The cessation of free ca$h flow ending the robbery of crude oil from Syria and Iraq by Turkey has thrown a monkey wrench in the plans of “the exceptional’s” New World Order with US in Charge scenario.
Speaking of “Exceptional” take a gander at Israel in Palestine, then take a gander at The Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland. Sort of forming a pattern here now aren’t we?
Just me opinion

Posted by: ALberto | May 10 2016 19:45 utc | 4

I don’t understand why Russia is playing the “negotiate with the liars” game. I guess there must be a reason, but from my vantage point it looks like it just gave (and is giving) the terrorists more time to regroup and rearm.

Posted by: rcentros | May 10 2016 19:47 utc | 6

I twixed me twangs …
“The cessation of free ca$h flow, as a result of actions taken by Russia in Syria, ending the robbery of crude oil from Syria and Iraq by Turkey has thrown a monkey wrench”
Just me opinion

Posted by: ALberto | May 10 2016 19:48 utc | 8

What the ” opposition” really is, is opposed to human dignity and liberty, which the dispicable Lister is trying to sell.
Lister warns about undermining talks, but not about the murderous, torturous Jihadi criminal behaviour of the “opposition.”

Posted by: tom | May 10 2016 20:21 utc | 10

@ 9, Smoothie,
We all understand Russia has interests beyond Syria, but the question we all have is wouldn’t they be better served by a clear cut victory in Syria? How does agreeing to a ceasefire near the point of winning help Russia’s global interests? We all understand Russia should not do the ground fighting for the Syrian army, but doesn’t letting the fighting go on too long raise the risks for Russia?

Posted by: Lysander | May 10 2016 21:50 utc | 12

@11 ssh
I agree that the US directly backs al-CIAduh and has since Graham Fuller – who has now ‘got religion’ and is selling the ‘US can’t be cop of the world’ line in drag at the consortiumnews.com – of Iran-Contra fame, the godfather of al-CIAduh, the father-in-law of Ruslan Tsaernaev, uncle of the boys in Boston, founded the operation.
@13 jen
Yes, I think you’re right. Russia does not want to be any more involved than she has to be in Syria, and knows that in the end it’s up to the people directly involved there to clean up after the USA/EU/GCC.
b, it is good to see them so openly accepting/embracing al-CIAduh as part of the team, isn’t it? There’s an opening The Donald could drive a truck full of political IEDs through.

Posted by: jfl | May 10 2016 23:42 utc | 14

@ 13, Russia cannot and should not intervene everywhere. Russia really had no responsibility to intervene in Syria and I did not expect it to until it did. Having done so, I fail to see the reason behind ceasefires that occur at the moment of victory. I can’t see it even in terms of Russia’s global interests. In other words, if the Syrian army can retake Aleppo with Russian assistance, how is it better for Russia that it does not?
Mentioning other countries with terrorism problems where Russia could hypothetically intervene doesn’t explain Syria. Russia has no interests in Mali that I know about and at any rate it is much too far away. Iraq would be a direct challenge to the US which Russia might want to avoid for now. And in 2014 Russia in fact did help Iraq when ISIS first splashed into the headlines. When the US refused to deliver the F 16s it had promised, Russia delivered equipment to Iraq quickly. In fact, I suspect the seemingly increased motivation of the US to help Iraq retake Mosul is inspired by fear that the Russians might be invited to help if the US does not.

Posted by: Lysander | May 11 2016 0:02 utc | 16

I suppose some might be surprised by this and the resultant threads … but the bottom line is that very few Americans give a s—, and those that do usually do so based on the myth of America the good. The reality is far different, and has been from the very beginning. Some can’t seem to handle that reality, but there never has been a time when the Americans weren’t self obsessed predators. It goes way back beyond the first colonists, and it may simply be nothing more than the western demand that all others should be subservient, or preferably, dead.

Posted by: rg the lg | May 11 2016 0:30 utc | 18

>> Having done so, I fail to see the reason behind ceasefires that occur at the moment of victory.
How ’bout:
“Do not interrupt your opponents while they continue investing more into the same mistake.”
Maybe they figure “let this boil fester here where it’s contained, rather than the germs pull out and start somewhere else on their own time table”.
Just a guess.

Posted by: dumbass | May 11 2016 1:41 utc | 20

I have great concerns about the way that opposition to the amerikan inspired takeover of Syria has morphed into opposition to any attempt by the people of the middle east for self determination.
The US was able to exploit the anger of younger generation ME populations by suborning political movements which they had set up. As we have discussed many times before young people in the ME turned to islam because they felt betrayed by both rightist (US) and leftist (USSR as it was then) interference in their nations revealed to be a front for imperialism.
Since all streams of political consciousness are closed off to the people of the ME it is little wonder they seek to attack those they see as the instigators of their oppression.
We may not like some of the policies of Islamism but really it is none of our goddam business – the simple fact is people of the ME are angry because no independent movement has ever been allowed to evolve. Any independent attempts are quickly crushed by one outsider or another. The fact that b’s piece relies heavily on commentary from amerikan policy wonks who were the architects of the illegal invasion of Iraq makes me sick.
Not just because giving another vector to those assholes’ cruel self interest and arbitrary declarations empowers them even more, but because it is as though the one thing that everyone in ‘the west’ agrees upon is that the people of the ME are not entitled to have a say in their own destiny.
This is what getting too close to a conflict does – it encourages people to pick a side then support that side no matter what, and I fear that this is what has happened at MoA. The initial opposition to the Syrian conflict was that it was a reaction against amerikan shit stirring but now it has gone far beyond that into a win at any cost jingoism that pays absolutely no regard to a simple truth and that is it wasn’t purely amerikan antipathy towards the Assad administration which kicked off this mess, a substantial number of Syrian citizens had felt neglected and/or oppressed by the status quo which existed at that time.
It seems the default position of many people has become to turn the clock back to the political structure pre insurrection. That is damn stupid as it won’t fix anything and will leave an unstable mess ripe for exploitation again.
I’m not advocating an end to Pres Assad’s tenure and I don’t like the thought of Erdogan being able to exert influence over a part of Syria any more than anyone else, but Erdogan interference is the price that has to be paid in the short term to allow Syrian people who are opposed to Assad to enjoy political expression then so be it. There are ways to obstruct a further major uprising that don’t involve destroying those areas with a majority Sunni population, but rather allowing them to evolve, they will wake up to the opportunism of Erdogan and Salman themselves. If the upshot of that is a few groups of alenated citizens in ‘the west’ commit a few more actions against their populations that is unfortunate but needs to be regarded as the inevitable result of centuries of oppression rather the shock, quelle horreur, lets kill all the muslims that it currently is.
The longer nations such as amerika or russia seek to totally oppress islamic populations, the longer the whole fucked up process will continue.

Posted by: Debs is dead | May 11 2016 2:49 utc | 22

Debs is dead @21
“I’m not advocating an end to Pres Assad’s tenure and I don’t like the thought of Erdogan being able to exert influence over a part of Syria any more than anyone else, but Erdogan interference is the price that has to be paid in the short term to allow Syrian people who are opposed to Assad to enjoy political expression then so be it.”
This is nonsense. For starters, tanks, armored infantry vehicles and missiles are not “tools to enjoy political expression”. Imagine that some very nice group of American malcontents removes federal agents from some part of US territory (that happened early this year) and gets heavy weaponry from abroad (that did not happen). Now National Wildlife Refuge in Malheur is back under federal control and no one cares about concerns of that group of farmers.
Furthermore, the type of “political expression” we can observe there has other religious groups running for their lives. I do not care if these people are Salafists or Scientologists, but what passes for “politics” in the “liberated zones” is a string of assassinations and other power games that could be called “backstabbing” except that firearms and explosives are preferred. And the winners are groups that are most disciplined and fanatical, i.e. al-Qaeda and ISIS.
Next, in Bashar’s Syria some groups were “left out”, but here we see an alternative: the country is turned into ruin. It is also instructive to consider the history of countries that underwent prolonged civil wars. Colombia had 10 years of La Violencia and 60 years later it remains a brutal polarized society. Mexico had ten years if revolution nearly hundred years ago and it stills harbors surprising amounts of violence. And the most recent examples are even worse. The destruction of civil wars is not merely infrastructure and lives, but also deep scars in the psychology of the people and deep suspicion given to all kinds of political compromise. In USA there is a lot of attention to PSD among veterans, but when the entire population is under traumatic stress, the negative result have exponentially worse dimensions. Not a good bargain for “enjoyment of political expression”.
Finally, for better or worse, the opposition in Syria is financed from abroad and thus influenced from abroad. And who is doing influencing? The most benevolent group that is involved is CIA, those guys do not give a damn about democracy, moderation etc. but at least they know what is it and are not hostile to it. Then you have Turkish government, increasingly oppressive and dictatorial, with “left out groups” being treated with destruction of villages and cities, moderate malcontents having their properties confiscated (banks, manufacturing companies and of course the press). But the real money comes from a bunch of absolute monarchs who view democracy as a horror to avoid at all costs. So what we see in the region is that instead of spreading democratic values, hitherto democratic states import civil war and dictatorship, in the case of Turkey, and total disfunction of the government, in the case of Lebanon and Iraq (well, in Lebanon it is “imported” because political parties are paid from abroad to be obstructionist, in Iraq it is perhaps more of an internal inability derived from more than one decade of strife that is ongoing).

Posted by: Piotr Berman | May 11 2016 3:47 utc | 24

Charles Lister @TSG
○ The Soufan Group (TSG): The Islamic State – A Summary
Ali H. Soufan (born July 8, 1971) is a Lebanese-American former FBI agent who was involved in a number of high-profile anti-terrorism cases.

Posted by: Oui | May 11 2016 7:19 utc | 26

Debs is dead @ 21
” … I’m not advocating an end to [President] Assad’s tenure and I don’t like the thought of Erdogan being able to exert influence over a part of Syria any more than anyone else, but [if] Erdogan interference is the price that has to be paid in the short term to allow Syrian people who are opposed to Assad to enjoy political expression then so be it …”
If you had been following MoA’s blog since 2011 when the war began, you would know that no moderate opposition against Bashar al Assad’s government exists and that so-called “moderate rebels” are up to their necks and beyond deeply embedded with Al Nusra, ISIS and other Saudi-funded and Turkish-supported takfiri groups.
Syria had presidential elections in June 2014 and parliamentary elections only a few weeks ago. Bashar al Assad was voted back as President with over 88% of the vote (voter turn-out being 70% which, in this day and age where 2/3 of the electorate in the US don’t bother to turn up at polling stations, is good)and the National Progressive Front, of which the Ba’ath Party is the leading party, won 80% of seats in the Syrian parliament in 2016.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_presidential_election,_2014
The full list of Syrian politicians who won seats can be viewed at this link:
http://www.activistpost.com/2016/04/syrian-parliamentary-election-results-disprove-dictatorship-claims.html
It should be clear where the Syrian public’s preferences lie and you are in no position to say that they ought to tolerate the interference of a known corrupt and increasingly authoritarian Turkish President in their affairs.

Posted by: Jen | May 11 2016 8:00 utc | 28

@24 pb. ‘ The most benevolent group that is involved is CIA’
With the exception of that line I think you’re right. What’s going in Syria, whether the Lebanese, Syrians, Iranians and Russians like it or not, is much larger than Syria. They have to stand together or they’ll be picked off individually. I think, I hope, they can do so. They’ve made tremendous strides since they began openly working together last fall.

Posted by: jfl | May 11 2016 10:22 utc | 30

‘Cooperation With Al-Qaeda et al’ — They will be dealt with like the Black Plague (by the usual suspects) only after they their ‘utility’ as shock-troop vandals on the ‘uncooperative’ status-quo is exhausted.

Posted by: x | May 11 2016 11:36 utc | 32

I did have a chuckle when one of the “twits” asked Lister for clarification on the meaning of that tweet.
A Lister-lover shot back this reply:
“@BenjaminNorton @Charles_Lister for clarification Ben are you referring to one of the world’s foremost terrorism experts as a propagandist?”
Well, yeah, he is.
Lister worked at the Brookings Doha Center, and last I heard he is at the Middle East Institute.
You don’t get those gigs unless you have demonstrated an ability to sing for your supper.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | May 11 2016 12:55 utc | 34

To be fair to Lister, he did clarify his tweet, not once but twice.
Here:
“@BenjaminNorton That barely merits a response, of course not. I’ve written consistently on Nusra’s cynical exploitation of the opposition.”
and then here:
“@BenjaminNorton Nobody can deny opposition groups have cooperated with Nusra – my position has long been that needs to stop ASAP.”
Sounds plausible-deniable, so it may be possible to cut Lister some slack.
But, really, this highlights an undeniable truth: if you make your living out of publishing edited (or refereed) article then Do Not Touch Twitter With A Ten Foot Pole.
Because all you will ever do is prove to the world that you are a hapless water buffalo without a good editor – or a knowledgeable referee – standing over your shoulder, politely coughing whenever you start jotting down jibberish.
Charles, baby, get rid of that twitter account ASAP.
You’re not as smart as you think you are, and people are starting to notice that you are a twit with a twitter account.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | May 11 2016 14:47 utc | 36

Charles Lister is something else I tell ya, absolutely & completely entirely one sided; unfortunately his side is pretty wicked by the fruits born thus far.

Posted by: Au | May 11 2016 15:59 utc | 38

What a surprise i wasn’t surprised completely when he said this in his tweet.

Posted by: Bruno (@GamerOps) | May 12 2016 0:58 utc | 40

At smoothie 35,
Thanks for the explanation. It is certainly a compelling one and it is wise policy to handle the decline of US power cautiously. That said, one also has to consider that the longer the Russian campaign in Syria lasts, the greater the risk that Russia bears. When the Russian intervention started, the Syrian army was on the verge of collapse after a 5 year long exhausting war. While it has certainly been reinvigorated, I can still picture a situation one or two years from now when the Syrian army is again exhausted despite Russian assistance. There seems to be no limit to the amount of money the rich gulf Arabs are willing to spend and no limit to the supply of useful idiots they can send to replace the ones killed on a regular basis. It would not be a good situation for Russia, or anyone really, if the Syrian government collapses while Russian forces are still in Syria.
I well understand that there are many people all over the world that want Russia to fight their battles for them and that Russia must only intervene when it’s own purposes are served and for both other reason. I only point out the risk that, having entered Syria, Russia’s allies on the ground might exhaust themselves while waiting for others to see the light. Thus leaving Russia in a precarious situation.

Posted by: Lysander | May 12 2016 16:56 utc | 42

@42, Lysander

That said, one also has to consider that the longer the Russian campaign in Syria lasts, the greater the risk that Russia bears.

Very true and the risks, most likely, will grow. But here is also another factor–using neocon parlance–“mission creep” in Russia is not the same as in US and so is the manner in which risks are handled. Russian military is also well aware of limitations of Arab militaries (bar some elite units) when conducting serious combined arms operations. Arab record is not very impressive in this field.The main question is, however, this: will Russia accept partition? Who knows. I think by now Russia’s leadership is keenly aware that any treaties with US are not worth the paper they written on and that the game today reminds that of tilt labyrinth, with Russia, through her military, turning the plane in order to put the ball into the hole. US elections, Ukraine, Europe and even Pacific–all these factors are in play.

Posted by: SmoothieX12 | May 12 2016 21:12 utc | 44

@42 lysander and @44 smoothie… you might be interested in chiming in on the open thread where a few of us are having the same conversation topic..

Posted by: james | May 12 2016 22:28 utc | 46