Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
May 3, 2009
Links May 3 09
  • Bernard Chazelle – The Big Lie About Torture – (ATR)
  • Insightful – torture and domestic politics – (anna missed)
  • al-Sadr in Ankara and Istanbul – Reclusive Iraqi Cleric Visits Turkey – (WSL)
  • As we expectedNo Signs of Sustained Global Spread of Swine Flu – (NYT)
  • Embarrassing – ARMS TRANSFERS DATA, 2008 – (Sipri (pdf))
  • They shall have no food – Israel warplanes strike Gaza border tunnels – (LAT)
  • The war lobby – AIPAC set to push Iran legislation at major conference – (JPost)
  • Important distinctions: Jerome – The cost of wind, the price of wind, the value of wind – (D-Kos)

Please share your links, news and views in the comments.

Comments

Gideon Levy: Poets beware

Yitzhak Laor, our best protest poet, may soon face arrest. On Independence Day eve he published a poem in Haaretz’s literary supplement with the lines: “Perhaps shame prevents me from getting up to embrace my son / And warning him of those who want to enlist him.” Arresting Laor for having written such lines may sound like fiction, but something similar has already happened. Last week nine activists from New Profile, a feminist-pacifist organization formed in 1998 that aims to demilitarize Israeli society, were arrested on suspicion of incitement and assisting draft dodgers. The police raided their homes and confiscated their computers. The military advocate general requested the raid, the attorney general obliged and the police carried it out.
The public reacted to the raid with typical indifference; it came just as we were busy enjoying the cheesy Independence Day holiday, complete with songs of self-praise about Israel being the only democracy in the Middle East. But a democracy that raids the homes of political activists is no democracy. Democracies are tested by how they treat the fringes of society.

Posted by: Colin | May 3 2009 7:52 utc | 1

Interesting post by John Cole on the two most successful interrogators of WWII; German Hanns Scharff and British Robin Stephens, neither of which resorted to any violence against their captives. But of course they were interested in information, and not punishment.

Posted by: anna missed | May 3 2009 9:16 utc | 2

God loves to incite himself some punishment

Posted by: anna missed | May 3 2009 9:32 utc | 3

One more, but on the bright side – Obama’s Secret Plan

Posted by: anna missed | May 3 2009 10:17 utc | 5

AIPAC set to push Iran legislation at major conference.
al-Manar quotes “L’Express”, a French weekly, about a maneuvre Israeli Air Forces staged in Gibraltar (British territory). According to the weekly, that’s about a plan to strike Iranian nuclear facilities.
Free trade and Mexico’s drug war.

Posted by: andrew | May 3 2009 10:18 utc | 6

That is one angry god those christians are worshiping.
I guess they are all saying, “fuck jesus! what a goddamn pussy that liberal dressed in funny-looking robes is. Turn the other cheek my ass. Fuck peace, we want to kill and torture for our lord, ’cause we is so sure we’re right.”
Goddamn anna missed, you must need a shower after slinking through all that filth. Thanks for the reminder that some of the most dangerous people on earth are those who believe in the ten commandments. I wish I could take solace in knowing these folks would have to answer to their god someday; have to explain why they chose to bend god’s words for their benefit and ignore the humanity of their fellow man.
The man Christians worship is a man that was tortured to death… I doubt he would view their actions kindly, but then those idiots plead they’re only sinning humans anyway, one more sin to be absolved of ain’t any big deal and it keeps their god busy.
No matter how heinous a crime, jesus forgives, which must be very comforting to the guy wearing black rubber gloves and hooking a prisoner’s testicles to electricity.
I can tell you what ever god those folks are worshiping must be a weak-assed pussy god… any god worth their salt doesn’t believe in torture – they don’t need to torture to find information ’cause they’re gods and all knowing. Duh!

Posted by: DavidS | May 3 2009 10:40 utc | 7

Dear b and barflies, I take the liberty in these trying times of forwarding this (Sufi) performance my son sang in at Union Square SF last year. Receiving his email of it in the middle of last night cheered my heart and courage and perspective, and with it I now send my very best regards to yours..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sk5bDnqtcU8

Posted by: lambent1 | May 3 2009 12:37 utc | 8

lambent1-
Nice songs and a nice way to start the day. Thanks.

Posted by: DavidS | May 3 2009 13:14 utc | 9

re annamissed at #3 I am almost sure calvinists for conservatism is satire along the line of Jesus General. It is hard to tell and I think I would be devastated to find out that guy really thinks like that. in the second link (#4) annamist provides there were some very good comments that kinda took the writer down. most commenters were quite good at calling him out on his BS.
it is truly remarkable, especially if you have seen the Passion of Christ, that anyone who follows the teachings of Jesus would ever consider torture. If torture is not such a big deal then why would Jesus be held in such high esteem? when the same thing has happened to several unlucky souls at our hand in the war on terra? Hell, they may even have the same ancestors if you go back far enough. Yet we have to feel guilty for what some worried elites did 2 thousand years ago to one brown skinned middle easterner but feel completely justified in doing the same thing ourselves to other brown skinned middle easterners.
and as annamist said elsewhere, making sense to these people does not make sense and you are considered weak for trying.
my only hope is that the lead lemming somehow makes a break for sea and takes the rest of these knuckleheads with him.

Posted by: dan of steele | May 3 2009 14:12 utc | 10

I’ve yet to hear anyone state their confirmed beliefs in regards to torture. I stated mine a few threads back, but unless you explicitly state where you stand on the matter, there is no benchmark for your criticism.
What are your views, or your stance on torture?
Once again, I’ll state mine.
Torture is unacceptable in any form, or any amount of any form. It is an inherent crime against humanity, regardless of any legal machinations to the contrary, and a crime against nature and the universe, in general. It should never be tolerated, but rather prosecuted at every turn. Torturers should be shunned, ostracized, and the thought of such an act should be seen as something so alien and abominable as to render it moot.

Posted by: Obamageddon | May 3 2009 14:52 utc | 11

lambent1 (8) – Thanks for sharing.

Posted by: beq | May 3 2009 15:03 utc | 12

Obamageddon,
I will stand proudly beside you. Torture is evil, it is wrong always.

Posted by: dan of steele | May 3 2009 15:41 utc | 13

Obamageddon: utterly agree. wish you or someone as principled as you were calling the shots rather than the vile scumbags we’re stuck with.

Posted by: ran | May 3 2009 16:03 utc | 14

b – thank you for the link to the wind power article – really good.

Posted by: Jeremiah | May 3 2009 17:08 utc | 15

The flap about flu actually turns our attention away from the very serious infectious diseases that plague mankind. Malaria, TB, …. account for 13 million deaths per year, 50% of deaths in developing countries.. (that was in 1999, so I cherry picked, who report)
I made the point indirectly before, stress it again, because it is really vital. Many of these diseases are preventable or curable through infrastructure, (e.g. clean water, and that is a big sticking point, as filth in water is a huge killer and neo-colonialists and quasi-overt genociders are aware of that fact) simple hygiene, low level nursing, cheap medication, etc.
The emblematic horrific vision stuck in my head is Iraq some time post-invasion with money poured in for splendid new clinics (which were never completed), with ragged children standing in sewers playing bang-bang knowing their houses could be bombed or charged into at any point and that three members of the family were already ill…
Flu is seductive. Everyone in the west has had the flu, or at least seen a loved one struggling with chills and joint pain.. the idea that it might be a killer is supremely scary. For some it is the only infectious disease they ever had. Flu is also an equal opportunity killer in the west – something like a natural catastrophe, not predictable, controllable only in some indeterminate measure, and the deaths that do occur seem unavoidable despite all the magic bullets of modern medecine. So the media have a field day, as political/ideological etc. aspects can be evacuated, and fear pushes people turn on the tv, buy papers, etc.
The apprehension of the PTB has nothing to do with virulence / mortality, but with ‘the economy’ breaking down as workers, employees, key ppl, etc. are out sick, or give up their jobs, to take care of kids at home for ex, Gvmts. implementing strict social distance measures, hospitals being both swamped in patients and lacking in staff – top surgeons leave, nurses quit, and ‘regular’ patients can’t get life-saving heart operations, not to mention elective procedures. A serious epidemic would be an supremely unwelcome disturbance, would impact their lives dreadfully.
Which shows how little resilience our present ‘economy’ or just-in-time network has. It is hanging on by a shoe string, and flu is a serious threat to those in power.
They relate big time to 1918:
It is estimated that one third of the world population was infected and ill in the 1918-20 pandemic. link (article pre dates present outbreak.) So they are very keen on tracking, prevention, doing the utmost to prevent the profits from pouring in.

Posted by: Tangerine | May 3 2009 17:08 utc | 16

Obamageddon,
I agree. The laws agree. The issue they are trying to dance around is what is torture? The released memos put a lie to their arguments. That is why the advocates of torture are so upset.

Posted by: biklett | May 3 2009 17:19 utc | 17

dan,
I think the Calvinist website is not tongue & cheek, as (s)he even has a headlined disclaimer saying its no joke. Although it is obviously on the far right fringe. A particularly revealing post there is the one called Policemen are Replacing Parents which is a textbook case of what I’ve been trying to get at regarding how torture is so easily assimilated and personalized by the right as a paramount function of in maintaining authoritarian cultural values. In this case (a well known police brutality incident caught on tape in the Seattle area) the author applauds the massive punishment of the girl by the police officer, because, the (liberal) parents were to weak to assume the task themselves.
(S)he goes on to imply some regrets though, in that when the government, or government programs assume the role of parenting, this empowers government to transfer authority from the family to the government thereby undermining control by offering shelter or relief to those who don’t conform, and who should be punished. This is a central fear of the values types, that big government undermines their authority by offering shelter to those who choose not to conform – offering them things like abortions, womens shelters, welfare, social security, etc. And further underlining this erosion of authority, is that they have to pay for these very programs through taxes – which is why they hate them so much.

Posted by: anna missed | May 3 2009 19:25 utc | 18

Policemen are Replacing Parents
that is actually the story that made me think it was satire. compare to Landover Baptist Church and you will see what I am talking about.

Posted by: dan of steele | May 3 2009 20:13 utc | 19

Interesting dan, the big difference is Landover and Jesus’ General are funny. Isn’t satire suppose to be funny or at least amusing? The arguments on the Calvinist site are very tightly constructed from the correct ideological perspectives, and are amusing only in the sense that the arguments themselves are amusing – which I concede could be the point. If so, then it takes satire to a new utterly stratospheric (although deadpan) level. None of the other satire sites come anywhere close to following the ideological script of subject matter so close to the letter, with the joke always plainly visible. I would say that having gone so far in authenticity, that even if the site were satire, it need not matter – for the sake of rational arguments to the contrary. In the sense that seeing something Michelle Bachmann has said as being both authentic and crazy enough to be satire.

Posted by: anna missed | May 3 2009 20:56 utc | 20

The psuedo-leftie who claimed last week that there was no real evidence of Bush using torture to bolter the invasion of Iraq with links between AQ and Saddam should re-read Scott Horton’s piece from last week where he says:

The push for application of torture techniques occurred as the Bush administration scrambled to come up with evidence to support its claims that Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein had links to al Qaeda or was pursuing the development of weapons of mass destruction. Two major spikes in the use of the harshest techniques occurred in the weeks just before the Iraq invasion and the couple of months after the occupation of Iraq had begun. The first spike coincides with a period of difficulty with America’s principal ally, Britain, shortly following the famous Washington meeting between President Bush and Prime Minister Tony Blair in which the latter expressed concern about the lack of evidence supporting claims about a WMD program. Blair had been informed by his attorney general, Lord Peter Goldsmith, that the legal case for invading Iraq was exceedingly tenuous and badly needed to be bolstered with evidence showing an imminent threat coming out of Saddam Hussein’s Iraq. Also in this period, Vice President Cheney was doing his best to make this case by talking up evidence that proved specious—including reports of a meeting in Prague between an al Qaeda figure and an Iraqi diplomat.
The new documents make plain that interrogators using the new harsh techniques, including waterboarding, were pushing their subjects for information that would justify the Iraq war. For instance, Major Paul Burney, a medical professional attached to interrogation efforts at Guantánamo, told investigators that “we were there a large part of the time. We were focused on trying to establish a link between al Qaeda and Iraq and we were not being successful in establishing a link between al Qaeda and Iraq. The more frustrated people got in not being able to establish this link… there was more and more pressure to resort to measures that might produce more immediate results.” Numerous other sources involved in the interrogation effort recorded the same intense pressure to secure “results” that would justify a decision that had already been taken in Washington to invade Iraq.

Posted by: Debs is dead | May 3 2009 21:12 utc | 21

Thanks Did… good to hear form ya..
And also thanks to anna missed, DOS discussion. Reminds me of John Dean‘s Authoritarians and the Bush Administration. I can’t say enough about hid book, ‘conservative’s without conscience’.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | May 4 2009 4:04 utc | 22

@ annamissed, #5:
I’ve thought about precisely this possibility you write of, but i have also noticed a phenomenon that seems to counter it.
The most extreme of the U.S. right — and most extremely cloaked — manage certain bits of information and public opinion quite adroitly, far in advance of the knowledge becoming mainstream. To give some examples:
* The recent “FEMA Concentration Camps” were actually a rumor going back to the Reagan administration, back when Ollie North was in charge of FEMA. The story went something like: the U.S. far right wing was laying the groundwork for a coup back during the time when the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld junta was running amok across Central America. There has never been a lot of concrete evidence to back it up, but IIRC there were purported lists of the first 3,000 people who would be targeted that were in Samizdat circulation. Now, however, Glenn Beck has succeeded in shifting that backstory onto the Obama administration, while at the same time negating any possible means of the mainstream media ever taking that story seriously.
* During the Clinton administration, Lord Conrad Black and his lackey, Ambrose-Evans Pritchards, managed to concoct a long and widely circulated right-wing backstory about Clinton working with the Tyson chicken king and the CIA to import cocaine into the U.S in chicken carcasses. This was just before and a long time after the Mercury News expose on the CIA-Contra cocaine connection. It succeeded in convincing a large swathe of the country of one of two things:
A) Any idea that the CIA is involved in the illicit drug trade is completely the invention of a bunch of radical nutjobs, or
B) If the CIA is involved, it’s not the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld junta responsible, but rather the Clinton clique.
Of course, the only involvement with cocaine that the Clinton clique ever had were as buyers, while there’s an enormous sub-mainstream literature of corroborating evidence showing how right-wing mercenaries like Oliver North, Colin Powell, other members of the CIA (Lansdale and Chennault, for instance) and their people were directly involved in profits from the illicit drug trade.
Now, of course, we see the right wing starting up a bunch of hubbub about how Obama’s going to be the president who brings us Communism under a velvet fist, how he’s going to help out the terrorists and put us all at risk.
From my perspective, i see your article at #5 as being a very real possibility, but with one fatal flaw: Obama and his clique, like Jimmy Carter, don’t yet understand that they need to prepare for some very real violence, and the very real possibility of some (more?) false-flag operations aimed at destablizing and defaming their efforts. The groundwork is already being laid, and I’m sure Obama’s aware of it.
Obama may be a good man, with the right intentions, but unless he’s got some serious loyalty with some serious, combat-ready generals who are ready to defend him, going back as deep into the military establishment as you can go while still keeping loyalty to our vision of the constitution, then i worry that, like Jimmy Carter, he’s going to be backed into a corner by the MSM and rendered unable to achieve his intended reforms, ultimately hounded out of office by Reagan II (i.e. — an amiable actor giving surface legitimacy to a shadow governnment) at the end of his first four years (the Iran hostage affair only began about six or eight months before the end of Carter’s first term, right? So there’s still plenty of time, and aren’t we still in a “war on terrorism”?).
Or let’s flip it around and say he really does have that loyalty — then in that case, i’d say the U.S. is pretty much headed for civil war. The right wing elite are that strong, as Cheney-Bush proved, they are unquestionably that evil, and as the t.v. shows every day, an awful lot of those gun-toting “Christian” rednecks are quite that stupid.
Anyhow, that’s all presuming Obama’s really intending to make some changes. So far, he has made only baby-steps in that direction. It may only be 100 days, but until i start seeing some backbone on Israel, Central Asian pullouts, habeas corpus, human rights/torture, government transparency, the economy and health-care, i’ll stay unconvinced. So far, Obama is merely the Bush regime with a better, more realistic brain behind it.
So whatever way you look at it, the outlook is grim: Obama succeeds in moderate reform, but at the cost of his presidency and the ascension of yet another Junta stage manager. Obama fails in his reform, and the status quo simply grinds along. Obama has no intent of reform, and increases the injustices. Or Obama intends reform, succeeds, but ushers in an era of open conflict in the streets.
Now, let me say that i don’t think there’s going to be conflict in the streets. So far, my expectations run more along the lines of: more prisons, more police, more military, more wars, more economic stratification. By following that course, the MSM and the elite can all pretend together that things really aren’t all that bad.
But really, the U.S. is in such a state that right now it’s damned if you do, don’t, do, don’t, do — whichever way you look at it, sane people in the U.S. are up against a stupefyingly powerful right wing threat, and a terrifyingly vicious military-industrial alliance. Barring some sort of grass-roots movement that’s dedicated enough to line themselves up like the Wobblies or the 30’s era socialists (in the iPod age? Get real.), i don’t see a lot of hope for its future.

Posted by: china_hand2 | May 4 2009 4:06 utc | 23

Exhibit 3,006:
Prison Guard Tazes Kids On “Bring Son/Daughter To Work Day”

Schmidt, the arsenal sergeant at the Panhandle prison, said he asked parents for permission to shock the kids

.
I know I am supposed to be appalled and outraged by this but frankly, I’m not. I’m numb. Why is that? Because, the powers that make believe, have induced in us, a form of mass psychology, a form of mass anhedonia. Willy Reich warned us in his “The Mass
Psychology of Fascism”.

Posted by: Uncle $cam | May 4 2009 4:23 utc | 24

U$-
and you’re probably tired of reposting this link to Edward Bernays I liked it so much I keep it on my list of links.

Posted by: DavidS | May 4 2009 4:51 utc | 25

@china_hand2 ET AL…
Inside Anti-Obama Extremist Gun Culture, Max Blumenthal

Posted by: Uncle $cam | May 4 2009 6:19 utc | 26

ch2, if only to agree that things look grim, as the author of #5 is only concerning himself with the banking aristocracy and there are plenty of lethal appendages to that aristocracy. It is curious that the “secret plan” is largely community activism 101 in that it relies on motivating the people in political actions that create new problems for the corporates to deal with that compound bad publicity, legal problems, political entanglements, and etc – that taken together threaten both the image and bottom line. I think that the author is correct in assuming Obama is doing this by giving the financials the “rope” necessary to hang themselves up in a cycle of enabling their own greed instinct, that fuels public outrage – so that Obama can then come to their rescue with the reform medicine. He seems to be doing the same thing regarding the torture issue, releasing information that the media is behooved to report upon, that increases pressure (on himself) to take more investigative action, that spins the issue yet faster until he’s forced (himself) to really do something about it to [sic]restore the nations reputation. This line of auspiciously running a community action program from the white house has the added benefit of driving the wingnuts freaking crazy by the same logic – seeing that already they can’t seem to hang themselves fast enough. Of course its anybodies guess whether any of this will pan out into significant reforms before the economy really hits bottom, so maybe it’s some consolation that the republicans will be in such disarray that they won’t be able to pick up the pieces when it does.

Posted by: anna missed | May 4 2009 7:34 utc | 27

Yeah, but my greater point — and you probably picked up on it, but i worry i didn’t make it clearly enough — is that there are right-wing forces in the U.S. that are clearly anticipating this approach, and already moving to counter it in our media by screaming “Socialism! Get your guns!” or “Torture prosecutions? You mean dictatorship!”
That is, they’re gobbling up whatever resources they can now, and as they do so laying a rhetorical groundwork that can be used to incite violence against any meaningful government reforms.
How well-organized are their brownshirts? That remains to be seen, but what’s for certain is that those folks have more guns and are far better prepared to fight than anyone else in the U.S. — and they’ve got a LOT of friends in the military and police.
So i guess i’m skeptical that these community organization tactics are going to do the trick. If Obama succeeds, i think it probable we will see some serious, violent opposition. That will mean a further slide towards a police state, regardless of what Obama wants.
Wasn’t it during the Clinton era that the prison system exploded?
Unless Obama has a plan for that, then i don’t see much reason to hope for peaceful resolutions.

Posted by: china_hand2 | May 4 2009 8:45 utc | 28

Certainly, right wing violence is in the cards, but the greater threat of authoritarian fascism has abated with their successive political/economic failures at the controls of government. What remains of their power is further diminished with their current attempts to distill (purge) their ideology into its evermore essentially purified nonsense. The greater threat of course is domestic terrorism, especially if it should begin to congeal into coordinated violence incited and supported by state government rhetoric – or in other words, the current attempts (Texas&Georgia) to re-float the secessionist idea of disengaging from the federal government, that works in synchrony with violent expressions, and elicits a popular sympathy.
David Neiwert at Orcinus has been tracking these developments of right wing terrorism.

Posted by: anna missed | May 4 2009 10:27 utc | 29