Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
Back to Main

June 20, 2009
Links June 20 09

Please add your links, views and news in the comments.

Posted by b on June 20, 2009 at 05:39 UTC | Permalink
Comments

a musical sample from a musical group that defies categorization.
the toids, ring out
in memory of all those who die fighting for something better.

Posted by: Lizard | Jun 20 2009 5:55 utc | 1

There is so much detail in the Holbrooke piece I question it.

Posted by: rjj | Jun 20 2009 7:10 utc | 2

Regarding this debate on whether the green revolution is a foreign backed color revolution, you may have notice that I’ve generally stopped responding. I won’t take part in it. I’ve made my opinion clear, and provided as many facts to back it up as I have access to. To me, with my background and understanding of Iran, it was without a doubt coup d’etat orchetrated by AN/Khamenei/militarist faction in Iran. I’ve also heard your sides of the story, and to me they have been utterly unconvincing and theories you’ve provided stem mostly from ignorance.
Personally I think it’s a classic case of “enemy [AN] of my enemy [Israel] is my friend” for the western left. I as an Iranians in the mix have a more nuanced view, not only because my superior understanding of the situation, but also because “the enemy [AN] of my enemy [Israel]” is also my enemy.
I think I do have the opportunity to provide people with actual facts. So here are a few:
– Rafsanjani may be the richest man in Iran, but his wealth is miniscule compared to the the Bonyads and industries controlled by the IRGC (roughly 20-40% of the Iran’s GDP).
– Mousavi has the support of Iran’s religious establishment: Grand Ayatollah Montazeri, Grand Ayatollah Sanei, Ayatollah Khoiniha, Ayatollah Ardibili, etc.
– Mousavi has the support of federations of war-veterans and the families of national heroes such as Shahid Jahanara, Shahid Bakeri, Shahid Hemmat (his son made a television ad for him, which wasn’t aired since the media is under IRGC and AN control), etc.
– Leg-less middle-aged men in his protests, or veterans who had been gassed by western chemical weapons and still suffer daily the consequence of the disaster of western support for Saddam during the 1980s would come to his rallies. In fact, according to a former IRGC commander (محسن رشید), “The veterans of the Holy Defense [Iran-Iraq War] will tend to vote for Mousavi”
– In general, Qom, Iran’s religious establishment and the veterans of a war which filled the pockets of the American and European governments at the cost of a million lives are not the likeliest supporters of western influence in Iran.
—
For anyone actually interested in analyzing Khamenei’s sermon, it’s important to know that the sermon is traditionally composed of two parts, nafs and naas. One part is directed to himself, the other is directed to the people.
I’m too depressed to give my opinion. The sun is rising in Tehran right now and there will many dead before it sets.

Posted by: Amir S. | Jun 20 2009 7:23 utc | 3

@ #2 the rjj post is so bereft of fact, rational analysis or reason that I dismiss it as a piss weak attempt at diversion by a paid spruiker.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Jun 20 2009 9:00 utc | 4

According to Fars new this morning sponsor of Saturday demonstration has cancelled earlier call. Iran TV report Khatami and Carob have confirmed such cancellation.
According to Fars news. Musavi has distanced himself from Saturday call for demonstration.

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 10:03 utc | 5

@Amir S. #3
I’m too depressed to give my opinion. The sun is rising in Tehran right now and there will many dead before it sets.
That is strange. I posted a comment on the other Iran thread about half an hour before yours “Posted by: a | Jun 20, 2009 2:46:06 AM | 65” and that was around noon for my local time (I am in Pakistan). And the time difference between Iran and Pakistan is one hour.
So does the sun rise in Tehran at about noon time in the summer? Or are you just twisting around the day and night a little bit so that it fits your rhetoric?

Posted by: a | Jun 20 2009 10:11 utc | 6

We’ll see.
The “group of resisting clerics” (not sure how to translate into english, the one with Khatami, Abtahi, Montazeri, etc.) has declared that they haven’t got the permits, so they’re canceling it. The problem is, they hadn’t called the protest in the first place, to be canceling it.
Also Guardian council is meeting right now; Karroubi & Mousavi are not there.
In other news, a new wave of arrests has occurred. Head of the “etemad melli” newspaper was arrested at night.
Either way, 3am here. me go sleep.

Posted by: Amir S. | Jun 20 2009 10:18 utc | 7

To Amir S
Earlier call was from The Combatant Clergy Association, they were the sponsor in first place.

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 10:23 utc | 8

a: ??? i don’t get what you’re saying.. do you have a problem with me you cunt?
i’m in the US. no sleeping and i made the time zone conversion incorrectly (by a couple hours). give me a fucking break.
go fuck yourself you douchenozzle.

Posted by: Amir S. | Jun 20 2009 10:28 utc | 9

Spokesman for Guardian Council this morning announced Guardian Council is ready to recount 10% of total votes randomly.

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 10:30 utc | 10

Loyal, the earlier call was jointly from karroubi and mousavi, not the clerics. btw where are you located?

Posted by: Amir S. | Jun 20 2009 10:50 utc | 11

@Loyal – 10% sounds good to me. Important is that they do it publicly and with people from all parties involved.

Posted by: b | Jun 20 2009 10:54 utc | 12

@Loyal – 10% sounds good to me. Important is that they do it publicly and with people from all parties involved.

Posted by: b | Jun 20 2009 10:54 utc | 13

@Amir S. – you asking that after that email you send me is a bit off.

Posted by: b | Jun 20 2009 10:57 utc | 14

B, I’ve told people I reside in the US, and I’m curious to know where Loyal is if he wishes to share the information.

Posted by: Amir S. | Jun 20 2009 11:19 utc | 15

No, Debs, just calibrating on the disinformation detection system.
Pants are too short on that cranky suit.
And zip the fly.

Posted by: rjj | Jun 20 2009 11:26 utc | 16

to Amir S i live in United State of America ?

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 11:32 utc | 17

To b:
Spokemen for Guardian Council said recount of 10% is at request of Rezaei and all candidates can have representative for recount.
Musavi and Karoub did not show up.

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 11:34 utc | 18

To Amir S:
I disagree with you about who had asked for demonstration.
Here is a link to Mehr news .
http://www.mehrnews.com/fa/newsdetail.aspx?NewsID=899377

Posted by: Loyal | Jun 20 2009 11:47 utc | 19

Musavi and Karoub did not show up.
Not a surprise. They can claim for the Western media that the recount was pointless, because it, too, was rigged.
But it won’t go over well with the Irani electorate.
Looks like Iran is in store for more violence.
Antifa must be having an orgasm.

Posted by: china_hand2 | Jun 20 2009 11:56 utc | 20

James Petras’s article is piece ofcrap,it is typical how US educated “scholar” see:class struggle,or how WSJ and FT see it.He even see EU as side that has positive approach in Iran’s election!!??I guess that is one of ways how governing class control opposition.Or,they are working hard to attract attention on themselves by pseudo-analysis of event that fits MSM,and entertain “Joe Six Pack”.
I do not know who the guy is but his writing style resemble to Michel Chossudovsky’s crap,especially from days when he wrote crap about the war in ex-Yugoslavia.Liberal-left in US and EU is just disgusting.

Posted by: balkanac | Jun 20 2009 12:27 utc | 21

@ Amir S.
Wow such explectives!! Looks like I really caught with your pants down! You were giving the impression in your post that you were sitting in Tehran. All I said was to point out that either you were not in Tehran or you had no sense of night and day.
So it seems now that you have no sense about what time zone Tehran is in, either that, or you are such a head-in-your-ass American that you cant do simple math? So why should someone who is sitting in the region take you seriously?
BTW, dude! your explectives made me laugh…. so funny… haha

Posted by: a | Jun 20 2009 12:30 utc | 22

To Loyal,
Please keep us informed with your analysis. I for one would like to see more of the “hidden Iranians” who do support AN. Also are there any videos of AN support?
I was in Iran 2 years ago and I would say I am not surprised that AN won, especially the carpet weavers who have greatly benefited from him, the reduction of illetracy etc. Many have great admiration of his oratory skills and his piousness.
Good luck to all Iranians but do not fall into them Zionist trap!

Posted by: hans | Jun 20 2009 12:35 utc | 23

I have been wanting to comment along the line of hans as well. As far as I can tell, the Iranians posting here are either expats who obviously do not support the current government…..perhaps they were part of the Shah’s group and left when he did or the one who says he does live there (Parviz) who quite openly despises AN. It is not likely they would have an unbiased opinion of what is really going on in Iran.
much of their commentary reminds me of Fox News’ claim to be fair AND balanced.
though I thought that corporate media was ready to move on to the next news item it seems that the game is on again in a big way. watching US corporate media this morning there are a few voices giving Obama credit for not weighing in too soon. I guess he has a bit of a tightrope to walk, he knows very well about the destabilising forces unleashed there with US tax dollars but has an official policy of diplomacy with the incumbent government of Iran. what to do? one commenter said that he is being coy in that openly supporting the opposition would put them in a bad light at home thereby reducing their chances of success.
it seems that too many people want to much too soon. I have heard from friends who work in Iran of the corruption and overall dislike of the Mullahs. yet these things cannot be changed so easily. we in the US have a powerful elite who use the country for their own personal gain and there doesn’t seem to be a damn thing we can do about it with all of our freedoms and technology and shit. why should the Iranians be any different? in addition to being rich and powerful, the mullahs are also afforded a special religious status which makes it pretty hard to attack them without opening yourself up to charges of apostasy.
in the meantime, the Israeli foreign minister states he will continue to build settlements in direct confrontation to the US SoS. Maybe he twisted Hillary’s arm? I was wondering how she broke her elbow. We certainly don’t want that stuff in the news so it is back to Teheran. I suppose some good will come of this, US Americans are seeing pretty blond Iranian women now instead of all those black burkas…that might make it a little harder to walk around humming bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran.

Posted by: dan of steele | Jun 20 2009 12:58 utc | 24

Beware of those who want to harm you
And drag you down to a lower game
Just know the truth is coming
To bring peace to this troubled land
John Mellencamp – Troubled Land

Posted by: balkanac | Jun 20 2009 14:11 utc | 25

…

we in the US have a powerful elite who use the country for their own personal gain and there doesn’t seem to be a damn thing we can do about it with all of our freedoms and technology and shit…

This is the big reason I support our founding fathers for giving us the Second Amendment to the US constitution. Just like the mujahidin in Iraq, I may not be able to deliver a decisive blow but I can definitely be a pain in the ass.
This will be decided in Iran. All the posturing and blowing and hot air coming from the opposition (with whatever agenda) isn’t going to change anything, and neither is anyone’s declarations on some web page. It is rather humorous to see people put their words down in black and white, then try to disown them later. Makes me think Slothrop has a twin brother, or something…

Posted by: Jim T. | Jun 20 2009 14:14 utc | 26

@ Jim T.
thank God and pass the ammuntion

Posted by: dan of steele | Jun 20 2009 14:36 utc | 27

@DoS – or the one who says he does live there (Parviz)
I can confirm that Parviz indeed lives in Iran.

Posted by: b | Jun 20 2009 14:40 utc | 28

In partial response to Amir S at 3:
Some never argued that Mousavi’s Islam green was the usual foreign-formented and paid-up for color revolution.
One should take into account that the tactics of color revolution present a model that guarantees coverage in the ‘western’, US press, and if followed is rewarded, at least with a few dollars of 15 mins of fame, for one or the other actor. Sometimes much more…
The model includes supposed groundswell support, communication by internet, cell phone, now *twitter*, crowds assembling in peaceful demos, adopting a colorful garb that furnishes great pictures, repression being reported as vicious, the last might be true. Pretty girls with ethnic jewelry and make-up, lame banners..stalwart youths face off against Goons. Best if a few are killed, apologies for my cynicism.
So the model is adopted, copied in many different situations.
It is the age of pretend, ersatz revolutions. Mustering massive groups of ppl and stunning photographs is a tiny feather in the cap for the powerful, so they organize and manipulate the crowds.
Three weeks later it is all over, everyone goes home, it is business as usual. Instigators are bought off, rewarded with minor Gvmt. or think-tank positions, TV glitz, whatever. All know there is something to gain, but personally only; nevertheless, shamefully, some are willing to perform, and serve the PTB by dragging in friends, making a big show, etc.
Demonstrators are of course 90% genuine, no criticism of them.

Posted by: Tangerine | Jun 20 2009 16:07 utc | 29

Test–Message coming up: We’re sorry, we cannot accept your data.

Posted by: jawbone | Jun 20 2009 19:20 utc | 30

This is being called the Twitter Revolution by many MCM* reporters, analysts. It’s to the point that some debunkers are being brought on the air to point out that very few in Iran are creating tremendous numbers by tweeting to friends/family in the West, then these Western based people “retweet,” retweets get retweeted, so the same message is multiplied exponentially.
My criticism is of the MCM* reporters who are absolutely giddy when talking about the Iranian street protests, but barely reported huge street protests against the Bush Iraq Invasion prior to Bush launching it. Amazing, but as the new DoD manual says, protests are “low-level terrorist activity.”
That seems to mean that the US government –and its military– may use the laws against terrorism against political gatherings, protest marches, etc. First Amemendment be damned, since the president is the commander-in-chief and it’s “wartime.”
I await Obama saying this DoD definition will not be tolerated.
fterall, he was a Constitutional law professor.
I wonder how he taught it….
*MCM–Mainstream Corporate Media

Posted by: jawbone | Jun 20 2009 19:22 utc | 31

Yes, but goons are still goons in any language.

Posted by: Copeland | Jun 20 2009 19:45 utc | 32

yes, you can! join the groundswell, as the New! Improved! Imperial Humanitarianism gathers its stars & glitterati in DC this June 22-23
don’t forget to “Dress to impress,” & if you can’t make it, learn how to “join the advocacy assault from your living room”
can’t imagine why Mamdani isn’t invited . . .

Posted by: Arcturus | Jun 20 2009 23:57 utc | 33

Western politicians / media comment on the Iranian regime preventing protests, yet say nothing of United Arab Emirates which outlawed any protests by its Iranian population.
Western politicians / media cry out against violence and civilian deaths in Iran, yet 86 Afghani civilian deaths are swept away with a “we’ll have to rethink our processes.”
“Why do they hate us?”

Posted by: Ash | Jun 21 2009 3:23 utc | 34

arcturus – i’m guessing that their idea of “how it ends” is the recent congressional push for assassination? in the words of the “Ranking Member of the Terrorism, Nonproliferation and Trade Subcommittee”, u.s. rep ed royce,

The world is full of complex crises. They can seem overwhelming. It is fashionable to blame conflict in Africa on poverty and other environmental factors. But sometimes just getting rid of one person does make a big difference. History is full of captivating leaders with bad ideas who do great damage. … Kony’s removal won’t guarantee peace — but it will make it possible.

“captivating leaders with bad ideas who do great damage”…
don’t get me started

Posted by: b real | Jun 21 2009 3:56 utc | 35

@Ash
Yes, “Why do they hate us”
Because provide the F-16’s and Apache gunships, the missiles, the shells, the money and the resources to routinely murder the ghettoized Gazans and the ‘contained’ and occupied Palestinians of the West Bank … because we support, fund, arm and provide specilaist Intel support to a murderous Columbian regime … because we fund, support and sustain the UNDEMOCRATIC regimes that dictate to thier populations throughout the Middle east and anywhere else in the world where our elites deem ‘your resources belong to us’, since at least the end of WWI and the time of Balfour (French, UK, USA) … because we organised a coup d’etat of a DEMOCRATICALLY elected government or Iran, Mossadeq in 1953, our Agencies wet thier pants in excitement as a result and have been attempting the same non-top ever since … lessons learned, again and again … because we spout ‘Democracy’ and ‘Liberty’ yet deny Habeous Corpus and Constitutional rights, nay, the very Rule of Law … because we kidnap, assassinate, rendition and torture even the citizens of our allies (or should that be vassal states) … because we murder, remotely, dispassionately, by Missile armed Drones and B1-B bombers, and then blather of ROE’s, procedures, and ‘collateral damage’, not Justice for a 100+ dead innocents … because the existing Western elites, their military and thier Intelligence organs are by and large the Angels of Death of innocents uncounted … because we demand legal immunity whilst murdering at will … because the Laws of War and Armed Conflict, the Geneva Conventions and real Human Rights are only applicable to our enemies, and selectively at that … because the current western democaracies are, NOT … becaause we are bomarded with white, gray and black propaganda and infotainment, always to a script and a specific agenda of power … but most of all because of unupportable and continuing immoral, unjust hypocrisy on an inhuman and grand scale … perhaps that is ‘Why they hate us’

Posted by: Outraged | Jun 21 2009 4:10 utc | 36

Outraged, couldn’t have said it better.

Posted by: Ash | Jun 21 2009 5:53 utc | 37

correction on my phrasing in #35 – i should not have been so ambivalent – of course “how it ends” is advocating that kony be terminated w/ extreme prejudice. it has ties to the ‘save darfur’ mvmt
ips interview w/ mamdani, june 19

IPS: You say the West’s humanitarian intervention is a cover for military invasion. What facts do you base this assumption on?
MM: Initially, I thought Save Darfur was another classic peace movement in the US. But I realised that Save Darfur was a war mobilisation. It’s slogans were ‘Out of Iraq into Darfur’, ‘Boots on the Ground’, ‘No Fly Zone’. Its emphasis was to never focus on the issues that were driving the violence. The entire focus was to demonise the perpetrator.
This emphasis was very much like the War on Terror, which said that any attempt to talk about issues was an apology for the perpetrator. Darfur was just a place where evil lived. They think if you do away with the perpetrator, the violence will stop. Yet the violence will go on, because the issues remain. If you understand the history of war, you understand victims and perpetrators are on the same side, and sometimes victims and perpetrators are the same people.

Posted by: b real | Jun 21 2009 6:29 utc | 38

@jawbone: it’s not the twitter revolution anymore. cnn just told me that, because so many women have helped fuel this uprising, “some have called it” the lipstick revolution.
is there a step in the color revolution manual that covers using footage that features attractive young women?

Posted by: Lizard | Jun 21 2009 6:46 utc | 39

“some have called it” and some say, both weasel words need to be pointed out as such and could form great drinking games. Everytime a talking head says one of those phrases you have to down a shot. most people would be completely hammered before the sports section.

Posted by: dan of steele | Jun 21 2009 9:23 utc | 40

@33, presumably the answer will be in that classified annex to the Sec. 4 strategy. The NGO is cats and dogs, a NASA clique, a bunch of fishheads, programmatic agencies showing the flag; Enough has CAP ties but Amnesty International’s involvement is reassuring. Financial evidence of astroturf is equivocal at the level of detail provided.

Posted by: …—… | Jun 21 2009 12:41 utc | 41

Back to Main