News & views …
Back to Main
January 20, 2012
Open Thread 2012/02
Comments
“The problem of democracy today” by Cornelius Castoriadis, speech held in Athens in 1989, unfortunately many typo’s.
http://www.athene.antenna.nl/ARCHIEF/NR01-Athene/02-Probl.-e.html
Posted by: absinthe | Jan 20 2012 22:25 utc | 2
I’m contemplating alternative reconstructions of what happened on the Costa Concordia; I simply don’t believe an experienced captain panicked just after having executed a brilliant re-entry manoeuvre and the worst was over, and even less that he could flee without anyone noticing, when just everybody must have been searching for him;
the lines along which I’m thinking are:
1) the captain had other reasons to get so close to the island and then reach it by boat; cocaine distribution to central Italy, maybe, in the hypothesis that neapolitan camorra could well use tourist cruisers to transport drugs around the Mediterranean – the same ship had coasted near the Giglio Island 52 (!) times before
2) the captain misjudged and thought the ship would stay afloat, and that he would be back in time without an emergency being called
3) when the emergency was called, triggered by calls from the passengers to the carabinieri and then to the Coast Guard, the captain was caught unprepared, and understandably preferred to pass for a coward rather than let the truth transpire
This would explain the incredible silence of the rest of the crew; if the captain is absent, there’s a second-in-command that must take over; instead, everybody waited for … what? for the captain’s return, I presume; there’s considerable “omertà” up to now among the crew, and I feel they aren’t being asked very hard what happened; they are probably waiting for a credible narrative to be elaborated to which then ask everybody to subscribe, covering up the real nature of the captain’s little voyage
There are many other strange details that would be explained by such a scenario. What one needs to find is exactly when/where could the captain have “fled” from the ship, look up where/when he was seen on the island, etc
Maybe he was away from before the impact on the rock, and that why he misjudged the damage (assessment done through phone calls), and maybe even why the incident happened in the first place (inexperienced substitute at the helm?)
Somebody here at MoA might help me verify this scenario? Navigation isn’t my forte (all these italianisms fit well with the story, don’t they?)
maybe b’s link at the end of “British humor” thread could be a starting point
Posted by: claudio | Jan 20 2012 22:49 utc | 3
Thanks for the link @1. I will treasure it. John Maclean was right about two things: Socialism and national independence. There was nothing narrow or bigoted about Maclean’s or Connolly’s Republicanism/Nationalism. Or Ho Chi Minh’s.
Posted by: bevin | Jan 20 2012 23:21 utc | 4
Well today was a crappy day for me since the Sky platform in the UK and Ireland has just taken Press TV, my most watched news channel, off the air. Of course all the MSM reports do not talk about how the US Embassy in London complained about Press TV to the British Government as revealed in the Wikileaks cables.
– Here is a 5 minute Channel 4 report on the news: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0jBNHA2jzA
Also the site Megaupload, which I regularly used, was seized by the US Department of Justice. So all in all a double whammy on the censorship front today… think someone is trying to tell me something about my use of subversive media.
– Good summary on Megaupload over at the piracy news site Torrentfreak: http://torrentfreak.com/megaupload-what-made-it-a-rogue-site-worthy-of-destruction-120120/
– Also Cyptome speculates on whether the Megaupload seizure was made possible by the NATO’s “big brother” the monitoring system Echelon.
http://cryptome.org/2012/01/0049.htm
Posted by: Colm O’ Toole | Jan 21 2012 0:21 utc | 5
could/should the German embassy do something for its citizen Kim Schmitz?
Posted by: claudio | Jan 21 2012 1:39 utc | 7
@ Colm O’ Toole (post #5)
This is posted on PressTv Website – maybe will help.
How to watch Press TV in UK
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/222136.html
Posted by: Rick Happ | Jan 21 2012 1:40 utc | 8
How the hell can you guys have an open thread if Morroco Bama ain’t around to tell you all what not to discuss?
Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | Jan 21 2012 2:33 utc | 9
Geez, Claudio. Maybe the ‘ol salt just blew it. People DO make mistakes sans nefarious motives, you know. I understand this kinda incident ain’t all that rare, that cruise ship captains are known to grandstand on occassion. And it seems this is the second time this ship has come in that close, having had done so last year as well. Perhaps the past incident was a hair’s width from catastrophe, without it being realized. So this guy figured he got away with it once without mishap, so it was safe to give it another shot. Who knows, maybe a deviation of inches from last year’s course made the difference.
The fact that the cruise line was aware of a prior incident alleviates some of the blame I’m willing to assign to this ship’s captain. They should have laid down the law, and insisted all their captains adhere to courses laid down on the charts, without deviation. But they too probably figured “no harm, no foul” on the first incident.
Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | Jan 21 2012 2:52 utc | 10
Viva La Quinta Brigada
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IyvshOYelU&feature=related
Posted by: bevin | Jan 21 2012 2:58 utc | 11
How long do you think it would take for the secret service to knock on my door if I suggested assassinating Barack Obama?
Well, get a load of this….
http://mondoweiss.net/2012/01/publisher-of-the-atlanta-jewish-times-suggests-mossad-should-assassinate-obama.html
Andrew Adler, the owner and publisher of the Atlanta Jewish Times, a weekly newspaper serving Atlanta’s Jewish community, devoted his January 13, 2011 column to the thorny problem of the U.S. and Israel’s diverging views on the threat posed by Iran. Basically Israel has three options, he wrote: Strike Hezbollah and Hamas, strike Iran, or “order a hit” on Barack Obama. Either way, problem solved!
Here’s how Adler laid out “option three” in his list of scenarios facing Israeli president Benjamin Netanyahu (the column, which was forwarded to us by a tipster, isn’t online, but you can read a copy here):
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/284979-ajt.html
“Three, give the go-ahead for U.S.-based Mossad agents to take out a president deemed unfriendly to Israel in order for the current vice president to take his place, and forcefully dictate that the United States’ policy includes its helping the Jewish state obliterate its enemies.”
“Yes, you read “three” correctly. Order a hit on a president in order to preserve Israel’s existence. Think about it. If I have thought of this Tom Clancy-type scenario, don’t you think that this almost unfathomable idea has been discussed in Israel’s most inner circles?”
“Another way of putting “three” in perspective goes something like this: How far would you go to save a nation comprised of seven million lives…Jews, Christians and Arabs alike?”
“You have got to believe, like I do, that all options are on the table”
Posted by: PissedOffAmerican | Jan 21 2012 3:14 utc | 12
Re Claudio @ 3.
I like this bit…
Maybe he was away from before the impact on the rock, and that why he misjudged the damage (assessment done through phone calls), and maybe even why the incident happened in the first place (inexperienced substitute at the helm?)
Imo the owners acted with indecent haste when they tossed the captain under the bus so soon after the event. In business/management circles it used to be standard operating procedure to extend the benefit of the doubt to an (apparently) errant employee in a jam. It helps the employee if he turns out to be innocent and, initially at least, it makes the company look competent, confident and strong.
And if the employee turns out to be guilty he can be tossed under the bus then.
The shipping company is now in more trouble than the captain. No matter what crimes he’s committed, they’re the people who hired him. Cutting him loose before a thorough investigation makes it look as though they knew he was a menace but failed to act on what they already knew or suspected.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 21 2012 4:11 utc | 13
Yeah PoA, Zionists love their assassinations. I get the feeling its a sport for them. Will be interesting to see them squeal when operation touche’ commences and the opposing sites agents start taking out prominent Jews all over the globe.
Perhaps Andrew Adler will get to taste his own medicine and make it onto the list, when in the morning rush hour on his way to the office to write up another Israel ueber Alles editorial a motorbike rider attaches a magnetic bomb to his car and speeds off. Later Adler.
Posted by: Juan Moment | Jan 21 2012 10:39 utc | 14
Watched part 1 of whats to be a 4 part documentary on Putin called “Putin Russia and the West” by the BBC. Made by the same people who did “Iran and the West”. Very interesting documentary which speaks to all the major figures involved. The first part deals with Putin gaining the Presidency and how he behind the scenes he took on the Oligarchs to cement power and feel out with the West.
Episode 1 (Taking Control): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJILjbIoc98
Posted by: Colm O’ Toole | Jan 21 2012 14:12 utc | 15
“On Iran, NYT Introduces New False Propaganda Line”
At least you can’t accuse the NYT of misogyny. The writer Isabel Kershner is payed to spin lies about Iran, while Judith Miller was payed to spin lies about the WMDs in Iraq.
Posted by: ben | Jan 21 2012 19:24 utc | 16
r’giap @ 6: wonderful, and highly relevant in today’s world. Thanks for that link.
Posted by: ben | Jan 21 2012 19:34 utc | 17
Libya marks the end of international law
exhibit one)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PPi7OLHl8w
exhibit two)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LP2ZkTAlL7Q&feature=player_embedded
Posted by: somebody | Jan 21 2012 21:08 utc | 18
@POA #10
Maybe the ‘ol salt just blew it
No doubt on that! I simply don’t believe he panicked and fled the ship once the real dangers were over. Nor that he brought the ship so close the coast just to show off. I think he had an appointment with someone on the beach, or later at the harbor. Here in Italy we have been flooded with videos and reportings depicting the passengers’ experience, but very few hard facts regarding the officers’ movements and decisions.
The GIS, the Carabinieri super-trained special force, were sent to recover the captains’ belongings in the shipwreck. Why them?
Posted by: claudio | Jan 21 2012 21:19 utc | 19
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10174834
Good piece on “Capitalism in Crisis”
Posted by: ben | Jan 21 2012 23:07 utc | 20
The US deficit figures are in for December, when the government had receipts of 240 and outlays of 326 billions of dollars, and an average daily deficit of 2.8 billion.
For 2011 the deficit was 1.249580 trillion, or an average daily deficit of 3.423 billion dollars. The US 2011 deficit was slightly less than Canada’s GDP.
Current discussions include budget cuts of $1.2 trillion over ten years, or about ten percent of the above if we consider the economy and the outlays frozen — no better and no worse. Of course that probably won’t happen.
Good piece by Charles Pierce on the South Carolina primary;
link:http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/south-carolina-primary-results-6642563
South Carolinians are more serious about being white. All three groups are heavily influenced by the conservative splinters of evangelical Protestantism, but South Carolinians are more serious about being Christian. All three groups talk loosely about rolling back the New Deal, about minimizing the permanent impact of the Civil Rights Movement, and about loosening the limits of theocracy that were previously a matter of common agreement, but South Carolinians expect the candidates down here to deliver on this stuff. This is the Nullification primary. This is the Massive Resistance primary. This is the primary of old unsettled grudges. This is the primary where nothing and nobody ever is truly disenthralled.
Opinions that are on the fringe everywhere else are in the mainstream here. Issues long since settled are reopened regularly with the prybars of ancient prejudices. (Ron Paul, of all people, comes down here and blames Roe vs. Wade on the 1960’s, and quotes John Adams on why the Beatles sent the country to hell in a bucket. Willard Romney, that old smoothie, yells at a heckler while appearing to be channelling Joe McCarthy.) There is no scar tissue down here, only scabs that open, over and over again.
Posted by: anna missed | Jan 22 2012 3:53 utc | 22
From ’04, but funny as hell.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10177756
Posted by: ben | Jan 22 2012 16:08 utc | 23
953 dead people voted in SC primary:
South Carolina’s Attorney General detects voter fraud during primaries
Posted: Jan 21, 2012 7:26 PM MST Updated: Jan 21, 2012 7:26 PM MST
Already, there has been some question into folks who cast their ballots on Saturday.
South Carolina’s Attorney General, Alan Wilson has notified the U.S. Justice Department of potential voter fraud.
Wilson says an analysis found 953 ballots cast by voters were people who are listed as dead.
He has asked the State Law Enforcement Division to investigate.
Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jan 23 2012 1:12 utc | 24
Reuters: Secret panel can put Americans on “kill list’
There is no public record of the operations or decisions of the panel, which is a subset of the White House’s National Security Council, several current and former officials said. Neither is there any law establishing its existence or setting out the rules by which it is supposed to operate.
America has it’s own star chambers now eh?
Posted by: Uncle $cam | Jan 23 2012 1:58 utc | 25
this is NEWS …
Ron Paul implicated in attempted white separatist invasion of Dominica
http://ww4report.com/node/10745
Posted by: Kim Sky | Jan 23 2012 7:01 utc | 26
the great film maker theo angelopolous has died after an ‘accident’ in piraeus
Posted by: remembereringgiap | Jan 25 2012 1:21 utc | 27
shit. and he was working on a rproject dealing w/ the political class and brecht, from what I read recently.
Posted by: b real | Jan 25 2012 3:16 utc | 28
Medecins sans frontiers suspends work in Misrata due to torture of prisoners.
Who are the torturers and what the aims of their coercion, besides intimidation and suppression? Ransoms? Appropriation of properties? Inducing rivals to flee?
Posted here, as Libya thread has moved far away from Libya.
Posted by: smoke | Jan 26 2012 19:57 utc | 29
Obama has been fine-tuning his conjuring skills.
He distracted the audience at his 2012 State of the Union address by pulling a SEAL hit-squad out of his hat and claiming that they had rescued two hostages in Somalia.
The last time Obama pulled some SEALs out of his hat it was to claim that ObL had been killed and buried at sea. It also took the debate about Obama’s US citizenship off the table.
One wonders if the SEALs who rescued the Somali hostages will survive longer than the SEALs who saved the world by executing ObL without the inconvenience of a trial?
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 27 2012 2:23 utc | 30
@Hoarsewhisper
1. Those SEALs that “parachuted” into Somali actually flew in by Helicopter in a huge operation which had local support.
2. The U.S. would never do such a thing for just NGO people. I would bet 100:1 that those were spies.
Iran to stop oil exports to EU:
You can’t quit, you’re fired!
Posted by: Biklett | Jan 27 2012 19:00 utc | 32
Good catch Biklett. The Iranians show how savvy they are to pre-empt the oil sanctions, and turn the tap off now. This has to seriously fuck with what is probably the Western timetable for attack on Iran.
I was listening to the BBBC (British Balderdash Broadcasting Corporation) doing it’s job last night. They were reporting on the situation is several hot spots in Syria. After listening to several ‘rebel’ perspectives on the casualties caused by attacks on “Syrians” by the Syrian Govt, a few idle thoughts struck me.
“Is the BBBC yanking my chain?”
“Whose side are they on?”
“How come they’re interviewing ‘rebels’ and reporting their perspective, but not Syrian Govt reps and their perspective?”
“How often did the BBBC interview the Vietnamese Resistance and report their casualties and perspectives?”
“How often did the BBBC interview the Iraqi Resistance and report their casualties etc?”
“How often does/did the BBBC interview the Afghan Resistance and report their casualties etc?”
How often did the BBBC interview Gaddafi loyalists and report their views?”
“Are US & NATO’s enemies also the BBBC’s enemies?”
“Or are the BBC’s enemies the truth and its audience?”
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 28 2012 2:21 utc | 34
Biklett @ 32.
Sharing the pain – or spreading it?
(love your headlne, btw)
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 28 2012 2:53 utc | 35
@35,
That was actually a paraphrase of a telegram I got from Chase Manhattan when I quit my job a long time ago. Some things you always remember.
Posted by: Biklett | Jan 28 2012 3:16 utc | 36
b @ 31.
I agree with your conclusion.
I question the wisdom of O’Bomber using the SOT to advertise the Presidential Prerogative to murder anyone he feels like murdering.
Anyone can do that.
Somalia and the OBL op bring to mind a quip by Jaques Chirac a few years ago…
“He missed a wonderful opportunity to shut up.”
——————————-
Don Bacon @ 37.
It doesn’t matter if Iran drops this threat. The mere mention of it serves to remind the bailout buffoons that no matter how much the sanctions are hurting Iran, there are MANY EU countries on the brink of a chain-reaction of economic collapses.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 28 2012 4:05 utc | 38
@Hoarsewhisperer
Okay, the truth doesn’t matter to you. To me, it does. And it always will. Take it from my guru:
“Let us settle ourselves, and work and wedge our feet downward through the mud and slush of opinion, and prejudice, and tradition, and delusion, and appearance, that alluvion which covers the globe, through Paris and London, through New York and Boston and Concord, through church and state, through poetry and philosophy and religion, till we come to a hard bottom and rocks in place, which we can call reality, and say, This is, and no mistake;”–Henry David Thoreau, Walden
It means “What does that mean in plain English?”
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 28 2012 6:39 utc | 42
pls look at http://www.wikirating.org/wiki/Main_Page
look at UK, USA, etc.
Probably one the most interesting pages in the web. (i hope)
Posted by: timidocurioso | Jan 28 2012 13:55 utc | 43