via Penny
Odd thing about Fanapt was that it had been rejected for years by the FDA 
Then suddenly it was approved? Why?

Remember Fanapt (iloperidone)? That’s the antipsychotic compound that bounced around from company to company during the 1990s, and nearly sank Vanda Pharmaceuticals a few years ago when the FDA gave them a “Not Approvable” letter. I predicted at the time that we’d never hear from them again, but to my surprise (and to Vanda’s, I’d guess), the FDA reversed itself and let the compound through in 2009.

Surprise approval of Fanapt makes stock go wild
Did the FDA finally approve this drug after years of rejection for the sake of pharmaceutical profit making???

Posted by: ONS | Dec 17 2012 20:49 utc | 203

However, can you cite an example of a “home invasion” occurring to any households affected by Sandy?
http://fios1news.com/longisland/node/23276
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/explore?tag=home-invasion
A fantasy, in other words. See, thats the problem. Both sides of the debate have to dredge up ludicrous examples and situations in order to justify their arguments.
No fantasy. It might be a fantasy where you live, but in high crime neighborhoods these kinds of things are a regular occurrence.
It is always interesting to see people who live in safe neighborhoods or foreign countries where there is very little violent crime decrying the “paranoia” and “machismo” of Americans who want to protect themselves against crime with something that works (guns) rather than something that doesn’t (cops, liberal bullshit). They never have an answer as to how you are supposed to protect yourself from criminals when the police can’t (or won’t). They seem to think that guns in the hands of law abiding citizens are more dangerous than guns in the hands of murderers and rapists, which is a view so divorced from reality as to defy explanation.
By the time I was 13 years old I had been the victim of an attempted murder with a knife 3 times. One incident occurred outside my school one hundred feet from the cops. The cops came over, hit me over the head with a nightstick then arrested me and brought me to the station and gave me a JD card (juvenile delinquent) despite the fact I had my hand slashed open during the fight with the mugger. My niece was assaulted across the street from that very spot 20 years later and again within a few hundred feet of the cops. The cops grabbed the kid who menaced her with a box cutter, brought him over to her and asked “is this the guy who did it?” and of course she had the common sense to say “no.” In both incidents, the cops were nearby and made the problem worse.
My sister was stabbed in the back by a nutjob on the international bridge between Juarez, Mexico and El Paso, Texas. This attack occurred within two hundred feet of Mexican border guards. One unarmed man was killed trying to save her life and another guy was severely injured. Mexican cops came over with guns and ended the rampage without firing a shot.
I have been assaulted and beaten by street gangs many times in my childhood and had my nose broken twice. Every single member of my immediate and extended family including immigrants from Ireland and Scotland who never went through our violent school systems have been the victim of violent crime at some point during their lives. Though none have been killed, there were some attempted murders in there as well as successful rapes and assaults. Easily one third of the women I know have been raped, and those are just the ones who have told me about it.
I have been the victim of police brutality twice including the incident mentioned above. My father was beaten Rodney King-style in his own backyard by El Paso cops, and he was tortured by the NYC cops when he was a union organizer in the Sixties. My next door neighbor in Brooklyn was shot in the stomach by a drunken off-duty NYC cop who had insulted his wife, and my best friend was savagely beaten by New Rochelle, NY cops at a tollbooth on I-95. The whole event was captured on video and his father, one of the top lawyers in the county, couldn’t get him off without accepting a charge of drunk driving of which there was no evidence.
I could go on and on with stories like this that convince me that people need to be armed with weapons that will effectively enable them to defend themselves and their families from criminals and cops, who are nothing but sadistic scum cut from the same cloth as the criminals are, but they get to kill with inpunity and take your freedom away.
Fantasy? I think not.

Posted by: Sean | Dec 18 2012 0:44 utc | 205

from an ex-cop
Until U.S. Understands Police Limitations, Some Will Put Faith in Gun Control
We cops know the truth, but we rarely explain it to civilians or politicians.

Since I’m no longer serving as a police officer, I can tell the truth — the whole truth — and it’s not encouraging. Remember, above all, this foremost truth: -No one is responsible for your personal safety and that of those you love but you.
-The Police Want To Help You, but They Don’t Have To Help You . .
-There Are A Lot Of Bad Guys Out There . .
-The Police Are Less Ready Than You Think . .
-Time Is Not On The Side Of The Good Guys . .
-Feel-Good Measures Harm, Not Help . .
-The Single Most Effective Solution . .

Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 18 2012 4:11 utc | 207

No problem with stopping kid-killing, but it’s totally impractical to say that the USA should be like Australia. No kangaroos, to begin with.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 18 2012 5:36 utc | 209

@206 “To so completely dismiss the role that behaviour modifying drugs may play in such violent acts makes absolutely no sense,”
A bizarre argument.
The incidence of Americans walking into schools and murdering somebody is about ten times higher than it is in The Rest Of The World Combined.
That is a fact.
Sooooooo, there has to be a reason why the USA stands out like a sore thumb in that regard.
b (and most others here) are suggesting that this is because it is ten times easier for a crazy-eyed loonie to get hold of lethal weaponry before then walking into a school and going Ratta’ Tatta’ Tatt!!!
PoA insists that it is because there are ten times as many crazy-eyed loonies in the USA.
He even has a reason why that is so i.e. because of the use of “behaviour modifying drugs”.
Which, axiomatically, should require both to produce evidence to support their thesis i.e.
1) b needs to demonstrate NOT ONLY that it is easy to get your hands on a military-grade weapon in America BUT ALSO that it is ten times easier to do that in the USA compared to Everywhere Else
2) PoA NOT ONLY needs to show that behaviour-modifying drug use is high in America, BUT ALSO needs to show that this is ten times higher than it is Everywhere Else.
I don’t think b is going to have terribly much trouble demonstrating (1).
I would be very curious indeed to see if PoA can demonstrate (2)
Have at it, sunshine.

Posted by: Johnboy | Dec 18 2012 6:41 utc | 211

“b” #181
“I wonder why some are trying to involve drugs here. As is known until now, no drugs were involved.
The guy was a bit shy and kept to himself? Well, we are all a bit autistic, some less some more.
To push the discussion to drugs is nothing but diversion.”
Maybe because it has been reported that he was on medication.
Suspect Adam Lanza was obscure in life, now is infamous in death
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/adam-lanza-is-recalled-as-a-rambunctious-kid-with-family-problems/2012/12/14/795ad0fe-4641-11e2-8e70-e1993528222d_story.html
“A really rambunctious kid, as one former neighbor in Newtown, Conn., recalled him, adding that he was on medication. He was the son of an accountant. A family member told investigators that he had a form of autism, a law enforcement official said.”
People with Autism or the related Asperger’s Syndrome usually are on at least one proscribed med. Often they are given several of them, depending upon what symptoms their doctor(s) want to counter. Some of the meds are taken to counter side effects of other meds taken.
It only took a few seconds to find the above article, along with a whole lot of other material discussing how these drugs and mass murder incidents tend to coincide. People are asking questions.
Now I’m curious why you would try to shut down this area of discussion up?
BTW, this same article mentions Lanza’s the cops said the Bushmaster rifle was found in the car, and that he brought the 2 pistols with inside the school to do the shooting. Another article I read said he killed most the people with the Bushmaster. So who to believe?
Doesn’t really matter what sort of weapon he used. What matters is find what set him off, or perhaps who set him off (seen the quoted part in #170:
“The father of Connecticut school shooter Adam Lanza, Peter Lanza, was the tax director for General Electric, a corporation that paid -0- taxes on 14.2 billion dollars in profits last year. According to Fabian4Liberty, Peter Lanza was scheduled to testify in the ongoing global LIBOR scandal. In what could only be described an amazing coincidence, the father of Colorado Batman shooter James Holmes, Robert Holmes, was also a LIBOR witness in his position with FICO. According to the link at FICO, Robert Holmes was a ‘Fraud Scientist’”
I didn’t know Peter Lanza was set to give testimony, like Robert Holmes had been. There was another case I remember reading about at the time of the Colorado shootings that was similar (though I forget what it was now) and noted then it seemed too much of a coincidence. Now with 3 down, I’m sure of it. I’m reminded of how during the S&L investigations during the early 90’s a couple of execs died in suspicious single car accidents (ala like Karen Silkwood) before they could give testimony. One can take a borderline psychotic and push them over the edge, if one is very familiar with their problems and trusted. It might be a very good idea to do a thorough investigation of the psychiatrists these shooters had contact with. This might be more than just side effects of psychiatric drugs.

Posted by: вот так | Dec 18 2012 7:46 utc | 213

vot tak, I guess people are in denial. From the article you linked to

“The man defended Adam’s mother and objected to some reports about her. “I know her. My family knew her. She was a respectable collector [of guns]. She used them responsibly. It’s not her fault that any of this happened.”

Guns are dangerous? No can’t be, they make you safe. Just check the medicine your kid is taking.

Posted by: somebody | Dec 18 2012 8:04 utc | 215

Following up on the Chinese knife attacker:
Adam Lanza Mass Murder in US, China’s Knife Attacks Shift Focus on Mental Health
http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/415745/20121217/adam-lanza-mass-murder-violence-knife-attacks.htm#.UNAlgVIi9WM
“China’s state-run news agency Xinhua said in a report that a 35-year-old-man suddenly went on a stabbing rampage on Friday, inflicting cuts and bruises on 23 residents–22 of which are students aged 8 to 12 years old on their way to school.
In Shanghai, a day-care helper went deranged and hurt children ages 3 to 4 years old with a box cutter recently. However, in the year 2010, a man stabbed to death eight students at the gate of their school and injured five.”
Aspirin doesn’t cure brain tumors, it only alleviates the symptoms somewhat.

Posted by: вот так | Dec 18 2012 8:17 utc | 217

The following article isn’t directly related to this particular murder spree, but it is about child abuse, so it’s in the general ball park. It’s about a form of child abuse not usually thought of as child abuse.
The World’s First Terrorist
Where is Violence Learned?
http://dissidentvoice.org/2012/12/the-worlds-first-terrorist/

Posted by: вот так | Dec 18 2012 9:35 utc | 219

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-peter-breggin/antidepressants-cause-sui_b_218465.html

Here are the starting facts: Death by suicide is at record levels in the armed services. Simultaneously the use of antidepressant drugs is also at record levels, including brand names like Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa and Lexapro.
According to the army, in 2007 17% of combat troops in Afghanistan were taking prescription antidepressants or sleeping pills. Inside sources have given me an even bleaker picture: During Vietnam, a mere 1% our troops were taking prescribed psychiatric drugs. By contrast, in the past year one-third of marines in combat zones were taking psychiatric drugs.
Are the pills helping? The army confirms that since 2002 the number of suicide attempts has increased six-fold. And more than 128 soldiers killed themselves last year.
One theory states that the increased prescription of drugs is a response to increased depression among the soldiers. In reality, the use of psychiatric drugs escalates when, and only when, drug companies and their minions target new markets. In this case, the armed services have been pushing drugs as a cheap alternative to taking genuine care of the young men and women in our military. Instead of shortening tours of duty, instead of temporarily removing stressed-out soldiers from combat zones, and instead of providing counseling–the new army policy is to drug the troops.
First, there is no evidence that antidepressants prevent suicide and a great deal of evidence that they cause it.
Second, antidepressants almost never cure depression and instead they frequently worsen depression.
Third, antidepressants never cure biochemical imbalances. Instead, they always cause them.
Fourth, when all antidepressant studies are examined as a group, rather than cherry picked by the drug companies, antidepressants are no better than placebo.
In my latest book, Medication Madness, I describe dozens of dramatic cases in which peace-loving citizens have become suicidal, violent and psychotic from taking antidepressant drugs like Prozac, Paxil and Zoloft.

To say, with any seriousness that discussing the drugs Adam Lanza was taking is a diversion is disingenuous at best.
At worst it could be construed as promoting a tyrannical agenda.
I am not suggesting that is necessarily the case, however prescription pharmaceutical ingestion particularly SSRI’s has to be considered and is a definite problem

Posted by: Penny | Dec 18 2012 12:20 utc | 221

Reading the anti-gun posters comments above is like reading the fantasies of children. Take the guns away and all the problems go away. Yeah, right.
It’s amazing many folks who with good reason question governments, automatically accept that the government has your back when it comes to firearms. You don’t trust the government’s middle east policy, the way government fights wars for big business, the constant eroding away of personal rights, but when it comes to deciding who should own firearms you trust those same governments to make the RIGHT choices.
Ummm, which of us has our head buried in the sand?
We could argue with statistics, but if you’re like me you don’t trust statistics, only personal experience. On that note how many here read Armed Citizen? Yeah, the organization compiling these stories is pretty much a piece of shit, but these stories are why honest, law abiding americans need access to guns. Despite what a poster above wrote about guns never stopping shooters intent on mass murder there are several stories of good people with guns stopping bad guys with guns… remember the congress woman in AZ who was shot by a loonie? He was stopped and a concealed carry guy didn’t shoot anyone in the process (including the two old folks who brought the shooter down) and more recently the Oregon mall shooter killed himself when he realize there was a guy there who had a concealed carry license and was set to bring the bad dude down. There are just a couple of examples of gun owners and their weapons being helpful and not causing more casualties.
I get that you western europeans don’t like guns, and I don’t blame you. But you don’t live in america where the weird have turned pro and some have turned evil and guns have been part of the landscape as long as there has been an ‘america’. We live with guns and the problems they create because that’s part of being an american. I think the big difference between you and us is our large population. America has a giant population compared to anyone but india and china, plus we’re a population of transplants; we call ourselves americans, but the truth is most of us haven’t lived here that long, at least not compared to the european nations where the populations tend to have a long deep attachment to their nationality. We’re gypsies, malcontents and the human refuse of the rest of the world which is what makes us a nation with such great potential, yet it also makes it difficult to unite everyone in these supposedly united states.
Guns are supposedly used over a million times a year to stop crimes (I say supposedly because as I said earlier I don’t trust statistics – even ones in my favor) and I’d hate to think what would happen to those people if their guns were taken from them. It’s unfortunate that america is such a violent place and it’s unfortunate there isn’t a magic pill to make that all go away (stay away from pharma’s magic pills unless you want to add to the bloodshed) but what can we do? Banning guns isn’t going to do shit to stop people from hurting others, the bad guys will still have guns. Heck, the largest modern mass murder on american soil happened due to box cutters and airplanes (if you believe this I’ve some cheap aspen real estate to sell) and I don’t think anyone has banned those two dangerous weapons yet.

Posted by: DaveS | Dec 18 2012 16:05 utc | 223

🙂 🙂 ..right.

Posted by: Noirette | Dec 18 2012 17:10 utc | 225

224, I am talking escalation and deescalation. You describe a situation of permanent war. Let’s assume that is the American condition as you say. And let’s assume Americans need weapons to defend against the governement.
Do you think any of the weaponry people in WACO possessed saved them from the government or would they have had a better chance of survival without owning any weapons?
It’s an arms’ race. The better armed the citizenship, the more armed the monopoly of power and the criminals. The only one profiting is the arms’ industry.

Posted by: somebody | Dec 18 2012 17:50 utc | 227

sean, 216, the chances you have your gun in your hand at this precise moment and the person slaying your family is not part of your family (possibly using your gun) are very slim.
People feel safe in their family but fact is most homicides are by people closely related. You are right, robbers do not aim to kill.
This is a particular bit of anti-gun propaganda that a lot of people get taken in by—the idea that members of your family are more dangerous to you than outsiders.
In reality only 16 percent of murders involve family members, but over 75 percent of murderers have a prior criminal record. The remaining 25 percent of murderers are juveniles who have a criminal record over 50 percent of the time. This statistic has held up over numerous studies. Additionally, most domestic homicides occur in families with a long history of domestic violence, and not all murders involve guns. So most domestic homicide involves people with criminal records and/or a history of domestic violence. It is not usually the case that in a normal, healthy family without a history of violence or criminal behavior a firearm is likely to be used by someone in the family to murder someone else.
But yeah, in families where the parents are beating or raping the kids, keeping a loaded gun around probably isn’t a good idea. It might be used in self-defense by one of the victims.
Another interesting fact is that most of the victims of “acquaintance” murder also have a criminal record, indicating that many such murders may involve criminals killing each other. Criminals have friends, family and acquaintances, too, and many street gangs and mafiosi know the people they do violence against. Many rapists target women they know. I see no reason why any of this proves that people should be denied the right to self defense.
http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvmurd.html
Your otherwise stable best friend isn’t going to go apeshit and kill you just because he has a gun.

Posted by: Sean | Dec 18 2012 18:54 utc | 229

The source of the following is the FBI – they should know

Of the homicides for which the FBI received weapons data, most (71.8 percent) involved the use of firearms. Handguns comprised 70.5 percent of all firearms used in murders and nonnegligent manslaughters in 2009. (Based on Expanded Homicide Data Table 8.)
In 2009, 24.2 percent of victims were slain by family members; 53.8 percent were killed by someone they knew (acquaintance, neighbor, friend, boyfriend, etc.). The relationship of murder victims and offenders was unknown in 43.9 percent of murder and nonnegligent manslaughter incidents in 2009. (Based on Expanded Homicide Data Table 10.)

“Strangers” are ca. 25 percent of the known perpetrators. And most of the homicides by strangers are done during a robbery or during an argument (all this is FBI data) – both cases where having no guns would save lives. Plus – to a lesser degree – to juvenile gang killings where I doubt they would be that good at it with their hands.
Yes bank clerks rarely get shot because they just hand the money over and fist fights kill less than a gun.
“unknown” means not cleared/solved which seems an abysmal clearance rate (Germany quotes something like 90 percent), however might just mean that doctors are more capable to detect it, as in Germany it is assumed that every second murder (e.g. of a child, old person, partner) is not recognized as such.

Posted by: somebody | Dec 18 2012 19:34 utc | 231

All the gun control talk has had one immediate effect — a surge in gun sales.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 18 2012 20:23 utc | 233

definitely – tanks –
or do you think these people will shoot straight

“The biggest new group of buyers now are senior citizens,” Larry Hyatt, owner of a North Carolina gun shop, said on CNBC’s “Closing Bell.” “Ten thousand baby boomers a day are turning 65; they can’t run, they can’t fight, they got to shoot.”

Posted by: somebody | Dec 18 2012 20:47 utc | 235

Guns and Glory
http://dissidentvoice.org/2012/12/guns-and-glory/#more-46871
“…In America today most people are far removed from the cycles of life and death. We hear news stories of drone strikes in Pakistan and bombs falling on Gaza and the casualties are spoken of as “collateral damage.” For the cause of the just the death of the “other” is an acceptable sacrifice. So we play it out in our video games and in our movies and our culture becomes numb to the pain. Right debates left on the semantics of gun control, rights and freedom while at the heart of society the contagion continues to spread.
America has been in a state of war, in one form or another, since its founding. Some wars are deemed just by historians and some not but whatever the cause war would seem historically to be the default reaction. An unbiased look at statistics comparing the instances of gun violence in western nations will show what this preoccupation with guns and glory has done to the American psych.
The bodies of those children in Newtown should cause America to examine not its laws but its heart. How do we dissuade the mentally unstable from surrendering to the urge to do harm when violence continues to be perpetuated by policy?”
The culture is sick. Like with a junkie, restricting their access to a tool to implement their sickness (syringes) wont alleviate the sickness. One has to tackle the root problem, going after “tools” will either delay, or prevent this.
Now who wants to delay or prevent the American sickness? To whose advantage is this?

Posted by: вот так | Dec 19 2012 1:39 utc | 237

I’ve decided the “somebody” is an opinionated jackass that makes blanket stements about things he knows NOTHING about.

Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | Dec 19 2012 3:54 utc | 239

Penny 240,
I wonder, would you go to the police when you were attacked or would you refuse to do that out of principle?

Posted by: somebody | Dec 19 2012 12:15 utc | 241

Israeli-American fascism. How long till every American town and city is blessed with this overt display of it?
Martial Law in One City: The Case of Paragould, Arkansas
“The fear is what’s given us the reason to do this,” insisted Todd Stovall, the head functionary of the paramilitary occupation force afflicting Paragould, Arkansas, as he announced that the city would be placed under martial law for the supposed purpose of deterring crime. “Once I have stats and people are saying they’re scared, we can do this. It allows us to do what we’re fixing to do.”
What Stovall and his fellow tax-feeders are “fixing to do” is to leave the city’s streets clotted with SWAT operators toting AR-15s and official permission to harass anybody who comes within eyeshot.
The marauders “are going to be in SWAT gear and have AR-15s around their neck,” grunted Stovall at a town hall meeting held last Thursday at the West View Baptist Church. “If you’re out walking, we’re going to stop you, ask why you’re out walking, check for your ID.”
“We’re going to do it to everybody,” Stovall explained, anticipating objections. “Criminals don’t like being talked to.”
The same is true of citizens, of course — but like most members of his paramilitary tribe, Stovall divides the world between enlightened agents of State “authority” such as himself and the Mundane population, which is to be intimidated into submission.”
One suspects the proper greeting these cops will expect from their victims is this:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c2/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-H13160%2C_Beim_Einmarsch_deutscher_Truppen_in_Eger.jpg
No doubt the nazi mayor will expect such recognition of his political prowess.

Posted by: вот так | Dec 19 2012 15:27 utc | 243

@ somebody,
This is what I referred to the other day [about Europe – not being snotty here]:
Although the level of homicides has risen markedly since the 1950s in Britain, the number of those committed by the mentally ill has remained static Guardian

Posted by: Daniel Rich | Dec 20 2012 1:29 utc | 245

Newtown massacre motives: likely factors behind school-shooting emerge
http://rt.com/usa/news/newtown-massacre-adam-otoole-426/
“An article published over the weekend by the New York Daily News reportedly cited Adam Lanza’s uncle as saying the shooter was prescribed an antipsychotic called Fanapt, a drug with documented links to causing impulse-control disorder and major depression in some users, as well as other side-effects. By Tuesday, though, the Daily News’ quote had been scrubbed from the site and no verifiable source has been able to confirm that preliminary report.”
Scrubbed? Funny that.

Posted by: вот так | Dec 20 2012 15:30 utc | 247

@ somebody [#248],
So, you too must wonder how anyone can do what the mass murderers have done, right? Dunblane [UK], led to British subjects having to hand over their guns. Is England any saver today? To paint a clear/er picture: I am a vegetarian, but will eat you if it comes down to shear survival. I think life is as simple as that.

Posted by: Daniel Rich | Dec 20 2012 23:14 utc | 249

250, I did not take it as threat. I assume nature to be a huge food chain.
I guess these mass shootings are a form of very dramatic suicide by people who hate themselves and the world.

Posted by: somebody | Dec 20 2012 23:39 utc | 251

@ Daniel, just saw your 250. I’m arguing against the idea that at bottom we will fight each other to survive. I think evidence is there that at bottom, we work together to survive, but in extremis we will eat those who die. Eating those who have died = OK; killing people to eat them does not = OK. As a philosophical position. If you and I were stranded together, I hope we could make that pact.

Posted by: ahji | Dec 21 2012 0:25 utc | 253

As long as “profits uber alles” rule the day, nothing can ever change. In America today, any solution to any problem that puts the profits of mega-business at risk will be ignored, no matter how many kids die. Profits for the 1% must continue.

Posted by: ben | Dec 21 2012 3:52 utc | 255

249
“I am a vegetarian”
Nothing wrong with “Veggie Love”.
http://features.peta.org/VeggieLove/Default.aspx

Posted by: вот так | Dec 21 2012 6:24 utc | 257

I’ve been left spell-bound by your comments down to the bottom of the first page, POA. But now its time to close down and do something else…I thank you for your continued passionate defence of the American Constitution and America’s traditions. You are a good, intelligent and well informed man challenged by ignorance at every turn. I would have lost my temper with your adversaries, had these arguments been mine, long ago. So I guess that means you’re a saint too…(Should I start a fan club? LOL)

Posted by: arthurdecco | Dec 24 2012 5:49 utc | 259

“You have to wonder what makes some people think that school shootings are funny and entertaining. That’s the theme on a new “mod” based on the popular computer game Half Life 2.”
written by ‘Parent Further’, included in comment #7 by Don Bacon.
I’d like to know more about the principals involved in the development of this “game”, myself, Don.
I want to know the names and addresses of those who wrote the software…of those who wrote the synopsis and full “screenplay”…of those who funded the development of the game and I want to know who owns the copyright and the rights for distribution.
I would then be closer to an understanding of who my real enemies are.
I would then be closer to an understanding of who my enemies actually are.

Posted by: arthurdecco | Dec 28 2012 2:17 utc | 261

Here you go arthur….http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valve_Corporation

Posted by: dh | Dec 28 2012 2:42 utc | 263