The Protests And Embassy Assaults Will Proliferate
This morning I suggested that yesterday's deadly attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi was an Al Qaeda operation in revenge of the killing of Abu Yahya al-Libi by a U.S. drone in Pakistan. The protests in Benghazi and Cairo against an anti-Islam film were used as cover for this operation. Al-Libi's death was confirmed in yesterday's video message by the current Al Qaeda leader Ayman al-Zawahiri. That al-Zawahiri message, the attack in Benghazi and the rising of the AQ flag in front of the embassy in Cairo all came on the same 9/11 anniversary day is unlikely to be a coincidence. Recent news seem to confirm my take:U.S. sources told CNN on Wednesday that the Benghazi attack was planned, and the attackers used the protest outside the consulate as a diversion. The sources could not say whether the attackers instigated the protest or merely took advantage of it, and they say they don't believe Stevens was specifically targeted.The protests in Cairo and in Benghazi were primarily against an anti-Islam movie. But that was likely just a pretext and a helpful diversion for the attack. The spectrum of Salafists in Egypt and Libya is wide but the few violent ones do have little problem to get some otherwise peaceful ones up for some loud protest against this or that perceived injustice. The U.S. support to the Benghazi radicals against Gaddhafi also brought former militant radical Islamists into official positions in Libya. They may well have helped in the creation of the incident.
That anti-Islam movie, of which a trailer was launched a few days ago, came just in time. That "Sam Bacile", who told the Wall Street Journal that he is a Jew from Israel and that Jews financed his hate-speech movie, does not seem to exist at all. It is not yet known what islamophobic nut is behind this information operation. The movies dubious origin and that it came out just in time for the attack will be the base for many interesting conspiracy theories. I don't want to add one here but will look at the U.S. response to the attack.
The important people in Washington DC will feel the usual urge to "do something" about the death of ambassador Chris Stevens. The ongoing election campaigns will create the necessity for a revenge operation.
The Libyan government is in the hand of U.S. proxies. It has already apologized for the attack and will allow the U.S. to take any necessary action. The preferred tool of the Obama administration's foreign policy is the weaponized drone. I therefore expect that drones will soon start to fly of Cyreanica to look for signs of those who killed the ambassadors. They will find many a "militants", i.e. male person of the age ten and above, and will kill a rather random sample of them. The following outrage and radicalization will later lead to attacks on the Libyan government and the country will go down from there. Another Somalia in the making.
The situation in Egypt is different. President Mursi has yet to condemn the breach of the embassy perimeter and the rising of the al-Qaeda flag on its flagpole. For him and his Muslim Brotherhood the Salafists are the political competition. He has to protect his right flank and is therefore unlikely to punish any of the demonstrators nor will he act forcefully to prevent another attack on the embassy. The Brotherhood has already called for more protests against the film. Further serious trouble in Egypt can thereby be expected.
The U.S. on the other side has no good instrument to make Mursi compliant to its will. If it stops the money flow the peace agreement between Israel and Egypt will be in danger. The Egyptian control of the Suez canal is also an issue the U.S. can not ignore. Any threat to Egypt may end up in a blockade of the canal for U.S. warships. The relation between the U.S. and Egypt is therefore likely to deteriorate.
The protests against that stupid movie and the now established examples of storming U.S. embassies will likely proliferate. By Friday night Beirut, Amman, Kabul, Sanaa and other capitols will have followed the pattern.
The only place where we can expect no protest against that idiotic movie is Syria. No one there has time for such a nonsense. After yesterday's sobering experience in Libya the U.S. support for the radical insurgents in Syria there will likely become smaller or even stop. That would then be the only valuable thing those movie makers, whoever they are, would have achieved.
Posted by b on September 12, 2012 at 19:23 UTC | Permalink
next page »For disagreeing with Jeffrey Goldberg and his utter Zionist lies and fabrications, mostly against Iran, I have been blocked from The Atlantic.
President Mohamed Mursi's main objective now seems to be financial. He has asked the IMF for a $4.8 billion "loan" and now "a senior EU official" has said "probably Egypt will need more than double this amount, more than $10 billion." So internationally Mursi is dissing Assad and treading carefully at home.
Mursi's off to Europe. He will meet European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso, EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton and Herman van Rompuy, President of the European Council, which represents EU governments. The talks in Brussels are expected to cover economic support, job creation, agriculture, energy and European private sector investment in Egypt, the official said. The Egyptians aim to develop their gas and renewable energy industries.
b, this as well as the previous post are downright brilliant. How is that you are staying about 1 hour ahead of this story compared to the rest of the world?
You wrote: The Libyan government is in the hand of U.S. proxies. It has already apologized for the attack and will allow the U.S. to take any necessary action.
It is more complicated then that. Benghazi has been in the hands of the Islamic militants from the very beginning. The Libyan government to this day have not achieved full dominion over that city. If my reading is right, they entered into some kind of "understanding" in order to avoid civil war and partition. For the US to now start droning the Benghazi people could unravel whatever unity exists and reignite that conflict.
What I find perplexing is why the US would send its ambassador to such an unstable place in the first place. Wasn't it just a few months back that one of Libya's high ranking officers was assassinated there? For sure, they shouldn't re-open the consulate there.
Posted by: ToivoS | Sep 12 2012 20:59 utc | 4
My understanding is that Benghazi did house the initial US embassy, and later when the embassy was established in Tripoli the Banghazi site was retained as a consulate, for some reason. So then why was Stevens in Benghazi, especially considering it had already been bombed once in June in retaliation for Abu Yahya al-Libi? Apparently b/c Stevens had a great relationship with the people there. (Okay, not so great.)
I expect we'll get some information from the State press conference today.
I was trying to figure out who would have most to gain from assaulting embassies and al queda do have form when it comes to attacking them. Good thinking B.
Posted by: heathroi | Sep 12 2012 21:21 utc | 6
Well oblamblam has to re-open the consulate there even if it only stays open a couple of hours a day until after the prez 2012 farce. I would imagine that fukasi have been strengthening the Libyan central governments hand by way of arms shipments and cash to pay troops since the ghaddaffi rape n murder, so the regional leaders in Benghazi may discover they have been outplayed.
No one knows who fired the rocket launcher and as b says the conspiracies will run thick and fast. Who ever it was knew the most likely escape route the ambassador was gonna take and what car he was in; as well as having a rocket launcher and a man with sufficient training to use it properly.
One suggestion could be that militia loyal to the central government used the demo to create an incident which will not only give them teh perfect excuse to take over the province, they will get a coupla companies of amerikan marines (assholes who fancy themselves as special forces even tho they have the surgical precision of a shillelagh) to assist in the slaughter.
Even if the mob in washington suspect they have been played, which may not happen - military n state blood will be running hot and politicians are busy eying the polls, but even if they do suspect they've been played they will still hafta go with the flow.
I do think the whole 'lets create anarchy in troublesome places' strategy may be up for rethink soon tho. These regional leaders are chessmasters of local politics and amerika may rediscover what the european colonial powers learned 120 years ago. That is trying to get down and play the game yerself is nigh on impossible because of a limited understanding of many of the pieces in play.
They will understand that types like Saddam Hussein and even Muammar Ghadaffi don't make things difficult, that in fact they make doing bizness in the ME easier. Even so given what we know about pols' hubris it is tough to see a back down on Assad, that would be a a tough one to explain, even to the whitehouse press release stenographers.
As it is the new Libyan govt is back-pedalling on its purge of ghadaffists. Now that the fukasi pricks are all caught up in Syria maybe the real peace deal between the old administration and the new one will be settled.
Wouldn't be surprised to see Saif al-Islam Gaddafi making a comeback. Only if he can stay alive for the next few weeks because there will be many from the transitional council who see his resurgence as being their end.
May be that is wishful thinking - I still get upset thinking about the colonel's end.
Posted by: Debs is dead | Sep 12 2012 21:39 utc | 7
One could say that the recent remarks of Paul Craig Roberts regarding 9/11 might also apply to Cairo and especially Libya, eleven years later. We'll see how it pans out.
"You only have to know two things.
"One is that according to the official story, a handful of Arabs, mainly Saudi Arabians, operating independently of any government and competent intelligence service, men without James Bond and V for Vendetta capabilities, outwitted not only the CIA, FBI, and National Security Agency, but all 16 US intelligence agencies, along with all security agencies of America’s NATO allies and Israel’s Mossad. . . .(more failures)
"It is hard to image a more far-fetched story--except for the second thing you need to know: The humiliating failure of US National Security did not result in immediate demands from the President of the United States, from Congress, from the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and from the media for an investigation of how such improbable total failure could have occurred. No one was held accountable for the greatest failure of national security in world history. . ."
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2012/09/11/the-11th-anniversary-911-paul-craig-roberts/
b, I think you're wrong on Morisi not protecting the Embassy, he will try, he must show he can deliver order. That creates an opportunity for his Salafists right and for the military to embarrass him, but I think he's gotta step up and lead. If he can't, Egypt could come unhinged.
I also want to predict that we see far more limited embassy stormings, though I find it a provocative prediction. Perhaps some of the weaker autocratic states see it, but again, I think it's a mark of pride for these nations to prevent that.
Posted by: scottindallas | Sep 12 2012 21:54 utc | 9
'Posted by: Colm O' Toole | Sep 12, 2012 3:53:32 PM | 1
a somalia on the edge of Fortress europe and africa did nothing to help...shame on africa...as for the eurotrash...they will get more immgrants flooding in which will push europe further to the right...neosomalia in north africa and neonazism in europe...thats what you get when you set party political 'democracy', where regimes are loaded with sociopaths and good government is a fast fading dream.
Posted by: brian | Sep 12 2012 21:56 utc | 10
'For disagreeing with Jeffrey Goldberg and his utter Zionist lies and fabrications, mostly against Iran, I have been blocked from The Atlantic.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 12, 2012 4:09:29 PM | 2
'They hate us for out freedoms'
Posted by: brian | Sep 12 2012 21:58 utc | 11
The US State Dept. is in seclusion. So, many questions will go unanswered. Intentionally?
Daily Press Briefing Schedule
September 12
There will be NO Daily Press Briefing today.
September 13
TBD
NYTimes: Libya Attack Provokes Washington Crisis
WASHINGTON — The violent deaths of four American diplomatic personnel in Libya during a heavily armed and possibly planned assault on a flimsily protected consulate facility on the Sept. 11 anniversary provoked an uproar in Washington on Wednesday, presenting new challenges in the volatile Middle East less than two months before the American presidential election.
This photo was on twitter. Is it photoshopped? Looks like Stevens? http://imgur.com/Iybvh
Posted by: Linda J | Sep 12 2012 23:20 utc | 15
When the details come out, I would not be surprised to learn that Stevens' death is a "green on blue" incident. Afghans have used the tactic to the point where American troops barely associate with Afghan counterparts anymore. It is making a mockery of American security in the country, proving that Afghanistan is uncontrollable. And it sends a powerful message to other areas the US is trying to pacify.
There are plenty of Libyans who would love nothing more than freedom from the USA, like they had before.
Posted by: JohnH | Sep 12 2012 23:53 utc | 16
Linda J. Almost certainly not the Ambassador, but America's enemies certainly cannot let up rubbing our noses in the Libyan fiasco.
Posted by: ToivoS | Sep 12 2012 23:54 utc | 17
@Linda J - true or not, it sends a powerful message to all Arabs, Muslims, and beyond, willing to believe it, or that suddenly come to think that it could become true; much worse than the Mogadishu fiasco, when a captured Us helicopter pilot was paraded on TV
Posted by: claudio | Sep 13 2012 0:31 utc | 18
There may yet be videos from Benghazi. The Americans lost track of Stevens during the consulate battle. Administration officials said that Libyans transferred Stevens to a Benghazi hospital at some point during the fighting. It is unknown if he was dead or alive when he reached the hospital, or what ultimately killed him. His body was ultimately transferred to American personnel at Benghazi airport, where a chartered U.S. flight was called in to evacuate the Benghazi diplomatic staff to the embassy in Tripoli.
California man confirms role in anti-Islam film
By GILLIAN FLACCUS, Associated Press
LOS ANGELES (AP) — The search for those behind the provocative, anti-Muslim film implicated in violent protests in Egypt and Libya led Wednesday to a California Coptic Christian convicted of financial crimes who acknowledged his role in managing and providing logistics for the production.
Nakoula Basseley Nakoula, 55, told The Associated Press in an interview outside Los Angeles that he was manager for the company that produced "Innocence of Muslims," which mocked Muslims and the prophet Muhammad and may have caused inflamed mobs that attacked U.S. missions in Egypt and Libya.
http://tinyurl.com/9w4scme
B, so concerned about "salafism" these days. Funny how this never came up when he was so concerned about US imperialism in Iraq in which there were no foreign fighters and no sectarian schism, only Iraqi nationalists bombing their own mosques in order to shame the US occupation. Clever Arabs!
And now the Salafists are going to take over everything, and the sky is falling on the little slice of the Levant chartered to the Russians. B's precious Russians.
Posted by: slothrop | Sep 13 2012 1:19 utc | 21
oh, wait a minute, I forgot. It was the US spooks who among those pretty mosques. According to b.
Posted by: slothrop | Sep 13 2012 1:21 utc | 22
oh, wait a minute, I forgot. It was the US spooks who bombed those pretty mosques. According to b.
Posted by: slothrop | Sep 13 2012 1:22 utc | 23
Claudio #18 Interesting that you bring up Mogadishu. At the time I was working with a PRC Chinese scholar (in some totally unrelated subject) who noted how the US was totally humiliated (we all agreed). He went on how difficult it is to predict how interventions and wars can escalate. He then came up with an amazing optimistic prediction, that this event will teach the Americans to stay out of the internal affairs of other nations. My good Chinese colleague assumed, as I did at the time, that the US was a rational actor and adjusted to its mistakes.
With this tiny anecdote, can you imagine how the Chinese FP establishment must have sat in wonder and then in delight, as the US expanded that error many thousands of time in Iraq and Afghanistan. All China had to do was stay out of the way and watch the US thrash around losing military effectiveness, influence in the Muslim world and achieve near bankruptcy.
Posted by: ToivoS | Sep 13 2012 1:28 utc | 24
It's natural for a Chinese because China has a policy of non-interference in other countries' domestic affairs. It doesn't come naturally to the US.
Good call on use of drones in Libya. CNN is reporting that they will be deployed.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/12/world/africa/libya-us-ambassador-killed-pentagon/index.html
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/09/libya-drone-war/
Posted by: Paul | Sep 13 2012 2:45 utc | 26
But of course, Paul, outside of beefing up the Embassy security(which he did, theater-wide), what else is at his disposal...?
President Obama and Secretary of the State Clinton are shocked by the events in Libya. I am shocked by their state of shock :-)
Let us recap and review the state of affairs in Libya in the past year, and see if you would remain as shocked as our administration.
Before I start, I must add I DO NOT condone taking anyone's life for any reasons what so ever, however this news is not shocking to me.
There is no secret about US involvement in Libya, that coupled with the NATO bombings resulted in an escalated violence, which left thousands of civilian death, and hundreds of thousands displacement in its aftermath.
Let us not forget that US involvement in backing the rebels in overthrow of Gaddafi government was an act of ethnic cleansing and was done in violation of international law.
Furthermore let us not forget that most of us knew that Libya had little chance of growing into a full democratic state, because the “seeds” planted by NATO’s support for the rebels were not exactly democratic. What NATO and US did was that they’ve given air and military cover to a rebel faction that was NOT chosen and elected by people, they did not have a mandate, they created a protracted power struggle, and a tribal backlash as a result. The West (US & NATO) just carved up Libya, because the only stability they were really interested in was if it becomes stable enough for Western companies to come in and sign profitable contracts. This is what we are good at, this is what we do best.
We did it with Fallujah in Iraq, we carpet bombed it, until there was nothing left but pile of dust. This is what we are doing in Syria now.
Then we act like we are shocked, holly hell why did they kill our diplomatic officials, the very people that brought them democracy, we mourn and etch their names as a fallen hero on some marble plaque, hang it somewhere in the hallway of State Department building, and go on to the next country. It is very sad state of affairs really.
One other point of interest the similar event happened in Egypt, another country who seemed to have some grievances with us, and both incidents happened on September 11.
Did the Sam Bacile vile movie had anything to do with this? Perhaps. Was the movie the only thing that instigated this? If you say yes, I’ll say read the above again and deliberate. Will something along the same line in making after we liberate and bring “democracy” to Syria? You can pretty much bet on it.
Posted by: Susan Nevens | Sep 13 2012 3:06 utc | 28
It's natural for a Chinese because China has a policy of non-interference in other countries' domestic affairs.
Which is at the essence of the Westphalian Peace principles enshrined in the Vienna Conventions, and, something the Chinese had learned much earlier...! It was usually those pesky Mongols that disturbed their peace...!
Aleksei K. Pushkov, the head of Russia’s parliamentary Foreign Affairs Committee, wrote via Twitter: “Under Qaddafi they didn’t kill diplomats. Obama and Clinton are in shock? What did they expect – ‘Democracy?’ Even bigger surprises await them in Syria.” --NYTimes
Posted by: slothrop | Sep 12, 2012 9:19:25 PM | 21
look what the cat dragged back in
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 3:27 utc | 31
Obama, last year: “I have directed these actions, which are in the national security and foreign policy interests of the United States, pursuant to my constitutional authority to conduct U.S. foreign relations and as Commander in Chief and Chief Executive.”
Of course none of what Obama said last year had any truth to it. The president has no such constitutional authority. This is the problem with a renegade president who assumes powers not granted to him by the Constitution -- he's shocked at the results, as he should be, as everyone is.
President Barack Obama vowed on Wednesday to "bring to justice" the Islamist gunmen responsible for a ferocious assault that killed the U.S. ambassador to Libya and three other Americans - an attack that may have been organized in advance.
Libyans have identified units of a heavily armed local Islamist group, Ansar al-Sharia as being involved. CNN reported that the Libyan group that bears the name “Ansar al-Sharia” is an autonomous collective of loosely-affiliated jihadist groups that sprung up in the post-Gaddafi era. There is also a seemingly separate group in Yemen that has links to al-Qaeda and operates under the name Ansar al-Sharia.
b @ 20 (last thread) says, 'Looks like I was a few hours faster with this story than other "experts."'
True. But I bet you weren't faster than BBC reporter Jane Standley on 9/11/01 in reporting the "collapse" of Building 7 ;o)
Posted by: Arash Darya-Bandari | Sep 13 2012 3:55 utc | 35
President Barack Obama vowed on Wednesday to "bring to justice" . . .
Think about it. On one level it's amusing, on another, tragic. This SOB has reserved the right to murder anyone he pleases, including American citizens, and he speaks of bringing people to justice?
As b said above: "They will find many a "militants", i.e. male person of the age ten and above, and will kill a rather random sample of them." Women and little kids too, if past example is a judge.
Ann-Marie Slaughter, one member of the cabal who promoted Libya, wants to do it again in Syria, and she says that the recent US deaths make US intervention in Syria even more imperative.
NYTimes
"The repercussions of these killings extend far beyond Libya. Calls for more active U.S. intervention to help the Syrian opposition will now be met with arguments that our efforts to help the Libyans were repaid by the killing of our ambassador. In fact, however, the lesson of this tragedy should be exactly the opposite." http://tinyurl.com/8q95cch
Think about it. On one level it's amusing, on another, tragic. This SOB has reserved the right to murder anyone he pleases, including American citizens, and he speaks of bringing people to justice?
"...Six-gun sound is our claim to fame!..."
Posted by: Dr. Wellington Yueh | Sep 13 2012 4:24 utc | 39
Dr. Yueh, are ya sure it's not Good Lovin' Gone Bad...? ;-)
*heh* From Reuters... Russia, China join West in Iran rebuke at U.N. nuclear meet...
Naturally the Lede was buried...
...In their proposed resolution, the six powers voiced continued "support for a peaceful resolution of the international community's concerns".
They said Iran should immediately agree a framework accord with the U.N. nuclear watchdog to clarify questions over possible military dimensions to its nuclear program.
An IAEA investigation into suspected nuclear weapons development work in Iran has made little progress over the last four years, with the West accusing Tehran of stonewalling.
Iranian cooperation with the IAEA "is essential and urgent in order to restore international confidence in the exclusively peaceful nature of Iran's nuclear program", the powers said...
Why on earth would you take anything Goldberg says as credible? He is a war crimminal and is running interference for this Israeli op that went a bit south. Sort of like a mini Lavon affair.
Posted by: demize | Sep 13 2012 7:08 utc | 43
Will the US learn its lesson and immediately stop supporting the terrorists in Syria? I hope you are right. Syria has suffered enough.
Posted by: Bashar | Sep 13 2012 9:02 utc | 44
Apparently the director has been found: Anti-islamic film search leads to coptic Christian in California | World news | guardian.co.uk
Like Coptic Christians in Egypt did not have a rough enough time already.
Posted by: a swedish kind of death | Sep 13 2012 9:25 utc | 45
And so the US embassy in Sanaa, Yemen, has been the target today. The police had to open fire on the protesters.
Posted by: ThePaper | Sep 13 2012 9:30 utc | 46
From the Yemeni journalist Haykal Bafana
#Yemen
| Photo : American flag at US Embassy #Sanaa replaced : "There is no god but Allah & Muhammad is His Messenger."
#Yemen
: Photo : Burning cars INSIDE US Embassy #Sanaa. Clearly clueless characters in charge of security.
looting the embassy (scroll down)
Video of looting at the U.S. embassy
---
Now this happened after a high alert went out.
It seems therefore very likely that Yemeni troops guarding the embassy colluded in this.
Maybe president Hadi didn't like all the interference he gets from the embassy and used this to send a signal?
This confirms my take of an AQ operation in Libya
Libya rescue squad ran into fierce, accurate ambush
Captain Fathi al-Obeidi, whose special operations unit was ordered by Libya's authorities to meet an eight-man force at Benghazi airport, said that after his men and the U.S. squad had found the American survivors who had evacuated the blazing consulate, the ostensibly secret location in an isolated villa came under an intense and highly accurate mortar barrage."I really believe that this attack was planned," he said, adding to suggestions by other Libyan officials that at least some of the hostility towards the Americans was the work of experienced combatants. "The accuracy with which the mortars hit us was too good for any regular revolutionaries."
And that islamophobe film is getting more mysterious by the day. Who planned this?California man confirms role in anti-Islam film
The search for those behind the provocative, anti-Muslim film implicated in violent protests in Egypt and Libya led Wednesday to a California Coptic Christian convicted of financial crimes who acknowledged his role in managing and providing logistics for the production.After 48 hours the Egyptian president Morsi finally apologized for the embassy storming in Cairo. This AFTER Obama said Egypt is not a U.S. ally but also not an enemy.
Before this Egypt was seen as a. U.S. ally. This is a VERY significant change in U.S. middle east policies!
It seems therefore very likely that Yemeni troops guarding the embassy colluded in this.
Yeah definately. After the Libyan consulate and the Egyptian Embassy, a prime hotspot would have been the US Embassies in Yemen and Pakistan (I'm still suprised nothing has happened in Pakistan yet). The security services must have known Yemen would be likely next and should have beefed up security.
Therefore the question becomes - Why did the Yemeni military allow themselves to be caught off guard?
Answer: Same reason they hype the Al Qaeda threat in Yemen, because they can get the US to offer huge military aid. Ali Saleh was a master at that extortion and now he is gone his military generals are at it. The US is more likely to support a military junta if the people protesting it are charging the US Embassy.
Posted by: Colm O' Toole | Sep 13 2012 13:28 utc | 49
As in other countries that the U.S. meddles in, like Pakistan (best example), Egypt has internal domestic factors that outweigh their subservience to the U.S.
from The Daily Beast
More serious is the exploitation by Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood president of the incident as support for anti-Islam blasphemy laws. It's important to understand that Morsi is concerned with Egyptian, not American, laws. Morsi is taking a page from the 1979 Khomeini playbook, fabricating an international incident to mobilize religious passions as a weapon for his political grouping against more secular blocs in Egyptian society - the Egyptian military very much included.--David Frum
don, slaughter and al-Zawahri could put out a joint statement.
Posted by: annie | Sep 13 2012 14:04 utc | 51
The attack on the U.S. embassy in Benghazi, Libya was due to the drone killing of Abu Yahya al-Libi in Pakistan? Maybe. I think it has to do with Libyan populace outrage about what happened to their country. Besides, the U.S. ambassador that was sent to Benghazi had something to do with Ghaddafi's demise. Despite what you think of a dictator and how horrible he may seem to you, when you capture a wounded man and sodomize him in public just adds more timber to the fire. Likewise, Al-Qaeda is suppose to be our wonderful allies now, right? Have you heard of the Free Syrian Army and Belhaj? The same Al-Qaeda forces that were the mercenaries in Libya. When you ramsack a country that has one of the highest ratings on the UN human index for a standard of living in Africa as well as literacy, well, things happen. Why would Al-Qaeda attack the embassy? Wouldn't factions still loyal to Ghaddafi, freedom fighters, who wish to liberate their country, carry out such an act against a target that had so much to do with the destruction of their country?
Posted by: Andre' E. Williams | Sep 13 2012 14:37 utc | 52
Libya's Ambassador to Washington Ali Aujali said Wednesday that associates of disposed tyrant Muammar al-Qaddafi were behind the Tuesday attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi that resulted in the deaths of four American officials, including Ambassador Chris Stevens.
"We know that Qaddafi's associates are in Libya. Of course, they took this chance to infiltrate among the people," Aujali said in today in an interview. His claim contradicts most reports, which place the blame on radical Islamist groups that claimed to be reacting to an obscure American film they viewed as insulting to Islam. Aujali said that the Libyan government has intelligence that unspecified Qaddafi forces were involved.
So let's see. Ghadaffi loyalists, Senussis, Cyrenaican separatists, Idris royalists, disgruntled oil region tribalists, Derna jihadis, AQ and the homeless people of Sirte. There is no shortage of potential drone targets.
Posted by: dh | Sep 13 2012 14:54 utc | 54
"After yesterday's sobering experience in Libya the U.S. support for the radical insurgents in Syria there will likely become smaller or even stop. That would then be the only valuable thing those movie makers, whoever they are, would have achieved."
I wouldn't be so sure b:
"Le Nouvel Observateur: When the Soviets justified their intervention with the statement that they were fighting against a secret US interference in Afghanistan, nobody believed them. Nevertheless there was a core of truth to this...Do you regret nothing today?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: Regret what? This secret operation was an excellent idea. It lured the Russians into the Afghan trap, and you would like me to regret that? On the day when the Soviets officially crossed the border, I wrote president Carter, in essence: "We now have the opportunity to provide the USSR with their Viet Nam war." Indeed for ten years Moscow had to conduct a war that was intolerable for the regime, a conflict which involved the demoralization and finally the breakup of the Soviet Empire.
Le Nouvel Observateur: And also, don't you regret having helped future terrorists, having given them weapons and advice?
Zbigniew Brzezinski: What is most important for world history? The Taliban or the fall of the Soviet Empire? Some Islamic hotheads or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?"
I think (and I am part of a minority I know) that these military interventions and supports for this or that religious psycho are not 'mistakes' and therefore will not stop or be reduced due to "learned lessons". The system is based on the profit and accumulation of capital and whatever is necessary to that end will be done irrespective of its consequences for middle eastern or African or for that matter for the American people. What matters is the requirements of the capitalist system. Even if todays "band aid solutions" are tomorrows massive problems so be it. In fact this has always been the case with capitalism. As once a very smart man put it: "Capitalism never solves its problems, it just moves them around".
Posted by: Pirouz_2 | Sep 13 2012 15:56 utc | 55
@Andre' E. Williams again - an interesting comment
An Islamist militia, Ansar al Shariah, has been blamed for Benghazi, but the Libyan government has said that it was a Gaddafi remnant force (#53). Then we have statements from the militia and from the US that might lend credence to the Gaddafi scenario.
Ansar al Shariah, an Islamist group in Libya that has been accused of executing the attack on the US Consulate in Benghazi, issued a statement on the assault.
from Long War Journal
Ansar al-Shariah Brigade didn't participate in this popular uprising as a separate entity, but it was carrying out its duties in al-Jala'a hospital and other places where it was entrusted with some duties. The Brigade didn't participate as a sole entity; rather, it was a spontaneous popular uprising in response to what happened by the West.
from the State briefing Sep 12
I’d also like to underscore that it was Libyan security forces that stood with ours in defending our buildings. We also had some – one of the local militias who is friendly to the Embassy came to assist as well. And I think that really speaks to the relationship that we’ve built with Libya.
The "local militia" needs a name, obviously. Meanwhile, Obama is off to get himself some Islamists.
The U.S. seems to be focusing more on Libya now than on Egypt, even though Egypt is much more important, because of the ambassador killing of course, but perhaps also because now the U.S. has its own guy in Tripoli whereas it has to deal with the Muslim Brotherhood guy in Cairo. Libya now has a new prime minister, elected by the congress immediately after Benghazi, while the Egypt president is off to Brussels to ask for money.
Libya Herald, Sep 12
Libya’s Deputy Prime minister, Mistafa Abushagur, has been elected by the General National Congress as Libya’s new Prime Minster. In the second, run-off round, he beat Mahmoud Jibril by the thinnest of margins. He took 96 votes to Jibril’s 94. Of the 190 members present and voting, he won a wafer thin 50.53 percent of the votes compared to Jibril’s 49.47 percent.. . . .The contest shows yet again the rejection of the Brotherhood.
wiki - Born in 1951 and educated in Tripoli, in 1975 Abushagur moved to Pasadena, CA to continue his education at the California Institute of Technology (Caltech). During his time at Caltech, he earned a M.Sc. in electrical engineering in 1977 and earned his Ph.D. in 1984. Abushagur began his academic career as a Visiting Assistant Professor at the University of Rochester, New York in 1984. Then he joined the University of Alabama in Huntsville (UAH) in 1985 as an Assistant Professor of Electrical and Computer Engineering (ECE) and became full Professor in 1995. In May 2011, Abushagur flew to Benghazi and set foot on Libyan soil for the first time in nearly thirty-two years.
The thing to remember in all of this mess is that it continues to be in the long-term best interest of Israel to pit Muslims against Christians and works like this false flag video are the perfect foils to foment such orchestrated acts. Just when you think things are too hard to understand - remember the USS Liberty.
The newly emerging " Black Flag of al-Qaeda" seen in the Cairo videos is the same flag flown above US/NATO/Israeli "rebel" camps in eastern Syria - so the take away is now al-Qaeda is our friend - except when they are killing our Ambassadors and when we need to deploy more expensive body scanners to degrade and violate Americans.
The second thing to remember is that Obama is just a teleprompter and when you read all these indignant stories on Fox/CNN/ABC/WSJ/Drudge about how Israel and Obama are at odds - it's pure deception. There has never been a time where Israel and its American agents have had more influence in the White House.
The race is on - pull America into a larger Sunni-Shia regional conflict anchored in the well-dressed lie about Iranian nukes and their threat to Israel, or watch 20 million unemployed Egyptians shamble across the Sinai to take down Israel by hand. Even the Muslim zealots would sacrifice every Arab capital to a zero-azimuth nuke strike policy to see their ethnic humiliation end. The tick-tock of the clock is speeding up.
H/T: Zero Hedge
Posted by: Cynthia | Sep 13 2012 16:23 utc | 58
The sources for this USA Today report are all from the Israel Lobby. I am therefore not sure of how much I can trust it, if at all.
The killings in Libya followed demonstrations in front of Cairo's U.S. Embassy, where protesters tore down the U.S. flag and scaled the embassy's wall.The protest was planned by Salafists well before news circulated of an objectionable video ridiculing Islam's prophet, Mohammed, said Eric Trager, an expert at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy.
The protest outside the U.S. Embassy in Cairo was announced Aug. 30 by Jamaa Islamiya, a State Department-designated terrorist group, to protest the ongoing imprisonment of its spiritual leader, Sheikh Omar abdel Rahman. He is serving a life sentence in the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center.
When the video started circulating, Nader Bakkar, the spokesman for the Egyptian Salafist Noor party, which holds about 25% of the seats in parliament, called on people to go to the embassy. He also called on non-Islamist soccer hooligans, known as Ultras, to join the protest.
On Monday, the brother of al-Qaeda leader Ayman al Zawahiri, Mohamed al Zawahiri, tweeted that people should go to the embassy and "defend the prophet," Trager said.
If true Jamaa Islamiya (who are Salafists) would be the so far missing link between the rising of the AQ flag at the U.S. embassy in Cairo and the attack in Benghazi.
Adding to the conspiracy theories, Pat Lang has this (might be plausible!):
The longer this crisis continues the more the whole thing smells like an attampt to cause difficulty for BHO in the American election. Now, who would want to do that?
Posted by: Maracatu | Sep 13 2012 16:59 utc | 60
@Cynthia
1. Muslims vs. Christians
Israel might contribute, but there is plenty of Islamophobia from Christians without Jewish help. It seems that "Radical Muslims" has become a synonym for "Muslims," with Congressman Peter King and others stoking the fires. It is a deception to blame Israel for U.S. foreign policy. The U.S. has a long history of military imperialism, often religion-based, starting with the extermination of the Native Americans.
2. US vs. Israel
The difference is a relative matter, the difference between total US obeisance and almost-total (currently regarding attacking Iran). All politics is "deception" to some degree. I believe the primary purpose of the concocted Iran crisis, successfully achieved, is to disappear the ongoing rape of Palestine. Others might have a different view of its purpose.
@Don Bacon "The U.S. has a long history of military imperialism, often religion-based, starting with the extermination of the Native Americans."
True but there has always been a fundamental core of decency in the US. I think after 911 many Americans became vengeful.
Posted by: dh | Sep 13 2012 17:19 utc | 62
@61 on your number 2
Iran is emerging as a regional power since after the end of the Iran-Irak war. US believes, mistakenly in my mind, that its global interests are better served by total control of the region. Palestinian issue is an excuse and Israel is ultimately a tool. The mis-guided goal is to weaken Iran.
Posted by: ATH | Sep 13 2012 17:21 utc | 63
The longer this crisis continues the more the whole thing smells like an attampt to cause difficulty for BHO in the American election. Now, who would want to do that?- Pat Lang
Wait...could it be? OMG ! Mitt Romney is in league with Egyptian Salafists :o some crazy Mormon-Salafist alliance forming to damage the Democratic Party. EVERYTHING makes sense now...
Seriously though, didn't this joker used to work for the Defence Intelligence Agency. I suppose we should just be thankful the US government has got someone who can find Egypt on a map. He is right though that the Egyptian Friday protests could get dangerous. One Million Egyptian protesters Vs One US Embassy.
Posted by: Colm O' Toole | Sep 13 2012 17:23 utc | 64
Don't be too hard on Colonel Lang. He's having a lot of trouble with events in Libya. He was a big fan of NATO intervention.
Posted by: dh | Sep 13 2012 17:28 utc | 65
The U.S. has a long history of military imperialism, often religion-based, starting with the extermination of the Native Americans.Terrance Nelson, former chief of Roseau River First Nation in Manitoba, heads to Iran in October with two Dakota chiefs. Today, Nelson writes to Harper concerning, Israel, Iran and Canada's closing of the Iran
Could Canada be scared about this alliance?
Posted by: hans | Sep 13 2012 17:29 utc | 66
@ 59 re: Jamaa Islamiya & USA Today's Eric Trager, "an expert at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy."
Beware of an "expert."
Jemaah Islamiya organization is a Southeast Asia group, responsible for Bali and other events in the area. The expert" probably meant Gama’a al-Islamiyya in Egypt.
wiki -- The Egypt group al-Gama'a al-Islamiyya is (or was) dedicated to the overthrow of the Egyptian government and replacing it with an Islamic state. Following the Egyptian Revolution of 2011, the movement formed a political party, the Building and Development Party, which gained 13 seats in the 2011-2012 elections to the lower house of the Egyptian Parliament.
It's not probable (but possible) that a political organization with representatives in parliament would lead a violent protest in the nation's capital.
Both Jemaah Islamiya organization (JI) and Gama’a al-Islamiyya (Islamic Group) are on State's Foreign Terrorist Organization list.
http://www.state.gov/j/ct/rls/other/des/123085.htm
@ATH #63
I agree with you. Can't cover all aspects in a short comment (that's my excuse and I'm stickin' to it).
@45 that fits nicely Basseley - Bacile
again the question is why major newspapers printed this without doing any fact checking whatsoever
soon journalists will have the same credibility as used car salesmen.
this has to go back to supporting republican candidates, maybe not Romney because he emits awfulness but there are plenty of house and senate seats up for grabs. help get rid of the few remaining democrats that are worth a damn.
kinda makes you wonder just who al qaeda takes orders from though, for one reason or another they always seem to do things that benefit the republican party
Posted by: dan of steele | Sep 13 2012 17:54 utc | 69
Perhaps you're right, Don Bacon@61, but given that the reaction, though deplorable and inexcusable, was also entirely predictable, it seems highly 'coincidental' that someone operating with a faked identity would issue such a video while Netanyahu is demanding we deliver an ultimatum to Iran, which, once made, would have to be backed up with force, thereby committing us to the maniacal murderous suicidal designs of the Israeli radical right.
Interesting too that Bibi and Willard are old pals from decades back, and that Romney had no compunction whatsoever politicizing this tragedy.
Posted by: Cynthia | Sep 13 2012 18:57 utc | 70
I posted about a previous attack in Benghazi, on the UK ambassador. There have been I am sure many others. Underreported, for certain.
None of this has anything to do with a dubious ‘movie’ that less than 1% of ppl anywhere have seen (or the trailer.)
Modern, savvy, leftish, orientalism insists that demos and the like that are ‘for democracy’ are often manipulated by the CIA, special interests, Western powers, etc. That is certainly correct in some minor degree.
But then if so called Ayrabs and other such low-lifes demonstrate or go nuts about cultural products, imagery or symbolism (think Mohammed cartoons, say) that is all grass roots genuine! Absurd.
The stuff about a MOVIE is just used to demean Lybians and others, and serves to cover up real geo-political strife, trivialize it down to craziness and irrelevance. That *must* de DEALT with, of course. With more fire power and control! (Obaman will have to show muscle..)
I’m not keen either on the idea of ‘revenge killing’ (second in command of Al Q - what is that anyway - killed, what relevance?), that again smacks of attributing primitive feuding, eye for an eye, to low-lifes.
What about, some currents in Lybia have always hated USuk imperialism, intervention, overt and covert? And are determined to fight foreign take-over?
Posted by: Noirette | Sep 13 2012 19:05 utc | 71
Yes, this has nothing to do with the so-called movie, more smokescreen than anything. Nor are SITE or Ayman al Zwahiri reliable sources.
Who benefits? Looks like the Zionist faction and the American Internationalist faction duking it out, and more posturing for the election.
A pox on Obomba, MittleMormon, and Nagginyahoo.
Posted by: Man From Atlan | Sep 13 2012 20:19 utc | 72
Obama said that, despite the inflammatory movie, the violence was unwarranted. "Since our founding, the United States has been a nation that respects all faiths. We reject all efforts to denigrate the religious beliefs of others," he said.
Map - ACLU - Nationwide Anti-Mosque Activity
This is such a complex issue. Been trying to come up with something that doesn't sound trite. The war against the US-Euro-Israeli Axis is the most righteous of our time, no doubt about it. Beyond racism, sexism, homophobia, anti-semitism. But the Islamists are hard to like. God is great, by definition, no one needs to shout it in the street. And God's will cannot be known, not by any mullah, rebbe, pope or minister. "Muhammed is His messenger", is an opinion; it's not a fact.
Posted by: ruralito | Sep 13 2012 20:26 utc | 74
b
i just wanted to say your work, is finer, always finer
fools can throw slurs at you but your consistent accuracy on a whole range of issues, your speculative work worth more weight than anything else i read on the question, i have directed many people here & from what i can see you are used by very many people, unhappily sometimes, not sourced
i would rather go with a guess from you, debs, bevin noirette than i would in the cold comforts of the false scholarship of someone like slothrop
that he cannot see the throughline, or the 'arc' as u s imperialists are want to call it - between baghdad & bhengazi says more about him than your work
as always
thanks
i'm too ill to contribute substantially but i read every day
Posted by: remembererringgiap | Sep 13 2012 20:37 utc | 75
@ruralito #74 - "But the Islamists are hard to like"
I've traveled a lot in the world, I've lived in many places, mostly Europe and Asia, and I've found people to be interesting and likable everywhere I've been. But while there are 1.5 billion Muslims in the world I've never lived in one of their countries or even visited one for any time. I did walk through a Muslim city (or portion of one) in India a couple years ago and bought something from a street vendor, but that's it. The people all looked okay to me, but I didn't really interact with anyone.
So help me out. Why are Islamists are hard to like? I ask because I think your view might not be uncommon and I have a feeling that for many it's just simple prejudice.
I think Obama is in deep doodoo now..
Considering the fact that he didn't get congressional approval for the war in Libya which a majority of Americans were opposed to in the first place and which has resulted in the death of an American top diplomat and sub diplomats.
At this stage, it's fair to assume Romney will be the next US president...Romney will be milking this event till the cow runs outta milk.
Posted by: Zico | Sep 13 2012 21:14 utc | 78
So help me out. Why are Islamists are hard to like? I ask because I think your view might not be uncommon and I have a feeling that for many it's just simple prejudice.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 13, 2012 4:52:15 PM | 77
well when your being killed by one (cause you are an appostate not of their beliefs or just different , you will understand why they are hard to like
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 21:48 utc | 79
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 13, 2012 4:25:11 PM | 73
Obama like most US presidents ..its not what he says its what he leaves out...focus instead on why US regime is sending its armed forces into other countries, why itys embassies are centers of coup activity...forget the 'we love all religions' posturing and focus on why they have set up all those miltiary bases abroad.
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 21:51 utc | 80
Welcome back Mr. Giap - missed your comments
Hope you'll get better soon
Posted by: Rainbow | Sep 13 2012 21:54 utc | 81
Don if you visited some Islamic societies, you would find that Muslims are hard not to like. Honesty and humanity are two of the qualities that are most evident in Muslim communities - oh and a pretty droll sense of humour too.
Posted by: Debs is dead | Sep 13 2012 21:55 utc | 82
@brian #73 "well when your being killed by one (cause you are an appostate not of their beliefs or just different , you will understand why they are hard to like"
But when Christians act that way, and they have, we don't say "Christians are hard to like," we say these people are not typical of Christians, they don't follow Christian principles, rather they are criminals.
So that's a double standard, isn't it?
FYI
Linda Juniper @LindaJuniper
Photos of the invitations for protests against the offending movie with the Syrian embassy address. (2) #German #USA pic.twitter.com/8DvEKp0Q
Linda Juniper @LindaJuniper
Calls for protests against the movie offending Islam in #Germany in front of #USA embassy, but the given address is of the #Syria-n embassy!
[ a trick to get persons to attack the syrian embassy….just as the afghans were misled in syria:
'There are a lot of soldiers of fortune among the bandits. They are Chechens, Romanians, French, Libyans, and Afghans. Moreover, there was a very funny accident with Afghan soldiers. A few Afghans were caught and asked, ‘What are you doing here?’ They replied, ‘We were told that we came to Israel, and at night we are shooting at Israeli buses. We are fighting with the enemy to liberate Palestine.’ It might be funny, but it is true. The guys were really surprised, ‘Are we in Syria? We thought we were in Israel!’'
http://gbtimes.com/third-angle/syria/syria/eyewitness-account-media-lies-about-syria
so who sent out the invites?
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 22:20 utc | 84
Posted by: Don Bacon | Sep 13, 2012 6:02:51 PM | 83
so far christians are not killing people because they dont follow their creed
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 22:20 utc | 85
I just read through the record of today's State presser. There was no substantive information on the consulate attack. The spokesperson Victoria Nuland claimed that the information is largely not definitive yet. Following are some interesting (I think) remarks on the movie, consulate security and Obama's 'Egypt not an ally' comment.
regarding the movie:
MS. NULAND: My understanding of the sequence of events was that in the day or days prior to the protests that became violent at our Embassy in Cairo, the film had been shown on Egyptian television and was being quite heavily watched, and our social media tracking indicated that. And it was on that basis and the basis of a few other things that the Embassy put out the Warden Message and was concerned about protests. At that point, we expected it to be localized to Egypt.
regarding consulate security:
MS. NULAND:. . .what you have to understand about embassies around the world, not just ours but those of foreign governments here in Washington, is that the outer perimeter in any embassy is always the responsibility of local security. That’s the way it is done in embassies around the world. So in this case, we had arrangements for Libyan security on the outer perimeter. We – as we do around the world – train them, work with them, obviously, and then we have additional American procedures inside the wall. . . There were not marines at this mission.QUESTION: Toria, do you have a rough estimate of how many missions do not have marine guards? Isn’t it more than half?
MS. NULAND: I don’t think it’s more than half. But it’s certainly more than people expect. I don’t have a number. . .we have a number of posts around the world. We have – there are embassies without marines, there are other consulates of this type without marines. We make a decision based on the local conditions as to whether that makes sense, but this posture that we had, which was external security by the Libyans and then a strong U.S. security presence – but it didn’t include that particular contingent of Americans – inside, in a number of other missions that look a lot like Benghazi. . . It’s not a matter of marines necessarily being a qualitatively different way of securing. There are many other ways to secure that are equivalent, too. It depends on the circumstances and it is different in every part of the world, and we evaluate it along with our friends at the Defense Department and other agencies individually, per mission.
regarding Obama's comment that Egypt is not an ally
MS. NULAND: Well, obviously for parsing of the President’s comments, I’m going to send you to the White House. But as a matter of fact and practice, the word ally generally is used with a treaty ally, which is a different matter than the fact that we have a very close and longstanding partnership with the government of Egypt, and we are working together to support their democratic transition.QUESTION: So other countries – so, Pakistan and India that don’t have mutual defense treaties with the United States, they’re major Non-NATO allies, but you guys don’t really think they’re allies. Is that the message you’re trying to send? Because that’s the message the President did last night, unless you’ve decided that Egypt no longer qualifies as a major non-NATO ally.
MS. NULAND: Well, that was certainly, I don’t think, the intention. I’m going to refer you to the White House for further parsing on this.
Reports say the protesters set a number of diplomatic cars on fire.
On September 11, demonstrators in Libya attacked the US consulate building in the city of Benghazi, protesting against the movie, named Innocence of Muslims. US Ambassador to Libya Christopher Stevens and three consulate staff members were killed in the incident.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/09/13/261332/yemenis-storm-us-embassy-one-killed/
why do it on sept 11?????? this suggests someone is orchestrating this
Posted by: brian | Sep 13 2012 22:50 utc | 87
When the muezzin shouts from his turret: Muhammed is Allah's messenger. Who dares shout back, No he isn't. And if God is so damn great, why does He need puny men to stand up for Him? Of course many Xtians are loathsome, it's obvious. But Xtianity from the getgo was a-politcal: Render unto Caesar, Caesar's; unto God, God's. Do Muhammed's follower's agree? Not that I can tell.
Posted by: ruralito | Sep 13 2012 23:09 utc | 88
Liked your last line about Syruia being the only?beneficiary,as they didn't cross my mind.
They?the CIA,(probably not but it could be another intel gone wild job)its eastern cousins alCIAda,Israel or Khaddafi loyalists seem to me as the best list of culprits.
And these authors of these diatribes of BS directed at Muslims know that the 7th century literalists will react to such,as they haven't been couched in 21st century hedonist luxury and ease of living we in the west live in,so its all deliberate provocation and all these innocent rubes,dupes,or believers in something other than nothing,are incinerated,blown up,droned,slaughtered what have you,all for what,more of the same cycle of thugs turned liberators turned dictators.
Enough already.How about vote out anyone who's in?Aaarg...
Posted by: dahoit | Sep 13 2012 23:39 utc | 89
@brian #85
so far Christians are not killing people because they dont follow their creedGabrielle Giffords and a few abortionist doctors and nurses might have a different opinion on this
@ruralito #88
Xtianity from the getgo was a-politcalemperor Constantine fixed that a few years ago
Posted by: claudio | Sep 13 2012 23:41 utc | 90
@brian #87
why do it on sept 11?????? this suggests someone is orchestrating thisAQ loves coincidences - multiple contemporary attacks, symbolic dates, etc
Posted by: claudio | Sep 13 2012 23:47 utc | 91
Constantine was a hypocrite. The Xtian doctrine is explicit: Politics and religion don't mix. Read my quips.
Posted by: ruralito | Sep 14 2012 0:05 utc | 92
@Ruralito,
I am not a muslim but I can tell you that the call "Muhammed is Allah's messenger" is a call for unity. People in that region of the world needs unity the most. Not everyone agrees with the fanatism of the Salafis in the muslim world. And Shia Iran, unlike what is portrayed here in he West, is not a fanatic state. Go and visit them, as Don Bacon says, and you will witness the truth with your own eyes.
Posted by: ATH | Sep 14 2012 0:21 utc | 93
Mitt could wrap up this election in a heartbeat,but he keeps stepping in Zionist doo doo,as the American people are tired of this nonsense and want change,the change that wasn't delivered by the other moron who keeps scraping the sh*t off his shoes also.
Amazing the power of the Ziodoremi that decides our elections,simply amazing.
What are they blackmailing our poohbahs with anyway,that MSM,for this tone deaf race?
Posted by: dahoit | Sep 14 2012 0:34 utc | 94
ruralito, it is not true "no bishop, no king" "whose land it is, whose religion"
Posted by: somebody | Sep 14 2012 3:08 utc | 95
@r'giap, good to see your handle pop up. I too am continuously grateful for b's perspective.
Posted by: lizard | Sep 14 2012 3:21 utc | 96
Posted by: Pirouz_2 | Sep 13, 2012 11:56:15 AM | 55
Pirouz, spot on.
Such is the nature of the corporate, fascist beast which rules US and essentially, most of the western world.
Posted by: Larue | Sep 14 2012 4:22 utc | 98
Constantine was a hypocrite. The Xtian doctrine is explicit: Politics and religion don't mix. Read my quips.
Posted by: ruralito | Sep 13, 2012 8:05:30 PM | 92
Yer killin me, you DO know that our military, especially the USAF, is HEAVILY mixed up and manipulated by Xtian's? And well, do you read any of the press regarding Xtian political leaders and their GOP comments, especially the TeaBaggers?
They quote scripture, force prayer in Congress, and mix politics and religion 24/7.
Your comment is not reality based.
Posted by: Larue | Sep 14 2012 4:39 utc | 99
Probably a couple of events in the background worth going over again, to give some perspective on what is now happening.
---
Abdel Fattah Younes, the former western annointed military chief of the "rebels" was killed by islamist rivals where the killers obviously had to have a great deal of inside information. Most believed that this was done by the Quatari financed section of the salafi's in a powerplay. This didn't seem to cause much fuss because he was considered France's man, the weakest of the players in the international scene.
There were supposed to be two major blocks financing & supporting the "rebels" in co-ordination - the Western block of France/UK & the GCC block, with the US being the glue that held them together, supplying the support infrastructure & co-ordination. But there were major rifts within each faction from the start as each were pushing their preferred groups/representitives for leadership positions or control of certain area's in the economy.
The ultimate winner here was the background co-ordinator, the US, who seem to have the leadership positions sewn up, the banking sector, & likely the ministries that divy's up who gets the oil/gas/water contracts...
This is not likely to have gone down well with the other factions who had more boots on the ground & were providing more direct support, especially the Quatari's, who have become very ambitious over the last few years.
Of the factions (note: it is very hard pinning down who supports who the most, as things were & are very fluid)
The Saudi's wanted the decendants of Idris as-Senussi that they had in their pocket in charge of a new emirate, but there seems to be an amazing number of these guys around & the anointed sucessor lived in the UK. The Saudi's want a seperate Cyrenaica emirate with Benghazi as it's capital. Ahmed al-Senussi was head of the self-declared Cyrenaica Transitional Council, & the London based Mohammed El Senussi (the annointed one) was popping up everywhere calling for NATO intervention.
They also did their usual in supplying salafi jihadist's for the cause, but it seemed more in the background than usual, acting more as a co-ordinator & supplier to the Quatari's & UAE factions.
The Quatari's seem keen on expanding the Muslim brotherhood, & were one of the biggest direct suppliers to the salafi groups. They also seemed to be the lead co-ordinator in bringing in the Berber's with large-scale cash payments & promises of more autonomy. They had large scale military forces on the ground, & shipped container loads of weaponry to the salafi groups. They also seemed to be one of the major staging areas for military training & media management. The Quatari's were reported to be actually handling most of Libya's oil sales at one point.
(The UAE seems to mixed up with same groups as well, but seems to be acting more from the rear than the Quatari's)
The UK looks happy to support anyone who can get them preferential treatment in contracts & expand their influence, but they have already had several companies kicked out which looked like sure winners in the giant resources scramble...
The French were the most aggressive from the West, & while they have won some major contracts, it obviously isn't close to what they were pushing for, looking like having most of the leadership positions sewn up at one point.
Also in the mix is the extensive list of oil/gas/water companies that were shelling out large sums of money & support to exiles & representatives of on the ground "rebel factions" for preferential treatment before & during the "rebellion", & a lot of promises were made on both sides.
---
A lot of the money being shelled out to the various rebel groups has now dried up, & there were a lot of losers in the power struggle to get their hands on the various power ministries, oil & banking sectors.
The country is awash in arms, & many of the "rebel" groups had atleast some military training, as well as extensive exposure to western military practice from the inside.
The salafi groups were the clear winner in the military aspects, as the western "liberasts" drawn from European exile groups proved next to useless in the fighting, & so most military support, arming & training focused on the salafi's, who now have much of their cash support cut-off & little direct representation in the power ministries.
The Libyan "government" is a joke that makes Karzai's Afghanistan look like a paragon of respectability, & they control next to nothing in physical terms. However they are the centre of who-gets-what in terms of contracts & cash...
---
Most likely this gets nastier & nastier, with periods of quiet while factions re-align before the next explosion.
Posted by: KenM | Sep 14 2012 6:00 utc | 100
The comments to this entry are closed.
Can't trust Jeffery Goldberg as a source for anything except Likud propaganda. Andrew Sullivan had a good piece a while ago on how Goldberg doesn't even mind being used to relay disinformation from Netanyahu, admitting that his 2010 article predicting an Iran war "within six months" was likely a "bluff that has so far worked magnificently well."
Source: Andrew Sullivan
Obviously the guys journalism ethics are somewhere around the bottom of a trash can.
On Libya I agree, it is going to be a Somalia on the edge of Europe. As the drone strikes in Pakistan show it usually just accomplishes turning the whole population against the US. European policy makers should be fired for ever intervening.
On Egypt if things go bad the US will likely try for a coup. But Mursi at present has plenty of cards to deal. The US needs Egypt more than Egypt needs the US. It can always go China.
Posted by: Colm O' Toole | Sep 12 2012 19:53 utc | 1