Syria: "It Is All About Iran"
The latest western UN Security Council resolution about Syria was, as expected, vetoed by Russia and China. South Africa and Pakistan made a point by abstaining. The resolution threatened the Syrian state with sanctions should it not withdraw its troops from population centers while saying nothing about a withdrawal of the western supported insurgents or any consequences to them.
The Ambassador to the UN for the Russian Federation Vitaly Churkin made the point that the issue of Syria is about much more than Syria. It is a global geopolitical conflict.
There is no transcript yet of the press stakeout where Chrukin elaborated on that but the gist was caught by the valuable Matthew Russell Lee of Inner City Press:
Then Churkin went bigger picture, paraphrasing Bill Clinton by saying "It's all about Iran, stupid" (and striking the last word).He said that after the US invasion of Iraq worked out differently than the US expected -- with an expanded Shi'a and Iranian role, that is -- now they had to try to contain Iran, by way of Syria.
After the failed policy of the war on Iraq the U.S. is now trying to correct the outcome through another catastrophic attack on another middle eastern country.
But this is even about more than Iran. It is about resistance against Israel and its occupation of Arab land. U.S. politics, under Israeli pressure, can not longer acquiesce to resistance. It has to be snuffed out. No matter what happens next.
The ongoing attack on Syria, if successful and after a long bloody sectarian civil war, will lead to the installation of another fundamentalist Sunni government in a geographically critical state. This is lunacy. Even imperial stalwarts like the former director of the Defense Intelligence Agency Pat Lang ask:
Are we really happy that Sunni jihadis are disassembling a government that does not represent Sunni fanatics in the likelihood that it will be replaced by one that will?
The humanitarian interventionists in the Obama administration, especially the female ones, seem to be fine with that. They will of course deny any responsibility when the predictable consequences of their action, especially for the women in Syria, will become visible for all.
Posted by b on July 19, 2012 at 18:12 UTC | Permalink
« previous pagewww also claimed anti-Americanism is not related to American imperialism
Posted by: nikon | Jul 21 2012 16:28 utc | 202
Re: Nikon's link to NYTimes' article on the Bulgarian bomber --
A link in the article of security footage of the bomber, of a tall guy with a baseball cap over shoulder length hair walking into the ticketing area --or information area-- then back outside, shows him wearing a somewhat large backpack, of which the Times writes:
But it is his oddly bulky, oversized backpack that, in terrible hindsight, stands out the most. This bag, investigators believe, contained the bomb that the man is suspected of detonating next to a bus outside the airport, killing the five Israeli tourists, a Bulgarian bus driver and himself in a fireball that upended this city on the Black Sea.
Uh, I may tend to over pack, but if the guy was trying to look like a tourist on more than a day trip, how could his backpack be all that much smalled and less "bulky"?
Also, it is amazing that the US declared him a member of a Hezbollah cell without knowing his name, as Nikon points out. Maybe the US sources knew a lot more than they let on to the reporter or let the reporter, well, report.
Posted by: jawbone | Jul 21 2012 16:38 utc | 203
alexno @ 197
"Yeah, but the Orontes is not navigable. It is quite shallow and has water-mills across it."
Ever hear of Portaging?
While I do not know the ins and outs of this specific waterway
I would suspect if there is a will there is a way
Waterways are the easiest means to transport whatever.
People, munitions, chemical weapons
Maybe it is difficult
But, likely it is not impossible.
Especially not for persons rigorously trained and or used to having to persevere strenuous treks
Such as special ops
How leftist "anti-zionists" are allied with Israel against Syria
By Mimi Al Laham (aka "Syrian Girl") and Lizzie Phelan
The Myth
There has been a ridiculous notion amongst numerous left groups and those opposed to the Syrian government, that the Israeli regime does not want to see Assad fall. As self-professed “anti-zionists”, many in these groups are content to delude themselves into believing that both their enemies are on the same side. In the case of several socialist groups, they believe that this forcing of the Syrian crisis into their blanket “anti-authoritarian” narrative (regardless of the state in which they are applying that narrative to) enables them to maintain a façade of anti-imperialism.
London based socialist newspaper The Socialist Review writes: “Israel, although hostile to Syria, could depend on the Baathist regime to keep the frontier quiet. Thus criticism of Bashar is more muted in Tel Aviv.”
And Simon Assaf of the SocialistWorker writes:
The notion that ordinary Syrians struggling to change their country are the pawns of a ‘Western plot’ is absurd…In fact the Arab League is attempting to throw the regime a lifeline.
This view is also pervasive amongst the Islamic opposition to the Syrian government. Rafiq A. Tschannen of the The Muslims Times writes:
Israel believes that it would be safer under Assad regime than the new government whose credentials are unknown or the new Islamic extremist regime that would open a new war front with the Jewish state.
Israeli state media has actively fuelled this manipulation, as it has been beneficial to the Israeli state to both discredit the Syrian government in the eyes of Syrians and Arabs amongst whom cooperation with Israel has historically been a red line. Therefore the goal of these reports has been to create the false perception that Israel is uninvolved in the insurgency against the Syrian government.
Similar to how the NATO powers [and certain dishonest commenters at this site] were keen to portray the Libyan insurgency as a “home-grown revolution”. . . . . .
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 16:50 utc | 205
www
you're obviously missing the point in your robotic-trained rush to respond to "antisemitic" innuendo. what makes Ahmedinejad being jewish crucial is- considering Ahmedinejad's rhetorical history that has had such gravely BAD consequences for Iran, and generated such destructive backlash against the country- is this guy a plant, spy or AIPAC equivalent agent furthering the zionist agenda? a very legit suspicion. it also totally destroys the perennial victim tactic the jews employ to get their way. With Attaturk being admittedly jewish (ala jerusalem post) as well as Ghaddaffi (israel today and their heated debate over his right of return) the Tribe has its agents in the highest posts across the world- and are hardly poor, persecuted minority. thats not counting Hitler, their favorite bludgeon on the world- who William Donovan, head of OSS- a hardcore zionist himself- investigated to find he was illegitimate offspring of a Rothschild. that "antisemite conspiracy" came from the top inside authority himself; not an internet hate site...
Carroll Quigley. Antony Sutton. Eustace Mullins. London Time's Douglas Reed... wake up people. the "antisemite" smear can only go so far to vitiate a mountain of evidence as to who really runs the world, and at whose behest it is being destroyed.
Does Mahmoud Ahmadinejad Have Jewish Roots?
True or not, the rumors matter. Here's why.
BY JAMSHEED K. CHOKSY | OCTOBER 6, 2009 Foreign Policy
http://74.6.238.254/search/srpcache?ei=UTF-8&p=ahmedinejad+is+jewish&fr=ytff1-ytie&u=http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=ahmedinejad+is+jewish&d=4834583339207058&mkt=en-US&setlang=en-US&w=7f342ed2,df013808&icp=1&.intl=us&sig=4gJB4.xoptgQuieMkWMyQQ--">http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=ahmedinejad+is+jewish&d=4834583339207058&mkt=en-US&setlang=en-US&w=7f342ed2,df013808&icp=1&.intl=us&sig=4gJB4.xoptgQuieMkWMyQQ--">http://74.6.238.254/search/srpcache?ei=UTF-8&p=ahmedinejad+is+jewish&fr=ytff1-ytie&u=http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=ahmedinejad+is+jewish&d=4834583339207058&mkt=en-US&setlang=en-US&w=7f342ed2,df013808&icp=1&.intl=us&sig=4gJB4.xoptgQuieMkWMyQQ--
The world has been transfixed this week by speculation that Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, a self-proclaimed devout Shiite Muslim infamous for his frequent anti-Semitic and anti-Israel remarks, may be of Jewish heritage. Jews may not be eager to claim him, but his family's religious history -- or even just the rumors surrounding it -- could have serious implications for Iranian foreign policy
Posted by: JL | Jul 21 2012 16:52 utc | 206
www@
"It's mostly about anti-American or anti-imperialist sentiments that are coming across here as being so pro-Assad."
That is a false dichotomy. You don't have to be anti-american to be "pro-assad"
I really dislike this kind of stuff, personally
This is black or white, war is peace, kind of thinking.
I find this most offensive.
The fact of the matter is, Syria is under attack via NATO's proxies for a specific geopolitical reason and many, many innocent civilians are being killed.
That is an anti-human situation. The human condition is tantamount in my opinion
Posted by: jawbone | Jul 21, 2012 12:18:49 PM | 200
they disappear down memory hole like everything else that doesnt suit the agenda. look at 911. couldnt stuff a bigger rabbit down the hole than that one.
the arafat assassination is a case in point. it was well raised back in 2004-6. See Q & A below. Al Jazeera trying to regain its Arab St creds by their "breaking scoop" on Arafat killed by polonium. (after they destroyed pushing zionist lies of arab spring).
problem is that anna politkovskaya revealed back in early 2006 that Arafat was killed by polonium and was murdered immediately thereafter- blamed on Putin of course. try finding ANY of that on the web. gone like lightning- who has the capability to scrub something off the global web so quick? not FSB i guarantee you.
Posted by: JL | Jul 21 2012 16:59 utc | 208
"www also claimed anti-Americanism is not related to American imperialism"
Did not see that but I could certainly well believe it - fits right in with the competely contradictory statements he so frequently makes.
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 17:00 utc | 209
You don't have to be anti-american to be "pro-assad"
You don't have to be "pro-assad" to be anti-american
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 17:01 utc | 210
Regarding propaganda, let's not lose sight of the tremendous capability of the U.S. effort which has now gone beyond even the formidable "strategic communications" (propaganda) and "intelligence" (CIA and SOF) to an integrated State/Defense/CIA effort to control the narrative and have it gibe with concocted "massacres," "rapes," "checkpoint occupations," etc. on the ground.
David Axe: "For its part, the State Department has stood up a new bureau of Conflict and Stabilization Operations, which Clinton said “is working to put into practice lessons learned over the past decade and institutionalize a civilian surge capacity to deal with crises and hotspots.” Together, Special Operations Forces and State’s new Conflict Bureau are the twin arms of an expanding institution for waging small, low-intensity shadow wars all over the world."
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/05/clinton-goes-commando/
Peter Chamberlain: "The overriding purpose was to generate national revolutions by first creating a false perception of an ongoing revolution within the minds of the people. The people were made to believe in an inevitable national revolution by hiring locals to stage revolutionary attacks (terrorism) on key targets, at critical junctures in the molding of the national debate. The contracted newsmen spread the story of the ongoing revolution far and wide, while the newsmen who could not be bought are deceived with selective leaks from anonymous government sources. The revolutionary (terrorist) acts are timed so as to validate the doctored news reports."
http://newscentralasia.net/2012/05/26/hillary-finally-brings-bureau-of-spydiplomatic-liaisons-out-of-the-closet/
This goes 'way beyond "no fly zones" in its complexity. And what better target than Syria, an ally of Iran and the Palestinians.
From the Libbie Phelan and Syria Girl article
The Guardian’s recent headline “Saudi Arabia plans to fund Syria rebel army” is in the typical style of the liberal media based in the NATO countries, a malignant manipulation.The text of that article is specifically about plans by the US’ and by extension Israel’s most important regional allies, Qatar and Saudi Arabia, to pay the salaries of insurgents.
But, buried further down, the very same article also reports that such support began months before.
Very similar to what 'Somebody' 'WWW' and one or two others are doing here
A less misleading headline therefore would replace “plans to fund” with “increases support for”, however a truthful headline would suggest external control over Syria’s insurgency has existed since its onset.
Pretty much describes to a 't' the sort of dishonest behaviour WWW and the other slippery individual are engaging in here @MOA
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 17:08 utc | 212
>>> www also claimed anti-Americanism is not related to American imperialism>>>
That's very interesting, Nikon, I'd like to read it too. Would you give me the post number in which he said anti-Americanism is not related to American imperialism? Maybe Hu Bris is on to something here about www masquerading as someone else.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 17:09 utc | 213
Maybe Hu Bris is on to something here about www masquerading as someone else.
ah yes - the usual dishonest distortions - you are not "masquerading as someone else"
you are masquerading as somthing you are not and that is: an honest individual.
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 17:12 utc | 214
Posted by: Copeland | Jul 21, 2012 12:25:12 PM | 201
Actually it is anything but old. As long as we continue to hear "Iran wants to wipe Israel off the map" etc etc the issue is very alive and very well. As long as the antisemite/holocaustianity card is played to blackmail the world, the Ahmedinejad -jew issue is an exemplary prototype of how they play their game.
Posted by: JL | Jul 21 2012 17:13 utc | 215
>>> That is an anti-human situation. The human condition is tantamount in my opinion>>>
I also dislike it, Penny, going back to Albright killing 500,000 Iraqi children with her embargo on medical supplies, then another million by Bush II in Iraq and more recently 100,000 in Libya by NATO pulling a "humanitarian" gimmick. I also see the West and the Gulf doing double and triple somersaults to kick off another "humanitarian" assault on Syria.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 17:24 utc | 216
>>> With Attaturk being admittedly jewish (ala jerusalem post) as well as Ghaddaffi (israel today and their heated debate over his right of return) the Tribe has its agents in the highest posts across the world- and are hardly poor, persecuted minority. thats not counting Hitler, their favorite bludgeon on the world- who William Donovan, head of OSS- a hardcore zionist himself- investigated to find he was illegitimate offspring of a Rothschild. that "antisemite conspiracy" came from the top inside authority himself; not an internet hate site....>>>
JL, welcome to Hu Bris' and Walter's twighlight zone. The 3 of you will be great ghostbusters. You forgot to include Houda Ezra Ebrahim Nonoo, the Jewish ambassador for Bahrain to Washington and probably the reason why the Bahraini Shia are bring clobbered.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 17:39 utc | 217
>>> You don't have to be "pro-assad" to be anti-american >>>
I don't like a lot of things the US has been doing, but I don't consider myself anti-American. In fact, I like Americans although I don't like the American regime. I'm not anti-Assad either, I have nothing against the guy, he's actually a nice guy, but I don't like what his father's regime has been doing for decades. I know this must be really tough for you to understand, Hu Bris. Use a paper and pencil and draw diagrams, it helps.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 17:50 utc | 218
A troll is rhetoric masquerading as a person. A troll stands clarity on its head and indulges in endless repetition. A troll tries to drown a comment board in deluge of trivial and divisive jabs, aimed at other commenters. You will notice that trolls are always picking fights, belittling other people's sources, without ever offering a logical rebuttal; and they are always framing their argument without the equivalent sourcing and citation of their own. This is a taxing methodology that is the equivalent of a wad of spittle hurled at everyone simultaneously.
@brian #183 -
this is the work of israel as usual using dumb arabs slaveshow enlightened of you to support Arabs against western imperialism, in spite of their inferiority; they must feel overwhelmed by your generosity
I repeat:
1) religious and political radicals exit at all latitudes
2) your language is odious and racist
Posted by: claudio | Jul 21 2012 18:00 utc | 220
>>> But, buried further down, the very same article also reports that such support began months before. >>> (Hu Bris 212)
The US support actually started more than just months before. US funding of Assad's opponents started in 2003 at just about the same time that the Congress' Syria Accountability Syria and Lebanese Sovereignty Restoration Act Act (SALSRA) was passed and subsequently flipped into UNSC Resolution 1559 in Sept 2004; do your own googling.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 18:35 utc | 221
Posted by: www | Jul 21, 2012 1:39:18 PM | 217
why dont you do some basic research instead of copping out with the 'crazy' 'conspiracy' rubbish? read Tragedy and Hope- written by Bill Clinton's mentor. Unless your willing to dig into the bibliography suggested- your opinion isnt worth diddly squat on that score.
Posted by: JL | Jul 21 2012 18:39 utc | 222
re penny 204
Ever hear of Portaging?
While I do not know the ins and outs of this specific waterway
I would suspect if there is a will there is a way
Waterways are the easiest means to transport whatever.
People, munitions, chemical weapons
Maybe it is difficult
But, likely it is not impossible.
Especially not for persons rigorously trained and or used to having to persevere strenuous treks
Such as special ops
You would have done better to let the matter go, rather than insisting. Then no-one would have noticed your ignorance of Syrian geography.
The Orontes is a broad shallow stream, backed up in places by weirs, in order to provide a head of water for water-wheels or water-mills. The most famous case is the water-wheels of Hama, but there are also water-mills for grinding corn. No-one has ever tried to use it for transport. Special ops can't do what the locals don't know about; though they might do what the central government doesn't think about.
Posted by: alexno | Jul 21 2012 18:50 utc | 223
>>>why dont you do some basic research instead of copping out with the 'crazy' 'conspiracy' rubbish? read Tragedy and Hope- written by Bill Clinton's mentor. Unless your willing to dig into the bibliography suggested- your opinion isnt worth diddly squat on that score.>>>
JL, I'm actually a conspiracies nut myself and I just love the stuff. I was kidding about it with you because there's no way of carrying on a serious debate with people here because the minute I don't agree with any of the comments, the insults starts flying my way and it has gotten very tiring. So I stopped taking people seriously here. By the way, I'm a big fan of Thierry Meyssan and I've posted a couple of links to his great articles. Sorry I can't read your Clinton suggestion, it's because I don't read much anymore and I'm no longer a fan of the Clintons. Their personal business dealings left a foul smell when they moved out of the WH.
Posted by: www | Jul 21 2012 19:26 utc | 224
>>>why dont you do some basic research instead of copping out with the 'crazy' 'conspiracy' rubbish? read Tragedy and Hope- written by Bill Clinton's mentor. Unless your willing to dig into the bibliography suggested- your opinion isnt worth diddly squat on that score.>>>JL, I'm actually a conspiracies nut myself and I just love the stuff. I was kidding about it with you because there's no way of carrying on a serious debate with people here because the minute I don't agree with any of the comments, the insults starts flying my way and it has gotten very tiring. So I stopped taking people seriously here.
There was a time when all the remarks here were serious, and I hope it'll return. Not all participants know much about the issues, but that's part of the game. What I expect from MoA is intelligent discussion, some know about the issue, some don't.
Let's not descend into abuse, easy to do. I admit to having accused Penny of being ignorant of Syrian geography, which wasn't worth it. I would have done better to limiting myself to pointing out the errors.
Posted by: alexno | Jul 21 2012 19:51 utc | 225
"the minute I don't agree with any of the comments, the insults starts flying my way and it has gotten very tiring."
again with the deliberate distortions, and outright lies, about what has occurred
Some might prefer gloss over your 'Errors' or just be polite and call them 'errors' but I prefer to call them what they obviously are - lies and deliberate distortions
To reiterate:
You made a very definitive-sounding and specific claim which you were politely asked to source - you were completely unable to do so, so instead you went off and found something which you thought might fool others into believing was an actual soiurce for your definitive-sounding, but completely bogus, claim
Then, when that was shown to not confirm, but in fact contradict, your claim, in an very obvious effort to try and distract from the FACT that you had been caught just deliberately making shit up, you tried to switch the converstaion to a claim by VOA that had little to do with your original claim, one which in fact pretty much completely contradicted your original claim.
You also refused to acknowledge, and are STILL refusing to acknowledge, that your original claim was proven to be bullshit preferring instead to start waffling on about 'conspiracy theories' in yet another rather lame effort to try and distract from the FACT that you had deliberately lied earlier, and been caught red-handed at it.
And you are still doing it - which does nothing but confrirm your dishonesty, as if any more confirmation were needed
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 20:03 utc | 226
"JL, I'm actually a conspiracies nut myself and I just love the stuff"
and yet curiously you seem unable to pass up any opportunity to rant about 'conspiracy theoriets' in an effort to distract when when anyone points out your earlier lies and distortions
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 20:07 utc | 227
"Sorry I can't read your Clinton suggestion, it's because I don't read much anymore and I'm no longer a fan of the Clintons"
Seriously - is anyone swallowing this crap?
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 20:12 utc | 228
Before this thread got sidetracked Hu Bris posted some good info on how to access SANA and showed us the link to the article that claims Western forces are planning on hijacking Syrian media.
Thanks Hu Bris.
This supports my suspicion that the media has been hijacked. The West has announced they were doing this, as Penny has shown (can't find the link showing preparation to cut off media, although I found this), and as Don Bacon (#211) showed above.
I've been mostly unable to get the main SANA site and at least one television station was hijacked last week. I've suspected at least two false storied of being planted recently in SANA and FARS*.
Of course the Western media is trying furiously to hide the truth.
*FARS involved the story that the Chinese and Russians were going to conduct joint exercises with the Syrian and Iranians and Chinese ships were heading thru the Suez. I think the SANA story involved the defection of the pilot but I'd have to look back.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 21 2012 20:36 utc | 229
more conspirational fun & psychological warfare games, cnn insinuates the bomb in Damascus was by Mossad and the target was Assad
http://amanpour.blogs.cnn.com/2012/07/18/in-wake-of-damascus-killings-a-bizarre-scene/
I guess getting the news for free means somebody else pays ....
Posted by: somebody | Jul 21 2012 20:37 utc | 230
Alexno @223
Did you actually read what I said?
It does not appear so.
Rather you took the option to demonstrate your alleged superior knowledge
"You would have done better to let the matter go, rather than insisting. Then no-one would have noticed your ignorance of Syrian geography."
Reread what I said, since you took the time to quote it
Or let me help you
"Ever hear of Portaging?
While I do not know the ins and outs of this specific waterway
I would suspect if there is a will there is a way
Waterways are the easiest means to transport whatever.
People, munitions, chemical weapons
Maybe it is difficult
But, likely it is not impossible.
Especially not for persons rigorously trained and or used to having to persevere strenuous treks
Such as special ops"
I admitted I do not know the ins and outs of this specific waterway
but, where there is a will there is a way
nothing can be discounted at this point in time
Nothing.
Unless you have some specific knowledge?
I certainly don't claim to.
You should however read about the natives and their portaging history they traveled miles and miles and miled by foot and water
I for one am not impressed.
You should however read about the natives and their portaging history they traveled miles and miles and miles by foot and water
I for one am not impressed by persons who resort to arrogance, for no apparent reason
The Bulgarian terror attack: Beware of not falling into yet another Israeli trap
By Maidhc Ó Cathail
The Passionate Attachment
July 19, 2012
In light of the concerted attempt by Israeli officials and the Jewish state’s partisans around the world to link yesterday’s terrorist attack in Bulgaria to the bombing of the AMIA Jewish center in Buenos Aires exactly 18 years ago on July 18, 1994, it’s worth recalling Alireza Miryousefi’s reply to Alan Dershowitz published by the Wall Street Journal this February. As the First Secretary of the Mission of the Islamic Republic of Iran to the U.N. observed about an earlier attack in the Argentine capital:
Finally, regarding the author’s false allegations about Iran’s role in a bombing in Argentina in 1992, suffice it to say that the real target was Argentina’s bilateral relations with Iran. Given Israel’s notoriety in using so-called “false flag operations,” the real value of Mr. Dershowitz’s article is that it should send a warning to the people and American policy makers to beware of not falling into yet another Israeli trap.
As for the 1994 attack, award-winning investigative reporter Gareth Porter wrote ,
“I spent months investigating that bombing in 2006-07 and found that the Argentine case against Iran was not based on real evidence at all.”
.
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 21:27 utc | 234
"re 230
I didn't see an implication of the MOSSAD."
hahaha
roflmao
and you're surprised by this?
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 21 2012 21:32 utc | 235
re 232
You're losing your online reputation for no good reason, Penny. I've known Syria for 40 years. Dabbled my toes in the Orontes at least once. Do you want a photo of me in front of the water-wheels of Hama? I can probably find one on my computer if you want.
Posted by: alexno | Jul 21 2012 21:40 utc | 236
Here's some updates about the degree to which the rebels have attacked the border checkpoints between Syria and Iraq. The questin has a bearing on the strength of the rebels in eastern Syria.
Clarification: The border crossing between Syria and Iraq at the Euphrates River is called Qaim in Iraq, while in Syria it is called both Al-Bukamal and Abu Kamal; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Kamal
Preliminary comment: Syria closed the border crossing at Al-Bukamal some considerable time ago. I'd guess there's a fear a suicide bomber driving a truck would blow up the big bridge that crosses the Euphrates river at Al-Bukamal, but there has also been considerable though intermittent armed rebel activity in Al-Bukamal town itself for the last six months, which would be another reason to close the border crossing.
Preliminary backgrounder: Date 20 Jul 2012, Associated Press: "Iraq's government spokesman Ali al-Dabbagh confirmed that [Syrian] rebels held Qaim, located in the Euphrates river valley. But he refuted earlier reports that rebels had seized all four major border posts, saying that only the one at Qaim was wrested from the Syrian regime. http://bigstory.ap.org/article/iraqi-flights-evacuate-its-residents-syria
20 Jul 2012: "At the al-Bukamal border point, an AFP photographer saw a watchtower apparently empty and crossing buildings deserted. He reported that a poster of Assad had the head torn off, and that no flags were raised above the border point." AFP @ http://www.naharnet.com/stories/en/47243-fiercest-fighting-yet-in-syria-s-aleppo . My comment: No flags. So the rebel flag reported raised there on 19 Jul 2012 was since removed.
21 Jul 2012. Iraqi Deputy Interior Minister Adnan al-Assadi told AFP: "Only Abu Kamal is under the control of the Free Syrian Army." He added that on 20 July "reinforcements from the regular Syrian army arrived to some of the border posts." He left it unclear when, if ever, control of other border posts changed hands on the Syria-Iraq border. http://www.naharnet.com/stories/en/47348-syria-rebels-hold-one-iraq-border-crossing
21 Jul 2012: Iraq's Nineveh provincial governor Atheel al-Nujaifi told AFP: "The [Rabiyah, aka Yaribiyah] border point [in north eastern Syria] is still under the control of the Syrian army, but they are in a critical situation because all the roads leading to it on the Syrian side are under the control of the Free Syrian Army." http://www.naharnet.com/stories/en/47348-syria-rebels-hold-one-iraq-border-crossing
21 Jul 2012: "At 5:00 pm (1400 GMT), some gunmen took control of the Yaribiyah crossing and they were informed that the crossing is now in the hands of the Free Syrian Army," said Atheel al-Nujaifi, governor of the Iraqi province of Nineveh, referring to the Rabiyah crossing by its Syrian name. AFP @ http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hFLkDnPvz0g07Lqar-RYy6JyjcxA?docId=CNG.14ee08cd81a96d23327fb33afcb2654e.7b1
Clarification from 19 Jul 2012: Close to the Yaribiyah, aka Rabiyah, border crossing twenty Syrian soldiers plus their commander were killed on 19 Jul 2012 according to Iraqi Army Brig. General Qassim al-Dulaimi. Al-Dulami also said that on the morning of 19 Jul the Al-Bukamal crossing was stormed by only about a half-dozen armed rebels. http://bigstory.ap.org/article/rebels-kill-21-syrian-guards-overtake-border-post
Understanding the situation is complicated by the unmistakeable desire of the Western news agencies to spin it so as to cast the rebels in the strongest light and the Syrian army in the weakest light. The Syrian news agency SANA has the same desire in reverse. SANA is still not reporting anything at all from the Yaribiyah, aka Rabiyah, border crossing. SANA's last report from Al-Bukamal was on 19 Jul 2012 when it said that dozens of rebels were killed or wounded and more captured in Al-Bukamal [in the town of? or at the border crossing of?].
One last comment: Except in the northeast of Syria, the Syria-Iraq border is desert which is very hard or impossible for the rebels to hide in. They have support among some of the populatin in the town of Bukamal, which is pretty much the only place where they can find any shelter near the border, along the whole border outside the northeast. In the northeast, the terrain is more favorable for rebels, but the local population is not. The local population is overwhelmingly (1) Kurds who may or may not support the rebellion but are not armed rebels themselves and don't mix well with outsider Sunni Arab armed rebels, (2) Christians who don't support the rebellion, and (3) Sunni Arabs who don't support the rebellion.
You can add to the situation the political damming inability of the "rebels" to remain popular in border countries (and very likely within Syria, too)
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/turkish-truck-drivers-accuse-rebels-of-looting.aspx?pageID=238&nID=26033&NewsCatID=352
"Dozens of Turkish truck drivers on Saturday accused the Free Syrian Army of having burned and looted their lorries as they stormed a border post in Syria.
A group of truck owners, traders and transporters have been waiting since Friday at the Cilvegozu border crossing, in Turkey's southern province, which lies opposite to Syria's Bab al-Hawa post.
Rebels captured the Syrian border post after battling President Bashar al-Assad's loyalist troops.
"We barely escaped when the rebel fighters took full control of the Bab al-Hawa border post in Syria," said Hasan Abbasoglu as he retrived his vehicle from Syria after the looting.
While the truck was not damaged, its cargo had been ransacked. And he had to pay $700 (575 euros) in bribes to get his truck back, he said."
Posted by: somebody | Jul 21 2012 22:09 utc | 238
Another weird thing about trolls is that they are impervious to irony. I hope b is going to sweep up the place soon; it's starting to get nasty in here.
Lilly Martin Sahiounie
The American Ambassador's residence in Damascus is surrounded by the Syrian Arab Army. We now know that a Syrian man is inside the residence. This man is a University student. This man has been accused, by his fellow accomplices, with bombing the Security building, last Wednesday, in which now 4 senior officials have died. The bomb was detonated by remote control and the Syrian man now inside the US Ambassador's residence in Damascus is the person who detonated the bomb and from that location. The bombing was planned and executed by several people, some are in custody and giving information about those involved. The last official to die yesterday, from his wounds on Wednesday, gave information about having trusted that University student with important security information, concerning the meeting. It would appear that the United States of American is involved in this bombing possibly. I don't like to make accusations without proof against my own country, so I am careful about stating the situation in terms which are truthful. The material used in the explosion has been found and examined and is found to be a very sophisticated substance, not the common C4 and other stuff which is everywhere. No, instead this substance is found to be of a grade and type which is not available to common terrorists, but it is a form which is available for use by military only, and not just any military, but of a specific origin. The source of this type of explosive material is rather rare, and therefor can be used to trace it back to the actual manufacturer. This information comes from Damascus, via ShamFM, which is a Damascus media.
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 0:50 utc | 240
Posted by: claudio | Jul 21, 2012 2:00:42 PM | 220
allow me to broaden it for you claudio....dumb goyim
Happy? or do i get slammed as racist for slamming goyim? in either case...arabs ought to know better than work for USrael...dont try to act as a subtle zionist apologist
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 0:56 utc | 241
>>> In Syria there issn;t a Assad regime, at best a Baath regime, >>>
More of the blind leading the blind. The regime is definitely Assad's but the Assad being referred to is Hafez el-Assad, and not his son, the current President, which is Bachar el-Assad. Hafez el-Assad WAS the Syrian Baathist Socialist Party. Is there anyone here that knows something about Syria, its people, its history or is this only about bashing America?
Posted by: www | Jul 21, 2012 10:33:41 AM | 191
i hate to go further in this farting contest...but...yes its about bashing america...it america and its dumb servile goyim, its strings pulled by israel, that is bashing the middle east
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 1:00 utc | 242
#140 brian:
Thanks for the link to the article by Prof. Tracy. While he rightly critiques the response of many Progressive anti-Zionists and points to the history of manufacturing spin for the left, his use of that particular show to pidgeonhole Democracy Now is simplistic. The objectionable 7/19 DN show aired just two days after an excellent interview with Patrick Seale on 7/17. In that interview, Seale made many of the points that are being made on this site regarding Syria:
1) The attack on Assad's inner circle highlights the role of Jihadis (possibly AlQaida) in the opposition -- an embarrassing alliance for the US.
2) Reports of the Assad government's imminent demise are exaggerated -- he doesn't think it's going to happen.
3) While profoundly divided, the opposition is dominated by the Muslim Brotherhood, who are not willing to negotiate because they want revenge.
4) The allies of Syrian Muslim Brotherhood are the foreign jihadis flowing into the country -- who can't be held to honor a ceasefire.
5) The Russians are afraid that a Chapter VII resolution will be used as an excuse for military intervention, as happened in Libya.
6) The attacks on Syria is linked to that on Iran -- both the US and Israel are committed to bringing down the Assad government.
7) While divided, the liberal protesting wing of the opposition wants no connection with taking up arms or calling for outside intervention. Their positions are not represented by the FSA.
After such an interview with Seale, it would not be surprising if DN were pressured to give a "more nuanced view" of "the complexities of the situation." Rather than giving up on DN because of shows like 7/19, it should be encouraged to bring guests like Seale or Greenwald more often.
Posted by: Rusty Pipes | Jul 22 2012 1:37 utc | 243
rusty
to this day ImperialismNow has not interviewed Cynthia McKinney on her visits to Libya...where she witnessed the victims of the genocide inflicted by the creatures IN has been supporting.
IN formerly known as DemocracyNow..is history
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 2:03 utc | 244
USrael aids Alqaeda yet again:
Raising Al-Qaeda flags, Islamist terrorists declare an Islamist Emirate starting from Aleppo countryside
http://www.syriatruth.org/news/tabid/93/Article/7846/Default.aspx
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 3:30 utc | 245
>>> Dabbled my toes in the Orontes at least once. >>> (Alexno 236)
You could have also eaten trout from it, but why the fuss about Penny's minor geographical glitch?
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 4:30 utc | 246
Rusty Pipes, pidgeonholing DN because it doesn't agree 100% with the Moonies' view on anything 100% of the time is more serious than simplistic. Same disparaging being done with the Guardian. Having Patrick Seale on DN should have been enough. Some here are chasing after ghosts.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 6:13 utc | 247
>>> to this day ImperialismNow has not interviewed Cynthia McKinney on her visits to Libya...where she witnessed the victims of the genocide inflicted by the creatures IN has been supporting.
IN formerly known as DemocracyNow..is history>>> (Brian 244)
There's something fascistic about your mentality, Brian, it's no wonder you're all gaga over the Baathist regime. So what's the big deal with DN not inviting McKinney for chat; will the world stop turning? You just read Rusty's 7-points laid out on DN by Patrick Seale. If it would have been the villain you are describing, it would have never allowed Seale a chance to express his views. Do you know Patrick Seale?
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 6:26 utc | 248
or Stalinist or whatever ... not logical in any case ...
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 7:13 utc | 249
Speech by Hezbollah Secretary General Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah during the Victory Celebration
Read carefully when he talk's about rocket technology and why recently the FSA with Mossad has been killing rocket scientists in Syria. BTW most Israelis believe Hassan Nasrallah rather then their own politicians.
Posted by: hans | Jul 22 2012 7:39 utc | 250
>>> USrael aids Alqaeda yet again: Raising Al-Qaeda flags, Islamist terrorists declare an Islamist Emirate starting from Aleppo countryside>>> (Brian 245)
I keep thinking how the US is helping Islamists everywhere known to want the extermination of Christians and other minorities. It can't be for anything religious so it has to be to fracture the whole area into little statelets ruled by Sheiks and policed by its bouncer, Israel. But as in Afghanistan, one day it will again bite the US in the ass.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 7:51 utc | 251
yes, Nasrallah is warning Israel not to attack Syria
http://english.al-akhbar.com/content/nasrallah%E2%80%99s-message-israel
basically from Iran sanctions on there is undeclared warfare
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/pipeline-fire-halts-iraqi-crude-supplies-to-turkey.aspx?pageID=238&nID=26026&NewsCatID=352
http://www.todayszaman.com/news-287264-turkey-us-seek-countering-russian-naval-dominance-in-east-med.html
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 7:58 utc | 252
Hans, the focus of the speech was to spook the Israelis by telling them that Syria has the missiles that can hurt them bad. Everyone had been assuming that Hezbollah's firepower had all come from Iran and the Sayed went out of his way to stress that the good stuff that was used against Israel in 2006 had come mostly from the Syrians that had manufactured it. Other than for the land-to-sea missile provided by Iran that took out the Israeli destroyer "Hanit" anchored 10 km off Beirut, mostly everything used was Syrian. He also said that the Syrians have already provided the Gazans with what they'd need to hit Tel Aviv. It was speech intended for Israelis.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 8:07 utc | 253
somebody @ 252
Turkey has bitten more than it can chew..The fake Syrian army(fsa) have now attacked Turkish trucks on the Syrian border..This is the very same fake Syrian army(fsa) that Erdogan is in love with and hosting them on Turkish "refugee camps" (aka military training camp). Experience has proven that one cannot control these events..They have a life of their own and once they start, they never end..
Turkey crying over some blown up pipeline, which is not supposed to be sending oil to Turkey anyway, is a bit rich considering the fact that Turkey itself is openly supporting TERRORISM in Syria..They shouldn't complain and just suck it up.
The alliances made by Turkey is very very weak..They have kooks like Barzani and his gangster family now championing pan Turkish agenda to his fellow Kurdistan people - FAT chance!!! His days are very well numbered.
So lets see, Iraq, Syria Armenia, somewhat Iran are now hostile state to Turkey..One has to be a fool to think this is a foreign policy success.
Posted by: Zico | Jul 22 2012 8:25 utc | 254
'We arrived to Midan, to the Police center; they sent us in a tanked vehicle with some soldiers to accompany us. We got down in the heart of a popular area where streets are narrow and houses are traditional (irregular houses). The quarter was empty of inhabitants. Soldiers told us that Syrian army helped them to evacuate the quarter before starting its operation. We saw traces of fights everywhere. Bullets’ caps everywhere. We wanted to see bodies of fighters of the so-called FSA (I said “the SO-CALLED” because the bodies belonged to NON-Syrian nationalities!) Answering a question of the journalist, soldiers said that most of the foreign fighters are Libyan, Afghan, Pakistani and other Arabic nationalities.'
http://nsnbc.wordpress.com/2012/07/21/syriaonline%C2%B4s-iyad-khuder-reports-from-damascus/
FSA is not Free not Syrian and not an army
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 8:59 utc | 255
same goes for the US by the way. they now have a united front of Iran, China, Russia and somewhat Iraq and Latin America ...
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 9:03 utc | 257
re w3 246
You could have also eaten trout from it, but why the fuss about Penny's minor geographical glitch?It beats me why she persisted. If I'm shown to be wrong, I tend to let matters go.
Posted by: alexno | Jul 22 2012 9:45 utc | 258
Formatting glitch on 258. should be:
You could have also eaten trout from it, but why the fuss about Penny's minor geographical glitch?
It beats me why she persisted. If I'm shown to be wrong, I tend to let matters go.
Posted by: alexno | Jul 22 2012 9:48 utc | 259
the muslim brotherhood : servants of the US in syria, seeking influence in the USA
http://www.twincities.com/ci_21119446/bachmann-broadens-muslim-brotherhood-allegations-include-ellison
Posted by: brian | Jul 22 2012 10:14 utc | 260
The FSA are known by two different transliterations; The Free Syrian Army, and The Free Syria Army. I believe the latter is accurate.
Posted by: Alexander | Jul 22 2012 10:34 utc | 261
Alexno, she was just rambling on (her words, not mine) about Ginsberg's stupid article and not debating any issue. She actually admitted not knowing the workings of the river when she added that the stuff could be moved by portage, especially by trained guys like the ones we keep hearing about working for the West from inside Syria. What she's saying is possible about special ops guys like Prince's that are reportedly all over Syria making trouble and probably there on loan from the UAE where they are training a private army for the Sheikh of Abu Dhabi. At the time you probably dipped your toes in the river, whiteriver rafting hadn't yet started on a small stretch of it; now it's a big thing locally with a run of about 10 km.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 11:44 utc | 262
@Copeland #239 - I share your worries about trolls on MoA
Posted by: claudio | Jul 22 2012 12:47 utc | 263
and proven liars are just fine by you two?
Nice to know where you guys stand anyway.
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 13:36 utc | 264
which side is russia on ?
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/07/20/assad-agrees-to-go-says-russian-ambassador/#comments
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/07/20/dempsey-russian-counterpart-meet-at-pentagon/
*This year is the first time that the Russian navy will participate in RIMPAC. The Soviet bloc was considered the original target of the RIMPAC when the exercise was launched during the cold war era. "Russia's presence speaks to a Russian desire to be more deeply engaged in this region*
http://tinyurl.com/d8exl36
China blasts Russia for shooting, arresting fishermen
http://tinyurl.com/brm7cc6
Posted by: denk | Jul 22 2012 13:50 utc | 265
US announced cash gift to Jordan of $100 million to help with expenses of Syrian refugees. Looks like His Majesty's CNN interview last week stressing his fear about Syria's chemical weapons falling into the hands of AQ paid off.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 14:42 utc | 266
would now be an inopportune moment to remark that BOTH claudio and Copeland were two of the people that got most upset when I attacked their beloved 'Occupy' as the useless waste of time wa was clearly designed to be?
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 14:53 utc | 267
>>> and proven liars are just fine by you two?>>> (Hu Bris)
About refugees crossing into Lebanon, I said the number was 32,000 refugees in 24 hours from a news report I saw. It turned out the written press reported that the UN had said the number was somewhere between 8,000 and 30,000 in 48 hours. What I heard on the news differed by 2,000 and by an additional 24 hours beyond my statement about it being 32,000 over 24 hours. If you want to have a nervous breakdown over the over-reported 2,000 refugees and the understated 24 hours, go ahead and enjoy yourself; you're not being serious.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 14:56 utc | 268
US announced cash gift to Jordan of $100 million to help with expenses of Syrian refugees.
Oh Bernanke just add this to my slate of $53 trillion I promise to pay. This is the AIPAc, Zionist private ATM.
Posted by: hans | Jul 22 2012 14:58 utc | 269
"I said the number was 32,000 refugees in 24 hours from a news report I saw"
you said nothing about it coming form "from a news report [you] saw" you made a very specific claim, in an effort to portray the situation in Syria as deteriorating rapidly.
When asked for the source you were completely unable to produce any source containing the phrase '32,000 in 24hrs' - the sources you did produce contradicted you on both the numbers and the time-frame. The closest source to your claim was in fact completely anonymous - and the more authoritative source said nothing like you were trying to claim. So you clearly just made up those figures in a dishonest attempt to 'win' an argument by trying to sound authoritative
no one is have any kind of a breakdown you silly little man - merely pointing out your dishonesty, your willingness to just make-shit-up, that's all
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 15:05 utc | 270
Hu Bris, as to the second item that appears to have lit a fire under your ass, it was my statement about the oddity of seeing contradicting positions between the State Department communications organ "Voice of America" that reported that Syrian refugees into Lebanon were a mere trickle and more likely mostly comprised of Syrians visiting relatives in Lebanon for the Ramadan holidays and thereby belittling the refugee story, and the communication organs of America's allies, Qatar and Saudi Arabia, Jazeera and al-Arabia beating on their pots and pans about the "thousands" of refugees fleeing a Syria in the process of falling apart. The contradiction between what VOA on one side and Jazera and Al-Arabia on the other was too much to grasp for you and you chose to call the whole thing a lie. You're all sour grapes.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 15:09 utc | 271
>>> The closest source to your claim was in fact completely anonymous - and the more authoritative source said nothing like you were trying to claim.>>>
One source I provided after the fact was Naharnet and the other was the Daily Star. One of them quoted and named a UN spokesperson that said the number was between 8,000 and 30,000 that crossed into Lebanon over the 48 hours. Both links are somewhere in the posts above. Get off your lazy ass and find them.
The Voice of America article was taken from the VOA website, also posted above. Stop being a jerk.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 15:17 utc | 272
obfuscate as much as you like, but at the time you were vehemently arguing, in a rather heated back-and-forth between yourself and others, that it was now a 'civil war' (fully understanding the grave legal implications for the Syrian Gov't should it be officially declared as such) and you used the phrase '32,000 [refugees] in 24hrs' as some sort of definitive 'proof' that it must now be considered a 'civil war'.
When challenged on the veracity of those very specific and definitive sounding numbers, instead of climbing down a little and announcing that you might have got something wrong, you chose instaed to bluster and produce two 'source' that actually contradicted your claim.
At this point an honest or intelligent person would most likely have admitted that there were a lot of different numbers being thrown around by propagandists everywhere (yourself included ;) and that really the UN statement was probably the most reliable, certainly far more reliable than anything from anonymous sources.
But you refused to address the claim that in acting as you had, by waving about a '32,000 in 24hrs' claim, which by the way you have STILL not managed to provide a source for, you were in fact merely peddling disinfo/propaganda
as yet you have yet to produce any source that reported your '32,000 in 24hrs' claim - so in light of that it's pretty obvious you just amae that shit up
Q.E.D. ;-)
Now since this subject has been done to death IMHO (partly mea culpa, but partly youra culpa too :) and everyone else is probably bored to tears with it, unless there's another outbreak of lies from you, I'll leave it at that
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 15:26 utc | 273
>>> Oh Bernanke just add this to my slate of $53 trillion I promise to pay. This is the AIPAc, Zionist private ATM.>>>
Hans, the next question should be whether or not Turkey and Lebanon would be also getting a cash grant because of the Syrian refugees. In any event, the US wanted those refugees created so it stands to reason that the US should be paying for their room and board.
Oddly though, the US created a million Iraqi refugees that have been living in Syria for years thanks to the US but the US is not sending any cheques to Syria to help with the expenses. Syria is also host to 400,000 Palestinian refugees because the US doesn't believe in sending them to their righful place in Palestine.
Anyway, this $100 million to Jordan should be welcome news in Israel since whatever freebie the Arabs get, Israel automatically receives a matching grant.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 15:27 utc | 274
I suppose Turkey needs this money urgently
Syrians revolt, fly own flag at refugee camp in Turkey
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/syrians-revolt-fly-own-flag-at-refugee-camp-in-turkey-.aspx?pageID=238&nID=26083&NewsCatID=359
Al-Assad arming PKK militants, report says
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/al-assad-arming-pkk-militants-report-says.aspx?pageID=238&nID=26044&NewsCatID=338
whilst Obama speaks in some kind of dreamland
while on the Turkish border fighters say they are AQIM
http://www.skynews.com.au/world/article.aspx?id=774697
I guess at this point they might as well transfer the money to the Syrian government to root the fighters out and let the refugees back in, never mind those Kurdish fighters ...
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 15:40 utc | 275
Some of the fighters said they belonged to al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM), while others claimed allegiance to a group called Shura Taliban.They were armed with Kalashnikov assault rifles, rocket launchers and improvised mines.
The fighters identified themselves as coming from a number of countries: Algeria, France, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Tunisia, the United Arab Emirates and the Russian republic of Chechnya.
brilliant
Posted by: Alexander | Jul 22 2012 15:49 utc | 276
yes, Alexander, I just wonder about the strategy behind it. there is also accompanying video where they pose to the press on the border point with an Al Queida flag. They "identified themselves" to the press.
Al Queida's strategy alway's has been to get the US to intervene ....
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 16:06 utc | 277
if you read through all the mostly unreadable comments in this thread, and you step back and try to reasonably evaluate the consensus view about the events in Syria, the only thing that you can know is that just about all the commenters here are searching for any kind of information that can be kludged together to demonstrate the overlording, nefarious, cosmically-directing, powers of the United States to colonize the fragile eggshell minds of Arabs.
this "analysis" is even more dimwitted when you realize that the consensus view among commenters here is that the American "empire" is collapsing. It seems that the ostensible political "left" laughably represented here possesses the same inability of right-wing knuckleheads to achieve an awareness that their worldview is constructed by a patchwork of polarizing contradiction.
And then on top of all of this, the consensus here is paralyzed by a lack of any normative orientation to the problem. Assad forever!
Posted by: slothrop | Jul 22 2012 16:14 utc | 278
no, slothrop, I think we are deconstructing the news, and it is actually quite interesting to internationally crowdsource what people perceive to be reality ...
as you took the pains to read through all of this you obviously are fascinated by it, too
Posted by: somebody | Jul 22 2012 16:23 utc | 279
Has anyone seen confirmation of this?
A blast has hit the builing of Saudi intelligence service in Riyadh, killing deputy of the newly-appointed intelligence chief Prince Bandar bin Sultan, according to reports.
The explosion took place on Sunday when Bin Sultan’s deputy was entering the building, Yemen's al-Fajr Press quoted eyewitnesses as saying.Saudi media have so far refrained from showing any reaction to the blast.
I haven't seen it anywhere else. It would be quite a counter escalation if true and possibly a warning to the Saudi royals that they are not untouchable either.
Posted by: Lysander | Jul 22 2012 16:26 utc | 280
@Hu Bris #267
would now be an inopportune moment to remark that BOTH claudio and Copeland were two of the people that got most upset when I attacked their beloved 'Occupy' as the useless waste of time wa was clearly designed to be?Hu Bris, it's fascinating; the sector of reality you chose to inquire in search of dots to connect is ... MoA itself! Just take a deep breath, reconsider your priorities, and please consider the possibility that posters here are, basically, surfers with an interest in international politics, each one with his pet theories, personal experiences, preferences, prejudices, etc
for example, I also frequently disagree (mostly silently) with somebody (starting with his choice of nickname, which makes it so hard to cite or search for), but he provides good links, and some of his comments are irritating but can't be simply waved away; and he gave now a good answer to slothrop: "we are deconstructing the news [... ]"
Posted by: claudio | Jul 22 2012 17:00 utc | 281
@slothrop #278
this "analysis" is even more dimwitted when you realize that the consensus view among commenters here is that the American "empire" is collapsing
I don't think that's the consensus view here; it's not mine, anyways; I'm both anguished and awed by the "Empire's" power, starting with his ability to "create its own reality" (remember?); in particular, his ability to constantly conjecture and gather consensus over new agression scenarios while the debris of the preceding ones haven't settled yet
And then on top of all of this, the consensus here is paralyzed by a lack of any normative orientation to the problem. Assad forever!not sure of what you mean, but resistance to Empire is a normative orientation; by itself is not "constructive", but usually you don't get in the cross-hairs of the "Empire" if you agree to sell-out the country's resources, open up to foreing investment (u.e., looting), spend in Us military gear, etc
Posted by: claudio | Jul 22 2012 17:15 utc | 282
@281
equally fascinating that 3w's obvious lie is A-OK with you ;-)
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 17:27 utc | 283
Denk @ 265,
Good catch on Russia. This buttresses my suspicions for a while now that Russia is the captured opposition.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 22 2012 18:49 utc | 284
A lot of games being played.
Even sites where there appears to be honest discussion one must watch out.
Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 22 2012 18:53 utc | 285
"Anyway, this $100 million to Jordan should be welcome news in Israel since whatever freebie the Arabs get, Israel automatically receives a matching grant."
Isn't much more likely that the $100 Mil, rather than being actually destined to 'help' real Syrian refugees, is in fact just financing-in-disguise for an expanded Anti-Syrian Mercenary army based out of Jordan?
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 19:21 utc | 286
>>> equally fascinating that 3w's obvious lie is A-OK with you ;-)>>> (Hu Bris 283)
I thought you said that our disagreement was over and that you'd leave it at that (your post 273). You can't stick to your decisions and you want to keep it up. This thread is about Syria, not about me. Your obsession with me is disturbing.
Posted by: www | Jul 22 2012 19:26 utc | 287
We have other concerns than ripping at people getting facts wrong. State facts, we appreciate that, but get over the petty quarrels with others, and get over yourself - but then again your nick is Hu Bris.
Posted by: Alexander | Jul 22 2012 19:37 utc | 288
I'm just replying to people that keep attacking me -
I keep also posting stuff about Syria, in an effort to help get the thread back on line, but it is you lot that seem to not want to let this die.
if either of you took the time to look at my latest reply to 3w it had nothing to do with the argument, and addressed, in as respectful manner as any rational person could hope for - and others and yourself jump back in and keep resurrecting the argument - all the while accusing Me of doing so- claudio could have left it alone, 3w could have to, so could you Alex, but all 3 of you choose not to and then blame me when I reply.
If you want the argument to stop being resurrected it is ALL of you who are going to have to stop resurrecting it, while hypocritically accusing me of doing so
@ 287
My comment was addressed to claudio, not you. You could have replied to my comment of #286, which was completely on-tropic and contained no attack on you whatsoever, but you chose instead to attack me yet again.
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22 2012 20:00 utc | 289
Posted by: hans | Jul 22, 2012 10:58:51 AM | 269
Funny, I dont recall any help being offered to Syria when they hosted the Iraqi refugees for a decade due to illegal 'Arab Spring' invasion of Iraq in 2003
Omar Suleiman dies while getting medical tests in US. No reason given. "He was fine. It happened all of a sudden." said Hussein Kamal, his Pres campaign team... maybe they should check him for polonium 210??!
Posted by: JL | Jul 22 2012 20:57 utc | 290
@Hu bris
I'm just replying to people that keep attacking me
c'mon, you started; you really give (gave?) the impression you are (were?) anxious to pick up fights
equally fascinating that 3w's obvious lie is A-OK with you ;-)
he posted, you answered, it's ok with me; I dedicate my limited time and mentale resources to Syria, not to www; it's your multiple posts and attacks that distract (us, including yourself) from the important topics
Posted by: claudio | Jul 23 2012 0:38 utc | 291
Allow me to explain the purpose of the Syrian crisis...
Back in 2006, Bush and Cheney were pushing for Israel to attack Iran. However, Israeli leaders balked because they believed that attacking Iran would result in Iranian, Syrian AND Hizballah missiles raining down on Israel, causing Israelis to hide in bomb shelters for most of every day, damaging the economy, and possibly causing the electorate to vote out the leaders in the next election.
In short, Israel wanted a "cheap" Iran war where they only had to deal with a couple hundred missiles from Iran (if that, once the US air strikes had taken out most of Iran's missiles or where Iran had used most of its missiles on US assets in the region.)
So Israel decided with US blessing to attack Hizballah in Lebanon, hoping to force them far enough north that their (at that time limited-range) missiles would be ineffective in an Iran war. As we know, Israel failed miserably due to Hizballah's superior preparation.
At that point, Middle East expert Colonel Pat Lang pointed out that the only way Israel could take out Hizballah in southern Lebanon would be to attack Hizballah in the Bekaa Valley, which provides Hizballah with "defense in depth".
To do this, however, would require Israeli forces to enter Syrian territory and engage Syrian forces. Not that Israel couldn't do this, but it would result in Israel forces facing Hizballah guerrilla war in their front while the remnants of Syria's forces engaged in guerrilla war in Israel's rear - not a good position to be in if you want to minimize casualties and get Israel electorate support.
BUT...IF Syria were ALREADY under attack by the US/NATO/Turkey air strikes for "humanitarian reasons", that would make such an attack feasible because large concentrations of Syrian forces would be suppressed by air strikes.
And this is why Syria is where it is today. And this is what will happen:
1) The US and NATO and Turkey will find a way to bypass the lack of UNSC Resolution authorization and will attack Syria before the end of this year.
2) In the course of that war, Israel - using the excuse that Syrian weapons are being sent to Hizballah (already floated in the Israel press as an excuse that Israel "will have to" attack Syria and Lebanon) - will send one armored division into Syria to protect a second armored division which will proceed up the Lebanese/Syrian border and then turn into the Bekaa Valley, while a third armored division attacks Southern Lebanon as before, in a classic "pincer movement".
3) IF Israel succeeds in damaging Hizballah enough (which I am not sure is feasible but Israel has to try) and IF the US and NATO can damage enough of Syria's missile inventory, then in the next year or so Israel and/or the US will attack Iran.
The ENTIRE purpose of the Syrian crisis is to remove Syria and Hizballah as effective actors in an Iran war, and thus to enable the Iran war to proceed.
Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 23 2012 3:05 utc | 292
Good review, Richard. Hezbollah today has to be better armed and prepared than in 2006. Nasrallah promised for the next war that battles will be fought in Tel Aviv and that missiles will fall on every part of Israel and he is known to have kept all of his promises. What the West and Israel has been unable to do militarily against Hezbollah, it's now trying to do by way of internal sectarian strife and by snuffing out its Syrian backers. War whether on Hezbollah or Syria, it's really all about Iran, as you said and as the title of this thread says.
Posted by: www | Jul 23 2012 4:34 utc | 293
Walter Wit Man 285
*A lot of games being played.
Even sites where there appears to be honest discussion one must watch out.*
wwm,
without the rigor to follow every twist n turns
i've been relying on 2 golden rules
1] fukusi is always lying
2] for every unrest, conflict, assume fukusi are guilty....until proven innocent
so far these rules have never failed me !!
Posted by: denk | Jul 23 2012 4:49 utc | 294
>>> Isn't much more likely that the $100 Mil, rather than being actually destined to 'help' real Syrian refugees, is in fact just financing-in-disguise for an expanded Anti-Syrian Mercenary army based out of Jordan?
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 22, 2012 3:21:29 PM | 286>>>
It is fast talk and financing in disguise as you called it. Jordan having very little other than its potash exports survives on grants and loans from the US, the WB, IMF and the rich Arab cousins. One of its cash generators is the international police and military academy that is financed and managed in good part by the US, over $500 million so far. Most of the US-sponsored militias, such as the PA police, are trained at that academy. 10,000 Libyans are being trained there as were various Lebanese pro-US militia. There is no doubt the US is helping out with the refugees because Jordan simply doesn't have the means pay for them and as Hu Bris noted here, the $100 million is most probably intended for the Syrian rebels under the guise of humanitarian aid to bypass US funding laws.
News about Libyan cadets misbehaving at the academy last week from an Azerbaijani source:
Arrests after Libyan cadets torch Jordanian police academy
11 July 2012, 23:36 (GMT+05:00)
Jordanian authorities arrested dozens of Libyans on Wednesday for allegedly torching several facilities at a police academy in Amman, dpa reported.
According to the state-run, Petra News Agency, police officials arrested over 100 Libyan police cadets for setting fire to parts of the Jordanian International Police Training Centre in protest over a delay in their return flight to their home country.
The cadets were part of a group of 2,500 members of Libyan security services currently being trained in Jordan - the first batch of some 10,000 to be trained at the facility over the next two years.
Jordan has become regional a hub for military and police training, hosting and training some 53,000 Iraqi and 8,000 Palestinian officers over the past decade.
http://en.trend.az/regions/met/arabicr/2046013.html#popupInfo
Posted by: www | Jul 23 2012 5:25 utc | 295
@291
claudio, even 3w's letting it go - but not you, eh?
Why waste yer time attacking me, when there's so much syria info you could concentrate on? ;-)
Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 23 2012 8:22 utc | 296
The comments to this entry are closed.
Didn't Amadinejad recently announce that he would not be running for another term of office? And isn't speculation about how the Iranian leader's alleged Jewish roots might have, or might not have, influenced his policies, just pointless guesswork and gossip.
There is no "astonishing secret" because this old chestnut is worn out, and it's a story that clearly has whiskers on it by now.
Posted by: Copeland | Jul 21 2012 16:25 utc | 201