Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
October 22, 2017

Open Thread 2017-38

Last week's posts on Moon of Alabama:

October 16: How The Washington Post Deceives Us About The War In Syria

Ahab Jezebel dissects the bullshit the Washington Post peddles on Syria.

October 16/17: Iraq - Thus Ends The Kurdish Independence Project

Egged on by Netanyahoo the Barzani mafia made a bid to steal Kirkuk and its oil from Iraq. The Iraqis disagreed with being robbed and took back their land. Barzani failed. The Kurdish bubble deflated. There will be no Kurdish independence.

Syria, Iraq - Why The Kurdish Independence Project Failed

Background analysis on the failure of Barzani's bid and thoughts on the consequences in Iraq and Syria.

October 18: Saudi Money Invades Raqqa - Sowing The Seeds Of ISIS 2.0

After having bused out the remaining ISIS fighter, the U.S. declared victory in Raqqa. But after more than 20,000 bomb impacts the city lies in ruins. U.S. envoy McGurk brought in the Saudis to pay for rebuilding it. They will pay, but only for new Wahhabi mosques that will then create the next incarnation of ISIS.

October 19: The U.S. Military - Pampered, Safe And Very Scared

Members of the U.S. military are well cared for and mostly live a safe life. There is factually little 'sacrifice' in being a U.S. soldier. While one side of the propaganda depicts the military as 'heroic', another side emphasis the ever growing 'fears' it allegedly has. That doesn't compute.

October 20: Emma Sky - British 'Mother of Daesh' Wants To Reoccupy Iraq

Three op-eds in four days? Clearly, someone hired Emma Sky for an influence campaign. She argues for keeping U.S. soldiers in Iraq. But the U.S. occupation of Iraq, and Emma Sky's very active role in it, created the mess in the first place.

October 21: "Above All" - The Junta Expands Its Claim To Power

The generals have consolidated their power within the White House. They are now moving to extend it over the public.

Please use the comments as open thread ...

Posted by b on October 22, 2017 at 15:32 UTC | Permalink

next page »

looking at what is happening in eastern Syria lately, there no longer seems to be a frontline between SDF and ISIS. Only a transition zone were the two forces merge.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 22 2017 15:45 utc | 1

Say what?!

Samantha Power attributes Trump's policies to Karl Marx:

Posted by: Anonymous | Oct 22 2017 15:59 utc | 2

One of the voices of empire has spoken......

Tillerson Demands Iran "Militias" Leave Iraq As Fighting Against ISIS "Comes To A Close"

Posted by: psychohistorian | Oct 22 2017 16:11 utc | 3

sejomoje wrote in the 'junta' thread -

"Ah, Masha Gessen, literally cancer. Who elevated her? I find it interesting that she does the "translating" for the CIA-scripted FX show "The Americans", a show which has probably more effectively demonized Russians for the cud-chewing crowd than the sum total of Cold War propaganda since the 50s AND the daily Russian hate columns in Wapo et al that trickle down to the Buzzfeed crowd."

"We need to start calling the CIA traitors, actual traitors. Masha Gessen is CIA, CIA ghostwrites for most MSM. Traitors all. But even without the constant hagiographies, would people start to get it? "Americans", I mean?"

It's recently been reported that the show 'The Americans' is based on 'Hillary Clinton's Russian
Ghost Stories' and has a connection to the recent reporting by Sara Carter and John Solomon on the Obama/Hillary Uranium One deal.

Also, about the suggested military junta, Trump may very well have surrounded himself and his cabinet with generals for a reason - draining a swamp of vipers who took control of DC/MIC 50 years ago, it might be wise to have the military protecting your back, your family, your cabinet secretary's and their families and NOT pray tell the Secret Service/CIA/FBI. Just sayin...

Posted by: h | Oct 22 2017 16:24 utc | 4

@3 Did Tillerson really say "All foreign fighters need to go home,”? ALL?

Posted by: dh | Oct 22 2017 16:42 utc | 5

elijah j m has a new post from 2 days ago up here..

Posted by: james | Oct 22 2017 17:22 utc | 6

5 Turns out US silence on Kirkuk did cost Abadi something after all.

Tillerson participated in the inaugural meeting of the Saudi Arabia-Iraq Coordination Committee, along with Saudi King Salman and Iraqi Prime Minister Haider al-Abadi, telling the leaders that the event highlighted the improving ties between the longtime rivals and showed “the great potential” for further cooperation. He noted the August reopening of a major border crossing and the resumption of direct flights between Riyadh and Baghdad. ... History, religion and lots of politics stand in Tillerson’s way, but both the Saudi king and the Iraqi prime minister appeared optimistic about the prospects.

“We are facing in our region serious challenges in the form of extremism, terrorism as well as attempts to destabilize our countries,” Salman said. “These attempts require our full attention. … We reaffirm our support for the unity and stability of our brother country of Iraq.”

Abadi expressed pleasure with “the thriving relations between our two brotherly countries.”

“We are open and we want to move away from the past,” he said. “The region cannot tolerate any further divisions. Interference in the internal affairs of other state should stop.”

or maybe not - Raghida Dergham used to be well informed on Saudi thinking

The situation in Iraq today indicates the presence of a secret thread not only in Kurdistan but also across the rest of Iraq, where Abadi’s ties to Iran and the PMF overlap with his relations with Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and the Trump administration.

There is something curious about the Trump administration steering clear of criticizing Abadi’s policies, to the extent of ignoring to place the PMF, which are backed by Iran’s Revolutionary Guards, within Iran’s violations. That despite the fact that Qassem Soleimani continues to publicly tour all parts of Iraq. There is something curious too about the shift taking place in Iraq’s military and civilian ties with the Gulf, towards more normalization and collaboration after a 25-year estrangement. Here, US and Gulf strategies in Iraq overlap in a striking fashion, bearing in mind that Trump’s new strategy on Iran has been welcomed in Saudi Arabia, the UAE, and other Arab countries, though it has caused concerns in countries that fear the repercussions of a renewed US-Iranian clash, such as Lebanon.
Today, the Trump administration is tacitly supporting the military measures taken by Abadi to retake Kirkuk, because the Trump administration and some Gulf countries believe Iraq could be reclaimed from Iran’s sphere of influence by supporting a strong central government under Abadi’s leadership.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 22 2017 17:35 utc | 7

@2 It is ALWAYS about the Reds. Not gays, blacks, jews, misogyny, pedophilia, drugs, shooting sprees, corruption, terror, famine... The Reds, sapping our moral fiber!

Posted by: ruralito | Oct 22 2017 18:07 utc | 8

Contradictory reports about SDF possibly controlling Omar oil fields..

Posted by: Lozion | Oct 22 2017 18:08 utc | 9

Lozion | Oct 22, 2017 2:08:46 PM | 9

ISIS are the SDF. They wear ISIS hats when attacking SAA and SDF hats when SAA look like taking ground that the US considers their territory. This has started taking place since McGurk met with the trbal leaders that had pledged alegiance to ISIS.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 22 2017 18:37 utc | 10

Peter AU 1 @1

ISIS and the SDF are both run by the US. They swap territory and possibly manpower according to tactical convenience.

Posted by: Anonymous | Oct 22 2017 19:40 utc | 11


Anyone who believes golden-spoon life-long bunko-artist money-launderer serial-fraud merchant Donald Jaweh Trump is a 'Populist' who will 'Build the Wall'(R) and 'Drain the Swamp"(R) by allying himself with Goldman:Pentagon Elites, and nominating dozens of CFR apparatchiks to positions of high policy influence, should probably schedule a doctor's appointment, before GOP takes away their Medicare, to be tested for early-onset dementia.

Posted by: Chipnik | Oct 22 2017 20:12 utc | 12

Anonymous | Oct 22, 2017 3:40:52 PM | 11
From what I can make of it, prior to air lifting them out, the CIA/Mossad run ISIS through "assets" - Jordaninans, egyptiones ect from what I could make of the nationalities of those pulled out.
The airlift was most likely because CIA had decided to abandon the area west of the Euphrates.
East of the Euphrates it seems State Department and pentagon have taken over management of ISIS.
A bit of sporadic fighting here and there, most likely just a few ISIS zombies that thought they were actualy fighting the US rather than for the US. This seems to have occurred since McGurk's meeting. Now they are free to fight the SAA as ISIS, which gives the US plausable deniability, and at the same time, if they look like losing ground, they put on SDF hats and imediately come under US protection.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 22 2017 20:27 utc | 13

...Jordanians, Egyptions ...

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 22 2017 20:29 utc | 14

Gulf News: Syrian Kurds move towards federalism

The view from Turkey
What does Russia say about an independent Kurdistan?

The current outlook allows us to forecast a few developments in the near future if both the Americans and the Russians remain in favor of strong Kurdish federalism in both Syria and Iraq. Among these is a possible compromise between Iraqi Kurdistan Regional Government (KRG) leader Masoud Barzani’s Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP) and the PKK, as well as a possible change of sides of the PKK from the U.S. to the Russia-backed Syrian regime, before or after ISIL is defeated.

Turkey should certainly be prepared for such scenarios.

11 How come the US are in this weak position if they control everything?

US will have to negotiate a new SOFA agreement now with Iraq.

The issue is sensitive in Iraq, and Mr. al-Abadi this month insisted that there would be no “combat troops” in Iraq once the Islamic State is defeated, even though both sides said talks on the long-term role of the U.S. military in the country continue. An official who traveled to Baghdad with Defense Secretary James Mattis recently said “nothing has been finalized.”

There are an estimated 7,000 overall U.S. military personnel in Iraq, including several hundred Special Forces fighters advising the Iraqi army in the siege of Mosul. At the height of President George W. Bush’s “surge” against insurgents before the rise of the Islamic State, there were some 170,000 American troops in Iraq.

A new status of forces agreement got an endorsement from a key Iraqi Kurdish leader Tuesday. Masrour Barzani, chancellor of the Kurdistan Regional Security Council and the son of Kurdish Regional Government head Masoud Barzani, said on a Washington visit that he and his father would back a deal allowing U.S. forces to remain in Iraqi Kurdistan after the fall of Mosul.

Surely, Barzani won't have much of a say in this, Especially when there is an official Iraqi-Iranian military cooperation?

Posted by: somebody | Oct 22 2017 20:52 utc | 15

re somebody 7

Turns out US silence on Kirkuk did cost Abadi something after all.
I don't understand. What did it cost him?

As far as I can see, Kirkuk has been retaken permanently. During my visit to Najaf in March I noted a desire to have more relations with the outside world, as presented by a spokesman delegated for external relations. He wasn't described like that, but that's what he was. He was described as ibn al-Marja' - son of a reference, i.e. son of one to whom the Shi'a refer.

But that doesn't mean they are ready for more than a verbal agreement with Saudi. Kirkuk was the act, and it wasn't done in agreement with Saudi.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 22 2017 21:30 utc | 16

re somebody 15

Syrian Kurds move towards federalism
Have you not understood that this was always the Syrian Kurdish position? They've always been ready for a deal with Asad. The demonstration is that there's still a Syrian army base in Qamishli. If they'd wanted it gone, it would have been gone long ago. There was one attack, no doubt under American stimulus, but it wasn't carried through.

I don't know that a new Iraqi-US SOFA will be necessary. The US troops are there unofficially, as trainers.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 22 2017 21:53 utc | 17

@somebody -
What is often called a SOFA with Iraq was really a Withdrawal Agreement, Nov 19, 2008. It was finalized solely by the White House (no Senate advice & consent) and Iraq (reviewed/approved by parliament). Democracy in action! (in Iraq)
Obama & Biden never made an attempt to affect Senate review (Fall of 2008). Later, Obama has taken the fall for the withdrawal.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 22 2017 21:59 utc | 18

Kirkuk bell also tolls for US strategy in Syria
M K Bhadrakumar

...The fact that the US watched passively the defeat of the Kurds in Kirkuk tarnishes the overall American image, especially among Syrian Kurds. This casts shadows on the Syrian situation. The US has been routing the military supplies for Syrian Kurds in Raqqa via Erbil, Massoud’s stronghold (in the face of Turkey’s virulent opposition.) This supply route is no longer under Barzani’s control and the disruption will affect the US’ operations in Raqqa. The US-led Syrian Kurdish militia claims to have liberated Raqqa, but a real consolidation needs the decimation of the residual ISIS fighters present in the region and it may take months. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 22 2017 22:02 utc | 19

The Iraq Withdrawal Agreement was accompanied by a Strategic Framework Agreement: ". . .the Parties shall continue to foster close cooperation concerning defense and security arrangements without prejudice to Iraqi sovereignty over its land, sea, and air territory." . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 22 2017 22:07 utc | 20

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 22, 2017 5:53:18 PM | 17

As I understand the Syrian Kurdish position they want a complete change of the Syrian political system. And as I understand Assad he definitively does not want any change of that system. A "deal" on this is clearly not possible just one side winning and another losing.

It is not just Assad but also the Syrian opposition that is against federalism. For Syrian Kurds to get any of it they need continued support by the United States. Neocons want exactly that rewriting the history of "the successful surge" in Iraq. See b.on Emma Sky.

This here is Kagan

When Iranian, Syrian or Russian forces attack or threaten American allies on the ground in Syria, as they have repeatedly done, the United States should protect its partners from and retaliate against those attacks. President Trump should make clear in word and deed that he will respond to Iranian provocations anywhere in the Middle East with actions to weaken and dismantle the Iranian military footprint in Syria, including military strikes.

I think Trump has wisely decided to bomb poor Yemen instead.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 22 2017 22:33 utc | 21

>>>> psychohistorian | Oct 22, 2017 12:11:37 PM | 3

Zerohedge is asleep - they didn't pick the stupidity of Tillerson's comment.

“Certainly Iranian militias that are in Iraq, now that the fighting against (the Islamic State group) is coming to a close, those militias need to go home,” Tillerson said during a press conference in Riyadh, where the U.S. diplomat is holding talks with top Gulf officials. "All foreign fighters need to go home,” he added hopefully, quoted by NRT.

AFAIK, all the Iranian-backed militias in Iraq are made up of Iraqis so they are already fucking well home. Syria's a different matter because some of the Iranian-backed militias are of Afghan or Pakistani origin but they can't safely go home. Tillerson is just as dumb as all the Americans who believe that Hezbollah is an alien force in Lebanon.

Meanwhile the British government is just as ignorant and stupid as the American one:

The only way of dealing with most of the British Islamic State fighters in Syria is to kill them, a British government minister has said.
He confirmed that it remained British policy to remove the Syrian president, Bashar al-Assad. “I don’t think anyone should be in any doubt that the control that he has is brutal and ultimately fragile,” Stewart said.

“The policy of the British government is that Bashar al-Assad needs to step aside and we need transition to a new government, because so long as that man is in power it is going to be impossible to have a long-term, stable, sustainable future for Syria.”

Perhaps the Russians and Syrians should persuade the British jihadists to surrender so they can be repatriated.
Finally, American liberals are showing why they'll lose in 2018 again:
Policymakers in Trump’s White House argue that the U.S. should refrain from influencing curricula and “other touchier-feelier programs” at foreign institutions that receive federal funds to educate young girls—except in “muslim countries, where we need to do a check of the curricula at the schools we’re supporting to weed out jihadism.”

Though not as nakedly discriminatory as Trump’s 2015 call for a “complete and total shutdown of Muslims” entering the United States, this new proposal, like the travel ban, envisions a double standard in the application of policy toward people and institutions on the basis of whether their home countries are majority Muslim or not.

So it's discriminatory to want to try to stop schools funded by the USG promoting jihadism, bearing in mind that the jihadists mostly kill other Muslims. Identity Politics gone stark raving bonkers

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 22 2017 23:38 utc | 22


"Anyone who believes golden-spoon life-long bunko-artist money-launderer serial-fraud merchant Donald Jaweh Trump is a 'Populist' who will 'Build the Wall'(R) and 'Drain the Swamp"(R) by allying himself with Goldman:Pentagon Elites, and nominating dozens of CFR apparatchiks to positions of high policy influence, should probably schedule a doctor's appointment, before GOP takes away their Medicare, to be tested for early-onset dementia."

Dude, meet kettle.

In case you haven't noticed the draining has begun. Stay tuned...

Btw, all I said was rather than trusting domestic services to protect the Prez, he's chosen to use the might of U.S. military to protect him, his family and his cabinet/families as well. Who knew that observation would light your fuse.

Breathe, chipnik, breathe...

Posted by: h | Oct 22 2017 23:59 utc | 23

While everyone's busy talking about conman Trump handling of his call to the widow of the soldier killed in Niger, they all missed the important part of that story, the part about what happened that night in Niger.
The story emerging is so much worse than anything that happened in Benghazi, but the same reactionary GOP Congress that investigated Benghazi with a fury seems to have little or no interest in this story.
Here's what we know so far...
The soldiers went to a meeting in an area near the border with Mali. This is a well known hot spot for ISIS activity.
The soldiers were not backed up by US Military air support. No, they were backed up by the French, who were not authorized to intervene or even fire a shot.
The green berets did not have armored vehicles. They traveled in pickup trucks.
The soldiers were given faulty intel that said "it was unlikely that they would meet any hostile forces." Of course, they walked into an ISIS ambush. It was chaotic and they took three casualties.
It took the French 30 minutes to arrive. When they did they were not authorized to help. So, a dozen of our Green Berets fought a battle with more than 50 Isis fighters, without help, for 30 minutes.
Finally, a rescue helicopter arrived, but it was not a US military helicopter. No, the Pentagon outsourced that job to “private contractors.” So, these contractors landed and loaded the remaining troops, the injured and the dead.
Here's where things gets really bad.
Because they were not military, they never did a head count. That is how Sgt. La David Johnson was left behind.
That's right, they left the black guy behind to fend for himself.
According to the Pentagon, his locator beacon was activated on the battlefield, which indicates that he was alive when they left him there.
They recovered his body 48 hours later but are refusing to say where. According to his widow, she was told that she couldn't have an open casket funeral. This indicates that he was mutilated after being left behind on the battlefield.
This is the real story. As usual, the orange Chump and his Semper lie generals are happy to make this clusterfuck about distractions, but this is Benghazi on steroids.
The Trump Junta gave these men bad intel, no support, outsourced rescue people and then tried for more than a week to pretend it never happened. In that time, Trump spoke on many occasions and never mentioned it. In true Scoundrel fashion the front goy tweeted attacks on the NFL but never mentioned these men. Only after pressure from the media did he bothered to even acknowledge these men and their service.

Another reason our troops in Niger were left vulnerable is that Chump recently placed Chad on the Muslim travel ban list. The travel ban is one of General Kelly's dubious achievements. Chad’s troops had been a great military support to the US in this region, but they withdrew their troops (2000 soldiers) from Niger after Chump placed them on this list. Why are they on the list? Because Chad sued Exxon for back taxes and settled with them over the summer. This was an act of personal vendetta from Tillerson against Chad and it’s apparently killing our troops, nothing like an oligarchy of loosers to Make america Gilded again. Will Chump and his entire cabinet of liars and loosers be confronted on these facts by the Washington presstitutes ? Or will they be cowed by a camarilla of bars and stripes ?

Posted by: Augustin L | Oct 23 2017 0:32 utc | 24

Posted by: Perimetr | Oct 23 2017 0:44 utc | 25

@ 9 Lozion

It's a simple choice. The SAA can attack now and watch the wells go up in flames as happened in Jafra, or let IS change uniforms and become SDF and keep the wells intact for now. Then try negotiate a transfer of intact assets after the rest of the the Euphrates Valley is cleared out. If the SAA wanted the field it was there for the taking but it would have been in flames. No matter who controls the oil fields, these areas are in open terrain and undefendable without the nearby towns along the Euphrates Valley.

Posted by: Sad Canuck | Oct 23 2017 0:53 utc | 26

re: . . it remained British policy to remove the Syrian president, Bashar al-Assad. “I don’t think anyone should be in any doubt that the control that he has is brutal and ultimately fragile"

British humour, can't beat it. . . .Are you being served?
Frederic Hof, US State Dept, congressional testimony, Dec 14, 2011: "Our view is that this regime is the equivalent of dead man walking."

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 23 2017 1:28 utc | 27

@Augustin L 24
As I posted elsewhere, these ssoldiers didn't die in combat in Niger, they were (according to news reports) trying to track down an accomplice of one Abu Adnan al-Sahraoui. In other words they were doing police work in a foreign country, an absolutely ridiculous task which they were not trained or able to do and which put their lives needlessly in danger. This criticism applies to the whole "war on terror" which has proven to be a tragic farce (if there can be such a thing).

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 23 2017 1:33 utc | 28

@ dh who commented: "@3 Did Tillerson really say "All foreign fighters need to go home,”? ALL?"

I read that and the same thought came to me. here is to hoping the US is called on it/empire assumptions.

@ Ghostship who was critical of my ZH link.......I know the ZH has limited functionality and I assume others can read the obvious bias in some of the crap they publish as well as the snide characterization of some situations/events/people.

@ Perimetr who noted the ratcheting of FEAR with the nuke saber rattling. I think that those that thought Trump was going to be less of a war president that Clinton II are delusional. Trump is an apprentice oligarch and will continue the support for private finance empire regardless of whether the MIC/CIA/NSA or whatever tool is being outed for human perfidy like the spiteful behavior toward Chad by Tillerson that likely led to the killing of our troops and evident disrespect of Sgt. Johnson.......this is the kind of shit that fealty to the God of Mammon gets you.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Oct 23 2017 1:52 utc | 29


Links? Your info is very compelling. Please provide links. They would be very helpful.

Thanks in advance.

Posted by: h | Oct 23 2017 1:54 utc | 30

I confess I've had trouble coming to terms with the ruin of Raqqa.

When Russia's Defense Ministry spokesman General Konashenkov today or yesterday called the destruction comparable to the Dresden bombing in WWII, and called the US action "barbarian", it got my attention. I live a selectively unplugged life. But I just looked at the drone footage.

So this is what carpet bombing looks like. This is how you fuck a country up, by targeting and massacring its civilians and their life support infrastructure.

I suppose everyone in the whole region sees this, and compares it with Aleppo. Konashenkov said the money allocated by the US to rebuild the city is actually to hide evidence of the scale of its war crime there.

Well, it will be interesting to see how this all develops. Following b's article on 10/18 about the Saudi money and McGurk's visit, and Russia's calling out of money to whitewash crimes, one can only hope for, and expect, more outing by Russia as this appalling work of ruin attempts to hide under the western rug.

Equally bad as the bombing is the MSM cloak over it all, which is the only thing that makes it possible. I think it was b's link that goes to a CNN captioned drone, and from there I read a CNN story about the future of Raqqa. It's very nuanced, all the blames alluded to and misdirected, all the guilt shielded. These writers should be hung, next to the generals.

Posted by: Grieved | Oct 23 2017 2:43 utc | 31


In your long explanation, one thing seems to be missing: WTF are US forces doing running around in Niger in the first place? Watch the coverage carefully, as the usual Republican/Democrat food fight over the deaths of "our troops" unfolds. Will ANYone ask why the US has any right to be conducting military operations there?

Posted by: Jim | Oct 23 2017 2:44 utc | 32

Well I guess I'll be the first to say that I find the 'new' Open Threads confusing.

b: when you rehash what you have posted during the past week, you encourage moving those conversations to the Open Thread.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 23 2017 2:58 utc | 33

h @ 23: Set the bong down slowly, and back away please...

Posted by: ben | Oct 23 2017 3:06 utc | 34

b, merely a small prick among retrobates.

Posted by: J | Oct 23 2017 3:15 utc | 35

@32 Dont be naive, AFRICOM is the new playground. Look at the spate of terrorist attacks these last few years in African capitals. Since Gaddafi’s death there has been a proliferation of Salafist groups, the corollary being “justification” for US presence: Problem - Reaction - Solution
Not that this has anything to do with China’s ever growing need for trade and ressources on the Dark Continent..

Posted by: Lozion | Oct 23 2017 3:32 utc | 36

@10/26 Understood and agreed. Lets see how this all plays out..

Posted by: Lozion | Oct 23 2017 3:41 utc | 37

Grieved @31--

Must agree with your sentiments. Don't know if you've read them yet, but Putin's answers at the close of the Valdai Club's annual conference are quite pointed and powerful and aimed at the proper people. You'll find them towards the end of the transcript,

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 23 2017 4:37 utc | 38

Fascinating what's going on in EU politically.

A 31 year old on an anti-immigrant platform becomes the head of government in Austria after their recent election. A billionaire, with an EU-sceptic and anti-immigrant campaign leads the biggest party after the Czech election. Lombardy and Veneto regions vote for more autonomy from Rome in an Italian referendum. And now the showdown between the Catalan separatists and the Spanish government moves to an interesting stage as the Spanish government strips Catalonia of autonomy and imposes rule from Madrid. This all comes after a stunning election in Germany where a new party on an anti-immigrant platform enters the German parliament for the first time.

Clearly there is some significant ferment among many people in the EU and they are expressing themselves against the status quo establishment.

A question for the Europeans. Where is this bubbling of discontent among people going to lead to? Who will capitalize on this angst being felt by many people?

Posted by: ab initio | Oct 23 2017 5:37 utc | 39

ditto grieved @31 and karlof1 @38... it's amazing how well propaganda and control of the media can keep the general populace in the dark.

@33 jackrabbit.. i am a bit confused by this new presentation...

Posted by: james | Oct 23 2017 6:03 utc | 40

>>>> Jackrabbit | Oct 22, 2017 10:58:54 PM | 33

Well I guess I'll be the first to say that I find the 'new' Open Threads confusing.

How many go back and look more than three or four threads to read comments just added? At least the new approach is better than commenters going OT on more recent threads.

>>>> psychohistorian | Oct 22, 2017 9:52:43 PM | 29

@ Ghostship who was critical of my ZH link.......I know the ZH has limited functionality and I assume others can read the obvious bias in some of the crap they publish as well as the snide characterization of some situations/events/people.

I wasn't being critical of your link to ZH, and normally they pick up on the absurdities in what they write about, but here they hadn't so since commenting at ZH is such a pain, I just thought I should point out the absurdity they missed. The point I made was a valid one I think?

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 23 2017 7:02 utc | 41

>>>> h | Oct 22, 2017 9:54:12 PM | 30


Links? Your info is very compelling. Please provide links. They would be very helpful.

Really? You don't know the source and what specialist knowledge he has. What you really mean is that you want to believe it's true without any real evidence.

A quick Google search revealed that the text is available on with a link to
the Facebook page of a Bob Lamb where it's supposed to have originated, so, Augustin L @ 24 why no quotes or a "blockquote" and why no link?

Snopes then go onto to analyse the claims and end with the comment "Stay tuned", so it's a work in progress.

BTW, I can see some problems with the snopes analysis.

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 23 2017 7:55 utc | 42

Posted by: somebody | Oct 22, 2017 6:33:15 PM | 21

As I understand the Syrian Kurdish position they want a complete change of the Syrian political system. And as I understand Assad he definitively does not want any change of that system.
That is a genuinely comprehensive misunderstanding of the situation. You shouldn't read Kurdish propaganda sources from Erbil, if you want to know what Asad thinks. A Kurdish source depicting Asad as a centralising monster is doing it for a reason. Just to repeat what has been said before, Asad will be forced into a devolved system after the war, not only because of the Kurds, but also because of the Druze. Quite how devolved will depend on the negotiations, and the situation at the end of the war.

The Syrian Kurds, too, have always been ready to make a deal with Asad. We've discussed it a lot with Paveway on here. But the US doesn't want it to be shown that way, because they are pushing for a breakup of Syria, nor do the Rojavan independence zealots. So it can't be said out loud, certainly not while they've got US special forces on their backs, ready to put in rather forceful "persuasion". But the Syrian military base is still there in Qamishli, which it wouldn't be, if the Kurds were really anti-Asad.

There are probably some illusions going on about who is getting the oil-fields.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 23 2017 8:38 utc | 43

Posted by: ab initio | Oct 23, 2017 1:37:25 AM | 39

Could be that people in Europe feel so secure that they are prepared to try anything in politics. After the war a German party won with "no experiments".

Could be that social media ended the power of main stream media, so now the regulars rule politics.

Could be that societies are so disintegrated by 24h availability that consistent politics are impossible.

Or that politics have converted to consumerism where you buy products at whim. And where politicians are forced to present something new, distinctive. And a fresh generation of politicians is lusting for money.

There used to be an agreement between politicians that you don't do certain populist stuff like campaigning for capital punishment or extreme nationalism. They have always tried soft nationalism. The more the competition, the more ruthless they get, the more they dip into it.

But very likely people cannot come to terms with national identities being eroded and they choose the smallest entity they feel safe in.

It will come to nothing if people don't intend to produce and buy local.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 23 2017 8:43 utc | 44

Posted by: Grieved | Oct 22, 2017 10:43:17 PM | 31

Russian spokespeople are enjoying themselves playing the moral card for once, but the comparison of course would be Grozny.Just go to the google image search for "Grozny destruction".

Posted by: somebody | Oct 23 2017 8:54 utc | 45

Posted by: h | Oct 22, 2017 7:59:34 PM | 23

Of course, the military is not protecting Trump but in a prime position to control him.

What the Trump reality show is used for - see
Posted by: Augustin L | Oct 22, 2017 8:32:11 PM | 24

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 23, 2017 4:38:20 AM | 43
Do you trust an Assad interview printed by offical Sana news agency?

Question 13: They talk about creating federalism in Syria. Is that possible? And do you accept the creation of federalism in Syria?

President Assad: Federalism is a national issue; and whether it should or should not happen depends on the constitution. And the constitution needs a popular vote. That’s why we cannot, as a government, say that we accept or not accept federalism. The government and the executive authority express the will of the people. However, I can give you the general view in Syria. The majority of Syrians do not accept federalism because it is an introduction to partition. There is no justification for federalism, for the Syrians have been living together, in the same structure, without any problems for decades and centuries, even before the existence of the Syrian state, even during and before the Ottoman state. There are no historical wars between the components of the Syrian people to justify the assertion that these sects or religions or ethnicities cannot live with each other. So, the issue of federalism is made-up with the objective of reaching a situation similar to that of Iraq. In that case they use this or that part of the state, which is supposed to be a strong state, in order to produce a weak state, a weak government, a weak people, and a weak homeland.

Kurds not attacking the Syrian army is part of the agreement that Russia/Syria will not attack the SDP. The oil fields are a negotiation chip. But YPG will go the way of Peshmergas as Iran - and Turkey - will not support autonomy.

Should the US leave (where are their supply lines), the YPG will need protection from Russia and Syria.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 23 2017 9:37 utc | 46

Grieved says:

I confess I've had trouble coming to terms with the ruin of Raqqa

consciousness benumbed?

So this is what carpet bombing looks like

well, from our safe distance, anyway...

from up close i dare say it's considerably worse, you know, the kids in the other room blown to pieces while mom's screams of horror penetrate the confused dust and oblique light just before the entire building where their lives were normal collapses in a pile of rubble.


but the teevee's subliminal message just shows us the thrust and ejection of fighter jets from the flight deck, snippets on the news that reassure us that 'the man' is still on top...

...and then the dreamy images of nebulous eruptions down below that bring closure and assure anew that we are indeed on 'the winning side.'

Posted by: john | Oct 23 2017 10:43 utc | 47

I wouldn't take what Asad says literally or as permanent, somebody. The point of view changes with the moment. There will be some level of devolution. He can't avoid it, if he wants peace. And he does. Asad is not stupid, though rather constrained by his family.

Kurds not attacking the Syrian army is part of the agreement that Russia/Syria will not attack the SDP.
The affair is much more long-term than that. And indeed the existence of the agreement is a demonstration that they are not at daggers drawn. The US made one attempt to try to get the Kurds to destroy the base, and then there was no further action.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 23 2017 12:03 utc | 48

The liberation of Raqqa
Anyone else notice how the U.S. MSM slavishly uses the term 'liberation' and talks about the celebration on the streets of Raqqa but isn't bothered that all of the celebrating is being done by the conquering troops?

This reminds me of the liberation of Berlin by the Red Army. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for it. I'm just vexed by the MSM's lack of curiosity about the absence of civilians. Whenever the SDF takes a city, it is 'liberated' or 'retaken'. Whenever the Syrian Army takes a city it is 'conquered' or 'it has fallen', it is never liberated despite the fact that there are civilians in Aleppo, Palmyra, and Deir Ezzor who are celebrating.

While this may be another tedious example of media bias, it's actually worse than that. It shows that our MSM is incapable of doing anything else other than using govt talking points. It shows that no matter what happens in the world, the U.S. is always right, and the press will never function as an entity that will contradict, embarrass or challenge any action like they did in the 70's. These are very dangerous waters.

[btw where are the civilians, refugee or internment camps? don't mean to be cynical but in the absence of reporting why assume anything. There is no reason for our press not to cover this.]

Posted by: Christian Chuba | Oct 23 2017 12:04 utc | 49

Further to the discussion about the us military;

In George W. Bush’s home state of Texas, if you are an ordinary citizen found guilty of capital murder, the mandatory sentence is either life in prison or the death penalty. If, however, you are a former president of the United States responsible for initiating two illegal wars of aggression, which killed 7,000 U.S. servicemen and at least 210,000 civilians, displaced more than 10 million people from their homes, condoned torture, initiated a global drone assassination campaign, and imprisoned people for years without substantive evidence or trial in Guantanamo Bay, the punishment evidently is to be given the Thayer Award at West Point.

Due to an overriding obligation to the state and a purely subordinate obligation to the truth, West Point is structurally incapable of adhering to its own honor code in practice. Dishonesty, however, has a subtler aspect to it. It leeches away whatever integrity the academy does possess beneath its granite foundation. In that sense, the latest Thayer Award is an attempt to revise history by denying the illegality of Bush’s wars and absolving him of any accountability for them.

George W. Bush Receives a Character Award at West Point

Posted by: Bolt | Oct 23 2017 12:10 utc | 50

>>>> somebody | Oct 23, 2017 5:37:37 AM | 46

The SDF is a US created and controlled entity that includes a number of organisations so it's important to look at which organisation is doing what. Raqqa, which is a straight fight against ISIS is the YPG which understands that it has to co-exist with the Assad government in Damascus. The "conversion" of ISIS aligned tribes and capturing the Deir Ez-zor oilfields is the FSA/NSA/DMC part which is overtly hostile to the Assad regime in Damascus. Once the US leaves the FSA/NSA/DMC within the SDF is going to have problems on a far greater scale than the YPG. What the FSA/NSA/DMC part needs to do is really reconcile with Damascus but they're probably too stupid, ignorant and arrgant to do so.

Otherwise I agree with the point that a federal Syria is just an invitation to the US/UK/KSA/UAE/ break it up as they did with the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia. Something the Russians, Iranians, Iraqis and Syrian government are not going to allow whatever anybody thinks. Few Americans are aware that the borders in the former Yugoslavia were not drawn along ethnic lines but were designed to constrain the power of the Serb majority. When it came to breaking up Yugoslavia, the internal borders should have been redrawn to reflect the ethnicity of each area but that wold have left Serbia far larger than it currently is which is not what the Americans and Germans wanted. A lot of people died because of American and German stupidity, ignorance and arrogance.

Added to which, Syria is such a patchwork of different ethnicities and tribes, how do you divide it up cleanly without genocide and/or ethnic cleansing. For example, Fu'ah and Kafirya in Idlib.

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 23 2017 12:40 utc | 51

Christian Chuba

Right on, note also that in general western backed kurdish militias and US army itself of course seems to get all the credit for "saving" Syria from ISIL. The bias never stop it seems.

Posted by: Anonymous | Oct 23 2017 13:29 utc | 52

Regarding federalism and devolution, there are many "autonomous areas" in the world here.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 23 2017 13:32 utc | 53

U.S.-Backed Fighters Take Largest Syrian Oil Field From ISIS-- NYTimes

. . .The Omar oil field that was seized on Sunday is a major prize in that competition. Local witnesses, as well as conflict monitoring groups, said that pro-government forces had been within a few miles of the oil field but retreated after heavy attacks by the Islamic State.
Now that the Syrian Democratic Forces has seized the oil field, it could find itself facing pro-government forces across a front line, increasing the risk of a clash between them or between their international backers. The American-backed coalition and the Russia-Iran coalition have previously accused each another of firing on their proxy forces in the area.
The government, led by President Bashar al-Assad, controls around 60 percent of the country and has vowed to retake the rest of it.
Still, a Kurdish official, reached by phone in Qamishli, a Kurdish-controlled city in the northeast, was ecstatic. Speaking on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to discuss politics, he noted that the S.D.F. now controls Syria’s largest hydroelectric dams and oil fields as well as sprawling gas fields and agricultural lands.
That, he said, could give Kurds and their allies leverage to get a seat at the table in any future peace talks. Up to now, they have not been recognized as a party to the long-stymied talks held in Geneva between the Syrian government and a coalition recognized by the United States and its allies as the sole representative of the Syrian opposition. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 23 2017 14:26 utc | 54

>>>>> Don Bacon | Oct 23, 2017 10:26:22 AM | 54

The ever truthful Anne Barnyard reporting from Beirut. She's nothing more than a stenographer for the various "rebel" groups, and she left out the bit about the ISIS-affiliated local tribes switching sides to the SDF-FSA/NSA/DMC. The "heavy attacks by the Islamic State" were to buy enough time for their buddies to cut off the ISIS patches and sow on SDF patches in their place. With Saudi Arabia now funding Wahhabists in Raqqa and former ISIS members fighting for the United States, ISIS 2.0 is already here and it really was created by and is controlled by the United States.

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 23 2017 15:21 utc | 55

In any case, the Omar oil-field has been taken by Arab tribal fighters, not Kurds. They are the local inhabitants, but there's no certainty that they will remain loyal to the US.

Posted by: Laguerre | Oct 23 2017 16:40 utc | 56

@54 don bacon.. i guess that means ISIS are us backed fighters, switching over to the SDF when needed... it get a kick out of that ''made in america'' name too - syrian democratic forces... got to love how the usa pisses on everything and hope to think people are stupid enough to believe anything the usa represents..

Posted by: james | Oct 23 2017 16:42 utc | 57

@ Ghostship, Don Bacon, H, you bring out Snopes I bring facts.
*** The grieving wife of the slain soldier is sticking to her guns and calling out the Orange Chump and his lying general. She confirms that her husband was left behind for 48 hours mutilated and probably will not have an open casket funeral.

1- The french magazine express cites the french Col Patrick Steiger on the incident:''Were it not for our 2 hélicopters sent to rescue the A-Team would've been totally wiped outd''

2 - In the same article Col Steiger says that the french Barkane force sent one mirage 2000 to the firefight but that the strike aircraft couldn't fire because of "imbrication" on the groud. I've read other sources that tell another story...

3- Idriss Deby decided to withdraw his troops after Chump's muslim travel ban targeted his country that bravely fought against jihadi chaos spreading all over the Sahel following Nato's destruction of Lybia. Chadian troops have paid a heavy tribute for more than 5 years and Deby felt insulted by Washington's travel ban and decided to withdraw 2000 of his troops from Niger. Chad started withdrawing troops 2 to 3 weeks ago and the region has seen an uptick of insurgent activity and attacks ever since. During the same time period, Deby accused Qatar of fomenting a plot and terrorist attacks in N'djamena.

4- Kelly the lying general is one of the architects of Chump's immigration policy and travel ban.

5- The plausible links between Chad, Exxon Mobil and the reason why Tillerson probably did not lobby the moron in the oval office to get Chad off the travel ban list.

Le MondAfrique a known organ of the french Quai d'Orsay seems to imply that Chad was indeed placed on the travel ban because they requested Exxon to pays unpaid back taxes.

So I reiterate what I said, will the presstitutes connect to dots or will they be cowed by the orange patriotic conman and a camarilla of lying bars and stripes ? Considering we might be in the early stages of an escalation in the region, I think it would be wise to ask the right questions. The french are playing their last gambit to preserve what's left of their pre-carré in the face of mounting competition from rising eurasian powers. To do so they seem to be implementing a new version De Gaulle's OCRS (organisation centrale des région sahariennes) to secure the hydrocarbon and resource rich Touadeni basin. The destruction of Libya was intended to secure the franc cfa currency (a colonial relic whereby they loot/use as they see fit 50% of 14 African countries reserves)to support their bankrupt treasury. The chaos in the Sahel and the African sub-continent was a small price to pay, if it meant saving the teethering western banking system by looting Libya's reserves and SWF...

Posted by: Augustin L | Oct 23 2017 21:56 utc | 58

snopes is for dopes.
sorry, I couldn't resist. :^)

Posted by: Stryker | Oct 23 2017 22:07 utc | 59

Posted by: Augustin L | Oct 23, 2017 5:56:58 PM | 58

Thanks for the links Augustin, it is great to hear the opinions of a french speaking anti-imperialist consistent in his/her opposition to all imperialism, as all too often divide and rule encourages a type of parochialism among us so that english speaking opposition devotes more energy to non anglo imperialism, while French and Russian speaking resisters can also be prone to the snare of disparaging the mob next door, rather than fixing their own back yard first.

Insofar as the issues with Chad go, the sooner populations everywhere recognise that any 'deal' with a large multi-national is gonna be a bad deal where local support is delivered via bullying blackmail & bribery, the better chance there is for all of us to cease the resource rape before planet earth's problems are terminal.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Oct 24 2017 1:09 utc | 60

and in today's turkish news- Turkish military’s Idlib operation almost completed, next is Afrin: Erdoğan

Posted by: james | Oct 24 2017 23:58 utc | 61

@58 Good post Augustin. Du bon boulot..

Posted by: Lozion | Oct 25 2017 1:38 utc | 62

>>>> Augustin L | Oct 23, 2017 5:56:58 PM | 58

@ Ghostship, Don Bacon, H, you bring out Snopes I bring facts.
You didn't bring facts, you brought someone else mixture of facts, half-truths and lies by cutting and pasting someones else Facebook black propaganda post without including a link, an attribution or a reference. And then the evidence you present refutes some of the "facts" you presented as your own.
The soldiers were not backed up by US Military air support. No, they were backed up by the French, who were not authorized to intervene or even fire a shot.
What was said in the article you linked to:
In the aftermath of these events, French colonel Patrick Steiger had explained at a press point that Mirage 2000 fighter planes had taken off in the direction of Tongo Tongo but had not fired "because of the interweaving on the ground.
Unless you have a clear target, there is no point in dropping a bomb because of fratricidal damage. The only time you would do this is if your position has been overrun and there are more enemy than allies as a Russian Forward Observer did in Syria when he was about to captured by Salafists in calling down a strike on his own position. Most irregulars fighting troops with close air support know that the safest place is to be as close to the troops as possible which was why there were no suitable targets
I've read other sources that tell another story...
Perhaps you could provide a link to those other sources or were they as dodgy as the Clintonist black propagandist who most likely posted the text you copied and pasted.
The green berets did not have armored vehicles. They traveled in pickup trucks.
So what? Driving an armoured vehicle untypical of the region is the quickest way to point out to the attackers just who the Americans were. A beat-up Toyota pickup could be safer than an armoured vehicle unless it was an MBT.
It took the French 30 minutes to arrive.
Actually it took two hours for the French air support to turn up because the American/Nigerien patrol didn't call for support until the fight had lasted an hour and then it took an hour for the French to arrive overhead.
When they did they were not authorized to help.
Rubbish, see above.
So, a dozen of our Green Berets fought a battle with more than 50 Isis fighters, without help, for 30 minutes.
Actually it was five Green Berets with an unknown number of Nigerien Special Forces who had been trained by Americans and the fight lasted two hours before help arrived.
Finally, a rescue helicopter arrived, but it was not a US military helicopter. No, the Pentagon outsourced that job to “private contractors.” So, these contractors landed and loaded the remaining troops, the injured and the dead.
Going back to the L'Express article you quote:
Before two helicopters from the French army come to evacuate wounded to Niamey, the capital of the country.
What "private contractors"? It was the fucking French Army that did the job. BTW, the idea that you don't leave anybody behind on the battlefield is a Hollywood fantasy that only really applies when you have overwhelming firepower available. Otherwise you occasionally have to leave the odd person behind unless you're prepared to lose a lot more people in the process of evacuating everyone. As I said earlier that article that you cut and pasted from elsewhere seems to me to be Clintonist black propaganda consisting of facts, half-truths and plain lies but the lies are not very subtle which suggests it's an amateur job.

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 25 2017 2:50 utc | 63

The FCC is about to announce a vote on its plan to kill net neutrality. We have just days to stop censorship, throttling, and extra fees online. Congress needs to hear from Internet users like you right now. Learn more.

Posted by: denk | Oct 25 2017 4:42 utc | 65 continue-idlib/
...."As a result of Tuesday’s assassinations, at least ten jihadist commanders have been killed in the last eleven days in the Idlib Governorate."...
"BEIRUT, LEBANON (3:30 A.M.) – The Free Syrian Army (FSA) met with Turkish officials and the Syrian opposition’s interim government in the northeastern countryside of Aleppo, Tuesday, to discuss several topics.

Among the topics discussed between the parties were the handing over of all border-crossings to the interim government and the formation of a national army.

The parties all agreed to hand over the border-crossings to the interim government and to form the national army from the existing groups in the Euphrates Shield forces.

The national army will consist of two large rebel factions: the Sultan Murad Legion and Levant Legion.

Both groups will first hand over their weapons and vehicles to the Syrian interim government."

Erdogan taking the Idlib jihadists under state control?

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 25 2017 7:24 utc | 66

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 24, 2017 10:50:19 PM | 63

Are you sure? This here is CNN

Private contractor used to evacuate US forces in Niger ambush

A US private aviation contractor conducted evacuations of US and Nigerien troops after they were ambushed on October 4 in Niger, according to US Africa Command spokesperson Robyn Mack. Mack said that US private contractor Berry Aviation was "on alert during the incident and conducted casualty evacuation and transport for US and partner forces." What is unclear at this time is whether the private contractor airlifted the wounded and/or the deceased. CNN previously reported that US officials said French military Super Puma helicopters evacuated the wounded Americans along with those killed. Contractor aircraft are typically not armed, though their crews may carry side-arms for personal protection.

This is raising questions about whether the French and contractor crews were in communication.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 8:36 utc | 67

This will get downplayed in the western media:

Hillary Clinton, DNC — and One Republican — Paid for Russia Dossier: Report

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25 2017 10:15 utc | 68


Breitbart quotes the Washington Post - how more "Western Media" can you go?

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 10:28 utc | 69


I said downplayed, meaning it wont lead to anything, media will quietly publish it and thats it.
This is a major thing but media wont take it further, alas their pro-clinton bias.

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25 2017 11:11 utc | 70

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25, 2017 7:11:26 AM | 70

People do get bored don't you think? Anyway, "alternative" Breitbart would not have the information without the Washington Post.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 12:25 utc | 71

This is the journalists that spread propaganda against Trump daily. Now? They want to bury and deny that Clinton have anything to do with this.
These incidents just show what biased msm we have in the west.

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25 2017 12:49 utc | 72

>>>> somebody | Oct 25, 2017 4:36:36 AM | 67
According to The War Zone at The Drive, the French helicopters evacuated two wounded soldiers while the private contractor evacuated the dead later. The whole article is worth reading as it contradicts the CNN report on issues like how long air support took to arrive and whether or not the air support was authorized to blow shit up - it was. I don't normally trust what the Pentagon says but as they very obviously don't really understand yet what actually happened, they're probably being as honest as they can physically be.

Posted by: Ghostship | Oct 25 2017 13:09 utc | 73


:-)) would you consider Trump good Clinton bad biased?


They certainly would know if they used a contractor or not.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 13:25 utc | 74


Yes thats what media try to do, push anti-Trump 24/7, deny Clinton any negative pressure.

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25 2017 13:51 utc | 75

75 - maybe because Clinton is irrelevant?

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 13:55 utc | 76


Oh ok now I get it, you share the view of the anti-trump media.

Posted by: Anon | Oct 25 2017 16:12 utc | 77


So Clinton is still relevant?

Posted by: somebody | Oct 25 2017 21:27 utc | 78

@Augustine "The story emerging is so much worse than anything that happened in Benghazi"

You wish.

Your whole pathetic anti-Trump verbiage is a give away of a paid shill of the Cliton criminal enterprise (btw is the evil *itch back yet from her handlers headquarters in London?) trying to distract from recent breaking news about the UraniumOne and the investigation into the Podesta connection.

The house of cards is coming down and the revolting ugliness of the ruling elite class, immersed in peadophilia, satanism, humantrafficking, is finally seeing the light of public scrutiny. Thanks to a large extent to the POTUS.

Pedophilia: Hollywood's other "open secret"

In 7 days, CNN has devoted just 4 minutes to breaking story of Clinton Uranium One scandal

Is Clinton back from the UK yet?

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 25 2017 22:39 utc | 79

@somebody Are you a Jew, or Zionist, or related in any way?

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 25 2017 22:40 utc | 80

@Ghostship Thank you for exposing paid agents trolling this forum!

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 25 2017 22:42 utc | 81

@somebody Sorry, I meant Augustine, got distracted while writing... :-)

@Bolt | Oct 23, 2017 8:10 Wheelchair-bound George H.W. Bush accused of sexually assaulting actress

Former President George H. W. Bush, now 93, has apologized for a 2014 incident that actress Heather Lind termed a "sexual assault."

According to the Daily Mail, Bush attended the premiere of Lind's AMC show, Turn: Washington's Spies, and during a photo opportunity, the former President - then 91 years old - reportedly leaned over in his wheelchair, patted Lind on her bottom, and told her a "dirty joke." Lind told the story on Instagram, where she claimed in a post that the president had his wife, Barbara Bush, by his side, and that Barbara simply "rolled her eyes" "as if to say 'not again.'" The photo is now gone off the social media network, but the Mail captured Lind's caption.

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 25 2017 22:56 utc | 82

@83 Asset to what you asshat? I may be wrong about Augustine’s analysis but you have no right qualifying me anything else but that..

Posted by: Lozion | Oct 26 2017 2:01 utc | 84

@83 pp... moa community is pretty strong.. you have to be careful labeling folks here any particular way, as it will more then likely just bite you in the ass... maybe you don't care, but if you want anyone to pay attention to anything you have to say, you might!

Posted by: james | Oct 26 2017 2:41 utc | 85

@Lozion Are you that blind to not see Augustine's post as a War Party propaganda piece?

@all This in quite interesting: Bannon sows trouble in Washington

The Hudson Institute held a debate in Washington on October 23, 2017 titled "Countering Violent Extremism: Qatar, Iran and the Muslim Brotherhood".

The Hudson Institute is a forecasting agency created by the futurologist Herman Kahn. It brings together many followers of the philosopher Leo Strauss.

The audience was high-ranking members of Congress and Administration, ambassadors and journalists.

Former CIA Director and Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta and his successor at the head of the CIA, David Petraeus, were to point to Iran while supporting Qatar and the Muslim Brotherhood.

To make a good impression, the Institute also invited Steve Bannon, former special adviser to President Trump. In introducing his guests, the director of the Hudson Institute, Ambassador Hussain Haqqani, declared that the first two were "enlightened", while their opponent embodied the "Forces of Darkness" (sic).

Speaking last, Steve Bannon described the New York Times as an "opposition party", refuted the "isolationist" term the newspaper used to describe President Trump's foreign policy, and recalled his action against Daesh.

The Islamic Emirate of Iraq (future Daesh) was created during the term of George W. Bush, under the control of General Petraeus who commanded the troops in Iraq, to ​​deflect the wrath of the Iraqis against the troops of occupation and turn it into a civil war; a device that Leon Panetta took on and supported [1]. John McCain met with Daesh leaders and has long maintained close ties with them in the name of the "Vietnamese" strategy against Syria [2].

In the Saudi Arabia / Qatar conflict, Bannon welcomed Saudi Arabia's change of attitude towards the jihadists and condemned Qatar, while officially the Trump administration took no position. The audience listened attentively in silence.

Bannon then ran into a criticism of the policies of George W. Bush and John McCain when the chairperson cut him off and ended the "debate" by saying, "Well, the elite of politics A foreigner here in Washington who asked me to give you the floor today also asked me to close this debate if you were dealing with other topics than the one we have planned. That's why we finish. Thank you for coming.

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 26 2017 2:42 utc | 86

This is also quite important Saudi Arabia could abandon Wahhabism

Opening the Future Investment Initiative conference, Saudi Crown Prince Mohamed Ben Salmane has declared his intention to transform Saudi society, to make it "normal, tolerant and good".

In recent months, the prince has alternated autocratic political measures (imprisonment of opposition leaders) and open societal measures (such as allowing women to drive their cars).

The Prince's engagement is the logical continuation of his country's development following President Trump's speech in Riyadh on May 21, 2017. Saudi Arabia has stopped supporting jihadist groups and has militarily withdrawn from Syria. The country is now considering dismantling the Wahhabi ideology that has provided fertile ground for the Muslim Brotherhood to invent jihadism. The third stage should see the transformation of the World Islamic League. The difficulty lies in the historic alliance between the founder of the Saud and Wahhabist dynasties, Mohammed ben Abdelwahhab.

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 26 2017 2:49 utc | 87

@james Duly noted.

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 26 2017 2:56 utc | 88

Not only has Russia failed to make angry noises about Erdogans operation in Idlib, they have now put out this statement. Always interesting to see where Putin's moves lead.
"Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov has commented on the new Turkish operation in Idlib, which is the second Turkish military campaign in the Syrian territory.

“The Turkish side is responsible for ensuring security in the de-escalation zone. … Without a doubt, the member states to the Astana agreements coordinate their actions on the issue of establishment of de-escalation zones,” Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters when asked whether Turkey was coordinating its actions with Russia."

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 26 2017 3:42 utc | 89

@87 pp.. i had read some of that earlier today... it seems like a pretty straight forward con job as i see it.. this young punk is the brains behind bombing the shit out of yemen... and now he is talking about transforming saudi arabia into some new form of tolerance for others.. sounds good on paper, but i will remain unconvinced until he stops the craziness that he is directly responsible for..

@89 peter au.. i shared a link @ 61 on this topic from turkey/erdogans viewpoint.. erdogan seems to be thinking everything is cool and the work has been done... maybe there is something i or we are missing in this whole thing? i suspect putin is very clear on what is happening and will act accordingly based on the inside track on what is happening here..

Posted by: james | Oct 26 2017 4:53 utc | 90

Checked your link. Have seen Erdogans statement elswhere. AMN?
I tend to think Erdogan is a political survivor and is heading towards the multipolar world. My thoughts are that Erdogan will say what he needs to at any point in time to survive, so I would place more weight on Russian statements than Erdogans.
To join the multi polar world, he needs to regain control of the dogs of war he has let loose on Syria. At the moment there seems to be an assassination program going on in Idlib, taking out the jihadist leaders, mainly HTS. I take it these are the dogs that do no wish to be chained up.
I may well be proven wrong on this, but thats my thoughts at the moment.

Posted by: Peter AU 1 | Oct 26 2017 6:01 utc | 91


Your love for Clinton, must not stop msm to stop publishing news about her. Deal with it.

Posted by: Anon | Oct 26 2017 7:13 utc | 92

@james | Oct 26, 2017 12 For me the confirmation of Saudi rulers intentions comes from the fact that the Intercept and other major news outlet waited until now to reveal Saudi support for the jihadists in Syria in their attacks on Damascus. Even though they've had the info for a year.

This is how the global evil empire works - its subjects, puppets, vassals must be "blackmailable", ordered to engage in criminal activities so that some "dirt" can be held against them in case they think about switching sides.

The Saudis seem to be switching sides now - on cue some "dirt" is revealed by "concerned press"...

Regarding Syria this is quite interesting, not sure if already discussed here:

Israel Asks For Air Corridor To Provide Assistance To Iraqi Kurdistan In Its Standoff Against Federal Government

Israel Now Threatening Military Escalation with Neighboring Syria

Can't wait to finally see Russia confronting that pesky apartheid state in Palestine.

In the meantime Texas City To Residents: Sign Loyalty Oath to Israel or No Hurricane Relief Funds

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 26 2017 16:44 utc | 93

Another country with a positive outlook on lasting peace:

Russia delivers new armaments to Phillipines

Duterte welcomes Russian Naval ships to Philippines as military cooperation pact is signed

Posted by: PeacefulProsperity | Oct 26 2017 16:47 utc | 94

@91 peter au.. i concur with your thoughts on all of that! we'll see where this goes, but i read it much the same as you. erdogan is playing both sides as a political survivor!

@93 pp.. i read the intercept holding back on those stories as confirmation that the intercept is indeed an inside job propaganda outlet - not to be trusted.. that is an interesting story with your southfront link and the 21stcenturywire too.. the fact is israel has been at war with syria and iran all along.. coming out and saying it publicly would be a switch though.. they are not happy with where things are at in syria or iraq.. they were really hoping that isis - that paid for mercenary group - could do the job they are unable or unwilling to publicly execute.. it really tells one something when countries like the usa, israel and saudi arabia are hoping to use isis as a battering ram to fulfill their interests.. now much after the fact they are claiming otherwise and changing their approach, but it is really too late.. anyone with a brain can see who is supporting who to destabilize syria and iraq.. i suppose they fear the demise of their own country, but that is really no can't buy everything, and it is hard to propagate ignorance, in spite of all the image management they want to do thru the msm.. thanks for the links..

Posted by: james | Oct 26 2017 17:16 utc | 95

i see they are still peddling the bullshit.. tillerson saying assads days as leader are numbered and on and on.. support comes in today from the guardian - dam but that sure is a shitty lying piece of crap outlet - Thursday 26 October 2017 23.08 BST Syria regime responsible for gas attack on rebel-held town, UN finds

that's right.. that event from april 4th 2017 is again on the pages of the guardian.. i guess the people who read it are brain damaged or something..

Posted by: james | Oct 27 2017 1:21 utc | 96

todays daily press propaganda briefing on the topic @ 96..

QUESTION: Okay. In Geneva, he ( tillerson ) said that he wants a united Syria, a future united Syria without the Assad family, and --


QUESTION: -- is that a new position?


QUESTION: Because the position in the past has been that it’s a Syrian business, that was --

MS NAUERT: Yeah, what – we have – the Secretary has consistent – I see. Hi, Nicole. I see your question. Hold on.

The Secretary has consistently said that we do not see a Syria in the long run with the Assad regime running it. He’s been very clear about that. Now – let me finish – nothing about that has changed, but ultimately, that will be a Syrian-led decision. We are strong supporters of the Geneva process. The Secretary was engaged in conversations with Mr. de Mistura earlier today about that very process. We are a long way off from getting that – getting to the table with that, but we continue to support that process. We do not believe that the Syrian people will want Bashar al-Assad, the killer of women, of children, of innocent civilians, over and over again, who gassed his own people – we do not believe that the Syrian people in the end will find that they want that man, that family, that regime to continue running its country.


MS NAUERT: We believe that that process will take care of itself through a political process when we can finally get there. First, we need to keep pushing for a de-escalation of the conflict, and we’ve been somewhat successful in that. And of course, just to underscore once again the significance of taking away Raqqa from ISIS.

QUESTION: Okay, yeah. I’m not broaching the subject of moral crime.


QUESTION: I’m saying that the Geneva process calls for a transition and calls for negotiations and so on, and the government – the Syrian Government is part of that. There has been no backing away from that process, is there – has there?

MS NAUERT: There has been no backing away from the Geneva process?

QUESTION: From – from – yeah. The points that were articulated in Geneva I, I believe, which calls for a transition and negotiation under the auspices of the international community.

MS NAUERT: We remain fully committed to the Geneva process, as do many other countries as well.

Posted by: james | Oct 27 2017 1:29 utc | 97

and...elijah j m's latest from today - Barzani’s dream and the division of Iraq are over and Abadi criticises Soleimani

Posted by: james | Oct 27 2017 1:57 utc | 98

“What is behind the rush by Western capitals to provide targeted financial help only to Raqqa?”

“There’s only one explanation – the desire to cover up evidence of the barbaric bombardments by the US air force and the coalition as fast as possible and to bury the thousands of civilians ‘liberated’ from Daesh in the ruins.”

Posted by: denk | Oct 27 2017 4:43 utc | 99

Cover up in Bali ??
[whether you believe in the micro nuke theory]

On the morning of 6th November, my claims about a micro nuclear weapon in Bali were published on the front page of a major newspaper in Java. Apparently the claims were enthusiastically embraced by Indonesians already deeply suspicious of Australia’s unseemly and entirely unnecessary involvement in the Kuta Beach investigation. To understand the level of outrage and mistrust, ask yourself how angry you would be if a bunch of uninvited Indonesian police turned up to "investigate" a crime in New York, London or Sydney.

Yesterday it was discreetly announced that the contents of the crater, and other debris from the bombsite would be disposed of far out to sea, as a final step in the "Hindu cleansing process".

Late yesterday the diggers started work, frantically removing structures from Kuta high street before they could be subjected to proper examination by suspicious politicians in Jakarta.

Immediately after the Hindu cleansing ceremony, diggers and wrecking balls were sent in to remove the crater contents and other material for burial "far out to sea"

Removing the physical evidence will heighten rather than diminish the controversy, and it will certainly not stop those determined to prove that this was not an attack by Muslims on Indonesian, Australian, and British soft targets.

Posted by: denk | Oct 27 2017 4:47 utc | 100

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