Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 17, 2014
Ukraine: OSCE – Right Sector Fascists Deploy To Donetsk

There was some conflict in Mariupol with three Ukrainians ending up dead after protesters went to a military base. There are some videos but it is unclear what actually happened. There is a chance that provocateurs were involved.

The OSCE has an observer mission in Ukraine. From their latest (April 15) report:

The Lviv Team was told by Right Sector activists that they had begun recruiting for their paramilitary structure on 14 April. They said that approximately 100 paramilitaries had already been deployed to Donetsk region and were being trained in the eastern part of the country. One of the paramilitaries seen in Lviv was wearing a new military uniform, including a flak jacket, but carried no weapons.

There was a demonstration in Kyiv in support of Ukraine’s unity, attended by approximately 400people, about two thirds of whom were members of the Self-Defence force. The Team observed around 50 people armed with iron bars, baseball bats or makeshift clubs. Some protesters demanded the resignation of Interior Minister Avakov and more decisive action by the Kyiv authorities in Eastern Ukraine.

Lviv is in west Ukraine and the center of the Ukrainian fascists. That these deploy to Donetsk is a real concern that could lead to serious escalations.

(I am traveling and will have not much Internet time. Please behave in the comments and don’t feed the trolls.)

Comments

somebody, don’t tell me there is anything new from the current discussions in Russia, its all 19th century religious, slavocentric, mystic and irrational talk similar to what we experienced in Germany after WWI – our foreparents needed somebody to put the blame on and to hide their own responsibilities for what happened to them.
Exactly what we see now in russia – blame the outside world and eradicate every boil in the national body

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 12:56 utc | 201

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 19, 2014 7:49:32 AM | 190
“Russia is very naive, west dont want any peace.”
The Russian leaders are definitely not naive. Crimea shows that. But I agree that the west doesn’t want peace. They don’t even want a piece, they want all of it. The Russians know this, and also know how to use the west’s pathological lust for power against them, now. What we have been seeing recently is really a new era in international relations where intelligence, rather than brawn, is being used to slowly subdue a psychopathic aggressor.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 19 2014 13:01 utc | 202

We need to break the habit of only listening to like-minded people, angrily – and even with hatred – rejecting any other point of view from the outset.
Great advice. If only his faithful followers the world over, including many who post to this blog, would follow it. Instead, anyone who radically disagrees with the sentiment and tone of the conversation here, or many places in the bloggerverse, is labeled a troll. I have covered that tactic in my first blog post. It’s a form of censorship. It appears that even within the Church of Putin, people choose what aspects of his gospel they want to apply and/or ignore, including Putin himself. Afterall, look what happened to Litvinenko when he expressed and acted upon a “point of view” that differed from that of the Kremlin. And all those silenced journalists in Russia found motionless in pools of their own blood in lonely stairwells. Of course, Putin could always claim that silencing of critics doesn’t mean he doesn’t listen to them…because he obviously does and after listening realizes they’re a threat to his, and Russia’s, plans and deals with that threat in the way only Russians know how.
At least in America, and the West in general, more sophisticated methods of censorship are used. Muckraking maverick journalists can easily be brought to heel and marginalized to the periphery through any number of velvet glove approaches without resorting to murder and assassination. Yes, it’s more hypocritical than just murdering truly threatening dissent to send a message like is done in Russia, but it’s infinitely more clever and fools 99% of the plebes 99% of the time. But Putin and Russia are too slavishly stubborn to do it the Western way, so they cling to the (im)purity of tradition.
FYI: Trolls don’t have their own blogs where they welcome comments and open, honest discussion. Where’s Putin’s blog? I’d like to visit it and have a discussion with him. Oh, I see, he doesn’t have one. Is he a troll? I don’t know. As I mentioned in my first blog post, I don’t like the term and don’t use it…but so many do as a gesture of putting their fingers in their ears or their hands over their eyes in defiance of Putin’s gospel of “do as I say, and not as I do.”

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Apr 19 2014 13:03 utc | 203

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 5:36:29 AM | 184
Russian economics has been through many transitions since Communism, and each of those transitions has produced behaviors that brought forth interesting opportunity and subsequent obstacles to sustaining economic growth.
One can hardly blame Putin, or any one leader really, for the limits that Russia currently faces on Economic growth or the creation of “Russia Inc.”
There is only a thin line which separates the bureaucracy and private assets in Russia.

Posted by: Tea | Apr 19 2014 13:08 utc | 204

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 8:37:57 AM | 198,
Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 19, 2014 8:45:33 AM | 200
Yep, Thomas is willfully blind – Russia has got the people and the education to be top where they want to
Yandex (they do not need Google), Kaspersky (you might even use their antivirus software), Rosnano, Rosatom, M2M Telematics, Optogan, Mikron, they are pretty good in computer technology – better than Germany – they also have their own automotive industry and Gazprom prides itself on owning the whole production chain, there is more …
And of course, they have this land border to China …, this narrow sea border to the US (though in a very cold part – wait for global warming) and the largest geographical space of the world …

Posted by: somebody | Apr 19 2014 13:13 utc | 205

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 8:56:14 AM | 201
I haven’t heard anything new in the West recently. People in this forum from time to time discuss a 19th century theory of globalization called Marxism.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 19 2014 13:16 utc | 206

somebody, re you trying to make a fool out of yourself? Your famous list of russian technology and companies can be reduced to 2:
Kaspersky (really good as ONE of several anti-spam and anti-virus software);
Gazprom – using german gas pipes to distribute the rich gas reserves in and out of russia
Rosatom – a state company wasting russian citizens money on overpriced and dangerous nuclear plants like in Chernobyl and being responsible for thousands of nuclear contaminated sites all over the former Soviet Union
then nothing follows, only failiures:
Optogan – nothing than plans and illusions
rusnano – just a state company with plans on nanotechnology, obviously no sales or anything
M2M – ???? machine to machine???
the 1,000-petaflop “exascale” computer at Lomonosov Moscow State University is a plan from 2011 with obviously nothing being done or developed so far
Telematics – anything special more than elsewhere???
Mikron – show me a product which says something to the world

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 14:00 utc | 207

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 10:00:09 AM | 207
thomas you are not the world – that is all there is to say.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 19 2014 14:15 utc | 208

and that famous russian automotive industry:
Russia was the world’s 15th largest car producer in 2010, and accounts for about 2% of the worldwide production. In 2009 the industry produced 595,807 light vehicles, down from 1,469,898 in 2008 due to the global financial crisis.
so if russian citizen would rely for their cars only on russian production, they had to wait for 100 – 300 years for a new one….
maybe producing less tanks would help???

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 14:16 utc | 209

Strange tale of a Mariupol protestor leader who was abducted. Her friends reported her missing from the 15th April.
В Мариуполе пропала одна из лидеров народного ополчения (In Mariupol lost one of the leaders of the People’s Militia)
http://lifenews.ru/news/131420
On Friday, the 19th, she was released – basically booted from a car, which drove off, if I understand the translation correctly.
Пропавшую активистку удерживал в заложниках “Правый сектор” (Missing activist held hostage “Right sector”)
http://lifenews.ru/news/131608
She has no memory of the time she was missing and apparently had been drugged.

Posted by: brian | Apr 19 2014 14:38 utc | 210

Posted by: Cold N. Holefield | Apr 19, 2014 9:03:56 AM | 203
troll…

Posted by: brian | Apr 19 2014 14:40 utc | 211

‘because he obviously does and after listening realizes they’re a threat to his, and Russia’s, plans and deals with that threat in the way only Russians know how’
@203
what ‘plans’ are these?

Posted by: brian | Apr 19 2014 14:41 utc | 212

@thomas #181:
Why do you attack me for belonging to an American church and give links to Hebrew texts (MoA thead #68)?
Why would a German bother to learn Hebrew? Do you believe that Europeans and Americans should convert from Christianity to Judaism? That is by no means easy.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 14:44 utc | 213

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 5:36:29 AM | 184
you like Cold and Hole in the head came all this way just to say over and over you hate President Putin.
what a waste!

Posted by: brian | Apr 19 2014 14:46 utc | 214

@213: man, hebrew is a LANGUAGE and not a religion and the Borotba independent group in Ukraine decided to translate articles into hebrew, obviously it has a meaning to them. And people who also spoke hebrew beside russian, ukrainian, german etc. have been very important for the rise of that region from serfdom to independence – and I acknowledge that.
you yourself was talking about being in a church, and then you was uttering that BS about german culture, so I couldn’t resist to charcterize you as the backward person you obviously are…

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 14:56 utc | 215

@bevin et all:
Investigating Stalin is difficult. It’s all Communist Regime this, Western Democracy that. People who don’t know how to think and imagine language to
be candy floss fill the web with their drivel.
As to Stalin the Betrayer: Stalin wanted peace. He couldn’t get dragged into materially supporting foreign revolutions. Russia couldn’t afford it. The USSR’s adventure in Afghanistan demonstrates this. Revolutionists must avail themselves of their own resources: their wits, their passion and Marxist social science.
Russia doesn’t have the luxury of hunkering down between the two largest oceans with geldings for neighbours. Europe is connected by a virtual superhighway into Russia’s heart. Russias neighbours are murderous and venal. To survive it must throw up a cordon sanitaire. Least, that’s my interpretation of the “facts on the ground”.

Posted by: ruralito | Apr 19 2014 15:03 utc | 216

@thomas #215:
Hebrew has only two functions: (1) being the language that Judaic traditions were written down in to make up the Hebrew Bible; (2) being turned into an artificial contemporary language as part of the Zionist project once a large part of Palestine was stolen, to implement that project as something religious instead of socialist. Are you even aware that the language of European Jews, including German Jews, was Yiddish, not Hebrew?

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 15:07 utc | 217

@217: why should I argue with an outspoken anitsemite and authoritarian blindfolded Putin lover (maybe you even have homoerotic feelings for him which you have to fight against!!!) about questions of language use when I only copy a link other reasonable people in Ukraine think is useful?
Preach your religious BS into the prairie…

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 15:18 utc | 218

@Demian #217:
I should have said that Hebrew has a third function, being the language for Jewish worship, analogous to Old Church Slavonic for Russian Orthodox and Latin for pre-Vatican II Catholics.
Hebrew was not considered to be any less of an ancient language with primarily religious functions than those two languages until the state of Israel was created, and the decision was made to make Hebrew its national language instead of Yiddish. (That required the creation of new Hebrew words on an industrial scale, to turn Hebrew into a language usable in contemporary society.)

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 15:20 utc | 219

@thomas #218:
I am an “outspoken antisemite” and have “homoerotic feelings” for Putin. Really nice way to keep the discussion on a high level.
Go away, troll. You were away for a while. Make your absence permanent this time.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 15:25 utc | 220

@ Cold N. Holefield
i think the annihilation of a quarter million innocent Japanese civilians by atomic incineration and the resulting radiation sickness is a rather imperishable legacy of our “more sophisticated methods” of dealing with dissent. yeah, real genteel methodology that, no, mr. holefield, to warn off those wily ruskies?
take your phobic, aggrandizing caterwaul and fuck off!

Posted by: john | Apr 19 2014 15:27 utc | 221

thomas | Apr 19, 2014 10:16:04 AM | 209
It seems your opinions on economics in general does not create a perspective or understanding that gives your conclusions about economics the meaning you think it does.
There are many perspectives on the status of Russian economics that are predominantly based on less than careful surveys which in turn have been based on about 30 years of recycled figures, assumptions, or generalizations, which some have no empirical basis.
Measured trade consisting of unfinished goods being passed between different branches of the same multinationals should not be enough to consider that trade as being “important”, therefore its lack thereof is not sufficient to characterize an encomonic system as isolated, backward, or doomed.

Posted by: Tea | Apr 19 2014 15:35 utc | 222

Ok this man is here to ruin remember what b said:
(I am traveling and will have not much Internet time. Please behave in the comments and don’t feed the trolls.)

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 19 2014 15:46 utc | 223

@220: ya, man, I have to work and also have a private life apart from the internet, so I’m rather seldom on the site here. But today is holiday and with some glasses of very good red wine I like to annoy and irritate some of the bloggers here who think they can just come and spit BS and prejudices on every single subject discussed.
@222: what do you mean? most of the trade between industrialized countries consists of unfinished goods being passed between different branches of the same multinationals? And with russia its different? I very much doubt that. Give me some numbers if you have. And also try to answer the questions I posed to somebody and comment on the numbers and facts i presented on the state of the russian economy. Its just a resource bubble, nothing more

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 15:54 utc | 224

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19, 2014 11:18:50 AM | 218
the antisemites are in Kiev

Posted by: brian | Apr 19 2014 16:01 utc | 225

you’ve started drinking at a pretty early time of the day, lol.. it is reflected in your bullshit which i’ll attribute to the wine as opposed to your lack of intelligence.. for that we’ll have to wait til yer sober – which by the looks of it never happens!

Posted by: james | Apr 19 2014 16:12 utc | 226

to be exact I started drinking very good wine at 5pm german time, much later than the average south african with his/her braai or the Argentine with the asado at lunch time. So don’t insinuate I’m out of control when in reality you have nothing to add to the subjects discussed here…

Posted by: thomas | Apr 19 2014 16:17 utc | 227

Sounds like a waste of good wine then.

Posted by: Tea | Apr 19 2014 16:32 utc | 228

WWW III WAS CHECKED AND MATED AND NOT ONE NEW AGENCY REPORTED IT!
As we read the reports about the Ukrainian ship of state meandering deeper into the heart of darkness with each passing day, the storm clouds grew darker and have yet to abate. Maybe that was their intention all along! A 9-11 on a global scale!
It seems that the House of Saud was invited to the shindig, but, declined with extreme prejudice by firing BanDar Bush, for good measure. They wanted to make their intentions clear, so that they could not be accused of any involvement in this fiasco. Let’s not forget the sly, underhanded, British Crown, that would never pass up any rumpus that mitigates cooperation on the Eurasian continent. Minor character actors included the sociopathic blond bombshell and gas princess, a smattering of fascist, Back Water mercenaries, or whatever the hell they call themselves today, and last, but, not least, we have the entire world of shanghaied extras from Ukraine to Russia up to the EU and westward to the U.S. of A.
My jaw was on the floor listening to Kerry and Obama dribbling gibberish. Statesman they are not. I strained my eyes looking for wires and the ventriloquist operating them. Then it hit me, they were out of their comfort zones. Why, because Russia, was trying to explain to them what the word no means. Fear is debilitating emotion, and they know it. Kerry and Obama were noticeably unbalanced. Fear is the bread and butter of the oligarchical system. Without it, they would cease to exist as a subspecies. It saps our ability to think creatively by morally binding our minds to a very dark place. Under such conditions, we rely on those in authority for answers. However, the authorities are Manchurian candidates?
This is the very kernel of our tragic existence since the Palatial period and as a microcosm the US today. Like the crab that walks backwards, perpetual wars have transformed the human being’s capacity to think creatively into a hive mind that has acceded its greatest asset to the will of a collective and its authorities. If you think we left the Dark Ages, you are naive.
Wars are not waged against the human being, per se, they directly target our language by separating us from our creative potential. Orwell understood this with clarity. They always take control of the language. To control the language is tantamount to controlling all of the human being in mass.
Language is inherent in our genetic code. Human beings have two languages, the natural metaphorical language of the subconscious and the social symbolic language that is based on the former. For the language being, our natural syntax and vocabulary are immune from perpetual war. The fact that we have to “interpret” our natural language when we awake in the morning, is testament to the degree to which our symbolic social language has been corrupted by wars without end.
Why do you think that the fine arts are the one human profession that have always been excluded from every economic system? Because it is the one occupation that engages in knowledge of humanity without a purpose or function. It is a danger to the state because it can not be undermined by perpetual war, nor can it be brought to heel. Plato attacked artist with a vengeance because he was aware of the danger they posed to a “well oiled” state. He stated it openly. SEE THE FIRST MYTH…
The Ukrainian global 9-11 redux seemed as if they were probing with every dirty trick in their bag to learn if they have any magic left. They do not. What this tells us is that they are alone and on the run. They burned every bridge, broke every treaty, and have no friends left, no allies; even Israel turned is back. The Nobel Laureate, didn’t get a dime form the House of Saud. Moreover, Russia didn’t even sniff the bate. This in turn tells us that the cartel not only had to plan the operation themselves, they had to pay for it too! Can you imagine! Obviously, they tried to do it on the cheep by assembling a coalition of criminals. Americans absolutely could not do it, they are tired, dead broke and sick of the slaughtering.
Putin, emasculated the coalition of the criminally insane and turned operations Crimea into operation Dirty Dick Chaney (AKA Obama) meets Lorena Bobbitt. As Putin said, “What is happening today before our eyes is the end of one international system and the birth of a qualitatively different one.” In other words, US lawless savagery is over. Putin understands that America can not be bargain with, it has to be stopped. Russia was not given a choice. The barbarians were at their gate.
Over the next months, we are going to be subjected to a tidal wave of agonizing talking heads, Obama apologists and spin doctors ad nauseam. Please, Spare us, the ignominy. News Flash, the one thing that is news worthy and will not be on any new programs is that if we don’t get our act together, if we don’t stop the senseless murdering of entire cultures, and soon, the world will stop us, one way or another.
What can we do? Boo them everywhere they show their face in public and stop watching TV, especially the news. That would be a good start. However, the smartest way I know how to reverse the destructive path we have taken is to rebuild our culture by diverting funds from war to education and the arts; the rest will follow naturally. Oh, and dissolving the Supreme Court might not be a bad idea, and the executive. Actually, lets just start from scratch, there is too much rot.

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 19 2014 18:13 utc | 229

I’ve spent all day upgrading my machines to Ubuntu 14.04. I thought when I came back here after six hours or so of system juggery-pokery, I would find relevant and up-to-the-minute news, especially from brian, who is really good at keeping up with the russian-language internet and letting us know the news. But no, it’s all religious and nationalist drivel and srtupid statistics about who produces how much in the world market, which means nothing except that the US is good at interfering with other nations, and even if it were true, only an unconscious racist would imagine that the peoples of some countries are just inherently better at making world-class automobiles, or omelettes for that matter. Unconscious racism of this sort is more obnoxious to me than the out-front type. Anyway, I have one thing to add here, which is that I happen to really enjoy modern hebrew, even though or possibly partly because it is a sort of frankenstein language. I have scores and scores of israeli albums of various sorts, punk, hard rock, and even the odd balladeer, and I have spent many happy hours trying to figure out their lyrics. If anybody here wants to discuss israeli rock music, I would certainly be up for that.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 19 2014 19:04 utc | 230

This sounds also naive by Russia
http://presstv.com/detail/2014/04/19/359248/russia-hails-ties-with-new-nato-chief/
They really believe NATO ever will be nice to Russia?

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 19 2014 19:13 utc | 231

@231
I understood Putin’s answer to observe the positive tone of the preexisting relationship but also expressing reserve on how Stoltenberg’s new capacity will affect that relationship, but that whatever it will be not affect Russia’s relationship to NATO negatively.

Posted by: Tea | Apr 19 2014 19:36 utc | 232

Posted by: brian | Apr 19, 2014 10:40:07 AM | 211
Don’t feed the troll … Cold N. Holefield
@The Vineyard of the Saker

Posted by: Oui | Apr 19 2014 20:49 utc | 233

The putsch regime has said it is not going to move on the Donetsk resistance again until Tuesday. I guess we’ll see then if anything much changes. RF has repeated that it reserves the right to intervene military in eastern Ukraine. That still may happen if the crazies spill enough Ukrainian blood.
NATO is making itself look silly by talking of conducting military exercises in their countries bordering on the Ukraine and of the US sending troops there. The US military knows that it would be madness to send NATO troops into the Ukraine. So what is the point of NATO flexing its mussles? To keep up the pretense that NATO has something to do with protecting those poor East Europeans from the big bad Russian bear, I guess.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 21:53 utc | 234

Snowjob is back in the news again. How convenient and timely how he is trotted out whenever the US need a shot in the arm. Catherine Thompson’s article quotes Putin in regard to Snowden, Putin Says, Dealing With Snowden Issue ‘Like Shearing A Pig’. June 2013. TPM Media LLC.
Actually, it is more like milking a bull; a lot’a work for so little milk!

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 19 2014 22:45 utc | 235

Nicholas wrote an unbelievably tendentious column on how the east Ukrainians want to be Europeans, love America, and don’t want to have anything to do with Russia that appears in tomorrow’s NY Times.
He asks readers to comment on it on his blog. So far there is only one comment.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 23:39 utc | 236

Actually, his “ancestral” village that he visits used to be part of Romania (maybe it will be again!), so the column is probably less tendentious than I thought, in terms of how he represents the views of people there.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19 2014 23:48 utc | 237

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 19, 2014 3:13:57 PM | 231
“This sounds also naive by Russia”
No, it’s diplomatic protocol. Something which Russia still practices, even though some western regimes (notably the USA and Israel) have long ago abandoned diplomatic etiquette for the language of the schoolyard.
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_04_19/One-more-NATO-step-toward-Russia-to-change-European-security-structure-Putins-spokesman-5237/
One more NATO step toward Russia to change European security structure – Putin’s spokesman
“NATO’s further enlargement and “one more step towards the Russian border” will cause “the entire European security architecture to be overhauled”, presidential spokesman Dmitry Peskov said on the TVC television channel’s “Pravo Znat” (The Right to Know) programme to be aired on Saturday evening, April 19, Itar-Tass reports.
He said that NATO’s further enlargement would pose a serious threat to Russia because “NATO cannot stop being a military organisation” and “Russia will have to take measures to ensure its own security”.
Speaking about Ukraine’s possible admission to the alliance, Pskov said that “the military-political future of this country, we hope, will not envision such membership for the time being”.
Even though they remain polite, the Russian leadership is fully aware of what is threatening them.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 19 2014 23:58 utc | 238

@scalawag #238:
When the polite men in green first showed up in the Crimea, a Guardian opinion piece observed that there is some kind of rule that NATO can’t admit countries that have a border dispute. Apparently that blocks Georgia’s admission. So as far as I can tell, it would be impossible for the Ukraine to enter NATO unless it dropped all of its claims on the Crimea.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 20 2014 0:09 utc | 239

HAHA at 229: Nice paragraphs 1-4. But no, sadly, building a beautiful culture and pretty fine arts will not hold back the beasts of war and Wall Street. That will take mundane things like learning what is really going on and then communicating with (replace the corporations’ mass media) and organizing coalitions with and among workers, i.e., the ’employees’ of the world, but also with small-time capitalists and professionals. Even when those coalitions sometimes involve ‘icky stuff’ like talking in a respectful way to ‘right wingers’.
People need inspiration and entertainment, and sometimes the finest arts provide enlightenment, but organized groups need to carry that enlightenment into the political battlefields. Otherwise we have what we have now: defeat, alienation and depression in the West, except for the ‘hope’ provided by the eventual — but they will still be corrupt capitalist and exploitative — replacements for US/IMF hegemony.

Posted by: fairleft | Apr 20 2014 0:35 utc | 240

FairLeft @ 240,
Thanks for your thoughts. I agree with you if one thinks of art as only pretty or even inspirational. It certainly can be both. However, art can also come from a place of pain and loss, even on a global social level. As a process, art can help find ways to heal those divisions.
Nevertheless, you are right. Art is not the answer it is the catalyst and inspiration from which answers may be found.
The dialogue and arguments surrounding global human relations are limited to and are framed in a dark microcosm of differences from a limited language.
Human beings are only able to language because of art. Art is where new words are formed. And that is what we need now to break free from being bound by and restrained with the language of the past divisions.
When I focus my mind in a metaphorical manner, the way our minds naturally function, the dark box from which our thoughts have been restrained, are now able to explore infinite other avenues.
Art is not the solution it is the prelude to it.

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 20 2014 1:18 utc | 241

NY Times: Obama Writes Off Putin

In effect, Mr. Obama is retrofitting for a new age the approach to Moscow that was first set out by the diplomat George F. Kennan in 1947 and that dominated American strategy through the fall of the Soviet Union. The administration’s priority is to hold together an international consensus against Russia, including even China, its longtime supporter on the United Nations Security Council.

Good luck with that.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 20 2014 2:04 utc | 242

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 19, 2014 9:18:29 PM | 241
Thanks for your comments; they’re very useful and unique.

Posted by: fairleft | Apr 20 2014 4:09 utc | 243

Posted by: HAHA | Apr 19, 2014 9:18:29 PM | 241
“Human beings are only able to language because of art. Art is where new words are formed. And that is what we need now to break free from being bound by and restrained with the language of the past divisions.”
No. Language preceded human beings. “Art” was a spin-off of language, probably an initial way of expressing thoughts beyond the mundane every day use of language that is used to effect communication between individuals for everyday necessities and interchanges.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 4:28 utc | 244

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19, 2014 10:04:46 PM | 242
“Good luck with that.”
Yup. Typical NYT sleaze.
http://www.vz.ru/news/2014/4/18/682779.html Рогозин поблагодарил Китай за поддержку России
“Rogozin thanked China for its support of Russia”
“I want to thank you for the position of China. In a situation when Russia trying to “throw off the lasso of sanctions,” China unexpectedly made a absolutely solid partner “- Rogozin said after a meeting of the co-chairs of the Russian-Chinese commission on preparation of regular meetings of Heads of Government, reports ITAR-TASS.”
The west has wet dreams of Russian-Chinese conflict and tries every ruse imaginable to create that wet dream. The reality is, the western nazis (NWO=nazi world order) are slowly being consigned to history as a new historical emerges.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 4:59 utc | 245

“Language preceded human beings” is a nonsensical statement.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 20 2014 4:59 utc | 246

“are slowly being consigned to history as a new historical emerges.”
are slowly being consigned to history as a new historical ERA emerges.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 5:00 utc | 247

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 20, 2014 12:59:30 AM | 246
“Language preceded human beings” is a nonsensical statement.”
Even bees have been documented to use language, genius.

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 5:02 utc | 248

Posted by: Demian | Apr 19, 2014 10:04:46 PM | 242
It is pretense, the US is working overtime in Ukraine. Pravy Sektor seems to have attacked a checkpoint yesterday night, killed a few people and got themselves killed. Their car had advanced equipment, night goggles and satellite maps.
Pravy Sector’s leader Yarosh used to be an assistant to Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, who used to be (Orange Revolution) and is now again leader of the SBU recently visited by CIA chief Brennan. Russia accuses Nalyvaichenko to be a CIA agent – dating back to the time he was Ukrainian consul general in Washington.
This at Easter when a truce was declared. It is provocation pure and simple. They want Russia to get mired in Ukraine – it is the Afghanistan strategy all over again.
The US does not care about Ukraine – the New York Times (and Obama) are clear in this. No matter, what Russia does, the US will not act militarily. All they will do is try to gain the moral high ground.
What they would love to do is destroy Russia’s modern image the country has been investing a lot in – Olympic Games, media, think tanks etc, Russian business/ties with Europe and China.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 5:57 utc | 249

Posted by: Demian | Apr 18, 2014 6:34:37 PM | 158
You sound like a stupid fascist there – and the Saker forgets the very obvious fact that Germany’s Conservative Party is ruled by a German Chancellor from Germany’s East.
There is nothing like “German” culture (I said you sound like a stupid fascist because that is what fascists tried to do – “clean” German culture from “foreign” “Jewish” influence).
So – a large part of the US has been influenced by German emigrants – and it was not the uneducated poor Germans who emigrated, but the elites who had lost in the many German civil wars, starting with the Protestant fringe, the last wave being refugees from Fascism. And as the refugees were the ones with the language skills and the knowledge of the country, they and their off spring were the ones who returned as US army and Secret Service officers – and who wrote the concepts of US reeducation. Henry Kissinger was born in Fürth and emigrated with his family in 1938 – when he was 15 – having gone to a German school for a large part of the formative years. From 1945 to 1946 he worked for the denacification programme with the Counter Intelligence Corps in Hesse. He is just the most famous of many examples.
The Western “Bonn Republic” had a predominately Catholic constituency and business was conducted by Rhine capitalists – a huge change from Eastern oriented East Elbian nobility – which thankfully was got rid of – but who had formed a large part of the East colonizing German elite that led the wars with Russia.
Catholic Rhine capitalists were considered Communist by the US as this Willy Wimmer interview claims.
So on and so forth. There is no “ethnic pure” culture – it is a fascist concept.
There is a lot of German history and cultural ties with the US – just as there is a lot of German history and cultural ties with Russia. However, cooperative peaceful policies between Germany and Russia are very recent and there is a lot of bad memory – 20 Million Soviet people were killed in World War II – by Germans. And many Germans were made victims of their dictatorship’s agression.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 7:07 utc | 250

Somebody
What would you do without NATO for your livelihood?

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 7:40 utc | 251

Sell Fords in Germany?

Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20 2014 7:41 utc | 252

251 + 252 is displaying the usual brain dumbness of antisemitic commenters here when their irrational fictions are countered by facts and rational arguments

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 7:51 utc | 253

good morning somebody – still waiting for your research results on the state of the growing and flourishing highly diversified russian economy – you still owe me answers and explanations

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 7:54 utc | 254

@somebody #250:

There is nothing like “German” culture (I said you sound like a stupid fascist because that is what fascists tried to do – “clean” German culture from “foreign” “Jewish” influence).

You just confirmed with that remark my point that the west Germans have been brainwashed by their permanent US occupation. I don’t even know what to make of your using the word “German” in scare quotes and denying that there is such a thing as German culture. Language is an important component of culture. Are you going to claim that there is no German language, either? Did Kant, Hegel, Goethe and Schiller not make contributions to European culture, and did they not write in German, so that their contributions were to German culture, specifically? Were not J. S. Bach and Beethoven German, and did they not contribute to German culture? A friend who sat in on a music history course at Harvard told me that the professor said that classical music is essentially German music. What do you make of that?
It is because German guilt for the Holocaust has been beaten into you for most of your conscious life that you claim that when somebody says that there is such a thing as German culture, what he is really saying is that Germans should clean their culture of Jewish influence. What is really meant is that German culture is different from anglophone culture. German intellectuals were wary about the market taking over everything under capitalism, unlike the British classical economists and liberal philosophers like Locke and Hume. The basic point of Hume’s philosophy is that there are only logical truths and empirical facts (this is called Hume’s fork); there is no such thing as human reason. Reason is the basis of culture, and since Hume’s philosophy denied that there is such a thing as reason, it also in effect denied that there is such a thing as culture: there are just subjective preferences and empirically determined facts. German idealism showed the incoherence of this position.
But since German culture has been stolen from you, to be replaced by anglophone liberal empiricist philosophy and free market economics by your occupiers (you probably don’t even know that there was a German alternative tradition of economics called the German Historical School), you do not think that there is such a thing as culture.
And anyone who says that humans do have culture is a fascist, according to you. How very sad.

Posted by: Demian | Apr 20 2014 8:00 utc | 255

VKofSEVASTOPOL VK 25m
Somewhere around #Donetsk disappeared 20 employees of #Greystone limited. Blackwater? No, didn’t see anybody here LOL
https://twitter.com/VKofSEVASTOPOL/status/457782795579174912/photo/1/large?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=fb&utm_campaign=MarkSleboda1&utm_content=457785715192258561

Posted by: brian | Apr 20 2014 8:01 utc | 256

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20, 2014 3:54:41 AM | 254
I never said it was diversified, I said Russia has the manpower and knowledge to do whatever they want to do in their economy.
Russia has no need to diversify its economy – ie compete with Germany and China. They have the resources both of these countries need, the nuclear power and the army to defend them, and the top technological know to remain top of the field. They got all of that. They do have to buy some stuff with all the money they earn from their resources. It very obviously also buys them peace and political influence.
Russia is the second largest arms exporter – not that much behind on the US.
When you compare Russia to Saudi Arabia – have you ever heard of Saudi Arabia exporting weapons?

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 8:14 utc | 257

@257: so you think an economy as big as russia from the demographic and geographic point of view is viable without diversification, a system based on that can survive politically without supplying to its citizens consumer goods more than water and bread? and real democracy? the theoretic possibility of “doing whatever they want” may be there, I also have it, but nothing has obviously been done to convert these possibilities into practice as the list of companies you presented shows.
I told you it’s a very unhealthy bubble economy, any change in the prices of raw materials will affect the stability of the country and the underlying political system much more than even this crisis in Ukr. now.
I really don’t believe you are serious with your remarks on the war machinery being a cornerstone of that economy – then the US would be the safest and healthiest place on earth. Production of arms is a waste of your own resources and of the buyers ones – history of the last 30 years has proven that you have to replace the war machinery with political convictions otherwise you will not get anything.
a very simple slogan for Putin and his gang to survive has to be: more cars – less tanks

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 8:28 utc | 258

http://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/ukraine-steinmeier-will-keine-sanktionen-mehr-12903039.html
German FM Steinmeier demands from his own co-ministers and the US to refrain from sanction talk and work on the implementation of the Geneva accord

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 8:33 utc | 259

Mark Sleboda ‏@MarkSleboda1 2h
Crimean Tatars promise to go in force and help people of SE #Ukraine in fight against Junta in Kiev #Russianspring http://sebat.org.ua/?p=1300
Mark Sleboda ‏@MarkSleboda1 2h
@tlamb775 Tatar scholars and imams against the Banderite-Orangist Putsch occupying Kiev http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=256py8v6ZW4
Mark Sleboda ‏@MarkSleboda1 2h
@tlamb775 The Majlis is a self-appointed body and its hysterical raving does not represent all or even a majority of the Tatar community

Posted by: brian | Apr 20 2014 8:45 utc | 260

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20, 2014 4:28:28 AM | 258
your argument is plain stupid – and nationalist if you think it through.
Russia is fuelling China’s and Europe’s industries, if you consider it as one space, it is diversified. And obviously – Iraq, Libya, Iran … – you need an army to defend your resources. So yes, Russia needs tanks as long as it might get attacked by “the West”. It has always been Russia arguing for mutual disarmament – worldwide. NATO spoilt the chance after promising Gorbachev they would not enlarge towards their periphery.
The diversification you proclaim necessary is a silly concept – where do you draw the borders? Does Germany have to – again – rob resources to be diversified enough?
Posted by: Demian | Apr 20, 2014 4:00:26 AM | 255
Demian, you were not talking about “human” culture, you were talking about “German” culture supposedly suppressed by “American” culture. If you accept that both are part of “human” culture then your statement does not make sense, as any human can have any percentage of any culture, and “German” culture and “American” culture have influenced each other to a great degree back to Anglo Saxons who originally lived somewhere in the area of Hanover.
Anyway German FAZ now has woken up to the amount of provocation Germany has been supporting – again – in Ukraine.
Translation: “I am here because of my father – he fell in 1943 fighting against fascists. I am here so it was not in vain … tell Merkel we do not want her tanks.”
The article glosses over on the history of Ukrainian nationalism – the progroms, the SS Ukrainian groups and pretends that the Ukrainian right wing has changed – but it mentions the fact that Western Ukraine does not have a narrative to unite Ukraine.
Very subtly, the conflict is made a generational thing. Which it won’t be if Germany agrees to the New Cold War.

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 8:57 utc | 261

add to 261)
Actually Putin proposes a Free Trade Zone from Lisbon to Vladivostok
diversified enough, thomas?

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 9:00 utc | 262

@261: the plain stupidity falls back on yourself: Iraq and Lybia should have had which weapons to defend against US etc. invasions? WMD? nuclear capabilities???

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 9:14 utc | 263

@261: “Russia is fuelling China’s and Europe’s industries, if you consider it as one space, it is diversified.”
wishful thinking – the problem today is that’s not one space, otherwise you wouldn’t have a Ukrainian crisis. and an economy built on limited resources (and limited they are even if they’re enormous at the moment) doesn’t develop incentives to move towards more human, ecologically sound industries and a less carbon fixed way of life – it just exploits the very best, then the best and later worse deposits to keep with the rate of profit. That happens all over the world with resource bubble economies, and the huge country wide ecological and human destructions in Russia already is one of the most serious examples. The polical implications of a russian type resource economy with its oligarchy and 99% absence of people’s power and influence on the state of affairs – instead human destruction of the worst kind, mainly through alcohol abuse – are even mroe serious and threatening to the future of such a system. No more viable today in the age of traveling, internet etc.

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 9:28 utc | 264

@262: you should carefully read the links you provide. the lisbon – Wladivostok one exactly confirms what I’m saying, even through Putins own wrting:
“A ‘New Wave of Industrialization’
In addition to the establishment of closer economic ties between the EU and Russia, Putin also envisions close cooperation on industrial policy. “In my view, we need to address the question as to how we can trigger a new wave of industrialization across the European continent.” In particular, Putin mentions ship, automobile and airplane construction, space technology, pharmaceuticals and medical technology and nuclear energy.
Putin also proposes much closer collaboration when it comes to energy. “In recent years, cooperation on energy issues between Russia and the EU has attracted much attention and, to be honest, has been much too politicized.” He would like to see European and Russian firms working together “from exploration and exploitation of energy resources all the way to the delivery to consumers.”
Even Putin knows what’s lacking and needed in russias economy, but maybe he doesn’t have the power to push that plan through against the oligarchy.

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 9:36 utc | 265

somebody, take a leave now, the sun is shining, 21°, friends are waiting, the day will become bright and great…

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 9:38 utc | 266

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20, 2014 5:38:47 AM | 266
how about you? :-))
and how about the re-industrialization of Greece, Bulgaria, Eastern Germany, Czech Republic, Poland, Spain, Portugal, France and Britain?
Truth is lots of EU countries have become dominated by service industries like banking and lot of ex Eastern bloc countries had their industries destroyed as non competitive in the EU. I don’t think it is healthy but of course it would be competition for Germany that does not have any resources ….

Posted by: somebody | Apr 20 2014 9:55 utc | 267

Posted by: “Language preceded human beings” is a nonsensical statement.” Even bees have been documented to use language, genius. Posted by: scalawag | Apr 20, 2014 1:02:48 AM | 248

“Bees preceded human beings” is a nonsensical statement.
And what has happened to all the warnings that MoA was under DDos attack? It has been for over 24 hours. It still is. Occasional clear spots don’t mean the attack has ended.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 20 2014 17:43 utc | 268

I’m happy all of us refrained from stupid commenting for 8 hours, enjoying the day…
@268: you really think Putin was speaking about the re-industrialization of Greece, Bulgaria, Eastern Germany, Czech Republic, Poland, Spain, Portugal, France and Britain? countries which all have a higher industrialization relative to Russia (maybe with the exemption of Bulgaria). Just admit you were wrong on the russian economy

Posted by: thomas | Apr 20 2014 17:51 utc | 269

I’m happy all of us refrained from stupid commenting for 8 hours, enjoying the day. Posted by: thomas | Apr 20, 2014 1:51:01 PM | 269

Are you really? Then I suggest you stop drinking the ‘christ is risen’ koolaid.

Posted by: Rowan Berkeley | Apr 20 2014 17:57 utc | 270