Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 15, 2019

Notre Dame On Fire - Updated

Notre Dame, the 800 years old central cathedral of Paris, is on fire.


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Here are two short videos at the beginning of the fire 1 2. The second one shows scaffolding around the 90 meter high spire above the middle of the church.

The fire began at about 19:00 local time (17:00 utc , 1:00 PM blogtime).

Church roof fires are notorious for being uncontrollable. The whole roof is likely to come down into the church and burn whatever flammable it finds inside.

Let's hope that the beautiful windows survive.


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My sincere condolences to France over this huge loss.

(Update 1:30 PM)

This video was shot some 15 minutes after the pictures and videos above. Half of the roof is already burning.


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(end update)

(update 2:00 PM) Video of the spire falling down. (end update)

(update April 16, 5:00 AM)

The fire during the night. Firefighters prevented the fire from extending into the towers.


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Despite the large fire above and the immense load only two smaller parts of the vault came down. The fire extension within the church was limited.


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At least one of the beautiful windows (diameter 12.5 meters) survived.


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The large organ is also said to be intact.

For long years the French state which owns the cathredal and the church which leases it haggled about the costs to renovate the crumbling cathedral. Now donations of hundreds of millions are flowing in. This fire may - end the end - have done something for the church that other powers cold not do.

(end update)

Some joker on Wikipedia changed the "Functional Status" of the church to "On Fire".

(We probably can't blame the neocon Géraud Araud for this but how about Macron?)

Posted by b on April 15, 2019 at 01:28 PM | Permalink

Comments
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Posted by: Dennis18 | Apr 15, 2019 2:29:52 PM | 11

What is the chances the fire is blamed on the yellow vest?
-----------------

How did the Nazis blame the communists for setting fire to the Reichstag building in 1933? An interesting analogy ...

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 12:49:43 AM | 101

Posted by: AntiSpin | Apr 15, 2019 3:08:38 PM | 20

Once all this murderous nonsense has finally been worn down to its inevitable conclusion, all those Venezuelans who conspired to overthrow their government with the aid of a foreign military should be put on trial for treason, and disposed of appropriately.
---------------

The American Conservative: Trump’s Failing Venezuela Policy

<...>

It is fair to fault the opposition for wishful thinking, but it is the administration’s failure to take the assurances of the opposition at face value. When Guaido reportedly told Pence that half the military would quickly switch sides, the appropriate response was to assume that he was telling our government whatever they wanted to hear instead of telling them the truth. Unfortunately, the administration is full of ideologues and fools that want to believe anything that gives them a shot at bringing down a government they don’t like. The Trump administration thought they had a quick and easy foreign policy victory lined up for them, and months later they are discovering that they didn’t have the first clue what they are doing.

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 1:05:05 AM | 102

@104 peter au.. good point and nice to see you back..

Posted by: james | Apr 16, 2019 1:29:13 AM | 103

Aha ... can this be coincidence?

"Al-Aqsa mosque [in Jerusalem] catches fire as Notre-Dame cathedral burns"
https://www.alaraby.co.uk/english/news/2019/4/15/al-aqsa-mosque-catches-fire-as-notre-dame-ca

Posted by: Jen | Apr 16, 2019 1:31:05 AM | 104

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 15, 2019 7:46:37 PM | 78

Hey look, a fire!

.

<...>

.

Assange who?
-------------------

And this version has the right to exist ...

By the way about Assange:

The Indicter: My Friend Julian Assange – Alicia Castro, ex ambassador in London

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 1:32:16 AM | 105

Posted by: Jen | Apr 16, 2019 1:31:05 AM | 109

Aha ... can this be coincidence?

"Al-Aqsa mosque [in Jerusalem] catches fire as Notre-Dame cathedral burns"
-------------------

Mossad has indulgence from Uncle Sam on all his actions...

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 1:39:42 AM | 106

Gehennah, Jen, Ash

Thanks for the input.

That guy Virkernes seems like a real tool. Hes got a youtube channel here:

https://www.youtube.com/user/ThuleanPerspective

with 250k subscribers. Well, as far as prime suspects go, he takes the cake lol

Posted by: Dan | Apr 16, 2019 1:52:56 AM | 107

Britain's surveillance of the Russian submarines failed because of the sailors addicts:

The Daily Mail: Seven sailors are kicked off ‘hunter killer’ nuclear submarine after testing positive for cocaine on duty in 'major embarrassment for top brass' and one of the worst scandals to hit Royal Navy

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 2:02:50 AM | 108

Figures show 875 churches in France were vandalised last year

Catholic churches have been desecrated across France—and officials don’t know why
By Brendan Cole on 3/21/19 at 9:04 AM EDT

Thugs set fire to churches and smear poo on walls amid warnings France’s Christian heritage is under attack from ‘militant secularism’
By Jon Rogers -- 6th April 2019, 12:54 am Updated: 6th April 2019, 12:56 am

European Churches: Vandalized, Defecated On, and Torched "Every Day"
by Raymond Ibrahim -- April 14, 2019 at 5:00 am

Posted by: John Doe | Apr 16, 2019 2:37:42 AM | 109

Charlie Hebdo:

Incendie de Notre Dame : exceptionnellement Charlie Hebdo sort ce mardi, dès midi en version numérique et dans 50 kiosques parisiens.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D4QQqWRX4AA20xl.jpg

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 3:00:47 AM | 110

@Jen 77: Thanks, I'm well aware of the french black metal scene (and all others) just doesn't hold my interest. Monitored the rise of the first wave of BM bands (and the proto ones like Venom and Bathory) but my interests lie more with DM.

Your theory regarding the different churches closer to the banlieus sounds more plausible to me. Still I do not discount carelessness on the part of the builders.
We'll just have to wait for the fire department to conclude their investigation.

@Dan 112: Yeah he is a piece of work. Weird views but people still value him highly because of his accomplishments. (wether that is his music or his orthodoxy in his metalviews). Still he has a bunch of kids and a wife and spent a lot of years in jail. I don't see him throwing all that away.

All in all a great loss of history and architecture for France and the world but fortunately it can be rebuilt.

Posted by: Gehennah | Apr 16, 2019 3:46:04 AM | 111

Well, B will be a bit relieved. Since the upper area burned down but the core of the cathedral was protected by the stone vault, which mostly didn't collapse, most of the main rose windows survived:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D4QVtRuXkAEn6UH.jpg

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 4:23:22 AM | 112

Catholic churches have been desecrated across France—and officials don’t know why
By Brendan Cole on 3/21/19 at 9:04 AM EDT
Thugs set fire to churches and smear poo on walls amid warnings France’s Christian heritage is under attack from ‘militant secularism
By Jon Rogers -- 6th April 2019, 12:54 am Updated: 6th April 2019, 12:56 am
Posted by: John Doe | Apr 16, 2019 2:37:42 AM | 115

That would tend to imply that this might be a part of a campaign by the degenerate and * Soros crowd, designed to destroy and devalue culture - something which it has already been clearly established they are doing (see for example here and related articles).

Especially in combination with reports that the fire started simultaneously in two places, if confirmed.

The attacks by the US military proxy force ISIS on ancient cultural heritage such as Palmyra come immediately to mind, and appear to be a closely related aspect.

Culture, history, morality, religious spirituality and the integrity of society in all its aspects without exception are under deliberate and sustained attack from Sorosites, with as sole objective, better to control and manipulate the proles for the benefit of the 0.0001%.

Unfortunately on this site there are many ignorant fools ** who despise religion in all its aspects and fail to appreciate it's vital importance to society. Notwithstanding the sustained and longstanding subversion embedded in certain - but not all - major establishment religions - in most cases closely related to the corruption of the elite themselves and their desire to use subversion to control - the vital need for society to have religion and spirituality is absolute. It is precisely because of the lack of an authoritative moral compass that Western (Anglo-American controlled) society has degenerated to the extent it has today. Whilst a very small minority of highly intelligent and highly self-disciplined persons are able to combine atheism with high moral values and moral discernment, for ordinary people the absence of an authoritative moral compass has a devastating effect on moral values and the capability of moral discernment. (To those critics who would point to the inadequate moral compass and moral discernment in those idiot Z onist Christians such as Pence, Pompei, Bolton, Bush, Bliar etc I say YES, but much more so in combination with mass atheism which in MANIFOLD ways massively enhances and facilitates the destructiveness and amorality therein with positive feedback to the inadequacy of the moral compass and moral discernment of those same Christians). The moral compass provided by some establishment religions is inadequate for today's society, but still the total lack thereof is much worse still.

* We really lack an adequate word. I was about to say inhuman, but that is inadequate, and alternatives tend to have unintended connotations. "Distinguished by the absence of those qualities that define human beings" was the nearest I could find.

** I use the term ignorant specifically with respect to my proposition and not in general; and I use the term fools specifically to the action of denegrating religion in general, and not as a general characteristic of the persons concerned. We are all ignorant of specific concepts or issues and we are all fools in some of the things we do. My use of the term is intended to provoke, but with no intended attack on the person.

Posted by: BM | Apr 16, 2019 4:35:58 AM | 113

April 15 1912, Titanic sinks

Posted by: Red | Apr 16, 2019 5:06:25 AM | 114

most of the main rose windows survived:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D4QVtRuXkAEn6UH.jpg
Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 4:23:22 AM | 120

Wow! The "pompiers" did a wonderful job! They also must have had a strategy in place to prevent falling burning timbers from igniting fires in combustible materials at the bottom - see the un-charred timber objects in the photo. Contrary to one post suggesting they had no fire strategy in place, they must have quickly moved to prevent combusion at ground level, probably using specialist materials (foam sprays etc). The structural roof timbers would surely be much more difficult to protect. Whilst austerity and financial savings might have played a role w.r.t. sprinklers on the roof and related technology, practical difficulties of implementation and inherant damage to historical monuments very probably contributed to any absence. This sort of things would involve detailed monument-specific research and development, which would take years. In fact, the survival of the windows could easily be the result of complex and well-implemented fire damage limitation strategies, involving allowing the roof to be sacrificed but limiting further damage. It would be unreasonable to make any strong critical assertions without detailed knowledge of the roof structure and what fire strategies were implemented.

Posted by: BM | Apr 16, 2019 5:18:39 AM | 115

The war against Christianity and monotheism continues. 170 years into the war most of those being targetted are either oblivious or blaming the wrong people/groups. They refuse to believe in the satanic cult among the elite who are reengineering the world to enslave humanity so as to serve them and the lightbearer. As they blissfully embrace their CIA version of history and current events (Coincidence, Incompetence, Accidents) the conspiracy accelerates closer to final conquest.

Posted by: Pft | Apr 16, 2019 5:34:51 AM | 116

I'll go out of a limb here, so that's just my own hypothesis: The stone vault protected most of the ground floor, the inner core of the cathedral, and it took time for it to be breached in some places; by the time it happened and flaming debris came down, they had already poured a lot of water on the whole building and the floor itself was already flooded.
As for security systems and the like, historians, architects and conservationists are already up in arms across France, decrying the lack of financial resources for protection and restoration works, and the ridiculous security standards of said works. Hopefully, this catastrophe will lead to increased standards, better practices and higher financing.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 5:44:01 AM | 117

What a tragic loss for France, for Paris. But as Craig Murray pointed out, this was entirely preventable if the French government had spent more money on rebuilding Notre Dame over the last decades, and also invested in more robust fire department equipment. Instead, like USA, France puts all of its money into nuclear and conventional weapons–at the expense of other social, cultural and pro-human needs. France squandered its money on weapons of mass destruction instead of fire prevention and fire fighting equipment. It looks like the entire roof is gone, burnt through and through. Yes, it can be rebuilt–but it has lost the construction work to it that had been done 900 years ago. What a loss! :-(

Posted by: Deschutes | Apr 16, 2019 6:27:22 AM | 118

By the way about Assange:
The Indicter: My Friend Julian Assange – Alicia Castro, ex ambassador in London
Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 1:32:16 AM | 110

I highly recommend that link! It is a must-read for manifold reasons. The really personal touch to this piece speaks volumes not only about the true personality of Assange but also about the way modern intelligence-agency controlled media manipulate emotional responses in society, to solicit involuntary negative impressions in the viewer.

Please read that article with careful consideration of how mass news media is designed (by media psychologists and military psychologists, based on massive military-funded research) to pervert our emotional perceptions of reality. It is highly relevant to a proper understanding of all contemporary character assassinations by the elite: Assange, Corbyn, Putin, Chavez, Maduro, Assad, countries like Russia, Syria, Iran, Lebanon (Hezbolla), etc etc.

If we don't want our perceptions of reality to be involuntarily and unconsciously perverted by the War Powers, then we really should read that article.

In addition, we should promote that link far and wide to reach as many people as possible, because it can really make a difference to Julian. The more people strongly object to his extradition (whether directly or via Sweden) the more difficult it will be for the War Powers to inplement their strategy successfully.

Public protest on behalf of Julian is something the Elite are really terrified of, especially large protests, as it will have a multiplying factor. The bigger the protests, the bigger the factor multiplying the negative impacts on the elites and multiplying the damage to general public acceptance of mass media narratives. The more they try to limit the damage to themselves, the more they enhance the damage to the potency of the mass media.

And not only for Julian - protesting now is a perfect opportunity to permanently damage public acceptance of War Party mass media narratives, and thereby undermine their ability to control public opinion.

Consider for example the frequent criticisms on this blog of X, Y, or Z who made some comment criticising War Party policies, but undermined that criticism by reference to "brutal dictator Assad" or "the aggressive Russians" which precisely relates to the subtle emotional responses carefully engineered in us by military-psychology controlled mass media.

If you want to understand that phenomenon and prevent being yourself emotionally manipulated by the War Party, read that article.

Consider as further example that until a couple of years or so ago (I think about that long, maybe less) Craig Murray was regularly displaying an irrational rabid hatred of and aggressive racial discrimination towards the Russians, even while directly contradicting the rest of what he was saying at the time. Often I read an article about something I generally agree with by an author I generally respect, but then the author makes some snide remark and I think, well that's a really slimy and dishonest attack on whoever is the object of the remark (such as an insinuation that Julian is a really nasty person, in an article attacking his arrest). That is precisely the result of the subtle manipulation I am talking about (or rather, if the author is someone we know and trust, it may will be the result of such manipulation, but if not, there is also the possibility it is a contributory cause).

If we observe ourselves carefully, we can see this subtle manipulation in operation and can thereby avoid being manipulated.

Posted by: BM | Apr 16, 2019 6:28:30 AM | 119

I've just found here a link I wanted to include in my previous post, but couldn't remember where it was. I consider it an important article about understanding why Julian was arrested now, but just look at this slimy comment contained within:

"But I say, more important than whether he is guilty and odious as an individual ..."

Contrast that with the impression left by the link in my previous post, and that is a good example of the results of the psychological manipulation I warned of there.

Posted by: BM | Apr 16, 2019 7:08:58 AM | 120

quick marketing savvy could've projected a couple of four-legged holographic basilisks swimming through the sky around the flame-engulfed cathedral and sold the images to the game of thrones folks. the suits down at HBO would go apeshit. come to think of it, they could still do it.

Posted by: john | Apr 16, 2019 7:13:19 AM | 121

Cui Bono?

There are no accidents in Politics, according to Roosevelt. In recent months many arson attack and acts of other vandalism have taken place in France and in Europe - including in Ukraine...

This fire took very little time to spread, no? Experts say about 1/2 of fires are arson anyway...

The obvious deduction ad hoc is that GLADIO-X is in operation curated by the cryptonazi Welt-Reich, aka "deepstate".

Deduce also that blame and guilt are determined politically, not by forensic science. Maybe blame will stick onto "Putin's Yellow-Vested agents"? Of course the real responsible persons will meet for drinks on a golf course somewhere.

Posted by: Walter | Apr 16, 2019 7:20:31 AM | 122

With so much division within the French populace, an event such as this
might be used to "galvanize" the population.

Posted by: bob | Apr 16, 2019 7:44:46 AM | 123

"The Tower", in french "La Maison Dieu" (God's House).

Posted by: Renard | Apr 16, 2019 8:09:25 AM | 124

TV camera catches man in Notre Dame cathedral as fire rages

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 8:30:51 AM | 125

Interesting that around the same time, fire broke out at Al-Aqsa Mosque.

Posted by: morongobill | Apr 16, 2019 8:53:24 AM | 126


yes sir random accident zero sin bull here
move along goyim

b assured ashkanazim freak macron will rebuild with the help of his ex bosses and those friendly satanists at the bis bank swiss.
just like the quiet temple build going on under the dome of the rock nothing to worry about if you b slave class.
these things are random fluke.
macrons zion crew will sort subvert this correct and invert this issue out.
no plots The Plot Against Civilizationn
no Subversive Movements or World Communism here hare here
no Talmudic Noahide Law

no nesta webster talk
just cigarette worker butt flick mistake
on a random day nothing symbolick here
move along now

Posted by: winston | Apr 16, 2019 9:04:51 AM | 127

if fires where started
then by yahoo
who could of
if it was animal assad putin that mad duro fella friends of new hitler saddam hussein the dictator kim wong un average arab musselman or even the evil democracy haters of the yellow vest groups.

if any or all of these anti semite folks where involved they must be crushed.
israel the uk and usa and norway must be ready to fight for are new orders already

Posted by: myles | Apr 16, 2019 9:20:09 AM | 128

Timing: 2 hours before a scheduled TV speech by Macron where he was supposed to announce to new concessions to the yellow jackets (demonstrators on the rise last saturday)
Result: everything cancelled, his speech, the press conference of Wednesday where he was supposed to give further details on the announces of Monday, European campaign on hold (not that anybody, including the runners, was interested), and the French catholics parading on TV all day long plus a few hundreds calls for donation!
Could be inside job or an extreme-rightist who wanted to send a message (a famous alt-right guy actually committed suicide with a gun in ND during opening hours a couple of years ago). Macron has been using the place for his self promotion already twice (last night and this morning) but made sure that no picture of him visiting the ruins inside was made public.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 16, 2019 9:26:03 AM | 129

125
This might be a fireman (see the helmet) evacuating people at 18:20.
First call was made at 18:20 and dismissed after the people were evacuated, then second call around 18:40. The fire must have started hours before until it reached the stage it had at 18:40.The scaffolders had been finalized a few days before, and that included 2 elevators. French churches notoriously have very old electrical systems.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 16, 2019 9:32:26 AM | 130

Who is this man walking in the tower in time of fire? Strange. False flag? https://twitter.com/smoss319/status/1117963560636829696

Posted by: jirina | Apr 16, 2019 9:53:17 AM | 131

Sad, awful. I couldn’t watch the vids. To be optimistic … as b writes, perhaps it is for the best, surely now some rénovations sérieuses will be done.

I see some F comments on F blogs describing this conflagration as a symbol of France going down, imploding .. Gvmt. approaching the authoritarian criminal (yes), Yellow Vests, Macron an incredible horror, etc.

Not! just by the *Zombie Catholics* (not my expression, but E. Todd’s, it is not meant to be derogatory, merely ‘catholic origins who go to church at Xmas + Easter’, > ‘roots’ if one likes) but from all sides. The F of course love their monuments and are trained in ‘symbolic studies’ from a young age.

Posted by: Noirette | Apr 16, 2019 9:56:42 AM | 132

This man, walking in the Notre Dame tower is not a firefighter - they are in red or in black with the yellow strips.. This man has a yellow vest on and long white cloth, white cap and maybe long black beard.. Someone more info? Maybe false flag? https://twitter.com/smoss319/status/1117963560636829696

Posted by: jirina | Apr 16, 2019 10:07:34 AM | 133

130
French churches notoriously have very old electrical systems.

nice job mina real subtle
real good keep it up shylock sorry sherlock keep digging i think you are close to busting this case wide open.

it would seem to me that very few of you know what a natural fire looks like.
maybe the scaffold crew where off site then taken over by the bell pottinger crew white helmets or sum such.


a billion euros will be raised for charitable reconquest sorry recon struction call it a public private partnership.
bono and bob geldoff angelina jolly and gorge cloney not forgeting matt demon and johnny deep and brad pitts all raising for charity.


qui bonio

Au Revoir les Enfants

hello gladio
just
succumb. yield, submit, capitulate, relent already

Posted by: myles | Apr 16, 2019 10:11:07 AM | 134

Firemen were seen in the same place and ENEDIS (energy management and distribution) wearing these vests were also seen around They appear to be inspecting cables or laying a water line.

I would strongly recommend healthy scepticism in the heat of the event, or...

Posted by: Vasco da Gama | Apr 16, 2019 11:23:33 AM | 135

Jen @ 76. If arson is involved - and there have been many acts of vandalism and desecration recently in Catholic churches in France - the most likely explanation is that people in the country are angry and frustrated at the level of paedophile crimes carried out by Catholic priests …

Maybe. Or not.

Cemeteries, graves, tombs, are tagged and profanated, day by day in F, be they Catholic / Protestant / Jewish / whatever. (Many cemeteries are closed off because of it.) The Jewish ones are figured in the MSM, as a priority, I need not explain why.

In fact, the depradations and profanations are all-opportunity - anything goes. To me, it is similar to hundreds or thousands of cars being torched, year by year, in F, specially at New Years, and whenever some protest of the deplorables happens (it is covered up). The cars are not Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, etc. Yes... some may not like this comparison.

Cemetery vandalism in F has been going on for about 25 years (afaik. maybe before, but idk.) The perps are ‘goths’, ‘black block’ (though not in their pol. mandate?), ‘neo nazis’ (yes they exist, a minuscule minority) But overwhelmingly, overall, huge numbers of mostly young ‘pseud’ rebels who profess to hate God and older ppl — daredevils, who chase ghosts and - want to have sex in scary quiet spots - others who are attracted to various versions of arcane symbolisms, etc.

Basically, they ‘invade’ and desecrate small circumscribed identifiable areas that are close to them (no - little travel, cheap), that are quiet and not surveilled or policed, and might provoke outrage in the media, though correct reporting is absent. The Death Whooo*!* provides an ersatz thrill, a ‘daredevil’ atmoshpere. They are attacking ‘traditional society’ where they can.

It is also a ‘thing’ to do when you are drunk. The perps are too poor - excluded, to frequent nightclubs / snort cocaine / drive anywhere at all / afford postitutes / and even hope to get a ‘good job’…

one link in F that questions the nos.

https://www.lci.fr/societe/profanations-de-cimetieres-la-verite-sur-les-chiffres-1522743.html

Posted by: Noirette | Apr 16, 2019 11:26:10 AM | 136

Jirina 131
The guy wears a firefighter helmet. My take is that he's either checking the situation on the tower or actually putting down a hose line that will be used to pour water from above - something which was hard to do, the bulk of them being stuck on ground level when the fires were raging 30 m high or more, on the roof.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 11:32:51 AM | 137

Thank you, b, for your initial posts on this sad event as well as updates this morning that tell of less damage than anticipated. Very good news!

I spent a lot of yesterday trying to find a site dedicated to this historic church, just so I could see the interior - sadly the search was unsuccessful due to the proliferation of fire postings. I did get to the official Notre Dame site but would suggest to the builders of that site that it is almost un-navigatable. Part of that would be due to the attention being given causing an overload, but I could find very little.

I have never been to Paris, will never be able to afford to visit, so I would wish that part of the renovation funds pouring in be devoted to internet access. A little monastery I visit frequently online, with much less significance than this historic church, has better access. Also, it is unpardonable for search engines to clutter fire stories into a search when I did not want to be among the fire watchers at this critical time, but rather to use the search to gain more info on the interior beauties under threat.

One thing I did learn was that the spire is a recent addition. It certainly doesn't look as though it fits with the rest of the structure. A small suggestion would be to leave it out of the reconstruction plans, especially as it seemed to be the source of the conflagration.

I hope the bees were saved!

Posted by: juliania | Apr 16, 2019 11:50:19 AM | 138

Without having examined the videos or heard anything specific, my suspicion would be that winds were the problem - perhaps causing exposed electrical connections to tools in use or even metal parts of the scaffolding pinching on the extension cords - we saw how electrical wires became sources of fire in California due to extreme winds, and that spire, scaffodling and all, it seems to me, was asking for trouble.

So, rather than anything else, could it not be traceable to our main danger these days, that of extreme weather events?

Posted by: juliania | Apr 16, 2019 12:01:56 PM | 139

Thanks for your information, Hoarsewhisperer @93. That was a sensible decision for the builders to make back in the day, goes with my feeling that a spire is out of place, especially in our climate today. Santa Fe's cathedral, a much more modest building, has the same truncated tower construction. Those early builders were wise.

Posted by: juliania | Apr 16, 2019 12:09:27 PM | 140

BM @120

IMO Arkin's reporting is biased against Assange.

Arkin's anonymous source says the CIA had no interest in Wikileaks until AFTER US public opinion had turned against Wikileaks due to the publication of the DNC emails. IMO that is a doubly misleading. It wrongfully posits a change in public opinion, and it ignores the attempt to link Wikileaks to "Russia meddling" in the 2016 Presidential election.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 16, 2019 12:14:19 PM | 141

Thanks to comments at nakedcapitalism.com on Yves' posting on Notre Dame, here, I hope is a video that will give a brief encounter with the great cathedral:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQUOl8VnudA

I have previewed, and it seems to work. Enjoy!

Posted by: juliania | Apr 16, 2019 1:25:17 PM | 142

Any reason that these gothic cathedrals are not retrofitted with fire sprinklers? lighter weight materials than steel pipe are available

Posted by: carroll | Apr 16, 2019 1:49:51 PM | 143


Notre Dame Cathedral burned

at the same time...

Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem burned

and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull"

Jim Stone reported the Notre Dame Cathedral artistically shown as collapsing in I Pet Goat 2 and the (future?) ABSENCE of the cathedral mentioned in “Before Sunset | Notre Dame De Paris | Richard Linklater” [JS provided the link].

Jim continued, OUT TAKE: Muslims did not burn that Cathedral if the exact scenario it suffered was in I Pet Goat2, (including the spire collapse) and just like 911, movies referenced it’s destruction beforehand. Jim Stone has more, including his assessment of the burning with the Assange story

http://82.221.129.208/

Veterans Today (Gordon Duff, Robert Steele) have posted essays on who, how, and why.

the cat is out of the bag, the people know who did it, they also know who did 9 /11, the USS liberty and killed JFK and his family

Posted by: Joan | Apr 16, 2019 1:50:43 PM | 144

131: Forgot to mention about that video that you can see the water being sprayed all over the roof, in the background. Wouldn't make sense for the culprit to have remained there for so long. Besides, it's a tower, and they weren't hurt - they're mostly stone, not much to burn to begin with.
Not that I rule out foul play. Considering it's the Holy Week and possibly the most famous and iconic cathedral in the world, it shouldn't be ruled out on principle. But if there's any clue to be found, it must be elsewhere. And in case of foul play, there could be several kinds of culprits and I wouldn't rule out one group unless I've got good reasons and evidences another one did it.

As for the central spire, there was a gothic spire in the 13th century, but winds twisted it over the centuries and it was a liability that was torn down in the late 18th. Hugo lamented its loss, Viollet-Leduc put a new neo-gothic one in its place. As Hoarsewhisperer said, he also pondered adding spires on the towers, but some people noticed what happened to the lower central one and they eventually let them be as they were - I've no idea if the original builders back in the 1100s already planned to put spires on the towers.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 2:22:43 PM | 145

Huge publicity for the catholic church after a few movies and people have been denouncing sexual abuse in Lyon and elsewhere (plus this book that -eventually- got some coverage on the public radio), check for the last François Ozon movie too.
As of today, the catholic church has raised 600 million euros for renovation, while they were running on a 150 million euros budget that took them years to gather in order to renovate the spire... Qui bono?
Macron is in need of popularity just as the French catholic church is.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 16, 2019 2:40:24 PM | 146

Yippee, as predicted, they are now blaming the yellow vets, how handy! How dumb to they think the sheep are? Or are they right to think they're that dumb?

Posted by: Sober_Colm | Apr 16, 2019 2:41:05 PM | 147

How did the Nazis blame the communists for setting fire to the Reichstag building in 1933? An interesting analogy ...

Posted by: John Smith | Apr 16, 2019 12:49:43 AM | 101

Van der Lubbe did it, alone.
Eye-witness Sefton Delmer:
http://www.heretical.com/miscella/reichstg.html

Communist agitators Georgi Dimitrov (Communist International) and Wilhelm Münzenberg (head Agitprop) blamed the Nazis.
The Nazis couldn't believe Van der Lubbe acted alone.
http://www.historicalblindness.com/blogandpodcast//firebrand-in-the-reichstag

Posted by: Bert | Apr 16, 2019 3:28:58 PM | 148

Right on Jackrabbit @77 (at least so far as I can tell).

Frankly, from this clearly minority viewpoint - what does it really matter? By comparison, say, with the true, ongoing tragedy in Yemen (ah, wait, the US/UK/FR govts well involved with Saudia in that utterly immoral travesty), the travesty of justice with regard to Assange, the ongoing brutal, violent ethnic-cleansing of Palestinians from their rightful lands/homes, the chaos, death and destruction we in the west have visited on Libya, Iraq, Syria, the US drone slayings, the ND is just a heap of stone (and, yes, I've walked around it on its island in the Seine on several occasions in the past; but we didn't bother going inside, not my thing at any level).

The Beeb World Service spent 20 mins of a 30 minute news program this morning on this fire. Someone called it "tragic"? Tragic? Please. It has yet to mention to anything like a tenth of the time any of the above real tragedies (of our making). Didn't even spend that long on the Grenfell Tower fire which killed many people.

If this all makes me a troglodyte, so be it.

Posted by: AnneR | Apr 16, 2019 3:35:12 PM | 149

Pepe Escobar's laments on the fire, heaps scorn and ridicule on past several French governments after doing same to The West. Predicts it will be privatized as a tourist attraction.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 16, 2019 3:58:14 PM | 150

Now everyone's talking about "rebuilding" a knock-off. And that means killing - I wasn't surprised to read that France no longer has trees as big as the ones whose lumber was used in the original cathedral. That's a phenomenon throughout the industrialized West: Average and biggest trees are no longer as big as they were even a hundred years ago. But never fear: They can import such giant corpses by continuing to destroy what's left of the rain forest, the most sure way civilization is committing suicide.

https://abc57.com/news/no-french-trees-big-enough-to-rebuild-roof

Posted by: Russ | Apr 16, 2019 4:29:12 PM | 151

Anne @149. The catholic church claimed that you were a sinner, evren if you had done nothing wrong in your life, because an ancestor of you, by name of Eve, had eaten an apple which was not hers. Todays' left claims you are guilty, even if you have done nothing wrong, because others bombed or invaded.

Posted by: passerby | Apr 16, 2019 4:30:12 PM | 152

https://gigarama.ru/notredame/ with a litle zoom to notice the main damages.

Posted by: Paul | Apr 16, 2019 5:30:02 PM | 153

@151 Use aluminium. Recycle a few Boeings.

Posted by: dh | Apr 16, 2019 5:54:51 PM | 154

Now that this world heritage site appears to be largely safe, with the windows, organ, and carved wood panels all intact, it’s time for some levity.

Posted by: S | Apr 16, 2019 8:15:51 PM | 155

Russ @ 151:

Folks in African countries that used to be former French colonies should consider hiring more forest park rangers and buying binoculars.

Posted by: Jen | Apr 16, 2019 8:16:45 PM | 156

multi billion dollar rebuild the richest multi billion dollar satanists of the world all donating out doing each other.
roth schill ex banker macron saying it will be better and more beautiful than before.
in yahoos image?

the information purveyors are freaks who mock god jesus this is a hoot for them also a good way like the art world of moving money around.

how much did salman solomans son in saudi pay for that fake painting last year.

psy operations does not mean this did not burn but this was easter scripted.

the uk usa and tel aviv are helping france destroy itself in kaos comes the looting.


the relics that where pulled out weeks ago already in new homes abroad,3 d printed copies will make do insitu
the goy will never know.

qui bonio
bono
it is always so
the bankers of the vatican are macrons old bosses
who knew
100 million bell pottinger scaffold job may equal 2 billion silverstein type payday

this ticks many boxes works on so many frankfurt school levels.


timing is timing
qui qui bono
no importa

folks on here
put the blame on the wind
the wind

how many of us here where told at school
of churches destroyed by nukes fatman and littleboy churches in japan bomb epicentre.
why would the usa bomb churches
why would brits over germany

maybe the witches are here
running the shoa

cigarette butts and wind at easter
a random cruel end to chartre and western civilization


butt big profits incoming as the sfx crews leave the building

all news should be
qui
bono

Posted by: myles | Apr 16, 2019 8:36:22 PM | 157

@150 karlof1

The lament by Pepe Escobar is worth unpacking further. His anger is worth reading. So many national treasures of the wrong countries, destroyed by the forces of the west, to large media blackouts, and Notre Dame is destroyed by neoliberal austerity - cheapness and incompetent neglect, and fills the media as an icon of some kind.

Bamiyan, Babylon, Palmyra, Notre-Dame - Escobar opens with this:

The Bamiyan Buddhas were destroyed by an intolerant sect pretending to follow Islam. Buddhism all across Asia grieved. The West hardly paid attention.

The remaining ruins of Babylon, and the attached museum, were occupied, plundered and vandalized by a US Marine base during Shock and Awe in 2003. The West paid no attention.

Vast tracts of Palmyra – a legendary Silk Road oasis – were destroyed by another intolerant sect pretending to follow Islam with their backs covered by layers of Western “intelligence”. The West paid no attention.

Scores of Catholic and Orthodox churches in Syria were burnt to the ground by the same intolerant sect pretending to follow Islam with their backs sponsored and weaponized, among others, by the US, Britain and France. The West paid no attention whatsoever.

Posted by: Grieved | Apr 16, 2019 8:52:39 PM | 158

@158 more...

Adam Garrie takes a similar view, that this should be the shame of Macron, for happening on his watch.

Macron’s Eternal Shame - Garrie opens with this:

Last night should have been a time of humility for the deeply unpopular French President Emmanuel Macron. It was on his watch that his country’s most famous monument, the Notre Dame Cathedral burnt throughout the evening, causing damage that has been described as catastrophic. But rather than express supreme contrition for the fact that the French government had refused to provide adequate funds for the maintenance and repair of the cathedral, once much of Notre Dame was destroyed, Macron started asking the world for money.

I have little sympathy for the grief of those who loved Notre Dame if they have no feeling for the other treasures - and people - of the world destroyed by people like Macron, This is pure neoliberal, plunder capitalism, failing to protect wealth that could not easily be monetized - Escobar reported that for every 4 Euros the French government made in charges to visit the cathedral, it put 2 Euros back into its operating fund.

The French people should be enraged at this disgusting, cheap and heartless regime. It was the humanity of France that burned yesterday.


Posted by: Grieved | Apr 16, 2019 8:58:16 PM | 159

@ Grieved with the contextualization of the ND fire

Thank you for that.

I am less impressed with the edifices that humanity makes trying to be gods (entice people to have faith in you) when what the Cosmos provides all around us is truly awe inspiring.

It truly is reflective of the introversion of the Western "culture" that like their monotheistic religions, all but the true people and the true things must be destroyed/assimilated.

The West is dying of its own hypocrisy.....and I wish it would hurry up....

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 16, 2019 9:23:21 PM | 160

Grieved @158&159--

Don't know if you've seen The Pirates of the Caribbean film On Stranger Tides released in 2011, but it also destroys an Altar deemed Pagan to normalize such happenings. The destruction of cultural artifacts from West Asia seems as if the important findings of Hudson and his team had to be minimized in some manner. (Don't know if you read my comment comparing the news provided by Assange with that being told by Hudson being roughly equivalent and threatening to the same power base--The Money Power.) Pepe lived in France and in some manner probably adopted the Cathedral as I think he does to many important cultural icons regardless of who constructed them. We'll need to see if his recently rising emotions within his writing continues.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 16, 2019 9:33:13 PM | 161

Al-Aqsa Mosque burns the same time as Notre Dame Cathedral


bad electrics everywhere
plus strong winds and flying
cigarettes
timings the time
important time

one great structure 1000 years old the
other 800 hundred

who wants a world wide revolution
year zero
based on arrested devlopment.


the great fire of london made a nice space for the empire of the city of london

this new pope is in with the coming together of faiths
chartre will bring in the new
multi faith globalist beacon for the worldwide children of cern.
shiva in corner moloch owl in other

both flaming at the same time
what are the chances


zero reports of any roths chilled eyes wide shut palaces burning at the same or any time.

random fires not funny but sure are flukey

Posted by: myles | Apr 16, 2019 9:58:36 PM | 162

Macron's hubris has no limits. He delivered a 6 mn speech yesterday where he said the cathedral will be rebuilt within five years, i.e. to be ready for the Olympics in Paris in 2024
Not a word for the poor who have been expecting for weeks his speech which he promessed would be offering a brand new deal to the demonstrators of the last 4 months. Instead he said that the rich had started contributing to the reconstruction and that everybody should participate "each staying in his rank" !!
The guy is mad. As the ambitious parvenu he is, he feels difficulties assuming that his rank is merely that of a salesman working for the millionnaires who've put him where he is.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 17, 2019 3:38:13 AM | 163

Somebody is keeping very quiet about this, but apparently the Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem caught fire at the same time.
https://gulfnews.com/world/mena/al-aqsa-mosque-catches-fire-same-time-as-notre-dame-cathedral-1.1555395418351

Posted by: Steve | Apr 17, 2019 4:22:08 AM | 164

List of monuments damaged by conflict in the Middle East during the 21st century

http://thesaker.is/list-of-monuments-damaged-by-conflict-in-the-middle-east-during-the-21st-century/

Posted by: Rolf | Apr 17, 2019 4:49:27 AM | 165

myles says:

why would the usa bomb churches

just to remind the weary that the Omnipotent resides not in heaven, but in northern Virginia, and works in decidedly martial ways.

...

they even tried to destroy Leonardo's Last Supper back in 1943, but i made it up there last January and can attest, it's splendid!

Posted by: john | Apr 17, 2019 6:43:15 AM | 166


The New French mourn the loss of a cultural icon

https://irishsavant.blogspot.com/2019/04/the-new-french-mournethe-loss-of.html

Posted by: anon | Apr 17, 2019 7:58:04 AM | 167

Posted by: Grieved | Apr 16, 2019 8:52:39 PM | 158
(Pepe on Notre Dame)

Jolly decent of Pepe to avoid mentioning France's butchering exploits in Vietnam in the 50s - outsmarted by a bunch of pagan Commies to whom they eventually surrendered. Then Uncle Sam's Deer Hunters blundered in to show the French how to be thoroughly humiliated.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 17, 2019 8:36:31 AM | 168

the man on the bbc said soon brit specialist will be assist ting the frenchie no doubt polluting the evidence well.

the bbc also stated repair cost could be 1-3 billion euros
pledges of 700 million already in before the bono,bob geld off concerts.
city states from all over the world will be sending macrons old boss bankers donations tributes.
multi faith safe space for all maybe they will keep it open air.


where did the gold of ukrainia go
the gold of iraqi and libya
the precious items from destroyed museum of the syriana

who flew out the relics from chartre 2 weeks befor the sfx shock and awe event

qui bone o bono

Posted by: myles | Apr 17, 2019 8:54:52 AM | 169

@"b" @27

I'm sorry, but nowhere can I find any reference to the windows - the famous rose windows, at least - being lost. Please be careful what you post under b's name.

Posted by: Gene Poole | Apr 17, 2019 9:13:23 AM | 170

Now I have heard that yes, we will rebuild the spire, and it will reflect the challenges France now faces. Right. Oh boy, read into that, here it comes.

Posted by: Gravatomic | Apr 17, 2019 9:48:50 AM | 171

They just don't bother anymore, the level of double black psy-ops and gaslighting is a mine feild of disinformation. That's what you get when Washington - Obama, gives the green light to propagandizing their people. It's escalated, like we haven't noticed, under Trump despite his pathtic attempts at assuring folks it's fake news.

Posted by: Gravatomic | Apr 17, 2019 10:06:53 AM | 172

hi

I m french and I like this blog.
Just to say that I stop my radio the evening of the fire around 7pm and it was to be a special evening on public radio and otgher media for macron (our random président) who was about to tell us how he ll deal with social reform due to pressure from yellow vest and the country on fire. especially he should tell us what would become of the grand debate that was forced on him.
next morning I wake up with... still special edition on radio for the cathedral has been on fire. macron was "great" during the evening as he posponed all what he should annouce and went to see the fire. we had ministers and mayor of paris who were very very sad and... all social debate is to be... someday.

during all the report I learned that notre dame never had a fire (wood was original), there was no electricity on the roof, fire happened with no workers on site so far, and I m realy not the kind to believe a cigaret would put that roof on fire in april (meaning after the wet season).

also billionaires alredy "gave" (we ll see how much they ll get back from tax deduction) almost a billion (with free advertising from evry media)

let see what the inquiry will find but with my kind of mind, i don t know but I expect a big "don t know don t say but first don t be suspicious"

Posted by: schmuumf | Apr 17, 2019 10:41:26 AM | 173

...
I've no idea if the original builders back in the 1100s already planned to put spires on the towers.
Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 16, 2019 2:22:43 PM | 145

It's a hazy recollection of a couple of books I browsed in the early 1960s. One of the books was by a N Pevsner, and the other was a sing;e volume on (old) European Architecture. One of them focused on Cathedrals and the misfortunes which many experienced during construction. It was (almost) unusual for a cathedral not to suffer at least one catastrophic collapse during construction, especially when they were minimising the % of stone in the walls and maximising the % of glass.
Considering that we still, nearly a thousand years later, marvel at the skill and ingenuity which produced the early cathedrals, they must have seemed miraculous to the people who watched them grow out of the ground.
Anyway, I remember the Notre Dame missing spires because I'd seen the Hunchback of N-D movie and the thought that it should have had spires on the bell towers never crossed my mind until I saw the sketches of the original design. And ever since that day I've always thought of Notre Dame as the 'unfinished' cathedral.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 17, 2019 12:22:59 PM | 174

macron just put a statement talking of a new spire competition open to the diverse united colors of bennetton world.
a new spire to aspire or conspire.
france is owned by talmudic satanist so how about a spire made up of skulls topped with a moloch owl

the project bluebeam 3d projection system can be left in place with projection fire shows every sunday showing the new pearl harbour on repeat
open spaces for dancing for goyim satanist and talmud types to dance like on the 9elevens
frances own uss liberty fire show on repeat

the new spire competition is open to all so get sketching nothing holy or god or christ related

the gayer the better already

Posted by: myles | Apr 17, 2019 7:50:08 PM | 175

1. NYPD just caught a man trying to enter St. Patrick’s Cathedral in New York with two gas canisters and lighter fluid: https://twitter.com/NYPDnews/status/1118712787977555968.

2. Saint-Sulpice, the second largest church in Paris, was set on fire (video from inside, photo from outside) on March 17, a month ago. Police confirmed it was an arson: “The origin of the incident is, according to the first conclusions of the central laboratory of the police headquarters, ‘human’ and ‘deliberate’.”

Posted by: S | Apr 18, 2019 5:52:43 AM | 176

Upon the sad news, the instant memory that assaulted my mind was a compliment.
Compliment to a german Nazi officer, Gen. von Choltitz who
in 1944 was bold enough to disobey the Adolf maniac order to
set Paris aflame.-with all it includes- He was the commander of the German local garrison and France ows a lot to hi. I guess even a public recognition to his family whould be considered.
Unless the local jewish community decrees it a crime against their, let s say, feelings.

Posted by: augusto | Apr 18, 2019 8:09:48 AM | 177


wrong wind flicked cigs unnatural flames remember grenfels rather accelerated odd shaped flames.

"With really old oak like that, you'd need a lot of smaller wood to first get the fire hot enough for the ancient oak beams to burn.

In 2010 we replaced all the electrical wiring, so there's no way this was sparked by a short-circuit. We put new wiring in place according to modern standards. And we went even further; we installed state-of-the-art fire protection and detection systems in the cathedral.

At all times, there are always two men on standby in the Cathedral, day and night, to go investigate anything the moment an alarm goes off, then if necessary to call the fire emergency services.

I am really stunned that this [the fire] has happened."

Posted by: myles | Apr 18, 2019 2:40:04 PM | 178


It's my pleasure to announce that the burning ruins of Notre Dame Cathedral have mostly been extinguished. We can state with perfect confidence that all this unpleasantness was just some sort of bizarre "accident" and certainly not a North African immigrant unleashed by the (((chosenoid))) attacking its benefactors. Not like all those other times.

Also, this is not a metaphor for anything so please stop saying it is. Everything is fine. Take off that yellow vest and go back to sleep. We should have it rebuilt in a mere four decades. At some point during this interminable reconstruction the fallen symbol of the dying West might turn into a mosque, but this is fine, "diversity" is our mighty strength.

Yes, things couldn't be better. You are lucky to be alive right now, to enjoy such wonders.

Two new videos surface that cast doubt on the official narrative that the Notre Dame fire was caused by some kind of freak "accident"

First Video

https://ia801506.us.archive.org/10/items/g80WqiRdDeJnmJa_/g80WqiRdDeJnmJa_.mp4

Second Video

https://ia601407.us.archive.org/5/items/ubW1GFYdqlP1dME7/ubW1GFYdqlP1dME7.mp4

Zoom of Second video

https://ia601507.us.archive.org/18/items/MlCiobiIyZWSukUI/MlCiobiIyZWSukUI.mp4

Posted by: MH | Apr 18, 2019 6:13:47 PM | 179

The fact that there have already been uncovered planned terrorists attacks in Europe by ISIS, and that almost simultaneously to the Notre Dame fire, not only there was also fire in Al Aqsa Mosque, but Bannon was talking, from his new italian HQ in a Cisterciense Monastery where he is for trainning far-right neonazi cadres for the "reconquest" of Europe, against Pope Francis in coordination with similar efforts by Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI, whose nazi past is well known, has all the hints of a conspiracy to start a Christian-Muslim religious war to be extended to the whole Middle East and Europe, as they keep rebelling against the plans of occupation by The Donald and his 666 son-in-law....

Posted by: Sasha | Apr 18, 2019 7:16:34 PM | 180

Posted by: Sasha | Apr 18, 2019 7:16:34 PM | 180

Forgot to add the link...Bannon´s International Neo-nazi Movement

Posted by: Sasha | Apr 18, 2019 7:19:47 PM | 181

hey sasha
isis is israel
you did know that left right?


who was tim osman
who was shimon elliot simon elliot
bigdaddy bad bagdaddy
ashkanazi init

Posted by: myles | Apr 18, 2019 9:04:27 PM | 182

@MH #179

Do you know where these videos come from? Who filmed it? These videos, if real, are significant evidence in favor of the arson theory. I mean, how else do you explain the “flash of flame” in the hands of the person on the roof? Can’t possibly be anything related to construction work. On the other hand, it’s a bit too convenient that somebody would film the roof of the cathedral precisely at the time of the arson. Did they know about the coming arson? If yes, why didn’t they warn the police or the security at the cathedral? This gives me pause in trusting these videos.

Posted by: S | Apr 18, 2019 10:23:58 PM | 183


Jesus' murder was part of a cosmic struggle
between good and evil; life and death.

The arson attack on Notre Dame Cathedral
is the latest in the ongoing rape of Christian Civilization.
This is part of a larger campaign to mentally
enslave or even destroy mankind.

We are very much in the position of passengers in a plane that has been hijacked by members of a doomsday cult. We are passengers on the Titanic. We're in the thrall of some pretty sick people.

You see, God is their competition. He must be destroyed along with his adherents. In the meantime, mankind must be degraded to the level of - I won't say animals; they are often very decent -- Demons!

Mankind must be inducted into their cult, as their servants .

Posted by: myles | Apr 18, 2019 11:07:18 PM | 184

@ S # 183

S: "Do you know where these videos come from? Who filmed it?"

Yes, but I'm getting this from a French language site that's banned in France, so to avoid mistakes, first I'll try to write it in French, then I'll attempt to translate

Elles sont extraites des images produites les webcams du site viewsurf le lundi 15 avril (aujourd’hui supprimees)….Les images ont ete prises a 17:05

Une fois cette video connue, elle a ete rapidement contestee par la television d’etat France 24 laquelle cite les pompiers de Paris

And so translating the above, the videos were produced by images from one of the webcams for the city of Paris (Cathedrale de Notre Dame) collected on the site (viewsurf.com) for Monday April 15 (now suppressed)...the images were taken at 17:05

France 24 (the State TV) does NOT contest or even question the authenticity of the videos, instead they're trying to claim that the man seen in these video was a firefighter

Probleme: les pompiers n’evoquent pas cet homme mais un autre

Problem: the firefighters were not talking about this man but another one

Posted by: MH | Apr 19, 2019 12:43:36 AM | 185

@185: The figure in the video can’t be a firefighter as there’s no fire yet. The camera position and camera shaking of the livestream on the viewsurf.com’s Notre-Dame page do, indeed, match those of the videos you’ve linked to.

Posted by: S | Apr 19, 2019 1:30:28 AM | 186

this is the kind of jackets and white helmets people of the security and those intervening on the construction would wear; there are several videos where they are seen, including on the parvis.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 19, 2019 3:44:40 AM | 187

Sorry i had not seen the new vids.
In this one and the 3rd one it is rather 2 people that can be seen.
https://ia601407.us.archive.org/5/items/ubW1GFYdqlP1dME7/ubW1GFYdqlP1dME7.mp4
Is it smoke all around? are they supposed to have escaped by helicopter?
A Russian tourist who attended the mass at 6.15 said that they were evacuated after the first alarm, but that after it had been dismissed they were allowed back again and ... that the priest was very nervous while he continued the office.
Anyway, Macron looks quite panicked in the last few days.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 19, 2019 3:50:55 AM | 188

The roof that burned so quickly was made of 210 tonnes of lead-tables! This sure can make a hellish temperature...
http://www.notredamedeparis.fr/en/la-cathedrale/architecture/la-charpente/

Posted by: Mina | Apr 19, 2019 5:52:54 AM | 189

New spectacular video
https://youtu.be/rJfAECTcgFk

Posted by: Mina | Apr 19, 2019 4:08:00 PM | 190

Firms that were doing the works on the spire are on the record stating that the last members of their teams left at 17.30 after checking nothing wrong was going on. About that video, I had the impression the flash was basically a reflection on some metal thingie the guy was carrying or interacting with - no idea what it could be. If it's been taken at 17.05, it means it should've been one of their guys - if there's anything suspicious, I hope the cops will look into it.
It's also been reported that after the first alarm, a guy quickly went up to look what was wrong, but he went to a wholly different area than were the fire is supposed to have started, because sensors didn't indicate the right location. Not sure what kind of sensors they used since it's also been reported that there were no such security measures on the roof because they didn't want any electrical wiring up there - though they had to put a lot of them for the repair works, and they probably put these sensors as well just for that. Whatever it was, the guy didn't see anything since he was in the wrong place, reported there was nothing, people were allowed in once again, and 20 min later alarm rang a 2nd time, and things went downhill. Were I the priest, I would've been uneasy, because if the security system gives false positives, how can you trust it to warn you when there's a real fire starting?

Macron has good reasons to be worried. Between his billionaire buddies that make him look like a dunce by showing the whole world they have hundreds of mio ready to use, belying the "we can't tax the rich more than that" argument, and him proving to the French Catholics he doesn't give a fuck about them and only cares about looking good at the Olympics and leaving his own mark on Paris landscape, like Mitterrand and Chirac before, respect for a major historical monument be damned, he's going to lose even more voters. Worth noting that the usual suspects are already making a big fuss that it's the dreaded FN / Le Pen / far right asking for a restoration and rebuilding respectful of the monument - somehow, I don't think this will turn out the way they expect, since the bulk of the people clearly don't want some modern architectural crap on top of their 800-years old cathedral.

Mina: thanks for the video. I had only heard that the towers were hit but had never seen pics or vids of the flames going hard against them. These firefighters are national heroes; heck, they did more for France than the government and the bulk of the parliament in the last 2 years.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Apr 19, 2019 6:04:15 PM | 191

good drone video of the damages
https://youtu.be/1zKQPIRTM6I

Posted by: Mina | Apr 20, 2019 4:33:33 AM | 192

To clueless joe
A reflection of a metal thing. Not from the sun. All day on 15. April was no sun visible, cloudy. The flash should be investigatet.

Posted by: Gerd Müller | Apr 20, 2019 5:26:15 PM | 193

New video with one stricking view of the falling spire
au-coeur-de-lenfer-lincendie-de-notre-dame-raconte-par-les-pompiers-3894122

Posted by: Mina | Apr 21, 2019 6:05:52 AM | 194

...
2. Saint-Sulpice, the second largest church in Paris, was set on fire (video from inside, photo from outside) on March 17...
...
Posted by: S | Apr 18, 2019 5:52:43 AM | 176

Thanks for jogging my memory.
One of my favourite YouTube vids is of an amateur organist ploughing his way (competently) through Widor's Tocata in the cockpit of the organ at St Sulpice - the instrument at which Widor composed the piece. There's another vid of the same performance without the shouting and distractions of the keyboard-side version.
Widor's Tocata was unknown to me until I bought an album called the King Of Instruments. It evokes thoughts of whales singing to each other in the presence of an audience of littler sea creatures.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 22, 2019 10:27:38 AM | 195

Where are the other webcams from the city? Why arent there more cell phone videos, or interior cameras inside the lower or ground level of the cathedral? Or even folks in adjoining buildings filming? Certainly there were other folks on the island. Odd dearth of footage.
Why did it take so long to locate the fire- almost half hour?If everything had censors? Some accounts said near TWO HOURS!! Viewers called it a 'standdown'.
Why no helicopter firehoses? They wouldnt have had to dump tons at once from a huge airborn water tanker, but could have hosed water stream from above?
800 yr wood like petrified rock, hard to light. No lone cigarette did that. Those flames were like supernatural..!

Posted by: clare | Apr 24, 2019 4:39:26 AM | 196

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