Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
March 24, 2019

The MoA Week In Review - OT 2019-16

Last week's posts on Moon of Alabama:

They don't even hide their evilness: US official says cumulative sanctions have Venezuela in a "Darth Vader" style grip around the throat

The EU gave May two extra week to get her deal or something else through parliament. The next thing she did then was to postpone the vote for another week. Brussels will remember that when her next delay request comes in. Her attempts to run out the time to put parliament under pressure might well have catastrophic consequences.

Members of May's cabinet seem to plot a coup against her. Her potential replacement is Cabinet Office Minister David Lidington, who is a remainer. How is that supposed to work?

Jonathan Pie with a wonderful rant: Brexit: What's the f**k is going on? (vid)

Druze in Golan Heights Protest Trump's Call for Recognition of Israeli Sovereignty

Elijah Magnier - The occupied Golan Heights is offered to Israel and yet the indignation is verbal, nothing more

Matt Taibbi - It's official: Russiagate is this generation's WMD:

Stories have been coming out for some time now hinting Mueller’s final report might leave audiences “disappointed,” as if a President not being a foreign spy could somehow be bad news.

The Russiagaters won't give up. They are not only moving the goalposts, but the whole stadium.

Cenk Uygur @cenkuygur - 22:48 utc- 22 Mar 2019
Let me be clear before we find out what’s in #MuellerReport, my contention has been that the collusion was after the election. I’ve said countless times that I don’t care about tweets sent during election. Hope Mueller investigated connections to Russia before & after election.
Cenk Uygur @cenkuygur - 12:03 utc - 23 Mar 2019
It means @realDonaldTrump has very likely been helping the Russians get money out of Russia for decades. And after the election they call in their favors. That doesn’t mean they rigged the election but it does mean Trump is doing favors for them. I’ve said this countless times.

The collusion to help Trump win the election was after the election? Trump helped(!) Russians to move money and they(!) are now making demands? What's the logic with that? And what are the favors?

Use as open thread ...

Posted by b on March 24, 2019 at 18:03 UTC | Permalink

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mourning dove @93--

Given the present structure of the global economy, a Depression within the Outlaw US Empire would cause about the same disruption as 2008 and likely less because the central hub of global commerce's now located in China. The ability of the US market to purchase goods would diminish, but that's now being done via Trump's Trade War, so the impact of any future downturn wouldn't be nearly as impactful. Indeed, without any vision other than the Green New Deal being offered, the USA will likely continue to regress economically--a reality being masked on the national balance sheet by Finance as it eclipses the far more important productive economy. Things would be vastly different if Obama had chosen to Save the People instead of the Banksters.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 17:38 utc | 101

After spewing the usual Zionist propaganda, Trump today used a bigoted trope against the Palestinian people stating: There can be no better example of greatness than what Israel has done starting from such a small speck of sand.

The truthful translation.

The bullset trope, first: Palestinians did nothing to cultivate their land...The truth: Israel made the desert bloom on the backs of Palestinians, fertilized with Palestinian blood.

I'll say more on Trump's magnanimous gift of Syrian land later. Argh!

Posted by: Circe | Mar 25 2019 17:39 utc | 102

CORRECTION: Gift of Syrian land theft!

Posted by: Circe | Mar 25 2019 17:42 utc | 103


Is the US one big drama queen or is the President of the US the biggest drama queen in world history?

It cracks me up how so many of those who welcomed if not actively supported Trump's election now attribute his shortcomings to the US as a whole.

You got to accept the bad with the good, Trump Dick Suckers (the real meaning of "TDS", btw).

Posted by: donkeytale | Mar 25 2019 17:45 utc | 104

When are you going to drop Trump here and start condemning this bastards for the Zionist Neocon he is? When???

Posted by: Circe | Mar 25 2019 17:47 utc | 105

mourning dove @ 93

if you'd actually read the piece i linked to you'd know that Orlov's underlying thesis is that, indeed, collapse will in all likelihood be much harder in the USA than it was in the USSR.


of course it would be lethal for many in the USA(as Grieved says, The most vulnerable of the population will die off,...)...around the world? i don't know. it couldn't be any worse than the well documented fact that US success has already been lethal for many millions of those folks.

Posted by: john | Mar 25 2019 17:48 utc | 106

somebody @67

This seemingly different geopolitical posture is only skin-deep imo, as is the professed philo-semitism.
The main goal is to destroy any alternative societal/ economic model competing with capitalism, so it doesn't matter much whether funding comes from European, US or Russian capital. The first 'enemy' to be destroyed is internal left-wing movements and parties (for whom the first concentration camps were built in 1933), next on the list are external geopolitical and 'system' rivals.
Should right-wing governments be elected in Europe, I have little doubt that rivalries with Russia (and China) would re-emerge, leading to either war or economic collapse...or both. 'Nationalism united' works only short-term, cf. the Hitler-Stalin accord.

Actually what surprises me is how similar European fascists and islamist jihadis function, if you think of it. Exactly the same mechanisms, exactly the same purpose: keep people occupied, eliminate internal opposition, weaken geopolitical rivals. And the best bit: They even use the same drugs.

OhOh @81

This myth about the 2014 oil price crash really is hard to kill. The decline hit the US financial sector hardest, Russia simply devalued the Ruble and thus contained it. Behind it was not a US-Saudi conspiracy, but a change in price formation regime: from monopoly to market pricing.

Posted by: smuks | Mar 25 2019 18:00 utc | 107

smuks @107

"Behind it was not a US-Saudi conspiracy, but a change in price formation regime: from monopoly to market pricing."

What caused the change?

Posted by: arby | Mar 25 2019 18:13 utc | 108

I don't know much about the Depression Era, but the facts of the 1932 election are plain. Roosevelt got 22,821,277 votes while Hoover received 15,761,254. Most Americans considered Hoover to be a hopeless putz, and the few history books I have which touch on the matter agree. Hoover was totally in bed with Big Business, and the result was a disaster.

As for what The People thought of Roosevelt's first four years, one only has to look at the 1936 election. I can't find a quote by Alf Landon from late in his long life, but in an interview he once admitted that if Roosevelt hadn't won in 1932 the US would have have ceased to be a Democracy. I forget if he predicted 'Communist' or 'Nazi', but back in the day even national Republicans could sometimes have their heads in the Real World.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 25 2019 18:13 utc | 109

@ jonku | Mar 24, 2019 11:31:57 PM | 50

. . .couldn't a rogue US base take control of its host nation's armouries?

No. The idea that the citizenry could overwhelm the military in the US is based upon the fact that armed civilians outnumber the military by, roughly, 30 to one.* Most of those military personnel are not front-line infantry, and are not issued weapons. On the other hand, US military forces stationed in foreign countries would, in most cases, be overwhelmed by just the number of military in their host countries.

*Estimates of the number of US gun owners vary wildly. The lowest estimate, interestingly, comes from the NRA, at 80 million, so the ratio could be even higher.

Posted by: AntiSpin | Mar 25 2019 18:14 utc | 110

I have read many of his essays, you and he seem to believe that a US collapse would be contained to the US. I don't. But just to suppose for a moment that the US collapses and the rest of the world is unaffected, your cavalier attitude about the deaths of many millions of vulnerable Americans (40 million live below poverty) reveals your professed concern for the victims of Empire outside the US as complete bullshit.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 25 2019 18:16 utc | 111

@ Circe #102

In the wake of those unthinkable horrors, the Jewish people built a mighty nation in the holy land, something very powerful, something very special and important ... There can be no better example of greatness than what Israel has done starting from such a small speck of sand.

I had to doublecheck your quote, for it was hard for me to believe that even Trump was stupid enough to mouth those words from whoever wrote that speech. The poor fool doesn't have a single freaking clue....

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 25 2019 18:19 utc | 112

@ mourning dove @111

Possibly you aren't aware that there is a class of people who actively welcome a "collapse". Their fantasies mirror those of the Fundamentalist End Timers in that they imagine the big "re-arrangement" will have them coming out on top of the new social order. With their natural superiority in skin color and gene quality along with a well-stocked gun collection - how else could it work out?

There are lots of books of what I'd call "survival porn" where these dreams can be previewed.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 25 2019 18:30 utc | 113

mourning dove @ 111

think more, talk less. goodbye.

Posted by: john | Mar 25 2019 18:34 utc | 114


Trump said and meant those words! Why does everyone persist in pretending someone has a hand up his ass and is forcing him to talk? He just gave Israel land it stole from Syria for crisesakes! Did someone force a pen into his hand too?! Is he freaking braindead and therefore totally innocent? NO! So quit pretending the shadow made him do it! He's a Zionist and a Neocon up to his neck in swamp scum.

Posted by: Circe | Mar 25 2019 18:40 utc | 115

Zachary Smith,
I am very aware of that, it's what got me thinking about the subject. I've seen cheerleading for collapse here at MoA. It's astounding, and the apathy of it is disheartening to say the least. I see Orlov as kind of a salesman/propagandist promoting a very gruesome fantasy.

"survival porn" indeed.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 25 2019 18:46 utc | 116

@arby | Mar 25, 2019 1:19:05 PM | 95

Here we see Putin helping Trump stay out of hot wars again.

The "LOL" suggests you're being sarcastic but it's true, Putin has helped Trump "stay out" of Venezuela, if indeed he ever intended to invade it in the first place. The MIC in the United States requires external enemies to continue ripping off the American tax payer and if countries like Venezuela, Nicaragua and Cuba became Washington-friendly people might start to ask for a peace dividend. For the moment, Trump needs to keep feeding the MIC to keep it on side, so a shouting match between Washington and Caracus needs to be kept going but without outside support for Venezuela, the Washington Borg might realize that it's pure theatre and start to demand that the United States invade Venezuela. The Republicans and Democrats both want more war but Trump doesn't if he is to hang on to his USP of no foreign intervention. For the moment, everybody is happy.

And before anybody starts going on about multi-dimensional chess/chess masters/judo/jujitsu/etc. running a grift like this ain't that hard for a capable grifter and we know Trump is a capable grifter. Setting up this grift with Putin - perhaps that's what they talked about in Helsinki.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Mar 25 2019 18:49 utc | 117

@Circe | Mar 25, 2019 2:40:31 PM | 115

Trump said and meant those words! Why does everyone persist in pretending someone has a hand up his ass and is forcing him to talk?
Trump has been branded a compulsive and inveterate liar so while Trump undoubtedly said those words and it's unlikely anybody forced him to say those words. there is the possibility he didn't mean those words.

It was a presidential declaration which means it's about as permanent as the JCPOA. Although God claims "From eternity to eternity I am God. No one can snatch anyone out of my hand. No one can undo what I have done", I suspect Pompeo is incorrect when he suggests Trump is God's messenger on Earth.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Mar 25 2019 19:07 utc | 118

Who exactly are the vulnerable in the US who would die off in the event of collapse? 40 million Americans live in poverty, most of those are children, disabled people, and the elderly. For context, Canada's entire population is about 37 million. Add to that the 80% of American workers who live paycheck to paycheck. Out of 350 million people, it might be easier to look at who isn't vulnerable.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 25 2019 19:11 utc | 119

Just when you think it was over, it pulls you back in:

Michael Avenatti, ex-lawyer for Stormy Daniels, arrested on extortion charges
Avenatti charged with attempting to extort millions from Nike by threatening to release damaging information

Erin Durkin in New York

Mon 25 Mar 2019 17.33 GMT

Michael Avenatti, the former lawyer for Stormy Daniels, has been indicted on extortion charges and arrested.

According to a criminal complaint filed by federal authorities in New York, Avenatti was charged with attempting to extort millions of dollars out of Nike by threatening to release damaging information about the company. It did not meet his demands.

He has been also been charged with wire and bank fraud in a separate case in Los Angeles.

Daniels, whose birth name is Stephanie Clifford, is an actor in and director of adult films who claims to have had a sexual liaison with Donald Trump, years before he was president.

Avenatti rose to national prominence while representing her, and briefly flirted with a run for the Democratic presidential nomination. - "

At one time Michael Avenatti was a potential Democratic presidential candidate and also guest starred on CNN.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Mar 25 2019 19:18 utc | 120

Zach @109--

Hoover's plight--and FDR's--was the lack of any economic theory to deal with the conditions they faced--Keynes's deficit spending theory to pump the demand side of the economy hadn't been thought of by its author yet: The General Theory of Employment, Interest and Money wasn't published until 1936. Indeed, FDR's ideas differed extremely little from Hoover's. What did differ was FDR represented a new direction after 12 years of Republican Party rule. Even more indicative of the political ferment was the rise of numerous third parties throughout the nation to populate the House with a few entering the Senate. The New Deal got its start as merely a phrase within FDR's 1932 nomination acceptance speech with absolutely nothing behind it policy-wise, nor was it his idea--Stuart Chase borrowed it from Mark Twain.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 19:27 utc | 121

Pepe Escobar provides an update: "Empire of Chaos in Hybrid War Overdrive." In his usual upbeat manner, Pepe confirms what a few of us previously described:

"A hefty case can be made that the Empire of Chaos currently has no allies; it’s essentially surrounded by an assortment of vassals, puppets and comprador 5th columnist elites professing varied degrees of – sometimes reluctant – obedience.

"The Trump administration’s foreign policy may be easily deconstructed as a crossover between The Sopranos and late-night comedy – as in the whole episode of designating State Department/CIA regime change, lab experiment Random Dude as President of Venezuela. Legendary cultural critic Walter Benjamin would have called it “the aestheticization of politics,” (turning politics into art), as he did about the Nazis, but this time it’s the Looney Tunes version."

Meanwhile, I must repeat what Kremlin spokesman Dimitri Peskov said about the termination of Russiavape:

"It's hard to find a black cat in a dark room when it's not there."

That's the "gloating" BigLie Media's accusing Russia of doing.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 19:37 utc | 122


It's laughable that you pretend that an agreement made with Israel can be undone as easily a deal made with what the U.S. considers an adversary.

Who are you kidding?

@119 md

While I agree with you that the Empire ain't going anywhere especially under Trump, please, don't pretend people, American and other wouldn't be 100 times better off without trillions of $$$ spent on sustaining all those bases and hostile foreign interventions that have devastating consequences for millions and generate millions of refugees, and wasting on funding states like Israel and KSA?

The U.S. can still be a prosperous country without being an Empire,okay? All fallen Empires have survived. You care too much about the wellbeing of Americans and squat about the damage it does to others everywhere to sustain imperialism. The Empire, regrettably, ain't going anywhere, so this discussion is moot.

Posted by: Circe | Mar 25 2019 19:47 utc | 123

collapse as a massive depopulation scheme that will leave the Empire entact. emerge leaner, debt free, unhindered by any pretence of international law, and having rid itself of the pesky masses and their demands, it would be free to dominate everything that's left of this world.mourning dove | 22 Agree.. and that is a plan of the USA has had in place since 1948, it involves destroying America and replacing its population with tamed Israeli citizens.

You hit the nail on the head.. Trump's job as CIC of the USA is to destroy the people's America.. erradication by GMO (metabolic interference), G5 (calcium Channel Interference),

The massive loss of life that would result from a collapse, he(Trump) is almost giddy in his anticipation of it.
mourning dove | 38 < I think this is part of the plan.

a rogue US base take control of its host nation's armouries? jonku | 50 < i think this is part of the plan the USA has in mind.. ??

Hoover and FDR were both Pft | 52

suggest two books one from each side of WWI (Pan Germananism by prof. of History Roland Greene Usher .. 1913-1914 shows clearly how the Zionist planed in 1895 in Basil Switzerland to encircle Germany and take over the Oil in the Ottoman Empire< done by weaponing immigration< herding ordinary Eastern Europe Jews into the part of the Ottoman Empire (post WWI) that became the British Mandate Palestine and the French mandate Syria. It was about a railroad the Germans had and good relatiions with the Ottoman that scared the hell out of the British, French and American Bankers..(no damn German was going to get access to that oil) Two treaties Russia with France 1895 and England, France and USa 1896 (explains Wilson, Federal reserve 1913, and lot more ...) and the other book My Memorirs, 1878-1918 by Ex Kaiser William, II (himeself), 1922.. The entire middle east was a Zionist project then and now.

Like the plan to syrianize Venezuela, kick all Venezuelans abroad, like in Syria and keep the head puppet onboard for trying to convince everybody this is legit and not an ambitious op between US/Russia/Israel respective Deep State apparatuses? Posted by: Logic gate | 60

Not true => Nazis were financed by US/Britain to go to war against the Soviet Union and finish off the British and French colonial empires. see the two books above.. somebody | Mar 25, 2019 8:52:30 AM | 67

Israel would not exist had it not been for the wave of terrorist acts inflicted on the Palestinians after Zionists started illegally migrating to Palestine in contravention of British decree and also attacking the British that took over Palestine which had been under Ottoman rule prior to that. That's the shet they pulled for starters to wear down the British who were in no mood for a fight at the end of WWII!

The State of Palestine was literally forced into submission by waves of terrorist acts on the Palestinians and then with the godawful partition that never should have happened to compensate Zionist terrorism!

There is no longer democracy in the U.S. thanks to Zionism. Zionists did not waste any time moving in on government power. The goal of Zionists once they started to achieve prominent legislative and advisory positions in the U.S. Government has been to use U.S. military strength to neutralize and contain foreign competitors, that threatened this susceptible host, and they considered such strategy a means to Zionist empowerment and expansionism. They were 100% correct in that perception. However they used the canard of survival to justify such policy.

Circe | Mar 25, 2019 12:41:07 PM | 92

Trump who is a Zionist is also dangerous and abusing power to the detriment of many.Circe | 55 Agree

Capitalism is failing because it no longer helps ordinary people, says a top economist seen as a front runner to lead the Bank of England. by: John Doe | 58 The patent law, the copyright law, and privatization and rampant deregulation have created the monopolies that have taken away the competition which made capitalism good for little people with talent. For capitalism to flourish, it is necessary that government keep the playing field and the game on it fair, honest, just and that the government deny any and all any kind of monopoly..

Posted by: snake | Mar 25 2019 19:55 utc | 124

@ mourning dove #116

I see Orlov as kind of a salesman/propagandist promoting a very gruesome fantasy.

If you or I had lived through the destruction of our own nation, then watched while what was left of the place was picked over by neoliberal looters from somewhere else, we'd be as bitter as hell - same as him. We must credit the man for trying to communicate his own experiences - and conclusions - to people he believes are going down the same path as the USSR.

I disagree with a lot of what he says, but not everything. For example, I'd surely prefer to have a reliable weapon of some kind to being entirely at the mercy of the pond scum who surface instantly in a crisis. (Even if it was an old single-shot .22 rifle.) Every nation has those people - they're the Germans who were recruited to operate the Nazi Holocaust. The US citizens quite willing to become All-American Torturers. The Jews who happily steal from and murder Palestinians.

In each case the Powers That Be greased the skids for the monsters instead of restraining and punishing them.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 25 2019 19:55 utc | 125

mourning dove @119--

Perhaps you read The Grapes of Wrath and noted the total lack of any national or state provided institutional support system for the poor and downtrodden--all that existed then were various charities, mostly tied to local churches. What differs now is such systems now exist to keep people from starving, along with private charities. In a few ways, domestic America's beginning to resemble that of the mid-1920s, particularly regarding the maldistribution of wealth. One factor of Jim Kunstler's collapse hypothesis as described in The End of Suburbia is reliance on the automobile thanks to sprawl and the horrendous lack of mass transit designed into the suburban landscape. Eventually, dependency on hydrocarbons for transport fuel will cause great distress within the USA and globally where proper substitutes aren't provided.

Ultimately, it will be up to the morality of US citizens as to the fate of their neighbors, friends, and kinfolk. You can see that debate already in motion, and I predict it will become even more important as we approach the 2020 election.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 20:00 utc | 126

What exactly did I say to give you the impression that I'm a supporter of the Empire or that I don't think Americans and the entire world would be much better off without it? Your comment makes a lot of assumptions, very insulting ones I might add. My comments have been in the context of the sudden collapse that so many people seem to be eagerly anticipating without any consideration of the actual consequences. Statements like the vulnerable will die off are made casually but I wanted to give some context for that. I think a sudden US collapse would cause global chaos and a loss of life that is unimaginable. Somehow that makes me pro-empire?

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 25 2019 20:03 utc | 127

Zachary Smith
From what I've read of Orlav, his writing isn't a cautionary tale based on experience with the Soviet collapse. He's promoting a fantasy.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 25 2019 20:09 utc | 128

Interesting thread on "collapse". But this is an alternative line of thought:

The "fault line" is the US dollar and the massive US debt, as everyone seem to think. What could take it's place - in the minds of those most likely to be affected? (ie the "elite, rich oligarchs of the US). There are several "currencies" that have been proposed - Bitcoin, Gold and so on. However, there is another asset that could be used, and that is energy. Oil and Gas to be exact. (The dollar was based on being the "currency" used by all countries in transactions).

Have the behind-the-scene organizers of the US decided to simply replace the use of the dollar with control of ALL of the worlds Oil and Gas resources? By using the really massive quantity of US and Israel's military forces/bases and political puppets of individualcountries, to seize them by force or impose total control.
Rather than thinking that the Trump-Israel flapping about is a sign of weakness, in fact it could be a blatant foreign policy. Take it all. Fits well with Trumps "business" penchant, doesn't it?

Think about it, Many of the known sources are already under US control (Middle East). The recent Trumpian-Neocon objectives are mainly axed towards "regime change" in Oil/gas rich countries. (Iran, Venezuela). African sources (Nigeria) are also under population (terrorist) threats to gain political control of sub-surface riches.

The recent proclamation of the Golan "belonging" to Israel, almost certainly has more to do with it's Oil/gas reserves, than "just" water rights.

(The Golan heights have already been factored in as a supply source. The Undersea pipeline, (2'600 miles?) from Israel via Crete to the EU, which is not justified by the known fields off their own coast - would become financially viable when the expected output of the Golan fields are added in.)

Presumably they hope that the Collapse of the dollar would be mitigated by them having all the energy sources under one control (Count the oligarchs and Zionists in this group. Bankers as well. ie. The Rothschilds are supposed to form part of the drilling company which will be given the "rights" to drill into the Golan.)

This leaves Russia as the next country that they will try to "regime" change in the near future. China has few natural Oil/gas resources (Except the around the Spratley Islands) so would be open to blackmail.

Posted by: stonebird | Mar 25 2019 20:15 utc | 129

@104 donkeytale.. i hear what you are saying.. it was an off the cuff remark that seems to fit.. i don't think it is purely trumps responsibility either.. i see the usa as having cultivated this center of the stage we are the greatest mindset.. trump is the perfect leader for what i think is systemic in usa culture..

@114 john... that was funny! thanks! i could definitely apply that to myself!!

Posted by: james | Mar 25 2019 20:22 utc | 130

stonebird @129--

Apparently you missed Paveway IV's excellent disclosure of documents detailing the fraud of Genie Energy and the anticipated lack of any positive discovery from test wells. Also, there is an oil-based currency--Venezuela's Petro. Furthermore, proven global hydrocarbon reserves are declining, but demand is declining faster thanks to technology and replacement of older, inefficient cars, which for now is keeping the price stable. IMO, future money supply will be backed again by gold and silver as although finite neither will be wasted for fuel. And the need to provide an expanding currency to support infinitely expanding economic growth will no longer be required as the need to adopt a Steady-State posture becomes abundantly clear. China and Russia are obviously preparing themselves for the retro monetary future which will commence when the fiat Ponzi scheme propping up the Dollar finally collapses, with either a whimper or a bang. Presently, the oil & gas markets are becoming bifurcated regarding payment and the trend will continue to consolidate. Dollar recycling has already slowed and will continue in that direction, which is already hurting the US economy--and the pain will grow.

Eventually, the bubble-based US economy will burst yet again--when and severity being the only questions. IMO, the financial terrorists will wait until after Trump loses in 2020 so as to sabotage the winner's socialistic economic ideas. As usual, time will tell.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 21:15 utc | 131


The end of the petrodollar monopoly of course (May 2014).

Posted by: smuks | Mar 25 2019 21:29 utc | 132

A rather stimulating and important study's been published in pdf: "The Coal Cost Crossover: Economic Viability of Existing Coal Compared to New Local Wind and Solar Resources". A short discussion of the study is available here. The article relates the fact that states are beginning to target when they'll go 100% renewable with 2045 being the current consensus, although several states could easily reach that point much earlier as the study's charts illuminate.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 25 2019 21:38 utc | 133

Karlof1 @131
Although you are right about most things - my point is that energy could "replace" currency as a value, - via "Commodity trading". (Money/currency has no intrinsic value, as silver and gold have.) The dollar is in the process of tanking and it will take the US dollar denominated debt with it. The replacement is an US stranglehold on hydrocarbons (including the production of plastics). Thus present day US foreign policy might now be based on a simple "might makes right". ie Trump declared Guaido "President" and now declares Golan to be part of Israel - are statements that are brutal bully boy tactics. ("I" say this and that is all you need to know).

I did miss Paveway IV, (pity). However, as Cheney is part of the Genie Energy board - I do not trust him at all, I would not be surprised if there was more to the situation than is visible at the moment. (Cheney and Hydrocarbons; - him taking over the "parallel" Government in the US after 9/11 - and his participation in the lead up to 9/11 itself, then moving to Doha....) I reckon that he and others have been thinking hard about the demise of the dollar (as is now happening), and decided a couple of years ago that "full spectrum domination" should cover the future "financial situation" of the US as well. Some of the alternatives, Gold, silver, SDR's, precious metals etc. are too dependent on other countries. So why not use force to assume control of the world's major energy centres as policy?


I once read that hydrocarbons have about 32 other uses apart from wastefully being used for transport.

Posted by: stonebird | Mar 25 2019 22:03 utc | 134

karlof1 @131

Sounds plausible at first, but imagine what a 'dollar collapse' would look like, and what kind of havoc it would wreak across the world, not just economically. Do you think China, Europe and Japan (or rather: PBoC, ECB, BoJ) would allow that to happen? Isn't a managed, gradual decline far more palpable - and realistic, unless something goes badly wrong?
China wants an IMF reform to make it a truly international FI. This would imply an increased role of SDRs imo, and only if the other powers don't cooperate, a gold-backed Yuan would come in as a 'plan b'.

As for oil, it used to be important for the US to (directly or indirectly) control the producing regions - or at least the shipping lanes - to make sure that everything was done in $. But this has changed bc. they can control neither Russia nor the pipelines connecting it to China. So today, everyone can use pretty much the currency he wants.

Posted by: smuks | Mar 25 2019 22:17 utc | 135

smuks @132, and 135

The end of the petrodollar monopoly of course (May 2014).

I assume you must mean other countries willing to trade oil in currencies other than the dollar. I'm not quite sure how that translates into lower prices.

I can see a concerted effort to hurt countries like Russia, Iran, and Venezuela by using their partner in crime, Saudi Arabia.

Posted by: arby | Mar 25 2019 22:36 utc | 136

Was the amateurish Venezuela caper rushed to secure supplies ahead of a possible dip in the KSA or fracking “surge” that’s been used to hurt independent oil producers?

Posted by: oo goo gachoo | Mar 25 2019 22:45 utc | 137

@ stonebird 129

Interesting. They seem to have “reacquired “ Brazil recently too.

Posted by: oo goo gachoo | Mar 25 2019 22:50 utc | 138

stonebird @138--

FYI, Most plastics not made from oil; made from natural gas. When the USA experienced big spikes in Natgas prices during the late 1990s and early 2000s, much of the plastic and related industries offshored to places where feedstock prices were cheaper, and they have not returned. Iran, Qatar and Russia hold the largest proven Natgas reserves on the planet. Iran and Qatar recently inked a pact to jointly develop their shared field--Pars--and we know how the Outlaw US Empire feels about Russia's prolific NatGas sales.

The resource bubble created by fracking has about run its course and domestic gas and oil prices will again resume their upward trajectory thanks to overall field depletion.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 0:23 utc | 139

the bs chronicles from today

re isis in syria

"QUESTION: But all those not foreigners, right?

AMBASSADOR JEFFREY: No, no. Most – well, most of them are Iraqis or Syrians, which by the mindset are considered different than the foreign terrorist fighters who we identify as people who have come from outside the region.

QUESTION: Can you – do you have an estimate on those?"

further down

"QUESTION: Hi. Hi, Ambassador. What do you see as the practical significance of the declaration signed today recognizing Israel’s sovereignty over the Golan Heights? And how does that affect your job given some of the criticism that it’s a violation of UN resolution?

AMBASSADOR JEFFREY: The Assad regime is considered a pariah by almost all of the countries in the Middle East. It will continue to be considered a pariah. I don’t think I’m going to have a lot of problems with this. "

AMBASSADOR JEFFREY: The majority are Syrian and Iraqi.

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 0:27 utc | 140


As long as the US/ NATO controls all oil trade (via either production or trade or payment), it can force monopoly prices: Either you limit production to lift prices, or you'll be in trouble (sanctions).

2005/6 was the peak of conventional oil, with it the fear of scarcity, commodity speculation, prices going through the roof. Then came the crisis and the rise of unconventional oil, thus lower prices. But the western financial sector was dependent on ever increasing oil revenues (re-invested in the $ sphere), so 'we' forced a reduction of production, and prices quickly recovered to 100$+.

The oil price crash of 2014 didn't hurt Russia (Venezuela is a different story), but rather the US. The (very foreseeable) real estate bust in NY and London is a direct consequence of the loss of the petrodollar monopoly, and thus of oil money flowing back. Not sure who 'colluded';-) with whom to engineer it, my bet would be Saudi & China, as in Beijing giving security guarantees.

Posted by: smuks | Mar 26 2019 0:32 utc | 141

@stonebird, oo goo gachoo

adding to my previous post:
Today's US interventions/ hybrid wars in oil regions are not about getting more oil, but rather *less*. There's too much of it in the market, so prices are too low (for the US/ UK financial sector to thrive). Since market prices have made a return in 2014, it's just a matter of supply and demand: Reduce supply, and they will rise. check: Libya - endless civil war, Nigeria - fabricated rebellion ('Niger Delta Avengers' were straight outta Hollywood), Venezuela - sabotage, coup attempt. Probably others I'm forgetting.

Posted by: smuks | Mar 26 2019 0:42 utc | 142

Venezuela 3 - 1 Argentina in a friendly in Madrid, Spain says RT :)

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Mar 26 2019 0:55 utc | 143

@131 karlof1

Some good ideas here, thanks. You've offered some strong commentary through this thread - I'm rather busy right now and haven't been able to jump in and applaud all those commenters who deserve applause.

Posted by: Grieved | Mar 26 2019 2:22 utc | 144

I missed this open thread but I'll offer this idea anyway, maybe people have thoughts:

Kazakhstan President Nursultan Nazarbayev last week stepped down from the role that he held for decades. He has long been a friend of Putin and I think more of a mentor than not. He held Kazakhstan safe through the collapse of the USSR, he originated the idea of a new Eurasia, and he has often struck me - in my personal surmise of the situation - as being a wise exemplar to Putin.

Can it be that Nazarbayev is now showing to Putin the way of how to leave a commanding position and hand over the country to the next generation?

I expect much to come from this man's actions, and the developing picture of how he transitions to elder statesman, while others carry the nation forward. Frankly, I take great comfort from the wisdom of his actions, and great hope for Russia from its undoubted recognition of his examples.


ps..Korybko has a nice report on this. Some here will know that I frequently take Korybko with a grain of salt, but this article seems very balanced, as indeed is his subject, and the situation:
Nazarbayev’s Resignation Is No Cause For Alarm (Just Yet)

Posted by: Grieved | Mar 26 2019 2:29 utc | 145

@145 grieved.. i think you are right about nazarbayev and his role to putin..i haven't read anyone say that, but i think you are right.. but at the same time i think he is stepping down as it is time and he is quite old and has had this role for many many years.. i don't know if he is doing this to show putin so much as doing it as it is time.. i think he is 78.. he will be 79 this coming july 6th... he is experiencing the saturn-pluto opposition to his sun.. it is a good time to retire.. meanwhile putin is born in 1952 - 12 years younger then nazarbayev... i haven't read the link you have shared.. i think though the title says it all - no cause for alarm.. he might have some health issues - heart with saturn opposing sun by transit, but without having more specifics on his time of birth, what i am saying is what i got from looking at his chart - the time is right for him to step down.. and yes - his has played a leadership type / mentor role to putin as you say.. that fits with the astro..

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 2:54 utc | 146


From RT
'The two aircraft that were reported to have brought Russian troops and some 35 tons of cargo to Venezuela over the weekend arrived in the Latin American country with the full knowledge of the Venezuelan government, the president of that country's National Constituent Assembly, Diosdado Cabello, told the broadcaster Venezolana de Television on Monday. He said that the planes, reportedly an Il-62 and an An-124, landed after receiving a permit from the “only legitimate government” of Venezuela. AP reported earlier this week that the servicemen had arrived to discuss maintenance of Russia-made equipment, training and strategic matters. Moscow has not commented on the reports so far.'

Upgrades to s-300 missile system software, equipment and training?. Donated as a fraternal gesture of course.
Any Bay-of-Pigs type antics could lead to sad outcomes for the PMC's and other contracted murder squads.

Posted by: Emmanuel Goldstein | Mar 26 2019 7:57 utc | 147

Grieved @ 145, James @ 146:

Vladimir Putin is serving as Russian President for six years from 2018 to 2024. He is not expecting to contest the next presidential elections in 2024 though there are many people in Russia, including people in the Federative Assembly, who would like to see him in a third six-year term.

The Russian Constitution as is does not permit leaders to serve more than two six-year terms in succession.

My understanding is that Lee Kuan Yew pioneered the idea of stepping down as leader (in his case, as Prime Minister of Singapore for 30 years from 1959 to 1990, during which time he unrelentingly harassed opposition politicians like J B Jeyaretnam by suing them into bankruptcy and destroying their political careers) and then playing a shadow eminence grise role as a Senior Minister and then Minister Mentor in successor PMs' Cabinets from 1990 to 2011. How interventionist (read: meddlesome like LKY) Nazarbayev will be in Tokayev's administration remains to be seen.

Posted by: Jen | Mar 26 2019 10:39 utc | 148

The first sentence quoted below was interesting, everything else in the linked article has been said before and is unlikely to be new to anyone here.

I was born and raised in an America far more Orwellian than many now remember.

America is exceptional in all the wrong ways by Danny Sjursen.

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Mar 26 2019 11:37 utc | 149

@mourning dove, who is concerned with the human cost of the end of US empire.

Probably any large scale geopolitical change has the potential to veer into violence and maybe then loss of life.

My view is that there likely will be some disruption when the structures that enable the empire-vassal system erode and fall away resulting in the internal US system no longer being able to sustain itself in the same ways. This could be sudden and cataclysmic with riots and public violence but equally might be a slow “death by a thousand cuts” with things falling apart gradually.

Perhaps because of levels of gun ownership in the US population and tactics of the media to divide and conquer through emotion driven propaganda, things could ignite into a type of civil war - I don’t know, since I am not in the US. If people are desperate and angry enough, there is potential for mob violence such as in the French Revolution’s Reign of Terror:
“During the Reign of Terror, at least 300,000 suspects were arrested; 17,000 were officially executed, and perhaps 10,000 died in prison or without trial.”


A different take might be to look at the financial and economic machinations going on behind and around a collapse.

- Here is the testimony of Anne Williamson before The Committee on Banking and Financial Services of the U.S. House of Representatives on the financial plunder that took place by US and other oligarchs during the collapse of the USSR:

- Here is F. William Engdhal being interviewed on Guns and Butter on the same topic:
Fake Democracy: How Washington Destroyed Poland and Russia in the 1990s - F. William Engdahl, #385

Needless to say this financial pillage “programme” is devastating to ordinary people with their savings evaporating and starvation a real possibility. Probably the financial engineering here might be classified as a specific example of what Naomi Klein and others term Disaster Capitalism.

So, is the US being set up for a disaster capitalism style collapse? Or are the financial vultures just spotting and taking advantage of the inevitable? Either way, the outcome is negative for every day people.


In considering the broader aspects of empire, I have found the writings of Johann Galtung to be helpful in considering empire vs. country. He predicted US empire (but not country) collapse in the 1990s but I think he recently changed his prediction to be the US becoming a dictatorship. Here he is in an interview:

This 1971 paper of his, “A Structural Theory of Imperialism”, is helpful for the way it models power and economic flows between the empire core and periphery. A copy is here:

“The world consists of Center and Periphery nations; and each nation, in turn, has its centers and periphery. Hence, our concern is with the mechanism underlying this discrepancy, particularly between the center in the Center, and the periphery in the Periphery. In other words, how to conceive of, how to explain, and how to counteract inequality as one of the major forms of structural violence. Any theory of liberation from structural violence presupposes theoretically and practically adequate ideas of the dominance system against which the liberation is directed; and the special type of dominance system to be discussed here is imperialism.“


In more of the tin foil hat speculation area:

A possible outcome might also be the US devolving into groups of states: there are various maps and discussions online with different speculations on how this might turn out. I have no idea how plausible this is (not likely without some massive change I think) but it might be a path that avoids more dire outcomes.

Another sometimes speculated outcome is the merging of Mexico, US and Canada into some kind of North American equivalent of the EU. This seems even less likely to me so perhaps it’s just fear mongering.

Posted by: Mercurious | Mar 26 2019 12:26 utc | 150

@148 jen... thanks for that overview! i was not aware of any of that... Lee Kuan Yew played a pivotal role is separating singapore into a city state apart from malaysia and creating the city state of singapore.. any parallels with Nazarbayev would be very different as i see it for this and other reasons... however i am not knowledgeable enough to comment with authority on any comparisons to be made here with lky.. thanks for your comments!

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 15:57 utc | 151

"Did CNN's president just admit that the company has no investigative journalists?"

"CNN prez Jeff Zucker: 'We are not investigators. We are journalists, and our role is to report the facts as we know them, which is exactly what we did.'"

That's quite the Freudian Slip!

I've yet to watch having just discovered this Michael Tracy interview of Tulsi Gabbard from March 25. Be prepared as it's an hour and 20 minutes!

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 16:52 utc | 152

Meant to include this @152--

"The raid on North Korea's embassy in #Spain continues to develop -

"Spain's high court says 10 intruders included citizens of Mexico, United States and South Korea."

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 16:54 utc | 153

EUP passes Article 13 to censor the internet and nobody's made any notice here until now. Vid about how Filternet will work by Honest Government Ad. Wonder how this will affect MoA!

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 17:13 utc | 154

Not really spamming; just keep on finding important items to share. "ATTENTION: #IntegrityInitiative dump seven now available!!!" further advice and link to dump at Twitter link above.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 17:17 utc | 155

Wow, things are moving on, although there are those who still believe the Collusion conspiracy theory. Isikoff over at MSNBC now seems to be admitting that the Steele Dossier was garbage. When will people start loking at the Crowd Strike report in a more sceptical way. Soon Mueller might have to update his report to correct his characterisation of how the HRC and DNC e-mails reached Wikileaks. Then that just leaves the fake news about the Russian IO and the click-bait tweets. The edifice that the Democrats and their supports have created around this hoax is crumbling to dust. At least, any chance that Hillary Clinton had of running in 2020 is fast disappearing.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Mar 26 2019 17:52 utc | 156

Mercurious @150

Thank you for your very thoughtful and well considered comment, and for the links you provided. I haven't yet, but I will look in to them, thank you.

I've read a good bit about the Soviet collapse and the subsequent rape, pillage, and plunder. I think you are right, it's a perfect example of Disaster Capitalism, and it didn't just happen, it was engineered. It seems to me that something eerily similar is playing out today in the US and I can't help but wonder if there isn't some guiding force behind it. I find it very troubling that a similar sudden collapse of the US is being promoted by some as a liberating event and assumptions that such a collapse would be contained to the US seem almost delusional to me.

I've seen a map depicting the US broken up in to nation states, and I think that is a much more likely scenario than a unified North America. I've been able to travel quite a bit within the US and the culture varies dramatically from region to region. There isn't any culturally unifying element in the US and as you said, the propaganda promotes those divisions.

Gun ownership is no small matter either. There is a not so small minority here that is heavily armed and just waiting for an opportunity to live out their fantasies of an Old West style lawlessness. This group has the potential to seriously exacerbate any political or economic instability that might arise, and they can be found in every state.

Taken together, all these things, and the complete sham that is our political system, have created a situation that is precarious and unpredictable, as well as potentially catastrophic for the entire world.

Thank you again for your comment and the links you provided.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 18:27 utc | 157

Interesting links, thank you. I look forward to checking them out.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 18:29 utc | 158

Zachary Smith, re: Orlav

I took a look at his Wikipedia page and I think that you have a misunderstanding of his history. He's lived in the US since he was 12 and he didn't live through the Soviet collapse, he saw it as a tourist basically. His bio mentions extended visits throughout the 80's and in to the mid 90's, but there's no indication that he's been back since.

Also, this wasn't addressed on his Wikipedia page, but for him to have lived in the US since he was 12 means that he and his family came here in the mid 70's which means that his parents were defectors. Defecting wasn't an easy thing to do back then and it seems very unlikely to me that the whole family was able to do so without some kind of involvement with the CIA or possibly another government agency.

I haven't seen anything in what I've read of his work that indicates he considers the collapse of the Soviet Union as a tragedy or that he considers Russia to be "his nation". He still lives in the US. If he felt such an attachment to Russia, it seems to me that his writing would be focused more on what I think is the much bigger story - Russia's recovery and dramatic rise.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 18:42 utc | 159

In addition to my @155--

Klarenberg hits jackpot:

"So there we have it in black and white, in an official Whitehall document - #IntegrityInitiative IS a UK government program. Quelle surprise, but nice to have it incontrovertibly confirmed."

I'm impressed with Kit's work. For those unaware, many of his major scoops are published by Sputnik like this one. Unfortunately, they don't get the scrutiny they deserve, and barely 6,000 people follow him on Twitter.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 18:43 utc | 160

The main reason Mueller has served up his nothing burger is because to produce enough "evidence" to impeach Trump would require publicly exposing the full extent of the Deep State illegal spying, hit squads (his name was Seth Rich) and electoral manipulations so common in the US today. - A P at 7.

Yes. Also, imho (in view of the very public threats Trump has made), were ‘Russia collusion,’ BS ‘proved’, ‘attested to’ or weaponized against Trump - ex. impeachment - the riposte would have been immediate and a lot of very unsavory (or more damning..) + bizarre ‘facts’ would be revealed, and bruited about. The MSM would not be able to contain the storm (> internet..)

The USA-MSM has melded with the Dem. Party to some high degree. Mutual interests, Dems have the biggest ‘user’ public, the ‘modern’ media, high tech, smooth urban, non-racist, ‘edjicated’, poor saps in fact, etc.

That marriage created the massive coverage of Trump before the election (he couldn't win yet provided HUGE revenue..), it was all a joke, a spoof.

The subsequent Russia-Russia! collusion scandal was fabricated out of whole cloth to sell MSM products and exonerate Dems. It had nothing to do with politics, governance, foreign policy, the lives of US citizens, at all.

Biz. Scandals and pol. stances have become products that sell well or not. Selling them is dependent on build up..

As the MSM is in fact the more lowly, less powerful partner, while at the same time being the most venal (MSM news is peddled to earn money, not to inform, and they are being squeezed by overlords) and having powerful control levers, it all ends up in a toxic brew, as jockeying between the scandal-peddlers and the Pols who need votes spirals down into chaotic madness where the parties no longer know where their interest lie or what to do. (see also Brexit.)

Posted by: Noirette | Mar 26 2019 19:10 utc | 161

The idea that there will be any noticeable amount of US survivors after the US collapse is over is a very large assumption.

I don't see it, the US is not going to be as orderly as the USSR or Warsaw Pact countries or even the current Ukraine. Hell not even as orderly as the Nazi "Third Reich" where so many of them squirreled away to South America (many Argentinians insist Hitler died an old man in their country). It doesn't even matter if anyone wanted to help (or save) the US as no one are big enough to do that and can only try to avoid the worst consequences.

If you're a US citizen learn Spanish or Portuguese (now your main language) and head south of Mexico, stay out of the largest cities. That's what I would do. Become a citizen of wherever you settle down, don't be a "rich tourist" (if things go really bad there will be people specializing in hunting those down globally like has happened before).

The US is already on borrowed time, time which any sensible countries are using to disentangle themselves and prepare.

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Mar 26 2019 19:21 utc | 162

Noirette @161--

Self-declared D party members were the only faction retaining a 50% MSM believability in Gallup polling regarding media trustworthiness, well above R party and Independents. As such, it would be of interest to see the results of a new poll taken toward the end of April so the reality of BigLie Media might finally be realized and reflected by polling results. Those proven correct about Russiavape need to resist gloating and go on the attack with what ought to have been the genuine story if the hoax hadn't covered it up for two+ years and how they were duped, which is what Caitlin Johnstone has begun doing.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 20:20 utc | 163

@160 karlof1.. thanks for the links and ongoing comments... cheers james

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 20:25 utc | 164

A US collapse would effect you wherever you are, it's not only US citizens who would be effected. The US Empire includes NATO and it has it's tentacles in everybody's business. It doesn't collapse without triggering a global tsunami.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 20:33 utc | 165

a global tsunami is what is needed at this point.

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 20:37 utc | 166

@ mourning dove #159

Thanks for the biographical information about Orlov. I hadn't checked because I obviously made some wrong assumptions about the man.

Regarding "collapse", as I see it the event might have been pre-planned by somebody who expects to make a huge profit. Or it might be an 'out-of-the-blue' thing. An EMP attack would qualify here, for everything would instantly unravel and tens of millions would starve.

In either case I'm going to be in bad shape, but I'm sure the wealthy folks would prefer Option #1. Especially if they've been given inside information about the time schedule and their options.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 26 2019 20:39 utc | 167

james @166--

Be careful what you ask for!

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 20:42 utc | 168

Ditto to karlof1@168.

James, you don't strike me as a nihilist, what gives?

@165 I should have said that the US Empire includes NATO and 5Eyes etc.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 20:49 utc | 169

Zachary Smith,
I think that could easily be hundreds of millions. It's staggering to even try to contemplate.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 20:55 utc | 170

@168 karlof1 - thanks for that.. interesting..

@169 mourning dove.. i mentioned in my comment to you much earlier @47 which you never responded to - 'what do you want, a slow death or a fast one? it was related to the question of yours which i had given my own answer to..

no, i am not a nihilist, but as i see it the world can not continue on in the direction it is going.. it is going to hit a wall.. it is hitting the wall now as i see it.. it might take another 50 years for that to sink in and many will be gone by then, but it is the young generation that have to continue.. they also have to correct all the negatives the generations before then have initiated.. things can't continue the way they are at present.. anyone who thinks it can is living in a bubble..

and, i don't think having financial wealth is going to protect anyone either.. that is another illusion that some can entertain.. no one is going to escape what affects all of us..

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 21:03 utc | 171

I didn't respond to that comment mostly because I wasn't sure exactly what you were saying. I should have asked, apologies. I don't understand what you mean by preferring a slow death or a fast one, personally, I'd prefer life and not just for myself. Considering the sudden collapse scenario, that looks to me like a slow excruciating death, at an unimaginable scale.

I agree that the status quo is completely unacceptable and I'm assuming that what makes it unacceptable for you has something to do with the death and destruction it wreaks. I don't understand how the death and destruction of a global tsunami seems preferable. There has to be another way.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 21:37 utc | 172

james @171--

Correct, paper money as very little nutritional value.

At the beginning of the 21st Century, I participated in several blogs where the topic of Societal Collapse was often discussed, with most every type of scenario explored and dissected. The discussions were fruitful as they mostly involved academics who provided numerous references to bolster their assertions, which allowed me to fill out my library with some of the better books on the subject. The most cited and argued thesis regarding Collapse was Joseph Tainter's 1988 book The Collapse of Complex Societies, which was then bolstered by Jared Diamond's 2005 book Collapse: How Societies Choose to Fail or Succeed. Being a co-History/Anthropology Major, the discussion was rather fruitful and lead me to explore several tangents, the Peak Oil thesis being one of several, including the previous peaking of other vital natural resources, phosphorous being the most prominent.

For people genuinely interested/concerned about Collapse, I highly suggest following the links for the synopses and then reading them--they're inexpensive used at

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 21:58 utc | 173

@ 172 mourning dove.. i am sorry for being a bit opaque! the concept of frogs being boiled in water, but at a slow pace whereby they don't recognize the need to jump is the analogy here... that is where we are at now on planet earth.. death is inevitable and a part of life..i like your attitude and desire to find a positive alternative to death..i share your position.. death is never attractive, but at this point we are killing the planet.. it has reached a point that it is unsustainable to think we can continue to do the things we do and have it work out harmoniously, or to work out without catastrophic consequences.. this is how i see it.. the time to act was yesterday.. something significant has to happen soon for a greater number of people, (including politicians beholden to corporations) that it can not in any way continue.. we already passed the fork in the road as i see it..

@173 karlof1.. i am familiar with the jared diamond book, but not the other one from earlier.. thanks again for your participation at moa and the ongoing insights you offer everyone here..

Posted by: james | Mar 26 2019 22:29 utc | 174

Mourning Dove @ 159, Zachary Smith @ 167:

In the 1970s, the Soviet Union did allow some emigration. Nearly everyone who left the USSR during that time were members of minority ethnic or religious groups. Most emigrants were Jewish people who were given exit visas to Israel, although not all of them actually went to that country: some of them changed their minds in transit (or never had any intention of going to Israel in the first place and planned their escape very carefully) and went the US instead. Some people even pretended they were Jewish to escape the Soviet Union. At least 200,000 people left the USSR this way.

There is no need to suppose that Dmitri Orlov's family worked with the CIA or some other intelligence agency to leave the USSR in the 70s.

Posted by: Jen | Mar 26 2019 22:33 utc | 175

Thank you for those links, I read the synopses.

In the first, the writer examines 3 historical collapses, and while there are certainly some commonalities, I don't think that the historical record provides a template for a collapse of the US Empire, for a number of reasons. It's scale and it's integration into the world economy as well as it's infiltration of so much of the world create a unique situation although we do face many of the challenges and forces that he describes.

In the second, the writer identifies factors that can trigger collapse, but an engineered collapse like in the Soviet Union isn't identified or explored. Also, my brain has an almost allergic response to overpopulation theory. This article touches on that, but it's not in depth. If you're interested -

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 22:37 utc | 176

Maybe, maybe not. I didn't make an assertion, I said that it seems unlikely to me that there wouldn't have been some kind of involvement with some government agency. His bio doesn't mention the circumstances and while it's possible, given the political climate at the time, as well as the nature of the CIA, Russian defectors would very likely have been approached in some form or another.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 22:42 utc | 177

Thank you for clarifying that, and I agree that we've passed the threshold. Maybe it's a futile hope, but I'm still pulling for some alternative to the 'nuclear option' of a global tsunami.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 22:48 utc | 178

I read the page you linked to, it is specific to the Soviet Jewish population. Do you know if he is Jewish?

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 26 2019 23:06 utc | 179

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn's "200 Years Together"

Of course you all know of Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. Who doesn't? Legendary Russian dissident during the Soviet era, prisoner in the gulags, starved, tortured, ostracised. But never broken. He spoke truth to power like few have ever done. His novels such as The Gulag Archipelago, The First Circle and Cancer Ward were not only brilliant literature but offered the rarest of insights into the life of a dissident in the USSR. He came to be regarded as one of the most eminent writers and philosophers of his age.

Which contributed to his being awarded the Nobel Prize for Literature in 1970 "for the ethical force with which he has pursued the indispensable traditions of Russian literature".

Feted wherever he went, his books became international best sellers, translated into dozens of languages, the world was at his feet.

Then almost overnight it all stopped. He became a non-person.The transformation was virtually unprecedented in the field of literature. Why did this happen?

Because Alex stepped on the Third Rail.

Well he didn't so much step on it, rather dived on it full length.

You see he wrote a book called 200 Years Together that traced the Jews' colourful relationship with the Russian people and especially their role in the Bolshevik Revolution and its ensuing murderous tyranny.

He didn't pull his punches. He placed Soviet Jews centre place in perpetrating the worst mass murders of the 20th century. While acknowledging that some Jews also suffered under this tyranny he clarified that it was not as Jews per se, rather that they were in the wrong faction at the wrong time. Solzhenitsyn's own estimate for the number of Christians (his word) who died was 60 million.

He documented all of this in meticulous detail.... names, dates, times. But he did something else, something more insidious and dangerous. Something that had strategic international consequences for the Tribe. For a start he shone a light on the extraordinary Jewish capacity to magic themselves into the position of victimhood irrespective of their actual accountability. This in turn depended on - as he pointedly noted - their uncanny ability to seize control of media outlets. "There are pages of this history which one does not open without trembling. And these are the pages that are systematically and purposefully eradicated from the consciousness of the Jews."

Other observations that cut to the bone included their practice of manipulating the legal framework to reflect Jewish interests. (Think "hate" legislation.) “Russian people are now confronted by a Jew both as their judge and hangman. Why was it that anyone who had the misfortune to fall into the hands of the Cheka could count with high probability on standing before a Jewish investigator or being shot by a Jew?" He meticulously debunked Jewish writers who sought to portray Soviet Jews as having no choice in what they did. 'Just following orders' How ironic is that? He carefully traces the ways in which Jews, both within the USSR and internationally, favoured and supported Jewish interests under the cloak of universalistic altruism.

Sound familiar?

I haven't even begun to describe what he wrote in '200 Years Together' not least because I haven't read it, only certain chapters. So why have I not read it? Aha, therein lies a tale! You see, Solzhenitsyn's legendary status and guarantee of vast sales would in normal circumstances have had international publishers slavering at the prospect of getting their hands on the rights. But none did. None wanted it. It was never published in the West. In fact, incredible as it seems it has never been formally translated into English! Given that English translations exist for almost every half-assed writing in the most obscure of languages the disappearance of 200 Years Together is mind-blowing. The author himself became a non-person just as he had in the USSR.

Think about it. It is, as I said, mind-blowing. What sort of pressure could have resulted in every Western publishing house, every Western TV company, every Western magazine being intimidated into passing up such a unique and hugely profitable publishing coup? How exactly was this Jewish power exercised? Was it overt, subtle, physical, financial....or what?

It truly is frightening.

Posted by: anonymous | Mar 26 2019 23:41 utc | 180

Hudson on Keiser Report briefly explores one facet that will cause Collapse amongst other related topics. IMO, the shows are too short and don't allow for much extrapolation, which is unfortunate. Hudson appears just after the 12:00 mark. To Keiser's credit, he's one of the few TV journos exploring what ought to be controversial topics of great political import that aren't even discussed in the business press.

mourning dove @176--

Your reply resembles many made during previous discussions on Collapse. Unfortunately, the synopses don't do either work justice. Here's Tainter on YouTube for 40 minutes discussing his work. And here's Chris Hedges on The Collapse of the American Empire. (Disclaimer: I've yet to view either video.) Searching, I see that there're numerous videos on the topic, one by economist Richard Wolff sponsored by Financial Times, which I haven't viewed either.

For a number of reasons, I stopped being overly concerned about Collapse, although the topic still gets my interest as our discussion reveals. Personal responsibilities precluded me from attempting to implement a plan centered on Five Acres and Independence, but we do remain vigilant. By no means am I a survivalist, although I was certainly trained to survive. We work on the "needs" side of the economy, not the "discretionary," which provides better odds at remaining employed. And I agree with the comment about there being a lot of useless Survival Porn.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 26 2019 23:42 utc | 181

Mourning Dove @ 177, 179:

I don't know if Dmitri Orlov is or is not Jewish. I did note in my comment @ 175 that some people pretended to be Jewish in order to escape the Soviet Union.

Given the period in which his family left the USSR, in which a couple hundred thousand people actually were able to leave the country under particular circumstances, because of their background (real or pretended), it seems quite likely Orlov's family also left in a similar way.

Orlov does happen to be a fairly common Russian surname, derived from the Russian word "орел" meaning eagle. It can also be a Jewish patronymic surname derived from the Yiddish name Orl (pet form of Aaron).

Posted by: Jen | Mar 26 2019 23:47 utc | 182

Thank you for that comment. I didn't know that any part of that book had been translated into English but your comment made me look to see what I could find. I downloaded the pdfs from this site. Is this the same as what you've read?

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 0:07 utc | 183

I don't really like watching videos on my phone, definitely not lengthy ones. I appreciate you linking them though, and your input. I'm pretty sure I've seen the Chris Hedges one before though.

I don't really know where I am on this as far as what is or isn't overly concerned. This isn't something that I had really explored before so I'm still feeling my way through. What triggered my interest in the subject is the number of comments I've been seeing that are enthusiastic about the idea of collapse and who, I believe, have a romanticized notion of what that would actually look like. I also find it concerning that so many people outside the US seem to think that they would be untouched.

On a personal level, it's hard not to take that kind of enthusiasm to heart because I know what it would mean for me and for millions more like me. My wheelchair needs electricity so even a relatively brief but sustained power outage would cause a lot of problems for me. Of course, in the event of collapse, that concern would very soon be eclipsed by food and water.

You said in a previous comment something about depending on the morality of our fellow Americans, that sent a shiver up my spine. I don't think that's how you meant it, and the same thought might be a comfort to people who have a good family and a strong support system. Folks like me who came out of really messed up families and don't easily connect with other people have very different prospects.

Thanks again for your input. I apologize if I've been snappy or whatever or if I've misread you at times.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 0:32 utc | 184

I was just curious if you had any info about that. So again, maybe, maybe not. His bio is rather vague. Regardless of whether his family was part of that, it doesn't preclude what I think is a reasonable suspicion. Of course there are other factors that would be relevant, like the education and professions of his parents as well as other factors. Given that I think he's selling a fantasy that lots of people can't seem to get enough of, I was already wondering about him and what his motivation is. Maybe I'm a little paranoid, but this is the CIA we're talking about, so who's to say?

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 0:41 utc | 185

I've only just read Solzhenitsyn's introduction but you have greatly mischaracterized his work, or at least his intention. I do appreciate being pointed to what has been translated of 200 Years Together, and much of what you assert may be borne out as I continue reading, but it isn't an indictment, it's a call for understanding and harmony.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 1:56 utc | 186

@ mourning dove #186

When I saw your link to the Solzhenitsyn book I made a beeline to download it myself. That's when I saw this:

Meanwhile, readers need to be forewarned that any and all English versions available on the Internet (with two important exceptions listed below) are illegal, pirated, and/or entirely unauthorized; often poorly and loosely translated; and redact passages, and indeed whole chapters, that apparently do not support the prejudices of those behind these illegal editions.
It's impossible for me to make a judgement based on fewer than 60 pages, but the people who have arranged for it NOT to be translated into English seem to believe it's something I ought not be reading.

I've had similar experiences.

Hans Mommsen with Manfred Grieger, Das Volkswagenwerk und seine Arbeiter im Dritten Reich. Duesseldorf: ECON, 1996. 1055 pp. DM 78 cloth.

I've seen claims this one will never be legally translated - it's just too ugly. Maybe enough to impact VW car sales in the US.

Journalists for Hire: How the CIA Buys the News - a book by Udo Ulfkotte

As recently as a year ago a bookseller took my pre-order for this one. After a while they cancelled the order, saying that it wasn't going to be released in English. Thanks for nothing, CIA.

Palestine: The Reality: The Inside Story of the Balfour Declaration
by J.M.N. Jeffries

For many decades this one was under lock and key. There was no internet record of any copies being bought or sold - for ANY price. And the World Catalog listed only about three dozen libraries in the world as having a copy. Somebody somehow arranged for it to be put back ito print. I'm guessing the Zionists figure they have such a lock on the US it doesn't matter anymore what a few people think when they learn of that "Reality".

There is another book by a British woman who documented how the UK helped the Zionists suppress the Arabs. I contacted the UK archive which is supposed to have the materisals, and their reply said they had nothing. BTW, I learned of her existence in the 1939 Jeffries book.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 27 2019 3:51 utc | 187

Zachary Smith,
I just finished reading what there was of it a little while ago and oh yeah, it's totally messed up that this and the others you've listed have been suppressed. From what I read, Solzhenitsyn approached the subject matter very respectfully and honestly. I have to wonder what is so inflammatory that only a very small portion has been translated into English. And yeah, I don't like someone else deciding what I should or shouldn't ought to read. I'll look for that Jeffries book, thanks for the heads-up on that one.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 4:19 utc | 188

@ mourning dove @184

My wheelchair needs electricity so even a relatively brief but sustained power outage would cause a lot of problems for me. Of course, in the event of collapse, that concern would very soon be eclipsed by food and water.

If the wheelchair has a rechargeable battery, you might consider a small solar panel. Harbor Freight has a 100 watt solar panel which they usually sell for $150. The controller is said to be a lousy one, but buying a better one would still keep your outlay way below the cost of a generator. This would operate many LED light bulbs, and charge batteries for flashlights & whatnot. However, even the unopened box is neither light nor small.

Amazon/eBay Yamaha-EF2000iSv2-Pure-Sine-Wave-Portable-Powerful-Inverter-Generator

1600 watts is overkill in one way, but I think it would also be too small to reliably start a refrigerator or freezer. And $850 isn't chump change. Plus there is the gasoline storage and the pure invitation to be stolen as it sits outdoors running during the power outage.

Food and water? Walmart sells a 5 gallon water jug for under ten bucks. This would keep you going through a two week outage. Same store sells a 20 pound sack of rice which would do likewise, though you'd get mighty tired of it. Box of raisins to stir in with it? A little dehydrated meat for flavor? I suspect the rice could be cooked overnight in a 1-quart thermos bottle. Local junk stores have these all the time at low prices.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 27 2019 4:22 utc | 189

Thanks for your concern, I appreciate it. $850 might as well be $8000, completely out of the question. I do try to keep some supplies, water is easy enough, but you know, that "fixed income" thing with Social Security means that sometimes it's pretty scrappy at the end of the month and it's just that much harder to try to actually set stuff aside. Rice, peanut butter, oatmeal and dry beans are things that I always try to keep on hand. A small camp stove is doable, and probably a good idea. A part of me strongly resists emergency planning, I'm not sure what's up with that but I need to get over it. You've given me something to think about, thank you.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 4:41 utc | 190

I missed that about the smaller one, $150 is manageable. I'll look in to it. Thanks again.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 4:44 utc | 191

Sweet! Free download.

Posted by: mourning dove | Mar 27 2019 4:50 utc | 192

Zachary Smith @ 187:

"... There is another book by a British woman who documented how the UK helped the Zionists suppress the Arabs. I contacted the UK archive which is supposed to have the materisals, and their reply said they had nothing. BTW, I learned of her existence in the 1939 Jeffries book.

Would that British woman have been Gertrude Bell? She was a traveller and writer who lived with the Bedouin in the Levant and the Arabian peninsula on and off. British officials establishing and administering the state of Iraq before it became independent relied on her advice. Bell also opposed Zionist settlement of Palestine and predicted the trouble that the Balfour Declaration in 1917 would create for the Palestinians.

Posted by: Jen | Mar 27 2019 7:22 utc | 193

too much happening.. we need a new week in review page!

craig murray has a great article up that some here will find fascinating..

Posted by: james | Mar 27 2019 16:08 utc | 194

@ Jen #193

No, it was Frances Newton. By the way, here is a link to the Jeffries book. As an old source it's immune to the mucking around by the hasbara boys and girls who try to rewrite history.

Palestine: The Reality

Windows Reader

The second file - a reader - is an extension for Internet Explorer, a browser I use for no other purpose. Linux computers usually have a built-in djvu reader.

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 27 2019 16:27 utc | 195

Republican prays for Trump then insists everyone bow to Jesus just before state's first Muslim woman sworn in

This story shows that no matter what the little cesspool nation does, it'll have rabid fans here in the US.

Stephanie Borowicz began the day’s session on Monday with an emotional invocation thanking her Christian god for Mr Trump “standing beside Israel unequivocally”.

Appearing almost in tears, Ms Borowicz sermonised about “overcoming evil” in the name of Jesus – who she mentioned 13 times – and said “every knee will bow and every tongue will confess” in the name of him.

Trump is Great and Trump is Good
Now we Thank Him for Our Food

Posted by: Zachary Smith | Mar 27 2019 16:32 utc | 196

Trump, Bolton, Pompeo and gang now think they can out play Putin and the Russian leadership.
This will be interesting.

"“Russia has to get out,” Trump told reporters in the Oval Office, where he met with Fabiana Rosales, the wife of Venezuelan opposition leader Juan Guaido.
Two Russian air force planes landed outside Caracas on Saturday carrying nearly 100 Russian troops. The U.S. government believes the troops include special forces and cybersecurity personnel.
Asked how he would make Russian forces leave, Trump said: “We’ll see. All options are open.”"

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Mar 27 2019 16:41 utc | 197

mourning dove @184--

Thanks for your reply! Thanks for sharing the nature of your situation. I was in the process of writing a long reply but IE burped and the page was reset thus erasing my hour-long labor. Its general thrust was at what I see as a change in the demeanor of the US populous's moral grounding as reflected by the growing number of people who agree about the need for universal healthcare and economic support. This is reflected politically in the arguments forwarded by AOC and Sanders.

I'll try to remember your difficulty viewing vids, but I must ask if you have earbuds for your phone as what's said is far more important than the video images most of the time. Vids are so easy to upload versus constructing a transcript nowadays, which I find unfortunate. And many thanks for the kudos you gave to all us bar flies!

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 27 2019 17:25 utc | 198

Who benefits, ?
The deep state.

Whats' the crime ?

When ?

Why ?
Enabled Boots on the ground in Afpak, all Stans, Africa.
Carte Blanche to attack any country accused of
harboring terrorists.

Thats' enough.

There's a reason for placing How right at the bottom,
wasting too much time debating the methods is counter productive,.
Apprehend the criminals and waterboard them,
they'll spill out everything.

How ?
Planes, missiles, mini nukes , C4 ???

Posted by: denk | Mar 27 2019 17:26 utc | 199

Peter AU 1 @197--

The illegitimate National Assembly tried to do the dirty work but was outmaneuvered by the intergovernmental agreement. Clearly, the US "chess players" are woefully outmatched by their Russian opponents. In this situation, Trump's absolutely powerless.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 27 2019 17:38 utc | 200

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