(Those days when you can a piece because the very last source you check for linking completely debunks your arguments …)
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December 20, 2016
Open Thread 2016-43
Comments
“a retired KGB general … postulates that as early as the Bolshevik Revolution days a small core of officers around Dzerzhinsky tried to uphold traditional russian & christian values and bidding their time managed to influence late Soviet years and contributed in having Putin in power, himself apparently a member of that “Old Guard””
Frankly, this sounds like one of “tall tales”. Feliks Dzierżyński had a background in Polish nobility that was apparently loyal to the Russian Empire (after his father death, the family lived on income from renting their 100 ha (240 acres) estate), but personally, he abandoned Catholic faith and was very much an “international Communist”. “The old guard” had Poles, Latvians, Georgians, Jews, and of course, Russians, and did not represent “traditional Russian and Christian values” except for being educated on European and Russian classics.
If anything, intelligence officers are often more critical and independent thinking because they have access to more information, and first-hand experience in production of the propaganda for the masses. We can observe it in USA as well.
Posted by: Piotr Berman | Dec 21 2016 17:28 utc | 101
Occasionally the truth about who the Syrians are dealing with gets through the media:
Jihadi mum kisses tiny daughters, aged seven and nine, goodbye – then sends them off on suicide bomb mission
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/jihadi-parents-kiss-daughters-aged-9494372
Will the story make it above the radar in the US media? I doubt it.
Posted by: Curtis | Dec 21 2016 17:33 utc | 102
@99 somebody. A coincidence.
Ger police has found ID in Berlin truck. Are they serious?
http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2016/12/20/us-army-deploys-tanks-europe-ratcheting-up-tensions-with-russia.html
So we dont talk about this. How derail waragenda ?
Posted by: Y | Dec 21 2016 17:34 utc | 103
@80 circe… thanks for your post.. lots of good ideas..
Posted by: james | Dec 21 2016 17:35 utc | 104
Mina — I remain skeptical about kiddy suicide bombers for a simple reason — payload. Boko Haram has apparently used pairs young children to bomb outdoor (?) market places, so there may be some copycatting but the problem remains — payload (and the serious ick factor — the “eternal” questions wrt what sort of people would sacrifice unwitting children? versus look how dedicated they must be to sacrifice their children …
Most adult vests, irrc, weight 40-60 pounds. Children (being top heavy and small) simply cannot surreptitiously carry a large payload … and of course need an adult with detonator in the vicinity.
About a decade ago there was a spate of reports wrt Iraqi and particularly Afghan kiddy bombers which I looked into a the time (the Indian and Pakistani press loved to carry stories about these evil evil people) and found virtually none of the stories had been corroborated … reporters would arrive to do follow-up and would be unable to find any witnesses (or any witnesses beyond the initial named person who reported the “incident”)
The payload issue is also part of why livestock and pet dogs have only rarely been used. Like children, they are hard to control and — unless well trained to carry a load, will simply refuse to budge, and the net result will be a lot of ick and gore, but few deaths and not a lot of structural damage. Adult vests are designed to instantly kill the bomber (and hopefully make identification difficult) …
Again, the big “who benefits” question tends to favor the propagandists, but I suspect a few children have been used in this way … still, the small children evading security by moving quickly or by being “trusted” or adorable (I need to go potty) … doesn’t compensate for resulting stepped up security and government police actions. If kids could deliver a massive bomb, it “might be worth it” … but for a small payload, I remain skeptical … the “what kind of animals…” reaction is too powerful and predictable.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Dec 21 2016 17:48 utc | 105
Wishing all sibling Barflies A Merry Christmas. Happy Hanukah. Cheers for the Holidays. The next round of drinks will be on my tab. Stay well and be safe.
= = = = = = =
@ Curtis 74
To borrow a ZH phrase On a long enough timeline the survival rate for everyone drops to zero:
For those two –it’s been toooooo long.
= = = = = = =
Putin and the Kremlin are livid.
Kremlin Warns Of Response To Latest US Sanctions, Says “Almost All Communication With US Is Frozen”
In response to the latest imposition of US sanctions on Russia, the Kremlin said on Wednesday that the new sanctions would further damage relations between the two countries and that Moscow would respond with its own measures. “We regret that Washington is continuing on this destructive path,” Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters on a conference call.
As a reminder, on Tuesday the United States widened sanctions against Russian businessmen and companies adopted after Russia’s annexation of Crimea in 2014 and the conflict in Ukraine.
“We believe this damages bilateral relations … Russia will take commensurate measures.”
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-21/kremlin-warns-response-latest-us-sanctions-says-almost-all-communication-us-frozen
Just insane.
Extending the Silly Sanctions due
~ the re-unification of Crimea, a territory of Russia for longer than the USA is a country.
And
~ punished for the USA’s coup in Ukraine.
If I were advising Mr. Vlad, I’d suggest (a) postponing the Proton rocket launch scheduled for December 28 launch. EU satellite. (b) Place a hold on delivery to USA of the RD180 engines. (c) recall tansport of supplies aid to/from and the use of Russian helios in Afghanistan (d) embargo EU air routes over RF airspace – let EU carriers take the loooong go-around to Asia.
Can’t do that? Why not? Was France not pressured to cancel the contracted delivery of the Mistral ships. What goes around comes around. It is good for the goose and sauce for the gander.
Posted by: likklemore | Dec 21 2016 17:55 utc | 106
@80
“for that matter Mecca should be declared open cities belonging to no one and everyone and governed by an administrative council”
i think Jerusalem and mecca are not comparable.
for one, while they are both the centers of religion, mecca has had its own status for a very long time.
ever since salah ad din got in to a quarrel with the caliph, and created the title, “Custodian of the two holy places”
this title has been passed around by various regional powers.
mostly the mamluks of egypt and later the ottaman sultans.
the power who held the title would take it upon themselves to provide all the resources need to keep a midsize city in the middle of the desert functioning.
on top of that you have the sharifs of mecca, who are descended from Muhammed who are the nominal authority that rules mecca.
if the saudies collapsed over night, the sharifs would most likely return to an independent state of hijaz.
there is far less ambiguity in mecca’s status. so their is no reason for international community to step in.
and in case you are wondering the muslims of mecca and medina are far more liberal than their neighbors in Najd the home land of wahhabihs
Posted by: pb | Dec 21 2016 17:57 utc | 107
Trump granddaughter speaking Chinese | Ivanka Trumps daughter Arabella recites Chinese poem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikiv7VV24Kw
Posted by: Jack Smith | Dec 21 2016 17:57 utc | 108
In Chinese
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5kgLcClk44
Posted by: Jack Smith | Dec 21 2016 18:00 utc | 109
Posted by: likklemore | Dec 21, 2016 12:55:34 PM | 108
Relax.
It’s nearly the 20th of january.
Posted by: From The Hague | Dec 21 2016 18:13 utc | 110
les7@22, james@46, jfl@61, thank for the encouraging words.
psychohistorian@48, don’t worry, I’m not running a bait-and-switch. The Bible includes a very critical perspective on empire, which is why my website exists. And Syria provides many unvarnished examples of the empire at work, which is why I’ve posted more about Syria at my website over the past two years than about the Bible.
You-all here at MOA have been a rich and irreplaceable source of perspectives and links for my writing about Syria for a Bible-curious audience. Thank you!
Posted by: Berry Friesen | Dec 21 2016 18:20 utc | 111
Posted by: Y | Dec 21, 2016 12:34:17 PM | 105
Oh, the ID will have been there to be found. Angela Merkel has a political problem now. The people who profit are the populist pro Putin right wing.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 21 2016 18:34 utc | 112
penelope @ 35 said:Putin’s ideology is to support every institution of the emerging global oligarchy. Including the neoliberal economics of Russian austerity and the privatization of remaining State assets. He is demonized so that you will exclude from your mind the possibility that the Russian oligarchs are in substantial cooperation w the Western ones in producing the NWO.”
“It is not very different than the MSM demonizing Trump as a way to establish him as an “outsider,” a person against the establishment. ”
Worth thinking about folks. Don’t discount the possibility of an alliance between oligarchs. Greed and avarice are mental illnesses, and are found everywhere. I would like to think better of Russia, but, who knows?
Posted by: ben | Dec 21 2016 18:46 utc | 113
@Posted by: ProPeace | Dec 21, 2016 3:50:38 AM | 55
The difference of standards of living have been artificially maintained by creating “controlled chaos” in the colonies of the Brutish Empire in Europe and suppressing proposed reforms through puppet government, blackmailed by the Operation Gladio threat.
Actually, difference of standards is maintained by “money from the thin air” creation in UK/US and their colonies, as explained in this 20 years old article about banking in Canada. UNDERSTANDING MONEY – http://livingeconomiesforum.org/1996/15hotson . Once you create trillions of “money from the thin air”, which is at the same time world’s reserve currency, you can buy a lot of stuff!
Posted by: ex-sarajlija | Dec 21 2016 18:59 utc | 114
@ juliania who for whatever reason cannot/won’t go to a NASA web link
Here is another link
The link provides pictures to the north pole of Saturn that has a huge persistent hexagonal “cloud” formation. Years ago when I showed the pictures we had then to a math genius friend he blurted out the observation about the formation being in a space where pi = 3.
Thanks to all for the shooting follow up education.
As someone who spent 12 years in Catholic school reading the bible including 4 years with the Jesuits I feel quite qualified to write about the dogmatic delusions of faith breathers…..and will continue to do so. I see religions as useful myth but horrible dogma of human social organization. Their fatal flaw for me is in purporting to have answers for everything if you have enough faith…..and we continue to live that flaw by having faith in the “money changers” that run our world with the tacit approval of the Xtian religions…..we never made it through the Enlightenment period and will go extinct, IMO if we can’t evolve past that hubris.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 21 2016 19:30 utc | 115
The Secret Service used to be part of the Department of the Treasury. That’s where it was when JFK was assassinated.
But it was moved to the Department of Homeland Security when that misbegotten agency (lowest of all government agencies in terms of employee job satisfaction) was established after 9/11.
Posted by: lysias | Dec 21 2016 19:38 utc | 116
Wow. Insightful, informed, AND honest.
Thanks b. That combo is why so many of us keep coming back for more.
Posted by: ritzl | Dec 21 2016 19:46 utc | 117
ALberto | 89
When the photo was taken there had only been two shots in the back, dont forget.
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 21 2016 20:04 utc | 118
@ProPeace | 99
Excellent link.
Have to agree with the Rusaian being sceptical. Turkish news outlets with reporters on the ground at the tine were immediately referring to Al Nusra and Al Qaeda because of the words spoken in Arabic. There were very conflicting reports about the ‘Aleppo’ quotes.
Anyway. Shortly after the reporting started a media black out was announced. When that blackout was lifted the Gulen accusations began and all media channels sang in tune.
This is important because a) it is a clear display of the government once again dictating the narrative irrespective of any investigation or witness accounts; b) Gulen is the ‘lump all’ enemy of Turkey – for the people to understand the situation clearly all enemies are conflated with Feto (Gulen) (even PKK are blames on Gulen!!). c) it might well pre-empt Turkey’s move away from Al Nusra and Al Qaeda – by conflating them with Gulen, Erdogan can sell it to the people. I can not imagine Iran and Russia agreeing to any military / political solution whilw Turkey continues funding and supplying Al Qaeda and Al Nusra – will be interesting to see what happens to them.
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 21 2016 20:15 utc | 119
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 21, 2016 3:15:02 PM | 123
I think the evacuation of Aleppo proved which groups are controlled by Turkey and which groups aren’t. I think US are out because they do not control any groups i.e. are irrelevant on the ground, as long as they do not enter the war themselves.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 21 2016 21:08 utc | 120
Some may write this particular article off:
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/12/18/the-coming-war-on-pedophilia/
But it is possibly of extreme relevance.
It is given credence by much mainstream media news (collated over years because the mainstream media report when they are forced by events such as police arrests, but fail to follow up this issue) for the existence of a global pedophile ring of elites used for sado-sexual sociopathic thrills of harming innocents, powerful blackmail uses and even Satanic occult beliefs for power and wealth:
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1cm0t3/original_research_the_mountain_of_evidence_for_a/?sort=top
Here’s an easier to read version of that research:
http://themillenniumreport.com/2016/12/the-mountain-of-evidence-for-a-massive-international-pedophile-ring-protected-by-police-and-intelligence-agencies/
And then there was BoysTown Nebraska:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uDIrG3Lkmt0
And Epstein’s Lolita Express to Orgy Island:
http://humansarefree.com/2016/11/bill-clinton-on-pedophile-island-human.html?m=0 (click bait website but story factual)
And Jimmy Savile was only tip of pedophile iceberg in U.K. involving according to Aussie “60 Minutes” even the second in command of MI6:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=KjDdWViLl8s
Or in written form – how the British Establishment is corrupted by pedophilia according to the relatively mainstreamDaily Beast:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/11/06/alleged-pedophile-ring-connections-to-senior-public-figures-mount.html
Why is this important?
1. Innocent children are being trafficked and abused for sex but also sometimes tortured in most horrific sadistic ways and possibly sometimes murdered for ritual occult reasons and/or illegal organ trade.
2. Being invited into such activities- even at more benign honey trap with overage sex slaves leads to blackmail control of politicians and bureaucrats.
3. This links into probably how all the dreadful wars get supported by media ( more media figures than any other group were named as persons of interest in the wake of the Savile affair in the U.K.) and politicians.
4. Many of the soporific and tired out masses who don’t care or have time for truth in geopolitics and peace activism would be galvanised – and are starting to be -by this issue.
Hence the explosion of outrage online over the Podesta emails from Wikileaks that point to a likely pedophile network in Washington DC and the mainstream media’s crackdown on “fake news” moving into hysterical overdrive since “pizzagate” story broke.
Posted by: Anoncommenter | Dec 21 2016 22:17 utc | 122
newyork daily news article calling the assassination of the russian diplomat payback to putins destruction of syria, not terrorism…one doesn’t have to guess the new york daily news supports ISIS, more than anything else, excluding israel of course lol.. no wonder no one believes any of the shite coming out of the usa anymore.. the article is inside of an rt story.. also some other jackass wrote something for moscow times claiming the same ignorance… some western journalists don’t mind how depraved they show themselves to be..
Posted by: james | Dec 21 2016 22:29 utc | 123
The politics of terror
Last night’s terror attack in Germany is likely to constitute a significant political event especially if the arrested suspect turns out to be an immigrant;
conspiracy theories are already running rampant, fuelled in part by the very strange reporting of the events in the German media, which pretended ignorance of whether this was an accident or an attack, while foreign media produced much clearer, more detailed, and more graphic accounts;
it is the first large-scale terror attack in Germany, which has so far had a lucky escape from the threat posed by Isis, as attacks focused mostly on France and Belgium;
attacks such as these are likely to affect next year’s German elections, and play into the hand of the AfD, which lost no time in calling the twelve victims “Merkel’s dead”;
Posted by: okie farmer | Dec 21 2016 22:56 utc | 124
We begin, one faction of oligarchs have nudged out the another faction and lets see how far they want to take the war agenda of a war based economy to.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-21/trump-no-longer-wants-drain-swamp-gingrich-admits
reminds me of the deng xiaoping quote on the us political system. hehehe.
Posted by: ThatDamnGood | Dec 22 2016 0:16 utc | 125
Russia’s aerospace group wipes out 62,000 terrorist targets since Syria campaign’s start
“As at December 20, 2016 the Aerospace Force has carried out more than 30,000 sorties to have eliminated more than 62,000 military targets,” Kurachenko told a conference of the extra-departmental council of experts for aerospace issues.
There are 447 days between Wednesday 30 September 2015 and Tuesday 20 December 2016.
echo “scale=3 ; 447*24 ; 30000/last” | bc
10728
2.796
That’s 2.796 airstrikes every hour for the last 10,728 hours?
One every 20 minutes? For 447 days?
Posted by: jfl | Dec 22 2016 0:59 utc | 126
A Turkishb daily claims that one of the agreements that has come out of the RF-IR-TR meeting is that the three countries will fight ISID and Al Nusra. No mention of YPG!
So, Turkey has had to abandon Nusra and is still on its own against the Kurds.
http://www.sozcu.com.tr/2016/gundem/attik-tuttuk-yuttuk-1579442/
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 22 2016 4:50 utc | 127
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 21, 2016 11:50:24 PM | 131
I think Russia insists on the Kurds being part of the settlement with the opposition recognized by Russia/Syria.
Possibly Erdogan tried to play a double game and is now abandoned by the US. The US seem to have withdrawn from Euphrates Shield. Here is a reddit threat about it.
What happens to the CIA operation run by Turkey to destabilize the Caucasus and the -stans is anybody’s guess. Also the drug business financing that comes with it.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 22 2016 5:23 utc | 128
Turkey’s role in the anti-Russian destabilization
Taliban opium and not only
Afghanistan, Turkey and the drug trade
Is a NATO member playing into the capitalism of terror?”
Erdogan gets more threatened than negotiated with, I suppose.
The Turkish Coup in Context – Redrawing the map of the CIA drug trade.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 22 2016 5:33 utc | 129
Posted by: jfl | Dec 21, 2016 7:59:01 PM | 130
you should count airplane number in the game. It was 34~36 til february 2016, in syria kmheimm airport only, the sortie rate calculated was 1.7 sorties per day per plane.
If you fix an average number of 50 aeroplanes you have ~1.4 to fly 30k strikes.
Those numbers are realistic. They are more if you count strikes from russia bases.
Same numbers tell you how “inherent resolve” operation, us lead to fighr isis was almost a warming up.
if you want data you can find them here:
http://www.rischiocalcolato.it/2016/06/concerto-a-palmyra-e-potere-aereo-un-punto-di-vista-tecnico-sullintervento-russo-in-siria.html
it’s in italian, I’m sorry.
Posted by: y | Dec 22 2016 9:33 utc | 130
@134 y,
i wasn’t so much questioning the ‘facts’ as marveling at the destructive power unleashed on Syria. Those numbers are just the Russians. The US claims 60,000 sorties, i believe. true, a lot of them were sight-seeing expeditions or trying not to hit isis, but still, that’s twice the number of Russian sorties … and that’s not counting turkey, saudi, and qatari terrorists/bombers/gas attacks on the ground.
Dmitry Orlov – Is Obama a Russian Agent?
Obama’s most significant service on behalf of the Russian nation was in throwing the election to Donald Trump. This he did by throwing his support behind the ridiculously inept and corrupt Hillary Clinton. She outspent Trump by a factor of two, but apparently no amount of money could buy her the presidency. As a result of Obama’s steadfast efforts, the US will now have a Russia-friendly president who is eager to make deals with Russia, but will have to do so from a significantly weakened negotiating position.
As I have been arguing for the last decade, it is a foregone conclusion that the United States is going to slide from its position of global dominance. But it was certainly helpful to have Obama grease the skids, and now it’s up to Donald Trump to finish the job. And since Obama’s contribution was especially helpful to Russia, I propose that he be awarded the Russian Federation’s Order of Friendship, to go with his Nobel Peace Prize.
it’s Orlovian satire …
… once you tally up all the evidence it forms a coherent and damning picture.
… and it does, doesn’t it? the CIA at work. Obama is their guy. no wonder they’re looking for a someone to frame as patsy for their startling work in geopolitical support of the Russian federation.
Posted by: jfmxl | Dec 22 2016 10:30 utc | 131
Requiem:
|
With the attack in Berlin and the hue and cries for Chancellor Merkel’s scalp over the issue of refugees sheltered in Germany, an end of an era is in plain view, an era that saw the weaning of the German peoples from an authoritarian culture that had given birth to virulent National Socialism. The short reign of political reason will unlikely survive the gales of wrath and revenge, mothered by fearsome uncertainty for security and hidden shadows lurking in darkness whispering ‘the other, not us’. One thing is for certain, certified security exacts the price in liberty. Is that liberty worth more that the fraudulent promise of absolute security, or not? The decision du jour.
It is curious, with dense crowds, witnesses everywhere, how none saw the driver of the truck exit the vehicle once it came to a stop. Is there no witness coming forward with a description of the driver? or information about where the driver went? One of the people in the truck cab was reported as dead. How long had they been in that condition? How did that life end? Was it a natural or inflicted death? What connection if any did that body have with the truck? Repeated video of the site has no answers but serves to inflame emotions. Are those emotions a service to the people or a means of control over the herd. A dozen, maybe more are victims of the crime of murder and many dozens more attempted murder. Once this ends being a crime and becomes a crusade, all civilisation is lost. Is it worth the price? Cui bono?
Posted by: Formerly T-Bear | Dec 22 2016 11:31 utc | 132
@ somebody | 132
“I think Russia insists on the Kurds being part of the settlement with the opposition recognized by Russia/Syria.”
Spot on. The Kurds are key to any regional settlement and Turkey’s attempts to classify them as terrorists alongside Daesh are simply not working.
Euphratrs Shield ia interesting. Always considerwd it to be little more than a distraction for Erdogan. Somewhere to get his hands dirty while doing minimal damage. It has achieved nothing and Erdogan is unable to put a foot forward in Syria without Russia’s go ahead.
The drug links are interesting. Will have a good look. Reminded me of what a friend here in Istanbul said a few months ago, that the war on PKK is a fight for control of the drug trade. Maybe there’s substance to what he says.
Posted by: AtaBrit | Dec 22 2016 11:40 utc | 133
Thanks Susan
but there is more on that today on Maytham956 thread. Hard to think it is full propaganda. There is more on Bana too.
Posted by: Mina | Dec 22 2016 12:25 utc | 134
Wikileaks: How the PKK is entering the energy wars
Wikileaks: Turkey, PKK and the next steps by the US Government
There is more in the Wikileaks archive.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 22 2016 14:59 utc | 135
After Syria, Russia and Turkey seems to want to do the same in Libya.
Russia is giving its support to Haftar who fights ISIS and other islamist groups. Haftar wants a secular Libya. Turkey is keen to restart its profitable business in Libya and will go along with Russia. Egypt is pleased while Saudi Arabia is not.
The countries that killed Qaddafi ( France, the UK, the USA) risk been excluded.
Putin Promotes Libyan Strongman as New Ally After Syria Victory
Posted by: virgile | Dec 22 2016 15:51 utc | 136
When are people going to start condemning Trump around here and stop defending the indefensible just cause you think he’s going to be easy on Russia; when he said nothing regarding the new sanctions representing more financial tyranny??? Do you really think he’s going to reverse what a Republican-majority Congress passed?
Now Trump is coming out with a statement backing that war criminal, Netanyahu, on a critical Resolution to be passed at the Security Council condemning settlement expansion on Palestinian territory! This is one of the rare times that a U.S. administration is considering either abstaining or voting YES. This resolution will prevent Trump from moving the Embassy to Jerusalem to make it the capital of the Zionist State as he promised Zionists. He must be prevented from doing this! What Trump plans to do will ensure conflict, war and destruction and even more suffering for Palestinians with the biggest con/injustice to be perpetrated against them to date coming in the next few years.
“The resolution being considered at the United Nations Security Council regarding Israel should be vetoed,” Trump said.
“As the United States has long maintained, peace between the Israelis and Palestinians will only come through direct negotiations between the parties, and not through the imposition of terms by the United Nations.
“This puts Israel in a very poor negotiating position and is extremely unfair to all Israelis,” he wrote.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-un-idUSKBN14B033
After Trump’s statement, a U.S. administration official said: “We have no comment at this time.”
And just yesterday he taps the biggest Zionist fox on Wall Street to oversee regulation overhaul!
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/21/carl-icahn-donald-trump-special-adviser-regulation
Trump’s cabinet is a combination of MIC generals, who are all on the same page regarding escalating against Iran, and Zionist Wall Street oligarchs who want to secure their domination! Quit defending Trump and start speaking truth to power; otherwise, you have lost all integrity. I always thought this was a place where political deception and propaganda and imperial hubris machinations are exposed and all this is what drew me here. Stop defending Trump; he is exactly what the deep-state wanted. There is an ulterior motive regarding his pretense of resetting relations with Russia having to do with China and Iran and maybe even in regards to advancing the agenda of Israel. Trump is every bit an oligarch about to take the reins of power and advance AngloZionist imperial hubris. Stop defending the indefensible or you lose all credibility. The writing on the wall regarding Trump can’t be more clear: he is all in with the Zionist/Neocon deep state and he’s speaking for them in opposing this Resolution and protecting Wall Street oligarchy.
Trump’s presidency is a threat to justice and peace.
Posted by: Circe | Dec 22 2016 16:53 utc | 137
Propaganda on Aleppo siege bought by media
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/begun-739211-last-civilians.html
I would say sold would be a better verb.
Posted by: Les | Dec 22 2016 16:58 utc | 138
So much for Trump’s promise to Drain the Swamp.
That was just a vote getter: A Christmas stocking stuffer disappointment
Trump No Longer Wants To “Drain The Swamp”, Gingrich,
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-21/trump-no-longer-wants-drain-swamp-gingrich-admits
~ ~ ~
And here is why it’s the same old same old. For those wishing and praying the Middle East saga will be resolved anytime soon – Trump is so anti-Islam, he sees the Palestinians at the root of it.
Israel’s apartheid will always be rewarded. The open air prison will be upheld and the Khazars assisted with billions. Just imagine after Trump is sworn in he will double down!!!
Trump wants veto for ‘extremely unfair’ UN resolution on Israel
https://www.rt.com/usa/371276-trump-veto-resolution-israel/
Published time: 22 Dec, 2016 14:26
President-elect Donald Trump is opposed to the resolution before the UN Security Council condemning Israeli settlements, and wants the US to veto it.
The resolution proposed by Egypt says the “establishment by Israel of settlements in the Palestinian territory occupied since 1967, including East Jerusalem, has no legal validity and constitutes a flagrant violation under international law and a major obstacle to the achievement of the two-State solution and a just, lasting and comprehensive peace,” according to a draft put forward on Wednesday.
It also demands of Israel to “immediately and completely cease all settlement activities in the occupied Palestinian territory, including East Jerusalem.”
“The resolution being considered at the United Nations Security Council regarding Israel should be vetoed,” Trump announced Thursday morning on Twitter.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Trump has proven he is a TWAT, bigly.
How “extremely unfair” that Israel should continue to steal the Palestinian lands, tax revenues and gas reserves. How “extremely unfair” that Israel should continue to deprive the Palestinians of life’s basics.
How ironic is it that the former subjects and descendants of Hitler’s oppression who now occupy the Palestine lands have become the oppressors with the blessings of those who legislate against holocaust deniers.
Posted by: likklemore | Dec 22 2016 17:12 utc | 139
Hitchhiker’s Guide to the President:
“The President is very much a figurehead – he wields no real power whatsoever. He is apparently chosen by the government, but the qualities he is required to display are not those of leadership but those of finely judged outrage. For this reason the President is always a controversial choice, always an infuriating but fascinating character. His job is not to wield power but to draw attention away from it.”
from:
http://hitchhikersguidetoearth.wikia.com/wiki/President_of_the_Imperial_Galactic_Government
Posted by: Curtis | Dec 22 2016 17:56 utc | 140
143;The Palestinian prospects at this point in time are dismal.All brought to them by stalwart liberal liars.
Yes,negotiations between the 2 parties are what will end this nonsensical pox on humanity,and maybe Trump will offer both a deal they can’t refuse.
America first demands it.
We shall see,but to condemn Trump for the current state of hypocritical affairs is a reach too far.
Posted by: dahoit | Dec 22 2016 18:03 utc | 141
@145
Oh pawleeez! Your comment defies all credibility. Trump is the one who named uber-Zionist and illegal settlement supporter, Friedman, Ambassador to Israel! He’s the one who promised to move the embassy and that Jerusalem will be the Zionist Capital! He’s the one who promised to tear up the Iran deal.
Quit spinning by putting blame elsewhere; when he’s behind all this! If Trump is his own man he would care squat what a previous administration did; but the truth is he’s not his own man. He’s a Zionist puppet and he’s more in with Zionism than any previous President.
Posted by: Circe | Dec 22 2016 18:17 utc | 142
Watch and share Jimmy Dore Show. He’s a true leftist and NOT NeoLiberal. Watch in YouTube or KPFA. I have selected a few shows below – EVA BARTLETT, Syria, Obomo…..
http://kpfk.org/programs/178-jimmy-dore-live
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiqwqP_iXsc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2bRZsv2rlw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h14t9LvFWcA
Happy Holidays everyone 🙂
Posted by: Jack Smith | Dec 22 2016 18:20 utc | 143
@145
Trump will offer both a deal they can’t refuse.
Yeah. His actions so far all indicate it’ll be a con job against Palestinians as his appointment of Washington, MIC and Wall Street insiders indicates a con on Americans as I predicted all along. America first, my ass…1% America first.
Posted by: Circe | Dec 22 2016 18:24 utc | 144
In tune with some posts above…I have been looking into the White Helmets. Spine chilling, not kidding.
slow and easy… Here the some white helmets posing for cam.
http://i1.wp.com/21stcenturywire.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Motto-2.jpg
plus text on pic, see:
The upside down A (without a circle around it) is math symbol that basically means ‘for all’. (in math > for all values)
The D3 (upper left for viewer) refers to Diabolo 3, which has all kinds of Illuminati, Masonic and other meanings. *Creepy* – reaper of souls for ex. There is even a website called D3 that argues about this stuff. The second ‘logo’ from left signifies D3 for All, an enclosing ‘world’ circle is drawn around the two symbols. One can make that out easily.
No, these men are not accidentally standing in front of random graffiti on some city wall, though they themselves may not know why they pose in front of this.
The guys are pointing index finger forward / upish – why?
A group picture of an organisation, corporation, army, what hand gestures? Usually none, completely prohibitied. Maybe if in an informal setting (late night drunken party of a Telecom Co.in London), glad hands, waving to the audience hands, or thumbs up. Or maybe the V-sign with big grins, tilted heads, to go with it.
Here it is blatant, and all the black-gloved ones display it, with the last man on the right without a black glove, a naked hand, meaning it is he, him, doing it, showing what can only be seen as the ‘shhhhh’ gesture. He is the only man without a beard, clean-shaven, very white, stands on the right (for the viewer), a little to to the front. (He has his gloves but has taken them off for the pic.)
The pointed index finger represents the persons relations with some kind of spirit world (when it isn’t pointing in the ordinary way to some direction, object, person, to draw attention. Here there is nothing off camera to point to, it is a self-identity sign.) A finger pointing straight up to the sky is Christian, Jesus Power, but that is not what one sees here.
More is perhaps not suitable even for MoA open thread. Some can guess where this is going. Heh no Noirette has not gone bananas.
Posted by: Noirette | Dec 22 2016 19:08 utc | 145
@140 Don’t forget the Chinese. They may still have an interest in Libya. They lost something like $20 billion.
Posted by: dh | Dec 22 2016 19:18 utc | 146
@149, noirette, ‘More is perhaps not suitable even for MoA open thread. Some can guess where this is going. Heh no Noirette has not gone bananas.’
if you say not. i’ll take it on faith. oh no! … that makes me a faith-breather doesn’t it?!
no one at MoA has gone bananas. no one at MoA has gone bananas. no one at MoA has gone bananas.
Posted by: jfmxl | Dec 22 2016 19:22 utc | 147
Circe@141:
I will condemn any policies forthcoming from the new administration. That is, any deeds. So far we just have to wait.
Posted by: juliania | Dec 22 2016 19:43 utc | 148
I should have said ‘any damaging deeds’, sorry. Brevity isn’t my best quality.
Posted by: juliania | Dec 22 2016 19:44 utc | 149
Photos of Palestinian bombing used to fake Aleppo genocide
http://www.mintpressnews.com/fake-aleppo-genocide-pics-spread-amid-new-calls-for-war-on-syria/223306/
Russian ambassador assassin had worked as member of Pres. Erdogan’s security detail
https://twitter.com/FearDept
Some more things on the social media arm of the staged war on Syria
http://www.mintpressnews.com/social-media-stars-spread-pro-war-propaganda-in-news-social-media/223374/
Posted by: Les | Dec 22 2016 19:44 utc | 150
@152
Don’t you have enough proof of where he’s coming from yet? Aren’t Trump’s own words opposing this Resolution on illegal settlement expansion enough??? Wait for what??? Wait until it’s too late! Sometimes I feel like I’m trying to convince people brainwashed in a cult. Snap out of the self-deception, already.
Posted by: Circe | Dec 22 2016 19:53 utc | 151
Posted by: Mina | Dec 22, 2016 7:25:02 AM | 138
RT has an article about kiddy jihadis as a threat in Europe — however, they’re mostly talking about 14+ year old … and 11 year old apparently had a plan for a nail-bomb and was intercepted. It’s vague. RT is so “virulent” about the dangers of refugees and the story is without details.
Apparently many refugees (particularly young men) are stuck with nothing to do and nowhere to go and so they are ripe to be recruited … after the stories coming out of “lower rungs of society” Belgium earlier this year, this is probably not news.
The Afghan/Pakistan stories I followed up had local English language press available on google. Still, the need to maintain close proximity to appropriately remote-control detonate make use of children hard to justify particularly wiht such a small payload (the deadliness and bodycount is due to as much shrapnel as can be crammed into the vest being set off with the explosive, usually in a somewhat confined space to maximize the concussive effect) — It’s one of the reasons I have doubted the Boku Haram stories … although they are “different” wrt to their tendency to demonstrate to the population their willingness to terrorize. I think most groups aren’t going to “waste” the time and effort kitting up a suicide bomber for such a small “result” — except in very special cases. Why blow up a child, if a child can get some other form of bomb into the same space …
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Dec 22 2016 19:55 utc | 152
To psychohistorian@119:
Thank you for responding to my post. I did attempt the link, as I posted, but got a message that my browser couldn’t go there – I don’t know why except my computer is old and I have an internet service which prevents me from accessing videos as they use up my gigawhatevers. I am just happy to be able to come online and read. I did access your second link above long enough to see the photo – I am not sure why the pentaganol effect would obviate pi as the planet itself seems to obey Euclidean geometrics at least approximately and we on earth might have a spiral effect, which again sort of distorts pi. But I’m happy to be enlightened on that subject.
As to my link, which I guess you haven’t had time to pursue, as I said, when things quiet down might be a better time to discuss it. The speech I have there isn’t my own but that of a mentor, and as it begins with the Greeks’ determination of irrational numbers in their physical aspects, I thought it pertained.
“… Their fatal flaw for me is in purporting to have answers for everything if you have enough faith…”
I think if you investigated further, perhaps into some of the more science oriented Christian apologists (although I think of Jesuits as being so inclined) and laid aside the negative aspects of your education, you might see that the above doesn’t entirely hold for many of us ‘faith breathers.’ I realize that is difficult to do.
For us Orthodox, you can’t get anywhere without the mind. If you’ve got one, it is your prime responsibility to use it.
Posted by: juliania | Dec 22 2016 20:01 utc | 153
Again, to psychohistorian:
I think I do see an aspect of your friend’s comment, and that is similar to a ‘Flatland’ experience for the different planetary ‘occupants’ might give a different geometry to them. Which perhaps links to aspects of faith, in that I always think of the heart as ‘place’, and the mind as ‘companion’. Don’t know if that helps.
Posted by: juliania | Dec 22 2016 20:15 utc | 154
Reposting this before it gets immediately purged on ZioBreitbarts complaint that the UN is ‘anti- Khazar’, since Palestinians are also Semites, and we need to definitively and foever end the Anti-Semite playing card in 2017,… after 70 fracking years!
—
41 minutes ago (a lifetime on BB)
As Conservatives, we are much better than the Left at thinking critically and with an open mind, considering every point of view and putting truth before ideology. Please consider the facts and realize that we have been subject to a systematic controlled opposition campaign for decades. Have you ever wondered why traditional conservatives like Pat Buchanan aren’t that crazy about Israel?
The false theology of Christian Zionism, directly refuted by the New Testament, popped up in the 20th century out of nowhere from a heretic nutcase working for secular Zionists who needed to garner more political support for their ideology in the states. Less than 100 years ago, Zionists were liberals, while conservative Christians supported a Christian state in the Holy Land, as we always had. The first Zionists in the Republican party were also the first neoconservatives, former Jewish democrats such as Irving Kristol who wanted to liberalize the party. They are also the ones responsible for pushing economic globalization, mass immigration and endless war.
What do Israel’s enemies all have in common? With the exception of Shiite Iran, they were countries with moderate secular governments, such as Iraq, Libya and Syria, that killed radical Sunni terrorists and protected Christian and Shiite minorities. Including Iran, they were all nationalist countries that refused to allow foreign-owned central banks to be built on their soil. Most of them have fallen, Syria and Iran are two of the last nations on earth to fully control their own currencies, which is why we are seeing the destruction of Syria and an enormous war propaganda campaign against Iran, while the Saudis continue to be rewarded for supporting virtually every terrorist group in the Middle East.
Remember the neocon NeverTrumpers like Bill Kristol who absolutely hate Trump? They hate him because he doesn’t fall in line with their agenda. In Trump’s own words, he said the Middle East would be more stable with Saddam and Gaddafi still in power. He took the time during the second debate to say that Assad, Russia and Iran are killing ISIS. He has also said that Israel should pay us back for the countless billions in foreign aid that your tax dollars are paying for. He is playing a game of 6D underwater chess and it will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
—
Merry Christmas for the ‘deluded followers of the False Christ’ and let’s all join together, as Khazar’s ‘useful idiots’, to deny them any grift to their ‘anti-Semite’ cloaking psyop for 2017. 70 years of the Big Zionist Lie is far too long. The 26% super-minority of Khazars who rule Israel aren’t Semitic! They’re former Soviet Tartar Sons of Ishmael! Fully 49% of Israeli Jews are from foreign countries! And there are millions of Arab Israelis!
Let’s give ‘Never Again’ a whole new meaning in 2017, during the Venezuelan and Indian Holocausts.
Posted by: chipnik | Dec 22 2016 20:22 utc | 155
Cooperation with Russia achieves best results in Aleppo: Turkish minister
The defense minister also said that from the very beginning Turkey had been considering “Syrian opposition forces’ fight against the cruel regime to be legitimate.”
“Now Russia has finally accepted the need to separate moderate opposition forces from terrorist groups. However, there are still some groups that keep denying it,” [Turkish Defense Minister Fikri] Isik noted.
Russia has bought into Turkey’s ‘moderate opposition’?
Russian Envoy Assassination: Questions Must Be Answered
1. Why were there no adequate security measures by Russian security services, especially amid constant provocations, rallies and threats against the Russian diplomatic staff in Ankara?
2. Why were there no adequate security measures by Turkish security services?
3. Why did Turkish security services allow the attacker to remain at the scene of the crime with other people for a long time?
When police and security services want to investigate a crime, especially a much-publicized crime, they always seek to capture a perpetrator alive by any means. But Altintas received over 20 bullets and was killed.
This is Turkey’s ‘moderate opposition’ in action. (video)
Turkey is a den of vipers; a duplicitous, murderous state. Russia is right to resist the ‘sarajevo moment’, and rightly identifies Turkey as a potential bulwark of the Eurasian Union … but not in Erdogan’s lifetime. And not for who knows how many Turkish dictator’s lifetimes thereafter. Deals made with Turkey are not worth the breath wasted on them. If Russia builds a pipeline to Erdogan’s Turkey they will have no one but themselves to blame for the betrayal on Turkey’s part that will surely ensue. Never, ever turn your back on Turkey.
Posted by: jfmxl | Dec 22 2016 20:42 utc | 156
@105 Piotr. It very well could be but if you put aside Dzerzhinsky’s role and focus on Russia’s trajectory for the last 20 years, you’d still agree with the premise, (a return towards a sovereign christian nation) wouldnt you?
Posted by: Lozion | Dec 22 2016 20:56 utc | 157
I would strongly recommend to all Berry Friesan’s posted link @22. Do not be put off by the mention of the Bible in the link – there is nothing specifically religion-oriented in the comprehensive timeline to Syria’s agony the site has compiled. I found it extremely helpful, thank you Berry. The numbered historical events are accurate and digestible, for instance:
“29. A September attack by on the US consulate in Benghazi, Libya resulted in the deaths of US Ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans. Stevens was coordinating an extensive operation to ship arms from Libyan government warehouses to Syrian rebels via Turkey. Up to 35 CIA agents were working on the project in a nearby annex in Benghazi at the time of the attacks.”
Here’s the link again:
http://www.bible-and-empire.net/2016/12/the-fall-of-aleppo.html
Posted by: juliania | Dec 22 2016 20:57 utc | 158
Noirette Rowling
You have to continue the Xmas tale because a number of barflies certainly want to hear the rest, but correct your interpretation of the pointed finger, this is pure muslim bro for tawhid, i.e. la llaha illa llah “there is no god but god”. Check pics of bro demos in egypt you ll find that all over
Posted by: Mina | Dec 22 2016 20:59 utc | 159
They ll get him a security job in some Turkish embassy i guess
https://mobile.twitter.com/hamza_780/status/811672025735557127/photo/3
Posted by: Mina | Dec 22 2016 21:16 utc | 160
You know Mina it is interesting to note that la ilaha illa llah was used to define Allah as the sole god in the early days of Islam because of “competition” in Arabia. Allah pre-existed Mohammed’s time but it was decided that other gods (idols) were cast aside by the Ummah in favor of Allah so the use of said phrase would make sense in those days but less so in a modern context..
Posted by: Lozion | Dec 22 2016 21:17 utc | 161
@164 mina.. nice pics of bana and her dad! doubt any of that will get shown on the msm..
Posted by: james | Dec 22 2016 21:55 utc | 162
@146 Circe Thank you.
@145
Yes negotiations between the 2 parties are what will end this nonsensical pox on humanity, and maybe Trump will offer both a deal they can’t refuse.
How many two-party negotiations are required —going back to President Jimmy Carter, 1977-1981? Lost count.
Speaking as a Sephardic, Israel’s Khazars have never negotiated in good faith and the USA can not be said to be an “Honest Broker.”
Oh and should I get going on the Greater Israel agenda; their racism – sterilization program with not a mention in the Western MSM.
We hang our heads in shame.
An offer they can’t refuse?
Yeah, Pence as VP and Goldman Sachs boys piloting the ship? Right.
Posted by: likklemore | Dec 22 2016 22:28 utc | 163
UN delays illegal Israeli settlement program resolution vote
“We expect our greatest ally not to allow this one-sided and anti-Israel resolution to be adopted by the council,” [Israel’s Ambassador to the United Nations Danny] Danon said in a statement.
Responding to calls by Israeli authorities, US President-elect Donald Trump in a statement issued early on Thursday called for the veto of the resolution.
meet the new boss … same as the old boss …
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 0:20 utc | 164
@ juliania who suggested I go read a commencement speech at a web site
I read the speech and want to share some other musical scales with you that show that there are other ways to look at our world if one has an open and inquisitive mind.
The first is from the Wagogo tribe in Tanzania and can be heard by listening to the musician Zawose
The second is an African pentatonic scale produced by an instrument called a gyil Here is a link to some music from a marimba tuned to that scale.
I encourage you to spend more time looking at the world outside the one described in your bible. Such was the purpose of my link to the pics of the north pole of Saturn…..there is more that we don’t know than there is that we do is my point and I will keep being born with new information I seek out rather than dying with old information.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 23 2016 0:50 utc | 165
Hmmmm, the link worked in preview but here is the pentatonic scale music link again
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 23 2016 0:52 utc | 166
The New York Daily News …
Assassination of Russian Ambassador Andrei Karlov was not terrorism, but retribution for Vladimir Putin’s war crimes
After watching the death of Karlov, I could not help but remember the case of Ernst vom Rath, a Nazi diplomat in France, who was gunned down inside his consulate by a Jewish student in 1938.
… no difference between Zionist and Wahabi assassins, apparently. They’ve fused in New York.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 2:00 utc | 167
Andre Vltcheck compares Duterte to Chavez and Fidel here
http://dissidentvoice.org/2016/12/president-duterte-of-the-philippines-for-dummies/
Posted by: mauisurfer | Dec 23 2016 6:19 utc | 168
I haven’t seen this reported anywhere else but the quote below is being reported as a twit from Trump at 8:41 AM on Dec.22, 2016
”
Someone incorrectly stated that the phrase “DRAIN THE SWAMP” was no longer being used by me. Actually, we will always be trying to DTS.
”
The posting I got it from is this link
It will be interesting to watch the evolution of the new DTS meme given all Trump’s Wall Street cabinet appointments and the fact that his supporters are not happy with what they have heard/seen so far.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 23 2016 7:00 utc | 169
WaPo.
In the cavalcade of people to blame for Clinton’s loss, today’s new arrival is Loretta Lynch who “should” have ordered Comey to not deliver his letter … I predicted that as a multi-decade Clinton loyalist she would eventually get thrown under the bus.
Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Dec 23 2016 7:32 utc | 170
@173, psycho
Trump names billionaire corporate raider Icahn to slash regulations on business
Carl Icahn, long notorious for asset stripping and destroying jobs, is the seventh billionaire to be assigned a major role in the Trump administration.
Carl ‘swamp rat’ Icann joins the team.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 7:39 utc | 171
@ jfl about Carl ‘swamp rat’ Icann joins the team.
At some point the rubber will meet the road and those who voted for Trump that are still holding their breath will exhale…..and it may not be pretty.
I believe that DTS is a meme that crosses L/R boundaries and to me equates to getting rid of private finance so I want to se the meme live and grow so at least we may get to talk about the possibility of getting rid of private finance.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 23 2016 8:11 utc | 172
@psycho
i’d stay away from dts as your meme, when tee-rump, tee-rex and i-can get through with it, it will smell like ‘liberal’ or ‘progressive’. stick with private finance. you’re the only one i know who uses it, and it’s self-explanatory, really … meme-wise … the devil’s in the details … or did mies say it was god in the details?
now, now, don’t start up with your ‘faith breather’ at the two anthropomorphisms in the last sentence. they have broad currency … people know what they mean … like private finance.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 10:09 utc | 173
@psycho
in fact ‘private finance’ will be given a great boost in currency as a description for evil incarnate by the trump gang’s up coming ‘public-private ventures’, wherein expenses are funded by the public and their rake-off is private. like rahm emmanuel they will have privatized control of tax revenues … of what’s left of public finance.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 10:15 utc | 174
So they killed the Berlin suspect now in Italy, coming from France. after having spotted him on video in Berlin in front of an Islamic center.
I think it is safe to assume that European authorities prefer to “observe” Islamic networks to closing them down. Pretty much what they do to the right wing scene.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 23 2016 10:25 utc | 175
7 billionaires? is he planning a suicide bombing? maybe that’s what he means by DTS?
Posted by: Mina | Dec 23 2016 11:10 utc | 177
They ‘observe’, get zero info from Qatar and the Saudis, and let their guinea pigs kill wherever they wish: Aghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, as long as they know it will bring arm deals and reconstruction contracts. A win-win solution in their sick minds. As for Europe building jails and surveillance systems is a juicy business nowadays. It’s just a pity that IS seems totally anti-Schengen.
Posted by: Mina | Dec 23 2016 11:14 utc | 178
Re Mina 182. The Brits say they get important intelligence from the Saudis. It’s one of the reasons put forward for continuing the alliance with Saudi. I have difficulty in imagining what that intelligence might be. Whenever I’ve been with Saudis, they’ve been notable for their ignorance of anything outside their little world. Of course the Brits are going to claim that they get intelligence about upcoming jihadi attacks, but that’s just a fiction, in order to justify the security crackdown in Britain and Europe. I can’t imagine a Saudi prince handing over actual data about a coming attack, unless it is to get back at a rival prince. After all, the support for the jihadis is strong in Saudi. Anybody betraying them would not be well appreciated.
Posted by: Laguerre | Dec 23 2016 11:29 utc | 179
Turkish raids leave 88 civilians in northern Syria: Report
On Friday, the so-called Syrian Observatory for Human Rights some of raids hit the northwestern Syrian town al-Bab a day earlier, leaving 72 civilians dead, including 21 children.
Another 16 civilians, including three children, lost their lives in the Turkish assaults on Friday.
Turkey urges ‘nationwide’ truce in Syria after Aleppo liberation
The Turkish foreign minister has called for a “nationwide” ceasefire in Syria and negotiations between Damascus and foreign-backed militants who were fully driven out of Aleppo on Thursday.
“We should send out a strong message that the foreign militias should leave Syria right away,” he said.
Turkish troops should stay, of course. The Turks are trying the Obama/Kerry line on ceasefires, so that they can replenish their ‘foreign militias’ during their duration.
I cannot see the Turks as anything other than prevaricators and back stabbers. I understand that it’s better to talk to them than not, but it seems foolish to listen to them.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 11:35 utc | 180
Turkish raids leave 88 civilians in northern Syria: Report
On Friday, the so-called Syrian Observatory for Human Rights some of raids hit the northwestern Syrian town al-Bab a day earlier, leaving 72 civilians dead, including 21 children.
Another 16 civilians, including three children, lost their lives in the Turkish assaults on Friday.
Turkey urges ‘nationwide’ truce in Syria after Aleppo liberation
The Turkish foreign minister has called for a “nationwide” ceasefire in Syria and negotiations between Damascus and foreign-backed militants who were fully driven out of Aleppo on Thursday.
“We should send out a strong message that the foreign militias should leave Syria right away,” he said.
Turkish troops should stay, of course. The Turks are trying the Obama/Kerry line on ceasefires, so that they can replenish their ‘foreign militias’ during their duration.
I cannot see the Turks as anything other than prevaricators and back stabbers. I understand that it’s better to talk to them than not, but it seems foolish to listen to them.
William Loren Katz has The Seminole Christmas Gift of Freedom up, to cheer us up this season.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 11:45 utc | 181
re 185 jfl
“We should send out a strong message that the foreign militias should leave Syria right away,” he said.
I think you’re looking at it slightly wrong. Not that I would believe the PressTV report, but you know, the removal of foreign militias would tear the heart out of the rebellion. It would be the forerunner of an imminent end. çavusoglu should understand the implications of what he’s saying.
Posted by: Laguerre | Dec 23 2016 12:13 utc | 182
Posted by: Laguerre | Dec 23, 2016 7:13:08 AM | 186
This here is Bloomberg’s translation
While they said in a statement that they’d “fight jointly” in Syria against Islamic State and al-Nusra as terrorist groups, there were evident tensions at the foreign ministers’ news conference. “There’s Hezbollah and others,” Cavusoglu said. “Aid to all these groups must be halted.”
There’s no agreement about other groups, while Islamic State and al-Nusra are recognized internationally as terrorist groups, Zarif said. Iran backs Hezbollah, which has fighters in Syria in support of the Assad regime.
The fall of Aleppo marked a defeat for Turkey, which supported the Sunni Muslim groups fighting against Assad. Russia says the Syrian rebels are overwhelmingly made up of Islamic extremists, while Turkey has argued that they’re resisting a violent dictatorship.
While that’s still the Turkish line, in practice the country has switched its focus since the rapprochement between Erdogan and Putin. Turkish troops have pushed deep into Syria since August, but they’re mostly targeting Kurdish groups and Islamic State fighters and have steered clear of the battle for Aleppo.
Basically, it comes down to Turkey taking responsibility and negotiating a ceasefire for “their” groups, and anybody else fighting against the Syrian government or not toeing the line set by Iran, Russia or Syria is a terrorist. Or, groups that do not have Syrian, Russian, Turkish, Iranian protection are “out”.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 23 2016 12:44 utc | 183
False Flag Script always requires the madman to make an appearance (and/or to leave his passport to be discovered by the super sleuths) and to be shot dead with no interview and no due process.
Do not sign up as a crisis actor – especially not for any leading roles.
Posted by: fast freddy | Dec 23 2016 12:52 utc | 184
Posted by: fast freddy | Dec 23, 2016 7:52:32 AM | 188
I assume the Berlin perpretator was a paid informant. The way he got arrested, let free, was observed and let go despite being illegal- Also his stay in prison in Italy where he got “radicalized” according to his family when he was not religious before.
There is a long established link between Tunisian jihadis and Italy
Posted by: somebody | Dec 23 2016 15:38 utc | 185
An offer they can’t refuse?
Trump has indeed made an offer that couldn’t be refused. Except he made it to the Egyptians who were about to table the resolution. It must have been one hell of an offer because the Egyptians promptly postponed the vote for an indefinite period of time (read: forever).
Trump intervenes to sideline Obama over Israeli settlements
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/23/trump-intervenes-to-sideline-obama-over-israeli-settlements
However, the vote on passing the resolution was abruptly postponed by Egypt on Thursday amid a series of contacts between Israel, Trump and his transition team and Egypt, which culminated in Trump calling Egypt’s president, Abdel Fatah al-Sisi.
Details of the contacts emerged on Friday morning as Israeli officials disclosed that the prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, had contacted Trump’s transition team on Thursday seeking help after learning that the US delegation at the UN, under the instruction of Obama, might not veto the resolution.
So Obama finally grows a backbone (just kidding) and decides its time for a bit of payback now that he has nothing to lose. After 8 years of repeated embarrassments and grovelling before Netanyahoo and the Israeli-firster crowd, Obama, with one foot out the door, finally decides to take a ‘principled’ stand. And, in a blatant display of political power within the U.S. gov’t , all it took was a phone call from Netanyahoo to Trump’s office to derail this grand gesture of the sitting president;( the most powerful leader in the free world … oh wait); one final humiliation.
Yeah, sure, America is the most powerful country in the world…..right after Israel and its army of dual-citizens.
Posted by: pantaraxia | Dec 23 2016 16:04 utc | 186
@179 somebody
i think it’s not unlike what noirette talks about on the other thread @71… the ‘wiseguys’ in the CIA and the European intelligence gangs use the terrorists for what they think are their own purposes. The difference is that to the USA it’s always ‘over there’ and to the Europeans it’s always ‘right here and now’.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23 2016 17:21 utc | 187
OH No! Snopes – FTW! Courtesy ZeroHedge:
Snopes Co-Founder Embezzles $98,000, Drops Weight, Leaves Fat Wife And Marries Actual Whore
Fact-checking will never be the same…
Posted by: PavewayIV | Dec 23 2016 17:43 utc | 188
Posted by: jfl | Dec 23, 2016 12:21:22 PM | 191
Europeans think Africa is “over there”. People drown in the Mediterranean because of this.
Posted by: somebody | Dec 23 2016 17:52 utc | 190
@ the faith breathers
I want to go on record as explaining that I do believe that religions have added value to our species in the past. I have been told that I walk the talk of a Xtian even though I no longer believe. What I abhor most about religions is the insistence that their way is the only way. I want to be eclectic about taking the best precepts from each to help guide my existence.
All that said, I came across this link today that says similar things about religion and feel compelled to share thoughts from Walt Whitman contained therein.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 23 2016 18:40 utc | 191
195
There’s a new religion in town: Mil.Gov.Corp. The banner of the sign of the skewered snake, $, rampant on a field of pentagons.
Trump is actually the best representation of the current USAryan embodiment, once you stop and think about it. The most dead-
beat debt country on Earth, the most fraudulent fiat script funny-money actor in history, a bombastic, legalistic, inside-deal cabalistic nation of grifters, gamblers and swindlers (Carpetbaggers, Yankee Traders and Flim Flam men), the most 300% over-
priced White Bread Corn Margarine, medical and education quackery since the Plague Doctors, with a huge dollop of Dr. Phil,
and Maury Povich and Hugh Downes, its citizens wage-slaves for life to the Chosen, even as their pensions are being bled away,
in a bizarre twisted Pat Robertson African slave gold mine caricature of John Hagee channeling Jimmy Swaggart, weeping as the
vein of lucre taps out, ‘Aren’t you going to DO something about this guy!?’ (Rodham, sweating as Obama started pulling ahead).
Really, self-knowledge is the ultimate expression of self-hate. Don’t think. Because when you do, you’ll realize that USArya
doesn’t know how it got here after two centuries of slavery, then two centuries of flim-flam; USArya doesn’t know where it’s
going, which is nowhere, it’s a family of kudus being torn apart by jackals; and it doesn’t know what to do anymore, except
push DOW 36,000, and no Corporate taxes, no Capital Gains taxes, and no Estate taxes for the perpetually Royal Exceptionals.
It’s a fracking circus, but at least we can celebrate one incredible miracle this Christmas: Ding, dong, the Witch is dead!!
She’s gone, gone, where goblins go, below, below, below, and the Chelsea-Goldman spawn with her. That bloodline is wiped out.
If they’ll take those tax-and-welfare punters Krugman and Reich with them, we can get down to the business of Game of Thrones.
I’m sure many people, well, maybe not, remember Gorbechev remarking on the similarities between himself and Obama, in the fall
of the Soviet Union, splintering into states, and that black-out drunk Rodham bore every resemblance to Yeltsin, so again, it’s
beautiful symmetry with Trump as Putin, overseeing the Khazar oiligarchs destruction of the American Union, privatizing
all the resources, the infrastructure, the ag lands. Instead of Take That Wall Down, we have Put That Wall Up! It’s priceless!
USAryans are staring into the maw of the potato-eating fast-food gulags, because they haven’t even enough Sec8 public housing
or utilities to house their jobless and homeless and 3,000,000 prison inmates as it is. Where are they all gonna go?! They’re upside down! They’ll freeze in their empty house, cooking on a hibachi and sleeping on the floor, then when the Sherif evicts
you for good, they’ll starve and freeze to death right there on the mean city streets, shoes stolen and their skin caved in.
E pluribus It’ll be Glorious to be Rich!!
Posted by: chipnik | Dec 23 2016 19:34 utc | 192
@195 psychohistorian.. aside from agreeing with @196 chipnik – that is the obvious part – i think certain individuals are expressing a more ‘religious’ for lack of a better word – outlook on their daily lives which have more favourable outcomes.. of course we had berry friesen the other day sharing his website which i thought was a positive statement in this direction, i continue to hold up wendell berry as a person with deep conviction – not sure one would call it religious, but i think he might – that are a couple of examples of people who live in the usa who hold to a different standard or level then the one captured in chipniks post… it isn’t all about money and war, although it is sometimes hard to see this when looking out on present day usa..
Posted by: james | Dec 23 2016 20:24 utc | 193
mina yes the pointed finger – has many interpretations – and one can get lost in the symbolism, the icons, etc. however the pix from the white helmets are so strange, so odd, when one looks at details. of course generally if one looks one will find, say (?), but the contrast between them and 100s of ‘rescue of children Syria’ (or such tags) in goog images, where one can see many genuine ones, carried out by civilians, by the ‘real’ Syrian Civil Defense (who wear red helmets or none and have a logo that is not the ‘fake’ Syrian C D force, white helmets), by police, and random others, is striking. more another time.
Posted by: Noirette | Dec 23 2016 21:02 utc | 194
Wishing Bar Flies, lurkers, and especially b, a Happy Christian Shopping Festival and a 2017 with a Putin-flavoured silver lining.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Dec 24 2016 1:28 utc | 195
@199 hoarsewhisperer.. thanks! merry christmas to you too.. hope you can avoid the consumerism which has nothing to do with christmas in spite of the sale job!
again on this theme of a political solution for syria.. are all these politicians reading from the same politically correct script? sure seems like it.. here is the turkish dude stating the same, with a very big mouthful of bs to do with it..
““The regime must return to the negotiating table for direct talks with the opposition for a genuine political transition. We should send out a strong message that the foreign militia should leave Syria right away,” Çavuşoğlu said.” from this article today…
Posted by: james | Dec 24 2016 2:23 utc | 196
@179 somebody
you are not the only one who sees the cooperative hands of the german state security services in the berlin truck terror …
Growing signs of state foreknowledge of attack on Berlin Christmas market
[G]iven the manner in which the event is being used to weaken the government of Chancellor Angela Merkel and shift German politics even further to the right, it would be a mistake not to consider the possibility that sections of the state were involved in some manner—if not in directing the attack, then in creating the conditions in which Amri was allowed to proceed.
… the security apparatus is the ideal place for the right wing to ‘hide’.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 24 2016 11:07 utc | 197
yes it’s evening on christmas eve. so happy christmas to all. i don’t see the crazed consumer christmas any longer here in northern thailand, although i’m sure there are practitioners trying to light the commercial fire in bkk.
what’s left of christmas in my old bones? it’s all about the poverty and humility. scrooge collapsing, finally, unable to find any ‘salvation’ in his own poor, wasted life. ready to try to join the human race at last.
there’s little left of midnight masses in my bones. more of yule logs. little of the former and none of the latter here in thailand.
but we used to have a few little hummel figures in our creche, and they seemed recognizably human, and they came from germany, i believe. so happy christmas to all. to the german wood carvers especially.
and a happy new year. that’s the ‘feast’ in thailand. there’s been a ‘countdown’ crush downtown here every year since the erection of the gaudy new, baroque clock tower. not this year though. the men in black have decreed otherwise.
i hope next year is not all bad … 17 … what an ugly number that is, prime and ugly … in thailand it’s 60, even at least … four more years, the square root of 16, till another perfect square. numbers games. who knows. i have a cold and will curl up early. happy christmas to all. and to all a good night.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 24 2016 11:58 utc | 198
Turkey’s Erdogan to Consult Trump over Syrian No-Fly Zone
Speaking in Istanbul, Erdogan said he wanted to make a “terror-free safe zone,” in the north of Syria to protect Turkey’s southeastern provinces which border Syria and is reportedly pushing for a no-fly zone in the north of Syria. He is set to discuss the proposal with Trump once the real estate mogul takes over the White House on Jan. 20.
Since winning the election in November, Trump has revealed little detail on the U.S. role in the conflict, but on Thursday said that
“we’ll build and help build safe zones in Syria, so people will have a chance.”
… have a chance to establish a takfiri state in the east and, together with kurdistan, to fragment Syria, implementing the yinon plan. tee-rump has made it pretty clear that he will keep things on track for israel in his administration, play engineer, just as each potus has played engineer, of the clinton-bush-obama israeli choo-choo up until now. trump and erdogan seem to be two long lost souless-brothers about to discover and ’embrace’ each other.
Posted by: jfl | Dec 24 2016 20:11 utc | 199
Thanks to you, psychohistorian@169,170. One of my sons amazed me with his self-study through the internet on the different scales, and as you’ll know already the Greeks had many.
“I encourage you to spend more time looking at the world outside the one described in your bible. Such was the purpose of my link to the pics of the north pole of Saturn…..there is more that we don’t know than there is that we do is my point and I will keep being born with new information I seek out rather than dying with old information.”
Well said. The thing is, I have done exactly that for most of my life, and it still fascinates me. I didn’t have your rigorous upbringing in churchly matters – far from it. That could well have been a blessing, because when I did in my middle years begin to think about the biblical texts I already had had a liberal education, and though I’ll freely admit to being fuzzy on lots of things, that liberal education really helped me develop some modicum of critical thinking. I do love the Greeks, especially Plato – I love seeing how the thinking of the ancients bears on the problems we have today. I too went to a Catholic high school, though only for two years – I was the only non-Catholic there. I had a lot of Latin, and I like Greek better. And I love Orthodoxy, (at least my kind.)
Thank you very much for reading that long essay. That was kind of you.
Posted by: juliania | Dec 24 2016 20:42 utc | 200