Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 09, 2016

First Thoughts On The "Not-Hillary" Election Results

So I just woke up and found that the world has changed. World War III was called off. Trump won, Clinton conceded. His victory speech is fair and integrating.

My "not Hillary" hunch for the election was right. That is, I believe, how Trump won. No so much by gaining genuine votes but by taking them from the crappiest candidate the Democrats could send into the race. This was not a "white vote". Trump did better with black (+5) and latino (+2) voters than Romney. Racism does not explain that. Clinton promised more wars. Those who would have to fight them on the ground rejected that position.

The people voted against corruption, against international warmongering, against attacks of the culture of their life and against Zionist and Arab potentate manipulation. In short - they voted against Hillary.

The media with their outright and widespread manipulation and one sided reporting against Trump and for Clinton lost too. People did not believe the partisan crap that fact-checked Trump on every minor issue but hardly reported on the huge, huge scandals and corruption Wikileaks revealed about the Clintons. Fact-checkers ain't a good weapon in a culture war. The people want authenticity - lying is not seen as bad - if it is fairy open and authentic. Clinton is not authentic even when she tells the truth. The polls, but the one of the LA Times, turned out to be systematic manipulation.

The leading politicians in Europe will crap their pants. Nearly all but Putin bet heavily on Clinton. The European media were also strongly pro Clinton, even more so than in the U.S. There was zero reporting about Trump's real political positions and support. Only tiny bits about Clinton's corruption were revealed on the back pages. They always believe what the NYT writes is the essence of U.S. thinking. It is far from it. No one but a few east-coast party goers and the NYT cares about some 16 year old girl, who thinks she is "transsexual" and wants to use a men's public toilet. The average people think that such craziness deserves zero attention if not a hefty kick in the ass. Pro-migration and other political correctness movements in Europe will have a difficult stand now. They can no longer work against the instincts of the people by pointing to the soothing, fake words of an Obama or Clinton.

The Democratic party failed. The outright corruption of the party heads, who pushed Sanders out to move Clinton in by manipulating the primaries, blocked the natural development that went on at the base. They even wanted Trump as a candidate because they though Clinton could easily beat him. They were totally detached from real life. I am sure that post-mortem analysis will show that many, many potential pro-democratic voters were just disgusted and stayed at home or voted for a third party. The establishment of the Republican party were no better. They failed their voters just as much by shunning Trump and working for Clinton. All the neo-cons that flocked to Clinton will now scramble to get back to Trump. They will have little chance.

But the election also created huge new dangers. People around Trump, including his vice-president, are not sane realist but fairly extreme ideologues. Trump himself isn't. He is, in my estimate, fairly pragmatic. The Republicans also won the Senate and House. There is a danger that extreme policies will be implemented with huge and terrible long-term consequences. But remember that Obama had the same chance in his first two years of his Presidency. He never used it. From a progressive view he blew it.

Winning back the House and Senate in two years is a must for anyone with some middle-of-the-road thinking.

I believe that this result is good for Syria and the non-Jihadi and non-Zonist Middle East. Al-Qaeda in Syria will have a sad. Their main supporters leave the stage. The result is likely good for Europe including for Russia. It is bad for economic equality and other important issues in the United States and elsewhere. But would Clinton have been really better on these?

I for one feel mightily eased (with a not-so-small dose of Schadenfreude).  The U.S. voters knocked over a chessboard that brought war and misery to many people. We do not know how the new game will look, but I think there is a fair chance now that it, in total, will be somewhat less devastating for the global good.

Posted by b on November 9, 2016 at 8:03 UTC | Permalink

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@b real 91.
Good one.

Posted by: beq | Nov 9 2016 16:12 utc | 101

Trump's conciliatory victory speech may have calmed the markets.

Posted by: lysias | Nov 9 2016 16:12 utc | 102

test - sorry

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 9 2016 16:15 utc | 103

@99 Oh good. Seems Canada was preparing for a big influx of movie stars. Maybe somebody told them it rains a lot in Vancouver.

Posted by: dh | Nov 9 2016 16:18 utc | 104

b @ 65. It is also the fact that greed + allowed corruption have infested the system to such a degree that a kind of sect-like ‘world’ is created (particularly in the media, as it deals with symbols vs. concrete matters such as bridge building or curing cancer), and what is outside that ersatz ‘reality’ vanishes, because the cult has to isolate itself from it, except to exploit and profit from ‘the outsiders’ (aka sheeples.) When at the same time the sect feels it has the means and the power to ‘create reality’ through driving the narratives, the circle is closed.

That is also why Trump could only be seen by the Dem-media conglomerate as loathing part of the electorate (racist, hates women, etc. Though of course these were on the face of it floated to turn ppl against him.) Note, the meme was not: “Women dislike Trump and love Hillary ergo we have an advantage.” They had to attribute their own disdain for ‘ordinary folks’ onto their opponent. It was projection all the way: Trump loathes blacks, Trump is a crook, Trump cheats on his taxes .. However when you start talking about deplorables and basement dwellers you throw in your hand.

For me, the best thing about this outcome is that some good chunk of US citizens has now understood that Dem concern and sollicitation of ‘minorities’ is a crock of sh*t, a bold-faced, entrenched LIE.

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 9 2016 16:20 utc | 105

It seems like Trump is a bit nervous now, surely he didnt expect this I believe, hopefully the republicans that have won not only the President power, but also both chambers could unite and create a policy based on much of Trump's rhetoric and ideas, the alternative is a broken and weak US that will just keep on the wars, bailouts etc, hopefully the western MSM will stop slander Trump too.

Posted by: ZiP | Nov 9 2016 16:30 utc | 106

my posts were not appearing - here > Yeah Right @ 8.

I wonder if the oligarchs will now ask for their money back?

They started writing off their losses, imho, about 5-2 months ago, when it became evident to many of those with stakes (multi millions often), having some insider knowledge / connection / smart intuitions, that DT would win.

But it is far far worse for many than just having paid staggering amounts for speeches and not getting any return. I hope, like to expect, that the Clinton Foundation, and the myriad of other connected charities and organisations, are shut down. They are involved in much more than pay-to-play, which is bad enough in itself. (I will quote just two of my *suspicions* as I can’t ‘accuse’: insider trading and money laundering, but there is more.)

Ortel has done a bit of serious digging.

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 9 2016 16:36 utc | 107

Disaster #1--the most pressing one, of Hillary bringing us to WWIII--has been avoided. "Make America Great Again" trumped "I'm with Her" (which is one of the lamest advertising slogans of all time, offering nothing to supporters except the chance to bathe in the glory of Her). We an all breathe a sigh of relief that nuclear weapons may not be flying soon.

What do we get with Trump? Very hard to say. Rather than offing him, the powers that be will move to co-opt his intentions. I would celebrate investment in infrastructure as it is badly needed and would provide lots of US jobs. However, it would be a surprise if the Republican congress would allocate the money. Similarly, if Trump does indeed pick a Goldman Sachs person for Treasury we know that nothing is changing on the Wall Street side. And the War Party is strong with the people surrounding Trump so we'll see if he changes course in the Middle East as he claimed he would do. I have some hope that Trump can be swayed from his positions by the voice of the people, though. I had zero hope that Clinton would ever listen to ANYONE outside of the crazy voices in her head that told her to destroy, loot, burn, and then laugh about it.

I was picturing her last night smashing expensive china all over her $10,000 a night suite. "Why didn't I win by 50 points?!!!"

Posted by: WorldBLee | Nov 9 2016 16:38 utc | 108

You're to be commended, b. You saw it coming and called it. I didn't. I thought the gender gap was real, that if Hillary couldn't turn out the Obama Coalition like Obama himself, she would more than make up for it by winning Republic-leaning college-educated white women. It didn't happen. Apparently Trump's "Grab 'em by the pussy" comment didn't disqualify him. American women aren't in thrall to the type of bourgeois Victorian morality that mainstream taste-makers and Hillary's ad people imagine.

Posted by: Mike Maloney | Nov 9 2016 16:39 utc | 109

Sorry but I can't really be positive in all this.
The Republicans retain the House and Senate, and will have 4 years of potential setbacks and grievances to bend Trump to their will.

Trump has projected a dovish message, but USA's economy has been a war economy for the past century. Is he really going to change that? He'll have plenty of opportunities to cause major incidents if the hawks end up winning policy.

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 16:39 utc | 110

I do not share enthusiasm expressed here for Trump. We shall see. I am very willing to be surprised, and will be first on my feet to applaud if he does.

Just watched Tim Ryan's lengthy press conference... not very encouraging to say the least. His "excitement" about being able to accomplish:

- Open up coal mining/burning (roll back "stifling regulations")
- Open up public lands to gas/timber (roll back "stifling regulations")
- Restore mid-west (he omitted Ca. Central Valley) agricultural production to which he attributed "stifling regulations" on water quality. This problem has been drought: not enough water to go around.

If things go this way, it sure as hell won't be progress.

Posted by: jdmckay | Nov 9 2016 16:45 utc | 111

You can fool all of the people some of the time

You can fool some of the people all of the time.

But you can't fool all of the people all of the time.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 9 2016 16:47 utc | 112

Well. We'll see. OTOH, I'm not sorry to see the Clinton reign go down in the flames. I do see both Clintons (which is what we'd get) in a similar light to most who are commenting here this morning.

OTOH, I do have serious concerns and reservations about Trump. Time will tell. But I fear what will happen with the Supreme Court, and say what you will, a woman's right to choose may be a goner now. And some may not care about that, but I do. I am also not reassured that Trump is this great business "mind" that some here seem to think. Maybe he can clean house from the White House, or maybe not. If he surrounds himself by the usual suspects - as has been indicated - then I'm not so sure that things will turn out well for us peons, no matter how much Trump has said things will get better.

Trump has pretty much promised Ryan that he (Trump) is more than happy to gut and cut Social Security & Medicare, and many of Trump's most fervid fans have been heavily propagandized now to believe firmly that ALL govt programs are bad and somehow infringing on their "liberties." Well we may soon find out how "bad" social security has been for our "liberties" when it's gutted. Good luck on that one.

Trump has also promised to close the EPA and similar agencies, and he's floated out the idea of giving away federal lands, including national parks, to various corporations, mainly the extraction industries. So yeah: let's all cheer for that one. The Bundy gang may believe that they got a great big victory when they were cleared of all charges recently, but if those stooges believe that THEY'll get to take over "free" fed lands... yeah, well, the joke's on them, and that's for sure.

I'm hopeful about relations with Russia, and I'm mostly on the same page as many are here in re to that. But we'll see about the rest. It will be interesting, to be sure, to see what Trump can do in regard to the MIC. I'd love to see that Augean Stable cleaned up, but let's just say that I won't hold my breath. If Trump does initiate an infrastructure program, no one will be happier than me.

I do feel that this election was an indictment against the Democratic Party and for their stupidity in pushing Clinton to be the nominee when Sanders really would have been the better candidate. Well: win some, lose some. Just hope the 99% doesn't end up being the Biggest Loser once again.

Posted by: RUKidding | Nov 9 2016 16:55 utc | 113

Could the Trump victory have been rigged?

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 16:59 utc | 114

@15 said
"I'm an unapologetic rightist, but of the old school which is deeply suspicious of capitalism. I hope we can work with the old pro-nation state left to attack the global oligarchy and their insane plans. Yes, Trump adheres to some GOP orthodoxies on economic issues, but that's why you are needed - to constitute the element of a new unifying civic nationalism that directly addresses the neoliberal and market fundamentalist cluster-fuck."

I think you describe exactly what happened, Bernie's college kids did not swing Hillary's way and a whole lot of "unapologetic old leftist's" such as myself like Haim Saban voted on ONE issue, and it was PEACE.

Posted by: mad1 | Nov 9 2016 17:00 utc | 115

- posts were not appearing.. removed links.

> Yeah, Right @ 8.

I wonder if the oligarchs will now ask for their money back?

They started writing off their losses, imho, about 5-2 months ago, when it became evident to many of those with stakes (multi millions in many cases) having some insider knowledge / connections, that DT would win.

It is far far worse for many than just having paid staggering amounts for speeches and not getting any return. I hope, like to expect, that the Clinton Foundation, and the myriad of other connected charities and organisations, are shut down. They are involved in much more than pay-to-play, which is bad enough in itself. (To mention just two of my *suspicions* as I can’t ‘accuse’: insider trading and money laundering, but there is more.)

Charles Ortel has done a bit of serious digging.

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 9 2016 17:02 utc | 116

Trump will dominate the White House and Republicans. He will demonstrate the power of a strong president. He was opposed by the media, the two establishment parties and yet still won. He will talk to Putin and joust with China in the proper trading sense. God bless the American people.

Posted by: Lochearn | Nov 9 2016 17:24 utc | 117

I'm curious about the lack of any economic factor in your analysis. American's would certainly prefer less war and foreign interference, but Trump fundamentally won because he spoke to a vast number of disillusioned unemployed (and poorly employed) workers. His election is a repudiation of the neo-liberal establishment. Had Sanders been running he would have swept up a huge number of such voters. But in the absence of the nice guy economic populist the working class settled for the asshole economic populist.

Looking around the internet this morning it's clear a huge number of Dems, both voters and party apparatchiks, can't even begin to grasp this. They're dismissing Trump voters as all mean-spirited bigots and lamenting the 'hopelessness' of the nation as a whole. Economics doesn't even enter into the minds of most of these people; it's been systematically purged as a category that could even exist in favor of all consuming identity politics.

Posted by: Kuma | Nov 9 2016 17:25 utc | 118

The people employed up to now by the war industry can be transferred to infrastructure building, which Trump has promised to concentrate on.

How to pay for it? Deficit financing.

Posted by: lysias | Nov 9 2016 17:29 utc | 119

Yves Smith at Naked Capitalism argues that Trump is going to be far more constrained than appears to be the case right now. She makes a comparison to Jimmy Carter. He brought his Georgia Mafia to Washington D.C., but he was hamstrung from the get-go.

I heard one wag say the other day that Paul Ryan is going to be running the show.

Posted by: Mike Maloney | Nov 9 2016 17:30 utc | 120

Possible cabinet in waiting: - Meet Trump's Cabinet-in-waiting - POLITICO

Posted by: Lozion | Nov 9 2016 17:41 utc | 121

An interesting observation I read at another place..
Comey's sudden FBI investigation... was this a bargain, with the anticipation of the FBI gaining a larger presence as a deportation army for millions of Hispanics?
Will FBI gain significant funds to increase surveillance? Will the days of J Edgar Hoover return?

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 17:46 utc | 122

Trump win raises too many questions, unknown and unintended consequences.

- Another clone terrorist regime - Obama
- Independent prosecutors, investigate Clinton's and family
- Privatization Social Security
- Hands Medicare and Healthcare to vultures
- End, endless wars and regime change (Syria, Ukraine etc.)
- Secretary of states, Arch NeoCon John Bolton
- Nigel Farage in Trump’s team
- Meet Putin before taking office

Obama pardon Clinton, himself before leaving office. Trump win does’t mean we are out of the wood, deeper?

- Voted Dr. Jill Stein.
- Voted against Bernie Sanders, Clinton and NOT for Trump.
- Voted Clinton in primary, easier Trump to beat Clinton Nov8.
- Monitors LA Times polls - only pollster predicted Trump's was ahead Clinton.

Posted by: Jack Smith | Nov 9 2016 17:46 utc | 123

Now the real fun starts!
A great cascading fault line down through the lower rungs of the various hierarchies (most notable the FBI) between those that backed the Clinton cult and those that attempted to stand their ground (for Trump, or not...).
A lot of hedging went on, and now Trump will be rewarding the winning teams while the Clinton cronies will be disappearing faster than rain in the Sahara. The night of the loooong knives has begun!

Posted by: x | Nov 9 2016 17:47 utc | 124

Interview with President of Serbia - Tomislav Nikolic
At a time when international tensions are running high, refugee crisis, war against terrorism, open western confrontation with Russia, Serbia is trying to keep a balance between the EU and NATO on the one hand and Russia - on the other. An aspiring EU member, Serbia refuses to give up its historic ties with Moscow. And with the memories of NATO’s bombing of Serbia in 1999 still fresh, closer cooperation with the alliance is unpopular in the country.


Posted by: schlub | Nov 9 2016 17:48 utc | 125

WW3 has been postponed. In that we can all breathe a sigh of relief.

Trump, IMO, needs some early successes and he can get them by cooperation with Russia re/terrorism and by ratcheting things down with China. My sense is that Xi, in his pursuit of win/win, will give a little to get a little.

Iran will be tougher. Trump had gone out on a limb in saying too much. However, if he pursues better relations with Russia and China first, there's probably a face-saving option with Iran.

Domestically, first order of business is securing the border/illegal immigration. Time for e-verify.

He has a super-majority, but many of these Republicans worked against him so he won't have a cake walk with Congress.

Good luck, Trump. Take your successes early and build from there.

Posted by: woogs | Nov 9 2016 18:07 utc | 126

Gotta laugh ... the Perfidious Albion is far from amused by the Trump victory.

MI6's propaganda sewer, British Bullshit Corporation, has been so totally SHOCKED by Trump's ascendancy that they've been replaying all of the pre-election Trump tropes, scratching their heads, and looking puzzled and bemused. Funnily enough, most of the Americans they're interviewing, post-election, are similarly bemused. The new British Prime Minister-ette was so shocked that she had trouble feigning good manners and a polite demeanor...

Go Donald!!
You're not even Prez yet and you've already pissed off the Pommie Establishment!!

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Nov 9 2016 18:07 utc | 127

Bizarre but the relief I feel with Clinton's loss overwhelms my anxiety about a Trump presidency -- this morning -- like britain pre-article 50 implementation perhaps. I won't believe that she and her minions are "really gone" for a decade (the DLC may live to die yet again). As they ignored and denied the predictions post-Brexit, the self-deception of the Clintons and the Democratic party is likely to continue to shield their delusional self-affirming certainty (in their righteousness) ... but this is a start.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Nov 9 2016 18:08 utc | 128

Many in Egypt are aware of the Clinton/Muslim Brothers connections.,-.aspx

You can't say the same of French journalists!
But at second thought, they are so silent when it comes to Erdogan (except in Germany, but that's for the number of Turks and Kurds living here) that they must actually know about the connection.

I am delighted with the "F... Off" result of the election (just hope the same does not happen in France), if only because now the Brexist -if Brexit there shall be- is going to be really painful... Not to mention the incertainty now about the parliament debate, + scheduling a new referendum in Scotland...

More on Egypt; take a breath from the US election:

Posted by: Mina | Nov 9 2016 18:14 utc | 129

This highlights two day-after articles, which along with the comments thereon provide what is likely the most cogent analysis available.

Trump’s victory and the debacle of American democracy
9 November 2016
Such is the level of political crisis in the United States that it has elevated an obscene charlatan and billionaire demagogue to the highest office in the land.
"Media commentators, none of whom foresaw this outcome, fell back on now routine explanations focused on the voting patterns of various racial and identity groups. They all ignored the fact that the election became a referendum on the devastating social crisis and decay in the United States, which Trump was able to channel and direct to the right…

“Behind all of this was the central ideological role of identity politics and the systematic effort to conceal the real social divisions within society. The relentless and obsessive focus on race and gender over the past four decades has been used to give the Democratic Party a left cover for a thoroughly right-wing political agenda at home and abroad. At the same time, it articulates the interests of the most privileged sections of the upper-middle class.

“The notion that the basic divisions in society are along the lines of race and gender is not only politically reactionary, it is fundamentally false. The Democrats and Clinton were hoisted on their own petard. They not only lost in regions that are predominantly poor and white, but also suffered from a decline in voter turnout in majority black regions, as African-American workers and youth saw no reason to back the candidate of the status quo.”

Trump wins US presidential election
By Patrick Martin, 9 November 2016
Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump defeated his Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton, in a stunning upset and debacle for the Democratic Party.
"Fueling Trump’s lead in the polls was a further shift by whites without a college education—characterized as “working class whites” by the media, although many workers have a college degree—against the Democratic Party. While 40 percent of this demographic voted for Barack Obama in 2008, and he won a majority of their votes outside the South, only 27 percent voted for Hillary Clinton.

"This reflects both the impact of the financial crash and the pro-corporate policies of the Obama administration on the jobs and living standards of the poorest sections of white workers, and the complete indifference of the Democratic Party to the plight of the working class as a whole. The Clinton campaign sought to mobilize voter turnout among black and other minority workers on the basis of identity politics, while offering no policies to benefit workers as a class."

Posted by: Robert Beal | Nov 9 2016 18:15 utc | 130

Bill Clinton wants to know whether Qatar will give him 1 million dollars for his next birthday.
'[Qatar] Would like to see WJC "for five minutes" in NYC, to present $1 million check that Qatar promised for WJC's birthday in 2011,' Ami Desai, director of foreign policy for the Clinton Foundation wrote in an email, using the acronym for William Jefferson Clinton, the former president's full name.

Posted by: harrylawh | Nov 9 2016 18:20 utc | 131

I've always maintained that Hillary wd not be President. Whether decided by the people or TPTB she was impossible because her negatives are too high. For TPTB the essential presidential function is to placate the people into accepting their policies. If TPTB wanted civil disturbance and increased political instability, then only would they have wanted Hillary.

My reason for being certain that the PEOPLE wd not select her was entirely unintellectual. I have followed the Clintons since he was governor of Arkansas, and all these years I have disliked her intensely even apart from the Clintons' obvious mobbed-up, Mafia-type corruption & CIA connections. That is, I disliked her intuitively and viscerally. So what, right? There was never any possibility that other people wd not overwhelmingly feel the same way about her. It depended only on ordinary observation. Even those who voted for her apparently felt uneasy, for her rallies were underpopulated. Thankfully we will not now have to figure out the nature of her pathology.

Posted by: Penelope | Nov 9 2016 18:31 utc | 132

What clueless analysis.

If peace is what the US people wanted why did Jill Stein and the greens get less than 2% in pretty much in every State. I just obliterated your analysis with one fact. The green vote being so low is more shocking then Trump winning. Not surprising, still shocking.

Trump ran the most idiotic incompetent campaign in political history. But racism, sexism, fear, hate, delusion won comfortably over with a grossly incompetent contradictory liar in Trump.
It's also quite clueless how many leftists talk about the tactical failure of the Clinton campaign (true), but Trumps campaign was far worse, but it didn't matter in the end because of the reasons I outlined above and many more.

What the election showed too is that the US is willing and able for a competent fascist to move in so quickly and so easily it's frightening. Just imagine an aware political smart non-buffoon fascist campaigning in the US ? It would be a landslide.

Feels like to me that WikiLeaks was the deciding factor in the end. I can't really prove it but it seemed to make a difference.

Posted by: tom | Nov 9 2016 18:31 utc | 133

What will Trump do? I think we can depend on his debate statements that he will cut business regulations and corporate taxes; unfortunately this will apply to the mega-corps, too. I don't really believe he'll overturn the Iran agreement; there were reasons for it & those reasons still apply-- at least for a year or two, I think.

Donald Trump's overall function is to placate Americans with hope, but the overall dogma to be enforced is TINA, there is no alternative to globalism. He is cast as struggling to reverse certain consequences of globalism, especially as regards the damage to the economy wreaked by globalist trade policy. This will not be allowed to succeed. Indeed it cannot without identifying globalism and its institutions as the cause. Trump will not go there. He will not identify principles but merely apply ad hoc bits & pieces. Nevertheless the increased numbers who have awakened in various degree may oblige the oligarchs to take one step back before taking two forward towards the NWO. The task of helping Americans identify the alternative is ours.

Posted by: Penelope | Nov 9 2016 18:32 utc | 134

b, "chessboard" is a false metaphor.

Chess has fixed, written rules that are fully made known to all participants; chess has referees that know and apply all rules and all rulings are 100% transparent to all observers. All activity is observable and literally "above board". There are no secret meetings, unwritten agreements, side-letters, unknown "repos" or winky-wink actions.

"Politics" has no rules and no bribe-free referees; a fogged, mendacious free-for-all.

Posted by: chu teh | Nov 9 2016 18:33 utc | 135

for me, the meaningful takeaway is that tens of millions of americans have finally rejected the accepted narrative and will no longer buy the bs. reminds me of a bob dylan song lyric from ~1965: i've been through this movie before. ya gotta wake up and shake out the cobwebs first.

Posted by: bolasete | Nov 9 2016 18:39 utc | 136

IMHO 3 reasons why Trump won: because he was 1. A salesman to the right constituents and 2. was not a 'black-lives-matter' stumping woman, and 3. Was 'honest'

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 18:40 utc | 137

Similarly, the profession of "accounting" masquerades as some pure form of chess, but is often just "numerical politics".

Posted by: chu teh | Nov 9 2016 18:40 utc | 138

The projection of 'hope for good things to come' onto Trump may last another day or two, I suppose. The idea that Bernie Sanders and/or Elizabeth Warren or anyone can make a silk purse of the Demoblican Party is even more shocking than the reflexive casting of 'hope for change' onto ... Donald Trump?! Amazing.

The thing to do - seems to me - is to focus right now on people's candidates for 2018. The Republicans+Trump will cure everyone's onset of hopey-changey redux (reflux?) in no time and we need - literally - to capitalize on it.

To capitalize is to do a head count, I believe, and that's what we need to do, again and again, running our own paper-ballot elections in each of our 170,000+ electoral districts until it becomes second nature to do so ... on any issue, from continued death, devastation, destruction, and deceit to the latest Wall Street scam ... to the latest move by the fossil-fuelers to the next representative in each of our districts. All that rises must converge.

No one is going to do this for us - that's the message of this election: the only thing to come out of our present system is momentary relief that one wicked witch has been hit by a house. Followed by disaster with a different face from the 'opposite' direction. We need to wash them all right out of our hair. Rinse. And Repeat.

Posted by: jfl | Nov 9 2016 19:00 utc | 139

Would be fun if Trump "pardoned" Assange to be a free man after all Wiki-leaks, of course he wont do that :)

Posted by: Poliz | Nov 9 2016 19:01 utc | 140

Think of all the pearl clutching that is going on with CFPs (Certified Financial Planners) and folks that call themselves economists. Capitalism is a myth covering for the decisions that the global plutocrats make. The stock market lost the "fundamentals" that the economists built years ago and now they have to build a whole new set of myths about what is REALLY happening so they can keep their jobs and favor with the elite.

Nary a one of them, I suspect, will stand up now and say, "Gee, maybe we ought to look seriously at the way that private finance and those that own it are controlling humanity".

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 9 2016 19:03 utc | 141


Trump's central focus was economic. And he never let up on that message. That resonated.

Posted by: Kuma | Nov 9 2016 19:05 utc | 142

Kuma says:

Economics doesn't even enter into the minds of most of these people

no, it doesn't, because the people you're referring to comprise the 15 or 20 per cent of Americans for whom 'the system' is still working...

...whereas the populist advance is born of economic dismay, not the protest of illegal wars, but of diminished purchasing power.

the rub though, is that 'economic growth' is over, and no one's talking about it.

which makes making America great again an existential problem.

the single thing that a great president can do today is to inform the people of this reality and to guide them in the most creative and constructive ways into this unfolding transition to a 'lower' standard of living.

Posted by: john | Nov 9 2016 19:06 utc | 143

Putin, first foreign leader to congratulation Trump's victory and peace, will Trump reciprocate?

Posted by: Jack Smith | Nov 9 2016 19:12 utc | 144

Although I share (to some extent) B's Schadenfreude, I'm not so optimistic about the future development. First of all; more than two months to go till inauguration day, plenty of time for the neocons to try to convince Tronald to do what they want, or in case of that being impossible, to implement plan B, that being find some 'loner' to finish the job. Secondly the neocons may use this time to create the ultimate mess in Syria or Ukraine or wherever to force the Tronald in a war. And last but not least; Tronald may not act as expected, especially if the economic situation should deteriorate, which will happen duly.

Posted by: Pnyx | Nov 9 2016 19:14 utc | 145

Some already picked up on this...maybe a pissy fit by the 'losers' last evening taking out their wrath on the annointed Don, 72 days before he can get in to office to do anything?

They best be careful they don't swing things too far too fast to cause a crash, unless that's what they want, because there multi-sigma moves ongoing now in several financial & economic indicators/markets:

see the move here in price 10-year note---gigantic move for any bond:

see giant jump in 30-yr bond Yield today, but more so the big move up since the low July:$TYX,uu[d,a]daclyyay[df][pb50!b200][vc60][iUb14!La12,26,9]&pref=G

copper strange too, normally an economic indicator, it's launched past 3 weeks higher than
any of Kim Kong's inflatable ICBMs ever got:

ALL at or approaching decadeal moves.

Posted by: schlub | Nov 9 2016 19:15 utc | 146

this is a very bad day indeed.
wise heads need to speak to trump he cannot be allowed to push israel into the sea.
trump must sign onto the obarma agreements for the 48 billion dollars fron the us to israel to help keep us safe.
we must give the kurd a country they can call home create safe zones for the different groups all over syria.
we need to expose the new hitlers like putin and assad .
i am sure trump will be given the best advisor from goldman sachs,chatham house.the brookings institute,the royal united services institute,the move on soros group,saul alinsky brothers,the frankfurt school and stepehn spielberg and the kaballa numbers saturn corporation.

in time with help and threats from hasbara and sayanim and kitchen films grassy knoll 8mm movie hit shows jfk rfk
in time trump will bend

Posted by: slim cohen | Nov 9 2016 19:18 utc | 147

Gary Busey for Secretary of the Exterior!

Posted by: ALberto | Nov 9 2016 19:24 utc | 148

Trump will bend and/or be bent ... a surprise to me was his prominent cravenly wannabe-macher presence in Adam Curtis' HyperNormalization ... ymmv

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Nov 9 2016 19:25 utc | 149

@ slim cohen

Us pond scum don't want to push Israel into the sea but we do want to push private finance and unfettered inheritance into the sea so we can stop bowing to the God of Mammon.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 9 2016 19:27 utc | 150

I doubt Trump will end the issue of American warmongering. All the arms industry stocks are doing well today.

Posted by: MT | Nov 9 2016 19:32 utc | 151

a unique site is this one, where they pick a theme/topic & basically invite the public as contestants to submit their best ideas in pics/photoshop.

So today their theme contest is of course the NOV8 election:

Bonus: secret drone footage of Lurch heading off to McMurdo Antarctica base before last night:

Posted by: schlub | Nov 9 2016 19:39 utc | 152

Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte congratulated Donald Trump on his election win and said on Wednesday he now wished to stop quarrelling with ally the United States, recalling his anger at the Obama administration for criticizing him.
The maverick leader, dubbed "Trump of the East" for his unrestrained rants and occasional lewd remarks, has repeatedly hit out at Washington in recent months, threatening to cut defense pacts and end military joint drills.
"I would like to congratulate Mr. Donald Trump. Long live," Duterte said in a speech to the Filipino community during a visit to Malaysia.
"We are both making curses. Even with trivial matters we curse. I was supposed to stop because Trump is there. I don't want to quarrel anymore, because Trump has won."

Posted by: okie farmer | Nov 9 2016 19:43 utc | 153

I said it before in the prior election thread: let it sink in that the Clintons were just shown the door. People, this is a momentous occasion. No more political dynasty. All you wet - blankets couldn't do shit to stop Hillary...but the Donald did. When Hegel saw Napoleon as a child, he shit his pants and knew it was a happening. You people just witnessed the same earthquake and were immediately dismissive. What is known as globalism didn't just happen. It took connected actors and a demonic vision. But it can be undone just as assuredly by saner forces of creativity. Whatever happens to ' can't argue that it didn't matter which was elected. To Syrians, it did matter and will show to have mattered.

Posted by: NemesisCalling | Nov 9 2016 19:44 utc | 154

Cynically laughing about, the shocked, appalled, suprised reaction of some of the EU media, France in particuliar. (see also Mina above.)

Wonderful seeing these toadies with egg on their face.

To the last minute they tried to spin, the votes haven’t been all counted, Hillary da Best, etc.

Right now the top banner of France-Inter is pushing this message:

Disinherited and Disenchanted, the two Americas that elected Trump.

According to France-Inter, the US working class (who is that?) and US lower-middle *whites* are afraid of being déclassé ... + the alliance between them is totally unexpected!

Makes zero sense. Panicked verbiage, nonsense.

The top picture shows ‘nobodies’ doing indeterminate ‘stuff,’ in front of a flag, all isolated and alone, fat and ‘poor’…one is ‘black’…

(link may not last or have content changed)

Posted by: Noirette | Nov 9 2016 19:49 utc | 155

@139 john, 'the rub though, is that 'economic growth' is over, and no one's talking about it ... the single thing that a great president can do today is to inform the people of this reality and to guide them in the most creative and constructive ways into this unfolding transition to a 'lower' standard of living.'

Think Trump is the guy to do that?

Posted by: jfl | Nov 9 2016 19:52 utc | 156

Saudi King Salman expressed hope on Wednesday that US president-elect Donald Trump would bring stability to the Middle East.

"We wish your excellency success in your mission to achieve security and stability in the Middle East and worldwide," Salman said in a message of congratulations reported by the official Saudi Press Agency.
He praised the relations which are "historic and tight between the two friendly countries, that all parties aspire to develop and reinforce".
The United States and Saudi Arabia have a decades-old relationship based on the exchange of American security for Saudi oil.
But ties between Riyadh and Washington became increasingly frayed during the eight-year Democratic administration of President Barack Obama.
Saudi leaders felt Obama was reluctant to get involved in the civil war in Syria and other regional conflicts.
They also worried that he was tilting towards their regional rival, Shia Iran, which is on the opposing side to Sunni-dominated Saudi Arabia in the wars in Syria and Yemen.
Washington and other major powers reached an agreement, which took effect in January, to lift international sanctions on Iran in exchange for guarantees that it would not pursue a nuclear weapons capability.

Posted by: okie farmer | Nov 9 2016 19:56 utc | 157

The Palestinian state is DONE!
There might as well be some mass evacuation plans drawn up

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 20:03 utc | 158

Stocks bounce back from nosedive as Trump victory begins to sink in on Wall St.

Adam Shell

Republicans have seized control of all three branches of government

Paul Ryan says Donald Trump has a mandate
Stocks were rebounding strongly Wednesday as the major indexes reversed steep losses after markets careened out of control in volatile trading overnight after a speech by President-elect Donald Trump helped reassure investors after his upset win against Hillary Clinton caught investors around the globe by surprise.  

Quotes in the article
Aberdeen Asset Management PLC


Ameriprise Financial Inc


Hang Seng Bank Ltd


The Dow was up more than 250 points after tumbling as much as 800 points in late-night futures trading. The Standard & Poor's 500, which was down 5% overnight and hit a trading halt designed to limit losses, also trimmed its steep declines and was up 1.15%. The Nasdaq gained 0.85% 

Posted by: okie farmer | Nov 9 2016 20:04 utc | 159

Hi Noirette, try this playlist:
France Culture yesterday 22 to 23 PM
then all night on France Inter (they had a full studio reserved with some US expats to give their reactions through the night + guests). At Florida results they were still perfectly happy and hopeful, then when it started to unfold hour after hour they got progressively desperate.
I did not even try to listen to France Culture today 7AM-9AM except one piece of the news, but it should be good too...

The reactions of the Brussels people is proportional to the percentage of Qatari/Saudi money in their respective economy (apart from the helpless Easter Europe countries of course who simply woke up without a boss)

Posted by: Mina | Nov 9 2016 20:19 utc | 160

Well nice to see what this is really about, hatred ' "transsexual" and wants to use a men's public toilet... a hefty kick in the ass. '.

Amazing how out of all of the groups that are going to get hammered in the US by Trump b picks on we transgender people. Nice to see the true colours coming out, the 'Trump effect' writ large, feeling the freedom to shout out all the miserable hatred held deep in the heart, carefully hidden away from polite company up to you can shout it out from the rooftops.

Enjoy your jollies while they last, thinking Trump is going going to 'save' everyone (well except women, LGBTI, POC, migrants, minorities...) as he has signed up to the most right wing, neo-liberal, neo-conservative 'end of times' bunch that exists on the planet... the US religious right, too extreme even for the neo-cons ...which seems to have escaped everyone's notice.

Posted by: Lisa | Nov 9 2016 20:22 utc | 161

From Okie's post: "But ties between Riyadh and Washington became increasingly frayed during the eight-year Democratic administration of President Barack Obama.
Saudi leaders felt Obama was reluctant to get involved in the civil war in Syria and other regional conflicts."

What would it be if they had not been!!

Posted by: Mina | Nov 9 2016 20:23 utc | 162

b.. excellent coverage on your part. thank you.

@80 grieved... i concur.. thanks

@151 noirette.. thanks for the overview from france.. fascinating.. they will be wondering why le pen does so well in the next election too.. some folks / media establishments are blinded by their slavish devotion to the corporations..

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2016 20:24 utc | 163

I must admit that I thought Clinton would win. I don't think their (extreme) foreign policy will have been different but at least the vassals will (rightfully) be a lot less cooperative with Trump than they would have been with Clinton, demonstrated by the cheerleading pro-Clinton presstitude media outside the US. I never saw a trace relating to the Wikileaks in the presstitude media over here. I really had to go out and search for it, on Sputnik for example. It will be a lot easyier to mount protest against the far right Trump than against the far right Hillary who is being propagated as a 'progressive'. Trump would also face a lot more difficulties in getting support from Europe against Russia or Japan+SKorea against China as they would also bare the brunt in case the US would start WWIII.

Posted by: prez | Nov 9 2016 20:31 utc | 164

Words initially used to describe the US Govt:
Words later used to describe the US Govt:
Socialist democracy
Words used in more recent years to describe the US Govt:
Facist state
Kakistocracy (one of my favorites)

We've made progress and come full circle back to the GOP. No matter who gets into office we get more wars, Wall Street gets what they want, Israel gets what they want, lobbyists scramble to ingratiate with the newcomers and reinforce old connections, etc. In other words, business as usual. Back to work!

Posted by: Curtis | Nov 9 2016 20:33 utc | 165

@63. The Wikileaks made clear that Trump was the preferred Candidate to run against Clinton. The media supported him for that reason. The Clinton campaign felt he was the easiest one to beat. Of course that changed later in the election cycle.

Posted by: linda amick | Nov 9 2016 20:38 utc | 166

There are tons of wishful thinking here today. Reality is much different from what is being expressed.
1. Trump is in love with Israhell and Netenyahoo. He has two daughters married to Israelis. Neo cons will continue to own the U.S. government.
2. Trump is one of the money elite. He was going bankrupt some time back but was bailed out by the Rothschild cabal who then owned him. He, like Hillary, is just another Rothschild prostitute.
3. The money boys had to dump Hillary because of WikiLeaks. There was just too much baggage coming out. Had they put her in their game would have been exposed to everyone, even the thick-headed. So the people did not overcome the fix at all. The cabal owns all the parties, an honest American has NO CHANCE to get on a ballot. The cabal just covered its ass, because of WikiLeaks, by putting in the other prostitute.
Good luck with that.

Posted by: Tony B. | Nov 9 2016 20:40 utc | 167

@ okie farmer

Looking at the today's market response to the Trump victory should be a clear signal to those that think the zionists are afraid of Trump.....they are not.

When Trump first came on the scene I commented here that he represented the "don't throw me in the briar patch" candidate for the global plutocrats and, unfortunately, that is what the markets are much for hopey/changey

From the frying pan into the fire Americans. Its just business. Get over it.....isn't that how it goes from chipnik?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 9 2016 20:43 utc | 168

Int’l Election Observer Suspended After Tweeting Support for Clinton

Posted by: 2pap | Nov 9 2016 20:43 utc | 169

The GOP will push the same CONTRA/ISIS style scum---the author is anti-Trump, but at least he has a good idea of the trash that the Republicans will be bringing in---read to the end---a certain Fadli (Indonesian) with ties to a certain general and former presidential candidate Prabowo, has been seen on the stage with Trump, so we can infer that the Republican deep party leadership is hoping for a repeat of the 80s. According to the link, Prabowo used ISIS flags during his presidential campaign at his rallies, and he owned East Timorese slaves.

Even then, Trump is a huge improvement over Clinton, Bush and Obama---if anyting, the author probably believed a bit too much in the Yugoslavia and Rwanda propaganda of the 90s---to wit, the US intervention in Rwanda started on or before 1 October 1990, with DRC as a consequence.

Posted by: Johan Meyer | Nov 9 2016 20:46 utc | 170

And the new slogan will be

Make America Empire Again!

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 9 2016 20:46 utc | 171

@psychohistorian | Nov 9, 2016 2:27:21 PM | 146


Posted by: Jack Smith | Nov 9 2016 20:46 utc | 172

Trump picked his campaign team on their intelligence and smartness. Hillary picked her team based in on their loyalty and their submission to her 'superior' intelligence.
Hopefully Trump will also pick people for the administration exclusively based on their intelligence and honesty. Contrary to Hillary Trump want people to challenge him not to blindly obey him.
That is the trait of a real leader.

Posted by: virgile | Nov 9 2016 20:52 utc | 173

@125 mina.. thanks for M K Bhadrakumar's article on the egypt / syria developments.. that is encouraging.. anything to isolate the whackjobi religion and it's cult of headchopping fans in the saudi /qatar ruling class.

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2016 20:58 utc | 174

Noirette @112. The Clinton Foundation is toast.

Who in their right mind would "donate" anything to that "charity" when its entire purpose - buying access to the Clintons - will now buy you absolutely nothing of any worth.

After today the Clintons will have no influence, and even fewer friends.

After today if you want to buy time with Hillary you'll only need to go down to Central Park on a sunny day. You'll find Hillary sitting on a park bench and feeding the pigeons.

Give it six months and the Clinton Foundation will fold from lack of funds: Bill will have syphoned what's already there to a bank in the Caribbean, and it will have been six months since the last "donation" came in.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Nov 9 2016 21:00 utc | 175

jfl @ 152 asks:

Think Trump is the guy to do that?

no, mr. lee, i don't think so.

Posted by: john | Nov 9 2016 21:09 utc | 176


Except Trump's Cabinet will be former Goldman bankers and his VP is a Two-Front War Hawk, and his SecState will be John Bolton, a Kissinger/Brezinzski Grand Cess Game-naut.

Hope and Chains, baby! Hope and Chains...

Posted by: chipnik | Nov 9 2016 21:10 utc | 177


"I said it before in the prior election thread: let it sink in that the Clintons were just shown the door. People, this is a momentous occasion. No more political dynasty. All you wet - blankets couldn't do shit to stop Hillary...but the Donald did. When Hegel saw Napoleon as a child, he shit his pants and knew it was a happening. You people just witnessed the same earthquake and were immediately dismissive."

Trump didn't only shut down the Clinton dynasty, he also stomped on the Bush dream to rule the world back during the primary. Don't forget, this election was supposed to be b/w Bush and Clinton -- the dueling dynasties.

But Trump poured a lot of water on that fanciful thought and he did it by spending little money. I think I read somewhere today that each vote cast during the general cost less than $5 each, which in American politics is unheard of. He did it by breaking politically correct barriers such as race, gender, economic class and he did it by working his ass off...rally, after rally, after rally. There he was at the Virginia Loudon county fairgrounds at midnight on Sunday with reports of voters lines extending to nearly two miles long. Ditto Monday and that was just his closing.

His campaign staff, especially his field staff, was/is stellar. They sent him and Pence into the swing states packing auditoriums with supporters for months now, they kept him on message by forcing him to use a teleprompter, they forbade him to tweet during these closing weeks, but their real genius was being certain to work a traditionally blue state just in case he needed those electoral votes to win. Wisconsin became that state and he won it shocking the in denial, out of touch, entitled neo lib/neo con political class that thought we the people wanted a Bush and Clinton face off...these one percenters are clueless, truly.

The entirety of his campaign was nontraditional by all standards. Obviously Trump lead his campaign to victory, but it is equally as obvious that he listened and worked with his team. These are characteristics that make a solid leader. We'll see if he's that and more.

And 150 said -

"Whatever happens to ' can't argue that it didn't matter which was elected. To Syrians, it did matter and will show to have mattered." - Amen. And I sincerely thank any and all who took the consensus from MoA's many threads where b and his many posters protested loudly Hillary's diabolical 'No fly zone and safe zone' policy position in Syria and spread the word to other sites. Who knows, maybe the MoA community has greater influence than it realizes.

Posted by: h | Nov 9 2016 21:11 utc | 178

In reply to tom, 129.

You state: - "What the election showed too is that the US is willing and able for a competent fascist to move in so quickly and so easily it's frightening. Just imagine an aware political smart non-buffoon fascist campaigning in the US ? It would be a landslide."

Would a "competent fascist" really have an easy run in the US?

In a fascist state sectoral interests are represented directly to a paternalistic government. In an industrial society that must become corporatism. That in turn morphs effortlessly into cronyism. Spain, the longest lived fascist regime, was the clearest example. Fascism, in practice, and whatever the intentions of those who dreamed that particular dream, is Government by the Crony Elite for the Crony Elite.

Looking at the campaigns of Sanders and Trump, and the resolution demonstrated in those campaigns, I'd have thought that fascism was precisely what a very respectable number of people in America have just been fighting against.

But aren't these old labels more trouble than they're worth? They seduce us into fighting old battles, as if the terrain of those old battles is the terrain of our battles today. It's not. Couldn't we simply say that the American people have just shown that they are more ready to combat an authoritarian and corrupt regime than they are to accept one?

In those circumstances I think that a "competent fascist" would have quite a hard time gaining a foothold. Given that the electorate has just turfed out some incompetent ones.

Posted by: EnglishOutsider | Nov 9 2016 21:14 utc | 179

In his acceptance speech President Elect Donald Trump stated to he had the backing of 200 retired Generals and Admirals and 20+ Congressional Honor medal recipients. There are people saying on the www that Trump was approached by these people and others and reportedly they asked him to run against the Clintons. A Clinton Presidency would allow psychopaths Bill & Hill a possible total of 16 years of their self-enriching 'Reign of Error' and sustained attack on the Bill of Rights. Being a veteran it is my sincerest hope that the Bill of Rights has gained a champion and not another enemy of. Time will tell?

Just my opinion

Posted by: ALberto | Nov 9 2016 21:24 utc | 180

This has been said before, but the great victory in Trump's win is going to be the reduction, not the elimination, of US going to war against Russia. My take, is the biggest positive is that the neocons have been removed, for the time being at least, from any positions of influence inside the US foreign policy establishment.

What should be clear that the neocons have never been aligned with either political party. They emerged inside the Democratic Party during the Henry Jackson era. When they realized that there was too much anti-war sentiment with the Democrats they switched their loyalty to the Republicans. They reached the pinnacle of their influence with the Bush II admin. They orchestrated the war against Iraq. After Trump won the recent primaries, the neocon rats fled in mass into the Democratic Party yet again. Unfortunately for them, they fled into the Clinton wing of the Democratic Party.

One obvious result of Trump's win is that the Clinton wing has been greatly diminished in influence if not totally destroyed by Hillary's defeat. I know from my own experience inside the Dem Party that her supporters there are pure opportunists. They will be fleeing in droves over the next few months. The poor neocons. The ship they jumped to has just been sunk. And there is no way that Trump will wellcome them back into the Republican Party.

That is the good news from this election. Of course the neocons have tremendous financial support from their Zionist backers but they will have to rebuild after this lose with many of their opportunistic followers looking for employment elsewhere.

The bottom line should be that the Syrian people win as will the people of Donbass.

Posted by: ToivoS | Nov 9 2016 21:24 utc | 181

As far as I am concerned, the most important thing Trump can do right now is name Cynthia McKinney as Secretary of the Interior.

Posted by: blues | Nov 9 2016 21:25 utc | 182

#175 English Insider

Blairite Zionist fuc*tards like that Tom-Mark-Hank-whatever fool are a lower form of existence on the physical plane.

Talking to 'it' decreases your karma. Treat it as inanimate matter, utter mistakes of Mother Nature and Demiurge the fucktard.

Let it go through its well deserved reincarnations and then work its way up the Jacob's ladder.

Posted by: Quadriad | Nov 9 2016 21:27 utc | 183


Bush, Rodham, Bush Jr, Dunham, now Trump are all distant cousins of the Royal English Throne, and since the fall of the Berlin Wall, the US has been gutted by those Royalists and their Private Fed Bank. Same koolaid, different flavor. Stop waterboarding each other.

E pluribus (I can't tell you where all the money went) owe 'em.

Posted by: chipnik | Nov 9 2016 21:29 utc | 184


They weren't afraid of Putin either, the wishful thinking fools ignored him until Volodya become too powerful to be brushed aside by a bunch of random Judistani riff raff.

Pimping your own daughter to one is about as plausible deniability as one can go. Maskirovka to the power of N.

Posted by: Quadriad | Nov 9 2016 21:32 utc | 185

Trump won a popularity contest. It was up his alley as he's a reality TV show star, a pro wrestling character, and a ruthless tough guy.

Now it's all about policy. Does he really want to deal with it for 4 years? I don't think he has the stamina

Once he gets his law&order along with mass deportation thing going, he'll maybe check out and let Pence and the cabinet run the show before long. You'll see the pipeline protesters get thrown into jail en masse, to watch the pipeline go through as planned. You'll maybe see federally protected lands leased out for grazing and mining. Afterall Trump is a bigtime proponent of eminent domain.
The Palestinians in occupied Palestine might as well pack their bags. Perhaps chanters at the state of the union will shout 'Pack your bags' when he brings it up at his address...

Iran, Venezuela, North Korea.. potential targets when the war economy economists finally get their way.

The prison industry will be increased substantially, and newly funded FBI and state police agencies will ensure that a steady stream of malcontents get long sentences.

Of course all the above is pure speculation at this point - Hillary did not offer a much better deal, but it can be said that she would at least maintain business as usual, rather than expanding it

Posted by: bbbb | Nov 9 2016 21:35 utc | 186

i agree these trouble makers in gaza need to be transported to the london,munich and paris in france.
they have mad a terrible mess in gaza this land is needed for gas and oil storage and processing mega structures for the leviathan and genie energy corporations oded yinon projects.

israel should not allow arab anti semites to live be unemeployed drink precious frack bottled mineral water eat monsanto corn,wheat and gmo syrup live off the hog so to speakings.
a peaceful but firm relocation for the adults a more gentle slower pizza pasta spirit cook party for the children then a kinder transport to londonistan thanks to the soros foundation.
if some of them make it to calais all the better the ones that fall by the podesta leon britain jimmy saville wayside ho hum

Posted by: joseph farben | Nov 9 2016 21:35 utc | 187

@ Propeace 34.
So I had to check VT. You're right. Those guys are off the rails. Did they really prefer Shillary Killinton?

US MSM has been shameless whether it was last night or this morning. It was like the rejection of GOP 2006 and the long faces of Fox News. This time it was most if not all the media including Fox. They blamed uneducated white Americans. (insult the people) They blamed a lack of minority turnout. (admit they play races against each other) They blamed a lack of turnout in cities like Philadelphia. (admit they only have support in very select areas and not most of the country) Sometimes they actually pointed to perceptions of Hillary's corruption in spite of Comey clearing her (but not the reality) and rarely they admitted people rejected the media. (but don't expect any real change there)

Posted by: Curtis | Nov 9 2016 21:47 utc | 188

#161 Curtis

It's all scripted... until it's not.

The Zio frog's doing great, until it's cooked, then served on the plate.

"Surtout pas de panique, meme si les Allemands sont entres dans Paris!"

Posted by: Quadriad | Nov 9 2016 22:15 utc | 189

Don't get your hopes up too high, anyone, what with his named list of appointees ready to replace the ones the First Golfer has in place.

09 November 2016 18:17
Is President Trump Means End of US support for Rebels in Syria?
While according to Al- Bawaba reports supporters of Assad celebrating, trump victory has been unpleasant for Syrian opposition.

Across social media, Assad supporters have praised the election of Trump, a man who they see, potentially, as an exciting new addition to the coalition fighting against terrorists forces in Syria.

Trump has previously expressed support for Assad and his allies, indicating he would side with the Syrian Government if it helped to defeat Daesh (Islamic State, ISIS, ISIL and IS). "I don't like at all, but Assad is killing ISIS. Russia is killing ISIS and Iran is killing ISIS,” he said.

once again, the site u can participate with your own creative art:

I likes this one---TopGun Donald stars in 'The Ejectorator':

Posted by: schlub | Nov 9 2016 22:21 utc | 190

one question now awaiting us is how will NATO responded to their new commander in chief! they had expected a Hilllary (we came we saw we killed) Clinton, with an evolved hunter killer instinct..instead they get,...Trump and his Deplorables!, who prefer to make friends (JEEZ!). Expect a few beer sodden months as they adapt to the new condition

heres the Clinton New Networks take...sober after last nights drinking session!

WSJ shows its talent for understatement

the russians are probably still sleeping of their orgy!

The sober Atlantic puts it this way
WTF happened!
'It’s not unlike Trump to make shocking statements. But these ones stoked particular alarm, not least among America’s allies, about the candidate’s suitability for the United States presidency. So what’s the big deal? What does NATO actually do?'

Posted by: brian | Nov 9 2016 22:40 utc | 191

I really have no idea what Trump is going to do as POTUS. What he's said so far is not really believable as he's likely to change tomorrow. If he appointed a NeoCon administration, would he obey them? Not sure. He is going to support Jerusalem as Israel's capital. Is he thereby tamed? Not yet evident.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 9 2016 22:41 utc | 192

@ 188

Good point. I like the way you phrased it: "Is he thereby tamed?"

Posted by: Lochearn | Nov 9 2016 23:17 utc | 193

Read an opinion piece today that thought FBI's Comey did not charge $Hillary with email crimes and treason thinking that President Barry would pardon her which would result in her not subject to trial and punishment seeing that she had received a Presidential Pardon. Once Trump is sworn in the Clintons will be charged with Clinton Foundation crimes.

Posted by: ALberto | Nov 9 2016 23:35 utc | 194

@brian 187
Wow. Just, wow. There it is. What the people are owed before an election from the 4th estate - an open dialogue about real issues like "what is NATOs mission...?" - they are not getting. But now the people are getting it, after the election...? Give us all a fucking break. Please.

Posted by: MadMax2 | Nov 9 2016 23:42 utc | 195

re 190. Obama may well pardon her before leaving power. it's within his rights.

Posted by: Laguerre | Nov 9 2016 23:47 utc | 196

As much as logic suggests the Trump regime should throw out the neoliberal zionist foreign policy, I suspect that won't happen - why? Because 911.
When 911 happened shrub hadn't been on the scene long enough to really reveal whether he was gonna become an aipac tool or forge a new independant foreign policy. After the action, a great many people logically inferred that the way through the mess would be to toss zionism into the wastebasket of history and forge an alliance with the people of the ME. Like that happened - shrub absorbed the neocon poison then set about wilfully ensuring that all middle easterners be considered terrorists fit only for torturing and killing.
There is no reason to suppose trump will do it different - even if he backs off on Syria he will be pressured by the crew to hammer Iran & caress israel to 'show balance' - watch & see, I wanna be wrong about this but I just don't see Trump as a person of principle, like all greedies he will take the line of biggest profit, least resistance and that I'm afraid means going with the aipac flow.
I'm still happy that Clinton was beaten, but we always knew that whichever creep won this farce, ordinary humans would lose.

On a lighter note even the scumbag zionist kiwi PM conceeds TPP is dead in the water. This Key fella was one of the prime movers behind getting that abrogation of sovereign power pushed thru everywhere before citizens could notice. Heh heh heh there's always a silver lining - unless you're some poor fucker in the ME desperately trying to get by.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Nov 9 2016 23:53 utc | 197

lest we forget, Michael Moore, chief left win advocate for Hillary Clinton ios still taking in the almighty loss
Michael Moore Verified account ‏@MMFlint 8h8 hours ago
In one last act of sad historical irony last night, Donald Trump held his victory party in the hotel where Malcolm X spent his final night.
@MMFlint but who would Malcolm X have endorsed? Not Clinton!

Michael Moore Verified account ‏@MMFlint 21m21 minutes ago
Pistons coach Steve VanGundry on Trump: “This guy is racist & misogynistic. We've just thrown a good part of our population under the bus."
Moore ignores the elephant in the room: Clintons foreign policy and general war mongering
Michael Moore ‏@MichaelMoore_7 16h16 hours ago
Woke up in the middle of the night to the news that trump is the next president..America you had one job and you done screwed up #ripamerica
suits me..good bye america! much of the rest of the world tho is celebrating

Posted by: brian | Nov 9 2016 23:59 utc | 198

Trump could bring Russia in from the cold
Mary Dejevsky
As the tally turned towards a victory for Donald Trump in the middle of the European night, comments began to appear on social media to the effect that Russian intelligence had won its biggest victory in the country’s history. More than this, that the Kremlin had actually captured the United States.

The prominent, if spectral, role played by Russia was one of the stranger aspects of this already strange US election. And these comments were alarmist, if logical, extensions of the claims made by the Clinton camp during the campaign that Trump was somehow in cahoots with President Vladimir Putin and that the Russian state was interfering in the election on his behalf.
There was precious little evidence for such claims, and Putin himself ridiculed them at his annual Valdai meeting with international Russian specialists two weeks ago. Was the US a banana republic, he asked, that its elections could be so easily manipulated? Of course not. But they were useful to the Democrats’ campaign in showing off Hillary Clinton as a tough foreign policy president-in-waiting and demonising Trump by association.
They were not useful enough, though, given the result. Either the voting public dismissed them, or perhaps they agreed with Trump that improved relations with Russia might be a good thing. In any case, they turned out to be the black mark the Clinton campaign expected.

Posted by: okie farmer | Nov 10 2016 0:09 utc | 199

@177 TS,

Thanks for the history of the neo-cons ...

"After Trump won the recent primaries, the neocon rats fled in mass into the Democratic Party yet again."

You skipped the entire Obama administration.

... I think you missed a bit here as well.

"[T]here is no way that Trump will welcome them back into the Republican Party."

His VP is a neo-con. If Trump himself doesn't toe the neo-con line - I think he has/will - they'll pop him, and put in their man. I think Trump knows that, offered himself as hostage to his presidential run. The play's the thing with the Donald. That's the way it seems to me at any rate.

@173 h

Your tribute to Trump is frightening. I'm sure you will regain your sense of balance once the euphoria of Hillary's defeat calms down and the reality of the Trump presidency sets in.

@152 john

Thanks for the clear answer.

On the question itself, is it the whole of the American people who must accustom themselves to the "unfolding transition to a 'lower' standard of living". Or just the "15 or 20 per cent of Americans for whom 'the system' is still working." Or is it the 80 to 85 percent of Americans for whom the system is not working who must accustom themselves to the 'new normal'?

Posted by: jfl | Nov 10 2016 0:21 utc | 200

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