d notice
simple and effective
it has a chilling effect

the gladio diversion crew productions have moved on today it is the knife crime menace in london.
all contained on the salisbury front no dissent in the media places that count.

move along please

Posted by: dr sapperstein | Apr 5 2018 19:58 utc | 1

Highly Likely is Extremely Likely a Lie.

UK is definitely evil.

The Atlantic Alliance is definitely evil.

Thou Shalt Not Bear False Witness Against Thy Neighbor--a mortal sin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9cPnL6ep7E

Posted by: Red Ryder | Apr 5 2018 20:06 utc | 2

Thanks for continuing to hammer on this perfidy by the British puppets and their masters.

At the end of your posting you asked what the British government will do to get out of this situation and I can only expect them to try and top the situation with something to shift focus and so it has to be Huuuuuuge....and not likely in a good way....sigh

When do the aliens come in and save us from our species stupidity?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 5 2018 20:08 utc | 3

Only a top to bottom regime change will make Britain great again.

Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Apr 5 2018 20:08 utc | 4

The Telegraph today answered critics that are demanding proof, saying that no beyond-a-reasonable-doubt proof is required because governments are not held to that standard.

So what standard should a government be held to a) by other governments? And b) by the people that they represent? They didn’t bother to say but the impression I got is “trust us”. They are tone deaf. Public trust is worn thin. Do they think we have forgotten being lied into Iraq? Their incessant spying and propaganda? Western support for ISIS criminality? Clinton-DNC collusion? And much more!

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Apr 5 2018 20:16 utc | 5

The link to Sputnik has a link to the video of the Russian TV show but no English subtitles. Is the an English transcription anywhere?
According to the transcription of the recorded conversation, it is Yulia initiated the phone call and I would think it was the UK that recorded the call and sent it to Russian TV. I would guess the Skripals and the policeman would have a full time minder at their sides to ensure they say nothing that busts the narrative.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Apr 5 2018 20:18 utc | 6

As said before, no #Novichok was used. The Skripals could recover.Now the relative in Moskow asked, what was the order in the restaurant Zizzi. I think it was severe illness after Meal mess. Toad in the Pond? Not on the list of Zizzi.

Posted by: Gerd Müller | Apr 5 2018 20:20 utc | 7

does salmonella cause frothing of the mouth? botulism? I don't think so. Both can be deadly though

Posted by: mischi | Apr 5 2018 20:25 utc | 8

The Britsh police have finally started a proper investigation. It has had immediate results, when absolute proof of Russia's involvement was found under the bench where the Skirpals fell unconscious.

https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/a073irl/78622176/268527/268527_600.jpg

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 5 2018 20:26 utc | 9

The cracks are starting to show. No evidence. No serious facts. We continue on regardless pumping out the big lies.....Do they think we don't remember Tony Blair on Iraq, the rush into Afghanistan, the wilful destruction of Libya, which once had the highest human development index in Africa, the near destruction of Syria triggering a huge migrant crisis. The HMG view on all of these has been an inversion of the truth. I stopped beleiving anything any British government says to me after Iraq, and my default setting on this affair was 'false flag'. The Russian ambassador was given over ninety minutes of airtime this afternoon on Sky and acquitted himself very well, posing, to a Brit, very logical and sensible questions. When is he going to move Writ of Habeus Corpus for the Skripals? The guy has quite a sense of humour and the irony would be sublime...

Posted by: Emmanuel Goldstein | Apr 5 2018 20:57 utc | 10

So there we were after 1 month waiting for a man with a name and a job title to actually say it was Novichok, and finally one came along presented as the head of Porton Down.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/garyaitkenhead/
Turns out:
He heads up dstl, not Porton Down, but the holding group that owns Porton Down
His background is Telecoms not chemistry, and commercial not scientific.
He left the private sector to joined dstl only in December 2017 - barely got his feet behind the desk

Shame Sky didn't bother to ask if he works in Porton Down - I doubt he does.
Even greater shame no one has asked for a chemist from Porton Down to speak up. Maybe Corbyn will ask that, but right now the pro-Israel lobby is flat out to shut him up in case he mentions Palestine.

Posted by: michael d | Apr 5 2018 20:57 utc | 11

So, let me get this straight in my head for once. The Brits 'knew' even before this incident that Russia had been experimenting with doorknobs as delivery agents of this novichok stuff, yet it took them weeks, and dozens of alternate theories, to yell 'eureka, I finally have it. I'll go test the doorknobs now.'

Yep, that makes sense.

Posted by: Reality Check | Apr 5 2018 20:57 utc | 12

"We knew... pretty much... likely".

That really says it all.

Posted by: Tom Welsh | Apr 5 2018 21:01 utc | 13

Link to English language transcript for Yulia's phone conversation-

http://theduran.com/breaking-yulia-skripal-phone-call-leaked-everyones-health-is-fine-will-be-discharged-soon/

Posted by: Somebody | Apr 5 2018 21:02 utc | 14

It were the lies of Theresa May and Boris Johnson that convinced the other countries, not any factual evidence...
______________________________________________

True enough, but I think it's more correct to say that the lies coerced the other countries rather than "convinced" them.

That is, they weren't "convinced" in the sense of "rationally persuaded". They were "convinced" the way fictional Mafia Don "convinced" stubborn or reluctant parties by "making them an offer they can't refuse".

As I say, perhaps this is just a matter of semantics. I suppose that if one tells lies while twisting one's interlocutor's arm sharply, the interlocutor may be "convinced" as much by the pain as the merits of the lies.

I think the feckless response is driven by seeing the handwriting on the wall, not necessarily believing what's being written.

Posted by: Ort | Apr 5 2018 21:04 utc | 15

the uk gov't is in trouble.. no amount of msm cover up is going to work.. they are on shaky ground..

as karlof1 shared earlier on the previous thread - craig murray is all over this doorknob bs and more..

Posted by: james | Apr 5 2018 21:05 utc | 16

btw - the un speech from the uk and usa were ridiculous... someone ought to get a manuscript of there words earlier today at the un special meeting on this and tear them apart... ripe for the taking...

Posted by: james | Apr 5 2018 21:07 utc | 17

7/8

It might have been pesticide poisoning. If doctors guessed correctly they would have been able to treat it. Pesticide poisening happens a lot by accident in rural households.

Novichok shares characteristics with pesticides so laboratory results may very well be something that can be a pesticide - or Novichok.

The binary versions of the agents reportedly uses acetonitrile and an organic phosphate "that can be disguised as a pesticide precursor."

Mirzayanov gives somewhat different structures for Novichok agents in his autobiography to those which have been identified by Western experts.[53] He makes clear that a large number of compounds were made, and many of the less potent derivatives were reported in the open literature as new organophosphate insecticides,[54] so that the secret chemical weapons program could be disguised as legitimate pesticide research.

Good reminder that we fight bees with a "military grade weapon".

Posted by: somebody | Apr 5 2018 21:14 utc | 18

Boris needs to grow a brain.
"28 other countries have been so convinced..." is a pretty limp-wristed claim to brag about when one considers that if the evidence was overwhelmingly Q.E.D. then 194 other countries would be convinced. And Boris could just STFU and wouldn't need to say anything.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 5 2018 21:20 utc | 19

and what has happened to the pet? how does one spell 'cover up' in the uk??

Posted by: james | Apr 5 2018 21:22 utc | 20

pet- pets...

Posted by: james | Apr 5 2018 21:23 utc | 21

Thank you anonymous #9. I was expecting a mushroom and that reminded me of the passport that survived the 9/11 twin towers attack in the USA.

These malign fools are klutzes and for that we should be either thankful or terrified. My first thought on reading b's headline was a rough Brexit will follow.

Blessings on your day b.

Posted by: flamingo | Apr 5 2018 21:36 utc | 22

So, a tad more than 10% of the countries in the world are going along with this provocation. But, as when Ms. Clinton recently stated that she "won" in all the districts that matter (tripling down on driving that wedge between the "Party of the People" and the actual people), the countries that are playing along are the only ones that matter.

Meanwhile: Syria, Ukraine, Israeli slaughtering of unarmed protesters and passing laws to "finish 1948," Turkey, Honduras, Venezuela, Brazil (coup regime set to imprison second former leftist President), mass labor unrest in France, 3 US States school systems shut down by wild cat strikes, etc. etc. etc.

Oops. My dogs see a squirrel. Gotta go.

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 5 2018 21:39 utc | 23

The only Truth being ascertained in this SNAFU are the lies being unmasked. The diatribes by UK/US "ambassadors" at UNSC are utterly inane compared to Russian rationality. Germany's essentially said UK's provided zero evidence to back its very serious accusations and the vast majority of the world agrees. Past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior, and both the UK and Outlaw US Empire are guilty of casting Big Lies very often to further their Imperialistic Outlaw behavior since 1945--and that's precisely what's being done now.

I think bevin's correct--Brexit, Corbyn and further vilification of Russia are the motives driving this SNAFU.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 5 2018 21:58 utc | 24

Typo: der Stinker heisst Laschet, nicht Laschert.

Posted by: CE | Apr 5 2018 22:04 utc | 25

The OPCW Director has said that "The mandate of the FFM [Fact-Finding Mission] is confined to establishing only the fact of the use of chemical weapons" and not to determine accountability. But the recent meeting on April 4 was to consider the UK charges against Russia, which had EU and US backing.

from a document....
Russia convened an OPCW Special Executive Council meeting in The Hague on April 4, for "addressing the situation around allegations of non-compliance with the Convention made by one State Party against the other State Party with regard to the incident in Salisbury" on March 4. . .here

No doubt Mr. Johnson's remarks were considered and proof demanded. There has been no report on the meeting yet, which should show up here.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 5 2018 22:07 utc | 26

Hi MoA, I wanted to share a funny but tinfoil-y theory that came up on the Russian web very early in the Skripal affair. Briefly, that Novichok was a bogus gas and a KGB psy op to begin with.

https://m.facebook.com/lazarchuk.andrey/posts/2054379401482631

This is a post by a novelist (red flag, I know) with obv. no credibility that claims that Novichok was in fact the name of a KGB operation to locate leakers in their chemical research staff by feeding disinfo about a chemical super-weapon, and that Mirzayanov (an analytical chemist not directly involved in research or production) was ID'd as a leaker as a result, and turned into a disinfo dispenser.

Literally a conspiracy theory (also might be unironic disinfo in itself), but just think how absolutely fucking hilarious it would be if it turned out that (a) novichok really is bogus and (b) without knowing that, the Brits tried a false flag with what they thought was a hype Russian superpoison but was actually rubbish unable of killing a 66 y.o. diabetic.

Also, it does kinda play into OPCW's continued refusal to add Novichok to their CW list, despite years of Mirzayanov's advocacy and even having the formulas.

Posting translation below:

"The tail has wagged the god:

Don't ask for my source, won't give it away anyway. Everything written below is vastly different from what you can find online.

'1. As far back as the early 1980's the Soviet Army stopped considering [chemical weapons] as a worthwhile weapon in a real war. Around 83-84 a decision was made to stop supplying the army with CWs, decreasing operational stocks of it and moving CW from the armed forces to long-term storage and weapon disposal facilies. From that time to 1996 no new CW items were supplied to the army, as well as no instruction materials on usage or defense against them.
2. Mirzoyanov's specialty is analytical chemistry, he was never involved in neither theoretical R&D nor production. He spent the entire 80's in the First Department.
3. In the second half of the 80's KGB launched a wide-scale disinformation operation, which also had a side objective - expose leaks. They developed two dozen bogus but very detailed projects for "new chemical superweapons, which cannot be detected by existing NATO dectors and which is impossible to defend against" (NOVA with its variants, "Novichok" with variants, ASD and others). It was "Novichok" that passed through Mirzoyanov's hands.
4. R&D and production facility in Kantyubek was reoriented from testing and producing CW and BO [military equipment?] to producing herbicides and defoliants - mainly for the cotton industry's needs.
5. Mirzoyanov was immediately identified as a leaker, removed from any materials with a real basis behind them in 1990, and fed a disinformation channel since. In '92 he voluntarily exposed himself by publishing his famous article. Form this moment on "Novichok" reaches the realm of mass media. In '95 NYT writes about the "new Russian superweapon."
6. NATO had spent $10 bln. creating countermeasures for a fake CW.
7. What really happened in Salisbury is absolutely unclear; the victims' behavior, the actions of the police, medics, or special services doesn't all fit into a comprehensible picture. Poisoning by a synthetic neurotoxin, analogous to that of the fugu fish, seems more or less probable.
Summarizing briefly: "Novichok" is not the name of a chemical weapon, but a KGB operation cypher, developed to expose leaks and feed disinformation.'"

Posted by: Galvanise | Apr 5 2018 22:15 utc | 27

*gah, "The tail has wagged the dog", obviously.

Posted by: Galvanise | Apr 5 2018 22:17 utc | 28

Gerd Muller @ 7, Mischi @ 8:

The Skripals apparently ordered seafood risotto at Zizzi's Restaurant in Salisbury. If you look up Zizzi's Restaurant menus on Google, you will see the menus mention risotto with mussels.

Mussels can carry algae-related toxins that can cause (among other things) nausea, vomiting and (depending on the toxin involved) even brain damage, memory loss and death. Usually the symptoms set in about half an hour after eating so knowing when the Skripals had lunch and when they arrived at the park bench is critical.
https://www.emedicinehealth.com/wilderness_shellfish_poisoning_gastrointestinal/article_em.htm#causes_and_symptoms_of_shellfish_poisoning

Unfortunately the table where the Skripals had lunch has now been destroyed. The park bench has been removed from the shopping mall and who knows what state it's in now?

Also what appears to have been ignored in the official account is whether the Skripals had lunch on their own or if there was someone else with them at the cemetery, at the restaurant, at the pub or later in the shopping mall. That someone need not have accompanied them to all four spots where they went on March 4.

Posted by: Jen | Apr 5 2018 22:18 utc | 29

I agree with just about everyone here one way or another, but propaganda works and they have the media - they are scoring points.

I watched the Security Counsel meeting this afternoon and I must say the Russians did not do themselves any favors, he was rambling, sputtering and all over the map. Did not even mention that this agent can be made in many places and other details. The British argument was polished and thorough, it will convince a great many.

They have lost much but not all of their control of the narrative.

Posted by: Babyl-on | Apr 5 2018 22:19 utc | 30

What's really funny and sad is how the story keeps changing.

Do a search for Skripal poisoning and read through the first 2 or 3 pages - you'll see that at various times, it is the Skripal's car door handle, then it is their house door handle, then it is in their buckwheat (grechka).

The car door is problematic - it was raining.

The house door is problematic - since when do both people leaving both grasp the door handle? Unless maybe they're OCD.

The grechka is problematic - how did the policeman get ill?

Seems pretty weak all around, especially now that Porton Down has specifically stated that there is no evidence of manufacture in Russia.

Posted by: c1ue | Apr 5 2018 22:26 utc | 31

The London Times now claims the novichok was made in Russia in the closed town of Shikhany, formerly known as Volsk-18.

Agent used in Salisbury made at Russia's Shikhany military research base: Times - Reuters

(Reuters) - A Russian military research base was identified as the source of the nerve agent used in Salisbury, England, at a British intelligence briefing for the country’s allies, the Times of London reported on Thursday.

The gathering was used to persuade world leaders that Moscow was behind the poisoning and said that the Novichok chemical was produced at the Shikhany facility in southwest Russia, the Times said. The briefing included suggestions that Shikhany had been used during the past decade to test whether the nerve agent could be utilized for assassinations abroad, the newspaper said.

The Guardian made the same claim already on March 14th. I do not know if there is any real information or even guesswork here. Both Britain and Russia may have only one chemical weapons research facility each.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 5 2018 22:33 utc | 32

So now the standard has been lowered to a "plausible" connection to Russia. That allows for wild conjecture that will leave the public even more confused and, ultimately, disinterested. The term "Novi-fog" well describes the Tories' desperate effort to escape blame for their massive screw-up.

Posted by: Rob | Apr 5 2018 22:38 utc | 33

James @ 20, 21: The guinea pigs died from thirst? You'd think if there was nerve gas contamination in the house somewhere, thirst would be the last thing they'd die of.

Even the story about the animals' fate looks as if it had been cobbled together at the last minute.

If police had visited the house on March 4, immediately or almost immediately after the Skripals were found, surely they would have found the animals in good condition? Sergei Skripal had apparently had the animals brought over from Russia at considerable expense to himself. One assumes he must have been quite attached to them. Yet when the animals are found, they are malnourished and starving or dead from thirst?

So what was DS Nick Bailey doing if he didn't go to the house on March 4? When was he stricken with nerve gas poisoning?

Posted by: Jen | Apr 5 2018 22:40 utc | 34

@ Petri Krohn | 32

Its a common Western practice to point finger to enemies military or research facility. They win regardless of circumstances.

a) They have a specific location to point to, which "prove" they have intel.
b) If an enemy refuse access to secure facility, that means "they have something to hide."
c) If an enemy allows access and they find nothing, they simply say enemy "has hidden it somewhere else", plus they can spy on all the other research in that facility.

US does it all the time as well, whether its Iraq, or Iran (Parchin saga is of an epic proportions), etc.

Posted by: Harry | Apr 5 2018 22:54 utc | 35

Only two words: perfidious Albion... always was and always will be.
And this is how the west spins off into the dustbin of history... the newbie way.

Posted by: GoraDiva | Apr 5 2018 22:55 utc | 36

The following is from Ziad at SyrPers:

"Folks, the reason for all this anti-Putin nonsense is the one fact that the Syrian government now holds over 11 British officers who were liaised with the terrorists in the Ghouta. They were captured 2 weeks ago by Syrian Army commandos and are being held in separate jails around the Damascus area inside heavily guarded military bases. The Brits want them badly before they are used to implicate England in the mess it helped to create in Syria. Damascus won’t budge on this issue and, evidently, the English are assuming Moscow is not putting pressure on Dr. Assad to release them to Old Blighty. Too bad. And they were caught out of uniform, such that they could be executed as spies under international law. Isn’t that a howler?"

I posted about this possible angle several days ago when word of captured ZioNATO operatives were more rumor-like; instead, here Ziad makes a definite statement of fact. IMO, if the Syrians do have these spies--and I really hope they do--given the nature of the war waged against Syria, they will not let them go for any bargain.

It seems English speakers are professional prevaricators--I certainly had problems with truth-telling until about age 20. Otherwise, why the myth that the young George Washington being unable to tell a lie? Yet another lie to cover for endless prevarication.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 5 2018 22:59 utc | 37

pretty sure the Russians listed the Shikhany facility for the OPCW when they did their verification and monitoring of Destruction of Russian Chemical warfare stockpiles
Bullshit again , I'm picking, and not even very well researched

Posted by: francesca | Apr 5 2018 23:08 utc | 38

@29
Food poisoning?
Would the police lie? (trick question)
Mar 11, 2018 - Traces of the nerve agent used to poison former Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia has been discovered at the Zizzi restaurant where they last ate, police have said.

Zizzi food poisoning complaints from Trip Advisor (undercooking):
>Zizzi - The Strand
73-75 Strand, London WC2R 0DE, England (Covent Garden)
November 12, 2016 via mobile
Regrettably our visit last night will be the last! Clearly have food poisoning this morning from undercooked chicken in the Strozzapretti Pesto, we didn't have lunch so this can be the only place it's originated from.
Safe to say I'll be stuck in bed today!
>Zizzi Union Square, Aberdeen AB11 5RG, Scotland
Having been to Zizzis in St Andrews on numerous occasions we decided to go here before the cinema . .pizza/calzone and chicken pasta for me...Half an hour into the film my stomach started churning and I felt nauseous. Got home and have had extreme diahorrea and abdo pain all night. Since all I had yesterday was cereal and toast and jam I think it's safe to conclude I picked this up at zizzis. DON'T GO....

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 5 2018 23:08 utc | 39

@34 jen... it is a really poorly written script and appears to be changing quite regularly.... none of it adds up and as many of us here have said - we are calling bullshit on most all of it.. the story on the pets is further proof that none of this story holds up with any scrutiny..

Posted by: james | Apr 5 2018 23:17 utc | 40

What sort of libretto would Gilbert and Sullivan compose for this fiasco. Could The Onion do better? Reminds me of Cheech & Chong's skits.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 5 2018 23:34 utc | 41

@ 27
Chemical weapon named Novichok – a reality check - April 01, 2018 by Eugenia for the Saker Blog
is a long article and the following part of it would fit to your story or confirm it:

Mirzayanov claimed that the Soviet Union developed a binary nerve agent 8-10-times more potent that the American VX. A binary agent is a compound produced in a chemical reaction from two benign precursors right before use. Such agents offer obvious advantages: the production is much easier with no extraordinary safety precautions required, storage is also much simplified, no need to stockpile the actual chemical weapons agent (CWA), there is no problem with stability of the CWA, et cetera. The US spent significant resources on the binary CWA program of its own. Interestingly, in the original publications of 1992 the agent in question was simply referred to as binary agent. The name Novichok first surfaced in the 1994 report by Lev Feodorov about the chemical weapons in Russia. According to Vladimir Uglev, a chemist who worked at the same institute as Mirzayanov on the new series of CWA, the official name of the program was Foliant. Mirzayanov later confirmed that.
The believable part of the story is that the Soviet Union and later Russia would have a successful chemical weapons program similar to that in the US. Uglev specifically stated that the Foliant program was meant as the answer to the American VX agent. The quantities of the agents produced ranged from several milligrams to kilograms, and several hundreds compound were supposedly synthesized – all this points to the development stage of the program. There is no indication that any of the agents were ever weaponized, i.e. munitions for delivery of the CWA to the enemy were designed, except for the statements of Mirzayanov. However, by his own admission, he wasn’t involved in weaponization, and, thus, he is unlikely to have a firsthand know-ledge about it. Remarkably, Uglev said that although his group developed several deadly substances, attempts to develop binary formulations failed, and no binary agents were ever produced.
Uglev’s statements regarding his work are much more specific than Mirzayanov’s and, thus, more believable. Besides, Uglev, unlike Mirzayanov, was involved in the actual development of the agents.
Mirzayanov’s job, as the Head of the Counterintelligence Department, was to control the space around the institute, and he had no part in developing the technology.

Posted by: Dilara | Apr 5 2018 23:52 utc | 42

@42
Also it's been established that novichok doesn't exist.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 5 2018 23:55 utc | 43

The UK long ago voted in the highest chambers of power to manifest a Trexit, the exit from all forms of the truth. Every day they prove this more and more.

Posted by: WorldBLee | Apr 5 2018 23:57 utc | 44

@ Galvanise #28
Indeed the tail has wagged the God but first and foremost the tail has done the Devil's work.
If all dogs of wars are now unleashed following some absurd false flag as murky and grotesque as the Skippy affair...
we, as human species, are absolutely doomed to live in hell for quite sometimes.
When all it takes is a couple of goofs strained by some remnants from Vicky's cookies virus pleagues, we are issuing a no-parole sentence on all human beings... further to be condemned for centuries, our heads hidden in some 'Novi-fogs' of wars... or another.
Perhaps some sort of British standards of living, permanently under some kind of... 'foog'.
We have recently learned from the Pope there is no Hell to go to (cos' we already are in living hell). Then, Foggy Paradise must be empty, deprived from any kind of wisdom.

Posted by: kpax | Apr 6 2018 0:00 utc | 45

defense of the realm
who is defending blighty
article 5 not triggered ww3 put on hold
news anchor all actors
scripts transitioned from russia with love
onto knife crime yute on yute crimes
will salsbury be the new grenfell
yesterdays tavistock shock
knife attacks are now outside your door
whats that noise
dear you hear it.
sounds like bbc bell pottinger sharpening a new tale

where is rudderless rudd
where b gavin whatshisname minister for man on man love and war
where is treason may
where boris donmeh attaturk to much johnson.

the muppet show all away on holiday
champagne suppers
polite chits and chat
cocaine and camcorders
eyes wide shut
prince phillip new hip and out the door in 3 days

tavistock psy op central in chickentown

Posted by: dr sapperstein | Apr 6 2018 0:16 utc | 46

The only thing that has been officially confirmed is that blood tests showed breakdown products of organophosphates that were believed to come from a "Novichok class nerve agent or closely related agent." I still do not think they have found novichok anywhere in the environment or have collected a sample that could be independently verified to be novichok in some foreign laboratory. At least we have not seen any official confirmation that such a sample exists. Nor have we received information on exactly what compound this "novichok" is claimed to be.

I suspect the traces of "novichok" found all over the place, from the Zizzi restaurant to the door handle, are just some ordinary organophosphate pesticide.

A POSSIBLE SCENARIO

The Skripals are suffering from "paralytic shellfish poisoning" they received from saxitoxin or tetrodotoxin in the seafood in the Risotto Pesce they ate at the Zizzi restaurant.

The Skripals received traces of some organophosphate pesticide from the flowers they left at the graves in the morning. They then left trace on the door handles of the BMW. A video show the BMW driving away from Sergei Skripl's house at 14:55 in the afternoon. This would mean that they visited the house after leaving the pub and entering the Zizzi restaurant, leaving further organophosphate traces on the door knob of the house.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Apr 6 2018 0:34 utc | 47

Thanks 'B' for keeping the torch lit and shine thru the british lies .. it is so lame and amateurish and i agree for years these propagandist been doing their job the 'easy way' and now they been exposed by the still thinking crowd in the net..

BTW anyone here know why Col Patrick Lang disable comments on SST ? is he afraid of people posting facts and truth in his site ?

Posted by: Lufasu Mafalu | Apr 6 2018 1:01 utc | 48

Petri Krohn @ 47: I'd say your story is the most credible interpretation of all the "evidence".

This would suggest that if the breakfast cereal brought to the UK from Russia for Sergei Skripal is tested for "Novichok", it will also test positive for traces of "Novichok". (Unless of course Lord President Vlademort rids the entire Russian Federation of all its agricultural pests with a magnanimous wave of his hand and the utterance of a secret spell.)

The police officer DS Nick Bailey who was hospitalised may have had an allergic reaction to the pesticide or to something else in the Skripal house.

Posted by: Jen | Apr 6 2018 1:12 utc | 49

the Lithuanian PM has asked for concrete proof of Russia's guilt

https://sputniknews.com/world/201804061063260917-lithuania-russia-skripal-case/

Posted by: Mischi | Apr 6 2018 1:12 utc | 50

@46 dr sapperstein

Thanks for the laughs, Doctor. Good to hear from a man of science in this case. Makes entirely more sense than Her Majesty's Government.

Chickentown.

the fucking food is fucking muck
the fucking drains are fucking fucked
the colour scheme is fucking brown
everywhere in chicken town

[John Cooper Clarke - Evidently Chickentown: https://youtu.be/pB3NlOUg-ps?t=1m50s ]

Posted by: Grieved | Apr 6 2018 1:24 utc | 51

fwiw,

Bruce Willis, in the movie "The Jackal", sprayed poison on a car door handle. Since the FSB is already pros at this I will direct the attention of the CIA, MI6, Mossad to about the 1:54 mark in the following clip from the movie.

See how it is done? Now you too can apply poison to door knobs.

By the way, if you recall the movie, someone touched the car handle and knew immediately he was screwed. He was dead just a few seconds later.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbbFOgNtfKo

Posted by: librul | Apr 6 2018 1:29 utc | 52

@37 karlof1

We've seen theories of this Syria connection from several commenters and sources for a while, and every analyst in the Middle East seems to think Skripal is connected to western losses. Fadel makes a connection with the fires in Russia also.

It's all extremely plausible. Spite has been the Modus Operandi of the US and the Zionists forever, even in their good times, let alone when they lose.

Sooner or later it seems inevitable that some of those western spooks and soldiers lounging around in Syria were going to be killed and captured. Sooner or later it has to happen, just from the numbers. Now, and in East Ghouta of all places, a concentration of embedded western malice, would make tremendously good sense.

If it's not true, it should be. And one day soon it will be. What's the term? High likelihood?

Posted by: Grieved | Apr 6 2018 1:34 utc | 53

For your daily edification:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUGT0WWbUak

10 Deadliest Poisons

Posted by: librul | Apr 6 2018 1:55 utc | 54

Don writes:
"Since all I had yesterday was cereal...."

Was that cereal sent to you from Russia like we're told Sergej got? ;-)

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 6 2018 2:03 utc | 55

Unable at this writing to do links. There is a sleuthing article (with photos) posted today at Zero-hedge. BoJo, UK's FM and UK Intel are featured. The opening question: "Have we been looking in the wrong place?"

All Russiagate Roads lead to London.

As Russia's UN envoy warned. "Playing with fire, You will be sorry."

Posted by: Likklemore | Apr 6 2018 2:03 utc | 56

@Petri Krohn 47: The only thing that has been officially confirmed is that blood tests showed breakdown products of organophosphates that were believed to come from a "Novichok class nerve agent or closely related agent."

My very first reaction to this whole fiasco was that something happened to the Skripals, almost certainly not a deadly nerve agent (as they're not dead), and that the Brits likely did not know or care what the original cause was, but latched onto it as the "lucky break" they were desperately needing after the Syrian false flags failed and with the May government rapidly failing. Whether the original poison was severe food poisoning or they accidentally sat on fentynal residue left by the last druggie and it soaked into their skin on the wet bench (remember, that was what was first suspected by regular people), or were actually attacked by Hillary, it almost doesn't matter. Unless it was severely bungled, it's hard to believe this was a false flag from the beginning, else the Brits would have had their story consistent from the outset. It smacks of trying to morph an incident into a false flag on the fly, and not doing the best job of it.

Once it was decided to go all in and up the ante in pinning blame on Russia, with the Skripals in isolation and induced comas, whatever Porton Down had on hand that would produce breakdown products in the blood that would fit with what Novichoks were reputed to be could have easily been administered over days in non-lethal doses--just enough to produce some much needed blood evidence. Similarly easy enough to salt a few locations with nerve agent traces--not enough that testing would be able to disprove it could have been a Novichok, that's a dear. Poof! Instant international incident, just in the nick of time!

Posted by: J Swift | Apr 6 2018 2:08 utc | 57

People have shown how gullible they are. Governments no longer care if they get caught in lies. The corporate media has their back. So long as they please their corporate masters they are safe. For the 10-30% who see through the lies, few are willing to jeapordize careers or pensions to do anything about it. They may fool themselves they can make a difference with their vote, but their corporate masters choose which candidates they can vote for (just like in Iran the Supreme Leader chooses pr approves the candidates).

Posted by: Pft | Apr 6 2018 2:16 utc | 58

UK(like US ) will try to create another false flag ,another lie to try to cover up this failed one.And it is going to be even worse.
All these lies upon lies upon lies. The current lie has to be bigger than the prior one in order to try to cover it,and so on. It creates a vicious circle. And the weight of the next lie is pushing harder on the house of cards.'Til it implodes .
When the lies of the empire( the Anglo-America-Zionist one)become so amateurish ,so laughable that its population feels insulted in its intelligence ,the end is near.
The Empire was successful for so long because it had a great propaganda machine,good PR. When this becomes ineffective,when the Empire loses all credibility (and what an irony,losing its credibility while trying to make Russia lose face ),when the rest of the world,even the vassals , can no longer pretend that they believe the Empire ,it's over.
Sic transit gloria mundi ! With losing the front place on the world scene because you have very bad actors unable to convince the audience that they watch a credible show.

Posted by: veritas semper vincit | Apr 6 2018 2:19 utc | 59

J Swift, Isn't organophosphate an ingredient of Monsanto's Roundup?

You suggest that a planned false flag would have been more carefully crafted, but what about the false flag White Helmets CW attacks? They're so amateurish it's shocking if one watches their full videos. Only by media showing short, edited clips can anyone fail to see the frauds.

And then BBC's Panorama did an entire hour-long special that included an alleged chemical/napalm attack that just happened to happen while they were at the "makeshift hospital." That was so easily shown to be a fraud that BBC deleted all evidence that it had ever existed. It was dramatically aired the night before Parliament was set to vote on bombing Syria.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/evidence-of-fakery-in-bbc-saving-syrias-children-is-now-undeniable/5594917

https://off-guardian.org/2017/06/14/even-more-evidence-of-fakery-in-bbc-saving-syrias-children-doc/

More and more I'm thinking they've gotten so cocky about getting away with anything that they're essentially mocking us.

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 6 2018 2:29 utc | 60

In other news: As of Tuesday, Senator Sanders was the ONLY US Senator to speak out about Israeli Occupation Forces shooting over 700 almost entirely peaceful demonstrators with live ammunition, resulting in 17 deaths. So, an alternative news site attempted to contact all the other Senators to see if they had any comment on the Gaza Massacre.

"Blue Dog" Democrat, Senator Manchin’s office said “No.”

Senator Leahy’s office said he would probably be interested in looking into it, considering it might violate his own “Leahy Law” which prevents the U.S. from giving aid to units of foreign governments that participate in “gross violations of human rights.”

NO other Senator’s office either answered or responded to the request for comment.

https://splinternews.com/we-asked-every-u-s-senator-about-israel-killing-17-pal-1824291370

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 6 2018 2:56 utc | 61

@ Daniel with the OT Israeli killing of Gaza peaceful demonstrators

I agree with you that the global optics about world events is manipulated to cover for some actors perfidy......sad

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 6 2018 3:06 utc | 62

Russia guinea pigs were Russian? Bingo! Putin has weaponised guinea pigs, they poisoned the Skripal's and Putin even engineered them to die afterwards. QED. Bastard. When OPCW is finished with Putin, PETA will have a go. That should put the fear of God in him. Hey, it is as plausible as anything Lord Haw Haw (BOJO) has come up with today. About the only thing that is certain in this sordid affair is HMG is lying every day and the days in between.

Posted by: Tom | Apr 6 2018 3:55 utc | 63

Great discussion, many thanks! An old form of praise, can't tell you which culture, is "I learn from you". I offer that blessing to everyone here.

1. A-234 is not shorthand for a toxicological formulation. It's the bike lock combination of someone with a low IQ.

2.A binary poison could be delivered through various forms of encapsulation and microencapsulation used in pharm- and nutra-ceuticals -- enteric coatings (pills/powders), liposomal coatings -- water solutes with lipid films, etc.. Uncombined components, if not broken down by stomach acid, would be easy to trace. Newer binary coated elements could be exposed to combination through microwaves aimed at the bodies of those who have ingested the encapsulated toxins. It is safe to say that work would now be in process on ways to activate an ingested binary poison trough a phone call.
3. A failed state that continues to fall forward, propelled by lies, I call a "fictive state". Fictivity is an all encompassing security blanket of unreality that protects an institutional system from harsh days of reckoning. Fictivity is a team sport. Rules are always broken which makes the quotes from Alice in Wonderland -- from both sides in the same proceeding -- even more telling.
4. Fictivity is different from simple lying in that it tells a story. It is human nature to love storytelling. As listeners we actively engage with tellers in shared support and creation of a false reality. we crave the next episode, which propels the narrative forward and sustains it with social energy.
5. Conversely, to challenge a fictive narrative is socially taboo. It harms the foundational web of lies that we all share. When that fabric rips we all fall down, so obvious fountains of falsehood like CNN persist beyond all logic.
6. Snowden's first job was as a security guard at an NSA campus outside Baltimore dedicated to the construction and testing of false realities. In that realm false flags are data gathering events. Salisbury may simply be one of those.
7. The fictive state is a kind of thought bubble, like a financial bubble, which falls apart when the rate of accretion of disbelief overtakes the rate of belief expansion. It is a social Ponzi scheme. When Allen Greenspan was asked to explain the crash ten years ago he said simply "We mispriced risk". That is the essence of a fictive bubble. All of the lying simpletons chosen by the Rothschilds to prop up their failed UK, in being clueless about the basic protocols if fictive bubble expansion, need a new card game. They are in the casino and cannot leave but they will soon be set up at another table where the piles of chips are smaller and a different false narrative is in its infancy. How many reincarnations have we seen for that worthless POS Blair, and counting?
8. The anti-Russian narrative began to take shape and force at the dissolution of the Byzantine Empire, but probably really started well before Russia existed when Charlemagne's grandfather gave the Papal States to Rome and set up the full separation into Eastern Orthodoxy and Holy Roman Empire. The EU, under the Kelargi Plan still unfolding, is by openly stated intent the reincarnation of the Holy Roman Empire (Charlemagne Medal created for Kelargi to honor his work in forming the EU).
9. Since the last book of the Western Old Testament was written the Jews have been in the middle of the schism that we now see resurrected. It is an ugly business and no truth telling will be allowed to pop the vast froth of false narrative bubbles. If all false beliefs were to suddenly cease we would be surrounded by smoke and ash.

At any rate, tail wag God!

Posted by: mireille | Apr 6 2018 4:07 utc | 64

Did Nash Van Drake and the guinea pigs also grasp the exterior doorknob?

Posted by: PrairieBear | Apr 6 2018 4:55 utc | 65

@60 Daniel

No. Organophosphates are used in pesticides.
The active substance in RoundUp is glyphosate, a herbicide, not a pesticide.

Posted by: Permafrost | Apr 6 2018 4:57 utc | 66

perma @66
glyphosate was originally a metal cleaner
then it was registered as an antibiotic
and much later was sold as an herbicide

Posted by: mauisurfer | Apr 6 2018 5:12 utc | 67

@64 mireille

Some wonderful musings in your comment. You have more good thoughts than should see the light of day in any single thesis, I think.

I love the 'fictive state" - a state that has failed to match its real-world obligations, and is now "falling forward" with a government and stakeholder class waiting eagerly for each new episode to explain the current story that keeps the paychecks coming and the masses tranquil, as bewilderment submerges the national character. England, in short.

But as you suggest, they have "mispriced risk", these liars. Each lie takes its toll on humanity's inborn generosity of the benefit of the doubt, and paves the way towards the reckoning. Future epiphanies of the truth build for the common people as the wool has to be pulled over evermore eyes, and the veils get thinner.

They live in fear, these privileged schemers, that the masses will see through them one day and tear them to shreds - with no amount of tunnels to hide them from their guilt. It is always and ever a class war of plunder, with the rich at war against the poor, from whom they steal to divide the bounty of the Earth unfairly. None of this ever changes, except who wins. The poor always have a chance to win. This keeps the rich awake at night, and well it should.

And the more the rich try to keep the poor in ignorance and compliance, the more their actions backfire and produce the opposite effect, the eventual enlightenment that sends them, almost incidentally, to the hell they always suspect is waiting in the wings.

~~

Over time, the global mind learns.

~~

And this is why the odds are stacked against extinction. We can override these odds, but all things being equal, we stay alive as a species because the global culture is trying to find its way through the bullshit to peace.

This is why there is cause for optimism. The universe tends towards truth. Everything they do through greed is a doomed activity. Consumed with material greed, they don't lift up their minds to know this. But many among the poor do know this, having precious little but time. Time to reflect, and consider the truth of things.

The poor know these things. The rich desperately scheme to destroy this knowledge and wipe it from the Earth. But this tends against the whole universe, and can never succeed.

Posted by: Grieved | Apr 6 2018 5:22 utc | 68

For those thinking that somehow the elite of the West can isolate and attack Russia I offer the following news from today

"
MOSCOW, April 5 (Xinhua) -- China-Russia relations are at the best level in history and the two countries need to further strengthen their cooperation in view of various uncertainties on the international and regional agenda, Chinese State Councilor and Foreign Minister Wang Yi said here Thursday.

At a press conference following talks with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov, Wang, also special envoy of Chinese President Xi Jinping, congratulated Russian President Vladimir Putin once again on his re-election with record support rate, recalling that Xi was also elected Chinese president by a unanimous vote last month.

He said that the results of the presidential elections of China and Russia fully manifested that the paths of development of the two countries are supported wholeheartedly by their peoples.

China believes that under the leadership of President Putin, the Russian people will unite as one and keep on achieving new accomplishments in national rejuvenation and development regardless of difficulties, Wang said.

In the meantime, China will continue to support Russia's efforts to safeguard its own rightful and legitimate interests and play a bigger role in international and regional affairs, he said.

Noting that current international and regional situations are still full of uncertainties, Wang said China and Russia, as close strategic partners, need to strengthen their communication and cooperation.

Wang said the fact that he was visiting Russia as the special envoy of President Xi showed that China attaches great importance to the development of its relations with Russia and reflected the priority of the bilateral ties on the respective diplomatic agendas of the two countries.

During the talks, the two ministers held in-depth discussions on bilateral ties and crucial international and regional issues, according to Wang.
"
"
As for cooperation on international affairs, Wang said China and Russia will work actively together to push forward a political settlement on major issues and enhance coordination within the framework of multilateral mechanisms including the United Nations, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization and the BRICS.

In view of the complicated international situation, China and Russia, as permanent members of the UN Security Council and comprehensive strategic partners of coordination, need to strengthen and prioritize coordination with each other, especially on their major policies and actions, so as to safeguard regional and global peace and stability, Wang said.

President Putin is scheduled to visit China this year, and the two heads of state of the two countries are also expected to meet on a number of other important bilateral and multilateral occasions, he said.

China and Russia will coordinate in preparation of a series of activities on the highest level and implement agreements reached by the heads of state afterwards, Wang said.
"

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 6 2018 5:38 utc | 69

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 5, 2018 10:29:01 PM | 60

The Russian UN ambassador was right in that they are repeating the methods of Goebbels - if you repeat something long enough people assume it is true no matter what the facts are. The BBC and British media have become fully weaponized.

Your connection to the Syria scams sounds about right - there are private contractors who have the know how to fake a chemical attack not so much the know how of the chemistry itself.
And as usually is the case - what you do abroad will haunt you at home.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 6:06 utc | 70

Thanks Permafrost.

I'm still not convinced any actual nerve agent attack occurred, and certainly don't buy the fiction that Russia did it.

A query.... has anyone else noticed that the photos of Yurial we see most often are seemingly 10 years old or older? There are a couple that we see occasionally with daddy (and wine) that appear to be more recent, but all the photos of just Yurial are of a much younger woman. I wonder why?

Could it be that when they raise the curtain for the big reveal that we're supposed to be shocked at the changes in her appearance? Certainly, that was a major feature of 2 earlier "poisonings" blamed on Putin.

I love mireille's "Fictive State," and will be using that term.

psychohistorian. I sure do hope this multipolar Russia/China thing does produce a genuine competitor to the One World Financial Order.

Posted by: Daniel | Apr 6 2018 6:10 utc | 71

Throughout this whole skripal debacle I think it is fair to say the shining lights for 'getting at' the truth of the matter have been our host B here at MOA, Craig Murray on his blog and some thought provoking input from the offguardian site.

What a mess.

Given the total lockdown on factual information thanks the the position of the UK government I believe the main objective has been to mask a much bigger/wider objective. This leads directly to the syrian situation. It was heavily flagged by the russians prior to the Skripal incident they were expecting a serious chemical weapons incident to occur to enable western forces to wreak havoc to try and change the momentum for the lost cause it has become for them. Fortunately, both the syrian army and their allies moved quickly enough to snuff out the planned action and whilst doing so inadvertently captured a significant number of 'allied' special forces assets embedded with the terrorists operating within the East Gouta battle theatre. This brings to mind the 'Basra incident' where 2 UK special forces assets were apprehended by Iraqi forces dressed up as arabs in a car loaded with explosives on their way to their next job. What did the brits do? They organised a heavily armed rescue squad to bust them out of gaol that very evening - you couldn't make that story up if you tried.

Anyway, with that as background context I believe the UK government panicked and came up with the Skripal plan - although it may have already been in place as a pre-cursor/accessory to the syria plan. Either way once implemented events started going awry. One of the main problems in the Skripal incident is that it HAD to be a nerve agent to carry the necessary weight to bring in european allies to castigate the russians. However, nerve agents kill - quickly and that didn't happen so all this conjecture about novichoks etc is pure bollocks. This was confirmed by the medical consultant at the hospital who through either naivety or just being an honest guy wrote to the Times to state that no-one had been poisoned by a nerve agent - i'm sure he's been thoroughly reamed out by now for that indiscretion!

So what really went down? Well no-one other than the participants and the medical staff at the hospital to a lesser extent really knows. I have serious doubts about the integrity of the injured policeman in this case. A senior detective just happening to be on the scene - unlikely. A feigned poisoning perhaps? Was he the poisoner? What's his background? Is he ex-military and was operating as a minder? We don't know and he's been allowed to slip back into the weeds as just another innocent party here - I'm sorry I just don't buy that.

The bottom line here is that rather than the 'bulldog breed' the brits have degenerated into a nation of jack russells led by a pack of mongrels and these cunts are going to lead us into a world war unless we wake up because the guy they are messing with has shown himself to be a real hard nut who will have the final say because love him or loathe him he will stand by his word and protect his country from the shit that is being thrown their way

Posted by: m | Apr 6 2018 6:49 utc | 72

@66 Permafrost

FYI: Glyphosate is an organophosphate. Organophosphates are used in both nerve agents, pesticides, herbicides and flame retardents.

Posted by: Antares | Apr 6 2018 7:04 utc | 73

m 72.
Superb - I think you could be very right.
There have been other reports of embedded NATO forces in E Gouta.

Posted by: Emily | Apr 6 2018 8:25 utc | 74

What is he smoking?
...the Arab League secretary-general and former Egyptian foreign minister said "I am optimistic the Riyadh summit will create a new momentum similar to the momentum we have seen towards the Palestinian issue, which was reflected in active Arab moves to support the Palestinian people vis-a-vis the pressures they have been facing from the recent stances of the American administration and the continued intransigence of the Israeli side."
http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/1/64/295095/Egypt/Politics-/INTERVIEW-Arab-League-chief-AbulGheit-talks-to-Ahr.aspx

Posted by: Mina | Apr 6 2018 8:39 utc | 75

Let's sum up:
SF in East Ghouta, Fr/UK/Gulfies not happy, FF scheduled.
Same mixture used by 'rebels' there known and flown to the UK, with antidote or at a dose known to be reversible, so that OPCW will have to take note of both. East Ghouta taken, large online conversation about the mixture(s), no more possibility for FF.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 6 2018 8:45 utc | 76

There is a good

plausible theory here

My hunch — and it is just that — is that Mr Skripal himself was perhaps still working for British intelligence, and may have been in possession of a nerve agent. Somehow, this involvement went wrong, and he ended up accidently poisoning himself and his daughter on the bench in The Maltings. The Government then scrambled to concoct a story in order to cover up the real story of a Russian working for MI6 and handling nerve agents, and so quickly decided to point the finger at that most convenient scapegoat, the Russian Government.

The reason that I’m attracted to this possibility is that it explains all three aspects I have described above, and which I think are the most important aspects of the case. The rush to judgement — which looked like panic-mode to me — could have been an attempt to divert attention away from the investigation looking at the possibility of Mr Skripal having military grade nerve agent in his possession. The ignoring of international legal protocols, at least for a time, could have been done to ensure that the case was not probed by any outside body, which may well have exposed discrepancies. And it could also explain many of the oddities mentioned above, such as traces of nerve agent apparently being found in various places in Salisbury, since these could have come about because Mr Skripal was in possession of some sort of nerve agent when he left his house that day.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 9:04 utc | 77

John Helmer's latest:

The Empire Strikes Backwards

http://johnhelmer.net/the-empire-strikes-backwards/

"Empires are just like everything else going down the toilet. Bits always stick on the porcelain which require more flushing. Embarassing bits. Now in its fifth week since the poisoning of Sergei and Yulia Skripal in Salisbury on March 4, the bits that cannot be flushed away are producing an odour whose obviousness is embarrassing for Salisbury hospital and the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW)..."

Posted by: John Gilberts | Apr 6 2018 9:18 utc | 78

add to 77

That would also explain May's accusation that "either Russia did it or lost control of its stock".

Plus Putin's spokesperson's claim that it was an "accident".

It opens the interesting question if Skripal was working for MI6 when he possibly acquired the poison. And if MI6 definitively knows that the stuff is from Russia because it was them who imported it.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 9:21 utc | 79

https://www.rt.com/uk/423359-skripal-salisbury-pets-die/
They euthanized the cat because it was in distress!!!?
#79: the man had GUINEA PIGS he brought from Russia, that does indeed raise a number of possibilities ...

Anyway, I would launch an online campaign to condemn the Brits for mistreatment of animals.

Posted by: Mina | Apr 6 2018 9:24 utc | 80

don't forget OPCW did not arrive in Britain until about 21st March - nearly three weeks after the 'event' in Salisbury - how valid will be their claims and findings as we don't even know what samples they have?

Posted by: jazza | Apr 6 2018 9:25 utc | 81

That and the bench... systematic destruction of evidence. Do they plan to atomize the grave they went on?

Posted by: Mina | Apr 6 2018 9:27 utc | 82

It were the lies of Theresa May and Boris Johnson which convinced the other countries, not any factual evidence

horse shit. this story was obviously horse shit from day one. and notwithstanding the thousands of words devoted to this little skit, it has essentially debunked itself. the idea that the Germans or anyone else actually believed the lies is preposterous. i mean, where are we, in fucking never-never land? uncle sam might be losing his grip, but quite clearly he still sets the narrative, and will continue to do so for as long as these pussy european countries continue to 'host' his mercenaries and their nuclear weapons.

...

hat tip to Grieved for the John Cooper Clarke stanza...i posted the entire poem several threads ago, but b deleted it ):

Posted by: john | Apr 6 2018 9:34 utc | 83

On the UK political front I am really surprised that the Conservatives are not keeping Corbyn, following his 'conversion' to the cause after his initial scepticism, as tied in as possible. They should be trying to lock him into the farce rather than let him off the hook to attack them.

Posted by: JohninMK | Apr 6 2018 9:39 utc | 84

I looked up D Notice. Wkikbollox says it is a DSMA Notice:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/DSMA-Notice

As of 2008, there are five standing DSMA-Notices and one proposed:[3]
DA-Notice 01: Military Operations, Plans & Capabilities
DA-Notice 02: Nuclear and Non-Nuclear Weapons and Equipment
DA-Notice 03: Ciphers and Secure Communications
DA-Notice 04: Sensitive Installations and Home Addresses
DA-Notice 05: United Kingdom Security & Intelligence Special Services
-
Of course till total silence in the British media about Pablo Miller, Orbis, the Steele Dossier even though it is mentioned outside the UK, such as the US. They don't want to muddy the 'narrative'.

Posted by: et Al | Apr 6 2018 9:41 utc | 85

HMG/Met Police have come up with so many theories about what happened and not one of them makes sense. Let me indulge in my own theory: Skripals got poisoned by the polluted mussels from their sea-food risotto. Sitting on the park bench, they collected traces of organophosphate pesticides used in the park spraying or on some fruit they both consumed, totally unrelated to the poison that knocked them out. The policeman's sickness was a regime's/Met's creation or may have been a totally unrelated sickness, which would explain why OPCW did not take samples of his blood. In fact, all of us have such cocktail of chemicals in our blood from eating, drinking, breathing and touching objects that you could find almost any chemical in trace quantities, especially if it is an industrial chemical such as a pesticide.

A little while after they were found slumped on the bench, the wheels of the British propaganda machine started spinning to ensure that no good crisis goes to waste, especially if it could be related to the lost war on Syria. The rest is where we are now, lots of lying and screaming with open use of the voting dominance in OPCW to sham an investigation. Reading John Helmer's description of the OPCW manipulation, it reminded me how NATO dominated the MH17 investigation and excluded Russia. Now again NATO dominates the OPCW investigation and excludes Russia. It was silly of Russia to demand OPCW investigation knowing who is running that show. The pro-NATO Turkish chairman of OPCW is breaching the statute/constitution of his own organisation in two major ways. WADA, IOC, FIFA even SC and UN have been compromised, which does not suggest their longevity: Russia and China could exit and create their own equivalents.

Posted by: Kiza | Apr 6 2018 11:13 utc | 86

@m - "snarky" one-liners do not contribute to the discussion. I deleted them.
---

@all -

Sergej Skripal had two cats and two Guinea pigs. On cat fled, said a neighbor, when the police broke into the house.

Yesterday the British embassy publicly asked the British government what happened with the pets.

Today the British papers report that the Guinea pigs died of thirst while the cat was so starved that it had to be put down. The animals were brought to Porton Down where they were eliminated.

In my country there are procedures the police will follow when their are pets in a home they lock down. They will call up someone from a animal charity (or a local zoo) and the pets will be removed and put into care.
Anything else would be "cruelty against animals" and a crime.

I am pretty sure that the UK has, despite fox hunting, equivalent rules. Why were they not followed?
-

Interesting that the UK is now reacting to information coming from Russia. It is no longer leading:

- Ru calls for OPCW, UK reacts with to loud and pretty embarrassing propaganda
- Yulia calls up her cousin in Russia, hours later the metropolitan police comes out with a mangled "statement from Yulia"
- Ru ambo talks about pets, UK must reacts with news that is not favorable for it

Lets hope that Russia keeps up the pressure.

Posted by: b | Apr 6 2018 11:56 utc | 87

b: Your report and the latest discussion are peak 'Moon of Alabama'. Outstanding when the mainstream narrative gets particularly surreal and ... abuses pets.

Posted by: fairleft | Apr 6 2018 12:11 utc | 88

86 German media now have become completely sceptical.

I suppose that OPCW session did not go as well for Britain as claimed.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 12:14 utc | 89

add to 88
there is also this bit in strange media Yulia Skripal has not taken Russian offer of assistance - UK government

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 12:15 utc | 90

White Snow's step-mother returns...
From CM's website's comments
The boyfriend has now been identified and is being interrogated as we speak:

In Russia, the civil husband Julia Skripal, who escaped from the joint apartment

The Investigative Committee is going to interrogate the civil husband of Yulia Skripal

Stepan Vikeev (Степа Викеев)

This is reported by the telegram channel Mash.

It is specified that Stepan Vikeev and Julia Skripal have lived together in Moscow for the last two years.

According to the resource, Vikeev – a Muscovite, a graduate of the Faculty of Sociology of Moscow State University, wrote his thesis on the development of the market. He met Julia about two years ago. Soon the couple began to live together in an apartment on Davydkovskaya Street, which was purchased by Julia Skripal.

After what happened with the esque Grushnik Sergei Skripal and his daughter Julia, Stepan moved out of this apartment and did not appear there again. He also did not fly to London.

https://strana.ua/news/134225-sledkom-rossii-nameren-doprosit-hrazhdanskoho-muzha-otravlennoj-julii-skripal.html

https://web.telegram.org/#/im?p=@breakingmash

Posted by: Mina | Apr 6 2018 12:35 utc | 91

interesting - Russia is now explicitely claiming Sergei Skripal as a citizen

Posted by: somebody | Apr 6 2018 12:37 utc | 92

B @ 86

I'm sorry you deleted my 'clutching at straws' one liner as snarky but it's your site and you call the shots.

However, not having been raised in the UK I know you missed the significance of that post and its highly relevant input to the general conversation. It ties in with my original post where i characterised the uk populace as being a nation of jack russells as opposed to the 'bulldog breed' they would like to be known for. They have been captured and demoralised by a malignant force in the political arena.

Just as in your country as you allude to there are rules where animals are involved. The same rules are in place in the UK. What you may be less familiar with is the inherent belief of the vast majority of UK citizens that their love of animals is a direct corollary of their belief in the basic concept of 'live and let live' or put another way, life is precious.

And their government is dropping chemical weapons alongside terrorists on innocent civilians in various regions of Syria?

You are more able than I to make sense of all this

Posted by: m | Apr 6 2018 12:38 utc | 93

jazza @ 81

Plus, given how dominant the US/UK and their friends are in all these international organizations, we should not be expecting too much truth will come from the OPCW investigation.

Posted by: mali | Apr 6 2018 12:42 utc | 94

Matt Lee @APDiploWriter now LONDON (AP) - Hospital: Ex-spy Sergei Skripal is responding well to treatment, no longer in critical condition

He will be reported awake by Sunday or so. The appropriate day for resurrecting an orthodox christian ...

Posted by: b | Apr 6 2018 12:59 utc | 95

We had an interesting short discussion at craigmurray.org.uk about the deliberately wrong translation of one Russian ambassador's expression, which made it into most Western MSM titles in the general form of: "the Russian ambassador is threatening UK with revenge by fire", which started from a mistranslation of the original into "you are playing with fire".

Sorry for cross-posting but here is my comment: My original language is related to Russian, thus что вы заигрались и доиграетесь would be closest to English "you over played and got carried away", or more freely translated as "you went over the limits of a game". Definitely not an expressed or implied threat, then perhaps a warning of a teacher to a restless student that there are limits. Naturally, the mistranslation is a deliberate ancient trick, an Israeli and their servant favorite. Thus we remember Ahmadinejad’s supposed: “wipe Israel off the map”. ...specialists such as Juan Cole of the University of Michigan and Arash Norouzi of the Mossadegh Project pointed out that the original statement in Persian did not say that Israel should be wiped from the map, but instead that Israel would collapse: https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/did-ahmadinejad-really-say-israel-should-be-wiped-off-the-map/2011/10/04/gIQABJIKML_blog.html?utm_term=.6089eb8c52ae

I bet that this new creative mistranslation will be repeated by the Main Sewerage Media ad infinitum as well.

Posted by: Kiza | Apr 6 2018 13:25 utc | 96

Adding to my comment in @87

Interesting that the UK is now reacting to information coming from Russia. It is no longer leading:

In the call to her cousin that was published yesterday Yulia Skripal said that her father was okay and just sleeping.
Today Sergej Skripal is declared to be out of "critical" and is now recuperating.

This is another reactive communication by the Brits. They are not leading the pack anymore.

German papers/website have turned quite a bit critical of the May case (and Merkel's cooperation with it).

Posted by: b | Apr 6 2018 13:33 utc | 97

The pets were ill-treated!! The Vet did warn.

The wrath of pet owners will be on Mrs. May from which she will not ever recover. I hope the cat that ran away will return to deliver paws full of .karma

Posted by: Likklemore | Apr 6 2018 13:52 utc | 98

RT's recent CrossTalk on the Skripal case (Problem with BoJo) delivered a new catch phrase: "Porton Down Syndrome"

The does seem to be a rather nefarious past with this facility and human "guinea pigs":

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2004/may/06/science.research

Posted by: imo | Apr 6 2018 14:20 utc | 99

Most viewed on The Guardian today - (1 to 10)
1. Sergei Skripal no longer in critical condition and 'improving rapidly'
2. Sergei Skripal's cat and guinea pigs die after police seal house. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 6 2018 14:58 utc | 100