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Torture And Exceptionalism
New poll finds majority of Americans believe torture justified after 9/11 attacks
By an almost 2-1 margin, or 59-to-31 percent, those interviewed support the CIA’s brutal methods, with the vast majority of supporters saying they produced valuable intelligence.
In general, 58 percent say the torture of suspected terrorists can be justified “often” or “sometimes.”
Is any European politician still talking about the “common values” Europe and the U.S. are alleged to have?
Do the people of the United States understand the logic of their thinking?
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Or is it just the usual “exceptionalism” Obama professes to believe in?
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Cordesman warns of the Strategic Cost of Torture, Racism, and Bigotry but he only points to Asia and the Middle East as areas where the view of the U.S. is in trouble. I believe (or maybe just hope?) that the U.S. support for torture, support only as long as the U.S. does it, will move it further away from Europe.
Torture And Exceptionalism
The poll is terrible for sure. (See previous posts.)
Amongst the US citizens I know and keep in touch with I have noted a definite shift towards tolerance of torture, particularly amongst 15-30 yr. olds. A few older ppl (60+) have not come on board.
The attitude seems to be: “Torture is bad, torture is horrific, in an ideal world it would be banned, anyway other countries torture too; but if a terrorist can give information the individual must be sacrificed for the greater good.”
This argument is nuts, and only shows how effective the propaganda and brainwashing is.
The poll itself (questions and answers given) shows that the issue is strongly tied to the ‘terrorist threat’, it is very hard to counter-argue, as moral/ethical criteria are trumped by functionalist ones, and denying the ‘terrorist threat’ is tantamount to subversion, a desire to bash the USA, a sign of belonging to conspiracy circles, etc.
These ppl feel that in dire circumstances (which they themselves cannot judge, and don’t even claim to!) torture is permissible, even necessary, as a last-ditch measure — to protect innocent Americans! They refute the functionalist, pragmatic, counter-arguments of a *low* level – torture doesn’t throw up solid info, false confessions arise, etc. – as being perhaps correct in part, but that isn’t proven, and you never know, valuable information about terror attacks has to be rooted out, investigators can check what is ‘false.’ !!
Moving further forward in discourse makes them belligerent and extremely anxious, and, huh, how would I feel if my country was being attacked!
— Propaganda rests on perceptions and feelings concerning personal issues, personal life, how ppl feel and act in their daily spheres — they would not give up their ‘ugly’ secrets to a policeman or judge but under even mild torture they would immediately.
— Punitive US impulses are very strong (see prisons, slave labor, judicial system, schools, punishment of children, abuse of elders, forced medication, etc.), torture is only a step away, in fact a kind of staple domestically, which is not acknowledged
All fascist systems, or so called neo-nazi impulses, are dependent on framing of calling up these kind of ‘personal’ issues, view-points and analysis, which are turned into national preoccupations.
In this way the State (its Republican, democratic, or benevolent Monarch, etc. trappings) dissolves, and the ppl at the top accrue more power. Ppl sometimes see this as an ex. of divide-to-rule, but that isn’t correct. What is being bartered is the power of the individual, his aspirations, desires, beliefs, plus individual comfort and competitiveness (being part of the power structure even if extremely low on the pole) in return for submission to like-minded authority. Through the ‘justified’ oppression of low-lifes, whomever they might be, at home or abroad…
Posted by: Noirette | Dec 17 2014 17:07 utc | 51
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