Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
August 3, 2007
An Afghani Farce

by Debs is Dead
lifted from a comment

The latest news that South Korean officials plan on meeting with
representatives of Afghanistan’s Taliban resistance movement doesn’t
auger well for Kabul’s mayor and city council chair Hamid Karzai.

Following the confirmation that the body of a second Korean hostage
had been found and that the Korean aid workers lives were in grave
danger, Kabul had set about ‘rescuing’ the abductees with whatever
force may be necessary. On Aug 1 reuters reported that a rescue
operation had commenced with the dropping of pamphlets by USAF aircraft
warning citizens in the area the hostages were believed to be held, to
stay out of the way.

There is no longer any sign of that bulletin on the Reuters site, however the Canadian National Post blog
has constructed a timeline of Reuters changing bulletins. Somehow it
was determined that telegraphing one’s punches by letting the Taliban
know you were coming was not such a good idea.

Of course none of that would have been of any concern to the Kabul
City Council or the US and other Nato forces who were about to ‘go in’.
Alive or dead the hostages must be rescued because as long as they were
hostages the Korean govt was under pressure to get the fuck outta Dodge
(ie pull it’s remaining troops out of Afghanistan immediately rather
than the slow withdrawal agreed to). Worst of all however was the bad
press around this issue. It means that the cardboard cut out Nato
leaders look silly claiming they are winning in Afghanistan when as
this incident clearly shows the Taliban are becoming stronger.

Maybe the Korean govt had already quietly agreed to a ‘save them by
shooting them’ scenario. There were intimations that was the case, as
long as it was a Nato operation not an Afghani one. There wasn’t much
faith in the spine that a ‘good dose of freedom’ delivers.

But as news of the rescue attempt leaked to the Korean people, in
particular relatives of the hostages, they made it plain better dead
than Taliban was a lousy option.

Somehow Deputy Secretary of State John Negroponte was involved,
which gives an indication of the likelihood of any survivors, since
Negroponte never seemed to mind amerikan xtians being martyrs
for the cause of corporate capitalism in central america, it is
unlikely he would demur at the notion of Korean xtians croaking.
Negroponte was bailed up at a meeting by Korea’s Foreign Minister Song Min-soon on Aug 1 just as the operation was swinging into top gear.

That meeting must have been full and frank as they say in the classics:

"The two sides ruled out the possibility of military
operations and placed a top priority on safely resolving the issue by
mobilising all means," Song said after the meeting, the official said.

"The United States is not preparing military operations," he quoted Song as saying.

In another development, eight senior members of South Korea’s
National Assembly left for Washington on Thursday to urge US officials
to take an "active and positive" approach to the crisis, amid
widespread perceptions that Washington is key to ending the crisis by
influencing Afghanistan’s government.

Song indicated there were difficulties in ending the crisis because
of a US policy of refusing to negotiate with people it regards as
terrorists, but vowed to resolve the issue while keeping intact the
principle, the South Korean official said.

Now that the South Koreans have managed to force the US into
permitting direct contact with the Taliban Government, other nations
faced with intractable Afghani issues will insist on the same access.

Say for example you are a European state whose population were being
decimated by the availability of cheap and freely available Afghani
smack. Would you plead with the DEA to stage one of their show
operations in the few parts of the country controlled by Karzai and co
– knowing that the flow of smack into your society would not be impeded
by this? Or would you sit down with the Taliban and negotiate a deal
whereby they got paid to stop the flow?

In the end people have to deal with the entity in control, while the
coalition of the swilling had control of most of Afghanistan’s
territory for that fleeting period after the invasion, it was the US
led Nato forces one did business with, but now control of the
countryside out of Kabul has gone back to the indiginous forces of
whatever ilk, frequently incorrectly referred to as the Taliban, that
is who others must deal with.

There will be other issues like this with the eventual result the complete sidelining of Karzai and the City Council.

Leave the last word to the Nazis:

The conservative xtain blogs
condemned the liberal media for blowing the rescue, but were divided on
whether death by rescue was a workable option. Comments ranged from:

"So what’s the deal? Are we never gonna use the neutron bomb, or what?"

and

"Lord, take me under friendly fire in a rescue
operation any day, as long as my captors experience the pain of life
before they spend eternity swimming in a lake of fire."

(where do you make these people amerika?)

To:

"I cannot find it in myself to give CNN/Reuters any
shred of a benefit of the doubt. I hope the hostages and the raiders
survive the attack by the legacy media. I should think the hostages
would be safer with the Taliban than with these guys “helping”.

With allies like that is it any wonder the South Koreans have opted out of the Afghani farce?

Comments

Funny how those missionaries always get in trouble. Deathwishes? Evangelizing in a Muslim country gets you and any convert killed – nothing new there.
The US ist still looking into some “military means”, i.e. kill ’em all, to solve this problem.

South Korea expressed hope Friday that a summit this weekend between President Bush and Afghan President Hamid Karzai would advance efforts to win the release of the hostages.
“We have expectations that the two leaders would have sufficient understanding of our position when they hold a summit,” said South Korean presidential spokesman Cheon Ho-sun.
South Korean lawmakers were also in Washington to appeal for US help in the standoff.
Richard Boucher, assistant US secretary of state for South and Central Asia, said the use of military force to free the hostages had not been ruled out.
“All pressures need to be applied to the Taliban to get them to release these hostages,” Boucher said Thursday. “There are things that we say, things that others say, things that are done and said within Afghan society, as well as potential military pressures.”

Must do so because the South Koreans get some wacky ideas:

South Koreans also began asking why their country had sent troops to Afghanistan in the first place and why they should suffer in a war that is the business of the United States.

Maybe Monolycus can give us some insight why those folks come up with such crazy questions.

Posted by: b | Aug 3 2007 13:42 utc | 1

i don’t know whether to laugh or cry.
excellent post debs

Posted by: annie | Aug 3 2007 13:42 utc | 2

So. What’s “Reverend” Moon up to these days?

Posted by: beq | Aug 3 2007 14:14 utc | 3

Glad you are back DiD.
Debs made his best-remembered statement at his sentencing hearing:
“Your Honor, years ago I recognized my kinship with all living beings, and I made up my mind that I was not one bit better than the meanest on earth. I said then, and I say now, that while there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free.

Posted by: Malooga | Aug 3 2007 15:24 utc | 4

Dang, Debs.
Excellent post! Thanks. You make that scene easy to understand.

Posted by: Jake | Aug 3 2007 15:53 utc | 5

Maybe Monolycus can give us some insight why those folks come up with such crazy questions.
The folk here haven’t been this unhappy with the US since the beheading of another Christian evangelical, Kim Sun-il, in Iraq three years ago. They are openly wondering what their allegiance has cost them and have placed the blame very securely on the USA for the visible and undeniable failure to achieve anything remotely resembling progress in Iraq or Afghanistan… and, as I wrote before, they have voiced suspicions that the US has prevented any real progress from occuring with their relations in the North (this is notable since the North and South are still observing the 1953 “cease-fire” and there are laws which have not been revoked prohibiting people from saying anything sympathetic about the North).
It’s truly an odd mood here. The newspapers have described the “anguish” over the plight of the hostages. What I see is anger, pure and simple, and a rising nationalism. To begin with, it is almost universally recognised that the hostages went to Afghanistan in the first place against a travel advisory from the government, and this absolves Roh Moo-hyun’s administration entirely in the eyes of many. While Christianity has certainly caught on (I’ve heard some estimates that up to 40% of the population claim to practice it), many of the “Christian” groups here practice doctrines that would not be recognisable to Christians in the West (I was told with overt hostility in the subway yesterday by a group of local missionaries that “Buddha can’t save anyone”, but if I were to accept their “God, the Mother”, then I would be free to be reincarnated to try again in a new life. Not all of this was the result of errors made by non-native speakers of English). They are also incredibly pushy with their proselytising, which is widely acknowledged. While the Taliban are viewed as bad guys, nobody is turning this into a fundamentalist “clash of civilizations”. Everyone agrees that the hostages shouldn’t have been in Afghanistan in the first place.
The anger comes, as I said, from a palpable sense of rising independence and nationalism. One of the recent blockbuster movies (and it’s a powerful piece of film!) is May 18 (Splendid Holiday) (Hwaryuhan Hyuka), a history lesson about the massacre of pro-democracy supporters in Gwangju after the coup d’état in 1980. For a country with as deeply rooted a military heritage and Confucian ideals as this one has to be embracing anti-government, anti-authoritarian films such as this indicates a deeply schizophrenic, and increasingly cynical, movement going on in the national psyche.
They are also concerned about the financial ramifications of all of this. They have only fairly recently begun to move out of a general squalor to become one of the world’s leading economic powers, particularly in the IT field. The South Korean won has gained about 40% on the US dollar in the past three years, and has dropped sharply in light of this incident. By contrast, the won dropped for a total of one day and immediately rebounded in response to North Korea’s nuclear test on October 9th, 2006.
So, to answer your question, the general opinion here is that the US has become out-of-touch, inept and overly inclined to insist that its allies make unrequited sacrifices on its behalf. There is a rising sense that backing the USA is not in anyone’s best interests. They are not happy and are becoming less so all the time.

Posted by: Monolycus | Aug 3 2007 18:05 utc | 6

@Monolycus there are many Korean xtians living in NZ and I feel a mixture of pity tinged with guilt when I hear them elucidate their philosophy. Most of the Korean xtians I have met are subscribers to an almost colonial belief in the power of western ‘culture’. There is a definite correlation in their minds between xtianity and the acquisition of material wealth.
Of course it is far too simple to characterise Korean xtians as money hungry. NZ always had a culture of voluntarism, but that has declined with the rise of neo-liberalism, two income families and the politics of fear, that being poor is evil and the poor are to be condemned, however it is asian migrants, particularly Korean xtians who have retired here that are taking up the roles once performed by middle class married pakeha women.
They now entertain the elderly in rest homes, drive meals on wheels and perform all the tasks that had once been the province of NZ born secularists.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Aug 3 2007 23:35 utc | 7

Debs is dead,
I really like your inputs on issues of cultural-anthropology.
its tough, sensitive & sometimes thankless stuff.
But Keep it up.

Posted by: jony_b_cool | Aug 4 2007 1:44 utc | 8

@DiD (#7)
There is a definite correlation in their minds between xtianity and the acquisition of material wealth.
I don’t disagree with that statement at all. With the exception of a few Catholic nuns I have run across, the “Christians” here have cobbled together odd (and kind of amusing) hodge-podges of belief systems with a most definite Calvinist streak.
It does seem to be a generational thing. The wild eyed proseletyzers seem mostly younger, predominantly female, and unable to really know what to do with the excess income and opportunities that their parents a mere generation earlier would not have been able to imagine. If you ask them to name a great scientist, they will answer Thomas Edison because “he made himself rich”. Many of them have never heard of Albert Einstein. They are adamant that Bill Gates simply “must be a good man” for reasons that should be obvious. I’ve probably noticed this because I tend to take the diametric opposite view and think that someone who is overly wealthy must have done something untoward to become that way. I acknowledge that my position is hardly more rational.
Those Catholic nuns, however, are predominantly much, much older and do seem to be genuinely ascetic. My suspicion is that they converted over twenty years when opportunities for women included either marrying into what was almost statistically guaranteed to be an abusive relationship, or join a church as a mystic. This was almost always the case for practitioners of the native Korean shamanism (Kut). It became a religion practiced nearly exclusively by women who had few other options and could not assimilate themselves into an extremely violent, male-dominated culture. Catholicism seemed to represent a new and preferable option to Kut when it was introduced here because these women were able to live in communal dorms rather than solitary caves in the mountians. Incidentally, there still are a small number of those women living in caves and practicing Kut to this day, and they are occasionally consulted to cast their charms for those motivated to go out hiking and looking for them. I was fortunate to be able to observe one of these ceremonies done on behalf of a young man whose business was faltering.
As I tried to indicate with my first post, however, it is certainly not fair to categorize every Korean this way. Christianity, while very pervasive, still represents a minority here and they are viewed by a slim majority as simply annoying and muddled people. The sentiment here stops short of believing that the “foreign aid workers” (what an odd euphemism!) in Afghanistan “got what they deserved”, but nobody is kidding themselves that the hostages should not have been there. That is not where the anger is coming from.

Posted by: Monolycus | Aug 4 2007 6:16 utc | 9

The Independent writes: South Korea turns against ‘arrogant’ Christian hostages

Whang Sang-min, a psychology professor at the prestigious Yonsei University, said: “There is growing resentment toward Christians. Many Koreans feel oppressed by the power of the church.”
Korea was a Buddhist country 120 years ago, with only a few thousand Christians, mostly Catholics, who faced intense persecution. By the 1960s, Korea had about a million Christians, but their numbers exploded in the decades that followed.
Christians now make up 31 per cent of South Korea’s population. At night, the Seoul skyline glitters with video billboards and neon lights but all the commercial illumination is rivalled by the thousands of bright red crosses that shine from the churches found on almost every street corner.
Korea now has more than 36,000 churches, and many of them are loud and proud with a firm commitment to missionary work and a passionate zeal for evangelism.

Saemmul, the captive missionaries’ church, was formed by a breakaway group from Somang and it has grown so big it recently converted a five-storey shopping centre into a new church – the Yeoido Full Gospel church in central Seoul, which has 750,000 regular attendees, making its congregation the largest in the Christian world.
Korea has 16,000 missionaries working overseas, second only to the US.
The chairmen of all South Korea’s top-10 companies are Christians, as are the majority of National Assembly members.

If only 30% of Koreans are Christian, then the last sentence definitly shows some class issue here …

Posted by: b | Aug 4 2007 8:08 utc | 10

Debs: There is a definite correlation in their minds between xtianity and the acquisition of material wealth.
This philosophy is becoming prevalent with many of the new “Christians”, especially here in America. It may have started with the growing “evangelicals” here in the U.S., especially as the middle class started getting squeezed economically. ‘Being a good Christian will bring you material wealth’ -quite a selling point eh? Years ago, I never heard of such a philosophy, but I’m getting used to this new “bizarro” world I guess.
Oh yeah, and these so called “fundamentalists” make sure to preach that there is a 10% tithe to be given to the “church”. It is all very materialistic, quite ironic really. Nothing surprises me anymore.
Maybe all this explains why there are more “Christians” in China now than there are “Communists”. A sad thought if such “materialism” is the reason. I don’t know.

Posted by: Rick | Aug 4 2007 12:11 utc | 11

It’s not new, Rick. It’s a pretty old twist on Calvinism. The idea is that God is omniscient, so you are either “saved” or you aren’t… nothing you do in this life can change what was pre-ordained. He already knows the outcome, and would not have created you except to play your part in His grand scheme of punishing the pre-ordained wicked folk. Obviously, if you are one of the elite, you are one of God’s favourites. That being the case, it is your duty to hoard material wealth so that you can showcase God’s graces in this life. God must have picked you for mysterious reasons known only to Him (or Her… or It) and it is encumbent upon you to be amongst the uppermost class and play the part of one of the “saved”. It’s elitism at its finest… and it allows folk to be complete shallow, materialistic bastards to one another and sleep soundly that night.

Posted by: Monolycus | Aug 4 2007 17:09 utc | 12

@Monolycus
You write, I read. New religion of sorts.
🙂

Posted by: Wolf DeVoon | Aug 4 2007 22:48 utc | 13

That bloke “The Reverend Creflo Dollar” features on late nite early am TV here too. He preaches the divinity of currency with vigour. I guess he must have following in NZ or he wouldn’t pay the charges for getting on air, bein as how he places considerable value on money.
I realise that western xtian religions, particularly the Calvinist ones preach the rightness of being rich, hell the last xtian I can find in my family was a presbyterian a few generations back, but I guess the point I was trying to make was that all the xtian Koreans I have met belong to the cadre of Koreans who have embraced western materialism.
I feel bad for them since of all the facets of Westernism they could have been attracted to they have chosen the worst.

Posted by: Debs is dead | Aug 5 2007 5:36 utc | 14

Oh yeah, and these so called “fundamentalists” make sure to preach that there is a 10% tithe to be given to the “church”.
Denzel Washington says this is the reason for his success. Why would a god need 1/10 of his or anyone’s salary? Several ex-wives? Bad gambling mojo? On-line porn addiction? A monkey?

Posted by: jcairo | Aug 5 2007 8:49 utc | 15

I feel bad for them since of all the facets of Westernism they could have been attracted to they have chosen the worst.
No argument here. I’m actually slightly relieved by b’s #10 which indicates that there are 9% fewer of them than I had been told (he cites 31% and I’d heard 40%). Any rate, b does bring up the very valid point that this represents a most definite class issue as well as a batshit-crazy theological issue. Take my word for it, though, your average Korean recognises it for what it is and feels that same mixture of pity, guilt and embarrassment about the crispety-crunchety-Christians that we do.
btw, it’s good to see you, Wolf DeVoon. Missed your voice around here.

Posted by: Monolycus | Aug 5 2007 10:08 utc | 16