Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
February 10, 2018

Syria - Is War With Israel Imminent (Updated)?

Around 6 am GMT the Syrian air defense shot downed an Israeli fighter jet that was attacking the country. There is now the chance that a larger war will ensue. (The whole story behind this will surely be covered in Elijah Magnier's upcoming book on Hizbullah.)

[This is a developing story that will be updated below as new information comes in. - The latest update (below) is a video interview with Elijah Magnier on the implications of today's developments.]

This escalation comes after a series of recent provocations against the Russian forces in Syria, yesterday's U.S. attack on Syrian forces, last week's Israeli threats against Lebanon and dozens of Israeli air attacks on alleged Hizbullah or Iranian installations in Syria.

Tonight's events developed after Israel shot down what it called an "Iranian drone" allegedly in air space over the Israel occupied Syrian Golan Heights. Syria denies that its drone violated Israeli air space. Israel then attacked ground targets in Syria. One attacking Israeli F-16 fighter jet was taken down by Syrian air defense. The pilot ejected and parachuted into Israeli territory. He is wounded but survived. It is the first downing of an Israeli jet by Syrian air defense since 1982!  Further Israeli "retaliation" followed. This is another paragraph in the long history of Israeli aggression against Syria.

Older map with an approximate timeline of events - Source: LeBeck- bigger

There are some unconfirmed vague reports of a second damaged F-16 and a destroyed Israeli Apache helicopter.

Today's development as covered in Eljiah Magnier's timeline (emphasis added):

Elijah J. Magnier‏ @ejmalrai - 5:06 AM - 10 Feb 2018
Missiles launched over #Damascus; Rockets over the Golan Heights and a drone downed over #Israel: all in the last hour.
Israel said it is "an #Iranian drone". If that is the case, it is a "forced reconnaissance" to exhaust the Israeli defence system, #Hezbollah's style.

#Israel F-16 downed by what seems to be #Syria air defence system

#BreakingNews: Private source
All Syrian military and intelligence and their allies (#Hezbollah) positions in #Syria and #Lebanon on full alert

Source: #Israel recognition of downing an F-16 means Syria is on alert waiting for any Israeli violation, as is #Hezbolah and #Iran. Would Israel be dragged to war? How #Russia will react in #Syria? The front is very hot now.

#Israel changing version from "an #Iranian drone" to admit the downing of an F-16 was a first attempt to accuse #Tehran but later had to admit the reality showing a confusion in decision makers in the first hour.

#Syria is used to war as its leadership has been engaged in it fully for the last 6-7 years. Therefore #Damascus's Gov is ready for another front following the liberation of #ISIS last pocket in the north (except the one under #USA control).

Level of escalation in #Damascus response was a warning to #Israel that #TelAviv didn't take onboard. #Israel may limit itself bombing few Syrian positions from afar (flying over #Lebanon) or be dragged into escalation on a front from #Lebanon to #Syria

#Israel can't ignore the downing of its F-16, never happen in the last decades over #Syria and #Lebanon. Therefore what is important is the level of response: will the response bring a retaliation? If so, the long waited war may began.

This is a new Rule of Engagement and a new situation where #Israel is finding itself incapable of dominating the #Syria/n air space. It also shows #Damascus freedom (unlike many analysts believed) to respond regardless what #Russia's position is.

#Syria/n officials believe more than 1 F-16 were hit by its anti-Air missiles, showing the Syrian air-defence capability and the challenging attitude of #Damascus towards #Israel (not accepting the Israeli version of only 1 F-16 downed).

One conclusion: The Sky over #Syria is no longer an #Israeli/i promenade and the Syrian Army is now ready for another confrontation. This blows up all (ridiculous) assessment by analysts that "the Syrian Army stretched..., skinny..., few thousands only...)

#Israel admitted, indirectly, of the efficiency of the #Syrian Air-defence system by saying:"We study a retaliation". The question is and remain: How #Russia will behave? Allow #Israel to hit its Syrian ally and remain on the side? Or stop the escalation?

It is in the disadvantage of #Russia to see another war in #Syria on the southern front, with a #USA intervention, #Hezbollah #Iran the #Palestinians... all that may lead to a general war unless the Israeli response is limited.

#Hezbollah, on full alert in #Syria and #Lebanon, expected the reaction. Its leader Said Hasan Nasrallah warned to open a general war from Naqoura to the Golan Heights in the forthcoming war.

This escalation coincide with the approval of #Lebanon to start its oil exploration in Block 9.

Just a thought: If this is a #Russian tit-for-tat, we could say that it is #Russia response to the downing of the Russian jet over #Idlib. Russia accused the #USA of providing anti-air missiles to #AQ allies.

It is likely that #Damascus issues a communiqué to confirm its air defence fired the missiles against the F-16 hitting more than one jet to counter the #Israeli version claiming that #Iran is directly involved in this event.

It seems #Israel warning Sirens blare in Northern #Israel over the Golan, the Galilee and the northern of Israel, closing the airspace over the north of Israel.

7:35 AM - 10 Feb 2018
#BreakingNews: A second #Israel/i air bombing against #Syria. #Damascus open fire again against Israel Jets and Golan Heights positions. Siren over Israel continue. Escalation (for now).

Should Israel escalate to a bigger war it will be covered with hundreds of missiles per hour. Hizbullah has enough reserves to submit Israel to weeks of uninterrupted fire. Normal civil life will come to a stand still. Lebanon and Syria would also be under severe attacks but they are better positioned to endure such a situation.

A downed F-16 is already a bloody nose for Israel. It is not in its interest to further escalate.

Russia as well as the U.S. could become involved and into direct conflict. This must be avoided at all cost. But the current personal in White House, especially the military triumvirate behind the president, is of dubious quality. Moscow is hopefully aware of this.

[Update 12 am GMT]

The parties are now deescalating. In the last round Israel claimed to have hit several Syrian air-defense positions and "Hizbullah depots" while Syria claimed to have shot down more incoming missiles. Israel signaled that it is not interested in further escalation and Russia called for both sides to calm down. There has been no statement from Washington.

If this outcome persists we can state that there are now new "rules of engagement" and new "red lines". Further Israeli attacks on Syria will be responded to by effective means. The Russian officers who are co-located with the Syrian air defense will not intervene to Israel's advantage. That fact is in itself a message from Moscow to Israel to stop its open and its clandestine provocations.

[Update: 1:30 pm GMT]

Elijah J. Magnier‏ @ejmalrai - 1:03 PM - 10 Feb 2018
This is the end of it guys: #Israel decided to stand down and de-escalate. #Russia received an Israeli request to mediate to stop the escalation. Israel has lost the first battle against #Damascus when Syria was ready, after eliminating ISIS in central Syria

Commander in #Syria confirmed to me: It was not an S-200 that hit the F-16. "It was a prepared ambushed". Read more tomorrow via @AlraiMediaGroup

[Update: 7:00 pm GMT]

Elijah just gave an interview (video) to 108morris about the implications of today's development.

Posted by b on February 10, 2018 at 9:29 UTC | Permalink

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Some rumours that an Israeli attack helicopter (Apache) may also have been downed. Some photo evidence that at least one Israeli pilot out of the two is seriously wounded. Some "red line" must have been crossed for Damascus to react differently to this Israeli incursion. Surely no random occurrence but a deliberate tactic to let loose multiple AA missiles against the Israeli craft.

Posted by: Southern Kiwi | Feb 10 2018 9:58 utc | 1

From Reuters
"One set of raids hit positions belonging to the Syrian government and its allies in central Syria around the T4 airbase and in the Homs desert, the Britain-based Observatory said." crashes-idUSKBN1FU07L

Lst time a majoir incident occurred was when the Israeli's hit near T4. Missile debri landing in Jordan and so forth.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 10:00 utc | 2

I've been wondering how long it would take for Israel to find a way to get involved. In the past, it has been content to let the United States do its dirty work, while providing intel and 'moral support'. Now it's been caught out and even had its nose bloodied. I seriously doubt either the Israeli high command nor its political leaders will be able to resist the urge to get more heavily involved. That said, it looks like they'll be the rubes in a sucker's game. They have little to gain and much to lose- not that it's stopped them before.

Posted by: Tyronius | Feb 10 2018 10:13 utc | 3

If Israeli jets can be shot down, then trust me they will not be in any rush to start a bigger war.

2006 war stopped because a few helicopters got shot down, csn you imagine if they lose MORE jets illegally over Syrian airspace ?

Sorry but if they do start a war, its going to give them more then a blood nose and it will force them to negotiation table.

Also dont underestimate Arab public opinion. If the so called "shiite crescent" really step up to Israel and put them in their place, wont be long before all their puppet leaders are over thrown.

My 2 cents

Posted by: Deebo | Feb 10 2018 10:23 utc | 4

Trump needs to grow a pair and bring this charade to a close. And Israel should pause for a moment and ask themselves "if we get into a tit-for-tat missile exchange with Syria/Iran, which one of us has more to lose?".

Posted by: fort sensible | Feb 10 2018 10:44 utc | 5

Israel's assessment is that the situation cannot be more favorable. There is a front in the north of Syria (Turkey) and in the east (US). Israel will open a front in the south, I am pretty certain about that. It is remarkable that after the failure of the plan having ISIS and Al Qaeda do the work for them, Israel, Turkey and the US are stepping into this themselves. They are betting on Putin not going all out in view of the upcoming elections (which, incidentally, is another thing that makes this moment so favorable). Another factor is that Trump lets "his" generals run things (he is lazy, he is bored reading reports, he has no clue what he is reading, he has no analytical capabilities, just survival instinct - real estate is not a very innovative business and the kind of real estate he dealt with is an ideal target for corruption and money laundering; so, as a luxury real estate magnate, he has no clue and has little regard for rules, law and fair play). And lastly, Trump's ego will make him want "win the thing in Syria". There is no such thing as retreating, conceding for him. That ain't going to happen under his watch. And then, he said, after the Iraq war, the US should have taken the oil and other resources (as a compensation for a war that was the US' own choice!). He will view this similarly with regard to Syria. And very lastly, Kushner and Netanyahu, these guys are close and it is all pro-Israel. The fact that Ivanka is married to Kushner plays a role as well. She will be in Daddy's ear, too. In the end, while the reaction to the Jerusalem decision was comparatively muted at first (and Trump/Kushner are putting Palestinians under financial pressure as much as they can), the match was lit and this declaration does play a role, too, as it emboldened Israel. They see themselves on the winning path. Israeli police chiefs just recommended Netanyahu to be indicted for corruption. And what do you do if you are in trouble domestically? You are looking for some distraction externally and a war is a proven and tested means to deliver that AND unite a country behind you.

Posted by: BX | Feb 10 2018 10:57 utc | 6

Zio-fascist's pilot parachuting. Hopefully he will die.

Posted by: Partisan | Feb 10 2018 10:58 utc | 7

Would Syrian jets have dared to shoot down an Israeli warplane invading Syrian airspace if the US were in a better position to retaliate on Israel's behalf (by having a more secure position in NE Syria east of the Euphrates River or by having a better and more secure relationship with Turkey)? Perhaps the fact that Syria has for the first time since 2011 brought down an Israeli warplane despite numerous Israeli attacks in the past is an indication of American weakness and lesser influence in the Middle East.

Posted by: Jen | Feb 10 2018 11:04 utc | 8


Israel will need Russia to mediate.

Trump's military is not stupid. And no, they are not pro Israel.

I assume Iran is not joking.

Brigadier General Hossein Salami "did not comment on the reports about the Iranian drone when asked by journalists, but he said that Iran could destroy all American military bases in the region and create a hell for the Zionist regime (Israel)," according to Tasnim.

Posted by: somebody | Feb 10 2018 11:06 utc | 9

Dear BX | Feb 10, 2018 5:57:29 AM | 6

Propaganda has it's limits:

Stratfor Jul 16, 2016 | (1 day after the coup attempt)
Broken Trust: How a Failed Coup Weakens Turkey

"It will take years for Turkey's armed forces to recover."

Wishful thinking? Failure in foresight?

Merely 40 days after the coup attempt
TAF is in Jarablus.

TAF is in Afrin
TAF will take Manbij after August and clean the 'terror corridor' as they describe it, all the way to the SR-Iraqi border.

Israel has to hurry up or the Greater Israel Project has to be postponed for another 100 years.

So says people in the region.


Some people are sceptical about Israel vs. Assad+Iran confrontation
Some people are sceptical about Erdogan and Putin's actions which they think only serve the interests of Israel

How about this?

"Some of the 1.7 B cash Obama sent by plan to Iran has been traced to Iran-backed terrorist groups, including Hezbollah."

Will see. Fingers crossed.

Posted by: ConfusedPundit | Feb 10 2018 11:06 utc | 10

None of this can be resolved peacefully. Big regional war will allow total criticism of Israel again (Since it's a Trump war, the left won't be able to hide) and finally end this farce. Israel has taught the world that it can't or won't live peacefully with it's neighbours (Or even countries hundreds of miles away) time for it to end. It might win militarily, but this will finish it diplomatically and the country itself can't survive that.

Posted by: Altai | Feb 10 2018 11:06 utc | 11

@6: That was 2016. Pat Lang's take:

Posted by: Gesine Hammerling | Feb 10 2018 11:08 utc | 12

Great job Syria, time someone respond to this crazied bully.

We all know the pathetic western regimes refuse to condemn Israel for its repeated attacks, but now they will whine and condemn Syria for its defensive acts. Heck even the arab sunni states refuse to condemn Israel these days!

Posted by: Anon | Feb 10 2018 11:09 utc | 13

@all: Is it possible that the US, Turkey, and Israel are acting according to this memo:

Posted by: Gesine Hammerling | Feb 10 2018 11:10 utc | 14

Israel's fear of Hezbollah's 100,000 missiles [mostly short range unguided Katyushas] is magnified by the fear of them acquiring Iranian supplied guided missiles capable of hitting all valuable targets in Israel with pin point accuracy, including Ben Gurion airport [the closing down of which Israeli economists have warned would be a financial disaster] and the Dimona nuclear plant. Also Hezbollah have the Chinese sea skimming missile C-802 which can eliminate all Israel's gas platforms and off shore storage facilities, and generally stop any ship attempting to make an Israeli port. Just what capability Hezbollah have to stop massive retaliation from Israeli aircraft bombing the whole of Lebanon is not known. Do they have the Bavar 373 long range anti aircraft missile, put into service by Iran in late 2016 [an Iranian clone of the Russian s300?]. Nasrallah said in the next war Hezbollah operatives will be in Israel, could this mean man pad operatives taking Israeli jets out when at their most vulnerable [Heavily laden with fuel and bombs in that short window on takeoff and landing]? Most of the Israeli population and most of its vital infrastructure are within the Tel Aviv metropolitan area, well within reach of Hezbollah rockets, are the Israelis keen to see Tel Aviv in rubble? As time goes by the technological powers of Israel's enemies grow stronger and these technological powers are cheaper and available to more and more nations. Could Israeli calculations be ' if we do not act now, it will be too late when Hezbollah are fully tooled up in a year or two's time' Professor Postol of MIT in the USA published a paper on the Israeli Iron Dome System and its performance, he concluded that the system intercepted just 5% of Hamas rockets in the last Israeli massacre, quite clearly that system would be overwhelmed by Hezbollah's rockets, and at a fantastic $50/100,000 dollars per interceptor missile.

Posted by: harrylaw | Feb 10 2018 11:17 utc | 15

Another factor is that Trump lets "his" generals run things (he is lazy, he is bored reading reports, he has no clue what he is reading, he has no analytical capabilities, just survival instinct - real estate is not a very innovative...
Posted by: BX | Feb 10, 2018 5:57:29 AM | 6

You wish, BX. Is Trump lazier and stupider than your good self?
A simple YES or NO will suffice...

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 10 2018 11:19 utc | 16

Turks need Russians' permission for SR airspace usage.
Israelis don't. Or do they?

Posted by: ConfusedPundit | Feb 10 2018 11:30 utc | 17

Iranian Drone ; The Russians hijacked six of the drones that were attacking Hmeimim and Tartus. Landing three succesfully. It is quite possible that the IDF can do the same with other peoples drones.

(The ones launched against the Russians had sophisticated "anti-jamming" electronics and Advanced GPS guidance systems (satellite) hidden inside. They were disguised as "Hamas-made". By landing them the Russians discovered the trickery. Who supplied the advanced electronics ? Hamas doesn't have the ability to launch satelletes.

So a "false-excuse" of Iranian trespassing over the Golan could be used, to start a new war. Note that due to the speed at which the IAF sent in more aircraft, a ready-made attack plan seems to have been used with suspicious haste.
There is now a third wave of IAF planes.

One further bit of information that I alluded to a couple of days ago, is that there is the possibility of Russian warships using Lebanese ports - (which would naturally have to be defended by S-400's or Pantsir units ?). Which could have definitely stopped Israel firing from Lebanese airspace.

Posted by: stonebird | Feb 10 2018 11:42 utc | 18


The devil is in the detail.

The PKK/YPG/SDF/ appears to have spent hundreds of millions of dollars building Fortifications in Afrin.

Tunnels, trenches, watch towers, depos, loads of strutctures. Massive amount.

1) This is a product of a superior intelligence to that of the PKK freebooters.
2) The purpose of this massive fortification is not about defending Afrin against the Turks. It's about breaking the connection between Turkey and ME!

Israel has to hurry up. Otherwise they may have to be forced to give Haifa back to Lebanon!

Posted by: ConfusedPundit | Feb 10 2018 11:53 utc | 19

What is missing in all this is the plain fact that a sovereign nation has been invaded by other countries. And there should be no pretence, Israel is the cause of this.

Posted by: Steve | Feb 10 2018 12:13 utc | 20

The BBC, Fox News, and CNN just can't bring themselves to say that the plane was shot down. They all use variations of the plane crashing amid fire. It's like they just can't accept that the Syrians might have been technically capable of shooting down an Israeli plane.

Posted by: Qualtrough | Feb 10 2018 12:16 utc | 21

>>>> ConfusedPundit | Feb 10, 2018 6:53:03 AM | 19

Otherwise they may have to be forced to give Haifa back to Lebanon!

I think you're confused. Lebanon has nothing to do with Haifa, Lebanon was created by France to give Syrian Christians a country of their own on what was a piece of Greater Syria , Haifa was in Palestine until the British handed it over to the Zionists. If anyone has a prior claim to Haifa it's the Turkish as Haifa was in the Ottoman Empire.

Otherwise, if Israel had any sense it would be on the 'phone to Putin begging him to cool things down. Israel has already had it's "proportionate response" for propaganda purposes and it can't afford to take things further. Israel might try to persuade the rest of the world that nothing's changed but it has and Israel knows it. The only problem is that Netanyahu and his political allies are idiots.

"proportionate response" - yes I know Israel was the aggressor and the Syrian had the legal right to shoot down the aircraft but politics largely works on appearances rather than the truth.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 12:24 utc | 22

yes...also they are saying that airplane "crashed" in "Northern" ....hell.

Posted by: Partisan | Feb 10 2018 12:27 utc | 23

another bird is down. this time the turks have to smell loss one of its own.
TAI/AgustaWestland T-129 helicopter near AFrin is shot down by Kurds.

Posted by: Partisan | Feb 10 2018 12:33 utc | 24

Israel has been chomping at the bits for at least a couple of weeks to pick a fight with both Lebanon and Syria, and this "drone" episode (if it even happened) is just an excuse for them to get some trigger time at the expense of Syria.

Glad this blatant aggression and warmongering has been met with a punishing response. Now watch them cry to Uncle Sugar and Papa Putin.

Posted by: Cycloben | Feb 10 2018 12:37 utc | 25

pretty sure NuttyYahoo needs a big-time diversion from his imminent bribery and corruption charges....

Its also how major wars can start...from one small mans greed///



Posted by: oldenyoung | Feb 10 2018 12:51 utc | 26

confused pundit what a ap handle, you should be hanging out with friends from Jerusalem. Breathless statements "Israel has to hurry up. Otherwise they may have to be forced to give Haifa back to Lebanon!"
Horse thieves and land swindlers yea all

Posted by: col | Feb 10 2018 12:56 utc | 27

>>>> Deebo | Feb 10, 2018 5:23:47 AM | 4

After Hezbollah defeated Israel in 2006, many Sunni indicated a wish to become Shi'ites. This upset the Wahhabist al-Sauds who regard themselves as the natural leaders of the Sunni because they control two of the three Holy Sites. Hezbollah and the Shi'ites were a threat to that leadership and Saudi Arabia looked at ways of continuing their leadership by destroying Hezbollah and its backers, the Syrian and Iranian governments. Paradoxically, their own actions could destroy the al-Saud regime.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 13:00 utc | 28

Dear Ghost Ship | Feb 10, 2018 7:24:28 AM | 22

"I think you're confused."

Thanks for the compliment.

What I mean is that I heard a few prominent guys talking about Haifa on TV and I found it strange. Amongst so many, zillions of issues why must we focus on Haifa? All of a sudden? So I thought there must be something in the oven. No smoke if there is no fire. Maybe it's a message to somebody. Maybe it's to do with the planned (so it's claimed) pipe line from Iraq via Jordan, DeirZor to Haifa?

Posted by: ConfusedPundit | Feb 10 2018 13:34 utc | 29

After this incident, Israel will think twice before trying any stupid adventure into Syria.

Before the war imposed on Syria begun, Syria had a very sophisticated radar system that could see all air trafic over Israel. This made it difficult for the IAF to operate freely in the area so they got their fsa buddies to destroy it. It was the first strategic assets the fsa rats attacked when the war begun.

After that, the IAF had free pass to strike anywhere they wanted in Syria. Seems that is changing.

This is also a message to the US forces in Syria that their fighter jets(almost on par with the Israelis) are no longer immune and can be hit by old "Soviet junk"(a term they like to use to denigrate their opponent's capabilities)

Posted by: Zico | Feb 10 2018 13:35 utc | 30

Re the Magnier quotes:

Why #do some #writers find #it necessary #to put #a number #sign in #front of #every other #word?

Yes, yes, I know – it's a hashtag. Whatever the reason they do it, it's distracting and extremely annoying for the reader. Stop it!

Posted by: AntiSpin | Feb 10 2018 13:59 utc | 31


There has been no statement from Washington.

Now that's very interesting.


@ Partisan | Feb 10, 2018 7:33:50 AM | 24

another bird is down. this time the turks have to smell loss one of its own.
TAI/AgustaWestland T-129 helicopter near AFrin is shot down by Kurds.

Nice. I wonder why they didn't target that other Turkish helicopter that was circling the place where their comrades crashed.


@ Jen | Feb 10, 2018 6:04:41 AM | 8

Would Syrian jets have dared to shoot down an Israeli warplane invading Syrian airspace if the US were in a better position to retaliate on Israel's behalf (by having a more secure position in NE Syria east of the Euphrates River or by having a better and more secure relationship with Turkey)?

Oh but I think they are. The US could exert air superiority over Syria at any given time. They can strike from their occupied bit of Syria, from Incirlik, from the Mediterranean, from Jordan, Irak, the Gulf... So it's not w/o significance that they haven't intervened in this matter up to this point, I think.

Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Feb 10 2018 14:21 utc | 32

Dear Confused Pundit,

The money that Obama sent to Iran was the property of Iran.

- BX

Posted by: BX | Feb 10 2018 14:22 utc | 33

From 2017
"KUBINKA /Moscow region/, August 25. /TASS/. A unified air defense system has been set up in Syria thanks to efforts of Russian and Syrian military experts, Chief of Staff and Deputy Commander of the Russian Aerospace Forces Major-General Sergey Meshcheryakov told a round table dedicated to the Syrian experience at the Army-2017 International Military-Technical Forum.
"Today, a unified integrated air defense system has been set up in Syria. We have ensured the information and technical interlinkage of the Russian and Syrian air reconnaissance systems. All information on the situation in the air comes from Syrian radar stations to the control points of the Russian force grouping," he said."

And from April 2017
The efficiency of the Syrian air defense systems will be beefed up, Konashenkov told reporters several hours after the US conducted a missile strike on a Syrian airfield.

“To provide cover for the most sensitive targets of the Syrian infrastructure a set of measures to bolster” the defense systems would be “shortly implemented,” he said.

At the time Russia announced the completed upgrade and integration of the Syrian air defenses with Russian air defense, there was a video of Russian military announcing the completed project, which I think had a little more information.
It makes me think Syria would not act independently of, and against Russia's wishes with the air defense system.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 14:40 utc | 34

A section of the Ministry of foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation official statement on the Israeli attack...
".....We urge all parties involved to exercise restraint and avoid any actions that could lead to further complication of the situation. We believe it is necessary unconditional respect for the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Syria, other countries in the region.
Absolutely unacceptable is the creation of threats to life and security of the Russian troops stationed in Syria at the invitation of its legitimate government, to assist in the fight against terrorists."

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 14:57 utc | 35

Most accounts say that Israel tried to attack T4 or a site near Palmyra. No doubt Russian personal would still be stationed at T4. As I put in a comment in a previous thread, the last major incident of Syrian air defense vs Israel occurred when Israel tried to attack T4 and missile parts landed in Jordan

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 15:09 utc | 36

A full on US/Israel attack on Syria would crash the markets for sure. Donald doesn't want that. Unless of course he's long Lockheed Martin and Raytheon. His increased defense spending suggests he might be.

Posted by: dh | Feb 10 2018 15:29 utc | 37

Posted by: fort sensible | Feb 10, 2018 5:44:06 AM | 5

Trump needs to grow a pair and bring this charade to a close.

Fortunately it looks like Trump has always had a pair and brought this to a close with a bit of "masterly inactivity" by visibly staying out of it. The pressure will come over the next few days as the Washington Borg (probably including Hillary Clinton) question his lack of activity and "poor judgement". The problem for the Borg will be that much of America doesn't give a toss and this will remind then that they did the right thing by voting for Trump.

Clinton if she has any sense will keep quiet, but she's repeatedly demonstrated she has no commonsense whatsoever.

BTW, this event makes it quite clear that unlike some of his generals, Trump doesn't want a war with Iran, all he wants is to show he's a better negotiator that Obama.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 15:29 utc | 38

It is pretty clear Israel, which had been gradually escalating its strikes on Syria for some time now, had a strike mission prepared and was waiting for an excuse. It is possible there was indeed someone’s drone (how in the hell does Israel purport to know that it was Iranian?) somewhere near the SYRIAN Golan, but it is ludicrous to even suggest that a drone was allowed to approach the Golan from Palmyra, fly over illegally occupied Golan, and then meander down through Israel proper to Beit Shean (so probably well over half an hour over Israeli held airspace) before a helicopter was sent to shoot it down. Seriously? Of course it had to be asserted it was the evil an aggressive Iranians, so that immediately 8 planes are sent to strike a suspected Iranian installation near Palmyra.

The Syrians, having their hands full on the ground, have been letting the small, mostly ineffectual Israeli strikes go largely unchallenged, but with the recent successes on the ground may have been feeling a little less preoccupied and more ready to react. They almost certainly needed Russian approval, because the Russians apparently utilized their electronic countermeasures in addition to the Syrian SAMs. Makes you wonder if Russia had some inkling that Mossad was involved in that MANPAD attack. I suspect Israel will roar and assert victimhood as they bravely run away, and try to con the US/NATO into getting more heavily involved. But it is true the Big Mick is facing serious criminal trouble at home, and he makes Trump look sane and serene, so he may well drag Israel over the edge just for the distraction.

Posted by: J Swift | Feb 10 2018 15:36 utc | 39

Whatever happened - the Syrian (Russian?) reaction was the right one. If you do not collect a price the imperialist forces will go on and on.

Posted by: Pnyx | Feb 10 2018 15:37 utc | 40

We knew this was another one of those neocon "inevitables" like Iraq 2003 when J Cobra was slated to coincide w/ near defeat of fake justification for illegal USrael occupation of Syria.

Posted by: Kol Nidre | Feb 10 2018 15:37 utc | 41

It is the Soviet era SAM S-125 AD system that shot down that F-16

Posted by: Yul | Feb 10 2018 16:03 utc | 42

My thinking is that the US military has a relatively free hand to act in Syria, free at least from any actual control by the Oval Office. But not free from the oil industry nexus that has maintained huge power in the ME since Sykes Picot at least. Bush/Cheney of course represented the oil industry in full control. Tillerson remains at the head of the State Department. Trump is both embroiled domestically and shut out by the generals who control his briefings. But he too might have political use for a military crisis. Oil remains the crux of the matter in the region for US imperialism. I agree with those commenters who’ve pointed to the US actions around el Tanf and the recent killings of pro Syrian regime forces near the oil fields as a defense of plans to divide Syria and hang on to those fields. “Last ditch” as some would have it, maybe not so much. In the context of all the forces contending in the region, it makes the situation extremely fraught and dangerous. I have to go back to Mao’s statement regarding the inevitability of a third world war but also of its leading to the final downfall of imperialism. Conscious elements will have to think and work very hard for that not to end up also being the downfall of humanity. My view regarding current tasks of such in the US is we must organize around slogans of HANDS OFF SYRIA and NO WAR WITH RUSSIA in particular, linking them strongly with domestic issues of engorging the military machine at the cost of domestic security, both economic and, in fact, military.

Posted by: Lonl | Feb 10 2018 16:03 utc | 43

Zero Hedge reports a major escalation as Israel responds with a large-scale attack on Syria.

Posted by: lysias | Feb 10 2018 16:05 utc | 44

What an interesting development. Sochi was Russia's big attempt to establish itself as the Lord of the Syrian Carve-up, it seems. The response of Turkey, the US and Israel has been to enter the war much more directly, aggressively pushing their control over chunks of Syria. Russia is back-pedaling fast, though it seems to have given Assad's government permission to down exactly one Israeli jet, presumably in retribution for the downed SU-25. I expect that an important next step for Russia will be to turn on Assad.

Posted by: paul | Feb 10 2018 16:06 utc | 45

>>>> ConfusedPundit | Feb 10, 2018 8:34:46 AM | 29

Thanks for the compliment.

You're welcome, have a nice day

I heard a few prominent guys talking about Haifa on TV and I found it strange.

Perhaps I might be able to de-confuse you on this. Haifa has a large tank that contained 12,000 tons of ammonia imported to Israel, but is now being emptied, because of suggestions from Hezbollah that this might make a very suitable target if Israel launches a war against Lebanon, or more specifically Hezbollah. The Israeli government has ordered the tank to be shut down with the loss of 800 jobs, and they need to build a new facility to import ammonia-based fertilizers.

The latest news from two days ago in The Times of Israel:

The Economy Ministry has asked for a three-month delay in the expected closure of an ammonia storage tank in Haifa amid fears it could rupture and kill tens of thousands of people.

I believe the ammonia tank is the only thing of any interest in Haifa at the moment. Perhaps the memo about the delay didn't reach Netanyahu and he thought without the risk of Haifa being blown up he could go and blow up Syria.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 16:08 utc | 46

I'm totally in agreement with the assessments here with the escalation in brinkmanship and the unknown positions that will betaken by Russia and the USA in light of this new normal. Time will tell and in the short run. I wonder how much this may also have to do with the corruption charges being compiled against Netanyahu as a means of distraction?

Posted by: BRF | Feb 10 2018 16:22 utc | 47

I'm glad that, at least for the moment, cooler heads have prevailed. The best scenario for all sides is to leave each other alone, and perhaps even the Zionists realized this.

Posted by: WorldBLee | Feb 10 2018 16:47 utc | 48

@5 Trump? He is the Republican equivalent of Obama - an absentee president on foreign military matters

Posted by: aaaa | Feb 10 2018 16:53 utc | 49

@4 2

That's S-200 or SA-5 Gammmon system which has been updated. Some claim that old American system MIM-23 Hawk updated by the Iranians downed F-16.

It was good riddance.

Posted by: Partisan | Feb 10 2018 17:05 utc | 50

Ghost Ship,

Hezbollah are Sunni...

Posted by: kgw | Feb 10 2018 17:18 utc | 51

My mistake, you are correct: Shia.

Posted by: kgw | Feb 10 2018 17:19 utc | 52

What are these people looking for and then disposing of in the Israeli plane wreckage?

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 17:24 utc | 53

@52, Peter AU 1

Looks like a very very toxic environment, sealed suits and external oxigen. Wondering why?
Even after these vicious Assad-Sarin-Gas attacks the White Helmets did not need such a safety equipment.

Posted by: maningi | Feb 10 2018 17:44 utc | 54

Looking at a sequence of photos of the Israeli crash site, the initial people on site have no protective gear as in this pic.

A security unit wearing basic disposable breathing masks then guard the site

Which then moves to the pics in my previous links @52 with people in full protective suits searching for and removing something from the wreckage. Looks like this plane was carrying something particularly nasty that is not normally aboard these aircraft.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 17:47 utc | 55

@ 52

And why are several of them bare headed in cloth uniformes and wearing only a marginally effective particle mask, while the majority are in full Hazmat suits with SCBA?

Does an F16 have any radioactive components? Or chemicals more dangerous than jet propellant, hydraulic fluid, battery electrolytes.

Posted by: Whyawannaknow1 | Feb 10 2018 18:04 utc | 56

thanks for the update b and thanks for the many informative and educational comments and posts from others... thanks to the cooler heads prevailing at this moment in time as well.. would be good if all the countries responsible for trying to tear apart syria would get the fuck out of the way as well, but alas - they just can't seem to do that... yet...

i think the idea of a connection to the russia jet shot down and this israel jet here seems likely... don't know how they connect, but it is possible.. either that or russia is getting fed up with all the intervention to continue a war and has given syria a green light to respond to israels bullshit..

got a laugh out of this in yuls link @42 in case you missed it..

"Israeli Knesset calling for an emergency meeting to discuss a bill that would officially designate the Soviet era SAM S-125 AD system as "Anti-semitic".

Netanyahu compared the S-125 AD system that downed an Israel F-16 to Hitler and urged all nations to defend Israel against this anti-semitic force which threatens Israeli existence.

US UN representative Nicky Haley called for an emergency meeting to discuss enforce sanctions on the S125 calling it another proof of clear Russian meddling."

Posted by: james | Feb 10 2018 18:05 utc | 57

Thanks for keeping on top of this, b.

A very serious consequence of this is that the Israelis had to go to the Russians to obtain a ceasefire, not the Americans. Tillerson and Mattis were completely useless to them. They needed Lavrov and Shoigu to bail them out. Every action the US and Israel take seem to increase Russia's influence in the middle East at their own expense.

Posted by: lysander | Feb 10 2018 18:10 utc | 58

@all - updated above with an interview (vid) Elijah gave to 108morris:
- What happened today
- What are the implied messages
- What does it mean for the strategic situation

Posted by: b | Feb 10 2018 18:55 utc | 59

I keep repeating it, but people in the West really need to start reading Israeli news papers. Pretty well every thing people in the West think they know about Israel is white washed BS. Read Israeli papers and let Israeli Jews tell you some thing much closer to the truth than you will ever be allowed to hear in the West.

You can start here.

Israel is desperate to drag the NATO countries into a war with Lebanon, Syria and Iran. If they are going to do that they need to make it happen before the midterms when control of the House could swing to the Democrats. There is nearly a 50 point difference in support for Israel between Democrats and Republicans and Hillary doesn't get a say. Trump and his all Jewish cast of Middle East advisers have shown they will do any thing for Israel. So buckle up this will be a rough year.

Posted by: BraveNewWorld | Feb 10 2018 18:55 utc | 60

@ everyone.. further to @58 b's post - maybe others can consider making a donation to elijah j. m's working work too..

Posted by: james | Feb 10 2018 19:10 utc | 61

maningi@53 The F-16 carries a 20 mm (0.787 in) M61A1 Vulcan cannon for close range aerial combat and strafing. No doubt those cannon rounds are made of depleted uranium, absolutely deadly when particles breathed in, and cause cancer.

Posted by: harrylaw | Feb 10 2018 19:25 utc | 62

31: In days of old that symbol was called either a pound sign or a number sign.

Posted by: Bart Hansen | Feb 10 2018 19:30 utc | 63

harrylaw 61

You may be right on the depleted uranium, but what I find odd the uniformed and civilian clothed officials initially on the site and among the wreckage did not see a need for protective gear. After that a special guard detail seem to have taken control of the site until specialists with full protection arrived. Depleted uranium would fit the picture though as those standing back a bit still only wore a light breathing mask.
That the officials initially on site found no need for protective equipment makes this seem a little out of the ordinary.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 19:36 utc | 64

Some resistance sites claim the drone flying in Golan was a trap that Israelis unexpectly walked in to , to make Israeli react and pull out the Israeli aircrafts over Syria, when Syrian anti air system were fully ready, this they claim was a payback for US attack on Syrian forces a few days back. Maybe the message has registered in DC and CENTCOM.

Posted by: kooshy | Feb 10 2018 19:40 utc | 65

AntiSpin @31:

I agree it's annoying.  I believe "#" symbol allows for easier search of topics within the Twitter application.  If I'm correct, then it would give the "Tweet"?? higher priority to be shown to all Twitter users in their news application.

Posted by: Ian | Feb 10 2018 19:43 utc | 66

b 58

Magnier seems to be the only account saying the Israel jets were over or in the vicinity of Suknah
An odd place to be if their intention was to hit T4.
If Magnier is correct on the location, what where they doing there? Heading for Deir Ezzor rather than T4? I believe the US department of State's local goons are currently attacking SAA east of the Euphrates.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 19:45 utc | 67

I'm not sure that you're correct in saying the Vulcan shoots a DU round. The GAU-8 of the Warthog does, but... I'd be interested in seeing any corroboration you have available.

Posted by: cjla | Feb 10 2018 19:45 utc | 68

„Israel is desperate to drag the NATO countries into a war with Lebanon, Syria and Iran....."

Posted by: BraveNewWorld | Feb 10, 2018 1:55:51 PM | 60

Imho this is the sole reason why this celebration of the first US military Base in israhell took place not long ago. Its just a matter of timing and opportunity that we will have an alleged iranian/hisballah/syrian drone/missile 'attacking' this site and there you go......

Posted by: youss | Feb 10 2018 19:53 utc | 69

Peter AU 1 @64:

First responders usually don't know what the situation is, other than something big is burning.   Although I'm no weapon expert (perhaps Pathway VI could chime in), but I doubt any bio/chemical weapons would have survived the crash.   My gut feeling is that harrylaw @62 is correct regarding DU ammo.

A question for Pathway VI, would a tactical nuke survive that burning wreck?

Posted by: Ian | Feb 10 2018 19:57 utc | 70

cjla@68 According to wikipedia it does, and chimes with its strafing ability, those rounds penetrate tanks and other military vehicles like a knife through butter.

Posted by: harrylaw | Feb 10 2018 20:25 utc | 71

james #56

Yep that is a good laugh. Surely those twitter posts were a spoof? But who knows when it comes to craziness that comes out of Israel.

Posted by: ToivoS | Feb 10 2018 20:38 utc | 72

Israel lost more than an F-16 and one pilot today.

They lost their cause against Assad.

They wrapped the action as Iranian. They accused only Iran of everything.

And they have called their own bluff.

Time for war against Iran, and they know that is un-winnable.

Israel basically punched itself out today. It can launch a war against Syria or Lebanon but it cannot launch a war against Iran.

So what was achieved?

TKO, first round. A groggy Bibi spit his mouthpiece and drooled blood from his self-inflicted attack.

The US is not going to begin a war IDF-style.

If Bibi had a half-functioning brain, he would have blamed it all on Assad and attacked Assad directly. That would have garnered McMaster and Haley's response and maybe a hundred missiles from the Chocolate Cake and two scoops Trumpster.

Posted by: Red Ryder | Feb 10 2018 20:39 utc | 73

Dont know if its rumours or legit, but can anyone confirm the latest report that israel is currently striking khalkahla airbase ?

Posted by: Deebo | Feb 10 2018 20:58 utc | 74

The entire U.S. media circle refused to republish certain comments by the Israeli defense minister about the preferred outcome in Syria, but here they are:

“Ya'alon: I would prefer Islamic State to Iran in Syria ...
Ya’alon: I would prefer Islamic State to Iran in Syria Defense minister says jihadists don't 'have capabilities' of Islamic Republic, which he brands Israel's ...”

I never link directly to Israeli news sources for obvious reasons (malware, etc.) but that’s their mentality; however, this is a viewpoint that many Israelis will happily support. I think it has something to do with bogus notions of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend’. It’s not so strange that fanatical American evangelical interest, fanatical Israeli Zionist interests, and fanatical Saudi Wahabbist interests would all get in bed together; they think they can support each other’s interests. Israel would probably be happy to see American neoNazis eject all Jews to Israel, right. . .

Posted by: nonsense factory | Feb 10 2018 21:01 utc | 75

The reason for the people at the crash site in protective gear is not because of depleted uranium (could be that they carry DU shells) but because of Hydrazine. That is very toxic and is carried by F16 jets as emergency jet fuel.

Hydrazine wiki

In my country we've had a couple of F16 crashes and I remember reading this numerous times.

Posted by: Gehennah | Feb 10 2018 21:05 utc | 76

Here is a paragraph from the Guardian report on this incident:

That is weird. Iran official quote is to deny Iran flies drones over Israel and the Guardian quotes this as proof Iran condemns Israel for shooting down one of its drones. Western reporting is going off the rails.

Posted by: ToivoS | Feb 10 2018 21:10 utc | 77

[must us preview before posting, sorry about #77]

Here is a paragraph from the Guardian report on this incident:

Iran condemned Israel for intercepting one of its drones. “Reports of downing an Iranian drone flying over Israel and also Iran’s involvement in attacking an Israeli jet are so ridiculous,” state TV quoted Iran’s foreign ministry spokesman Bahram Qasemi as saying. He said Iran provided only “military advice” to Syria.

That is weird. Iran official quote is to deny Iran flies drones over Israel and the Guardian quotes this as proof Iran condemns Israel for shooting down one of its drones. Western reporting is going off the rails.

Posted by: ToivoS | Feb 10 2018 21:18 utc | 78

Gehennah | Feb 10, 2018 4:05:28 PM | 76
Thanks for clearing that up. The relevent piece from your wiki link "The F-16 fighter jet, NASA Space Shuttle, and U-2 Spy Plane use hydrazine to fuel their emergency power units." I would guess this is for powering an emergency electrical power system rather than the main engines.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Feb 10 2018 21:25 utc | 79

amn now saying israeli pilot dies of injuries after being in hospital.. and - 10 elite syrian army people died in the usa safe haven they set up for isis...

Posted by: james | Feb 10 2018 21:25 utc | 80

Thanks to the Izzies, news stopped talking about north and south korea s romance

Posted by: Mina | Feb 10 2018 21:26 utc | 81

I can say that this was a good day. The criminal zionist entity took a big one in their kosher ass.One F-16 destroyed,pilot dead in the hospital and it seems another F-16 damaged and a helicopter too(unconfirmed,but I hope true),

Assad's patience has limits,especially now,when ISIS is eradicated and Al Nusra is being transformed into pieces of halal meat.

Russia had harsh words of condemnation for this:well,it seems that Satanyahoo's visit to Moscow ,on January 30th,was useless for him.

Hezbollah and SAA are"ready" if the zionist criminals push again.

JUSA had nothing to say for now(there are many pictures of American soldiers on the net,all saying"I did not enroll in the Navy to fight for AlQaeda in Syria",maybe this contributed to the silence for now,or the Donald hasn't finished his call received from Satanyahoo with instructions).

After the criminal JUSA attack on SAA(killing ISIS fighters) and acting as ISIS air force(as usual),after the criminal and coward way they killed the Russian pilot,maybe it's time for the Donald and JUSA to realize that assisting the criminal zionist entity in attacking Syria,will be a bite too big that will choke them.

This attack coincided with the threats from the criminal entity against Lebanon and their gas fields.At the same time,Russian navy was invited to Lebanon ports.

OT,related:Philippines (Duterte boy) has cancelled a helicopter purchase from the Canadian faggot and is buying Russian weapons(Shoigu,the Russian defence minister just visited a Manila on a Russian destroyer).

NK and SK will compete under a flag in the Olympics

JUSA is been shown the door all over the world.

Posted by: veritas semper vincit | Feb 10 2018 21:31 utc | 82

@Peter AU1 #79
You're welcome. I stand corrected. It is for the Emergency Power Unit.

Back on topic: Anyone know what the F16 was bombing? Elijah mentioned Sukhnah and Palmyra that is nowhere close to the Golan. Was it going for the T4 pumping station? Or Tiyas airbase (T4 airbase)?

Posted by: Gehennah | Feb 10 2018 21:39 utc | 83

any thoughts on this:

Timing seems awfully useful

Posted by: eagle eye | Feb 10 2018 21:52 utc | 84

You may want to read that F-16 Fighting Falcon page again. Zero mentions of DU ammo, and the only mentions I found via the Google on the M61A1 Vulcan and DU are of the Navy's CIWS and Marines' Super Cobra gunship. That's not to say that the Israelis haven't manufactured their own DU rounds for their F-16's, but if so, I've not been able to find documentation to back it up.

Posted by: cjla | Feb 10 2018 21:53 utc | 85

The US State Dept said...
"The United States is deeply concerned about today's escalation of violence over Israel's border and strongly supports Israel's sovereign right to defend itself. Iran's calculated escalation of threat and its ambition to project its power and dominance, places all the people of the‎ region — from Yemen to Lebanon — at risk.‎ The U.S. continues to push back on the totality of Iran's malign activities in the region and calls for an end to Iranian behavior that threatens peace and stability," Nauert said in a statement.
The Pentagon said...
Meanwhile, Pentagon spokesman Maj. Adrian Rankine-Galloway told Sputnik that the United States is concerned about "destabilizing activities" of Iran and supports Israel's right to defend itself.
How can anyone negotiate with these gobshites. They think up is down, and black is white.

Posted by: harrylaw | Feb 10 2018 21:56 utc | 86

We're told it was an F-16 but what proof is there? Where are the photographs? Israel already claims that its F-35Is are operational. For a deep penetration mission over Syria, the stealthy F-35I would make more sense so what if it was an F-35I shot down, there goes Israel's technological advantage over neighbouring countries that was supposed to last for decades in just over two months. Maybe stealth technology is now a fully depreciated asset?
What if NATO has based all its war plans on technology that's now obsolete?

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 22:31 utc | 87

Gesine Hammerling

Yes, CIA and Oded Yinon have planned (and attempted) to “regime change” and divide up Syria for decades.

This is an interesting tidbit. That CIA document was written by career CIA/Rand Corporation operative, Graham Fuller. From his official biography, we learn Graham was "the National Intelligence Officer for Near East and South Asia at CIA.” At Rand, he focused primarily on the Middle East, Central Asia, South and Southeast Asia, and the politics of ethnicity and religion.”

You know, things like Chechen Muslims and their decades-long war against Russia

OK, here’s the interesting tidbit. Remember the Tsarnaev brothers who were killed or sentenced to death for the Boston Marathon Bombing event? Remember their crazy Uncle Ruslan, who was all over the TV while the brothers were on the run, calling them “losers?”
Well, crazy Uncle Ruslan was married to CIA officer Graham Fuller’s daughter! In fact, Ruslan Tsarni lived in Fuller’s house and ran an NGO out of there that worked with CIA and may have funded Chechen Terrorist Groups, fighting against Russia.

Posted by: Daniel | Feb 10 2018 22:32 utc | 88

@ 83
The JPost article was dated on February 24, 2016. Old and incorrect news from Israel.

Posted by: Krollchem | Feb 10 2018 22:32 utc | 89

yentob #87 says:
israel is not the issue here.

Excuse me? Israel is most definitely the issue here. Can't you read? An Israeli jet was just shot down while attacking Syria. It is not antisemitism to report that news. You guys are not just devious but stupid as hell.

Posted by: ToivoS | Feb 10 2018 22:37 utc | 90


Posted by: Gesine Hammerling | Feb 10 2018 22:39 utc | 91

>>>> eagle eye | Feb 10, 2018 4:52:05 PM | 83

Eat more carrots, eagle eye. Timing doesn't seem even slightly useful - the report is dated February 2016.

No confirmation from Russian MoD so nothing more than Ahrar al-Sham BS.

Posted by: Ghost Ship | Feb 10 2018 22:47 utc | 92

re 90, thanks for that, my bad

Posted by: eagle eye | Feb 10 2018 22:48 utc | 93

At present, ISRAEL-USA-ISIS-AQ are fighting against the Syrian Army. Yes?

Posted by: ConfusedPundit | Feb 10 2018 22:52 utc | 94

Regarding Gehennah @76 comment on Hydrazine use in the F-16.   Pictures of a Hydrazine container in an F-16 (scroll down to picture 37).   Given the amount of damage to the fighter, I doubt the container would be intact, but it's always best to be cautious.

GhostShip@88, The IDF didn't expect a response based on Syria's lack of one in the past.   Since they don't have that many, I would expect them to use the F-35I only when necessary.   Would the IDF risk it?

Posted by: Ian | Feb 10 2018 22:54 utc | 95

@ ConfusedPundit | Feb 10, 2018 5:52:26 PM | 95
Funny that a pure description is noticed as an interesting view.-;)

Posted by: Hausmeister | Feb 10 2018 22:55 utc | 96

"The US Nuclear Posture Review is a seminal document, not just because of the nuclear weapons build up it speaks of – worrying though that is – but because it represents a formal admission by the US that the so-called ‘unipolar moment’ – the period after the end of the Cold War when the US enjoyed unchallenged global dominance – is over."

This is great news for all of those who follow the banking masters and their planning groups as they scheme budgets and marketing methods for their several upcoming wars, including the middle east. Weapons budgets will be through the roof. Congrats guys. Now back to your sociopathic sicknesses.

Posted by: John | Feb 10 2018 22:59 utc | 97

Since there is very few photos and with bad resolution at that, is anybody can point out at a warplane engine, nozzle, stabilizer, in that wreckage site?

Posted by: Partisan | Feb 10 2018 23:05 utc | 98

@ 19

If the Kurds have prepared themselves by digging (as you say):
"Tunnels, trenches, watch towers, depos, loads of strutctures. Massive amount.

1) This is a product of a superior intelligence to that of the PKK freebooters.
2) The purpose of this massive fortification is not about defending Afrin against the Turks. It's about breaking the connection between Turkey and ME!"

If so, then at least the Kurds have finally learned because two winters ago (IIRC) their uprising in eastern Turkey was squashed, unable to learn from ISIS (who Tel Aviv taught)... In the War of 2006 Hezbollah had studied the Zionists social organization of network of Kibbutz settlements that not only were self sustainable villages but with tunnels beneath that turned them in to forts.

Fantastic documentary (10/10!): If Hezbollah was Defeated

@ 57

Yes, maybe Moscow did sanction Damascus to shoot down one IDF jet after having the SU-25 downed.

But there are rumors that three more IDF jets simultaneously got hit but managed to land. If so, it it technically possible that the SAA self terminated the missiles prematurely only to warn Tel Aviv without over antagonizing them? Or maybe the F-16's flares diverted them?

Posted by: rockwool | Feb 10 2018 23:12 utc | 99

@91 toivo... that is another variation on charles drake the regular hasbara troll who always posts here under countless names... best to ignore these types of stupid comments, but i am glad you enjoyed that humour from yul earlier!

@95 confused pundit.. yes - correct... and a few other players are in the game too of course.. like turkey.. and whose side to do you think are playing on, with regard to al nusra / al qaeda, ''''free'''' syrian army, or even the ftsa - whatever the latest name change is?

Posted by: james | Feb 10 2018 23:21 utc | 100

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