Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
May 17, 2014

Ukraine: Recommended Reading

Sometimes I to read too much to write. Therefore just a few reading recommendations about Ukraine.

The empire is pissed that its puppets in Ukraine fail to fight: One month on, Ukraine military fails to rout rebels

Now the U.S. believes the oligarchs are coming to help its aims: Ukraine’s richest man enters dispute in eastern region

The steelworkers’ patrols seem to mark a turn in the conflict, but Akhmetov’s decision to use his clout may be more significant. [...] But with his decision to put his workers on the street, he may be saying enough is enough with the separatist movement in eastern Ukraine.

Idiots. Why should the Ukrainian military fight its own people? Why would Akhmetov, who's companies for depend on good relations with Russia, work against Putin? Hint: He doesn't. The National Interest: The Battle for Ukraine: Who Is Winning?

The May 25 election is in Russia’s interests, because it will give Western policy makers their desired short-term victory on the ground, and then American leaders can begin to direct their attention elsewhere. It also saves European leaders from having to make economic sacrifices as part of sanctions nobody genuinely wants to impose on Russia. Vladimir Putin is signaling that Moscow will play along if Ukraine agrees to give it that which it has largely conceded on the ground. Rinat Akhmetov, Ukraine’s most powerful oligarch and largest employer in the Russian-speaking regions, has finally come to the rescue by using his workers to seize control in Mariupol from the separatists. He supports the restoration of order, and constitutional reform to give the regions greater autonomy, but not independence. His forces are a welcome change, but it is the bargain Vladimir Putin has been offering all along, just better wrapped to make it easier for Kyiv to accept.

Most realists in the West would have already taken this deal, and settled in for the long game in Ukraine. The rest will likely come around after realizing that at the moment they are being taken for a ride by Kyiv, Moscow, or both.

But the real "western", read U.S. target is more than Ukraine. It is full spectrum dominance. Ideological neoliberalism used for U.S. imperial ambitions.

Today's must-read: Michael Hudson: The New Cold War’s Ukraine Gambit

There is no single paragraph in that long piece to quote. It is a tour de force binding together the historical and economic context of the conquest attempt we are witnessing in Ukraine. Today's recommended reading.

Posted by b on May 17, 2014 at 19:15 UTC | Permalink

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I agree, there are too many good paragraphs to quote, but these two are the clincher for me
The aim is to break as much of Ukraine as possible out of the Russian orbit and to draw it into the West, and into NATO itself.

This has been the plan ever since President Clinton broke the disarmament agreement made by George H.W. Bush with Gorbachev and extend NATO to the former Warsaw Pact members, starting with the Baltics. The logical extension of this tactic is to promote separatist movements in Russia itself, much as U.S. strategists are seeking to stir the pot of ethnic resentment in China, and as they have done in Libya, Iraq and Syria.

Posted by: harry law | May 17 2014 19:53 utc | 1

Speaking of Akhmetov, I'll repost here what I posted in the previous Ukraine thread.

The position of Ukraine's richest oligarch, Rinat Akhmetov, is closer to that of Moscow than of Kiev: he wants federalization. He has also called on Kiev to stop its military operation in eastern Ukraine.

A fact that suggests the alignment of Akhmetov’s interest with Moscow’s is that teams of his steelworkers that took over in Mariupol were backed by municipal police that had openly supported the separatists.

The Washington Post reports that even after the steelworkers took over, pro-Russian forces were allowed to remain with their flags still flying above the city administration building.

What we would see if separatists in Donetsk and Luhansk also back down is Akhmetov taking over from where the separatists left off to press home demands for decentralization of Ukraine.

He will have an ally in Russia to that end, even though those separatists who have wished for full autonomy and accession to Russia would feel betrayed.

Akhmetov recorded a speech in which he said federalization is the best option for Ukraine, and Yats spoke against Akhmetov's suggestion. (Both links are Russian.) So far the Western media seems to be ignoring this, since the US plan to make all of the Ukraine Russia-hating still stands.

Posted by: Demian | May 17 2014 20:00 utc | 2

The world has turned upside down now that RT is how you get news that is closest to reality.

http://rt.com/shows/crosstalk/159368-political-disaster-nuland-ukraine/

It all comes back to the original decision by Barrack Obama not to nationalize the banks and not to jail the crooks who caused the 2007-2008 economic crash. This signaled that the Plutocrats’ coup to seize control of the governments in the West was a success. Corporate media is cementing control by providing disinformation and diversion.

Since then the oligarchs have been creating havoc all across the world, making money, until told to stop in Syria by Russia. In response, together, the neoliberals and neo-conservatives opened a fifth front in Ukraine. John Brennan’s and Joe Biden’s visits to Kiev green lighted the Right Sector’s marauding though the Eastern Provinces killing civilians.

http://lightbox.time.com/2014/05/15/ukraine-referendum-deaths/#1

Russia has shown amazing restraint with a civil war erupting on its borders caused by the West. Unless everyone agrees to a neutral federated Ukraine, a bloody civil war will split Ukraine along ethnic lines. A holy war between Latin and Orthodox Christians will inevitable draw NATO into Western Ukraine and Russia into the East. Eyeball to eyeball in a middle of a religious civil war it is inevitable that a hot war will break out between NATO and Russia troops that would naturally progress to use of hydrogen bombs on both sides.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 17 2014 20:13 utc | 3


Hungary calls for autonomy for hungarian group in Ukraine.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/sns-rt-us-ukraine-crisis-hungary-autonomy-20140517,0,6761808.story

Posted by: Anonymous | May 17 2014 20:17 utc | 4

Ex German Chancellor Helmut Schmidt now 95 slams EU over Ukraine, "The latest example is the attempt of the European Commission to annex Ukraine, and also to try to draw in Georgia. Just a reminder: Georgia lies outside of Europe. This is megalomania, we have no business being there." http://www.thelocal.de/20140516/ex-german-chancellor-helmut-schmidt-slams-eu-over-ukraine

Posted by: harry law | May 17 2014 20:39 utc | 5

So many Americans are so clueless -- I was appalled by the enthusiasm that "steelworkers" were (apparently) going to beat-the-shit out of the pro-russian "separatists" ... American media still cannot pronounce "federalists." Sounds like he (and many other "pro-russian" Ukranians) is actually a Ukranian nationalist ... not pining for a return to the USSR afterall. Sigh.

I'm a bit confused about what-sounded-like "mysteriously recruited anti-separatist militas" -- called Donbas volunteer battalions" -- reported in the Guardian: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/15/ukraine-civil-war-fears-mount-volunteer-units-kiev-russia
who were reportedly heavily armed, largely military veterans recruited via mysterious adverts in the local "underground" press. Sounds like the patriotic, but federalist Steelworkers may have obviated the need for those thugs.

Regardless, the cheering for a likely head-banging, truncheon wielding vigilante force to smite those disloyal to Kiev ... oh my. Will be on the lookout for further mention of those Guardian reported vigilantes. Anyone know anything?

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 17 2014 20:49 utc | 6

Moonies of Alabamy, Donbass separatists: Together Putin's Pawns, expendable useful idiots all. In the former case, the expenditure of any kind of leftist, progressive principles whatsoever. The slogan: All Hail Oligarch Akhmetov, Capitalist Savior of Donbass!

Or what part of the conceptual difference between "federalization" and "separatism" do you not grasp? At some point the "separatists" will have to furl their Donetsk Republic banners and settle for whatever Akhmetov can wheedle out of Kiev for them, if anything. So much for that bloody little Kabuki.

Think I'll start my own blog. I'll call it "Mackie der Messer" in your dishonor.

Posted by: Matt | May 17 2014 21:17 utc | 7

@Susan Sunflower #6:

That Guardian "article" is pretty amusing. It keeps skirting around the reality that the only people willing to fight against the republicans (i.e., rebels) are rabid neo-Nazis.

"It is hard to trust the army and the national guard," said Semenchenko. "There are cases when they have just given up their weapons and fled. I don't understand it at all, how can you give an oath to a country and then not stick to it?"

Hehe, the National Guard, consisting largely of Right Sector members, was formed because the regular Ukrainian army did not want to kill Ukrainians. But it now appears that even National Guard members are not willing to fight the republicans.

Interestingly, none of the "commanders" that article mentions are willing to give interviews, as far as I can tell. In contrast, the (soft spoken) republican military leader did give an illuminating interview, as the WSJ reported.

As for Akhmetov having his workers patrol the streets of Mariupol, as the Wash Post article b links to mentions, to me at least it's pretty obvious that the main reason he did that is that he does not think that the Uki neo-Nazi crazies would dare attack his workers. Thus, the kind of skirmishes occurring elsewhere in republican controlled territory are unlikely to occur in Mariupol now.

Posted by: Demian | May 17 2014 21:30 utc | 8

@ Demian -- thank you! Yes, there's more than one way to skin a cat (and preempt the vigilantes!). Still, reminiscent of the Iranian "Green Revolution," the tone of several reports was disturbingly "enthusiastic" at the prospect of violence (with no acknowledgement of the potentials for rapidly snow-balling violence) ... Quite revolting how nakedly eager we are for OTHER PEOPLE to shed blood and endure beatings, while we sit on our comfy couches, remote and snacks at hand. See also: Libya

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 17 2014 21:37 utc | 9

thanks b. glad you too enjoyed hudsons article.. we were discussing it on one of the previous threads thanks to bevin bringing it to our attention earlier.

@2 demain. thanks.

@3 vietnam vet.. i agree, expect i am not sure about very your last statement. i sure as hell hope not..

Posted by: james | May 17 2014 21:49 utc | 10

Two months ago the NY Times told us that Crimea's reuniting with Russia left its economy in a "precarious state".

Now we learn that In Taking Crimea, Putin Gains a Sea of Fuel Reserves.

The article begins by saying "Russia seized Crimea". Even "annexation" doesn't sound nasty enough for the Times. And the joyous celebrations of Crimeans upon joining Russia never happened.

Posted by: Demian | May 17 2014 22:22 utc | 11

Isn't it obvious that the steelworkers are Jews being funded by George Soros? Just ask Rowan Beserkley.

Posted by: Louis Proyect | May 17 2014 22:56 utc | 12

troll alert..

Posted by: james | May 17 2014 23:15 utc | 13

@ Louis

No Louis that isn't at all obvious but what is quite obvious by now is that what's now emerging, a federalized, largely autonomous east region of Ukraine was what Putin has been suggesting all along.

Posted by: Bill J. | May 17 2014 23:27 utc | 14

James@10

My belief that a hot war between NATO and Russia will escalate to a nuclear exchange comes from being raised during Cold War and the fact that no leader of a nuclear armed country has been insane enough to start a shooting war with another nuclear armed country (Mutual Assured Destruction). The problem is that the neo-conservatives are insane and corporate media refuses to acknowledge it. Victoria Nuland still has her job. The neo-con foundation belief is that the USA would win a nuclear war. They and the neo-liberals, who kick started the revolt in Kiev, are insane. They placed anti-Russian ultra-nationalists in control in Kiev on Russia’s Borderland which is an existential threat to it.

An unconfirmed comment at Naked Capitalism stated that Vladimir Putin backed down from invading in April when threated by the Swiss President to seize his assets. At least the invasion has been put off to date. If the USA keeps escalating the Ukraine Civil War and refusing to agree to a neutral federated Ukraine, at some point to preserve the Russian Federation, Putin will send in the troops. Finally, NATO will have its excuse to invade and armed troops from opposing sides will be right in the middle of a hot Civil War; guaranteed to provoke an incident where hair-triggered soldiers start shooting at each other.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 17 2014 23:42 utc | 15

#12
no, but Louis Proyect is blatantly obvious

Posted by: Cu Chulainn | May 17 2014 23:54 utc | 16

@ Demian | May 17, 2014 5:30:49 PM | 8
That seems to be true.

Louis Proyect | May 17, 2014 6:56:15 PM | 12
That doesn't seem to be remotely the case. Do you have some links??

Posted by: VRainov | May 18 2014 0:00 utc | 17

@VietnamVet #15:

Unlike you, I was never in the US military, so I have no basis on which to speak, but I still believe that the American generals will not allow the US or NATO to get in a war with Russia. It is such a stupid thing to do, from a military point of view. Also, although I despise Obama and think he's mostly a figurehead, I believe him when he says that NATO is not going to get into a war over the Ukraine, and he has some say on the matter. (The neocons can't get USG to do anything if both the White House and the Pentagon are against it, IMO.)

I find the claim that Putin didn't invade Ukraine because he was afraid of his assets getting seized ludicrous. Reports that Putin has significant assets in the West have never been confirmed. Also, invasion of the Ukraine by Russia has thus far most definitely not been called for. (I'm not talking about the Crimea, which is a completely different matter. Taking control of Crimea was very easily militarily, and if Russia had not done that, it would have lost its port in Sevastopol, which obviously was a main objective behind the whole USG plan for the Ukraine.)

I agree with you that there has so far been no indication that the USG will agree to a federalized, neutral Ukraine. But if the position of the Kiev regime continues to deteriorate, USG may relent. Another possibility is that further regions will join Donbas (Donetsk + Sloviansk) and a new republic will be formed that will be a protectorate of Russia, like South Ossetia. That outcome is looking increasingly possible without Russian military intervention. That National Guard troops are running away and surrendering their vehicles to locals, just as the proper Uki military did before them, suggests that Kiev will never be able to assemble a military force adequate to taking the southeast. So long as Kiev refuses to yield on (1) neutrality; (2) federalism; (3) Russia having equal official status with Ukrainian, most southeastern Ukrainians, not just active rebels, will want nothing to do with the central government, as last Sunday's referendums clearly showed.

Ukraine splitting up is a second-best outcome for Russia. If it happens, the final result may be the western rump gradually being absorbed by Ukraine's EU neighbors. That would be preferable for Russia to a western rump, ruled by neo-Nazis, continuing to exist.

Posted by: Demian | May 18 2014 0:17 utc | 18

@ VietnamVet, 15

i think that last wave of NATO expansion was triggered by russians repossessing their media and energy from neocon russians --khodorkovsky, nevzlin, gusinsky, berezovsky... here's that map again... look at the dates of NATO expansion...

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img836/4894/ki9e.jpg

.

the neocons are nuts, no doubt, if they believe in their "nuclear primacy"... google: "nuclear primacy" "first strike" russia china

and i think some of them are nuts... the racial supremacists and religious fanatics... hopefully, though, most neocons are simply looters, looting a dying empire...

humanity has a lot better chance of surviving looters than a nuke war

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 18 2014 0:25 utc | 19

our best way out of this peak oil/global warming pickle is to tell everyone the truth... but that's kinda hard for the neocons to do if the truth, especially about peak oil, was the reasont hey needed a new pearl harbor

and powerful people have spent to much time, effort and money in these denial camapaigns that nobody'd believe you if you told them the truth

it's a hell of a problem, and about the only thing we can do is wait until peka oil and global warming get too obvious to deny

.
if we last that long

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 18 2014 0:44 utc | 20

the germans seem to be paying pretty close attention to the energy situation...

there's a site called the "energy export databrowser"... BP energy stats, production, consumption, export info compiled in an easy-to-search format... search by type of fuel, country or grooup of coutries...

http://mazamascience.com/OilExport/

there's a little map in the lower left corner that takes you to a site that maps the hits on a world map...

the germans are paying attention

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 18 2014 1:10 utc | 21

@ Demian 18,

Indeed the USG has no intention of accepting any compromise on Ukraine. Hopefully Russia understands that the US is playing a winner take all game and are planning accordingly. So the only situation in which the USG would compromise is if they sense they will loose the game entirely, leaving Ukraine largely in the Russian orbit. In other words, if the Kiev regime is about to collapse due to economic pressure and most Ukrainians, even in the west, come to realize that their only hope is Russian economic aid, then the USG will ask for a compromise. Until then...

Posted by: Lysander | May 18 2014 1:15 utc | 22

I think I would have been attacking the left-cover Jewish fifth column in the West even if this Louis Proyekt had not descended from the empyrian of false Leftism to heckle me with straw man sarcasm. Far more than just a Zionist phalanx, the left-cover Jewish fifth column vaunts its conveniently powerless principles everywhere it can, shamelessly attracts bourgeois government sponsorship in imposing its gag orders on political discussion, distracting would-be Leftists both Jewish and non-Jewish, and like the great Chomsky painting the Anglo-Saxon imperialists of the 19th century as the continuing source of all evil and "Israel" as hardly more than a cog. Get that: it's far broader than mere "Zionism", indeed it professes to hate "Zionism", but it has the apparently inadvertent effect of exonerating "Zionism" from all historical responsibility, by painting it as just another accessory to the great Anglo-Saxon wave of conquest which. according to it, never ended.

Various Cockburns wrote excellent exposes of Zionist covert ops long ago (e.g. "Dangerous Liaison", Andrew & Leslie, 1991), but you'll spend your life going round in circles if you adopt their perspective, because even when "the Israelis" (never mind "the Jews", you won't hear that word) are explicitly described as fooling the CIA and exploiting it for their own gain, it's still the "David and Goliath" paradigm: the puny shall outwit the mighty. But they aren't so puny, or they wouldn't be if one didn't make this artificial distinction between "Jews" and "Zionists" (above), "religious" and "secular" (very important in obscuring the gatekeeper role in the US, not to mention actual subversion for non-Zionist but highly political ends), "and even "Left" and "Right" (most obviously in the person of this Louis Proyekt himself, who is, in Marxist-Leninist terminology, "objectively right-wing.")

As for the Mariupol steelworkers, Akhmetov is walking a razor's edge, but my own view is that this is not an acceptable alliance for the self-defense forces. In class terms, these steelworkers are no better than backlegs. In the absence of a dominant Marxist-Leninist party, "nationalism" is deployed on both sides, in a way the steelworkers can't grasp. It's impossible that the steelworkers could have defeated the self-defense forces (which are after all armed) in open conflict; this is a highly unstable exercise in attempted political manipulation by each party of the other. When it snaps, it will take the form of the steelworker cadres splitting, some under Akhmetov's control to ally with Right Sector 'National Guards', and some defying him, at immediate cost of their jobs, to join self-defense.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 18 2014 1:16 utc | 23

Demian@18

Vladimir Putin does not want anti-Russian Fascists in control in Kiev. I do not think Russia’s position is negotiable. So far he has been playing the long game. The Financiers and Military Contractors who provide the wealth for the Obama and Biden Families want a destabilized Russia. Barrack Obama says he does not want a war with Russia but he has always done what his handlers want him to do.

Destabilization will lead to war. Russia was ravaged by the neo-liberals in the 1990s. No Russian national leader would allow that to happen again.

These are strange days for this old Vietnam Vet. I never thought in my life that all that is preventing the USA from going to war with Russia is General Martin Dempsey. I was never dissuaded that the officers felt that Vietnam was a crappy war but it was the only one they had. Thirteen years of fighting unwinnable wars and five or six combat rotations must have convinced the most hardened soldier that it is time to give peace a chance.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 18 2014 1:20 utc | 24

Loud blasts, heavy gunfire heard in Slavyansk – RT stringer

“The gunfire is a fabric of daily life now in Slavyank, but this is the heaviest fighting I’ve heard in Slavyansk since I got here over a month ago,” he added.

He noted that Ukraine seems to have doubled their forces in the area and “what we see now seems to be the sharpest and strongest action yet on their part to try to retake the city, which has been in the hands of these pro-Donetsk activists since April 12.”

In the video report, Phillips provides a lot more detail than the written article. From his report, it sounds like another nazi try to unseat the anti-junta self-defense people around Slavyansk, but he seems to be getting his info second hand. It could be the the self-defense people went on the offensive. Their 48 hour ultimatum to the bandera nazis has expired.

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 2:16 utc | 25

@15 vietnam vet.. thanks for sharing your perspective here. i tend to share demian @18 and lysander @22 viewpoints, but i don't discount the insanity of the usa at present and the scenario you paint @24. actually that is what it looks like to me too.. going to the brink and seeing what things look like once we are their.. that is how insane these folks who have undue influence over the direction of usa foreign policy appear to me. i am sure the military brass have a much more realistic perspective on all this, but i don't know that they have much say on any of this.. obama seems little more then a rubber stamp for whatever way the wind is blowing and he certainly doesn't know how to shut the windows to stop the wind from blowing entering either.. if he had any backbone he would never have covered over all the past crimes saying something to the effect, we have to look forward instead.. one can't look forward without an honest appraisal of the past which never seems to happen with the us, except if it is to glorify all past usa actions... crazy set up and thus your scenario is not unreasonable given all this..

Posted by: james | May 18 2014 2:56 utc | 26

I always spoil my effect with at least one misprint. In #23, for "backlegs" read "blacklegs" in paragraph 3, line 3. Other than that, I'm happy with what I wrote. As for #25 and #26, remember what General Smedley Butler said about US power. Elsewhere (not in "War is a Racket" but in a newspaper article for a long extinct socialist newspaper called "Common Sense"), he wrote:

I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism. I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street. I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912. I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916. I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903. In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested. Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.

US military power is good for nothing except protecting the likes of United Fruit, or Conchita Brands as it is now: send in the Marines, overturn the government, install a fascist junta, to protect a goddam fruit company. That's the way it is. Dempsey is no different.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 18 2014 3:16 utc | 27

America/Israel/EU now setting up an expansion of their terrorism to Transnistria?

Украинских пограничников задержали в Приднестровье

Yandex translation.

"Ukrainian border guards detained in Transnistria"

"Transnistrian border guards headquarters "Kamenka" beyond the checkpoint were identified and arrested two unidentified persons in civilian clothes, who moved on the territory along the border with Ukraine, said on Saturday the representative of the state security Committee (KGB) of the PMR Alexander Dorna.

According to him, during the procedure of identification of the detainees reported that servicemen are Mogilev-Podolsky border unit of the state border service of Ukraine, and now aims to strengthen in Kotovsk border guard detachment, reports RIA "Novosti".

"The detainees had at itself did not have any documents proving personal data and the status of servicemen. In addition, these persons were not able to give clear explanations on the fact of illegal crossing the state border of Transnistria", said Dorna.

He said that arrived officials of the border guard service of Ukraine also found it difficult to answer questions about the reasons of their soldiers in Transnistria.

"Currently in custody Sergeant Frost Ruslan Dmitrievich and corporal of Cheporniuk Maxim Andreevich review, following which they will be prosecuted for illegal crossing of the state border", - said the representative of the KGB of the PMR.

He added that the question on transfer of border violators by the authorized representatives of the border guard service of Ukraine.

Later Dorna reported that detained by Ukrainian border guards on Saturday night were transferred to the Ukrainian side. He noted that arrived officials of the border guard service of Ukraine also found it difficult to answer questions about the reasons of their soldiers in Transnistria.

Good thing the two buggers got caught. Not so good they were returned to the Ukraine without finding out first who they were scouting for.

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 3:25 utc | 28

@Rowan Berkeley #27:

Honduras can't retaliate against an American nuclear first strike. So I don't think you're postulating a valid equivalency. As VietnamVet wrote, "Putin does not want anti-Russian Fascists in control in Kiev. I do not think Russia’s position is negotiable."

Hopefully the republican self-defense forces will be able to defeat the Uki neo-Nazi aggressors. But Russia will intervene if they can't.

Posted by: Demian | May 18 2014 3:32 utc | 29

I don't know -- I get the feeling that we are riding roughshod over our NATO partners ... for very little to no "good" reason that I can envision, it looks an awful lot like "score settling" with Putin over Libya, Syria, Iran, etc. It's like the Captain on the Caine Mutiny. The captain has gone crazy, how do I get off this boat??? Team Obama is ramping up to support "our boys" in Syria. Libya is in flames. Nigeria was unimpressed by Michelle Obama's sad-faced tweet. I read somewhere that the newly elected leader of India is a neo-liberal true believer, but it sounded more like he was another "pragmatist" but I'm wondering what it means for BRIC down the line. The ICC is looking British soldiers for post-invasion war crimes in Iraq ... while the 1 person actually tried (years later, one out of 8), skate on Haditha (2005) and last week saw some feeble attempt to resurrect the case against those in Blackwater responsible for that massacre in 2007 ... Oh, and Gitmo's still open and the latest is that those in charge falsified records about the hunger strikers ... and then there's the Snowden revelations. But seriously folks, something's gotta give. We're like that BFF gone bad, who's turned into an extortionist, after he co-signed that loan. Obviously "we" aren't going to self-correct and we have no shame. If the EU dissolved NATO, where would we be? Is that "our" best hope for salvation, redemption, even ressurection?

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 18 2014 3:34 utc | 30

Yarosh goes all Israeli.

Ярош призвал устроить в Крыму «партизанскую войну»

Yandex translation.

"Yarosh urged to arrange in the Crimea "guerrilla war"

"The leader of the ultranationalist movement "Right branch", the candidate in presidents of Ukraine Dmitry Yarosh in debates in Ukrainian "First national" channel stated that "Crimea was and is Ukrainian, but to return it, you might start there guerrilla war, using the Crimean Tatar factor".

In addition, answering the question of the audience about how to resolve the conflict in the Eastern regions of the country, jarosch said that instead of the frontal attacks need to "vasilkevich" the leaders of the militia. The leading question, what does it mean to vasilkevich", jarosch said - "physically eliminate", reports RIA "Novosti".

In the case of his election the President of Ukraine he promised to appoint a high state posts of maidanova. "If I become President, it is clear that I will not be President "Right sector". But I am a team player, and I'll do everything for my sister who passed the Maidan took certain positions," said Yarosh.

He stressed that "the federalization unacceptable, because it will lead to the destruction of Ukraine as a state."

Yarosh also announced the formation of a battalion "Donbass-2" for "large-scale guerrilla war in the East of Ukraine. According to him, "volunteer units that are already formed in Donbass", have to wage a "large-scale guerrilla war in the East of Ukraine.

Let's remind, preparation for the extraordinary presidential elections in Ukraine is on the background of military operations, which Kyiv is conducting against the South-Eastern regions, who disagree with the policies of the Kiev authorities.

At the same time, Kiev has also stated about the upcoming fair and free elections. However, the pre-election race in Ukraine turned out to open the beating of a number of undesirable Kyiv authorities candidates, in particular, the leader of the public movement "South-East" of Oleg Tsarev.

On Friday evening, the candidate from the Communist party of Ukraine Petro Symonenko stated desire to withdraw from the upcoming elections in protest against the actions of Kyiv. However, later the CEC of Ukraine refused him, saying that it is illegal.

According to the UN, during a special operation of the Ukrainian security forces in the Southeast of the country has killed already 127 people. Since the beginning of the Ukrainian crisis were killed 250 people.

On Sunday in Donetsk and Lugansk regions held a referendum, organized by the supporters of federalization, the results of which on Monday Donetsk national Republic declared itself a sovereign state. The self-proclaimed Lugansk people's Republic declared independence from Ukraine. The self-proclaimed Republic have started to create its own organs of power."

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 4:18 utc | 31

Saturday's roundtable talks:
AP: Eastern Ukraine, Kyiv argue over 'terrorists' in crisis-torn areas

Lawmakers and officials from eastern Ukraine on Saturday poured criticism on the fledgling central government, accusing it of ignoring legitimate grievances of the regions which have been overrun by pro-Russia militia fighting for independence.

One eastern leader said last weekend's unofficial referendum in favour of independence "expressed the will of the people."

The criticism came in the second round of European-brokered talks intended to resolve the country's worst crisis since the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991. […]

"The referendum doesn't have any legal consequences," said Valery Holenko, chairman of the Luhansk regional government. "But it has expressed the will of the people, which cannot be discounted. People genuinely went en masse to the referendum. This was a protest vote."

Holenko said the devolution of powers that the government is offering was no longer enough and that as a first step in appeasing eastern Ukrainians the government [sic] has to stop its "anti-terrorist operation" in the east.

Acting Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk, who was often busy with his iPad while some of the eastern lawmakers were making passionate speeches, called on the eastern leaders to resist the armed men and support the government's efforts to devolve powers to the regions.

"You have got in your home, in Luhansk and Donetsk, armed terrorists who are funded by Russians and those who fled Ukraine and want to seize our land," Yatsenyuk told the gathering.

"We're not going talk to robbers and terrorists. They will not be telling the Ukrainian people how to live in our country."

That is not the language of a neoliberal technocrat, which is what Yats was presented to us as. It is the language of a shameless, rabid fascist.

Posted by: Demian | May 18 2014 4:54 utc | 32

but, but, but, isn't he just repeating "our" famed negotiating strategy -- most recently obvious wrt Bashir Assad, who we refuse to even acknowledge is in any way a "stakeholder" in the future of Syria. It's the same thing we did with Saddam and Gadaffi -- we declare they are liars and illegitimate and have not place at the table ... bold as brass, bully boy because we get away with it. Let's see if Yats is allowed the same freedom ... doubtless his CIA advisers have assured him that this he-man stance will raise his profile in a "good way"

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 18 2014 5:07 utc | 33

One thing is certain the people of East Ukraine are facing long odds and are on their own. Everyone to their west is determined to see them fail and Russia is demanding that they surrender their arms, their buildings, their right to vote on referendums and submit to amnesty dictated by the Kiev Junta. Luckily for them they have rejected Putin's demands or they would already be under the heels of the thugs from Kiev.

This appears to be a real outbreak of Revolution by people grasping power and demanding direct control of their future. It's a shame that the majority of the people at the Maidan demonstration who had the same aspirations were overrun by the Fascists. It is possible that they may be inspired by the resistance in the East and rejoin the struggle, one can hope.

The fact that the people of East Ukraine are holding out and growing stronger, we'll see how the Steelworkers figure in the equation, is driving Obama Ltd to distraction and this whole poorly conceived power play may backfire, especially if people in the west begin to revolt. The massacre in Odessa was because there was resistance there and the rescue of the prisoners from the police shows the resistance continues. The reporting from Ukraine seems to be focused on blood and mayhem and not on telling the bigger story of what the resistance is actually doing and thinking, hopefully that will change.

Posted by: Wayoutwest | May 18 2014 6:17 utc | 34

VietnamVet | May 17, 2014 9:20:30 PM | 24 writes:

I never thought in my life that all that is preventing the USA from going to war with Russia is General Martin Dempsey.

I too was impressed when it was US Navy admiral Fallon that threw a monkey wrench into Bush/Cheney's efforts to escalate tensions against Iran in 2006-2007. We know now from Cheney's memoirs that he was disappointed in 2007 when Bush decided to avoid war with Iran. US imperial power resides in multiple power centers and the military is just one of those. They are supposed to be apolitical and are, for the most part. That means they are one of the power centers that is not infected with neocon ideology and maintain a realistic view of things. It is a sad day when the most sane voice at the center of American power happens to be the military.

Posted by: ToivoS | May 18 2014 6:34 utc | 35

Steiner ‏@Steiner1776 19m
#Donbass Recruitment video for #Donetsk & #Lugansk defense forces http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S7fjNwXijM … #Ukraine

Posted by: brian | May 18 2014 7:09 utc | 36

From WSWS

Akhmetov and other oligarchs seek role as Ukraine’s policemen

By Chris Marsden
17 May 2014

The New York Times has led efforts to portray the setting up of patrols employing “steelworkers” and “miners” in the eastern Ukrainian city of Mariupol as proof of a rising wave of opposition to all those presently engaged in conflict with the Kiev regime and its thugs.

In its front-page lead article Friday, the Times described the move as “a body blow,” asserting that “the pro-Russian protesters have melted away, as has any sign of the Donetsk People’s Republic or its representatives.”

The Times claimed that by late Thursday, “miners and steelworkers had deployed in at least five cities, including the regional capital, Donetsk.” But the Wall Street Journal reported patrols being mounted in only “four smaller towns” where the steel and mining oligarch Rinat Akhmetov’s company owns facilities, and cited a spokesman stating that “it wasn’t clear yet whether similar patrols could be introduced in Donetsk….”

Once again, the New York Times —the so-called “newspaper of record”—has distinguished itself only as a useful conduit for the crudest propaganda in the service of US imperialism.

In reality, the launching of the patrols has nothing to do with a movement in the working class. Along with their promotion by the Times and other sources, the patrols are part of a concerted effort by the United States and Germany to stifle resistance to Kiev’s coup regime and ensure that presidential elections planned for May 25 go ahead. To this end, the Western powers are seeking to use the wealth and influence of Ukraine’s oligarchs to bring things under control.

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2014/05/17/ukra-m17.html

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 8:55 utc | 38

Jumping Jack Flash indeed:

Kiev’s Jumping Jackboots… It’s a Gas, Gas, Gas!

Finian CUNNINGHAM | 18.05.2014 | 00:00

Well ain’t it a gas! The Western-installed neo-Nazi regime in Kiev wants to join the European Union and the US-led NATO military alliance in order to allegedly adopt Western standards of market principles and law. So they say, anyway.

Yet, in the capitalist West one abiding principle is that if you don’t pay your bills on time, then the bank or utility company can sue the customer for non-payment, leading to foreclosure or the utility supply being shut off.

In Kiev, the Western-sponsored coup, posing now as a sovereign government of Ukraine led by the self-styled Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk, wants to assume the responsibilities of state power. Their main responsibility so far is to wield a monopoly of state violence against so-called terrorists and separatists in the east and south of the country, who happen to dissent from the regime’s illegal self-imposed rule.

http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2014/05/18/kiev-jumping-jackboots-its-a-gas-gas-gas.html

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 9:25 utc | 39

Update from Graham Phillips:

Loud blasts and repeated heavy gunfire have been heard in the Ukrainian city of Slavyansk, according to freelance journalist Graham Phillips, who is reporting for RT.

Full-scale military operations are happening in Slavyansk and Kramatorsk, located in the north of Donetsk region, a self-proclaimed leader of the Donetsk People's Republic, Miroslav Rudenko, told RIA Novosti. He added that fighting escalated early on Sunday morning as Ukrainian troops tried to dismantle self-defense forces' posts. Information about the number of injures is not available.

The press secretary of the people's mayor of Slavyansk confirmed that fighting lasted all day on Saturday.

Graham Phillips said that the Ukrainian military has been active all around the outskirts of Slavyansk.

“There had been repeated blasts and we have reports that the Ukrainian military is on all sides of the city,” Phillips said.

“We have heavy fighting to the east of the city. I went there several hours ago and we had gunfire breaking out by eight o’clock. We had reports of the Ukrainian military moving in at that side. We got reports that they are moving in from the south, north and also action at the airfield at Kramatorsk – there is a conflict between the Ukrainian army and pro-Donetsk forces there,” he reported.

http://rt.com/news/159668-slavyansk-reports-heavy-fighting/

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 9:45 utc | 40

forgot to mention there's a good video in that link

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 9:49 utc | 41

This is what Pravy Sektor is boasting about.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 10:05 utc | 42

This is what Pravy Sektor is boasting about.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 10:05 utc | 43

Here's some sick shit from Reuters:

Failing Ukraine state plays in to Russia's hands

By Elizabeth Piper

KIEV Sun May 18, 2014 4:41am EDT

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/18/us-ukraine-crisis-russia-insight-idUSBREA4H02520140518

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 10:07 utc | 44

Some of the shooting around Slavyansk which Phillips reported was junta troops shooting their own troops.

ДНР: Украинских солдат расстреливают за желание перейти к ополченцам

Partial Yandex translation.

"DND: Ukrainian soldiers shot for wanting to go to the militia"

"The press Secretary of the people's Slavyansk mayor Vyacheslav Ponomareva Stella Horosheva told journalists that on may 18 ten Ukrainian military wanted to go over to the militia, but were shot by the officers of the Ukrainian nazvanii.

Ten people (the number of Ukrainian military) wanted to go to our side, but the Ukrainian guard themselves the rulers, they were shot, " said Horosheva may 18.

On the eighth of may in Slavyansk two servicemen of the Ukrainian army voluntarily went to the side of the militia. They claim that many of their colleagues also want to leave the location of its parts. But dare not all, fearing primarily retaliation by the radicals for their families."

Под Славянском в рядах нацгвардии произошел конфликт: есть убитые

Yandex translation.

"Under Slavonic in the ranks of nazvanii the conflict occurred: there are dead"

"Several Ukrainian military refused to fire on civilians and tried to go over to the militia, but were shot.

People's Slavyansk mayor Vyacheslav Ponomarev and militias told LifeNews details night attacks of the Ukrainian nazvanii and preparing new armed clashes.

In Slavyansk preparing for the storm, which stated the Ukrainian military. Militias pull forces to the borders of the city: armored vehicles drove up, going teams of fighters. Hours ago on Slavic flew the fighter. From the side of the mountain Karachun the shelling continues.

As the correspondent of LifeNews from a place of events, occurred at night several armed clashes on the outskirts of the city:

- In a night battle in Semenovka wounded one fighter of self-defense. Splinter in the face. Two people were ontogeny.

However, this is not the only collision. Shooting was heard near another roadblock, where, according to the Ukrainian law-enforcers were killed seven soldiers nazvanii. But as stated people's Slavyansk mayor Vyacheslav Ponomarev, from militias fire was not conducted.

This information was confirmed by the representatives of the self-defense of the checkpoint, which was heard shooting:

- Ukrainian soldiers were shooting at each other. As we found out later, about ten Ukrainian military army decided to lay down arms and said he did not want to shoot at civilians. They decided to go over to the militia. Officers of nazvanii tried to stop them, but could not. In the end, deserters were shot."

Second article includes a video report.

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 10:30 utc | 45

Lovely guy, Parubiy writing in the Wall Street Journal to ask for more weapons to fight Putin's (dreamed) invasion

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303908804579561884271779644

(French translation and nice pic of Parubiy in his favorite Halloween attire,
http://www.les-crises.fr/nazis-nous-appellent-a-l-aide/ )

Posted by: Mina | May 18 2014 10:45 utc | 46

The May 25 election is in Russia’s interests, because it will give Western policy makers their desired short-term victory on the ground, and then American leaders can begin to direct their attention elsewhere. It also saves European leaders from having to make economic sacrifices as part of sanctions nobody genuinely wants to impose on Russia.

- quote from National Interest, b’s top post (did not read the whole thing.)

No. 25 May elections are not in Russia’s interests. (1) The feb 21 agreement stipulated, national dialogue (whatever that is when it’s at home, see Burkhalter), a Constitutional Assembly, and then elections.

In short, the general status was to be discussed first (oblasts, federation or not, regional independence, languages, whatever.) The outcome would no doubt have been favorable to Russia’s interests, whether crassly commercial, sentimental, or do with Real-Politik. (Trade, influence, etc.) It was a good way to go, actually, for Ukrainians. So it was immediately junked by snipers and a fleeing president.

The 25 May elections (if ..) are uniquely in the interests of the Koup Kiev Gvmt. and certain US actors.

Once Poroshenko is elected, he simply becomes Prez Elect of the Koup Gvmt. and bolsters its legitimacy. (In time, various elections, parliamentary..) Constitutional discussion or reforms (if any) take place after his election and must be finagled by him within the present Constitution. Which is already a dead document - a) it was not followed, respected, for ousting Yanuko, b) it has been amended and changed since 21 Feb. Including electoral laws!

Europe bows down to the US and will tout that legitimacy too. But that is an admission of weakness and subservience and not in its interests. Eff the EU, right? Remember, the MAIN aim of the US is to prevent Europe from coming closer to Russia. Weakening Europe, dominating it, is thus on the agenda ever more than before.

The Ukr. oligarchs are just shuffling their ppl around, the Koup Gvmt. as well, flaunting a democratic facade. The aim - thrilling! - a Country completely run by Corps and large Biz. interests. That is why, right from the start, neo-nazi and fascist elements (Pravy Sektor, Svoboda..) were part of the plot and action on the ground.

1. If that happens, they will accept the result. wait and see.

Posted by: Noirette | May 18 2014 12:26 utc | 47

Has anyone read Israel Shamir's latest 'Ukraine in Turmoil: War May Come at Any Time as It Came Twice during the Last Century?

Shamir is exasperated with Putin:

Putin’s respect for others’ sovereignty is exasperating. I understand this sounds like a joke, you heard so much of Putin as a new Hitler. As a matter of fact, Putin had legal training before joining the Secret Service. He is a stickler for international law. His Russia interfered with other states much less than France or England, let alone the US. I asked his senior adviser, Mr Alexei Pushkov, why Russia did not try to influence Ukrainian minds while Kiev buzzed with American and European officials. “We think it is wrong to interfere”, he replied like a good Sunday schoolboy.

It is rather likely Putin advisors’ misjudged public sentiment. « The majority of Novorossia’s population does not like the new Kiev regime, but being politically passive and conservative, will submit to its rule”, they estimated. “The rebels are a small bunch of firebrands without mass support, and they can’t be relied upon”, was their view. Accordingly, Putin advised the rebels to postpone the referendum indefinitely, a polite way of saying “shove it”.

They disregarded his request with considerable sang froid and convincingly voted en masse for secession from a collapsing Ukraine. The turnout was much higher than expected, the support for the move near total. As I was told by a Kremlin insider, this development was not foreseen by Putin’s advisers.

Ukraine it seems, is Plan B after Plan A, Syria went pear-shaped. Ditto Venezulea (so far). Either way, this is a showdown, or rather, this is the showdown.

After all, isn't this the culmination of a process initiated by the US after WWII? Either, the US achieves total global hegemony, or it doesn't and in order to do that, it has to remove both Russia and China from the equation. Again, either they roll over and play dead (eg Russia and China over the invasion and destruction of Libya by NATO), or they stand up. What's it to be?

Shamir continues:

A few months ago, Russia had made a huge effort to become, and to be seen as, a very civilised European state of the first magnitude. This was the message of the Sochi Olympic games: to re-brand, even re-invent Russia, just as Peter the Great once had, as part of the First World; an amazing country of strong European tradition, of Leo Tolstoy and Malevich, of Tchaikovsky and Diaghilev, the land of arts, of daring social reform, of technical achievements, of modernity and beyond — the Russia of Natasha Rostova riding a Sikorsky ‘copter. Putin spent $60 b to broadcast this image.

The old fox Henry Kissinger wisely said:

Putin spent $60 billion on the Olympics. They had opening and closing ceremonies, trying to show Russia as a normal progressive state. So it isn’t possible that he, three days later, would voluntarily start an assault on Ukraine. There is no doubt that… at all times he wanted Ukraine in a subordinate position. And at all times, every senior Russian that I’ve ever met, including dissidents like Solzhenitsyn and Brodsky, looked at Ukraine as part of the Russian heritage. But I don’t think he had planned to bring it to a head now.

However, Washington hawks decided to do whatever it takes to keep Russia out in the cold. They were afraid of this image of “a normal progressive state” as such Russia would render NATO irrelevant and undermine European dependence on the US. They were adamant about retaining their hegemony, shattered as it was by the Syrian confrontation.

Most crucially, Shamir says:

The Ukraine is not a foreign entity to Russians, it is the western half of Russia. It was artificially separated from the rest in 1991, at the collapse of the USSR. The people of the two parts are interconnected by family, culture and blood ties; their economies are intricately connected. While a separate viable Ukrainian state is a possibility, an “independent” Ukrainian state hostile to Russia is not viable and can’t be tolerated by any Russian ruler. And this for military as well as for cultural reasons: if Hitler had begun the war against Russia from its present border, he would have taken Stalingrad in two days and would have destroyed Russia in a week.

/../

The Washington hawks still hope to force Putin to intervene militarily, as it would give them the opportunity to isolate Russia, turn it into a monster pariah state, beef up defence spending and set Europe and Russia against each other. They do not care about Ukraine and Ukrainians, but use them as pretext to attain geopolitical goals.

The Europeans would like to fleece Ukraine; to import its men as “illegal” workers and its women as prostitutes, to strip assets, to colonise. They did it with Moldova, a little sister of Ukraine, the most miserable ex-Soviet Republic. As for Russia, the EU would not mind taking it down a notch, so they would not act so grandly. But the EU is not fervent about it. Hence, the difference in attitudes [from the US'].

Shamir reckons that,

Putin will try to find an arrangement with the West for sharing authority, influence and economic involvement in the failed state. This can be done through federalisation, or by means of coalition government, or even partition. The Russian-speaking provinces of Novorossia are those of Kharkov (industry), Nikolayev (ship-building), Odessa (harbour), Donetsk and Lugansk (mines and industry), Dnepropetrovsk (missiles and high-tech), Zaporozhe (steel), Kherson (water for Crimea and ship-building), all of them established, built and populated by Russians.

There's more, I really do recommend reading it.

Posted by: William Bowles | May 18 2014 13:52 utc | 48

Demian at 2.

The Communist party in Ukraine is on the point of being banned for good by the Kiev Koup Gvmt. How to qualify that exactly (as there is no rule of law) is moot. The W of course won’t publish anything about any party being banned, as that goes against the democratic shtick.

Steel workers walking in the streets in kind of citizen patrol manner, or just to make their presence felt, when ordered by the Big Boss, is no worker triumph. In fact it is submission to the Big Employer, who orders, regulates, what is done in free-time, what pol. stance to take, etc.

In the steelworks in Ukr. (imho, comparing with others, never set a foot in Ukr.) the no. 1 allegiance is to the factory and the work place, and pol opinions are kept out, we are all mates together.

Quasi-forcing employees to act outside of work, as Akhenov has just done for federalization or whatever, as that is a necessity for continuing to earn profits, and civil war in any case would destroy everything, is but one other symptom of corporate power and take-over and total melt-down of Gvmt.

That he is ‘closer to Russia’ or what not is totally meaningless. The steel workers took over nothing (snippet from article you posted), they marched around and are facing terminal job loss.

The workers who come out into the streets may believe they are defending their interests, and in a way they are, as they want to keep their jobs and endure. At the same time, they become militant serfs.

here one vid (plz see pix i don’t agree with all said)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4iFvjchXGg

Posted by: Noirette | May 18 2014 14:15 utc | 49

@Noirette -- the question seems to be whether the steelworkers were mobilized to oppose (and hopefully neutralize by outnumbering) the pro-Kiev vigilantes who were -- the media reported -- recruiting, training and arming. I'm doubtful it's possible at this point to parse how "independent" much less "spontaneous" the formation of the steelworker "militia" was (however, without the approval and deep pockets of the Steelmill Oligarch probably means that those workers will not lose income and may be adequately equipped by same). As reported in the Guardian, [link] the pro-Kiev militia (aka "Donbas volunteer battalions") benefactor is unknown (the possibilities are endless), but apparently THOSE volunteers are being equipped and trained and deployed in a rapid recruit/deploy fashion. I don't think this is a "positive development" but the number of "steelworkers" appears to vastly outnumber the right wing Donbas "volunteers". Actually I'm expecting that the reported "vast natural resource Putin gained rights to by reclaiming Crimea" will be the next "outrage" to be exploited in the endless "challenging" of Putin.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 18 2014 14:31 utc | 50

It is militia against militia now - probably correct description.

Posted by: Noirette | May 18, 2014 10:15:40 AM | 49

In the steelworks in Ukr. (imho, comparing with others, never set a foot in Ukr.) the no. 1 allegiance is to the factory and the work place, and pol opinions are kept out, we are all mates together.

That is office rule anywhere.

Quasi-forcing employees to act outside of work, as Akhenov has just done for federalization or whatever, as that is a necessity for continuing to earn profits, and civil war in any case would destroy everything, is but one other symptom of corporate power and take-over and total melt-down of Gvmt.

It also is in the interest of close to everybody in Mariupol as the attack on the police - and their powerlessness in public space - was used for looting.

Let's hope Akhmetov pays overtime.

The hit and run attack on Mariupol smelled a lot like Mafia.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 14:42 utc | 51

Good site: THE US INDEPENDENT - When Quality and Integrity Matter Most

Susan Posel in interviews is eloquent, knowledgeable, with good timing, round statements. Very sexy laughter and seductive voice.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 18 2014 14:54 utc | 52

Noirette, that NYT video may be the best thing the paper's done on Ukraine. I took particular note when the reporter called the steel workers "neighborhood watch".

Susan Sunflower, good comments on this thread, but I think you hit the nail on the head @50. Akhmetov has enough power and influence with Kiev junta AND Russia that he's not to be messed with. If the armistice holds up in Mariupol, I think b is right "The steelworkers’ patrols seem to mark a turn in the conflict, but Akhmetov’s decision to use his clout may be more significant. [...] But with his decision to put his workers on the street, he may be saying enough is enough with the separatist movement in eastern Ukraine."

Perhaps that NYT vid reflects US State Dept wishful thinking, but I think Susan and b have it right.

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 14:59 utc | 53

@VietnamVet The war has already started, it's by different means, unconventional warfare by special ops, blackteams, commandos embedded with local thugs and criminals. It's global and incessant: NEO – Odessa: A Model of Warfare On the Cheap

Posted by: ProPeace | May 18 2014 14:59 utc | 54

@33 susan sunflower in response to @32 demians comment at bottom.. that is it exactly!

@35 toivos quote "It is a sad day when the most sane voice at the center of American power happens to be the military." that is indeed sad..

@38 okie quote "Once again, the New York Times —the so-called “newspaper of record”—has distinguished itself only as a useful conduit for the crudest propaganda in the service of US imperialism." maybe that is why they got rid of what's her name.. she was too crude in her outlay of the propaganda talking points..

@45 scalawag - interesting info and makes a lot of sense.

@46 mina.. that is all the usa seems capable of offering - weapons and recommendations to adopt crazy ass financial approaches - imf and etc..oh yea, and regurgitate the propaganda about 'terrorists' 24/7 while crossing your fingers no one acknowledges who the real terrorists are..

@48 william bowles. thanks - excellent overview.

Posted by: james | May 18 2014 15:15 utc | 55

It seems that the Ukraine usurpators are hesitant about holding an election on 25 may. They know that it maybe appear as a bogus election since half the country will boycott it, and anyway it will change nothing in the East attitude, in the contrary it can make it worse.
Therefore they probably prefer to postpone the election and blame Russia for that. As the West will be obliged to keep its threats, it will 'punish' Russia even more, thus creating an escalation of violence that may dismember Ukraine.
The USA and EU have changed by force a regime in countries like Iraq and Libya that had strong international allies. They failed in Syria because of strong long term allies, Russia and Iran. They did not learn the lesson, quite the contrary. They seek revenge on Russia by intervening in Ukraine. They dare confront Russia. They are realizing now that they have opened a pandora's box that will ultimately harm them and are now desperate to find a face saving exit.

Posted by: Virgile | May 18 2014 15:17 utc | 56

The USA and EU have changed by force a regime in countries like Iraq and Libya that had NO strong international allies .

Posted by: Virgile | May 18 2014 15:21 utc | 57

@48 william bowles. thanks for that article by Israel Shamir.. his tentative conclusion is not too far away from vietnam vets which we talked about here earlier in the thread..

Posted by: james | May 18 2014 15:29 utc | 58

Kiev will of course love the election since theres no opposition.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 18 2014 15:36 utc | 59

#48;Really now,Putin had no idea that the (pictured by the ZioMSM)Federalists were going to vote anyway.Please,he had to say that to defang the monsters,who were chomping at the interventionist bit.Masterful and wise,and now his popularity,where it counts,is up to 85% in Russia.

Posted by: dahoit | May 18 2014 15:48 utc | 60

The last three paragraphs of the Hudson piece say it all. The article has been posted here at MoA before. Thanks b, and the prior poster. This strategy applies globally. for those who haven't taken the time to read it, you should.

Posted by: ben | May 18 2014 15:51 utc | 61

ProP, Suzanne Posel may have "very sexy laughter and (a) seductive voice," her latest blatantly over-funded exercise in glossy high tech gimmickry and hype may bill itself as "INDEPENDENT - When Quality and Integrity Matter Most," and the whole thing may be infested with recycled analysis from genuine underground journalism of two to four weeks ago, but she's a fraud. That was obvious almost as soon as she appeared with her unintelligibly titled "Occupy Corporatism" website, which she claims "quickly became one of the most widely-read, linked to, and frequently-cited websites on the Internet," a claim which is of course absurd. That site, like this one, was an exercise in recuperation. Look it up. Why do you keep coming up with these phony, fifth-rate sources?

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 18 2014 15:55 utc | 62

I'm thinking the East Ukraine should vote - massively. Boycotts often lead to the worst candidate being elected. It shouldn't be too hard to figure out who the best of the worst is, and vote for him/her. IMO the chocolate king seems to be the oligarch that might be more reasonable. Certainly a neoliberal, but possibly someone who will pay attention to reasonable proposals to save Ukraine by urging trade ties with both EU and Russia's Customs Union.

I know most on this site think he'll win, and so does the media. Makes me nervous, nonetheless. Getting rid of the coup govt is important for the country, as well as Russia.

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 15:57 utc | 63

okie farmer

There is no opposition. Do some research of that chocolate guy, he is as anti-russian/east as anyone else in kiev.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 18 2014 16:16 utc | 64

On that Mashable site I read another story about Akhmetov's steelworkers, at the end of the piece "Akhmetov has been invited to attend the roundtable talks in Kiev, but it isn't known whether he'll attend."

(incidentally, Mashable is pro Kiev coup govt.)

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 16:21 utc | 65

Anonymous, I hate to hear that. That really means there's no best worst choice.

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 16:27 utc | 66

add:
The boycott might be the right approach.

Posted by: okie farmer | May 18 2014 16:29 utc | 67

okie farmer
67

I agree, yes I think boycott the best approach for the east instead of giving the corrupt system any support.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 18 2014 16:32 utc | 68

In the meantime - Austria (and EU Oettinger) joins South Stream.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 17:16 utc | 69

Boycotts do not work out well for the boycotters -- particularly boycotts against American allied elections -- see Iraq where there were several boycotts, which were then used as reasons to exclude the Sunnis and -- possibly worse in its way -- the noblesse oblige offering of "minority representation" to hand selected "cooperative" minority representatives, whose tenure (see the Sunni vice president of Iraq) can be suspended at will. The United States (hysterical to be freed of the responsibilities of an occupying force) shamefully validated the Iraqi election ...

Better to find a way to protest within the vote ... millions of votes on a referendum with a tiny vote for the top of the ballot and/or disproportionate votes for an insignficant minor or write-in candidate -- to demonstrate a willingness to participate and create a document a significant "no" vote for the "front-runner" ... It may not be possible ... Apparently there is movement for a boycott of this month's Egyptian election.

Posted by: Susan Sunflower | May 18 2014 17:45 utc | 70

Deutsche Welle names Pinchuk as possible owner of Burisma, the firm that hired Biden's son, as well as Kolomoisky.

Pinchuk is this guy.

And this is Deutsche Welle's description of the Round Table Talks - featuring Pinchuk's father in law.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 17:55 utc | 71

"There is no single paragraph in that long piece to quote. It is a tour de force binding together the historical and economic context of the conquest attempt we are witnessing in Ukraine."
b.

Couldn't agree more. Hudson has managed to squeeze the 1%'s plan for the world into a nutshell; albeit a big one but a nutshell nevertheless.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | May 18 2014 18:33 utc | 72

The people of East Ukraine are ignoring the sham elections and it is the people of West Ukraine who need to boycott this corrupt attempt to legitimize the Junta government. The only voting that matters is the referendums because they bypassed the corrupt system and gave the People power through direct democracy, this is why they were denounced by everyone involved because this kind of direct action could lead to other people thinking they can rule themselves, how distasteful for the Elites.

Posted by: Wayoutwest | May 18 2014 18:36 utc | 73

Posted by: William Bowles | May 18, 2014 9:52:18 AM | 48

Shamir panicked also about Crimea and thought Russia wasn't doing enough to help them. The piece you posted at your site is a mixture of similar panic, good analysis, poor analysis, accurate info, inaccurate info. In other words, Shamir is throwing a lot of things into the pot, but is not sure what is going on yet.

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 18:36 utc | 74

Quickly from Hudson's piece:

This means that the further economic inequality widens and the more a population is ground down into poverty and debt, the more the weak identify their interests with those of their oppressors. They believe that their best hope is that somehow the rich will reciprocate by accepting them in a patronage system. The effect is to demoralize populations and make them so fearful that they feel even more dependent on their oppressors, whom they hope will see how obediently they are behaving and will treat them better.

Adding to what I said in the other thread about this piece:

But like a good bourgeois liberal - h/t RB - Hudson doesn't speak to the OTHER HALF (or 20%? 30%?) of the equation involved here b/c it's not just those who are rendered destitute by the system that identify with their oppressors but - as they get richer and richer due to the fruits of finance capitalism - the very CURRENT and bourgeois class of which Hudson and his targeted audience are ALL APART OF who have been implicitly and silently acknowledging and - yes, condoning - these events again because they've been getting richer and richer all the while!!!!Hello? Any one home? Bueller?

Certainly by crafting scholarly and detailed analyses about events makes the bourgeois class feel as if they're doing something b/c NOW - after all this effing time - they NOW really understand just how evil the US is, right? Hmmm, funny how making money off of overtly and ridiculously inflated stock/housing etc markets will do that, huh, professionals? That the bourgeois fake lefties just don't have the time or wherewithal to think about the crimes being committed by the very people they look up to in this American/capitalistic system when it begins to threaten THEIR livelihoods, huh?

Don't break up Ukraine, it'll crash the economy!!!Oh yeah.....a scores and scores of people will be needlessly murdered/raped/maimed etc etc. That too. Thanks, Professor Hudson.

NOW that a member of their own privileged and moneyed class has explained it to the bourgeois fake left NOW they understand the US is not really the purveyor of black & white evil throughout the planet - as BILLIONS of people could easily attest to - it's just following a rational - or a least consciously theoretical - plan/strategy of action to which the bourgeois hangers-on RIGHT NOW identify with but who will NOW feel better writing (not too) scathing letters to the editors of the NYT comparing Kerry to Cheney - super-villian - and speak to how - sarcastically not angrily, mind you - they've all be so fucking clever in figuring out TPTB's plan of action! Caught you, guys!!!! Here's another zinger web-post!!! Take THAT Darth Cheney!

No matter the fact that the US war criminal strategy implicit in Hudson's piece has been in evidence for decade upon decade upon decade he joins in keeping the conscientious people busy as he makes it seem necessary for all of us to need to understand WHY the murder/rape/maiming/ etc are taking place.

Tell me, should I fucking care if Dahmer or any other serial killer etc was listening to Jesus, Satan, my mom or my hamster when he committed his crimes?

That these individual killers' patterns of crimes and human damage were all an outgrowth from some effing crazy - though detailed and internally logical - plan that only he could see originally but which after the crimes are committed are focused on/"discovered" by people - liberals especially - as providing some kind of mitigating perspective to said crimes?

Oh, the Nazis leaders thought - for example - that they REALLY WERE a Master Race. Why didn't you say that? Why, that changes EVERYTHING!!!!

I've got to run but after decades of crimes I see ZERO evidence that ANY bourgeois "understanding" the likes of which Hudson delivers to us here bring us as a planet ANY CLOSER to stopping what is going on and that is my point.

Yes, yes, we've got it Grand Chess Board, Cold War II, blah blah blah, but at the end of the day we are still viewing the perpetrators of these crimes as rational - yet misguided - people who just happen to have the blood of BILLIONS on their hands as they continue waging the US war of aggression - in all of its theaters and forms - that is 50+ years long now when their crimes scream that they should be treated as subhuman monsters and pariahs of civilization.

Quit effing thinking and start getting pissed/sickened for Christ's sake.

But my 401k appears to be resistant to the Ukraine crisis....

Posted by: JSorrentine | May 18 2014 18:47 utc | 75

@somebody #69:

That article's about Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban, not Austria. Hungarians are not fans of the Kyiv regime because Ukrainians have been trying to Ukrainize Hungarians stuck in the Ukraine ever since it gained independence.

@William Bowles #48:

It's interesting that the Shamir piece didn't appear in Counterpunch, where his pieces have previously appeared. I don't know what's up with that. Counterpunch damaged its credibility and prestige considerably by publishing Chris Floyd's lunatic Putin-hating rant.

@okie farmer #63:

The leaders of Donetsk and Sloviansk said that their provinces will not participate in the upcoming presidential election, and they have a record of keeping their word.

@Anonymous #64

According to the Daily Beast,

When Poroshenko talks about Putin, for instance, his language is never hateful, always calculated. In a political landscape filled with populist provocateurs, Poroshenko has never played that game, and that may well be why he’s leading all other announced and potential candidates for the critically important presidential elections to be held May 25.

I think that is correct. I think the main consequence of the election to look out for (if it takes place) is whether the new president will try, and whether he will succeed, in moderating the insanely anti-Russian stance of the putsch regime. He would have his work cut out for him, but I think that Poroshenko would be less of a US puppet than the junta.

The other notable upcoming event is the deadline of the end of May that Russia has given the junta to pay its gas bill. The junta obviously is not going to, and I believe that Russia will shut off the gas. It simply has to put more pressure on Kyiv, and follow through on at least some threats. The interesting thing then will be whether Kyiv responds by stealing gas from Europe, or "taking" it, as the BBC puts it.

I haven't seen anywhere mention of when the new president would come into office. He might try to reach an accommodation with Russia on the gas bill.

Both these looming issues—whether a new president would temper the craziness of the junta, and how Russia's shutting off Ukraine's gas would affect EU positions—are good reasons by themselves for Russia not intervening militarily in the Ukraine.

Posted by: Demian | May 18 2014 18:52 utc | 76

william bowles@48

Thanks for the link. This is good summary. This is the type of analysis that is completely missing from 21st century corporate controlled media.

ProPeace@54

I agree. The United States has been at war most of my lifetime. From WWII on, in each case, the enemy did not possess nuclear weapons. None of the wars threatened to escalate into a nuclear holocaust. LBJ expressly decided not to invade North Vietnam because of the threat of the use of Chinese and Russian nuclear weapons if he did. The disciples of the nutcases, back then who wanted to bomb them back to the Stone Age, have seized control of the US government except for the military. The danger from the Ukraine Civil War is that it can so easily escalate into a nuclear exchange between NATO and Russia. If we had a sane government that was run by and for the people, it would be working overtime to find an agreeable settlement to end the crisis; not giving its wholehearted support to anti-Russian neo-nazi hooligans.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 18 2014 18:58 utc | 77

Junta forces kidnap Russian journalists

I am waiting for the OSCE and the UN to be up in arms about this.

Posted by: Demian | May 18 2014 19:05 utc | 78

Correcting:

That the bourgeois fake lefties just don't have the time or wherewithal to think about the crimes being committed by the very people they look up to in this American/capitalistic system UNTIL it begins to threaten THEIR livelihoods, huh?

Later

Posted by: JSorrentine | May 18 2014 19:06 utc | 79

Posted by: Demian | May 18, 2014 2:52:19 PM | 76

The Gazprom Austria Deal is true - this in German is a full version, the Hungary article had one brief sentence in ti.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 19:17 utc | 80

@VietnamVet The problem is not the risk of the nuclear war, which I believe to be quite lower than a couple of months ago, but the new evil, and sadly much more likely to be implemented, strategy of low intensity conflict all over the place: in Europe, ME, Africa, Asia, Americas.
Without pause, break, just every week clashes/attacks/bombs somewhere caused by terrorists de-joure handled by the special forces. Constant state of semi-emergency, but without threatening the exploitation of the resources needed by the Big Business/special interests. Pipelines still pumping while people being killed nearby - that's our future envisioned by the newest plans from the stink-tanks of Transatlantists

Posted by: ProPeace | May 18 2014 19:23 utc | 81

80) that link also has a bit of information that might explain another coup attempt in Lybia - Austrian OMV has not been able to pump oil in Libya since March.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 19:27 utc | 82

@Rowan That's advertising, not fraud. And I welcome her initiative to create a Huffington-Post-like (in a good sense) website in the alternative blogosphere. We need attractive package for people of "regular" kind. Not everybody is like Rowan Berkeley with his sometimes too in-depth, sophisticated, wordy analyses. We need numbers to reach the critical mass for real change.
Anyway, it's evolving and people may like to check it out from time to time.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 18 2014 19:34 utc | 83

"...Quit effing thinking and start getting pissed/sickened for Christ's sake."

This just about sums up the J Sorrentine school of...
What? Vomiting, perhaps, as a more sincer reaction to reality than analysis.

What surprises me is not that J thinks that the time for thinking is past and the situation calls for an endless repetition of the enchanting mantra that thinking is wrong because thinkers eat and therefore require payment and therefore are just doing it for the money (which is essentially the reason given for rejecting Hudson's explanation, for those who won't take J.Sorrentine's word for it, of the progress of events in Ukraine) but that he bothers to repeat the same point, at great length, day after day and week after week.

It is a waste of fucking time and brains.

It is not as if J objects to Hudson and intellectual analysis because he has an alternative. The only explanation Sorrentine gives of the Ukrainian crisis is that the US is ruled by criminals.
Fair enough.
But Hudson goes further. Which is not to J's taste. Either Hudson subscribes to every jot and tittle of the Sorrentine rant or he is to be denounced as a hypocrite making money out of those over whom he sheds crocodile tears; a rank careerist, a bourgeois masking the crimes of the Empire by attributing them to political economy rather than-the Sorrentine approved explanation-homicidal mania.

Discussions and debates on this blog, which sometimes involve contributions from dozens of thoughtful, knowledgeable people, are increasingly hi-jacked by one trick hobby horse riders such as Sorrentine and Rowan Berkeley, who salts his demented-Blame the Jews-rigamarolls with slices of dessicated "marxism" intended to suggest that behind his weird imaginings lies a Herr Doktor Professor up to his armpits in dialectical materialism and esoteric ideologies.

The truth is that just as "No more thinking please: let's all barf in unison" is anti-intellectual nonsense. So blaming the Jews for everything is racist, self indulgent, criminal stupidity.

It matters little but both of these practitioners of the most bourgeois and antiquated of alternatives to thinking preen themselves with the feathers and paint-the patter and the self regarding manner of the con artist whose con is affect a lifelong acquaintanceship with the works of Karl Marx.
A man who, whatever his personal failings and private griefs, used deep, rigorous critical analysis not as a means to make a name for himself but to fight along with the wretched of the earth for emancipation.

Posted by: bevin | May 18 2014 19:46 utc | 84

@ Posted by: somebody | May 18, 2014 3:17:45 PM | 80

Correct me if I'm wrong but my understanding was that what OMV and Gazprom have just signed is a Memorandum of Understanding not a binding contract.

Also from the article you posted:

EU-Kommissar Günther Oettinger sprach sich zuletzt nicht grundsätzlich gegen den Bau der von Russland vorangetriebenen Gaspipeline South Stream aus. Bislang stand die EU dem Projekt kritisch gegenüber, weil es die Abhängigkeit Europas von russischem Gas nicht reduziert, sondern lediglich die Ukraine als Transitland umgeht. OMV und Gazprom arbeiten seit Jahren zusammen.

If that's correct then that's big news as prior to now the EU Commission has been actively hostile to Gazprom particularly Gazprom becoming involved with Baumgarten.

Finally (because I'm greedy :-) ) is there any chance you could post a link to the article in "Wirtschaftsblatt" referred to?

Dubhaltach

Posted by: Dubhaltach | May 18 2014 19:50 utc | 85

Posted by: Dubhaltach | May 18, 2014 3:50:24 PM | 85

Contracts are complex, you won't get anything but a memorandum of understanding at this stage. But the intention is clear, and they will most likely follow through.

Here is Reuters on Oettinger not blocking any more.

This here is the Wirtschaftsblatt Link on Gazprom Price for Austria.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 20:03 utc | 86

@ Posted by: bevin | May 18, 2014 3:46:07 PM | 84

Just scroll past - their style is so predictable that after a while you get to recognise from the first sentence or two that it's yet another one their effusions and can thus be safely ignored.

As to your "Herr Doktor Professor" remark I deeply resent you casting aspersions on such a gifted and hard working academic !!!???!!!

Dubhaltach

PS: I decline to accept responsibility for however much time you waste clicking in horrified fascination at that site. Nor will I pay for your ribs to be bandaged up if you crack 'em by laughing excessively.

D

Posted by: Dubhaltach | May 18 2014 20:08 utc | 87

@ Posted by: somebody | May 18, 2014 4:03:51 PM | 86

Many thanks for both those, much appreciated - agreed about MOUs. That being said this Reuters (English language) article seems a bit more emphatic Side deals with Moscow thwart drive to wean Europe off Russian gas | Reuters

I especially liked the quiet little kicker in the last paragraph.

Dubhaltach

Posted by: Dubhaltach | May 18 2014 20:16 utc | 88

Somewhat off topic, but a great rant on the kind of unchecked western corruption that ultimately leads to western war crimes in places like the Ukraine.

Obama-Walmart-Barbara Walters — Slum Lords & Bedbugs

Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 20:31 utc | 89

Posted by: Dubhaltach | May 18, 2014 4:16:30 PM | 88

English language Reuters seems to have put a bit of moral outrage into it. I do find the way, Gazprom seems to think German Social Democrats are good for business quite intriguing.

Posted by: somebody | May 18 2014 20:37 utc | 90

Back on topic, the nazis have staged an assault on Kramatorsk today.

Kiev army shells Kramatorsk, city ‘left without water’ – self-defense coordinator

Also:

Russian journalists detained by Kiev forces near Kramatorsk in E. Ukraine


Posted by: scalawag | May 18 2014 20:41 utc | 91

It isurely isn't fair to the "let's all barf at everybody who thinks because they also eat" (or "Sorrentinian" school) and the "let's all blame the Jews while pretending to be dessicated Herr Professor Marxists" (or "Berkeleyan" school) into a two-for-the-price-of-one rant, because they are different. The only things they have in common is that they both maintain that Hudson is a bourgeois apologist, and so is bevin,and so therefore must be Dubhaltach, who rather seems to specialise in agreeing with bevin. There are all sorts of patent weaknesses in bevin's polemics which would become rather more obvious if he didn't roll two different rants into one like this.

I have noticed over the last few days that a greater injection of bourgois moderation is appearing on these groaning boards (that's a pun, and you can groan too). Susan Sunflower, for instance, is a moderate, from her ephonious name to her curly verbal toes. She provides a perfect example of moderate thinking when she says: "Boycotts do not work out well for the boycotters -- particularly boycotts against American allied elections." The assumption behind this sweeping universal is based on just one case, arguably misunderstood, viz Iraq. But an accurate generalisation should not be based on just one case, especially a dubious one like Iraq in fact is.

Boycotts, strikes, and even armed revolutions, will work under certain rather complex conditions: not just such and such pre-existing, explicit support from such and such sectors of the population, but also several decisive conditions regarding which sections will jump which way and why, after the thing starts to roll. I have always said that the decisive condition for an armed revolution, which is the limit case, is that the army must mutiny, and that isn't a simple statement either, because what I really mean is, everyone below the rank of full colonel must mutiny, except in the most carefully vetted security battalions.

One of the most interesting and least explored things about Ukraine is the exact extent of the army mutiny, but it's clearly very considerable. The rest of the population tends to live in a sort of mass psychological shopping arcade state of mind, but armies live under a permanent command economy (typically misunderstood by usaian so-called libertarians, who understand nothing at all, as 'socialism'). They know what command economies can do, and can't. Others know nothing except the market.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 19 2014 0:35 utc | 92

It isurely isn't fair to the "let's all barf at everybody who thinks because they also eat" (or "Sorrentinian" school) and the "let's all blame the Jews while pretending to be dessicated Herr Professor Marxists" (or "Berkeleyan" school) into a two-for-the-price-of-one rant, because they are different. The only things they have in common is that they both maintain that Hudson is a bourgeois apologist, and so is bevin, and so therefore must be Dubhaltach, who rather seems to specialise in agreeing with bevin. There are all sorts of patent weaknesses in bevin's polemics which would become rather more obvious if he didn't roll two different rants into one like this.

I have noticed over the last few days that a greater injection of bourgois moderation is appearing on these groaning boards (that's a pun, and you can groan too). Susan Sunflower, for instance, is a moderate, from her ephonious name to her curly verbal toes. She provides a perfect example of moderate thinking when she says: "Boycotts do not work out well for the boycotters -- particularly boycotts against American allied elections." The assumption behind this sweeping universal is based on just one case, arguably misunderstood, viz Iraq. But an accurate generalisation should not be based on just one case, especially a dubious one like Iraq in fact is.

Boycotts, strikes, and even armed revolutions, will work under certain rather complex conditions: not just such and such pre-existing, explicit support from such and such sectors of the population, but also several decisive conditions regarding which sections will jump which way and why, after the thing starts to roll. I have always said that the decisive condition for an armed revolution, which is the limit case, is that the army must mutiny, and that isn't a simple statement either, because what I really mean is, everyone below the rank of full colonel must mutiny, except in the most carefully vetted security battalions.

One of the most interesting and least explored things about Ukraine is the exact extent of the army mutiny, but it's clearly very considerable. The rest of the population tends to live in a sort of mass psychological shopping arcade state of mind, but armies live under a permanent command economy (typically misunderstood by usaian so-called libertarians, who understand nothing at all, as 'socialism'). They know what command economies can do, and can't. Others know nothing except the market.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 19 2014 0:37 utc | 93

It isurely isn't fair to the "let's all barf at everybody who thinks because they also eat" (or "Sorrentinian" school) and the "let's all blame the Jews while pretending to be dessicated Herr Professor Marxists" (or "Berkeleyan" school) into a two-for-the-price-of-one rant, because they are different. The only things they have in common is that they both maintain that Hudson is a bourgeois apologist, and so is bevin, and so therefore must be Dubhaltach, who rather seems to specialise in agreeing with bevin. There are all sorts of patent weaknesses in bevin's polemics which would become rather more obvious if he didn't roll two different rants into one like this.

I have noticed over the last few days that a greater injection of bourgois moderation is appearing on these groaning boards (that's a pun, and you can groan too). Susan Sunflower, for instance, is a moderate, from her ephonious name to her curly verbal toes. She provides a perfect example of moderate thinking when she says: "Boycotts do not work out well for the boycotters -- particularly boycotts against American allied elections." The assumption behind this sweeping universal is based on just one case, arguably misunderstood, viz Iraq. But an accurate generalisation should not be based on just one case, especially a dubious one like Iraq in fact is.

Boycotts, strikes, and even armed revolutions, will work under certain rather complex conditions: not just such and such pre-existing, explicit support from such and such sectors of the population, but also several decisive conditions regarding which sections will jump which way and why, after the thing starts to roll. I have always said that the decisive condition for an armed revolution, which is the limit case, is that the army must mutiny, and that isn't a simple statement either, because what I really mean is, everyone below the rank of full colonel must mutiny, except in the most carefully vetted security battalions.

One of the most interesting and least explored things about Ukraine is the exact extent of the army mutiny, but it's clearly very considerable. The rest of the population tends to live in a sort of mass psychological shopping arcade state of mind, but armies live under a permanent command economy (typically misunderstood by usaian so-called libertarians, who understand nothing at all, as 'socialism'). They know what command economies can do, and can't. Others know nothing except the market.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 19 2014 0:38 utc | 94

Sorry, the MoA server is being weird. It twice told me it had failed to post that, because of a "timeout", so I twice tried again. Perhaps b can remove the duplicates?

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 19 2014 0:39 utc | 95

Vietnam Vet, thank you for your contributions here.

Posted by: guest77 | May 19 2014 0:52 utc | 96

Link to RT, Putin pre-China visit interview

Q: In 2015, our countries will celebrate the 70th anniversary of Victory over fascism. What is the impact of joint Russian-Chinese efforts to oppose the attempts aimed at challenging the results of World War II?

VP: It is true that the attempts to rewrite and distort history are becoming more frequent.

Four years ago Russia and China adopted a Joint Statement on the 65th Anniversary of Victory in the Second World War.

We share an idea that it is unacceptable to revise the results of the war, as the consequences will be extremely grave.

It is clearly evident from the tragic events currently unfolding in Ukraine, where violent neo-Nazis are waging a real campaign of terror against civilians.

I would like to express my gratitude to our Chinese friends for cherishing the memory of thousands of our compatriots, who sacrificed their lives to liberate Northeast China from invaders.

Next year we will hold a range of joint events to mark the 70th anniversary of Victory both in the bilateral and the SCO format. During these events, youth will be in the focus of our work.

We will certainly continue to oppose attempts to falsify history, heroize fascists and their accomplices, blacken the memory and reputation of heroic liberators.

Posted by: anonymous | May 19 2014 1:57 utc | 97

@ 84 Bevin

"...Quit effing thinking and start getting pissed/sickened for Christ's sake."

This just about sums up the J Sorrentine school of...
What? Vomiting, perhaps, as a more sincer reaction to reality than analysis.

Most of us have been analyzing the antics of US Gov't for about 15 years now... the 'light bulb' went on for many of us long ago. I get Sorrentine's frustration... what the hell are we going to DO about the mess we see happening to our planet. Hudson's article is great, as far a stating the obvious (well, what's obvious to many at any rate)... analysis doesn't create a fire in the belly. Statement of facts, that is to say recitation of crimes committed, is a great motivator -

When are Americans (left and right) going to shout "I'm pissed and I'm not taking this anymore?" (one of the forums I used to visit and frequently post is totally anti-Putin - so much for intelligence and analysis - they are venting all their unexpressed frustration with Obama onto Putin. Apparently Cognitive Dissonance is a real bitch for progressives.)

Posted by: crone | May 19 2014 1:58 utc | 98

ps

I'm 75 and I'd take to the streets except that I live in a Red County in a Red State and I am fully aware that my neighbors would report me and I'd be in jail (or under it)...

Posted by: crone | May 19 2014 2:01 utc | 99

That article's about Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban, not Austria. Hungarians are not fans of the Kyiv regime because Basen Eritme Ukrainians have been trying to Ukrainize Hungarians stuck in the Ukraine ever since it gained independence.

Posted by: Sagliklibirey | May 19 2014 2:10 utc | 100

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