Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
January 26, 2020

The MoA Week In Review - Open Thread 2020-07

Last week's posts at Moon of Alabama:


Interview with Iran's Foreign Minister Javed Zarif:
"It’s a Disaster for Europe To Be So Subservient to the U.S" -Spiegel


The OPCW Scandal and the Silence Cartel (pdf) English translation by Michael Kobs of the German report below
Der OPCW-Skandal und das Scheigekartell - Multipolar Magazine

Other issues:

Hong Kong:

"Protesters"? Or U.S. funded terrorist ...
Hong Kong protesters torch planned virus quarantine building - Reuters

>A group of protesters set alight the lobby of a newly built residential building in Hong Kong on Sunday that authorities planned to use as a quarantine facility for the coronavirus outbreak.

A Reuters witness saw several masked protesters, clad in black, rush into the public housing block in the Fanling district near to the border with China, and set alight a Molotov cocktail before running out. Black smoke could be seen pouring out of the building to the sound of fire alarms. Windows were smashed.<


Only Zionists and Nazis believe that Jews are a race.
Israeli High Court Allows DNA Testing to Prove Judaism - Haaretz

>Petition filed by Avigdor Lieberman, Yisrael Beitenu and several individuals asking for the DNA testing to prove Judaism to be disallowed is struck down<


The U.S. no longer cares for international law. Others continue to do.
The US’s Inalienable Right to Violence - Fair
The Troubling Decline of International Law - Craig Murray
EU, China, 15 Others Form Alliance to Settle Trade Disputes - Bloomberg

Use as open thread ...

Posted by b on January 26, 2020 at 15:34 UTC | Permalink

« previous page | next page »

That is, unless this coronavirus reveals to be some kind of smallpox-like plague which can ravage 33%-50%+ the entire Chinese population - which doesn't seem to be the case (there are already cases of people healing after some weeks without any medicine).
Posted by: vk | Jan 27 2020 11:46 utc | 99

Yes their incubation period is of longer type. That made room for autoimmune system to work on it and heal naturally as long as the symptoms are under control.

Posted by: Lucci | Jan 27 2020 12:06 utc | 101

the .com domain of Farsnews has been blocked since January 25th. The site can be accessed here: But it will no longer appear in google searches. Farsnews can be read in 5 languages.

Posted by: psychedelicatessen | Jan 27 2020 10:13 utc | 94

I don't know what hasbara propaganda is. What I wrote was just my own thoughts about the word Zionism. Which has become a curse word, I understand. But I read in a lot of comments here where there is a deep aversion towards Zionism, which I not always like to read, because I think it is unjust and not well thought through. So I took the opportunity of this open thread to present my view, as a counterbalance so to speak. Which many of the commenters here don't like to read, I know. Besides, I am not Jewish myself. I guess. Even if I was, I don't care. I don't even want to know. I think and feel on a simple level. On a simple level where all women and men are sisters and brothers. There are no 'special' people or 'more equal' people. Or 'chosen' people.

I just can't see any advantage in hate. If you put the blame for many evils to the Zionists, when you say they want the entire world, then you are in a state of hate. I refuse to be in such a state. This is my choice. Call me a simpleton, a dreamer, that's alright. I try to find another approach. First step is to understand, to 'know the enemy', as they say. Second step is to feel like the enemy. Third step is to love the enemy.

This is extremely difficult. Probably the most gruelling task in the world. But it can be done, with patience, endurance, and a strong will. And compassion of course. We will fail again and again, but the important thing is to try.

When you put your sword away you lose your defence. But what you gain is grand. You will encounter miracles that you never thought possible. But I know that this is not alien to you. You certainly have encountered such experiences yourself already.

So who's the enemy? I say there is none. There are only people that are ignorant, without knowledge, without wisdom. That's all. As well as I am ignorant, without knowledge, and without wisdom. Who am I to judge others?

Posted by: Phil | Jan 27 2020 12:08 utc | 102

J Swift | Jan 27 2020 11:44 utc | 98 (flying)

Last time I rode an airplane I sat in the front left seat and it was a DC-3, a "Dakota" - 30 years ago... (non-formal instruction, the other guy knew what he was doing...and He shut down the starboard engine on approach, sob!. Several years later my "instructor" died in that airplane...John Lennon glasses and all. Passengers? It belonged to a jump club - and they had jumped. Only the goofy pilot died, and ruined an bitchen airplane. He was clowning around I think, and made one error too many.

One ad read "take a chance", another "good to the last drop".

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 12:42 utc | 103

A passenger jet just crashed near Kabul, Afghanistan.

I doubt anyone here is even remotely surprised by this point to learn it was a Boeing 737.

Posted by: JW | Jan 27 2020 12:44 utc | 104

A User @91: Nice rant. Well, I'm 2nd gen on one side (my Dad was from Glasgow) and waaay back on the other, Welsh-Irish as near as I can tell, and I can tell you I gave up on it about twenty years back. I think it was the slavery, we never really cleaned it out here. But up to Bush the Lesser, I thought the political system was capable of reform, etc. I'm in my 70s now with no unfinished business, so I'm not stressing, just waiting for all to implode. I've worked hard to get my health back so I can watch it all, as I can tell you I remember what we once had here and it pisses me off.

But I think they are cowards, I know Trump is, so I think they might not.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 12:59 utc | 105

@ Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 12:59 utc | 104 > I went back and re-read 91. Yeah. What you said.

Except I think cowards are more liable to do stupid stuff, as they are ruled by fear and panic...and stupid stuff can go off catastrophically, especially in a highly metastatic and vastly complex system...and especially when the rulers themselves are in chaos, and especially when they are ignorant. But I absolutely agree, they're cowards.

(as to genealogy, since prior to 1640, DAR pins an' all)


But about that good man Jeffery... this claim may be true, I can't say, but it has . ah . implications, eh? Pay-off comes after a suitable interval, (drum roll) It's vaudeville. And the show goes on.

" The warden in charge when Jeffrey Epstein died in his jail cell is getting a cushy new supervisor’s job at ‘Club Fed’ despite Attorney General Bill Barr’s demand that he be reassigned to a desk job.

Lamine N’Diaye is being reassigned to a leadership role at FCI Fort Dix, a low-security prison in Burlington County, New Jersey, two people familiar with the matter said.

The move comes months after Barr ordered N’Diaye be reassigned to a desk post at the Bureau of Prisons’ regional office in Pennsylvania after Epstein´s death as the FBI and the Justice Department´s inspector general investigated. "

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 13:13 utc | 106

Walter @105: Yep, there is a lot of stupid involved, but it's all on our side from what I can tell.

"Keep Hope Alive" -- Jesse Jackson. Obama kind of borrowed that.

Our bosses rely way too much on cheating and lying.

More Pompeo:

Pompeo Crumbles Under Pressure

He must be in quite a tizzy now.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 13:28 utc | 107

Helmer on CN/Freeland 'Russian Asset' Smear

The Truth & The Irony: Consortium News And The Continuing Tale of Chrystia Freeland's Grandfather And His And Her Nazi Scheme For Ukraine Today

"...The point isn't that Freeland is culpable in her grandfather's sins. Her sin is hiding them, and her reason for doing so. She agrees with Chomiak on turning Ukraine into the Greater Galicia it was Adolf Hitler's objective to achieve between 1939 to 1945: that's to say, cleanse the territory of Jews, Poles and Russians by killing them all. Chomiak succeeded with the first two; he was then employed by the US Army on the third. Freeland is keeping the plan in the family; they now have the Canadian government behind them..."

Posted by: John Gilberts | Jan 27 2020 13:35 utc | 108

It may not be a passenger jet there in Afghanistan:

U.S. Air Force E-11A aircraft crashed in south-west Afghanistan

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 13:45 utc | 109

Looks like the Taliban just shot down a us air force cargo plane

Posted by: Kadath | Jan 27 2020 13:47 utc | 110

re Bolton striking back at Trump:

What did Trump expect when he brought Bolton in?

Reminds me of that old fable The Frog and the Scorpion. If Trump (frog) wonders "Why did you sting me?" scorpion replies "Sorry, it's just my nature".

Posted by: Kabobyak | Jan 27 2020 14:03 utc | 111

Interesting post by Crooke today:

Phil@101: The problem with zionism is that it is a philosophy of hatred-a virulent form of racism. And, like most such racisms, it originates in the notion that it is impossible for non-Jews to treat Jews fairly and equally. Add to this the 'revised' zionist ideas of the fascist Jabotinsky to the effect that Arabs can only hate and seek to destroy Jews and therefore must be destroyed themselves, and you have a form of racism more virulent than any other.
Given these features of zionism it is unsurprising that the Nazis held it in high esteem: they agreed that Jews were different from others and that they should mover out of Europe into a country 'of their own."
Any doubt that, as the famous UN General Assembly put it, Zionism is racism should be erased by contemplating Zionism in action in Palestine where the system of apartheid exceeds anything previously achieved in the Jim Crow south or the old Republic of South Africa.
So don't tell us that you support Zionism because you are incapable of hatred-zionism is based upon hatred of 'inferior' races, and-racists are never rational- religions.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 27 2020 14:12 utc | 112

more about suppression of other media:

“My accounts on Facebook and Instagram were both disabled today in total disregard for the freedom of speech,” Marandi, an Iran affairs expert regularly appearing on a wide range of world media, told FNA Saturday evening.

Asked if his posts covered any illegal or violent contents, he said both social medial outlets had suspended his pages after he released photos of ailing IRGC General Ali Fazli when he was under chemotherapy at a Tehran hospital.

Posted by: Phil | Jan 27 2020 14:13 utc | 113

There was a guy in the news. He was divorced and had a visit by his two daughters for the weekend. Its now Monday morning and he was in a tizzy to get the girls to school and himself to work. He told them to go out to the garage and get in the car while he searched for the keys. Finding them he pushed the button to start the car and looked for his briefcase and jacket.

Finding them he headed for the garage. He got into the car and looked over the vizor for the garage door opener remote. Pushing the button with no response he is thinking what a time to have to replace batteries. He gets out of the car and runs around to the house door for the door opener button by the door. It will not work either. He rushes back to the drivers door steps up on the rocker panel to reach for the little rope and wooden handle to switch from automatic to manual. That’s where they found him with the two daughters in the car.

Looking out the ISIS space station window the earth and a very thin layer of atmosphere can be clearly seen. When you are stuck in traffic it is a good time to theorize how many cars, trucks, planes, and trains running does it take and how long before …..?

Posted by: diveshopingoa | Jan 27 2020 14:32 utc | 114

Iran to open Marble Palace to tourists after 40 years

A century-old palace known for its pure Iranian architecture is set to open to the public after more than 40 years of closure.

A group of journalists were allowed to The Marble Palace in downtown Tehran on Sunday with a reinstated owner of the facility saying it will become a museum to attract tourists in two weeks time.

The palace, built on an order in 1934 by Reza Shah, the first of the two Pahlavi kings that ruled Iran until the Islamic revolution of 1979, has been scene to major historic events, including Reza Shah’s abdication of power after the occupation of Iran by Allied during the Second World War.

Posted by: Phil | Jan 27 2020 14:34 utc | 115

the few scientists that dispute the consensus about global warming, including attributing all of it to human activies, are all shills, including pat michaels. don't know what the poster above was referring to about incomplete studies used by both sides, but i take it the poster agrees with the consensus--it follows from the well known theories he mentions.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 27 2020 14:35 utc | 116

bevin | Jan 27 2020 14:12 utc | 111 "zion-ism"

If you knew more... (an Iranian cat said that to me in 1977, and I've been ashamed ever since). But ain't it always that way?

It may be that people, rather than describing zionism, either rightly or wrongly, would benefit by looking into the real-politic of the genesis of the "movement" of "zion-ism". How it got traction, and why.

Not an expert, but my understanding is that as the telegraph and British intelligence meddling in affair by proxy, nascent zionist idea began among more or less secular Jews in Eastern Europe. This was not going anywhere fast, but it was something which provided British sub-rosa curation...and a few buckies to the right man now and then...a matter of using Jews as stooges against the Arabs, to divide and rule, by Britain. This continues to-day, but of course the project, the stooges, have grown themselves into a very Jewish story, the story of the Golem. MI-6 and their cohort conjured up the Golem, and nobody know the magic word to put him to sleep. Now the Golem is itself attacking Semitic Peoples...thus the rational view is that zionism is anti-semitic, and what we see now may be understood as a racial civil war based on religious myth. I am quite sure many Reform Rabbies would tend to agree, and that they are troubled about this very un-Jewish project that's got quite out of hand and beyond control.

UNZ has an article up that has this quote>

"“The murder of American President John F. Kennedy brought to an abrupt end the massive pressure being applied by the US administration on the government of Israel to discontinue the nuclear program. Cohen demonstrates at length the pressures applied by Kennedy on Ben-Gurion. […] The book implied that, had Kennedy remained alive, it is doubtful whether Israel would today have a nuclear option.”

Title> "Fifteen Years Before Kennedy, Zionists Murdered Forrestal"

(I figure Mossad knew that Johnson knew, because of the Mob in the US being one with Mossad, and that they blackamiled Johnson over the Liberty matter, the attempted and actualized murders of numerous Americans.)

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 14:48 utc | 118

Someone mentioned the Magnier interview. It is worthwhile repeating the link for the information contained therein:

Magnier is completely fluent in English, and more articulate than most Americans. A search of wikipedia shows no entry for him. I wonder if his entry has been removed or banned.

Posted by: Bart Hansen | Jan 27 2020 14:51 utc | 119

RIP kobe

Posted by: Bob | Jan 27 2020 15:05 utc | 120

The Aviationist’s article on E-11, a U.S. military “Battlefield Airborne Communications Node” aircraft that has crashed/was shot down over Afghanistan.

Technical issues? Iran’s revenge?

Posted by: S | Jan 27 2020 15:08 utc | 121

So it appears it was not a passenger aircraft that crashed over Afghanistan earlier today. Looks like a US Air Force jet with speculation that it was a surveillance aircraft.

Could this be an example of Iran asymmetric tactics against the US in the region as revenge for the assignation earlier this month?

Anyone have more info on this?

Posted by: Mehdi | Jan 27 2020 15:12 utc | 122

Apolgies if already posted.

The FISA court has taken steps to correct the Carter Page abuses. But more reform is needed.

Interesting. BY the editorial board of the Bezo's news. Whole editorial worth a read.

Trying to let the public down gently before the Durham Report is released?

Only one comment so far:

If the Page case illustrates anything, it is the fact that no U.S. citizen, of any political party, is immune to unwarranted surveillance by a misguided or overzealous FBI. Reform, therefore, should be a bipartisan cause."

"Misguided or overzealous FBI." No. These fraudulent FISA warrants were the result of a coordinated and systematic effort to overthrow our duly elected President by Comey, Brennan and Clapper. They and the Obama White House politicized our intelligence and security services with very predictable results. They must be held accountable for what they did. That is where reforms begin. Reforms must go beyond the FISA court system.

Ironically, stopping political partisanship in Federal investigations was one of the reasons the modern FBI was created almost a hundred years ago. It is critical that it and the other intelligence and security services never be used again for partisan political purposes.

Posted by: erichwwk | Jan 27 2020 15:18 utc | 124

The E-11A is a military variant of the E-11. Both are made by Northrop Grumman. The E-11A is used as a battlefield airborne communications node.

Posted by: lysias | Jan 27 2020 15:28 utc | 125

Magnier is completely fluent in English, and more articulate than most Americans. A search of wikipedia shows no entry for him. I wonder if his entry has been removed or banned.

Posted by: Bart Hansen | Jan 27 2020 14:51 utc | 118

Magnier is an interesting author, but he theorizes a bit too much, and once a theory is logically smooth, it strays from reality. For example, human actors do not follow their interests as theoretically determined.
Phil@101: The problem with zionism is that it is a philosophy of hatred-a virulent form of racism. And, like most such racisms, it originates in the notion that it is impossible for non-Jews to treat Jews fairly and equally.

Hm. Reconstructing the meaning of an ideology requires a bit of observation. When X says that he is the best friend of women, and Y says that too, and so does Z, it is possible that they actually fight with each other. X would like to keep women at home, and modestly covered etc. when they go out -- because it is the best of them, Y wants to admit "male shaped trans people" to female private places which makes Z froth at her feminist mouth etc. (it is only last week that I learned about the problem, apparently, quite acute in Scotland. So there is a lot of twisting of meanings. An ideology typically creates terms of its own that can be translated only imperfectly into the notions of outsiders. Precise explanations of those terms lead to considerable infighting.

Back to 19th century, Zionists lived in the landscape of nationalisms, and upon inspecting the status of Jews, as Jews, they found it awful. A lot of criticism of their "race" was actually accurate. Back in Jewish golden years, Jews were farmers and warriors rather than craftsmen like tailors or dominating retail trade. All around people were glorifying the spiritual values of village life and military pursuits, and Jews could either assimilate or be left out of the action.

The solution was to create a new type of Jew, close to land, with military virtues, combining the features of early Iron Age with modern science and technology. Land would be Palestine, language a new Hebrew combining ancient and modern features etc. As American transplants to Israel report, there they can more Jewish then anywhere. In Israel, they are elevated (Aliya) as opposed to un-elevated cousins in Galut.

This model posits that Jews in Galut are ever threatened by anti-Semitism so they have to bide their time raising loud protestations and in Israel they nobly fight existential threats. This way spiritual value of Jews in Israel is ever increasing, and those in Galut can participate vicariously.

Like for many other nationalisms, say, American, other nations are merely an arena for their achievements. Like a ballpark for baseball players.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jan 27 2020 15:32 utc | 126

@lysias #124: E-11A is a Bombardier Global 6000 business jet fitted with military communication equipment (wiki, photos).

Posted by: S | Jan 27 2020 15:43 utc | 127

Phil @101 clutches his pearls because of push-back over his see-no-evil, speak-no-evil approach to Zionism.

It's encouraging to see that no one is buying Phil's baloney.

bevin @111 talks about Zionism as Racism, and Walter @117's "Zionism is antisemitism" underscores the racism while highlighting the media-driven hypocrisy.

However, in my comment @57 I tried to make the case that Zionism has morphed from a political movement for a Jewish Homeland into a new form of colonialism. That colonialism is a joint project of Christian and Jewish "elites" that use Zionism as a mask.

This more toxic form of Zionism (aka "Zionazi") has corrupted Western Democracies because the secretive and ruthless adherents of this supremacist ideology have circumvented democratic processes.

"Democracy Works!" propagandists try very hard to distract from this state of affairs.

But we can not restore democracy via rigged elections offered by these "elite" scumbags. Only by recognizing what has happened and forming and joining MOVEMENTS will be be able to restore accountability and secure a real peace.


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jan 27 2020 16:19 utc | 128

@ben #36
I've never said humans have no impact on the planet.
What I've posted concerns one specific area: CO2 emissions.
And even then, the data concerns what CO2 emissions are supposed to have according to multiple different sources including
1) the IPCC
2) the climate models
3) the overall research
Simplistically saying humans fuck up the planet is pointless - unless you advocate exterminating humans.
The point about examining the basis for policy decisions is to ensure that decisions are made based on defensible, realistic information as opposed to ideology.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 16:20 utc | 129

@karlof1 #42
So you assert that crab weight and local oceanic productivity reduction is a function of climate change.
The problem is that none of these impacts are consistent with the IPCC science. The IPCC does not project short term, major changes in weather. They clearly state that there is no attributable increase in floods, droughts, hurricanes, tornadoes or any other weather related catastrophe imaginable.
Even sea level rise is in the order of 3 millimeters per year - with no acceleration seen in the record to date.
But let's look at your "proof" of climate change.
Dungeness crabs are a West Coast thing, so we're only talking about the Alaska to Santa Barbara coastline.
Crab weight is a function of many things - including fishing. Have you looked to see if dungeness crab fishing limits were changed recently?
Here's a graph of Puget Sound dungeness crab harvests over the past 20 years: Puget Sound Dungeness Crab historical harvest
First, note the cyclical nature of the harvest.
Second, note that since 2016, the cycle was broken. Very high commercial harvesting levels for 4 years running - unlike the previous 15 years.
If this pattern replicated in California, it seems very likely that the reason Dungeness crab weight is down is because too many people are catching them and selling them (and eating them).
Here's another graph showing all Puget Sound crab fishing - it is a hockey stick upwards: All crab harvest in Puget Sound, historical
Now let's look at the birds.
Yes, there was a murre die-off from 2014-2016 - the credible research says it is due to a blob of warm water. The problem is, the blob is - by definition - exceptional. Is it proof of climate change? Highly unlikely, although unscrupulous researchers will attempt to "find" attribution.

More importantly, however, murre die-offs are not unusual.
Here are 2 examples in the same region, but earlier:
annual Murre dieoffs in Oregon from 1978 to 1997
Murre dieoff in Monterey, California in 2007

Lastly, the fact that you resort to ad hominem is once again proof that the mud slinger is acting on emotion as opposed to information.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 16:41 utc | 130

Most people think this is a bad thing. No. Already far too many people.

That is the problem. All other 'problems' are little more than symptoms of that basic fact... too many fucking people.

It's actually happening, welcome to the Malthusian Chaos. I'll give it another five years or so.

Posted by: Ant. | Jan 27 2020 16:47 utc | 131

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jan 27 2020 15:32 utc | 125

many thanks for your explanations, Piotr. Although I must admit that I didn't understand much what you wrote. I appreciate your effort, maybe later I will be able to understand.

My understanding of Zionism is simply the recreation of a nation. I see that it has elements of racism. For example, there is an Israeli website that openly advises Jews to marry Jews. To keep the bloodline intact, so to speak. Such actions, or websites, are unthinkable in Europe and in other parts of the world. It is a clear racist expression.

I still try to understand the background behind all this.

The problem with zionism is that it is a philosophy of hatred-a virulent form of racism

While this might be true in current times, I simply reject that idea. I try to feel the hatred that originates from this source. Hatred is wrong. It does not conform to the Kabbalah, it does not conform to any philosophy. Therefore it has no meaning. What does not conform to the truth has no existence.

Like for many other nationalisms, say, American, other nations are merely an arena for their achievements. Like a ballpark for baseball players.

You put me into the edge. What I can say is that nationalism can be good and can be bad. It's a bit difficult to explain, but somehow I feel that I don't have to do this. A nation state is very important for a people. A nation state, the notion of it, can be abused. There is a movement among the Jewish culture that find the nation of Israel a wrong idea.

Does that make sense? Probably not. It's too difficult.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jan 27 2020 16:19 utc | 128

This more toxic form of Zionism (aka "Zionazi") has corrupted Western Democracies because the secretive and ruthless adherents of this supremacist ideology have circumvented democratic processes.

indeed there are signs of what you say. But isn't it also an abuse of the term 'Zion'? I would like to adhere to the original meaning of Zion. But it may be too late. The word has already been spoiled.

Posted by: Phil | Jan 27 2020 16:50 utc | 132

A scenario given the latest Bolden revelations:

Bolden is called to give testimony.

He recants.

Impeachment implodes.

Trump wins big in November.

Bolden's swiss bank account gets bigger.

Oligarchs of the globe rejoice.

Posted by: ben | Jan 27 2020 16:52 utc | 133

@JasonT #49
Well said.
I believe in being environmentally conscious.
I believe that we should find better ways to obtain energy.
I believe humans are affecting the Earth, but it is increasingly unclear if CO2 emissions are the primary expression of this - as compared to say land use or the co-option of the ecosystem for human food vs. "nature food".

I don't believe in allowing myself to be manipulated by present-day alt-energy speculators or by activism masquerading as science, or stampeded by those who don't put some effort into testing outrageous claims due to ideological leanings.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 16:53 utc | 134

c1ue @ 129 said;"@ben #36
"I've never said humans have no impact on the planet."


Posted by: ben | Jan 27 2020 16:56 utc | 135

@Patroklos #52
So you don't believe fuel loads matter? If so, that's against every credible fire management policy I've ever seen.
Note I'm not talking about preventing homes from burning - I'm talking about keeping the amount of burnable matter low through proactive burns. It isn't clear from what you wrote that you are distinguishing between these 2 things.

Secondly, as far as I can tell, the really bad burns weren't occurring in farms or ex-farms - it was occurring in the "national park" regions.
I am also interested to see how you position the fact that the largest historical burn was in 1974 - buttressed by that noted right wing rag - the Guardian Guardian source article
So while I agree that the conditions this year were unprecedented in terms of dryness and temperature - it is far less clear that fuel load wasn't a factor, or that climate change "caused" this as opposed to made a bad situation worse.
The reason I was interested in the historical record of proactive burns is that the 1974 fire (and other earlier ones with fatalities) prompted major changes in land management policies, and I am interested to see how these policies were followed over time.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:01 utc | 136

@111 bevin

Zionism isn't only about rascism or Apartheid Israel. Zionism is also about control; domestic and foreign. It has serious fascist elements therefore is not democratic, and EXPORTS that kind of flawed democracy to western governments through its over-bearing influence think tank and lobby networks. The fascist element eliminates all resistance to Zionism. In the UK Ziofascists destroyed Corbyn's campaign with a daily online and media repetitive fear-mongering narrative and they will do the same to Sanders because Sanders does not promote the fascist goals of Zionism. That's why I refer to the Trump cabal as an example of Ziofascism at work, because Trump & co. have imposed unilateral illegal policy regarding Israel that serves Zionist expansion and hobbles and censors all resistance.

Posted by: Circe | Jan 27 2020 17:08 utc | 137

@Extra #59
Thank you for the links. The first link noted:

Warmer, drier conditions with higher fire danger are preventing agencies from conducting as much hazard reduction burning – it is often either too wet, or too dry and windy to burn safely.

Or in other words, fuel load management wasn't being conducted but due to other reasons.
I would still be interested to understand the historical record on burns - because the above could still be a function of bureaucracy and/or activism due to lawfare.
The second link is pure nonsense - it doesn't address anything except long term trends which are not a major factor, even according to the IPCC.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:09 utc | 138

@OneofaFewJasons #63
The flu season is winter. Clearly for the flu virus families, they like it colder.
Equally, weather related disasters are fewer and less damaging than before; sea level rise migration would be more credible if New York City and other large cities weren't expanding by building land via fill. Pandemics - also extremely unclear - between modern medicine and vaccines, plagues just aren't what they used to be.
But kudos for identifying the real driver behind the more radical environmentalists: the desire to see a lot of people die.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:14 utc | 139

@ThisHereJason #68
I don't disagree with what you write - yet the proof is in the pudding.
If hurricane genesis is indeed as well understood as you wrote - then why can't predictions be better? They're crap.
Secondly, the Maue/Pielke data presented above - I don't see you disputing it. Specifically that there are no trends in hurricane formation, landfall, strength, etc
As for fossil fuel money - I keep hearing that, yet the numbers I've seen quoted are underwhelming. Supposedly the evil fossil fuel lobbies spend hundreds of millions of dollars a year lobbying against climate change somehow.
Besides that these numbers are extremely weak - they lump all PR spend by the fossil fuel companies regardless of messaging - the numbers themselves are not impressive compared to the budgets of the big "green" NGOs.
WWF, NRDC, EDF and Greenpeace together comprise more than the entire fossil fuel industry spend, for example.
Then there's the NOAA: would you consider the NOAA a neutral party in the climate change equation? I certainly don't, given the many instances of policy statements made as opposed to data emission.
The NOAA 2020 budget is 4.46 billion dollars. It alone is more than 10x what the evil fossil fuel companies spend. Sure, it isn't all climate change, but sauce for the goose and gander, as it were.
You shouldn't be surprised that I utterly ignore your attempt to play the "bad faith money" card.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:22 utc | 140

@ spudski 27; jayc 39

It's Guaido's last ride.
Not many have noticed Guaido's demotion. He went from interim president to "Leader" of one faction of a splintered opposition.

So what to do? he set himself up a parallel parliament. Poor guy is being managed by the clueless in D.C.
Just imagine; the opposition is in such disarray, so the clueless in D.C. slapped sanctions on the opposition to the Maduro government!
In a month of Sundays, Go figure. LINK

Posted by: Likklemore | Jan 27 2020 17:32 utc | 141

Many people here have been asking this question: what is GDP and how's it measured?

The value in GDP

Posted by: vk | Jan 27 2020 17:43 utc | 142

@snake #77
Re: funding for universities.
The amount "government" funds universities depends on your definition.
There are about 5.2 million university students; 4 year state college cost is about $42K. This implies a total university budget of at least $220B, more likely $260B or more.
Outstanding student loans are $1.6 trillion, but monthly issuance is about $6B-$7B ($6.6B in April 2019). Is this a subsidy from the government to the universities or to the students?
States are still paying to state universities to some extent, but less than ever before.
Federal has Pell Grants, but Pell Grants total about $30B.

Tech companies: no. Tech companies do not get the majority, or even a large part of their income from the federal government. Many started with help from the US government, but the $250K grant to Brin & Page when they were at Stanford is not the same as a majority of Google's $136B in revenue.

You then repeat the flawed economic understanding with education. Education is like sewers, electricity, national defense etc - it is done because it is better to have it done than not. K-12 education is *not* funded by the federal government, it is funded by local property taxes - which is the people living around the schools.

Roads aren't funded by the federal government, they're funded by the gasoline tax.

Note I'm not saying all government spend is funded by taxes - the TARP bailout was straight out money printing.

All in all, your arguments are not convincing. Under your criteria, the real problem are mothers. Mothers give birth to all the children. All the children grow up to do everything. Therefore it is all a plot by mothers to rule the world. /sarc

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:44 utc | 143

I would like to adhere to the original meaning of Zion. But it may be too late. The word has already been spoiled.

Posted by: Phil | Jan 27 2020 16:50 utc | 132

The meaning of Zion was corrupted from the moment religion, ideology and power merged into one.

From then on, fascism creeping into the meaning of ZION was a certain, predictable conclusion. One could almost say destined if destiny weren't the product of accumulated action. Maybe, it's more like KARMA, because fascism always ends badly. I would say though that the karmic will lead to what evolution dictates so in a way it was all destined to happen this way for a better end.

Zionists therefore do wrong to force through fascist control what evolution must transform. Evolution is the unstoppable energy of human metamorphosis, and Zionist fascism is a dam meant to protect Zionism from that energy. How foolish is it to believe that dam (CONTROL) isn't already in the first stages of cracking open and releasing the massive energy being held back? IT'S INSANE.

Posted by: Circe | Jan 27 2020 17:48 utc | 144

@Dr. George W Oprisko #80
Meh. Ocean acidification is a marketing term created by Ken Caldeira in 2003 to promote his own work.
The ocean isn't acid. It has never been acid. And it never will be acid.
In theory, CO2 levels should decrease the base level of the ocean - but the problem is that the ocean isn't a static system. A simple example: the annual plant growth cycle changes atmospheric CO2 levels by an enormous degree every year. The ocean is the same way: more CO2 will be acted upon. In particular, the pH levels in sea water vary dramatically literally at the kilometer level and at levels far above whatever global CO2 level impact has.

Secondly, the corals that exist today formed when CO2 levels were far higher than now. Ditto molluscs. It is far from clear to me why organisms originating in high CO2 level eras are suddenly unable to handle slightly higher CO2 levels today.

Sea acidification is complete bullshit.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:50 utc | 145

if you support the oil company propaganda, you support warmongering. the military machine runs on oil, and is driven by oil company interests--see the middle east, venezuela, over and over. now biology is a vast plot, too, i guess, and all other branches of science involved in the study of ocean acidification.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 27 2020 18:06 utc | 146

@ c1ue | Jan 27 2020 17:50 utc | 145

Once again, I strongly recommend you stick to electrical engineering!
Acidification is about the abundance of alkaline earth elements in sea water, first and foremost about Ca++ levels.

Educate yourself on the law of mass action, solubility, solubility product and the solubility constants of respective reactants. Jeez.

Posted by: Hmpf | Jan 27 2020 18:07 utc | 147

oh, and the guardian is a right wing rag, nowdays.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 27 2020 18:10 utc | 148

@ ThisHereJason

"I work for NOAA and amongst my peers it is frustrating how incomplete scientific studies get used by both sides to support their view."

Yes Indeed because;
“At the heart of this nonsense is the failure to distinguish weather from climate”

Global Warming for the Two Cultures
a lecture by
Richard S. Lindzen, [Retired] Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology until his retirement in 2013. He is the author of over 200 papers on meteorology and climatology and is a member of the US National Academy of Sciences and of the Academic Advisory Council of GWPF.

and I am curious:
- how is it that NOAA trips up on its daily forecasting. Leads me to conclude a 50 year model should be binned.

- given you work at NOAA, is there any truth to the question: Weather Warfare - Who Owns the Weather? Whatever Happened to the UN Treaty that banned weather warfare?

Oh wait. Treaties are for the other people.

Posted by: Likklemore | Jan 27 2020 18:18 utc | 149

Today is Holocaust Hypocrisy Remembrance Day. It's 75 years since the liberation of Auschwitz concentration camp. DW News has been broadcasting detailed personal accounts of Human Suffering in Auschwitz, delivered by Jewish Holocaust Survivors.

What happened to Jews in Europe 75 years ago is shameful and sad. But it's hypocritical for Jews to claim the moral high ground by regularly 'reminding' us about their "Never Again" Holocaust whilst their kith and kin have been perpetrating similarly heartless crimes in Palestine for 75 years.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 27 2020 18:37 utc | 150

c1ue @139

I was unaware that flu viruses “like it colder.” I’d always thought that airborne viral transmission was easier in the cold season because more people stay indoors, thus reducing the average space between them.

Learn something new every day, I guess.

Posted by: corvo | Jan 27 2020 18:38 utc | 151

Deepest ethical guffaw of the day came from this:

Guess Who Was In Charge Of Reviewing Bolton's Leaked Book At The NSC?

The identical twin brother of Democratic impeachment witness Alexander Vindman, Yevgeny Vindman, is reportedly in charge of reviewing all publications by current and former officials at the National Security Council (NSC), according to Breitbart News, which would include the recently leaked manuscript of former National Security adviser John Bolton.
Breitbart notes that the Vindman brothers have offices across from each other at the NSC, and that the Wall Street Journal describes Vindman as "an NSC lawyer handling ethics issues." Alexander Vindman, meanwhile, has said that his brother was the "lead ethics official" at the agency.

Posted by: librul | Jan 27 2020 18:59 utc | 152

@Hmpf #147
The definition of acidification is the process of making or becoming acid.
The ocean is not becoming acid or making acid - it is becoming less base.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 19:13 utc | 153

It was good to see how many eagerly outed themselves by trying to refute my Climate Crisis comment, while the other permanent trolls here again proved that's what they are. Last year I wrote a comment providing the scientific evidence for Climate Change that's totally irrefutable and based on its chemical and physical qualities--Ocean Acidification and the lessening of the temperature gradients between poles and equator that ultimately drives the jet stream: neither of which would be occurring absent the massive amounts of carbon pollution over the last century.

So, thanks again for alerting us to ignore whatever you write.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 27 2020 19:15 utc | 154

@corvo #151
The reason I put forward that fact is that temperature is not a primary factor in pandemics.
Or has anyone not noticed that the coronavirus thing we're seeing now is during the dead of winter?

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 19:15 utc | 155

Hoarsew @ 150 said;"What happened to Jews in Europe 75 years ago is shameful and sad. But it's hypocritical for Jews to claim the moral high ground by regularly 'reminding' us about their "Never Again" Holocaust whilst their kith and kin have been perpetrating similarly heartless crimes in Palestine for 75 years."

Yep, but, most U$A'ens don't hear a whisper about the massive hypocrisy, because there's a
virtual blackout on the MSM where Israel's treatment of the Palestinians is concerned.

Posted by: ben | Jan 27 2020 19:28 utc | 156

Meanwhile...he squeeze toward the show-down (Texas predicted) in April..."NATO’s Upcoming Exercise Is Targeted Against Kaliningrad
Will Europe Be Willing to Go to War Against Russia?" (can they chose?)

Maybe he's right. After all, the power is slipping away, things are unstable, and time is short. And they always double because the ideology cannot be wrong, can it?

@ Duran.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 20:24 utc | 157

“The troubling decline of International Law” by Craig Murray is fine in a way — at least he mentions Gaza. Who makes the rules and who ignores them with impunity is not exposed or tackled broadly / in detail. Yes .... a short blog post.

Thierry Meyssan points out that Iran is drifting in that direction as well, which is something I hadn’t thought about at all.

Iran’s drift towards US and Israeli behaviour

Posted by: Noirette | Jan 27 2020 20:24 utc | 158


Atlantic Council resident senior fellow Karim Mezran argues that the US must bomb General Hatfar's Libyan National Army to force him to come to the "negotiation table".

The UN installed "Government of National Accord" (GNA) is a perfect example of the negotiation table hoax. Western imperialist invite warring parties to a "negotiation table". The "international community" then dictates an "agreement" that sounds good and everyone is forced to sign.

A new "government" is formed. Only the best and most competent people are chosen to this new government. The criteria for competence is long service in English-speaking international organizations or Western banks and oil companies. In reality this government of technocrats and bureaucrats is a puppet government serving Western interests.

When all this is done, the "International community" recognizes the new puppet government. Foreign funds and seats in international organizations are handed over to these puppets.

Haftar closes in on Tripoli: Where is the international community? - Atlantic Council, December 17, 2019

If Western powers truly want to bring Haftar to the negotiating table, they must engage in a serious way in the conflict, perhaps “sending military forces to declare a no-fly zone to force the militias that support Haftar to come to the table, or even to threaten a military action against Haftar himself,” which will force a real negotiation from the general, Mezran argued. “If the GNA is supported and given more weapons and soldiers, than that will stabilize the situation on the ground [and] might force the foreign powers who support Haftar to think twice.”

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Jan 27 2020 20:27 utc | 159

c1ue @155

“Exactly”? Your sloppiness oif expression disqualifies you from serious discussion.

Posted by: corvo | Jan 27 2020 20:47 utc | 160


If the oceans are “becoming less base” the it necessarily follows that they’re becoming more ________. Especially for creatures that survive at a certain pH level that’s above 7.

Thank you for playing. We have lovely parting gifts.

Posted by: corvo | Jan 27 2020 20:54 utc | 161

Ngram Viewer for “acidification” has links to its usage in various eras at the bottom of the page. In early usage (1784–1858) it meant a process of converting to acid. In modern usage (1999–2008) it predominantly means a process of becoming acidic (more acidic). gives both senses of the word.

Posted by: S | Jan 27 2020 21:14 utc | 162

Role of carbonic acid in ocean chemistry

The oceans of the world have absorbed almost half of the CO2 emitted by humans from the burning of fossil fuels.[9] It has been estimated that the extra dissolved carbon dioxide has caused the ocean's average surface pH to shift by about −0.1 unit from pre-industrial levels. This is known as ocean acidification, even though the ocean remains basic.[10]

Carbonic Acid(Wikipedia)

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 21:14 utc | 163

Noirette | Jan 27 2020 20:24 utc | 158

The voltaire article expresses but one view of International Law. There are several ways to understand the basis. Merely "custom" is one. TM posits yet another "...the Law has been based on a simple idea: just as individuals - including political leaders - agree to protect themselves from civil war by submitting to national law, so states can protect themselves from war by voluntarily submitting to international law." The Law of Contracts is another. I posted previously the title to another foundation> the law of contracts. This, I think, is sounder.

see (you'll have to search for it)

Professor Ali Khan
Washburn University School of Law

Contracts are entered into voluntarily, yes, but they have penalties for non-performance...hanging, sometimes. And a "contract" made under duress is not a contract...

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 21:19 utc | 164

James @ 61:

Sorry for late reply. Public holiday yesterday in Australia. I was out at Dangar Island (about 50 km north of Sydney) for the day with a friend.

Thanks for the link to the CNN article on Olena Malakhova.

You may have also seen the tweets by the journalist Babak Taghvaee who has been investigating flights of Ukrainian cargo planes carrying illegal arms and equipment from Turkey to Libya in recent years. He has been able to confirm that Malakhova was on the flight and that she had been in Tehran on business to discuss and negotiate a proposal for one of her companies, SkyAviaTrans, to provide VIP and ambulance jets for Pouya Air, an Iranian cargo airline.

Posted by: Jen | Jan 27 2020 21:37 utc | 165

Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 21:14 utc | 163 (pH sea waters)

There is not very much mixing between abyssal sea and surface waters, so the CO2 distribution is heterogeneous, and thus the pH is non-uniform. Of course where ever there's a river or a spring under the sea things get more complicated.

Organic chemist @ Cornell David Collum (see zerohedge) in his end-year several hundred page post opined what he's decided that the climate change is real, and that people are probably responsible for at least a lot of it...Dave was not convinced previously. Very conservative and cautious guy.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 21:44 utc | 166

Walter @166: I think that's about right. I think climate change has always been real, always been going on, and in the circumstances, it's dumb for us to be forcing it for a bit of cash. Yeah, it's the surface effects, that's where most critters live, but I understand the deep mixing is speeding up, we are dicking around with the oceanic currents too. A change in the Gulf Stream or Arctic currents could have all kinds of interesting consequences. Northwest Passage coming soon. Russia seems to be working on their version too.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 22:02 utc | 167

Elijah J Magnier in tweet says>

Replying to

Exclusive: #US commander of the #AinAlAssad airbase was killed in #Iran's missile attack.
He was in the operating room during the missile attack with other senior officers.We obtained the info from a trusted source inside the base, acc to our information he was killed instantly.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 22:19 utc | 168

Walter @166--

Also, in regions receiving very heavy rainfall which also has carbonic acid within in elevations would be higher as it is along the Pacific Northwest Coast from roughly Oregon to Alaska. Scallop and oyster farmers are having great difficulties because acidification inhibits shell thickness in larvae just as with crabs. Other aspects of the marine ecosystem are also being negatively affected. The relentless march of a massive army of purple sea urchins is decimating the bull kelp forests aided by the lack of sea otters, which eat the urchins, whose populations have yet to recover in Oregon and Washington after being decimated for their fur, even though the furriers have long vanished. And a recent grey whale die-off was also attributed to lack of food. And of course there's the longstanding problem of salmon preservation.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 27 2020 22:21 utc | 169

"Chicken Soup for the MBA Soul", or "Barons of Crap" - book review of Billion Dollar Brand Club by the Baffler

He was unemployed after getting laid off from a dead-end marketing job at Sports Illustrated Kids, until he met a friend’s dad at a party in Beverly Hills. This dad owned a warehouse full of unsold products, including a cache of cheap disposable razors. Would Dubin be interested in selling this inventory of blades?

He would. Dubin decided to film a commercial for his new business idea, Dollar Shave Club, in the warehouse, featuring himself, a dancing person in a bear costume, and a loveable employee named Alejandra. The concept was a low-cost, direct-to-consumer subscription shave products service.

So it seems the "new" economy is nothing more than the 1% in action...

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 22:36 utc | 170

I recall also that the S otters experienced a plague that is carried by domestic kitties. I may be mistaken though. Kittyshit in the creek ran down to the Big Sur...I think.

The S otters are fun to swim with...scuba many years ago.

And river otters! Like juvenile delinquents. They'll trash a boat. And poop all over your stuff. A political critter.

Who now recalls the thesis proposed by old Ted, Ted Kaczynski ... and his "Industrial Society and Its Future" ?

see the pdf.

http://editions-hache[dot] com [right stroke] essais/pdf/kaczynski2[dot]pdf

His methods were not right, how could they be? but his thesis seems to be fair. It's been a long time since I read it, so I am not sure.

I can say that industry does not run without plenty of carbon getting oxidized...coal is more or less the sine qua non of steel making, and steel is basic. Similarly the petro... I have loaded ships with the carbon from California refineries...goes to Korea to make steel ('cause petcoke is too dirty to burn, but ok ?? to burn there!) Go figure.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 27 2020 22:45 utc | 171

@corvo #159 & #160
Is the outcome acid?
Is acid being created?
Sorry, but you keep trying to maintain the false meme.
The ocean isn't acid, isn't going to become acid, and it becoming less base due to CO2 is irrelevant because pH levels vary by an order of magnitude more by location than by the theoretical CO2 impact.

Since you purport to be a science guy, perhaps you can review what a pH level mean in terms of concentration. In particular, the part where it is logarithmic. Are CO2 levels increasing at a logarithmic level? Is CO2 absorption into the ocean increasing at a logarithmic level?
The answer is: No.
What is the difference between pH 7.1 and 7.2 - in terms of actual numbers of free Hydrogen - which is what pH stands for?
It isn't 1.39% (7.1 vs. 7.2)
It is 0.708% (log 7.1 vs. log 7.2)
That's why Caldeira was so clever terming "acidification" - it implies a much greater delta than actually exists.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 22:48 utc | 172

@karlof1 #169
carbonic acid sounds so scary - except for the little problem that the absolute level of CO2 is extremely low: 385-400 parts per million
I would definitely be curious as to why carbonic acid is a problem at 385-400 parts per million, the level today, vs. the 350 parts per million in 1990.

The clams and oysters are really so delicate? Easy way to test: breathe on them. Human exhalation is about 38000 parts per million CO2 - it should be easy to watch the clams and oyster shells visibly being etched away due to the 100 times more CO2 (and accompanying "carbonic acid").

If this doesn't happen, then all this talk of "carbonic acid" is bullshit.

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 22:54 utc | 173

More fun with startups:
apparently, if your restaurant doesn't do takeout or delivery, some of the startups will just take your restaurant's name and delivery food anyway.
KinKhao tweetstorm

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 22:58 utc | 174

This sub thread is getting a little bit too whacky even for me.

The clams and oysters are really so delicate? Easy way to test: breathe on them. Human exhalation is about 38000 parts per million CO2 - it should be easy to watch the clams and oyster shells visibly being etched away due to the 100 times more CO2 (and accompanying "carbonic acid").

I don't think anyone said the shellfish shells are forming, then being etched away by carbonic acid, rather the hypothesis is that even a slight increase in carbonic acid causes these species to not form thick enough shells in the first place.

Posted by: Lennard Brunswick | Jan 27 2020 23:00 utc | 175

c1ue - Acidification doesn't mean that the oceans are turning into acid. Literally nobody has made that assertion. It was just a convenient way to describe the theoretical/observed trends in pH levels. I really don't think there is any benefit to demonstrating how logarithms work to minimize the importance of just a few percentage points (or fractions of them) without much deeper knowledge of the subject matter and what, exactly, is being postulated (or observed). Being a scientist/engineer myself, I would never presume to attribute or detract significance from what looks like a very minor difference (in number or %) within a complex system that I do not fully understand. But again, I don't think that anyone is claiming the detrimental observed effects on the aquatic life in question is due to their bodies being submerged in "acid" - rather the slight acidification observed was the most prominent indicator of change that happens to accompany shellfish not generating thick enough shells.

but that's all from me.

Posted by: Lennard Brunswick | Jan 27 2020 23:07 utc | 176

Calcium carbonate is a chemical compound with the formula CaCO3. It is a common substance found in rocks as the minerals calcite and aragonite (most notably as limestone, which is a type of sedimentary rock consisting mainly of calcite) and is the main component of pearls and the shells of marine organisms, snails, and eggs. Calcium carbonate is the active ingredient in agricultural lime and is created when calcium ions in hard water react with carbonate ions to create limescale. It is medicinally used as a calcium supplement or as an antacid, but excessive consumption can be hazardous and cause poor digestion.

The problem is that Calcium carbonate precipitates out of the water, being then no longer available for the shellfish etc. There will be a balance between the carbonic acid in the water and the calcium. When the carbonate goes up, the calcium will go down. It's an equilibrium system, and we are disturbing it.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 27 2020 23:19 utc | 177

Bemildred @ 163, 167

Thanks for injecting some facts into the bizarre shouting match between c1ue and Hmpf. Its like they are a tag team. Hmpf says things that are completely unscientific, which allows c1ue to use him as a foil to take the climate denier POV.

Neither of those posters have the slightest awareness of non-linear effects and tipping points. Once you get past certain levels, positive feedback loops (non-linear behavior) sets in. For example melting permafrost releases methane (an even bigger greenhouse gas, but with a shorter half life). Another scary example are the methane clathrates on the ocean floor. If those deposits start to release en masse, its game over.

As for c1ue:

I would definitely be curious as to why carbonic acid is a problem at 385-400 parts per million, the level today, vs. the 350 parts per million in 1990

Because 350 was already ringing alarm bells in 1990. Based on the fossil record, that CO2 level will cause massive climate disruption. That's why there's an environmental organization called

As for

Posted by: john brewster | Jan 28 2020 1:27 utc | 178

That's Bemildred @ 177 (not 167).


Posted by: john brewster | Jan 28 2020 1:28 utc | 179

Oh, c1ue, the current CO2 concentration is 411.85 (, not the lowball "385-400" that you quote.

When the middle of your range (392) is almost 5% off the easily searchable true number, it looks like propaganda.

Posted by: john brewster | Jan 28 2020 1:32 utc | 180

@ 165 jen.. thanks... i imagine it is just a coincidence she was on the you see it differently?

Posted by: james | Jan 28 2020 1:53 utc | 181

climate change is not always going on. climate reaches an equilibrium, till something upsets that balance. that something is fossil fuels in the present case, google attribution studies. economists and political scientists like pielke jr have little competence in evaluating their own fields, much less other fields.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 2:10 utc | 182

Two days ago The Times has published this:

Ex-MI6 spy ‘fabricated dossier on Trump and prostitutes’

The dossier on Donald Trump compiled by the former MI6 spy Christopher Steele, which accused the US president of being compromised by Russia, was a work of “fabrication”, according to a devastating report by a leading British spy writer.

Nigel West has revealed he was hired by a US Republican law firm to assess the dossier in 2017 and concluded that large parts of it were faked.

What kind of blasphemy is that? I thought anyone doubting the veracity of Steele’s dossier was considered “Putin’s Kremlin maskirovka kompromat another-skary-Яussian-word useful idiot agent”, no?

Posted by: S | Jan 28 2020 2:34 utc | 183

err clue. HCL acid at 99% is harmless against dry substances such as your hand since there is no hydrogen to react to the acidic substance. breathing your co2 on a clam is silly since it is not in its aqueous form h2co3. though you have a point in that the delta is not as exaggerated as some may claim. i wonder how your body would be able to handle pH fluctuations should your blood level fluctuate.

try putting HCL at any strength on your hand even when its wet. i suppose it is only getting "less basic" and not acidification as you so propose.

Posted by: jason | Jan 28 2020 4:06 utc | 184

as i was saying the other day, all bad stuff in iraq will be blamed on iran.. read it here from the pomparses ass in today's daily usa propaganda briefing...

Secretary Pompeo’s Call with Iraqi Prime Minister Abd al-Mahdi

clearly syria, russia and iran are making headway in idlib as well.. from the same horses ass..

Attacks on the People of Idlib

ahh here - i will quote the article in full. it is not that long, but longer then pinnochios nose of course..

"The United States is monitoring with grave concern the situation in northwest Syria where the combined forces of Russia, the Iranian regime, Hizballah, and the Assad regime reportedly are conducting a large-scale assault upon the people of Idlib and western Aleppo provinces. These forces reportedly are conducting indiscriminate aerial bombardment and ground attacks that have trapped thousands of civilians under bombardment in Marat an-Numan, leaving them nowhere to flee. In other areas, tens of thousands are reportedly fleeing from their homes. The destabilizing actions of Russia, the Iranian regime, Hizballah, and the Assad regime are directly preventing the establishment of a ceasefire in northern Syria, as called for in UNSCR 2254, and the safe return of hundreds of thousands of displaced persons in northern Syria to their homes.

The United States condemns these unjustifiable attacks against the people of northwest Syria. We call for an immediate ceasefire and full access to the affected areas by humanitarian organizations to alleviate the suffering of the hundreds of thousands that have fled the incessant bombing. The United States is prepared to take the strongest diplomatic and economic actions against the Assad regime and any state or individual that aids its brutal agenda."

Posted by: james | Jan 28 2020 5:40 utc | 185

elijah j magniers latest from today.. i don't imagine pomparse or anyone at ned has read it..

The USA was the kingmaker in Iraq, but now its withdrawal is inevitable

Posted by: james | Jan 28 2020 5:52 utc | 186

Posted on January 27, 2020 by M. K. BHADRAKUMAR

Russia stood by Iran in showdown with US

Posted by: james | Jan 28 2020 6:07 utc | 187

james @185:

That State Dept message is ominous:

... grave concern ... indiscriminate aerial bombardment ... preventing the establishment of a ceasefire in northern Syria, as called for in UNSCR 2254 ...

Giving credence to this warning from SANA:

Terrorists Plan To Stage Chemical Attack In Northern Syria: SANA


Posted by: Jackrabbit | Jan 28 2020 6:14 utc | 188

Below is a link to a Juan Cole piece that at least asks some of the questions that I am asking about the quid pro quo confirmation from "Bomb! Bomb! Bomb! Iran" Bolton about Trump holding up Ukraine funding for Biden dirt.

A Pence Presidency and an Iran War? Why does John Bolton really want Trump Out?

No nukes used yet, thankfully and Iran seems to be continuing the push to drive empire out of the ME. This is a path that needs to be traversed and it is happening in front of our eyes and ears and lives.....the part of that slow motion train wreck that goes by quickly as we have discussed before.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 28 2020 7:36 utc | 189

James @ 181: I see Malakhova's death as you do, as an unfortunate coincidence. We will never know if she knew that her companies' planes were flying illegal arms and drone parts from Turkey or Ukraine to Libya.

Posted by: Jen | Jan 28 2020 9:54 utc | 190

"carbonic acid sounds so scary - except for the little problem that the absolute level of CO2 is extremely low: 385-400 parts per million"

Posted by: c1ue | Jan 27 2020 22:54 utc | 173

Ok, explain this to a judge after you have caused an accident and they have measured your blood alcohol.

"Oh, come on, it's just parts per million! Totally negligible..."


Posted by: Cemi | Jan 28 2020 10:32 utc | 191

pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 2:10 utc | 182 "always going on v equilibrium". I'm afraid you wrote a silly, friend.

Think about all the co2 that caused a meteor to hit 65 million years ago...Maybe it was flatus from dinosaurs? that attracted the space rock@

Now then, does anybody imagine that was part of equilibrium. I am, sorry, but equilibrium in a test tube is not the same as dynamic charge of time. Climate "equilibrium" consists of non-linear change over time, with surprises. In you can't even find equilibrium at the bottom of a mine.


I see @ reuters this morning that they say Iran has spoken to the exit from NPT

" Motion for Iran to quit nuclear proliferation treaty enters parliament

A motion for Iran to quit the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) was introduced in parliament on Tuesday, the assembly's news site ICANA reported, in a move that appears to raise the stakes in Tehran's confrontation with the West."

I've said before that Ethics is circumstantial, situational, very substantially. The NPT prohibits inter alia most of the US bomb program and "deployment" (transfer of weapons to 3rd parties). But it does not prohibit (in my reading) making all the parts or obviously knowing how "it" is to be done. Leaving NPT removes the prohibition on putting the bits together, erector set style. It's straight engineering and prototype work.

Iran is letting the cops know she's inclined to, maybe, "get a revolver". Thus, as Doctor Merkwurdigliebe said, creating fear and doubt in sane individuals opposed to Iran (are there any?)

Posted by: Walter | Jan 28 2020 11:45 utc | 192

About pH and stuff... people maybe would benefit from revisiting junior hight school level chemistry...accordingly snoop round sciencenotes[dot]org

The lady curating the site is kinna neat, and she puts up fun stuff for the kiddies. Also 'splains much of what people as abults busy with nontechnical lives either have forgotten or never knew.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 28 2020 11:52 utc | 193

james @185: What I notice about Pompeo's screed is he didn't make any threats.

Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 28 2020 12:09 utc | 194


Apologies for the sharp attitude. Certain 'schools-of-thought' here in Australia seem to trigger me somewhat.

I have been trying to find out exact figures about the fires and related issues, and there is so much chaff being spewed out by certain outlets here. The deep shame is it is these same outlets that have around 70% or more of the total media landscape under their control.
I am largely spent from trying in vain to share dissenting views to the MSM status quo to friends/colleagues/acquaintances, and being regarded as "a bit weird" for carrying such views becomes incrementally more tiring by the day.
Even had a guy recently defending the treatment of Julian Assange, as "They need to keep things secret to keep us safe, and he shouldn't have 'dobbed' on them." (or words to that exact effect). No getting through there.

ABC Fact Check did do a piece on prescribed burns about 6 days ago, and they highlight some variances in the data and reporting methods.

FriendlyJordies is an Australian satirist who runs a channel on You Tube (and does live tours), who sometimes comes out with some quite brilliant, funny, and well-informed takes on things. When he tackles something like the bushfires, he does provide quite a decent list of references (click on the 'more' icon below video, if not experienced with YT). The sources he provides are a good place to dig outward from.

Posted by: Jon_in_AU | Jan 28 2020 12:28 utc | 195

c1eu@34 - ctd

The CIA/Trilateral types are all about control. Control of the narrative, writing the script, preventing change to status quo.

They always fund contrarians to any non-conformist standpoint. These "experts-for-hire" will have expenses paid, websites established, speaking tours funded (including access to decision-makers), and often an astro-truf "institute" set up to further their agenda.

The only reason the bankers are not still aggressively opposed to action on climate change, is that they think that by bringing in a global carbon-trading system they will retain their ability to skim the cream off all forms of human activity.
I try to avoid arguments about CO2, as it is only one of the dozens of key elements of the extinction crisis we are in.

I do also read ZH, American Conservative, among others, just to gather a range of opinion about issues. In the case of Quadrant, I have found them to be largely faux-libertarian religiously conservative contrarians, who have railed against Indigenous rights, LGBT rights, environmental protections (or "green" policies of any sort), and anything else that conflicts with the "give all the money to the rich guys and we'll all get rich someday" mentality.

Posted by: Jon_in_AU | Jan 28 2020 12:46 utc | 196

you misunderstood walter. the meteor changed the climate. that was one of the earlier events that changed it. this does NOT mean the climate is always changing. when something causes it to change, like a meteor or massive fossil fuel emissions, that's when it changes. climate is not weather; weather is always changing, climate isn't. it eventually reaches a new state of equilibrium (the energy balance) after whatever triggering cause or causes, with considerable disruption in the meantime. then it is stable till the next event.

just remember
1.cataclysmic meteor caused it to change.
2.eventually it stabilized., fossil fuel emissions are causing it to change. hasn't stabilized yet: we are continuing on the same course of disrupting the climate.
5.even if we could magically switch over to renewables tomorrow, it would still take awhile to reach a new equilibrium, but that new climate won't be as favorable to us as the old.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 12:46 utc | 197

perhaps that will help.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 12:48 utc | 198

particularly, walter, the section on external climate forcings.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 12:50 utc | 199

pretzelattack | Jan 28 2020 12:50 utc | 199

I'm sorry, but the assumptions underlying equilibrium are not valid.

Earth exists in a open system. Climate results from outside as well are terrestrial mechanisms. The open system is chaotic. That's the point of the meteor...stuff happens, meantime we gas off H2 and other gasses and receive a constant rain of radiation, that's variable and non-regular.

But if you say differently, then it must be so. Peace.

As to "renewable" that's a fairytale. The system will crash. People may cause this, or not, (right now they are, but they might die). People or not, climate crashes.

Meantime, enjoy the fairytale.

Posted by: Walter | Jan 28 2020 13:11 utc | 200

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