Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
May 24, 2014

Ukraine: Major "Western" Think Tank Admits Defeat

There is simply no viable alternative for Ukraine than to cooperate with Russia and to pay the price that is necessary to do so. That is why Russia is just sitting back and waiting for that simple truth to become evident.

Back in February we said:

Putin will now sit back and let the "west" squabble about who will throw tons of money into the bottomless pit that Ukraine is going to become. ... Putin now just has to wait for the apple to fall from the tree.

In March:

To the growing unrest one can add the likely economic collapse that will come rather sooner than later. Any "western" help will be conditioned on austerity and impoverishing the people as well as on political reform that the oligarchs and the current politicians will not allow to happen. Under such condition further unrest is a given while Ukraine falls apart and there is no need at all for Russia to intervene to achieve such.

Russia will do nothing nefarious, it will do just nothing. Russia will not help, neither economically nor politically, unless Kiev and the "west" are willing to pay its price: A federalized Ukraine with strong regions and a weak central government.

Two month later this truth finally dawns to the mediocre thinkers in those "western" misnomed tanks. The Brookings Institute, which in general supports Obama policies, finally admits that a Ukraine without Russia is impossible and therefore cooperation with Russia on Ukraine is the Only viable way forward. It all comes back to money. The loss of access to Russian markets is already hitting and will kill Ukraine's heavy and weapon industry in east Ukraine. That will be expensive:

[A] minimum estimate is $276 billion to buy off the east. It is unthinkable that the West would pay this amount.
The key point here is that there can be no viable Ukraine without serious contributions from both Russia and the West. Of all the options for Ukraine’s future, a Ukraine exclusively in the West is the least feasible. A Ukraine fully under Russian control and with severed links to the West is, unfortunately, possible.

A Ukraine in the "west" is impossible. A Ukraine within the Russian Federation is possible but would somewhat hurt Russia at lest in the short term. A finlandized Unkraine, in which Russia has a major say is the best possible outcome for all sides.

The upcoming sham elections of the chocolate king Poroshenko over which Russia has major sway -his markets and some of his factories are in Russia- is now just a fig leaf for the "west" to disengage. Poroshenko will be send eastward to pledge allegiance to Russia and to sign the unconditional surrender treaty. He has to:

[H]ving normal relations with Russia is a natural position for Ukraine which fits her strategic interests. For this basic reason, Ukrainian politicians haven’t the slightest chance of ignoring their past, present, or future ties with Russia, regardless of the fact that they are talking about it.

He will then have to suppress the nazis in the west Ukraine. The political part of the EU Association Agreement, which the coup government signed, will be revoked and the economic part will not be signed at all.

All this now seems to turn into a major defeat for the neo-cons who completely misjudged the situation:

Strategists in the US may not have foreseen that, because of the very delicate domestic equilibrium of so many difference forces and actors, the Ukrainian state may have simply disintegrated in the face of a drastic geopolitical turn, as it is indeed happening.
The US finds itself once again in the awkward position of having decisively contributed to the insurgence of a certain critical phase [...] where however the partners and allies on the ground [...] are successively abandoned at the decisive moment ..

The neocons had planned this attack on Russia via Ukraine and Crimea and they, again, failed. That does not mean that the issue is over. In sight of defeat the neocons love to "surge" and to escalate the situation. But as seen in Iraq and Afghanistan such "surges" are unlikely to change the inevitable outcomes.

Posted by b on May 24, 2014 at 15:17 UTC | Permalink

« previous page | next page »

yeah, the "west's" original plan seems to have been to keep ukraine intact to serve as a block to russian energy exports...

fallback position... wreck ukraine and blame russia

meanwhile, the grownups in the energy business are going ahead with the south stream pipeline, which is intended to bypass neocon bullsh*t in ukraine

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 5:26 utc | 101

Posted by: Demian | May 25, 2014 12:32:17 AM | 94

No, capitalist media is 'free' to censor as much of the political spectrum as they feel like. It's why we need a democratic media and not a capitalist one.

Posted by: fairleft | May 25 2014 5:52 utc | 102

This analysis by Paul Craig Roberts may be of some interest for both its source and its already known content.

Posted by: Hannah K. O'Luthon | May 25 2014 5:54 utc | 103

98) Demian
Simple. They live there.
Seems all of Ukrainian neighbors have been offering passports to "their" ethnic groups. Which in the case of EU passports will have been gladly accepted as in the case of Russian passports, too.
Russian Ukrainians are bound to be supported by Russian nationalist organization, not necessarily by the state. But the state tolerates it. Same like the Western support system, really.

This here is another take on the South Eastern conference where Novorussia was proclaimed.

Sounds like they are far from marginal.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 6:41 utc | 104

Please, Scalawag, or anyone who is reading the russian-language blogs, give us some real-time updates on what is happening to Slavyansk! Obviously there is a massive blackout operating throughout the mainstream media, including the Russian MSM. I know the bastards are shelling Slavyansk, and I very much fear they may start, or may have started, rocketing it. The point about the rockets, be they Smerch or whatever, is that the bastards can level a whole city block with one salvo. So what is going on there, tell us, please!

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 6:47 utc | 105

Posted by: LolWut? | May 24, 2014 9:04:04 PM | 66

thanks for the response, but it is no answer - I still do not know who you are talking about.

Posted by: Fran | May 25 2014 6:48 utc | 106

The split of Ukraine

From 2012

With the declaration of Russian as a regional minority language in one half of the country, and a possibility of switching to Polish citizenship in the other, isn’t it somehow hard to come up with an example of positive implications?

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 7:08 utc | 107

@105 The blogs are silent, the news outlets only mention a counterattack yesternight on the Ukie forces.

Said couple of vehicles blown up, casualties so far unkown but presumed to be present.

Posted by: Grim Deadman | May 25 2014 7:53 utc | 108

105/108 From the past - Jamestown Foundation - Radical Ukrainian Nationalism and the War in Chechnya

From February 27, 2014 Chechen Leader Kadyrov offers to send troops, peacekeepers to Ukraine

On the intricacies of involving Chechnya in Ukraine

Lifenews reporters were freed by Kadyrov negotiating in Kiev.

For some reason the Italian journalists who seem to have got killed by Ukrainian shells later seem to compare the situation in Slaviansk to Grozny.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 8:39 utc | 109

more on today's Ukrainian nationalists fighting in Chechnya and Georgia.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 9:07 utc | 110

The killed Italian translator Andrei Mironov was a co founder of Memorial concerned with human rights violations in Chechnya.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 9:17 utc | 111

And now we are back in Nulandistan - Chechen Terrorists and the Neocons

The interesting thing about Kadyrov is that his clan switched sides in the Second Chechen War. He is bound to have a lot of information on Right Sector militants who fought in that war.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 9:53 utc | 112

yup, the american committee for peace in chechnya is made up of pretty much the same people as PNAC...

...including victoria nuland's husband, robert kagan and an all-star cast of neocon heavy hitters

when you couple the chechens up to the orange revolution in ukraine and the rose revolution in georgia, a patterne seems to emerge...

boris berezovsky. who vowed to overthrow putin by forcebefore he strung humself up, was apparently a great supporter of shamil basayev, who claimed resposibility for the beslan operation in north ossetia...

just too damn bad basayev and his chechen terrorists killed those schoolkids .. that kinda leaves the chechens in bad odor

membership list: american committee for peace in chechnya

list of PNAC signatories

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 10:14 utc | 113

So it follows, then: these Chechens who are fighting in Ukraine, they must have cast off any pretence that they were ever fighting for Islam, correct? They are now fighting for the global zionazi empire, and it's impossible to pretend anything else.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 10:28 utc | 114

Rowan Berkeley

What are you talking about?

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 10:32 utc | 115

I can't put it more clearly than I just did. I expect a few of you to say "Thank you, Rowan, you've hit the nail exactly on the head," and the rest of you to bullshit away furiously to try to obscure the clarity of it.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 10:43 utc | 116

1997.... PNAC founded by bill kristol and rober kagan

1999... american committee for peace in chechnya founded... mostly same people as PNAC

sept 2000... PNAC says they need a new pearl harbor

post-election 2000... PNAC/AEI people installed in the US government after an election recount in a state governerned by a PNAC signatory

sept 2001... PNAC's new pearl harbor materializes

late 2003... rose revolution in georgia... neocon Mikheil Saakashvili is installed early 2004

sept 2004... beslan school massacre... chechen terrorist basayev clims responsibility for operation in which 186 schoolkids are killed

nov 2004... orange revolution in ukraine

2008... georgia neocon saakashvili attacks south ossetia and abkhazia, western press attempts to blame putin, putin hands saakashvili his ass

meanwhile, putin's biggest sin was progressing as he purged neocon russians in control of russian media and energy...

and how you gonna achieve your benevolent global hegemony if you dont control russia?

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 10:47 utc | 117

@Rowan Berkeley 114
For your information "Chechens" come in two flavors and though both are muslims there are "some differences" between them.
May be your red colored spectacles are a bit of hindrance?

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 10:47 utc | 118

It is too complex for Rowan. That is why it is such a good idea to have Chechens fighting in Ukraine.

Boston Marathon Attacks, Chechnya and Oil – the Hidden U.S. Connection

In 2005 the western consortium attempting to cut Russia out of the Caspian energy loop achived its goal. The $3.6 billion, one million barrel per day, 1,092-mile Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan (BTC) pipeline, which ships Azeri Caspian oil to Turkey’s Mediterranean Ceyhan port, began operations in May 2005, transiting high-quality crude from Azerbaijan's offshore Azeri-Chirag-Guneshli fields to Turkey's deep-water Mediterranean terminus at Ceyhan.

Accordingly, the Chechen conflict dovetailed perfectly not only into Washington’s plans, to bog down the Russian military in a long, drawn-out conflict in the Caucasus, but provide Western energy companies with an alternative route as Chechnya was slowly ground down by the Russian military.

Oil that would have otherwise moved northwards to Russia, providing lucrative transit fees.

Chechnya proved ground zero for both Western political and business interests.

All of the above history, virtually unknown in the U.S., is deeply known to every Chechen. The shadow war between Moscow and Washington for the Caspian’s energy riches saw Chechnya squarely caught in the middle, leaving the Chechen homeland virtually destroyed, something to remember when reading the increasingly contradictory news reports coming out of Washington about the blood shed in Boston by the Tsarnaev brothers, as the U.S. is hardly blameless about the carnage visited on their ancestral homeland

The Kadyrow clan, by the way, switched sides because they could not stand Saudi Wahhabis.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 10:50 utc | 119

i spose, in theory, once you regain control of russian energy, you have a shot at subduing china...

but geology and geography and common decency seem to be working against the neocons... and i guess they realize that... that's what "nuclear primacy" for... nuke first strikes on russia and china so overwhelming that russia and china are unable to retaliate

good deal

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 10:59 utc | 120

googling: "nuclear primacy" "firsty strike" russia china

this is not my fault
in 51,212 (Old Christian Calendar), rudyard kipling was granted a limited-stay, one-time reincarnation so he could update his "just so" stories

"how white people got their brown skin" is one of his new stories

on the banks of the great grey-green, greasy Limpopo River….

the Great Nuke War was started by the US, in belief that their nuclear primacy would make retaliation impoosible… but the ability to retaliate had survived and the war escalated

the battle lines had been drawn long before by western media, and the UK, canada, australia and parts of western europe supported the US

the war was a disaster… such a disaster that white people became pariahs

the global anti-whitism became so pronounced that white females started seeking colored mates so their offspring would have a chance of escaping the stigma…

…the stigma of being white

and that, Best Beloved, is how white people got their brown skin

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 11:05 utc | 121

May be your red colored spectacles are a bit of hindrance?

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25, 2014 6:47:51 AM | 118

much as I often disagree with Mr Berekely, and even annoy him with conter-points, his red-coloured spectacles are a damn sight more revealing than the shit-covered spectacles that many, such as yourself, appear to favour ;-)

Posted by: LolWut? | May 25 2014 11:11 utc | 122

Be prepared to hear in some hours that this was the most legitimate and free election ever in history, by obama/merkel/eu/nato/u.s

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 11:22 utc | 123

120 - nuclear primacy seems to have been a pipe dream.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 11:43 utc | 124

of course nuclear primacy is a pipedream

no sane decent person would think of such a thing

but i've never accused neocons of being same or decent

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 11:48 utc | 125


Hes talking specifically about the chechens who are A. religious extremists and B. fought against russia in the Chechen war. Hes not talking about peaceful muslim chechens or peaceful nonmuslim chechens, and warlike nonmuslim chechens didnt exist in large numbers in the chechen war to my knowledge.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 25 2014 12:00 utc | 126

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25, 2014 7:48:41 AM | 125

That is the problem, they are neither sane nor decent, how come they are in high office? Americans/Europeans just don't notice?

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 12:00 utc | 127

Ok, they're fighting for Russia, against the zionazi empire.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 12:01 utc | 128

somebody asks, @ 127, "they are neither sane nor decent, how come they are in high office? "

it's called the holocaust exemption

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 12:04 utc | 129

but we really dont know... they may be fronting for somebody...

it wouldnt be the first time

but that's how the system works

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 12:07 utc | 130

cheney was cast as the fall guy, just in case... he's the perfect bad guy, with that snarl

somehow he escaped, but then the official 9/11 story has held up well enough to be serviceable still, so there hasnt been much pressure to find scapegoats

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 12:10 utc | 131

Posted by: bevin | May 24, 2014 6:30:57 PM | 56

Thank you. You've helped me put my own thoughts into sharper focus.

Posted by: madisolation | May 25 2014 12:15 utc | 132

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25, 2014 8:07:51 AM | 130

they are the sales people for the arms industry that much is clear.

from 2008

NATO's Role Requires EU Allies to Up Defense Spending, US Envoy Says

from 2013

But I’m also dismayed that Allies expect to sleep safely at night on the cheap and ever cheaper. Just five years ago, average defense spending by our Allies stood at around 1.7 percent of GDP. By 2012, it had dropped to below 1.4 percent. So, as we bring our combat troops home from Afghanistan and look toward a NATO Summit in the United Kingdom next fall, we need a renaissance in the way we think about collective defense and security.

May 2014

NATO leaders plan to push European countries to increase defense spending at September’s meeting of alliance members in Wales, amid Russia’s military buildup on its border with Ukraine and annexation of Crimea.

They complement their sales pitch by creating the crises they need to argue for an increase of spending.

It is like this Chaplin glass repair man employing a kid to throw a stone through the windows.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 12:25 utc | 133

On Mar 1, Dmitr Yarosh posted a call on the social network, urging Chechen separatist leader Doku Umarov to support Ukraine's anti-Russian forces "with weapons in arms." Yarosh wrote:

Ukrainians have always supported the liberation struggle of the Chechen and other Caucasian peoples. Now it’s the time for you to support Ukraine. As the Right Sector leader, I urge you to step up the fight. Russia is not as strong as it seems.

During the first Chechen war, Yarosh was among several Ukrainian militants fighting against Russian troops. His post has caused indignation in republics of the North Caucasus and among the Russian public and lawmakers.


VoR, today: Oleg Sidyakin and Marat Saychenko, who were detained in Ukraine about a week ago and released on Saturday evening, claim to have spotted several mercenaries at Kramatorsk airfield in the eastern Donetsk region. Sidyakin told a press conference on Sunday:

There were lots of mercenaries at the airfield. There were people dressed in uniforms that aren’t typical of Ukraine. They talked to no one and walked into the headquarters in silence. We still can’t figure out who those people might be. Their behavior, the way the held themselves were odd. as was the fact that they didn’t speak to anyone.

There's an assumption that they were english-speakers, but why shouldn't they have been Chechens? Anti-Russian ones? That's what I was originally thinking of. There are more likely to be anti-Russian Chechens fighting for Kiev, and in order to fit in in this new environment, they would have to stop pretending to be Islamists, and just admit they are working for the western powers, the 'zionazi empire' as I called it, against Russia, because they hate Russia. That's what I meant. I haven't actually seen any solid evidence that there are any Chechens fighting on either side, but if there are, they could just as well be these ones as those ones. Kadyrov apparently got the LifeNews journalists out (presumably by paying an enormous secret ransom, I can't think how else) but Kadyrov is not representative of the entire Chechen people, far from it. There are Chechen 'Islamists' in Syria, though admittedly they have been fighting each other quite a lot of the time, because of the struggle between Jabhat al-Nusra and ISIS. Chechens are acutely divided politically, with some supporting the anti-Russian 'Islamist' movements and regarding Kadyrov as a stooge of an occupying power. It's hard to imagine that Chechnya is in any real sense a Russian ally, given its history.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 12:31 utc | 134

Somebody #110
Berruyer traced the hoax about tortured guys with their eyes pulled out to a FB page for an al Qaeda fan with US Turkish-speakers connections

Posted by: Mina | May 25 2014 12:32 utc | 135


yeah, it's hard to believe anyone but racial supremacists and religious fanatics really believes in any of this stuff

more likely they're just common garden-variety looters, looting an empire that's doomed because there's just not gonna be enough oil...
do we know the rreal reason tall those generals were purged from the US nuke forces?

did they purge the sane ones or the crazy ones?

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 12:33 utc | 136

Anna News' replacement YouTube account has just been suspended, just like their previous one was yesterday. This is imperial censorship operating with very high speed and efficiency.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 12:55 utc | 137

Not runing so smoothly:

Ukraine’s Security Service claims that it has removed a virus at the Central Election Commission’s server, designed to delete the results of the presidential vote. According to the interior minister the cyber-attack may force a ‘manual vote count.’

“The virus has been eliminated, software is replaced. So, we now have the confidence that the Central Election Commission’s server is safe,” Valentin Nalivaychenko, SBU head, is cited by UNN news agency. He is cited as saying that the virus was meant to destroy the results of presidential election on May 25.

However the CEC programmers may not be able to fix the system in time for the elections, coup-installed Interior Minister Arsen Avakov announced on his website.

‘Cyber-attack’ on Ukraine’s election system may force ‘manual vote count’

Or could it be that this was planed?

Posted by: Fran | May 25 2014 13:04 utc | 138

Whether in the main post by b or in comments I do not understand this need to single out neoconservatives... when, to me, it makes no difference whether you are neo-liberal or neo-conservative... lawlessness, torture, murder, occupation, usurpation is the rule of their game.

No neoliberal really ever disagreed with the PNAC. Both Clintons, Gore, Lieberman, Kerry, Biden, Obama, Pelosi, Reid... pretty much any and all heads of the D party for decades are at best Cheney's and Kagens with an NPR (american public radio) tone.

I mean have any of you heard one neoliberal even suggest perhaps they should not keep Kagen/Nuland on the State Department payroll?

Sorrentine is so spot on these days... the murder and looting will continue unabated as long as we refuse to see and unapologetically rage against the forrest for the trees.

As an westerner...what the west/people need to do, is demand imprisonment all of their leadership and their oligarch/corporate owners.... rather than spectator sport/ rubber neck our way through more countries destruction than most can count. Because this is just blood sports viewing if we don't. Never begin or end a conversation without making it clear these people, their organizations, are bloody criminals who must be stopped. For they know no boundary. This is what we can and must do with the information/knowledge gained in fine places like this. We should do it with each other and everywhere else. The knowledge of details must be put to use... or we are simply trolling ourselves.

Seems to me the non-fascist/neoliberal/neoconservative Ukrainians have the same problem today at the voting booth (with much more urgency of course) that we do... TINA - there is no alternative. No matter who they vote for they are screwed.

If my observations on this are correct I can only hope the good people in Ukraine refuse to participate in a rigged game.

Posted by: Eureka Springs | May 25 2014 13:17 utc | 139

did they purge the sane ones or the crazy ones?

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25, 2014 8:33:44 AM | 136

Actually, the story of the general is quite funny

The Air Force investigation report said Carey was "frequently rude to both his fellow delegates and to his Russian hosts" while attending a two-day nuclear security training exercise at the Abramovo Counterterrorism Training Center in Sergiev Posad.

At a Russian-hosted lunch banquet on the first day of the nuclear security exercise, Carey gave a toast that included unspecified comments about Edward Snowden, the National Security Agency leaker who was in Russia at the time but had not yet been granted asylum. Moscow refused U.S. requests that he be returned to the U.S. The report said Carey's remarks were "not well received" by his Russian hosts.

The report also cited Carey for associating with Russian or other non-American women, who may have posed a potential security threat.

I do wonder what made him so worked up to mention Snowden in a rude way? Maybe this?

"All military combat operations depend on NSA contributions," Robert Caruso, a former assistant command security manager in the U.S. Navy and a consultant, told Business Insider when discussing documents potentially accessed by Edward Snowden. "[The Department of Defense] depends on NSA and the Defense Information Systems Agency to secure all its networks, and others networks too."

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 13:19 utc | 140

apparently they fired nine of those guys... for cheating


Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 13:28 utc | 141

This Cold Hole asswipe...a blog that exhorts us to lie well and for all the right reasons?
Aren't there enough smarmy lying scumbag pro empire whores in the MSM? Sounds like Putin is making all the right moves so far, if it pisses off you and the almighty "West" everywhere, all the time, while Putin's domestic popularity is in the 70-80 percent range.
You might just have reality warped to fit your own uncle cracker, anti Russian viewpoint stuck in 1986.
I think the reson your blog is not popular is not that it is full of truthiness, but that it is full of meandering bullshit cherry picked to support your own views.

Posted by: Prey4 Justice | May 25 2014 13:42 utc | 142

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25, 2014 9:28:54 AM | 141

No general fired in this case - sounds like standard organization laxness - firing people seems kind of over reaction.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 14:13 utc | 144

well, now, you don't know, do you?

they might have been deathwish Christian Zionists

or they might have been forming a cabal to resist the air force bias favoring deathwish Christianity

it's not likely that we'd be told the truth if there was a political aspect to it, eould we?

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25 2014 14:20 utc | 145

Speaking of "imperial censorship operating with very high speed and efficiency", I am not longer able to connect w/ . While not experiencing an outright block, a connection is not made, usually timing out, but on occasion receiving a bit of text, but NEVER a video feed. Is this a DDoS attack or what? Are others experiencing this?

Posted by: erichwwk | May 25 2014 14:20 utc | 146

More Cia?
An Afghan student in Ukraine claims to be the first Maidan organizer
what the guy has to say in the interview is that's it's only a start and that Maïdan is still in process... Enjoy the show...

Posted by: Mina | May 25 2014 14:23 utc | 147

@plantman (2):

"Couldn't they see that Ukraine would fall apart??? Don't they think about stuff like that at the State Dept or do they just shoot first and ask questions later?"

The neo-cons approach foreign policy the way venture capitalists approach investing. Like the VCs, they're willing to tolerate a very high rate of failure on the off chance that one of their little 'investments' will pay out big time, becoming the silver bullet that solves all of the Empire's many problems and gives it a new lease on life.

@Virgile (5):

"One wonders where these so called 'analysts' from Brookings etc... get their information."

They're not really analysts in the true sense--just more propagandists. And why would they need information anyway? Facts are for ordinary shmoes like you and me. They, on the other hand, are an empire now. They "create their own reality," as Karl Rove once put it.

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | May 25 2014 14:30 utc | 148

As a battle of raw power and wits, it's quite clear that the Western project has come to end. As a moral struggle, the Western project has come also come to an end. I look forward to a Novorossia that is essentially Communist in intent, taking into account the practical lessons learned in the last 100 years, and drawing on the rich independent anarchist and partisan spirit of the inhabitants of that land. In terms of the political and military struggle between Russia, US/EU/NATO, Z . . . Mr. Pragma was right.

Posted by: Mr. Pragma fan | May 25 2014 14:41 utc | 149

Posted by: flickervertigo | May 25, 2014 10:20:16 AM | 145

Unlikely, as once fired they surely would be free to talk or take their case to court.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 14:41 utc | 150

Here's a clip that says it is of Chechens fighting as part of the Vostok Battalion (separatists)

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 14:46 utc | 151


Sometimes you have a good point to make. But often, it seems, you just turn up here to vent spleen on all the rest of us "bourgeois" lefties who are, in your opinion, too "optimistic". Well, JSorrentine, all we really have to go by here are evidence and reasoning. Are you really in possession of some hidden gnosis, some secret, transcendental knowledge denied to all of us non-illuminati? If so, pray tell!

I mean to ask specifically: what exactly is your thesis regarding the American Empire(TM)? That it's going to last forever and ever until the end of time?

Nothing on this earth--good, bad, or indifferent--lasts forever. Some people have even gone so far as to define history itself as being nothing other than the rise and fall of successive empires. The very best-ruled, geographically contiguous ones (the Roman Empire, the Ottoman Empire) have been able to stick it out for many centuries; but the track record of the far-flung maritime empires (Spain, Britain, France) is not quite so impressive. They quickly become over-extended and exhausted. So what makes you think the American Empire is going to be the first that lasts forever?

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | May 25 2014 14:50 utc | 152

plantman, interesting about Azerbaijan. I noticed that this analysis singles it out:

(And of course Sibel Edmonds is always bringing it up.)

Posted by: RudyM | May 25 2014 14:52 utc | 153

Whoops! I screwed up the italics tag. Sorry...

Posted by: Seamus Padraig | May 25 2014 14:53 utc | 154

This rather interesting clip (ignore the opening scare shots of right sector rallies) is interviews with self-defense people, and the first one keeps mentioning "Kavkazi," which would presumably mean Caucasians, ie Chechens again. Somehow, I still expect them to be fighting against Russia and everything associated with it, not for (ie with the separatists). But having seen the clip that I posted the link for in #151, I have to accept that I got the wrong end of the stick about them.

There aren't many good channels now that Anna has gone (again), but this one certainly keeps up with the situation and has a commendable bias towards actual field video, as opposed to talking heads:

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 15:01 utc | 155


Neoliberalism is an ECONOMIC ideology, neoconservatism is an FOREIGN POLICY ideology.

Neoliberalism: "Neoliberalism is a form of economic liberalism whose advocates support laissez faire, free trade and open markets, privatization, deregulation, and enhancing the role of the private sector in modern society."

I.E. its about economics. So thats why B didnt use the term neoliberal.

Neoconservatism isnt about economics. Its about foreign policy.

And this post isnt about economics its about foreign policy.

Again theyre pretty much the same people, same elites. Neoliberalism is the economic ideology of the elite whereas neoconservatism is the foreign policy ideology of the elite.

Posted by: Massinissa | May 25 2014 15:15 utc | 156

Massinissa, neoconservatism merged with neoliberalism long ago. I'm going to post again this fabulous essay by David Gabbard, "Militarizing Class Warfare"

He wrote the article in 2006. It lays it all out in detail, unquestionably accurate.

Posted by: okie farmer | May 25 2014 16:52 utc | 157

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25, 2014 2:47:12 AM | 105

There does not seem to have been a lot of attacking by the junta sunday in the east. The only incident I saw news about was this:

В Новоайдаре между силовиками и ополченцами идет жестокий бой

Yandex translation.

"In Novoaidar between security forces and militias is fierce battle"

"Novoaidar, May 25 (Navigator, Victoria Litovchenko) - In the village Novoaidar (Luhansk region) there is fighting between security forces and supporters of the "Luhansk national Republic".

This was announced by the Chairman of the Committee of voters of Ukraine Oleksandr Chernenko in his Twitter.

"In Novoaydarskiy area seized 4 sections. In Novoaidar is a tough battle between the military and the separatists," said he.

Let's remind, today in Donbas are protests against the election of the President of Ukraine.

As reported by the "Navigator", former security officials said they did not plan on may 25 active operations."

Nothing from the Donetsk region. I expect that the killing of the foreign journalists saturday and the "election" sunday put a temporary brake on their assault.

Posted by: scalawag | May 25 2014 17:07 utc | 158

Anna-News now has their videos over> Here

Posted by: rouge | May 25 2014 17:08 utc | 159

Off topic, but couldn't get the Open Thread to load......

Premonition, intuition, or just logic??

Cross your fingers while the Pope is in the Middle East. It is a golden opportunity for Israel. The perfect set up for an earth shattering false flag black op that would demonize the Palestinians irrepairably.

Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | May 25 2014 17:08 utc | 160

rouge, here it is

Posted by: okie farmer | May 25 2014 17:14 utc | 161

Election already finished - poroshenko won

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 17:23 utc | 162

Oh, it's good to be able to watch Anna News again, thank you. It's a really good channel, and it reassures me somewhat that in fact the bastards haven't taken advantage of the news blackout, to level Slavyansk to the ground. I have become extremely fond of the people of Slavyansk, and their self-defense forces. It's a beautiful town, set in beautiful countryside, full of people essentially just like me, and I shall become extremely angry (a dangerous state for me, by the way), if anything happens to it.


Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 17:24 utc | 163

«Русский блок»: Работников предприятий Ахметова заставляют идти на выборы под угрозой увольнения

Yandex translation.

"Russian bloc": Workers of the enterprises Akhmetov forced to go to the elections under the threat of dismissal"

"Mariupol - Donetsk, May 25 (Navigator, Kirill Boyar) - In Mariupol workers oligarch Rinat Akhmetov forced to go to the polls under threat of dismissal, this explains a record for the Donbass turnout in this city.

This "Navigator" stated the leader of the party "Russian bloc" in the Donbass Natalia Bilotserkovets.

"In Mariupol did polling stations in the factories Akhmetov and forced people under threat of dismissal to go to vote," she said.

According to Belotserkovskii, "voluntarily people will not vote".

The voting turnout wasn't what the nazis hoped for, so they used the traditional western practice of faking news reports, together with misrepresentation of photographic "evidence".

Украинские СМИ публикуют фотографии с очередями на референдуме 11 мая, выдавая их за фото с выборов Президента

Yandex translation.

"Ukrainian media published photos of Queuing in a referendum on may 11, giving them a photo with presidential elections"

"Our readers sent us a link to the photo Agency published on Twitter Ukrainian media, which, allegedly, the queue at a polling station on election of the President of Ukraine. Actually the photo queue with the referendum on may 11 on the status of the Donetsk region.

This falsification is not the only one lying mass media of Ukraine, having no real queues at polling stations in the small turnout, began to publish photos of the Referendum on may 11th, from the Donetsk national Republic, arguing that today there is a record turnout at the presidential elections, as earlier stated the acting President of Ukraine Turchynov.

The original photo was published in Novosti "Russian spring" from may 11: "the Referendum on Ukraine: chronicle of events and huge oceni on sites".

Posted by: scalawag | May 25 2014 17:37 utc | 164

Nice going, scalawag. It's wonderful to get back in touch with the reality on the ground. I get so sick of abstract opinionating. And for some reason, Saker is even worse today. Perhaps he's following the Putin line: none of our business if Kiev start massacring the innocents, it's not our country so forget it.

That is the line, too. At least, their english-language reports are pathetic today, totally pathetic. I think it's because they want so bad to sell into the Usaian media market. They are not much more than a Russian version of al-Jazeera Usaia. What they do on their Russian-language channel may be completely different.

By the way, there is one difference between me and the people of Slavyansk: they're religious, and I'm not. But apart from that, we breathe as one, right now. I'm not particularly optimistic, but I'm with them nonetheless.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 17:43 utc | 165


Take it easy, you mean Russia should attack Ukraine and then get US and NATO to justify attacks on Russia?
Putin plays smart compared to obama/merkel/nato.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 17:51 utc | 166

More info on the attacks in the Lugansk region. Looks like there were a couple raids by death squad types.

ЛНР: Нацгвардия расстреляла членов избиркома за отказ открыть участок

Partial Yandex translation.

"LNR: the national guard under shot by members of the electoral Commission for refusing to open a polling"

"In Lugansk Novoaidar battalion nazvanie "Dnepr" shot members of the precinct election Commission for refusing to open the site, said the representative of the press-service of the Luhansk national Republic.

The number of victims, according to him, currently is unspecified, according to RIA "news".

Earlier the representative of the administration of Lugansk national Republic informed that in the region of Lugansk Novoaidar Ukrainian military opened fire at a cafe, killing a man and a woman injured.

On the eve the head of the Lugansk national Republic Valery Bolotov said that troops subordinate to Kiev, trying to take Lugansk in the ring."

Posted by: scalawag | May 25 2014 18:18 utc | 167

New pictures showing the horror in Ukraine.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 18:45 utc | 168

Frank Zappa wrote these decisive words about 45 years ago, seeing Albright in advance, so to speak:

Take a day
And walk around
Watch the nazis
Run your town
Then go home
And check yourself
You think we're singing
'Bout someone else . . . but you're

Plastic people!
Oh baby, now . . .
You're such a drag

Ooo-Ooo-Ooo Ooo-Ooo-Ooo Ooo-Ooo-Ooo Ooooooooh!

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 19:01 utc | 169

Rowan Berkeley@155

To Americans Cyrllic text is just as unreadable as Chinese glyphs. We are relying on your and the other commenters’ analysis to try to figure out what is going on in Ukraine.

If Chechens are indeed fighting alongside the Separatists it explains the expertise of the ambushers who wiped out the Ukraine Army checkpoint. There is a small minority of men who can survive war and return again and again for the adrenaline high. If you are getting paid to kill the infidel, that is a real plus. Their paymasters must be neo-conservative/neoliberals who want a civil war on Russia’s border to destabilize it.

The Separatists need all the fighters they can get to protect themselves from the Right Sector goons but allowing Muslim Chechens to fight in their war is like the frog carrying a scorpion across the river on its back. It is in the scorpion’s nature to bite and doom both of them.

Even I am becoming convinced that the Boston Marathon was another case of neoconservative’s support of Jihadists blowing back on the American people. Corporate media has been silent about this from Charlie Wilson’s War to now.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 25 2014 19:13 utc | 170

Where's Yulia???

Posted by: Zico | May 25 2014 19:19 utc | 171

@VietnamVet #170:

Yes, official account of Boston Marathon bombing doesn't add up, as WhoWhatWhy and Sybil Edmonds have reported.

Meanwhile, the Wash Post reports that two journalists were killed yesterday, but not who killed them:

Also Sunday, the deaths of Italian photojournalist Andrea Rochelli, 30, and his Russian translator, Andrei Mironov, 60, were confirmed the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe. The two were killed by mortar fire Saturday near the rebel-held city of Slovyansk, the OSCE said. The exact circumstances remain unclear. Mironov, a former dissident who was imprisoned during the Soviet era, was a longtime fixture of Moscow’s journalism community and well-known to many Western reporters there.

Posted by: Demian | May 25 2014 19:25 utc | 172

This video suggests that voter turnout in Kharkov was very low, so that reported votes are most likely the result of ballot stuffing.

Posted by: Demian | May 25 2014 19:55 utc | 173

#170, that's a really interesting analysis. I thought I was devious, but I hadn't got it figured out that way. The thing is, I don't know the language, so I can't tell whether any of my hare-brained hunches and assorted brainstorms is credible, plausible, or just plain ridiculous. And currently I seem to spend about 18 hours a day doing this, totally by guesswork. So I shall ask the Saker and his two resident gnomes, Bot Tak and Crazy Ivan, whether that is conceivably the case.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 20:17 utc | 174

Did I read somewhere that the Kiev junta had just opened a lawsuit of their own against Akhmetov? Or was I hallucinating again? It must be all these 18-hour days, I go to bed at 10 pm and get up again at 1 am, because I just can't leave reality alone.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25 2014 20:50 utc | 175

I was curious about ANNA News, and found out that it is the Abkhazian Network News Agency. According to Wikipedia, Abhasia,

Transnistria, Nagorno-Karabakh, and South Ossetia are post-Soviet "frozen conflict" zones. These four unrecognized states maintain friendly relations with each other and form the Community for Democracy and Rights of Nations.

Are we going to see a new member of the Community for Democracy and Rights of Nations in Novorossia?

Posted by: Demian | May 25 2014 21:03 utc | 176

Even I am becoming convinced that the Boston Marathon was another case of neoconservative’s support of Jihadists blowing back on the American people. Corporate media has been silent about this from Charlie Wilson’s War to now.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 25, 2014 3:13:42 PM | 170

WTF is it with dumb-bovine-mental-defective yanks and their f*cking stupid addiction to these f*cking even-stupider-than-they-are "blowback" theories of theirs?

I can only suppose that dumb-bovine-mental-defective yanks, and their even dumber Canadian cousins, take solace in these moronic theories of "blowback" so that they, dumb-bovine-mental-defectives that they are, don't ever have to contemplate the alternative - that these bomb attacks are in fact completely manufactured within their own f*cking Governmental "security" apparatus.

becaase THAT is what all the actual available evidence (All the obvious lies we were told about Bros Tsarnev, the CIA uncle, the false charges of shooting a cop, the dead cop Dennis O Simmonds, the friend of Tsarnev murdered by the FBI, the dead FBI agentas that were witnesses to that mrder etc etc ) points to so far

There is not so much as one scrap of real reliable evidence being presented that the Bostan False-flag "bombing" had anything to do with either of the Tsarnev brothers. Almost literally EVERYTHING we were told about those 2, with the exception of their names and ages, has turned out to be nothing but blatant lies

But lets pretend for a moment, just to humour these dumb-bovine-mental-defective yanks, that there is some actual EVIDENCE implicating the Brothers Tsarnev: "Why label it "blowback"?"

"Blowback", as a label, imples that the action was carried out as some sort of "revenge" on the US by "terrorists" they once supported Again there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever to support such a claim. (pls don't claim that that is not what you meant when using the label "blowback" cos THAT is what it means, and if you are mis-using the term then clearly you're too dumb to even be discussing this)

So please, dumb-bovine-mental-defective yanks, give the internet a rest for a while, until you grow back a few braincells at least, because just going on the evidence so far you lot are clearly operating waaaaaaaaaaaay above your comprehension level when you start theorising in such a manner about such things as the Boston False Flag "bombing"

Thanks in advance

Posted by: LolWaut? | May 25 2014 21:07 utc | 177

Oh did I mention "Denis"?

You remember "Denis", right?

Denis was the alleged name of the alleged "Chinese Entrepreneur" that the brothers Tsarnev were alleged to have allegedly kidnapped, who somehow allegedly miraculously escaped from the dastardly Brothers T.

It was in ALL the Media - and ALL the media claimed to have gotten that info from their sources within the security apparatus.

But "denis" never existed.

We can be pretty damn sure of that now.

That info could simply NOT have appeared in the Media by accident. someone, more than one in fact, in the security apparatus definitely had to have spread that story. And it had to be more than one Security source spreading that story because it appeared in ALL the Media reportage. Every single one of them carried it.

That points the finger right back at that security apparatus as the culprits for the whole false-flag event.

based on the little we know so far, any other conclusion about where the "Denis" story came from is simply retarded

Posted by: LolWaut? | May 25 2014 21:17 utc | 178

US media and obama already love poroshenko, no surprise though!

Posted by: Anonymous | May 25 2014 21:19 utc | 179

Vietnam Vet @170: "Their paymasters must be neo-conservative/neoliberals who want a civil war on Russia’s border to destabilize it."

So wrong in so many ways. You & Rowan should do a little research on the character & politics of Chechnya leader Ramzan Kadyrov (sorry, I can't do it for you). Suffice to say, he is a strong ally of Putin's. He will not send his Chechen fighters into Novorossiya without a clear signal from El Presidente. Trust me.

Do you know that Kadyrov was instrumental in securing the release of the Russian journalists? "2 Russian journalists were released following Chechen leader ultimatum: tell us directly - you either want us as friends or foes" (@PaulaSlier_RT).

Posted by: Pegasus | May 25 2014 21:38 utc | 180

LolWaut? @177 & 178. I'm with you, brother. Tell it like it is.

Posted by: Pegasus | May 25 2014 21:54 utc | 181

Go, Rossiya. "Did Kadyrov secretly help #Russia win the hockey world championship too? ;)" (@NinaByzantina).

Posted by: Pegasus | May 25 2014 22:00 utc | 182

It will be interesting to see what happens with Euromaidan now. Peter Lavelle thinks that it will raise up against Poroshenko. Colonel Cassad thinks that now that another oligarch has been installed as president, it is time to dismantle Euromaidan, as the new mayor of Kiev promised to do in his election campaign; in any event, it will not last long, since the oligarchs will stop financing it.

Posted by: Demian | May 25 2014 23:12 utc | 183

Posted by: Demian | May 25, 2014 5:03:23 PM | 176

They have been very active in Syria, too. Basically going, where nobody else dared to go, being embedded with the Syrian army, with great filming skills. They are part of Russian information warfare and more professional than US trained "citizen journalists", an invention of the communist party in the 1920's.

Posted by: somebody | May 25 2014 23:25 utc | 184

@somebody #184:

By the way, if anyone was still wondering whether Google is evil, they can stop wondering now.

Posted by: Demian | May 25 2014 23:50 utc | 185

b, don't forget that "admitting defeat" is not necessarily the same thing as "giving up".

You can "admit defeat" in order to convince everyone to pull back, regroup, and then "once more unto the breach, dear friends!"

After all, nobody in any of those Washington Think Tanks is ever going to volunteer to be a part of that forlorn hope......

Posted by: Johnboy | May 26 2014 0:35 utc | 186

Posted by: Demian | May 25, 2014 7:12:12 PM | 183

Will Poroshenko be able to stop the anti-terrorist operation? As long as Pravy Sektor/National Guard are fighting in the South-East, the civil war is on.

Posted by: somebody | May 26 2014 1:01 utc | 187

So there are Chechens fighting for Jabhat al-Nusra, ISIS, and Assad too? That certainly makes them sound like reliable, known quantities. And Pegasus, #180, yes, I did know that Kadyrov was the intermediary for the large Russian govt bribe (I assume it was very large) that got the LifeNews guys out, and is that supposed to increase my confidence? That Kadyrov can make the Kiev junta accept bribes? I suppose you are going to tell us that the Chechens who are now serving in the Vostok Brigade are from his personal palace guard and there on his orders. Is that supposed to be reassuring? I know who Kadyrov is. He's a traitor to his people, and a tyrant to boot. The Chechens are not a Russian or even a Russian-speaking people at all, and hence quite unlike either the Ossetians or the inhabitants of the Donbass. Kadyrov started as a Chechen rebel leader, then deserted them when he found he could no longer retain control of the rebellion, because Bandar Bush was taking it over with his Wahhabis. Someone just reminded us of that, earlier. And none of this arouses even the tiniest iota of confidence, frankly, nor should it in you. But you are presumably one of those who thinks Putin is a god among men, and therefore that anybody who serves him is godlike too. Well, I think otherwise. To me, Putin is a piece of shit, actually. I have never believed in him the way all the pseudo-left sheeple now obediently do. That is why I keep on and on reporting a ten year old story that says from a consummately insider point of view that he is in the pocket of the Lubavitchers (as is Dugin). And Boris Berezovsky, the Jewish vykrest, brought Putin to power by means of an unnecessary Chechen war started by Shamil Basayev, to whom he (Berezovsky) personally paid very large sums. What does that tell you, Pegasus?

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 26 2014 1:38 utc | 188

So, that's it. The civil war is on.

Speaking on the possible outcome of the raging political crisis in Ukraine, Poroshenko promised that “we will have a united and unitary, not federative state.”

Poroshenko claimed that his first “decisive step will be aimed at ending the war, ending chaos, and bringing peace to a united and free Ukraine."

"I am certain that our decisive actions will bring fairly quick results," the 48-year stated without clarifying what these “actions” would entail, as earlier it was announced that Ukrainian troops are to resume what Kiev calls an “anti-terrorist” operation in eastern Ukraine.

You are too optimistic, b. They will fight it out.

Posted by: somebody | May 26 2014 1:47 utc | 189

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 25, 2014 3:13:42 PM | 170

"The Separatists need all the fighters they can get to protect themselves from the Right Sector goons but allowing Muslim Chechens to fight in their war is like the frog carrying a scorpion across the river on its back. It is in the scorpion’s nature to bite and doom both of them."

Such bigotry is not only tolerated here, it passes without notice.

That is simple minded bigotry. Very simple minded. What is revealing of this site and the mentality of many of the comment writers here is that this kind of bigotry goes pretty much unremarked (Lolwaut and Pegasus appear to be the only ones who took this bigot to task and they appear to be new writers or irregular ones). Earlier, another commenter mentioned one of the Ukrainian puppets being Jewish, and it brought the usual outrage from the anti-zionist-zionist hyterics brigade. One can say what they want against Muslims, spew any sort of bigotry and smear the lot, and it hardly raises an eyebrow among the patronized plutocracy here. But accuse somebody of being Jewish, with not an intention of worshipful praise, invites a mob of hysterical smearbots. And few even think twice about such hypocrisy here. And it is not just here, but on every Jewish run and dominated website and organization I have ever encountered. You people need to do some very serious house cleaning.

Posted by: scalawag | May 26 2014 2:01 utc | 190

Look what I found!

Hands down stupidest thing I've read in this pathetic, tragic, depressing affair.

Posted by: Oddlots | May 26 2014 2:04 utc | 191

Saker has come back after a three day avoidance of Ukraine issues, with another slab of putin walks on water. I don't trust that guy one bit. Plus, he adds that he's glad the communists were wiped out in the Kiev election, cos he hates communists. You know, they rape evnerable elderly orthodox monks, and force nuns to pee on altars, and so on.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 26 2014 2:05 utc | 192

Coincidentally, the Vineyard of the Saker has very informative piece up on Chechens, and Kadyrov. Time to open some eyes people, and dump those western media instilled prejudices. Russia, Chechnia and the Ukraine - the *choice* to keep hoping for the impossible

"It all really began in Crimea where, before the operation of the Russian Polite Armed Men in Green (PAMG), when there were some very serious tensions between the various parties including the Muslim Tatars. At that time, Ramzan Kadyrov for the first time made a statement from faraway Grozny saying that he will not tolerate any "abuses against the Chechen" minority in Crimea. Since there are not all that many Chechens in Crimea and since soon thereafter PAMG solved the problem anyway, this statement was rapidly forgotten. But think again, besides being a statement in support of the Chechens in Crimea, who was that statement directed against? Clearly, the threatened party was not the pro-Russian one, but the pro-Ukrainian forces, including those Tatars (mainly linked to Turkey) who had been manipulated by the USA to take action against the pro-Russian population of Crimea. It is now clear that what happened in this instance is that Kadyrov did openly say that which Putin could not (for obvious political reasons). In the end, it was Putin who eventually engaged his PAMG, but it was Kadyrov who had made the threat.

This time again, Kadyrov got involved by issuing an amazing statement which most commentators overlooked. Here is what he said about the two kidnapped reporters:

The Ukraine's leadership continues to use Fascist methods. We demand the immediate release of Sidyakin and Saychenko. If the folks in Kiev don't come back to their senses and do not let these journalists go back home, we will not stand by in silence and watch as mock them, for them to their knees and keep them with bags on their heads. We have the forces and the capabilities to influence those who are holding these journalists in captivity. I therefore advise them to free these journalists or otherwise we will have resort to some tough actions.

I don't know about you, but when I read that I went "wow!". There is a Chechen President (who is also and-ex warlord) who is clearly giving the Ukies an ultimatum which they better not ignore. They didn't.

During 4 days of secret negotiations a group of Chechen negotiators sent by Kadyrov flew to Kiev in his personal jet and had some very frank conversations with the right people in Kiev. The Chechens probably used the typical mix of threats and bribes to prevail and, as a direct result of this operation, the two reporters were freed.

It was also interesting for me to hear the testimony of the two reporters who told that they understood that something dramatic had changed in their condition when they heard a voice pick up the phone and say "salaam aleikum". Soon thereafter their handcuffs were taken off and they were told "take off the hood off your heads, you are safe now, you are under the protection of the President of Chechnia".

Why do I consider this so important?

Because the image of Chechnia and the Chechens is radically changing in Russia. The media openly calls Kadyrov a hero and Russian citizens rejoice when they hear the Islamic "salaam aleikum" because they know that they are now safe. This is huge! What a change from only 10 years ago.

Kadyrov in reality plays a role which is a much bigger one than "just" the President of Chechnia (and a hugely successful one at that!). He is clearly Putin's "ally number 1", especially in security matters, and the two men clearly work closely together as a kind of "tag team". This kind of special role does a lot to restore the pride of the Chechen people and it also does a lot to change the terrible image many Russians had of Chechens as a result of the horrors of the time when Chechnia was ruled by psychopathic Wahabis. Instead of being "terrorist barbarians" the Chechens are now increasingly seen as tough and reliable allies of Russia and of the Russian President.

As for the Chechens, they are still feared, but this time outside Russia. During the 08.08.08 war the Georgians ran as fast as they could as soon as they heard that the Chechen battalion had arrived. Nowadays, the Ukraine is full of rumors that Chechens have arrived to support the Donetsk and Lugansk republics. To my knowlege this has not happened (yet?) and apparently there is some confusion between a "Vostok battalion" (Eastern battalion) in the Ukraine and the Chechen "Vostok battalion" which saw action in 08.08.08. The former is composed of local volunteers from the Donbass while the latter is now formally part of the 291st Motor-Rifle regiment of the 42nd Guard Motor-Rifle Division of the Russian armed forces. But I would not put it past Kadyrov to send in Chechen special forces as "volunteers" into the Donbass if things get really ugly there. Of course, the key thing would be to get Putin's go ahead for such a move."

This is one of his better efforts. What I quoted is only about half (didn't want to upset the usual zio net nanny queens, and give them an opportunity to run their usual obfuscation routine, by posting it all).

Posted by: scalawag | May 26 2014 2:23 utc | 193

Well, that is exactly what I consider to be total bullshit, scalawag, as I just said. the proof of the pudding will be in whether the Donbass survives as an independent entity, which of course it won't. And I really wonder what these Chechens are up to. This is what I put on my own blog (whether what I put on saker's blog will appear there, remains to be seen):

IMO, Saker is a putin PR flack, Putin is a sellout to the right-wing Jews, and Donbass is doomed
After a three-day silence on Ukraine, while waiting for instructions from Putin’s psyops team, Saker has come back with another slab of Putin walks on water. And by the way, he says he is glad that the Communists (and the Party of Regions) were wiped out in Kiev’s phony election, which he will henceforth regard as a valid expression of da peeple’s will, because he really hates communists. You’ve heard all the latest about communists, the 100-year old atrocity propaganda from the right-wing Orthodox crowd about how they raped all the Orthodox nuns, buried the monks alive in quicklime up to their necks, the whole bit. And this is not good news for Donbass, which is at least half communist, as you can plainly see from the hammer-and-sickle flags behind half the Donbass spokesmen and women, from the statues of Lenin which they defend and rally around, and so forth. So now, we shall hear how Putin is so wise, keeping his supposedly world-beating powder dry while the people of Donbass are slaughtered, and how Poroshenko is a friend of Moscow, and how the Chechens are honorable fighters if not saints, and so forth. At the moment he is trying to deny there are Chechens fighting in Ukraine at all, while again, he waits for further instructions on how he is supposed to explain away the videos of them. He says that the Ukraine Vostok Battalion is being confused with another Vostok Battalion, in Chechnya, which is not a very good cover story and which he will conveniently forget when he gets new and more plausible instructions, of course.

It is of course only 3:30 am here and I wrote my responses to Saker at 2 am, having leaped out of bed after 4 hours sleep and filled my soul with expresso coffe, so it is v ery possible I am delusionary. Very possible indeed. Maybe Putin is god on earth and will achieve everything by doing nothing. We shall see, shan't we.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 26 2014 2:41 utc | 194

Wow, have I ever managed to piss off that Saker bird. This is what I wrote on his blog, apparently the last time I shall get to air my views there:

There are Chechens in Syria, fighting for Jabhat al-Nusra, ISIS, and Assad too. That certainly makes them sound like reliable, known quantities. Kadyrov was the intermediary for the large Russian govt bribe (I assume it was very large) that got the LifeNews guys out, but is that supposed to increase our confidence? That Kadyrov can make the Kiev junta accept bribes? We have a youtube clip of the Chechens who are now serving in the Donbas Vostok Brigade, and I suppose that in his oriental way, Kadyrov has sent them from his personal palace guard. Is that supposed to be reassuring? I know who Kadyrov is. He’s a traitor to his people, and a tyrant to boot. The Chechens are not a Russian or even a Russian-speaking people at all, and hence quite unlike either the Ossetians or the inhabitants of the Donbass. Kadyrov started as a Chechen rebel leader, then deserted them when he found he could no longer retain control of the rebellion, because Bandar Bush was taking it over with his Wahhabis. And none of this arouses even the tiniest iota of confidence, frankly, nor should it in you. But you are one of those who thinks (or at least says) that Putin is a god among men, and therefore that anybody who serves him is godlike too. Well, I think otherwise. To me, Putin is a piece of shit, actually. I have never believed in him the way all the pseudo-left sheeple now obediently do. That is why I keep on and on reporting a ten year old story that says from a consummately insider point of view that he is in the pocket of the Lubavitchers (as is Dugin). And Boris Berezovsky, the Jewish vykrest, brought Putin to power by means of an unnecessary Chechen war started by Shamil Basayev, to whom he (Berezovsky) personally paid very large sums. What does that tell you?

Saker responds to my views, as indeed he must, because unlike Colden Holefiend, the conventional pro-Usaian propagandist, I am a real menace:
@Rowan Berkeley: “What does that tell you?” It tell me that you are an ignorant, bigoted, arrogant and rude idiot. Exactly the kind that I don’t want on this blog. So, congrats, you are the first one I am booting out by name and this was the last post on this blog you have signed with you name. You can still try to post as anonymous or under a new name, but as “Rowan Berkeley” you are now officially the first resident of this blog’s trash bin. Good riddance and bye-bye! The Saker

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 26 2014 2:54 utc | 195

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 25, 2014 10:41:50 PM | 194

"so it is very possible I am delusionary."

Yes it is. :)

Posted by: scalawag | May 26 2014 2:56 utc | 196

@scalawag #193:

I have just one objection to that otherwise illuminating post by the Saker:

I am under no illusion about the possibility of a "Ukrainian Kadyrov" appearing on the world scene anytime soon. But if such a miracle could happen in Chechnia, I want to at least hope that it is possible in a future Ukraine, one freed from oligarchs and Nazis as much as Chechnia is now Wahabi-free.

I don't think you can compare Ukrainians to Chechens in this respect. The Chechens are an old, authentic people, with their own distinct culture, based on Islam. Thus, they are clearly distinct from Russians. Ukraine, on the other hand, is the construct of imperial powers hostile to Russia, first Poland, than the German Reich, and finally the US. Their religion is phoney; it follows the Russian Orthodox liturgy and just hacks on an allegiance to the Pope. While the Chechens have a rich culture upon which to base their identity, the only thing Ukrainians have to base their identity on, to distinguish themselves from Russians, is fascism and hatred of Russians.

As for Rowan's offense at what the Saker says about Putin's relationship with Kadyrov, it apparently wounds Rowan's English pride that Russians can have good relations with (traditional) Muslims, whereas Anglo-Saxons can't.

Posted by: Demian | May 26 2014 3:09 utc | 197

Nonsense. I don't give a damn about the English. I'm not George Orwell, you know.


Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 26 2014 3:14 utc | 198

I’d read that Chechens were fighting in Afghanistan, Syria, and some even made it to Libya. They are even feared in Mali. Calling Wahhabi True Believers scorpions isn’t bias, its reality. That is why it is crazy of the American government to be supporting them since Charlie Wilson’s War. American has been fighting GWOT so long, I assumed that the Chechens were on the American payroll. It never crossed my mind that Chechens who fought on the Russian side would show up at next Balkan’s Mash-Up for some more combat. If not volunteers, I wonder who is paying them. Learning more is why MoA is so important.

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 26 2014 3:29 utc | 199

Posted by: Demian | May 25, 2014 11:09:53 PM | 197

"I don't think you can compare Ukrainians to Chechens in this respect."

That's not the point. He's talking about leaders, not culture.

Posted by: scalawag | May 26 2014 3:36 utc | 200

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