Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 08, 2020

2020 Presidential Election Thread 07

Bernie is giving up.

Joyce Karam - @Joyce_Karam - 15:27 UTC · Apr 8, 2020

BREAKING: Bernie Sanders is Ending his Campaign for 2020, making Joe Biden essentially the presumptive Dem. Nominee to face Trump.

Posted by b on April 8, 2020 at 15:29 UTC | Permalink

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He'll support the Democratic nominee.

Feel the Bern. Again.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 8 2020 15:42 utc | 1

Precisely when his policies made more sense than ever, and when a possibility of a comeback was the most possible, he drops out.

Those center-leftists don't fool me - never did.

Posted by: vk | Apr 8 2020 15:43 utc | 2

the NYT ran pieces about how Bernie mismanaged his campaign, but that doesn't wholly explain how braindead, grope-for-words-and-women Biden is now the nominee. ultimately, I shrug my shoulders, but it still remains mysterious to me.

Posted by: occupatio | Apr 8 2020 15:51 utc | 3




FU lamebrain media who helped destroy Bernie

FU Democratic Party

FU Whoopi Goldberg and special message just for the blck b*tch:

FU Hillary Clinton Witch

You're all going to eat Trump for 4 more years every single day until you turn green and plead on your hands and knees.

3rd Party with or w/o Bernie. I know he'll do what Tulsi did. But promises like supporting the Nominee no matter who were meant to be broken.

All the Democratic operatives who worked to sink Bernie Sanders can go to hell!

Biden is gonna lose, you damn losers.

Posted by: Circe | Apr 8 2020 16:08 utc | 4

@occupatio #3
You are underestimating the power of the DNCC and Obama endorsement.
That, combined with Sanders' focus on policies helping the kiddies, ensured that the older Dem voters chose the safe, mainstream alternative.
Plus Biden, for all his numerous faults, is much more likeable than HRC. The feeling apparently is that this, plus Trump = bad, means 2016 won't happen again.

We'll see.

Prior to nCOV, I saw Trump as moonwalking into another term.
It is possible the nCOV backlash will change this, but equally possible that it will make him stronger than ever. I've said several times now that Trump has laid the economic negatives firmly at the state level - more blue state than red - while being the source of the good (stimulus checks).

Politically, it means he can say that he isn't responsible for the millions of people who lost work in the travel, restaurant and other entertainment sectors due to the lockdown caused by the Chinese virus - he isn't responsible for the lockdown keeping people at home and the cause was bad China!
He worked hard to get money to every American.
etc etc.

And what can Biden say? I'm not Trump?

Posted by: c1ue | Apr 8 2020 16:11 utc | 5

Bernie Sanders is a coward. I'm embarrassed to have supported him for so long. If he constantly caves under pressure (like he has this whole campaign), he doesn't deserve to be the nominee or the president.

Posted by: morbidprime | Apr 8 2020 16:15 utc | 6

@ c1ue 5
Yes, about DNCC machinations, but what is confounding is it looks like self-sabotage. Biden has little chance of winning, mostly bc he doesn't excite the swing-voters enough to go to the polls. Few hate him; but few are enthusiastic. That's a recipe for losing. And his creepy groping and Ukraine corruption will be easy fodder for Trump.

The DNCC seems content to be the fake opposition party to the Republicans. It's bad intentions or utter incompetence. Take your pick. It's hard to really wrap one's head around either one. But dysfunction is like that; it defies sense.

Posted by: occupatio | Apr 8 2020 16:25 utc | 7

As a non-American, I am not unsettled that Trump will serve a second term. Trump is doing more to dismantle the "American Century" - an idea more destructive to the rest of the world that anything I can presently think of - than any anti-war group ever could. Trump has exposed the US for what it is - a rogue state, self-involved, run by greed and corruption.

Of course Trump is an idiot. A narcissist, a self-promoter, and a fella with a very tepid relationship with truth. He entirely lacks compassion or any sense of empathy whatsoever. However, he IS showing the world that the US cannot under any circumstances, be trusted - has it ever stuck to any of the treaties it entered into?

All this is not a result of Trump alone. Every president since JFK has had but two priorities: to keep the powerful powerful, and the rich rich. Capitalists doing what Capitalists do.

The Bushes, the Clintons, so-called Saint Obama, Trump, and a dementia-ridden Biden vying for the big chair. This is the best America has on offer?? At least Trump is honest in exposing America for what it is. A rogue, near-failed state. The sooner the population at large realize this, and start raising politicians who aren't chosen simply by how much money they have, the better.

But I'm not holding my breath. Go Trump!

Posted by: rgl | Apr 8 2020 16:27 utc | 8

Bernie was never a leader, but my sentiment is with Joe Rogan when he said "Biden is turning us all into morons"

Posted by: Enrico Malatesta | Apr 8 2020 16:27 utc | 9

Election 2020-Dotard [Dem.] v. Retard [Rep.] The oligarchy is happy with either outcome as it assures nothing changes. The only difference is things get worse more quickly or more slowly. Trump may be God's justice on Americans for permitting their government to become an empire which is murdering its way around the world.

Posted by: stevelaudig | Apr 8 2020 16:40 utc | 10

I think we can make do without Political Parties, PACs, and Corporate+Non-Profit Contributions to the Political Process.

Having Individuals run on their Own Dime and Individual Contributions (Scaled for the Office Type, Cash Only).

End this State+Federal Legislature+Executive Selection Hijack by Political Parties.

Posted by: IronForge | Apr 8 2020 16:42 utc | 11

So it appears that when Election Day rolls around, I will again be writing in the name "Vladimir Putin" as a protest vote.

At least the hapless poll workers who have to tally all these write-ins up can get a chuckle or two out of it.

Antoinetta III

Posted by: Antoinetta III | Apr 8 2020 16:44 utc | 12

@occupatio #7
I agree with what you say, but look at the polls:
they all say Biden can beat Trump:
Biden beats Trump by 6 percent - Newsweek
Biden leads Trump by 9% - CNN

I'm sure you can find many more.
It wouldn't shock me at all if the DNCC thinks Biden will win.

Posted by: c1ue | Apr 8 2020 16:46 utc | 13

rgl @8:

"The Bushes, the Clintons, so-called Saint Obama, Trump, and a dementia-ridden Biden vying for the big chair. This is the best America has on offer??"

One word: kakistocracy.

Posted by: corvo | Apr 8 2020 16:46 utc | 14

rgl @ 8

I'm an American and I feel the same way

Posted by: paulmeli | Apr 8 2020 16:46 utc | 15

The reason Biden beat Bernie in the primaries is obvious: electronic vote flipping, just like Hillary’s DNC did in 2016. The exit poll discrepancies prove this beyond doubt. And Bernie, coward or sheepdog that he is, refused to complain that millions of his supporters were cheated again. It seems that violent revolution is being made inevitable.

Posted by: NoOneYouKnow | Apr 8 2020 16:48 utc | 16

Feels to me like the DCCC and Biden's people are holding any future primary states they can hostage. "Y'all see what we did in Wisconsin? We can keep this up. If Bernie doesn't drop out, we'll keep killing our base with primaries."

Posted by: boots | Apr 8 2020 16:49 utc | 17


Bernie Sanders is not a coward. He is a realist. He has proven beyond a reasonable doubt that the corrupt political system will only be defeated with violence.

Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.

John F. Kennedy


You had me going until you wrote: Go Trump! Then stupid came to mind. Quit that U.S. exposed reverse psychology Trump bait! Trump's Presidency is the most opaque Ziofascist takeover in the history of America.


The Democratic Establishment and the fake lame brain media CNN and MSNBC put the fix in this race. Trump has all the goods on Biden and he will win again cause he was the Chosen of the Zionist Oligarch United States.

Why couldn't black people heed the words of Reverend Wright and vote freedom instead of continuously following the brainwash decoy (Biden) straight to the slaughter like dumb-assed sheep.:


Posted by: Circe | Apr 8 2020 16:58 utc | 18

“I think we can make do without Political Parties, PACs, and Corporate+Non-Profit Contributions to the Political Process.”

I completely agree that all these are nefarious and destructive to the system.

“Having Individuals run on their Own Dime and Individual Contributions (Scaled for the Office Type, Cash Only).”

The problem with this is that Fat Cats like Bloomberg or Zukerman could simply buy the office is question with far greater ease than they can now.

Antoinetta III

Posted by: Antoinetta III | Apr 8 2020 17:04 utc | 19

Dear Circe;

Bernie's ideas are more alive than ever and *they* will live to fight another day.
I admire your passion here and it is that passion that give people with sense hope. To paraphrase the Saker: "Our collective greed is not from which a just society rises."
We've all had our hopes dashed but the world needs many more builders than cynics.
An old song for you.


Posted by: bobzibub | Apr 8 2020 17:25 utc | 20

There's just no way Biden can win. There will be a much smaller conversion of Bernie voters than in the prevous election. This is Trump's to lose, unfortunately. Because Biden will have to count on icon-images of himself to convince people. Whenever he opens his mouth, it's a disaster. Will he even be alive by November?

Posted by: Josh | Apr 8 2020 17:25 utc | 21

First time posting on MOA, and recent "defector" from CoronaHedge (fka ZeroHedge). Active on ZH since 2009, and it has denigrated into a haven for Chinaphobia and hasbara trolls. Thank God for this site...the level of info and intelligence puts the crap on ZH to shame.

Posted by: DAA | Apr 8 2020 17:26 utc | 22

actual Biden quote broken up to highlight the absurdity:

We cannot let this,
we’ve never allowed
any crisis from the Civil War
straight through
to the pandemic of 17,
all the way around, 16, we
have never, never let our democracy
sakes second fiddle, way they, we
can both have a democracy and ...
correct the public health

Posted by: lizard | Apr 8 2020 17:27 utc | 23


Posted by: karafspolo | Apr 8 2020 17:29 utc | 24

@c1ue 13
Yes, that polling is reminds me of the MSM predictions that Hilary would win by a ridiculous margin. Except Biden's margins here are small.
It seems like the DNCC has learned nothing from the Hilary debacle, and is trapped in their little bubble of political consultants.

In any case, I don't live in a state where my vote makes any difference in the electoral college. And besides, Trump is the best candidate for unraveling the current system of perpetual warfare and sanctions abroad, and austerity at home. No reforms before wreckage.

Posted by: occupatio | Apr 8 2020 17:37 utc | 25

rgl@8 Yes Yes Yes +10 000 000

Circe, Now that it is abundantly clear, undisputed even that YOU were Burned again, I'd say it's high time for you to make amends to the many posters here you have disrespected almost habitually over the last 4 months or so? IMO anyways.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2020 17:41 utc | 26

"Bernie Sanders is Ending his Campaign for 2020, making Joe Biden essentially the presumptive Dem. Nominee to face Trump."

I'm still a Trumper and like the way he's moving from helping the self-worshipping "Israelis" to ambush themselves, to helping the self-worshiping Swamp to ambush itself. I mean, how unhinged does Darth Pompeo have to be to ramble on about war-mongering and genocidal sanctions, in the middle of a catastrophic health crisis?

There's circumstantial evidence that every POTUS since J Carter, at least, with the possible exception of Bush 1, has been the recipient of "The Chat" from the Permanent Bureaucracy in AmeriKKKa and imo Trump was aware of how the system works before he nominated himself.

When Trump has finished with Biden the Dems will probably have to apologise to US Citizens for nominating a sleazy jackass.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 8 2020 17:46 utc | 27

The Democrats don't want to win. Biden is not up to it, he may even be less capable mentally than Trump is, and Sanders is a coward.

Posted by: Waldorf | Apr 8 2020 17:48 utc | 28

"I congratulate Joe Biden, a very decent man, who I will work with to move our progressive ideas forward."

Fuck off Bernie, that misogynistic dementia-addled warmongering corporate tool Joe Biden is NOT a very decent man, never was, and neither are you.

You are a feckless liar and coward who sheepherded your followers (again) into the death grip of the Democratic party:

Posted by: Trisha | Apr 8 2020 18:06 utc | 29

Circe @4, 100%!

Posted by: spudski | Apr 8 2020 18:13 utc | 30

Bernie Sanders' announcement that he is dropping out of the presidential primary comes as no surprise. But Bernie isn't finished. He has single handedly changed the nature of the 2020 presidential election, as well as the election for the House and Senate. He has also moved the debate for a national health care system to the political front burner. Along with the other issues he raised, such as a livable minimum wage, free college tuition, etc., these will continue to be debated. If the political and business elites think that these issues will simply fade away with Sanders withdrawal, then they are in for a nasty surprise. These issues are basic meat and potatoes issues. The more the elites ignore them, the more likely they will be rammed down their collective throats, kicking and screaming.

Posted by: GeorgeV | Apr 8 2020 18:19 utc | 31

rgl | Apr 8 2020 16:27 utc | 8

Back in 2016, I was recommending people vote for trump. My reasoning was that if he got elected people would finally see and admit what a farce our government is, and would therefore demand change.

That has not worked out quite like I had hoped. Despite all the evidence to the contrary, trump has a 44% approval rating. He has literally fucked up yuuugely, and a large portion of our populace ignores that reality and believes their delusions instead. I don't have much hope for americans figuring anything out.

But, the rest of the countries of the world are quickly seeing who we are, and they are going to be leaving us in droves. Which will force us to change.

So, kinda, in a very roundabout way, got what I recommended?

ps I don't vote. It is a useless waste of energy, and my opinion doesn't matter anyway. Anyone who feels the need to tell me that I am part of the problem by not voting, can save their keystrokes, as I am just going to ignore that.

Posted by: David F | Apr 8 2020 18:20 utc | 32

@19 bobzibub

Thanks for the encouragement, but I think the pandemic and the concerted fix on Bernie's campaign is just the beginning of the worst to come. We are doomed.

@26 Hoarsewhisperer

One of the worst things about Bernie dropping out is being exposed to your delusional Trump-drool again.

@25 Tannenhouser

GTH. 🖕

Posted by: Circe | Apr 8 2020 18:21 utc | 33

@ GeorgeV 30
Bernie changes nothing. Even he had become present, anything of substance he wanted to do would be blocked in congress. the US political system is so dysfunctional now that it cannot be reformed from within. these 'democracy games' are just ways for us riffraff to busy ourselves.

Posted by: occupatio | Apr 8 2020 18:25 utc | 34

Circe you have even less class than Trump

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2020 18:25 utc | 35

Bernie once again took the easy path and "burned" his supporters rather than burn down the corrupt DNC. Did he gain anything for his movement with his second campaign? No, Biden has already promised to veto universal medical coverage and his proxies are already talking up his "team of rival" cabinet for more Neoliberal centralism and continuous warfare, while quietly putting the blame on Bernie for daring to question the divine right of DNC establishment when Biden's campaign inevitably crashes into a puddle of his own feces in front of the whole nation. The age of despair for the American worker that started with Regan will continue for another 8 years at least. Bernie's failure is complete and total

Posted by: Kadath | Apr 8 2020 18:33 utc | 36

Another sad day, thou not a great Bernie fan, he certainly outdistanced the field in my estimation ?? Will I vote for another corporate blue dog, can you guess ?? My days of supporting so-called democrats that are nothing but warmed up former moderate repukes have long been passed !! Someone said it above so well (c1ue) apologies if others had mentioned it also "I'm not Trump", 'bout says it all !!

Posted by: terrorist lieberal | Apr 8 2020 18:35 utc | 37

RE: c1ue | Apr 8 2020 16:11 utc | 5

And what can Biden say? I'm not Trump?

how about "I will be the best, the best, you know, you know the thing!”

Posted by: Perimetr | Apr 8 2020 18:36 utc | 38

meant to include this link:

Posted by: Perimetr | Apr 8 2020 18:37 utc | 39

Where are the proper words for this disaster? You have look back earlier to the vote-flipping software of Election 2000, recall the server in Ohio that was hijacked in 2004 when Karl Rove calmed Bush's anxiety. The thing was in the bag. The machine of chicanery, and the illusion of democracy, the counterfeit process is impossible to ignore. The Democratic Party doesn't feel required to offer a fair process in 2016 0r now; and as they argued in court, fairness is not the standard they are bound to respect.

Whatever you think of Bernie Sanders' decision today, he added much more to the movement for justice than was accomplished by his 2016 campaign. If the Party bosses humiliate the movement that brought Bernie this far. And if they refuse to open the party platform to the social movement that filled the ranks of Bernie's campaign; then the result will surely be that the ranks of this support will abandon the Party. This will turn out to be a much broader and deeper revolt than the one in 2016.

The institutional corruption of the political establishment, on both sides, is a body blow to this nation. Those who gloat at this outcome do not add anything to the conversation.

Posted by: Copeland | Apr 8 2020 18:40 utc | 40

The bottom line is trump will be elected (or not) on the state of the economy in Oct. Biden's best chance may be to disappear until the election lest out his dementia. I don't see any logic that the economy can V recover, everything was already in bubble and I don't think infinity new money can fix it. I think generally trumps numbers are going to drag down as the economy fails to recover. The popcorn moment may be who Biden picks as running mate VP.

Posted by: endthefed | Apr 8 2020 18:46 utc | 41

IMO, the VEEP choices will be the ones to deeply examine, but those won't be known for several months. Sanders choice given his health and the pandemic makes sense to me. I don't intend to throw stones at him or Gabbard. IMO, the pandemic is teaching some valuable political and economic lessons, but presently there's no way to judge the depth of their absorption aside from some resurgence of resilience as communities are forced to generate solutions to the problems foisted on them by Neoliberalism. The impactful economic and thus political fallout from COVID-19 has yet to materialize and won't until June, IMO, although some of the stats will be known by then. In the Big Picture, Mighty Casey (Trump) struck out; but the Outlaw US Empire's political-economy was already crippled by 2007-9, and the attempts to keep it on life support only served to enlarge the Abyssal Black Hole it will soon topple into. I'm sure Sanders didn't relish the idea of trying to manage that. And as pointed out by political-economists outside the narrow board rooms and Ivory Towers inhabited by Neoliberals, the problem resides in the System's Structure, which can only be resolved through a complete reboot with a new OS and design.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 8 2020 18:47 utc | 42

As for the singing fat ladies, sirens, and so forth ...

A harbinger informs us that Mr & Mrs Beck Esquire suuccessfully filed their petition challenge to the latest ruling on their class action lawsuit DNC ruling in the Supreme Court!

DNC Fraud Lawsuit Plaintiffs Petition Supreme Court

Official record was filed March 26, 2020.

Oh to live on, sugar mountain, with the barkers the yellow balloons.
You can't be twenty on sugar mountain, though you're thinking that you're leaving there too soon ...

Posted by: Екатери́на | Apr 8 2020 18:52 utc | 43

There will be no corona backlash for Trump. He now holds daily rallies on live TV and will continue to do so for months. His job approval has risen and if the situation gets worse, which might happen when the second wave hits this fall, it will only rise further.

Biden has practically vanished from the media. There will be no celebratory convention and Trump will hit him left and right over his son in Ukraine, his sniffing of girl's hair and his obvious dementia.

Trump will also launch a large infrastructure effort with another trillion $$$ or so to up the economy. He will use that to buy votes.

Absent some catastrophic Trump mistake I see no chance for the Democrats to win in November.

Posted by: b | Apr 8 2020 18:53 utc | 44

"I agree with what you say, but look at the polls:
they all say Biden can beat Trump"

Yeah and they say Hillary beats Trump also.

Posted by: jinn | Apr 8 2020 18:53 utc | 45

Well that's completely not unexpected. His job was to con the non-retarded democrats into thinking they have a choice. He will laugh all they way to the bank, just like he did the last time.
P.S. Trump is a complete moron, as are most of his fans. It has to be said. I've watched his daily corona conference yesterday and if was all "america grate!" and zero substance. I'm pretty sure no man or woman with the IQ above 80, except Americans, would listen to that bullshit and think he's doing even a mediocre job. The man is a train wreck. Lets hope the fall of America won't kill us all...

Posted by: Tod | Apr 8 2020 18:57 utc | 46

Copeland @39--

The institutional corruption of the political establishment, on both sides, is a body blow to this nation. Those who gloat at this outcome do not add anything to the conversation.

Agreed, but that corruption's been ongoing since the end of WW2, and in some cases--corruption of the political establishment--preceded it.

Few will recall my invitation for barflies to compose a Revolutionary Manifesto that deals with the genuine problems we face in prose understandable by a citizenry with a 6th grade reading level. And since we're all marooned on our little islands of social distancing, perhaps now provides the time/opportunity for composition.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 8 2020 18:58 utc | 47

Back to the VP. I think Hillary is not. I doubt her health issues have gotten better in 4 years and certainly the criminal baggage is still there. I think if they could convince her to run Michelle Obama would be the electable choice. She's got everything lefty except transgender but maybe she/he could fix that also.

Posted by: endthefed | Apr 8 2020 18:58 utc | 48

The coming general election will feature the two least qualified candidates in U.S. history. Trump is a malignant narcissist and very stupid, while Biden is a corporatist and a hawk in addition to being senile. As president, Biden would be less likely to abuse the Constitution and to appoint far right ideologues to the federal bench. Clearly, he is a lesser of two evils choice, and I say that as someone who regards him as an absolute evil. My fear is that a second Trump administration will make the first one look like a kindergarten singalong.

Posted by: Rob | Apr 8 2020 19:00 utc | 49

I’m not voting. But Trump has a lock on 45% of the electorate regardless of what he does. Assuming Biden currently has the remaining 55%, all Trump has to do is peel off about 1 in 10 Biden voters. I don’t think that is too hard to do as the Bernie voters are pissed Biden’s support is not very enthusiastic. The lockdown will be largely lifted by May and the healthier parts of the economy will return very quickly and this will be evident by fall. The economy as a whole will take a lot longer. Biggest risk could actually be a return of consumer price inflation with significant production capacity still down but many people primed to avoid shortages.

The election is Trump’s to lose.

Posted by: Kevin | Apr 8 2020 19:01 utc | 50

The vitriol in this thread is much healthier than than the glad handing by fauxgressives right now thanking Bernie for "permanently changing the discussion". Bernie fulfilled his sheepdog role of keeping people who want change attached to the moribund, corrupt Democratic Party, so he can now retire well loved by the political class. Anyone who thinks change can come from the Democrats is deluded. You'd have better luck changing the Republicans as they seem more open to ideas... Building a real third party is more needed than ever.

If Bernie had really wanted change, he would have refused to support any candidate until his demands were met, threatening to tell his voters to stay at home in November. Fighting back is the only way you'll get anything.

Posted by: worldblee | Apr 8 2020 19:04 utc | 51

It seems like the DNCC has learned nothing from the Hilary debacle, and is trapped in their little bubble of political consultants.
You have to pretty gullible to believe that is even possible.
After they did it once I can see how you would think it is due to incompetence, but the second time surely you now harbor some suspicion that it is intentional?

Posted by: jinn | Apr 8 2020 19:10 utc | 52

Makes no sense for Bernie to drop put and he will likely stan for Biden now.

In my opinion, Bernie should be appreciated for the movement he built, but he is not the champion we need. He completely lacks a killer instinct and wears kids gloves when he needed to go at his opponents. He's way too soft. He didn't do what it took to win.

With that said, I will NOT be voting for Biden or any corporate/neoliberal Dem ever again. So I will either vote 3rd party or sit my ass home come November.

I fully expect senile Biden to get his ass handed to him by Trump.

Posted by: KP | Apr 8 2020 19:10 utc | 53

i tend to agree wtih b @ 43... it is hard to see anything else happening here...

and i agree with this post below too... i don't like piling on, but the negative response to tannenhouser from circe casts a clear image of circe in a very negative light...

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2020 18:25 utc | 34 "Circe you have even less class than Trump"

Posted by: james | Apr 8 2020 19:11 utc | 54

I still see the possibility of a brokered democratic election where Biden will have bowed out due to his deteriorating mental conditions, and Hillary and Dem. Establishment will once again be stupid enough to believe that Trump can be beaten by name-calling, accusation, and innuendo.

Au contraire, that only works when Trump does it.

IMO, nothing would be sweeter than a rematch where Trump really wipes the floor with Hillary this time.

One can dream.


Yes, Bernie is a phenomenal coward with 1/2 the intestinal fortitude of Trump.

He didn't really want the presidency. Bummer, because, like Trump, there were probably a lot of independents like myself who would have given him a chance, and, had he picked Tulsi as running mate, that duo would have been a shoe-in.

As for Tulsi, it looks like she will be relegated to Hawaii indefinitely and out of any kind of remaining spotlight. There are worse fates, I suppose.

Posted by: Nemesiscalling | Apr 8 2020 19:11 utc | 55

and for the record jackrabbit has been prescient from day one on sanders.. kudos jr...

Posted by: james | Apr 8 2020 19:12 utc | 56

The Corona crisis will be a huge wake-up call for the American people, and what then? The dotard in the WH is incapable of getting a grip on the situation, and will probably FU majorly.
That a election for the presidency in the US have two contestants, Biden and Trump, draws wide amusement in Europe.
Elect the jester for king!
Go America, we cant wait for your collapse!

Posted by: Den Lille Abe | Apr 8 2020 19:17 utc | 57

James @55. Yes thanks for the reminder I second the Kudos for JR

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2020 19:17 utc | 58

>And what can Biden say? I'm not Trump?
> c1ue | Apr 8 2020 16:11 utc | 5

"The People are hungry? Let them eat Dollars!"

Posted by: Trailer Trash | Apr 8 2020 19:23 utc | 59

David F @ 31

"ps I don't vote. It is a useless waste of energy, and my opinion doesn't matter anyway…"

If voting mattered it would be illegal

Posted by: paulmeli | Apr 8 2020 19:24 utc | 60

I'm writing in "Not Sure" for president

President Not Sure's Final Speech

Posted by: Perimetr | Apr 8 2020 19:26 utc | 61

GeorgeV 30:

But Bernie isn't finished.

Is this a joke? Can he screw his supporters even more than he has?

He has single handedly changed the nature of the 2020 presidential election

Nope. Same foolishness as 2016.

He has also moved the debate for a national health care system to the political front burner.

"Moved the debate" needs some unpacking: Bernie successfully covered Obama's healthcare betrayal (Obama confessed: a public option would be "unAmerican") with an an even bigger electoral betrayal.

NY Times Reporter Confirms Obama Made Deal to Kill Public Option:

Even while President Obama was saying that he thought a public option was a good idea and encouraging supporters to believe his healthcare plan would include one, he had promised for-profit hospital lobbyists [and the drug industry] that there would be no public option in the final bill.

Along with the other issues he raised ...

LOL. Yes, Bernie's failure was not just about healthcare.

political and business elites ... are in for a nasty surprise.

This is just pure deflection. IMO hating on Bernie is healthy. The more I see hate for what Bernie has done, the more hope I'll have that a real Movement can be formed.

<> <> <> <> <>

Bernie was already 'finished' for anyone willing to exercise their brain.

Only a genuine Movement(s) will change anything.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 8 2020 19:27 utc | 62

Those bashing Bernie should understand that there was no way in hell the establishment (party duopoly and corporate media complex) was going to let him win. They almost didn't let him in - the DNC considered forcing Independents to join the party in order to run. They blatantly sabotaged his campaign in 2016 and rigged the primaries against him in 2020 starting with the Iowa Caucus. All you have to do is compare exit polls - which the US uses to validate foreign election results - with vote counts.

The stranglehold of corporate interests and the party duopoly on the electoral system is clear. The only reason that Trump won was widespread dissatisfaction of voters with the entire system. Trump was an outsider put up by Clinton to be the one of “the most despicable GOP candidates” and assure her victory. Whoops.

Back to Bernie - his positions on the issues are the most widely and strongly supported of any candidate, which makes him a dire threat to the system. His perseverance in the face of extreme political resistance - forced to sign a pledge of support for whoever the DEM nominee is just to be allowed to participate - is to his credit, not his detriment.

Bashing Bernie for failing to score a victory in a game rigged against him from top to bottom is asinine. Bernie has been leading the political charge on universal health care for decades. Don’t blame him for failing, put the blame where it belongs, squarely on the shoulders of the corrupt corporate government. Who in case you haven’t noticed just bailed out the parasitic corporations (again) while ignoring the people. The for-profit-only health care system has been nickel-and-dimed to the barest minimums in every possible way from system capacity (2.8 beds per 1,000, about half of China) to underpaid health care workers (the real health care providers) in order to maximize profit without regard for anything else. This is the business model of capitalism.

Meanwhile the DEMs are putting up a dementia-riddled lifelong corporate servant Republican in a blue suit to assure that nothing changes. The duopoly doesn’t care who wins as long as it’s not Bernie and the corporate welfare keeps flowing. Trump gives DEMs the illusion of relevance. Their motto is not “anyone but Trump” but rather “anyone but Bernie”.

Posted by: Noah Way | Apr 8 2020 19:33 utc | 63

Well, that gives Trump a lock on 4 more years. If Trump wants to seal the deal all he has to do is declare war on the covid, do some fireside chats, and and talk up being brave in the face of adversity (as if he knows anything about that). No switching leadership in the middle of a life-and-death struggle, doncha`know.

The Dems have saved American capitalism yet again, but it is a system that is looking mighty decrepit nonetheless.

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 8 2020 19:35 utc | 64

Democrat, Republican, Democrat, Republican, Democrat....Still the same.
Democracy, Freedom of Speech, Americans love to kills, Sanction, Endless wars.

Revolution of our times, five demands not one less ... god, family and country

Posted by: JC | Apr 8 2020 19:38 utc | 65

Noah Way @63

No, the only reason Trump won was because the American public caught the establishment completely by surprise. Elections can be rigged, but not on the fly and at the last second. If the establishment had any suspicion that Trump could have won in 2016 they would have prepared the election results ahead of time.

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 8 2020 19:40 utc | 66

Let the battle for America's soul begin:

Trump blames Warren & DNC for Sanders ending campaign, INVITES ‘Bernie people’ to the Republican Party

‘I need to earn your votes’: Biden

As I've said in this blog many times, my bet is the American working classes will choose fascism. And I'll complement my thesis: the sandernistas will be the decisive factor.

Posted by: vk | Apr 8 2020 19:43 utc | 67

Rob @ 48 said;"The coming general election will feature the two least qualified candidates in U.S. history. Trump is a malignant narcissist and very stupid, while Biden is a corporatist and a hawk in addition to being senile."

Agreed, and your comment is probably too kind to both..

Bernie is like much of the so-called left, they've forgotten how to fight, by surrounding themselves with DNC hacks. Never the less, his ideas are credible, and shouldn't be forgotten.

Don't see how DJT can lose in Nov., but stranger things have happened. Regardless, I'll never vote Biden, and if DJT wins, the U$A gets what it deserves, whatever that is.

All Bernie can do is continue to collect delegates, and hope to move Biden leftward, to at least support Medicare for all, which, given the state of healthcare in our present pandemic, might gain some traction.

Still in all, very interesting times..

Posted by: ben | Apr 8 2020 19:44 utc | 68

WG @ 65 said; "The Dems have saved American capitalism yet again, but it is a system that is looking mighty decrepit nonetheless."

Yep, don't ya' love it when a plan comes together?

Posted by: ben | Apr 8 2020 19:47 utc | 69

>Those bashing Bernie should understand that there was no way in hell
>the establishment (party duopoly and corporate media complex) was
>going to let him win.

People here paying attention knew he wouldn't be allowed to win. So did Bernie also know this, and went along with the charade, or did he not know, thus showing that he is a complete fool and nincompoop?

Knowing he could not win, a real radical would've been building a movement, not an electoral machine. He did earn lots of delegates but threw them all away instead of taking them to the convention and cause a ruckus.

No one will be talking about Bernie's ideas by next month, but there will be plenty of US peons desperate for food and shelter. Will Bernie's movement be there to organize them and help them get the necessities of life?

The sad part is all the effort and resources wasted on Bernie the Bozo's campaign. That campaign money could've bought a lot of groceries and tents.

Posted by: Trailer Trash | Apr 8 2020 19:53 utc | 70

"Yep, don't ya' love it when a plan comes together?" --ben @71

It would be nice if they were not so obvious about it. It would be nice if they gave us enough room for doubt to pretend that we don't notice them screwing us, you know?

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 8 2020 20:00 utc | 71

Noah Way @ 63; excellent post, well said...

Posted by: ben | Apr 8 2020 20:02 utc | 72

Noah Way @63:

They blatantly sabotaged his campaign in 2016 ...

He sabotaged his own campaign by his deference to Hillary and the Party.

Who can forget when he let Hillary off the hook by exclaiming: "Enough with your damn emails!"

The stranglehold of corporate interests and the party duopoly on the electoral system is clear.

Then why did he mount a Party insurgency instead of a proper Movement?

Bashing Bernie for failing to score a victory ...

We're bashing him for not even trying to score a victory.

Leading his flock to a brick wall is less than useless.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 8 2020 20:07 utc | 73

Can't believe we're even still speculating or fretting over Bernie's dropping out. His supporters can be oh so sad that his ideas were the best, but the dastardly "establishment" just wouldn't go along! He lost me in 2016 with his sheepdogging; he lost me in 2019 for not attacking Biden's corruption and war-mongering, but the killer for me was Bernie embracing the moronic and dangerous Russiagate narrative. The sunlight is shining onto many areas, as Caitlin Johnstone says, if we can wake up and see it and create a real movement for sane actions and policies. Bernie's "movement" was designed to be a feel-good exercise in support of empire.

Posted by: Kabobyak | Apr 8 2020 20:10 utc | 74

@VK "As I've said in this blog many times, my bet is the American working classes will choose fascism."

No....No I dont think they will....Like always the people will get something 'other' than what they think/believe they have voted for.

@68WG. "No, the only reason Trump won was because the American public caught the establishment completely by surprise."

No....No I don't think they did...Trump was always gonna win.....his rhetoric was way better than HRC's. Like always the voter voted for the rhetoric that vibrated most with them.

this is my hindsight op as I was sure HRC was gonna win in 2016.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2020 20:17 utc | 75

Bernie was the sheepdog of the DNC that kept people from organizing outside of the two party hustle(system. People were pointing this out to his supporters very early on in this cycle using last cycle as evidence yet no one listened. If there is a next cycle let's hope Bernie didn't ruin them for political action and they finally figure out they need to go against the entire establishment machine instead of trying to reform one half of the mafia from within.

Posted by: dave | Apr 8 2020 20:18 utc | 76

Both the withdrawal of Sanders and the inexplicable return from the dead of Biden cannot be explained outside of the context of this crisis.
The Sanders campaign was designed to culminate in political rallies involving large numbers of people. The ground campaign canvassing too, depended on the mobilisation of crowds and the interaction of activists with electors.
Such a campaign is now clearly impossible. To replace its ancient design with something completely new, something not involving printed literature and public speeches, is challenging. And, in these times, times in which Sanders would be ill advised to make public appearances, almost impossible.
It makes the possible Plan B of a Third Party platform- which would involve vast amounts of energy getting petitions signed to open the ballot- close to impossible.

Nothing could be more mistaken, however, than to infer from this outcome that all was planned in advance- that Sanders and his supporters were never serious, they were devoting their lives and their money to an effort (unrewarded if the 2016 experience is a precedent) to ensure that nobody on the left challenged the Democratic Convention's nominee.
Unless that is the 'Bernie as sheepdog', proponents are ready to make the claim that the coronavirus, so susceptible to cheap and easy treatment, is being exaggerated into pandemic dimensions as part of a general plan to get Joe Biden (who has no more chance of becoming President than his son Hunter)
on the ballot.

The problem with the sort of cheap explanations that fools borrow without thinking, is that they don't add up. For example sheepdogs require decent treatment and rewards or they won't work. Since they are sent daily into the very heart of the flocks they must be trustworthy and coordinate their work with the shepherd's.
Sanders is none of these things- he has never needed Democratic support in Vermont, as an Independent he can do without the DNC's support, and has done so for decades. He received nothing but ill treatment from the DNC after 2016. His platform suggestions were treated with contempt. His nominees for party office rejected en masse. He was the victim of all manner of discriminatory behaviour throughout the past two electoral cycles. I don't doubt for a moment that the Primary voting was rigged elsewhere just as we saw it being rigged in Iowa. Just as it was in Brooklyn in 2016 or California where the vote was never counted.

He can be blamed for many things, as can his spokespeople and strategists but not for deliberately losing and deliberately wasting their followers' efforts.And yet that is what the "sheepdog" theory implies.
Still, the man is down. And this is America, so the obvious thing to do is to 'put the boot in'; blame Bernie , the latest in a series of failed messiahs. The chestnuts are still in the fire and where is Lefty to get them out for us?

Posted by: bevin | Apr 8 2020 20:26 utc | 77

don't cry for the sheepdog
his herding days are done
they've sunk so low with Dementia Joe
it's like they ate their gun

maybe you didn't know
viability is a code
so allow me to translate:
it's how much dirt you hold

the nastiness of these creatures
means all their files are plump
and mutually assured destruction
means they'd all go down with Trump

so Russia, Russia, Russia!
Ukraine, Ukraine, Ukraine!
two criminal syndicates go to war
and drive us all insane

will you wake up now Amerika?
or stay docile while they loot?
is Netflix your pied piper?
is Tiger King your flute?

Posted by: lizard | Apr 8 2020 20:45 utc | 78

Bernie's arousal of young idealists the country over and then promptly abandoning them is the equivalent of a big brother maliciously dropping "Santa Claus isn't real" onto his wide-eyed younger sibling.

Shame on him for leading his people to a dried up river.

Posted by: Nemesiscalling | Apr 8 2020 20:50 utc | 79

Sanders ran an insurgent candidacy within the Democratic Party based on the analysis that a third-party candidate faced too many hurdles to be a viable challenger. Sanders by far drew the biggest and most enthusiastic crowds, and his policies were articulated using tough and uncompromising language. He would have been the overwhelming leading candidate today if the DNC did not make an extraordinary intervention ahead of Super Tuesday. I am certain their internal polling showed Sanders winning not just California, but also Texas , Massachusetts, and more. Sanders had a winning platform for November, and the DNC again decided they would rather lose with an establishment candidate. The neo-liberal concept is, in their minds, fully TINA.

The takeaway is not that Sanders is a disappointment or turncoat, he was neither. The takeaway is the neo-liberal establishment does not respect the people and will not change their way, and that the system is impervious to reform.

Posted by: jayc | Apr 8 2020 20:50 utc | 80

Follow the Money
or, what the stock market may tell us about who will win in November 2020

In mid 2016, I received a report from my investment brokerage firm stating: research over a 75-year period has shown that the direction of the stock market (going up or going down) in the quarter before a US presidential election has a 75% probability of being accurate in terms of whether the incumbent party is elected or not.

Knowing this, in the 3rd quarter 2016 the stock market went up, so those attuned to the finance world were not surprised at Trump's win.

2020: If the stock market is going up July - Sept 2020, there is a 75% chance Trump as Republican incumbent wins. If it is going down, probabilities favor that the Democratic candidate (Biden?) will win.

I made a chart of the S&P 500 for the 2008, 2012 & 2016 elections but don't know how to post it here. In all 3 cases, the stock market made the accurate prediction.

Posted by: Cynthia | Apr 8 2020 20:54 utc | 81

I advise barflies to listen to what Martin Wolff has to say about what's happening from his monologue today on Galloway's The Mother of All Talk Shows, and then reboot your thinking, although I don't really expect many to do so given the depth of their entrenchment.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 8 2020 21:19 utc | 82

Bernie is old feeble and a talking head...

the democrat rulers hated Tulsi young strong moral as she doesnt represent their values
now Trump/Jared will have no problem winning

Posted by: brian | Apr 8 2020 21:36 utc | 83

Biden's real race isn't against Trump, it's against Alzheimer's. As far as I can tell, Alzheimer's has never lost.

Posted by: Madison James | Apr 8 2020 21:43 utc | 84

>> Posted by: DAA | Apr 8 2020 17:26 utc | 21

>> Active on ZH since 2009

Welcome, DAA. Sorta same here. After BigPicture Ritholtz went to Barron’s, CalculatedRiskBlog hoocoodanode disappeared, WashingtonsBlog disappeared, and ZH idiots overwhelmed quality posters (e.g., Cognitive Dissonance, Hedgeless Horseman, and certainly a few others I can’t recall) and ZH itself started carrying Bolton-backed Hatestone Institute crap, what are we to do?

I mostly lurk — and learn — here in the back.

If this place were physical, I’d buy you a beer.


Posted by: wunsacon lives | Apr 8 2020 21:45 utc | 85

I think Bernie did the right thing. What's the point of exposing voters to Coronavirus for a process that is already rigged and lost. It's sad to admit that the world would suffer another four years of Trump as the USA President.

Posted by: Steve | Apr 8 2020 21:46 utc | 86

Try this on for size; the rest is here:

"The problem of policies aimed to return the economy to what it was before the virus hit is this: Global capitalism, by 2019, was itself a major cause of the collapse in 2020. Capitalism’s scars from the crashes of 2000 and 2008-2009 had not healed. Years of low interest rates had enabled corporations and governments to “solve” all their problems by borrowing limitlessly at almost zero interest rate cost. All the new money pumped into economies by central banks had indeed caused the feared inflation, but chiefly in stock markets whose prices consequently spiraled dangerously far away from underlying economic values and realities. Inequalities of income and wealth reached historic highs.

​"In short, capitalism had built up vulnerabilities to another crash that any number of possible triggers could unleash. The trigger this time was not the meltdown of 2000 or the sub-prime meltdown of 2008/9; it was a virus. And of course, mainstream ideology requires focusing on the trigger, not the vulnerability. Thus mainstream policies aim to reestablish pre-virus capitalism. Even if they succeed, that will return us to a capitalist system whose accumulated vulnerabilities will soon again collapse from yet another trigger." [My Emphasis]

Some may note that Wolff and I think along the same lines.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 8 2020 21:46 utc | 87

As I said. Bernie is just an establishment shill to mobilize the youth long enough that their momentum carries into the chosen candidate. He's that goat that leads the sheep to the slaughter.

Posted by: Jezabeel | Apr 8 2020 21:50 utc | 88

Every now and then, I’m reminded again of Johnny Rotten‘s immortal words:

Bwahahahaha! Ever had a feeling you’ve been cheated?

Posted by: wunsacon lives | Apr 8 2020 22:05 utc | 89

Because several referenced it near the top of this thread, a little history regarding JFK's often quoted "Those that make peaceful change impossible make violent revolution inevitable."

That remark was contained within a prepared address that JFK delivered to a conference of wealthy and powerful Central and South American business leaders. Rather than being a rallying cry delivered from a podium to a throng of expectant faithful, it was said as a warning to the elite.

What makes this even more interesting is that at the very moment he was speaking those words the US military and CIA were involved in several "counter-revolutionary" campaigns in Central and South America.

Kinda' takes the glow off JFK's halo, doesn't it? Now, just where do we want to start in delineating when the US took a series of wrong turns? Eisenhower gave us the now ubiquitous phrase "military industrial complex" but it wasn't until he was on his way out the door as POTUS that he apparently felt free enough to tell the US public how phuqued everything was.

"Gee Mr. Peobody, I guess we'll have to use the Way Back Machine to solve this one!"

Posted by: vinnieoh | Apr 8 2020 22:06 utc | 90

Bernie could have gathered AOC, Jill Stein, Tulsi and a host of others to finally form a THIRD party, but chose just to remain in the same party.

Everyone wants something new, Trump is proof of that.

People are tired of the SAME dooshes doing and saying the SAME things.

The voters want a shake up.

So if Bernie coulda capitalized on that, he woulda done something special and different for America.

Oh well.

Let's go Unca Joe, do your worst.

Posted by: Fernando Martinez | Apr 8 2020 22:11 utc | 91

Sanders has never been a legitimate candidate. All the wishful thinking coming from otherwise sensibly cynical people on this site...

Voting / democracy are part of the trick...

Posted by: Tony | Apr 8 2020 22:26 utc | 92

I would bet heavily that more than a few of those who swear they will not vote for the Democratic candidate come November will have a change of heart as they contemplate another four years of President Donald Trump. The Dems are bad, and I despise most of them, but Trump’s malevolence is on another level altogether. The tiny shred of genuine American democracy that remains, Trump will surely destroy. Troops will be goose stepping in front of the White House before he is finished with his second term.

Posted by: Rob | Apr 8 2020 22:27 utc | 93

@Trailer Trash #59
You said:

"The People are hungry? Let them eat Dollars!"

Except Trump will have given each person $1200 - which is $1200 more than Obama ever did.

Posted by: c1ue | Apr 8 2020 22:42 utc | 94

So many surprises today.

Barack and Michelle Obama to come off sidelines after Bernie Sanders drops out

Posted by: Bemildred | Apr 8 2020 22:50 utc | 95

So Bernie picks the middle of the lockdown to announce what he was always going to announce.

This way it will be impossible for the few non-moronic amerikans still extant, to bail him up for fooling the dem electorate twice. By the time all the coronavirus noise has died down, Sanders will be old news.
He can slink of quietly to enjoy the proceeds of his raid on the hip pockets of the credulous - plus however much on top he screwed outta the DNC which won't be that much since his cowardly campaign had made eventual capitulation so obviously inevitable.

Still, he will be able to claim just like a loyal assistant executioner who has made sure the rope is the exact correct length, "Hey, I did my job, now you do yours".
Maybe that will loosen a coupla extra mill outta the notoriously tightfisted dem party backers (every dollar they give to the dems is a dollar they cannot run through corrupt trusts to reduce their tax burden whilst keeping extended family employed).

Bernie did do his job, he tricked young people who, upon realisation that the game was rigged were frantically casting about looking for a way forward that would be both personally rewarding (no more worries about Mom/Dad's medical bills eating up the difference between his/her hefty mortgage and the market value of the family home, so when the wrinkles finally kark it there could be some cash left) yet appear to be morally superior.

Younger people who are thus far free of the mind-numbing distraction of not only having to support themselves also having dependent mouths to feed, have the 'freedom' to concern themselves with how they appear to others esp viable sexual partners, so display of moral superiority - virtue if you will, weighs heavily on the minds of the moronic.
Bernie tricked 'em good, maybe not as deeply or passionately as he did last time, but that's a plus, because they won't be so reluctant to buy the new improved Bernie, the Biden, when Sanders tells them he is the one that is best in shop.

The only interesting part of all this is wondering who will be the more sympathetic distraction in 2024 - if the scam will still work then. Even if it doesn't, like ancient, past their best before date generals who know no other way, the DNC will still run with a dummy candidate, one with a seeming empathy surfeit so that by the time the masses realise the actual dem candidate is either a sock puppet like addled Biden, or a cold hard arsehole like W Clinton, it will be too late as they are already invested in the dem half of the imperial war party.

Tulsi is the obvious pick, she has done all the hard work of talking like a decent peace-loving person yet still cutting deals with arseholes like Pelosi without being sprung by too many of the faithful.
Surely she can be trusted not to push too hard and embarrass the real candidate - no more Kuciniches please. AOC? Too soon, they just don't know if she can be trusted to deny her ambition once the time comes ("that's the thing about the girls" think the DNC whitefellas - "they will break their word outta self interest - no honour") and Joe Crowley still has enough pull with 'the boys' for Ocasio-Cortez to get the nod.
So they will delay her with talk of 2028 and indeed it may be 2028 if Gabbard makes a cake of herself in 2024.

This game could run a verylong time given amerikan media's keen participation and the refusal of the masses to think for themselves. I blame the diet - too much crap food has addled the critical capacity of the amerikan population. That diet will continue too - as long as a corporate friendly political class retain control. The perfect sel-sustaining corrupt cycle.
Maybe in some distant time amerikans will wake the fuck up - probably not until Goths, Vandals & others of that ilk come a rapin' & a robbin' - seeking vengeance for the crimes committed upon their home nations.

Posted by: A User | Apr 8 2020 22:55 utc | 96

... Biden, for all his numerous faults, is much more likeable than HRC. The feeling apparently is that this, plus Trump = bad, means 2016 won't happen again.

Posted by: c1ue | Apr 8 2020 16:11 utc | 5

You’re a lying dog-faced pony soldier!!!

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Apr 8 2020 23:04 utc | 97

Considering how old both Biden and Trump are, and the ongoing pandemic, I'd say the winner will actually be the one who will stay alive until early November. Though there's no guarantee he'll live until inauguration day in late January 2021...

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 8 2020 23:11 utc | 98

Rob @ 95

As with Clinton in 2016, I'm not sure who scares me more making foreign policy. I would never
vote Trump, but will neither reward the Dems with my vote as they once again put forth the worst
possible candidate. Otherwise only guarantees awful now and awful future. The thought of a
confused man with cognitive dysfunction holding the nuclear button is pretty scary, with some
crazy general or Pompeo-like fool advising him it must be done.

Posted by: Kabobyak | Apr 8 2020 23:17 utc | 99

With 100,000 corona deaths possibly confirmed in August 2020 add it with an economic recession (or depression). Trump is toast. Finished for good..

Senile Joe Biden and warmonger Kamala Harris as his co-president will be the Obama era redux until 2024.

Posted by: Nick | Apr 8 2020 23:29 utc | 100

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