Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
August 12, 2018

The MoA Week In Review - Open Thread 2018-40

Last week's posts on Moon of Alabama:

Three weeks before the current Canadian-Saudi spat, the Canadian Revenue Agency took away the charity status of an Islamic center and mosque in Ottawa. The mosque had received largess from foreign donors and, it is alleged, featured radical preachers. The event may have caused the otherwise inexplicable Saudi behavior.

Just now the U.S. occupation suffers a new defeat.

On Friday some 1,000 Taliban infiltrated into Ghazni, an important city on the ring-road between Kabul and Khandahar. They have since taken most of the city:

Accounts from residents leaving the city said the only areas still being held by the government were the governor’s office, police and intelligence agencies headquarters, an ancient fort called the Bala Hisar and a few other government facilities.

Early today the Taliban brought the police headquarter under their control:

Intense fighting continues in Ghazni, the police HQ caught fire and collapsed to the Taliban. 113 dead bodies and 142 wounded were taken to Ghazni hospital. The hospital is running out of the capacity for treatment, they are using corridors and other available space.

Only the province government headquarter is still defended. More than 100 police and soldiers have been killed so far. Relief forces sent from Kabul are holed up in an army headquarter some five kilometers away. Telephone communication with the city is down. Some bridges were blown up by the Taliban which makes it difficult for the army bring in more re-enforcements. Some 150,000 civilians live in the city and bombing it to hit a few hundred Taliban would be catastrophic and of little use.  Additionally to the city 15 of the 18 districts of Ghazni province are under Taliban control and it is obvious that they have the support of a significant part of the population.


The U.S. occupation forces and their Afghan proxy government have long been in denial about the Taliban forces in Ghazni province as well as elsewhere. With the Taliban sitting on the ring-road, the south of Afghanistan is cut off from the center. They may eventually be evicted from the city but the attack is already a huge propaganda success for the Taliban and the negative moral effect on Afghan government forces will be huge. Another U.S. war that the empire obviously lost.

Right now Erdogan is holding a speech in Trabzon. He is defiant:

DAILY SABAH - @DailySabah
LIVE — President Erdoğan: The fluctuation in Turkish lira is a plot against Turkey, but Turkish people will not give in
LIVE — President Erdoğan: We might as well say goodbye to those who sacrifice their strategic partnership with a country of 81 million, alliance over 50 years for links with terror groups

Does that sounds like "Good bye NATO"? The Turkish military would not be happy with that. But by now it is presumably under Erdogan's full control.

Use as open thread ...

Posted by b on August 12, 2018 at 14:26 UTC | Permalink

« previous page

Hoars, and other fans of our Reality TV Show President.

I don’t so much love it when Trump fans keep moving the goal posts to maintain hope for change.

All that glitters is not Gold…
man Sachs.

But the Trump Administration sure glitters with more Goldman alum than any other before. Add in the longtime Military/Industrial Complex and Extraction Industry operatives, and Trump’s Swamp is brimming with Creatures of the Black Lagoon.

Even the hope for change in US war policy that I shared before the (s)election have been clearly dashed by the escalation of the wars in Afghanistan and Yemen, the deployment of thousands of soldiers who are now illegally occupying 1/3 of the sovereign state of Syria (containing 1/2 of Syria’s oil, and cutting off transit between Syria and Iraq) and the massive increase in military activities in Obama’s African Pivot.

Same with the campaign pledges to “work with Russia.’ Instead, this Administration hit the ground by calling Russia the “greatest threat” and adding new sanctions. And in short order, every Trump official who's commented on it (including Trump) insist that Russia did "meddle" in the election, and the US must take actions in retaliation. Then they not only kicked out Russian diplomats, but confiscated Russian Embassy properties (something we didn’t even do to Japan and Germany during WW II).

And though no one wants to admit how bad it was, the US military killed perhaps 200 Russian citizens who were legally defending the Syrian state by shelling them with US Marine artillery which is not legally in Syria.

And from Russian meddling to White Helmets sarin attacks, for a man who has spoken about false flag events for decades, and won over a large part of the "Truth Community" (especially the 9/11 truth seekers), this President has fallen for every false flag attack that's occurred since he had the authority and bully pulpit to expose them.

Then this Administration oversaw greater expansion of NATO, with 2 more countries added (including Colombia! the neighbor of the country this Administration has openly threatened with military “humanitarian intervention”). NATO funding has been increased. On Trump’s demand, NATO is working to add 30 new batalions, 30 new warplane wings and 30 new warships. The largest NATO war games in history were held on Russia’s border.

And of course, we are now openly sending heavy weapons to the nazis in Ukraine.

And that’s not even to consider the horrible domestic policies that are already negatively impacting the working class Trump fans who hoped for change from a candidate who (rightly) denounced HRC for her ties to Wall Street and neoliberal economics.

But just as the Obama-bots did for 8 long years, many Trump fans refuse to face the facts. They even use the exact same phrasing to defend or deny actions which are there for all to see.

My favorite is the continuation of the claim that Obama/Trump is “playing 4D Chess” and we who fail to see how all these acts that are themselves continuations or escalations of long-standing US policies are really the exact opposite are the fools.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 14 2018 18:57 utc | 101

Daniel @ 101
Thank you for all of that ! We will win ya know, we got truth and reality that will all ways win. Ride on brother.

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 14 2018 19:11 utc | 102

@Jen | Aug 14, 2018 7:13:40 AM | 84

Pft @ 67 is correct - the Weimar government in Germany in the early 1920s certainly did print too much money but did so to pay off the war debts it inherited plus the reparations demanded by the British and the French.

Yes, Pft was mostly right in his recitation of the Weimar case.

He wasn't addressing my point, however. Which was this: that hyperinflation happens when the other countries in the world refuse to take your printed currency, and you keep printing. That had happened to the Weimars and will happen to the U.S.

Posted by: Cyril | Aug 14 2018 21:07 utc | 103

@Jen | Aug 14, 2018 7:13:40 AM | 84

Pft @ 67 is correct - the Weimar government in Germany in the early 1920s certainly did print too much money but did so to pay off the war debts it inherited plus the reparations demanded by the British and the French. On top of that, reparations had to be paid in gold or in foreign currency, not paper money.Yes, Pft was mostly right in his recitation of the Weimar case.

He wasn't addressing my point, however. Which was this: that hyperinflation happens when the other countries in the world refuse to take your printed currency, and you keep printing. That had happened to the Weimars and will happen to the U.S.

Posted by: Cyril | Aug 14 2018 21:24 utc | 104


Don't worry, Marky Mark, I was here when b was B, and everyone who knows that, also knows that you are le poseur d'espions CIA.

Posted by: Chipnik | Aug 14 2018 22:09 utc | 105

Posted by: Yonatan @86

Great video! And at about 7:00, they show BUC anti-aircraft systems that had been serviced and delivered by the Ukrainian government just before the war. Any similarity between this system and the one that allegedly shot down MH17 is perfectly analogous.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 14 2018 23:01 utc | 106

always worth reading - daily usa propaganda press briefing from today...

Posted by: james | Aug 14 2018 23:44 utc | 107

Cyrila @ 103

If the US at some point is forced to pay war reparations denominated in gold or in some other currency pegged to gold there will indeed be hyperinflation in the US. The Weimar "lesson" is only that.

Posted by: sleepy | Aug 14 2018 23:47 utc | 108

I should add, though unrelated to Weimar, the US or any sovereign currency nation will produce hyperinflation if it continues to print money while its economy is operating at 100% capacity. In the US, the problem is the economy is operating at about 80% capacity. What it needs is not austerity which suppresses demand but more demand via federal spending.

Posted by: sleepy | Aug 14 2018 23:52 utc | 109

sleepy @108:

Forced? They would have be to militarily defeated. Good luck with that.

Posted by: Ian | Aug 15 2018 0:04 utc | 110


"wasn't addressing my point, however. Which was this: that hyperinflation happens when the other countries in the world refuse to take your printed currency, and you keep printing. That had happened to the Weimars and will happen to the US"

The US debts are in USD. Countries/individuals must accept them if they want the debts repaid.

Likewise, most debts of foreign countries are in USD. They must be repaid in USD

The US is the largest arms dealer in the world. Payment is required in USD. Some of the US largest weapons purchasers require payment for oil in USD

China sells much of its exports to US and payment is in USD. Walmarts paying for the goods they buy with USD

90% of international trade is in USD. The enormous illegal drug trade is almost entirely in USD

Liquidating 20 trillion in US based assets owned by foreigners will be paid in USD. Those owning such assets dont wish to see them devalued

The major central banks (ECB, US, Japan, London) will all by USD to defend it.

I accept your premise that should nobody require nor desire USD then inflation due to a collapsing dollar on FX . However I cant see how such conditions are possible or likely, at least not in our lifetimes.

IMO the vulnerability of the USD is a myth perpetuated by the elites to support the idea that government cant print dollars to support social programs to prevent inflation.

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15 2018 0:32 utc | 111


"US debt levels are projected to reach astronomical levels and Medicare will run out of money in 2026, social security will run out of money in 2034.

Pension funds are also massively underfunded."

The US can't run out of money unless by choice. They just have to print what they owe. All of those obligations you mention are owed to self. Since the US is well below 100% capacity and there is actually a shortage of dollars at the lower 90% of the economy, such printing would not be inflationary

Those who would like to gut those programs to enrich the elite and reduce life expectancy (neo mathusians) would argue otherwise

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15 2018 0:53 utc | 112


I remember reading Deng Xiao Ping said he did not know what socialism really was. In the end he decided it made no difference if it was black cat or a white cat so long as it was a good cat.

One thing China is is authoritarian. No rights there especially for the many migrant workers. Their social welfare system seems modelled after the US system but without the efficiency

As for their capitalism. Here are some excerpts from a Hudson interview

"Shanghai is where Milton Friedman and the Chicago Boys came in the 1970s and early 80s, because the Chinese government worried that if western Marxists came over, they would tend to interfere with domestic Chinese politics. So actually, China had less exposure to foreign Marxian economics than to U.S.-style neoliberal teaching."

"Meanwhile, there’s a shift going on in China now, and the political attitude of the students I talked to is quite different from what it was a decade ago, when students really thought that they could change the country and get rid of corruption. OK, they’ve cracked down on corruption. They put in bureaucracy. But now they’re faced with a problem that their students have all been sent to America to study economics and come back and ask “How do we get a free market?”

I couldn’t believe that students in China were asking me about a free market. But that idea led President Xi a few months ago to say they’re thinking of letting in American and European banks. Well, I think this would be a disaster. If you let in the American and foreign banks, their product is debt! What are they going to lend money for?"

"Paul Sliker: I wanted to ask you specifically about the issue of debt in China. Their private debt bubble is basically the biggest in the history of capitalism. I think the 2017 numbers had it at about 220% of GDP. So what do you think is going to happen there with the broader economy?

Michael Hudson: Under current conditions nothing. It’s not a problem. Here’s why: The debts are owed to government banks. A government can do what the U.S. can’t do. The government can forgive debts, at least those that are owed to itself, without creating a political backlash. If a viable corporation has run up too much debt, the government can forgive it. This is better than letting the debt close down a factory or force it be sold to a predatory asset management firm as occurs in the United States. That is the advantage of having public credit and why credit should be public. That’s how it was in Babylonia. Rulers were able to cancel debts all the time in the 3rd millennium and 2nd millennium BC, because most debts were owed to the palace or the temples. Rulers were cancelling debts owed to themselves.

China can cancel business debt owed to itself. It can proclaim a clean slate. It can minimize debt service to whatever it chooses. But imagine if Chase Manhattan and Goldman Sachs are let in. It would be much harder for the government to raise real estate taxes leading to defaults on the banks. It could save the occupants by making new loans to those who default – based on lower land prices.

Well, you can imagine the international furor that would erupt. Trump would threaten to atom bomb Peking and Shanghai to save his constituency. His constituency and that of the Democrats are the same: Wall Street and the One Percent. So China may lose its ability to write down debts if it lets in foreign banks. That was what the big political discussion was when did discuss economics at the Chinese Academy of Sciences in Beijing and in Tianjin, where we’re going to have a conference on Fictitious Capital in October."

So whats that all mean? I think it means China is capitalist, but less further along the neoliberal path than the West. It is certainly not socialist IMO, at least not as most commonly envision it. China has its own oligarchs who are mostly members of the minority in the CCP. Unlike Russia they maintained more state control of the economy including the central bank and controlled its currency and capital flows.

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15 2018 1:17 utc | 113

Pft @113. Thanks for that. There's been an interesting evolution here on MoA. Almost all of us agree that the AZ Empire is evil. Most believe that China, Russia and Islamic Iran are genuine competitors/opponents of the Empire.

But some have taken to believing that therefore, those societies are vastly superior.

In some (and different) ways I reckon each of them is better for the 99%. But the truth is that each is at least as authoritarian as the AZ Empire... and in some ways, much more so.

Sure, there's a lot of propaganda to cut through, but that's true on the pro- and anti- sides. eg. I've mentioned before that most of the propaganda I see on RT is not in what they're reporting - which is overall quite objective - but in what they don't report. Well, the sure do a lot of negative reporting about pipeline construction in the US and Canada... but nary a word about Russian pipelines.

If we are to create a better world for the 99% (and if that's not a purpose, then why are we even discussing this stuff?), then we cannot be blind to the realities of existing societies.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 15 2018 4:42 utc | 114

Hoars, and other fans of our Reality TV Show President.
I don’t so much love it when Trump fans keep moving the goal posts to maintain hope for change.
Posted by: Daniel | Aug 14, 2018 2:57:21 PM | 101

That's quite a long Trump Shouldn't Have list.
But it's easy to snipe from the sidelines. If you have a 10/ 20/ (?) point Drain The Swamp plan which feels superior to Trump's (undisclosed) plan would you be so kind as to share it here?

If you can make it sound practical and easy I'll reconsider my Hopiness in Trump, goal posts notwithstanding:-)

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 15 2018 6:59 utc | 115

@Pft | Aug 14, 2018 8:32:52 PM | 111

[Litany of transactions currently done with USD]

When these are done, then what? Will the foreigners come back for some more USD, when the U.S. is obviously printing it? Of course not. Thus the conditions for hyperinflation will ensue: the other countries will refuse to take more dollars, and the U.S. will continue printing more. As you say, the U.S. won't be bankrupt, but the suffering will still be yuge (as Trump would say).

Posted by: Cyril | Aug 15 2018 6:59 utc | 116

@sleepy | Aug 14, 2018 7:47:26 PM | 108

If the US at some point is forced to pay war reparations denominated in gold or in some other currency pegged to gold there will indeed be hyperinflation in the US. The Weimar "lesson" is only that.

There are always some people who are determined to learn the wrong lesson from history.

Posted by: Cyril | Aug 15 2018 7:02 utc | 117

The above gen comments sound rather defeatist, and apathetic ! Why would enyone wish to continue with this disfunctional USA status qou. Trillions squnderd on death and destruction instead of posative projects. The us uncaring in-deference to the world population and planet. I could weep.
That misguided sense of infallibility is mind boggling dissolutional. America is a tiny minority group. Who have sown the seed corn of abject hatred toward itself through out the world.
And yet you could be a good nabour living as part of a good globle comunity.
Just shows---- you can take the man out of the ghetto , but can you take the ghetto out of the man.if not America is about to become extinct.

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 9:21 utc | 118

The grapes of wrath !

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 9:25 utc | 119

Pft@ 113

I remember reading Deng Xiao Ping said he did not know what socialism really was. In the end he decided it made no difference if it was black cat or a white cat so long as it was a good cat.

Here your memory definitely fails you or you willinly mis-appopriate Deng's words: The famous “white-cat black cat“ is about economic reform models that Deng was talking about, not as you clamed “he didin't know what socialism really was“.

Deng also said people who have got rich first (thanks to “cat-theory“ aka reform and open policy) should help those left behind poor ones to become rich/prosperous as well. This is what Xi and CPC are doing now. Their tarhet is eliminate absolute poverty in China by 2020. Does it sound like real capitalist system?

China's social welfare system has been built on models from Western, for example, the universal health insurance that covers everyone is surely not a US model.

That being said, there are quite a bunch intelligentsia (profesors, journalists, etc.) are totally brainwashed by ifukus' ideology, some of them act as the fifth column for their masters in Western, which poses real danger to China's search of her own development path and independence.

Posted by: Mali | Aug 15 2018 9:55 utc | 120

Their tarhet = their target

Posted by: Mali | Aug 15 2018 9:57 utc | 121

Mali @ 121
I get a feeling the west could learn of good things from China . And perhaps m o a could learn a lot from you ! We tend to focus on the negative aspects here, I would love to here posative ways forward, tell me more!

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 10:26 utc | 122


Read Henry Wangs Socialism and Governance . Its a bit pricey if evan available now so I quote

"The problem is what-socialism-is and how-to-build-socialism. We have had a lot of experiences and lessons, the most important one is to understand clearly this problem (Deng, 1993, p. 116). 'We have summed up dozens of years of experiences in practicing socialism. What socialism is, what Marxism is, in the past we did not know clearly' (ibid., p. 137). 50 'What exactly socialism looks like, the Soviet Union experimented for many years, and they did not know clearly either' (ibid., 139). He also told visiting African leaders that 'I can't tell you what socialism is exactly; don't practice so-called socialism in your country.'51

Zhao Ziyang, the premier-turned General Secretary of the Party said, 'what is socialism? No one can clearly define it.'52

Deng seemed to have understood socialism during his South Speech in 1992. He said, the fundamental task of socialism is to develop and liberate productive forces. Note that Mao also wanted to develop and liberate productive forces.

For Mao, it is capitalist ideology that needs to be destroyed in order to develop and liberate productive forces. For Deng, it is the so-called 'socialist' elements, arrangements, institutions that are effectively fetters of productive forces and should be reformed away.

Nothing should constrain the development of productive forces. Anything that constrains it should be done away with. This is the essence of Deng Xiaoping Theory. Deng's cat theory is very well known and often cited: 'no matter whether it is white or black, it is a good cat if it catches the mouse.' In light of Deng's South Speech, his cat theory can be reformulated as, 'no matter whether it is socialist or capitalist, it is a good practice if it promotes development.' Paradoxically, this seemingly 'un-Marxist' view is truly Marxist. For, whatever is said to be 'socialist' or 'capitalist' is only made so by (mental) definitions. And different people can have different definitions. Thus, only the practice criterion is a reliable one."

As for Chinas HC system its insurance based ( capitalist) and not universal (socialist) based.

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15 2018 12:11 utc | 123

spudski@57, Pft@67, be@70:

Before jump to your comclusions, do your know how Turkey has been supporting Uighur separatists and TIP terrorists for decades? Are you fully aware how Turkey has been facilitating tens of thousands Uighur (20,000 ~50,000) to become jihadists mercenaries fighting in Syria? When China tried to stop this type illegal activities, UN and MSM were “comcerned“ and Turki mobs went to beat Chinese tourists and threw stones at Chinese embassy? Maybe this non issue for you since China is “evil commie“ country?

Here is some info I posted in other topic, just in case you're interested to inform yourselves a litle bit:

- Pres. Erdogan had allowed them Turkish passports, which they used to pass legally through Central Asia to arrive in Turkey. The immigration officials at the airport in Turkey recognized these special passports, and would confiscate them, but allow the Chinese to pass through legally and enter Turkey. Pres. Erdogan had arranged for them to be transported from the airport in Turkey into Syria through the large and porous border area North of Idlib, which was once a mid-size town in North West Syria. In the Zeytinburnu distict of Stabil, Nurali T., a Uyghur Turk working to transport terrorists into Syria, with implicit allowance of the Turkish government, and especially the Turkish Intelligence Services, provides militants with passports worldwide. According to Nurali T.'s office manager, "More than 50,000 Uyghur Turks came to Turkey with these fake passports from China via Thailand and Malaysia and entered Syria after staying a day in Istanbul".

- Turkey angered and UN comcerned when China tries to stop Uighur from becoming jihadists to go fight in Syria

- T
Use fake news to attack Chinese tourists and Chinese resturant in Turkey>

Please tell me how China should “buy Turkish lira off the market“ to save Turkey when it acts agsinst China's national interests and security?

Posted by: mali | Aug 15 2018 12:40 utc | 124


I dont believe the model we are looking for exists. We can not look to copy. We must articulate what the model society should encompass. Morality, freedom, equality (including income/wealth), peace, human rights, etc.

I found the series on islamic socialism on saker interesting and leads me to believe a theocratic control on secular governance is essential. Interesting that Russia is embracing orthodox Christianity after 70+ years of communist rule , and that has me interested. Christianity in the west has been corrupted and offers no hope. Perhaps the third Rome can resurrect the morality it preached even if the institutions of western christianity failed. Interesting thoughts for a guy who has not entered a church in over 30 years beyond weddings and funerals. Grasping at straws perhaps. The age of reason and secularism IMO has tended to drift us toward satanism and pathocracy. Its failed miserably.

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15 2018 12:45 utc | 125


We can and should learn from each pther. I've learned quite a bit here.

What amuses/baffles me is that lots of ppl who post at MOA are hapily regurgitate and accept what the Western MSM spoon-fed propoganda (ranging from total misleading to boldfaced lies) about China/Chinese without any critical thinking while they are on high alert about MSM when comes to Russiagate/Trump & election/Skripal poison/Syrian war/Iran. Is it because of ideology (evil commie China) and/or racial prejudice and/or culture difference?

Posted by: mali | Aug 15 2018 13:02 utc | 126

Iran now says "no negotiation, no war".

They have apparently backed away from the threat to close the Strait of Hormuz. This demonstrates BOTH the strength of Chinese support and Chinese diplomacy.

Iran can't sell oil to China if the Straits are closed and China will need that oil if US-allied energy sources stop selling oil to China.

The reduced belligerence is also smart in that it helps China to rally other countries to support Iran.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 15 2018 15:24 utc | 127


Allow me to share with you and all MOAers one golden rule about how to judge a leader via MSM lenses: When Western MSM heaps praises upon a leader from a (ex-)commie country or any independent-mind country, you can be almost100% sure that he/she does the iFukus' bidding, wittingly or unwittingly, Deng has never; IF Western MSM demonises a leader, you can be sure as hell that he/she hinders the Western rentier capitalist aka deep state/zioanglo ruling class/whateverothername you prefer from profiteering/ripping his/her country.

The love/praise/adulation from MSM towards Gorbachov, Yeltsin, Saudi prince MBS,Zhao Ziyang almost-succeeded-Chinese-Gorbachov vs the demonisation from MSM towards Stalin, Mao, Hugo Chavez, Assad, Putin, just name a few. You take your picks, you make your mind.

Now back to Deng and Zhao. Why Zhao Ziyang was put house arrest after 1989 student movement reflects patially what you mentioned above. When the General Secretary of the Party lost his faith, then he should go.

Btw, Zhao had been hand-picked Deng as his successor. Hu Yaobang was another successor sealed by Deng, who ushered in the ruinous ethnicity policy and practices, such as liangshaoyikuan and favorable treatments to the Tibetan and Uighur ex-ruling class aka lamas, imams, and landowner,etc. resulting the still going on separatist movements/terror actions both insider and outsider China, wide spread Saudi-fund mosque-building across China, 20,000 mosques have ben built in Xinjisng alone, rampagerous expansion of Islamisation in China: hala food, hala schools, hala restaurants, even hala benchs prohobiting Han Chinese to sit on! Poor Uighur peasants refuse to move in the free new houses built by the local goverments because imams in the mosques say the houses a not “hala“! Yet we only hear from MSM that China represses the poor Uighurs, Tibetans......

You can see Deng's capability of judgement or lack of it. If think China is no more a socialist but capitalist country with economical inequality with severe enviroment pullution and noral decay, then you got Deng to thank for.

Acontrary to Mao, Deng has never been famous for theory/philosophical thinking. He is pragmatic at best, intellectually lazy at worst, though unwaveringly emphasising all Chinese should get on the development train with noone left behind. Rampant corruption is one of his legacy, which is Nr. One complain (not freedom of speech or democratic election that MSM leads you to believe) Chinese have against the government. Xi trying to correct many of his disaterous legacies (coruption, food safty, enviroment damage, totally brainwashed Western-ideology-worshiping Chinese inteligentsia/media/academy/film/music/tv, lost of faith of average cpc members), which makes him a target by MSM attacking because they (both Western and Chinese capitalists) want China to follow the US way: legalise bribery aka lobby, “democratic election“ aka money takes control of everythong.

There was and is always difference about how to develop China among top party cadres. Mao wanted to industrilise China but not at the expense of its sovereignty and independence including ideology. Deng less so. MSM uses open-door“ to praise Deng and his era, which is misleading with the connotation that Mao was inward looking, backward and narrow minded nationalist.

The fact can not be further away: 1. US & Co embargoed/sanctioned Mao's China for over 30 years bust as they have been sanctioning N. Korea, Syria and partially Russia. 2. Mao laid the ground for normalisation of Sino-US relationship: He openly critised Khrushchev betray of Lenin/Stalin/Marxism at the end of 1950s - early 1960s, refused Khrushchev request to station army in China, and then fought a border war against USSR which led US realised it could form alliance against USSR. It's not Kissinger's genius to pry Chinay away from USSR.

Now got to stop here. FYI, recently the ex-husband of Deng's granddaught is sentenced to jail for corruption. When talk about corruption, Deng's kids are among the most corrupt red princes/princelings. Zhao Ziyang's also when he was in power. Both were the targets of 1989 protest.

Posted by: mali | Aug 15 2018 15:32 utc | 128


“Deng has never“ in the middle of first paragraph should be deleted. Please ignore it.

Posted by: mali | Aug 15 2018 15:38 utc | 129

Mali @ 126
The public are a bit like a computer, they can only compute useing the information given them , which is in this case ether false or absent ! If they think something is complicated they switch off completly. Both of those are encouraged by our govenment. Normally it would'nt be a problem, but TheUS has murderd 20million people since th last world war ! We need the for sight (as a globle comunity) to stop them. China can help this, by pushing back along with Russia . Bully's are cowards always .

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 15:46 utc | 130

Correctoion 2:

- “Deng has never“ in the middle of 1st paragraph should be deleted, it does not belong there.

It should go to paragraph 6: “Contrary to Mao, Deng has never been famous for theory/philosophical thinking. “

Posted by: mali | Aug 15 2018 16:42 utc | 131

Correction 3:

- Zhao had been hand-picked by Deng as his successor.

- 20,000 mosques have been built in Xinjisng alone

- Poor Uighur peasants refuse to move in the free new houses built by the local goverments because imams in the mosques say the houses not “hala“!

(Side note: Chinese government just started to wake up and try to curb the Wahhabism propagation and stop a illegally built/without permit Saudi-fund mosque, there is massive muslim protest and Western MSM as usual is crying loud about China “violating religious freedom plus the same nonsensical rubbish that government force Uighur eating porks!)

Posted by: Mali | Aug 15 2018 17:15 utc | 132

I bet there all USA freandly rebels, do they have white helmets ?
Same trick in Venezuela and Iran ! Close the door on the yanks don't trade with them and don't touch there banks .
There vermin.

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 17:34 utc | 133

Correction 4:

- 20,000 mosques have been built in Xinjiang alone

- Xi..., which makes him a target of MSM attacking because they (both Western and Chinese capitalists) want China to follow the US way: takes control of everything.

(Side note: Differs to US, central government in China, be it CPC or Emperor, in general makes rules and takes control. The rich Chinese/capitalists and their Western counterparts hate the Chinese system, with the help of their minions in media and academy they have been trying to buy power via bribery/corruption, brainwashing ordinary Chinese how great and advanced the US/Western systems are, and taking every chance to discredit/smear Chinese government/public insitutions such as police, hoslpitals, education system/schools.

If China and its development model fails one day, then it is largely due to the 30+ years' ideological brainwashing work by these “American-in-spirit“ Chinese and their masters in Western, and thanks to Deng's “white-cat black cat pragmatism“, which leads to the total lack of belief/faith of the Party ideology by its members.

The current Premier Li Keqiang was the student to one of the most prominent neoliberal economist Li Yining, professor of Beijing University, who has been a leading voice for the privatization of state-owned companies and is called Mr. Stockmarket.

So far Premier Li's finance innovation prove to be disater by factually legalising online usury, the next one is disater-in-waiting: allow Western banks aka WSJ predators to establish wholey owned banks/fund management in China. What these shark banksters are going to do? Robbing and asset stripping, just look at what is happening in Greece, in Turkey.

Hope some ppl insider Chinese government understand the dire consequence. Hope Hudson's talk in China may wake up some naive Chinese professors.)

@Mark2: Hope is all we get. Sorry for so negative at this moment.

Posted by: Mamali | Aug 15 2018 18:28 utc | 134

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 15, 2018 2:59:25 AM | 115

undisclosed Drain the Swamp plan

Yes indeed, it's so undisclosed it's been buried in a time capsule, not allowed to be opened until a hundred years after Trump's death.

Posted by: Russ | Aug 15 2018 18:43 utc | 135


Thanks for the information and qutation from Henry Wang. Sorry my @128 went a bit off target.

Just want to say: Deng is not ideology driven, and very flexible about all those theory stuff, which welcome the capitalism with Chinese characteristics to take off while avoiding long and thorough ideology debate, and at the same time the dicarding off the Party ideology resulting in all the problems mentioned in my post @128.

When the Party members don't care about or believe its ideology, it's time for its demise. This was how USSR died out. Deng would have to shoulder his big share for the demise of CPC. Mao saw this kind of reactionary coming and famously said: “Satelite goes up to fly in the sky, Red flag goes down to the earth.“

Deng however pragmatic, intellectually lazy, he was still believing the improvement of life standard for every Chinese. People always keep on citing his cat theory, but seldom/never mention his equally famous phrase “those who
have got rich first should help the rest to get rich as well.“ So when you read English version of his speeches, be aware that the authors tend to select and interpret what he/she believe Deng'essence is.

he used his power to force his opponents such as Chen Yun, who was one of the rauthoritarian way to force his way

Posted by: Mali | Aug 15 2018 19:22 utc | 136


When the peasants and jobless people pay 100-200 Yuan annually (ca 30 USD/year) to get covered up to about 80% for major treatments such as operation, I think it is decent, a mag improvement after Deng's reform killed the socialist universal coverage which left the ordinary people dared to not to become sick.

This why lots of workers hate Deng and Zhu Rongji, another Western MSM favotote, who killed the factories by privatisation, killed their livehood (job/universal health care/free school for their kids, most importantly their pride of feeling the owner of their factories and the purpose of their work.) Those who praise Zhu today are mostly the one who got their first eggs by getting rich through his privatisation.

The remained state-owned companies repatriate their profits back to goverment, which is then used to finance health insurance contribution and pension fund. If in dire short of fund, the government can always demand more from these SOE to contribute more.

The big pharm companies raise their price or stop producing cheap medicines because they are less profitable, the government can negotiate nation-wide price with big pharms, and demand the local Chinese pharm companies to produce the cheap medicines.(very dictatorship, no?)

The worst thing now is hospitals are picking up the tricks from their Western counterpats by scammimg the insurance by requring unnecessary and expensive machine screening/checking and useless treatments, etc.

The big pharm takes their honed skills to bribe the doctors to prescribe the more expensive medicines and to bribe the officials to pittheir medicine on the! Puurchasing lists. GlaxoSmithKline was fined 500 miillion USD for nation-wide bribery in 2014 in China.

Btw, do you guys know that mulrinatipnal companies are the biggest sources of bribery? Pfizer, Morgan Stanley, IBM, Walmart, Alcatel-Lucent, Nike, Avon, Simens, Coca Cola are caught in bribery in China.

Posted by: Mali | Aug 15 2018 20:25 utc | 137

'Cyberberkut' reported on provocation with radioactive substances on Donbass. Ukrainian sabotage group, trained by American instructors, is preparing a provocation.

Read here (in Russian, so use translator).

Posted by: alaff | Aug 15 2018 20:58 utc | 138

Thank you Mali @ 137 & mamali @ 134
I have loved and learned so much from you comments ! I truly beleave as a globle family we can cure the ill's of the world ! Am looking forward to your future comments and views. You gave me posativaty and optimism thank you.

Posted by: Mark2 | Aug 15 2018 21:42 utc | 139

Thank you Mali @ 137 & mamali @ 134

I second the motion. Mali, you rock!

Posted by: Guerrero | Aug 15 2018 22:33 utc | 140


Thanks for the comments.

I do not mean that capitalism is bad. The HC system sounds better than what most have, but keeping it will be tricky. Indeed, Marx always said capitalism is the one path to socialism. Neither China nor Russia have ever had true socialism. Mao was probably closer to it than Lenin/Stalin and Deng but bypassing capitalism was a fatal flaw.

Chinas capitalism is about where the US was before they were hijacked by neoliberalism. China is being driven to neoliberalism . Jury is out on if they can resist the temptation.

The multinationals are the true global elites. Basically run by psychopaths totally devoid of empathy. Hopefully China is listening to Michael Hudson. Bringing him in to teach at Beijing University is a good sign

At the same time their alliance with Eric Prince for Brics Security and entertaining opening the doors to the international banksters is worrisome. Keeping control of the Central Bank and onshore RMB is essential

As for the SOE's, Wang describes the looting by the party elite. They are basically Part Owned more so than State (by the people) Owned. Profits have been siphoned off unless they have stopped that

Posted by: Pft | Aug 16 2018 2:24 utc | 141

@ Pft who wrote: " The multinationals are the true global elites. "

I beg to differ.

I think you are at least one level too low.

The multinationals would not exist if the Western world of finance was not in control of their lifeblood.

The Western world of finance is private and owned by the real global elite of your attempted assertion.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Aug 16 2018 6:13 utc | 142

Posted by: Pft | Aug 15, 2018 8:45:10 AM | 125

"I dont believe the model we are looking for exists. We can not look to copy. We must articulate what the model society should encompass. Morality, freedom, equality (including income/wealth), peace, human rights, etc."

Yes. I absolutely concur on all counts. There is no “perfect” government, and never will be. It’s all about evolving and progressing, as the Framers of the US Constitution spelled out, “to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity.”

That’s one of the things Karl Marx got exactly right. He was all about social evolution as progress.

There are certainly things we can (and should) learn from previous and contemporary governments, but none should be copy-pasted as is.

I will take exception to your proscription, though.

"I found the series on islamic socialism on saker interesting and leads me to believe a theocratic control on secular governance is essential."

That is precisely what that paid propagandist of the Islamic (republic) of Iran intended for you to conclude.

I presume you missed it, but I tried on numerous occasions to have a discussion about the misrepresentations, ahistoric obfuscations and outright lies Mazaheri wrote in that series.

Suffice it to say that the Islamic Republic of Iran falls short (if not flat) on each of your aspirational goals. Unless you think sentencing teenagers to 90 lashes for dancing is moral. Because that is precisely what Mazaheri's beloved Basij enforces.

One must ask what sort of government imprisons, tortures and kills leftists for the crime of having socialist books in their private libraries. I don’t think those are amongst our shared goals.

So, I propose asking why even a theocracy can sound like a viable alternative.

The AZ Empire, and capitalism in general, are not simply amoral, but are fundamentally immoral. In fact, the Western system seeks to undermine all sound, socially responsible morality. The Western capitalist system celebrates and rewards the most profoundly sociopathic/psychopathic behaviors, and punishes or at least ridicules those who live and teach sound moral values. As Mao said, “the personality of a people reflects that of its leaders.”

And so, both must - and will - go. But that doesn’t mean reverting back to theocracy is a viable, long term solution. Progress, not regress. For decades, I mouthed the truism that “you can’t legislate morality.” I came to realize that is not at all true. In fact, I suggest that all just laws are about enforced morality.

Morals are taught (I actually believe morality is exactly analogous to language, but that’s another discussion). But moral behavior can be enforced through social and even governmental pressure. Though I’m certain that if we teach, practice and reward moral behavior, we won’t have to rely on the threats and punishments of government to enforce sound moral behavior very often.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16 2018 6:51 utc | 143

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 15, 2018 2:59:25 AM | 115

"If you have a 10/ 20/ (?) point Drain The Swamp plan which feels superior to Trump's (undisclosed) plan would you be so kind as to share it here?"

First, almost everything I listed were things that the Trump Administration did, which Candidate Trump and Trump Fans had previously held the opposite views on. It’s that goal post moving I addressed. It's the exact same thing I saw from Obama/HRC supporters.

Draining the Swamp should be pretty straightforward.

1. “You’re Fired!!!” all those Goldman Sachs and other supra-national banksters he hired.

2. “You’re Fired!!!” all those MIC and extraction industry profiteers he hired.

3. Hire people with track records of working for the 99%.

4. If the Swamp means anything, it must include all corrupt officials. So, use the “bully pulpit” to call for Congress to ban all forms of political bribery. From campaign donations (and the newish one of donations to the Inauguration festivities), to lucrative post-public service scams as consulting, speaking fees, lobbying (including family and associates as in Chelsea Clinton getting a $600,000/year “no show” job with NBC) to “junkets’ (like the all expense paid trips to Israel for every new Congress).

5. Shut down most of the "17 Intelligence Agencies" that are supposed to answer to the President, and create a genuinely accountable intelligence apparatus.

There's more I'd like to see a President do, and still more that Constitutionally should not be in the Executive's wheelhouse, but you specified "drain the swamp."

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16 2018 7:09 utc | 144


I respect your opinion. You are one of the more intelligent posters here. I dont really know much about Iran or Russia first hand. Perhaps theocracy is not the best way to put it.

What I am trying to convey is simply that we should all agree on fundamental basic human rights that are enforced by an independent branch of government beyond what we have today. Today we seem subject to a pathocracy. Evil is permitted by law. In the so called Dark Ages mans law could not go against the Mosaic Law enforced by the Church. As an institution the Church was imperfect, but Church and state made a good team IMO (contrary to reformation revisionism that is embraced today)

In the US the courts interpret the constitution and laws approved by government to determine what is lawful. There is no constraints from a moral perspective. From 1945-1952 we killed millions of civilians with napalm, bombs and nukes against enemies who were all but defeated and defenseless

Some say we should trust in logic, reason and science. But when these same people give us false economic statistics and fake science (Monsanto, Etc) perhaps that is not enough.

My mind is open. As long as its a good cat I am for it

Posted by: Pft | Aug 16 2018 12:22 utc | 145


The western world of finance are multinationals and interlocked with the non financial multi nationsls. They are one and the same

Posted by: Pft | Aug 16 2018 12:28 utc | 146

A moral govt is a good thing but the problem with religion in govt is: whose religion?

The problem with democracy is agency. Do your representatives really represent you?

Direct democracy helps to solve these problems. But it requires an infrastructure that keeps people informed and engaged.

The Pirate Party is a step in that direction. Their representatives cast votes based solely on votes received from their constituents. And blockchain-based voting systems are coming soon.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Aug 16 2018 12:55 utc | 147

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16, 2018 3:09:30 AM | 144
(Daniel's Drain The Swamp plan - basics)

Thank you, Daniel, for responding to my request to share your DTS plan @ MoA. I'm not in a position to nitpick it because I don't have a DTS plan of my own and know no more than anyone else about Trump's plan - which possibly makes yours the first itemised DTS plan, in writing, on the www?

Thanks again.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 16 2018 14:25 utc | 148

I google 90 lashes for dancing and the only sources were nytimes guardian and bbc
color me not surprised
also this is the same ews outlets which spread around that a women cheating on her husband was going to get stoned back in 2008 and many activist and even the french president I think Sarkozy signed a petition to stop the ruling and to call for her asylum in the west
when it turns out that she and her lover killed her husband and were sentenced to jail and there isnt a stoning ruling in IIR
and the one speaking to the western journos was her nephew who wasnt persecuted eventhough he created shitstorm of problem in the international sphere
Also nobody apologized after the truth was out
I read this report on the saker , I will try to find it

Posted by: occidentosis | Aug 16 2018 15:51 utc | 149

Bibi has made a fool of himself ... again.
He chimed in to the Corbyn "anti-Semite" fiasco on the subject of a memorial ceremony and got every factoid he could possibly have got wrong, wrong. He's currently fending off unsubtle observations that a person who defends and celebrates the mass murder of unarmed protestors shouldn't be pointing fingers or lecturing anyone on Morality.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 16 2018 16:49 utc | 150

Thanks,, Pft @145… and back atcha.

It’s fascinating that feudalism is being refurbished. I first started hearing that from apologists for the Catholic Church a decade or so ago. I’m trying to remember the name of the guy who began revising that history. An Irish-American if I recall. He strikes me as Opus Dei to the core.

Yes, the church helped mitigate some of the worst excesses of feudalism, at least some of the time for some of the people. But, the superstition that building fires cast out the demonic spirits that caused plagues also apparently helped prevent some people from becoming ill some of the time. Today, we know a lot more about disease, and we should know a lot more about how to structure society so as to promote sound morals. Progress, not regress remains my mantra.

I agree that we, the people should establish a moral code, which could be enforced by our government when the normal cultural and social constraints fail. I would suggest that morality should be built into every aspect of our lives and every branch of our government. Creating a new, fourth branch of religious morality would strike me as counter-productive. That is, much like how the worst sinners attend church each Sunday, separating moral codes from the other branches of government would make it easier to compartmentalize them.

Sound, socially-beneficial morality should be part and parcel of every aspect of our lives. Anthropological and primatological studies suggest that a constant moral structure is a significant part of “human nature.” It is therefore the deliberate erasure of morality by the 0.1% that creates both the widespread immoral behaviors we see and the desperate longing we feel.

The 0.1% psychopaths likely know this, and they manipulate that universal longing by blaming other factors for the “breakdown of society.” I see calls for a return to theocracy as an example of that manipulation of genuine emotional longing. A favorite false cause is the “breakdown of the nuclear family,” which, while having some basis, is really specious. But once again, I’m being too wordy, so I’ll stop here.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16 2018 21:42 utc | 151

Hoarsewhisperer. And thank you. I hadn't appreciated what a perfect PR/Marketing slogan, "Drain the Swamp" is until challenged by you to describe how to do it.

It's like "Feel Fresher!" What the heck does that mean, and how would one measure "Freshness" to test the claim? I've always credited the Trump Team with "creative" sloganeering, but this one exceeds even their standards. Here we are, going on 2 years into the "Drain The Swamp" Administration, and as you note, the Trump Administration hasn't even proposed a single plan.

I guess we can assume that none of the things this Administration has actually done fits into whatever definition they may one day specify.

And yeah, I saw NuttyYahoo railing on about Corbyn. I fear it will be just as effective as all of these targeted messages. His audience lives in their bubble. I think more damaging is the Blairite Labour crowd not just jumping on this auntie semite wagon, but cracking the whips to drive it... off a cliff.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16 2018 22:05 utc | 152

occidentosis @149

Yep. There's plenty of propaganda on all sides. Are you surprised that Iranian state media does not brag about such regressive laws and punishments? These sorts of things really are on their law books.

I saw the 90 lashes for dancing sentence on PBS Frontline. You can watch the whole program, of which that is one small segment.

You can see the kids dancing video and see them apologizing for their sin.

The cleric generously suspended the sentence. Allah Akbar!

Here's an Iranian actress arrested for scenes she shot in a film in Australia.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16 2018 22:14 utc | 153

I've always credited the Trump Team with "creative" sloganeering, but this one exceeds even their standards. Here we are, going on 2 years into the "Drain The Swamp" Administration, and as you note, the Trump Administration hasn't even proposed a single plan.
Posted by: Daniel | Aug 16, 2018 6:05:57 PM | 152

Trump is, imo, much smarter than 99% of people, including me.
He'd be foolish to articulate any kind of DTS plan. If he did he could be JFK'd. His perceived smartness plus his obvious interest in, and understanding of, the background complexities of Govt, are the foundations of my Hopiness.

Your contribution is important because it is A DTS plan where none existed before. A plan can be expanded and fine-tuned.
(Hopefully) relevant is this extract from the recent SST article on the revocation of Brennan's security clearance...

"Likely written by White House counsel Donald McGahn, the statement, after its declaration that former CIA employee and director John O. Brennan's security clearance was going to be revoked, concluded with a teaser at the end. Since he has show business experience, Donald Trump is doing this one act at a time. He says that he is "evaluating" nine other people to decide whether to revoke their security clearances or prevent them from getting one: James Clapper, James Comey, Michael Hayden, Sally Yates, Susan Rice, Andrew McCabe, Peter Strzok, Lisa Page, and Bruce Ohr.

Another name for such evaulation should be former NSA director Keith Alexander, but so far he has ducked beneath the radar."

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 17 2018 5:34 utc | 154

White House SPOX Huckabee listed each of those names. All names of people who are no longer IN the "swamp," but are outside, peeing into the heated, indoor, gold-plated pool of the Trump Swamp. They're all nasty POSs, but not nearly as dangerous as Bolton or Pompeo, whose positions on US foreign policy are identical.

Yeah, I listened to Obama-bots tell me for 8 years that if President CareBear did the things we want, and that we all believe he really wants in his heart of hearts - he'd have a "Dealy Plaza moment. At least they had actual evidence, like those State Dinner party crashers who SS let actually lay hands on Obama, or the murderer, carrying a handgun who they let onto an elevator with the President, and the multiple gun shots taken at the President's bedroom window, and then letting the guy with the sniper rifle in his trunk to drive away.

Whether real deadly threats or not, my answer to Obama-bots is now perfectly appropriate for you. If a President is afraid to serve the people, he should resign. Instead, he's signed off on the murder of many tens of thousands of innocent civilians in other countries while slashing programs for the 99% of this country.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 17 2018 22:43 utc | 155

I read this link from Reuters about the separation of Church and state in China and harken back to what I was taught was the theory of America's separation of church and state.

The take away quote
Writing in the latest issue of the bi-monthly Communist Party theoretical journal Qiushi, or Seeking Truth, Wang Zuoan, director of the State Administration for Religious Affairs, said China had to remain in charge on religious matters.

“There is no affiliate relationship between our country’s religions and foreign religions. Our country’s religious groups and religious matters do not accept domination by foreign forces,” Wang wrote, without making direct reference to any religion or the talks with the Vatican.

Religion in China has to follow the principle of “Sinification” under the guidance of the party, he added.

China’s constitution proclaims freedom of belief, but in reality the officially atheist ruling Communist Party keeps a tight rein over all religious groups, an area of frequent concern for Western governments and rights groups.

Wang said that China guaranteed the rights of believers, and that it was wrong to believe religion could be left free of government supervision or that it should be forcefully curbed or even wiped out.

Still, religion should not be allowed to interfere in administrative, legal or education matters, he added.

“The separation of government and religion must be upheld,” Wang wrote.

One of my pet peeves is the changing of the original American motto of E Pluribus Unum to In God We Trust in the 1950's

Posted by: psychohistorian | Aug 18 2018 5:51 utc | 156

psychohistorian. I was quite surprised to learn that the only official Motto of the USofA has been "In God We Trust."

It turns out that e Pluribus Unum, while clearly intended by the Founders to serve as our national motto, was never officially proclaimed such. So, when the Cold Warriors proposed In God We Trust, they were really squeezing out the de facto, but unofficial motto.

Posted by: Daniel | Aug 20 2018 1:28 utc | 157

Pft @ 141

Indeed, the cabal of Western ruling class, the elites who control the world via multinationals (banking system/technology/media), and rich Chinese have been desperately trying every means to influence/brainwash/trick/pressure CPC and Chinese people to whole heartily adopt/accept the neoliberalism.

There are prominent professors/experts/media flushing the classrooms, talkshows, newspapers and social media with the neoliberalism 24/7 for more than 30 years.

The turning point came in 2008 when the most admired, or should I say worshiped, WSJ exploded with its "financial innovation" aka subprime debts; and when the self-righteous CNN/BBC/NYT/WaPo & Co peddled boldfaced lies and misinformation about Lhasa Riot and totally biased reports about Olympic Torch Relay around the world. Chinese started to wake up and to rethink and question all these Western economic theories and democracy that had been downing their throats and minds for all these years. A gradual self-confidence in Chinese political and economic models began to take root among Chinese leaders, some business and academic circles.

The temptation and pressure are still extremely high.

Eric Prince has set up a joint venture providing security service with an rich Chinese guy based in HK, the heaven for neoliberalism. This is the typical ruling class aka global elites joining hands in hands to take profits wherever, whenever and however. It's worrisome but also I think he won't get the full access to the Chinese Central Government as he does to USG.

So long CPC is in power, it is relatively safe to say that it takes control of the Central Bank and keeps its eyes onshore RMB. But the potential danger is always a potential brainwashed insider aka Gorbachev might pop out along the way.

Of course, there is some serious corruption inside SOE's, some CEOs and top cadres of some of the big SOEs have been caught and sentenced to jails since Xi's anti-corruption campaign. But the SOE situation is definitely not so bleak as portrayed by Western MSM and academy. There are controlling and supervising bureaus in place oversee these SOEs to make stealing and stripping far more difficult nowadays. As said before, the ruling class, Western and Chinese, want to take hold of the enormous amount of assets as they did with those of USSR in 1990s, so you should read their MSM reports/books/studies with a big pinch of salt. Think of all the dis/misinformation/lies MSM peddle to us about Russiagate/SKripal/Iraq WMD.......

Posted by: lulu | Aug 24 2018 20:50 utc | 158

Correct 5 (sorry for all the errors and unfinished sentences @136):

"he used his power to force his opponents such as Chen Yun, who was one of the real economic expert, to accept his decision. You don't hear any MSM criticize or mention how Deng use authoritarian approach to force his reform."

Side not: Chen Yun is the one who won the important Shanghai Financial War in 1949/50, which was valued by Mao as no less important than Huaihai Campaign, by totally crashing the financial speculators.

Shanghai was liberated on May 27th, 1949 but without much left. The US supported Chiang Kai Shek and his Kumingtang government took not only gold (4.5 million teal), silver, USD and antiques (700,000 pieces of ancient Chinese imperial artifacts and artworks are now at Taipei's National Palace Museum), but also machinery, basically anything they could get their hands on, to Taiwan.

The new currency RMB issued by CPC government on June 1st. Within a few days RMB devaluated by 10 times against silver dollar on the black market. The major department stores refused to accept it. People exchanged it into gold or silver dollar. The new government put 410,000 silver dollar into circulation on June 5th and 6th but they disappeared immediately.

A bunch of financial speculators, gangsters and KMT left-behinds were gathering everyday at the old stock exchange to secretly decide the exchange rate of gold/silver/$ to try destroy the new currency and government. Once this plot was detected, the CPC government swiftly banned the black market and arrested all the financial manipulators.

The exchange rate between silver dollar and RMB fell from 1:2000 to 1:500 within three days. Silver dollar totally disappeared after one month.

Due to the new RMB devaluation and profiteers hoarding, the price of rice quadrupled, flour/cotton/coal doubled or tripled in June and July. New government put 100 million jin (50m kg) food and tens of tons coal into the market, but they all disappeared within a day. The KMT left-behind spies and profiteers publicly claimed they'd destroy CPC by controlling of the rice/cotton/coal, key materials to people's daily life and factories' production.

With the coordination of central and local governments, Chen Yun transported large amount of rice, cotton and coal from other provinces to Shanghai. In November, the Central Financial Committee decided to flood the market with all these materials with low prices set by the government, which led to the price of rice down by 1/3 at the same day, another 1/3 three days' later; price of cooking oil down by 1/2, those of coal and cotton basically down to the normal level. Profiteers who had been dreaming of making big money got a crashing defeat, lots of them went belly up.

No surprise nowadays we see tons of curses and smearings against CPC, Mao and his comrades online. Guess must come from the descendants of those speculators/profiteers and KMT leftovers.

Mark2 @139 and Guerrero @140, you've been far too generous to me. I've learned quite a lot from you. Thank you.

Pft: To know a little bit what Deng Xiaopin really is, take a look of the article written by his long-year English translator Zhang Weiwei:My Personal Memories as Deng Xiaoping’s Interpreter: From Oriana Fallaci to Kim Il-sung to Gorbachev

Zhang had a famous discussion with Francis Fukuyama in 2011, rebutting Liberal democracy may be right for the West, but would be wrong for China. If you have time, I'd strongly recommend you read it.

Posted by: lulu | Aug 24 2018 23:18 utc | 159

Just come across one of Zhang Weiwei's speech in English on youtube: Liberal democracy may be right for the West, but would be wrong for China

Posted by: lulu | Aug 24 2018 23:55 utc | 160

« previous page

The comments to this entry are closed.