Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 23, 2020

Open Thread 2020-58

News & views ...

Posted by b on July 23, 2020 at 14:04 UTC | Permalink

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S. Korean economy suffers worst contraction since 1998 crisis

I told you.

South Korea loses so much time and resources trying to become Western, so I'll give them this old one from Hegel: Minerva's Owl is always late.

The game's over for Moon Jae-in.

--//--

Tokyo logs 366 new coronavirus cases, topping 300 for first time

And given the Japanese government's fascist cover up policies (which stifles test to the maximum), we can easily multiply this number by 10-15, which would give Tokyo's daily cases to a 3,660-5,490.

You can stop leaving your shoes outside your homes now, Westerners: Japan is a farce, and there's no amount of reverse racism that can cover this up.

--//--

China marching to Mars for humanity's better shared future

--//--

Roughly two-thirds of Americans receiving unemployment benefits under the CARES act during the pandemic are getting more income than they did when working! For one in five, their income has doubled.

If the Trump's government is smart, they shouldn't even think about stopping giving the American populace its annona... oops, I mean, unemployment benefits.

--//--

The euro is booming on the news of the tortuous agreement reached by the EU member states for a mutually funded COVID recovery package.

Yeah... who's gonna tell the kids this "rescue package" won't work?

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 14:21 utc | 1

while y'all quibble about masks the global looting continues.
here's a little poem to ignore like the commentariat here ignores the supranational nature of the global elite.

FIAT FUKS

Black Rock is a crack rock
for these fiat junkie fuks
bailing out their buddies
with a cool trillion bucks

why take it, make excuses
sap our juices for these scum
who take and rape and rob
worse than any bum?

Black Rock’s quick attack shot
got no traction with the peeps
who Qanon for bread crumbs
in state cages seen as “deep”

but circuses have purposes
like genetically modified bread
and if they can’t make money
they’d rather see you dead

Posted by: lizard | Jul 23 2020 14:36 utc | 2

Fired Minneapolis officer Derek Chauvin, wife charged with tax crimes

He kills George Floyd over a $20 counterfeit bill...

"They underreported more than $460,000 in earnings and owe the government nearly $38,000, according to the charges."

How does a cop and his wife (what does she for a living - run a bank?) make this kind of money? They bought a $100,000 car.

More proof that being a corrupt cop pays very well indeed.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 23 2020 15:01 utc | 3

@Hack,

amazing insight, simply amazing. what are you going to inform us about next, that water is wet? maybe you can provide a dozen separate comments with helpful links proving the wetness of water.

Posted by: lizard | Jul 23 2020 15:11 utc | 4

Ok, time for part 2:

Trump is waging a Holy War against the yellows, they [the alt-right] say. He's fighting to protect Christianity, they say. He's fighting for the future of the white race, they say.

Well... not.

‘Europe shouldn’t let US meddle in its economy,’ German mayor under threat of US sanctions over Nord Stream 2 tells RT

Let's not sugar coat it: the USA is just a dirty, filthy empire. It's all good ol' imperialism.

--//--

Covid-19 could loosen communist rule in Vietnam

The moment I read the headline I knew the author was spreading fake news (as we know the other socialist countries are also doing very well against the pandemic). I could talk about how and where the author is lying.

But the article is hidden behind a paywall. What a shame.

--//--

Meanwhile, guy from an USG propaganda outlet talks about how North Korean propaganda is doing well:

North Korea’s Foreign Propaganda Takes a Step Towards Modernity

Coming from where it's coming, I would take it as a compliment.

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 15:13 utc | 5

@Richard Steven Hack #3
I don't think you have any idea how people actually make a living.
Chauvin was working at the same nightclub as Floyd. This work is not part of his normal police duties; I guarantee he was getting paid overtime - which in turn was paid by the nightclub (not the government/taxpayer).
Thus even if Chauvin was getting an average Minneapolis police salary of $60K/year - he would be getting 1.5x to 2x pay rates at the nightclub.
2-8 hour shifts a week would increase his income 75%. Another 6 hours would double it.
Minneapolis is also not SF - rents and other costs are a lot lower. A childless couple making $150K to $200K a year would be really well off.
Lastly, $460K of unreported income isn't for a single year - it is almost certainly for multiple years. One news report of the $460K reported income shortfall noted that his income was between $59K and $72K from 2014 to 2019, so the overtime was likely higher than what I used as an example above. The amount owed is also very low: $38K owed vs. $460K unreported income is less than 10% - which means the income wasn't "unreported" so much as likely Social Security or something similar wasn't (fully) paid. US federal tax rates at those brackets would mean a far higher % owed - 20% or more. Even the minimum federal tax bracket is 10% whereas $38K/$460K is 8.2%.

Posted by: c1ue | Jul 23 2020 15:14 utc | 6

@vk #1
Is it really better for Trump to "pay off" the unemployed by continuing the CARES act federal unemployment supplement?
Are those people Trump supporters? What percentage?
I would note that it is far more likely that Trump supporters are the small business owners that are the most affected by the lockdowns; which are employers as well as suppliers to these unemployed.
If we drill down to the electoral swing states: $600/week extra unemployment benefits, plus the state unemployment, means an employer would be competing vs $15/hour unemployment income - and note this unemployment income doesn't pay Social Security. This would seem to drive up the costs for those small business which can even operate.

Posted by: c1ue | Jul 23 2020 15:19 utc | 7

More talk about T-cells and B-cells (per Volchkov)
Australia T-cell and B-cell research
To recap: Volchkov, a Russian geneticist/medical researcher, was quoted in a John Helmer article that he believes the true COVID-19/nCOV/SARS-2 immunity comes from T-cell and B-cell activity. His view is based upon multiple European studies employing a very expensive T-cell/B-cell test called ELISPOT - and is that the actual nCOV infection rate is likely far higher than spot PCR or antibody tests can ever detect. In particular, if 20% of people tested by PCR or antibody tests show exposure, the likely actual exposure rate is 3 times higher (60% vs. 20%).
This has huge ramifications if true: it means places with high nCOV death rates have likely already achieved herd immunity levels.
One thing is true: death rates in every single nation and region with a high nCOV death/million count have fallen dramatically.
People are still dying, but they are dying at a far lower CFR/IFR rate.
IF, and I mean *IF*, this is true, this means the lockdown strategies actually did very little to "contain" the outbreak.
This is why looking at the historical behavior in different US states is so important.
California locked down early, but the nCOV mortality rates (both absolute and relative) have basically been flat from April until now.

Posted by: c1ue | Jul 23 2020 15:30 utc | 8

c1ue 8

US now appears to have a death rate similar to Australia, Russia and other countries that used good medical practice at the start.
US had a very high death rate at the start perhaps because the majority of cases where in New York, overloading hospitals there, plus it is likely they took no notice of what China had learnt at that point so started from scratch and re-invented the wheel over the bodies of the victims of US stupidity.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 15:54 utc | 9

"You can depend upon the Americans to do the right thing. But only after they have exhausted every other possibility" I guess Americans were a bit smarter those days. Now they try to exhaust things that aren't even possibilities.

Another reason for the lower current US death rate is the numbers are more wide spread, though the way they are going, they will again be swamping hospitals.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 15:59 utc | 10

Thank you, Lizard.

Posted by: Passingby | Jul 23 2020 16:07 utc | 11

@Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 15:54 utc | 9

According to data aggregate here https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ which may be completely wrong like any other source, total mortality rates are:

USA: ~7%
Brazil: ~5%
India: ~4%
Russia: ~2.2%
Australia: ~2%

It can be argued current rates are improving for USA, but then again, we can argue they can get even worse.

Posted by: Abe | Jul 23 2020 16:48 utc | 12

Has Israel caught on to the implications of the partnership being negotiated by China and Iran? It would strengthen Iran and alter the balance of power in the Middle East. It would be a strategic catastrophe for Israel. China was conspicuously absent from investing in Iranian energy in 2019. A Chinese oil company pulled out of a $5 billion natural gas project in Iran in October 2019. In the lead up to the deal, the Iranian side revealed details about negotiation of a much bigger investment package worth hundreds of billions of dollars, which sounds similar to the pact that is now reported to be in the final stages before closing. Clearly China was at a juncture in 2019 deciding on whether to go big or go home. They decided in 2019 to go home. Now only months later it looks like the decision will be reversed. The root of the strategic reversal is the Trump admin's stepped up initiative since February to dial up bellicosity and induce Asian states to form a grand alliance against China. China has reacted by starting to build its own alliance including a partnership with Iran.

But what is Israel going to do about it? Not award light rail contracts to Chinese construction companies to show that it is mad? Or will Israel be more strategic minded and seize the initiative? By that I mean figure out a way to halt the drift towards military confrontation in the Western Pacific so that China does not as a second order effect offload money, industry, and weapons to Iran.

Posted by: vigorspear | Jul 23 2020 16:51 utc | 13

...
and if they can’t make money
they’d rather see you dead

Posted by: lizard | Jul 23 2020 14:36 utc | 2

Yep. It's effing obvious that the main reason the Filthy Rich hoard money is to make sure that the Disgustingly Poor don't get their grubby little hands on it. Remind me how many Filthy Rich individuals own more wealth than the bottom 50% of Humanity?
Don't bother reminding me that they got that way by buying politicians.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jul 23 2020 16:52 utc | 14

=/ ...
and if they can’t make money
they’d rather see you dead /= -- above ^^^

I have really given it a lot of thought. They already have all the real money. They don't want any more useless money.

What they really want is for you to suffer. They will keep you alive as long as they can torture you. Period.

It's called Sado-capitalism.

Posted by: blues | Jul 23 2020 17:06 utc | 15

I think the web site is looking better! I am having an easier time reading... many thanks

Posted by: not important | Jul 23 2020 17:14 utc | 16

"Iran’s top security official: Harsher revenge awaits perpetrators of Gen. Soleimani’s assassination "

revenge

Posted by: arby | Jul 23 2020 17:34 utc | 17

I’d be interested on peoples views on this important link.
One hour long. A whistle blower nurse in a hospital in New York ! I have watched 10 mins and am already shocked, disgusted and sickened. I’ll get back to it when I’v calmed down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV0hOOB3oG4


America is now a mad house, if you are a sane member of the public hit the streets and protest. Or god help you.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 18:00 utc | 18

Whoever was involved in the Solemeni assassination in any way, drone operator, co-ordinator, etc., ought to be very careful about going higher than the first floor, driving a car, and probably many other activities.

Posted by: arby | Jul 23 2020 18:08 utc | 19

"Banana Republic Corruption" wow

Murray

Posted by: arby | Jul 23 2020 18:24 utc | 20

Blowback from the destruction of Libya, the attempted destruction of Syria, and the ugly face of European neo-imperialism:

Pernicious life and death policies in the Mediterranean

There is circumstantial evidence the European Union is systematically sinking boats loaded with refugees coming from the Libyan route. The MS editorial is correct in calling the Mediterranean "the graveyard of many people from the Middle East and Africa."

It looks like a continental-wide operation of genocide and silence: the Italian and Greek Coast Guards do the dirty job with secret blessing from their governments, and their governments count with the tacit blessing (and silence) from the other EU governments and their respective MSMs. The Russian and Chinese MSMs do nothing because they can't prove it (as they don't have access to the local) and are more honest than the Western MSM (they don't report what they can't know).

I wouldn't be surprised if we were talking, after all of this is done, of about some 100,000 dead drowned in the Mediterranean. After that dead boy in a Turkish beach fiasco, they took care of perfecting the scheme, so that the Italian and Greek coast guards can operate deeper into the sea, where the drowned corpses cannot be beached. If true, this would be the most well covered genocide in modern history, and the first one will full and direct complying from the "free press".

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 18:32 utc | 21

@vigorspear [13]

There are also shady reports of some Iran-Russia agreement, details of which are not known. I looked everywhere, all I could find is this link:
https://www.presstv.com/Detail/2020/07/22/630194/Iran-Russia-long-strategic-cooperation-agreement-Zarif-China-

Apparently, Iran understands that a major war is coming at it's doorsteps and is seeking help. However, it would be great to have some details on the matter.

Posted by: Frozen | Jul 23 2020 18:46 utc | 22

VK @ 21
Thanks for that link VK, why dose no one seem to mention or care about refugees. Truly a genocide of massive proportions !
The fascist’s march on.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 18:54 utc | 23

Re: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 18:00 utc | 18

Before taking this "whistle blower nurse's" word for everything, please look at the comments posted below that video by another nurse named Lisa Eischens.

Posted by: AntiSpin | Jul 23 2020 19:13 utc | 24

In Bolivia, the MAS will win in the first round (only 40% is needed if it's more than 10% ahead of 2nd place), so the regime is just suspending the right to vote in response.

https://twitter.com/OVargas52/status/1286362087636295681

Posted by: Evo Morales | Jul 23 2020 19:20 utc | 25

AntiSpin @ 24
AntiSpin I don’t pass my email out on subscribing to YouTube, twitter, Facebook ect ect.
Could you elaborate or copy the comment you think is relivant.
What am I missing here.
As someone who takes nothing at face value, I’m more than happy to listen and learn.
But it looks pretty genuine to me. Backed up by hidden camera ect.
You time and reply is much appreciated !

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 19:37 utc | 26

Very interesting opinion poll from Newsweek about Hong Kong
https://www.newsweek.com/exclusive-more-hong-kong-say-us-threat-china-poll-1519710

Posted by: Sven Lystbæk | Jul 23 2020 19:41 utc | 27

@18 mark2

Take with a grain of salt.

As another commenter also says, someone claiming to be a doc there left some detailed comments in the youtube so check those for the opposing side.

It would have been interesting to see this video produced by someone a little more neutral. This video is a mix of a lot of things, exaggerated and quite real, and the nurse has good reason to be horrified by

* the general screwyness and corruption of the medical system
* many of the docs talking down to everyone, including the nurses, even though the nurses provide 90% of the actual care
* the medical system having been turned into something like the kitchen at a mcdonalds, removing human intelligence from the process as much as possible
* that hospital in particular being the poster child for everything wrong with NYC public health care, i.e. overloaded to begin with
* during the crisis, esp. in April, private institutions were outbidding them for lots of critical supplies - in particular PPE and tests. Hence they had to diagnose based on limited information on xrays and lung/cardio function (blood oxygen).

From relatives, the story I got in NYC is that in April, hospitals did everything they could to send people home as early as possible - even if tested positive, even if there were symptoms of the disease that were obvious but not immediately life threatening (i.e. fever). They simply didn't know what to do with people in any lesser stage of the disease, and were overwhelmed by the critical cases, significant number of support employees (esp older) were deciding it wasn't worth it to go to work, etc.

Regarding the DNR part of the story, it wouldn't entirely surprise me that there was some triage type decision making going on. This may in fact one of the quiet reasons that NYC, Italy etc had such a high death rate. Human beings can be kept alive artificially for a long time, if the resources are available - which they were not. The other reason, if I had to guess, was that the standard cocktail of drugs given to the critical patients in NYC in April weren't quite right for their situation.

Posted by: ptb | Jul 23 2020 19:49 utc | 28

More about the possible European genocide of the Middle Easterners:

The EU-Turkey refugee agreement: A review [2018]

This article mentions the deal with Turkey was put in force in 2016. It envisioned EUR 6 billion in two years in exchange of Turkey keeping the circa 2.9-3.5 million refugees trapped in Turkish territory (probably Anatolia).

Now this is the weird part: the deal mentioned that the cash should be directed to "educating half a million Syrian children". Wait, what?

My guess is that this "build schools in Turkey for Syrian children" was merely a propaganda/legal device used by the EU to legitimate what was effectively a ransom being paid to Turkey.

But it gets even weirder. The very next year of the deal (2017), this came out in Germany:

Refugee numbers in Germany dropped dramatically in 2017

The figures German Interior Minister Thomas de Maizière announced in Berlin on Tuesday showed that the waves of refugees arriving in Germany continue to recede.

The Office of Migrants and Refugees (BAMF) registered 186,644 asylum seekers in 2017 compared to approximately 280,000 the year before and far fewer than the peak of 890,000 in 2015.

That is indeed a massive drop. At the time, the Merkel's government stated that the reason for this was "the closing of the Balkan and Mediterranean routes".

So the Mediterranean route was closed? How?

And the story doesn't end there. After Libya entered in civil war, disputes for the resources of the Eastern Mediterranean erupted:

Turkey Reiterates Determination to Continue Drilling in Eastern Mediterranean

Macron Calls Turkey's Mediterranean Drilling a 'Violation of the Sovereignty' of Cyprus and Greece

My hypothesis is this: the EU-Turkey deal included a secret protocol which, alongside Italy and Greece, authorized Turkey's coast guard to sink refugee boats further in the Mediterranean. With time and sufficient leverage, Turkey became at ease enough to begin to drill over the sea for natural resources, entering in conflict with Greece and Italy.

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 20:00 utc | 29

Ptb @ thanks for both your reply and opinion. Much apreciated.
It still looks like hell on earth to me.
Deliberate covid and none covid patients in the same ward.
Unnessersary use of resperartor as a source of profit for the hospital.
The related suspicious death at the end.
I could go on !
Haven’t even seen it all yet.
But it sure seems to fit the overall shit show that is America right now.
What shocks me is ——— the question - is this deliberate Trump led mass murder ? Fitting right in with the bio-warfare possibility ?
But much respect for your reply.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 20:06 utc | 30

@vk 129

So the Mediterranean route was closed? How?

I don’t think it’s closed, but letting migrants drown by the thousands in the Med as a “deterrent” has been unofficial EU policy for a few years now. Maybe it’s finally “working”?

The west certainly hasn’t stopped the the imperialist wars (direct and proxy), ‘sanctions’ and economic exploitation that drives migrants to risk life and limb for a Better Life™︎ in Europe or N. America.

Posted by: Daniel | Jul 23 2020 20:13 utc | 31

VK @ 29
Thanks again for airing this subject. I think you are right on all the above points.
Here in th U.K. the silence regarding refugees has been defening. (The dog that dosent bark)
Or maybe a D notice the only information to the media going through MI6.
We live in ‘dark’ times.
Refugees now, Our turn next.
They’ve already bankrupted us, our children and grand children and yet ——— crickets
Respect to you.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 20:23 utc | 32

@ Posted by: Daniel | Jul 23 2020 20:13 utc | 31

Look at the boat pictured at my first link. It an inflatable motorized boat, loaded with unprotected people.

If that picture represents the rule, not the exception, then you wouldn't need much to "sink" the refugees in the middle of the Mediterranean. You certainly wouldn't need anti-ship missiles or destroyers. A simple coast guard ship with something representing a harpoon would suffice.

One thing I'm almost certain: they didn't escorted the boats back to the coast of Libya or Syria (as was propagandized at the time). Even if the tiny Italian and Greek coast guards had the resources to do it, I doubt they had the will to do so.

I also doubt there are schools in Turkey for Syrian refugees. EUR 6 billion would not be nearly enough to build schools or education centers for 1.5 million children (assuming 50% of the refugees were children).

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 20:29 utc | 33

Daniel @ 31
Good to see a comment from you ! I hope your keeping really well.
We’re still here and commenting on this subject after more than two years ! Think of the mass suffering and death men women and children. What a heartless world.
Last time this subject arose it went to over 400 comments I beleave !
Keep strong my freand.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 20:35 utc | 34

The weekly jobless benefit claims in the US rose for the first time in weeks as the recovery from the lockdowns appeared o have stalled

The "experts" predicted +1 mln; it came out +1.4 mln.

But this is the smart decision, as the median American who claims unemployment is actually getting 34% richer than when he/she was employed.

On a side note: now I know why there are so many Americans in the "influencer" industry (youtuber, streamer on Twitch etc.). If you're lucky, you can get what you get in a menial job in just one week from donations through Patreon alone.

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 20:52 utc | 35

Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 19:37 utc | 26

You don't have to "pass your email out."

All you have to do is follow your own link.

Posted by: AntiSpin | Jul 23 2020 21:01 utc | 36

@mark2 30

We had similar vids in Hong Kong and China when covid was on full tilt in wuhan. Some vids was made by fake poseurs, some were eventually found to be Taiwanese or epoch times in origin with political motives in mind. Some are just clueless.

Yes it's definitely not a happy time in the health system but just like the wider community there are all sorts of people there. Some just can't handle pressure or when conditions and resources are not 100% perfect.

I have worked in, erm let's just say civil defense and rescue organisations and I will tell you first hand a lot of medical professionals are conditioned to "peacetime" work and goes off the rails when SHTF. In rescue we do reverse triage and will sometimes have to make pretty horrible decisions on complete strangers, on site, where sh1t is most messed up.

Chain of command is vital for clear communication and effectiveness. Keep in mind it's also the doctors ass on the line even though 90% of the care was given by the nurses. This statement tells you everything about how disingenuous this person is. If you don't like orders then be a doctor then I'd say, oh you're not, well then....

It's ain't like ER or Greys Anatomy I can tell you that.

Posted by: A.L. | Jul 23 2020 21:02 utc | 37

Great Covid 19 news from New Zealand. However Australia has slipped back and the virus community transmission has become exponential, especially in the state of Victoria. The difference is NZ went early and went hard, because it had no choice and not enough ICU beds per head of population. Australia, by contrast, relied on the proposition that shutting down early and hard would do too much damage to the economy. Wrong, that is putting the cart before the horse. Australia has a much higher ratio of ICU beds to population than NZ but that missed the point. Now the Australian economy is in real trouble, the normally circumspect ABC news economics commentator described it as "a depression" on Thursday's TV bulletin.

The big difference is Oz went for suppression NZ went for elimination. It's a no brainer. The Oz PM, Pastor Morrison, reminds me of POTUS in so far as he craves re election desperately so to him the economy comes first and that didn't work out, not that the opposition party is any better. A very similar situation to the US, one party - two names.

Here are the statistical findings from the University of Otago:

https://blogs.otago.ac.nz/pubhealthexpert/2020/07/22/nzs-team-of-5-million-has-achieved-the-lowest-covid-19-death-rate-in-the-oecd-but-there-are-still-gaps-in-our-pandemic-response/

Posted by: Paul | Jul 23 2020 21:04 utc | 38

We’re still here and commenting on this subject after more than two years ! Think of the mass suffering and death men women and children. What a heartless world.
Last time this subject arose it went to over 400 comments ...

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 20:35 utc | 34

The optioned faced by bankrupt Greece and as yet, not formally bankrupt Italy are not attractive. The weary population may vote at anyone promising to fix the problem, so they fix to the degree they can. EU as a whole would have more options that we could analyze.
Number one, increase the number of countries accepting the refugees. These countries comprise two groups: the larger one where anti-immigrant populist won already, and a tiny one, like Latvia, where the refugees would not want to go. Those two groups overlap a bit. The hard work devoted to this option changes the political landscape in a number of countries. Thus impossible.
Number two, eliminate the reasons for refugees to flee. For example, eliminate sanctions of Syria and perhaps give modest reconstruction aid, give aid to Lebanon that has twin refugee problem (Palestinians and now Syrians) without political conditions which parties are allowed to participate in the governing coalition. Patch some solution for Libya that would lead to a government that controls the country and does not let sub-Saharan migrants to cross. Some pro-industry pro-employment programs south of Sahara. If you sufficiently improve the situation in the home countries, you could even deport there (perhaps with some measures not to spread COVID-19, seems that Trump energetically exported COVID-19 to Central America).
Reactivate the agreement with Iran without any jokes and simulations of trying to do something in exchange for stopping Afghans. Same remarks apply as with sub-Saharan Africa.
As it usually happens, sensible options cannot be even discussed. They may strengthen countries insufficiently friendly to Israel and create tensions with USA. Ha, even Canada might criticize that approach, New Trumpland as it is. In any case, Atlanticists in Europe have sufficiently strong grip on public discourse that such options cannot be even discussed.

Conclusion: suffer more, my little children.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jul 23 2020 21:07 utc | 39

Re: my post above. It is hot here, our poor host cannot afford an interface allowing to edit after posting, and I made a lot of typos. Please read mercifully.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jul 23 2020 21:11 utc | 40

Bold assessment by the Chinese military over the Bonhomme Richard fire:

Burning USS Bonhomme Richard mirrors overstrain of US Navy

Posted by: vk | Jul 23 2020 21:22 utc | 41

A.L. @ 37
Sorry no offence, but I don’t buy into that normalisation shit.
That psychological rationalisation game.
How you ‘justify’ that vid could easily be applied to world war 2 gas chamber operators!
Don’t brush that aside with false equilvents.
I am aware that the blame dosent lay with the front line workers, but what you see is not just an unfortunate circumstance. This is murder.
Same here in the U.K.
Sorry if that uncomfortable truth keeps you awake at night. Better we all face reality dont you think ?

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 21:24 utc | 42

Piotr Berman @ 40
Agree with everything you say there !! It could be done.
But it would need sane none greedy, none psycopathic leaders to do so.
The fact there are humain ways to solve this proves, that it is a deliberate policy of planned co- ordanted genicide.
As for spelling I’d be the last here to dare to comment.
Respect

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 21:37 utc | 43

@mark2 42

Geez. That got personal quickly...

The murdering you spoke of was done by incompetence at the leadership level and mixing politics with medicine. Everything else are just consequences.

It was was suspected ventilators may be doing more harm than good in some cases but that's also conflated with lack of experience and training with the ventilator's use. In any case it is what the established regime or procedure is/was so you can hardly blame the doctors for prescribing. See b's article above re reinventing the wheel over dead bodies. I fully agree with b there.

I do not appreciate your ww2 refs. It is also very weak.

With or without your buy in peeps like me are the ones pulling you out of rubbles, wrecks and picking body parts afterwards. I would also posit don't know the first thing about rationalisation.

If you need to feel more human and involved from watching a tear jerker vid then please, by all means, knock yourself out. Hell, go and put a ribbon on, we need more slacktivism.

Posted by: A.L. | Jul 23 2020 21:51 utc | 44

A.L. @ 44
Don’t take my comment as an attack on you. It was not.
It was a comment on the general American mind set. See my first sentence.
As to the rest ! The time is long past for oppressing genuine justified anger.
Talking of that how’s those New York protests going.

Posted by: Mark2 | Jul 23 2020 22:12 utc | 45

Paul @Jul23 21:04 #38

The big difference is Oz went for suppression NZ went for elimination. It's a no brainer.

Exactly. USA, UK, and Australia leadership chose to kill their citizens.

Sadly, there's still, little awareness of this, and little outrage - even in alt-media.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 23 2020 22:41 utc | 46


@ 18 mark2 @ 18.. Previously I expressed similar concerns similar to what your movie suggest..

Covid is a series of infectious viruses.. S protein on virus surface has two parts: The S1 interacts with the ACE-2 Receptor on the human cell to decoy and S2 from clamping to the surface of the exposed target cell membrane, an thereafter disrupting the membrane between virus and the cell cytosol, that disruption causes the cell to open a pore tunnel thru both layers of membrane which enables the virus to crawl into into the cytosol of the live living human cell (this stage, the first, is called infection). Everything after that is up to immune system to overcome until after the 10 th day or so, then the damage the Immune system caused becomes a factor in whether or not the patient recovers or dies.

The focus should be on preventing infection. But no body wants to hear that.. Wear a mask and gloves. Infected patients are at the mercy of their own immune system to win the battle with the virus, and then at the mercy of the damage their own immune system did to their body. Let the physicians deal with post infected persons. Those still hoping to avoid the virus should be concerned with avoiding infection.

I know of no evidence suitable to prove RF does not accelerate infection probability? According to the patent application, etc., RF disrupts cell membranes to consummate its infection in humans in a manner very similar to how the virus gains access to the human cell, except the RF is more direct and quicker.

But what is the Covid 19 infection rate in humans, when humans are exposed to virus in the presence of high frequency energy formatted as RF anyway? Is it 5%, 10%, 20% or 100%?

Does RF catalyze virus infections to pandemic levels? <= Corna Virus has been around for a long time, long before the recent Pandemic, and it has not produced a pandemic until our time. Why? According to Dr. Pall, 7,500 new cell towers were put in place in Wuhan just two mouths before the outbreak of Pandemic Covid 19 virus.

Mask and distancing have not slowed the growing Covid 19 numbers

So what is the science. Articles 1) Remote activation of cellular signaling 2) Electric Fields stimulate genetically modified pancreatic B cells 3. electronic energy is used to program cellular behavior(like open a channel in a membrane) see... 29 May, 2020 p. 937-39 Vol 36 Issue 6494 of Science.

Beyond recent literature a EU Patent application [EUPA] EP 0710718A1.. published 08.05.1996 Bulletin 1996/19 application number 95115195.0 filed 5.10.1988 the application number of the earlier application in accord with Art. 66 EPC:88909944.6 published 8.05.1996 bulletin 1996/19 application number 95115195.0 date of filing 05.10.1988 which paragraph 54 claims it owns a patent on a "Method of, and apparatus for, cell poration (makes holes in cells) and cell fusion using RF generated electrical pulses.." (my lab experience confirms transporting items through membranes by electral or optical means is standard practice).

Line 55 of the EUPA says the patent applied for<= is a method for the poration (make holes in cell membrane) and fusion of cells using RF electrical pulses The alternating electric field induces cell congregation... the RF porates or fuses with .. very high efficiency.. animal cells, human cells, plant cells, protoplasts, erythrocyte ghosts, lipsomes, vesicles, bacteria and yeasts.

the EUPA says: the method has the unique ability to porate or fuse cells in very small or very large (like pandemic size) numbers. Further "During these prorations or fusions, ..a variety of chemical agents, including DNA, RNA, antibodies, proteins, drugs, molecular probes, hormones, growth factors, enzymes, organic and inorganic chemicals can be introduced into these cells.. and new biological species can be produced.. "

There is bunches of literature that suggest RF is involved in membrane disruption, yet, all I hear, is wear a mask and gloves. Information blackouts invite conspiracy theories because the propaganda that promotes pandemics to be natural risks humans endure, but in todays modern environment that propaganda is suspicious. Especially suspect is that at a time when Viral Pandemic is the center narrative around the globe little about infectivity is discussed? Why ..? Thank you for the video.


Why is there an organized effort to spread SARS-COV-2? by: Jackrabbit @ 15


so <= if infection rate is normally .1%, then 1 person out of every 1000 exposed should become infected.
For Corona to infect S1 and S2 portions of the S protein must find its way to ACE-2 Receptors on the cells to be infected and then clamp to cell membrane, then disrupt that cell membrane, and cell must be programmed to open a hole so the virus can crawl in .

But suppose you are in an industry that depends on RF and you learn about the increase in infectivity of the virus in the presence of RF.. What do you do? What did one airplane company do when it learned its best aircraft lacked adequate safety? What did the Chemical Industry do when it learned its waste were contaminating the environment?

What would providers of RF or those dependent on RF do, if they discovered RF increases the rate of viral infection in humans? They might fear that users would notice and blame the RF. Concerned citizens might cause the whole world to stop using RF until providers can prove its safety? Such a stoppage would devastate most RF investors but it might save a few million lives a year?

I think the industry would try to convince everyone the Pandemic came before RF so viral infections w/n/b blamed on RF?

Your video supports that the numbers are made up? The European Union Patent Application(EUPA) clearly says RF makes holes in human cell membranes so do hundreds if not thousands of scientific papers and using high frequency is often used in the laboratory to make one thing accept another through membrane barriers.

Ask the RF industry to defend by actual proof that RF is safe [words of 1000 scientist unacceptable], an environmental survey should be required for each source (cell tower, satellite etc.), before RF is allowed to be further deployed, before RF energy levels are allowed to advance to 5g levels, and then only after government outlaws use of wireless to control human thought processes or human body functions, and then only after satisfactory means to monitor compliance are developed to enforce those provisions.

Posted by: snake | Jul 23 2020 22:53 utc | 47

Jackrabbit 46

It's a weird setup here because oz health authorities worked closely with China health authorities and there has been no major outbreak here. The big thing at the start for many countries was flattening the curve which was what b was writing on at that stage. US and Europe had to learn this the hard way. Oz politicians went with flattening the curve rather than eradication which would have been easy at that stage - because we are not an 'authoritarian' country. I'm in Victoria and now the military has been pulled in to enforce quarantine at the state borders.
This latest outbreak - what a frigging mess. Those that tested positive had been quarantined at a hotel but those supposedly looking after them spread the bug like flies spreading cholera.
After all this time, it still takes four days to get test results and the politicians are whinging because people don't self isolate until they receive their test result.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 23:03 utc | 48

From The Who own lying numbers.

Out of the supposed 15 million confirmed cases worldwide, only 4.1 percent of those resulted in death. In other words if you catch it you have generally a 96 percent chance of surviving it. 80 percent of persons with covid have mild to no symptoms at all.

Better efficacy than most vaccines already out there.

The hysteria and huge governmental overreaction and overreaction is no where near warranted.

Who stands to gain the most? Big Pharma.

Anyone who can't see this scamdemic for what it truly is has been breathing too much of their own CO2.
Biggest and most powerful lobby in Washington DC and the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit margins in the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit centers for Big Pharma? vaccinations.

Are there actual free and open independently verified elections in the U.S.? Keep dreaming.

If a mask is all one needs to protect themselves from a supposedly contagious and deadly virus why would you need to have a BSL 4 suit in a BSL 4 lab to work with said viruses?

Posted by: O | Jul 23 2020 23:20 utc | 49

From The Who own lying numbers.

Out of the supposed 15 million confirmed cases worldwide, only 4.1 percent of those resulted in death. In other words if you catch it you have generally a 96 percent chance of surviving it. 80 percent of persons with covid have mild to no symptoms at all.

Better efficacy than most vaccines already out there.

The hysteria and huge governmental overreaction and overreach is no where near warranted.

Who stands to gain the most? Big Pharma.

Anyone who can't see this scamdemic for what it truly is has been breathing too much of their own CO2.
Biggest and most powerful lobby in Washington DC and the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit margins in the world? Big Pharma
Largest profit centers for Big Pharma? vaccinations.

Are there actual free and open independently verified elections in the U.S.? Keep dreaming.

If a mask is all one needs to protect themselves from a supposedly contagious and deadly virus why would you need to have a BSL 4 suit in a BSL 4 lab to work with said viruses?

Posted by: O | Jul 23 2020 23:21 utc | 50

An Israeli fighter jet buzzed an Iranian passenger plane while it was landing in Syria. Forcing the plane to drop several hundred meters and injuring dozens of civilian passengers. Another major provocation by Israeli, this time directly and publicly targeting Iranian civilians (Crimes against humanity are standard operating procedure for the Israeli military), when will Syria, Iran or Hezbollah respond?

Posted by: Kadath | Jul 23 2020 23:24 utc | 51

@ kadath - https://www.rt.com/news/495684-iran-plane-us-jets-passengers/

US Air Force, not Israeli, fighter jets were responsible for unsafely intercepting the Mahan Air plane over Syria, which resulted in injuries to several passengers traveling to Beirut, Iranian media reported.

see link for mre..

Posted by: james | Jul 23 2020 23:34 utc | 52

Peter AU1 @Jul23 23:03 #48

The big thing at the start for many countries was flattening the curve

But some countries - like USA - didn't move from flattening the curve to pro-actively fighting the virus (aka "eradication"). Instead, they moved to "open up" and talked up the promise of vaccines (which are all experimental - there's never been a vaccine for AIDS or SARS).

IMO this is not an accident. These governments and their leaders have ulterior motives. They are not acting with our best interest in mind.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 23 2020 23:42 utc | 53

Don't feed the troll!

O raised the BSL4 nonsense just a couple of days ago.

And claimed expertise in "cellular micro-biology".

My response is the same now as it was then:

BSL4 suits? LOL. That's a ridiculous strawman.

Any third rate biologist would know that masks and social distancing are used to reduce R0 not as an attempt to provide full protection.

Is there such a thing as a fourth-rate biologist?


!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 23 2020 23:53 utc | 54

Jackrabbit "These governments and their leaders have ulterior motives."

A big motive is to take us into cold or hot war with China. I think all of five-eyes chirped in tune for an "investigation" into the "Wuhan" virus.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 23:56 utc | 55

VK @ 29 and others:

Can we assume that there are women, children and elderly people among the Syrian refugees, be they actual refugees fleeing bloodshed, violence or persecution, or "Syrian refugees" answering the call of jihad or looking for work?

Are the "refugees", who would have fled Turkey in inflatables to arrive in Greece otherwise (until that photo of the dead Kurdish toddler on the beach went viral), now being held up in Idlib province instead, to be sent out to Libya when required to fight and maybe to settle there with their families in the future?

Might Turkey's drilling activities in the maritime territories of eastern Libya (historic Cyrenaica) be one step towards claiming that area as a colony of Turkey?

Posted by: Jen | Jul 24 2020 0:01 utc | 56

Re Syrian refugees - My take on that was the biggest exodus of refugees through the Turkey border and towards Europe took place with the jihadist takeover of northern Syria. 2013-2015

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 0:13 utc | 57

Marc2


See

Refuted theories about elmhurst hospital

for another perspective.

Posted by: suzan | Jul 24 2020 0:25 utc | 58

"In an article published in Nature Medicine1 on 9 November, scientists investigated a virus called SHC014, which is found in horseshoe bats in China. The researchers created a chimaeric virus, made up of a surface protein of SHC014 and the backbone of a SARS virus that had been adapted to grow in mice and to mimic human disease. The chimaera infected human airway cells — proving that the surface protein of SHC014 has the necessary structure to bind to a key receptor on the cells and to infect them. It also caused disease in mice, but did not kill them.

Although almost all coronaviruses isolated from bats have not been able to bind to the key human receptor, SHC014 is not the first that can do so. In 2013, researchers reported this ability for the first time in a different coronavirus isolated from the same bat population2."


https://www.nature.com/news/engineered-bat-virus-stirs-debate-over-risky-research-%201.18787


When one looks closely at these gain of function research, the area where the spike protein was designed to attach to was the
ACE 2 receptor.


"The results indicate that group 2b viruses encoding the SHC014 spike in a wild-type backbone can efficiently use multiple orthologs of the SARS receptor human angiotensin converting enzyme II (ACE2), replicate efficiently in primary human airway cells and achieve in vitro titers equivalent to epidemic strains of SARS-CoV. "

https://www.nature.com/articles/nm.3985

Why Wuhan?

Because the folks at UNC working on this research (looks at the authors of these gain of function papers) started up the Wuhan Labortory that continued this work in particular, Shi Zhengli


https://www.scmp.com/news/china/science/article/3086180/chinas-bat-woman-centre-coronavirus-theories-says-her-work

While the official narrative is that this virus jumped from bats, to a second species(pangolin) then humans, a process that usually takes thousands of years if not more. The probability that someone didn't follow correct cleaning protocols after leaving the lab is quite higher. If we are to even accept the narrative that this started in China in the first place.


This does not rule out another place of origin in another lab and may have been circulating in the human population long before it was identified in China which means the virus itself has already circulated around the world several times and only now are measuring its effects on population and thus so many. positive cases popping up. Again positive for infection does not equal showing symptoms much less death.

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 0:27 utc | 59

@ Posted by: Jen | Jul 24 2020 0:01 utc | 56

Assuming the EU has a deal with both Turkey and Greece, it would be easy to explain why the Aegean route is closed, as the refugees would be detained in Turkey.

But the German minister was clear by stating the entire "Mediterranean route" was closed. That implies not only the Aegean (which is a minuscule sea, that can be crossed by any kind of boat outside winter), but also the Libya-Italy sea route.

That the German minister called the Aegean "Mediterranean" by vulgar generalization is a possibility, as it would be apparent to any Northern European that the Mediterranean Sea is just one sea. But this is not the usual Southern European denomination, which differentiates the Aegean and the Adriatic from the rest of the Mediterranean.

My guess is the Aegean route is really closed from the source (at the cost of heavy ransom paid to the Turkish), but not the Libyan-Italian one, where boats would continue to be sunk very deep into the sea, so no bodies come ashore.

If you think about it, this is a genius move, as bodies that sink into the ocean do not fossilize (the fish and other detritivores immediately eat the whole body before it reaches the bottom). Inflatable boats also do not reach the bottom, so there's no way a future archaeologist can find any traces of it. This is the perfect genocide, one which will leave no archaeological traces.

The land routes are much better documented: the Eastern European countries have already officially stated they are retaining large quantities of refugees in the name of the whole European Union, while Turkey has already even given an official number (the already mentioned 3.5 million). Saudi Arabia has also already stated they are retaining a large number of refugees in the name of Europe. These concentration camps resulted in the rise of the far-right in Hungary, while the fear of the wave resulted in the rise of the far-right in Austria and Poland (already re-elected). The EU is offering a small sum of Euro for the willing to go back to Syria; Germany is openly inviting the ones who have any useful know-how (e.g. doctors and engineers), but the rest is probably trapped into concentration camps in Hungary, Turkey and Saudi Arabia, while there are "terminals" in Italy and Greece.

Yes, historically, most refugees from the Middle East in the 20th and 21st Centuries are women with their children. I don't know if they are the majority in this case, and I don't think anybody is bothering to do the counting. The only certainty is there's a lot of children, as the official argument the EU used for the EUR 6 billion paid to Turkey was to "re-educate the Syrian children".

I think Turkey's recent boldness in the Eastern Mediterranean is a blowback from the EU policy of allowing the Turkish coast guard (or even Navy) to operate deeper than usual in the Mediterranean, combined with the break of the Libyan civil war, its past imbroglio with Cyprus and its recent economic crisis. This gave Turkey the courage, know-how and geopolitical rationale to begin to exploit the gas reserves of the Eastern Mediterranean. And it's not like they have other choice, as they need to fund their new proxies and pay the bonuses for their soldiers who're going to die in Libya either way.

Posted by: vk | Jul 24 2020 0:31 utc | 60

Posted by: c1ue | Jul 23 2020 15:14 utc | 6

Thank you for entirely missing the point, in your haste to accuse me of not "knowing how people make a living."

Posted by: lizard | Jul 23 2020 15:11 utc | 4

At least it's not a stupid poem or some QAnon 5G conspiracy theory bullshit.

Posted by: snake | Jul 23 2020 22:53 utc | 47

Snake and lizard post 5G BS conspiracy theories. Similar animal names? Sock puppets is my guess.

Anyone reading this bullshit is invited to do their own Google search which will quickly lay it to rest.
From the International Commission on Non-Ionizing Radiation Protection:


COVID-19 and RF EMF
Apr 2020
It has been claimed that exposure to the electromagnetic fields (EMFs) generated by 5G devices can both cause COVID-19 and increase its severity. These claims are not supported by any evidence (not even extremely weak evidence), and the large body of scientific knowledge regarding the EMFs relevant to 5G demonstrates that those claims are not feasible. EMF exposure from 5G devices does not cause COVID-19, nor does it have any effect on the disease process or health outcomes of those who are infected by the new corona virus (SARS-CoV-2) that causes COVID-19. As described by the WHO, you need to physically come into contact with the corona virus to become infected by it, and as the EMFs from 5G cannot carry viruses, they cannot bring you into contact with the virus.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 24 2020 0:45 utc | 61

Peter AU1 @ 55
"A big motive is to take us into cold or hot war with China. I think all of five-eyes chirped in tune for an "investigation" into the "Wuhan" virus."

Those watching and listening to the Oz ABC following Trump's announcement that China would pay reparations and the US national debt to China would be cancelled, couldn't help noticing the likes of Julie Bishop and Alexander Downer, [both former Oz neocon type foreign ministers] speaking from notes handed to them by the US ambassador as usual, calling for a non WHO "investigation." Swiftly followed, presumably, by the chosen kangaroo court of choice in the US district of Virginia, no doubt following the show "trial" of Julian Assange. The US deep state types obviously know who to call in Australia for the desired "consensus" and media coverage. Pastor Morrison jumped on the bandwagon and agreed.

There was none of this lawless and reckless nonsense emanating from New Zealand, the other five eye.

Only clumsy Australia knows how to offend and infuriate its biggest customer. Now the Chinese won't take calls from Oz or rush to buy its products and who could blame them. Is that what passes for "diplomacy" in the obsequious land of Oz? Don't expect the opposition to notice, however they did notice what happened to Jeremy Corbyn, who did it and why.

Posted by: Paul | Jul 24 2020 1:07 utc | 62

Following on from my late posting re China embassy thread. Can barflies point me to papers and research studies that consider the intersection of Confucian and other Chinese philosophy with Marxist philosophy.

I would appreciate your advice and will reciprocate after reading.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 24 2020 1:18 utc | 63

No matter the origin of Sars Cov 2 wether natural or engineered, it was reasonable to accept the response of the heavy handed steps taken by governments early on because no one knew exactly how this was affecting the human population in particular its virulence.

However with the collapse of the Imperial College model by Neil Ferguson which was the basis for the initial lockdown measures and now with the collection of 15 million worldwide confirmed cases the data shows that this pathogen is not nearly as virulent as was once thought.

One must remember that the 600k plus deaths cannot be solely attributed to the virus alone. Many of the early deaths were caused by simple medical malpractice in particular overuse of ventilators and sending those with the infection into the most susceptible populations, elderly care homes. Furthermore one must take into account that these patients had two or more comorbidities and is a factor in the current deaths.


As media switched from daily death tolls to hyping infection numbers (again this doesn't mean actually showing symptoms), in reality it shows more testing is being done and that perhaps we have been living with this virus a lot longer than initially thought. Remember the human body can have several viruses circulating at any given time and not show any outward signs of any of them because our natural wonderful immunes systems evolved in this type of environment to keep it all in balance, homeostasis internally and externally is what our bodies evolved to do.


Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 1:19 utc | 64

@Hack,

you know I'm not a sock puppet, asshole. you think b would front page a sock puppet comment? I've been commenting here LONG before you started spamming these comment threads.

and where have I been commenting on 5G? please reference those comments.

Posted by: lizard | Jul 24 2020 1:28 utc | 65

O I #59

And before that researchers from Wuhan China, CSIRO Australia, Minnesota USA published a 2010 paper on the same receptor binding.

The research is international, it represents a global failure of ethics, supervision and engineering.

But that does not exclude Fort Detrick.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 24 2020 1:30 utc | 66

Paul 62

Both sides of the duopoly collect their foreign policy from the US embassy, though with swearing loyalty to the English monarch, they at times appear unsure which boss to obey if mother England and big brother US have different opinions.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 1:30 utc | 67

It should now be evident, that as we are constantly being told to accept this "new normal", that there is no scientific basis for this unprecedented social engineering experiment. That a need for a vaccine is solely based on the profit motive. And that continued government overreach is just a fusillade attack on civil liberties .

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 1:50 utc | 68

It is dawning on me that Trump wants to invoke martial law in the US. Covid-19 and/or the protest in the big cities are looking like the kind of situations he needs to make it happen.

On another note, Trump is/was pushing "payroll tax" relief which is a dog whistle cover for killing the Social Security Insurance program. Anyone that pushes any thoughts that Trump is motivated by service to humanity is deluded.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jul 24 2020 1:53 utc | 69

First six current news headlines on China as listed by bing search engine.

Oz ABC
"Houston Chinese consulate a 'hub of spying', Secretary of State Mike Pompeo says as US-China tensions escalate"

USA Today
"Mike Pompeo likens China threat to 'Frankenstein,' says engagement hasn't worked"

News.com.au
"Xi Jinping: Damning detail hints why China’s coronavirus response failed"

SMH
"We must change China or China will change us, Pompeo warns"

Reuters
"China says closure of Houston consulate has harmed relations, warns it must retaliate"

News.com.au
"Lizards ‘not known to science’ found in rice cookers headed for China"

Goering https://cdn.theatlantic.com/assets/media/img/posts/goering.jpg
Pompeo https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/iz1I6DhKouRM/v1/1000x-1.jpg

Very little difference between the two, both in physical shape and character. For all intents and purposes, Pompeo is Goering's protege.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 2:01 utc | 70

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jul 24 2020 1:30 utc | 66

I totally agree, as I said in my post the origins of this virus could be from another lab entirely. I also agree that if this was engineered and let loose(accidental or otherwise) it was a total failure of ethics, safety and supervision. Because of what is happening now is why the gain of function research was and is so controversial.

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 2:04 utc | 71

Re: 52 James,

your right, Iran has just amended their initial report to say that the fighter jet identified itself via radio to the airliner as a US jet before it attempted to crash into the passenger plane. I suppose the fighter jet being American makes more sense as the US still has several air bases in the region that it could have traveled from. Although a US jet doing this is even more reckless than an Israeli jet, perhaps Trump is trying to force a war with Iran before the election to unify the American people behind him. He might be right, the only thing Americans hate more than other Americans is non-Americans, so he might be able to squeak through a win in the elector council with a patriotic war on Iran. The question remains however, how will Iran respond? whether it is n 2 months or 2 years the US still wants a war to destroy Iran.

Posted by: Kadath | Jul 24 2020 2:08 utc | 72

Lizard 65 & 4

If RSH's comments annoy you so much you can't skip over them, a nice lie down on your couch for awhile and a few latte's to sip should make you feel better.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 2:13 utc | 73

Finally we must remember that these authoritative bodies such and the WHO, CDC, FDA, etc and many scientific publications suffer from regulatory/agency capture, in particular from big Pharma this also includes the media. For here in the US every morning and nightly newscast is accompanied by a slew of pharmaceutical advertising.

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 2:15 utc | 74

Peter AU1 | Jul 23 2020 23:03 utc | 48

This latest outbreak from the failed hotel quarantine debacle is due to Government incompetence & mismanagement, from both elected officials & the public servants tasked with overseeing it. This was further compounded by corrupt & criminal activity by the so called 'security' companies that were 'guarding' the hotels.

The Government/bureaucracy were warned at the very beginning that using untrained minimum wage security guards was a recipe for disaster - they all chose to ignore it.

The so called 'judicial inquiry' that started on Monday cannot compel the guilty parties to front up, or if they do, compel them to answer any questions. The only thing 'judicial' about is that there is a retired judge in charge & some lawyers who will make a shit load of money (at our expense of course).

There is now a stage 3 lockdown & mandatory 'face covering' in Melbourne - note mandatory 'face covering' - no requirement to use any form of surgical mask - just cover your face with any old scarf, an old sock or a wet paper bag.

Face to be covered everywhere - inside & outside - including when taking the dog for a walk in local bushland with nobody within hundreds of metres.

Of course joggers & bike riders are exempt - so good luck to the poor old pedestrian as these lycra clad clowns race past with inches to spare, exhaling from deep down in their covid riddled lungs a massive 3 metre long plume of virus laden water droplets.

Half arsed - if wearing a mask is to be mandatory it has to be done properly. This is precisely why masks were not made mandatory during the 'first wave' - they give a false sense of security & any form of social distancing gets thrown out the window.

Masks have been compulsory at my workplace for the last 3 weeks. Mildly irritating but not the end of the world.


Posted by: ted01 | Jul 24 2020 2:19 utc | 75

tedo1
"Of course joggers & bike riders are exempt - so good luck to the poor old pedestrian as these lycra clad clowns race past with inches to spare, exhaling from deep down in their covid riddled lungs a massive 3 metre long plume of virus laden water droplets."

Yeah I had to laugh when I read that one. I had a similar picture in my mind - joggers huffing and puffing and blowing spit and snot on everyone they passed.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 2:25 utc | 76

tedo1

but, but, but ... we are not an "authoritarian" country like China....

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 2:27 utc | 77

Hey Mark2 - would love to know your opinion of Putin and the Russian Federation.

Posted by: Australian lady | Jul 24 2020 2:31 utc | 78

snake | Jul 23 2020 22:53 utc | 47

How does covid 19 spread in third world & under developed countries where there is no 5G?

Posted by: ted01 | Jul 24 2020 2:35 utc | 79

@ 72 kadath... iran will respond and it will be a mystery when it does... that is my take.. they are smart and whatever they decide, it will happen..

Posted by: james | Jul 24 2020 2:45 utc | 80

Kadath 72

Trump's focus from early on has been building up the US military. That is not a domestic election ploy - it is a lead up to war. The way the Trump regime is pushing things now, US may have embarked on the Trump regime wars of choice before the election.
In going back through old video interviews of Trump, if there's one thing he wants do while in office is destroy Iran. That goes back to a 1980 interview at the time or shortly after the Tehran hostage drama has has continued throughout his life since then.
The other thing he will attempt to do is create major incidences with China so that China west relations cannot be mended - a cold war, if not actually starting some sort of hot war, proxy or otherwise.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 2:54 utc | 81

Below is a quote from a Reuters posting about Pompeo's latest fuel to the wannnnnnnnnabe fire

"
Speaking at the Nixon Library in President Richard Nixon’s birthplace in Yorba Linda, California, Pompeo said the former U.S. leader’s worry about what he had done by opening the world to China’s Communist Party in the 1970s had been prophetic.

“President Nixon once said he feared he had created a ‘Frankenstein’ by opening the world to the CCP,” Pompeo said. “And here we are.”

Nixon, who died in 1994 and was president from 1969-74, opened the way for the establishment of U.S. diplomatic relations with Communist China in 1979 through a series of contacts, including a visit to Beijing in 1972.
"

Nixon took the US off the Reserve Currency Gold Standard in 1971 and outsourcing became the gospel of financialization.

Empire is getting desperate for reasons to do more bad things. I hope none give them an out of the self destruction they are causing.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jul 24 2020 3:08 utc | 82

Pater AU1 @ 67

I agree that both sides of Australian politics collect their orders from the US embassy and the duopoly are sometime "unsure which boss to obey." Either the UK or the US , but only up to a point.
Take the vote to establish and legitimise the alien state in Palestine, UNGA 181. The UK abstained, the US and USSR fell over each other to vote yes, Australia voted yes. Australia's Doc Evatt was the UN president at that time as Labor party zionist apparatchiks never cease to mention.

Also take the 1949 UN vote to admit the bandit state to UN membership, conditional on the right of the return of refugees. The UK abstained the US voted yes along with Australia. So we can see the fault line, ever since Australia's vote has been on autopilot on this issue.

As to the dismissal of the Whitlam government, lo and behold both the UK and US were up to their armpits as recent analysis reveals:
https://johnmenadue.com/alex-mitchell-gough-whitlams-dismissal-and-the-cia/

Posted by: Paul | Jul 24 2020 3:20 utc | 83

@Peter AU1,

I don't like being erroneously labeled a sock puppet and ascribed commentary I am not making. other than those false accusations, RSH can do whatever b allows him to do here, and I will point out when he's full of shit.

if you don't like my comments how about you take your own advice.

Posted by: lizard | Jul 24 2020 3:25 utc | 84

I mostly ship your crap lizard. Short comments that are not dementia scribblings I glance at. Seeing you tugging your own chain I thought I'd lend a hand. Though really, you should see a shrink and get your anger under control.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 3:42 utc | 85

Why are people 100% sure of themselves when they have no actual knowledge. (Asking for a friend.) Insisting that one is 100% self-assured when one knows nothing is always a recipe for chaos.

The speed of light is constant regardless of electromagnetic frequency. Moves at 670,616,629 mph miles/hr in a vacuum. There is also dielectric constant to enter into the equation. But let's not worry over the basic engineering. You were worried about electromagnetic waves? Oh, OK, then:

LEXX (Ep.43) "The Rock" [UNCUT VERSION] (2001)

Posted by: blues | Jul 24 2020 3:48 utc | 86

Regarding the speculation that the US wants a war with Iran.

After the US killed Soleimani, Iran fired missiles at a US base, causing noticeable damage. The whole world saw it, and we were up half the night in these threads counting off the Twitter reports, etc...

We all witnessed exactly how the US retreated from that situation. The White House tweeted that "all is well", the Pentagon later said soldiers got headaches. We all saw - the entire world witnessed - how the US walked back and away from the situation.

If the US has been trying to start a war with Iran - why did it walk away from the perfect war handed to it on a plate?

It didn't even have to create a false flag to start the war. Iran attacked it first! The US had actually maneuvered its enemy into striking the first blow against US soldiers!

Brilliant move by the US - it had the war in its hand - sitting right there in its hand, for it to retaliate with holy zeal. This war that everyone keeps saying that the US wants and is frantically seeking to provoke or engineer.

In its hand!

~~

The fact most obvious from all this situation is that the US did NOT want a war with Iran, and DOES NOT want a war with Iran. This war in the hand was not a thing planned by the generals that Trump stopped. The generals stopped it.

Those generals at the press conference were not people cheated of their blood lust, they were very scared people whose bluff had been called and who had narrowly escaped having their whole source of income destroyed. They had explained it to Trump, what would happen to the US forces if it responded to the Iranian attack.

The Pentagon knows that it cannot win a war against Iran. Every war game for more than a decade shows this decisively, beyond any doubt. War games are serious plans to conquer, and when they fail, it means you get beat.

The knowledge that Pentagon war games show 100% defeat if it fights Iran is so well known that it could be taught in schools. Everyone knows this, all over the world, and all through the public sphere, and there is truly no excuse for not including it in any analysis regarding US war with Iran.

And the Pentagon knows above all things that it cannot be beaten in public in a manner beyond its capacity to hide the defeat from the domestic populace. If this happens, serious doubts will arise about funding the Pentagon. The Pentagon, as with all of Washington, is funded on its bluster.

~~

My friends, forgive me but I have to mention how tired I am of hearing that the US is trying to go to war with Iran. You just can't say that until you explain why it turned down the perfect war it already had 6 months ago.

And by the way, the US will be punished for that trick with the passenger plane it just pulled, and the US knows it. Just as it knew when Iran attacked its base that it was being punished for crossing the line, and meekly took its punishment like the bluffing, corrupt, greed-obsessed coward that it institutionally is.

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 24 2020 3:49 utc | 87

Blackrock, one of the largest "asset managers" in the world, is rubbing their collective hands at being the central bank darling set up to shape the world's economy. from a cheerleading article:

“The pandemic represents a rare but narrow window of opportunity to reflect, reimagine, and reset our world” – Professor Klaus Schwab, Founder and Executive Chairman, World Economic Forum.

Larry Fink, CEO of BlackRock, recently said that he expects “at least a 24 month downturn” before most businesses get back to their pre-Covid performance. “But that all depends on how quickly we can find a vaccine”. Pascal Soriot, the French CEO of Astra Zeneca (which has just become the UK’s most valuable company, after 11 years of HSBC and 8 years of BP) believes that Spring 2021 is likely to be the earliest that a vaccine is ready. His business is currently in the middle of clinical trials of a Covid-19 vaccine developed with Oxford University.

HSBC, don't they get slapped on the wrist for laundering cartel money, among other shady businesses? and BP, didn't they have a little oil spill in the gulf of Mexico?

it's a cartel world featuring a revolving door of .001% sociopaths raping and pillaging, so forgive me if I marvel at how an old anarchist can wait around for a eugenicists' vaccine and other rub-off comments suggesting anger management in dealing with these dumbfounding compliance games people are playing with the GREAT MASK DEBATE.

no-one commenting here is obviously angry enough at this massive con because you got internet connection and some degree of investment in the game continuing, which means continuing the illusion there are civilized rules by which we should be conducting ourselves.

stop holding on to what you think can't be changed because they are going after it all. I mean they're even calling it THE GREAT RESET! so what do you think that means?

they're gonna change the rules, change the monetary system, change social norms, change natural process, like reproduction, change the meaning of words, and, in some of the most alarming and fundamental ways, they are planning on CONTINUING to change the very building blocks of life at the genetic level.

maybe many of you are ok with this. maybe you think technology will save us.

so what if we lose what it means to be human along the way?

Posted by: lizard | Jul 24 2020 4:25 utc | 88

Grieved:

The Ian war motif is the trigger to shift Pax Americana to Pax Judaica. Some war is needed to shift the ruling world power to Jerusalem, the timing needs to be right, and part of the rightness of the timing are people's minds. Will they manage to pull it off? The changing of the empirical guard is always a messy affair. But don't lose sight of the fact that the guard is changing. Vaccines, war and financial wizardry will be used.

Posted by: Jezabeel | Jul 24 2020 4:37 utc | 89

@ Grieved # 87 who srote
"
My friends, forgive me but I have to mention how tired I am of hearing that the US is trying to go to war with Iran. You just can't say that until you explain why it turned down the perfect war it already had 6 months ago.
"
I agree with your description of the US backing down from a "hot war" with Iran because of MAD backing from Russia/China.

That said, I continue to posit that humanity is embroiled in a civilization war and so we digress into semantics about what war is and isn't.

Pompeo as much as just stated that China is Frankenstein which I consider an act of war.
The Houston China embassy closing is an act of war.
Holding the daughter of Huawei hostage in Canada is an act of war.
Buzzing the Iranian commercial airline in Syria causing bodily harm is an act of war.

And all these acts of war are executed in support of humanity's real Frankenstein.....a human body with private finance cult blood. Like Gollum, the global cult of elite are just trying to keep their precious private money cult alive a bit longer.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jul 24 2020 4:42 utc | 90

Grieved @Jul24 3:49 #87

the US did NOT want a war with Iran, and DOES NOT want a war with Iran.

I think its more complicated.

US has bigger fish to fry (China). Israel is probably disappointed at that but they are getting paid-off to wait via USA recognition of Jerusalem as Israel's capital, Golan Heights as Israel territory, and a go-ahead for annexation of the West Bank.

!!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jul 24 2020 4:58 utc | 91

Posted by: lizard | Jul 24 2020 4:25 utc | 88

I agree and in my opinion the mask has become an obvious totem of fear and compliance to the state and enforcement of 'the new normal'. It can be used as a measurement on how many are complying with the 'new normal' and it also has a much deeper psychological effect on the psyche of people in accepting the 'new normal'.

One only has to type in the term "The Great Reset" into a search bar and see how this meme is alraady being seeded in the collective consciousness by the very same people who stand the gain the most, the global oligarchs who run the largest 'asset manager'firms suck as Black Rock, Bain Capital etc with interwoven ties with governments and intelligence agencies.

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 5:02 utc | 92

The Great Reset may entail another "World War" but in fact may be just a change in intensity. Out right nuclear armed conflict would be like blowing up the world casino with no insurance so that, in my estimation, is off the table.

Posted by: O | Jul 24 2020 5:10 utc | 93

Posted by: lizard | Jul 24 2020 1:28 utc | 65

If I have mistakenly conflated snake's posts with yours due to a brain fart on my part, I apologize and stand corrected.

Doesn't forgive the unnecessary attack on me in this thread at 4. That was the act of a troll.

So fuck you again.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 24 2020 5:15 utc | 94

lizard

The vast majority believes what everyone else believes. Human nature as a herd animal unchanged throughout history. On a very small percentage say "why" or see the massive holes in MSM propaganda. For them if everyone is saying it, it must be true. The few that do question this shit end up at sites like this and then rarely agree on all aspects. Many I very much disagree with on a number of issues - apart from the obvious trolls pushing propaganda from the powers that be. People that actually think for themselves rather than running with the mob.

As for what is occurring in this so called west - virtually nothing can be done internally. Whoever controls the media controls peoples minds. The few that don't get caught by MSM mind control are no threat to those that control the narrative. A small site like this gets to the position it starts making waves as in large and widespread readership, it will be destroyed.
It is only self incurred collapse of the US or outside intervention that will change what is happening. If the US goes down, the whole western house of cards and illusion will collapse.
We can only watch. We could take a gun and take perhaps one or two politicians with us but that will change nothing. For me my life is finished but my children have now started their families. I watch, try and get an understanding of what is occurring and were we are at so that my children - if / when the shit hits the fan my children have some idea of what is occurring.
Tearing your hair out and screaming incoherently changes nothing.

But the point is, those that comment here are not those sleep walking into nothing to the tune of the MSM pied piper.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jul 24 2020 5:24 utc | 95

Posted by: Grieved | Jul 24 2020 3:49 utc | 87 You just can't say that until you explain why it turned down the perfect war it already had 6 months ago.

I already have, repeatedly. Israel can not afford a war with Iran until Hezbollah in Lebanon has been defanged (if it can be.)

Not to mention that as I said before, six months ago Trump considered attacking Iran over the drone shoot down. Iran told him what it would do if he did. He backed down because he wasn't ready for that and the Pentagon told him *they* weren't ready for that.

The US wasn't ready to attack Iran 6 months ago. More importantly, neither was Israel.

Wars don't start at the snap of a finger. There's such a thing as logistics. The US has plenty of assets in the region that they can use to start a war, but not to withstand Iran's retaliation without further preparation. Did the US invade Iraq in 2003 without a six months preparation time? Or in 1991?

People who don't understand logistics, and other military matters, always assume any country can start a war at any moment over anything. No, it requires a build-up.

The only people who can't accept the likelihood of a war with Iran are people afflicted with cognitive dissonance. Whereas I don't know any time in history where countries with this level of animosity haven't gone to war eventually. Both Israel and the US neocons want Iran destroyed. It's that simple. Their only problem is how to do it on the cheap and without having their electorates vote them out of office once it goes badly (as it will.)

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 24 2020 5:25 utc | 96

Not that this is a surprise, but, hey, it's *July*...almost *August*...

Coronavirus testing: Still 10-day wait to get tested in SF; experts breakdown top 3 symptoms


Kiekhofer said her provider was hesitant to give her a test, questioning specific symptoms. "She said it was most likely a sinus infection or a cold."

That's just stupid and incompetent. Your medical profession at work.


Dr. David Witt, Kaiser's lead epidemiologist said 'no symptoms, no appointment.' 'We've closed down just in the past few days some asymptomatic testing,' said Dr. Witt. "We're only focusing on those with symptoms."

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 24 2020 5:38 utc | 97

Maybe Trump is being pressured enough to "get it"...

In shift, Trump says some schools may need to delay opening amid coronavirus pandemic

But only in places which are "hard hit" - so the result will be everywhere else will *become* "hard hit".

According to Medium:


President Donald Trump says he his canceling Florida events for the GOP convention. Trump says he is not doing a “big crowded” convention and will do a speech in some other form.

Maybe the Trump trolls will start calling Trump a "gutless pussy". Of course, he is throwing out a pitch at a ball game - safely, on an open field...

Meanwhile:


California orders millions of masks: The state is recording more cases of Covid-19 than any other. Governor Gavin Newsom said he will extend a contract with China’s BYD Co. for hundreds of millions of masks.

States record new records: The New York Times reports that Missouri, North Dakota and West Virginia recorded their highest daily Covid-19 cases on Wednesday, and Alabama, Idaho and Texas reported their highest daily death records.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 24 2020 5:44 utc | 98

Wow. There is some real intellectual masturbation going on here in these comments.
I used to read here for information.
Nowadays, it’s just the same thing over and over again from pseudo intellectual narcissists.
I’m sure you will all be pleased to know that I AM OUT OF HERE.

Posted by: Cadence Calls | Jul 24 2020 5:55 utc | 99

@ Cadence Calls | Jul 24 2020 5:55 utc | 99

I AM OUT OF HERE.

Well, heartbroken, we are. Can't take it nomore. Too much heartbreak.

Posted by: blues | Jul 24 2020 6:06 utc | 100

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