The problem of Bashshar is that he is a softy – a nice ophthalmologist who spent most of his career in London, until his brother Basil, the prepared successor, was killed in a 200 mph accident of his sports car on the road to the Damascus airport. (Basil should have had more sense; that road always has slow-moving traffic, and like any road in Syria, unexpected movements. But no doubt testosterone was too strong).
Once in power, Bashshar has always tried to re-conciliate people. The example of his statement in the Turkish interview that Syria didn’t intend to knock down a Turkish aircraft is typical. But the background in the family, and other Ba’athists, remains hard. Since his appointment ten or more years ago, there have been attempts at reform, and all have foundered.
Bashshar is stuck with a hard line he doesn’t necessarily support. I don’t mean to support him; he has accepted a lot of evil he should have resisted. Isn’t that typical of weak people (of which I am one, by the way, so I know what I am talking about)?
I should think in the end he will fail. He doesn’t have the strength to impose his point of view on the family.

Posted by: alexno | Jul 4 2012 19:04 utc | 4

A collection of videos from that beautiful democratic Syrian opposition: Shocking Videos Reveal Truth Behind Syrian “Freedom Fighters”

Posted by: b | Jul 4 2012 19:20 utc | 6

Re Erdogan. He seems to me pretty trigger-happy, and has been held back in the past by his colleagues and by the vote of the Turkish parliament. Turkish opinion is strongly against intervention, and I should think that will win.
There is still a party, among the elite of Taksim and the military, for integration into Europe, and NATO. But it is not a majority.
On other Turkish matters, the danger that was suggested, tha

Posted by: alexno | Jul 4 2012 20:04 utc | 8

On other Turkish matters, the danger that was suggested, that the Syrians of Antakya (robbed from from Syria in 1939) might rise against Turkey in favour of their Syrian relatives, seems to have disappeared.
The Antakyan waiter in my local Turkish restaurant assures me that his relatives prefer life in Turkey. And that seems confirmed elsewhere.

Posted by: alexno | Jul 4 2012 20:11 utc | 10

‘In the second part he accuses Erdogan of having a “sectarian mentality” and of being merely a stooge for the United States-Israel-Gulf axis:’
which is exactly the way it is..Once more the truth lies with president Assad and the lies lie with Erdogan…wanna be pasha odf a new ottoman empire!

Posted by: brian | Jul 4 2012 21:47 utc | 12

I have no problem with people who aren’t Turkish or Syrian reporting on events in Syria & Turkey even opinionating on which story is most likely to resemble reality.
But I believe outsiders should not be expressing opinions on what “They reckon should happen” in Syria or Turkey.
Not only is it no one’s business other than a Syrian who lives in Syria, what the political structure of Syria is/isn’t/should be, outsiders who advocate one particular ‘solution’ for Syria over another are a short step away from providing some sort of support from the outside for that viewpoint. That is imperialism in its most basic form.
If I don’t wanna hear what Syrians reckon should happen in my country why should Syrians hafta put up with what a bunch of non-Syrians post to MoA about what Syria ‘needs to do’?

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 5 2012 0:52 utc | 14

@Debs is dead
Correct, but I do not think this is big issue, people may and should be entitled on own opinion.
What is the issue that folks from the West doesn’t see themselves as the oppressors, the occupations, the tortures, the plunderers, the killers; they see themselves as saviors of the world and in supremacy of political practice called “democracy”, not to mention others buzz words from arsenal which only purpose is to cause cognitive dissonance.
Whenever this kind of things I pull out of memory dialog at 2:55 from the movie Missing of Costa Gavras.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9_8BAi-N10

Posted by: neretva’43 | Jul 5 2012 1:23 utc | 16

“We Syrians…”
Whenever someone writing in this way, in the name of the people, I know he/she is manipulating. We are dealing with demagogue. Out of estimated 18.000 Nato’s mercenaries which causing carnage and mayhem in Syria 10.000 of them are not Syrians.
Of what “We Syrians…” are you talking about? Waiting another La Mission Civilisatrice?

Posted by: neretva’43 | Jul 5 2012 1:51 utc | 18

>>> Russia is standing up to its values and is fully protecting the Dictator by supplying him with weapons and financial resources. Russia supports dictators and at least Putin is honest about it. The US is also standing up to its values by talking the talk of democracy and walking the walk of hypocrite, populist election politics. Obama lies when he declares Assad must go a year ago and he keeps on lying.>>>
Freedom, you sound disappointed with the US that hasn’t come through and turned Syria into another Iraq. Russia is legitimately supplying arms to the legitimate government of Syria; the US and the Gulf states are illegitimately supplying arms to the terrorists to kill other Syrians. Big difference. Why did most Syrians vote for Assad if they didn’t want him?

Posted by: www | Jul 5 2012 3:24 utc | 20

Freedom @15
Who’re you kidding here? From your posing, I can tell you’re not even Syrian so stop fooling yourself – you’re not convincing anyone here with your sob/victim stories.
I hope you’ll be writing the same about the “peaceful protesters” who’ve been killing anybody and everyone that doesn’t agree with them..Go to Utube and see for yourself, they’ve stupidly posted hundreds, if not thousands of videos of themselves commenting murders. It’s all been documented and with time, justice will be served to each and every one of them.
From the very beginning of the chaos in Syria, these same “peaceful protesters” where killing real protesters on the streets in order to incite the people against the government. So if they can do that to real protesters, why can’t they do it to mourners? Feeling sad your terrorist friends have been routed out of Doumma?

Posted by: Ali | Jul 5 2012 5:23 utc | 22

>>> @Debs, wonderful paragraph:
If I don’t wanna hear what Syrians reckon should happen in my country why should Syrians hafta put up with what a bunch of non-Syrians post to MoA about what Syria ‘needs to do’?
Posted by: citizen x | Jul 4, 2012 9:41:09 PM | 17>>>
Not that wonderful, Citizen X, it’s the Syrians posting here that are inviting the comments of others. Speaking for myself,I have an opinion of what the Syrians should do, but it doesn’t involve in any way having NATO or the GCC meddling in changing anything in the country since this should be done by Syrians. It’s amazing that not many here are aware of how the Syrian regime had been carrying on for the past 40 years or why the problems started almost 2 years ago. Of course, it’s a fact that outsiders influenced much of the rebellion’s momentum with arms and money, but to deny that there was a problem with the regime to begin with is to stick one’s head in the sand. Debs and mostly everyone here don’t want to see anything negative being written about the regime because they think that NATO and the Gulf Arabs are all assholes and the guys of the Syrian regime are all Mother Teresa types.

Posted by: www | Jul 5 2012 6:45 utc | 24

Turkey supports terrorists killing Syrians: President Assad
July 4, 2012
“Turkey has supplied all logistic support to the terrorists who have killed our people.” Syrian President Bashar al-Assad
Syrian President Bashar al-Assad says Turkey supports terrorists who commit atrocities against the people in Syria, urging Ankara to stop meddling in his country’s internal affairs.
“Turkey has supplied all logistic support to the terrorists who have killed our people,” Assad said in an interview with the Turkish Cumhuriyet daily published on Wednesday. The first part of the interview was published Tuesday.
“Turkey’s desire to interfere in Syria’s internal affairs has put it in a position which unfortunately makes it a party to all the bloody activities” in Syria, he added.
Assad also accused Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan of being motivated by “sectarian instincts.” He said while Ankara is trying to persuade Damascus to introduce political reforms, it ignores the killings and democratic shortfalls in other Arab states.
In the first part of the interview, Assad had expressed regret that his country’s defense forces shot down a Turkish F-4 Phantom on June 22, but insisted that the plane was downed for violating Syria’s airspace.
“I would have wished 100 percent that we had not attacked it,” Assad said.
He said the plane was flying at low altitude and in an air corridor used in the past by the Israeli planes to attack Syria. Ankara, however, claims that the jet was downed in international airspace.
On June 26, Erdogan said in an address to the parliament that Ankara would retaliate “with determination” and take the “necessary steps by determining the time, place and method by itself.”
The Turkish Hurriyet Daily reported on the same day that Turkey had deployed a “large number of military vehicles to the Syrian border,” including “15 armored tanks, in addition to long-distance guns and other military vehicles.”
President Assad said on June 26 that Syria was in a “real situation of war.”
“When one is in a state of war, all our policies and capabilities must be used to secure victory,” Assad stated.
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2012/07/04/249278/turkey-helping-syria-terrorists-assad/

Posted by: brian | Jul 5 2012 8:15 utc | 26

>>> Assad also accused Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan of being motivated by “sectarian instincts.” >>>
Those instincts sometime backfire, Brian. After the fall of Mubarak Erdogan made a cameo appearance at Tahrir Square to tell the Brothers there that the Turkish Brothers were ready to show them the ropes. They told him that they didn’t want his help and he ended up with egg all over his face.

Posted by: www | Jul 5 2012 10:13 utc | 28

There will be some interesting stories in these just released files …

Thursday 5 July 2012, WikiLeaks began publishing the Syria Files – more than two million emails from Syrian political figures, ministries and associated companies, dating from August 2006 to March 2012. This extraordinary data set derives from 680 Syria-related entities or domain names, including those of the Ministries of Presidential Affairs, Foreign Affairs, Finance, Information, Transport and Culture. At this time Syria is undergoing a violent internal conflict that has killed between 6,000 and 15,000 people in the last 18 months. The Syria Files shine a light on the inner workings of the Syrian government and economy, but they also reveal how the West and Western companies say one thing and do another.

The Syria Files

Posted by: b | Jul 5 2012 10:38 utc | 30

great, b. this will blow up in the face of everybody :-))

Posted by: somebody | Jul 5 2012 11:12 utc | 32

this is rather bizarrely vicious!
‘While I was waiting the “big boss” I heard one of the kids – the older one – telling the other how he and large group of his “brothers” – as he called them – attacked an army checkpoint the night earlier and killed bunch of them.
He was telling details that scared me personally, including burning one soldier alive when they captured him. The other 12 years old was smiling and chanting Allah Akbar (God is Great) saying those Alawites deserve this.
I interrupted the conversation saying in a very smooth tone, but they are not all Alawites, some of them are Sunni, and some others are Christians and Druze, I personally have been stopped by couple of checkpoints from Eastern Syria (Dier Elzor) as appeared from their language, the older kid looked at me saying:
“why would they fight with the Army, they deserve to be slaughtered with a sword, Alawites are all godless and infidel, and those who support them are all the same.”
When we overthrow Assad – the 16 years continues – we will force Sharia rules on those who aren’t “Muslims” including killing their men and enslaving their women, we will also punish those Muslims who didn’t stand by us particularly Damascus residents who kept letting us down repeatedly.’
http://syriapolitics.blogspot.com.au/2012/07/part-ii-hell-on-earth-how-christians.html

Posted by: brian | Jul 5 2012 11:53 utc | 34

Kids can be brutal. Moral is most often learned values.

Posted by: Alexander | Jul 5 2012 14:07 utc | 36

yes, he makes a few valid points, in the meantime the Turkish pilots were found within 9 miles distance to Syria, Turkish vans were attacked in Syria and the drivers escaped with the help of the Free Syrian army and German Bundeswehr supports Saudi Arabi
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/leopard-2-bundeswehr-unterstuetzt-training-in-saudi-arabien-a-842819.html
sorry – no translation in Spiegel international

Posted by: somebody | Jul 5 2012 15:36 utc | 38

Re the Syria Files:
“There will be some interesting ‘stories'”
The operative word is “stories.” It’s going to be complete bullshit. Yet another opportunity for the CIA and pals to paint a picture of Syria.
Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit.
It’s too convenient. How many doucement dumps by the CIA are people going to fall for?
Let me guess . . . the emails will confirm that the “rebels” are crazy terrorists but the “regime” will also admit to crimes, etc.
Bullshit. Bullshit. Bullshit.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 15:55 utc | 40

Doesn’t surprise me that www is already running interference for the CIA. I suspected this was his game from the very beginning.
CIA document dumps will get some heads out of the sand?????
You need to get your head out of the sand if you believe this Wikileaks bullshit that is conveniently going to lay all the “regime’s DAMN EMAILS (!!!@!) on us.
Bullshit. If Syria and Russia claimed to have 6 years of emails from Obama and his cabinet members where they revealed the biggest state secrets would you unquestionably believe it? Bullshit.
It’s ridiculous. It doesn’t surprise me you’re peddling this crap and already vouching for the authenticity of CIA lies. You’re peddling an attack on Syria my friend. You’re no different than Juan Cole or Josh Landis or the many other neoliberal killers. You pretend to see both sides and pretend that you care about Syria but your MAIN GOAL is to support the bullshit western propaganda that the Syrian government should be overthrown.
You’re weeping crocodile tears for Syria as you justify a Western attack.
Emails. Bullshit.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 16:11 utc | 42

“Don’t these guys wear homing beacons? You’re telling me they ejected without being detected by anyone so they are only found weeks later? What are the odds of their helmets and boots being found but not either body?”
I wondering about this from the very beginning. As far as I can tell Nautilus is anchored and isn’t in Syria’s territorial waters.
http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/default.aspx?oldmmsi=376404000&zoom=10&olddate=lastknown#
If anything being downed than it was QF-4, drone version of F-4.
http://www.fencecheck.com/content/index.php?title=The_Final_Mission:_The_USAF%92s_QF-4_Target_Drones

Posted by: neretva’43 | Jul 5 2012 16:15 utc | 44

Oh, now www wants to wait and see what these emails say before we jump to conclusions . . . that’s cute.
Because he confidently predicted those of us that don’t believe the tales of massive crimes by the Syrian government aren’t going to be able to put our heads in the sand any longer.
Seems like you’re pretty sure of what these emails will say. As you should be, because they are LIES designed to assist in the attack on Syria.
And attack you are running interference for.
You are not open minded. You are peddling a war. Just like scumbags like Juan Williams and William Hague who I am seeing on twitter right now.
Disgusting.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 16:46 utc | 46

Greek SA-8 AntiAir System locks a Turkish F-4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ld30zCL6ovk&feature=youtu.be
While this is everyday occurrence in Aegean Sea, and Greeks are apparently having fun, not sure about Turk’s pilot.

Posted by: neretva’43 | Jul 5 2012 16:55 utc | 48

somehow slothrop, I get the feeling the “armed opposition” is loosing area after area they held, and the high ranking defector was not yet spotted in Turkey …
I think, as Assange said, the E-Mails will be slightly embarrassing for the Syrian Regime, but also embarrassing for everybody who has been dealing with it, and the actions that were different from the rethoric. I can imagine it to be highly embarrassing for Turkey.
Corruption usually does not leave a clear paper trail …

Posted by: somebody | Jul 5 2012 18:42 utc | 50

I think they got hacked :-))
from google, caption under the SERP-Link
Al Akhbar English
A farewell to Al Akhbar and Assad’s apologists | Jun 20 2012. Max …

Posted by: somebody | Jul 5 2012 19:23 utc | 52

The Ba’ath Party has been in power and without a ‘legitimate’ opposition for decades; of course the usual corrupt creeps are gonna be riddled through the administration like worms are through a dingbat’s brains

Sounds like the bankers in the City of London, corrupt I mean or the Semate and Congress!!

Posted by: hans | Jul 5 2012 19:55 utc | 54

Excellent post, Debs. I think you’ve got the right take on it. For sure, the propaganda engine is being revved-up until all the bolts and fittings shimmy. The bribes and other enticements are at their thickest; and as each favor, chit, and marker is being called in, the whole panoply of electronic tricks and spoofs are also called into action. All the sets and mockups are being adjusted.
The empire is desperate now and believes it must have the Iranian resources, if only to deny them to its rivals. The sociopathic players have the dice cupped in their hands, but have only a few more throws remaining.

Posted by: Copeland | Jul 5 2012 20:20 utc | 56

Has ABC removed the interview Mother Agnes?
Susan Dirgham ‏@SusanDirgham
@occupySYDNEY Download of P.Adams interview with Mother Agnes Mariam on ABC LNL interfered with. By whom? Any theories? http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/latenightlive/mother-agnes-mariam/4105266
Syd Walker ‏@SydWalker
@SusanDirgham Susan, I don;t understand what happened with the Phillip Adams tape. Did he ever interview Mother Agnes Mariam?
It should be here:
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/latenightlive/mother-agnes-mariam/4105266
Some comments:
susan Dirgham :
02 Jul 2012 11:26:34pm
Dear Phillip and team,
It is wonderful to hear the voice of Mother Mariam. We hear so few voices from Syria except for those of the ‘opposition’ or ‘activists’ who want to overthrow the government no matter what the cost in human life and to the society and country.
There have been other Christian voices coming from Syria. For example, an interview with Reverend Adib Awad confirms what Mother Mariam said about the Christian tradition of protesting injustice etc in Syria. Link to interview:
http://vimeo.com/43187181
Another voice of reason (I believe) is that of the Archbishop of Aleppo. http://www.france24.com/en/20120113-interview-jean-clement-jeanbart-archbishop-aleppo-syria-bashar-al-assad-christian-community
I have interviewed some Christian Syrians and Lebanese as well as an Iraqi Christian about the crisis in Syria, and their message is very similar to that of Mother Mariam’s.
http://socratesandsyria.com/australian-voices-on-syria/
http://pool.abc.net.au/media/iraq-and-syria-through-refugees-eyes
The message Mother Mariam was presenting at the end of your interview was an important one, one which I can concur with. The hope for people’s of the three Abrahamic faiths being able to live in harmony lies in the Middle East.
Many of the tens of thousands of Christians forced from their homes in Homs by Islamist militias will want to seek asylum overseas. It will be a tragedy for the world if Syria loses its wonderful mosaic of cultures and religions – that is the real treasure it offers the world.
Kind regards,
Susan Dirgham
http://socratesandsyria.com
=============
Alan Lonergan :
04 Jul 2012 8:55:11am
This interview is surly one of those rare events when people get a glimpse inside the daily life of a Syrian and likewise the life of an amazingly interesting woman. I have been troubled by the black and white portrayal of the Syrian conflict as a struggle between the good and the bad. Mindful of what is happening to Syrian Christians at the hands of rebel fighters I am thankful to you that you opened a window onto a different view of Syria.
Ever since the killing on January 25th last of Fr. Basil Nassar I have been concerned at the way in which the crises in Syria has been reported. Fr. Basil was gunned down in the street while helping a dying parishioner. CNN said he was the victim of the Government’s armed forces but his own Church confirmed that he died at the hands of armed terrorists. Following on from this I encountered the tragic story (as so many stories are on all sides) of the young Christian boy Sari Saoud, filmed by the “Free” Syrian Army as he lay dying in his mother’s arms and while she pleaded for help to get him to a hospital they were busy uploading the video to the Al Jazeera and Al Arabia networks who instantly broadcast the even as showing another child victim of the regime. In interviews after the event the mother, aunt and uncle of the boy categorically state the child was killed by a rebel sniper and that if the army had been present her child would still be alive. I have long wondered since how many more misreported deaths have occurred. Video of Sari’s story as told by his mother is here with subtitles http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIuWsV79Uok
While the ending of conflict and the saving of all human life is the paramount consideration in the current situation one of the sad tragedies sitting as a footnote to this dreadful conflict and the distorted media representation of events must surely be the wholesale destruction of Syria’s ancient architectural heritage. Among other things the six churches at the heart of Homs old city now lay in partial or total ruin. The old district of the City, Diwan Al Bustan and Hamidieh, where the majority of Christians lived was over ran by rebel fighters many like the Brigade Farouq with affiliations to extremist Islamic ideologies alien to Syria’s Muslim community. From these Christian vantage points and to the total distress of the local inhabitants the armed militants fired on regime positions from which fire was returned and by extension the old city was turned into a battle ground by the rebels against the wishes of those who lived there. Of the six churches lost to the destruction surly the greatest loss is the extensive damage done to the Syriac Orthodox Church of St. Mary – Shrine of the Belt (Um al-Zennar) located in the district of Bustan Diwan. Few people realise that this is or was one of the world’s oldest working place of Christian worship. The crypt / cave beneath the current structure contains a place of Christian worship dating back to 59

Posted by: brian | Jul 5 2012 21:50 utc | 58

Ha. Good effort there Debs is Dead @ 53,
I’m a dingbat for suspecting the CIA is involved in Syrian affairs eh? That must make you an outright genius for making this statement:
“If they stopped and actually considered wikileaks for what it is and always has been; an organisation that publishes whatever it is given as soon as the veracity of a docu-dump has been confirmed, they may just get an insight into the likely scenarios which have led to this publication.
Undoubtedly the leakers of these docs are no friends of the Assad administration . . .”
Ha. Ha. Ha.
In other words, you’re vouching for the credibility of Wikileaks and the leakers before you even see the evidence. You’re even vouching for the Wikileaks process EVEN though they allow gatekeeper MSM orgs to help do their vetting. Yep, good logic there genius. These same western media gatekeepers who have been reporting false stories in Syria should be blindly trusted on vetting documents.
My skepticism is “paranoid ramblings” whereas Debs is Dead is super smart for unquestionably believing the western-created and western sourced stories about Assad the Huge Giant DICKtator.
As far as it being paranoid to suspect the CIA in Syria . . . this actually reflects on your intelligence if you think it’s paranoid to suspect this. Hell, even the MSM who you trust to vet our news about Syria has reported CIA personnell in the rebel camps to keep an eye on things. What, are the MSM that you trust also “paranoid” “dinbats”?
www @ 57,
You are commending this logic as pulling one’s head out of the sand? How does he know the “usual corrupt creeps are gonna be riddled through the administration?” What does this mean? Sounds like basic conventional wisdom that I’m not sure can automatically be applied here and in any case I don’t know if it’s good conventional wisdom and can probably be misleading.
Does this mean that any government that has one dominant party or officially sanctioned party is automatically corrupt? What evidence does he have for this logic? Does it also apply to the U.S. that has only two dominant parties? Or does this only apply to countries (like Mexico for many years) that had one dominant party? Also, what about the changes recently made to the government in Syria? I notice you two “experts” gloss over these changes.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 21:55 utc | 60

Debs,
How’s this for paranoid?
I suspect there are multiple people commenting on this very site working in intelligence. I further suspect there these perps PRETEND to be sympathetic to an attack on Syria in order to establish their bona fides. They shed crocodile tears for Syria as Assad put it the other day.
But they also engage in propaganda to justify an attack on Syria. By pretending to care about an attack on the people of Syria these perps establish their opposition credibility so when they say Assad is guilt of crimes and “deserves” his fate or shouldn’t be supported, or whatever, it diminishes the ability to stop the war. I’m not saying people should defend Assad. I’m not defending Assad! It’s not personal. But he is no more of a dictator than Obama or Cameron. Full stop.
Actually, from the evidence I’ve seen that I can trust (i.e. not the bs lies we’ve been told from the opposition the last year), both Assad and Qaddafi are BETTER than Obama or Bush. Both of them are less tyrannical than Obama or Bush.
I’ve long thought Wikileaks to be disinformation. Simply look at who it’s benefited. Any “dingbat” intelligence analyst is going to look at who these things benefit. It’s not crazy to look at it this way.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 22:07 utc | 62

Straight Talking: The Syrian Cauldron
By Jeremy Salt
Ankara – Tension between Turkey and Syria along their border is edging closer to flashpoint. Last week a Turkish air force jet was shot down after violating Syrian air space. The Syrian government said the plane was hit while inside Syrian air space. Turkey says it had already left Syrian air space and was hit in international air space.
…
– Jeremy Salt is an associate professor of Middle Eastern history and politics at Bilkent University in Ankara, Turkey
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article31766.htm

Posted by: brian | Jul 5 2012 22:18 utc | 64

And I don’t mean to endorse the article . . . that too could likely be more propaganda along these same lines . . . I’ve already suspected that FARS and SANA have been hijacked recently and there is no news source I trust anymore.
Just mostly like the “Third Wayer” term.

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5 2012 22:33 utc | 66

Posted by: Walter Wit Man | Jul 5, 2012 6:22:35 PM | 65
millions also rally for Assad:
Umayyad square – Damscus : Massive Gathering in support of …
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOHIMt6yG-M
Pro Assad rallies in different faculties of Aleppo University 19-05-2012
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSjGLhTyF9o

Posted by: brian | Jul 5 2012 23:27 utc | 68

I’m totally astounded by the amount of suppossedly intellignet people that STILL have not figured out what Assange and Wikileaks are.
The idea that they are ‘good guys’ just passing on what has been given to them is “Seriously Fucking Retarded”™
Anyone still pimping for Assange and Wikileaks really has lost ALL credivbility IMHO – listening to such people make pronouncements about what is happening in Syria, or indeed anywhere but the inside of their own heads, gives me the heeby-jeebies.
How can people so utterly, stupidly, gullible think for one second that they might have anything worth saying that could possibly be of ANY value to anyone else, when they can’t even recognise a classic, almost textbook, example of a disinformation conduit?
Do you lot even know anything about how a Disinformation conduit might operate?

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 2:08 utc | 70

I don’t understand people who have a need to divide events and their perpetrators into ‘black’ and ‘white’. I have been a longtime opponent of amerika, england, france, israel or any other whitefella mob who thinks there is an earner in meddling in ME affairs.
I absolutely oppose the meddling in the Arab nations that every allegedly ‘democratic’ nation has supported since at least the 10th century AD and considerably longer if one considers the roman empire and its morphing into the “holy Roman Empire’.
But my opposition to imperialism doesn’t come with an automatic ‘big tick’ for the existing political structures in place in those nations.
Unlike the drop kicks who have commented just above me, I am capable of recognising that virtually all centralised political structures are corrupt by nature and exist primarily to meet the needs of those who run them rather than those whom they are meant to serve.
I have no liking for the Syrian opposition parties because a/ that haven’t demonstrated any more concern for the average Syrian than the incumbent govt and 2/ by accepting help from the same whitefella regimes that have had their feet on the throat of ME countries for centuries they have sold out Syrians to get power, a sure indication they are corrupt and self serving.
I realise that the world would be a lot simpler, maybe even simple enough for some of the brains on display here, if everything fell into one of two categories; good or bad, but binary situations such as that are rare in nature and virtually non-existent in human endeavour.
The situation that most peeps confront when assessing a political situation is bad, worse, and much worse . That is a simple fact of life.
I made those comments about the Syrian government precisely because that unless defenders of the Assad administration are mature enough to recognise this, and recognise that there is going to be stuff made public over the next while that will embarrass senior figures in the Assad government that will in all likelihood be correct, they are gonna do more harm than good if they wheel out the usual paranoid conspiracy fantasies in a piss weak attempt to wash the issues raised away.
You see even the most sheep-like follower of TV News recognises deep down that those who want to lead other humans aren’t who they claim to be. The reasons those types continue to support the insupportable are complex and worthy of debate another time, but the point I want to make is that if those who claim to want to help Syria resist invasion and interference, simply play a denial game when discussing the info which is released by WL, they will find out their entire argument has been destroyed when hard evidence supporting some of the claims surfaces.
Some of the stuff coming out will likely implicate opposition figures particularly those that jumped ship when they thought fukusi was gonna invade and chuck Assad & co out. What will the paranoid deniers say then? That this information shouldn’t be trusted either? Or will they destroy their already tattered credibility by claiming the usual good vs evil position of everything that is derogatory for Assad figures is lies but the stuff which exposes the opposition leaders is true?
As for the tin foil hat wearers still claiming that Assange was a cia plant right from the time he encrypted the info used by ‘the agency’ to co-ordinate the destruction of the twin towers or building n or however that wet dream goes, I always wonder how such people wipe the shit off themselves in the mornings. It looks like toilet tissue, smells like toilet tissue so, using the logic they apply to everything else, that must mean that it cannot be toilet tissue, it must in fact be secretly coated asshole dissolver.
“How come wikileaks didn’t have more about israel?” is the usual cry from those logic perverting types demanding the rest of us prove a negative.
Well it seems to me that the sort of low but secret classification which the WL cables were (remember they were available to a couple hundred thousand amerikan imperialists) would be a level lower than virtually any communication bwtween amerika’s jerusalem embassy and the zionist pricks who wanna slaughter palestinians. All of that stuff would be sensitive and handled by types much further up the food chain than the 200,000 shitkickers responsible for developing strategies for oppressing unwhites outside israel.
I’ve posted it before so I’ll post it again – the addle-brained paranoiacs who claim everything is a CIA conspiracy are worse amerikan exceptionalists than any thuggish no-neck amerikan rapist and murderer of arabs. These are the people who claim the cia must have been behind 911 “because ‘those people in caves’ could never have done that”.
One of the greatest victories of the left last century, the liquidation of the man who engineered the slaughter of millions, amerikan prez kennedy, was never seen as the victory for humanist endeavour it was, because so many of these lefty ‘the CIA is everywhere’ types, fell for the ultimate cia disinformation campaign.
That was that Kennedy was killed by some sort of rightist conspiracy. Yeah right. Of course he was. Even though that creep was worse than oblamblam for doing everything the elites wanted.
The last thing amerika’s ruling class wanted was for Kennedy’s death to be seen as the work of ‘the commies’. That would have exposed the cia to even more ridicule since they had tried to kill Fidel hundreds of times and failed, yet Castro’s boy Oswald popped kennedy’s brains across the trunk of his convertible first time.
Even worse for the elites exposing Oswald as a dedicated lefty and competent single assassin would have roused the population and moved the situation from the ‘cold war’ everyone was making money off of, straight into to a hot war where making an earner gets subsumed by the need to appear loyal to the war effort.
But you mob – you just keep thinking yer simple minded derp garbage, just don’t expect the rest of us to buy into it, cause it just doesn’t fit with any observable reality.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jul 6 2012 3:58 utc | 72

Name ONE truely important thing ever revealed by Wikileaks
Name ONE truely important thing/event that has changed because of a Wikileeaks ‘revelation’

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 4:57 utc | 74

WL could not operate the way it does without the help of the corrupt-to-the-core Western Media – if WL really posed any sort of threat to the Empire then the corrupt-to-the-core Western Media would just simply ignore it – instead Assange partner up with these people and allows THEM to filter the ‘revelations’ without any comment from WL on what the corrupt-to-the-core Western Media did or did not choose to highlight

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 5:05 utc | 76

“Maybe not important to you, Hu Bris, but lot of other feel it was important, I do. and the world and people are a lot more complex than you imagine them to be.”

[This new Religion of Wikileaks Worship] May not be important to you, Hu Bris, but lot of other feel it was important, I do. and the world and people are a lot more [gullible] than [they] imagine them[selves] to be.

There
Fixed it for ya!
Now maybe you’d be so kind as to try and provide some sort of an answer to my earlier questions?

Q 1) Name ONE truely important thing ever revealed by Wikileaks
Q 2) Name ONE truely important thing/event that has changed because of a Wikileeaks ‘revelation’.

ta very much like

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 5:57 utc | 78

so your answers appear to be
1) there are none
and
2) there are none
thanks
you could have said that with far fewer words than you used in your reply above

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 6:42 utc | 80

“And, IMO, Debs is always thinking two steps ahead of you guys “
Well at least you have a sense of humour

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 6:44 utc | 82

Wikileaks is the biggest CIA disinformation ever – half-truths mixed with whole lies intended to convince the weakest of minds. Occasionally, the of state department officials thrown in a few warning lines about “activists” lives being in danger blah blah……as a result of the “leaks” being published to make it sound legit. I mean, since when did the CIA gave sh*t about the lives of “activists”? It’s no like the CIA is a some charity/humanitarian organization that cares about the well-being of people, right? “Activists”, to the CIA, are dumb expendables with the weakest of minds who’re brainwashed into believing their actions actually make a difference…F*ck em and gaaaaaad bless Amerika!!!
I’ll believe Wikileaks when Assange dumps everything he knows about Israel..The sh*tbag never criticizes Israel yet all his actions seems to be geared towards throwing all of US/Israel’s enemies into a state of confusion causing them to fight among themselves. Classic case of disinformation.
Now back to Syria. Another Top general “defected”(aka, run for cover [escaped])..After a bit of research, it turned out this very general had been a member of the fsa all along and sensing his cover was blown, escaped to their favorite destination – A TURKISH REFUGEE CAMP FOR DEFECTING GENERALS(dig that?). Kinda confirms my suspicion all along.Many more will follow as their cover gets blown day by day.
It appears the military drenched regime change plans will have to be binned until another opportunity arises, after the Turkish jet fiasco. What the West are now focused on is the diplomatic front. This involves rallying some dumb countries, who’ve suddenly become “friends of Syrians” into a united front and……take it from there.
But the Russians and Chinese, after having their words twisted many times by the Billary and her tag-alongs in the EU after other previous meetings, are having none of it. They’ve decided to boycott the next “friends of Syria” in Paris, much to the dismay of Merkel(the empire’s facilitator). One thing for sure, if the Russians and Chinese have decided not to play ball again on the diplomatic front, the line’s been drawn.
It’s quite sad seeing how the West is trying frantically to unite the so-called Syrian opposition, who’ve lived outside Syria most of their lives, with very little success. Every time they meet, they come out more dis-united than before(the latest being their Cairo meeting).If I were an investor, I’ll pull out my assets asap. An incompetent bunch of free-loaders if ya ask me.
The whole regime change plan on Syria has nothing to do with democracy and human right..The West are perfectly happy doing business with democratic powerhouses like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE, Turkey etc..It’s just that Assad isn’t one of their bastards. The keywords here are GAS and OIL PIPELINES. Not too long ago, Syria, Iraq and Iran signed a deal to build a pipeline across to a port in Syria where OIL and GAS will flow to Europe. Alarm bells rang across Turkey,US and the reactionary Persian gulf monarchs who see this as a threat to their key investments in the region. So Assad had to go – at all cost. And here we are today. I bet if Assad agrees to give them a piece of the cake, all these “activists” pumping propaganda from Syria will immediately be labelled “terrorist”, droned out or put of US no-fly-lists.
There’s more to say but will leave it here for others to take over..Peace to all!!!

Posted by: Zico | Jul 6 2012 7:14 utc | 84

The cutting remark comes later.
Here’s a counterpoint, using WL:
Was the U.S. behind the Paraguayan coup?

Posted by: Biklett | Jul 6 2012 7:34 utc | 86

Now If you could name a SA Coup that the US was NOT behind, THAT might be newsworthy 😉

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 7:57 utc | 88

You True Believers know absolutely NOTHING, (Zero, Nada, Ziltch) about the source(s) suppossedly supplying wikileaks with these cables etc.
Yet because it comes through the Sacred Wikileaks you all accord it some sort of “immediately elevated above bullshit” status.
If the exact same info were fed to you through another source, printed in the National Enquirer for instance, you’d probably (rightly) not touch it with a 10-foot barge pole
Actually I’d bet the National Enquirer has a higher Signal-to-Bullshit ratio than the Church of the Sacred Wiki

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 8:13 utc | 90

According to the FSA terrorists the circled kid is a shabeeh and one of Assad’s informants and deserves to be punished http://pic.twitter.com/rvnvgPJT
#FSA militia captured citizens of Saqleen in Idleb because they’re pro #Syria & anti revolution, how democratic of them http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeIGLHT3VK8

Posted by: brian | Jul 6 2012 9:08 utc | 92

@ Biklett
I presume your latest communique was not the Joke which you promised us all earlier, right?
cos I’d hate to miss that! 😉

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 9:43 utc | 94

hu bris
*Actually I’d bet the National Enquirer has a higher Signal-to-Bullshit ratio than the Church of the Sacred Wiki*
some wit says that a good psyop is 99% sugar, its the 1% poison that’s lethal
by this standard, wiki outght to be the most transparent psyop ever, its signal to bs [lol] ratio is at best a dismay 99% poison
so far its *street cred* all comes from dog n ponny shows like the aborted prosecution for alleged sex scandal, the current staged drama of attempted extradiction.
all this while he is living it up and going around the chat show circuits

Posted by: denk | Jul 6 2012 9:45 utc | 96

anybody who’s been paying attention knows that fukusi has been busy taking out china’s energy sources all over the world,
for example, the *messiah* himself had a hand in the coup in kenya, to thwart china’s biz opportunity
http://tinyurl.com/76jgqyj
but u wouldnt know these from wiki,
nothing about the fukus skullduggery in kenya, sudan, yemen, congo etc
nothing about africom’s fake wot to recolonise the *dark continent*
zero, nein, nada, zilch,
see, according to wiki
*forget the west, china is the new evil colonial overlord in africa *!!
http://tinyurl.com/7jbfj3k
if i m uncle scam
i surely wouldnt mind having such a *whistleblower* by my side

Posted by: denk | Jul 6 2012 10:28 utc | 98

@ denk
That last one deserves highlighting – it’s almost as if these cables (provided they are even genuine in the first place) are being written with one eye firmly on how they will play to the gallery when Wikileaks finally gets around to ‘revealing’ them, ain’t it?
http://www.japantimes.co.jp/text/eo20101219a2.html (same as denks 2nd link – http://tinyurl.com/7jbfj3k)

“China found itself in the unwelcome WikiLeaks spotlight the week before last with sweeping claims against its “aggressive” policies in giving aid to Africa. Johnnie Carson, the U.S. assistant secretary of state for Africa, called China “a pernicious economic competitor with no morals” about propping up rogue regimes.
“China is not in Africa for altruistic reasons,” he said. “China is in Africa primarily for China. A secondary reason for China’s presence is to secure votes in the United Nations from African countries,” he claimed.”

gosh – imagine that, eh?
one can imagine the cries around the White House conference tables: – “those dirty bastards!! That’s OUR Job!!”
Talk about “Ham-acting”, eh?

Posted by: Hu Bris | Jul 6 2012 11:22 utc | 100