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May 5, 2014
Ukraine: Continuing Thread …

There was little significant news from Ukraine today. Fighting around various checkpoints outside of Slovyansk continued with casualties reported on both sides and of civilians but no movement of the lines.

I do expect some more serious diplomacy over the next days but the continued amateurish behavior of the State Department, discussed here, lets me believe that there will be no progress in solving the situation without more conflict.

Allegedly: A polite green man from Russia Putin's Spetsnaz special force enforcer Ukrainian woman awaiting fascists in Slovyansk.

Posted by b on May 5, 2014 at 18:35 UTC | Permalink
Comments

Posted by: Demian | May 6, 2014 7:52:31 PM | 173
Yep. It is like Syrian “democracy” rebels giving their troops the names of religious Islamic “Sunni against Shiite” war.
Same secret service rule book.
Posted by: lol | May 6, 2014 7:50:02 PM | 172
You are correct. What you wrote should be written in school books.

Before you answer, it might be constructive, mayhap, to consider the possibility, however slight, that maybe, just maybe, it might first seem desirable to certain vested interests, that in order to actually have a “successful” truly large-scale war (i.e. MUCH bigger than Iraq or Afghanistan) , one must first manipulate a rather large section of the population, on BOTH SIDES, into wanting one
AND, consider that it might also be deemed desirable, by aforesaid hypothetical “vested interests”, to stage certain rather barbaric provocations, such as the recent slaughter in Odessa, in order to manipulate large sections of the populations on both sides, into desiring war, if only for base “revenge” purposes

Even if it is only a new cold war.

Posted by: somebody | May 7 2014 6:57 utc | 201

For those that read “the saker”,,,,try questioning his reasoning and see if you get your comment posted, he conveniently calls it moderation,,,,,this is what I like about Moon of Alabama,,,free flow of information and promotion of debate and exchange of ideas,,no stifling,,congrats MOA,,,no wonder your comments just keep piling up,,,,,,,,

Posted by: Tantin | May 7 2014 7:03 utc | 202

plus 198
and a civil war that endangers European gas supplies from Russia.

Posted by: somebody | May 7 2014 7:15 utc | 203

@Tantin #199:
Yes, I don’t like posting at sites where your comment doesn’t show up right away. But what kind of comments did you try to post at Saker’s blog which he suppressed?
I post at the Saker occasionally, but I am not inclined to question his reasoning. This is because if I were to have a serious exchange with him, I’d feel that I should tell him that I come from a similar background to his (White Russian), which I don’t want to do, since he presents himself as a Russian Orthodox believer, whereas I stopped being a believer (like many people) when I entered puberty.
So I prefer to admire his excellent blogging from a distance. 🙂

Posted by: Demian | May 7 2014 7:25 utc | 204

I agree about his sometimes excellent blogging but I become suspicious of those that want to vet comments before posting unless of course one is using derogatory remarks, which I never have,,,He recently claimed that he has 20,000 hits daily/weekly?,,,, and moderation must come in to eliminate the trolls especially those that are ethnic specific and monothematic as he put it,,,,well obviously all those unwanted trolls with their offensive presentations in the past did not stop the accumulation of his huge audience (which includes you and me) ,,,so why change??? Maybe now he has the luxury to discard those that disagree with his narratives,,,I hope all this success is not in some way inflating his ego???? In regards to the suppression, I simply questioned if you are asking your followers for their thoughts on which way to move next on the Kiev fascists then you like us must be in a quagmire????….I like you have avoided comments in the past as I also stopped being a believer a long time ago (I am originally of Orthodox background myself) but I do not like the religious aspects of his posts,,it almost brings to mind the “born again” preaching of the US bible fanatics,,,,,maybe the Orthodox church of Russia is a “young” benign entity at the present,,but history is littered with the misery and suffering the Church and State have brought on Western society,,,,,,,,

Posted by: Tantin | May 7 2014 8:44 utc | 205

@Tantin #202:
I only came upon both the Saker and MoA after the Kiev coup. My impression is that the reason the Saker started moderating comments is that he got a lot of antisemitic craziness. As I recall, he made a couple of posts discussing his misgivings about moderation before he introduced it, so I think that his decision to moderate comments was fairly benign.
As for the Saker’s religious talk, I grew up in the northeastern US, so I simply feel that publicly talking about God outside of church, expressing your actual faith as opposed to just neutrally discussing religion as an idea, is bad form and impolite. So I have to agree with you that “it almost brings to mind the ‘born again’ preaching of the US bible fanatics”.
To be clear, I don’t mind at all Putin making occasional references to God in his speeches or public remarks. Russia (unlike the US) has an established church, so it is fine for a Russian leader to make references to Russian Orthodoxy as a component of the project to consolidate a post-Soviet Russian identity.
In contrast, I found Tony Blair’s wearing his religion on his sleeve, and what’s worse, demonstratively converting to Roman Catholicism (from Anglicanism??? What sane person would do that???) to be utterly primitive and barbaric.

Posted by: Demian | May 7 2014 9:48 utc | 206

@Demian 203 I also dont mind Putin making references and showing respect for the orthodox church and various other faiths ….I really admire his genuine nature….thank you so much for your most sincere comments Demian

Posted by: tantin | May 7 2014 10:18 utc | 207

It’s nice to see that our local sockpuppet Maidanist is now calling the Kiev junta “nazi-loons” after having treated us to the Svoboda approved versions of Ukrainian history. I guess that’s some sort of victory – after all, this is the guy who said:

Thats not the subject – the subject is what people in Poland, Czech, Ukraine, Belorus, Lithuania, Latvia etc etc, thought was worse, communism or nazism..The Nazis only stayed 4 years in those places – the Soviets stayed nearly 50 yrs.

Think about the stupidity of that statement – “the Nazi’s only stayed four years”, as if they would have spent the other 996 years of their 1000 year Reich at home knitting or something – and realize exactly who this guy is and what his dirty aims are.

Posted by: guest77 | May 7 2014 11:22 utc | 208

Posted by: guest77 | May 7, 2014 7:22:10 AM | 205
You react like Pavlov’s dog. No one posting on this blog has contributed to the Third Reich.
Some people try to use old flags for their own ends. If we believe them we end up like people in Odessa, considering killing the ones with the other type of flag as justified.

Posted by: somebody | May 7 2014 11:38 utc | 209

more witness accounts out on Odessa massacre
In other news Tymoshenko’s election campaign is accused of organizing the violence.

Posted by: somebody | May 7 2014 12:28 utc | 210

Excellent discussion on The Real News: Is Ukraine Descending into Civil War?
“Professors Nicolai Petro and Aleksandr Buzgalin discuss the factional clashes in the Ukrainian city of Odessa and how the international community can de-escalate tensions.” Petro is living and working in Odessa on a Fulbright scholarship. Buzgalin is a professor at Moscow State University.

Posted by: fairleft | May 7 2014 12:39 utc | 211

Why doesnt the western racists open the gas ovens for the russians?
RUSSIA GETS BOOED AT #EUROVISION 2014
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9if_MVl45Q

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 13:43 utc | 212

@205
To whom/what are you referring Guest? If you are talking about the foff thing, I agree. These bots are instructed, I presume, to enlist support by affecting to be in the mainstream of the blog community. In this case the foff thing made the error of thinking that the normal demagogic nonsense about the USSR would be generally shared. After a while it learned otherwise and, suddenly the “I’ve been to Prague and the stories I’ve heard were terrible…” nonsense ceased.
In its place came this faux anti-semitism, clearly designed firstly to gain the sympathy of the crowd that blames everything on “The Jews” and secondly to add evidence for the Louis Proyect self constructed bot, and others like him to claim that we are all Nazis here, starting with “b” who is German and therefore, according to Proyectian logic, very likely to be one.

Posted by: bevin | May 7 2014 13:44 utc | 213

some good news
PaulaSlier_RT ‏@PaulaSlier_RT 9m
#Donetsk people-elected mayor is now free. In exchange, pro-federalization forces released three Ukrainian officers of Alpha.

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 13:57 utc | 214

PaulaSlier_RT ‏@PaulaSlier_RT 1h
In #Slavyansk, women are also working at the #checkpoints, like Lena: Mother of 2, activist and ready to fight. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaT-8xmg4QA&feature=youtu.be …

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 13:57 utc | 215

Posted by: fairleft | May 7, 2014 8:39:04 AM | 208
Do we have a number for the actual citizens of Ukraine supporting the post February 21 agenda and conduct of the current regime in Kiev?
Looks like ultra far right and neo-nazis to me.
What do they add up to be? Are they really much more than a 1,000?
We don’t see much in the way of Ukranians who are not ethnically Russian going to the East to drop the hammer on pro-Federalists.
Is this really a civil war or is it being branded as one?

Posted by: Tea | May 7 2014 14:15 utc | 216

@121 Noirette – I am assuming that the trade unions in the USSR were entities of the state, as is the case in China still today. Therefore, yes, the House of Trade Unions, at least historically, would be a government building.

Posted by: Snake Arbusto | May 7 2014 14:16 utc | 217

PaulaSlier_RT ‏@PaulaSlier_RT 27m
Russian media reported that he also called on the pro-federalization forces to postpone the referendum scheduled on May 11.
PaulaSlier_RT ‏@PaulaSlier_RT 28m
President Putin demanded from Kiev govt to stop its punishing attacks on pro-federalization forces in South-East of Ukraine………………………………..They shouldnt(top)…and …they wont(bottom)!

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 14:23 utc | 218

This confirms my theory based in earlier Meyssan and Duff writings that there is a Third Force behind the bloody coup and violence in Ukraine not answerable to the Obama team. It’s a mix of neocons, leftovers from the Bush/Cheney regime, Petreaus JSOC, Blackwater/Academi/Greystone, military and intelligence contractors, PNAC/FDD, Romney, Clinton, McCain, Nudelman, Likud/AIPAC/ADL, Nazi Ukrainian diaspora in America, Saudis, representing Big Corporations, controlled by Secret Shadow Government or Deep State that did NOT relinquished its power after Obama had won.
That’s why all the agreements, including the one from Feb 20th are immediately breached, tensions built up and violence erupts targeting both sides. Russia has been asking the US administration to curb that Third Force but Obama has no control over it. That shadow regime enjoys anonymity hidden from the public view, thus it cannot be target by pointing fingers and directing people attention to them. If such voices arise they are being ridiculed with a prepared argument: “how can you blame Bush after 5 years of Obama?”.
That the MAIN obstacle in restoring peace and order in Ukraine. To overcome this unaware public MUST BE INFORMED and liberate itself from the trap of being boxed in the narrative and mindset only concerning the official Russia vs. US/EU confrontation. Obviously blaming everything on Obama’s team is wrong, useless, counterproductive – it helps tremendously those evil forces operating in the shadows.
We have to target the Third Shadow Force and end their unrestrainted clandestine operations pitting people from opposite sides of the political scene against each other. Putin pushes for dialog to gain time to prepare for military confrontation, to make people, especially in the Ukraine become aware of the Third Force, to persuade the puppets like Yatsenyuk and his clique to cut their ties to the third Force and start cooperating with Obama/Merkel et al. Of course if Yats does not listen he will be dead soon, and many others too.
Once again the full impact of our effort must go into exposing and neutralizing the closely interconnected group with prominent figures of Igor Kolomoisky, Timoshenko, Nudelman, McCain, Romney, Bush clan, Cheney, Clintons, Mileykovsky, Rassmussen, Carl Bildt, US/UK business round tables, US Chamber of Commerce, FDD/PNAC, AEI, AIPAC, Potomac institute, Brookings, Heritage, Atlantic Council , CFR and branches…
Mindless bashing Obama team’s ridiculous but harmles rhetoric and sanctions is wasting opportunitites and our resources that do not have many.
Putin: Far-right radicals to blame for latest violence in Ukraine

Posted by: ProPeace | May 7 2014 14:29 utc | 219

@ Demian
Not to get too far afield but:
1) If you actually think it was Chechen “terrorists” behind the Boston false flag then we’re off to a bad start. The Tsarnevs and their CIA-connected family were simply patsies that got blamed for what was obviously NOT a terrorist attack. This is why the invitation of Israeli “investigators” is so damning. Not only have the Zionists/Israel bought off/blackmailed the entirety of the US political class, completely compromised the entirety of US intelligence mechanisms and helped train, advise and militarize nearly every major local law enforcement agency in America but the Israelis also just seem to show up/be needed when the world’s only superpower with an unlimited budget needs to figure out what happened concerning an “incident”. IOW, don’t even look at the BB as the work of Chechens – it was the work once again of US/Israeli intelligence agencies a la 9/11 – as it has all the hallmarks of an operation planned to whip up patriotic/anti-terrorism furor especially in that it brought the GWOT fight to Putin’s doorstep which is what we’re now seeing in a more overt form in Ukraine.
2) To try and separate the interests of Israel and the Zionist dominated US government is a fool’s errand as they are so intertwined they should be considered one and the same. There is NO daylight between American Zionists and Israeli fascists and people who attempt to state that there are are not being honest as there is scant evidence supporting this hypothesis.
Zionism – and the apartheid and genocide it necessarily entails – is a supremacist abomination and therefore ANYONE – i.e., Israel or American – who supports said creed should be considered cut from the same cloth as they are bonded in hatred and blood – a bond that goes above where they happen to reside.
3) As to Israel once again switching allegiances back to Russia, I would – as many Americans – would welcome it but I don’t think it’s really plausible. The Zionists have been to successful in hollowing out American society to their liking – again, extending throughout the halls of power – that it would be difficult for them to leave. They own the fucking place. Sure, if anti-Zionism spread in the US they might feel it in their interests to latch on to Russia but right now it’s too early to even think that especially as they still can count on votes in Congress re: the apartheid genocidal state of Israel to go 535-0.
That’s why all this Chomskyian nonsense that Israel is “sitting this one out” regarding Ukraine a la Syria and that they are “independent” are fucking bullshit. The apartheid genocidal state of Israel has the creation of chaos – wherever its interests lie – at the core of its strategic philosophy. What they intend to do with said chaos – e.g., Yinon Plan – can be decided upon/deciphered by the rest of the world later.

Posted by: JSorrentine | May 7 2014 14:39 utc | 220

@Sorrentine “the carefully constructed media personalities they have crafted ”
Few quick examples?

Posted by: Snake Arbusto | May 7 2014 14:39 utc | 221

Isn’t it time to recognize that it looks like the pro-Kiev forces are winning? The English language information coming out from RT and other reliable sources indicates just that. The regime has advanced at least to the near suburbs of all/most of the pro-federalist towns/cities. They are now being being slowly squeezed as regime reinforcements arrive. Explain to me differently, but most Russian-language truthful TV/radio also appear to have been taken down. So the residents are being bombarded with psy-ops propaganda as food and other essentials grow very short. The American stooges will likely be patient and wait for the usual ‘peaceful’ conclusion of a tight siege.
If Russia does nothing we’ll end up with a wasteland and election of Western stooges who’ll obey the IMF/US/NATO will. As a sideshow, there’ll be a replay in language destruction of what Latvia has done to the Russian language.

Posted by: fairleft | May 7 2014 14:40 utc | 222

Posted by: fairleft | May 6, 2014 7:54:47 AM | 103
I’ve just read Floyd’s piece on post-Soviet Russia and it’s all true; how the place got fucked over, plundered and left for dead.
But: notwithstanding that, as a lefty, Russia, just like Syria or Libya, has to be defended against the Empire. I apply the same criteria to Russia as I do to any other non-imperialist state namely, it’s up to the citizens of these countries to deal with their internal affairs themselves. And surely this is the point; we’ve had five hundred fucking years of interfering the lives others and mostly fucking them up.
Meanwhile, the Empire is setting the world on fire.
Which is more important? Quasi-Trotskyist analyses that takes an idealistic if not myopic view of events that ends up being an all or nothing position? What Syria needs is a ‘real’ revolution! Get rid of the corrupt dictator Assad! Etc.
Or, defending the right of countries to independence and self-determination? You can’t have it both ways.
Now perhaps more than most, Floyd could write what he did, the way he did, with some justification. After all, he lived through most of those events and is rightfully bitter about it.
I would not, myself write such a piece, even though I agree with most of it. He’s only describing what actually happened.
I think we have to go back to Samir Amin’s piece and what he said about what Russia’s response should be to this crisis, but I’m doubtful it will happen that way which begs the question; where the hell is it all headed?

Russia’s policy to resist the project of colonisation of Ukraine by western powers should be supported. The target of constructing a Euro-Asian community, independent of the Triad and its European subordinate partners, is a positive initiative.
/../
After the breakdown of the Soviet System, some people (in Russia in particular) thought that the “West” would not antagonise a “capitalist Russia”. Just as Germany and Japan had “lost the war but won the peace”. They forgot that the Western powers supported the reconstruction of the former fascist countries precisely to face the challenge of the independent policies of the Soviet Union. Now, this challenge having disappeared the target of the Triad is to destroy the capacity of Russia to resist to a complete submission
/../
Neo liberalism cannot produce for Russia but a tragic economic and social regression, a pattern of “lumpen development” and a growing subordinate status in the global imperialist order. Russia would provide to the Triad oil, gas and some other natural resources; its industries would be reduced to the status of sub contracting to the benefit of Western financial monopolies.
In such a position, not very far from that of Russia to day in the global system, attempts to act independently in the international area will remain fragile to the extreme, threatened by “sanctions” which will invigorate the disastrous alignment of the ruling economic oligarchy on the demands of dominant Triad’s monopolies. The current out flow of “Russian capital” associated with the Ukraine crisis illustrates the danger. Re-establishing a State control over the movements of capital is the only effective response to that danger. Russia and the Ukraine crisis By Samir Amin

Does USNATO really want an all-out war with Russia, or is all a big bluff, to see who will blink first? Hey, when sociopaths run the show, who the hell knows?

Posted by: William Bowles | May 7 2014 14:45 utc | 223

Gogi Gogi ‏@GogiGogi12 2h
After events in #odessa refugees fearing for their safety are starting to flow to Crimea.Christian priests among them http://www.interfax-religion.ru/?act=news&div=55218 …

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 14:46 utc | 224

@218
people with guns will always beat people without

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 14:47 utc | 225

From the NYT just now:
BREAKING NEWS Wednesday, May 7, 2014 10:36 AM EDT
Russia Pulls Its Troops From Ukraine Border, Putin Says
President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia said Wednesday that Russian troops had pulled back from Ukraine border, and he urged separatists in eastern Ukraine to postpone their May 11 referendum.
“We were told constantly about concerns over our troops near the Ukrainian border,” Mr. Putin said after meeting with the Didier Burkhalter, the president of Switzerland and current head of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe. “We have pulled them back. Today they are not at the Ukrainian border but in places of regular exercises, at training grounds.”

Posted by: William Bowles | May 7 2014 14:48 utc | 226

It seems Putin has made several reasonable moves. We now await the ‘Putin Blinks’ headlines.

Posted by: dh | May 7 2014 15:04 utc | 227

Ukrainian Defense News Network
about an hour ago
May 7, 2014. Kherson region, Ukraine. North-Crimean water canal. Kiev’s junta has ordered to build a dam closing the main water supply route to the peninsula from the Dnipro river.
Crimean agriculture is critically dependent on this aquaduct providing 80% of water for irritation purposes.
In April the new Kievan authorities have already reduced its export of the fresh water to Crimea in three times (from 50 cu m/sec to 16) causing outrage of the former Ukrainian citizens in Crimea and concerns in Moscow. Now Kiev is about to block the water supply of Crimea completely.
Russia has to take urgent measures to organize alternative water supply of its recently reunified region.
Photo: the dam under construction by Kalanchak (45km from Armyansk).
https://www.facebook.com/ukrainiandefensenewsnetwork/photos/pcb.565205033598566/565198603599209/?type=1&theater
my advice is to blow the dam up

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 15:04 utc | 228

crimes of the russian govt….simply awful!
Natasha Bastow
May 2
Called relatives from the Crimea. Russia continues to wreak havoc! “Despite massive protests of Crimeans”, Russia increased pensions and public sector wages. Introduced rewards for the second child.
Nephew, who went to serve in the Black Sea Navy, now instead of
$250 receives a salary of $3000 and by 1st September he will get an apartment.
Aggressors from Russia, more precisely, from the mayor of Moscow, completely updated medical equipment in two hospitals and three clinics, the process continues…In addition, there has been updated public transport fleet. Rescued Crimea received new cars, modern facilities and equipment, and even aircraft at its disposal.
Such are the results of the Russian occupation of Crimea!!!!
Alexander Sidorenko, Ukraine
Translated by Nat

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 15:11 utc | 229

Vladimir Suchan shared a link.
7 minutes ago
Breaking: the guy from the Odessa massacre who was on the phone reportedly with the junta’s interior minister Avakov in the morning and then caught on camera shooting on the people trying to escape the mayhem has been identified. His name is Mikola Volkov (1981), a criminal with a past search warranty.
Moreover, the day before, he was also recorded on video personally meeting with Andriy Parubiy, the Nazi (Svoboda) head of the Ukrainian National Security Council, at a Right Sector checkpoint near Odessa where Parubiy is presenting the Right Sector militia with armor vests. During the massacre, Volkov was, indeed, wearing one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tVITa8wegQ
http://antifashist.com/latest-news/24631-hunta-ispolzovala-v-odesse-karatelej-kotoryh-razyskivalo-mvd-pri-janukoviche.html

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 15:12 utc | 230

@221
Exactly the reason I exercise my (US) second amendment right to keep and bear arms.
JSorrentine you make me laugh so hard my sides hurt sometimes. Whatever you do, don’t change.

Posted by: Jim T | May 7 2014 15:13 utc | 231

fairleft
You might be correct that the military is winning the street but the problem hasnt been solved, the opposition is greater than ever.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 15:15 utc | 232

Posted by: Jim T | May 7, 2014 11:13:47 AM | 227
so when does your govt plan to attack the people? yours is a silly comparison, used to justify your having a gun

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 15:27 utc | 233

Posted by: Jim T | May 7, 2014 11:13:47 AM | 227
‘i need my gun just in case i have to shoot the government….! seriously!

Posted by: brian | May 7 2014 15:28 utc | 234

Look at the pathetic OSCE leader
http://img.rt.com/files/news/26/6d/c0/00/000_dv1719125.si.jpg
Not so brave anymore huh?

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 15:32 utc | 235

Hooligans took pictures of the massacred people in the building in Odessa – but somebody else, a Third Force, did the killing before them inside. Crime in Odessa
Everybody MUST understand that the SAME force has been behind the snipers killing on Maidan, in SE Ukraine, murders in Odessa, Breivik, terror in Iraq (e.g. Juba sniper killing 400 US soldiers), atrocities in Syria and Libya, bombings in Bologna (GLADIO), Madrid, London, Mumbai, Boston, Burgas, Lockerbie, assassinations of Olof Palme, Aldo Moro, sen. Paul Wellstone, journalists Mike Hastings (expose of McChrystal), Gary Webb, knife attacks in China, Fort Hood shooting, Aurora, Sandy Haox, 9/11, attempt on sen. Giffords, Washington snipers, massacre in Touluose, Bolshevik terror in Europe, Bandera’s genocide in Ukraine, Nazi terror over Europe, breeding radical, not assimilated, blood thirsty islamists lead by the voices of maniacs like Choudary, Qaradawi.
That power lurks in the shadows, connected to Windsor/Bush/Clinton global drug empire, and is laughing seeing how stupid public blames EVERYTHING they do on Obama (who brought us rapprochement with Iran, restart of the Palestinian peace talks, pressure off Syrian authorities and people, fired most radical leadership of the armed forces and intelligence: Petreaus, Carter Ham, Stavridis), while the neocon cabal cannot be scrutinized and held responsible since supposedly “now they are not at power”.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 7 2014 15:42 utc | 236

It appears that Russia has backed down, withdrawing its troops from the border, without securing a logistics landline to Crimea and leaving the Russian speaking eastern provinces to the tender mercies of the Kiev Putsch. The Oligarchs won.
The prospects of a nuclear war even made the Elite blink. Ukraine proves that the undemocratic deep state is actually in control of the West. Merkel, Putin and Obama are at best paid puppets. Since no diplomatic settlement was reached except for secret plutocrat handshakes, the Ukraine Civil War could simmer on. This still could be dangerous. Not mentioned by corporate media are the four working nuclear reactors in Ukraine and Chernobyl that could melt down and release radioactive fallout if not maintained by a failed neo-nazi state fighting an ongoing civil war.
http://www.greanvillepost.com/2014/05/06/must-read-the-crisis-in-ukraine/

Posted by: VietnamVet | May 7 2014 15:47 utc | 237

ProPeace #215 continues to cite Gordon Duff and Cabaret Voltaire in his ridiculous effort to persuade us to defend Obama against the neocons. I have got him figured now: he’s a Larouchie. There is a third force of course, but it’s Jewish, which the Larouchies would never say outright, at least not nowadays, so instead they continue to spin their entertaining myth about the Queen of England and her personal, global drug empire, said by them to be the largest in the world. The idea of inviting Israel to take part in anything is noxious. We know that “ex”-IDF soldiers were commanding Nazi “hundreds” in the Maidan. But people cannot break their brainwashing, and obviously Obama (or rather Cass Sunstein)can play upon that with “cognitive infiltration,” which is why I keep trying to blow this irritatingly-named ProPeace person away.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 7 2014 15:51 utc | 238

VietnamVet
Yes it seems Russia is somewhat “backing” now.
Why did Putin remove troops? Didnt even know there were troops at the border?
Thing is, now US/NATO will push even harder. These people are psychos you cant deal with them.

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 15:56 utc | 239

Posted by: William Bowles | May 7, 2014 10:45:34 AM | 219
During the first era of imperial competition (1860-1945), nations discovered that a planned economy and a relatively well-treated working class was a way to gain competitive advantage.

Posted by: fairleft | May 7 2014 16:05 utc | 240

Posted by: dh | May 7, 2014 11:04:03 AM | 223
Putin has withdrawn troops several times by now :-)) This is what Putin according to RT actually said.

“We have been told that our troops on the Ukrainian border are a concern – we have withdrawn them. They are now not on Ukrainian territory, but at locations where they conduct regular drills at ranges,” he said.

The conflict now is defined as inter Ukrainian conflict, not Ukrainian freedom fighters against Russians. Russia as the EU/US is in the role of peacemaker.
Let’s see how that goes. Kyiv has released a leading pro Russia figure. Maybe it is a deal.

Posted by: somebody | May 7 2014 16:08 utc | 241

Things being calmed down now, like before perfect storm…
Spanish and Polish NATO killers in Donetsk…great… #UnitedforUkraine “>http://youtu.be/sZrTtBeAtrE
Nightingale group that fascinated the CIA and was recruited essentially en bloc
TC 18-01 SPECIAL FORCES UNCONVENTIONAL WARFARE
US Envoy Admits: No Evidence of Russian Involvement in Odessa
Odessa: Ukraine’s Waco by Justin Raimondo
Ukrainian forces prepare provocation against Russia in Donetsk
American missile cruiser to enter Black Sea on Victory Day
NATO’s record 6,000-strong drills kick off in Estonia amid Ukraine tensions, until May 23
NATO kicks off ‘TRIDENT Jaguar’ naval drills in Mediterranean until May 16
Russia suspends accord with Lithuania on exchange of info on weaponry in Kaliningrad | The Lithuania TribuneThe Lithuania Tribune
‘Blood and treasure’: US defense chief pushes global military engagement
Gladio II: 4th generation warfare against Russia, Syria, Iran
Wayne Madsen – Obama prepares to smash BRICS during his last few years in office – Strategic Culture Foundation – on-line journal > Obama prepares to smash BRICS during his last few years in office > Strategic-Culture.org – Strategic Culture Foundation
What American Soldiers Think of Ukraine Washington’s Blog
Europe dragged into a division of the world between debtors and creditors: the United States’ desperate solutions for not sinking alone
Raping German Women and Children as a Form of Revenge After WWII (Part I)
NATO’s new Cold War runs into trouble in Germany
Germans hold demo against US-EU free trade deal
China’s Xi: Hands On Approach to Countering Terrorism in China the SCO

Posted by: ProPeace | May 7 2014 16:24 utc | 242

Boris Kargalitsky tells me that:
Putin is in trouble. He can’t act against the Donetsk Republic and has no desire to help it. And he can’t just do nothing because it reveals his weakness…

Posted by: William Bowles | May 7 2014 16:26 utc | 243

Posted by: fairleft | May 7, 2014 12:05:58 PM | 236
Yeah, but not any more. It’s a race to the bottom.

Posted by: William Bowles | May 7 2014 16:28 utc | 244

kiev hasnt paid the gas bill
http://rt.com/business/157304-gazprom-ukraine-gas-deadline/

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 16:31 utc | 245

@237 Of course NATO will say the troop movements are not enough….or it’s just a trick. But Putin made other gestures like backing the May 25th election and discouraging the upcoming referendum. There are people looking for a way out (Merkel?) who may see an opportunity to tone down the rhetoric.

Posted by: dh | May 7 2014 16:38 utc | 246

This video that ProPeace posted at 242 shows european soldiers in donetsk?!
http://youtu.be/sZrTtBeAtrE
What the H are they doing there?!

Posted by: Anonymous | May 7 2014 16:44 utc | 247

As you see, Noirette, you can post as many links as you like. It’s selectable in the options of the owner of the blog. He can set 2 links as maximum, which will certainly weed out your average spam, or he can set it at zero, which in the logic of these things equals infinity.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | May 7 2014 16:53 utc | 248

Of course Israeli regime, as a British/Rothschild creation (wahabbis are too), has been deeply involved in the Ukrainian tragedy. That has been my point for a long time. I really do not understand your attacks against me. Nevertheless I still believe, based on ample evidence, that Obama has derailed and defused, more evidently after re-election, much bigger global conflict that was being staged to start during Romney’s presidency. And deflecting all analysis and research of the ongoing conflict into blaming Obama provides a perfect cover and plenty of room for the neocon/British/Israeli/wahabbi/MIC cabal (rooted in that old judaist cult aimed at world domination) to operate without being bothered by the public.
You cannot deny that Obama has provided needed time and space for Russia/Syria/China/Iran and their allies to absorb many strikes, consolidate, gain popularity and reverse the trend. You cannot deny either that Obama is absolutely hated by the Israeli lobby because his new team made them the weakest in their history and they’ve tried many time to neutralize remove him, including the Benghazi false flag, or Adam’s Kokesh armed “march on DC”, not to mention many fake stories planted in the lame-scream media or just blatant lies aimed at creating fake divisions between the president and his Russian, Chinese, Syrian, Iranian partners. “The purge” among the intelligence and armed forces disposing of the most radical elements is also a fact, but of course twisted by the lame-scream media, fake alternative outlets and double agents like Alex Jones to be “removal of true patriots”.
The evidence is against you.
IMO it’s ok to criticize ridiculous US policies but MUCH more important is to strike the fucking shadow evil cabal out of their comfort zone that they have been enjoying so much for so long due to the whole attention focused on “Obama the antiChrist”.

Posted by: ProPeace | May 7 2014 16:56 utc | 249

Posted by: JSorrentine | May 7, 2014 10:39:09 AM | 220
“As to Israel once again switching allegiances back to Russia, I would – as many Americans – would welcome it but I don’t think it’s really plausible.”
Not after 1951 and probably not before. But why would you welcome it, a little Russophobic slip there? I personally prefer freeing Palestine, not encumbering a healthier country than the United States.
http://representativepress.blogspot.com/2013/10/focus-on-atrocities-that-america-is.html
Blowback.
Yes, the Israelis have dominant control over a willingly compliant, decaying WASP elite. Not masterful control, as similarly not of revenge attacks, nor of control which could not be effectively resisted, if the WASP elite wasn’t willingly compliant, rather “philosemitic,” as it were.

Posted by: truthbetold | May 7 2014 23:56 utc | 250

@221 “Exactly the reason I exercise my (US) second amendment right to keep and bear arms.”
Another “interest group” heard from…

Posted by: Snake Arbusto | May 8 2014 6:39 utc | 251

@213 197 (and again @208 – cos once is never enough apparently)
I’d like to sincerely apologise for labelling you fine upstanding and honourable gentlemen as “;Fake Left” – that was completely called for
Quickly scanned what can only be described as a Festival of complete and utter clueless assclownery you two posted @213 197 (and again @208 – cos once is never enough for the assclownery apparently)
I should really have described you two as being the finest representatives of the Clueless Ass-Clown Left I have ever had the good fortune to meet
Never have i seen such a pair of utter Ass-Clowns, so willing to drop to their knee at a moments notice in order to fellate whatever Fake left Icons TPTB send us to distract the gullible
so far North america’s Premier representatives of the Clueless Ass-Clown Left have knob-gobbled Greenwald (currently holding, for his CIA boss Omidyar, and not releasing, Snowden’s super-duper revelatory “NSA Seekrits”), Hersch (last seen shilling for some CIA/Intel faction), Chompy (recently attacking BDS like there’s no tomorrow) , & of course brave little super-fearless Anti-Nazi himself Russell Brand (currently fucking one of the 1% – but don’t worry, he’s got a plan that’s gonna save us all!!!)
And who knew that

  • Eastern Europe = ‘Prague” +
  • “Poland” = “chicks whose only purpose in life is to whore themselves out to Drunken British Stag Party weekenders” ? [two moronic stereotypes for the price of one]

Not me, but then I’m not a famous leading completely ineffectual Lefty Canadian dissident Professor who’s never even left the confines of the North American continent but is somehow a leading expert on the thoughts of Eastern European’s regarding the 60 years of Soviet Occupation, so what the f*ck would I know, eh?
after all I don’t hangout all day reading Counterpunch nor watch TV so I’m obviously not privy to the sort of high-brow info required to formulate such apparently astute Stereotypical images of people in countries to which I have never been

Posted by: lol | May 9 2014 12:21 utc | 252

*Uncalled for

Posted by: lol | May 9 2014 12:24 utc | 253

PS – Gimp77 – I’ve never referred to the Neo-Nazi coup merchants in Kiev as anything other than Neo-Nazis, but I’m sure you’d never let a little thing like that interfere with your world-class Ass-Clown commentary on the subject of “why I hate really really that guy” when you present your nightly lectures on that subject down there at your local Community Clown College,
And the idea of anyone anywhere learning anything from a gimp77 comment is highly amusing, to say the least – thanks for that, cos I needed a good chuckle

Posted by: lol | May 9 2014 12:32 utc | 254

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