Hong Kong: The "Radicalize Or Fold" Alternative
The protest in Hong Kong, instigated by U.S. financed groups, were on the verge of ending in a fizzle.
Hong Kong protests dwindle after talks offer
Mass protests in Hong Kong appear to have lost steam after the leader of the Chinese territory refused to step down, instead offering dialogue.
...
The Hong Kong Federation of Students said in a statement early on Friday that they planned to join the talks with the government, focused specifically on political reforms. They reiterated that Leung step down, saying he "had lost his integrity".A wider pro-democracy group that had joined the demonstrations, Occupy Central, welcomed the talks and also insisted that Leung quit.
The offer for talks, the weather and the end of a two day holiday was the point where the protests largely died down. A few diehards kept blocking streets and buildings but the end was in sight.
Remarked a political editor of a U.S. magazine:
Blake Hounshell
@blakehounshellWhen protesters don't get at least some of what they want, they have to radicalize or fold. Key moment in Hong Kong right now.
5:36 AM - 2 Oct 2014
It seems that other people had the same thought and some idea of how to radicalize the crowd:
Hundreds of people opposed to Hong Kong's pro-democracy demonstrations converged on one of the movement's main sites Friday, prompting some of the ugliest scenes of violence yet in the past week of protests.In the early afternoon on Friday, opponents of the demonstrations moved en masse against the occupation site in the neighborhood of Mong Kok, a popular shopping district across the harbor from Hong Kong. They dismantled tents and removed the protesters' supplies. Scuffles broke out, with reports of roving street battles between protesters and their opponents.
The predictable consequence of that attack, certainly not in the interest of the government, was a revival of the protests and a hardening of the protesters position:
Student leaders called off talks with the government – offered the previous night – accusing officials of allowing violence to be used against them. It dashed the hopes of a resolution to a mass movement that has seen tens of thousands of people take to the streets of the city at its height.
So who paid the thugs, the police says some attackers were members of criminal triads, who instigated the radicalization? The government which wants to end the protests, the businesspeople who lose money due to the blockades or some three letter agency of foreign provenience?
The government now announced that it will end the protesters' blockades of public roads and buildings by Monday. As I had warned in an earlier piece:
While earlier Color Revolutions employed mostly peaceful measures the aim now is blood in the streets and lots of infrastructure damage to weaken the forces resisting the regime change attempts. Accordingly the authorities in Hong Kong should prepare for much more than just unruly demonstrations.
Posted by b on October 4, 2014 at 12:38 UTC | Permalink
« previous pageanother hk wog margaret chan of *who* serving the zwo agenda...
Posted by: denk | Oct 6 2014 13:45 utc | 102
What's wrong with Mexico? No need for a color revolution?
http://news.yahoo.com/hitmen-admit-killing-17-mexican-students-prosecutor-005040009.html
Posted by: Mina | Oct 6 2014 15:52 utc | 103
@103 Denk
Ole Margret got the job, and the recent re-appointment, on strong lobbying by China no less.
What's wrong with all the yodels from Hong Kong?
Posted by: OleImmigrant | Oct 6 2014 22:32 utc | 104
this appeared in the guardian
but they seem to have forgotten their history
Karl Marx wrote in "Genesis of the Industrial Capitalist," Volume One of "Capital": "The English East India Company, as is well known, obtained, besides the political rule in India, the exclusive monopoly of the tea-trade, as well as of the Chinese trade in general, and of the transport of goods to and from Europe. ... The monopolies of salt, opium, betel and other commodities, were inexhaustible mines of wealth."
So while the Chinese government was taking stronger and stronger measures to end the opium trade, the British were doing all they could to increase it.
Britain's East India Company would wage three wars on the people of China in order to secure the right to sell opium there. These wars for imperialist plunder and to open up new markets determined the fate of Hong Kong.
They were the world's first drug wars. Their sole purpose was to secure the importation of an addictive substance that provided a bountiful flow of profits.
Opium sales had risen gradually from 2,330 chests in 1788 to 4,968 chests in 1810. But once the British got a monopoly, they forced it up to 17,257 chests in 1835, worth millions of British pounds.
Britain's governor-general of India wrote in 1830, "We are taking measures for extending the cultivation of the poppy, with a view to a large increase in the supply of opium."
The Opium War of 1839-42 started when the Chinese imperial government confronted foreign merchant ships and demanded they surrender their illegal cargo. Capt. Elliot, superintendent of the British fleet, asked the governor-general of India for as many ships as he could spare.
He sent them to Hong Kong, where they protected the opium-carrying merchant vessels. Chinese junks sent by the emperor didn't stand a chance against the British warships.
Rowntree wrote that the British were "in a great hurry to make money out of the East, and the gunboats were found to clear the way quickly. All vestiges of compassion for mankind had been swept away by the silver stream of rupees which poured into the Calcutta Exchequer."
The wars waged on the Chinese people caused untold deaths and casualties. The British destroyed, plundered, looted and raped their way along the coast of China.
http://www.serendipity.li/wod/hongkong.html
Posted by: brian | Oct 7 2014 0:06 utc | 106
@brian #107:
I'm told that the English consider it to be "bad form" for you to point out their history to them. Everyone knows that the only evils committed by European powers worth remembering were those perpetrated by Germany and Russia. Those are the designated bad guys for eternity, as far as the Anglosphere is concerned.
@108 It's a little more subtle than that. According to British history the Chinese were being unreasonable by not opening up to two-way trade. They needed to be taught a lesson in civilized behaviour. Some Chinese leaders even resented seeing their citizens getting hooked on opium!! Hence the First Opium War and the attacks on Shanghai and Beijing.
Posted by: dh | Oct 7 2014 1:00 utc | 108
@108
thats why god made foreigners....to teach perfidious Albion its history
Posted by: brian | Oct 7 2014 1:51 utc | 109
OleImmigrant 105
the msm including guardian have highlighted [sic] several interviews with some kids
the journo prompted..
*are u afraid that such confrontations might turn violent ?*
kid
+ yes, but im ready to die for democracy+ [sic]
omfg, it send a cold chill down my spine !
since when has neoliberal material crazed hk become a hotbed for these political prodigies, lol !
how old is joshua wong again !
i wonder who teach these kids that shit, in their sunday sermons perhaps ?
well u aint gonna *die for democracy* [sic] kid, some old bastards are bravely risking YOUR lives to serve their agenda, or rather their foreign masters agenda.
where'r these kids parents anyway ?
Posted by: denk | Oct 7 2014 2:31 utc | 110
@dh #109:
I suppose that I should have guessed that the English would have their own outstanding way of whitewashing their history. And they are doing their best to help brown and yellow people to this very day.
BTW, IIRC, on the day of the Scottish independence vote, brian wrote something like, "So we have not gained our freedom." Perhaps when you use "British" in connection with English imperialism, you are being insensitive to Scots?
@Ole Immigrant: you forget to mention the little prophet Joshua along with Jimmy Lai, Anson Chan, et al.
The anthem for these shit-stirring protests should really be born-again Bette Midler's From A Distance, not Can You Hear the People Sing:
We are instruments/marching in the common plan/God is watching us!x2/From A Distance. Lol!
In the 19th century, China was eviscerated in the sequence of trader-missionary-gunboat, with Hong Kong as its first base.
Today, the `religion' being proselytized is democracy, and the same pattern seems to be in play. China has not forgotten, imo.
Karl Lagerfeld's pretentious `protest' collection for Chanel - as posted by Noirette on the previous thread - is the perfect metaphor for HK demos.
Both are largely media spectacles,hyped up by fawning media, but weak in substance; in HK's case, it is not a one-size-fits-all label of `democracy' or one-man, one-vote, that will resolve social inequities.
Once upon a time, the colonial slaves knew their place. The second-rate Anglophone FILTH (fail in London, try Hongkong) got all the cushy jobs while the compadre class got fat and the worker ants at least had an assurance of shelter and toil, even if back-breaking.
British rule wasn't necessarily better; it just provided stability at a time when China was in total chaos.
Hong Kong was relatively superior. Now the mainlanders are the ones buying up Chanel and Gucci while the Hong Kongers are left with cheap Giordano T-shirts from their sponsor Jimmy Lai, who incidentally exploited cheap mainland labor to build his clothing empire.
The hillbillies who didn't even know how to flush a generation ago, are buying up our prime properties, horrors!
They are even taking over our rightful jobs! Well, equal opportunity is one of the tenets of democracy, right?
Deal with it. Hong Kong is part of China; it doesn't ``belong'' to it, unlike it did with the British Empire.
All the hissy fits about dumping in streets or buying up the milk powder is a fig leaf for envy and inability to compete of the self-entitled.
As for Ming Chun Tang's claim that the protesters do not need foreign funding to take to the streets, shouldn't it cut both ways; there are as many (or more) pissed-off and unpaid people fighting back to maintain their livelihood. Even unsavory triad leaders have their mouths to feed.
Ming Chun seems to have jumped the script anyway. Before the counter-protesters had appeared, he declared that these people were being paid. Suspicious..much?
Posted by: Amomynous | Oct 7 2014 11:45 utc | 112
@113 Why let Scots off the hook? They were the right hand of British imperialism.
Posted by: dh | Oct 7 2014 12:21 utc | 113
Amomynous @114
Oh I left out lots of names, Long Hair, Emily, Lee Jin Yen, Ho Jin Yen, blah, blah...:-) But leaving out Joshua was intentional. For god's sake the kid is only 17, haven't even started on growing pubic hair. He ain't no leader! Being put on the pedestal was merely a publicity stunt cooked up by his Hollywood handler.
Posted by: OleImmigrant | Oct 7 2014 22:54 utc | 114
Peter Lee has an interesting analysis for what is going in Hong Kong. He sees the students in the street as just a front for some serious Hong Kong power players and finance types directly challenging Beijing. Of course, he does not dismiss the role of the NED and other international elements playing an important role.
Posted by: ToivoS | Oct 8 2014 6:33 utc | 115
the guardian etc raised a heckle when some anglo was busted at the check point, trying to smuggle hundreds of copies of bibles into the mainland.
*hell, the ccp is even afraid of the holy bible* , they hissed !
western sheeples no doubt made a hue n cry whenever they read about china's *crack down* on the christian faith. [1]
its not for nothing that fukus keep druming up china's *persecution* of the churches.
as tool of subversion, the church is even more deadly and insidious than the ngos. while the likes of ned, usaid , even msf etc have long been exposed as fukus destabilisation outfits, the churches are largely let off, clandestinelyly doing their stuff unoticed.
in sk for example christians are the most pro fukus faction.
hk churches are playing a pivotal role in this *umbrella rev*. [2]
hell rev Chu Yiu-ming is a tam veteran no less !
china has a damn good reason to curb the growth of underground churches, house churches , those are veritable *brain washinging* centres !
i know it first hand, well, second hand actually.
so many sheeples i know tell me ccp is *anti christ* hence the enemy of all good christians !
thats what they pump into the heads of the sheeples 24x7 !
those hk 17 something nerds who declared solemnly before the western msm that *im prepared to die for democracy* were prolly told that there'r seventy virgins waiting at the heavens gate forchrissake !
hey, i heard hk parents are weary about brain washing from the mainland ? [3]
brain washing , no kidding ?
[1]
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/05/china-christianity-wenzhou-zhejiang-churches
Posted by: denk | Oct 9 2014 6:25 utc | 116
@113 Why let Scots off the hook? They were the right hand of British imperialism.
Posted by: dh | Oct 7, 2014 8:21:33 AM | 115
now thats a matter of how you read it...the brits read the scots in their campaign as 'being together'...the independents knew full well the relation was master and man.
they didnt become the right hand till they lost their independence
Hong kongers are the same...they were taken over by the brits, but ended up becoming their right hand
Posted by: brian | Oct 9 2014 12:18 utc | 117
@119 In fact the Scots (who came from Ireland originally and took over from the Picts) lost their independence at the same time as the Saxons i.e when the Normans arrived. The Stewarts (stewards) were a Norman installation. With a Scottish king on the English throne the kingdoms became united.
Yes the clearances were brutal but they were done by Scottish landlords like the Macleods.
Scots thrived under imperialism. They were active in the East India Company. They opened up Canada. Scottish merchants did very well out of tobacco slavery and opium. Anyone who sees them as innocent victims should check out Jardine & Matheson.
Posted by: dh | Oct 9 2014 13:07 utc | 118
What fortuitous timing! Just as ``negotiations'' are to begin with the protesters, a financial scandal emerges around the chief executive Leung Chun-ying and his tenure with an Oz company.
Was the leak from the anti-corruption leadership of Xi Jinping? Or the Beijing faction in bed with Hong Kong's fat cats? Or the lofty-minded democrats?
The charade is like an intrigue of political clans, something out of a Shaw Brothers 1970s swordplay movie, or Louis Cha wuxia movie; it's cross, double-cross. triple-cross, etc.
The end-game is not democracy but power (and not to the people, either).
In the jiang hu, there are no good guys. But there are naifs and useful idiots.The students are the Zhang Ziyi character in Crouching Tiger: self-entitled, arrogant and headstrong. When her adventure ends, rather than face reality, she throws herself off a cliff. The Hong Kong students should do the same, like the lemmings they are.
The media portrait carefully crafted and presented is of a city with a `unique identity', `freedom-loving',`orderly and polite protesters'.
Our Warhol-esque 15 minutes of fame! They could even let it go to their heads.
But, another little history lesson for the little boys & girls of Hong Kong who don't know their heritage. Once upon a time, in feudal China, an invading army made huge noises that echoed over the hills.
It made their conquest easier,since defenders on the other side feared an army made times its actual size.
The din from the Western corporate media is huge, elevating the protests to a sonic level.
But to the Emperor far away, the sounds of `democracy' are muffled. Beijing will prevail.
Posted by: Amomynous | Oct 9 2014 14:20 utc | 119
Hmmm...This thread has staying power. Excellent posts one after another. Longivity indeed.
@117, thanks for the Counterpunch link ToivoS, but I consider Peter Lee's assessment of the situation questionable. He is articulating under the same premise of most western pundits; that is, HK still matters critically to China. In reality things have changed so much so that, 35 years after the Deng Xiaoping Reform, HK is just another built-up city within the China family, one whose citizens are viewed as contemptuous of the motherland. HK's properity bring China no dividend, and HK's collapse brings China no collaterals. If there are hidden cliques behind the teenage front that occupied Central, these entities hold no bargaining power against China any more. If HK stirs enough to pursue independence, China would simply march in with force and clean plate as called for in the Basic Law.
@118 Denk
Another brilliant post! 100% agree with your Christianity angle. In fact, what the Christian entities do is no different from the Falongong, and just as mean in tactics and as evil in essence. They have been at it for decades. But should China do something about it? This is where you and I may disagree. I am of the opinion that if Chinese as an ethnicity is so stupid as to fall for such primitive religious brainwashing and turn against their own heritage, then they would deserve what comes as a consequence. If Chinese are not strong enough to uphold their cultural heritage in the future community of humanity, then serfdom should be their destiny. Deep down, however, I hope China as a civilization would emerge victorious against the cultish conspiracy you spoke of.
@120
Agree with your assessment of the Old Scots. The Scotland of the past half century? I don't know much about. But the British Empire as a whole, true to today, has been sneaky, cold-blooded, Machiavellian, and whorishly lackey to the Imperial Zionist of the 20th century, Scots included.
Posted by: OleImmigrant | Oct 9 2014 15:24 utc | 120
OleImmigrant 122
looks like china is fucked...big time !
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/10776023/China-on-course-to-become-worlds-most-Christian-nation-within-15-years.html
just look at those sheeples, omfg. !
Posted by: denk | Oct 10 2014 16:10 utc | 121
denk@123
Bbbbbbbbut that's only according to Telegraph, a known convicted lying propagandist, no?
In this particular commentary, however, I AM afraid there might be an element of truth. Omfj! For the past 150 years Chinese lost their pride, self-esteem, and intellectuality. They grew to adore anything and everything western--big boobs are beauty, big round eyes are beauty, big noses are beauty, brownish hair (otherwise known as blond or brunette) is beauty, and so on. Therefore, since westerners are christian, they must also be christian.
My hope is, if and when Chinese do become the largest christian ethnicity, they may also come to dominate christian doctrines. May be 20 years from now, reincarnation will be central to christian dogma :). Dalai becomes a high christian priest. A blond one no less.
Posted by: OleImmigrant | Oct 12 2014 1:54 utc | 122
@OleImmigrant #124:
I hope you're joking. I'm very fond of Christianity – Lutheranism and Russian Orthodoxy, anyway – but I find the idea of Asians becoming Christians appalling. People should stick to the religion of their ancestors. The South Koreans are by far the worst offenders here. (So susceptible are they to being brainwashed with ideas from the Anglosphere, that they have a higher circumcision rate than the US.)
OleImmigrant 124
chinese yanks are often ecstatic that one of their son/daughter has *made it* to the murcun mainstream political arena.
my advice is , forget it !
they'd be exploited, abused and then discarded like a used doll. !
for the wasps and zios who run murkka, the only use for a colored person is a fall guy .
witness obama the first black prez who's now being universally reviled for merely carrying out the whites agenda. the former bush security czar harold koh was roundly despised by liberals for his draconian policies but that wasnt his idea either.
the obamas, kohs etc take the rap while the puppeteers remain in the shadow, chuckling to themselves.
hey, dont blame everything on us ,say the wasps and zios, u'r just as bad !
this is why they have their first black prez [sic], the condi, susan rices,the harold kohs , the margaret chan of who, etc etc......and the likes of gary locke. !
have u ever seen any murkkan ambassdor harrased and openly humuliated like this ?
*When Mr Locke attempted to elaborate, saying, 'how I practise my religion is not something for the American people...', Mr Wolf cut him off, raising his voice and pounding the table as he demanded a stronger stand against Beijing.* [1]
ever seen the muricun ambassador to india hounded like this for example ?
india is where a family of australian pastor was burned alive by a hindu mob some yrs back.
no way, indians are kinda like honorable whitemen now, after the japs.
how about the abassador to indonesia, where muslim mobs attacked christian churches and killed the worshipers in broad daylight...abetted by us trained military armed with us weapons ?
hell no, such special treatment is reserved for chinese. !
gary locke is appointed coz the wasps and zios enjoy watching a *chink on chink* spectacle ! [2]
i dont even want to comment on the fucking hypocrisy , not to mention chutzpath of cunts like frank wolf and his ilks, is there anything about these cunts that we dont already know yet ?
[1]
http://heresthenews.blogspot.sg/2011/03/obama-china-envoy-grilled-on-church.html
Posted by: denk | Oct 12 2014 13:59 utc | 125
When China really tallies 160 million or more Christians, the church, not the CPC, is more likely to face a major crisis.
This is one huge flock that will not answer, for instance, to the Vatican (which still has no diplomatic ties with Beijing). Church leaders in China will have a direct line to God, via the party.
When you can instant-message the Lord yourself like the Cabots of Boston, why would you want to go through some cross-dressing old geezer in Rome? God is CHINESE! (Though Mr B once fantasized that She was a Tall Black Woman).
Imagine 160 million bible-thumpers brought up with a strong dose of nationalism. Onward, Christian soldiers!
The Anglo-American imperialists foresaw the dangers ( to their plundering ways, that is) of a militant, puritan Christian Chinese kingdom; they obliged in helping to crush the Taiping Rebellion and prop up the effete Qing.
But, who knows? God's Chinese Son may actually re-incarnate. Perhaps as Joshua Wong. However, rumors are that, with the slow collapse of Occupy Central, he will soon leave for USA, to discover his inner Chelsea Manning.
Posted by: Amomymous | Oct 12 2014 15:22 utc | 126
Land Destroyer: Hong Kong's "Occupy Central" Fooling No One
China's People's Daily in an article titled, "Why is the US so keen on ‘Color Revolutions’?," states what has become abundantly obvious over the past several weeks of protesting in Hong Kong - that the protests are driven by foreign interests masquerading as a "desire for democracy." …Still no snipers. As I've said before, using snipers in Syria or the Ukraine is one thing; using them in China is quite another.The presence of such an overt accusation against the US for its role behind "Occupy Central" is in fact part of this counteraction. By understanding the subversion and accurately reporting on it for both China's audiences as well as global audiences, raises questions "Occupy Central" supporters will have to answer …
Beijing and Hong Kong's government's refusal to meet with what is increasingly exposed as an illegitimate demonstration led by compromised leaders is another sign that China will not play along with the "color revolution" model of destabilization. Rather than crack down or lend legitimacy to demonstrators by meeting with them, it appears authorities have decided instead to let the protests sit in the streets indefinitely, expending both their own resources, and the patience of the silent majority.
Demian,
Firearms are unusual items in HK, so when it is used in sniping, the ensuing investigation would be meticulous and the REAL instigator risks being EXPOSED. NED/NDI etc. wouldn't want to take such chances. On the otherhand, EVERYBODY knows there is no chance China or HK Government would resort to such tactics, since they can use firearms openly if necessary.
On another point, use of sniper to stir more chaos is based on the assumption that there is a silent majority in support of the protesters but not yet in the protest. Sniper casualties would thus cause emotion to erupt and draw these people in. In HK this time, all the anti-China/Government scums are already on the streets. US/UK knows there ain't anyone else to stir and draw from. Use of snipers would be totally futile.
By the way, I apologize for the offence you took in my Christianity remarks. Didn't mean to say all Christians are connivent. I agree about Lutherans and Eastern Orthodoxy being more purely religious and non-political. But I do think the evagelicals stinks :-)
Posted by: OleImmigrant | Oct 15 2014 17:06 utc | 128
that was quick innit ?
http://www.straitstimes.com/news/world/united-states/story/hong-kong-activist-joshua-wong-malala-obama-girls-named-times-influen
that mighty wurlitzer !
no kidding, wong could be the world's youngest nobel piss prize lauriate before u know it hehehe
Posted by: denk | Oct 16 2014 2:31 utc | 129
revolution of the rich?
'Even a Hong Kong poll showed that most of those making $10,000 a year or less opposed the protests, while support was highest among people making $100,000 a year or more'.
http://www.workers.org/articles/2014/10/07/hong-kong-protests-imperialists-support-democracy-movement/
Posted by: brian | Oct 16 2014 11:15 utc | 130
Yea, so the po-faced holy chimpanzee child Joshua Wong will get hitched?
Our young icon of demo-crazy won’t be welcome in liberal democratic Denmark though.
http://www.straitstimes.com/news/world/more-world-stories/story/denmark-mulling-make-bestiality-illegal-4-things-about-the-contr?page=26
An alternative can be a Doraemon-gets-married-to Hello-Kitty! bash in Tokyo. With Pikachu as best man. That will draw tons of fan-boys and girls in CosPlay from the mainland to Akihabara.
They will swamp the sniffy Hong Kong poseurs. Outclass them, too.
http://jingdaily.com/chinas-382-million-millennials-demand-corporate-social-responsibility/
Yea, while the airheaded Hongkie students posture about being morally superior and culturally forward , their peers – the mainland millennials – have actually evolved ahead socially.
So keep on dreaming , Hong Kong. Stay stuck in your brainwashed colonial groove about being an advanced entity from the rich peasants across the border.
9000 hooligans in Mong Kok & the fake show about peaceful, well-behaved protesters is over. Student radicals+professional protesters+ social misfits, fighting for `democracy’.
Cue Stephen Sondheim and Send In The Clowns. Or maybe the mastermind of chaos Jimmy Lai can fly in Adele. When the Fat Lady sings, it’s over. To the sound of some heads getting cracked by the police, soon.
Posted by: Amomymous | Oct 18 2014 13:05 utc | 131
The comments to this entry are closed.
@101
i used to read him before the libya debacle where he backed the war on libya.He blogs o n ,among other things, left wing films even from north korea....but he began t change with libya after 2010..It was then he blocked me for'spamming'! posting same response 2 two persons asking a similar question!
i was not very impressed!
Posted by: brian | Oct 6 2014 9:22 utc | 101