Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
October 02, 2017

Another Day, Another U.S. Mass Shooting

"Turn down the music. You know uncle Stephen goes berserk when one disturbs his sleep." /snark

One Stephen Paddock rented a room on the 32nd floor of a Las Vegas hotel. Over three days, he brought some ten guns into it. The room was chosen to overlook the space of on upcoming open air concert. 

Last night Paddock waited for the concert to start and then fired his automatic weapons into the crowd. At least fifty-eight people died and some 400 were wounded. The murderer later killed himself.

Paddock is portrait as a reclusive, well-off retiree and is thought to be a professional gambler. There is no hint yet of the mans motive. He is white and has a Christian name. Thus, according to U.S. standards, his killing spree was not terrorism.

The state of Nevada allows about anyone to buy and own automatic rifles. With one pull of the trigger one can fire off a full 30 round magazine within a few seconds.  The use of such machine guns leave the victims in an attack like this no time to escape. With a bit of training, a change of magazines takes less than five seconds. The man must have had more than a thousand rounds to cause such a number of casualties.

The statistics paint a horrible picture of gun violence in the U.S. There is now one mass shooting, with more than four victims, per day:

First 9 months of 2017:
-11,572 gun deaths
-23,365 gun injuries
-271 mass shootings
-1,508 unintentional shootings
-2,971 kids/teens shot

The Onion headlined: ‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens . It was the fifths time in the last three years that the Onion used the same headline and story. They only switched the photo, the name of the city and the body count.

The gun lobby will again say, "Let's not politicize this tragedy by talking gun control."

Sure, let's wait a few months, at which time there will be another mass shooting.

Every gun massacre is an advertisement for guns. The stocks of gun manufacturers soared today, casino stocks fell.

Posted by b on October 2, 2017 at 17:20 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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As I see it, they won't change the laws because it's driven by a deep seated fear of black and brown people. The NRA lobbied against the 2nd amendment to change gun rights, when the black panthers started to wield guns in California on the regular. Right now 90% of suicide deaths are white men killing themselves with guns. I say let them do as they please. Between this and the current opiod crisis, americans might be able to enact meaningful legislative changes in a generation or two.

Posted by: Augustin L | Oct 3 2017 1:49 utc | 101

@ 103:"
"As I see it, they won't change the laws because it's driven by a deep seated fear of black and brown people. The NRA lobbied against the 2nd amendment to change gun rights, when the black panthers started to wield guns in California on the regular."

True that, especially the second sentence..

Posted by: ben | Oct 3 2017 1:54 utc | 102

more to this than meets the eye:

Ryan McKinnell‏Verified account @RyanMcKinnell

Terrifying.

Woman celebrating 21st birthday was in front row. Says another woman came during show & told everyone they were going to die.

https://twitter.com/RyanMcKinnell/status/914755192444272640/video/1

Posted by: brian | Oct 3 2017 1:59 utc | 103

having guns wouldnt have saved people in the crowd, could have led to random fear ridden shooting

Posted by: brian | Oct 3 2017 2:01 utc | 104

@ 93

I Agree. Why would one shooter with a good view of the event waste time moving to another location that looks farther than the confines of one hotel room when he was obviously in a hurry to kill as many people as possible? Why would a multi-millionaire, living with a partner, who enjoyed his poker and could afford it, do a thing like that? And in his 60's with no previous? How did he get the weapons up the room?

I find the brother's behaviour in interview unconvincing. There is a lot of eye movement and jerking of the head, a bit reminiscent of the pathologist at Sandy Hook. There's even a little joke - he ate burritos, as if pre-scripted. He told us he was in shock but he didn't seem to act like he was. I think if my brother was dead after massacring so many people my head would be down in shame and in sorrow. I would avoid eye contact. I would mumble. I would be devastated.

Posted by: Lochearn | Oct 3 2017 2:07 utc | 105


American society has degraded into a culture of psychopaths - with each generation obliviously multiplying and amplifying the causal factors of the previous. No one bothered to consider what the effect on the mind is when parents don't raise their children anymore, when everything of value is meaningless plastic gadgetry and marketing for its own sake, when every role model or example of "success" is an artificial pop star, a corrupt financial tycoon or oligarch, or politicians who change laws to legalize their own corruption preaching that the ends justify the means. The narcissistic view that undeservedly glorifies a delusional self image of the nation state, oblivious to its behavioural flaws, incapable of processing criticism, and reacting violently to any nations who do not glorify their omnipotent self. A media who teaches a dialog and thinking of empty continual self glorification and pseudo-intellectualism replacing any meaningful example of critical thinking or debate, who's only underlying substance is propaganda serving state corporate and oligarchic interests, or marketing. A culture of ignorance and mal-education, cowardly hyperbolic paranoia, and self exceptionalism. There are lots of brilliant, kind courageous individuals in America, but they are just a minority, preaching to a majority of child-like minds, lacking any emotional maturity to comprehend, as they emulate the behaviour of their utterly air-headed mainstream media personalities and "experts".

..and they all have lots of guns. Unfortunately at this stage, gun problem or not, until the societal-scale collective personality disorder is addressed, (likely impossible now) The culture will just keep manufacturing psychopaths, disasters and degeneration until doom.

Posted by: Thominus | Oct 3 2017 2:13 utc | 106

Now, I'm waiting for the morons at Fox "News" to forward the idea that this shooting is a "Liberal" false flag, meant to bring "Gun Control" to the fore..

Posted by: ben | Oct 3 2017 2:19 utc | 107

Every death is a big deal.

But, 12,000 guns death vs 60,000 deaths due to opioid overdose vs 30,000 deaths due to automobile fatalities.

Mass shootings get all the media attention however!

Posted by: ab initio | Oct 3 2017 2:29 utc | 108

ben @109,

/pol/'s already on it. They could be half right. It could just be a false flag meant to bring "Total Information Awareness" to the fore. Also, it's very important (to the globalists) that we do not talk about Catalonia.

Posted by: Jonathan | Oct 3 2017 2:29 utc | 109

How come Hollywood isn't being mentioned as a contributing factor?
Here's an incomplete list of worshipped Hollywood Heroes & series famous for portraying the ability to solve problems with violence and self-righteous and outraged 'goodness'...
Steven Segal, Dirty Harry, Chuck Connors, Chuck Norris, Wyatt Earp, Cheyenne, Jean-Claude Van Damme, Palladin, Gunsmoke, Hoppalong Cassidy, et al.
I'm not saying Hollywood is, and always has been, more obsessed with violence and retribution than all other movie-makers combined, but I'd really like to see someone to try to prove that it isn't and hasn't been.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Oct 3 2017 2:46 utc | 110

And the real debate is still not being discussed. Is it constitutional to ban certain types of firearms?

Posted by: ben | Oct 2, 2017 7:53:18 PM | 84

Yes, according to the courts. I live in a college town in Appalachia, in a rented townhouse. One summer day, I return home and there are two canons on the adjacent driveway. Later I smoke a cigarette, the neighbor and his guests (all look like former military, short hair and muscles) relax with cigars on his patio. So I have learned that these were functional (yea!) replica of naval guns from the Revolutionary War period (18th century), 16 pounders if I recall. Next day they were driving to a private shooting range to have fun.

Later I overheard this conversation: "I would move to Massachusetts, but they have those crazy gun laws. I would need to apply for a special permit for my canons."

Clearly, these babies had mediocre range, but if our hobbyist recreated canister shot and used a canon point blank at the crowd, the effect would be terrible.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Oct 3 2017 2:48 utc | 111

As much as people in other countries talk about gun control, it will not happen in the US. An attempt to confiscate private firearms would result in a civil war. You may not like that, but it's true. As for the conspiracy theories, I don't know what I believe at this point.

Posted by: Fidelios Automata | Oct 3 2017 3:03 utc | 112

Terrifying event, and incomprehensible too. I'm starting to wonder if terror has become an end in itself in America. Done randomly for no reason, and no longer a "tactic." At least not for any cause people really think of traditionally as a cause. I can't help but remember the Pulse nightclub shooting, which was nominally done for ISIS but ultimately revealed to be random, the perpetrator ignorant of even the most fundamental ISIS ideas. The spectacle loves terrorism, we love the spectacle, and maybe that's all there is to it.

Posted by: on a train | Oct 3 2017 3:15 utc | 113

Posted by: ben | Oct 3 2017 3:31 utc | 114

OOPS, make that There, instead of Their...

Posted by: ben | Oct 3 2017 3:33 utc | 115

44

Im with you.... Those were fully automatic, how can anyone compare that uzi saw gun sound to a remachined AR? And so he remachined 12 rifles in two days in his hotel room? Lol, this was Maidan in the Desert, because NFL and PRvwere gettingbtotallout out of control, popular people telling Trump to go to hell, bodies piling up in PR, American citizens (e.g. White people) stranded, massive media blackout breaking through, massive sports media assault breaking through...and before you shout tinfoil, remember your Pentagon slammed two drones into three buildings and broughtbthem down, then slammed accruise missile into the Pentagon, carefully and strategicallybdestroying all SEC, IRS and Congressional invrstigations into Wall Street and Pentagon malfeasance in the trillions. And who sits at Trump's right hand today? Wall Street and Pentagon! There is a massive bleedout going on, $100s BILLIONS unaccounted for, of course the 'Deep State' wanted to shut up the opposition. If they could have herded the NFL and PR loud talkers into a building and burned it down around them, would they not? Trump can go to hell, but he's not the Luciferian Satanusts disappearing $100s of BILLIONS of USA's Treasury, Wall Street:Pentagon is:
Defense.gov/news/contracts...over a $B every DAY, ...poof!

Posted by: Chipnik | Oct 3 2017 4:30 utc | 116

@ Jackrabbit 92
"And yet in Iraq and Afghanistan, US army was beaten or challenged by irregulars with outdated arms. They used IEDs, "terrorist" suicide bombings and more. It not the size of the dog in the fight, its the size of the fight in the dog."

That was a classic case of winning every battle but losing the war, a lot like in Vietnam. The fact is, when the insurgent armed forces have the support of the general population and the occupying force are seen as foreign invaders, all the dirty 'counterinsurgency' tricks in the world (like blowing up Shia mosques to try to drive a wedge into the insurgency, or sponsoring Sunni groups to attack Shias and Kurds, etc.) will eventually fail.

But you do have a point; even if a militia-type group can't halt a full-scale military invasion, they can make life hell for the occupying forces over time. But I really can't see the U.S. military being sent in to quell a domestic uprising somewhere inside the United States, that just sounds like someone having a paranoid breakdown. I'd expect that a great many soldiers, if given such orders, would turn their weapons on those giving the orders. In a heartbeat.

Posted by: nonsense factory | Oct 3 2017 4:51 utc | 117

https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/73unz0/mandalay_bay_footage/

Yom Kipper Massacre 2017

Posted by: Chipnik | Oct 3 2017 4:55 utc | 118

Pretty easy to set up an AR-10 or AR-15 on a tripod with some sort of "bump fire" device and a high capacity drum magazine, pick a spot in the crowd and let it fire. One could set up two of these units in different windows and set up a pretty efficient killing field in a crowded area. The "shooter" could then operate a third gun himself, picking out targets of convenience while making sure the two guns on autopilot are firing into an area of concentrated targets and reloading if necessary. I am not saying something conspiratorial hasn't occurred (although I don't believe that is the case), but I have yet to read a logical argument supporting conspiracy.

Posted by: Haassaan | Oct 3 2017 5:39 utc | 119

@3 Out of Istanbul

t is a culture of violence. A desire seems to resurface again and again, one that requires that we "punish" others for either perceived or actual wrong-doings, instead of actually addressing the systemic reasons that make the occurrence so common.

I remember arguing with some family that still lives there - "You have all the facts, but I know how I feel". That was the response after I used facts to disprove many of their arguments about incarcerating ever more people and increasing police brutality to make criminals pay.

Feelings are everything in America (and in Canada, the UK and other English-speaking nations). Facts are becoming irrelevant. This unfortunate trend, combined with the media's manipulative distortions, outright lies and gross overuse of sensationalist rhetoric, discourages thinking, especially critical thinking. The result is a population that increasingly embraces a radical (and unhinged) subjectivity that aggressively denies the extension of reality beyond the horizon of an individual's mind.

Challenging a person spewing inaccurate facts is often met with a variation of: "You have no right to tell me what to believe or think...I believe it and it feels real for ME and that is all that matters!" This is delusional and dysfunctional to the core and a can be seen as a form of denial. What these people are doing is cultivating a solipsistic fantasy world that conforms to their beliefs, prejudices and delusions and doing away with truth based on inquiry and learning facts and knowledge.

The notion that truth exists independently of what a person thinks or does not think about it is implicitly rejected, leaving them floundering in emotionally driven relativism and clinging to their ersatz "truths". This does not bode well for the afflicted societies. The powers that be are okay with it because it makes people easier to manipulate and control...but a polarized and willfully ignorant citizenry who no longer discuss and debate issues and ideas with one another are not the stuff stable and successful societies are built on.

Posted by: Temporarily Sane | Oct 3 2017 6:02 utc | 120

"Unfortunately at this stage, gun problem or not, until the societal-scale collective personality disorder is addressed, (likely impossible now) The culture will just keep manufacturing psychopaths, disasters and degeneration until doom.

Posted by: Thominus | Oct 2, 2017 10:13:02 PM | 108"

sure looks that way to me as well..

Posted by: james | Oct 3 2017 6:16 utc | 121

Ara 11
Complete nonsense. Between 1921 and 1949 2.3 million Soviets were gulagged for political reasons . Less then a million were executed for political purposes over that time . Indeed bloody and tragic but Ara 11 , not the many millions you and others tendentiously parrot !

Posted by: ashley albanese | Oct 3 2017 6:31 utc | 122

Seems likely that the key to finding motive is the girlfriend. But FBI simply says she wasn't involved.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 6:42 utc | 123

Proof this was a CIA black op /false flag

http://themillenniumreport.com/2017/10/las-vegas-mass-shooting-false-flag-psyop-black-op-to-distract/#more-55331

Posted by: John | Oct 3 2017 7:34 utc | 124

@3 Out of Istanbul

t is a culture of violence. A desire seems to resurface again and again, one that requires that we "punish" others for either perceived or actual wrong-doings, instead of actually addressing the systemic reasons that make the occurrence so common.

I remember arguing with some family that still lives there - "You have all the facts, but I know how I feel". That was the response after I used facts to disprove many of their arguments about incarcerating ever more people and increasing police brutality to make criminals pay.

Feelings are everything in America (and in Canada, the UK and other English-speaking nations). Facts are becoming irrelevant. This unfortunate trend, combined with the media's manipulative distortions, outright lies and gross overuse of sensationalist rhetoric, discourages thinking, especially critical thinking. The result is a population that increasingly embraces a radical (and unhinged) subjectivity that aggressively denies the extension of reality beyond the horizon of an individual's mind.

Challenging a person spewing inaccurate facts is often met with a variation of: "You have no right to tell me what to believe or think...I believe it and it feels real for ME and that is all that matters!" This is delusional and dysfunctional to the core and a can be seen as a form of denial. What these people are doing is cultivating a solipsistic fantasy world that conforms to their beliefs, prejudices and delusions and doing away with truth based on inquiry and learning facts and knowledge.

The notion that truth exists independently of what a person thinks or does not think about it is implicitly rejected, leaving them floundering in emotionally driven relativism and clinging to their ersatz "truths". This does not bode well for the afflicted societies. The powers that be are okay with it because it makes people easier to manipulate and control...but a polarized and willfully ignorant citizenry who no longer discuss and debate issues and ideas with one another are not the stuff stable and successful societies are built on.

Posted by: Temporarily Sane | Oct 3 2017 7:42 utc | 125

He shot in ten minutes as many people as it takes Chicago's young black males to shoot in a month or so.

Funny how a 'white' mass murderer means the problem is 'guns' but the steady drip drip drip of blood spilled by black and latino gangs is Thought Crime to even mention.

oh, and they arent licensed gun owners using registered weapons. So explain how 'more gun laws' does anything but disarm law-abiding citizens?

In a country where the police have drones and APCs and automatic weapons to take down guys selling weed.

Posted by: Florin | Oct 3 2017 7:48 utc | 126


This thread shows a major American dysfunction in action.

Yet another spree shooter massacres a bunch of people people with a firearm and the comments are mostly pro- and contra gun control/2nd amendment or statements dismissing the whole thing as a CIA false flag by people whose definition of proof is very...creative (and wrong).

Posted by: Temporarily Sane | Oct 3 2017 8:00 utc | 127

Are you here under sonic attack?

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 10:08 utc | 128

Every gun massacre is an advertisement for guns.

And then, the threat of banning guns that Democrats raise every time is another advertisement for guns. It goes like this :
1) a shooting occurs.
2) the gun sales soar because people want to « defend themselves ». (The fact no-one can be fast enough to defend himself against a demented shooter doesn't occur to them).
3) the Democrats start talking about gun control and banning guns altogether.
4) the gun sales soar a second time, with people rushing to buy before the ban.

If I was a gun manufacturer, I know what I'd do: stage phony shootings and try to get headlines.

Posted by: Lea | Oct 3 2017 10:33 utc | 129

in Catalonia there are numerous videos of innocent people with real blood pouring out of real wounds.

in Vegas there are numerous videos of a crowd of 20,000 being sprayed with high caliber machine gun fire, supposedly killing 59 and wounding over 500...

and i've yet to see a corpse, or even a drop of blood.

how do they do this?

Posted by: john | Oct 3 2017 10:49 utc | 130

Bad guy with gun redeems himself by becoming good guy with gun, kills active shooter, prevents bigger tragedy.

Posted by: Miller | Oct 3 2017 11:07 utc | 131

Can you spell: Sonic.

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 11:26 utc | 132

I've some associative / metaphorical thoughts and connections that might lead somewhere....
-> Mandalay -> was the last royal capital of Burma -> Burma is now called Myanmar... -> is there some symbolic link to the Rohingya uprising? -> which seems to "leverage" the discontent and grievances of a minority group to create trouble for and perhaps to stymie the Chinese-Myanmar cooperation -> The chief actors in this might be the US Imperialists(/Saudi Arabia?) -> How does this tie with the Saudi King's visit to Russia on Thursday (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp/article-4939988/Saudi-King-Salman-visit-Russia-Thursday-Kremlin.html)?

And
-> the shooter is from Mesquite = a type of tree native to US/Mexico -> it was a popular type of wood used by early Spaniards to build ships (see Wikipedia here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesquite) -> Spanish ships? -> this brings to mind Catalunya... With the Spanish civil guard poorly hidden aboard cruise ships -> is there a link between cruise ships and casinos? OR is this an allusion to a poor attempt to "hide in plain sight"?

And
-> the shooter's surname is Paddock = a place where horses are corralled -> is an open air music festival enclosure for concert goers a symbolic paddock? -> And regarding containment of horses, there is this story from CBS on the 27th Sep (5 days before)?
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/senate-bill-could-trigger-mass-slaughter-of-wild-mustang/

And:
-> the shooter's first name is Stephen = meaning "wreath, crown" and by extension "reward, honor", often given as a title rather than as a name, also
-> St. Stephen =
(1) traditionally venerated as the Protomartyr or FIRST martyr of Christianity
(2) was a deacon in the early church at Jerusalem who aroused the enmity of members of various synagogues…. Accused of blasphemy, at his trial he made a long speech denouncing the Jewish authorities who were sitting in judgment on him and was then stoned to death.
(3) His martyrdom was witnessed by Saul of Tarsus, a Pharisee who would later himself become a follower of Jesus and known as Paul the Apostle.
(4) he is mentioned in Acts 6 as one of the Greek-speaking Hellenistic Jews selected to participate in a fairer distribution of welfare to the Greek-speaking widows
(See Wikipedia: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_Stephen)
-> is "fairer distribution of welfare" an allusion to tax cuts? -> if so, is Trump's tax reform package under symbolic attack?
or -> are they evoking memories of Syryzia and Greece ("Greek-speaking widows") and what happens when people "try to buck the system"?
or -> perhaps they are evoking martyrdom, the church of St Paul (I.e. the Roman Catholic Church) or another religion triggered tension?

And
-> One or two analyses suggested last year that perhaps casino interests were behind Trump's presidential run (in addition to other power factions) -> is an "attack" on casinos an attack on Trump's backers? -> if so, casino owners' share prices have fallen since the shooting, for example:
http://fortune.com/2017/10/02/las-vegas-shooting-mandalay-bay-mgm-stock/

Posted by: 9308305K | Oct 3 2017 12:21 utc | 133

There is no way that I would give up my firearm rights to the mass murderers that reside in the halls of congress and the whitehouse, so that they can bring Syria and Libya here

Posted by: Mike G | Oct 3 2017 12:43 utc | 134

Who is the militia? Here is an example.

Battle of King’s Mountain 1780

http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/battle-of-kings-mountain

Posted by: JaimeInTexas | Oct 3 2017 12:46 utc | 135

mind blowing opinion coming from this website. wow B.

Posted by: Au | Oct 3 2017 12:53 utc | 136

136

:-)) there are loads of arms in Libya and Syria, loads ....

All you need are politicians to cause people shooting each other.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3 2017 12:54 utc | 137

@128TS. Perhaps you would care to demonstrate truth in a 'less' creative and right way?
Start with comments 127 and 131. Pontification on comment 136, and the picture of two separate windows being broken may be useful.
Thanks

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Oct 3 2017 13:05 utc | 138

@103. Right. It's all about fear. Americans fear each other. They know they can be shot anywhere, anytime. The shooter can be black, Brown or just some crazy white guy. It can even be a cop. So owning guns makes them feel safer I guess.

Posted by: Dh | Oct 3 2017 13:06 utc | 139

As pointed out on a radio show I heard, there is an interesting coincidence between the situation in Catalonia - which demonstrates how little governments deserve to be entrusted with monopoly over force - and the horror in Vegas, which of course has seriously empowered those who wish to destroy the second amendment. The Bill of Rights is a carefully designed and delicate structure: all the parts are needed. Everyone has their favorite amendment, it seems, and wants to hedge to death the amendments that other people like.

Noting the coincidence between Catalonia and Las Vegas and noting that Vegas has changed the conversation from the one we should be having about overweening state power to a conversation about the state needing MORE power (though the state has proven itself again and again to be far more psychopathic than any individual could ever be)- noting this will of course bring out the usual "conspiracy theory" catcalls. Fine. Do your worst. But any even like this should be considered a false flag until proven otherwise.

States don't have to be psychopathic. They could be engines for moving towards a better human future. But most if not all are, and this is a problem we have to face as citizens and human beings.

My guess about what happened in Vegas, my 'hot take', is that there were probably two professional shooters. I think Paddock was a patsy, forced to take the blame. I would guess he didn't shoot at all, but was left dead in the room as the shooters fled.

Posted by: paul | Oct 3 2017 13:09 utc | 140

This was certainly a tragedy. If in fact the shooter used a true machine gun, let's not forget that these fully automatic weapons are illegal. If he had one of the special permits, perhaps we should rethink this.

Remember: EVERYONE believes in gun control. Nobody that I know of thinks that private citizens should be able to have hand-grenades, or nerve gas, or howitzers, etc. Pretty much ditto for real machine guns. Maybe that should be tightened up. And really, firing a machine gun is so expensive that only rich gun fetishists go for that (sorry rich gun fetishists, secretly you know I'm right. It won't be all that bad if you go back to target shooting with a semi-auto rifle, and you can surely defend yourself with such a weapon).

On the other hand: even with disasters like this, the official per capita homicide rate in wonderful gun-controlled Mexico is at least three times higher than the United States. In a country of over 300 million and counting, now and then bad things will happen, gun control laws or no.

One is also reminded that the United States was created by private gun-owners who resisted the central government's attempts at disarming them. Perhaps that legacy has outlived its usefulness, but that is a part of this nation's history and culture and I would not sneer at it or call it irrational.

Posted by: TG | Oct 3 2017 13:21 utc | 141

yes, it may not have anything meaningful to do with it.
The Vegas mayor and the state governor declared on TV they were angry, furious, very much moved & all. With eyes and mouths on theaterlike grimaces on VEGAS carnage.
I couldn´t avoid recalling that LBJ was angry at the Tonkin gulf incident. That the same LBJ was deeply moved at the convenient murder of LH Oswald. That FDR got pretty much mad at Pearl Harbour. And that baby Bush went supremely angry over 9/11 horrors but only 6 or 7 hours after the tragedy, because of course he had kept himself placidly reading children´s books in Sarasota and surroundings for 40 minutes.

Posted by: augusto | Oct 3 2017 13:38 utc | 142

Watch this video of a young woman setting up an AR15 type weapon for what is called "bump firing" and watch how easy it is and the firepower that comes out. Evidently this has been legal for years. To my untrained ears, it sounds remarkably like the Vegas shooter, at least one of the guns. These devices need to be outlawed forthwith.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7DTjSla-O8

Posted by: Morongobill | Oct 3 2017 13:56 utc | 143

https://youtu.be/bsRNCvHXHHU

Posted by: nobody | Oct 3 2017 14:09 utc | 144

Heard on CBS radio yesterday that there is a big gun show in town and that lots of participants check into hotels there loaded up with gun cases which they take up to their rooms. Happens every year.

Posted by: Morongobill | Oct 3 2017 14:09 utc | 145

found this in the comment section at ZeroHedge:

" from 4chan:

https://youtu.be/gpMrm1xUJ40

http://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/143837839#p143843955

>9:10 reports shooter on 15th floor
>18:10 "shots fired on 29 and 32nd levels"
>18:25 "we are coming out on 32nd floor"
>18:45 "we have a security officer shot in the leg on the 32nd floor"
>19:15 "he shot down the hallway and hit a security guard" (32nd floor)
>19:35 "we'll need the 29th floor, it sounds like its confirmed there are at least 2 shooters with fully automatic weapons"
>26:30 "about 3 minutes ago a black unknown truck (unidentified) ripped out of the parking lot east of Excalibur heading south to the Delano, it was reported by several people and witnessed by me, keep an eye on it"
>36:10 "He's over in Tropicana/Motel 6, older white male with fatigues and a black bag, pedestrians say he came from the area of the shooting, he went into the motor home"
>37:15 "theres one 'WMA' in black fatigues and a white RV off of Koval and Tropicana, south of"
>41:30 (at Mandalay Bay) "nothing has been evac'd"
>43:05 "...at Reno and Tropicana we might have a possible... I need more units"
>47:10 "...confirming the Mandalay Bay, and Alibaba and Guille's(?) are the two shooting locations, do we have a third?"

Posted by: Joefour | Oct 3 2017 14:25 utc | 146

https://youtu.be/3isb_QN3VP4

Posted by: nobody | Oct 3 2017 14:31 utc | 147

Those of you who are advocating gun control in this forum may feel differently about your position as the US is driven further into insolvency and the wheels start coming off. If you can't see that outcome as a strong possibility (if not probability), you need to ask your physician if Normalcy Bias Disorder is right for you.

Venezuela was once a wonderful country, not so much any more. The US was once a wonderful country, but again, not so much anymore.

Stuff happens and things change. Financial collapse is messy. Best be prepared.

Posted by: Ageless Yankee | Oct 3 2017 14:43 utc | 148

Re: Posted by: Temporarily Sane | Oct 3, 2017 4:00:26 AM | 128

Not sure one can rule anything in or out at this stage.

Who was that woman with companion yelling/ warning everyone before it happened that they were all going to get killed?

Would your sentiment regarding a False Flag grow more skeptical or more open to the idea if she turned up dead unable to tell her story?

Posted by: Julian | Oct 3 2017 14:45 utc | 149

Re: Posted by: Joefour | Oct 3, 2017 10:25:18 AM | 146

Indeed. 32nd Floor story is blown to bits by this video. Clear shooting from the 4th FOURTH floor of Mandalay Bay.

If they are lying about this now it is a clear False Flag set-up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdoQq5bn7b4&has_verified=1

Warned about it 45mins early?

BY WHOM?

https://twitter.com/RyanMcKinnell/status/914755192444272640/video/1

Posted by: Julian | Oct 3 2017 14:55 utc | 150

"Stuff happens and things change. Financial collapse is messy. Best be prepared. "

Posted by: Ageless Yankee | Oct 3, 2017 10:43:20 AM | 148

https://youtu.be/MWCUh6tf7PA

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/money/dam/assets/151130120628-china-yuan-usd-780x439.jpg

Posted by: nobody | Oct 3 2017 14:58 utc | 151

A longer version of the earlier video. Clearly different shooters if you listen to where the gunfire is coming from - and at 4mins 55s you can clearly see shooting from the 4th FLOOR.

Very clearly.


This video by a taxi driver I believe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNiRr763gJA

Posted by: Julian | Oct 3 2017 15:02 utc | 152

The shooter identified by the FBI may be an anti-Trump activist based on this evidence:
http://drrichswier.com/2017/10/02/footage-of-las-vegas-shooter-stephen-paddock-at-an-anti-trump-protest/

Here are a couple of quotes from the Land Destroyer website that supports Oilman2 comments:
"the model citizen in a tyranny is one who fears responsibility & eagerly bestows it on upon a centralized oligarchy."

"nearly 2x more are murdered by fists/feet than by rifles (including "assault rifles"). Nearly 5x more killed by knives"


Posted by: Krollchem | Oct 3 2017 15:18 utc | 153

Posted by: Julian | Oct 3, 2017 11:02:28 AM | 152

@2:35

The 2nd Am. issue is a red herring. The media is framng a dialectic for your to follow, say "thank you but no".

Rings of Steel.

Posted by: nobody | Oct 3 2017 15:20 utc | 154

Does Moon of Alabama have the integrity to post the racial statistics about *who* is committing the vast majority of gun crime in America on a per capita basis? There is no "gun" problem in America. What America has is a "black male" problem. Over 50% of the murders in America EVERY YEAR are committed by 6% of the population - black males. Why is that never mentioned? We could cut the murder rate in America in half overnight simply by eliminating the black male problem.

Posted by: Old Ez | Oct 3 2017 15:41 utc | 155

The original post by Ben is pure ignorant anti-gun propaganda, right out of HCI or WaPo. From now on, I'll have to take anything this guy posts as possibly ignorant propaganda. Sorry I ever linked this forum to other sites, won't happen again

Posted by: Mike G | Oct 3 2017 16:06 utc | 156

54

Most of the debate over gun ownership is about what will Americans do with their guns when the debt increases past $30TRILLION, and anything purchased outside NAFTA costs a fortune.

Regulation of guns is as simple as regulating ammunition.

Posted by: Chipnik | Oct 3 2017 16:24 utc | 157

155

Most gun deaths are suicides.

The Vegas shooter is a case of aggressive suicide.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3 2017 16:46 utc | 158

Penelope @99

So the guards were armed with pistols should have attempted suppressing fire on a suicidal maniac with an automatic weapon in an occupied building hundreds of meters away.
And you can't see the problem in this scenario.
That a mental invalid such as yourself would be considered qualified to purchase a firearm in the US is just about the best evidence for a need for restrictions on gun ownership that I can think of.

Posted by: Rostale | Oct 3 2017 16:48 utc | 159

The gun was not a fully automatic. Reported that it had a "bump fire" stock. Fully legal.http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-10-03/las-vegas-shooter-purchased-guns-legally-passed-federally-mandated-background-checks

Posted by: Richard Andrysiak | Oct 3 2017 16:48 utc | 160

143

Guns are trafficked to Mexico from the US.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3 2017 16:54 utc | 161

What some believe to be firing from the 4th floor is probably just a reflection.

If someone actually WAS firing from there, it would be so loud and visible that it would draw lots of attention.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 17:00 utc | 162

Once again, a MoA thread where passion rules. Interesting times. This could be the litmus test: what scale of street violence does it take to rattle the Moon crowd?

~~

From the beginning, and now, it looks like more Gladio work. Given the numerous examples of recent years, I too am greatly surprised this thread doesn't revolve around this possibility as its principal theme.

~~

The Constitution was created to join state republics into a perpetual union and allocate majority power to the federal government over the states, if push should come to shove. But the Constitution would never have been ratified had the Bill of Rights not been amended to the document. The first 10 amendments came from the people, who had a recent and clear picture of how tyranny at government level looked and acted.

The 2nd Amendment exists to give the people of the Union the power to overthrow the government(s) by revolution if necessary. It was a power the people deliberately chose to retain, and not to delegate to the new federal government.

Gun ownership by the people has nothing to do with deer hunting, or even self-protection, today, and back then it had nothing to do with the *regulation* of militias - it had to do with the potency of the people to constitute those militias at need.

Does anyone really believe that, absent those guns, the US government would be a kinder and gentler experience today for its citizens?

~~

For the record, it's anecdotal evidence only, but I live in the US and find people friendly and open-hearted by nature. But the culture has been debased and twisted and propagandized by experts for a long time. So those natural traits of the people that I mentioned have to find the right channels to work through. How people act in spontaneous community is vastly different from what they might offer as a political or social opinion.

Posted by: Grieved | Oct 3 2017 17:02 utc | 163

If what we are hearing is true, this guy is a poster child for "gun nut".

Anyone that feels that they need more than about 5 guns should get counseling.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 17:02 utc | 164

The Vegas shooter is a case of aggressive suicide.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3, 2017 12:46:17 PM | 158

Prove it:

it: single shooter
it: someone named paddock
it: 32 floor
it: killed himself
it: 59 dead
it: hundreds "hurt" [that per NYTimes, as soon as the realization that 500 "injured" strongly implies 1000 rounds hit their neoliberally picked brains]

Isn't it amazing that a hacker genius who starts piratebay can't stay hidden but "ISIS" manages to broadcast live for Rita Katz via satelite?

Isn't it amazing how your expensive big brother machine with mega pix camera turns into a shitty device when there is something going down? (x 20,000)

Isn't it amazing how we don't get crime scene and hospital looksies and all that old fashioned stuff anymore? Just "take our word for it!"

Isn't it amazing that the most effective and simple counter to "fake news" and "mistrust in institutions" is to shine a bright light and be transparent, but we are getting the precise opposite?

@157: man, that is a shit load of debt that can't be paid back if the magic printing machine is moved overseas.

(I wonder what was the collateral "our" government used to get those loans...)

Posted by: nobody | Oct 3 2017 17:07 utc | 165

Why is it taking so long to hear from his ex-wife and his girlfriend?

Once we do, maybe the conversation can turn to mental health issues.

We may learn that his divorce was very bitter and that his girlfriend was breaking up with him. These separations may cause mental anguish as they recapitulate the loss of his father.

In that regard, it is quite interesting that he ended his life as a "most wanted man" - just as his father was.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 17:20 utc | 166

somebody @158:

The Vegas shooter is a case of aggressive suicide.
On planet somebody murder is "aggressive suicide" (when it is murder of political adversaries?).

On planet earth murder and suicide are distinct.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 17:33 utc | 167

167

Do you think the guy planned to get out alive and live happily ever after?

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3 2017 18:16 utc | 168

add to 168

American Roulette - Murder Suicide in the United States

To keep the whole thing in perspective - there are something like 40.000 traffic deaths per year in the US compared to about 16.000 homicides in 2016.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 3 2017 18:32 utc | 169

He was under sonic attack.

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 18:41 utc | 170

@162JR Yes....Reflections...From where one might ask? The audio from the cab video is quite loud at one point....

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Oct 3 2017 18:45 utc | 171

Tannenhouser @174:

From where ...?
In the video the flashes are seen when the cab is directly in front of the hotel entrance.

The wings on either side of the hotel entrance create a concave structure. The position of the shooter at the far end of one of the wings allows flashes from the gun caught by a window pane near the hotel entrance to be reflected.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 3 2017 18:57 utc | 172

The girlfriend is overseas. He was twice divorced.

Lots of Fake News distributed by Google, You Tube and Facebook some of which has infiltrated this board, https://sputniknews.com/viral/201710031057912410-google-facebook-youtube-vegas-fake-news/

The man had lots of guns. In the AP story published by my local paper, "23 guns--some with scopes--in his hotel room;" two modified to be fully automatic. At his home, "19 more guns, explosives and thousands of rounds of ammunition."

As the Sputnik item points out, trolls come out of the woodwork to feed on events like this, some of whom we've seen post here.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 3 2017 18:59 utc | 173

His brain was about to explode, the voice in his head told him what to do. ISIL's voice. You can not resist that voice.

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 19:02 utc | 174

The bigger the lie the more believeable, by sheeps.

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 19:05 utc | 175

Plus, It has to be SPECTACLE.

Posted by: Henry Kissinger | Oct 3 2017 19:20 utc | 176

Chicken-fried, right-wingie, C&W performer explains his change of heart wrt to 2nd Mendmint.

https://twitter.com/mashable/status/915162724602142726

Posted by: ruralito | Oct 3 2017 19:26 utc | 177

It is interesting to see all the usual suspects in this comment thread.
1) The gun control people: if guns were illegal, this would never happen! Maybe. Maybe not. Guns make it easier to kill people, but it is also true that the guns themselves are not what triggered this behavior.
2) The pro-gun people: If there were armed people in the crowd, this would not happen! Actually, it being a country western music festival in Las Vegas - it is almost certain there were a significant number of CCF licensees in the crowd.
subset to 1) and 2): the gun control people and the CCF fans both have representative statements saying that either security or CCF holders could have done something. Absolutely not. The shooter was on the 32nd floor of a building. That's hundreds of feet away, at night. Shooting at a hotel full of potential innocents is irresponsible and stupid.
I actually know someone who was less than 1 block away at a corporate team building event. The deaths are real, and the tin foil hat segment that thinks this is made up is equally foolish.
Time will provide more info on what happened, but we already know:
a) Shooter recently moved to Nevada
b) Shooter was a gun person
c) Shooter was a gambler
The possibility of this being some form of gambling loss related "going postal" is not to be underestimated. The act of shooting up a bunch of people is inherently not a normal activity - and to pretend that legislation for or against guns would have mattered is extremely unclear.
Legislation banning the media coverage of mass shootings, however, very likely would make a positive difference.
People with nothing left to lose - some want to be remembered - and being #1 on any kind of noteworthy list is memory...

Posted by: c1ue | Oct 3 2017 20:15 utc | 178

Often such terror attacks are linked to drug use. Generally, the drugs prescribed by physicians are the ones that are found in the system of the attackers:
http://theduran.com/americas-mass-shooting-problem-drug-problem/

Posted by: Krollchem | Oct 3 2017 20:24 utc | 179

If the whole country (USA) is awash with guns then why not one round of return fire from a crowd of over 1000?

Makes me wonder what the anti-gun folks are worried about.

Posted by: ken | Oct 3 2017 20:48 utc | 180

Poor Mr b. He tries to post a rational comment on the gun violence craze going on in the US. It attracts 183 comments. The majority of responses seem to be coming from more of the most idiotic conspiracy minded fools. I smell 911 truthers, lurking among those maniacs that think the Sandy Hook massacre was totally staged, idiots that doubt that Oswald pulled the trigger, and so on. I went to Infowars today to see where this craziness has spread -- and yes, it there as well.

MoA has been a successful blog in my opinion for many years. I guess part of that success is that it tolerates some really wacky views. Boy oh boy, has it attracted the wack jobs today.

Posted by: ToivoS | Oct 3 2017 21:21 utc | 181

@184

If you're read this blog for years, ToivoS, you should already know that most regular contributors to the comments boards are conspiracy theorists. 9/11 truthers and Infowars readers especially.

Posted by: Inkan1969 | Oct 3 2017 21:58 utc | 182

Idiotic conspiracy minded fools. Only believe what your beloved government tells you like:

"Sadaam has weapons of mass destruction."
"We had to dump Osama in the ocean.... because."
"We were just attacked in the Gulf of Tonkin."
"We found one of the hijackers passports unscathed 2 hours after the initial attack on the Twin Towers."

Posted by: Purity | Oct 3 2017 22:17 utc | 183

The reports are that the guns used were legal as with the ammo.
There should be other events with purportedly white shooters with no evident motive down the line who are killed in the process of confronting them by police, self inflicted or what not.

Then there will be talk of gun confiscation. Hard to impose martial law when the time come with so many guns running loose.

Posted by: ThatDamnGood | Oct 3 2017 23:18 utc | 184

The attempts of establishment stooges to discredit those who had enough of any of the "official stories" is noted and was to be expected. At the core of the deception is the seeding of controversial "opinions" about what really happened.
The goal of dividing and conquering the minds of the lesser intellectually gifted is always reached.
The chemical lobotomy of the American population via fluoride in the drinking water is a resounding success.
Establishment stooges, your time's up. Nobody takes you serious any more, but the wholly devoid of thinking crowd.

Posted by: nottheonly1 | Oct 3 2017 23:33 utc | 185

188 Oh very good. We now have an anti-floridation wacko joining the rest of the wackos. As I said b seems to attract them.

Posted by: ToivoS | Oct 4 2017 0:25 utc | 186

eye got kicked off zerohedge cos i kept calling ebola rock n rolla.
all that talk pages of comments the end of the human race.
you folks are meant too be special yet your belief in the legacy media absolute.
zombies all
maybe your spelling is better your ideas more flowery but in the end just more
huff puff post tings.

whoever put up the reddit thanks a lot that was a shock even more
goy morons.


wait for the israeli security firms who will soon be getting 100s of millions from new contracts
who runs the biggest cctv companies in the world
why does your metro,bus,train tube video images end up in israel.
who controlled the cctv at the major airport during 911 bus and tube video on london 7 and 7
ritual all

keeping running round the msm wheel goyim you may end up somewhere
in the usa marine corpse doing the dirty work for nutyyahoos oded yinon.

why chatter here
why not find out if the guy was real
what was his real back story
no


plato cave dwellers keep watching rabbi rupert murdoch and mossad rita katz new news
rita at site intel amaq news said this sim was a 30 year musselim sim
zion said it
it must be true


go back too sleep sports fans tune back in for nfl kneeling
for yonny kipper at 9.11

Posted by: charles drake | Oct 4 2017 0:29 utc | 187

I am just back from being off the grid since early Sunday and almost everything I know about the Vegas situation I learned from MoA posting and comments......the passel by Henry Kissinger caught my eye.....

Seems like there are lots of questions and a lot of people dead and wounded which fits the Kissinger SPECTACLE comment but with questions of origin.

This is another data point along the path towards the FUD (Fear, Uncertainty & Doubt) goal of TPTB.....which of course will elicit a "public demand" for more control and loss of freedoms......because security.

And to respond to Jackrabbit's comment, yes this is another opportunity to ask more fundamental questions about the God of Mammon incentives that drive the Western world.....and these incentives will be further perverted by the proposed US tax changes by the latest round of proposed US tax changes.......the institutionalism of ongoing plutocracy.

Will the brainwashed Americans continue to support ongoing wars to maintain the God of Mammon system for the global plutocrats? The situation seems to be getting dicey but the cranking up of craziness in the US seems to show some perceived weakness in keeping the public in line.

The beatings will continue until moral improves or TPTB run out of shit that they can throw at the wall.....except nukes......lets hope for the end of the God of Mammon option.

I am not against guns. The reasons behind the people pointing and pulling the triggers, or those manipulating them to do so, should be the focus, IMO

Posted by: psychohistorian | Oct 4 2017 2:12 utc | 188

Further to my speculation at #114 that the Hollywood factor shouldn't be ignored, it turns out that Paddock set up cameras inside and outside his hotel room. There aren't many reasons that someone about to commit a well-planned act of mass murder and the main one would seem to be to capture and preserve a permanent record of his Final Act.
How Hollywood is that?
Given that his squeeze is Filipino, and every white male with a Filipino or Thai girlfriend that I've met is a control freak with very few friends, delusions of grandeur, and a thick veneer of bluster to conceal a shy nature. If those were Paddock's shortcomings then a case could can be made that despite having achieved vocational and financial success, he was not a happy camper.
Control freaks can be safely assumed to be Right Wing Cranks. The over-arching mindset of Right-wingers is that none of their blunders/failures are ever their own fault; they're ALWAYS someone else's fault. This denial of personal responsibility invariably leads to a convoluted quest to look for scapegoats.

Someone who amasses a huge variety of guns and ammunition can only be compensating for feelings of inadequacy. Unfortunately, the only obvious way for a heavily-armed inadequate to prove that he's not inadequate is to Show the World they were wrong. It remains to be discovered which Avenging Angel he was channeling when he performed his Final Act. My guess is Rambo but there's a cornucopia of glorified violent misfits in the Hollywood Honour Roll.

Caution: The above is pure speculation and could be way off the mark.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Oct 4 2017 2:13 utc | 189

Hoarse @192

FYI Latest reporting is that the cameras were only for watching for police. He didn't actually film himself. The camera in the room was on the peep-hole for a view of the hallway.

Posted by: Jackrabbit | Oct 4 2017 3:01 utc | 190

The 2nd Amendment exists to give the people of the Union the power to overthrow the government(s) by revolution if necessary. It was a power the people deliberately chose to retain, and not to delegate to the new federal government. Posted by: Grieved | Oct 3, 2017 1:02:10 PM | 166

If that is the purpose, then it does not work. We follow the news of the civil war in Syria, and some other places. Light weapons like automatic guns have relatively small role. To have any meaningful ability to attack they need armored vehicles or "technicals", pickup trucks with anti-aircraft guns mounted on them (they are like machine guns, but with very heavy bullets, sufficient to pierce non-armored vehicles and light fortifications). Such weapons are also used in remote places in Africa etc. Against armed elements of American public the government would send light armor and light artillery at that would be it.

The truth is that weapons that can offer "credible resistance" are way to terrifying for private hands. Imagine a "technical" mowing a concert. After a minute you would have a field covered with mangled bodies and pools of blood (say, from two hundreds 30 mm fragmentation shells).

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Oct 4 2017 4:42 utc | 191

The 2nd Amendment is about militias: "its context [is] the right of the States to organize a Militia." It is about militias, NOT individual ownership. AND it says ARMS, not "guns." So according to YOUR crazy interpretation, an individual has the right to own a M-28 or M-29 Davy Crockett (a NUCLEAR ARM!)

"In 1840, the Tennessee Supreme Court captured a widespread understanding in announcing that the real object of the right to keep and bear arms "is the defense of the public" and so refers to "military use." It follows that a hunter "might carry his rifle every day for forty years, and yet it would never be said of him that he had borne arms."

"the military meaning of the phrase "keep and bear Arms" is elucidated by James Madison' s inclusion of a conscientious-objector clause in his original draft of the Second Amendment ("but no person religiously scrupulous of bearing arms, shall be compelled to render military service in person"), "

"For many decades, almost all lower federal courts rejected the conclusion that the Second Amendment protects an individual right."

"Despite his conservative bona fides, Burger didn't believe the Constitution created an individual right to possess guns. On the contrary, he said the Second Amendment "has been the subject of one of the greatest pieces of fraud -- I repeat the word 'fraud' -- on the American public by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime." In the next year, he proclaimed that "the Second Amendment doesn't guarantee the right to have firearms at all."

(meaning the context is CLEAR from the opening words of the Amendment, it was not about an individual citizen having the right to have guns)

Burger was speaking for the overwhelming majority of lawyers and judges. The Second Amendment reads: "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed." In Burger’s view, the opening reference to a “well regulated Militia” suggests that the Second Amendment was meant to forbid the national government from abolishing state militias." See http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-10-07/how-the-gun-lobby-rewrote-the-second-amendment
and the in depth article:
http://digitalcommons.law.yale.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2132&context=fss_papers

Posted by: Tom Murphy | Oct 4 2017 4:47 utc | 192

@196 my comment isn't directed at anyone in particular. I copy and pasted it from an old comment and didn't realize it said "OUR crazy interpretation," all I wanted to do was get facts out about what the 2nd Amendment is and what it isn't.
http://www.moonofalabama.org/2017/10/another-day-another-us-mass-shooting.html#c6a00d8341c640e53ef01b7c926a3ae970b

Posted by: Tom Murphy | Oct 4 2017 4:50 utc | 193

Hoarsewhisperer | Oct 3, 2017 10:13:32 PM | 192

I'm glad you qualified with; ...that I've met...
I understand your statement but; it ain't necessarily so.
The class of western whie males coming here leaves much to be desired.
But, there are a few exceptions. ;-)

Posted by: V. Arnold | Oct 4 2017 5:03 utc | 194

198

white males

Posted by: V. Arnold | Oct 4 2017 9:50 utc | 195

We do not yet know what actually took place. There have been so many questionable events of this nature, most notably the Sandy Hook, Charlie Hebdo and Orlando false flag (?) terror spectacles...that one can no longer take at face value anything the media puts out. Rita Katz, the notorious Israeli propagandist who pushes ISIS and Osama bin Laden fake news... is involved in this shooting?? That's a red flag for sure.

Gun control and disarming the citizens will never stop anyone from committing an atrocity. A would be killer can always use something in ways it was not intended to be used. This is just plain common sense folks. And the police will just keep on shooting regardless....

Posted by: Daniel Bruno | Oct 4 2017 10:21 utc | 196

http://hpub.org/16_Unanswered_Questions_About_The_Las_Vegas_Shooting_That_The_Mainstream_Media_Doesn%E2%80%99t_Want_To_Talk_About-61119/

Keep an open mind people, we dont know what happened in Vegas except that this time what happened wont stay there. Interesting that this Stephen Paddock was formerly employed at Lockheed Martin...as we saw with the September 11 false flag, 90% of the alleged passengers on the 40% occupied Boeing that certainly did not crash into the Pentagon were military industrial complex employees...these people are often used as patsies.

Who benefits from this event?
Does this further damage Trump?
Is it distracting from something the powers that shouldnt be dont want discussed?
Is some legislation about to be voted on?
How does the surveillance and police state stand to benefit with new powers?
Can we dig up evidence of actors and props?
Were First Responders en route before the first reports of a shooting?

Posted by: Daniel Bruno | Oct 4 2017 11:04 utc | 197

189

b. is using clickbait :-))

192 Horsewhisperer nails it.

Posted by: somebody | Oct 4 2017 12:17 utc | 198

Surprise surprise.
Old Steve was prescribed pharma crap.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/local/the-strip/las-vegas-strip-shooter-prescribed-anti-anxiety-drug-in-june/

Posted by: lurker | Oct 4 2017 13:07 utc | 199

@198. And some of those guys end up getting disillusioned. Especially after paying all the bills for their adopted families.

Posted by: Dh | Oct 4 2017 13:10 utc | 200

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