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August 24, 2014

Open Thread 2014-19

News & views ...

Posted by b on August 24, 2014 at 17:24 UTC | Permalink

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What does it take to get this lawyer disciplined for lying about the cases he is involved in? Crump abuses the public forum to spread lies. Crump was asked "And what came out of that press conference and that autopsy that you think is significant? " and his reply was a lie: http://youtu.be/7qPPsuX4HGo

Crump is the guy guilty of the whole hoodie narrative that everyone foolishly played along with for goodness sakes! Crump lied about what Zimmerman said about the hoodie and made jackasses out of millions of people. You had people wearing hoodies and even a member of Congress all thinking what Crump claimed was true. Why the hell is this man allowed to get away with lying lying this? Are so many people so gullible or intimidated by being accused of being a racist that they won't even call Crump out on his lies?  I'm sick of his lies and people that play along with them.

What do people think, wouldn't it be good to get people to contact the Florida Bar about this guy?

Posted by: Tom Murphy | Aug 24 2014 17:40 utc | 1

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Abdel-Majed-Abdel-Bary/521478631317121

He created his Facebook page yesterday? I smell a rat. Just this morning I was searching for Headsman 'John' and saw the security services knew who he was but wouldn't yet release the name. Now when I google his name i get a couple of hundred hits with his name. This news is very fishy, kinda like Lee Harvey Oswald.

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 17:42 utc | 2

A video in which the BBC interviewer accuses the Syrian government of only fighting ISIS in "the past few weeks".

"Why haven't you attacked them?" he has the gall to say - as his government and their allies sends ISIS the funds and weapons to make them dangerous. After sparking a war that has cost 200,000 Syrian lives. He then goes on to accuse the Syrian government of the gas attacks - despite all we know, just repeating the claim.

"How would you convince France, UK, and Germany that you want to fight ISIS together?" he asks - does he mean for more than for two years demanding that France and the UK stop supplying them????

Unbelievable. The ultimate slimeball. This is a media terrorist. A modern day mini-Goebbels. And the double-standards are obvious - would he ask the same of his government? But this is "the free press", right? Right.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article39485.htm

Posted by: guest77 | Aug 24 2014 17:44 utc | 3

Looking more closely at the FB seems to be a proxy account. Assholes !

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 17:48 utc | 4

facebook.. one big cesspool.. who would even bother swimming in it for anything resembling truth or fact?

Posted by: james | Aug 24 2014 18:07 utc | 5

"who would even bother swimming in it for anything resembling truth or fact?"

NSA?

Who would rely on media outlets alone for anything resembling truth or fact? Gold is where you find it.

Now maybe you have a valuable contribution on those facts you deem worthy of comment?

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 18:22 utc | 6

I use Facebook to keep up with where my friends are hanging out in Frankfurt or what my relatives in America are up to...I do not use it as a source of information and generally avoid any sort of political discussion there, that's what sites like MoA are for!

Posted by: ralphieboy | Aug 24 2014 18:40 utc | 7

ralphieboy | Aug 24, 2014 2:40:35 PM | 7

Good on you. It's a pleasure dealing with sterile self-righteousness. Now go change your underwear. You've had them on for hours.

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 18:45 utc | 8

http://www.syrianperspective.com/2014/08/syrper-exposes-foley-murder-as-spaghetti-western.html

A little more on the last subject

Posted by: jo6pac | Aug 24 2014 18:49 utc | 9

guest 77 at 3, I saw that as well. Over the top…Shaaban is heckled by Snow from Channel 4. He blames her (and > Assad, she is an advisor to the Gvmt.) for ….not fighting the Islamist terrorists!

Accused for not having acted! (Now that a Nov Caliphate is taking shape.) Snow forcibly jams in all the memes “killing own ppl”, “Gvmt. uses chem weapons and barrel bombs on Syrians”, “where are the hostages?”, “why do you support Hamas?” and on and on.. and blames her, > Assad Gov., for not murdering /containing Black Flag Jihadist terrorists!

Here another example:

BBC Hard Talk, Yevgeny Shevchuk, facing Steven Shackur, 3 mins. - re. Transnistria

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p023vtfd

Can it really be that Brits watch this and adhere? I haven’t been to GB for 10 years and my last visit was brief.

Posted by: Noirette | Aug 24 2014 18:52 utc | 10

Here's pics of John McCain meeting with Bağdadi’.
http://odatv.com/n.php?n=bu-yazi-okunmadan-isid--abd-baglantisi-anlasilamaz-1908141200

Posted by: okie farmer | Aug 24 2014 19:07 utc | 11

How pathetic to be one of these attack dogs: yap, yap, yap all day long. What a waste of human life and consciousness.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 24 2014 19:22 utc | 12

Ben,

FB is where I go to find out what my friends are up to MoA is where I come to argue with assholes.

Posted by: ralphieboy | Aug 24 2014 19:25 utc | 13

More info on the US attack on Syria that didn't happen:

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Kerry-s-Unenviable-Record-by-Ray-McGovern-Assad_Lying_Neocons_Russia-140721-721.html
http://consortiumnews.com/2013/09/14/how-war-on-syria-lost-its-way/

Israel wanted a war against Assad as well. I guess they now have a different view with ISIS gaining strength in Iraq & Syria. ISIS is gaining popularity as a result of Israel's attacks on the Gaza strip.

Ray McGovern is a former CIA analyst.

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 24 2014 19:31 utc | 14

Interesting take on the attack on CIA facility in Benghazi, Libya.
http://consortiumnews.com/2012/11/04/the-why-behind-the-benghazi-attack/

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 24 2014 19:39 utc | 15

"where I come to argue with assholes."

I have no problem with argument if there is a point worthy of it. I just don't like argument for it's own sake. Just for the record, this place is Eden-like compared to the swamps of John Cole and Bob Cesca

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 19:50 utc | 16

A caldera collapse would be catastrophic, and life-altering for much of the planet. It could just fizzle, but many in the scientific community are alert.

http://volcanocafe.wordpress.com/2014/08/24/bardabunga-eruption-has-started-maybe-not/

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 20:27 utc | 17

Posted re: Bardarbunga on the previous Open Thread, but that thread is a bit stale. Here's a very good article at Ars Technica about the (scary!) issues:

Is a different Icelandic volcano about to act up?

The article is from last week, so obviously the question has been answered. Caldera collapse would be a spectacular show, but the expected alternative - a slow, smoldering fissure emitting hydrogen fluoride and hydrogen sulfide for many months - would be quite bad also.

Posted by: Dr. Wellington Yueh | Aug 24 2014 21:35 utc | 18

By the way, Ray McGovern never got back to me. Curiously, Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, which appears to have many members I respect, has no website or contact info.

Again, McGovern based his evidence for what happened at the La Belle disco on one piece of cryptic evidence:

Intercepted messages between Tripoli and agents in Europe made it clear that Libya was behind the attack. Here’s an excerpt: "At 1:30 in the morning one of the acts was carried out with success, without leaving a trace behind."

Intelligence professionals know never to do that. As we now know, that evidence was faked.

I'm not sure why he muddied the good cause of preventing direct conflict with Russia with spreading disinformation about past events.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 24 2014 21:53 utc | 19

"I'm not sure why he muddied the good cause of preventing direct conflict with Russia with spreading disinformation about past events."

Perhaps haste in the rush to publish ahead of prior restraint. We really can't predict what will happen in the next 24 hours, can we?

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 22:07 utc | 20

Dr. Wellington Yueh | Aug 24, 2014 5:35:52 PM | 18


Even scarier,from my link...

“The most surprising sign though is that this rifting fissure is not following a single fissure swarm. This is totally unsuspected behavior that nobody has even guessed at in their most feverish fantasies. The initial intrusion charged straight out of the Bárðarbunga fissure swam, passed barren land in between fissure swarms and connected with the Grimsvötn northern fissure swarm, followed that downstream and then once again changed trajectory and entered the fissure swarm of Askja.

This means that potentially the intrusion might be feeding on the 3 largest Icelandic volcanoes if the fissure evolves a bit more. If this actually happens all bets are off and we would be most likely talking about a rifting fissure eruption with explosive components.

If the intrusion continues to move forward in this direction it will enter the caldera of Askja in 4 days. Problem here is that Askja is known to have pockets of rhyolitic explosive magma, and if those pockets suddenly reheat from the new hot magma things could get interesting fast.”

Posted by: Ben Franklin | Aug 24 2014 22:26 utc | 21

@Ben Franklin:

No. Like many people who write a lot, these parts are all boilerplate, and if one googles around one can find much the same construction with only minor word changes used repeatedly by both McGovern and his source going back a number of years.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 24 2014 22:47 utc | 22

@Ben #21:

Was reading that thread yesterday. Sounds like they updated, so I'll go back and review. Thanks!

Posted by: Dr. Wellington Yueh | Aug 24 2014 23:07 utc | 23

Hope the volcanic eruption in Iceland is 'normal'.

I think that the CIA is really two operations, both incompetent, and that we all suffer from the incompetence of both. One tries to gather intelligence and one directs the 'secret' wars of the USA. The intelligence gathering operation is the public face of the underground monster, the unloved stepchild by those who administer it, kept on as a false front for the 'real', monstrous, all-war-all-the-time CIA whose magma intrusions have been spreading underground. I think Ray McGovern and the rest on the 'intelligence' side know little more than the rest of us about the workings of the monster below.

They hope that the real CIA's eruptions worldwide remain 'normal'. We've all been watching our seismographs in alarm and disbelief since the CIA's Manchurian Candidate took office in 2009.

Posted by: john francis lee | Aug 24 2014 23:09 utc | 24

@ 8 Ben Franklin

Oh please, I use facebook to post pics of my grandkids for friends and relatives, and that's it.

Can't imagine how you would term that self-righteous.

Posted by: sleepy | Aug 25 2014 0:19 utc | 25

@Noirette: Its a good trick I guess. Send a terror army to attack a country, and then when "blowback" comes, blame the guy you attacked for not doing enough to stop it.

Really, its the richest thing I've ever heard.

Posted by: guest77 | Aug 25 2014 0:56 utc | 26

There was a shrill German fellow who claimed to be a friend of b posting here vociferously against the Donbass, w. links to an alleged anarchist site; now Petri Krohn on his Facebook page has uncovered some interesting facts about this allegedly impartial group--

English/Spanish) #antifa #soros #donetsk Fake antifascist for a fake revolution//// Some days ago I told you that there are some groups of so-called "anarchists" working for Poroshenko. Specially the Autonomous Workers Union (here http://avtonomia.net/2014/02/19/zayavlenie-ast-kiev-o-situatsii-v-ukraine/) that is an "anarchist" group-puppet of Soros Foundation. Today I read that there is a "anti-fascist" battalion pro-maidan and involved in the war against the Ukrainian people. Behind this kind of groups are obviously the long hand of Soros, the western secret services and other CIA controlled western NGO's. Any real anti-fascist of anarchist would support the criminal regime of Poroshenko and the massacre of civilians and political oponents in Ukraine. They are fake antifascists like Femen are fake feminists or Pussy Riots are fake punks. All of them are made in the factory of illusions and monsters of Uncle Sam like Bin Laden, Boko Haram, ISIS or Santa Claus. More information about the fake "antifascist" that are participating in the massacres of Eastern Ukraine here: http://slobodari.wordpress.com/2014/08/13/antiimperijalisticka-akcija/

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | Aug 25 2014 1:23 utc | 27

Iran intercepts "Israeli" drone near Natanz (that's a flying drone - not Bibi).
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/world/2014-08/24/c_133580685.htm

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25 2014 1:30 utc | 28

Interesting: the pro-junta Kyiv post has published an article in which pro-junta Ukie mercenaries are quoted as saying that the junta and the Ukie media lies. The article also gives the impression that the war is not going so well for the Ukraine, in a way that Anglophone outlets like the NY Times and the Guardian are not yet doing.

With disillusionment and anger at the Ukrainian government and army leadership rising, it is a question how long volunteers like Semenchenko and his men will continue fighting - or rather, just where they think that fight should be taking place.

Glyadelov and his fellow photographers decided to disregard principles of wartime secrets or keeping up national morale in order to speak out about what they are witnessing: that more and more volunteer soldiers, tired of the government’s inability to support them, are talking about finishing the war in the east and then turning their guns on Kyiv.

The Saker talks about one side or the other reaching its breaking point. This Kyiv Post article gives the impression that junta forces are reaching theirs.

In related news, the civilian and military leaders of the Donetsk People's Republic gave a press conference today. (Unfortunately, there are no English subtitles.) The new head of the DPR government is pretty charismatic, and he speaks Russian with a Ukrainian accent. In the press conference, he kept on saying how he is from Donbass, like his forefathers, and he is defending his land.

So I think it's pretty clear now why the Russian leadership of the DPR and LPR was removed. This was done to forge the Novorossiyan state, with its own distinct national identity. It's hard to do that if the leadership is from Moscow.

By the way, my impression is that Novorossiyans are now using "Ukrainians" and "fascists" as pretty much synonymous terms. At the very least, "Ukrainian" signifies the enemy. I think this is further evidence that there is virtually no possibility of the Ukraine not breaking apart. The Western media really should catch up with this development.

As a recent post by Colonel Cassad indicates, Russians and Novorossians have reconciled themselves to the fact that there is going to be a rabidly Russophobic rump Ukraine/Banderastan for the foreseeable future.

Posted by: Demian | Aug 25 2014 1:56 utc | 29

Interesting: the pro-junta Kyiv post has published an article in which pro-junta Ukie mercenaries are quoted as saying that the junta and the Ukie media lies. The article also gives the impression that the war is not going so well for the Ukraine, in a way that Anglophone outlets like the NY Times and the Guardian are not yet doing.

With disillusionment and anger at the Ukrainian government and army leadership rising, it is a question how long volunteers like Semenchenko and his men will continue fighting - or rather, just where they think that fight should be taking place.

Glyadelov and his fellow photographers decided to disregard principles of wartime secrets or keeping up national morale in order to speak out about what they are witnessing: that more and more volunteer soldiers, tired of the government’s inability to support them, are talking about finishing the war in the east and then turning their guns on Kyiv.

The Saker talks about one side or the other reaching its breaking point. This Kyiv Post article gives the impression that junta forces are reaching theirs.

In related news, the civilian and military leaders of Novorossiya gave a press conference today. (Unfortunately, there are no English subtitles.) The new head of the Donbass People's Republic government is pretty charismatic, and he speaks Russian with a Ukrainian accent. In the press conference, he kept on saying how he is from Donbass, like his forefathers, and he is defending his land.

So I think it's pretty clear now why the Russian leadership of the DPR and LPR was removed. This was done to forge the Novorossiyan state, with its own distinct national identity. It's hard to do that if the leadership is from Moscow.

By the way, my impression is that Novorossiyans are now using "Ukrainians" and "fascists" as pretty much synonymous terms. At the very least, "Ukrainian" signifies the enemy. I think this is further evidence that there is virtually no possibility of the Ukraine not breaking apart. The Western media really should catch up with this development.

As a recent post by Colonel Cassad indicates, Russians and Novorossiyans have reconciled themselves to the fact that there is going to be a rabidly Russophobic rump Ukraine/Banderastan for the foreseeable future.

Sorry that I have not given any links. When I did, the comment was blocked.

Posted by: Demian | Aug 25 2014 2:01 utc | 30

@29 demian - thanks for the overview on all that... here is the kiev post article mentioned in your post..

Posted by: james | Aug 25 2014 2:38 utc | 31

Demian@29

Thanks for the latest information.

Without any air power, scavenged weapons, a small Area of Operation and too few soldiers, I am shocked the Ukrainian rebels are fighting back so effectively. This has to be due covert Russian support from intelligence to supplies and soldiers fighting for their homes and families. On the other hand the Ukrainian conscript army’s heart isn’t into fighting a civil war yet and their leadership is incompetent.

I’m having a hard time dealing with the US government, the media and NATO flat out lying. The western media’s maps show Donetsk and Lugansk encircled. This is not academic. Russia cannot let these cities fall. The slightest mistake and the Russian Federation and NATO will be in a shooting war which will inevitably escalate to a nuclear exchange.

It is insane not to have negotiated an end to the fighting by now.

Posted by: VietnamVet | Aug 25 2014 3:36 utc | 32

Russian Spring

08/24/2014-20:22

Summary from the Army of South-East:

The situation was essentially unchanged. The opponent avoided large scale operations preoccupied by defense activities.
In Lugansk region the punitive troops retained occupied positions and were regrouping.

The enemy artillery continued to destroy residential quarters, other civil objects in Donetsk, Lugansk, and Ilovaysk.
New Olenovka (?) caldron entrapped units of battalions “Azov” and “Dnepr”, which are being eliminated. The combatants gained foothold in north-east part of settlement Olevonka and destroyed up to eight tanks, up to nineteen APCs and a mortar battery.

Those opponent troops blocked south-east of Donetsk (Voykovskiy, Kuteynikovo, Blagodatnoye, Alekseevskoye, Uspenka, Ul`yanovskoye) launched incoherent and unsuccessful attacks to break free. They abandoned most of block-posts and bases.

The artillery units of Donetsk army destroyed up to eighteen units of military hardware. Up to hundred eighty punitive troops were killed or wounded.

Near settlement Mikhailovka thirty fully demoralized Ukrainian soldiers surrendered.


Posted by: Fete | Aug 25 2014 4:05 utc | 33

@VietnamVet

There's more to it than that.

http://links.org.au/node/4008 Check out this Boris Kagarlitsky piece that Okie Farmer posted

Posted by: Crest | Aug 25 2014 4:07 utc | 34

@VietnamVet #31:

It is insane not to have negotiated an end to the fighting by now.

As I've said before, I hardly know anything about military matters. I have never watched a war as closely as I have the war in the former Ukraine. It is very easy to do that on the Internet if you know Russian. It's better than having Dan Rather tell you in your living room how the Vietnam war is going lol.

My response to your statement is that in a civil war, it is not possible to have a negotiated solution. Neither side is willing to compromise. The only way the conflict can end is by one side defeating the other, militarily.

A Ukrainian officer said in an interview I brought up before that somebody does not want this war to end. He clearly meant the US government. If Kiev can't win this war, the US wants chaos to reign there. See The Reverse Brzezinski: The Ultimate Eurasian Dilemma.

The US sought to capitalize off of the chaos present in Syria and Ukraine in order to create ‘black holes’ to suck in Iran and Russia. Scientifically speaking, a black hole is formed from a collapsed star, so the metaphor can quickly be transplanted to geopolitics when one looks at Balkanized chaos being formed from a collapsed state (or portions thereof). Syria has not collapsed, but parts of the country remain beyond the control of the legitimate government. It is Iraq that is approaching near-failed state status and whose problems can pose a dangerous threat to Iran. Likewise, Ukraine itself is a pseudo-failed state, and the events that have transpired there are of significant danger to Russia. In both cases, what has occurred is that black holes are forming in parts of Syria, most of Iraq, and Ukraine, and the gravitational pull of the destabilization and chaos there can quite easily suck in Iran and Russia.

Posted by: Demian | Aug 25 2014 4:12 utc | 35

@13 "FB is where I go to find out what my friends are up to MoA is where I come to argue with assholes." And is it where they come to argue with you?

Posted by: Snake Arbusto | Aug 25 2014 8:00 utc | 36

The situation in eastern Ukraine right now remains extremely complicated. However, there seems to be some changes recently that might just be pointing to what some call a Clauswitzian turning point. A brief summary might be useful.

Here is one firm fact that both the Ukies and Donbas militias accept. Beginning at least in early July the UA and its associated right sector national guard units launched a major offensive operation to eliminate the militias who controlled most of the Donetz and Lughansk oblasts. Both sides agree that the militias had to retreat from the cities of Slovyansk and Kramatorsk. This then focused the UA offensives against the cities of Donetsk and Lughansk. Both sides agree that that is where the major fighting has subsequently occurred. Since mid June there has been intense combat around those cities as well as along the Russian border that is obviously the life line for the militias.

Agreement has stopped at this point. The Ukie regime has been claiming major victories over this entire front over the last six weeks. What is questionable about those claims is that they keep on announcing progress against one city or another, but then repeat the claim a few weeks later. This is prima facia evidence that the offensive has bogged down. They publish maps showing that they still control regions along the Lughansk oblast-Russian border where it was cleary shown that the troops controlling those regions abandoned their heavy weapons and retreated into Russia. These were the remnant of the troops trapped in what the militias called the 'cauldron'. The loss of this territory has not been acknowledged by the Ukies and they still claim to control that territory even though all of the troops have fled.

The offensives around Donetsk and Lughansk have not really resulted in any changes in the last six weeks. The militias claim that though they do not have enough troops to drive the Ukies out, they do claim that they are inflicting serious losses on the attacking Ukie forces. The Guardian today somehow inadvertently supported that claim. In their article on the Independence day celebration in Kiev today they interviewed an officer of one of the Aidar units: "He said of their group of around 100 fighters, only 34 had returned, of the others, 15 had died and the rest were injured." Now for one unit to lose 66%of their fighters has to be considered some serious losses. Also this group left the front lines on their own to make a presence in Kiev. They were not authorized by the UA.

This is a sign of lack of central control over the troops fighting in Donbas. Units seem to be free to leave the battlefield on their own volition. Of course, the Aidar battalion is an all volunteer group composed of Maidan square activists. However, these were the most motivated troops for this whole invasion of Donbas. If they are leaving, what does it say about the morale of the conscripts in the UA who didn't want to be there in the first place?

Coming back to my first paragraph, the Clauswitsian point is that point when an offensive losses its energy and the defense assumes the upper hand. What often happens at that transition is the attacking forces mus withdraw. Just maybe, we are now witnessing such a transition. Recent reports of militia recon and sabotage activity well to the rear of the UA army positions could well turn such a reversal into wild panicked retreat by the Ukies back into western Ukraine.

Posted by: ToivoS | Aug 25 2014 8:47 utc | 37

You seem very concerned about the Yinon plan. If it is 30 years old, as you concede, why has it taken Israel so long to make any visible progress towards its achievement?
Posted by: Malooga | Aug 4, 2014 8:22:19 AM | 48

Well, actually the intervening 30 years have been marked by pretty much continuous progress in this direction.

Takis Fotopoulos, who is not cited around here as much as he might be, makes this point in a recent column; explicit reference is to the goal of fully integrating the Arab world in global capitalism, but is it coincidence that implementation of the Yinon plan serves both global capitalist & Israeli goals?

(TE stands for Transnational Elite)--

http://www.inclusivedemocracy.org/journal/vol10/vol10_no1-2_Iraq_destruction_Transnational_Elite_and_ISIS.html

This campaign, which began in 1991 with the Gulf War, went on throughout the 1990s with a ruinous embargo and continuous bombardments and was followed by the 2003 invasion that destroyed the country's infrastructure and turned a nation, which had made enviable achievements in meeting the basic needs of its people, back at least 100 years, not to mention, of course, the carnage. The main political weapon used by the TE (led by the American elite playing the role of gauleiter after the invasion) to reach its goal was the de-Ba'athification of the regime. The principal architects of this policy were two well known American-Zionists, Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith, who played a key role in the destruction of the Iraqi people... The goal was the elimination of any Ba’athist trace from the new client regime, which would, eventually, replace the occupation authorities.

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | Aug 25 2014 9:34 utc | 38

Coming back to my first paragraph, the Clauswitsian point is that point when an offensive losses its energy and the defense assumes the upper hand.

It's been fashionable lately, I've noticed, to reference Clausewitz as often as possible. Colonel Mustard's been the torch-bearer of this latest trend, and whereas Carl had some astute observations, his word is not the end all be all. War is not an absolute physical law, the workings of which are beyond reproach and dispute. It's more like a virus or a bacteria, ever-changing and morphing in its quest to remain relevant. Applying Clausewitz's postulates to today's generation of warfare isn't very useful. Some of it may apply, but choosing what does and doesn't will only leave you more flummoxed in the end. I suspect this is why Mustard keeps getting it wrong and why he no longer walks in "those" circles.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25 2014 10:31 utc | 39

The only way the conflict can end is by one side defeating the other, militarily.

That's a good point, and it will serve as the pretext for this Ukrainian conflict to rage on for approximately a decade. If it doesn't, it's not truly a civil war, but rather a fabricated conflict that, despite all intentions to turn it into a civil war, there was just not enough organic resistance to kick-start it.

I pay little attention to the day to day specifics and instead keep my eye on the curve. If you get bogged down into day to day battle minutia you end up losing sight of the forest for the trees at which point you're lost. Those who's purpose it is to obfuscate know this and lead you down that path deep into wilderness where you lose your bearings and then your perspective is all their's.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25 2014 10:40 utc | 40

@james (Aug 24, 2014 10:38:04 PM | 30):

Well, it looks like the Kyiv Post pulled the story. When I followed your link, here's what I got:


"Page not found. Sorry, but the requested page could not be found."

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | Aug 25 2014 11:01 utc | 41

Whoops! Never mind. I found the problem. There was an extra '/' at the end of the link. If you strip it off, the URL is:

http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/abandoned-donbas-battalion-fights-on-361886.html

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | Aug 25 2014 11:03 utc | 42

This just in from The Telegraph: Foley murder video 'may have been staged'.

Money quote: "The video of James Foley’s execution may have been staged, with the actual murder taking place off-camera, it has emerged."

If the "actual" murder took place off-camera, how do they know it took place at all? What a joke! Looks like yet another failed false-flag.

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | Aug 25 2014 12:29 utc | 43

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | Aug 25, 2014 5:34:10 AM | 37

The Yinon Plan presumable is same as Neocon/Netanyahu A clean break - securing the realm

Israel can shape its strategic environment, in cooperation with Turkey and Jordan, by weakening, containing, and even rolling back Syria. This effort can focus on removing Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq — an important Israeli strategic objective in its own right — as a means of foiling Syria’s regional ambitions.[1] Since Iraq's future could affect the strategic balance in the Middle East profoundly, it would be understandable that Israel has an interest in supporting the Hashemites in their efforts to redefine Iraq,including such measures as: visiting Jordan as the first official state visit, even before a visit to the United States, of the new Netanyahu government; supporting King Hussein by providing him with some tangible security measures to protect his regime against Syrian subversion; encouraging—through influence in the U.S. business community—investment in Jordan to structurally shift Jordan’s economy away from dependence on Iraq; and diverting Syria’s attention by using Lebanese opposition elements to destabilize Syrian control of Lebanon. .. Were the Hashemites to control Iraq, they could use their influence over Najf to help Israel wean the south Lebanese Shia away from Hizballah, Iran, and Syria. Shia retain strong ties to the Hashemites: the Shia venerate foremost the Prophet’s family, the direct descendants of which—and in whose veins the blood of the Prophet flows—is King Hussein.[1]

Of course it did not turn out that way.

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 12:38 utc | 44

@Vietnam Vet #31

You said: "Without any air power, scavenged weapons, a small Area of Operation and too few soldiers, I am shocked the Ukrainian rebels are fighting back so effectively. "

The NovoRussians don't have air power - but it seems clear they have effective anti-air capabilities and thus have neutralized the junta's air power.

As for weapons - there are all sorts of weapons all over the Ukraine. I would not be surprised if covert assistance was there in the form of ammunition and supplies, but equally it is possible that the heavy weapons are actually "liberated". For one thing, there has been no mention to date of heavy bombardment by the NovoRussians - only very strategic use in specific situations.

The possibility of the NovoRussians being a core of experienced fighters (from Afghanistan and Chechnya) vs. a large number of neophyte junta troops - that would also explain the relative combat effectiveness.

Posted by: c1ue | Aug 25 2014 13:15 utc | 45

@Cold N. Holefield #39:

this Ukrainian conflict to rage on for approximately a decade.

That assumes that the Ukrainian state will continue to exist for a decade. How the junta is going to keep its people from freezing in the winter is still unresolved.

As for the war, I think that it is safe to assume that Ukrainian military commanders will continue to be incompetent indefinitely, simply because the junta does not trust anyone who is not a rabid Ukrainian nationalist fanatic. Thus, I don't see any reason for thinking that the current ratio of casualties (not counting civilians), which appears to be about 10:1 in Novorossiya's favor, will not continue for the duration of the war. How long are Ukrainians going to put up with this high rate of death of their men? As the Kyiv Post article which has been referred to in this thread indicates, even pro-junta Ukrainians are becoming aware that the war is not going well for them.

How long are people going to be willing to die for a fantasy (that there are such things as a Ukrainian nation and a Ukrainian people)? One purpose of this war, from a Russian/Novorossyan point of view, is to weaken Ukrainian fascism, by demonstrating to the Ukrainians that the Ukrainian state is a failure.

As if you needed a civil war to do that. But Ukrainians are slow learners, especially after they drunk the virulently nationalistic Kool Aid that the USG served to them.

Posted by: Demian | Aug 25 2014 13:20 utc | 46

One purpose of this war, from a Russian/Novorossyan point of view, is to weaken Ukrainian fascism, by demonstrating to the Ukrainians that the Ukrainian state is a failure.

This trope is getting old. The precept that all non-Russian slavs who aspire to state sovereignty are Fascists is absurd. Fascism is a canard. Putin is as Fascist if not more so than the newly-formed government in Ukraine.

That newly-formed government in Ukraine will change and morph significantly over time, especially if the turmoil in the East continues indefinitely. You can't possibly believe Ukraine will genuflect to Russia now after all that's happened. It's not going to happen, and I don't even think that's Putin's intention. I think it's progressing just as he planned.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25 2014 13:34 utc | 47

The NovoRussians don't have air power - but it seems clear they have effective anti-air capabilities and thus have neutralized the junta's air power.

Not to mention also neutralizing any international commercial air travel as well on their way to obtaining 3rd World status for Ukraine. Such is the way of Obscurantists.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25 2014 13:37 utc | 48

Posted by: c1ue | Aug 25, 2014 9:15:09 AM | 44

I wonder which strategic genius came up with the idea to try to cut the rebels off the Russian border along a small stretch of the border without border incidents.
But the strategy is anybody's guess. Part of it might have been to destroy Achmetov's assets, disrupt Donbass/Rostov economy, Russian arms trade, pour refugees into Russia, destabilize Russia, part of it might have been to get rid of right wing radicals.

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 13:47 utc | 49

@46&48 "I wonder which strategic genius came up with the idea to try to cut the rebels off the Russian border along a small stretch of the border without border incidents."

Putin of course. He factored in Ukrainian stupidity. It's all part of his evil plan.

Posted by: dh | Aug 25 2014 13:59 utc | 50

Posted by: ToivoS | Aug 25, 2014 4:47:43 AM | 36

What a load of crap!
Especially this bit...
This is a sign of lack of central control over the troops fighting in Donbas. Units seem to be free to leave the battlefield on their own volition.

One doesn't need to be a military genius to deduce what's going wrong with Kiev's 'strategy' (LOL). Kiev's problem is THE 'central control' ... from Washington. Try to remember that US strategy is ALWAYS to avoid confrontation with armed opponents and focus on killing, maiming and displacing civilians - it's what weak-as-piss & twice-as yellow cowards do. The Kiev junta, being a US construct, is clearly so incompetent AND gullible (in that it clearly believes all the Superpower horseshit about the US) that. having no ideas of its own will do any stupid thing Washington advises.

Hence, the junta is setting up artillery positions to vandalise civilian & residential infrastructure, from unprotected positions, without sufficient manpower to protect its stand-off batteries. There are lots of ways to paint a target on your back but this is the most effective if you're a dedicated ship of fools - which the US Military, and anyone who takes its advice, surely is.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25 2014 14:13 utc | 51

I know it's unkind, but Ukraine is just a 'bigger, new, improved' rehash of the Georgia fiasco, a few years ago. Georgia was a joint US-"Israeli" SNAFU and Ukraine will go the same way for the same reasons - arrant stupidity and wishful thinking in Washington & Kiev.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25 2014 14:27 utc | 52

I didn't spot any high ranking members of the International Community at the Independence Day Parade in Kiev. A visit from Victoria Nuland would have done wonders for morale.

Posted by: dh | Aug 25 2014 14:43 utc | 53

@52 dh... i'd heard cold holefield put in an appearance in the parade in between posting his moa inanities..

Posted by: james | Aug 25 2014 15:09 utc | 54

ISIS-LINKED BOMB THREAT AGAINST SONY EXECUTIVE DIVERTS SAN DIEGO-BOUND PLANE

American Airlines diverted its flight 362 from Dallas to San Diego, landing in Phoenix after a group claiming ties to the terrorist group ISIS tweeted a threat stating explosives were on board.

The tweet from the group calling itself Lizard Squad referenced Sony Online Entertainment President John Smedley, who was on board. Earlier today, Lizard Squad hackers reportedly took down Sony Playstation’s network after tweeting that the group had planted the ISIS flag on Sony’s servers.

The tweet was sent with the hashtag #ISIS #jihad.

The hackers also posted a tweet to Smedley’s Twitter account displaying video of the World Trade towers being hit by planes during the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks in New York with the hashtag #PrayForFlight362.

And ISIS attack the Sony PlayStation Network, too!!!

ISIS is like TOTALLY EVIL, dude!!!Attacking gamers!!!Not cool, bra!!

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 25 2014 15:22 utc | 55

@31
"Without any air power, scavenged weapons, a small Area of Operation and too few soldiers, I am shocked the Ukrainian rebels are fighting back so effectively."

Not unlike the NLF (VietCong) situation in the mid-sixties is it?

At MRzine there is an excellent article by Marta Harnecker:

“..... we need a new culture on the left: a pluralist and tolerant culture that puts first what unites us and leaves as secondary what divides us; that promotes a unity based on values such as solidarity, humanism, respect for differences, defense of nature, rejection of the desire for profit and the laws of the market as guiding principles for human activity.
A left that understands that radicalism is not about raising the most radical slogans nor about taking the most radical actions, which only a few follow because the majority are scared off by them. Instead, it is about being capable of creating spaces for coming together and for struggle that bring in broader sectors, because realizing that there are many of us in the same struggle is what makes us strong and radicalizes us.
A left that understands that we have to win hegemony, that is, that we have to convince rather than impose.
A left that understands that what we do together in the future is more important than what we may have done in the past.”
http://mrzine.monthlyreview.org/2014/harnecker240814.html

Making a new society might be more amusing than "arguing with assholes."

dh @52 That is shocking news, I'm surprised that Joe Biden wasn't there, and Nick Clegg too plus BHL. Did the Israeli Embassy send a diplomat with braids and an embroidered blouse?

Posted by: bevin | Aug 25 2014 15:31 utc | 56

Posted by: ToivoS | Aug 25, 2014 4:47:43 AM | 36

What a load of crap!
Especially this bit...
This is a sign of lack of central control over the troops fighting in Donbas. Units seem to be free to leave the battlefield on their own volition.

One doesn't need to be a military genius to deduce what's going wrong with Kiev's 'strategy' (LOL). Kiev's problem is THE 'central control' ... from Washington. Try to remember that US strategy is ALWAYS to avoid confrontation with armed opponents and focus on killing, maiming and displacing civilians - it's what weak-as-piss & twice-as yellow cowards do.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25, 2014 10:13:18 AM | 50

HW you are contradicting yourself somewhat (not about that "load of crap" - that's a given, a feature not a bug - the ref to "Clausewitz" is a nice 'tell' )

One the one hand you say "US strategy is ALWAYS to avoid confrontation with armed opponents and focus on killing, maiming and displacing civilians - it's what weak-as-piss & twice-as yellow cowards do."

On the other you say

I know it's unkind, but Ukraine is just a 'bigger, new, improved' rehash of the Georgia fiasco, a few years ago. Georgia was a joint US-"Israeli" SNAFU and Ukraine will go the same way for the same reasons - arrant stupidity and wishful thinking in Washington & Kiev.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25, 2014 10:27:50 AM | 51

given that you identify the US aim as always "US strategy is ALWAYS to avoid confrontation with armed opponents and focus on killing, maiming and displacing civilian" why then go on to essentially "invent" a seemingly "reasonable explanation" for all of this when you later claim "Georgia was a joint US-"Israeli" SNAFU and Ukraine will go the same way for the same reasons - arrant stupidity and wishful thinking in Washington & Kiev."?

If the strategy is always to kill civilians etc, that why claim the the game in Georgia was a failure of sorts, a "SNAFU"? US-Israeli SNAFU? That presumes that the end-game was control of Georgia with a roadmap of "Georgia in NATO."

(similarly many here also tend to presume an end-game of "Ukraine in NATO")

Lots of civilians were killed in Georgia, and are being killed right now in Ukie-land, so why the presumption that there is any "arrant stupidity" or "wishful thinking" involved? It may seem stupid to you but if the strategy is always to avoid conflict with able opponents and kill civilians (through proxies), while keeping up a front that US-Israel Mil are not at all involved, then both Georgia and Ukie-land are successful ops.

They cost the Empire little in resources and, depending on how one chooses to view it (are there are many different ways to do so) the return-on-investment is both potentially, and imo currently, quite substantial.

After all if the aim/strategy is to degrade economic/cultural links between Europe and Russia and create a frontline in East Europe, using Ukie-land fascism as a tactic, (which it clearly Iis ;) then things are going quite well for the empire, imo.

Posted by: JFC | Aug 25 2014 15:37 utc | 57

"Newsweek: Syria released ISIS prisoners in 2011"
Weblink:
http://www.newsweek.com/how-syrias-assad-helped-forge-isis-255631

"New York Post: Syria helped to foment trouble in Iraq during the US occupation".
Weblink: ??????

According to western diplomats syria has helped the insurgents in Iraq to make life extra difficult for the US troops in Iraq. It was meant to keep the US from invading/attacking Syria as well.

Keep in mind: In the fall of 2001 during the invasion of Afghanistan, the US drew up a list of 7 countries that had to undergo "regime change". Iraq, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Sudan, Somalia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RC1Mepk_Sw
http://www.globalresearch.ca/we-re-going-to-take-out-7-countries-in-5-years-iraq-syria-lebanon-libya-somalia-sudan-iran/5166

Including Afghanistan the total was 8 countries.

No wonder, Syria was very eager to cause more "unrest" in Iraq.

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 25 2014 15:58 utc | 58

GOOGLE the words "Wesley Clark, seven countries in five years."

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 25 2014 16:00 utc | 59

Posted by: JFC | Aug 25, 2014 11:37:53 AM | 56

If you'd care to shorten the comment by eliminating the repetition, avoid putting words in my mouth, and simplify
given that you identify the US aim as always "US strategy is ALWAYS to avoid confrontation with armed opponents and focus on killing, maiming and displacing civilian" why then go on to essentially "invent" a seemingly "reasonable explanation" for all of this when you later claim "Georgia was a joint US-"Israeli" SNAFU and Ukraine will go the same way for the same reasons - arrant stupidity and wishful thinking in Washington & Kiev."?

I'd be pleased to respond.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Aug 25 2014 16:25 utc | 60

Interesting -- the headlines began yesterday saying that Libya's capital was under fundamentalist control ... now breaking news:

Guardian: libya's capital under Islamist control after Tripoli airport seized
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/24/libya-capital-under-islamist-control-tripoli-airport-seized-operation-dawn

NYT: Egypt and United Arab Emirates Said to Have Secretly Carried Out Libya Airstrikes
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/26/world/middleeast/egypt-and-united-arab-emirates-said-to-have-secretly-carried-out-libya-airstrikes.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&version=LedeSum&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

The American officials are quoted as being unhappy -- only We are allowed to bomb other countries to effect regime change ...

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25 2014 16:35 utc | 61

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25, 2014 12:35:32 PM | 60

Yep. It is interesting. It confirms that there is a Turkey, Qatar, US axis and a conflicting Saudi, UAE, Egypt axis.

According to Nasrallah ISIS is supported by Turkey and Qatar. Which implicates the United States.

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 16:51 utc | 62

According to Nasrallah ISIS is supported by Turkey and Qatar. Which implicates the United States.

I nearly fell out of my chair with this line. It could have been the other axis option and it still would have implicated America with this crowd. You could have chosen any combination, however absurd, for your new axis theory and America would always be at fault.

If so, why bother mentioning anything about any reformulated and ever-changing axis relationships if it's as easy as saying "it's all America's fault."

I've always asserted, if America's going to be blamed for everything anyway, it ought to go all out and out Nazi in order to reap the greatest bang for its blame buck. I say that with tongue in cheek — but only just barely. If you cry Hitler long enough, he will eventually come.

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25 2014 17:23 utc | 63

Ukraine.

1) A brave people fighting against a fascist Junta.

2) Trans-national and global capital and resource extraction, fossil fuels and also agri, provoking deathly strife to overtake a potentially rich region (for ex. introduce GMOs., fracking, slave labor, etc.), under any or no national banner

3) US provocation to prevent closer Europe-Russia ties, or simply continuing a long term effort at encirclement and destruction. Dislodge Putin for a Yeltsin bis. Prevent a EU-Russia alliance at any costs.

4) NATO being instrumentalized by the US. - In fact the US commands it and Fogh is just the public face. War-mongers, arms producers, contractors, of any kind, gleeful for opportunities. (As in Afgh.)

5) A proxy war between Russia, in the shape of Putin the supremo chess master, and the US + EU as poodle. Germany to finally make its submission public - and enforce it re. their ppl.

6) An old-style civil war, with rebels, partisans, guerrillas, brave women, aspirations to freedom, aka. self-determination, left in orientation. > Echoes to the Spanish Civil war. (French fighters, very few in no., have gone to both sides, with similar sort of arguments, nationalistic in the main.)

7) A failed state, run into the ground by oligarchs and a Gvmt. of mafia-official-type thugs in crappy suits, moreover never a real country - culturally, linguistically, historically, etc. breaking up with opportunistic vultures poised to feed.

8) A final test of US domination. (.. won’t be final.)

9) A sign that Satan, or the forces of Evil, are gathering more power, unleashing destruction on the world (I can get the feel of that non specific stuff.) This fits in with creating destruction, death, chaos, to prevent others from ever rising up.

10) other

All these narratives likely have some ‘truth’ or hit on some relevant aspect(s). But which point is overriding, if any? How do they meld together to produce the confused results we see? I’m guessing that the main actors haven’t a clue.


Posted by: Noirette | Aug 25 2014 17:31 utc | 64

More on the firing of the anti-Zionist professor at the University of Illinois. Why it looks there are some emails surfacing in which donors threatened the school.

As concerns ISIS and the MSM's deflection away from its obvious creation/funding by the Zionist US/Israel, this is a better take on Nasrallah's statements from the Israelis themselves: Funny how they use the term "conspiracy theory", huh? I especially like how that sentence is singled out in the article.


WHAT ABOUT the West and Israel? Nasrallah accused the UN of being a paper tiger.

“UNIFIL [the UN force in Lebanon] can’t even protect itself,” he said. He claimed that ISIS was serving US interests “even if they don’t know it” and that ISIS is part of a “conspiracy,” part of a “battle of life and death, similar to the resistance against Israel.” He points out that ISIS actually “serves the objectives of Israel.”

This Mossad-US-ISIS conspiracy theory is relatively common in parts of the Islamic world today.

Nasrallah’s dangerous game is positioning himself against Qatar and Turkey in the regional struggle for power. He is trying to pry Saudi Arabia, a traditional guarantor of the special status of Lebanon (it brokered the Taif agreement in 1989 to end the Civil War), into his camp as well. It is not a surprise that former prime minister Saad Hariri returned to Lebanon on August 8th, nor that he has pledged $15 million to rebuild Arsal; nor that he announced a $1 billion grant from Saudi Arabic upon his return. Nasrallah is correct, there is a conspiracy.

Oh, so ISIS does serve Zionist US and Israeli interests, huh?

Here's another take on what Nasrallah said:

The international community did not react when ISIS killed Christians in Mossul, or when the Kurds, Sunnis and Shias got killed in Kirkuk,” he said. “But when ISIS reached Erbil, where US has interests, the US stood up. It’s not that they care about the Kurds, it’s because of what Erbil means to them strategically.”

Nasrallah said ISIS “served US interests, whether they know it or not,” and tied the 2006 war to a broader Western plan to try and destroy the anti-Zionist resistance.

“The 2006 war was a fundamental part of a chain of events that tried to crush the Resistance,” he said. “And the plan to crush the Resistance in Gaza is the same as the one in Lebanon in 2006.”

“Can we defeat them and their plans? We can. We did it before and we can do it now,” Nasrallah added.

Oh so it's all part of a plan to crush the anti-Zionist resistance, huh? Hmmm, then I guess we SHOULDN'T include the apartheid genocidal state of Israel in our discussions of ISIS but rather - like Noam Chomsky told us during the Syrian Conflict - believe that Israel is just ALSO just sitting this one out again, right?

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 25 2014 17:43 utc | 65

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Aug 25, 2014 1:23:55 PM | 63

Somehow I don't think Saudi Arabia, UAE and Egypt are friends of the US any more.

This here for example is Egypt

Sisi says Qatar, Turkey, US and the Muslim Brotherhood are funding media projects to undermine Egypt's stability

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 18:09 utc | 67

@66

No, that story denied directly by Edward "Psyop" Snowden's lawyer and bff Mr. Greenwald both show that this was a rumor intentionally created to deflect attention AWAY from Israeli/Zionist participation in all things ISIS.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 25 2014 18:12 utc | 68

@68 UMM, WHERE? I DO NOT SEE ANYTHING ON GGREENWALD'S TWITTER ABOUT IT

Posted by: jisdj | Aug 25 2014 18:20 utc | 69

Its just an old rumour, Snowden hasnt released any such documents.

Posted by: Anonymous | Aug 25 2014 18:27 utc | 70

More from Egypt

The Gulf states once relied, almost entirely, on the United States to lead security and anti-terrorism efforts guaranteeing regional order and their continued rule. But for many reasons, the United States now seems unsuited to continue playing that role, which means Saudis will have to work alone or find other partners. In fact, the United States, by malice, incompetence or differing interests, bears a large part of the responsibility of the collapse of the regional order.

This situation gives rise to a dire demand for the emergence of a regional security alliance where Egypt, Saudi Arabia, UAE and possibly Algeria’s armies and intelligence communities would cooperate, through a formal institution, NATO-style, to fill the vacuum that is gifting IS and the like with room for quick unopposed advances. Russia could become an important partner to this alliance.

Now, Algeria is a very special proposal

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 18:49 utc | 71

#71 -- oh yeah, in 10 years (or less) Egyptians will hate us at least as much as the Iranians have hated us for decades -- for squashing their self-determination and installing a tyrant ... Our objections to the Muslim Brotherhood and our heavy-handed support of the coup that took out Morsi will not be forgotten as another generation of prodemocracy types spend years in jail or worse ...

Fascinating that over at the NYT comments, almost everyone is expressing delight that Egypt and the Emirates are "cleaning up their region's problems" without us ... with zero recognition that Libya may now, in fact, become another hotbed of competing Islamist factions with all non-Islamicist "moderate" factions defeated and/or in exile... (or that we and others might chose to intervene again to protect 'our interests"). It's not yet a coup, but I'm pretty sure that they not going to stick around to do nation-building, etc. ... and ISIS is doubtless already there ...

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25 2014 18:59 utc | 72

@60

Nah, dont bother with any further replying

Clearly you're quite content to post a pompous and dickish reply, so far be it from me to interuppt you when you're all being pompous and dickish

Carry on . . .

Posted by: JFC | Aug 25 2014 19:00 utc | 73

My proof that ISIS is unislamic: http://radioyaran.com/2014/08/25/islamic-state-isis-beheads-crucifies-and-mutilates-enemies-but-is-this-allowed-in-islam/

Posted by: KerKaraje | Aug 25 2014 19:14 utc | 74

I'd say ISIS's brutality fit a generation raised on computer games and recruitment/martyr videos ... it has little to nothing to do with Islam ... WWII Americans reportedly brought back Japanese ears and fingers as souveigners ... not very Christian (or "American")

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25 2014 19:27 utc | 75

Anon@70

This Iranian nonsense propaganda is much more than a rumor, it has been repeating for over a month and this latest iteration is trying to project a Canadian source that is parroting an Irahian, poorly produced, pseudo-story. The Iranians are so inept at this game it is almost hilarious but they must do something to deflect people away from their responsibility for their satrap in Iraq.

Posted by: Wayoutwest | Aug 25 2014 19:33 utc | 76

Yeah, the Zionist NYT is a good place to go to see how this ISIS etc horsecrap is being sold to the masses.

So, to bring ourselves up-to-date and pretend that we are faithful readers of the Zionist NYT we are supposed to believe:

1) the Arab Spring in all of its Zionist US/Israel-backed glory across all countries involved was actually a bunch of aspirants for democracy just wanting to be free and NOT a series of color revolutions

2) that the Zionist US/Israel after funding/training/creating/unleashing these jihadist mercenary groups across the region is now SURPRISED at the chaos they are causing

3) that now that this "chaos" - made scariest in the form of the bullcrap ISIS gang - is just getting "out of control" the US has ceded control of what will happen next in the region to the UAE, Egypt, Qatar, Turkey and the rest of the gang of US bootlickers

4) that throughout the entirety of this operation the closest thing you could come to direct Israeli involvement - they've been just so busy with Gaza, right? - is the false rumor spread about ISIS' leader being a Mossad asset as we've been told they are actually AFRAID of jihadists - except when tending to them in hospitals - living next door to them.

Yup, that sounds TOTALLY effing believable to the readers of the NYT of course.

Spontaneous outburst for freedom that the Zionist US/Israel had NO involvement in ----> chaos that the Zionist US/Israel just had NO idea/is worried about ----> the creation of a crazy mercenary jihadist groups that the Zionist US/Israel just also had NO idea about ---> an outcome of regional events that the Zionist US/Israel are seemingly NOT INVOLVED in anymore.

And the fact that this all somehow hews exactly to Zionist balkanization plans for the ME?

Effing coincidence.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 25 2014 20:00 utc | 77

76 wayoutwest

It wasnt Presstv that started the rumour.

Posted by: Anonymous | Aug 25 2014 20:09 utc | 78

actually I'm so confused at this point ... the NYT breaking news about Egypt and Emerite is getting no play on BBC or Guardian ... the Guardian apparently reporting, if not a coup, dualing governments.

Guardian new headline: Libya needs help to defeat Islamist militias, says foreign minister
Foreign minister Mohamed Abdel Aziz warns against factions 'who are now stronger than the government itself'

{Foreign Minister]Mohamed Abdel Aziz stressed he was not calling for direct foreign military intervention. But he said Libya's government, which has fled to the eastern city of Tobruk, is now unable to safeguard key state institutions by itself, and called for "arms and any other equipment… that could ensure the possibility of protecting our strategic sites, our oil fields, our airports" against militias "who are now stronger than the government itself, and who do now possess arms even more sophisticated than the government itself."

Abdel Aziz's call came as the new militia leadership in Tripoli appointed a former guerrilla commander [Omar al Hasi,]as head of a reconvened Islamist-led parliament, formally breaking with the country's elected government which has escaped to the east.

note that Omar al HasI is not the USA/CIA superhero General Khalifa Haftar ...

"Islamist" apparently sometimes = equals = Political Islam i.e. Muslim Brotherhood (whom Egypt, the Saudis and the UAE hate) preferring the Islamic fundamentalist jihadi/extremeists like ISIS and Ansar al Sharia
... and other times, seemingly does not ... I'll be back when figure this out a bit more.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25 2014 20:18 utc | 79

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25, 2014 2:59:31 PM | 72

I assume that the US continue to cultivate the Muslim Brotherhood via Turkey and Qatar and directly.

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 20:24 utc | 80

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25, 2014 4:18:33 PM | 79

note that Omar al HasI is not the USA/CIA superhero General Khalifa Haftar ...

He is a member of the Libyan Islamic Fighting group, an al Qaida franchise cultivated by the US and the British.

I guess, it would be a bit much for the readership of the NYT to be confronted with the fact that al Qaida has a state in Iraq/Syria and in Libya now.

preferring the Islamic fundamentalist jihadi/extremeists like ISIS and Ansar al Sharia

No they hate every stripe of Islamist. Islamist is incompatible with monarchy or military dictatorship.

Posted by: somebody | Aug 25 2014 20:47 utc | 81

It's almost as if they're saying, well, if NATO can, so can we ...
That Bush precedent setting "preemptive war" -- with UN Approval based on Bogus Evidence -- really makes it hard for us to object too strenuously ... considering what we've done since and are doing now in Iraq (and elsewhere)

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 25 2014 21:05 utc | 82

The UAE jet fighters supposed flew multiple missions needing refueling planes this week and the week before from Egyptian air bases across to Libya and back and NO ONE in the US military had ANY idea about any of that crap at all.

Yeah, that totally sounds plausible.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 25 2014 21:16 utc | 83

Anon@78

The first apperance of this BS story was attributed to Iranian sources and now PTV is parroting it and trying to validate it with more BS. They may not be the authors of this propaganda but they are surely trying to sell this BS to the rubes.

Posted by: Wayoutwest | Aug 25 2014 21:41 utc | 84

@65

You're quoting Nasrallah?

What the hell would he know about Zionist machinations?

Does he even have a Phd, or even a degree, in History?

Posted by: JFC | Aug 25 2014 21:59 utc | 85

New ISIS video shows that they can use drones.

Hey, wait a second, this video is being pushed by the exact same hasbara group - Vocativ - that originally pushed the ISIS memorabilia story. Oh well. At least Israel isn't involved in any of these shenanigans.

Posted by: JSorrentine | Aug 26 2014 2:00 utc | 86

The New York Times Editorial Board has hit a new low. And that's saying something, indeed. But they truly have.

In a new editorial, they continue with the meme, first heard on the BBC, that Syria - having paid with the lives of 200,000 of it citizens and trounced the Takfiris into Syria's eastern desert - has not done enough to defeat ISIS. This from an editorial board that has numerous times in the past supported these same rebels.

They describe ISIS as such:

the extremist group known as ISIS whose ruthlessness and killing has dumbfounded and horrified the civilized world.

Yes - horrified and dumbfounded "the civilized world" - so horrified and dumbfounded these "civilized" actors that they've seen fit to shower these killers with cash and weapons, sent their top leaders to meet with them, pooh poohed their war crimes so long as they were directed towards the enemy du jour of the "west", and refused to reign in the cash pouring into their coffers from the bank accounts of their favored allies.

Horrified and dumbfounded indeed. If these "civilized" nations were anymore dumbfounded and horrified, they might lend them a few F-16s.

That’s why President Obama was correct to argue that “from governments and peoples across the Middle East, there has to be a common effort to extract this cancer so that it does not spread.”

The NYTimes, ever the sycophants. Only a well-trained (as in, a seal at a circus) western "intellectual" could claim that President Obama was "correct" to belittle those in Syria who have given their lifeblood, their sons and daughters, their fathers and mothers battling the Obama-backed Takfiris. "Correct"? I'd have thought "dripping with unprecedented hypocrisy" might be a better description, but then I don't have a PhD from Harvard.

Can the New ork Times really not find someone better to deliver a lesson on "common cause" to those who are sitting on the front-lines of the battle against these fanatics than the man sending their enemies flak jackets and cold hard cash - a man whose closest allies are arming them directly without a peep passing his lips?

I suggest everyone read this. I can't do it justice. It is a goldmine of double standards, hypocrisy, and pedantry like I have never seen. Exceptional even for the editorial board of the NYTimes. And I haven't even gotten to the best part, where they congratulate the one power probably (though certainly not the most powerful of their backers) most responsible for the existence of these Takfiri murderers, Saudi Arabia:

To their credit, some leaders are speaking out. Among them is Saudi Arabia’s highest religious authority, the grand mufti, who called ISIS and Al Qaeda the “enemy No. 1 of Islam.”

Yes, the western media in this display has really hit sickening new height of hypocrisy. And they even add this - this sickening colonial attitude which blames the victims of this western-backed onslaught on its very victims, somehow managing to even make it appear as if "Islam" and not decades of US support for extremist militants from 1970s Afghanistan until this very day is the problem here.

such extremists will never be defeated if Muslims themselves don’t make it a priority.

Yep, blame "the Muslims" for not caring enough. As if to say: "You violent Muslims, if only you'd have thrown more of your children into the meat grinder we invented and funded, we might have bombed you earlier". You really couldn't make it up.

...

@JFC - He's not busy stroking himself to memories of Ariel Sharon like you are, you piece of garbage. Go to hell, turd.

Posted by: guest77 | Aug 26 2014 2:02 utc | 87

mmm, I read an article over at Foreign Policy that blamed Assad for every death ... every death ... even the massacres by ISIS, every killings by the "rebels" ... although oddly it suggested that working with him should not be unthinkable ...

When you consider the carnage Saddam caused during the period he was our friend -- the poison gas used against the Kurds and Iran (oh - and the PR campaign, as I recall, to blame his use of gas on the Kurds on Iran, which I believe we "helped" with) ... no one seems to factor that during Assad's first years of the rebellion which then became a proxy war in which he was being attacked (not subtly either) by proxies for the Saudis, the U.S., France, jihadi wannaes and others) I'm not justifying crimes against humanity here... however, he was facing a "rebellion" artificially hopped up on steroids ...

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | Aug 26 2014 2:46 utc | 88

True Story! "Rip Van Winkle" Man asleep for six years wakes and utters first words.

A modern medical miracle!

Report says "deep mental hibernation" saves him. Able to recognize people, memory appears intact, some difficulty remembering who his friends were, judgment may even have improved!

Israeli doctors believe man's technique could have saved Sharon.

"Rip" holds first press conference -- shares what he learned upon coming out of "suspended animation" in exclusive interview with Salon.com.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 26 2014 3:19 utc | 89

Eternal Fascism: Fourteen Ways of Looking at a Blackshirt
By Umberto Eco
(excerpt)

In spite of some fuzziness regarding the difference between various historical forms of fascism, I think it is possible to outline a list of features that are typical of what I would like to call Ur-Fascism, or Eternal Fascism. These features cannot be organized into a system; many of them contradict each other, and are also typical of other kinds of despotism or fanaticism. But it is enough that one of them be present to allow fascism to coagulate around it.

3. Irrationalism also depends on the cult of action for action's sake.

Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation. Therefore culture is suspect insofar as it is identified with critical attitudes. Distrust of the intellectual world has always been a symptom of Ur-Fascism, from Hermann Goering's fondness for a phrase from a Hanns Johst play ("When I hear the word 'culture' I reach for my gun") to the frequent use of such expressions as "degenerate intellectuals," "eggheads," "effete snobs," and "universities are nests of reds." The official Fascist intellectuals were mainly engaged in attacking modern culture and the liberal intelligentsia for having betrayed traditional values.

4. The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism.

In modern culture the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge. For Ur-Fascism, disagreement is treason.

5. Besides, disagreement is a sign of diversity.

Ur-Fascism grows up and seeks consensus by exploiting and exacerbating the natural fear of difference. The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 26 2014 3:35 utc | 90

@juannie:

Thanks for the kind words and wise advice.

Hey, just a few thoughts running around my head if you are still thinking of getting into clicker training:

With a dog like yours, the goal obviously is not to see how many cool tricks you can teach him, or what you can push him to do. The goal is simply to create a space where your animal is comfortable, and a method within that space for him to feel that he can communicate with you. For a dog that is “lost” with loss of the past, it can help bring him into the present and empower him to feel he has some positive control over his life again. That’s why something so simple can be so transformative, on so many levels.

Dogs talk to us in dog language, we talk back to them in human language. The clicker and command technique gives you a common language that you both understand -- and your dog will know this -- to speak with each other. and it gives you organized times (at least at first) to have those conversations.

Therefore, if you do try this:
1) Start slow, keep sessions short (1-5 min.) and frequent (3x/day), break at the first sign of stress, do not push him, always praise him or keep quiet.
2) The first step is to get him to associate the noise of the clicker with something positive, usually a treat. This can take up to a week or more, though probably less. He can also be reinforced with compliments and petting. Once he “gets it,” he will start to enjoy and look forward to his sessions.
3) The next, and harder step, is to get him to associate the click with some action you expect of him. Books go into more detail on how to do this. The point here, which books often neglect, is that while you think you are training him to perform an action, he will think that he is training you to treat him when he performs his action. It can be difficult until he makes the connection between the action and the treat, but when he gets it, there is literally a “light bulb going off” moment where you can see it in his face, thinking, and whole being. It’s always a great moment! After that, as long as you go slow -- because for your particular pooch it is all about him, and not your expectations of his performance -- it will be a pure joy which will unite you both. I can say from personal experience that within a month you will have a whole new animal.

Anyway, just some thoughts. If it is not right for you and him that is OK too, of course.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 26 2014 4:22 utc | 91

The color revolution robbery

“Libya is a monkey box,” says Rashid when asked if the Libyan government is capable of managing what remains of its wealth. “You see the chairman of the National Council or whatever it’s called appearing on television wearing slippers and holding a Kalashnikov. They have no idea what they have, and what they have, they steal.” The game of wildly overstating the personal wealth of Middle Eastern dictators, and then stealing national assets under cover of civil conflict and social chaos, Rashid suggests, is one that Western governments and financial institutions and their co-conspirators in Arab countries play hand-in-glove. “They said Hosni Mubarak and his family were worth over $20 billion,” Rashid says. “The real number turned out to be a few tens of millions. Meanwhile, when Mubarak was removed from office, the foreign currency reserves and national investments of Egypt were $54 billion. Now they are below zero. You tell me where that money went.”

Posted by: somebody | Aug 26 2014 4:42 utc | 92

84 wayoutwest

Really? Where are the evidence for that?

Posted by: Anoynmous | Aug 26 2014 7:27 utc | 93

@JFC - He's not busy stroking himself to memories of Ariel Sharon like you are, you piece of garbage. Go to hell, turd

.Posted by: guest77 | Aug 25, 2014 10:02:58 PM | 87

One can always rely on the retarded to mistake the snark for something else, and here comes one of this site's premier retards to show us what true mental retardation looks like

Posted by: JFC | Aug 26 2014 7:53 utc | 94

Somebody,
Thanks for that one
http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-08-07/libya-waste-fraud-erase-billions-in-national-wealth
should be added to "South Sudan" in the list of success stories Qatar is responsible for

Posted by: Mina | Aug 26 2014 8:59 utc | 95

Patrick Cockburn: "How to Ensure a thriving caliphate".
http://www.tomdispatch.com/post/175884/tomgram%3A_patrick_cockburn%2C_how_to_ensure_a_thriving_caliphate/

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 26 2014 10:39 utc | 96

"No Force can beat ISIS on the ground".
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/08/26/obama-s-iraq-syria-dilemma-no-force-now-on-the-ground-can-beat-isis.html

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 26 2014 10:40 utc | 97

Interesting articles from "Der Spiegel" (online):
- Israeli attacks has radicalized palestinian youth
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/violence-in-gaza-strip-leads-to-radicalization-of-palestinian-youth-a-985510.html
- The israeli attacks on Gaza also radicalized Israelis:
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/interview-with-sociologist-eva-illouz-about-gaza-and-israeli-society-a-984536.html
- NATO contemplates a "missile shield" against Russia.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/nato-considers-missle-shield-directed-against-russia-a-987899.html

Posted by: Willy2 | Aug 26 2014 10:59 utc | 98

US Federal Judge Who Was Arrested for Beating His Wife (and Who Sentenced Don Siegelman) Is Now Hoping to Avoid Prosecution...

http://www.opednews.com/populum/pagem.php?f=Federal-Judge-Who-Was-Arre-by-Brad-Friedman-Crime_Judge-Mark-Fuller_Prison_Prosecution-140825-800.html

Posted by: really | Aug 26 2014 11:50 utc | 99

"3. Irrationalism also depends on the cult of action for action's sake.

Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation. Therefore culture is suspect insofar as it is identified with critical attitudes. Distrust of the intellectual world has always been a symptom of Ur-Fascism, from Hermann Goering's fondness for a phrase from a Hanns Johst play ("When I hear the word 'culture' I reach for my gun") to the frequent use of such expressions as "degenerate intellectuals," "eggheads," "effete snobs," and "universities are nests of reds." The official Fascist intellectuals were mainly engaged in attacking modern culture and the liberal intelligentsia for having betrayed traditional values."
@90

"Pointy-heads" is another such expression.
It is important when discussing these characteristics of fascism to be clear that they are not shared by 'populist" movements. The elision of fascism and populism is more than mistaken it is designed to discredit popular political action.
Anti-intellectualism is a key component of fascism, a reaction against reason and democracy.

Posted by: bevin | Aug 26 2014 14:01 utc | 100

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