTC | Permalink

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On June 10 Germany was doing 425,000 tests per week with plans to double that, so they may be doing 850K per week if they have doubled it, but this sounds like a new thing and their success has nothing to do with testing (US is and had been doing more), and increased testing in healthy people leads to false positives and unintended consequences

Posted by: Kay Fabr | Jul 8 2020 23:00 utc | 101

“... i would be cautious of just using this barometer in the present to make any wider prognosis on where we are headed going into the fall here...“

But the statistics CAN be used to support fear porn?

Isn’t the ultimate goal to see deaths minimized?

Posted by: Kevin | Jul 8 2020 23:26 utc | 102

Kevin # 82

@_K_C - “ I can only go by what is written, and "absolute number of deaths" means the running total, which again is continuing to rise.“

Why wouldn’t the running total of deaths continue to increase? Can someone who has died come back to life?


Fabulous retort Kevin. I will shout your drinks for rest of the night. Barflies rejoice!

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 8 2020 23:32 utc | 103

R.A. | Jul 8 2020 22:53 utc | 98

Any rational discussion in this totally politicized pandemic is impossible.
The agenda has been set & it will be followed.

The science is settled.
If you don't consider it 'settled' you will be vilified & ostracized.

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 8 2020 23:50 utc | 104

Posted by: Roberto | Jul 8 2020 21:37 utc | 77

That's old info.

Already the US death rate started increasing again for the last two days - and its back to beginning of June levels.

Judging by the 50 % increase in US hospitalisations for the last 16 days US death rate should start increasing again just about now. Exactly what is being observed.

Posted by: Passer by | Jul 8 2020 23:54 utc | 105

@ 100 kevin... fear porn has a nice ring to it, lol.... i'm not taking any firm position here, and wish to remain open minded about how all this plays out.. thanks... the people with the ready made conclusions are the ones i find suspect...that can include b..

Posted by: james | Jul 9 2020 0:03 utc | 106

@hopehely (78) Perhaps the reason that countries such as Canada, Japan and Germany have managed the pandemic so much better than the U.S. is that they have not turned over the bulk of their healthcare systems to private enterprises whose primary concern is profitability. This is even true of so-called “non-profit” U.S. hospitals that keep their eyes glued to the bottom line. Public health infrastructure has been decimated under both Democratic and Republican administrations. Put all that together with the rank stupidity and incompetence of supposed political leaders, and the result is the abysmal Covid-19 response that Americans are now experiencing.

Posted by: Rob | Jul 9 2020 0:09 utc | 107

That's a workable bottom-line.... for everyone to do their best to be responsible for their health. On that advice, i can suggest the following MD's viewpoint on virtues of Vitamin C, hydrogen peroxide inhalers, Vits, B, D,K, plus magnesium and niacin... also what to avoid such as sugar, calcium etc. depending on your particular situation, of course. I found this video helpful, so i bring it to MOA

Posted by: chu teh | Jul 9 2020 0:20 utc | 108

@106 Rob Agreed. But do not underestimate the effect of the "anti-expert" attitude in the USA, which is far more extreme than it is in other western countries.

The cause for that is obvious: the extreme profit-driven ideology in the USA means that if the expert advice is in line with what the oligarchy wants then great, hurrah, it must be true! The experts have spoken! But if the expert advice gets in the way of making the mega-rich even richer then, boo, hiss, experts suck, why would anyone listen to those pencil-heads!!!!

The expert advice w.r.t. coronavirus gets in the way of turning a buck. And that puts at risk the multi-billionaire's ability to acquire more billions. Heck, They May Even Lose Money!!!!

As a result the bought-and-paid-for politicians only pay lip-service to that advice or, even better, decry it as obvious nonsense. They will claim to know better for reasons of.... reasons. Obviously.

The result is there to see in all its glory in the USA.
It is also on display in Brazil, for much the same reason.
And to an extent, in the UK.

You know, those places where oligarchs really rule the roost despite the thin veneer of "democracy" that they hide behind.
As in: the more a place resembles a thinly-disguised oligarchy the worse it has performed. Funny, that.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Jul 9 2020 0:36 utc | 109

The morons are out in force in this thread...

The explanation is simple:

1) The pandemic is getting worse and it's becoming more obvious that it's getting worse.
2) The morons level of cognitive dissonance grows as they subconsciously recognize that the pandemic is getting worse.
3) The morons are thus desperate to find *any* excuse to doubt the facts.
4) They desperately search for anything to support their cognitive dissonance.
5) They find some nonsense on some Web site OR they make up their own nonsense based on their ignorance of the pandemic mechanisms.
6) Then they come here and spew bullshit over everyone else.
7) PROFIT! Or at least Trump and *his* morons will profit.

The number of people here who have decided that they know more about epidemiology, medicine, statistics, etc. than the professionals is what classifies them as morons over and above the points I just made.

Once again, personally if I were b, I'd dump these pandemic threads as they turn worthless almost immediately. There's no possible rational discussion going on here. b should just post what he wants to post, then turn off comments for those threads.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 0:39 utc | 110

"the positive test rate has reached nearly 20%"

I think you might want to give that complaint some thought.
Breathless drama.
According to CDC, IFR approx 0.027%.
Just, Wow.

Posted by: jared | Jul 9 2020 0:56 utc | 111

I like that I'm in a pretty good position.

1) Living by myself in my own room with no one else present means I'm not exposed to potential carriers like wives, children, relatives, dogs, etc.
2) I'm only exposed when going out of my room to use the hall toilet and shower or on supply runs. Most of the time that exposure is just passing by someone.
3) Since I wear a mask whenever out of my room, I'm not concerned about inhaling the virus from passers-by.
4) I wear food service plastic gloves when out of my room as an additional protection from fomites.
5) On returning to my room, I wash my hands immediately, remove the mask, then apply hand sanitizer.
6) I have 14 KN95 masks in play, so with rotation the same mask is used every two weeks - more than enough time for virus particles to expire.
7) I wipe down all packages brought in from the outside with hydrogen peroxide (kills any virus in thirty seconds.) Then I wash hands again to remove the HP and apply hand sanitizer.
8) I periodically spray surfaces I use regularly (sink, cooking and eating surfaces) with disinfectant spray.
9) I periodically wipe down my computer keyboard and mouse with hydrogen peroxide.
10) I'm retired, so I'm not at risk of exposure in a workplace.

As I've said before, it's mostly a crap shoot whether you catch the virus. But following the above procedures limits my exposure as much as is practical. It's a nuisance to wash hands every time I go out to use the toilet, as I drink a lot of water and thus have to go maybe 8 or more times a day. But it's better than dying.

Washing hands and using a lot of hand sanitizer means I have to apply hand lotion before going to bed to offset the "dishpan hands" effect. Hardly a big deal.

The expectation I've read in the last couple days is that we'll be wearing masks for at least the next year and probably every year during flu season until it's confirmed that the population has reached "herd immunity". The estimate is that at least 60% - and possibly 80% - of the population needs to have developed the antibodies before herd immunity is reached. That's 180-240 million people. At even 100,000 cases a day, that's going to take a while. Do the math (oh, wait, I forgot, the morons can't do arithmetic.)

It's unfortunate for people who have families, each of whom is likely to infect the other members. It's unfortunate for people who have to work for a living, as they will have a higher risk of exposure. They need to focus on the fact that it was the US government's inability to protect them, as South Korea and other governments protected their populations successfully, that is the cause of their woes - not just the virus itself.

The morons, of course, can't comprehend that. To them, it's all just a hoax to do...something. Sooner or later they'll get infected, unless they're lucky. Or someone they care about will get infected (assuming these morons actually care about anyone - or that anyone cares about them.) Since even the asymptomatic carriers apparently have biological effects from the virus, even without symptoms, and people who have had the virus without dying also show negative effects of the virus on lung capacity, eventually it may dawn on these people that this thing is no joke.

It's amazing how many of the morons fail to read the accounts of the front-line medical people who are treating virus patients. Very few front-line medical professionals are calling this "normal flu" or disregarding the extreme effects of this virus. But the morons are certain that they know better. It's hard not to "know better" when you're immune to reading the research, immune to reading the accounts of the people fighting this thing, and you are infected with the assumption that everything you read that isn't supportive of your notions is part of "the conspiracy" - and anyway you've "reasoned" that you "know better".

Hopefully, the morons will get infected and die. It's called "Nature's way of eliminating the stupid." Unfortunately, given the relatively low death rate of the virus, most of the morons will remain alive to infect everyone else with their stupidity.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:05 utc | 112

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Jul 9 2020 0:36 utc | 108

You know, those places where oligarchs really rule the roost despite the thin veneer of "democracy" that they hide behind.
As in: the more a place resembles a thinly-disguised oligarchy the worse it has performed. Funny, that.

Yup, pretty much that sums it up. The success of handling the covid challenge reflects the degree of how much a system is people-oriented.
So corona virus turned out to be an oligarchy litmus test. Countries who are top 5 in number of cases have shown their true colors.

Posted by: hopehely | Jul 9 2020 1:12 utc | 113

Brazil’s president tests positive: Jair Bolsonaro, president of Brazil, tested positive for Covid-19, after months of dismissing the danger posed by the disease. The pandemic has killed over 65,000 Brazilians. He's 65 years old. Don't know his level of health. He might survive. Then again, he might survive with severely reduced lung capacity or other effects. With luck, he'll simply die and thus stand as an shining example of being a corrupt moron.

How the Coronavirus May Attack the Brain Even if you don't die.

According to coverage of the study in the Guardian, at UCL’s Institute of Neurology, cases of Adem rose from one a month before the pandemic to two or three per week in April and May.

Yeah, but that's just "normal", right, morons?

Making Sense of New Research Showing Covid-19 Is Airborne

Once again, masks work. People who say they don't are morons who haven't read the research and don't have the common sense to reduce risk. Most of them probably smoke and over-eat, too. Good - when they get the virus, they'll die or get fucked up. It's too bad the virus doesn't distinguish between smart people and morons. Maybe we need to petition the government to develop a virus that does.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:17 utc | 114

Fortunately, I'm "non-essential". I hope most of the morons here are "essential".

“Essential” Means Underpaid and Unprotected

Keeping America’s steaks and Big Macs was essential to Trump as he called meat packing plants essential before they could retrofit so as to not become blazing hot spots. You show who’s essential by who you protect and who you don’t...

A crisis shows our truest colors. The U.S. put the needs of the well-off first, asking for relatively-speaking minor sacrifice (other than learning Zoom angles and teaching math to our kids, which is actually no small thing). But “essential” workers have it different.

Essential workers sleep on couches to reduce family spread, beg for masks, take public transport and of course, interact with “non essential” people who refuse to wear masks or socially distance. This just scratches the surface of the indignities of being “essential.”

Black communities not only have been getting disproportionately sicker from Covid-19 but are disproportionately asked to work to support the rest of the country. Wonder if there’s any correlation…

How grateful are we as a nation to the essential? Well, we decided that as of May, if people couldn’t work for health reasons, they wouldn’t get unemployment in most states — starting in Georgia.

We decided not to ensure people had their health care costs paid for. Or make sure they got access to enroll in health care if they got laid off.

Now Mitch McConnell says he won’t renew unemployment insurance. He does want employers released from liability if you get sick in the job. And he’s willing to have a showdown with our lives as stakes this month.

There’s been no hazard pay, job guarantee, minimum wage (let alone UBI), guaranteed paid sick leave. We are seeing the longest food lines seen in anyone’s lifetime and now we are allowing people to get evicted from their apartments.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:20 utc | 115

I find this one strange but I suppose it's possible. So far the cases are what I would call "anecdotal".

But what did I say above about people who don't die but may get screwed up anyway?

Covid-19 May Trigger Diabetes in Otherwise Healthy People
The coronavirus is not just a risk for people with diabetes — it may actually cause the disease

This wouldn’t be the first time researchers have reason to believe that a viral infection may trigger diabetes. It was seen with the SARS coronavirus, mumps virus, coxsackievirus B, and other enteroviruses. Little is known about why these viruses may trigger diabetes, but one theory is that the virus triggers an autoimmune reaction that affects the pancreas, where insulin is made, Rubino says.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:24 utc | 116

Another country got it right - Greece.

How Greece Managed to Get It Right

In March, the people of Greece witnessed the hecatombs of coronavirus victims in nearby Italy, where one person died every two minutes. “The proximity to Italy and the inherent familiarity Greeks feel with Italians, and vice versa, struck a chord with Greeks,” Lourida says. This may have increased public support for the political decisions that followed.

By March 10, with only 89 confirmed cases in Greece, schools and universities closed; cafes, restaurants, and tourist spots followed suit three days later. On March 23, when the U.K. was still preaching the herd immunity approach and the U.S. was contemplating reopening the country by Easter Sunday (April 12), Greece entered a full lockdown. The country had just 624 confirmed cases and 15 deaths at the time. According to Lourida, this quick action is the main reason why experts cite Greece as a coronavirus “success story.” “The early lockdown gave precious recovery time to the overstretched medical infrastructure,” she says.

“The Greek government swiftly yielded the floor to experts and took courageous decisions to safeguard public health,” says Pagona Lagiou, MD, PhD, professor of hygiene and epidemiology at the University of Athens Medical School. Lagiou also cites Greeks’ compliance with the lockdown and expert guidelines as a key reason why Greece flattened the curve. And, she says, well-designed public health information campaigns ultimately secured people’s cooperation.

Of course, that wouldn't work in the US - too many MORONS - including the ones running the government.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:30 utc | 117

and what did I say about even if you don't die?

What Covid-19 Did to My Brain
Long after my acute symptoms waned, my brain still couldn’t keep up. Here’s why experts think that may be.

I had other lingering neurological symptoms as well. I was still putting far too much pepper on my food because otherwise, it didn’t taste like much. Sometimes there was ringing in my ears. My entire body ached, and I was so fatigued it felt like I was training for a triathlon. There were also migraines every single day that started midmorning and didn’t go away until I eventually fell asleep (if I was even able to sleep at all). My brain felt too large for my skull. Some nights the throbbing was so intense it was as if my brain contained a second heart.

All of my symptoms added up to what doctors are beginning to define as a “post-Covid syndrome.” Many of the features of this illness can look similar to chronic fatigue syndrome, which was seen in some patients after the SARS outbreak. Headache, fatigue, malaise, cognitive slowing or dysfunction (“brain fog”), dizziness, loss of smell and taste, and muscle aches are some of the most commonly reported lingering symptoms from the virus that may endure — or even emerge — weeks and months after an acute Covid-19 infection...

Of course, since that study, more research has emerged that identifies a link between Covid-19 and incidences of stroke, encephalitis, seizures, neuropathy, and encephalopathy. In one of the very most recent studies, conducted by researchers in the U.K. and published in the Lancet Psychiatry, 39 of the 125 hospitalized patients had altered mental status, due to encephalitis and encephalopathy.

Well, that's no problem, right, morons? You already have "altered mental status". No one will notice.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:36 utc | 118

Oh, and your kids, morons... It's unfortunate that kids have morons for parents, but that's frequently the case. Better hope your kids don't have comorbidities.

How to Make Sense of Cases Spiking Among Young Kids
New increases in cases seem to contradict previous knowledge

As cases spike in over 41 states, epidemiologists are noticing that cases among kids are increasing. On July 4, Florida reported a record high number of cases among children aged 19 and younger. In Oregon, cases among kids younger than 10 grew fivefold during June. Texas reports that the number of cases is rising among kids attending daycare...

Salemi points to a small recent study from Switzerland showing that 12 symptomatic kids had a viral load (amount of virus in their systems) and virus-shedding patterns that resembled those of adults. It’s more evidence that ‘transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from children is plausible,” he says, though the data on infections and deaths already bear that out. On July 4, COVKID’s most recent count, the total number of current Covid-19 cases in American children and teens was over 190,000. The number of kids who had been admitted into intensive care was 670, and 64 children had died in 19 states.

But the morons will continue to cite obsolete statistics about the number of children who died and claim that this proves schools should re-open. Whereas as I have been saying all along, there are children with comorbidities that can be damaged or killed by this virus.

Quotes from official sources:

Asthma is more common in children than adults. Currently, there are about 6.2 million children under the age of 18 with asthma. In 2017, 1 in 12 children had asthma.

Between 2011 and 2012, 17,900 children and adolescents under the age of 20 were diagnosed with Type 1 diabetes...

Approximately 2.4 million people were estimated to be living with a CHD (Congenital Heart Disease) in the United States in 2010. About 1 million of those were children under the age of 18 years and about 1.4 million were adults age 18 years and older. About 12% (289,000 people) were estimated to have a severe CHD.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:44 utc | 119

Latest numbers are up for the US.

All time high with more than 60k new cases.

Hospitalisations up (and these lag).

Death rate up (and these lag).


Posted by: Passer by | Jul 9 2020 1:45 utc | 120

Some good news for a change...

There Is a Light at the End of the Tunnel

The vaccine data from Oxford (being run in Brazil) looks strong. No real safety issues so far. Gives people the antibodies. People are getting it post-Covid-19 and some will get it in a challenge trial.

What “works” means, and for how long, and for whom is less clear. But probably more like a flu vaccine (40%?) versus MMR (97%). There will be multiple vaccines after the first expected in the Fall. Each likely progressively better...

Everyone — and I can’t emphasize this enough — was a huge proponent of masks. Efforts to invalidate masks were considered absurd.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:50 utc | 121


You finally understand the meaning of your original post! Amazing! It was *your* wording that implied people could come back from the dead. The "absolute number of deaths" decreasing every day - as you stated it - would mean we should be preparing for a zombie apocalypse, not a virus.

Posted by: _K_C_ | Jul 9 2020 1:51 utc | 122

And then we have Trump...arguably *the* worst President in US history.

Trump Has Quit on the Coronavirus

We should all have high-quality masks by now. See how.
By now every American should have access to N-95 quality masks. Every day that passes is a scandal & an epic failure of indifference of our government.

I will say it again. We defined essential services like a bunch of spoiled babies. There’s no luxury or service Trump isn’t willing to sacrifice you for.

This broad definition is self-defeating. It means when we thought we were locked down, meh. Millions were forced to work. And work without testing, contact tracing, quality masks...

There’s one place with lots of testing and lots of mask-wearing. That’s in the White House near the president and his family. You want us to go without tests and masks, “you first.”

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 1:58 utc | 123

There are doubters that believe
that the whole COVID19 lot is a Hoax so as to enrich TPTB.

Enrichment has taken place already.

But the cases are surging. Maybe younger people may be spared, but according to many testimonies, COVID19 leaves a lot of surviving patients diminished for life, others sick for months.

If we want to protect others, we shall wear masks that limit our expulsions of virus-containing emissions, talking, sneezing or coughing.

the fact is, the most likely gate to the infection is through the EYES!

Several studies dating to he 1970/80s point to that direction. So, protecting oneself must be done by shielding the eyes. This is probably more important than wearing a mask.

Goggles, like the ones worn by pilots in the past century are what we need.

Cheers! My we all live through the pandemic!

Posted by: CarlD | Jul 9 2020 2:03 utc | 124

@ juliana #94

Well I can't just let someone hooey on my argument and not respond! ;) Lol, in all seriousness I appreciate the detailed response and keeping the disagreement civil. I wish you had responded to my full post- my whole point was that the issue is extremely complicated, and of course I could not list every complication in a short post. Your points, especially numbers 1 and 2, and more considerations that you would have to work through to come to a full conclusion.

It seems like you're assuming that I am a "non-protector" as you call it... that is not the case. I am 100% behind masks for everyone, it is such a small cost and such a large benefit. I don't think the facts give a clear conclusion either way on lockdowns, reasonable people can disagree. Although I do think the arguments from the media and government are very shallow and not taking these things into account. I hope they are doing the real analysis behind the scenes... but obviously I am skeptical. :)

Two specific things I want to respond to though. First, your #3 about starving the beast: I think this is pretty clearly contradicted by what the US has done so far. My city was locked down for almost 3 months, and as soon as it was lifted here comes the virus again. Eradication from lockdowns may have been possible at the very beginning when there were hardly any cases, but that ship has sailed. There are more active cases today than there were when the first lockdown was put in place, and they did not even come close to getting rid of the virus.

Second, "Hooey on your 'economic disruption' Saber. People's lives are at stake." Money and lives are both valuable things that we want to maximize. You MUST make trade-offs between them in order to make good decisions. We can debate how much money it would take to offset one person's life, but the value of life cannot be infinite or we would be required to throw away all of society's money to save a single person.

The current value of life used by USG is $3-5M depending on the situation. I haven't done much research on their methods but my first reaction is that it seems in the right ballpark. And with lockdowns we are talking about potentially TRILLIONS in damages. That is money that will affect many, many people's lives in a huge way, and can't be dismissed.

Posted by: sabre | Jul 9 2020 2:06 utc | 125

From last Friday, a news report about one the FLCCC doctors in Texas - who's using the MATH+ Protocol and has achieved 100% success...until now.

Coronavirus: Houston doctor says 'we're heading to pure hell' as COVID-19 cases spike in Texas

Strict hygiene protocols are among the reasons the hospital team can boast a 100% success rate in treating COVID-19 patients over a period which lasted longer than 80 days.

"Then the lockdown was lifted," chief medic Dr Joseph Varon told us. "And it changed. We are getting many more patients, they are coming to us much sicker and a few are so sick, we can't save them."

Still, even the hospital's reduced success rate of 96% is impressive...

Dr Varon took the Sky News team around the hospital's ICU, joining the chorus of medics, scientists and politicians pleading with Texans to be vigilant in not spreading the virus.

"Because if you aren't, you will die," Dr Varon said.

"There's no more Mr Nice Guy now. You must stick to the guidelines, wear a mask and keep social distances because otherwise you are going to get killed or you will kill someone else."

"I've been an emergency care nurse for 20 years," one tells me.

"I'm passionate about my job but I can't save everyone and if people are ignorant, and not going to take precautions, then they are going to have to die so the rest of us can live."..

Math+ includes cortisone steroid, vitamins and anti-coagulants to try to curb the key challenges caused by the virus - blood clotting and inflammation.

"We've been doing it for a few months now,' Dr Varon said, and "it's working a charm".

He very much believes the hospital's 100% success rate for nearly three months is down to Math+...

"No-one needs to die from coronavirus any more," he said.

"This won't cure you of coronavirus but it can stop the build-up of problems which can lead to you needing a ventilator and when that happens, your chances of survival are only about 20%.

"Putting someone on a ventilator is like signing their death warrant.

"Finally, we have an option and I think it's going to work."

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 2:11 utc | 126

Forget the propaganda. The facts indicate the following :

Western governments :
‒ prioritize profits to capital over the well-being of their people
‒ governance ineptitude in their answer to the corona-virus

Chinese government :
‒ prioritizes the well-being of its people over profits to capital
‒ governance excellence in its answer to the corona-virus

This is the spectacle all the people on this earth have been watching over the last few months. What do you think the people on this earth are concluding ?

Me think that the rest of the world has finally had enough of Western exceptionalism !

Posted by: laodan | Jul 9 2020 2:19 utc | 127

What is a pandemic?

According to the WHO it is- "A pandemic is the worldwide spread of a new disease."

Since the mutation of bacteria and viruses is a natural process and happens all the time it follows that the world always has a pandemic at any given time.

Welcome to permanent pandemic.

Posted by: jiri | Jul 9 2020 2:22 utc | 128

Trump's bright idea of kicking out foreign students unless unis resume in-person classes stuns tech, science world
The last thing America needs right now is a brain drain

Google senior veep, and machine-learning guru, Jeff Dean was equally scathing: “This ICE action against students on F-1 visas is incredibly damaging in many ways. It hurts US competitiveness, damages our world-class universities, and, if enacted, will disrupt the scholarly study of millions of the brightest students from around the world.”

There appear to be two main drivers behind the new policy, both by the White House. First, polls ahead of this November's elections show President Trump lagging further behind Democrat challenger Joe Biden.

There are a broad number of reasons why Trump’s approval is falling: his failure to get a hold on the coronavirus pandemic and unite the nation in stemming the bio-nasty's spread; the poor state of the economy and high unemployment as a result of that bungled pandemic response; and Trump’s rejection of a recent groundswell of support for greater racial equality in the States, especially when it comes to policing.

With the election looming, Trump and his advisors have gone back to a strategy that helped him win his first term: take a strong anti-immigrant stance, and appeal to White voters. In that sense, this new policy pushes the sense that the president will keep immigration to a minimum.

Secondly, the president is keen to persuade and pressure businesses and institutions to reopen in order to help the economy recover in time for November.

Worst. President. Ever.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 2:34 utc | 129

Some morons can't even comprehend the definition of a pandemic.

Who breeds these idiots?

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 2:40 utc | 130

I guess RSH boss upped his quota.

A bit o/t but still on topic with regards to fake news on COVID

This article knocks it out of the park for HCQ

“Hydroxychloroquine and fake news
Fake news is keeping us away from the treatment to end the coronavirus crisis”

Question everything and make up your own mind.

Posted by: Kay Fabe | Jul 9 2020 2:45 utc | 131

The pariah state digs its hole deeper.

Record new cases again even as positivity rates bloom. Deaths are on the uptick, hospitalizations are growing and masks are shunned. Schools are going to be forced to open.

International students and tourism are big business in the US. Both of these revenue streams are being demolished.

United plans to slash 36,000 jobs

The stock market continues to lap it all up as free government credit and cash rain down all while the expensive burden of employing people has crashed and the pressures to raise pay and expand benefits are erased. Jobs will continue to be off-shored and be victims to automation, AI, etc. Americans as consumers are becoming less and less important as the global economy beckons.

The MIC is all we have.

The rest of the world is going to move on as the US flounders in feces.

Posted by: snow_watcher | Jul 9 2020 3:05 utc | 132

Attempted to post this this morning, to no avail. Let's see if it works this time...

Yesterday in the US reported daily deaths reached 993, the highest daily total since June 10th at 998. The downward trend has reversed and there will be an inexorable and deadly climb from here on out. It didn't have to be this way. The US is failing on many levels, including failing its own citizens in controlling a controllable disease as demonstrated by other countries. It's a stunning spectacle of mendacity, greed, incompetence, ignorance, evil, religious freakery, etc.

Meanwhile there's growing concern for survivors, even for those with relatively mild symptoms. Add this to the costs of this experiment.

Warning of serious brain disorders in people with mild coronavirus symptoms

And the myth of herd immunity is beginning to crumble.

Coronavirus: Spanish study casts doubt on herd immunity feasibility

The US is a pariah state. This is an extremely dangerous time with a mentally crippled and flailing leader of a super power constantly lashing out with increasingly violent rhetoric. Catastrophic actions may soon follow with the support of 40% of the population.

Posted by: snow_watcher | Jul 9 2020 3:12 utc | 133

Richard Steven Hack 128

US is really in a bad way when it outsources brain manufacturing. Wouldn't be so much a brain drain as that would entail Americans leaving the US. Australia is following the same path, at least as far as Chinese students go.
Though its not just students as we are also following the US in its anti China McCarthyism.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 3:14 utc | 134

@ Richard Steven Hack

I like your comments on this pandemic. Every time you call people morons because they act like morons, I feel a light breaks through the clouds.

Also, you're determined to survive if you possibly can, and so, like many of us, you've spent countless hours studying the emerging information, sifting out provisional conclusions and observations along the way, and not forgetting them, even the ones from months before. You post a lot of good information on this situation, and I appreciate it as a matter of survival. I will survive also, if I can.

We're six months in, and even Moon of Alabama threads are still saturated with unknowing and disputation.

And then a light breaks through the clouds.

Many thanks.

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 9 2020 3:15 utc | 135

RSH @128 - I just noticed your comment and agree. I mentioned international students briefly in my comment focusing on the business aspects.

That is a HUGE mistake. An incredible blunder. The US has benefited immensely from being a place millions of people wanted to go to learn.

I was already beginning to watch what would happen with international students coming to the US even before COVID. I was predicting that the numbers would begin to drop as the idiot-in-chief raged and made people feel most unwelcome in the US. The COVID crisis and the pathetic US response ramped the issue up considerably. And now students will be KICKED OUT!


The US is a pariah state and could collapse quickly. This is a dangerous time with a mentally deranged ignoramus flailing as the leader of a super power, constantly lashing out with increasingly violent rhetoric.

Who's gonna save the day - Biden?

Posted by: snow_watcher | Jul 9 2020 3:28 utc | 136

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 8 2020 21:54 utc | 84 who spewe in usual uninformed fashion:
"New Zealand - lauded as a success story in containing Covid 19 - No masks."

During lockdown here we spent nearly two months distributing masks to vulnerable people.
The reason the government didn't insist on masks was simple, they had none available.

However when the news of Covid first hit I began ordering masks from China. Why? Cos when I went into town, my pharmacy told me a story about how a couple had come into their shop and bought all masks. The idiot pharmacist sold the whole lot because she thought "I'll just order some more" but there were no more to be had. This was in early february, so I ordered a few hundred in different batches to see which courier/postal service worked best. A couple were useless and the masks only turned up after the end of lockdown but one (one of the least costly too) got me the masks within 10 days.
I kept ordering & distributing and I know I wasn't the only person in Aotearoa to do this cos towards the end we were backing up with other similar operations in other parts of Aotearoa.

As it happened community transmission in Aotearoa was very low, so the mask issue didn't become critical, then as we came outta lockdown all the supermarkets began stocking masks and most people have bought a package against the time when community transmission does happen.

Dingbats who reckon the virus is no problem, you don't need masks etc., will eventually succeed in getting rid of the 14 day quarantine for new arrivals; greed & stupidity trumping commonsense and we will get community transmission here. Then people will break out the masks & gloves.

Oh one further thing about the death rate falling, that is another furphy from stupid meets greedy.

When testing first began in amerika, only really sick people got tested. Remember how amerikan testing "couldn't happen?"

Trump's bagman Kushner had tried to stitch up a deal where their 'trust' copped 15% of the charge for every test but their test was an antibody one rather than a pcr - quick but really inaccurate and the CDC wouldn't approve it. The reagents and technical training for PCR testing wasn't about so only really ill people were tested and there was a long turnaround time.

The death rate is calculated by determining the total numbers of people tested and dividing it by the numbers who died.

It stands to reason if yer only testing really sick people more of them are going to die, rather than testing everyone in a bubble where at least one person has it, but there are others who are positive but non-symptomatic.

That is why the death rate appears to have dropped. Nothing has changed other than a higher percentage of those who return a positive test aren't symptomatic with covid 19.

Protocols for covid treatment have gotten better but one statistic remains the same. If you are put on a respirator you have a 1 in 5 chance of surviving.

Intensive care wards in Florida and Arizona are full to the gunnels with people who are on respirators. The numbers of deaths are going to get a lot higher yet.

I dunno why we are still having a debate about this here, blind freddy can see that a cadre of trumpists are using this blog to spread disinformation whenever a covid thread is opened. Providing that platform is criminally stupid.

Posted by: A User | Jul 9 2020 3:32 utc | 137

This is the spectacle all the people on this earth have been watching over the last few months. What do you think the people on this earth are concluding ?

Me think that the rest of the world has finally had enough of Western exceptionalism!

laodan | Jul 9 2020 2:19 utc | 126

I think you are correct. I'm pleased you wrote western exceptionalism,because unfortunately, it's not just the U.S.(the absolute worst)
Here in S.E. Asia, the governments have done a spendid job controlling the virus.

Posted by: V | Jul 9 2020 3:39 utc | 138

Posted by: A User | Jul 9 2020 3:32 utc | 135

"New Zealand - lauded as a success story in containing Covid 19 - No masks."

A place of extremely geographical isolation with the population of maybe 2 Chinese rural counties is portrayed as a "successful" COVID containment story is only so because incompetent Anglos desperately need some face saving.

Posted by: JW | Jul 9 2020 3:48 utc | 139

Kay Fabe @Jul9 2:45 #130

I hope b will see your comment and reconsider his stance on HCQ.

I think he caved to anti-HCQ fear-mongering because he didn't want to put moa at risk. But now there's more evidence that HCQ+Zinc protects people from getting Covid-19 and other complications of the SARS-COV-2.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 9 2020 4:03 utc | 140

Posted by: Rhisiart Gwlym | Jul 8 2020 20:02 utc | 53

Posted by: brian | Jul 9 2020 4:36 utc | 141

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 9 2020 3:15 utc | 136 Many thanks.

You're welcome.

A lot of people here ignore my posts. Which is fine if they ignore the ones where I babble my philosophy. But if they ignore the posts where I provide links to good information, they're...well, they're morons. :-)

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 6:35 utc | 142

Posted by: A User | Jul 9 2020 3:32 utc | 138 I dunno why we are still having a debate about this here, blind freddy can see that a cadre of trumpists are using this blog to spread disinformation whenever a covid thread is opened. Providing that platform is criminally stupid.

Indeed. I think b needs to resume his practice of culling the real idiot posts here. Most of these clowns are clearly Trump supporters getting their marching orders from "Dear Leader."

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 6:41 utc | 143

if some of your minority disgruntled readers/ commenters don't like your research and journalism they can always switch to the Langley Times or the Bezos Post.

Posted by: Paul | Jul 9 2020 6:45 utc | 144

@ vk etc
I'm not going to risk my life to go to a restaurant. I doesn't matter if that risk is an extra 10% or an extra 0.26% - it is an extra risk I don't need to take, for the simple fact going to the restaurant is a superfluous commodity. This is simple game theory, has nothing to do with ideology.

This is not game theory. This is the opposite of game theory. GT is math, you ignore math.

Seriously people get a grip, do you drive a car? Do you walk down a street? Do you use a stove or drink water from a tap?
Risk is everywhere. Your risk of dying from covid is almost nothing. The overall # (perhaps its .26%) doesn't include anything personal about you - it includes the huge % that died in nursing homes, do you live in a nursing home? It includes a huge # of people that politicians sent to nursing homes to die as well. If you spend your time worrying about a bag of hammers falling on your head you might as well give up on life now.

Go, do your research on daily deaths, causes of deaths. You can use the pure nasty american 'statistics' even.

Plus the cost of this... the costs of these lockdowns and the propaganda and the fear mongering and the human costs of the attention being so pin pointed on covid are so large and not measured at all in this. If you dont put the other side of the ledger up you're wasting your time, you might as well be doing 2 mins on msnbc.

And finally. it moves the topic of conversation. we here should be talking about the decay of our post future world. Pulling in strands and information from around the world to shine some truth on whats really going on. This covid tripe has even lured the best and the brightest of the opposition, some of the readers and writers here for example,
from what is really important.

Posted by: x00x | Jul 9 2020 7:07 utc | 145

@ A User. Like your stuff and good tip about masks thanks. Do you write anywhere in Aotearoa?

Posted by: fabian | Jul 9 2020 7:46 utc | 146

The cost of lockdown is real but our ultra liberal pseudo-democracies haven't found another way to tell people they can't fly/travel. And if they do, then it will indeed come to the point we'll see people falling/dying in the street.

Posted by: Mina | Jul 9 2020 7:50 utc | 147

A User | Jul 9 2020 3:32 utc | 135


As you very well know mask wearing is not mandatory in NZ & never has been.
Of course some people wear masks (the same in Australia) - a small percentage in specific circumstances (mostly the old or those around the elderly & a higher percentage of Asians).

Three (3) people under the age of 60 years of age have died from Covid 19 in Australia to date.
This is a disease that affects the elderly.
The elderly need to be protected.
Common sense dictates that correct PPE should be worn around the elderly.

(Cue torrent of abuse & sensational fear mongering nonsense about how Covid 19 causes diabetes/heart disease/brain disease/ & all cancers known to man.

In the case of Australia & NZ successful control of Covid 19 was achieved by not requiring mandatory wearing of the mask by the healthy general public.

The NZ Ministry of Health website current policy "Use of face masks in the community" seems to be identical to the Australian Gov.
"...Based on the New Zealand context of COVID-19 and the range of control measures we have in place (including staying home if unwell, basic hygiene measures and maintaining physical distancing where possible and practical), current advice on the use of face masks in the wider community is as follows:

Healthy people in the community are not currently required to wear a face mask for protection from COVID-19 in New Zealand...."

To me this is common sense advice - act the way any sensible person does when they have the normal flu - stay away, don't cough & splutter on people, don't share utensils/household items etc., don't touch everything with your grubby mitts, be considerate & be aware that you have something that is contagious - stay away.

While certain characters go apoplectic with rage when anybody disagrees with them, it would be more productive for them to ask themselves two simple question:
What did the governments of Australia & NZ do differently?
What did the people of Australia & NZ do differently?

'One use masks' are what they say they are 'one use'.
Advocating their reuse multiple times is gross stupidity.

If you are going to wear a mask at least have the gumption to do it properly.

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 9 2020 7:53 utc | 148

Posted by: Paul | Jul 9 2020 6:45 utc | 145

I don't think B has much respect for sycophantic bootlickers.

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 9 2020 7:57 utc | 149

Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 6:41 utc | 144

"...cadre of trumpists are using this blog to spread disinformation..."

Please can clearly articulate the disinformation that I am spreading.
If you are not referring to me feel free to ignore.

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 9 2020 8:04 utc | 150

For those China followers counting on the seasonal flu to destroy the US,I would like to sell you a Nirvana I have in Shanghai.
Sorry to say the Wuhan Flu is way past its best days.

The CCP botches even its weapon labs.

Posted by: Liberty Blogger | Jul 9 2020 8:25 utc | 151

Richard Steven Hack

Thank you for your posts. Great span of information.

Salut your feverish mind :) Stay well.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 9 2020 8:40 utc | 152

South Africa has been in various stages on lockdown since the 26th March.

We were in full lockdown for a whole 6 weeks.

People must wear masks if they leave the house since day 1 of the lockdown. When you walk into a shop they spray your hands with sanitizer. You can’t go into any shop without a mask.
Old people have been told to stay at home. Schools have resumed slowly in stages with Grades 7 and 12 first under strict hygiene conditions.

We were one of the first countries to go in full lockdown early and we have done of the stringest lockdown rules in the world.

Yet the virus still spreads. The Health Minister told us that hospitals will reach full capacity in 4 weeks and we are still only on Stage 4 of the lockdown. Stage 1 is the lowest. They are considering going back to full lockdown.

But how so ? According to the intelligentsia that resides in the deep bowels if moa that should have led to a decrease in cases ? Anyone who disagrees is a troll, a Trump supporter , (pick your slur)

Posted by: Down South | Jul 9 2020 8:48 utc | 153

On top of the virus spreading so fast there also has to be taken into account the cost of the lockdown and I’m not speaking financial. Chris Hani/ Baragwanath Hospital is starting to see cases of malnutrition which they had never seen before. Operations were cancelled. How many people who needed surgery died from not getting it. Where is the stats for that ?? Now before you can go to a hospital for any procedure you first have to do a Covid test and if it comes back positive, no procedure.

As a result of the poverty xenophobia, which was mainly a lower class phenomena has now spread to the middle class. Twitter daily has a trending #. which is openly xenophobic. #Nigeriansmustgo #PutSourhAfricansfirst #IstandwithSAtruckdrivers etc.

There is a well known case recently of a Sudanese born doctor, DrTaban who was assaulted by metro police because they didn’t like him as he was a foreigner, called his wife (SA born) a whore for marrying a foreigner. Even though the doctor (a pulmonologist) was racing to the hospital to treat Covid19 patients.

There is a real cost to these lockdowns which is completely ignored.

Posted by: Down South | Jul 9 2020 9:09 utc | 154

That method of steam sterilisation doesn't look entirely safe. As mentioned in the paper, when boiling water in a microwave (without boiling chips or something similar) you have the potential for superheating to occur.

Posted by: aairfccha | Jul 9 2020 9:13 utc | 155

Its a long way to the top but once you get there it becomes the highway to hell.

I liked both these when I was flying. Very applicable to the current anglosphere

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 9:14 utc | 156

Richard Steven Hack says:

The morons are out in force in this thread...

Do the math (oh, wait, I forgot, the morons can't do arithmetic.

The morons, of course, can't comprehend that

It's amazing how many of the morons fail to read the accounts of the front-line medical people who are treating virus patients

But the morons are certain that they know better

Hopefully, the morons will get infected and die

Unfortunately, given the relatively low death rate of the virus, most of the morons will remain alive to infect everyone else with their stupidity

People who say they don't are morons...

It's too bad the virus doesn't distinguish between smart people and morons

I hope most of the morons here are "essential"

too many MORONS

Well, that's no problem, right, morons

Oh, and your kids, morons... It's unfortunate that kids have morons for parents...

But the morons will continue to cite obsolete statistics...


oh, and here's Grieved @ 136, our most congenial poster, addressing RSH...

Every time you call people morons because they act like morons, I feel a light breaks through the clouds

bask in the glow, dude, bask in the glow.

Posted by: john | Jul 9 2020 9:15 utc | 157

snow_watcher #133

The MIC is all we have.

The rest of the world is going to move on as the US flounders in feces.

Exactly that and I need some comic relief from this gloom - Vic WILL be ticked off.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 9 2020 9:26 utc | 158

Ramaphosa was told by his scientific advisers there is nothing more he could do, he had taken all the precautions necessary , whatever is going to happen will happen, and so they advised him to go to lockdown level 1. He refused. The WHO said SA must lower the lockdown in stages and that is what he has done. So the economic hardship will continue leading to more poverty leading to rampant xenophobia which one day I’m afraid will turn into violence unlike any we have seen so far.


Posted by: Down South | Jul 9 2020 9:28 utc | 159

1% of 330 million is 3.3 million. Acceptable?

Posted by: Mark Gaughan | Jul 9 2020 9:38 utc | 160

I come here for the middle east analysis, and now for info about the virus. thanks to b, and some of the commenters like rsh and snow-watcher. living in an emerging hot spot and being in a vulnerable group, i have a keen interest in the subject.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 9 2020 9:38 utc | 161

Down South #155

There is a real cost to these lockdowns which is completely ignored.

Thank you for your information on South Africa and I trust you will all get a grip on its spread.
In the bunya nut republic a few thousand kilometers east of you they almost had it under control and then a dumb arse private security company employed low pay, low skill security people to guard a quarantine hostel of recent arrivals from elsewhere on the planet.

There was minimal 10 minute training for these low skill, low pay recruits. They blew it, got too close, some got into bed with the clients under guard. Then they took that Covid cuddly back to their homes which happened to be in high density, high rise structures. Now it is rampant and an entire city and surrounding regions are locked down. The army is guarding everything.

Now I have a discontent when the private sector screws up and seems to avoid having to pay for its gross callous negligence leaving the public sector to fix it. These rsoles in the private sector have cost the community purse millions through their callous disregard for the consequences of the cavalier attitude.

Its about time that directors and shareholders had their entire assets seized by the state until such time as the cost of such exercises can be deducted from their banks and sold up assets. Both Directors and shareholders are liable to see their companies act in a manner that does not screw the public.

This Coronavirus episode has revealed that capitalism without conscience or penalty is a detestable failure. It needs to change: immediate confiscation of all wealth, all assets, then a rapid legal process to determine the longevity and span of the confiscation until the damage is rectified. Without dire penalty the unconscionable will screw the dedicated service providers and the state.

The Bunya nut republic press seems to have an enormous difficulty in even publishing the name of the company that has perpetrated this crime against society. Vic is not the only one ticked off.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 9 2020 9:47 utc | 162

They say hospitals in Miami are full.........full of what? gunshot victims? The only thing wrong with FL is that it is THE battleground state and the Democrats (in S. FL) are doing their part in throwing the election. Most of you on this site seem to be old enough to know this nonsense happens every 4 years. Especially in Florida!!!

Posted by: ceaclearly | Jul 9 2020 9:51 utc | 163

Maskturbators. Wear one now:) Comic relief again.
There are some priceless line here - thermometer logic :))

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 9 2020 9:54 utc | 164

uncle tungsten | Jul 9 2020 9:47 utc | 163

They were also paying their employees cash in hand - no tax paid & no super.
I don't think there was any tender process.
Also cases of 'ghosting'.

Quality outfits.

Where was the oversight by government?
They are equally culpable.

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 9 2020 10:00 utc | 165

"The U.S. Has Surrendered To The Pandemic. Protect Yourself."

Is it U.S. or Trump who has surrendered?

Posted by: Muzaffar | Jul 9 2020 10:09 utc | 166

Trolls and anglosphere media have got everyone squabbling over the bug. Squabbling should be over cue bono rather than the bug.

ACDC's highway to hell was something I liked when I was flying. It is now a very apt song for the anglosphere.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 10:12 utc | 167

b writes “More and more people will know someone who died of Covid-19.”

That is the problem right there. Where I live 0.1% of the entire population is supposedly dead. That is one person in one thousand. No one knows anyone who has died. In NYC I know people who say they know no one who has died. Myself I know a woman, an old friend, who lost her brother back in March. I met him once for maybe two minutes, did not know him. Losing her brother was, and is, a big deal. She expected the floodgates to open. And nothing. Even that person is wondering what the heck is going on.

Here in Evanston the rolling seven day average for new daily cases is two. Some days no new cases. People are not getting tested. For the longest time it was simply not possible to get tested. And no one ever understood what it would take to be allocated a test. Basically those with tests in hand chose who got tests and nothing you could say to them made any difference. Front line health care workers wanted to be tested, and wanted regular re-tests. And were endlessly denied. Now they are begging the public to come in and get tested and no takers. Even the health care workers just won’t go in and get a test. Told them NO! A hundred times and it is over. For a while employers were having employees, meet the public type employees, get tested. But all that happened was a few got positive tests and had to take 14 days off work. No one was getting sick. So employers don’t get the staff tested and the staff sure doesn’t want time off.

We are lied to endlessly. Nothing the authorities say is ever true. Nothing.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jul 9 2020 10:30 utc | 168

To the deniers: Why argue about the covid being harmless? If you are so egotistical as an infant that you strongly believe that you cannot wear a mask because everyone must see your face, which you apparently think is the most beautiful thing on Earth because all you are is childish ego, then just don't wear a mask. Get covid brain damage, kill your grandparents, and be shunned by people who are capable of thinking about more than just themselves, and keep your ugly mug on display like that's the most important thing in the world.

But why bother coming here to argue about it? Morons don't need permission from readers here to not wear a mask, so what are they trying to accomplish by arguing here that the virus is harmless? Just sit back and enjoy the show until a year from now when enough data will be available. Then they can point out "Only a million people died in the US, and nobody misses them!" What do they gain from trying to convince other people to not wear masks now?

I think Richard Steven Hack @111 nailed it pretty accurately. These virus deniers are the kind of delusional fools so prevalent in the West these days who think that they can make something true by believing in it hard enough. These Tinkerbells think they just need to get a critical mass of believers on their side and {{poof}} the world changes to match their fantasy. It is people like Richard Steven Hack, who don't believe the virus is a big nothingburger, who are holding back this magical transformation of the virus into pixie dust, and so these people must be convinced of the error of their perspective.

My local hospital just filled up yesterday. I didn't hear about it on the news, but my neighbor who is a nurse there told me. I don't see her too much anymore now that she's been working double shifts, but I did catch her yesterday as she was stumbling home to pass out for a few hours. She will be pleased to hear that this is all a big mistake and the virus isn't really a problem.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jul 9 2020 10:41 utc | 169

Grim projection: 200,000 dead by Election Day

“I am despairing for the future,” said David Eisenman, the director of the UCLA Center for Public Health and Disasters. “I don’t see anything happening to indicate that [the future] will be much better.”

It took just four weeks for the U.S. to jump from 2 million coronavirus infections to the 3 million mark. Most forecasters now say that, as case counts accelerate at a record pace, it will likely take even less time to surpass 4 million.

The dubious milestone comes a week after President Donald Trump again said coronavirus would just disappear and on the day that he threatened to cut federal funding to states that don’t fully reopen schools in a matter of weeks.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 10:45 utc | 170

Posted by: oldhippie | Jul 9 2020 10:30 utc | 169 Nothing the authorities say is ever true. Nothing.

I'm not listening to the government. I'm listening to the front-line medical workers.

Nothing *you* say is ever true. Nothing.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 10:47 utc | 171

The original ACDC Its a long way to the top if you want to rock and roll.
The US empire/anglosphere made its way to the top through conquest. China has made its way to the top through manufacturing and trade and communications. Most that comment here live within the anglosphere and that includes the Eurotwits.
So now we are gonna take china down. For anybody that has got some money to invest - long term, a good investment would be yuan or rubles.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 10:50 utc | 172


You are listening to front line medical personnel in SF, where approx one person in 20,000 has died. Greatest epidemic ever. Right.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jul 9 2020 11:10 utc | 173

Health official: Trump rally ‘likely’ source of virus surge

Tulsa County reported 261 confirmed new cases on Monday, a one-day record high, and another 206 cases on Tuesday. By comparison, during the week before the June 20 Trump rally, there were 76 cases on Monday and 96 on Tuesday...

Although masks were provided to rally goers, there was no requirement that participants wear them, and most didn’t.

A reporter who attended the Trump rally is among those who have tested positive for COVID-19, along with six of Trump’s campaign staffers and two members of the Secret Service who worked in advance of the rally.

Trump morons. Nice to hear six of his staffers got it. Can we hope Trump was shaking hands with them?

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 11:16 utc | 174

Posted by: oldhippie | Jul 9 2020 11:10 utc | 174

You are aware that San Francisco was one of the first counties in the nation to lock down, right?

Of course not. You're not aware of anything.


Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 11:17 utc | 175

William Gruff 170

The virus argument is nothing more than reality tv bullshit for the masses. b puts it straight up an plainly. I feel it is the geopolitical implications we should be looking at rather than arguing propaganda details with trolls or suckers.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 11:27 utc | 176

A Spike in People Dying at Home Suggests Coronavirus Deaths in Houston May Be Higher Than Reported

An increasing number of these at-home deaths have been confirmed to be the result of COVID-19, Harris County medical examiner data shows.

The previously unreported jump in people dying at home is the latest indicator of a mounting crisis in a region beset by one of the nation’s worst and fastest-growing coronavirus outbreaks. On Tuesday, a record 3,851 people were hospitalized for the coronavirus in the Houston region, exceeding normal intensive care capacity and sending some hospitals scrambling to find additional staff and space.

The uptick in the number of people dying before they can even reach a hospital in Houston draws parallels to what happened in New York City in March and April, when there was a spike in the number of times firefighters responded to medical calls, only to discover that the person in need of help had already died. These increases also echo those reported during outbreaks in Detroit and Boston, when the number of people dying at home jumped as coronavirus cases surged.

While far more people died of COVID-19 in those cities than have died so far in Houston, researchers and paramedics say that the trend of sudden at-home deaths in Texas’ largest city is concerning because it shows that the virus’s toll may be deeper than what appears in official death tallies and daily hospitalization reports...

Many people who die at home are not tested for COVID-19, said Dr. Jeremy Faust, an emergency medicine physician at Brigham and Women’s Hospital in Boston. In New York City, for example, only 16 percent of the 11,475 at-home deaths between February and June have been attributed to COVID-19, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

“There’s no reflexive testing,” Faust said, noting that medical examiners are selective about the cases they take. “There’s no pressure to call it a COVID death.”

Exactly the opposite of what the morons are claiming about everyone dying of comorbidities and doctors supposedly mistakenly labeling it COVID-19.

Another conspiracy theory debunked.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 11:31 utc | 177

This might turn out to be useful - UCSF Library made a virus resources page.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 9 2020 11:34 utc | 178

Paul @ 145

Exactly. If readers can't sift through what they consider chaff, find somewhere else to moan about the content.

Posted by: Digital Spartacus | Jul 9 2020 11:36 utc | 179

it's not too late,

Posted by: CMT | Jul 9 2020 11:41 utc | 180

I generally agree with RSH, but tend to disagree with the idea of censoring alternative viewpoints, however, wrong headed. So to play devil's advocate, I will post this by Neil Clark, a journalist, writing for Sputnik. I wear a face mask and it is compulsory in Turkey. I have no problem doing so. Masks can be gotten free at pharmacies.

Why Wearing Face Masks Shouldn't be Made Compulsory in the UK

"The UK government is coming under intense pressure to make the wearing of face masks mandatory in shops and other enclosed public places in England, but if that happens, it would be the wrong move.

And so it goes on. Even though deaths with COVID have dropped sharply, even though the virus has clearly petered out in Britain, even though there’s been an official acknowledgement that some 30,000 ‘positive‘ test results have been double-counted, the clamour for more ‘New Abnormal’ measures to be introduced grows by the day.

The ‘big’ thing this week is to try and make the wearing of face masks compulsory.

In Scotland, Nicola Sturgeon has announced that despite there having been no COVID deaths for several days north of the border, her government would be making the wearing of masks in shops in Scotland compulsory from the 10th July. Anyone not complying could face a fine of £60.

Sturgeon’s ‘safety first’ approach has been lauded by her supporters but is it the right one?

The onus is surely on those who want to introduce such illiberal measures to prove that they are necessary. I don’t believe the advocates of mandatory mask-wearing have done that.

In March, Dr Jenny Harries, the Deputy Chief Medical Officer, said wearing masks could actually put people more at risk.

"Tell me about the value of wearing face-masks, is there any point to that," Dr Harries was asked by PM Boris Johnson.

She replied: "If a healthcare professional hasn’t advised you to wear a face mask, it’s usually quite a bad idea. People tend to leave them on, they contaminate the face mask and then wipe it over something, so it’s really not a good idea and doesn’t help."


The widespread use of masks everywhere is not supported by high-quality scientific evidence, and there are potential benefits and harms to consider‘.

WHO did not call on governments to make mask-wearing compulsory and only said governments should "encourage" the public to wear a fabric mask "if there was widespread community transmission," which clearly there isn’t in Britain at the moment.

It’s strange then that there’s such a campaign now to make the wearing of masks mandatory, given the very low risks of catching Coronavirus (COVID-19) in July 2020 in the community at large.

If we weren’t wearing them in March when we’re told COVID was as its peak, why wear them in mid-July?

Moreover, if you take the line that we’re better safe than sorry, why were there no calls to make the wearing of masks mandatory in the winter of 2017/8 when there 50,000 excess deaths- thought to be caused by the predominant strain of flu?

The fact that there were no calls then for masks to be worn by the politicians now calling for us all to wear them is quite revealing. Because surely if you think face coverings do make a difference with reducing infections, you’d want them used every time there is a bad bug doing the rounds?

In fact, given the figures, you could argue that there was a much stronger case for wearing face masks in early 2018 than there is in the summer of 2020. Yet no one made the case for the two years ago.Clearly there‘s more to this than meets the eye. You don’t have to be Hercule Poirot to suspect there’s a hidden agenda at play.

​The simple question for those who want to make face masks mandatory is: For how long?

Until we have zero COVID cases? Until a vaccine is found? Until there are no infectious diseases doing the rounds? I asked that question yesterday on Twitter and didn't get a satisfactory answer.


You can’t say the same about masks. Masks can make us ill. They are particularly bad news for elderly people and those with breathing difficulties. They can trigger asthma attacks and are problematic for people who are autistic, deaf and hard of hearing.

With COVID having petered out in Britain, making masks mandatory at this stage only serves to boost paranoia about a virus which any calm, objective analysis tells us has been greatly over-hyped.

Put another way, the risks of catching the virus don’t warrant the measures that are being imposed or advocated. Face-mask-wearing bolsters the narrative that COVID is a huge threat to us- on a par with the Black Death-which it isn’t.


It always makes sense to observe basic hygiene, to regularly wash your hands and to sneeze into a hanky and away from someone. If you‘ve got a cold, or think you‘re coming down with the flu, stay away from others as much as you can, especially vulnerable people.

But mandatory face mask-wearing is a ludicrous overreaction. Let those who wish to wear them do so, but there should be no pressure applied on everyone else to follow suit."

Posted by: Blue Dotterel | Jul 9 2020 12:22 utc | 181

@ Posted by: Muzaffar | Jul 9 2020 10:09 utc | 167

Definitely the USA.

Trump, as POTUS, is the personification of the USA. Therefore, everything he says or does is the same thing as if the USA itself has done it.

Posted by: vk | Jul 9 2020 12:24 utc | 182

Five-eyes don't like trump because he is a US nationalist, but he is also the gift that keeps on giving. Five eyes began the pivot on China with obama in 2011

We cannot control this latest fad because we are not an authoritarian country like china, but now the oz military is enforcing the borders between colonies. Perhaps Lord Pomp Ass will fund me to throw petrol bombs at somebody? But yeah, us anglos have ruled the world for a bit, a sparrow fart in history to be exact, but still still, we can't let the chinks beat us by building infrastructure and communications.

The soviet Union destroyed Nazi Germany, the greatest military power of the day - the yanks in a sideshow with luck destroyed Imperial Japan sea and air power at Midway - But then had to wait for soviet union to move its army from Germany to to Manchuria to actually defeat the Japanese. Yay for the anglosphere. We are the greatest. Bullshit that is....

We are going into either a hot or cold war with the east because they will not bow to US/anglo diktats.

To go anter another country, where I dont speak the language, get caught by the cons on arival, but to the the decent people, honest people, an alien culture to mine - Though with this anglo white-eyes five-eyes culture breaking down, the east looks fuckin good to a white-eyes like me.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 12:28 utc | 183

@Michael Droy
"My guess is that if nothing is done to prevent everyone being exposed to Covid, then on average we will have our lives reduced by 2 months per person."

Is this the New Math?

Posted by: Light Traffic | Jul 9 2020 12:39 utc | 184

I'm not letting the virus deniers off the hook as delusional morons. They are deliberate and fully conscious of what they are doing. If they were living in China they would have been disappeared and/or executed by now, and with this I agree with the CCP. In a time of crisis like this, you don't suffer purposeful fools. You execute them. On the spot. I think we're probably very close to that in America, but vigilante style. American law enforcement and the American government thus far have been protecting the virus-denying purposeful fools, but as the crisis worsens, people are going to reach a breaking point and then administer proper justice to the virus deniers and those who refuse to take proper precautions. It will become open season and as far as I'm concerned it can't come soon enough. God what I would give to rip these bastards to shreds. They are parroting the Trump regime's malevolent talking points related to this virus and therefore are complicit in the, what is effectively, gassing of the American people and the world actually considering America is an out-of-control disease vector. Once again because it can't be stated enough, Donald J. Trump and his supporting cast, his regime and his supporters domestic and foreign, is/are mass murderers and MUST BE BROUGHT TO JUSTICE NOW!! Congress and the Supreme Court refuse to act. The undemocratic alphabet agencies who have a license to kill refuse to act. The military refuses to act. ALL ARE COMPLICIT IN THIS MASS MURDER BECAUSE THEY HAVE THE ABILITY TO STOP IT AND THEY REFUSE TO ACT. They can't use the excuse that America is a nation of laws and there is the Constitution to think about. The record is clear on that, they don't give a shit about America being a nation of laws and they shredded the Constitution long ago to the point it's merely window dressing now hiding the bloated rotting stinking corpse in the back room.

That fucker from Sputnik, where would he like to meet so I can annihilate his Russian fucking ass. No doubt the FBI and CIA and NSA would protect his Russian ass, like they protect PL's ass, traitors that they are.

Posted by: | Jul 9 2020 12:46 utc | 185

Remove Trump will anything change in USA?

I am having a discussion with a friend who insists if Trump is replaced America will shine again.

Thanks for your response.

Posted by: Muzaffar | Jul 9 2020 12:46 utc | 186

@ Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 12:28 utc | 184

There's no difference between American nationalism and imperialism (globalism). To be a patriot in the USA is to crave for world domination. See Manifest Destiny.

Posted by: vk | Jul 9 2020 12:53 utc | 187

Posted by: Light Traffic | Jul 9 2020 12:39 utc | 185

It's called statistics. ... I would suppose you can spin whatever you like in times with limited solid knowledge. But then when if ever do we have all the knowledge we would like to have???

Remove Trump will anything change in USA?

I am having a discussion with a friend who insists if Trump is replaced America will shine again.

Thanks for your response.

Posted by: Muzaffar | Jul 9 2020 12:46 utc | 187

Not really. This is a good question anyway. But he no doubt he maust be somewhat somehow shameful to quite a few Americans as top face or representative.

Posted by: blum | Jul 9 2020 12:54 utc | 188

Someone will have to explain why Vietnam, next door to China has zero deaths. Is this due to a herd immunity from the use of anti-malarial drugs such as HCQ?

It seems to me that the politicians take advice from the doctors, who take advice from WHO, who in turn take their orders from the psychopaths who run our debt based monetary system.

Everyone has plausible deniability, and while the smoke and mirrors of the virus is going on there is also a banking heist being performed that the little fish do not seem to understand.

Posted by: Ric G | Jul 9 2020 12:56 utc | 189


too speady, how did the a get in here: maust=must.

Posted by: blum | Jul 9 2020 12:56 utc | 190

i think y'all mask wearing aficionados and lockdown enthusiasts might be onto something after all...

in Gaza, where about 2 million people are living on top of each other in less than ideal sanitary conditions and more often than not in abject poverty, covid numbers are pretty marginal...

72 confirmed cases, 60 recovered, 1 death.

and all it took was about 70 years of lockdown.

i guess one man's fear is another man's atonement.

Posted by: john | Jul 9 2020 13:00 utc | 191

The "increase" in COVID cases is due to people going to hospitals for their delayed procedures and are being tested. They are not going to hospitals because of COVID symptoms. Texas redefined who gets categorized as COVID, from verified to also include probable.
What percentage of COVID deaths are people in old folks homes and assisted living housing?
What are the numbers on seasonal flu deaths? Heart attacks?

Posted by: JaimeInTexas | Jul 9 2020 13:24 utc | 192

Death rate is double or triple reported number. Those who died at home were not included in count. Those who were unable get needed care for other illnesses and who died as a result were not included in the count. Adding it all up and you get to half a million dead.

Posted by: RenoDino | Jul 9 2020 13:25 utc | 193

@ Posted by: JaimeInTexas | Jul 9 2020 13:24 utc | 193

But other Americans here are telling us the overloading of the American healthcare system is a myth!

The only way to reconcile the two narratives (since both are national narratives, we can't use the State-by-State hypothesis) is to accept the fact that Americans are dying more of lack of treatment because they lost their jobs, hence they stopped seeking the medical treatment they need to survive (the American healthcare system is entirely for profit).

Posted by: vk | Jul 9 2020 13:28 utc | 194

Hospitals are at capacities that are within normal range. There are a couple of places that is a problem, ahem, near the border with Mexico, but you are not supposed to say so in polite company.

As to overloading, we have a huge illegal immigration issue and for years ERs have been used as waiting rooms for non-emergencies. No one, by law, can be denied emergency medical treatment. Guess who remains holding the bill?

Posted by: JaimeInTexas | Jul 9 2020 13:38 utc | 195

@bevin #47
Great post!

Posted by: Jacek | Jul 9 2020 13:50 utc | 196

158 - Regardless of rights and wrongs about the virus, it is clear we are in the presence of a wonderful human being. It would be truly tragic if he were to sicken and die despite all precautions because the world needs more people sputtering about "morons".

Posted by: Waldorf | Jul 9 2020 13:50 utc | 197

You wrote:

"In Gaza, where about 2 million people are living on top of each other in less than ideal sanitary conditions and more often than not in abject poverty, covid numbers are pretty marginal...

72 confirmed cases, 60 recovered, 1 death.

and all it took was about 70 years of lockdown."

My question what is Gaza doing different? Is Cuba their model?

Posted by: Muzaffar | Jul 9 2020 13:54 utc | 198

vk 188

Yep. US have always had manifest destiny, but the anglosphere/five-eyes quiet belief in superiority is now coming very much to the fore. The Cecil Rhodes and Churchill types pulled the US and its manifold destiny back into the anglo fold through and at the end of WWII

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 9 2020 14:02 utc | 199

AU1 200

I disagree. It is true for some but not true for others.

As to manifest destiny. We cannot change the past and, today, there is no manifest destiny. There is no desire to acquire new lands, an attempt to control other countries, sure. The only land related extreme nonsense has to do with Israel.

Posted by: JaimeInTexas | Jul 9 2020 14:19 utc | 200

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