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Ukraine: Continuing Thread …
There was little significant news from Ukraine today. Fighting around various checkpoints outside of Slovyansk continued with casualties reported on both sides and of civilians but no movement of the lines.
I do expect some more serious diplomacy over the next days but the continued amateurish behavior of the State Department, discussed here, lets me believe that there will be no progress in solving the situation without more conflict.
Allegedly: A polite green man from Russia Putin's Spetsnaz special force enforcer Ukrainian woman awaiting fascists in Slovyansk.
The Odessa House of Unions was a massacre, and a planned one.
– I have not read all the comments on Ukr. so some of this type of material may have been posted previous.
Luckily, there are now ppl on the case right away (see one link below, a F trans of a live.journal Ukrainian. Warning: gruesome to the extreme.)
Now, it is very easy to be misled by video and picture analysis that is either ‘fake’ or ‘heartfelt but sloppy’, taking over this or that with odd matches, conjectures, etc. Lots of fake analysis of the Boston bombings out there, was a set-up btw. I mention it deliberately.
But for this, which I haven’t looked into really (contrary to the Ghouta attacks) the pictures speak for themselves.
These people were shot, stabbed, strangled, beaten to death.
Some were then doused in inflammable liquid and set on fire, on upper body, presumably to accredit the ‘fire’ explanation. At the same time – imho, no proof is possible – there was some ‘stage setting’ in the sense that the dead were dragged and positioned to make for more dramatic pictures, in what has now become a tradition.
> The pix all show real dead ppl, but not in their ‘proper context’.. Some are peculiarly naked or missing some of their clothes, there are various explanations for that.
So, who took these pictures?
Why did the photographers make efforts towards cinematic horror and drama?
Of course, to shock, horrify, and put blame on the designated perps. At the same time, it is in your face provocation – it shouts – see the horror, and see how we present it, and we don’t care if it looks strange?
This type of photography has a long history, Holocaust (end ww2) for ex. for recent, which worked at the time, but today ppl are far more sophisticated and technically savvy, also know far more about forensics and generally ‘what things should look like’ and are on occasion more skeptical.
Interesting difference. The ‘rebels’ in Syria cobbled together fake pictures, videos, plus telephony testimony (which ppl tend to forget as it is garbled in other langs. and the image is tantamount..) Despite their meets and courses in Istanbul to learn about presentation and propaganda, of course didn’t instruct them to kill living ppl, just err err 🙂 the ‘West’ reacts to this stuff 😉
While the advice prob went against their core values concerning false witness and false images, which was part of the point imho, they went ahead gleefully but yet with half a heart. If that makes sense. Clumsy stage management. (And it didn’t work. Ppl say because of Putin’s strategy, but imho the evidence played a big role.)
Odessa .. we see real butchered ppl, if somewhat arranged, the horror is graspable. An escalation of violence for the cameras…Gore porn.. It blasts ‘real serious’ as opposed to ‘sketchy, fake’…
http://tinyurl.com/n7vjfq9
Posted by: Noirette | May 6 2014 14:30 utc | 127
Oh this is nice. We now have our little far-right sockpuppet bouncing around calling the Banderites “Nazi-Loons” and declaring that the West seeks to “stain Russia’s image”.
I guess that’s some sort of progress considering this is the guy who has done his level best to put forward the Svoboda version of history [2] in every thread he can, declaring that anti-fascists are just “intolerant” poseurs trying to “be Rebel” [1] (who thinks he should go tell that the the anti-fascists fighting those Bandera-Nazi-Loons today… let’s vote).
Funny, you seem to see now how the west is trying to smear Russia with lies about what monsters they are. I guess you figure that the United States just came up with this whole “smear other countries” idea. Because when it comes to the many bad things said about the Soviet Union, you take that as bible truth (and even add your own flourishes – such as adding 4 million to the famine death toll and declaring it a planned genocide).
Hell, you’ve even come around to a positively Chomskyite view of the Syria situation: that NAZO’s main interest in Syria is not to overthrow Assad but to cause death and destruction.
I mean, fellow MoAers, I’m almost ready to say that the long re-education is quite complete. Though I am still deeply troubled by this little gem:
“Thats not the subject – the subject is what people in Poland, Czech, Ukraine, Belorus, Lithuania, Latvia etc etc, thought was worse, communism or nazism..The Nazis only stayed 4 years in those places – the Soviets stayed nearly 50 yrs.”
He really declares that all of Eastern Europe would have much preferred being slaughtered by Einsatzgruppen, worked to death in slave labor camps, and be ruled as slaves by nazi subfurhers to…. having to put up with shoddy consumer goods through the end of the 1980s. And that he followed it up by saying “the Nazis only stayed 4 years and the Soviets 50” as if the Nazis weren’t driven out by the Red Army and partisans of all shades (Poles, Czechs, Ukrainian, Belorussians, Lithuanians, and Latvians), you know, just got a real sense of their humanity and decided to take up knitting. Let that statement sink in – “The Nazis only stayed 4 years in those places – the Soviets stayed nearly 50 yrs.”
Yeah. Yeah – that’s the kind of stupid that there is no being redeemed from. But still, I’ll take this is as a banner day. I think we’ve won. Wasn’t it Ghandi who said: “First they hmm…, then they sheesh, stfu, foff, and lol, and then you win”? Absolutely prophetic.
But seriously though. This guy is a real dangerous jerk. Anyone who falls for his “pseudo left” nonsense is flirting with the devil. JSorrentine – I accept his “pseduo-left” rants because I think he has a good, if not a bit irrational, heart. But when the kind of scumbag who can say “The Nazis only stayed 4 years in those places – the Soviets stayed nearly 50 yrs” starts trying to win points talking about “the pseudo left”.. well, you really ought to question it.
[1] “Oh quick, over here: the NAZI’s – they’re like “:The WORST people ever” and given all that’s happened in the world these last 10 years it’s totally REBEL to diss the NAZI’s, and my hero referenced them in an irrelevant rebel-pose sometime somewhere ergo he’s got balls o’steel and worth ten times any o’ you godammed non-Fanboi ingrates!”
[2] On the Ukraine Famine: “it is clear that they knew the effect of their proposed actions before they took those actions – that makes it a genocide”
Posted by: guest77 | May 7 2014 5:47 utc | 197
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