Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
December 8, 2008
Pakistan Did Something – And Now?

According to AP Pakistan nabbed a few people thought by  some to be related to the attacks in Mumbai:

Security forces overran a militant camp on the outskirts of Pakistani Kashmir's main city and seized an alleged mastermind of the attacks that shook India's financial capital last month, two officials said Monday.

Backed by a helicopter, the troops grabbed Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi among at least 12 people taken Sunday in the raid on the riverbank camp run by the banned group Laskhar-e-Taiba in Pakistani Kashmir, the officials said.

AFP reports this a bit different:

The 15 arrested in Pakistan-controlled Kashmir were from an Islamic charity closely linked to the Lashkar-e-Taiba group, which India accuses of being behind the 60-hour siege, the intelligence official said.

"Security forces raided a relief camp set up by Jamaat-ud-Dawa," he said.

The U.S. put Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi on its Treasury terrorist list in May this year. An old post on a Punjabi message board has this bit on Zaki-ur-Rehman:

Writing for Associated Press (May 30, 1999) from Muzafarrabad Mr.
Amir Mirza reported that "… in the mountains that divide Kashmir between
India and Pakistan, militants are training at dozens of camps on Pakistani
territory." He, along with other journalists, interviewed Zaki-ur Rehman
Lakhvi, chief of Lashkar-e-Tayyaba, one of the most militant fighting groups.
In this interview Mr. Lakhvi claimed that "there is no shortage of recruits."

The man is obviously not unknown. But is he guilty in this case, or just a convinient target?

There were rumors on Saturday, later denied, that Sec.State Rice had given an ultimatum to the Pakistani government do something within 48 hours. Now Pakistan has done something. Whether the people nabbed now are really related to the Mumbai attack is an open question.

And what will be the next step?

It is doubtful that the Pakistani government can and will simply send
off the captured folks to India. There are legal reasons against this
as no extradition treaty exists between the countries. The internal
political situation will also not allow it, as Zaki-ur Rehman is to many Pakistani not a terrorist, but a hero who fought for the freedom of Muslims in
Kashmir.

Pakistan could put the nabbed people on trial. But it may have no evidence
against them except what Indian 'sources' leaked to Indian media. An then what?

Some Indian TV channel is speculating about military action against Pakistan.

B. Raman, hawk and former chief of India's foreign intelligence
service Research and Analysis Wing, says that is the wrong stuff to do.
Instead he is urging India to copy the U.S. and to not care about
international law.

Why would India need to show evidence that Pakistan was behind the attack, he asks:

What
evidence did they have before Bill Clinton ordered the Cruise missile
attacks on jihadi training camps in Afghan territory in August,1998?

What evidence did they have against Al Qaeda and the Taliban before they bombed Afghanistan from October 7,2001?

What evidence did they have against the Saddam Hussain Government before they invaded and occupied Iraq in 2003?

In every case affecting American nationals and interests, they
bombed and then collected evidence. They did not wait till they had
collected all the evidence possible before they bombed.

Raman wants the Indian government to reactivate the operational arm of its
foreign intelligence service and to get active within Pakistan. Follow the U.S.:
Just spread terror in the land of the alleged and perceived enemy.

The objective of the action should be to force Pakistan
to act effectively against the LET and its terrorist infrastructure. It
should also be to mount a no-holds barred covert operation against the
LET through our own resources and methods.


A divided Pakistan, a bleeding Pakistan, a Pakistan ever on the
verge of collapse without actually collapsing—-that should be our
objective till it stops using terrorism against India.

A divided and bleeding Pakistan is of course what Pakistan is already
today. Creating more strife in Pakistan would only create more
terrorism spreading from Pakistan into India.

Raman knows this:

We should be realistic enough
to anticipate that Pakistan will step up terrorism in Indian territory
if we adopt such a policy. This should not deter us from embarking on
this policy. The policy of active defence against Pakistan should be
accompanied by time-bound action to strengthen our counter-terrorism
capability at home.

So terrorism from Pakistan in India should not deter it from raising terrorism in Pakistan. Why then
does Raman believe that such action by India can deterre Pakistan?

There is some very faulty and dangerous logic behind such thoughts.

That may not prevent their implentation.

Comments

Well, well.
Bravo, b.

Posted by: slothrop | Dec 8 2008 16:46 utc | 1

And what the hell is this phone call? Cheney wants his mushroom cloud, goddammit, and he’s going to get it before he leaves.

Posted by: …—… | Dec 8 2008 16:59 utc | 2

Now Pakistan has done something. Whether the people nabbed now are really related to the Mumbai attack is an open question.
As Captain Renault said: “Round up the usual suspects.”

Posted by: CluelessJoe | Dec 8 2008 17:29 utc | 3

It was probably just those crazy French Canadian DJs who duped Sarkozy and Sarah Palin…Good one, guys!!!

Posted by: ralphieboy | Dec 8 2008 18:51 utc | 4

Sounds pretty stupid when a leader from another country parrots the vicious circle logic of the bush administration. And doubly stupid when those same types rush off to India to urge restraint – in effect saying you’re not big enough to act in the totally reckless and duplicitous fashion that only we are famous for. It’s the exceptionalism talking again.

Posted by: anna missed | Dec 8 2008 19:00 utc | 5

the logic would be that a weak Pakistan would be good for India in the sense of conventional warfare, though a weak Pakistan would also be good for the Taliban, and a torn Pakistan could blow up patchwork India …
me personally am waiting for the moment Latin America is taking over the rest of the continent …

Posted by: outsider | Dec 8 2008 19:33 utc | 6

India can’t do what America has done. Quod Licit Jovi, Non licit Bovi. Or something like that. Seriously, if India were to really attack Pakistan, it risks self destruction and they know it. If Pakistan didn’t have nukes, Indian troops would be across the border by now.
Indeed, if Pakistan had no nukes, the U.S might have invaded them after 9/11 rather than Afghanistan.
Which is precisely why nukes are so useful.

Posted by: Lysander | Dec 8 2008 19:41 utc | 7

Extradition demand rejected in response to demarche

Pakistan has rejected India’s demand to extradite three fugitives and urged it to share evidence proving that elements from this country territory had carried out the recent attacks in Mumbai.
This was communicated to India in a demarche from Foreign Secretary Salman Bashir to Indian High Commissioner Satyabrata Pal in response to India’s second demarche which had listed actions it wanted Pakistan to take.
The response came amid reports from various parts of the country, including the federal capital, that a crackdown had been launched against the outlawed Lashkar-e-Taiba and Jamaatud Dawah. This was one of the main demands made in the Indian demarche of Dec 1.

Both the US and India have said that there were “information and irrefutable evidence” to prove the involvement of elements from Pakistan in the Mumbai attacks, but none of it had so far been shared with Pakistan. Instead, both the US and India insist that Pakistan “knows it all”.

Posted by: b | Dec 9 2008 8:40 utc | 8

DEBKA, so take with a large amount of salt: Israeli experts help India prepare commando raids into Pakistan

New Delhi has asked Jerusalem to assist in the operational and intelligence planning of Indian commando cross-border strikes against Islamist terrorist havens in Pakistan – including al Qaeda, Indian counter-terror sources report.
The Indian government’s decision to embark on these in-and-out incursions in reprisal for the Mumbai outrage of Nov. 26-29 was first revealed in DEBKA-Net-Weekly 375 published Dec. 4 (Indian Retaliatory Raids inside Pakistan Impending).
DEBKAfile adds: Israel is willing to help the Indians carry out punitive forays into Pakistan because it has its own scores to settle for the brutal murder of six Israelis in Mumbai’s Chabad Center by the Islamist terrorists and for the Pakistani Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) agency’s hand in the atrocity.
Security sources in New Delhi disclosed Saturday, Dec. 6, that ISI officers actively trained the terrorists on military lines and selected their targets, including two big hotels and the Jewish-Israeli center.
Indian sources told DEBKAfile that Israel was asked for assistance because its special undercover forces were long seasoned in plotting and executing reprisals for terrorist attacks; above all, they were expert in getting away after covert operations without leaving a trail. New Delhi wants its commando operations in Pakistan to be stealthy and focused, and does not propose to admit responsibility.
Four Pakistani locations are targeted:
1. Pakistani Kashmir where scores if not hundreds of extremist Muslim training facilities are situated – many of them ISI-run and funded;
2. Punjab in eastern Pakistan on the border of northern India. DEBKAfile’s counter terror sources report that Lahore and Multan have attracted a cluster of Islamist terrorist centers.
3. Pakistan’s southern coast – from Karachi north to Gwadar close to the Iranian border. Indian intelligence (RAW) has evidence that this strip was where the terrorists who besieged Mumbai ten days ago were trained for their assault.
Our New Delhi sources disclose that Indian leaders showed the outline of this plan to US secretary of state Condoleezza Rice when she visited last week. She commented guardedly that the United States was strongly opposed to a full-scale war between India and Pakistan but not averse to limited counter-terror operations.

Posted by: b | Dec 11 2008 10:59 utc | 9

Uh oh Spokesman: Pakistan air force put on alert for “aggression”

ISLAMABAD, Dec. 10 (Xinhua) — The Pakistan Air Force (PAF) has been put on alert for “aggression”, local television quoted a spokesman on Wednesday.
The PAF remained focused on the Indian situation and Pakistan was all the time ready for the security and safety of its airspace, the private Geo TV quoted the PAF spokesman Humayun Waqar Zephyr as saying.

Indian media reported on Wednesday that the Indian air force had been put on high alert.
Also on Wednesday, a Pakistan navy spokesman said the navy was put on alert to closely watch India’s movement at sea.

Posted by: b | Dec 11 2008 13:48 utc | 10

A post on a Reuters blog with interesting links and questions:
China, Pakistan and India

According to Pakistani newspaper the Daily Times, Pakistan’s decision to crack down on the Jammat-ud-Dawa, the charity linked to the Laskhar-e-Taiba, came as the result of pressure from China. Jammat-ud-Dawa was blacklisted by a UN Security Council committee this week.
(snip)

And in an ATimes article linked by the above, there is this:

Adding to India’s irritation over China’s pro-Pakistan position on anti-India terrorist groups operating on Pakistani soil was a report in the People’s Daily, the mouthpiece of the central committee of the Communist Party of China, which alleged that the Mumbai attack was the work of radical Hindus from India rather than terrorists who came from Pakistan.

Posted by: Alamet | Dec 14 2008 0:44 utc | 11